Walmart Is Getting 'Better.' But Will Brands Benefit?

0:10Hello friends and thanks for tuning into Taste Radio the number one podcast for anyone building a business in food or beverage. I'm Ray Lateef, the editor and producer of Taste Radio, and I'm with my co-host for this episode, John Craven, Jackie Brugliera, and Mike Schneider. John and I are on the coast that some refer to as the best, which is the west. Best coast, west coast? Correct. We are up the street. We're not in San Diego. We're in Los Angeles, more specifically Manhattan Beach. I think the first time I came to LA for BevNet was in Manhattan Beach. We think we went the Simsies. Oh, yeah.

0:43Down by the pier. Yeah, we're kind of more in El Segundo over here, but it's right on the border. I mean, El Segundo is across the street. It is. It is. It's all good. You know where Zico was founded? El Segundo. No, I don't think it was founded there. No? I don't think so. Are you guys going to talk about how you can detect the rain because of your joints ache? Wait, what? It's like a geography conversation. Yeah, we're just going to really hone in on the geography and the traffic on the freeway this morning was brutal. Luckily, we avoided that. What everybody wants to know is John. Yes. Have you had Juiceda yet?

1:13And how many times? Well, twice. But I never went there. I had it brought to me. Yeah. Oh, wow. Bouncy. Yeah. Yeah, even Ray is going to house a breakfast burrito from Juiceda as soon as this is over. It's sitting out of camera shot here. I am going to have my burrito. I didn't have it ahead of time because I feel like I probably would have fallen asleep during this recording, which is not a good thing. But you know what is a good thing? The fact that I'm back here. I flew to San Diego last week and I flew home and then I flew back here to the West Coast to LA for two different things. San Diego, I was there to host the Naturally San Diego Pitch Slam, which was a phenomenal event.

1:54Jackie, you were there too. I think you can back me up that it was a raucous and fun and very rewarding affair. Yeah. Yeah. No, the energy is always so great at their pitch slam. They're playing hype up music as they're walking up on stage. It feels like you're in the pregame of a basketball game. It was really great. The energy was great. The pitches were solid. Everyone was just there to support each other and saw a lot of local San Diego brands and caught up with them, which was really nice. I know Loli's was the one that actually won the competition. They did a great job. They make better for you, clean dressings.

2:28And then Madly Hadley was the runner up, which they make plant-based foods. And specifically, I tried their plant-based bacon, which was really, really good. It was like these crumbles. And then Sipwell. Yeah, it's coconut. Oh, yummy. Yeah. And then Sipwell was the audience vote. And then Hillary from Sipwell did a great job pitching their canned wines and they debuted some new packaging, which they worked with Beck's brands on. It looks really, really good. It does. Yeah. I tried some Sipwell. I mean, I tried a Sipper too, before I got on stage. I tried another couple of sips off stage, but fantastic brand.

3:03Also great to see the founder of BAM, B-A-M, which is a maker of plant-based milk, buckwheat-based milk. Is that right, Jackie? Yes. And then Mesa De Vita, which makes a line of marinades and they were really, really delicious. And I feel like... Sipwell must be good because there was a time when you wouldn't touch a canned wine, Ray. I don't know about that. I don't know about that. I feel like every brand that we saw was polished and ready for primetime. And also, the founders who presented were outstanding on stage. Each of them had four minutes to present, no notes. They just went through their presentation professionally with a lot of poise, grace, and just deep understanding of their business and the category that they're participating in.

3:54And so I was really impressed with the level of entrepreneurship that I saw on stage. I was just happy to be there. And also, speaking of Madly Hadley, for folks who are at the event, and there were, what was that, about 350 people attended the event? Yeah. They probably saw me terrified when there was a, what was it, like a cheetah? It was like a chameleon, wasn't it? Oh, it was a chameleon. That's what it was. Yeah. So a chameleon apparently is the mascot. No, what? A live one? No, it wasn't a live one. It was a live human. It was a live human in a costume. I'll mistake a cheetah and a camo.

4:24I don't know. Yeah, that made no sense. I'm not sure. Too much canned wine. Exactly. Yeah. Too much canned wine. No, so while the founder was doing her presentation on stage, all of a sudden, this thing slipped up behind me, and it was someone in a suit crawling in all fours and just shocked me. I was like, ah! You know, and as I mentioned at the event, it kind of reminded me of Pulp Fiction. The outfit kind of looked gimpish in nature. And yeah. I should have warned you. I saw them coming through the side door. You were the only one. No one else. I turned around. I saw some other folks and they're like, where the hell did that come from?

5:05But anyway. Interesting. Yes. Very interesting. Now, John and I are here in Los Angeles attending an event called the Beverage Forum, which is being run by the LA Libations team, Danny Stepper and the folks. This is the second day of the event. As you might expect, the Beverage Forum is an event focused on the beverage industry. And it's been a good show. We have a taste radio studio here at the hotel, at the Westrift Hotel here in Manhattan Beach. And we've been interviewing folks all day. Well, I guess yesterday was all day. And today we'll be interviewing some more folks for the show. I was extremely happy and honored to sit down with the one and only Emma Chamberlain, the founder of Chamberlain Coffee.

5:48yesterday. I sat down with her and company CEO, Chris Gallant, which was really exciting. John Graham that yesterday, and I was happy to - That's what I'm here for, just a random - Just to Graham. Just post two Instagram. We'll be featuring that interview in an upcoming episode of Taste Radio. Stay tuned. Also sat down with top executives from retailers, including Albertsons, Walmart, Sprouts, and Gelson's. Very excited to share those conversations with our audience. And then I was both exhilarated and terrified to sit down with a man known as Quentin Rampage Jackson, the MMA fighter who could rip my arms off without much effort.

6:25Yeah. He was B.A. Baracus in the rebooted A-Team, the A-Team movie. So you might recognize him from that. But he's a very soft-spoken, very nice guy. But I did say one thing that got him a little agitated. He actually was like, I'm kind of sweating right now. I'm getting all like, I thought he was going to do something to me. Oh my gosh. You were trying. You were testing the waters. Well, I mentioned a fight that he had won, but he got booed for. So, yeah. So if you want to find out exactly what happened and why he was about to, like, you know, throw me through a window, you can listen to that episode of Taste Radio.

6:57It's coming soon. Ray, you know, it's always recommended to push the buttons of the large man who can kill you with one finger. Yeah, definitely do that next. Keep doing that, Ray. I mean, you know, my whole plan was to get thrown through a plate glass window and then sue the guy and then I'd be set for life. so that's not a good idea sounds like a bad plan okay bad plan bad plan right yeah yeah but john i mean you know you've been here as well obviously you know meeting with folks and it's been it's been great to sit down and oh by the way i did also sit down with the founder of a brand called the free spirits company which is a maker of non-alcoholic spirits and canned cocktails he dropped off myelin is his name myelin martin he dropped off some of the samples of their products including their new Kentucky Mule canned cocktail and their Margarita canned cocktail.

7:45These were just a few of the products that were being sampled here at the show. John, you have a can in front of you that was not sampled here, but it looks like a pretty delicious product. Yeah, the new Erwan branded kefir soda. I don't know. I haven't sampled it yet. Doesn't it need to be cold? Well, I don't know. Doesn't it also need to be pronounced kefir? I don't know. Whatever. It's too early in the morning. It's doing it all wrong. Too early in the morning? It's not even nine. Hmm. Pretty tasty. Watermelon lime. It's like 40 calories sweetened with Demerara sugar. I thought you were going to say it was 40 bucks.

8:15It might have because I didn't actually go to Air One. I just got Instacart. Okay, well then yeah. To bring me a really, really expensive bag of groceries. Do you tip well? We don't go to Juiced anymore. We don't go to Air One anymore. We just have it all. Of course I tip well. Come on now. What's your tipping percentage? I don't know. I'd probably go at least 20%. Oh, that's good. Outside of... Wow, that's great on groceries. I won't even get into it. I feel for the Instacart driver though. Oh my gosh, absolutely. I want to be your Instacart driver. Seriously. You know, here's the thing though.

8:44Here's a tangent on tipping. I don't even know what to say to that, Jackie. Can we talk about something that sort of grinds my gears? What grinds your gears? I think it makes a lot of sense to tip an Instacart driver or an Uber driver or any kind of delivery person well, to tip them well. 20 % is great. I am getting agitated and frustrated when I go to a store and buy, say, groceries, and you get ready to pay, and then they flip the screen over, their iPad screen, so that you can tip 20 % on the groceries that you picked out and now that you are expected to tip on. I get that tipping was important for folks and people who are working during the pandemic, but tipping for groceries that you're buying?

9:30First of all, I'll give you a tip that maybe don't buy your groceries at like the bougie wine shop in Brookline. Because typically when you go to a Whole Foods. That's the only place they have the pate that I like, though, you know. For sure. Understood. Just go buy the pate, Ray. But they don't normally have those at grocery stores. Yeah, I don't know what grocery stores you're going to. Mine don't do that. Okay, so. I get a discount for bringing my own bag. No, there are some places that do this. And it just, it really drives me nuts. And it's just like, can you, I mean, you're really. Don't be one of those guys.

10:02No, but you're not. I mean, like that is, that's aggressive. Raise grocery shopping at the store at the Four Seasons. All right. That was my. That's his rant. Stand in a soapbox. I just want to clarify also that I tip 20 % unless the 20 % amount is some embarrassingly low amount. Okay. Or the times I've done Instacart from Best Buy, that's actually a thing. Tipping 20 % on a single electronic device could be rather costly. So you don't always tip 20%. I would probably tip a flat, reasonable fee for the... So if you were buying a VCR... There's an asterisk. If you were buying a VCR that costs$90, how much would you tip?

10:39Well, I wouldn't get a VCR, but let's use a real-world scenario of like, there was this one time at BedNet Live that a certain, someone will call him Josh, needed a bunch of like, were there SD cards or hard drive? It was like 300 bucks, little tiny thing. Sure. That guy just went with 20 bucks as a tip to get one thing. The Josh he's referring to is Joshua Pratt, who is BevNet's technical director. I referred to him yesterday as BevNet Gandalf. And I think we're going to start using that as his nickname because he does have a big gray beard. He doesn't wear a wizard's hat, at least in front of us.

11:11I bet Josh wears a wizard's hat at home all the time, though. I think he's plotting to kill you. He has a better nickname, and it's Waffle Jesus. Waffle Jesus. Yeah, we'll have to show the image on a reel. I do recall when he did come into the office once and he wouldn't let me into his office for some reason. I was really upset about this. And he just kept going, you shall not pass. I was like, Josh, what is your problem, man? I don't know. Anywho. Fly, you fools. So here at the Beverage Forum, I was really happy to see the folks from Cognizant. Cognizant, as we know, is an ingredient that boosts cognitive health.

11:50and Cognizant is owned by a company called Kiwahako. Kiwahako also markets one of my favorite functional ingredients and yours too, Mike. That is an ingredient called Amuse. Now more than ever, consumers are looking for ways to boost their immune systems and Amuse gives them that edge. Amuse is the primary sponsor of today's episode of Taste Radio. It is a dietary and food ingredient clinically shown to stimulate immune function at the cellular level. Incorporate IMUSE into your innovation strategy and help your consumers optimize their health throughout the year. Learn more at amusehealth.com.

12:28That's I-M-M-U-S-E health.com. You know what you should have done, Ray? You should have had an IMUSE before you interviewed Quentin. Then you wouldn't have asked that question. I don't think any amount of IMUSE would be able to stop that man from ripping me apart. So you would have been really healthy going into that interview. I think I would have been overconfident and he still would have tore me apart. He would have just body slammed you into this table right here. I offered him 20 bucks to do that. He wouldn't do it. Good man. Good man. That rampage. Before we hopped in the mic, Jackie shared with me something that I didn't know about her.

13:05And that is that she is a big Walmart shopper. Someone who shops at Walmart on a regular basis. Groceries in particular. Yeah. So I won't go into Walmart. It just still scares me. I would never step foot inside of a Walmart. But I will gladly get like two hour express delivery from Walmart. And I mean, with a lot of people that have Amex cards, it's included with your Amex subscription. Yeah, Walmart Plus, which is their delivery. And I get primarily like packaged goods from them. And they've done a really good job in the last year to get more emerging brands, better for you brands onto the platform.

13:51So I usually, you know, buy my packaged goods and then I'll go to Whole Foods for my produce and for my proteins. It's worked out really well, especially when I'm using... What are your Walmart go-tos, Jackie? I get a lot of bonza from Walmart. Uh-huh. Siete Foods, like their tortillas. I even get like eggs from Walmart. Grabbing your granola butter. Calafia. Hero house. Interesting. Kind of like the essentials, the basics, you know? Yeah, I never would have guessed that. But Walmart is the biggest brick and mortar retailer in the world. And so it was great for me to have an opportunity to sit down with their VP of beverages.

14:26His name is Will McDonald. And he was up on stage at the beverage forum as well. And at the end of our conversation, I was doing some word association. I would throw out a category. He would tell me what his thoughts on the category. And the last category I mentioned was kids' drinks. and kids drinks, as you guys know, is near and dear to my heart. It's near and dear to his heart, as he mentioned. He has four kids. And so we were like, you know, why is it that when you go to an event, you go to a soccer game and then the drinks are busted out and it's like, okay, everyone knows the brands. I'm not going to say the brands.

14:55The brands are there. It's, you know, a six ounce juice box or pouch. And there's like 25, 30 grams of sugar inside each one. Like, can we not, can we not do, exactly, exactly. Can we not do better? I mean, really honest kids is the, I mean, I guess only better for you one that's widely distributed. And so he said, no, actually, I challenged him. I said, well, you know, Walmart, with your influence and the amount of buying power that you have, why don't you put pressure on some of these suppliers to reduce their calorie count, to reduce their sugar count? And he's like, well, you know, he gave us, he gave a good political answer.

15:32He's like, you know, we want to have a broad variety of products in our stores, but, But, you know, we also have the opportunity and the ability to create private label products, including kids beverages, that we feel will benefit our consumers, our customers, and will benefit, I think, just kids as a whole. And he mentioned, and he, I guess, alluded to Walmart's new private label brand, which is called Better Goods. It was announced yesterday. And as we reported on Nosh, Walmart is set to capitalize on consumers' growing affinity for private label offerings amid continued heightened food prices.

16:06And the great thing about this new private label line is that it looks good. The products that they're selling look like very high quality products that you would want to have in your home. And they actually look better for you. So as an example, they have an organic reduced fat chocolate milk that comes in an eight ounce plastic container for kids. And again, I mean, I think chocolate milk, a good beverage for kids, organic, reduced fat, checks every box that I would want from a kid's beverage. They also have plant-based mozzarella, chicken wings, restaurant-style chicken wings, premium ice cream, campfire roasted salsa.

16:41So all these things that actually look like, if you didn't know that Walmart produced these products, you would just think this is a high quality brand using better for you ingredients and speaking to a consumer that can afford these products, whether they are, you know, middle class or otherwise. Yeah, I believe that most of the products too are under $5. So from like an accessibility standpoint, I think this is great for people to have better for you options that might not be able to afford like a brand that's at Whole Foods. Exactly. Yeah. So in the story, the products will sit on shelf between$2 and$15.

17:15But as you mentioned, Jackie, the vast majority will be available for around$5. And I think this actually speaks to a topic that we've been eating around at the edges. We're buttoning around at the edges for a while now. And John, you mentioned this as I, as I do, I sit on my soapbox and talk about the need for big food companies to do better when it comes to formulations. And you talked about food insecurity and the ability for people to need to afford better for you products. And I'm, I'm, You know, I don't know how this line is going to do. I haven't had any of these products yet. But on the surface, this looks like this addresses that concern of people being able to afford better food.

17:53Well, I mean, it's a start for sure. I think the point I was trying to make ultimately was that, you know, to fix what you're talking or we're talking about, we need sort of, you know, an ongoing evolution of products. and certainly seeing kind of biggest retailer in the country in Walmart, you know, taking a step in that direction is positive. But, you know, I think it ultimately needs to prove that it's successful from a business perspective for them to stick with it and for others to follow suit. So, you know, I will definitely compliment them. Nice looking products. And again, I think, you know, it is a good move.

18:28And also looking at just the product mix from my own personal experience ordering on Walmart plus they've just, you know, really doubled down on getting better free products. And I think that they've probably had a lot of success with bringing in, you know, emerging brands and that showed them that, okay, this could be, you know, a great revenue stream for us, but also we need to provide something that's a little bit more affordable. So now people have options rather than, you know, just the standard brands. And I think this will just open the door for hopefully other better for you brands to get in the mix as well.

18:59Jackie, I know you are a discerning customer, so you must be reading these labels. How do they look? I don't have any experience yet. I mean, they look better for you. I mean, I think that's the key thing. And I mean, they're not perfect, but when you're looking at it and you're looking at that compared to what they usually have on shelf or what you would expect from Walmart, I think it's a step in the right direction. If you step foot inside of Walmart. Big Corporation. Is it like big corporation better for you? No. Or is it like... So if you go into, well, actually you don't have your phone with you, but on our Slack channel, I posted a link on the random Slack channel to these products.

19:37And John, you can see them now. I don't know if I can turn my iPad over to see them. But they, I mean, they look private label-ish, but they also look like a brand. And I'm sure there are some brands that are listening right now or some founders of brands are listening right now. And they're like, that's not a really good thing for us. I mean, I'm looking at, you know, they have a guacamole flavor tortilla chip that's made with cassava flour. And so I'm sure there are some brands out there being like, that's kind of stepping on our toes. And, you know, is this a good thing for us? But to your point, John, I think it's just better to have all this stuff out there and be more available for lots of folks.

20:11Yeah, I mean, it is certainly like, I think a rising tide floats the boat. but also get for brands that make similar products that some of these might undercut. And it kind of changes what a competing brand maybe has to do to stand out. But I think that's kind of the nature of the beast. And I think also some of the consumers may have not even known that some of these products are an option for them, or they've never tried a plant-based mozzarella, and then they're going to try it and think it's great and then look for other options. So I think it again like it's allowing consumers to have better options and then maybe expand beyond this private label i did mention this new line of products to seth goldman actually who was here yesterday i think he's here today as well seth goldman is the founder of honest tea or one of the founders of honesty and one of the co-founders of what would you call it a rebooted honesty just iced tea and uh i had mentioned that yeah walmart's getting to the private label game and coming out with a kid's beverage and he kind of paused for a second there and it made me wonder is just iced tea launching a kid's beverage because he was like uh what is this and then i showed him the chocolate milk he's like oh that's fine so yeah i don't know i wouldn't be surprised if we see just iced tea kids coming soon mike do you approve of the labels did you get to see them there do you like them i'm having a look here they i mean they definitely look better for you they're pretty rev one uh Super simple.

21:40I guess I'll dive into the ingredients and report back. Okay. Maybe you can use Jackie's Walmart Plus membership. Now, today is May 1st. The day of this recording is May 1st. May Day. I don't know if anyone celebrates May Day. Do you, Mike? You prefer Cinco de Mayo. No? You know me, right? I celebrate every day. You really? Cinco de Mayo. Oh, yeah. Cinco de Mayo is the fifth. Yeah. I said I prefer it. Oh, you prefer it. I'm planning for it. I thought you said, okay. I'm a May 4th guy myself. Ah, May the 4th. Yeah, there's a lot of those, aren't there? May the 4th, there's May 1st, or May Day, and then there's Cinco de Mayo.

22:17Anywho, there's also BevNet Live. BevNet Live is happening on June 12th and 13th. That's a Wednesday and Thursday in New York City. That makes BevNet Live a little less than three of us, six weeks away. And, you know, the industry as a whole will be there. and some of the most important people that you know and want to meet will be at BevNet Live in New York City. I always talk about this. I've said this on the podcast in the past. It is the critical mass for our industry. It's where people who are quote unquote gatekeepers, the most influential distributors, retailers, investors, all in one place.

22:55So I think we've talked about this in the past. If you're not there, we're wondering where are you going to be? You don't want that FOMO. You want to be in New York City with the team. To register for BevNet Live, it's extremely simple. Jackie, how do you do it? You just go to bevnetlive.com. BevNetlive.com. Just go to bevnetlive.com. We've got great content for you. We've got phenomenal networking where you're going to get your hardest questions answered. Just bring two or three of them. Ask everyone. If they can't answer the question, they're going to know the person who does and you're going to move your business a milestone or two just by attending the event we've also got retail one-to-one meetings so you can get registered for those as well there's of course the new beverage showdown there's so much going on at BevNet Live we can't wait to see you absolutely and I believe we extended early registration so that if you sign up now, I think you get two days probably or less than that to save at least$100 and more if you're an insider if you register now for BebNet Live.

23:59The point is you can save and you can find out how at BebNetLive.com Just to recap. Go find some savings. There you go. I just got, my beard is stuck to my microphone. I sit way too close to my microphone. Obviously. While I'm getting the hair out of my microphone, Mike, what are you sipping on these days? I'm not sipping on it. I'm simmering. Oh, simmering. Look at that. I thought that was bone broth. I've got some new simmering sauces and, well, sauces in general from the good folks at Red Boat who make my favorite fish sauce. They've got this Vietnamese simmer sauce here. And then there are two curries with one of my favorite words, lemongrass, spicy Vietnamese lemongrass curry and Vietnamese lemongrass curry.

24:40Can't wait to try these. Are you going to bathe in those or are you going to eat? Just chug it now. Come on. I might chug them. Yeah. I'm either going to chug them, bathe in them, shave with them. No, Ray, I'm going to make chicken or fish. I'm just thinking about when you chug some sriracha, and then you said you'll do anything for BevNet, Nosh, and Taste Radio. So I think the Taste Radio audience would want to see you bathe with those. You want me to chug some Red Boat? No, I didn't say chug. I said bathe. I'll go for it. We need a bathtub. Ray, we're trying to keep things PG-13. All right, fair enough.

25:14Jackie, what do you have you on your desk? I have the no alcohol company, non-alk wine. So it's alcohol removed. This is their Chardonnay. They also have a, I believe a red and a couple other whites. I saw them originally at Expo West. They sent in some product really. I mean, I feel like non-alk wine is hard, especially on the red front to like get the flavor, but this is really, really good. The packaging's really fun. I guess My only point of feedback is just, it's hard to tell what varietal is because it has a lot of no-alk everywhere. But it's really catchy. I think people are going to grab it off the shelf and want to learn more.