Five Brands Shaping CPG's Next Wave

28:45Yeah. Right now, I'm seeing a lot of price hikes when it comes to whey protein, now collagen, now a little bit butter. Actually, we had a really big supply chain crisis with organic milk last year. That's why, for example, some of our customers switched into A2 milk because it was easier and cheaper to find it. And as you scale up to a coal manufacturer right now, how do you think it's going to affect you? Do you have any long-term connections with the suppliers? And also, can you also tell us a little bit about how to work with a coal manufacturer when it comes to really clean ingredients? Because it's also a slab bar.

29:22Yeah, so we're really grateful to have really great suppliers. Our grass-fed butter actually comes from New Zealand. So we have a really great relationship with our butter source and our comb manufacturer that we are actually transitioning to. Their practices and their quality requirements are very intensive, where we really adore and love about that. And yeah, they only make natural products like ours. So working with them and teaming up with them was an automatic, you know, yes for us. And it's been a long process. You know, onboarding with a co-manufacturer can take like up to a year or more.

30:08We've been like seven months at it and we're like almost there. So we're really excited for the next chapter. Outstanding. Russell, Julia, I am thrilled for you guys because it's not every day that you come across a brand like yours and products like yours. And I think they're going to be a big hit with consumers. The more you get the brand out there, the more you get into people's hands, they're going to become believers of what you're doing. And certainly everything that you've gone through and gotten to at this point is really remarkable. Congratulations on everything that you've built. And please let us know if we can help in any way.

30:49Introductions to folks in the industry, in whatever capacity you need, we want to help in any way we can. Definitely. Thank you guys so much, Ray and Ken. Really appreciate you guys having us today. Thank you so much. Thanks so much for being with us on Elevator Talk. Thank you so much. All right. From one bar brand that I'm in love with to another bar brand that I'm in love with, Our founder, our next founder is Srivanti Balaji, who is the founder of Samsara Nutrition. Hey, Ray and Cam. Thanks so much for having me. I'm super excited to be here. Tell us all about what makes Samsara different.

31:24Thank you so much. So Samsara Nutrition is an Indian-inspired protein bar brand. And what we're looking to do is shake up the protein bar aisle with some really different flavors that haven't been seen before on shelf. I started this brand when I was postpartum with my twins and I had so many protein bars just for nourishment. But what I found was one, they weren't actually nourishing me too. I didn't like the texture of most of them. And third, which is the most important thing. All of them kind of had the same flavor profile, peanut butter, chocolate chip, cookie dough, and none of it felt like a bar or flavors rather that I really wanted to eat.

32:00And so I used to bake in a past life. And so I just took out a mixing bowl and started making protein bars myself. And the things that are in my cabinet might look a little different than what's in a traditional pantry. So we have Indian spices and mango. And all of those flavors are what inspired our first three flavors to market. Golden mango, spiced chai, and masala peanut. Each of our bars have 15 grams of protein, 7 grams of fiber, no added sugar with all-natural sweeteners. And we've seen some really great traction since we launched in April. We are mostly D2C, but also have a growing independent retail presence.

32:34This is mostly concentrated in the Bay Area where I'm based. And generally, we are here to show that joyful eating and nutritional eating can go hand in hand. You don't have to sacrifice joy for eating well. Outstanding. My goodness. Well, you didn't have to go much further than masala peanut, golden mango, and spiced chai. Just those flavor names will take you a long way. And I should note, being from the Bay Area or being based in the Bay Area, coming up soon is our Taste Radio San Francisco meetup, which is happening on September 17th. If you are based in the area or visiting, definitely check us out.

33:14Head to tasteradio.com slash meetups to RSVP. Ken, I got to start with you because I've been taking up so much time on this show, and I'm sure you have a lot of questions about Samsara. I really like the packaging. I think it stands out in the protein aisle, protein bar aisle. But I have a question on the positioning. Like you say the bars are inspired South Asian flavors. I really like the flavors, by the way. But the mission is about like metabolic health in a population that's like underserved, as you stated. Like when you write an ad or like communicate your product, which one comes first?

33:50Yeah. So right now I would say that our flavors are what come first. I think that's what gets people to try the bar more than being about metabolic health or having more protein in your diet. I think every bar that's a protein bar tends to lead with protein first. And I think our positioning is that that leaves us with a lot of room to lead with flavor in the category. I think the reason why people eat any food, protein bars or not, is for the taste. People come back for the taste and the flavor. And what we're trying to show is that protein bars are not the exception to that. And that's what should bring you to eating something consistently.

34:27So that's really why we lead with taste. I think that in the positioning, I definitely talk a lot about metabolic health and underserved population with, in terms of flavor needs in the nutrition aisle. Those things are certainly important, but none of it matters if you don't like the taste of the bar. That's true. So Avanti, where do you see Samsara fitting in best? What retail channel? Is there a particular retail chain that you think this brand can really have an impact? It's a great question. So our initial customer base, I thought was going to be mostly South Asian. And I've been pleasantly surprised by how well our bars have been doing in independent retail stores with a mostly white population, to be perfectly honest.

35:13And I think it really speaks to the fact that one, people want bars with lower amounts of sugar with them. I think that people who are sugar sensitive are really quite drawn to these bars. And then the second thing is that I think everyone wants different flavors. And so while I initially thought this was going to be more of a specialty retail product, which is where it currently sits, I do think there is strong mass market potential for it, especially considering that the protein bar aisle has felt kind of stale in terms of flavor innovation. So to answer your question, I think we could do really well in like a Sprouts, maybe one day like a Target, but I would say more in the Sprouts type of retailer.

36:00Yeah. Just quick follow up on that. Your packaging is vertical themed. A lot of protein bars, it's sort of horizontal. You see it on a shelf, it's in a box and you're looking at it in the logo from a horizontal perspective. Why was vertical your choice in terms of how the brand looks? Yeah, I think vertical for us was just due to the shape of the bar. It's a relatively smaller bar. And so what that means is that if I were to do the packaging horizontally, it was just hard for us to communicate what we wanted to communicate about the packaging horizontally. With that said, I think even though the packaging itself is vertical, there is room for the outer packaging case to still be horizontal on shelf.

36:44Right now, our independent retailers are loving that we're vertically faced because it's easier to place those on their shelf. But I don't think that's sustainable for us long term. And so I am considering it in the back of my head of what it would mean to keep the vertical packaging versus switching to something horizontal. Ken, what stands out to you about Samsara? You know, for me, it's very much the flavors. But, you know, I know you're someone who enjoys working out and I'm sure has consumed a lot of protein bars. Do you think about the protein count as much as you do the flavors? I think the best approach in this product, if you ask me, is the balance of the product because it has 7 grams of fiber and then 10 plus grams of protein.

37:35which actually if you ask me a little bit like a white space and it was because we see a lot of protein maxing last year and now it's going to be much more balanced but there's also supply chain side for that I think you're in a good point because I've seen a lot of price hike as we just mentioned before and I see a lot of protein bar brands that are leading the categories in all over the world, like in Turkey, in Europe, in US markets, they started to mix other sorts of proteins in their products. And do you have any plans on that? For example, if you are using milk protein crunch for the texture, and then you also have white protein, milk, do you have plans to switch into a little bit plant protein as well?

38:27I'm so glad you asked. It's actually one of the number one questions we get about our brand is, will there be a vegan option? And the reason why we didn't go vegan from the beginning is purely taste-based. Whenever I had pea protein, I couldn't stand the earthiness of it. And I think a lot of people don't like it. And ultimately, again, it comes back to taste. If people are not going to enjoy the taste, they're not going to come back to consume the product. And so we started off with whey protein. But with that said, I think there's actually some really interesting innovation in the plant protein space.

38:58And so I have my eyes on a couple of other plant-based protein sources that could be great. And again, like you said, whey protein prices are going up, up, up. And I think for me, this is also a way to mitigate that and have a backup option or hopefully not a backup option, but an option that tastes just as good as what we have today. Gervonta, I see a lot of you on your Instagram account, which is great. I feel like people want to associate the brand with the founder. They want to know about their backstory. They want to know about how they're building the company. Just in terms of your social, what's resonating most?

39:34What's really getting the message across about your brand and what you're doing that's different? Yeah, I think founder-led marketing is what got me to this point. I started founder-led marketing before we launched the brand. So I was on the socials maybe six to nine months before launching. And I think that really helped us establish early traction organically without paid media. I think, however, for the brand to grow beyond what I want it to be, I think it has to be more than just me doing the marketing. And so I'm really self-conscious of the fact that it can't just be my face on social media.

40:07That is totally a valid strategy for the first three to six months. And then hopefully beyond this year, just bringing in other people who want to talk about the bar, more social media presence that extends beyond that. I think that will be super great. One thing I've noticed that has resonated is a lot of South Asian cultural references and just showing that we're not just making flavors that are South Asian inspired, but that we're really part of the culture and have our pulse on the culture that way. And so that's resonated, but of course, want to make sure that we have marketing that appeals to everyone, not just South Asians.

40:43So again, very much an open-ended question for me, but something I'm thinking about. Yeah, I haven't watched the video that is titled, Can Saffron Feel Special in a Protein Bar? But that really stood out to me because I'm like, that's a good one. Thank you so much. I so appreciate you saying that. And that is the perfect lead in for our special flavor that will be coming out very soon. Okay, well, we almost let the cat out of the bag, but not entirely. You define differentiation, right? I mean, there are so many new protein bars coming to market, but yours is truly different. And I commend you on that.

41:19And I think there's a great runway for you and for the brand. And I'm just really excited. But please, if you need anything, if you need any help with building your company, I always point this out on Elevator Talk. You know, part of our job is the journalistic side of what we do and talking about news and trends and innovation. The other part of it is community building, and we're here to support founders as they continue to scale. So if there's anything we can do to help, just let us know. Thank you so, so much to both of you for having me on the show. I really appreciate it. Thank you, and hope to see you in San Francisco in a couple weeks.

41:55Absolutely. Thank you. All right, great stuff. On to our next guest. That person is Joseph Chen. He's the founder and CEO of Joy Nordic Seed Crisps. Joey, it's great to see you again. Yeah, nice to see you. And thanks for having me. And nice to meet you, Ken. Yeah. I met you at the Summer Fancy Food Show, didn't I? Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Tell us all about what you do. For sure. Yeah. So Joy Nordic Seed Crisps is a certified organic, certified gluten-free sea cracker. So we're made with seven super seeds, including watermelon seeds, which is naturally high in 14 iron potassium. So each bag of the Joey Cracker contains 22 grams of protein and 13 grams of fiber and no seed oil.

42:38And what differentiates us is we feature the economy inspired premium seasoning. So our classic signature flavors are saffron and pink salt, rosemary, black pepper, and black truffle. And this year we just launched our gastronomy inspired flavors. there was no way to marry peri peri sula and blue salt Ken I'm trying to remember where I saw Joey Organic seed crisps I think it was in the upper level of the fancy food show did you get a chance to try them I think no we were together actually when we visited their booth so it was on the yeah it was on the downflow oh okay well I know I know I tried them and I'm glad that you I think it was startup CPG aisle Oh, okay.

43:23That's what it was. Yes. Well, clearly this is a brand that I remembered because I reached out to Joseph about joining us on the show. Clearly, it's a brand that you remembered as well, Ken. What's your experience with this? I mean, again, for me, this is a product or a line of products that I was just surprised to see anything like this because it is very new to me. It feels very innovative. So actually, because I also know the Turkish market, we have a little bit similar products, but not in this flavor profile. So actually, this is a really innovative product, if you ask me. Really could also that.

44:00And I think it's a really good product for a next generation fiber trend, because this is what the flora bar betting on is like different kind of fibers in a single product that will serve your gut health really good way. So it's like a rainbow diet. And I think this product also fits into that trend. And my question is that, Joseph, do you communicate on this, having different fiber sources in just one product that's also giving you protein? We don't really overly communicate in terms of the fiber benefit, which we should because Because all the fiber that's in the cracker is all naturally occurring from the seeds.

44:44Yeah, so it's definitely something that we're looking to communicate more because we've been focusing so much on the porting side, the porting benefits. But there's also the fiber component where we need to talk about it a bit more in our communication. On the packaging side, I see it's a seed crisp, but you also have no seed oil. I know the difference, but does this like any confusion in the consumers? Do you have any feedback on that? It's interesting that we have not received like from a consumer perspective, but we have one distributor who mentioned to us, like he was a bit confused, like, oh, you guys have seats, but then there's like no COO.

45:28So we have to sort of like just educate him a bit more about that. but so far like you know like we have we purposely like really intentionally like many producing this product without any seed oil because we know that in terms of like and also actually like we also receive feedback from some retailers in terms of what they're looking for what's important to them there's one retail that we work with we actually do private for them and then like they actually work with us to really like fine-tune our recipe and that's we decide to make sure that when we're producing this product, it's sea oil free.

46:05You're a Canadian brand and you are making your way into the United States. According to my notes, you'll be expanding nationally in the U.S. in October. Can you tell us more about that? Yes. Yeah. So we have started. So last year, we started entering the U.S. through a retailer we've been working with for their private label business. And then this year is actually our very first year in January. So we should not shoot the different like distributors and also retailers here in the U.S. Our primary focus right now is really like expanding in the Southern California or the whole California and also in the New York area.

46:45So in New York, we're at like Pop-Up Grocery, Happy Grocery, and then like Union Market. market and then like in California we just started we just landed with the mother's market we land market here like in the bay area we just got the note about the the launch with sprouts for the forage program like in November so just gradually like just in terms of like start working with yeah with the speeders and also a retailer in terms of the retail expansion here in the U.S. And where in-store, where in-store do you see the brand being merchandised? Is it with other snacks? Is it with crackers? Is it with nuts, seeds?

47:31Yeah, so it's interesting you bring that up. I would say like 90 % of the time, retailers, they merchandise us in the cracker section. So we do have like some retailers put us into like, there's a lot of functional snacking area. So that will include a lot more like, you know, like seaweed or like a trail mix. It's a lot of sort of a mixed bag of different type of salty snacks. We also have like retail actually merchandise as in sort of the seeds and nuts area. That's very, very rare. I would say, yeah, 90 % is in the cracker section. Yeah, I would assume so. So it feels like it is kind of a cracker brand or the use case feels like it would be that of a cracker.

48:22But then, you know, I don't see why you wouldn't just snack on it almost as an alternative to a potato chip. Ken, what would be your advice in terms of sort of positioning and talking to American retailers about how consumers see this product and see the brand? so i think the flavors are the hit in here but i would love to ask first like which flavors actually really sell uh on for the consumer because like you have almost 10 6k right now like safran pink salt rosemary black pepper black truffle nori and tamari peripera and sumac and budu salt and it can read as like asian flavors at the same time a little bit middle eastern flavors So which one resonates more with the US consumer?

49:11Oh, yeah. So our number one seller is the Saffron and Pin Salt. So that's also the most basic and also more approachable in terms of flavor profiles standpoint. With some retailers, Black Trouble is actually the number one seller. Yeah, so for one more like the upscale type of retailer, Yeah, so that's the number one. We're seeing a lot of interest in the U.S. The peri-peri flavor and also the suma and brusol. So these two are also two other flavors that are also getting really great traction. But our number two seller is the rosemary black pepper. So I still feel like consumers are gravitating towards a bit more, like a more approachable type of flavor profile.

50:05Yeah, so saffron and pink salt and then like the rosemary and black pepper are the two top ones. You can't go wrong with either. They're both fantastic. And then somehow the black truffle, I mean, that's just the cherry on top. Joey, thank you so much for taking the time to be with us on Elevator Talk today. I'm so excited for the future of Joey in the United States. It seems like you already had a great start in Canada. The U.S. market, obviously, a little different. But when you have a product like yours, success should follow pretty quickly. Thank you so much. Thanks so much for having me. Yeah, thank you.

50:46And please, please stay in touch. For sure. Thank you. Vibrant Ingredients is the natural ingredient partner powering food and beverage innovation, delivering flavor, function, and protection through a science-backed portfolio. Vibrant delivers purpose-driven solutions that help brands create extraordinary experiences. Discover what's possible with Vibrant today. Visit VibrantIngredients.com. The Angel Group was among the first believers in brands like Poppy, Batchans, Goodles, and Siete. The next generation of great consumer brands is being built right now. Learn about investing alongside other industry professionals at wearetheangelgroup.com.

51:34On to our final guest for this episode of Elevator Talk. We have Carlos Santos, who is the founder of Nada's Empanadas. Carlos, it's great to see you again. Hey, Ray. How are you, my friend? Good to see you. Absolutely. You and I met at the Summer Fancy Food Show, and I just love what you're doing. Thank you. I already left the cat out of the bag with empanadas, so it's pretty clear what you do. But what makes Nadas different? Yeah, man. Well, number one, I think the really cool thing is that obviously we're filling a white space in the frozen section, being that the frozen section has been, for the majority, as long as I've been alive, kind of boring, right?

52:16People go to the frozen section of the secondary option, tertiary option. well, hey, we have a restaurant quality empanada that's corn-based Colombian style that immediately addresses, hey, an over-processed, underwhelming, and wheat-focused section of the supermarket. I'm not going to say, listen, that we're going to be the frozen section of Siete because God knows it will sell for that much, but we like to believe that players like them, like my dozen cousins, like Tia Lupita, have taken the same premise of better for you ethnic, mostly Hispanic foods, working across all demographics. And that's what we're doing, man.

52:48But we started from my mom's restaurant that was open for 20 years, a little bit outside of New York City, New York Times, right? And we took that exact same product, and we're just trying to bring it from our home, our hearts, straight to people's freezers. And they are delicious. They're also differentiated because, according to my notes here, they're Colombian-style empanadas. What makes a Colombian-style empanada? Yeah, man, I'm not trying to start a South American war here. But I think what is interesting is a lot of people know empanadas to be either the Argentine, the Chilean, kind of that south, southern empanadas made with wheat, right?

53:28So they make them, they bake them, they're wheat focused. But as we've seen in America, hey, 18 % of the population right now is either gluten-free, they're celiac, or they're gluten insensitive. And so we're trying to bring our empanadas that are corn-based into the market to kind of rival what's been known to be an empanada and what I have known to be an empanada my entire life. The other part of this, and I want to get to Ken, but you call out the protein count on each of your products. That is not necessarily something I've seen with empanadas. I think usually you're eating them for pleasure, for just nourishment.

54:10Why do you feel like you needed to call it the protein? Yeah, man. I mean, I think protein is having a moment, obviously. And I think that's something people like to know, right? They like to understand the macros and micros of how they're eating. And so for us, it's kind of showcasing that. Listen, we have all the bells and whistles of every trend, but we're still an inherently cultural product, right? It's something that Colombians have been eating their whole lives. What we make is just an elevated version of what I've been eating my entire life, even from the colors, right, that we have. That's to call the attention for families.

54:42It's to force kids to eat cheese and spinach, even though the spinach may be tricked onto them because they say it's Hulk cheese. But all that we're doing is that, hey, we're taking a product that Colombians have grown up with our entire lives and we're displaying it in a new manner for consumers. And so that's all that we're trying to do. Obviously, hey, if you're going to have three empanadas and feel like you have your protein filling right there, amazing. but for us it's more about showcasing that these traditional products and cuisines can fit into for everybody's diet and category can is there a turkish version of an empanada i don't know i like i don't want to start anything start anything up with carlos but uh anyway yeah is it yeah we have a version with cracked cracked wheat and we have the same felix almost like we mostly use beef but I think the way Carlos like approached the feelings is much more diverse and creative you ask me and on that actually I wanted to ask something about the production because you now working with a core manufacturer at the same time and you stated that you needed to teach a machine to have to do the same thing how was that process like commercializing process because I think that must have been the hardest part.

55:58Yeah, I mean, I think we went from doing when we started the empanada kind of journey from my mom's restaurant I went from doing like a couple hundred a week to then during pandemic starting to do thousands to now doing tens of thousands hundreds of thousands and what's been cool in that trajectory is that we've always been able to figure out that next step and so with the co-man it was like, hey, we've been doing this this way. Here's these recipes. Now let's just figure it out together, right? Even though we've had to incorporate more machines and obviously it's less manual labor than it used to be, there's a certain standard, mostly when you're using the ingredients that we use, that we know because we made the product so many times, we know what the output should look like regardless of whether it's with machines or whether we're needing the dough.

56:46So I think just figuring out things like humidity and water and at that scale was the biggest thing, right? doing a couple runs, paying for those runs until it got to the standard that we needed it to be. But I think that once you made it, by the time that we got into CPG, we had sold close to 700 ,000 empanadas in different venues from obviously our own storefronts and stadiums and pop-ups and in the rain, the snow and the sun. So we already knew the quality that we needed to get to. It was more just about figuring out and tinkering with the process.

57:23carlos uh not as recently launched into the northeast region of whole foods congratulations on that what's been that what's that experience been like for you yeah man it's been really cool i think um you know obviously we've only been in the cpg market we launched in january we launched ourselves in january so uh we've been learning you know while we while we fly the plane we're building it and so it's been cool to to figure out obviously what velocities look like um i think one of the big things is, okay, now that we're building a brand, what does our marketing work like, right? Our strategy obviously changes to focus on our three core demographics, our house makers, our second generation immigrants, and then obviously people with dietary restrictions.

58:06So figuring out how we can fully grasp everybody and funnel them into all their stores has been really fun. And just hearing the feedback, right? We have customers that have known us for 20 years since my mom had a restaurant that has been eating these products and can attest that the quality is the same when they make it at home. And I think that's the most rewarding part. What's the price point per package? So we're$9.99. We had to get under 10 because that's what our distributors told us. So we were able to reformulate size and get down under the$10 mark. And so we're$9.99. We're actually cheaper than all our competitors in Whole Foods by ounceage, which is fun to say, even though every consumer doesn't fully understand that we do.

58:50And you're clean label throughout, correct? I mean, even though you have this rainbow array of empanadas, there's like this really bright red that's, that's wrapping your beef and potato empanada. Everything is clean label, correct? Yeah, everything is clean label. So yeah, it's one of the things that we hear most from parents, right? They want something that's easy. They want something that they can trust and they want something that their kids are going to like. Right. And I think that we hit all three categories. is we're easy to make you pop in the oven or the air fryer. We're fully clean labeled.

59:20So like you said, we don't really have, parents don't really have to worry about that kind of stuff. All the colors are naturally derived from vegetables. And then, what was the third thing I said? Cheese. But yeah, and yeah, we're really easy to enjoy. So yeah, I think like it's really cool. It's been really awesome to launch a product that's clean labeled and that people are enjoying. Yeah, on that front, Ken, And how much would you highlight the fact that these products are clean label on the website, on the NADA's website? It does highlight that the products are clean label, no BS. But you feel like that is something that belongs in front of pack?

59:57I think it would be really great to highlight that because you're coming from restaurant world. Actually, your packaging also really in line with your prior restaurant. And people know that you came from that background. and you know how to cook, you know how to nourish people. And they were really,

1:00:20trying to find the word, I'm so sorry. They're really aligned with your position actually. So I would love to see something like that because when you, even though it's frozen, when you take the ingredient list, most of the frozen products right now, you'll see a lot of preservatives, even though it's frozen. So this, I think you're a differentiator in this category. Yeah, I would 100 % agree. I mean, your packaging on its own, it's sort of minimalist and it looks beautiful. Even the logo that you use for NADA just feels very straightforward. I almost wonder if in your next iteration, if you decide to iterate on your packaging, noting that you are clean label, no BS, as you point out on your website, feels like it's something that would resonate with consumers, especially in the frozen food aisle when you do see, as Ken pointed out, a lot of preservatives.

1:01:11So, yeah, that's a really good call out. I think obviously, you know, we're, we're small batching some of these, some of our packaging right now. So once, once we get into the larger runs, we'll, I think this is an awesome, awesome point and call out for sure. Yeah, well, one thing that I didn't call out earlier is how delicious your products are. Everyone got to try some at the Fancy Food Show and just the delicious and wonderful aromas that were coming from your booth. I feel like we're drawing so many people in and a good way to get people to try your products. Yes, sir. Yeah. Thank you so much for what you do.

1:01:49And thanks so much for being with us on Elevator Talk today. Excited to see where the brand goes from here. And we want to know where the brand goes from here. Please stay in touch. Let us know about any new retail distribution, what have you. Thank you guys so much. Appreciate y 'all. Thank you. Thank you, Carlo. Well, as advertised can, a great group of founders and a great group of brands. And as I noted, I think before we hopped on the mics, I am going to be, I am very, very hungry. and I can't wait to eat lunch because everything that we saw today just makes your mouth water. And that's really where it starts, right?

1:02:27If you have great taste, you have a great foundation for growth and the story can help tell itself from there. If you don't start with great flavor, great taste, great ingredients, it's kind of harder to build a business. But I really thought that this was a great group, as I mentioned, and I thought you were a great co-host today. Thanks so much for taking the time. For folks who want to get in touch with you and the team at Chapter Foods, what's the best way to do so? I think the best way is LinkedIn. You can find me on LinkedIn really easily and you can reach out to me at ken at chapterfoods.com.

1:03:04Anything related to ingredients or candies, let me know. Or just perspective on the food and beverage industry of which you have a great one. Yes. Thank you. Thank you again. And thanks so much to all our entrepreneurs who joined us today. Thanks to everyone watching or listening. And thanks to our amazing team at BevNet, Nosh, and Taste Radio, the best in the business. Signing off for everyone, I'm Ray Lateef, and we'll talk to you next time.