Joseph Nguyen

28:30And it's worked pretty well. The best market so far is actually India. Interesting. Yeah. Why do you think that is? Likely because they're deeply spiritual. And so many of them resonate with it. And a lot of them speak English there. It's almost as much as their native language. And the English version is doing incredibly well over there. Great. Instead of just the native languages that are there, which there's over like 10 or 11 or something like that in different dialects. So it's so many. So cool. But it's spread all across the world. Totally unexpected. You could never imagine it. No, I couldn't.

29:06And it was always a distant dream of, oh, it'd be so cool if I could have a translation. But then I let it go and all of a sudden it happened. But I think if I really tried to get it and forced it, it probably wouldn't have worked well. It's so cool that in this antiquated industry, you carved your own path without really knowing in advance how to do that. No, I had no idea. No experience. Yes. And even nowadays, even after I've done this, most people still don't do it. Yeah. I've never heard of half of what you talked about. Yeah. I thought it was a normal thing until I started talking with other authors and they're like, oh my gosh, like, what do you even do?

29:44How are you even doing that? Like, what is it? You print your own books. How is it even possible? You have a warehouse and it's just so foreign. And to me, I'm just like, it just seemed like the next logical step to do. But I think going into it without any preconceived notions was the greatest strength that I could have.

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31:43how quickly did the 30-second readings grow it was in a few months but i really need the comments i did what would people say luckily they were all really mostly positive so people would say that this seems like it would be something that would help them or they've thought about this before, but they couldn't articulate it. They had breakthroughs just from listening to those few lines or they haven't heard it in this way prior, or they relate it to their own experience and they're saying this might be Eastern philosophy type of concept or it ties into Christianity. There's so many people now write to me from every religion possible.

32:32Even people that are psychologists use this, counselors, and Buddhism, Zen, Taoism, just name it and they've read it and they've resonated with it. And so I don't want to say it's transcended religion, but it's not limited by one particular religion. And I think it just resonates with people. Had you studied all of those before writing? I haven't studied all of them. And the studying that I would do is just probably light research around it. I was born and raised Catholic, so I had deep experience within that realm of Christianity. It's very interesting because I had to let go of a lot of those structures to be able to see beyond it.

33:17And then I did look a lot into, well, Western philosophy, more so like Plato, Socrates, and then even Nietzsche and things like that. And then Eastern philosophers, so more so Alan Watts is more Western, but he gets a lot from Eastern. He was a brilliant, I would say, harmonizer of the two worlds. And that's what I attempt to do. Buddhism is a massive influence on it as well. Zen, Taoism. And you weren't researching those for the book. You were researching those for your life. That's correct. For the book, I actually didn't research any of it. So I have this process that I will ingest information.

33:59There's seasons. So there is a season for just intentional consumption of whatever I'm interested in, not passive. And it just is bombarding me. That usually doesn't do well or go anywhere. And then I become a victim to the whole economic machine. but through intentional consumption, probably very similar to how you listen to music. That's what I do. And then when I start writing, I go on what I call an information diet. So I eliminate everything and just write. I don't look at all these other references, books, and all these studies because when I do it, if I'm reading something and I'm writing, I write like what I'm reading.

34:39So I go through that pause period. Most of the time I am, actually in that information diet, it's probably 5 % to 10 % of my life that I do some sort of consumption. Other than posting 30-second clips, did you do anything else? I did reach out to a myriad of different book influencers that reviewed nonfiction books. So it was just people that loved reading nonfiction and would just share it. They would highlight the book and write their own notes on it. And I just saw that seems like a great way to share the book. And so I sent them the book. I would pay them whatever that they asked for. And I didn't know if it was going to work.

35:22I just assumed it would because I see that their accounts are doing really well. It's the same principle of where are the eyeballs? So you paid them to read the book? Yes. I didn't know that. I didn't know that that ecosystem exists. Yes. So that's what happens. And what's nice is if the book isn't good, it won't go anywhere. Of course. So it's just distribution. And then if it does resonate, then it will take off. And so that's the beauty of it. But that's why I always like to be able to post on my own as well and not have to rely on someone completely for the distribution of the book. If you pay somebody to read the book, would they always say they loved it?

36:01No, they would not. So that's the thing. So I never said you had to review it in a good way. And that was actually a lot of great ones. They would say, I'm going to review it how I'm going to review it. Yeah. Most of them did have great reviews of it. Some did not and outlined why they didn't like it. And that was totally okay too. Not everything is for everybody. Exactly. How has writing the book changed you? It's probably changed me in every way imaginable. it's allowed me to become much more reflective. It's encouraged me to slow down. It's expanded my capacity for different beliefs. My patience has grown as well.

36:50I've also been encouraged to let go of so many different things. In order for the book to be born, that's what had to have happened, the death of the previous self. But did the change happen when you started to write, when you finished writing, or when a lot of people read it and liked it? It did nothing after a lot of people read it and liked it. After the book was done, I wouldn't say that I wouldn't change anymore. But the book itself, it didn't lead to additional transformation. I had to go beyond the book in order for that to keep going. One of my great friends, he says, the structures that build us become our shackles.

37:33And then we have to let go of those structures and therefore the shackles. So I had to let go of a lot of the book and the attachment to it to grow and beyond it and to explore new territory. And you started a new book? Yes. Good experience? Very challenging experience. How was it different than the first experience? This one was under a publisher. Right. So it's different. There was expectation. And as much as I worked to let go of those, they're always there. And so I love the self-publishing aspect because there's really no, there's no expectation. So the pure existence of something like that, like a publisher or an external entity, it alters the art.

38:18It could be good. It could be bad. It just depends on the person and how they relate to it. for me i think it was good in a sense that it forced me to grow in a different way that i haven't before so it was a very tight deadline i think i had about a month and a half which yes i wrote the first one in a month and a half but it took me a lifetime to get to that point where i couldn't do it and now i only had two to three years to live before i could write this one And this one, you could say it's technically say it's more advanced, but it's essentially after. Once you've learned how to regulate your emotions, find more peace in your life and don't believe every single thought that comes to your mind.

39:05What do you do now? What do you listen to? How do you know if it's intuition or anxiety? These are the questions that I answer in the book or attempt to, because that's what I wanted to know for myself. I don't know what I don't I didn't know the answers and so the book is an exploration of what that could be and hopefully it's helpful but because of that tight deadline and then the external pressure it was much more difficult and then I had to create ways that that revealed the path of least resistance so what's interesting is for this book I wrote more from my voice than physical writing or typing.

39:42So you spoke it? Yes, I spoke the book. That was actually the only way I would be able to hit the deadline. Otherwise, I would have written probably half or less. But in doing so, I realized that there was a faster transcription process. I do sacrifice a little bit of precision, but I think the emotion is still there. So now I just unlocked a new way to write. Did you start the same way by having a series of questions? Correct. Each chapter is a question and you spend time answering that question. That's correct. For yourself. Yes, exactly. And the core question from the book was, what do we listen to if we no longer listen to our mind?

40:25At least the judgmental, thinking, opinionated, egoic part of our mind. And to me, that was intuition or the heart, the soul. You can say God, whatever word works for you, that's beyond the self. And then the secondary question to that is, if we know that that's what we're meant to listen to, because most people have heard all the time, listen to your heart. But why don't we then, if we know that that contains the answer? That's the second part of the book. And the root reason for me of not following that, which I knew in the back of my mind always, was one answer. But I thought it was other people's judgments.

41:08It was circumstances. I can list a million things, but it all came down to one root reason, which was fear. Other people, the opinions, expectations, all these things are external. But as soon as I was able to let go of fear or allow it to be in my body and not have to listen to it, or for it to command me, then I was able to follow intuition. So most of the bad or negative habits, destructive habits that we have is a reaction to fear. And so that relationship we have with fear completely determines our life. And so that was really fascinating to explore. Are you happy with the results, even with the pressed timeframe?

41:54I think overall I am. I believe that if I had more time, I would be able to let go of those expectations and pressure and be able to, I would probably be able to write a little bit more and make it more comprehensive. But for the constraints that were there, I'm very happy with how it turned out. And you don't necessarily know that if you did do that, that it would be better. I don't. You never know. Exactly. And so all I can do is be at peace with it. Yeah. And if it helps, awesome. And if it doesn't, that's okay too. Have you ever done any type of therapy? I have. Tell me about that. Many different modalities.

42:35So I've done traditional therapy, hypnotherapy. There's other forms of healing like Eastern that are similar, like acupuncture, acupressure. I learned and read a lot of Dr. Joe Dispenza. I went to his seven-day meditation retreat in Cancun a few years back. How was it? Incredible. It was essentially seven days of meditating for at least three to four hours. I've never done that intensive meditation. Usually it's maybe 15, 30 minutes. And it was really amazing to see other people, just being in a room with other people also doing that type of work was very powerful. When did you first learn to meditate?

43:19It was after I read Eckhart Tolle's Power of Now. That was the first spiritual book that I ever read. Beautiful book. Amazing. When I read it, I did not understand it. but something deeper in me said this is the path but the ego is like what do you do okay in life once you let go of all this it just why wouldn't i just go in the middle of the mountains in a dark cave and just become a monk and just meditate all day but it took years after that to truly understand what it meant and to embody it and to live it. So I started meditating likely, it's got to be probably about five to six years ago. So it's very, very recent.

44:08And it's not as intense as a lot of people might assume. I'm not doing it to a very, very high degree. I do it for what works for me. Well, I struggled a lot with meditation because while I was meditating for about the 15, 30 minutes, pure bliss. I think most people can find a little bit more peace if they do that. What was very challenging for me was as soon as I opened my eyes, an hour later, I'm right back to baseline anxiety of worrying about what do I have to do next? What's on my to-do list? Life hits you. And then for me, it was very difficult to find that same level of peace that I had during the meditation.

44:51And it wasn't until that I started asking myself, what is happening during the meditation that allowed me to be at peace? And can I apply that same mechanic with my eyes open? So once I started to do that, I realized that if I just observe my thoughts and don't have to believe all of them or to entertain them or to argue with them or to resist them. And I can just let them pass and I can follow my intuition. That's not only how I can meditate well, but to remain in a meditative state throughout the day. And that to me was more important than my actual meditation. How do you know now when something comes up in you, whether it's intuition or a thought?

45:41So if it's just a thought, it could be a neutral observation, such as that's a tree, that's a thought. For intuition, it's very distinct. And the best way I've figured out for myself of how I know that it's intuition is a couple of characteristics. So one is, it actually makes the acronym SAGE. So the first one is S, which is serenity. Does this feel like peace or some underlying aspect of that? The next one is aligned. Does it feel aligned with me, my being? G is growth, which is, is it facilitating some sort of growth within me? And then E, which is emotion, is it rooted in fear or is it rooted in love?

46:36And if it is at the intersection of those four things, I can simplify it to three, which is peace, alignment, and growth. If it checks those boxes, it's likely intuition. So intuition is very rarely going to bring you back to what you've experienced before.

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48:34Tell me about your relationship with your parents. My relationship with my parents is quite odd. I love them to death. And there are so many, a range of emotions with them. Growing up, deeply Catholic, they spend almost all their free time at church, volunteering, teaching. My dad was servicing youth group for a decade plus. He was the only one that would do it. No one else could do it. I asked him one day, I was like, you've been doing youth group for so long, everyone loves you there. And like, it seems like you're thriving there. I'm like, how do you like it? He's like, I don't like it that much.

49:10He's like, I'm just doing it because no one else will do it. So my dad is an interesting figure in that way. His ultimate virtue is sacrifice. Even if he doesn't like doing the thing. And that almost goes antithesis to how I operate or we would operate, which is we got to like the thing that we're doing. We're not going to do it just because it may help someone else at the cost of our own peace and happiness. But my dad. It's not sustainable. Yeah, it's not. And I see that he's stressed a lot, right? And bless his heart. But I just can't live like that. And I admire him for doing that. And so one of the highest forms of love in this type of complex relationship is to allow other people to suffer, which sounds very, it doesn't sound good.

49:58No, but it's their choice. It is. And I want to honor that. Of course. Rather than try to take it away or get rid of it. Or that you know better than him how to live his life. I don't know. It's insane. Yeah. So I had a very difficult relationship with them when I was trying to do that. saying, you don't have to suffer. Like, why are you doing this to yourself? But that just created a chasm between us where we could never see eye to eye or connect. But as soon as I let that go of needing to change them or trying to help them, oddly enough, the closer we got. And my mom and dad still want me to go back to the Catholic church and practice that as the stole religion.

50:43And I asked my dad one day, because he does this interesting thing where he'll just say, one of the first things, if I see him after not seeing him for a few weeks, he'll be like, I got about 15 years left. I'm like, that's great, dad. What a way to open a conversation. But he's like, I'm trying to make the most of every day. I'm like, that's great. But what you speak may come true. So be careful about that. So I asked my dad one day, as I was just trying to connect more with him, I was like, dad, if you're saying you're going to leave soon, what's like the last thing you would want me to do? Like, what, what is that thing that I could do for you that you'd be like, yeah, my life is like complete.

51:26It is done. I can go. And he said, I just want my son to come back to the church. It's beautiful. It's beautiful that he's got such strong faith. Yes. And he wants to share that with me. And so all the emotions came up from that, which I was like, oh my gosh, he is saying that that's his last dying wish. And if I don't fulfill it, I mean, he'll definitely be sad, right? But not like his whole life is ruined. No. But he is saying that it would be absolutely wonderful and it would make his life feel more complete, if that was the case. So there is, of course, a little sense of guilt there coming up where I do want to do that for him, but I won't sacrifice what my beliefs are for his beliefs.

52:20But I think him and I, just hearing him say that was a bonding moment in and of itself, even if I could not fulfill it. For sure. So I think that's where my parents and I are now, which is we're closer than ever. even closer than when I was part of the church. But even though we're not practicing the exact same religion or same spiritual kind of philosophies, we can still honor what we're doing individually. During the time that you were trying different things, different therapies, when you were a seeker, what things did you come across that you found most helpful? The way that you phrased the question is very interesting because you said when you were a seeker.

53:05Yeah. You continue to be? Well, I don't know if I would identify as a seeker. Okay. I guess you could label it as that. I think when I was looking for the answer most intensively, the answers eluded me more. That made it more frustrating because I was doing all the things. I was meditating every day. I was reading books. So I was going to the retreats. I even went vegan for a while. I was doing acupuncture and learning different modalities. And I was doing so much and it felt like I wasn't making progress. And I felt stuck. And it was weird because as soon as I stopped seeking, the answer came.

53:48I think it was because I was open. It also sounds like the reason you would stop seeking would be that on some level, you must have given up. Yes, I did. Yes, I did. Because all the modalities. Nothing worked. Yes. So then in giving up, it created the space to allow the thing to happen. That's exactly it. Without space, nothing new can come in. And I was so busy trying to fill that internal void up with all these things, even if they were good things. There was just no space for insight, no space for healing. Even though I was doing all the healing practices, it didn't allow it to work. It's really hard to force the body to heal.

54:35But we get in the way a lot of the time. If we keep poking at the bruise, it'll just stay there. But if we stop poking it or a cut or anything like that, it heals on its own. Yeah. So now I don't know if I would identify as a seeker. I think I would identify more as a surrenderer. I gave up seeking too, which is counterintuitive. And that paradoxically allows me to experience more and find more and discover more in life. The curiosity is still there, but it's very, very open. in terms of what helped most with all the modalities that I tried. I believe meditating is likely the one that had the biggest impact.

55:18Therapy was nice and it's not bad. But for me, what happened was I was just rehashing the past over and over and over again. And I couldn't break through. And it made me feel worse because I was just bringing up all these emotions again. So in meditation, I learned how to observe without attachment and without labeling it, without judging it, without resisting it, without wishing it were different. And through that process of surrender, that's what allowed me to be free and to heal finally. During the process of writing, do you have anyone that you would show any of your work to as it's happening?

56:03or not until it's finished? Yeah, I actually don't show anyone until it's done. The whole book. Yeah. Well, this last book was different and we had to go on such a quick timeline that I was basically sending chapter by chapter. But my preferred and general writing method is completing the full draft, editing it myself as if I were the sole editor, not delegating that part because the editing is still part of the art. And then once I feel like I've taken it as far as I could, then I'll pass it to an editor. It's funny because my first book, I edited it myself. And then I had someone on Fiverr, because I didn't know what I was doing.

56:51I just had someone on Fiverr edit the book for a few hundred bucks. And that was kind of it. They didn't add too much. They would point out certain things, but it was pretty much edited by just me. I think an editor can be good to help point out certain things where you might have missed things or want to elaborate more on. But I did do most of it. And I do enjoy editing it almost entirely myself. With the first book, who was the first person who read it? My wife. And how did she react? She's my biggest fan. Oh, great. Yeah. and i always tell her it you don't have to like i get that you took a vow to me and you're married to me and you want me to be happy but like you do not have to just hype me up and make me feel good you can say it's trash and i'll be okay because then i'll have something to work on but every time she reads it she just says this is the best thing ever and i love reading it and she doesn't read nonfiction other than memoirs.

57:56So she loves reading fantasies, romance, some literary fiction. She reads a couple hundred books a year. Wow. It's great that she's so supportive as well. She is. Can you read to me something from the new book? Let me see. It'll be fun to read. Yeah, because I don't really read my work afterwards, after it's kind of published. Okay, here we go. The root of overthinking is fear. You're not stuck in indecision because you don't know what to do. You're stuck because you're afraid of what you will lose if you choose wrong. Fear is not an indication that something is wrong, but that you are on the verge of something right.

58:45Fear is not in the way, it is the way. I love it. And I love the idea of fear being an indicator that you're onto something new, something good. Yeah. It's a helpful framing to change that feeling of anxiety to one of excitement. Yes. Tell me something you believe now that you didn't believe when you were young. A personal one growing up was I believed I wasn't really good at anything. I was decent at most things, slightly better than average than most people at whatever I did do, but never the top. So because of that, I did hold a belief of I was just going to be a pretty average person at whatever I put my mind to.

59:35And even in business, I was also incredibly average, fascinatingly average for how much effort I put into it. And it wasn't so much that I changed my belief around it. I just let go of wanting to be good. And then everything changed. And then the book was written. And now people may regard it as good. I still don't really have a particular judgment of whether it's good or bad. That's not really my role or authority to say that it is. but holding the inverse belief was quite damaging. And then a more universal thing I used to believe that I no longer do is more so believing that I needed to understand everything intellectually and to have an opinion or judgment on everything.

1:00:37so even if it's just a thought of walking through and oh it's really hot outside totally unnecessary yeah like my own judgment of the temperature created unnecessary suffering when it's objectively 82 degrees or 90 degrees whatever it is But the story around it, my judgment of it creates all of that internal turmoil. And I didn't understand that I could just not do that. Nobody told me that. I didn't have to think about everything. I didn't have to judge everything or make a conclusion in some way. They'll decide. Yeah. And nowadays it's particularly difficult because people say, oh, if you're not with us, you're against us.

1:01:27what if i'm just neutral and that is also seen as an enemy now so it's it's very interesting to see how the landscape of politics has changed but i think being neutral or balanced is likely a a more harmonic way to live rather than too much on one side and i'll still flip every now and then And as I learn new things and all that. Yeah, of course. I change my mind all the time. Of course. I actually change my beliefs all the time. Yeah. So what I believed a year ago, I still don't believe anymore. Everything is questionable. And I do my best to do that. And so if it's what is useful may not always be.

1:02:15And so I do my best to discard what no longer is true, even if it gave me what I have now. that's really wise that's beautifully stated appreciate it really helpful yeah really helpful and i i only learned by getting beat down so many times i was incredibly stubborn and until i had to learn a lesson so many times especially if i make a conclusion on something or someone yeah nothing is definitive everything is always changing so if if i think something about someone And that is not absolutely true. It's only a piece of what I see of them. So to say someone is ultimately bad or evil is an injustice to them and a disservice to myself.

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