The Innovation You May Have Overlooked At Expo West

0:10hello friends i'm ray latif and you're listening to the number one podcast for the food and beverage industry it's taste radio i'm ray latif the editor and producer of taste radio and i'm here with my bevnit and nosh colleagues john craven jackie brugliera and mike schneider i'm not actually there with you guys i'm not even in the studio where are you i'm not even in the country you're so excited right i'm in barcelona you got there fast from anaheim that's kind of crazy i'm a glutton for punishment jackie that looks like the anaheim hilton in the background i don't believe You know, if I close the shades, it could be the Anaheim Hilton.

0:45But as I open the shades, I'm seeing this beautiful Gothic architecture and it definitely ain't Anaheim. So, yeah. So sad. No, I'm here because I was invited to cover an event, a competition, as it were, sponsored by Familia Torres, which is one of the largest, if not the largest, winery and spirit maker or distiller in Spain. they are sponsoring a competition called Taurus Brandy Zero Challenge. And in short, they're inviting, or they did invite, 10 bartenders from across the world to present plans to introduce sustainability initiatives into their bars and ones that they could replicate and be able to share with the community and the world really at large.

1:37Pretty cool stuff. Ray, I have an important question. What is that? How do you say cognizant in Spanish? Well, in the Catalan region, you say cognizant. So you've got to slur your TH. Slur is the wrong word. Cognizant. Cognizant. Cognizant. And I appreciate you bringing that up, John, because Cognizant is the presenting sponsor of this episode of Taste Radio. Cognizant is a clinically tested utopic ingredient that delivers a patented form of citicoline to supply your brain and those of your consumers with the energy it needs to stay sharp. Learn more at cognizant.com. That's C-O-G-N-I-Z-I-N.com.

2:16Ray, one of the highlights for me of Expo West was I got to meet the Cognizant team and they had chill jackets. Why don't we have chill jackets? We could use some hoodies, some Cognizant hoodies for sure. Yeah. I would like that. I think they should infuse Cognizant into the jamón here in Barcelona. That would be awesome. Every time someone get into some jamón. Just a big ham leg full of cognizant. Yeah, exactly. You'd be smarter every time, you know, well, every day because they eat jamón here pretty much every day. Yeah, lots of jamón. Yeah. Just a bit more on my visit here. Look forward to or stay tuned for an episode where I sit down with three of the key players of this competition, including last year's winner, who is the founder of a bar called Paradiso, which according to the world's 50 best bars is the number one bar in the world, the spirits director of Torres or Familia Torres, and the lone American competitor in this competition, who is a firecracker and someone that you'll love to hear from.

3:16But as you mentioned, Mike, Expo West is still top of mind for our office and pretty much the entire food and beverage industry, the American food and beverage industry, that is. Still so much buzz from that show. Although I do want to ask John Craven a question. Are you ready for this, John Craven? Sure, why not? Okay. What choice to have? You really don't, actually. But I saw you posted something on LinkedIn about how people were questioning or unhappy, I guess, about the lack of innovative concepts and ideas at Expo West, which I would totally disagree with. I don't know who said that, but who has been saying that?

3:53And what's your response? Well, I think what I wrote was about people saying that there wasn't real meaningful innovation at expo and you know look some of these people i think didn't even go to the show so there's i don't know there's always that you got to drag down people trolling how do you know there's there's no meaningful innovation if you couldn't go yeah that's weird well because they read everybody else's like here are you know i saw one that was like here are 35 trends i saw at expo west but no i mean i think you know there have been years where there's some like real bleeding edge thing that everyone's like talking about.

4:30And generally those are at the time, not things that are being talked about in like a positive, like we got to get behind it more like, oh my God, can you believe that there's like, I don't know, CBD in every single product? Or, you know, I don't know. I remember the year like Stevia became a thing and it was like all of a sudden everything or gluten-free products, whatever it might be that now many years later are like actual legit trends. But, you know, this year, like kind of didn't have one of those things as far as I could tell, which my whole point of the post was that that no way takes away from Expo West and the innovation that was there, which right now I called it incremental innovation, you know, kind of improving upon things that are already sort of proven concepts.

5:16And, you know, those improvements might be infusing some new like global cuisine or flavor into it, or just general improvements of packaging or taste or branding. And I think on that front, like this was a show that had a lot of ideas that felt ready for primetime or close there too. You know, I think folks like us, yeah, it's our job's easier if there's some like, Hey, there's this new, I don't know, Barry that someone found in the Amazon, right? You know, it gives you a little more gossip when someone's like, what'd you see at the show? And you're just like, yeah, go try that. Right. Whereas this time I was like telling people about, I don't know, companies that were making awesome dumplings, you know, stuff we talked about on the last episode.

5:59And that's fine. I mean, I feel like this is one of those times in the cycle where like, we're actually going to have some companies that come out of this that go on to like big things. And most of the mega exits in CPG are products that, you know, were some little twist on a thing that consumers are already familiar with. So that's kind of the way I felt after seeing all the, I don't know, not all the shade, but there was some shade thrown at the show, kind of calling it boring. But there was also plenty that was like, hey, this thing's awesome. Everyone's here, lots of great energy. And I think, again, that's kind of how I felt leaving it and still feel that way.

6:38There were a lot of people having their moments too that maybe those people were different than the people who are trolling, I think we saw a lot of just meal innovation. There was noodle innovation. There were Indian flavors and Pakistani flavors. And as you said, dumplings. And I think that is innovation, whether you recognize it or not, or whether you think it's cool or not, it's still innovation for our industry. And part of that is just, it's people innovation, which just having a, you know, a more globally diverse group of people at the event is unfortunately innovation for Expo West. We just, we saw a lot more founders making foods from their own ethnicities and it was a breath of fresh air.

7:23And that was a big piece of innovation for me at Expo West was just that we started, we're starting to see more people making foods from their homelands and they're, and they're making them in ways that are able to scale. Well, and they're doing it. I think in a lot of cases, what I really like is clean ingredients. You know, there's like authentic recipes being used for these things. And I don't know, I'm someone who like, you know, you go to these trade shows at times and there's only so much like processed food you can eat, but there's actually like good, wholesome stuff here that felt not that there wasn't in the past, but it felt actually like really like market ready.

8:00I mean, take a food like Homia, for instance, that we've known for a while, still ridiculously innovative to be able to just have anybody be able to make Loxa in their home. I had a pretty in-depth conversation with Kartik from Ducra about this too. And he's just telling me, Mike, you have no idea. Like that is very hard to make and you get it in a pack, add a few ingredients and you're pretty close to authentic in your house in the U.S. and that's unheard of. Yeah. And I feel like there's just been a lot of innovation and there has been a lot of over-processed products and things that are maybe a little bit more buzzy, but people are focusing more on quality.

8:40And like you're saying, like simple ingredients, which is actually harder to do as far as innovation goes than it is to just, you know, create something that's shock and awe, but has, you know, 20 different ingredients in it. So I think it's like reeling that back and being more authentic and creating cleaner ingredient profiles is a lot harder to do, but it might not be as sexy. Especially in the U.S. We talked about on the CPG Week podcast this week about Kellogg's and their commitment to, you know, in the U.S. to changing ingredients that's kind of gone into the background. It's a big controversy right now.

9:17But if you just look at, say, I don't know, Fruit Loop cereal, the way that they color it in the U.S. versus the way that they do it in Canada and Europe, very different. And we should be asking ourselves, why are we allowing that in the U.S.? And that is what founders are doing on a daily basis. And we're seeing that at Expo West. And that is, unfortunately, innovation. To answer your question, Mike, if you want to know why, call your congressman or senator and ask them to ask the FDA why artificial colors or colors that aren't used and flavors that aren't used and sweeteners that aren't allowed in Canada and Europe are allowed in this country, because it's shocking when you think about it, because clearly those countries see a problem and have their own health departments that see a problem with those ingredients.

10:08But somehow we don't in this country. So anyway, if you really want change, I think you're right. On the one hand, it's incumbent upon founders to make better products that taste as good or perform just the same way as legacy products. But also, complain is the right word. to complain to your elected leaders about the fact that these ingredients still are in a majority of processed foods and packaged foods in America. It's very strange. This is my favorite Ray rant there is. I'm just going to take this rant and send it. I'm not going to tell him I'm on the podcast. I'm going to say, hey. You opened this can of worms, my friend.

10:46I love it, Ray. No, keep doing it. I mean, this is one of the reasons that we support the next generation of brands and we're hoping to see them change the food and beverage industry. Yeah. And it comes from both sides because consumers often aren't going to even know that these are issues until brands bring it to the forefront and let people know that this is what they should be, you know, asking for. A lot of people just show up into the grocery store and they take what's given and they're not asking that many questions until they realize that there's a better alternative or people are doing things differently.

11:18To link a couple points that were made by the team here. When we attended the MENA CPG meetup at Expo West, which was held on Friday of the show, we saw founders, and just to back up for a second, MENA stands for Middle Eastern, North African, and MENA CPG is intended to highlight and feature brands that are created by and operated by folks from the MENA community. the products that we saw at the meetup represented the ones that John, you were talking about and Mike, you were talking about and Jackie, you were as well in that they had a cultural tilt to them. They had high quality ingredients.

12:01Oh my God, they did. And they tasted amazing. Right. So like, these are all things that I think generally consumers want and represent sort of that next generation of food. It's just a question of, you know, adoption, I think at this point and awareness. So for example, like Afia, which is a maker of frozen falafel, which is sold in pouches and you can find it at Whole Foods and Wegmans and stores like that. They also have a line of frozen entrees that I believe are all vegetarian, things that are pretty much made with ingredients that you're familiar with, lentils, rice, quinoa, things like that.

12:37All really easy, convenient foods that are delicious and easy to make. And I think that was a key trend that I saw at Expo West, which was, you know, you don't necessarily need the complex to make an industry better. You know, convenience and the convenience of good food, I think is a really important trend that I hope continues, you know, at Expo West and certainly beyond. When I think about the breakfast opportunity and, you know, maybe a bacon, egg and cheese or a sausage, egg and cheese will never be quote unquote healthy, but it can be better for you. It can be better for you than the Jimmy Deans of the world.

13:14And, you know, we saw Mason Dixie, we saw Reds, we saw Rudy's all come out with better for you versions of that legacy frozen product. You know, on the lunch front, Deep Indian Kitchen, which is a maker of Indian inspired entrees and other snacks, introduced a new line of khati street wraps, which I thought, you know, I've never seen anything like this within the Indian frozen food category, but basically they are exactly what they sound like. They're wraps that include like a chicken tikka masala or a different kind of like the spices and flavors you would find in one of the entrees that's Indian kitchen markets, but in a wrap form, just to make it a little bit easier and more convenient for folks who want to take things like that on the go.

14:00Did you get to try Ahanas Bombay Masala Lentil Bowls? No. That was a product that I got to try. I wanted to give them a shout out because we got to try them at the Startup CPG event. And it's an interesting take on, you know, the lentil bowl comes in sort of that, similar to the lentiful, comes in that sort of ice cream looking pack. But they have grains in theirs as well. Super tasty stuff. Nice. Very convenient. I was babbling about the different kinds of Kati Street perhaps that Deep Indian Kitchen Markets. I'm referring to their press release now. They include chicken tikka masala, which I mentioned, butter, chicken, spinach, paneer, chicken curry, and potato and pea samosa.

14:39So love that stuff. Yeah, they're delicious. And also they were telling me about like their packaging innovation and they have this special crisping sleeve. So I feel like even like they're thinking about the experience and how do you bring something that you would get like from a restaurant into like your home by just microwaving it for a few minutes, which also just shows the opportunity in Frozen in general, too. I can't stop thinking about Yaza. Yaza is a fantastic brand of Lebna. And Lebna is a yogurt dip that is familiar to and traditional to the Middle Eastern community. It's a thicker kind of yogurt.

15:15It's almost got like a little bit of a sour flavor to it. It's like sour cream. It's like a thicker sour cream. you see it served with olive oil, with zaatar, with all kinds of things like that. It's a delicious product. And so Kareem Khalil, who was the founder of that company, participated in the Mina CPG meetup. Mike, you interviewed him. You also interviewed the founder of Annie's Tomb, which makes a garlic dip, which was delicious. That's how you eat with your hands, your fingers, that is. And then you interviewed one of the founders of Afi as well, who taught you some Arabic, is that right?

15:49Taught me some Arabic. And you're going to see on a reel later that I just, I did my best and she said I did well, but it was hard for me to remember after I said it. I need to practice it a few times. So the next time that Farrah and I get to meet, I'm hoping to have it polished. Yeah. Farrah Sibai, who's one of the co-founders of Afia. Huge thanks to Bella and Samira from Better Sour and Rafi and Patrick from Ziba Foods, who co-hosted the events. Better Sour basically gave up their booth for a little over an hour to share with folks from the media community and highlight what they're doing. And there was a good turnout and a good crowd.

16:29And we did a bunch of interviews and you'll see them coming soon on LinkedIn. Excuse me. Well, maybe on LinkedIn, but TikTok and Instagram. All the social medias. Yes. All the social medias. Bella's that person who, you know, when she sees us coming, she's pushing everybody else's products in front of hers. I mean, we love Better Sours and she knows, I think she knows that, but it seems like she's quick to talk about the rest of the MENA community before her. And I have a lot of respect for that. I think I'm just really excited and grateful that I got the opportunity. Thank you, Ray, to just continue to be there for the interviews and continue to learn and taste.

17:05And just, I mean, this community is phenomenal. And I'm just looking forward to seeing what they do next. You know, we also got to talk to, again, the founders of Mazah, who they also bring the vegetables. They're one of the few companies that brings vegetables to Expo West. So it's like, you know, there's so many breaths of fresh air. Which is kind of strange when you think about it, right? That vegetables in their roast raw form are lacking at Expo West. Lacking at Expo West. Yeah. What do they call that? What do they call that kind of spread? Charcuterie board? A charcuterie board, but no, there's another word.

17:39A crudite. Crudite. Yes. You know, they have their boxes that they like to bring around. They're full of vegetables, but their booth now is basically a giant version of their box. It was so good. Yeah, it's beautiful. Did you guys get to try the brand extensions or the line extensions for Wonder Eggs? So Wonder Eggs is the maker of plant-based hard-boiled eggs. It is in the more figurative sense of the word, a miraculous kind of concept and innovation. They introduced, I believe, two new varieties. the one I tasted was their deviled egg variety, which is made with bobalicious mayo, I believe. Hema Reddy, who is the founder of Crafty Counter, the maker of Wonder Eggs.

18:20I don't know, she just continues to knock it out of the park. She's so smart. You know, when we first met her, she had different branding and just was very far ahead in her roadmap. She had so many products that she was working on. And then she figured out that Wonder Eggs was the one and the one, And then she also won the Albertsons Accelerator Contest, too. And she's standing up, bucket list item check, you know, giant check in hand sort of thing. I mean, they were crushing it at Expo West. Yeah. The founders of a brand called Sunny, S-U-N-N-I-E. I don't think we gave them a check to hold up on stage, but they did win the Nosh Pitch Slam.

18:57They did. In December of 2022 at Nosh Live, December of 2022 or winter 2022. too. They had a good and a strong presence at Expo West, I thought. They introduced a new line of cocoa dippers, which are basically a snack pack. And we talked about Cocada's Dunkaroos killer. Well, Sonny had a pretty good option as well. It was a hazelnut spread with sort of like a cookie cracker that you could dip in there. It almost tasted like Teddy Grahams to me. They were delicious. Good call, Jackie. Hey, Ray, is it hazelnut or is it a hazelnut clone because they're trying to get into schools, right? That's a good question.

19:37I mean, whatever it is, it's phenomenal. They have just a brilliant line. I know they're called Sunny because they use sun butter and their jam and peanut butter clone is phenomenal. So I wonder if this one's also allergy-free. It's probably allergy-free. I would think so. Yes, I would think so. You know, on the dinner front, I think Jackie talked about the frozen aisle and I think there is a lot of promise that we're seeing in the frozen space. There was one brand that stood out to me called Wunderlish. Wunderlish is a maker of Better For You food entrees. The first thing I saw was their branding.

20:16It just had this like really slick, but also kind of nostalgic look about it. And the products themselves were just absolutely delicious. Wunderlish is marketed by Bob Evans Farms. The products that I tried included their peri-peri chicken. And so these are trays of food that come in 16-ounce packages. And it says on the front of the pack, three steps to prep and ready in less than 10 minutes. The peri-peri chicken was made with jollof rice and herb yogurt sauce. Ray, speaking of peri-peri chicken, did you see who has a new peri-peri chicken sauce with Nando's? Bukayo Saka. I'll have to cry out loud.

20:57You interrupted my frame of thought here. I was going to harken back to an earlier part of our conversation where, you know, when would you have seen jollof rice and herb yogurt sauce and a frozen entree and a frozen meal that was positioned to reach mainstream consumers in the U.S.? I think that is progress. John Craven, you're crunching on things. You haven't said anything in 10 minutes. You've been crunching on these chips. What is that? Sorry, busy crunching. These are the Graza extra virgin oil potato chips. You just said that like it was just like, oh, yeah, it's the Graza olive oil. What, Graza has potato chips now?

21:33They do. I think they're already sold out, supposedly making more at some point in the future. I don't remember when, but they're really good, like cayenne potato chips, slow fried and Graza olive oil. So I went on real quick to buy these and I got an entire case of them and I only have a few bags left. I just sit around eating these like all day long. Gotcha. Well, what you just said sounded like a great ad for them. You're like, as a limited edition product, they're sold out. They're pretty good. I think they're coming out with another round of products, but I don't know. I don't feel like I just use my affiliate code.

22:08The Graza folks would be proud to use that as an Instagram reel promoting these. Now Mike's having some too. Jackie and I are just stuck here. I have to find the, what are the, the olive oil chips that are ubiquitous here in Spain? Well, there's the, what are they? Torres, I think. Torres, exactly. Those are delicious. I believe that it's a different company than the Familia Torres that I was talking about earlier in the show. Yeah, those are a little thicker cut. These seem a little thinner cut. Pretty darn tasty. They need a barbecue chip, then I'd be happy. Okay, a barbecue Graza chip? Interesting.

22:44Yeah, why not? Oh, I don't see that. As long as they're like cooked in olive oil, I guess it makes sense, right? Yeah, then just put a little barbecue seasoning on them. Come on. Also got to give a shout out from Expo West to Matt McLean, who is the founder and CEO of Matt's or Uncle Matt's. Uncle Matt's. A.K.A. Uncle Matt himself. It's not Uncle Matt's juice. It's just Uncle Matt's. And they make a variety of products. Most of them are juices. But they did introduce a new iced tea product that Matt mentioned. And it's not necessarily a Milo's killer, but is intended to go up against Milo's. It'd be that better for you option in the multi-serve tea category or multi-serve tea set, that is.

23:27I thought it tasted delicious. It's an organic brewed black tea. It is sweetened. It contains 40 calories per serving and 10 grams of sugar. But yeah, I mean, again, I think this is progress. I think for people who were drinking Milo's and are looking for a better for you option in that cooler case, this is a great option for them. Now, of course, it's probably going to cost a bit more. I believe he said the price point's right around$4.99. I don't know what Milo sells for. I would assume it's probably closer to$3.99 or even$2.99. But hey, you know, organic, less sugar, real sugar. Take it every day.

24:03We're going to talk about what Mike's drinking. What is Mike drinking? What is that? I think he's grimming about the arsenal. He just said, you should have heard what I told Ray on the podcast about Sokka. I'm going to post that right now.

24:17How'd you know? I'm drinking Beekeeper coffee here, and this is their horchata flavor, which is very subtly co-branded with Taco Bell. So subtle. Not very subtly branded. It doesn't say Taco Bell on it, but the Taco Bell. You guys didn't read the press release that came out. Didn't even see the press release. It's so subtle. Mike went up to the booth and he's like, hey. I was like, hey. He's like, hey. Did you mean to put the Taco Bell logo on your head? Yeah, he's like, you probably shouldn't use copyrighted logos. They're like, it's Mike. We're partnering with Taco Bell. I was like, okay. There you go.

24:49Interesting. Wow. Beekeeper coffee. What is beekeeper? I'm assuming this is coffee that's flavored with honey. Horchata. Sweet with honey. Oh, yeah. It is. It's all got honey in it. It's all got honey. And this one's got 2 % milk, coffee, organic cane sugar, honey, vanilla extract, natural flavors, and some stuff I can't pronounce. But 150 calories, pretty tasty stuff. Cold brew latte. Speaking of tasty stuff, you know, one of the trends at Expo West was protein everywhere, which I love. And Amanda Smierlinski, also our high protein expert, loves. Amanda's post, how I eat a thousand grams of protein a day.

25:25Right. She's not that much. She's figured it out. One thing she might want to try is this new chocolate or mint chocolate milkshake from a brand called Grounded that has got some traction at Whole Foods in the UK and is trying to come over here. I mean, this stuff is pretty tasty. It's almost in like a milk carton. You get 20 grams of protein. It's dairy free. Pretty tasty stuff. It's really excited to meet the founders. I just thought of a cool like advertisement that they could do a cool like promo that that brand could do where like they put images of other brands that have like lower amounts of protein in them.