Bruno Helps Arsenal Pass Huge Test of Character in Sunderland

31:34And, you know, the big one, of course, comes right away in the 13th minute. Declan Rice over the top to Saka. He could slide it over to Kai or he could try to finish from there. He doesn't. It's been a week of big chances. And I was sort of forgiving against Napoli of our profligacy. because I felt if we keep playing that way, someone's going to get hammered. I still believe if we keep playing this way, someone will get hammered, but I'll admit you can only miss chances for so long. This was a chance to get out in front and maybe make this game less nervy. So your thoughts on Saka missing some chances and not being as clinical as we'd like that, that first period of dominance, but not leveraging it into that goal.

32:14Elliot:Yeah, so feeding into the game, the Napoli game was in my head. And for those that went, it was very, very hot. and draining. And then we have a big away game at the weekend, Saturday night, big journey. My worry, you know, we're taking the Chelsea game, which was very, very intense. You know, we came out of the right side, but a lot of effort was put in. Napoli then into this game. So I was a little bit concerned. You can always find things to be worried about. Then we start the game. We start off very nicely and calmly. It seems to be similar to the Villa game that we want to shut the crowd up by having slow, deliberate build-up, making sure we have our back four diamond and it's quite interesting to see Declan Rice and Konza rotate on occasions some sometimes Rice in the middle sometimes Konza's on the outside I really like this I like that back four Gabriel tends to stay where he is but between the two midfielders and and Konza they drop in in different spaces they all know a need to be and I'm liking Rice on his right hand side he's driving out we overloading that side he's like an insurance policy and i really like it and of course he can switch it to the left he's got a great switch path so we isolate on the left hand side i'm thinking yeah man i really like what we're doing here aldegar drops in shuts the crowd up puts in his pocket drops it off then disappears and the crowd are getting a little bit antsy then we create the first big chance and we're arsehole people right we want that to go in because we we love watching the team but we like watching the team from two nil up so that's when we really enjoy it and so when he's nil nil we're missing the first big chance.

33:47Elliot:He's like, oh man, come on, man. Couldn't you have just squared it? Couldn't you have volleyed it? We've all got great finishes. None of us have ever been in that situation before, but we've got great finishes going through our mind as it drops over his left-hand shoulder. And then you go back to Napoli. You think, oh for God's sake, we're not starting this again, are we? But we didn't, right? And I do think, you know, the last few games, away games, we have been nil-nil at halftime. We've rolled into the game second half. And there is inevitability about what we're going to do. However, there is a bit of you that says can you just make it a touch easier just a touch easier on my heart and my blood pressure just can we have a little bit more care about what we're doing i know you really care but but just for me can you just slap that one into the top corner just just do it because we we will get caught eventually if we don't keep taking these chances and um and we've felt this for a while haven't we really maybe for over a year now we're we're better then if you look the numbers are the underlying we're running a bit hot when it comes to certain things around next year for example so i just um would like to see that be a bit more decisive and effective but the way we're playing i really enjoy and i really enjoy the approach and the professionalism and the the win at all contexts i really i'm enjoying that i'll just ask you quickly do you have some frustration with Bikayo, who is our sort of superstar in the attack.

35:15We're an attack that's more a group than an individual. But if there is an individual, you'd say he's meant to be it. Do you feel, I mean, one thing I feel, I think his involvement will ultimately yield big results for us. But he does, to me, look like he's looking for his own shot more than others. There were two times he could have played Solas in, for example, where he opted to take a shot and into legs. Does he seem more focused on his own shot to you?

35:40Elliot:Yeah, I hope so. I mean, someone's had a word in his ear and said, you need 20 goals, mate. So go and get them. And if you look at the positions he's taking up, he's getting to the penalty spot a lot. He's paying time at center forward a lot. He's got three goals already, by the way. Yeah, three goals in four games, is it? And we're still after him. There's no sacred cows on this podcast, mate. You're all going to get it. and so um so yeah i i must admit i'm liking where he's arriving into the box and it's the same for odegaard they're hitting the box harder they're running through they're being more creative in their movements and this was a problem last year i felt we're a little bit behind our little bit worried you know but looking at the scoreboard and we weren't being so decisive from the first minute of that charity community shield sorry the intention has been different and i see that and And if anything, I want to see a little bit more of it, particularly in away games.

36:32Elliot:Keep running in, keep running through, keep making them defend. You know, that's important because Sunderland made us defend a lot more in our box than anybody else has done. And it wasn't always comfortable, was it? You know, sometimes you've got to make people defend their box. I mean, Sunderland, to their credit, understood the assignment, which is go long, break up play, go down. I mean, their goalkeeper was putting the ball in our box from their half from the first minute of the game. And by the way, that's not a criticism. That's probably the right way to play us because you're not going to play through our midfield.

37:04You're not going to play through our press. You might as well go over us, go long, break up play, try to break up the flow. Even still, we did have them push back a bit in the first half. There were some good chances. Obviously, the big one is Saka's. Kai had a miss from Odegaard, but I thought Odegaard laid it slightly behind Kai, the one where he blasted over. I think it's just behind him a bit. Solis plays that well in that moment. And then Kai had that lovely swivel shot where he swiveled on it, almost an overhead kick, but more of like a swiveled shot that was saved over, I think, a good half.

37:35The thing to me to him, one of the things that, where I was not really understanding the commentary, there was huge praise for Brian Broby. And it was sort of at the expense of Kansa. I thought Kansa was brilliant. He didn't go in too hard. He let Broby get the position because Broby's a bigger man, but he kept him in front of him. I mean, you look at Broby. he finishes with no shots in this game. He finishes two of eight on his ground duels, zero of two on his aerial duels. He commits three fouls. He creates almost nothing. You know, and again, it's good hold-up play. I want to be clear. He holds it up well and he's strong, but Kansa kept him in front of him, kept the danger from developing.

38:15And other than the fact that he nearly lost his rag at one point in the game and Gabby got booked for peacekeeping, which I assume was mistaken identity, I guess. You know, a Kieran Gibbs, Oxlade-Chamberlain kind of situation. But yeah, I thought this was a great Konza game. And I thought it was Konza doing the right thing, keeping a cool head and dealing with Braby rather than going through him or giving away cheap fouls. So that felt like a big part of the first half, the dynamic of them going up to Braby and Konza having to handle that. yeah absolutely and that's ultimately why we dropped the money on a 28 year old guy who's played in the Premier League for several years and was at Charlton before that so he came up through the Football League as well so he's very very well versed in this type of challenge will have played on this ground last season I assume so anyway I assume he played for Villa at Sunderland and was just very very well versed with the challenge whereas with Mascara who knows really it feels he might have dealt with it very very well he's certainly very capable but it feels more variable whereas with concert it's just like yep this guy he's 28 he's done this he knows what's about to happen and I think the thing is about Sunderland all the things we're we're saying about them is this fixture is very reminiscent of like Everton away that's what it feels like really tough the crowd are on you they're going to load the ball into the box we saw what happened last year that's exactly where their goals come from last year they just keep loading it into the box they keep putting you under pressure they keep challenging you and um you need guys that can deal with that and concert is absolutely a guy who who can deal with that and i think i've said this but i can't remember whether i said it on the podcast whether i said it on the way back um from the game with friends but the best thing i can say about esri concert is is it's like salibas there and i think that's pretty much as big as compliments come for center backs because I think Saliba absolutely has an argument for being the best centre-back in the world and Conta at this point in time we're not missing him and that's exactly why we made this signing, it's exactly why we needed to make this signing, we've gone away to two difficult grounds, not conceded, I appreciate he didn't start the Villa game but he's just been a massive, massive part of us not losing the thing about us that is definitely elite, I think we are good at everything, but you'd say probably, I mean, set pieces, we haven't scored from one yet this season, but out of possession, defending, keeping, you just read those statistics there for Brian Brobby, keeping things to a minimum, low incident, that's our real superpower.

41:00hour that's really what kind of gets us where we are at the moment and to walk into that and look like you've been there for the last five years is is just enormous it really is i can't compliment him enough someone checked me on this but i think esri canta has misplaced three passes for arsenal this season in the premier league and that's the other thing right we're focusing there on what i'm focusing there on the type of challenges you get at sunderland and rightly so but that's the other thing about saliba he's like 95 pass completion and then and that's not because he's rolling it side to side like and it's the same with concert he's not listen in that position really hard to find a defender who can do both tim you know what i mean exactly yeah and and look in that position the priority is nothing stupid and that's something arsenal are quite good at is just not having those bozo moments and yeah that's concert all over as well not to mentioned four of six in ground duels three of three in aerial duels i don't think i think the statistic was saying like sunderland didn't win an aerial duel in our box in this game which given the kind of threat it was that's how they expect to beat you they didn't by the way dan ballard i get it you are an arsenal guy you want to you want to show us how good you are can your watch be ended now can you stop targeting arsenal as as your most important game of every season it's it's another part of what and i want to mention this just because it's probably quite a small sidebar from the game and I don't know if we'll get into it but bringing Zubimendi on for Rice obviously you don't really want to take Rice off in this game state but one of the things that's so underrated about Zubimendi he is amazing in the air and that actually really makes him make sense as a closer of games get him on you know they're going to pump it into the box he'll win his headers which is not what he's associated with but his should be his statistically aerial dual percentage is freakish yeah statistically is as good as they come before we move to the fun stuff bruno raya um all that uh clive do you want to have any final comments on on our defending and and esri canta just slotting in effortlessly in the celebra role yeah i think what's nice about

43:05Elliot:us is that they play in units don't they they have you heard me talk about pairs before but the defensive unit is a big part of what we do in the last year or so for those that go to the games you can see that Heinzer has the defenders in a unit on the pitch and he's hyping them up and he's getting them going and whether you be a defender who's on the bench or starting the game he creates these game-based scenarios in the warm-up training and he gets them to a physical pitch and a level and I think they're a team within a team you know and they they die in that box they really do care and Gabriel's the leader of that to be honest in years and and everyone follows him and Concer, he's a London boy right?

43:50Elliot:He is not for messing about he's one of the car park players one of the seven that you need you need to go over the top and I love that type of Arsenal player, full stop I hate getting bullied on a football pitch that's the one thing I just can't stand if you ever get bullied on a football pitch Elliot please do not ask me on the next podcast because I'll say something wrong. Mate I've been bullied almost everywhere except a football pitch because I don't go on to the football pitch. And yeah and we don't get bullied anymore and it makes me proud it really does because those days when we used to get smashed about and no one cared were not days i was fond of and conso's the most arsehole player i did i had no hesitation about him signing none whatsoever i thought him and rogers were quite leggy in the world cup for england but villa like us played a lot of games last year and i thought they both looked a little bit fatigued at the world cup like some of our players did.

44:39Elliot:I had no doubts once he had a bit of time off, he'd come in and do well and he'd look great. Yeah, it is so important to restate, by the way, that teams just struggle after Europe and having Sunderland away following a Champions League away. That's tough. And to get through that is huge. I mean, look at the toll it took on Chelsea this weekend. Oh no, that's right. They're not in Europe. Okay, sorry. We got to shift gears to the second half. And obviously that's going to mean talking Bruno that's going to mean talking Raya which is going to take up most of our discussion this came from here I think worth noting by the way that that Ben White came off uh with what looked like a groin injury I haven't actually checked do we have an update on that a clear update he's not in the training pictures just come out so as we are recording so yeah yeah I don't think that's great news I mean we we just get one and one out but timber being back as we'll discuss obviously huge for us um yeah so so we got to come to all of that i i think this is as clear a moment as ever to give you what you've been crying out for is is that the way to say it which is brands um and you know i look i want to be clear we try to do a lot for you and and giving you the right brands to help you lead the life you deserve that's that's a big part of it so let's start with shopify uh shopify is the e-commerce platform that by now you should know what this is about.

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47:21Do it now. And this episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. BetterHelp is therapy. And therapy is important. As many of you know, as I have shared on this podcast, my youngest daughter, six-year-old Sophie, was diagnosed type 1 diabetic just a few days ago. And we're coping with that as a family. And she's doing brilliantly. And my wife's doing brilliantly. I'm doing the best I can. We're all doing the best we can. We're all doing the best we can in our life, period. a big part of this transition is that the hospital provides therapy because it's a life change there's just this tendency to feel like you should be able to take things on and handle it i can't tell you how much things help when you're going through something the messages of support i receive by email by uh dms help still have a lot of people that i have to get back in touch with by the way you should get help dealing with the things that life makes hard because you can wake up one day and realize it's been overwhelming you and getting in your way.

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49:00Obviously, Timber had to come on for Ben White, but he could have waited until 70 minutes for Miles. But he said, you know what? We spent a lot of money on Bruno Gamer-Eisch. He doesn't have much affection for Sunderland. He knows what it takes to beat these guys. We'll talk more about that in a moment. And he made the halftime changes. With no disrespect to Miles, who's been a big part of our season already, but at the right time, when I think Miles was just enough off it and Bruno could add just a little bit more of what we needed. So what do you think about Mikel making that change, Miles' performance and the decision to go with Bruno at halftime?

49:31Elliot:Yeah, not every game suits you. And this game was developing into a game for adults, right? People have been around the track a few times and I was calling for, I'll be straight, I was calling for Eze, Bruno, and obviously Timber was sort of in force, and you just needed another adult on the pitch, really, to manage them, because I'm watching a game with fear, right? It's nil-nil, right? So I'm looking for everything that's going to make us better. And yeah, Miles lacked a little bit of concentration at the start, and I know we were trying to be controlled, and he was a bit slow on the ball, but part of that is by design, in my opinion, to just be really deliberate, but there's a there's a moment where you do need to show a bit more personality and Bruno's got loads of it right so um and it's also how the opposition and reacts to use when Bruno comes on he get he comes in straight away drops him receives it the crowd are on his back then he pops into the middle of the pitch and then he gets it off the sides and we're rocking and rolling and the simplicity of just being on the right passing lane to receive and then have a picture it's just simple stuff I'm not gonna I'm not painting him out to be Zidane but you understand that area of pitch and there's a level of understanding association with a lot of our players how they connect with each other and i must say i feel there's a lot more respect what each other can do and a lot more support what each other can do i felt i didn't feel that so strongly at the start of last season but i really feel that now i really feel a level of accountability on the pitch for each other to hold people to account but also respect what they're doing and support people to make sure you're available for them to get them out of dodge get them out of trouble and Bruno does it straight away.

51:10Elliot:Conce does it straight away. It's like, we're here, two 28-year-olds, don't worry, we've got this. We've been to Sunderland before. This is no drama, you know? And so, yeah, a very impressive performance and I've said many times, I was waiting to see what he would bring and it's becoming really clear what he's bringing, isn't it? It's becoming clear. We look like a proper, proper midfield that can go anywhere, you know, and do what's required, Elliot. It's so crazy. It's so rare that you get someone that can be so influential with the last ball, who's also so good in the middle of the park in his duels and in his combativeness.

51:45I mean, he's a unique one-of-one player. Might be the best player that moved in the Premier League this summer while everyone was focused on everything else that happened. I will say, by the way, just to keep an eye on Myles Lewis Skelly and what he's accomplishing, from Harvey Downs, quote, Myles Lewis Skelly is the first English teenager to start each of Arsenal's first four league games of a season since both Tony Adams and David Roecastle did in 86-87. So, I mean, what Miles is accomplishing at his age is special. And what Miles gave us last season was a little more of that progressiveness, that go forward, that willingness to be brave under pressure and take it forward.

52:14What Bruno does, he does that in one. He does what Miles does by taking it, shifting his body, rolling a challenge and driving forward. Bruno does it in one. Get it? Give it. I mean, it's incredible, the tempo quickening. Clive, yeah? I think it's important to realize that you also have to play the hot hand.

52:32Elliot:And Miles has been hot since Fulham. really hasn't he since fulham and he's got a bit cold on this day so you play someone else and they're going to have their moments they're all going to have their moment oligar's hot at the moment he's hot he's a hot hand right so you must use that player in that period when they're hot and when they're called down you get someone else in and you get them in quickly so you don't lose them so don't become you're all i can't play them because i haven't played too long you know i really liked what arteta did the weekend he got someone else on he's getting minutes in Marino and and Zubmendi so they're now usable really really important means they're fit and ready to go post the World Cup Odegaard's hot he's had two 90s and then he had to come out of this game because he was just tiring a bit but it's no drama Marino's there he's 6 foot 100 guess what Son of a tick putting the ball in the air like Zubmendi come on I think this I know I go on about this a lot but this view of not settling on what we think is the best making sure we're using people appropriately for the minutes that are on the pitch and the requirements, what the opposition are doing.

53:35Elliot:If we all have a strong principle by which we're playing, it doesn't matter. And back to where Tim said, or maybe you said earlier, sorry, earlier on, we took Declan Rice out. We weren't doing that last season. For no money at all, we were not doing that. He stays on the, if he starts, he ends. Unless he's injured. And he's not ending. Yeah, he finished left back in Napoli. Or right back, I mean. But, you know, he's not ending every game at the moment, which is, again, it's a step forward, isn't it? And it's going to be important when we need to be in condition towards the end of the season. If he's even in the squad for Ipswich in midweek, I will send a nastily worded letter.

54:12Elliot:No, he's playing right back and he's captain. There you go. Tim, we'll come back to Bruno in a minute, but look, we already covered the ref stuff. We certainly don't need to again. But once the penalty is given, this is the kind of moment that seasons turn on. They really do. And usually when a keeper makes a save, a penalty save. I want to be clear. Anytime you save a penalty, you've done well. Because you've at least guessed right. You have 50-50 plus the mid. So, you know, the penalty taker is an 80-85 % chance of scoring. So you're at a huge disadvantage. But it's rare, I think, to see penalty saves where the penalty is perfectly struck and it's saved.

54:53usually then you say you can't save those this is hit firmly low to the post right where you're supposed to do it and raya gets pilloried when he goes early there were meme videos going around of raya going early and like how dumb it looked well it doesn't look dumb now because this is extraordinary save he guesses he goes and he gets it right and it's i mean david rye was brilliant in this game, collecting the ball. He had the sidewinder kick out to Saka on the wing. He had claims in a crowded box, punches, the double punch in this game, but the penalty saves the highlight. A lot of people calling Raya the best keeper in the world after this, and welcome to the party.

55:36Yeah, absolutely. I'm really pleased. I wish it hadn't. Well, no, in hindsight, I'm glad it did happen that the penalty was given because the right thing happened. And I do think that kind of spurred us on a little bit. But largely, I'm just happy for him because goalkeepers don't usually get those moments. Like he comes the closest because the save he makes from Esteval, the other way, like is a match where it's a point winning save, right? If that goes in, we almost certainly don't win. But, you know, to get like a really clear moment where as a goalkeeper, you swing the game, that's very, very rare.

56:16And he just really deserves that because he does loads of kind of smaller, less noticeable stuff that I think Arsenal fans notice because we see it all the time. But the taking of crosses under pressure, like when you look at his stature, you wouldn't guess that he's the sort of goalkeeper that just comes out and just plucks bombs out of the air all the time. and like you say his distribution the way in open play he acts as a release valve that you can go back to as well the way he's able to do short and long distribution but he's just another one of those players who we and again all your like all your best teams your title winning teams obviously around recruitment right but it's not just getting the right player it's getting the right player at the right time and I think getting David Ryer at that time in his career when he's clearly on an upward trajectory I think it was also getting him from Brentford who again as I said at the beginning of the episode very admirable club it's not the first time we've gone shopping there not just for players but for for coaches as well and I think probably recognizing the way the Premier League was going as well and kind of saying this is the type of goalkeeper we need because everyone's sticking the ball in the box now, ourselves included, from set pieces and all of that.

57:39So having a goalkeeper who can do that, hugely, hugely kind of crucial. And also, obviously, as we all know and as we all remember, we had to make a very difficult decision or Arteta had to make a very difficult decision to do that. Aaron Ramsdale signed his new contract just before we signed Raya, right? So we were broadly happy with him. He was signed to a new contract. it's like okay and then riot became available and arteta was like i've got to get this guy i've got to get this guy he saw the vision and i always come back to you know in terms of history repeating um arsenal replacing john lukic with david seaman which clive i'm sure you remember and i just love the quote from george graham after that he said um i think john lukic is one of the best goalkeepers in the country i just think david seaman is the best goalkeeper in the country and that's kind of what we've done here and I think there's a very very valued valid argument that this is our most important player not least because the nature of goalkeeping your backup's always going to be quite a big drop-off unfortunately where and it's the one part of the squad I think our backups in pretty much every position are barely even backups they're like look at the midfield we're likely to play tomorrow Ipswich like that is that's the top of the Premier League midfield but obviously you can't really do that with goalkeeper and yeah raya's in that kind of that where alisson was a couple of years ago for liverpool where for maybe four or five years he was probably just the best goalkeeper in the country i think raya's slap bang in that form at the moment and he i'm really happy for him that he got this kind of spotlight moment he really deserves it tim you're historian so i'll just ask you are you prepared to start talking about his place in the sort of pantheon of of arsenal goalkeepers and and where he is in your estimation now or is it a little too premature uh i think there are this this is a story that's got a few more years to run um david riah and arsenal i'd say let it run um let's see what's in the trophy cabinet at the end and everything like that obviously i've grown up watching david seaman that's very stiff competition if you're talking about kind of best goalkeeper, I know historically as well, before my time, Bob Wilson, you know, people like that, Jack Kelsey, going back to the 1930s, legendary goalkeeper.

1:00:04I was going to say. Well, he used to... Almunia, Ospina, are we... No. But I mean, put it this way, I think he's quite a bit better than Jens Lehmann, who was like our last title winning goalkeeper. Really, you're looking at David Seaman for company and that's incredibly stiff competition. And obviously there's always like recency bias with these things. But let's have a decade of David Royer at Arsenal. I think if he gets that or something close to that, we could well be using words like that. What makes it hard, Tim, is he may be as good a shot stopper as any of those guys, but he has to do something they didn't, which is he has to be a footballer too.

1:00:45He has to be able to play with the ball at his feet in a way that none of them had that demand So he's got both, and it's incredible. But at the same time, maybe David Seaman coming out for a cross in 1991 might have been a little bit different. Fair point. Yeah, fair point. Coming out for a cross in 2026. Yeah. Yeah, all right. Well, look, Clive, it's less than two minutes maybe after that that Bruno sticks the ball in the back of the net. and Solis plays Odegaard into the box quite brilliantly, I thought. And the ball, I think it's a shot or it gets blocked up and Kai gets to the ball and it recycles.

1:01:24And Rice has a really nice... Oh, I should mention, by the way, Thomas Frank, not only a Silver member, but was on Match of the Day last night. And if you do get a chance to watch it, or two days ago, whatever it was, he obviously managed David Raya and he had a really good section on the four aspects of David Raya that he rated. It's about a two-minute clip. You can watch. I'm sure it's out there. So I did just want to mention that because I thought he had an interesting insight there. But so I could. Yep. Thank you. Yeah. So Rice slips it to Bruno. The technique is brilliant. The celebration is special.

1:01:57He shows them that they're small. He cups the ears. I mean, he obviously wins all the Newcastle fans back immediately, which means he'll get an easier ride at St. James's Park, I'm sure. This is a guy who produced a performance that says there's maybe still a little Geordi in him because he hates Sunderland. and that's a beautiful thing for us. What a moment, Clive. So what do you think about this? Bruno's sort of announcing his importance to us, his quality, the magnitude of that signing coming home in one big moment and him celebrating it with a little bit of extra stick for the Sunderland fans.

1:02:33Elliot:Yeah, sort of thing. If he did it against us, we would absolutely detest him. And I don't think as Tim was in the app with tears singing Bruno, Bruno. like everybody else was so um yeah that switch passed out to left hand side solace was starting to get into the game by then and he flipped the ball down to califuri back heel we recycle get the ball again and it goes to rice and this is where he bruno creates this chance by backward running and it's something that you know you're right i can speak to miles you learn about backward running because you focus so much on what's in front of you and just jogging forward but backward running creates separation to receive and turn out and do things and it's a big part of the game to make the body language that you show when you're backward running to receive it that was that was the difference and so he separated away from rice nice little backward jog oligarchy crowd scene crowd scene let me get out of the way let me just make a darting run to give him a half a second that he needs to get the shot off and so this is i do believe it's all the players involved in this of course bruno decides he isn't oh i've just joined arson maybe maybe i knock it out to the fullback no i'm going for i'm going for the postage stamp mate he could he couldn't have put it better he couldn't put it there better than shaq you know i mean he couldn't have done anything better i'm gonna put it right there and he just does it so surprised you idiot did surprise you surprised me anyway i was buzzing with that you know and yeah i know he had it in him you know i mean i knew he had that in his locker the funny thing is i thought the one that he was mad about was the curler inside the box where he passes it past the far post yeah i mean he could have two goals in this game addition everything else just told it a bit and he plays he plays saka in for the penalty i mean clive it it's funny even without the goal his influence on the game was so noticeable everything first time i mean you know what's crazy for a guy who's playing tough passes hard passes he's 12 or 13 in this game he creates the penalty you know he just he does everything at tempo it's it's beautiful so i'll tell you what's crazy there are three new signings on this pitch and they're all excellent and that is a credit to the coaching staff right and the most so you've got solace who's just come in and we've like settled like snow isn't he right straight away he had one bad half and that's that's it because he got booked and then you've got burritos come in straight away looks like an also player and cons has come in and we're sitting here scratching our heads thinking hmm this looks quite good you know they're just just not a problem there you know and um so the level is great which means our principles and how we play are really becoming easy to communicate and it's just clear to me that these are out they look like arsehole players so immediately and then bruno it's not it shouldn't be that easy to join a team and just settle in against big personalities like Odegaard and, you know, and Rice.

1:05:33Elliot:And then you've got Miles there, you've got Zubemendi, Marino. They can all play. You've got a couple of World Cup winners there, national team captains. Rice will all be the England captain one day. These are big players. And to come in and coexist with them, I just think it's brilliant. You know, and I don't know what they're talking about because a lot of this stuff is done in meetings, et cetera. But the way they're accepting their roles, except for the fact he's not starting maybe because he's not quite fit this is a this is a player that i'm starting to really like you know really like and i don't know about you guys but i've got psg in my mind how are we going to beat them one day you know i shouldn't be thinking that but i often think about it a lot what do we need to do that and i think this guy brings the ingredients that will help us overcome them just by what he brings to a pitch his understanding of the contest understanding of the space, his tools, his running, everything.

1:06:26Elliot:I just think he's got a lot of football in him. Yeah. Yeah, I'm very, very excited about it. I can't say enough good things. And Tim, one thing that I really liked about this second half is they went long, they tried to put the ball in the box. We committed players to the counter. You know, we did not – I think there were times last season when we got pushed back and we were reactive and we didn't necessarily commit to trying to find a second goal. Timber did get a second goal, by the way, offside from a brilliant Odegaard free kick and a brilliant Timber header, and it's very close. It has to be just a few centimeters offside, I would guess.

1:07:05But we committed bodies to the counter. Saka was played through by Odegaard and shot straight at the keeper. Maybe he could have slid it across to Solis. We were in on goal a number of times. Obviously, we get the goal at the very end when Saka scores his penalty through some weak hands by the keeper. But did you notice that as a change, the degree to which we committed to the counter, committed bodies to the counter, and really tried to go find that second goal as Sunderland pushed for theirs? Yeah, absolutely. I think it's been more of a theme this season, almost like maybe this is projection because we talked about it a lot, but trusting the defenders to defend.

1:07:42Obviously, we defend in shape as well, and that involves everyone coming back and getting behind the ball and we still do that but it does feel to me like there's been more of an emphasis on we got some really good defenders they can take like everyone else getting your positions but they can take care of business and when I look at some of the stuff that's happening as well I don't think for example I think Erdegaard for example is largely back in form for like cerebral reasons relating to himself but I also think as we've discussed previously there are things we're doing that suit him I think the same about Saka as well this is another game where he has three non-penalty shots on goal and if we can and he's taking up lots of shooting positions lots of central positions as Clive said earlier there's lots more getting into the box I think that's a big part of why Havertz is staying on as well because he really facilitates that in perhaps a way that Jokeres doesn't because Jokeres is going to be the one in the box kind of staying there and there's there's stuff about the attacking rotations but absolutely I think I think we know that we have listen this we've lost something with Martinelli right that kind of speed in behind but we still have it like Saka's still quick in behind Zollis is still quick in behind I think Madueke can be as well but yeah if it's a bit weird because it does feel like we've been going for that second goal but not getting it basically which which feels a little bit strange and counterintuitive we did get it on this occasion through a penalty and it should be said as well like the penalty is not incidental it's not like Saka's through one-on-one like if he's not if he's not fouled he probably scores you know so it's not like a it's not a crappy penalty by any means so yeah that that does feel like a little bit of a sea change from last year and one that none of us should be surprised about really we all talked about it didn't we all last season about trying to create a little bit more separation on the scoreboard and so i i was always very confident that arteta and his coaching staff would be talking about doing that and ways of doing that

1:09:55Elliot:yeah thanks i think obviously i missed a couple of pods and so now the chance really get to this really particularly in napoli game we look at our so we've often spoken about 44 percent where his right-hand side by us and and we think oh we don't want that because we're going to get stopped there well i think that anyway i think back to bionic tushel playing two left backs and stopping us in that quarterfinals of champions league and i'm worried we're going to get stopped that right hand side so what what have we done we've actually gone even more right-sided we've moved rice to the right-hand side we've moved rice through over to the right-hand side i think part of that is to because Saliba's not there and we want to make some insurance policy.

1:10:41Elliot:So he's on the outside tip of the diamond on the right-hand side, progressing there. And he's underlapping that side and putting switch passes in. Odegaard, he's not just staying on the right, but obviously we all know his comfort zone. Kai's on the right, Saka's on the right, Ben White's on the right. So we've actually doubled down on the right. We've gone more right-sided and we've become quite relational. So without using the hipster words, relationism, we are playing relational football on that right hand side so what does that happens i always think that proximity of your players if we're close it develops a style the napoli game really stood out to me that was relational football it was five a side tip tap one two they were frozen in their boots on the spot and we were just passing it around them so we've doubled down something that we've done well over the last few years and we've gone back to it we've gone back to it and added another one or two players into it and at some points we've got six players in that right hand quadrant to create an overload to get the cross in and the difference what makes that work is that califiori becomes a center forward and so we have a box presence which is really important for people to track and mark so this style is developing you know and i'm i'm really enjoying seeing these developments and it will no doubt go again when someone stands in those spaces and matches us up 6v6 but with rice there we can switch the point of the attack with real pace if you look at his switch passes they're not in the sky because you teach people to travel as the ball is traveling he's fizzing it over there so when he's arriving at solace or arriving at ezay arriving at califuri they've got time to get into their running to set people on their heels that's that difference of pace of cross of switch place sorry it's really important to the next phase of play and And it's really good.

1:12:29Elliot:It's really good. I'm waiting for an article to come out about Arsenal's relational football. Yeah. You know, I haven't seen one yet. I saw a few on set pieces last year and keeping the handbrake on. I'm waiting to see those articles because I think what we're doing, I don't see anyone else doing that, playing six people in a right-hand socket and destroying teams. Go ahead, mate. Yeah. Yeah, well, I was going to say, I mean, the Napoli goal comes from that when Solis is in the right channel and he's the one who plays the ball to out of guard. So it's bearing fruit for sure. And it's going to be interesting to track.

1:13:05A few little bits and pieces from this game that we should pick out. I think, Clive, I'll stay with you just for a second here on the sort of flashpoints late. Obviously, Shaka and Kansa get into it. Gabi is fouled for, pardon me, carded for playing Peacemaker. So any thoughts on that flashpoint standing up to it? I mean, there were, there are so many things I love about this arsenal, but one thing I love is that they're, they're just for as technical and gifted as they are, Clive, they are, they're physical as well. So, and they will stand up to it and they, but they don't do it without crossing the line.

1:13:40No one did anything in that little melee to get sent off or have something stupid happen, except for Gabby, obviously trying to pull Conce out of the fight.

1:13:49Elliot:Yeah. I, I do appreciate Granit Shakala. I gotta say, right. he works himself into the ground for his team and he really fronted up for his team and he was really getting into our players and really trying but I did see a clip afterwards of him and Quansa Hank hugging at the end of the game and I love that this isn't crest time this is a football match in the Premier League 8 o 'clock Saturday night it's all on and I love the approach of the players to really go at each other and you know something that the English game has and we must never lose it you know okay the referee nearly blew it but um yeah he didn't and we got away with it and now we're not talking about a really dark moment like we were inst james's park a few years ago right so um but i just love the the contest that football is a contest right it's sometimes tactical sometimes it's a bit more non-contact like napoli you know you're trying to create a goal in a space that's been reduced and sometimes it's a bigger distance up to a big center forward.

1:14:51Elliot:He's pinning your center back. You're getting it back again. You're going again. You're trying not to create a transition game. Love it, mate. Absolutely love it. And we should all embrace it, these different types of games that we get to see. Yeah, I mean, for years we talked about, like, our player would get kicked or pushed to the ground and no one would rush to defend him. Remember, Tim would get furious about that. And it was like, what are we doing? And now that's not who we are. By the way, if you want any sense that John Brooks had decided he'd had enough of us, I don't actually think Gabby got booked for mistaken identity.

1:15:22I just think after Gabby did that elbow gesture on his ass in our box, he had enough with Gabby and he was looking for a chance to book him. If you want any evidence that John Brooks had it out for us, here's the evidence. The booking Kai gets late in the game down near the corner flag where he goes in for a 50-50, barely does anything. The Sunderland player goes over to nothing. It's a nothing challenge in the corner flag. And he yellows Kai. I mean, terrible. But Tim, one last thing that we should talk about. Sometimes a player you've forgotten a little bit about comes on and you go, oh shit, yeah, I forgot about this.

1:15:59This player's special. Uri and Timber reminded us, he went super cyan, as the kids say, for a period of the game there where he just couldn't be beat, kept taking the ball off people and then kept charging it up the other way. And it's like, all I could think was, please stay fit. we have to find someone to play right back occasionally so timber can get fully fit because we saw a little glimpse against sunderland of what arsenal can be if tim and this is no offense to ben white but what arsenal can be with a fully fit urian timber it's just worth reminding people this may be the best right back in world football if it's not akimi it's urian timber that's how important this is yeah absolutely and and it's i i just really pray for this day when they're both available and maybe we can uh but white and timber that is and we can 60 30 or 70 20 them but also like i think about the possibilities and wonder what they are in terms of um how we use both players like because to me it's almost this is a bit too simplistic but you could almost split it to ben white for your home games against low blocks but this was a uri and timber game it's not that this isn't a ben white game or he can't handle sunderland away um by any means but but it's really a uri and timber game like it's a it's a battle it's kind of gloves off it's a it's a bit of a car park game yep and and he can really really do that um and it just there was a section somewhere where like i think a sunderland player like clipped him or something he goes up to him wags his finger at him immediately runs back wins the ball gets up the pitch gets tripped referee doesn't give anything and then he gets back up and goes and gets it and it's it's just very like you know i i saw like um someone posted just that clip and they just and the caption was something like arteta signing madmen or something it's just like someone who is so not just physically capable but so committed to the idea of winning the ball back and keeping it like he's really got a defender's mentality of one of those guys who just enjoys doing that who really really enjoys the act of resisting I think um another team and and trying to get at them and he he's just yeah it's it's one of those things isn't it like I think we all felt the same I certainly felt like that where you know the player's good and everything and you want them to come back but then they come back on and they jump out at you a little bit I don't know if it's just because like he's grown the hair out a little bit um as well and so he does look a little literally look a little bit different and whether that that jumped out as well but it's just like ah yeah i remember this this was like it's it's almost a bit like what i always say about um you know looking back at like clips of henry or something and i'm like how did i internalize this how did i just like think that this was normal i know it's just very similar yeah yeah and and like i was like well when he came on at halftime I was like we have to be prepared for him to be a little bit rusty and it's like nah he's not and I look I for one didn't think at all about the Champions League final not not even not even once I promise um and what could there is he put a caption on his Instagram as well right something like hard to explain um you know but some people know or something like that like we've got to consider the emotional toll on him he missed the end of the season where we won the league he played the Champions League final but like he clearly played and a lot of discomfort and we didn't win and he lost his world cup like that's a lot for him to go through actually that we we probably haven't myself included haven't thought about enough and he's just coming back like he's never been away i think that there's a mental side to that as well that's that's truly incredible huge win huge moment in the season really spectacular display for men this this was a brilliant premier league game this is the kind of game the Premier League can throw up that other leagues don't.

1:20:04Right? In a tough place, hard crowd, at night, under the lights, up north. They're physical. We're talented. We stand up to it. We show our quality. We show our medal. It's back and forth. It's ding-dong. There's bad calls. There's saved penalties. There's made penalties. Just a great game of football that we came out on top and rights are wrong from last season. I'll leave it on this, Clive. It is that time of year where I get to tell people I don't care about the League Cup, where it means nothing to me. And I don't care if we win. And people get to write angry messages about it. I hate this competition.

1:20:36I wish it didn't exist. I don't care about it at all. And if Mikel plays anybody against Ipswich that he wants to start against Brighton, he should be sacked. Do you agree with all that, basically?

1:20:46Elliot:I agree with it partly. But I have to be honest with you, I don't want us to be anywhere near it. But I just don't want Arsenal to lose a game. And as soon as the ball rolls on the grass, I become a hypocrite. Because I don't want us to be in this competition. But I don't want us ever to lose. And in the league cut the semifinal last year when Kyler ran the keeper of the semifinal, I pulled my calf while I was jumping so high. But that's because it was Chelsea. You know what I mean? Like this is Ipswich. We get the kids to lose to Ipswich. No one cares. On, we go off to Brighton. It'll be fine.

1:21:14Elliot:I'm just speaking my truth, right? So I agree with you conceptually. I want to create space in the schedule so we can do our work and start having injuries and secure the trophies we want to really win. but when the ball rolls and I'm telling you I'm going to be there thinking we've got to win this. Of course. I do too just so everyone knows. Me too. It's hard. It is hard because you are conceptually right. Well, for me, I agree with you. Those two games in January. This double-legged semi-final in January when everybody else is on their winter break type stuff, that's the shit that wrecks the season.

1:21:48It is

1:21:49Elliot:but it's alongside the two extra games in the Champions League so you have to think about that. That's four extra games if you're in the semi-final that you have to manage. And the Champions League games could be critical. They haven't been so far. And then the FA Cup starts in the same month. So January becomes, when everyone else is resting, it becomes the most taxing month. You could be in four competitions in one month. That does not feel right to me. That's a very Arsenal view. And this competition is very important to the EFL clubs, but I don't want it, mate. It's this simple. The League Cup should be for non-European competing clubs.

1:22:25It'd be more fun. You'd have more interesting competition. There's plenty of football. The idea that Arsenal need to be playing Liverpool twice in January in the League Cup when we have two extra Champions League games in January, it doesn't make sense. And look, just so we're clear, every time we play, I want us to win. I root for us to win. I don't want us to lose. But if Mikel rolls Marley Salmon and Max Dahman out there tomorrow, or whenever it is, is it tomorrow? Is it Tuesday or Wednesday? Tuesday. Tuesday. tomorrow i will be fine with that go ahead club sorry i sounded like you know i'd like to see and

1:22:55Elliot:i know people agree with me until maybe the final is that these competitions don't have bar at all and so they they have an opportunity to almost rebrand themselves the cup competition to say this is how we go back to old school football and uh and don't have far maybe the final because that wember you got you can do it there but all the way up to the final nova just create something different you know and um get with the semi-finals two-legger you know and let's get back to maybe having a semi semi-final FA Cup not at Wembley but at one person's ground you know whoever gets drawn and it's at their ground and that's it you know let's get back to that making football a little bit more accessible and not just a bleep washing machine for crazed opinions because you've being upset about a decision.

1:23:46Elliot:And our decision's coming, by the way, but it's going to cost us. And it just bothers me a little bit. Yeah, yeah. And look, I mean, like I said, of course I want us to win every game. But if you said, how could we crash out of the League Cup over two legs to Liverpool in January or with the academy kids playing Ipswich in September, I know which I'd pick. Obviously, once you're at the final, you want to win it. We're not going to go down that road again. We'll leave it there. But I will say simply this. It's almost hard for us to lose these games now because if he rotates fully, you still have a Champions League level team out there that's going to blow Ipswich off the park.

1:24:21So maybe the good news, to be fair, maybe the good news with the League Cup this season is you keep Yoko Ress involved. You get Eza more minutes. You give Zubamendi more minutes. You give players you're going to need more minutes that they're not getting at the moment. So we'll see. It'll be a fun instant reaction, I'm sure. And maybe Marley Salmon and Max Downman get a start. I'd be fine with that. Let's leave it there. That's plenty for today. Really, really huge win. League Cup midweek. And then before we go into the 92-week international break, we've got Brighton. That's a big test. They've been very good.

1:24:50Now, granted, they've beaten two teams with 10 men, Coventry and Villa, who are bad. But, you know, Herzlert hates us and we hate him. So it's another emotionally charged game coming up. Clive, great job. Thank you. Thank you very much. Tim, thanks very much. My pleasure as always. Thanks, everybody. Love you so much. If you have questions, let me know. Champions 50 is the code. If you want to have the instant reaction tomorrow, you can give it a try. See what you think. We love you. And we'll talk to you after Arsenal 10. If you want to know.

1:25:43Elliot:We'll see you next time. with free one-on-one design support for any project on any budget. Yep, we said free. Oh, and did we mention the cafe? So what are you waiting for? Come see all that's in store. Visit the Wayfair store today at Edens Plaza and Wilmette. Wayfair, every style, every home. For a limited time at McDonald's, get a Big Mac Extra Value meal for$8. That means two all-beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun. And medium fries. And a drink. we may need to change that jingle. Price of participation may vary.