Candy Dates & 'Noise Canceling' Tonics. Is Niche The New Norm?

0:10Hello, dear friends, and thanks for tuning in to Taste Radio, the number one podcast for anyone building a business in food or beverage. I'm Ray Lateef, the editor and producer of Taste Radio, and with my co-host for this episode, Jackie Brugliera, Mike Schneider, and Melissa Travers. Melissa, welcome back. Thank you so much. It's great to be here. I feel like this is your, it's a shared seat now. It's not just the Craven seat. It's the Travers seat as well. Yeah, it's like musical chairs. I'll just sit wherever someone isn't sitting. Yes, exactly. What are you doing, Mike? Forgot about us. We didn't even get welcomed.

0:44I can welcome you. You went straight to Melissa. I mean, geez. We're old news. I'm just a novelty. Well, my point was that you're not a novelty, but then Mike was just like, I feel unwelcomed. I feel like I'm just like that. I felt attacked. Mike needs some love. I feel attacked, and so did Jackie. Okay. I can sense it from San Diego. Let's try this again. It's good to see you, Melissa. Enjoy. Mike and Jackie. Oh, my gosh. Oh, my goodness. It's been so long. Not at all. John is OIO, as I like to call him. He's out in Orlando. So Melissa was very kind enough to say, you know what? I'll pop in and do my best John Craven impression, which I don't know how you would do one.

1:32Ooh, let's hear it. I don't even know. I don't know. Let's call Mike a numpty and say, Ray, you're wrong. Mike, you're a numpty and Ray, you're wrong. There you go. Well done. Okay, that's a very good John Cravening question right there. It's more like ignoring Ray, but whatever. No, sometimes it's like... Can I ignore that question? Oh, yeah, that was... The New Beverage Showdown, that was not John's best moment. Three in a row. Yeah, but what was the point of that? I don't know. Ray, I'm going to ignore your question again. Anyway. And answer a better one. Yes. As most folks know, Melissa is the director of community at BevNet CPG Media, and she runs Nombase.

2:12And for those of you that are relatively new to the podcast or might just need a refresher on what Nombase is, Melissa, tell us all about that amazing platform. I would be very happy to do that. Nombase is BevNet's platform that integrates all of our verticals. And it's a place where you can find all kinds of helpful stuff. So we have a data hub there that you should absolutely check out for all of your data needs. We also have a partner directory so you can find all of the partners that you need, commands, design, whatever it is that you're looking for, you can find it there. We also have the Non-Base podcast, which I host and produce.

2:51And that's sort of how I'm building this podcast. So we have brands like Chomps and Kite Hill and AO talking about how they specifically figured out a very particular part of business, whether it's operations or finance, sales and marketing, that kind of thing. We also talked to retailers like TikTok, Fair, and Wegmans. And then you should absolutely check out our education hub, which we launched in the last month or so. And we have some really amazing experts explaining all kinds of CPG topics like Arnulfo, Ventura, Seth Goldman, Asha Abelisha. And then coming up soon, we've got Ben Mand and Jack Ackrey.

3:34So definitely check out nonbase.com to help you figure out whatever it is you're puzzling over. I also want to point out that you often bring on our suppliers and our service provider partners to just get into the ins and outs of what they do. And, you know, since they're so brilliant and you just bring it right out of them. And that feels like a lot going on. I feel like the easiest way for people to kind of take a step in is maybe your weekly newsletter. Yep. Check out the Nonbase newsletter. Just go to nonbase.com and head all the way to the bottom to sign up for that. We have a Q &A with anyone and everyone that you can think of in CPG there, which is a fun interview and a great way to get to know folks.

4:15So nonbase.com. Now, obviously, we're back from our LA events, which were spectacular, December 4th through the 11th. A bunch of us were out there the entire time. And Melissa, you were out there from the fourth until, well, really the third until the ninth or the 10th? Yep, until the 10th. And I headed home the 11th. Yes, the 10th and 11th, we held our Brewbound Live event in LA, which was really well received. You know, the beer industry and founders tackling beer adjacent categories like cider or hard seltzers or F &Bs, it's a space and it's an industry that is really complex and doesn't necessarily have a very clear path forward.

4:59And I think the content was just really, really well curated and thought through. Zoe Lucada, Justin Fonte from the editorial team, Justin Kendall, who couldn't be there, but congrats, Justin, on your new child, just did such a really great job addressing the biggest topics, the most pressing concerns that entrepreneurs are facing in that space. And in addition to that, the networking was just really amazing to see. It seemed like everyone was very interested and engaging and wanting to meet people that they haven't connected with in the past. And BrewBound gave them that opportunity. So congrats again to the editorial team, our operations team, our marketing team, our events team, everybody who put that event together.

5:45Because I heard from a lot of folks that not only are they coming back next year to the BrewBound live event in Marina Del Rey, but they're bringing their friends. And I don't know what else to say. I was just really happy that the event went as well as it did. The vibe was amazing at the event. You know, in the news, there's been some negative headlines about beer, alcohol, THC, but everyone was very hopeful. They were excited for what's next. Rather than just reading the headlines and being doom and gloom, it was like, how do we dig in deeper and figure out what can we actually do? How can we come together?

6:17How can you bring fun back into the category? I love the presentation with RoboBank where he's diving into why Gen Z is actually drinking less. And a lot of the stats are actually just made up based on the fact that they're not even legal drinking age yet. So there's a lot of things that need to be, you know, dug in deeper to really understand where we're going and what can happen within the industry. So those presentations are awesome and everyone can watch them at brewbound.com slash video. Well, you just took the words out of my mouth because I was going to say if you missed the event or if you were an attendee of the event and want to refresh yourself on the content, you can do so.

6:58And you can do so if you went to BevNet Live or Nosh Live. And the way to do that, Jackie, is simply to go to the websites. Yeah, go to the websites, BevNet.com slash video, Nosh.com slash video. You do have to be an insider to watch those replays, but it's pretty easy to do. You just go to bevnet.com slash insider. And if all the videos aren't up at the time that this podcast is published, don't worry. Our team is still getting to it and they'll get everything out there as soon as possible. But everything from our Taste Radio studio interviews to main stage interviews to our Pitch Slam competitions is all on the site.

7:36but you got to be an insider of bevnet and nosh or brewbound to do so you can actually be an insider for all three websites it's uh yeah it's a pretty easy process all access is that sort of that's what it's called i already have all access so i don't really yeah you don't really need to know what it's called because you have all access i mean you are an a-list industry celebrity so i am definitely not a celebrity i'm i'll call myself a list you're a q-list in cute you just call me cute cute yeah q list oh q list oh my gosh edit that out we're z list i was hoping for v but we'll see i would say q because like you're above me that's that's true the q rating is that what you're talking about no there is a q rating out there you never heard that no oh there's like a q rating for people who are actually celebrities really q yeah that low I only think of A and B list celebrities.

8:28I don't know what to tell you. Once you're C, you know, you're dead to me. Okay. I wanted to say that, speaking of celebrities, there was a Bob Ross happy little accident that led to like a beautiful moment when we kind of had a little glitch with the reveal of the pitch slam winner. Oh, geez, yeah. And he didn't quite, I don't think it was anyone's fault, but it was just like, all right, we're just going to get on with it. You're talking about the Brewbound pitch slam. Yeah, the Brewbound pitch slam. And the graphic went up before Ray knew and everyone starts cheering. and the founder didn't know.

8:58And then he stands up and he's like, yeah! He runs up to the stage. It was so awesome. Yeah, well, I tried to extend the anxiety a little bit longer than I probably should have. And all of a sudden, everyone started drumming on their tables like that. And I was like, oh, that's cool. I'll let that go. Yeah, you kind of tried to let it go. And then as soon as I heard people start cheering, I was like, I haven't said anything yet. And they had shown the graphic that said, Ikasu Brewing, the founder, who is Masa Kitano, Ikasu Brewing had won the competition. He jumped up and he was jumping up, arms flying up in the air.

9:35And he ran up on stage. He jumped up onto the stage from the front of the stage. I thought he was going to do a flip. He was very happy. I love that kind of enthusiasm when people win the pitch slams. It was a really cool moment because the tension built. He didn't realize he'd won. And then afterwards, he's like, I didn't realize what had happened. Yeah, I think people were slapping him on the back and being like, congratulations. But congratulations to Masa Kitano, the founder of Ikasu Brewing. Melissa, do you get a lot of questions about whether brands should incorporate regenerative ingredients into their products?

10:07It feels like that's a term that's been having a moment for some time. I mean, people always, obviously, their organic is known. It seems like there's a lot of demand for that, but it seems like regenerative organic and regenerative farming has been bubbling up for a while. Yeah, for sure. And I think folks are still not sure which certification to go with, how to word it, what the hierarchy should be if it's, you know, among other differentiators. I think there are a lot of questions around it, but I also see a lot of interest not only with retailers, but more and more with consumers being interested in, especially now with some of the rollbacks that we're seeing.

10:49regenerative, I think, has maybe even more potential than it has in the last few years. Yeah, I think one of the hardest parts about regenerative agriculture is that it's not very clear what it is. I think essentially it's about protecting the soil that farmers are using. We're using it in a sustainable way as opposed to clearing it out and just replacing it with sod or new soil each time. It's intended to protect the health of our lands as much as it is to grow ingredients that taste good and have the nutrient density that we have come to want in our foods. I guess I've always wanted in our foods.

11:28And one of the things that's been hard is that you're right, Melissa, there's all these different kinds of certification programs out there. And it's not necessarily clear as to which one branch should latch onto. And so people have been waiting for the USDA, the U.S. Department of Agriculture to say, okay, well, here's a clear certification process, just like USDA organic is. When you see that seal, you know, you can trust that the product is organic. So last week, I saw this in the news on NOSH. Adrienne DeLuca, our dear colleague who writes for NOSH, why are you doing a penguin thing? What was that all about?

12:00I was doing a seal. A seal. Okay. What for? Because you mentioned a seal. Oh, for crying out loud. Adrienne DeLuca wrote this story where she wrote that the USDA this week unveiled the Regenerative Pilot Program, an initiative that claims will put$700 million, claims, I'm not sure what says that, claims will put$700 million toward assisting American farmers in the adoption of regenerative agricultural practices to improve soil and water quality, boost productivity, and strengthen the U.S. food and fiber supplies. So I feel like at a time when we're not hearing a lot of great headlines coming from the government, this seems to be a good one.

12:38And hopefully it leads to great things and hopefully eventually a certification program that's sort of an umbrella for all the other certifications that we're seeing out there. You know, I think such a great example of a regeneratively centered product is Lil Bucks. Emily was at Notch Live and actually that was one of the products that I ate. I ate two bags. Emily Griffith is a maker of, or is the founder of a brand called Lil Bucks. They're a maker of buckwheat snacks, which is her buckwheat-based snacks. Yeah. And so buckwheat is a cover crop. It's something that farmers plant to put nitrogen back into the soil.

13:17And she's using the buckwheat itself for her product. And I think it's such a great example because it makes so much sense. It's not hard to understand the regenerative principle when you look at a brand like Lil Bucks. And it's so good. It's not hard to understand now. I mean, she's done so much work. Yeah, exactly. And, you know, we never recommend that a brand is the educator. And that is a brand that has required, you know, her to be a big time educator and it's worked for them. And this new packaging is absolutely stunning. It's gorgeous. And the product itself has had a bit of an evolution.

13:52And I think that the one that she's settled on now where it's clusters. Cluster bucks. It's, they're so, they're so good. So funny. Yeah, I don't necessarily look for products that are made with regenerative ingredients, but I hope that it becomes more of a standard than it is sort of the exception to the rule. Just like with organic, I feel like consumers didn't even know what that was. And then that became, you know, a new standard for produce, for products. And I think this could be another standard to level up from organic even. And I think the USDA putting money into it is just going to help everyone.

14:36I think a lot of companies have been doing it like themselves and really trying to invest in that. But to have just a baseline of support, I think, would be really helpful for just that movement. To your point, though, Ray, I'm still not sure that the majority of consumers would choose a product that has, even if it has a regenerative certification on it, but I think if they buy the product because they like it, then you feel good about buying it a little more because it does have that aspect to it. Yeah. Most likely you're going to find these types of products at places you'd expect to find them in the Whole Foods, the Sprouts, and Erewhon, what have you.

15:13But as soon as they get into more mainstream and mass retailers, I think consumers are going to be a little bit more aware of the certification or the ingredients and what regenerative means. And I think, again, that's to the benefit of everyone. So continue to follow that story on nosh.com and certainly on bevnet.com as well to do so. The best way to do so is to become an insider. And we already talked about that. So Mike is over here, just like bursting at the seams, ready to talk about all the wonderful products he bought. He brought, you didn't buy them, did you? Not today. Not today. Okay.

15:48These were sent to us generously. You got some festive beverages there. I have been sipping on a Recess Zero Proof Pepper Barktini. A Pepper Barktini? Yeah. Do they trademark that? I hope so. I mean, I really hope so. It's a holiday mocktail with notes of candy cane and chocolate. It's lightly sparkling, zero ABV, 30 calories, 12 % juice. Pretty spectacular, actually. So Recess, as we know, is a maker of beverages that are intended to calm or chill you. and they have their recess, what do they call it? Moods, recess mood beverages that are - Magnesium? Yes, infused with magnesium. And they also are makers of zero-proof cocktails.

16:29This peppermint barktini looks pretty good. Does it taste like chocolate? It does. Okay. It tastes, it's got a little, I mean, it tastes like peppermint chocolate. It's exactly what you'd want it to taste like. But there's no creaminess to it. There's a little creaminess to it. There's no cream, but it's got a little creaminess to it. Interesting, okay. It's one of those beverages that you look at it, you get an idea of what it's going to taste like, and then it tastes exactly like that. I mean, I want it perfect from the carotene. It's really well done. Yeah. Okay, good stuff. Well done, Reese's.

16:59And now you've got some, oh, candy dates. Smooth sweets, candy dates. Nice. They're green. Unfortunately, I destroyed the sweet berry fish yesterday, which are kind of a take on Swedish fish, and those are incredible. So these are not too dissimilar from the True Dates. Remember the True Dates that we were all gushing about at Expo West where they're dates, but they're candy flavored. The difference with these is there's a candy shell. It's like an M &M candy shell around the date. I just had the peach. This looks amazing. It's fantastic. It really does taste like candy. I just had the watermelon.

17:35I'm going for bubblegum. I'm a little skeptical about this one, but I'm going to do it anyway. The sour watermelon, it seems like it's right up my alley. So are you, Melissa. Sweet peach and they've got sweet. Oh, you destroyed the sweet berry fish already. It's fizzy bubble gum. Peach is really good. Not a fan of the bubble gum, but I see what they're going for. I like it. Do you think kids are going to eat this stuff or is it really just for adults? That's a good question. I'm not sure. I mean, I think if you're a Swedish fish fan, for instance, that these sweet berry fish hit almost the same note.

18:08So kids would like them, but the question is, are they going to pick them up? The answer is probably not. I think it's how restrictive are you with your children and how much sugar they're allowed to have? Because if you are, then they'll probably love them. Yeah. Well, there's three servings per pouch. Each pouch contains three ounces. There's four pieces per serving. And each serving contains 80 calories and 13 grams of sugar, which is not terrible for candy or at least. And dates are naturally more low glycemic, as I understand it. I'll take your word for it. But the pitted dates, it says they're grown in California, so you can appreciate the fact that you're buying a U.S.

18:47product if that's important to you. No artificial flavors or colors. Yeah, I would buy these, depending on the price. If these were like$4, I'd definitely buy these. If they're$6, I'd hesitate. I'd hesitate, but I probably still would do it. Yeah, good stuff, smooth sweets. This seems like a great airport snack, too. I definitely want this to take on the plane with me. These are great. Or if you're like Monica and you run marathons, I bet this would be a great marathon snack. Monica Watrous, the managing editor of NOS, she runs a lot of marathons. A lot of marathons. Very impressive. She just ran another half.

19:18Yeah. I don't think I could. I mean, I know you have to train for marathons. It just seems like a lot. Yeah, I couldn't do it. No. And what do you do? Like when you're running a marathon, do you listen to music? Do you just like focus on the road? I don't know. I feel crazy. Cry. I guess, you know, you have to be an extraordinary human to run a marathon. and we're not. Right, right. We'll leave that to Monica. There you go. I'm not for us. Jackie, have you run a marathon? Actually, Jackie is not. I am not a runner. I'm a sprinter, not a runner. I need to like chase something. I'm like a dog. I need to chase a ball.

19:50That's how I am too. I can't just run for miles and miles and miles. I've seen you run, Jackie. So the funny thing about Jackie, she's like, I'm not a runner. And then she does great in a 5K. Okay. Also, I haven't ran a 5K in like 10 years. And then you were like, let's run a 5K. And I was like, sure, why not? And then I was hurting. for weeks, but I made it. When did you run a 5K? Last year, we did the Santa Monica Christmas run, which was tragically moved to the day after we left. Darn it. Jackie, I didn't know you didn't like it. Sorry. The tears are streaming down her face. It was really fun.

20:25My body just didn't like it. I understand. Was it because we had been at Shea Jay the night before? Is that why you were hurting? No, we weren't. I was just trying to keep up with Mike. So I was just running really fast. Okay. Okay. Peak physical condition, Mike. Yeah. Versus, you know. Peak physical condition, Jackie, but just not for running. Okay. I hear you. All right. So more beverages there, Mike. There were two extraordinary beverages that I want to shout out. I mean, there were a lot of extraordinary beverages at BevNet Live, but I want to shout out the founders of hippie water, Sasha Spovoda and Sasha Patirce, who I really enjoyed that product.

21:07It was the exact thing that I needed after a day of just being like, ah, and you know, wait, hippie water. She's the founders pretty well known, isn't she? She is. Yes. The CEO is on a show that you might know called pretty little liars. Okay. I didn't know. I didn't know. I didn't actually know. I didn't know. I was scrolling through the attendee list and I'm like, what's this hippie water stuff and then I looked up the founder whose name is well she's the co-founder Sasha Pieters I'm getting I think it's Piersay Schaefer yeah and so she's uh she's got 18 million followers on the grams I mean all I know is they were two really nice people who had a beverage and they were trying to figure out how to sample it and I helped them figure that out and then Jackie tried it and it was really good okay just hit the spot and it had just the right amount of THC too.

22:00Oh, you gave me one, I think. Yeah. Yeah. It was good. Yeah. She was a undercover celebrity at BevNet Live. I guess so. Her and Ryan Phillippe. Khloe Kardashian. Sasha was telling me that she was not undercover. They can't walk down the street without somebody asking for a picture of Sasha. And I'm like, is it because she looks like Wednesday Adams? And she laughed. And I think it was like, I was being serious. The Adams family? Yeah. Oh, Oh, you just called someone Wednesday Adams. Is that what? I thought she had a little bit of that vibe going, which is good, by the way. Right. I think that's a positive thing.

22:32Also, I didn't know. And then, you know, later they followed me on Instagram and I was like, 17 point how many? 17.6 million followers and only 1 ,552 that Sasha is following. So you're one of very, yeah. Yeah, she'll figure that out soon enough and not follow me. But maybe her PR team. Oh, no, she's following Craven, too. I just saw this. Craven, she's following Mike. But they were saying, like, the event was great. They had a good time, and they were just, you know, they're walking around, having great conversations, and they really enjoyed the event. So I was, like, I was, you know, eating that, of course.

23:08And I also got the— She's also following Kevin Bacon. So you're, like, on the same— Oh, yeah. Yeah, six degrees. Yeah. Not six degrees. I'm just saying you and Kevin Bacon are basically— Oh, I might be two degrees now. Yeah. Forget the degrees. Go on to Geely. Well, this is not Geely. It's called Giggly, actually. But old people like you and me who remember that terrible film, Geely, see this and go, no, but it's actually Giggly. And this part here is a smile, right? It looks like a tongue. They're making it look more like a smile in later revisions. But the important thing here is that it's very colorful.

23:43The THC call-out is super clear. And the flavors are great. I've got blood orange margarita, raspberry mule, pineapple mojito in my hand here. And I think I'm going to go in. And so this brand was founded by Jennifer Lopez and Ben Affleck, right? No, that's the movie, right? It's the movie, right? No, right. Hopefully it has a better outcome than that movie because that movie bombed. This is, I mean, the bar is low for Gigli, but this is Gigli, which the bar is high for. So this is really tasty stuff. It's got real juice in it and really hits the spot. How many calories in it? It's only 70. Not bad.

24:21Not bad. Not bad indeed. Not bad. I mean, it's supposed to be an indulgence, right? Absolutely. 70 calories is nothing for an indulgence. It's a lot less than a, you know, margarita. Mm-hmm. Quick break. If this episode has you thinking about what's next in food and beverage, explore BevNet and Nosh Insider, our subscription platform with deeper insights from the BevNet team. Visit tasteradio.com slash insider to learn more. All right, Jackie, what's new on? the West coast. I have another product that people were sipping at the official party at BevNet live, which is Vivi. Oh yeah. This was like a fan favorite of the team.

25:01VIVY. Yeah. Viviana on our team. I think she was a little biased, but everyone else loved it too. And it's kind of fun. It's in like a pouch and this is their pineapple martini. It's a vodka cocktail and it comes with a straw and it's just very simple. It's just a vodka cocktail, 9 % alcohol, gluten-free, made with natural flavors. And everyone that I was talking to really enjoyed it. It's the adult Capri Sun. Pretty much, yeah. Yeah. Definitely leans more towards women. Do you think Viviana was biased because of the name or because it was her third alcoholic drink ever? I think both. We'll ask her later.