RZA

27:32It's 10 o 'clock, whole with the fuck, just see that. Chill with the feedback. So the feedback also from the feedback or the mic feedback with the beef feedback somebody gives you. We don't need that, right? Cinnocloc, whole with the fuck, just see that. Remember that commercial in New York, come on TV. It's a now saying, fill in that hostel. Where in El Apostle, flowin' like Christ, when I speak the gospel. So now, flowin' like Christ, when I speak the gospel, that goes back to me getting that first pamphlet, the bread of Christ, right? What happened with my mathematics in it? Then in the very next line is a Buddhist line.

28:07It says, flowin' like Christ, when I speak the gospel, I slow with the Holy robe. So the Aberde -Syland, or the Aberde -Bool Chambers, where that Holy robe, in the Holy robe represents their position. So I slow with the Holy robe, then attack the globe, with the bucket, style, the rockus. Now we got rockus, ten times ten men committing mad sin. Wait, though we were righteous, we'll be committing mad sin because you turn the other cheek and I'll blink your fucking chin. And that was the idea of the idea that when Malcolm and Martin were teaching, Martin was saying turn the other cheek. But no, he was still getting beaten down with sticks.

28:48Right, so no, we got to break a chin, we can't offer you a cheek up, right? Turn out to your break a fucking chin. Then I went to this as regular hip hop slang boom bang, it's like African drums. It will be comin' around the mountain when I come. That's the fun of it. Then we go into the political line, crazy flamboyant for the rap enjoyment. My clan increased like black unemployment. That's stupid, but it's like, wait a minute, you increase some black unemployment? Yeah, another one. There. There goes another pop stuff right in the middle of the lyric. Then I passed on Mike the Jailer. Genius, take us the fuck out of here.

29:22Then of course, he goes into a very descriptive, very detailed way about industry. Clear. Without, it's still multiple meanings, but one thing about the juzza is that he also provides you the surface view and the beneath the surface view. Where as for me, I hide a lot of the surface view. You got to go beneath the surface. Yeah. You figure out that. Yeah. Your lyrics are more oblique. Yeah. Let's say. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'll take that one. Yeah. But the beauty of that is, it feels like your lyrics are for the initiated. But do you know what I'm saying? Yeah, you got to know. You got to know. You got to know.

30:08Yeah. Yeah. You know, we, you guys ever talk about lyrics like each other's lyrics or you just did your verse and then next rapper does their verse. Yeah, not, well, as a producer, I was definitely able to shape even sensor and direct lyrics. And that's basically in the first five albums I would interject, you know, but as time went on, there was no need for interjection. Everybody had mastered their craft and master who they were. So now, and so in the process of it being competition, do you feel like there was competition within the group? Yeah. So everybody wanted to outwrap everybody else.

30:49Yeah, this is MC's. Is that part of what makes Wu Tang so strong? Yeah. It's very interesting. I never thought of it. Yeah, the Juza said, the Juza had a lyric. He said, I forgot the line in front of it. But the punch line was, the clan makes me rhyme like D -Banner on the pressure. So you know, D -Banner is, right? So he's about to turn to the Hulk because the clan is making him like, Yeah. When Dr. Banner gets pressure, you got to go into the Hulk and fuck what these dudes do. You know what I mean? And you'll hear it throughout our lyrics. You'll hear us say something like, this one made me do that.

31:29Yeah. You know, I mean, just almost like a battle in a way. Yeah. It is though. It's very interesting. I never thought of it that way. Yeah. And at different times, different one of us wins. Yeah. And the thing that was crazy for us is that, so when they say that Juza is the head, it's because he is the foundation of our political skills and approach. Right? And for many years, it was his determination. Like, I'm the abbot. So even if somebody comes for me for the determination measure, I didn't go to him. You know what I mean? Because of my respect and reverence of him, he's the one that had me pick up my pen.

32:12He's the one that had me study my knowledge, right? So he's my enlightenment. And so I always go back to my enlightenment. And doing the tip of the years, you know, and sometimes it just be me and him. I like, who's the best in the clan right now? And to be different ones. Yeah. And I mean, that was the best. And the way the listener wins, because they get, they get the best of you both. Yes. And at one point, Killer Priest was the best. Yeah. At one point from the Wu family, it was a year when everybody was like, Killer Priest is the illicit MC. Yeah. I was pissed off. You know what I mean? And I came to beat Killer Priest in 97.

32:56You know what I mean? If you go back and check my lyrics in 97. So even though Ghost got the best lyrics of the year on that song, and possible, because he was like, call the ambulance. Jamie, he been shot. He pitched you right there. Yeah. And it was such a dramatic ghost lyrics or incredible. Yes. Such a dramatic. But Joseph came to me and said, you have, you've got the best lyrics. Because of the content, the fusion of the five elements. Right? That's dealing with the diowism alchemy, the search for the higher intelligence. Women walking around celibate, little and light be relevant. The most benevolent king can communicate through a dream.

33:37A mental picture is formed, a large hole is seen everywhere. You're surrounded at atmosphere. Don't miss the atmosphere, stratosphere, stratosphere. Can you imagine from one single idea, everything appeared here. So understand it makes the true crystal clear. There's still got innocent black immigrants, 85 dependence. We're for every sub -election house in tenements. And my neighborhood has been stamped, right, as a concentration camp. But nighttime I walk through with my third eyes. Brighters of street lamp. And there's electric probes. Electric strobes, robotic probes. They take the telescopic pitches under the globe.

34:17While babies being born, with microchip stuff and stuff, they're illoges. And they're vaccinated. Lots fabricated and exaggerated. You know what I mean? Food and drug administration, testing, poison and prison populations. It's like, it's a lot of sick going on in there. But call the ambulance, Jamie, this shot. Where's the chimney that don't go? You're my mother fucking heart. That was somehow. That's incredible. Yeah, incredible.

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36:17Did you think of yourself primarily as an MC or something else? Well, I think my first form of art was MC. Before producing. I wrote my first rhyme at the age of nine. I recited my first rhyme at the age of eight, but that was with Jussa. So I first started by reciting a copy in his lyrics. And another MC who never really made it out of the hood named Scotty Wadi. So him and Jussa, they had their tapes early. And I would copy them. And then at nine, I wrote my own lyric. Similar to this. And then I think by the time I was 13, 14, I think I was good. Some of the lyrics that ODB says are the ones that I wrote when I was 14.

37:08Because that's the make him write. And then he would end it. I'd give him a mind. And so that's why sometimes I'm on some of his cadence. Or some of his lyrics may have seen not as deeply potent as some of the wool brothers because he would just take what was already there. Because he realized that into the day it's a song. It's a performance. He said, I want to go on the mic and rhyme and rhyme and rhyme and rhyme. Fuck that shit. Should I make his head? He says that right on his song. You know what I mean? I want to sing up in the air. Come on, do it. Everybody come along, come along, come along, come along, come along.

37:47Like he says, he's performing. And we didn't catch that. We learned that from him. You know what I mean? We learned that. Wait a minute. You have to put the performance and animation into it. And the personality. His personality would come through where it wasn't necessarily about the words. But it might be your favorite verse. Exactly. That's the point I'm making. Yeah. Because he realized the performance was even stronger than trying to boggle somebody's head. Right? Whereas, you know, some of us are trying to boggle your head. It's because it wasn't worth it. It's worth it. Yeah. Some of us are trying to show you how dangerous they are.

38:30But the Rayquan first, you know, listen to the first blue album and listen to his early features. He always got 16 shots. You know, he busts and shots in his rap. And he's, and he got, and he's talking about his cars, his sneakers and his guns. You know, I'm in because he's a street dude. You know, I mean, and ghosts, you know, you know, ghosts are a street dude. You could feel the danger in this model. You know, I mean, maybe like you hear the shank sleeping on the wall. Like he'd be, but then deck. I said, I think I'm going to go through with respect to deck though. Yeah. He's looking at it through a magnifying glass.

39:05So if, if Ghostface saw the license plate and he wrote that in the lyric, deck saw the tag was inspired. You know what I mean? And that's why his lyrics are, I'm automatically, Socrates philosophies and hypotheses can't define a lobby drop in these margaries. The other people form on robbery, fleed with the lottery, possibly they spotted me. Yeah. It's like, damn, that's a lot. And for a lot of... He's bringing in those verses. It was just like a exuberating, fun, young energy. And to be quite honest with you, when you were young like that, I think each and every last one of us thought that we were the best one.

39:54Yeah. Nobody didn't think that he did it. He beat me. Yeah. It's like, yeah. And if you did, thank you, beat you on that one. You beat him on that one. Yeah. So you couldn't tell you, God, that he don't got the best lyrics. He's not gonna... What... Brother, you're still being motherfucker, I eat your shit up. Like, you're not going for that. You know what I mean? He thinks that how he think is the thing. How they... Have they ever been a group before with the internal competition like that? I don't know. I'm not aware of it. Yeah, I don't know. Like, that's something that we should maybe open up the floor for and have us think.

40:31Because it seemed like most groups of compliment each other. Yeah. And we do compliment each other. Yeah. But it's different. What you're describing is different than that. Yeah. Because we have... We approached their pop. There's also never been a group with that many rappers before. So that's another big piece of it. But we approached their swordsmen. That's why it's called the Wu -Tang Clan. Yeah. These are all warriors and their tongues, their sword. And they're pointing at... Whenever they got a point at that, even at each other. How would you describe your production? It's hard for me to describe it, right?

41:03You know, I can add on to the description. I actually believe... Two things about me. One, I believe that... There was no other way to define my production other than hip hop. That's what I believe. I believe that all the producers, you could define it as jazz, funk, soul. Especially in 36 Chamber. I don't think you could... What is this shit? It's hip hop. It's like, that's what it is. It's nothing else. Yeah, it's... So I think... It's not even a variation on anything else. It's pure hip hop. Yeah, that's what I think I was... That's something that you could look at me and see. Yeah. And then the second thing I think that's so awkward, but weird.

41:49But potentially, it's very true. And I felt true about this for a long time. You know, especially for the first 10 years of my career. I felt like I make beats for people with an MC tool, not to dance to. I make beats that's made to challenge the MC. Okay? And if the MC could catch it, it could catch my vibe. Listen to Method Man. You don't even hear people take my beats and freestyle over them. Maybe cream, because there's very... There's a couple. But you don't hear other rappers take my beat because it ain't easy. But you gotta be an MC to do it. And you can't even be a rapper. And you think that's because you were an MC first.

42:31Yeah. I made beats. I want to have you beat first anyway. Yeah. If I could run to it, you could run to it. If you can't run to it, you're not a good MC. Yeah. And at one point, we thought rapping and MC was two different things. We really felt that way. You know what I mean? We felt that... How would you describe the difference? Well, a rap is like... Is like anybody could rap almost. Not anybody. Almost. You know what I mean? A MC is... I guess I could try to describe it in a lyric. The MC, you say, I ain't going to say that I'll be using it. The MC means the master confusion. Right? MC is always like time moving constantly.

43:22Okay? It ain't just move the crowd, which he has to move the crowd. You know what I mean? But I had a whole lyric when I wrote down all the different things that an MC must do. You know what I mean? He must match the competition. And I think that an MC is almost like the difference between the Jedi Knight and a Samurai. Because the Jedi Knight has a light saber. Right? And not only is this light saber powerful, his force is powerful. You know what I mean? So I know this is all using... You know, trying to explain something that... That's where I can't explain that. But there's a difference. And you can hear it.

44:06You can feel it. You know what I mean? You can feel it. So you can have anything to do with the music. Because it feels like when you first said it, what I heard was that a rapper writes words that you could probably say on anything. Whereas an MC, you could only say it over the particular beat because it's connected to the beat. That's a piece of it. That's a good digesting of it. Look now it's the MC. It's a fight. Even if you took away all the music, it's still potent. Absolutely. That's another way of looking at it too. What happens if you take away all the music? Right? Is it potent? What happens if you write it down?

44:56You know, is it stronger? Yeah. Right? So an MC is more like a poet, we may say. He definitely has to be part poet, right? Where's a rapper is more like somebody doing the songs. That's a good argument. Because the poet, you have to be a poet and deeper than a poet, right? Because, you know, I grew up on the crime side, the New York timeside. That's a lot right there. That's the New York timeside. That's a lot in that one phrase. Stand alive with no job. Okay, that's simple. I had second hand. My mom's bounced on Old Man. So then we moved to Shaolin. In four lines, right? In Mully Mel, a child is born with no state of mind.

45:48Blind to the ways of mankind. God's smiling on you, but he's frowning too because only God knows what you've been through. Even in those four lines. A lot of information. And MCs tend to do that. And they do it in a way that even if you hear it 20 years later, it has the same thing. Now, no, there's just a deep... Because it's deep. You're saying that MCs lyrics have a depth that make it timeless. Yeah. Yeah. That's a fact. Tell me some of the technical standpoint how you would go about production from the beginning. Okay, on a technical standpoint, how I want about production, the first thing is shoes, whatever you got, right?

46:30So of course, I started with the turntable and the four track. We said a four track. Is that the kind of four track? Yeah, I'm a four track. And this is like maybe 16, 17. So the first thing is just a square tape recorder. When those tape recorders... Yeah, they had planned record. They put the tape back. To set recorders. My cousin Ramsey had one. Ramsey is old dirty bass. It's big brother. So he's a few years older than us. We got to be... He's going to be a head of us on everything. Record collection, rock and roll. He's a good tall player, keyboard player. He got the turntables first. Everything, right?

47:07The old dirty mother and father worked for transit and for 9 -1 -1. They liked the Jefferson and some of my family. My family is the Wehrfehr, 11 -Kiss Wehrfehr family. But the first thing was this tape recorder. And comic books and a shoe box. And that's what the dramas were. And we just wrap it to the tape recorder. And play that back. Then of course the Kanye comes out. And now you got the two tape recorders. And then you do in Paul's tapes. Would it be Paul's tapes from Stuff You Record of the Radio? Yeah. Or Forever Yup. Or turntable. Yup, yup. Whatever you could get. A track form or a beat's form.

47:45But before that though, I heard the song flashes on the beatbox. And so I said, what is a beatbox? So I already had a pair of turntables. Straight arms. Sadly. But went down a few - Did you have a mixer as well? At a mixer. So newspapers that get this. Let's give you a little back. G .L .I. What was the mixer you had? No. No, but it wasn't even a Gemini. Eventually I got a Gemini. Eventually I got - It's more like I got the $60 ship. Yeah. I mean I didn't have, you know - Yeah, like Radio Shack. Do you remember where you got it? I got it from Forteve Street in Manhattan. Remember they had all that - They had like a monitor and all the boom boxes and everything.

48:25And they had the rhythm box. When you just get walks, slow rock, bossing over. But if you push two buttons together, what happened? It had changed into something different. And if you hit the fill button. So that was my first technology demo. And it wasn't even a roll. I know Roland kinda maybe invented it. But by the time we got it, it was some generic brand. They're coming business, get out of business. All right. So then all of a sudden, 14 years old, high school. I see a 606. That was like a small white drum machine. It's silver. Yeah, it's more silver, 606. We borrowed it from a guy. And he had to basically pull the gun to get it back from us.

49:09Because I was like, this is the - This is the Grail. But my 606, 707 comes out. DJ Dr. Rock from the For some Cs had a 707. We went to his house and made demos with DJ Dr. Rock from the For some Ds. And I mean, 14 years, I was 14, 15 years old. So we got Dr. Rock on the 707, Rizzards just at ODB doing songs. And this is before the rest of the world are starting to make their demos. You still have those recordings? I don't have them. Somebody does. Somebody does? Oh, cool. I'm glad they exist. Yes, somebody does. So from the 707, the 909 comes. And then my DJ gets one of those DJs, Scotty Rock.

49:48Not like Scotty Rock. He had his name with Scotty Rock. Then with Scotty Rock came out. Everybody thought it was him, but it wasn't. But anyway, 909. So now I got a 909. Yep. Four track. Two turntables. And then the Casio RZ1 comes out. With the four paths for pole sampling. That's my original setup. And that's demos from the age of 16 to maybe two years. Because then the SB 1200 come out. Right. And so did theasonic EPS. I had an SB 1200. So the SB 1200, you had to take the time. No, it was very limited time. So you used to speed the records up to 78. And then slow it down. And then the machine, which gave all of our sound, that other ring that we didn't even know was part of that sound.

50:40We didn't know that. That's how you get this. I didn't know that that was why the ring was there. But that's why I always had this ring. And you listen to a lot of dope tracks. And it was Easy Mode B, who had the 1200. I used to go to his house. Because my manager was looking for tracks for me. And I saw that. I was like, I get one of those. And then when I got it, my other colleague slash rival. I mean, it was another DJ in my projects. And you know, he used to make songs with ghosts. I make songs with ghosts. But I learned that he was kind of colleague rivals. But he had the EPS. But the SB 1200 was considered cool.

51:24And he's like, yo, I'm going to Virginia for the summer. And I can't take the EPS. I'm off in my family car. When I let you hold an EPS and you let me hold an SB 1200. I was like, cool. That was like, because the SB 1200 is a drum percussion. The EPS is a keyboard. Yeah. And I didn't know that I'm more of a keyboard player. And now I know. So only because you were being cool. Yeah. And now I'm like, I'm a keyboard player. That's what I like. And I remember that my cousin had the cashew. And I played with the keyboard. So now when I was on my keyboard, I can play my sample. I can sample one note and fucking go up and down the key with it.

52:17With the drums playing. Yeah. What the fuck. And then I mastered that keyboard. You listen to the early rule, because of course the EPS then went to be the EPS 16 plus then eventually to the ASR 10. That's the thing. And when the rule comes out, they'll say, you know, you can take your old district into the ASR 10. The first 100 tracks that I release besides bringing the pain and maybe this 10, that's 12 hundred tracks in my catalog. But most of those songs are ASR, it's Sonic tracks. And that became my technology all the way through. And then I would take the NPC and MIDI it with the ASR 10 and that's how do you get triumphed.

53:04Because now I mean the NPC is the most powerful as you got to admit. But it wasn't what I started with. Once the NPC takes me back to the drum. I mix that with the fucking ASR 10 and that's the Wu -Tang Forever album along with now now you know people getting the sound modules, the 1080s or the 2020s from rolling. You get the Nord lead come out and the digital synthesizers are there now in the late 90s and all that becomes my arsenal and that became how I did it. And then I now you know I was giving them one level and then I became a keyboard lord. Right meaning if they made it I bought it you know 50, 60, 70, maybe 80 keyboards in my life.

53:49You know I mean they make one I buy it just to fucking master it. Make some 10, 20 tracks with it that you ain't never here and then I go I treat I guess those became my girls. Yeah I mean. And so I was collecting keyboards for years and I ran through many of them. And I became Bobby Digital. I had all my keyboards in my studio you know like I do have it. And I caught it the my digital orchestra.

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55:56Tell me about becoming Bobby Digital. Vivo becoming Bobby Digital was a step backwards. Being the result for those years from 1993 up until 1999, 1998, 1999, I didn't realize my success. Meaning economically, I was pretty monotonous with my relationship. I think I did almost like three years, that's what one woman was, which is weird for artists. But I wasn't into it. Like after we would take forever, being rich and being loose and seeing the world and also having some internal problems in my household. I just cut loose. You know what I mean? And then when I cut loose, I just became a heath -onistic, and be quite frank.

56:51And then also I became more consumption of substances. And then also I just had this, I had like a vision, a foresight vision. I've been blessed, you know, every few years with a vision. And there's time it was that everything is going digital. You gotta leave the way.

57:15That's the sound of, you know, I've made a joke on myself. I'm gonna share this joke with you. So my mother named me Robert Fick's Gerald Dex after Robert Kennedy and John. She put those two names together and named me Robert Fick's Gerald Dex. And when you name Robert, sometimes they'll call you Bobby or they'll call you Robbie. I started thinking, well, am I a robot? Like I asked you question myself. Like is there something in me that's like, there's something I don't know. Like am I physical, am I digital, am I a robot, am I a man, am I a god? Like all these questions was as zone into me, and especially at this period.

57:58And I think it was a few things happening in my life. I think the trauma of what happened in my personal life, the trauma of Wu -Tang, it's almost like, this is Korsheng -Wala, what we had here. And Dasker said, almost having one of them. You know, I was fortunate to be free in 1997. I was fortunate to be given the gift of mental freedom. And it all happened from watching a flower grow and die in one day. So I was blessed with that. But then a few days later, something very traumatic in my personal life happened. But I was free. So it effect me like that. And then the Wu -Bloathers around the same time decided that we're not going to finish the race against the machine tool.

58:53And everybody just started scattering it to the own way. Tell me about that moment in time. Tell me about the tour. And then tell me about how that happened. Yeah, well, we were on the biggest tour of our career. Wu -Tang and Rage, 30 ,000 kids a night. Good show. What a show. What a show. Especially at that time. I mean, you know, of course, you lived through Dev Jam, so you know, Beasties and Round Mind Fest. What was it called? Fresh Fest, I think. Fresh Fest, you know, you know the things that you guys had did. But it was hip hop wasn't getting these moments like this. Yeah. Right? P .E. and Ampthax maybe, but not this was a huge.

59:33And then my guys don't want to do it. You know, didn't understand the cultural relevancy of it. And I did. Yeah. I understood at that time. And it happened at one of our concerts when I saw all five families there. Black, white, red, brown, yellow. It was on the Rage tour that I invented this. Like these wings. The Wu -Sem. Yeah, the Wu -Sem. Well, I saw it. I saw the people. My mind was like, we got to get through something. And here you got the five families on this side. It's fitted all together. Yes. That's the Wu. But the crew didn't get it. They rather do the college shows. And they thought that we was kind of selling out.

1:00:17That would be quite frank. Because the audiences were big or why do you think? Tell me what you think it was. More white, than ever. I see. Okay. Not sure what the big ass right there is. It was different. You know what I mean? And we from the hood. All of them felt that way. No. Except you. No, no, no, no, no, enough of us that you're looking on stages for guys. Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah, yeah. This was like it wasn't so serious. And not to go back like that or the, you know, point any fingers. But I've even been telling them that we're going to do this first. Yeah. And then do that.

1:00:53And then do that. Yeah. It's all good. Yeah. And the way that way it was planned was like, we're going to hit the colleges in September. Yeah. And go through the homecomings. Yeah. And it's going to be crazy. Yes. And then when we come first of all, they put me in Zach on the cover, Rolling Stone. It's on. And one thing about wool is all alpha. You don't got no non -alphas. And they gave me five years in 1992. So in 1997, what did I mean? Five years is up. Yeah. And was it from the beginning? Was it discussed as a five year plan? Yes. Five years without interruption. Yeah. Five straight years.

1:01:34Yeah. And that's, that's a lot of work. Yeah. But now we added here, where it's not your work. We get to say, we want to say. Yeah. So now it's different. Yeah. So for five years, they agreed that you would lead. Yeah. But after the five years to be discussed. To be discussed. Right. And even though the contract, I think one of my lawyer contract amended it like so. No. I was like, the contract on me said doesn't mean anything. Yeah. If everybody's not into it, it's not going to be any good anyway. And I've been said that to myself. My time is up. My time is up. I'm good with it. But it was hoarse.

1:02:15Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Just because he'd worked for five years to get to that point. Yeah. For that opportunity to see people. Yeah. And so it hurt. So that was part of the hurt. And then the personal thing was part of the hurt. And then the exploration enters me. Explorations in women. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Rich. Yeah. Would that not have happened had the who stayed on course? I don't think it would have happened. Because you probably would have been too busy. Yeah. I wasn't outside. Yeah. Like that. Yeah. Because in. Yeah. To be quite frank with that. I wasn't outside. You didn't see me outside. Yeah.

1:02:57I wasn't mysterious. Yeah. Yeah. What the f***? No. Abit was a must but you also you were working. Oh, definitely. I stayed like it was all work. You could smell me from the front door. Yeah. You know what I mean? That's how I was. Yeah. And I'm not. I love it. I love that. I'm grateful for it. But the question was how do I become Bobby Digital? Yeah. Well, now it's on me. Everybody is doing them. Now what I'm going to do. So I thought I do a real album. But I just had a vision that things were different. The world is going to change. And you got to go digital. And then you know, it was in my studio.

1:03:43And I had had some other MCs with me. The young MCs like Kilawe Army and. Suns and men and all type of dudes. And I just said, y 'all. You got to go digital. There's a fucking talking about. I said, now I'm telling you. You got to go digital. Everything is going to go digital. The fucking talking about the fucking talking about. You tripping. You smoking that sick. You tripping. I said, no, digital. And my studio looked different to me. It didn't look like that. It looked like almost like a future. Wow. You know, I mean, yeah. Even though nothing had changed, you saw it in a new way. Yeah. Yeah.

1:04:24And maybe you hallucinated that too a little bit. I don't know. But it definitely wasn't the same. And then, and I wasn't the same. And then did the name come before the material? Did the material come before the name? The idea chain. And then I named it. I see. Yeah. I was like, Bobby, digital. But now all of a sudden, because you know what it is too, I got to honestly say, and I don't know. Yeah. Right. You don't know. We don't know. We don't know anything. Exactly. But I can say that I wouldn't be able to do what I did as the Rissa. Because that entity doesn't allow that. Understood. Yeah. You know, I mean, the Abbott can't do that.

1:05:14And Bobby can. And I think it became almost. I don't know. I think the Rissa functioned within the Wu. I don't know. I think the Rissa even functioned within like, if you think about, this is my lyrics. This is an example if we can. Yeah. And you hear me. You know, I got, I recorded a song called, Sun Shower. Where, if you listen to it, it should guide you on the path to knowledge of self and some enlightenment. Trouble follows behind a wicked mind. You got 2020 vision of the prism of light, but you're still blind if you like the inner. So every sinner will end up in the everlasting winter of hellfire, where thorns and splinters prick your third eye out, your words fly out, but your sound die out and you'll be main unheard.

1:06:09And you will suffer eternally, internal and externally, along with wicked fraternals who led off thermonuclear heat, weapons that could burn you firmly and permanently, as you travel through the journal of the book of life, but those who took a life without justice will become just ice. It's been taught, Buddha taught, that your worst enemy couldn't harm you as much as your own wicked thoughts, where people ought to be wrought, and they listen not, but there will be persecuted inside a universal court. As iron hell was strong blend of jasmine and rose petals in sandalwood, as men be chained with craft and do an instance to reach higher dimensions, I'm convinced.

1:06:58Anyway, it's just like, you know, great lyrics. Yeah, it was a good say that. Yeah, right? Bobby, which I'll just talk about, get the fuck out my house, go out and grab you by your hands, slap my dick in your mouth. Sorry, what the fuck is that? That's not... Wow, Dizzy. Yeah, tell me who is he? Bitch, I'll slay trade you like Izzy. Can't say. Wait, he's fucking motherfucker. Bitch, you wish you could fuck. All you could do is dick, so... So Bobby Dizzy was more the more raw character. Yeah, he don'tistic lose the anger, the things that really already worked out. And so what happened was, I realized I had to go back because I was stuck in that cave.

1:07:44It's called the studio for those years. Yeah. And I said, hold on, I have to go back before I go to Risa. And I needed to go back. I didn't intentionally go back though. Yeah, yeah. It was just like, that's where it was coming out of me. That was coming out of me. Damn, that's... It's all just coming out of me. You know what I mean? And then I liked it too. It's like that for... And I did a $5 million deal with John Baker for the album. So now I'm like, fuck it. Who John Baker? John Baker was one in G Street Records. So John Baker, known for... P .M. Don. I think he had Ziggy Marley, Grave Diggers.

1:08:29And then he came and did the Risa album. So Chris Blackwell, funded John, Able G Street Records. And what you call him, Booked Walk of the Dill, Rage's Manager, the female Bridget. Oh, Bridget. Yeah. Yeah. So Bridget had did the deal. So you don't know what you don't know, right? And so hip hop, you know, my biggest record deal was the Wu -Tang Second Album, which is a $4 million deal.

1:09:00Most artists were getting $3 ,000. Maybe $600 ,000. A million was LL. You know what I mean? So we was able to broke our $4 million deal for Wu -Tang. I thought I was the man. And then I met Bridget. And you said, you know, people are talking about you should do your own album. This is after the tour. Like people like you. Fans like you end up industry like you. Like I'm reliable. You know what I mean? And I was like, well, you know, I'm doing good by myself. I want to do an album. I got so many allies. I'm with Leo. I got Steve. I got Wendy. She said, well, how much you think, you know, a rose album, you can you get it?

1:09:43I said, I don't know. I go get $2 million. At least I know I could do that. I said, whatever I could get you five. What would you call five million? That's more than Wu -Tang. Yeah. So they know. They said, you get hip hop numbers. I could get you rock and roll numbers. So I didn't know that. Yeah. They rock and roll. I didn't know that either. But wanted to want this artist in the rock. I mean, this is. I don't know. I really have no idea. Well, that's what she exposed to me. Whether it was a myth or a magic. Yeah, but it happened. Yeah, it's been. Yeah. And I actually gave a lot of the money back.

1:10:20Because when I signed the deal. I did sign his Rizza. You know what that means? No. And then that I didn't own the Rizza name anymore. You know, you signed a record deal. You become. The Rizza becomes part of that company. It's like. Anytime I want to do the Rizza, they got the right to. Oh, I see. And I was like, nobody go on the Rizza. Philosophically. Yeah. And it was like, no, what do you mean? You signed the deal. Like it's like Wu -Tang, like that. You know, if you want to record, you got to hit it. You pitch it five. You go through your five album sequence. I said, no, no. It doesn't feel right for somebody to own the Rizza.

1:11:00I don't even own the Rizza. And it's what you mean. And I told my lawyer, I was like, we got to get the Rizza out of this. The body could stay. Yeah. And Bobby's the one who's delivering the record. Yeah. And then it was like, well, you wonder what? I said, I'll buy it back. I want to buy Rizza back. And they said, okay, a couple million hours, you go buy it back. I said, I'll buy it back. They didn't believe it. I did it right before Christmas, too. Like, well, give my name back. Give me, I will not give my name back. Yeah, yeah. Let the Rizza beat the Rizza. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know we have an interesting conversation there.

1:11:35And I'm so comfortable with you. Because you're a travel. The thing about life, right? You've traveled, bro. You know what I mean? Yeah. And your travel is the roles you pass in the destination that you've achieved, right? Mentally, physically, spiritually, emotionally, economically, socially. All these ways of achieving. Push you at a certain seat, right? And so, an out travel so far as well. So then when two people meet at that certain seat, you know what I mean? It's just like, it's a different type of conversation. It's like, I don't even be around people like that. None of this even begins to fluctuate out of me.

1:12:17So, know that. And it's a pleasure to build what you want it. I appreciate that. But yeah, the RISA going back to the beginning of our conversation. You know, the whole different artistic curiosity or the way that I said different personalities. There's definitely an entity of energy. Which is interesting. Viana named her son RISA. Her son is named RISA. And it says I was like. It's very interesting because I don't use the name as much. You know what I mean? I use it. But not as much as I used it when I was using it. And maybe imagine 20 years from now. And let's say, because I don't think the RISA is just a name.

1:13:03I think it's a title. I think it's an entity. I think it's something. And I'm not being superstitious here. No, I understand. But imagine if he doesn't body that. Because the RISA job is to resurrect. It brings something back. You know what I mean? To help us see what we missed. You know what I mean? And in a hip hop way, it was hip hop was everything but hip hop for a moment. And I'm disrespect to all our greats who are adding on to it. And it can be considered part of hip hop culture. But it wasn't hip hop. It was what it was. But it had to go into the category of hip hop. The same thing happened with rock.

1:13:43At the moment, it's like, that's not rock. But that's all that rock is given. That's rock. But it wasn't, right? And it's just like somebody always comes. Entity or come, whether it's in any form or jazz guy or somebody to come that would be like, Oh, that's the prayer for. That's what we forgot. And then we build again. How do you describe your relationship to hip hop now? I think my relationship to hip hop now is one foot in one foot out. Like one foot in because I found data in it. And I'm always striving to somehow find a new path for it. And that's because there's so many people in here. I'm not going to talk about it.

1:14:35Especially from young people. And I even point even more hip hop is seem to be it's kind of classified. Because of the majority of hip hop or to practitioners are black. So it seems like let's say 80%, at least 75%. It's black. And you have so many of these youths striving to be in it. But all striving like crabs in the barrel for that one path of it. And so my foot that's in it is always trying to show another path. My foot that's out it, you know, making movies and say, you know what I mean? And classical music, classical music, you know, just expressing it even by me doing the classical. I would hope that somebody from hip hop understand that when you're making a beat, you're making a beat.

1:15:26But when you compose something, you're composing something and start composing, you know, your beats. You know, Jay said it on one of his little interviews. He said on point it out how a beat maker is different from a producer. Because a beat maker makes them beat. But then he has to produce the record. You know what I mean? And you know, that's one of the greatest producers from the culture and multiple genres yourself. And so that's how I see myself, one foot in, one foot out. Do you feel like everything you make films, classical music, books, somehow still are tangentially related to hip hop?

1:16:17I do think that. I hope it's not my ego, Sam. No, I think that's true too. I hope I'm going to say that. Because when you're established in hip hop, it's a way of looking at the world that you don't let go of. It doesn't disappear when you're working on another genre. Yeah, I think what they say hip hop is a culture, it's a way of life. And, you know, even as we chill, as we chill in, we still got a swag that's going to be way different than our peers. When they see it, even so, even when I show up to the symphony hall, I'm a little bit different, you know, I'm a little different. And the cool thing about it, like if you look at, I think Eminem is another good example for just using him as a great artist.

1:17:05It's the same. It's like, if Eminem shows up, he's hip hop. You know, it could be a thousand white guys there, a thousand artists there, a thousand musicians. He's hip hop. Eminem is hip hop, my little fucker. Okay? And that's what hip hop is. It's something else. But yeah, so I like the one foot in, one foot out, because I'm never going to take both feet out. I can't. I don't think I can get away with it. Yeah. I mean, I get away with it meaning it's already in my blood. It's in you. Yeah. Tell me about the Ubita album that there's only one copy and existence of it. Yeah, that's the whole another chamber.

1:17:43Tell me the story. Man. That's a lot of the idea happened. It was, it was really like, so my student, right? My student's silver rings. I let them in to the temple. The world and let them in, you know, and let them sit by the door, get them a lot of trust. Maybe too much.

1:18:11And there's almost like, it was almost like my student challenged me. Right? And was doing things that was not pure in the sense of ovulation ship, in the sense of the conduct that I would expect from him. But yet, doing something in the cause of what he believed was the right cause of Ubita. And in that process, right, we are accumulating songs, vibes, moments.

1:19:02And after the accumulation of so much, it was true ideas we was tangling with. Right? One idea was I wanted to make a better tomorrow. And theory practice, music, everything. I just thought that was that's what the world needed.

1:19:28And in the process of doing that, I also wanted to centralize the idea of a Wu Tang item. The centralization of it became a physical form where I first thought this, that our maker album, that will be a piece of jewelry, that will be either Bluetooth or USB to you. But you had to have this. It's the only way you could have it. At that point, when you think there would be one of them or no, you were thinking that the delivery system for the album would be the bracelet, let's say. Yes. But you would buy it like you would buy an album into old days. But very, very high price. I see. Very high price.

1:20:25And very well -mitted luxury item. Yeah. Yeah. That you could physically wear. Yep. But that you could also play it. Yep. And if you didn't have that, you could not play it. Yeah. It wasn't important. And you know, I may. And you, boy, was it honor and badge of honor. And then talking with silver rings. Somehow, he had got, like, it was almost like, he got a wind of what I was doing. Like all these peers. Right. And then.

1:21:06He sent me an image that was close to my image. And I was like, go carry it. We got to meet. And then when we met, he was like, I didn't get it from your image. This is how my inspiration I had as well. I said, well, what should we do with that? Like, it's like, like, it's like, well, we should just make it singla. I was like, make it singla. I can't be meditated on that. And I meditated on it. But I didn't decide to do it. It wasn't until, and this is not, I haven't shared this story yet. It wasn't until the world that equipped your opinion run. And while we was working on it better tomorrow, we had maybe four or five songs.

1:21:52And while we was doing it, we all got into a argument about my direction. You know, I'm there. It's throwing me up. I said, we rather, you might as well, we should put that one out there. The silver rings one. That should sound like a real woo album. All right. All the old beats and old sounds and all that. That's it. That sounded like a real woo album. First of all, how do you hear it? It pulls me secret. I just listened to them. And I called me and said, you fucking say, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. You only heard that piece and then I said, okay, we got a figure this shit.

1:22:37So it became almost like a challenge to make the most of something. Right. And what's the best way? And I went with his idea, more than I did, which was make it singled out. And then I said, well, we make it singled out. We got to wait there. I said, so we're going to just hold it. And I put out a better tomorrow first. And see what the world wants to do. And if the world don't respond, let me hit on with that. I think one of the fascinating things is where I probably want to deliver it to select, maybe, you know, select them out. Yeah. It has, like the people that really build a wall, have this emblem first at a high level.

1:23:33And then maybe, let's just say hypothetically, maybe first that this thing, of course, you $10 ,000 in the juice. And it's made of fine metals and it's not cheap. It's wearable. Right. As if you were the board of the Tiffany's. And you could pass it to your child. The value will increase. Then have a version of course that you could pay $100 for it and all that. And eventually have the catalog on your wrist. Right. And then the idea of abandoning that to just centralizing into one in that box. In that case. And I wrote it with that, but I put a time on it. And then once the time came and it seemed like, you know what?

1:24:22And the wolf did it as well. You know, better tomorrow. What you were doing yourself. Thank you. Yeah. We did a song here. A song. Well, I. A better tomorrow. Why wasn't the 90s sound of the wolf boom. Back. It definitely was the rule in the mature form as men. And I think it has this merit as something. If you're a wolf fan and a music fan. It's something that you should give it a shot. Where at the time. The wolf also wasn't into it. You know, I may. I'm a diverge from the story and give you another sub story to this thing. Which is so funny about my life. So the wolf is not into this album.

1:25:12When you were making it, they weren't into it. Yeah. I mean, do the whole process making it. It's weird because we made it. It's like the fucking made it. But just. You know, and I understand the world. The wolf wants to be as threatening as the wolf always is the wolf. Music is pretty threatening and pretty fucking brain. The motherfucking wakas. You know, I mean, but I was like, that's how we felt this kids. How do you feel as a man? It's impossible to feel the same way. Or is it possible? Maybe I was wrong. Maybe it would likely feel disingenuous if that's not the way you're living. Yeah. Or maybe I'm the one that's out here.

1:25:53Went from the first album. Gold meat. Yeah. By the time he got the liquids, was a money in turkey burgers. Yeah. By the time he got the Wu -Tang forever, I'm going to eat in fish. By time he finished that album, I'm vegan. So maybe it's me. And I accept that. Yeah. But I thought we all was growing. That's a certain way. And maybe we worked, but musically we didn't need to and they disagreed on me. And I respect that. The science is always agreeing to disagree. But what happened was Rolling Stone, offer us a cover of Rolling Stone. This time us, all of us. Yeah. The last time we was on the cover of Rolling Stone, it was just Rizzler and Zach.

1:26:36And then the time after that was maybe me and five other rock and roll bands for that big summer tour. A cover they do. Maybe I think Ronald never swept me on that day. But it never been an entire Wu -Tang clan on the cover of Rolling Stone. And they was like, we're going to do it. And I get to New York and the only one after shoot is me. And I'm like, oh, shit. And Rolling Stone is there. So it's me. The writer, the photographers, and no wool. And no wanted. Because I flew in from LA. So I'm like, okay, that's crazy. And so I immediately, two days later, turned on my own flyback. And while I'm flying back, I get a...

1:27:27I had to script that my agent had gave me. And I started reading on the plane. It's a story about a female MC who wants to increase her lyrical ability by studying poetry and putting more meaning into the songs. But the other MCs and her crew or guys, they don't want to. They want to stay heard and they want to live in gangster fantasies. And she wants to expand. And they don't want her to. And she ends up getting kicked out of the group, leaving the group, and finding a whole new thing for herself. And I was like, that sounds like me. And so I land in LA and soon I called my agent, like, yo, did they find it directly for that movie yet?

1:28:17He's like, they're still looking. You know, a couple of names. I said, give me a meeting. And they got me a meeting. And I got the job. And I did it. It was my second film called Love Beach Rounds. You know what I mean? What's this? Good experience. Great experience. Yeah. The producer for that movie is actually a producer on my new movie. Great. It was a great experience for me beyond my lead actress. But great experience. I was sad to say that. It's crazy how things go. Yeah. And it's crazy how the V -bound tour, yeah, I rebounded well. Yeah. So now I'm going to do this movie. I was just going to ask you, was the wound not showing up and not telling you they weren't showing up?

1:28:55Unusual or is that something that might have happened in the past? That was heaviest, I think. I think like, I think nobody's showing up as deep. Yeah, maybe half wouldn't show. Half is always an equation. Yeah. It's always somebody missing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. Too many people. Yeah. You know, you look at our early photos, you'll see everybody's not in that photo. Yeah. I can respect that. But nobody's showing up. I just got to accept this of it. And I'll do it something. I'm totally wrong. Right? Because if nobody shows up and I show up, then I'm wrong. That means I'm making the mistake here.

1:29:35Yeah. Many of my dad is that it's been agreed that what I'm doing is not right. Yeah. The product is not right. The vibe is not right. Yeah. And how do I know it's been agreed unanimously? Yeah. So I'm wrong. And do you believe they discussed it? I don't know. No, I don't know. I don't know how to. That I never, I never, I didn't even inquire. Yeah. You know, I mean, I just accepted, okay. All right. I'll fuck that one up. Have the wood done anything since then, together? As an album or music? Anything. Yeah, we do concerts and tours. And how does that work? What a funny thing is, I said, I'd jump ahead then.

1:30:13Yeah. I was going to hit you with the, what happens then now is that the next move that was once upon a time. It's time in Charlotte. Right. So because it's what the, what the, what better tomorrow comes out. Yep. It does maybe 30, 40 ,000 units the first week, which is not that great for a whole time. Mm -hmm. And still is way on out of the world. And also, I'm looking at the wool. And I'm looking at the fans. I'm looking at the system. I'm like, okay. Launch the missile. And once upon a time in Charlotte, nobody get it. Nobody gets it now. So it has a, you know what I mean? So I got some, risen, in there, some, artists, others set.

1:30:57And then silver rings. Just a platform because he becomes his name was in a wool world. In a way that he never would have been in the wool world. Yeah. Good for him. He probably got the most out of it than all of us. Mm -hmm. So that's that. But going to them the modern day, you know, the war. All brothers. So what happened was there was a five year plan in the beginning. Rick. Mm -hmm. And then in 2018, 2017, 2018, I think I made another five year plan. And I pitched it to everybody. When I said to them, if you're not paying attention, hip hop is forgetting us. So what you mean? I said, but I say two documentaries on hip hop.

1:31:42They jump right over us. I said, we'll go from LL to Biggie. How do you get the biggie that I'll go into the wool? You can't, you know what I mean? Yeah. It's like we set that wick that opened that up. If we don't go platinum in 1993, he doesn't go platinum in 1994. Now I just don't go platinum in 1995. The money dictates the energy of where the system is taking bets. If we don't show improve, then the money ain't coming to New York. It's going to stay right out here in the West, which was doing very well for everybody. But they skipped us. And there's like nobody saw it. And then they invited me, they invited me to the show that was doing that.

1:32:30I think it's called hip hop evolution or something like that. Season three. Now you're inviting the wool and I decline. But they still got rain goes to do it. And I told everybody to climb. But they still did it. And so I said, we got to tell our own story. They skipping us. All right. And so I said, what we're going to do? Is we're going to do a documentary? And we're going to do a TV series. And we're going to do a tour. It's going to be a five year plan. Two five year plans. I said, that's going to actually, I'm going to do a relay race with these years. It's going to go five years here. And in the middle of this plan, the second five year plan to start.

1:33:19And so within seven years. Right. Everybody will become should be millionaires again. Should be able to ride off in the sunset. And I myself, who was actually doing pretty well, can also lay my head in my head. I'm not matching at night knowing that I did all I can to make sure my brothers legacy was protected. And that the economics and their families were protected. Unless they fuck it up. And then I say, but this is the shot. Yeah, that I'm going to take. Yeah. And everybody was like, nobody agreed. And even though I have bumps along the road. Yeah. Once you agree with me, yeah. I'm cool with all the stuff you do.

1:34:05This try to stop me because it's like you already agreed. My heart is in turn. The content of this is what we're doing. Yeah. And we ended up doing mics and then. And we nominated. Yeah. Big. Yeah. Big for hip hop. Yeah. And big for the culture. Yeah. Then we do the whole series. Thirty hours. No hip hop. And I even music people have gotten that much time of introspective creative art on their work. And we do the tour. And so the tour was the was the part was the parallel thing. Because the tour was supposed to lead to the to a Vegas residency. And the tour New York State of mind, one of the biggest tours in hip hop.

1:34:52Right. For the last five years. Yeah. The Vegas residency works. For the hip hop group. They have a residency in Vegas, which close to 90 % sell out rate.

1:35:06And we will announce. I'm going to I guess I'm going to announce it right here, but we got a big announcement coming for. Yeah. 2025. Yeah. And so the go back you said what are we doing like. And now. You know, the great art that all of my brothers possess. Actually, I'm seeing it. Even more now. Yeah. Everybody's individual works are growing based on this. Right. And no, everybody individually are settling into this manhood. Oh, I see. That's what's happening. That's beautiful. So it's like somebody coming in like Vincent's nobody's coming in. Like. Move that move that move that move that. They come in like, okay.

1:35:54You could put a little yellow on that. You said I'm there. The creativity that's now presented to them. Through my lens. First of all, I, I refined it. I think making movies and TV shows is my brain at this level. So if you have a, if you were to come to our Vegas show, you were the scene. You're even proud for hip hop because not with all those great sets and all that which hip hop has gotten to. No, you know, it's almost like you're watching a hip hop play. You know what I mean? Even on the New York state of mind, enough you made it any of those. But. Yeah. Well, you see that it wasn't usually when you got that many artists.

1:36:36It's a battle. No. I was able to along with my partner, Nihah, of course, being in the audience with me. We were able to meld it together. You know, I never forget when Buster came to the first day. You know, he signed on late. Well, when he got there, I was like, yeah, this is this, I had play. And I don't did his whole logo. The whole, he's like, never came to know concert with somebody and other, the other act. It's hookin' about him. Yeah. And they were day -locked, came. Yeah. They came kind of, they didn't hook up early. Yeah. And they, so they're a joint. And it was like, well, you know, all those day -locked, so I love them.

1:37:21So I was just like, let me just spend two or three days to look. Look at this now. And then it was like, yeah. I said, we're going to start with three. That's a magic. That's going to have to cry out like, oh, said, they were. And then you end with it. And on the three -time, it takes three. It's the magic number. So for the whole show, I'm giving them this one, the last song. Yeah. I give them that screen. And I put the true go up there. Yeah. And you go out like that. Yeah. Beautiful. Let's put a classroom behind them. Mm -hmm. You know what I mean? So my creativity is where is that as a filmmaker and all that.

1:37:59And now the team have that extra respect, you know, and when they come to say something, it's not the challenge. It's actually creatively to add on. Great. And that's how we did our first album. It was competitive. Yeah. And it was always adding on a layer. Yeah. And that came in. It was like, I said, I need a hook. He's not on the song. Guess what? Jazz rule. Everything. You, he wrote that. And he glued it. And he had no. He was like, oh, he go and doing that. You know what I mean? That, because I was like, yo, the lucky tell on cream. I was from his own song. We had three roses. I was like, nah, just give me that rose.

1:38:40For that song. And it took out, you know, took out like six or eight lines. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No argument. Yeah. You know what I mean? So hopefully, I feel like we're back to that. Because we have men. Yeah. You know what I mean? It's hard to be a man, even if you're 40, 50 years old sometimes. You still have this, this youth boy and you that wanna... Especially with your friends from when you were young. Exactly. It's different when it's something that you meet as an adult. Yeah. Yeah. It's like you revert back. Yeah. It's like your parent. Exactly. You go hold your parent. Have mom. Yeah, he got it.

1:39:16Mom, I know you got apple pie. Like, you just like, you see like... Exactly. And you feel it, yeah. What's that?

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1:41:02What's your favorite U -Tang salt?

1:41:08U -Tang clan, all right? I don't know. I tell you the one I feel is really proud of as a producer. I feel really proud of bringing the ruckus. I just feel like there's nobody did that before me. We're going to listen to bring the ruckus. Okay. Shower in shadow boxing. And a U -Tang salt style. They what you say is true. The shower in and the Wu -Tang could be dangerous. Do you think your Wu -Tang salt can defeat me? I'm tired. I'll let you try my Wu -Tang style. Bring the motherfucking ruckus. Bring the motherfucking ruckus. Bring the motherfucking ruckus. Bring the motherfucking ruckus. Bring the motherfucking ruckus.

1:41:59Don't space, catch the blast of a hype verse. My clock burst. Leaving her hers. I did worse. I come rough. Tucked like an elephant's tongue. Your head rust. Fly like Egyptian musk. Oh, shit. Detain clenched. Walk the wixen. However, I'm asked to the trick just like Nixon. Cores and gyro. Quick damage or hope ever. Hot rocks is worth the fuck off. I found stock PLO style. Has it is? Cause I wrecked this dangerous. I'm no spot like wake -o -texas. I watch my back like I'm locked in. Hark court hit it sound. Watch me act broke. It's hit down. I know the ritite asshole. Songs going go no doubt. And you'll watch it.

1:42:3640 minutes of foe. Yeah, they fake it. Know that. Marry your gags. But your mind went roll with like 40 bags. Now you act convinced. I guess it makes sense. Ooh, Jane goes. Ooh, look a thing. I wait for one to act up. Yeah, I got it backed up. Gunner was thick now. React what? And that's one in the chamber. You take bang up. 36 styles of danger. Bring them all the fucking rockers. Bring them all the fucking rockers. Bring them all the fucking rockers. Bring them all the fucking rockers. Bring them all the fucking rockers. Bring them all the fucking rockers. Bring them all the fucking rockers. Bring them all the fucking rockers.

1:43:21I whip it. Hark court like one of Lake Pitches. I roll with groups. I got no passage with biscuits. Check it. My matt did on the microphones banging. Wootang slang. I leave your head piece banging. Plus this. I'm kicking like a girl. I'm a justice to walk this. Just no goodness. You kiss? Red, rough. I'm a brilliant soul with a toe. Move the one. My style sucks and not like a stung gun. I'm hacked it. I'm fake it with the quickness. Say it on a microphone. I got my tissue get blown. Why this nasty ass nigga with my n***a? The result. Tarts like a rolling gauze. Like a t***a. So bad. Scaven of the bad.

1:43:56What the vong cam? Crab. I scream on your ass. Like your dad bring it all. Bring them all the fucking rockers. Bring them all the fucking rockers. Bring them all the fucking rockers. Bring them all the fucking rockers. Bring them all the fucking rockers. I'm a rockin' then slag man, boot. New recruits. I'm fuckin' up MC troops. I break loose and trampol shit. Well, I stop. I'm on holdin' that ass. Cust through straight out the store. Keeping up on sight. That was frightening. My routine slang is bad fucking danger. And more deadly than a stroke of an act. Shopping through your back. Shhh. Killing bystanders hold attacks.

1:44:32N****s tryna play. Tell me who wins them. I grow up this fucking prism. Make it a vicious act. The terrorism. You wanna bring it so fucking. Come on and bring the rockets. And I'm from both n****s to kick buckets. I'm wetting kima ain't wetting pain. Who's selling cane? I'm giving out a deadly cane. It's not the Russian. It's the routine. Crush it. Who let's slap up? They get fucked like two zed. Bring the fucking rockets. Bring them all the fucking rockers. Bring them all the fucking rockers.

1:45:08I'm done. I'll let you try my wolf tank style. So bring it on. So bring it on. So bring it on. So bring it on. So bring it on. So bring it on. So bring it on. You dig up.

1:45:33What do you remember about courting it? Yeah, so many memories on that one, Rick. I mean, during the course of making the album, when did it happen? I feel like maybe in the middle, far as the rendition of what it ended up being. But I also think that the way we would call that album, that pieces of it was happening during the process. You know, Carlos Bess was the engineer then, and Ethan was the engineer. And Carlos was like, you know, put the drums in the elevator shaft. You know what I mean? We called that shit, you know what I mean? And so, you know, that process of making the album and also experimenting was happening through the thing.

1:46:21But one thing about it that I really love for me, and memory is that the willingness of unorthodoxness that as a creator, I was cool with. Like, do you know what that sound, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, that's the CD skipping. Wow. I sampled it. And it became, it plays in that track about 10 times. Yeah. That's my horns. It sounded like a horn. It sounded like a horn. It became my fucking horns. Yeah. And there was just a CD skipping that you just happened to notice when it was skipping. That sounds like going something to use it. So that type of freedom of grabbing and playing.

1:47:06Yeah. I love it so much because if you take, like, it's a lot of frequencies in it, but if you play that shit loud, it's ever changing. Yeah. You got the four emcees, but none of them rhyme to the same thing. Yeah. You know what I mean? It's always, even the music under the hook changes. Yeah. So it was composed and without knowing it. Yeah. You know what I mean? That's what it was. How would you decide who would go on what tracks? At that time, I considered the emcees as instruments as well. I see. You know what I mean? So I kind of, you know what I mean? I knew certain voices. And then also, I knew my brothers pretty well.

1:47:47More than they knew each other because they all was my buddies. Yeah. Even if they wasn't buddies with each other. I see. What was the first scoring job you did in Hollywood? My first score was Jim Jammu Scostog. It went well, critically acclaimed him. And what was the experience like? It was great. Jim was a cool guy. I didn't know shit. He's a great guy. I didn't know shit. I was breaking music at one o 'clock in the morning and shit. Tracking 40s, ODB in the car with me. Jim was like, you know, it was like a spy movie. I'd be needing the music and he'd be like, yo, what are you going to be Wednesday at one?

1:48:35Like, because editing in movies is over at six o 'clock. Yeah. Okay, it's a schedule here. Yeah. But he was cool. It was cool. Yeah, it was cool. And we stayed brothers. I was just going to fall in them last week. Right, man. Damn, yeah. I guess I did a good enough job that I got some critical respect. And then I met Quentin, my next one is Killabill. Great. And how was that experience? Changed my life. Because I saw in another artist, the epitome of art. And in my direction, in art, would you say you were inspired by the way he worked? Yeah, I was inspired by the the the brain capacity that he had to use to make his world come to life.

1:49:25You know, I was doing that with 12 people in the studio. He's doing it with 200 people on a movie set. And at the times, the good thing about it for me, when I've met Quentin, and I kind of saw that his brain was a certain way, I was humble enough to act and can I observe him. And he said, yeah, he said, I'd be in China, wherever you want to come on over and help yourself. You know, we was already friends. I flew to China. You know, I may stay a couple of days before I made myself known, because I like to be no brood and nobody. And then I was like, yeah, I'm told, line's been there. Yeah, I'm here.

1:50:08So yeah, yeah, been in three days. I'll be in flight two weeks. You want to be here for two weeks? Yeah, I'm just showing. You know, I mean, oh, you need to only need nothing. Just let me know who you guys want to be at. I'll be the outshow to set. I'll come every day after lunch, and then stay for the rest of the day. Yeah, cool. And I was up there with the same book, composition notebook that I write lyrics in. Now I'm writing ideas and any camera shit and all this shit. You know, that's what helped me find my new path. And I wasn't there as a composer. I was there. I was in the observer because I saw a like -minded man who had elevated his art to the highest level of art.

1:50:54A film, considerably, is the highest, most expensive form of art. It takes sound, music. It takes color, paintings, war droves, tempo, lyrics. I mean, acting. Acting? A lot. Everything. Almost every, a good movie has every piece of art in it. Right? Even name or weird art. Painting, let's say. Isn't it? You're art director painted the whole fucking set. Give me more. Dancing. That's why you love the whole politics. And when you're watching dance with Umu Thurman, you're like, yo. Exactly. Yeah, it's then it. And he opened my brain to that. And it wasn't until then it went to Japan. I didn't go to Japan.

1:51:48Then it went to Mexico. And I showed up in Mexico. Two weeks in Mexico. I mean, it was in Mexico. You know, we spent a lot of nice time together, especially on the days off and all that. I remember someone in the producer, just was like, what is this guy doing here? That would give you a quick story. So, you're not really a student. You went as a student. I mean, I just stood there. And I would get your teeth. And if you would say, yo, get the tea, I would get the tea. Yeah, yeah. And one thing that was funny, I just said this, which you guys, so one, so normally, let's say that there's three tables.

1:52:19And this table is Quentin, the producers, you know, this is the lead actress. Maybe Ethan Hawke came to town. That's that table. This table could be people from the crew, and all that, and all that, and all that. You know, I was at that table. The third table. Yeah. And then, after some nights, you know, I think Larry McCucklin, one of the greatest study cam, did all the study cam for Squarespace and Goodfellas. In fact, his family invented the study cam. Wow. Okay. It's called Larry Vision. But I became cool with him. You know, I didn't have the same skills as everybody. So I ended up drinking with anybody.

1:53:03Right. But anyway, I met that table. But I did over here some big, like, where's this guy going here? You know what I mean? Somebody asked Quentin, what is, you know, Quentin said, I don't know. I'm gonna figure it out. What I haven't figured out is actually what Bobby's going to be doing is part of the film. Right here, he's here observing, but I haven't figured out what we're always going to play. And then maybe it's two more days before the end of it. Quentin advised me to this table. And he makes the announcement of Bobby's going to be my first composer. He's never used a composer before. So he's going to be my first composer for my film.

1:53:47And he's going to help produce my soundtrack. Amazing. I was like, hey. In the funny thing, there was a guy there. I think who flew in because he wanted to be here. He had his guitar and everything. I know. But anyways, and that's no, I mean, that continued to lead the Madonna path. How many have you done since? Wow. A lot. Yeah. Yeah. I know the TV series. I've been got two immunomaniacists for music, uh, about the different working on a score, versus working on tracks. I mean, a score you have to service the film and remove your personal, what you want personally. It has to service the film.

1:54:37It's not about you. Right. At first, I thought it was about service in the director. I thought that, but it wasn't that. Or Kilber, I thought it was serving the director. And I never worked for nobody before. Well, since I was at an even did he. So that that also is interesting that he never worked with nobody. He never worked with somebody to do score. So in some ways, he found your way together. Yeah. I'm the riser right now. Yeah. I'm the producer. Yeah. I call the shots. Yeah. I'm in a situation to where I play something and they're like, no, that don't work, Bobby. It was, I went through a situation where it didn't work all week.

1:55:17Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was like, oh, fuck this. My mind. And then I just let myself be freed. And one day, and the scene that I didn't work, he burst into womb one day. That's it. Whatever you was doing right there, that's what we need for the scene, was he fights the crazy 88, well, where were, were, were, were, were, were, yeah. And then it was like a moment where that scene was out of the movie. But they didn't tell me. And I'm working on it. And then I'm like, you know, it was Friday, you know, Friday's my day to show shit. And my, I'm in the editing for, you know, editing is 20 weeks. So I don't get there as, you know, my time is still hip hop time.

1:56:01I'm, so I'm not getting there. Yeah. Like everybody else is like, not, yeah, not am, and some after lunch, but I'm hanging till dinner. Yeah. Or either hang till midnight, but I'm not getting there before lunch. But he, uh, the scene, um, was out of the film, but I didn't know. And for Friday, I said, well, check this out. Hey, listen, and I took a old sample that we had used, a Zander Fifth sample, then chopped it up to the scene. And it was like, you just saved the scene. I was like, well, so it was going to be out, but because you like the music, it made it in the movie. That, now, the music was such a good, great dig.

1:56:40Yeah. It is a music in the trailer. Wow. It was a great, it was a great dig. So cool. Have you ever studied martial arts philosophy? Of course, yes. Oh, the of course. Yeah, that's, I study martial arts philosophy like, even today, you know, I was actually studying, there's a filmmaker named La Colong, who made the movie 36 change, but he's a director of it. He's directed by 18 films. And I just been studying him for like the last two weeks. He's passed away in 2013. I think he's one of the greatest directors I ever lived. And he's a real kung fu master from the fourth generation of the hung golf form.

1:57:27I actually learned the hung golf form myself. I was trained by his classmate. And when I was a male, the IFS, they gave me this classmate. I read it from my book when I was a kid. So as a kid, one of the first books that I bought was the hung golf form. I'm like 14 years old. And I was just used to book and try to figure it out. And in real life, I get a hung golf master to come to me who's the brother of my favorite director. And Gordon Lewis's brother as well. And Gordon Lewis in my movie. And I go, the universe is crazy, right? Yes, I studied martial arts philosophy. And I will prescribe it that it should actually be added to a curriculum in school because discipline, spirituality, physical training of yourself, mental training of yourself, understanding yourself.

1:58:18Marsha art is actually the art of understanding yourself. It's so important. And the philosophy, whether you're shalant or Wu Tang or Er Mei, you know, or even if you want to just take it to Japan and do karate, it's all to build the individual and the community. You know, if you build yourself first, you become valuable to your community. And you could either be the one that opposed the community or aspire to community or even defend the community. So when you study it, you learn the physical forms, but the philosophy is always taught along with the physical forms, yes? Should be. So I can't speak for the forever teacher.

1:59:04And for me, the philosophy, in fact, Wu Tang itself, if you go through the history of what Wu Tang was, or is the story is that this monk leaves shalant and he goes to the Wu Dong mountain. And here he becomes enlightened. And he's not sitting there throwing punches all day. He's sitting still. And he's wanting to do his mind. You know what I mean? And so he's taking the Taoist approach versus the Buddhist approach. And he actually ends up melding the tool. And you meditate a lot and you sit. It's actually, if you have some physical training, and then you can sit there, and small spaces, move your muscles and have your mind move everything, then you get to post the movements, small spaces.

2:00:01You'll be just as strong as the more fuck a living weights. You know what I mean? That's the Wu Tang way. You know? The shalant way, of course, they go a thousand punches. Tell me about writing. And what's capacity for some type of content to come out of you? What happens? I think three levels come out of me as an artist. One is my personal experiences. One is my observation. And one of the strongest one is my imagination. And then if you're blessed, it's inspiration. That's not to do it. But you don't aim for the inspiration. That comes. Yeah. I don't aim for neither none of them. But if I'm forced to write, like to say right now, you go, oh, this is right a song.

2:00:51I will rely upon myself and my experiences. A lot of my Bobby Digital lyrics are more experienced than some of my Rizal lyrics. The Rizal lyrics are more philosophical. Yeah. So Bobby Digital, like I had a verse, I'll give you a few lines. It says, uh, you know, it's gangster shit a little bit. For Shelley's whip through his belly, they shout on right outside of Mike's deli. Yep, to the telly, call my bitch up on the celly. Bobby, what? I'm probably nuts. I walk strange. I talk strange. A long range sniper aim will switch. She's your brain. I don't sleep. I don't eat meat. I rest twice a week.

2:01:31I could speak without moving my lips. I got 50 pairs of sneakers. Fank of print proof rubber grips. Hollow tip clips. Eight ounce button lips. I sip and I love Bobby Q chips. That says me. I cluck a bird from the block straight away from a flock. You just forced me to bus stop. I had a snapper. I twist the top off. You know, she kept a here process. No panties underneath of the dress. A small link ankle bracelet. She had polo frames. My shades had no name. The purple cane. I slowed my game. My thick gold chain made the odds flame. So I stood up against the bodega gate and stayed straight. She had a perfect figure.

2:02:11Eight shape. I couldn't wait to bust a grape with my apple head. Anyway, so that's so that's easy to write. Cause I can just go through myself like, oh, I saw that girl. I go right. But then if you writing, the pre -existence of the mathematical bar chemical equation is the manifestation of rock, plant, air, fire, and water which are in the basic formation. Solid liquid and gases that form the land mass within the space catalyst. And all matter that exists must first be observed through a physical comprehension. But the taste should knows to be struck. That's a bizarre. You know, I mean, big difference.

2:02:47Yeah. Yeah, really different. It's cool that you gave them different characters essentially. And then when writing the movie, well, I learned from the Tarantino school. And in a way, I think I definitely will use my imagination. But also, hip hop, Quentin is a hip hop director. Right. He's a musical. Because he have a catalog of thousands of movies in his head. So he's like sampling ideas from things he's seen? And I, by myself, doing the same. Yeah. Yeah. And we say inspiration. You know, we don't have nothing to do with that, right? Yes. That's even deeper than Ruzza in a way of philosophical.

2:03:39Because you know, McCartney said, a lot of great artists say it shows up in your dream. You wake up with it. You know, and for me, the wake up has been actually, that's why we have this album about it, too much. I woke up without words. I woke up with music in me. Yeah. So tell me about your relationship to piano. When did you learn to play piano? I mean, I always liked the piano. Always had one. Never took formal training. Just always just fiddled with it, right? By fiddling with it, I just got better and better. Love this since I got the ass. Once I got the EPS, that was the keyboard. And I realized that I'm more of that type of musical creator when it comes to producing or songwriting.

2:04:33And so, yeah, I love the piano for years. Once you got into it, how much time would you say that the piano typically? Well, I've spent the most time at the piano doing the pandemic, I think. Maybe a year before that. But I'm the guy that you will, you know, in the room, do tours or whatever, you know, even in the mediocre way. If they had a piano in the lobby, I'm there. And the chicks were with me out there. And if only, you know, two chords, I'm playing those two chords for an hour. That's just, I'll just got addicted to it. I remember Wu Tang had our first album out or coming out, whatever.

2:05:11And we was all in the Bay Area. They put us in the Oakwoods. And we stayed there. And there was this great piano store. This in San Francisco. There's a great piano store that was somewhere downtown. It's our San Fred. And I remember going in it. And they couldn't afford a piano yet. Didn't even know a piano would be $20 ,000, $30 ,000. You know, I mean, thought maybe, you know, at that time, the biggest, most expensive keyboard would be $2 ,000 ,000. Yeah. And so, they got to tell me the price. And then there was some gentleman buying one. You know, he looked a little bit like, he could have been a business war sweet guy.

2:05:49But we had a Bay Area. So I don't know his profession. But he was testing the pianos. And I didn't know nothing. And I actually said, but I wasn't shy. I was like, yo, can you show me something? How long have you been playing? Right. He's an album playing for, uh, tell you that. I said, how long did it take you to get good? He said, I'm still ain't good. I said, well, could you show somebody like me? He said, actually, nothing. Okay. And I was cool with that, you know, I mean, but I was like, I'm gonna get one one day. And, uh, yeah. But I just started reading music theory that year. That year.

2:06:25That year, yeah, 1996. I started reading at least music theory. So I could, no, play on my keyboards. And that's why I'm Wu -Teng forever. You do hear chord progress in his internal house because it's the first piano you bought. The first one was a Yamaha upright. I had a disclave here on it as well. What, three of those are my life. And would you sit it and play a lot? Yeah. Yep. So my, uh, my ex -wife, you fuck that piano up. There's a great story in my old neighborhood. You go to the piano store. They got a great story about the piano. Like, she fucked it up in one way. Oh, she beat the sit -out of that piano.

2:07:07Like, Hammers, and then she knew I loved it. Oh, I see. Yes, you destroyed that motherfucker. And then took it back to them because he had to get me a new one, you know. And then tell them what the fuck happened. And she just told them, you know what the Wu -Teng, they had a crazy party. And it's that story lived in the piano place for a long time until I, uh, I actually never corrected the story. I didn't want to go onto the bus, but yeah. But um, but since then, wow, I mean, I've got a piano in every home. Just put my first time way, actually. Not even six months ago, but my first time way. Beautiful.

2:07:47Yeah. Well, we're lucky that we have a piano here. Yes, you do. You feel like you feel like, um, see if I can play some out of me? Yeah, why not? Let's see what I could do. Well, you got a couple of piano here. What you're going to like? Let's see what's going on here.

2:09:34This is basically the story of the, of the ballet.

2:09:41What's happening in the ballet? It's there.

2:09:48We start off in the key of C, which is Ionia. And then, um, the relative minor of C is A minor, right? And it becomes A -O -L -N. All right, so C is...

2:10:18major, right? And then the next is mold will be Dorvian, which will normally be minor, right? And this key of C. Whether my ballet is actually major, so it's... it's more heroic.

2:10:47And we follow throughout through these molds. And it was the Ionian with minor. That's to make it back to that major. And then I'll go through the whole thing. And the thing that walked with the Ionian, working the most back, is from the Ionian.

2:11:13The low Crian.

2:11:17Like that, the minutes.

2:11:22And then from that, the minute you want to make it back. And it's... You can do it anyway, right? You can do it other ways. You can go...

2:11:42Let me take that same concept. And don't think about the... molds. I mean, keep... Think of the molds. But don't think about the key. So now, I'm gonna still do the same thing, starting Ionian, right?

2:11:58But this here, that's not in the key of C. It's all of a jazz type thing.

2:12:09Once again.

2:12:26Now I'll do the key.

2:13:23How did the idea for the ballet come? From... finding my old lyrics. Inside my... Tommy Hill, Fanger, Duffel bag. And then wanting to put music to the lyrics. But in a way, like, I didn't want to rap, or I raped, I didn't want to rap over hip hop. I just wanted to have a different expression. And it just kept evolving into different iterations until I thought I was going to write on like a hip hop opera. And then it was a guy named Evan Lamberg, one of the presidents of Universal. I know Evan, I love Evan. Yeah, so Evan, I played maybe a couple of tracks of him when I was getting, you know, yeah, I worked on my new opera.

2:14:13He's like, opera. Well, opera's are usually in the Tanya, but that sounds like a ballet. Like a ballet is, you know, like the Nutcracker Suite on Peter and the Wolf. And he said that, I was like, that's crazy, because Peter and the Wolf was the first thing I studied when I was driving to be a composer. When Jim and John were said, you don't want you to compose my film. And I never composed a film. The first thing I did was when I studied Peter and the Wolf. And by studying Peter and the Wolf, it said that every instrument represented a character, the flute represented the bird, which makes sense because if you blow off flute, you can flutter.

2:15:00The trombones represented the wolf. The tuba, the elephant. Okay, that opened my brain to, you know, with folk -foss composing, come back now 20 years later and I'm doing my ballet. I identified with Evan said and then I pursued it as such. Okay, that's okay. And I told my wife, no, I'm writing the ballet. And then I took the story that I had, which was about these six, one of my lyrics is about these six kids who, I'll give you the lyrics, you could chop it up, but this is written between the age of 14 and 19, all these lyrics. And one was called Joe as a nerd. And it says, Sue was this girl was really quite fly.

2:15:48Brad was real cool when he was a guy. Lisa was freaky. They loved to have sex. A brother named was Dexter, but they called them Dex. His sister named was Monica and she was a virgin. Joe was just their friend, but he was a nerd. Brad bought the beer, Sue bought the smoke. Lisa had sheets, Dexter had coke. Joe was the type who didn't get high nor did Monica, but she was well in the trial. Brad lit a blunt and passed at the Joe said, come on man, smoking. And Joe said, no, which one are you scared? Was asked by Sue. Are you just a nerd? Joe said, that's not true. Monica said, Joe, just have a taste as he puffed on the blunt and blew the smoke in his face.

2:16:23Now, Monica, Joe had a crush. You don't want to smoke but felt that he must. Like many we know love made him a fool. So he took a pull. The proof he was cool. And Lisa was like, yo, forget about Joe. They say, hey, duck, where the heck is the blow? He pulled out two grams, said it's all that I bought. They said it's more than enough. They proceeded to snort. Now, at this time, Joe had finished three beers. And Brad was like, here, have another you queer. And Joe was like, no, as he helped the stomach. And while face and Monica, he suddenly wanted, but she said, oh my gosh, shit, I'll absurd. And everyone laughed and said, Joe was a nerd.

2:16:56Joe was a nerd. Joe was a nerd. Joe felt embarrassed so he did the boat. They chased him and ran and giggled and laughed. Through this abandoned house, then it was a sound of crashing glass. It was dark in the room. So Brad had to get a light and he checked the sea of Joe was all right. But when they found them, there was quartz or red blood spitting from his head. Exploded from his head. And Monica said, Joe, we is dead. And he all started to run and never mentioned this incident again to anyone. So I said, that was a story that I was like, okay, I'm gonna do this. I'm gonna write this into this thing.

2:17:32Along with another one, I won't say to you. Okay. And it's like a children's story, but an edgy children's story also. Yeah, yeah, yeah, basically you can, you can know the slick, rich time when those stories was happening. Yeah. Yeah. So then I said, okay, I can't get away with that. It don't sound like teenagers. And so I wrote a story into a higher level of college students. And when I did that, I said, okay, now I got these six college students. What can I, how can I tell this story? And I decided that I'll tell it through the musical mode. That's why I just went through that to show you and start stuff.

2:18:06Where I don't need who goes all the way through all the keys before she gets back to herself. And that's a ballet through mud. Because sometimes we got to go through all these different things, you know, I mean, to go through, you got to go through the mud. And what comes out of the mud and put it some, the load is, it grows out of the mud. And that's why the last song on that album is the Lotus and Rise. Have you performed it live? Yeah, we performed it live first before we recorded it. Actually, I performed it at the Colorado, the Colorado, the California, New Yorker story. So two sold out nights, which was great.

2:18:41Standing ovation, which was amazing for my spirit. Did you play piano or did you just compose and watch it? Just watch it. Yeah. Yeah. I don't play piano in front of people. You know, my wife, kids, maybe friends, but I love sharing. Yeah, yeah. You know, me and my son, at my phone, I got so many recordings of like, okay, do you go three minutes? I go three minutes. Whatever happens. Yeah. We don't worry about it. And we go and sometimes we say something interesting, sometimes we don't. And so taking the musical modes and telling this story, that's the, that's a beautiful. And then come here about how you recorded it.

2:19:21Recorded it in Colorado. In the Symphony Hall. Makes mics, you know, new ones. And how is it different hearing it with an audience in the Symphony Hall versus how you imagined it when you played it on the piano in the first place? Incredible. And on the reality, well, first it was piano. Then it goes to the AW. And then it gets written for the orchestra. But incredible. Because on the piano, you know that your tubers and your grass is all here, right? That's maybe the lowest grass. You know, your cello will start here, though.

2:20:07The end, right? You know, your violins will be.

2:20:17Know your flutes. But your flutes can also get down here. But you can also have your old balls and your other words down here, right? So you'll know that, you'll know that if you did a chord like this, like C7, you can look at that and look at the range of that. And what instruments fit here? If I did the, if all I did, I said I'll do a D here, right? But I'll do an inversion, right?

2:20:55So now I got that flute.

2:21:06And then it's only way so thinking like that, right? But then when you hear period played by the musicians, the 16 violins planted, right? It's four flute players planted. No, it's amazing. We had 60 pieces. And so it felt amazing. And they knew me. That's the other thing. Chris Dragon, our conductor, you know, we have built the friendship already for some previous things. By the time we recorded it, we had performed it. We have you hosted it. We have performed it to success, multiple nights. And now it was maybe a few months later, if I like it could have been about four months later. So okay, now we're going to record it.

2:21:55Now the only difference that happened is that the original ballet was written with choir. But there's no choir on that album. And so I said, The live performance, did you have choir? Yes, and I thought it was choir as well. Is there a recording of the live? Yeah. Great. And there's and there's might be one song that's on the bonus that has one song of the live. So you could hear the crowing or that shit. Yeah. And so you have to figure out what instruments, but basically the human voices here to hear. Well, I mean naturally, because they don't we up here. But yeah, I vote the notes down here. And so we just emulated it with brass, some old bowls.

2:22:33Yeah, so there's a part in the that song, a ballet, through mud, this track, the title track. Well, which I actually love that the instruments emulated with the voices was the one. Yeah. And since the voices only doing single vowels, it actually sounds better on an instrument. Interesting. Which leads me to something else in the future. Like okay, you know, if I'm going to use a single vowel, I might as well use an instrument. Yeah. Did you make any changes once you heard the orchestra playing it in rehearsal, where you had only heard it before on the piano? Did you make any changes based on where the instruments overlapped?

2:23:09Yeah, there was many changes that had to be made, whether I wanted to or not. I see. Because the digital, you know, if you're using goryco, logic, pro tools, Ableton, which all played, they won't pop up on this shit. Also, I have a keyboard called the Corg or Aces, old keyboard, but really have nice orchestra sounds in it. And actually have orchestras, like maybe an ostinato, maybe. So almost like I could take an ostinato.

2:23:47Right? And, you know, you get synthesized. I got one button to get that. Yeah. Right? So I could hit that with one button. Right? Why my other hand is figuring out something else. And then record that. You know what I mean? And then take that MIDI file and put it into logic, maybe, right? That's true. And say, okay, now how would that sound with this? And then maybe pull in a Spitfire audio. Right? And use one of their patches. And they got some motherfucking patches. And now it's like, it's sound close to something real. Yeah. But now I give it to the orchestra. It's like, no, it doesn't make sense.

2:24:22Because the flat tundo won't be there, or the tart won't be here. Or the human is not going to do it that way. Yeah. Right? You're sitting there holding the note on a flute.

2:24:40Flute play only has so much air. Exactly. He's out of that. Right. Okay. So what you want us to do, you know, do you want us to, um, the Vissy? Yeah. So the Vissy meaning, um, the fighting to know between two people. I see. Yeah. So now the Vissy is over. So one starts it. And then the other one takes over. Exactly. And the first one comes back. Exactly. The Vissy. So that's has to be written on that chart. Yeah. That means now the copious. God, I know that. And so then I had a great team, you know, me, Scott O 'Neill, of course, I'm Mitch. And Tan, who was actually on my staff. For the TV show.

2:25:20Right. So that's another good thing. I had all these musicians are valuable for me when I was doing the TV show. That I was able to just had them all salary. Yeah, it's great. And I got some advice recently from Alexi French. These are pretty established composers. Pianist, great. They wrote you also. And I was like, how do I become virtual also? And he said you should study, um, the Goldberg Vavations of Bach. I saw Mitch, I'm a, I haven't did it yet. Yeah, but I'm going to do that. He just told me that's your light in August. There's a lot of great version of it, too, to listen to. It's inspiring to listen to.

2:26:01You know, I don't read music fast. Like I can't put the music in front of me. And by the, by the, by the, by the, by the. Right. I read like, uh, maybe it's six greater by now, but it's still. So maybe at 60 BPMs, I could read it, you know, at 90. No, no, no, that's not happening. You know, I could go do Ray, me, Ray, me. Ray, far, far, so lie T, T. I could do that. Now once I hear it now, oh, that's what he's doing. So now I'm going to see that all. It's mostly a season to one that. And then I could go ahead and try. But that's been my, my biggest weakness is imitation. That's my biggest weakness.

2:26:49And it's where this thing about me. Besides recently, like I said, once he told me there's Goldberg thing, I did listen to a couple of them as well. And I've been listening to a few other greats. I actually realized. I wasn't mind imitating them. I'm a non -imitating dude. That's been one of my potential flaws as well as blessing. But I rather than do what I'm doing than do what you're doing. You know what I mean? I've been, I got the good talk. You know, I started late. One of the jobs, like what you're going to, you know, for John to tell like what you know, you're starting the good talk. This age is like.

2:27:26But you know what? I'll just do it. I just pick up the instrument and make sounds. It was easy to say, I don't see what I got there. It might not be until listen to the bass. It don't matter what it is though. It's the tar there, the third one, the furthest one. Yeah. That one here. Right. It's just like, I'm still going to, you know, I'm still going to. I'm not sick of it. I need you don't need to be able to read music to do that. Nope. So it's more like playing with the instrument having fun.

2:28:37Yeah. Yeah.

2:28:44Fucking, you know, man. Yeah. So much fun to make music, isn't it? Yeah. It's like that it out. That's great. So anyway, you mentioned the morning you pray. Tell me about your prayer life. I hold some of that personal, but I was just saying pray, man. You know, we grew up in this. People said don't pray. I tell you one thing, the old gentleman said, he was just a, I think he was a Jewish brother. He actually had no hands. He really works in the store, but he always helped me carry out the boxes.

2:29:19And I don't know. One day, you know, it's, it'll be okay. And friends, we start talking and talk about prayer. He said, what did you pray for? And I told him I don't pray for nothing. I just give thanks. He was like, oh, it's good. But pray for guidance. I say, okay, I'll take that.

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