The gravity-defying future of manufacturing | Schendy Kernizan

0:03You're listening to TED Talks Daily, where we bring you new ideas to spark your curiosity every day. I'm your host, Elise Hu. If I have an idea in my mind and I have a pencil, can I draw it in space and then have that shape there? That's manufacturing innovator and TED Fellow Schendy Kernizan describing something that sounds like science fiction, but isn't. He's found a way to manufacture objects by printing them inside a gel that holds their shape in midair, with no molds, less waste, and no gravity to fight. He calls it drawing calligraphy in space. TED Fellows are early-stage innovators TED finds and supports.

0:41You may have heard from some of them on this show before because I'm a big fan of this program. It's a community of more than 500 Fellows from around the globe whose work reaches more than 200 million people a year. They're not just improving broken systems. They're building a better future for all of us. In Skandy's case, he's taking on one of the oldest systems there is, how we manufacture the things around us. And he replaces the assumption that we must rely on molds and force every body and object into a handful of standard shapes. In this episode, he shares how his process could make truly custom products, ones that fit your exact body accessible to everyone.

1:19But getting here was anything but simple. People often imagine that, you know, innovation is like one big breakthrough and you're done. But in reality, that journey is really created from thousands of different failures along the way. Stick around after the talk for Scandi's conversation with TED Fellows Program Director Lily James Olds. They get into how growing up in Haiti taught him to build things out of whatever was around. And the advice he gives his daughter that he thinks all of us could use. That's all coming up right after a short break.

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4:09And now here's our TED story and conversation of the day. I'm Skandy Kjelnizan. I'm creating a new way of manufacturing objects. I'm part of a company called Rapid Liquid Print that is rethinking how products are made. 3D printing, for those who are not familiar with it, that's been a technology that's, you know, really taken off in the past 30 years. Traditional manufacturing was using a method that's just been so outdated, not digitized. 3D printing became kind of the new way of making that people said, oh, this is going to replace traditional manufacturing. But the issue is that you need to build on a platform.

4:46So you always need a surface that you're starting with in order to create an object. And the more complex that geometry becomes, gravity starts to become a limitation of what you can make. And in order to circumvent that, you need to actually create support. and then you need to remove those supports. So it's really kind of a manual effort of cleaning those pieces that are then discarded and quite wasteful. So 3D printing has almost become kind of this system that's great for prototyping, but hasn't really created that bridge from prototyping to production. We solve that by printing inside of this gel that holds the shape that you're drawing.

5:25You're able to eliminate graffiti. Think of the ability of, you know, if I have an idea in my mind and I have a pencil, can I draw it in space and then have that shape there? So you go on the computer, you draw the geometry that you want, and that information gets sent to the printer. And as the machine is moving, think of your arm moving that pencil around. The material is coming out of it and the machine knows how fast or how slow it needs to go and where it needs to be drawing it inside of the tank. The gel is mostly water that's been transformed into a gelatin. And think of hand sanitizer consistency where it can move, but it has structure to itself.

6:08And the viscosity is strong enough where whatever you extrude inside of it doesn't just pull at the bottom. And when it's done, you just let it there until it fully cures. You're literally doing calligraphy in space. You're able to make parts faster. You can customize the colors that you want. You can blend colors, create gradients of colors. And instead of having this mold that you then need to discard or put away because your design is different the next time that you build something with this gel, it's reusable. So you can extract that part, you rinse it with water, and you're reusing the gel to make more parts.

6:45So it's a reusable process and sustainable way of making things. As human beings, anything I touch, even from your phone case, usually having some kind of flexibility and give to it feels more relatable than having a hard surface that you're touching. Early days, there was another research group at MIT that was doing a lot of prosthetics, orthotics. They saw a process and thought, hey, this could be actually beneficial for us. And that led us to talk to more clinicians out there, more people in that space. People said, customization would be really beneficial, but I don't have a way to do that easily.

7:19Most of the time, what's really pushed on the patient is to wear, you know, small, medium, large because it's faster and easier to do. The downside to that is that you're being squeezed into something that doesn't fit you well. So we started printing and testing parts for them. And I remember seeing the first time they showed us pictures of their patient trying something that we had printed in our garage at the time. And hearing how, like, this is the best fit I've ever had. This is like really feels great on my body. That patient needed such a custom solution. And being able to scan patient in the morning, print in the afternoon, and have something ready the next day, it was exactly something that they were looking for that they couldn't do before.

8:01I think myself and others in the world, we would love everything to be customized to our bodies and our needs. Making mass customization more accessible to people is how I see the future. There are a lot of industries that can benefit from this. from toys to fashion, how cars are made, rockets are made, consumer goods and things that we interact with. Ways that we grow things or make things are going to be different. One of the things that I dream about is the idea that we can create new things that will inspire further travel, for example, in space or even habitats in space. We can kind of explore and come up with new solutions that maybe we haven't thought of.

8:41It does excite me to see that people want to use this tool to push their industry forward and try new things that they couldn't do before.

8:51Up next, Ted Fellows Program Director Lily James Olds sits down with Skinny Kournizan to talk about the childhood that made him a maker, what it takes to build something no one's built before, and where a technology like this can take us from the factory floor to maybe someday another planet. Don't go away. This episode is sponsored by Kohler Smart Toilets. The objects we interact with most are often the ones we notice least. But what if the most overlooked space in your home could be the most considered? Kohler Smart Toilet challenges that assumption. Their Veil Smart Toilet is a sculptural silhouette that isn't just intentional, it's a philosophy.

9:31That design changes everything. The Kohler Veil Smart Toilet is sleek with a rounded shape that's more like architecture than just plumbing. and it goes beyond looks. The touchscreen controls and customizable cleansing features offer a level of comfort and cleanliness that exceeds expectations. It's all about elevating those ordinary daily rituals into something extraordinary through thoughtful design. Kohler has been pushing these boundaries for over 150 years, mastering that balance of stunning form and high-performance function. That's a long time to get it right, and it shows in every detail.

10:03Experience the difference of Kohler Smart Toilets. Find out more at Kohler.com. With no fees or minimums on checking accounts, it's no wonder the Capital One bank guy is so passionate about banking with Capital One. If he were here, he wouldn't just tell you about no fees or minimums. He'd also talk about how most Capital One cafes are open seven days a week to assist with your banking needs. Yep, even on weekends, it's pretty much all he talks about in a good way. What's in your wallet? Terms apply. See CapitalOne.com slash bank. Capital One N.A. Member FDIC.

10:47Hi, Skendy. Welcome. Hey, Lily. Pleasure to be here. Before we get into the work in more detail, I would just love to hear a little bit more about your origin story. Like, take me back. What first sparked your interest in materials and making things? Thinking back, I would say I was very influenced by my parents early on, especially my dad. He's a civil engineer. So growing up, I spent a lot of time around construction sites and watching things being built from the ground up. I became extremely fascinated by the process of turning an idea into something physical. At the same time, I grew up in Haiti, where you learn pretty quickly that you don't always have access to the ideal tools or resources.

11:34So if something breaks, you figure out another way to either make it or you improvise. You become creative out of necessity. Some of my earliest memories are seeing kids building kites out of trash bags and sticks, or even watching artisans transform an old oil drum into beautiful sculptures, furniture, and artwork. So looking back, I think that's where my fascination with making things really began. Was there an object for you as a kid that changed how you thought about materials? You already mentioned those two. I'm curious if anything else comes to mind when I ask that specifically. I don't know if it was one specific object.

12:16I remember as a kid riding bikes with friends and my brothers, we used to take dry almond leaves and like stick them on the back of the wheel tire and it would make it sound like a motorcycle. So to me, that's like an example of something so simple as like a piece of leaf and sticking it to a wheel and changing the sound to become something else that, you know, as a kid you could imagine and create. I love that. Yeah, we use playing cards. So it's, you know, the same all kids around. You know, you said something that struck me that as human beings, things that are soft or that have flexibility and give, that they can feel more relatable to us than something that's hard and rigid.

13:01Tell me a little bit more about that. When did that realization first come to you? And can you give me an example? Well, this is actually very personal for me. I was born with what's called a club foot. So it's a condition where the foot is turned inward and downward because the tendons are too short or too tight. So at a young age, I had to wear bulky, rigid braces and medical devices. So looking back, I don't think it's a coincidence that I've always been drawn to soft materials. Having grown up wearing rigid braces, I really develop an appreciation for products that conform to the human body instead of forcing the body into something rigid.

13:46That's such a meaningful example for kind of something that didn't quite fit your body right. What, as you were growing up or beginning your career or whenever it makes sense, what was something that was a good example that you thought, oh, interesting, it can be done in a different way that caters to the body or the movement that's best for you or the individual? That's a great question. The simplest answer, I would say, is clothing, right, ultimately, or just any kind of wearables. It's just what we naturally create to conform to anybody and different shapes, et cetera. So to me, that's more of a natural give of a product that fits to the body than hard plastics.

14:30Okay, jumping ahead a little bit here, where did the idea of the gravity-free gel come from? So the technology and the idea came from a research lab, right? It was called the self-assessment lab. And that environment was constantly exploring different ideas across architecture, materials, robotics, and manufacturing. There was never a single like aha moment where everything suddenly clicked for us. We really kept exploring different ideas. And over time, those ideas started to come together in ways that honestly we didn't plan for. It was kind of unexpected. And we had been exploring new ways of fabricating like large scale structures, how soft materials behave differently from rigid ones, and how manufacturing without relying on traditional mold or support structure was kind of really complicated and it wasn't being pushed.

15:24So we thought to ourselves, how can we take advantage of what 3D printing was doing, but not be constrained by making things that were layer by layer or fit inside of a mold? So that question led us to, you know, experiment with supporting gel that could suspend materials exactly where you wanted it. And instead of fighting gravity like conventional manufacturing does, we realized we could work with it. So once we saw that it worked, we knew we were opening the door to an entirely new way of manufacturing soft materials that didn't exist before. You said it in such a, as if it was just an expected way, but like the gel.

16:04I guess I'm just so curious. I know it was through research, but were you guys trying different materials for a time? You know, were there others doing things like this that you thought, what if we took away those structures? It's just such an interesting material. Yeah. The one thing we always hear from people and always think it's funny is that people think like this is such a simple concept, right? Like how come no one else has done it before? And, you know, the reality is it is a series of things that we observe from existing technologies out there that were mimicking something similar or looking at one component of a system that works and saying, this is interesting.

16:44let's kind of keep a data of different things that either work or don't work and eventually let's combine them right and to your point earlier you know it wasn't just me working on this this was a combination of myself with other researchers and we eventually started combining the things that work from gel support or bioprinting concept that existed at the time combining them to what is traditional manufacturing good at what is 3d printing great at what are they not good at and eventually combining and finding the right combination of those things along the way, that led to what we do today. Even though it looks so simple, but it took years of experimenting to what we have today.

17:23I'm curious, do you remember what the first thing was that you made in that way? It's going to sound boring, but you know, the first successful prints were really just, I think people would expect like you were printing beautiful products from the gate. But in honesty, we're printing just simple shapes like lines, you know, tubes, just basic geometries. And the goal is that can we demonstrate objects or through those objects demonstrate that the material could actually stay suspended inside of the gel. And at that point, we weren't really trying to make something commercial. We were just experimenting and we're trying to answer one question.

18:03Is this even possible? And once we knew the answer was yes, the possibilities expanded incredibly quickly from there. It's funny when you say they were simple objects, I'm imagining, because I actually just got my kid his first 3D printer, you know, and we're working on printing like dice, you know, just like something very basic. But it is, it just feels kind of amazing when you can do it at home. I'm curious, you know, is your technology something that you see could become more mainstream or because of the vats needed of the gel? Do you think it's more for large scale manufacturing? First of all, that's awesome about your son and getting the first two sensors because that's it's great to kind of start, in my opinion, engaging early on with technology and kind of giving them a new tool to play with and kind of experiment with.

18:58I've done the same with my daughter, bought her like a 3D pen and try to figure out how hard that is to use. But also how can you circumvent the limitations to create something unique and whatnot. How old is your daughter again, Skandi? She is seven and three quarters. Okay. Yeah. My son's eight. So we're right in the same wheelhouse. Yeah. She turns eight in October. Oh, nice. But to answer your question directly, I think, you know, desktop 3D printers, they became successful because they allowed millions of people to experiment and try things, especially at the comfort of their own home. I think our technology for now will follow a slightly different path.

19:33For the foreseeable future, we're really focused on helping companies manufacture products, not necessarily hobbyists at the moment. Could it eventually become smaller or more accessible to a larger community? Absolutely. But right now, we're really focused on solving problems that factories can't solve. Yeah, that makes sense. You mentioned how this printing technology isn't as wasteful a process as 3D printing. I'm wondering if there's a concrete example you could give us. I mean, you even said, you know, 3D printing is great for certain things, but there are limitations. You know, to be extremely clear, 3D printing has obviously been a success.

20:14It's been a huge success when it comes to prototyping, rigid plastics, etc. But where it starts to struggle is with volume and soft materials, for example. If you think of seals and gaskets, right? Seals and gaskets are everywhere from cars, airplanes, factories, medical equipment, but they're still used in using a traditional manufacturing molding because 3D printing can't really print that soft or have the material properties that compete with what traditional manufacturing does, like casting and injection molding. The downside is that molding only becomes great if you're doing like thousands or millions of the same part.

20:57But if you need tens of parts or if you're just experimenting and starting a project or every part is slightly customized, that's where traditional manufacturing falls apart. And that's where our technology fits, in my opinion, where we're making mass customization more accessible. and viable for production. So instead of choosing between, you know, 3D printing and the efficiency of molding, our company is looking at bridging that gap. What are some other spaces or industries, I guess, where your technology is currently being used? Yeah, so we're seeing adaptation of our technology in different industries at the moment.

21:42So I've mentioned automotive where customers or printing seals and flexible components that go into a car, for example. We're seeing consumer brands, which is quite surprising for us, where designers are actually using our technology to create new product design. And then we're looking at, there's such a big push around robotics and humanoids, et cetera, that we're developing soft gripping systems that work with those systems in the future. And more importantly, we're seeing more growth in the medical space, which is where we started exploring, you know, wearable devices for patients. So to be honest, it's not one single application that's exciting.

22:23It's really about all the breadth of opportunities that, you know, we're opening up with our platform. Don't go away. We'll be right back with more of Scandi's conversation with Lily right after a short break. This episode is sponsored by Kohler Smart Toilets. The objects we interact with most are often the ones we notice least. But what if the most overlooked space in your home could be the most considered? Kohler Smart Toilet challenges that assumption. Their Veil Smart Toilet is a sculptural silhouette that isn't just intentional, it's a philosophy. That design changes everything. The Kohler Veil Smart Toilet is sleek with a rounded shape that's more like architecture than just plumbing.

23:04And it goes beyond looks. The touchscreen controls and customizable cleansing features offer a level of comfort and cleanliness that exceeds expectations. It's all about elevating those ordinary daily rituals into something extraordinary through thoughtful design. Kohler has been pushing these boundaries for over 150 years, mastering that balance of stunning form and high-performance function. That's a long time to get it right, and it shows in every detail. Experience the difference of Kohler Smart Toilets. Find out more at Kohler.com.

24:01dot com slash bank. Capital One N-A member FDIC. Meet Amazon Ads rising star Daryl Spencer, who set out to redefine men's self-care with his brand Crown Skin. Amazon Ads helped him grow. I walked away from big tech to build a luxury brand in a category that no one was paying attention to. With the help of Amazon Ads, I'm reaching relevant audiences and competing with the biggest names in men's grooming. We've scaled to over$500 ,000 in monthly revenue. Watch Crown Skin's story at advertising.amazon.com slash rising-stars.

24:44What are some of the limitations with this particular technology? There are still many things that, you know, we're still learning we are either good at or can't do yet. And that's really because of material science. So we need to explore more materials to see how it behaves. some things are either too thick or too thin for us to produce. You know, printing a solid block, for example, is not something that we're good at, right? Those are not the geometries that we go after. So we're testing different geometries and chemistries to help expand what our library will be good at. But solid pieces, 90 degree corners, not good at either because it's a liquid.

25:24So it has kind of a radius to it when you're printing it. So those are some of the examples, I would say. And obviously, we're focused on soft material. So we don't do hard plastic components, at least not yet. It can seem so inevitable when you're speaking to someone in an industry that it seems like, oh, this is a brilliant idea. And of course it worked. I'm wondering if you could take us kind of behind the curtain when you were building this with your co-founders. Was there a moment that you genuinely doubted it could be successful, a kind of a moment of failure or something that made you want to walk away?

25:57I'd love to hear kind of what was overcome to get to where you are now. Oh, man, there's so many moments along the way. And those moments, to be frank, they don't go away, right? We still have moments today as we start to develop new features or try to onboard new materials. People often imagine that, you know, innovation is like one big breakthrough and you're done. But in reality, that journey is really created from thousands of different failures along the way. And there's been weeks where things were not working and you're frustrated and then you're spending so much time on one problem. And then as you work on that problem, you're discovering new problems along the way.

26:43And it always sucks. It always sucks. But every time something finally clicks or works, right, no matter how small that may be, it is that moment of reminding like what we're doing is really hard. And if it wasn't, then someone else would have figured it by now. And to me, those are the things that keeps us going, right, along the way. Yeah, and I guess it's always that question on the journey of what keeps you going? What is the thing when you hit that not first, not second, but thousandth failure that allows you to say, okay, maybe I'm going to take a day, but then I'm going to keep going? What has that been for you on your path?

27:24Given my role, some of it is not even technical. Some of it is like finding the right hire or having the right amount of funding to get us to the next level, for example. And when you get a lot of no's along the journey, you get frustrated and you have to kind of still be motivated to go, all right, what did I learn from that no that I can kind of take and apply to the next conversation? so as much as my role has evolved from being more hands-on to more vision focus and having conversation about funding is always let's say a tough one but then you go to work the next day and you interact with the people there and you see the excitement you hear the laughter even though things are hard and that motivates me and I think it motivates a lot of the team members to just keep going you know we know why this is exciting we know why it's important maybe that person didn't see it.

28:19And maybe it's my job to make sure they get it next time. But that doesn't mean everyone's going to think the same way. So you have to kind of keep pushing. You spoke a little bit about your dreams for this technology and how it can help inspire innovations that could be used for space travel or habitats, you know, far, far away. What do you hope this actually looks like in, I don't know, 5, 10, 15 years? How can this technology help us get to these new realms of possibility in terms of manufacturing? You know, when we think about time and we think about the evolution of products in manufacturing, right, like it's very rare that over time there's a whole new way of making that's invented.

29:05And to me, that's what I think this technology is, right? There's a whole new way that is being created. and it's about teaching people how this is going to be the next best thing for the next 20 plus years my hope isn't simply that like rapid liquid print becomes successful it's that it will expand what's possible right it's gonna unlock things that just don't exist today whether those expansion happen here on earth underwater or just someday on a whole different planet that's what gets me excited. And that's what I hope for this company, at least what we're building, is going to trigger. For people listening who want to learn more and kind of get their hands dirty and explore materials and the processes of making things, what would you recommend?

29:54Obviously, we talked about our kids, but I'm wondering like if there's an adult who's like, I've always wanted to kind of learn about this more. What would you suggest? Like, where might they start? I would tell them probably the same thing I tell my daughter, you know, when I drop her off at school or camp or any activity. I always tell her, have fun and be brave. Sometimes being curious is not enough. You have to try things that feel unfamiliar. For example, I studied architecture and today I run a manufacturing company, rethinking how products are made today and also in the future. So that wasn't part of my plan and that's okay.

30:32So I would tell people it's okay to be afraid, you know, to fail when you're starting out, but don't let that stop you from actually starting. And that would be my recommendation for anyone who's interested in exploring and trying things out and getting their hands dirty. And that's what I like about kids, that they have that ego to just try things before they understand the limits of it. So be more like a kid. Such good advice. Skendi, thank you so much for this conversation and just for sharing your work and ideas with us. It's really been a joy. So thank you. Thank you.

31:09That was Skendi Kernizan in conversation with Lily James Olds. To learn more about the TED Fellows program, which supports a network of global innovators, and to watch all the TED Fellows films, go to fellows.ted.com. And that's it for today. This episode was produced by Lucy Little, edited by Alejandra Salazar, and Fact Checked by Ava Dasher. The audio you heard at the top comes from the short film made by Divya Gadongi and Owen McClain and story edited by Corey Hajim. Additional support from Lily James Olds, Leonie Horster, and Allegra Pearl. This episode was mixed by Steve Bone. TED Talks Daily is a podcast from TED.

31:48Our team includes Martha Estefanos, Oliver Friedman, Lucy Little, Emma Taubner, and Tonsika Sangmar Nivang. Additional support from Daniela Ballarezzo, Valentina Bohanini, Banban Chang, Brian Green, and Lainey Lott. I'm Elise Hu. I'll be back tomorrow with a fresh idea for your feed.

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