In short
The episode is a wide-ranging Arsenal Vision mailbag covering: (1) reactions to reports that Pep Guardiola could leave Manchester City this summer, including who City might target next (Enzo Maresca is discussed, with speculation about Chelsea’s internal problems); (2) what Arsenal should look for in the Everton match beyond results; (3) how much to rotate for the League Cup (Carabao Cup) ties vs Chelsea after beating Palace; and (4) whether Arsenal fans should “panic” after recent performances.
Guests
Phil Castillo (Costa), an Arsenal Vision podcast host/regular guest; Paul Halopaz (Patreon/Arsenal Vision contributor).
Key claims and notable examples
- Pep leaving is framed as either a “last chopper out of Saigon” exit ahead of the 115/117/142 charges resolution, or as part of City already planning for life without him (recruitment changes like Hugo Viana, young signings).
- Everton game: return to defensive stability (Saliba back; Timber at right back; Calafiori at left back; Capable left-center pairing discussed), plus balance fitting Odegaard and Eze together; also a functioning left side with Trossard starting to create space for Ødegaard/Yorøkeres.
- League Cup: Phil argues Arsenal can rotate heavily vs Palace and still field a strong XI; he’s not prioritizing the trophy over league/UCL. Eli argues winning it could jeopardize Premier League/UCL via fixture congestion, citing last season’s two-legged semi-final disruption and the need to avoid repeating “playing players into the ground.”
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOPep Guardiola News
0:28 to 0:40
Discussion on the implications of Pep Guardiola potentially leaving Manchester City.
“It's really exciting to hear that Pep Guardiola might be leaving Manchester City until you realize it's our manager who they're going to try to get next.”
Host Introductions and Mailbag Explanation
0:40 to 1:51
Hosts introduce themselves and explain the format of the episode focusing on mailbag questions.
“This is the Arsenal Vision Post-Match Podcast.”
Pep's Departure Reactions
1:51 to 3:05
Exploring various reactions to the news of Pep potentially leaving City and its implications.
“at least three of them in the next 90 minutes.”
Analyzing Pep's Situation
3:05 to 7:16
In-depth analysis of the potential reasons behind Pep's departure and its impact on Manchester City.
“and I will, I will start with you, Phil, the news of pep potentially leaving this summer has led people to have all different kinds of reactions that it will motivate them.”
Managerial Instability at City
7:16 to 11:43
Discussion on the potential instability at Manchester City post-Pep and implications for the future.
“want to keep it sort of arsenal and this season focused as opposed to big picture which is simply let's do some armchair psychology, which I find has always been your best work on the podcast.”
Upcoming Everton Fixture
11:43 to 12:50
Preview of the upcoming match against Everton and key indicators to watch for in the performance.
“Phil's just making up names at this point.”
Team Selection and Tactics
12:50 to 14:01
Discussion on team selection strategies and finding balance between players like Eze and Odegaard.
“which, to be clear, sure, would take it.”
Finding Balance in Team Dynamics
14:01 to 15:11
Discussion on integrating Eze and Odegaard into the team strategy.
“So if he has to leave one out, that's fine.”
Key Elements for the Everton Game
15:12 to 18:00
What the team needs to perform well in the upcoming game against Everton.
“obviously a great time together, Phil, in Bruges.”
Managing Player Options and Strategies
18:01 to 20:38
Examining the management of player options and the impact on team performance.
“Obviously, if we are to win, we will be back to first, where we want to be.”
Show all 27 chapters
Understanding Squad Depth and Rotation
20:39 to 22:45
Discussing the importance of squad depth and rotation in maintaining performance.
“this squad is that it could be there to support us, not to win us things.”
Defensive Structure and Team Identity
22:46 to 24:54
The necessity of a strong defensive structure and the team's identity in play.
“We can bring on a lock pick as if our runners in behind aren't working.”
Evaluating Performance Pressures
24:55 to 28:00
Analyzing the pressures of performance and the reactions to underwhelming games.
“But let me ask you this, Paul, because I like the way this is phrased.”
Analyzing Team Dynamics and Recent Performances
28:00 to 32:20
The discussion focuses on the current state of the Arsenal team, their performances, and the impact of injuries on their play.
“The ones that really just want to keep the positivity high and really believe it's going to happen.”
Debating the Importance of the League Cup
32:20 to 37:30
The hosts debate whether winning the League Cup is crucial for the team's success this season, weighing the benefits against potential drawbacks.
“It is now clear that we would have two legs against Chelsea where we do advance.”
Evaluating Risks of Prioritizing Cups
37:30 to 42:00
The conversation shifts to the risks associated with prioritizing cup competitions over league performance and Champions League pursuits.
“that we will have a rearranged league fixture in April.”
Debating the Importance of the League Cup
42:00 to 53:06
The hosts discuss the implications of competing for the League Cup versus the Premier League and Champions League.
Evaluating Jokeres' Performance
56:00 to 1:02:36
Discussion on the infographic and comparisons with Kai Havertz's first season.
“What do you think of the infographic that he posted?”
Injury Concerns and Expectations
1:02:36 to 1:10:04
Analyzing injury impacts on players and expectations for their return.
“But is it just me who just before he got injured, we were starting to warm up to the idea that he might be reasonably handy?”
Assessing Victor Jokras' Performance
1:10:04 to 1:13:25
Discussion on Victor Jokras' contributions and performance dynamics.
“Game for your life, who are our best front three, if everybody's fit?”
Debating Arsenal's Best Striker
1:13:26 to 1:18:11
A heated debate over who should be Arsenal's best striker considering current players.
“Obviously, we covered the one that gets the biggest pushback.”
The Role of Martin Odegaard
1:18:12 to 1:21:16
An exploration of Martin Odegaard's current influence and criticism within the team.
“Look, he won't get any bloody touches in the box.”
Evaluating Eza's Impact
1:21:17 to 1:24:05
A critical look at Eza's role and effectiveness in the Arsenal setup.
“I mean, if you'd have asked me two years ago who the key staples of the team were, it would have been Saliba, Gabriel, Rice, Odegaard, Saka.”
Evolving Perceptions of Player Roles
1:24:05 to 1:26:37
Discussion on the evolving roles of players like Kai Havertz and Martin Odegaard in Arsenal's strategy.
“things leo does he can influence the game from that position the way leo does but that understanding is evolving, especially as it pertains to our out of possession shape and our out of possession intensity.”
The Challenge of Midfield Contributions
1:26:38 to 1:30:01
Analyzing Martin Odegaard's contributions and the need for midfielders to contribute in the final third.
“For me, though, for a team that has been chance-shy over the years and goal-shy at times, I think he has a unique elite skill in that respect.”
Odegaard's Consistency and Future Impact
1:30:02 to 1:33:03
Exploring Martin Odegaard's consistency and potential impact on Arsenal's future performance.
“It's a different team at the functioning left-hand side, Odegaard, Saka, and Jurian Timber on the right.”
Predictions for Arsenal's Season
1:33:04 to 1:35:48
Hosts discuss their predictions for Arsenal's standings in the Premier League and overall performance this season.
“One of those is going to fly in, and I think it's going to change a lot, but it's got to happen soon is sort of where I come down on that.”
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:27This podcast has been brought to you by
0:32It's really exciting to hear that Pep Guardiola might be leaving Manchester City until you realize it's our manager who they're going to try to get next. This is the Arsenal Vision Post-Match Podcast. My name's Eli Smith. You bought me on Twitter. I was like, Pep, Pep could be leaving. This is great. This is really good news. And I was like, who's going to be highest on their list? Now, let's be clear. Mikel Arteta is not going there. That would never happen because only good things happen in football and never bad things and never things that make you cynical and think the game is going to hell.
1:00So we can all relax, rest easy. It's not going to be Mikel. There are reports that it could be Maresca, actually. And I can't decide if I like that because I don't rate him and it weakens City or I hate it because it means Chelsea could get a proper manager. Just to be clear, I really don't rate any of the managers. It's kind of where I'm at with this. So yesterday, Clive and I did a Patreon pod called Let's Talk Attack. and about 85 % of it is about our defensive shape. It's about the attack. It's about attacking personnel, attacking styles and what we need to do to improve the attack and just generally oriented around that aspect of our performance.
1:40So if you, like me, are always focused on the attacking aspects of football, we have the pod for you. We'll have a Friday Night Clive tomorrow. But today, we're going to do what we specialize at, answering mailbag questions, at least three of them in the next 90 minutes. You submitted questions on the digital internet webpages and we have collated them and will now answer some of them or indeed none of them. We'll see. I really don't even know, but I do know who's here to do it with me. One of them is Paul Halopaz. Woo-hoo! And another one is the AirSats host of the Arsenal Vision podcast, but actual guest today on the Arsenal Vision podcast.
2:19That would be Phil Castillo for Costa. Hello, mate. I think three questions would be a record, actually. So we'd be on a good pace to get there. Well, question one comes from Blue Sky, where a user there asks, when will Phil be the official host of the Arsenal Vision podcast, leaving Elliot out in the cold? And to that, I say, well, if it was based on listener feedback and what makes the podcast successful and effective, pretty soon. But thankfully, this podcast has never been built on any of those principles whatsoever. So I am here to stay. We got a lot of great questions, but the pep news kind of broke relatively close to us recording this.
2:58So we will launch the mailbag episode, I think in the truest fashion, which is with a question from me, which is, and I will, I will start with you, Phil, the news of pep potentially leaving this summer has led people to have all different kinds of reactions that it will motivate them. that it will do the opposite of motivating them, whatever that is, demotivate, unmotivate, anti-motivate, that it will bring stability, it will bring instability, that it means that they know they're going down because the 115 stroke 117 stroke 142 charges case is about to have a resolution. What is your Galaxy Brain take on Pep potentially leaving this summer, meaning to City this season?
3:40Yeah, this news kind of came out of the blue, didn't it? To be honest, there's always been a few rumblings that the last extension wasn't wholly part of his plan and that he sort of stayed to save face a little bit with City facing the allegations. My feeling about this is, I've got, there's sort of two sides to it. One side is that Enzo Maresca has been whispering to a few people because I have it on pretty good authority that things are not a happy camp at Chelsea. He has had issues with the leadership team. Would that pretty good authority be every public utterance he makes? Yes, but even from a few months ago, from the start of the season, I'd heard from a few well-placed people that there were ongoing issues with him and the leadership team, how much power he was actually being afforded, who was supposed to be doing what.
4:28And generally, he can be quite spiky. I think the hierarchy is not so clear at Chelsea. So there were issues with Tom Boli, there were issues with Eqbali as well. Then they've got all the sporting directors that are coming from Brighton. And so it's just a big mess at the moment. And they sell players, they buy players that he's not always on board with. So things haven't been so rosy since the start of the year. And then I think last week we saw all of those issues come to a head with quite a strange press conference, to be honest, where he sort of called out the board without calling out the board, talking about a lack of support and how the fans were great.
5:03And this was the worst 48 hours of my time as the Chelsea manager. So this to me feels a little bit like he's been on the phone to an athletic reporter, obviously David Ornstein in this case. Maybe it would have come through somebody else. But yeah, this feels a bit like him just throwing his weight around a little bit to say, look, if you guys don't want me, these guys want me and they're better than us. So that's one side of it. And the second side of it is regarding Pep. Is this the last chopper out of Saigon, Elliot? that's my question because we haven't heard anything about these charges in about two years i i have to admit i'm not up to date with the last you know court readings and all of the the delays and everything that's going on look we could be sitting here in 50 years and things won't have been done yet but i have a feeling that the premier league could come raining down on them very soon and pep's just putting his plan in place to for the gracious farewell the exit leaving as the most decorated manager in their club's history you know an all-timer and and the rats will be gone the rats will leave the sinking ship um and he'll just be out of there free of blame free of anything i was just a manager guys um it's these guys you want to punish and then that's that's my sort of two-part theory as to how this news has come out and when and why and how so So yeah, maybe one to keep an eye on, but there's a long season to go and I can't be bothered talking about the future because we have to beat him now.
6:37That's my point. I mean, it is an interesting one because if the theory of the case is that Pep leaving is indicative of the penalties for the 115 charges case arriving relatively soon, potentially as soon as the end of the season, then that doesn't make a lot of sense as to why Mareska would be lobbying for the job other than cold hard cash because he could in theory be managing a championship side so you know with with all of its best players having headed for the exit door so i i i don't know how you you put those two pieces of the puzzle together but then again i've always been shit at puzzles paul i'll stay on this topic just for one more question but i do want to keep it sort of arsenal and this season focused as opposed to big picture which is simply let's do some armchair psychology, which I find has always been your best work on the podcast.
7:29We've seen the last hurrah narrative before and what the last hurrah narrative does for teams. Klopp's last hurrah narrative did not end the way people presumed it would. They sort of collapsed down the stretch after it was made clear that he was leaving. Last hurrah narratives can galvanize a team, But I think also it can bring into clear focus the idea that maybe the charges are coming. Maybe with Pep leaving, it's the end of the era. Suddenly people are contacting agents. Can you get me out of here? Where's my next move going to be? People start making business decisions about going in for challenges with a move on the horizon, things like that.
8:07So in my wildest fantasies, this news causes a rupture inside of the club and City lose, I don't know, something realistic like seven of their next eight lead fixtures. and we coast to a title while playing a heavily rotated side to focus on the Champions League a la PSG and their domestic league. Is that what's going to happen, Paul? Do you see it similarly to me?
8:32Well, I think it could add a little bit of instability, but a year and a half is a long time away. So I don't think it's going to do much for this season, really. Well, it's this summer, right? Or have I misunderstood? Yeah, it was supposed to be at the end of this summer. Oh, the end of this summer. Okay, that's closer. I thought it was it chronologically speaking that's one year closer than what you said oh he has his contract till June 2027 doesn't he yep yeah okay so he'd go a year early um okay well uh I mean I think those last hurrahs work when they're really your squad and you've done brilliant things together which was the Liverpool scenario that didn't work out with them it was more ah than her out of the hurrah and so like does it really apply with pep i mean i'm not saying they aren't going to be good for the rest of the season based on what we've seen but it's not it's not like a classic team it's not like you know that i'm sure they like their manager i'm sure it provides a little bit of narrative but it's not like they all won everything together there's one or two players in his squad who have been around Bernardo Silva Rodri uh you know does Haaland need extra motivation uh the guy's a lunatic uh the rest of them uh not their problem either way and probably worried about you know he's got a lot of guys in that team who joined the team recently because Pep Guardiola is the manager um the Enzo Maresca thing look I don't really care It doesn't really matter after that.
10:07It's not like there's a whole bunch of managers out there in world football. You're like, oh, my God, if they get him, we're screwed. They'll get somebody good. If it's Enzo Maresca, that's fine. He hasn't proved anything. Would Enzo Maresca have a problem with managing Manchester City out of the championship? I don't think so. It's still a pretty good gig. They're going to throw money at you. You come in without the expectations. I think if I'm Enzo Moresco, I'm like, oh, yeah, Man City. Don't have to follow in the wake of Pep. I get a year to bet in the team. I come up. We're a hero. I wonder what that feels like because they're going to crush the championship.
10:48He'll get to win a title. And, like, people will like him. For at least a season, people would like him. And then he gets his, you know, and then he's brought his guys. So I think that's the worst scenario, apart from we'd enjoy the heck out of it. and like the Arteta thing we just need to be really really nice to Mikel Arteta and never say bad things about him and nobody's to criticize him till the whole Pep Guardiola has been replaced. Well that should be no problem knowing the internet It should be fine I don't think it's going to matter hugely but I like Phil's theory this is really an Enzo Moresca thing It's worth saying as well Sorry Phil No no I was going to say they've been planning for life without Pep for the last 18 months anyway.
11:34They've brought in Hugo Viana, who's like the new head of recruitment, sporting director. They've been signing a lot of young players. So this has been an ongoing process anyway. So I don't think he's just going to - Phil's just making up names at this point. Spanish names, we don't know. He's Portuguese. See what it means. Paul's way of handling Phil knowing stuff about football is just to ridicule you. But never let it be said that we don't value you knowing stuff about football. Never let that be said. He's not on a bad track there. Yeah. um okay let's get to more arsenal specific stuff and uh there is a game this weekend it is in everton uh this is not i think an easy fixture and it's one that's going to have a lot of scrutiny on it coming off our last performance and so i'm going to take a listener question from rmb in the discord and modify it of course uh because rmb said what are the indicators you're looking for over the next games leading to villa at home i'm going to modify it say what are the indicators you're looking for at Everton, Phil, that will give you an idea of where we are beyond results, i.e.
12:32team selection, stabilizing, off-the-ball positioning, speed of play, et cetera. Basically, what are the themes you're after? And I love this question because, yeah, we want the three points. But I think people are looking for some reassurance as well. So what are you looking for from the Everton game besides any three points we can get, which, to be clear, sure, would take it. But what else? yeah I I'm going to welcome back some stability to our defense um obviously Saliba is going to come back in uh Durian Timber is going to be at right back I hope um obviously in Cappier will likely partner him at left center back and then we've got Calafuri coming back in at left back so that feels more familiar to me it's not your Durian Timber at center back in Cappier here Lewis Skelly in at left back it's very familiar and stable and I feel comfortable when they're defending in isolation and I feel comfortable when they're squeezing the pitch so already just by having a couple of names back the team feels a lot better a lot more secure it feels like we can handle the spaces in behind it also means we can squeeze the pitch a bit more because that's what Everton will try to do they will try to look in behind with Cheno Barry or Beto sorry and then get the people around him like Jack Grealish, Dewsbury Hall if he's fit whatever you know so they're going to be looking for that ball over the top and I just feel you know when you've had a stressful day at work what do you like to come home to a nice warm bowl of soup chicken soup you sit there and it feels good right you see i was gonna say a warm bowl of bourbon but to each their well you know we did share a flu a few glue vines in in bruges um you know that that for me is a big one right just our defense looking a bit more familiar and then also the big issue for me is how we fit Eze and Odegaard in the same team if at all because I think more than anything that's been the biggest problem for Arteta is that he's trying to find a way to get both of them in the team and and it's it's come at the cost of both players you know because we've got Odegaard stepping on Zubemendi's toes and we've got Eze not really doing enough centrally we haven't really got him doing it doing enough on the left wing so it just feels like we're forcing things a little bit.
14:43So if he has to leave one out, that's fine. If he has to leave both out, that's also fine. I don't think he will. But you know, that for me is a big one, just finding a bit more balance across the team, because I think we've got enough options further forward to cause issues to Everton. It's more just who we put on the pitch and how we get them playing well together, which, you know, that's an easy job in essence, but it's been a bit of an issue recently. So yeah, that would be what I'm looking for. I like that. And I I do just want to say before I bounce this over to you, Paul, obviously a great time together, Phil, in Bruges.
15:16I think it is really important that, you know, sometimes to get together with your peers and spend time. And, of course, I'm talking about your dad. My brother, that people kept telling me. Because from an age standpoint, your dad is my peer. You are not clearly my peer. Paul, your thoughts. What do you want from the Everton game? three points notwithstanding uh i want a nice thick bench i want girth on the bench i want a bench that that whatever we've put out look we're all trying to pick the team for the manager and it's not going to be like that there's going to be lots of different games uh what'll get yorkeres going i know this isn't one more yorkeres uh podcast and i hope we don't put that in the title because he's seen a lot of titles with his name in it in the last week yeah so he needs a breather from all that and um yeah so stable back line uh nice juicy bench and then a left-hand side with leo trossard starting there and i think the if we get a functioning left-hand side is probably the biggest thing we can do for this overall team it'll buy space time for yaka resh he likes to peel left uh in behind into the channel or just into space i want to see him going left not right He can show up at the back post or run in behind the center backs or cut across the box and meet that ball before the center back.
16:47And he needs to start building relationships in places other than where Odegaard and Saka may stand. So, like, what I'm really looking for is I want patience in our team and in our supporters and just give them a chance to play without us all freaking out. I know I'm just talking to myself there. I don't want the team to play slowly, but I want them to be patient because it ain't linear. We could play well in the first half and not get a goal, and we can't freak out. We've got a good bench, stable defense, and a functioning left-hand side, and I want to see us playing at a higher tempo, and that means having more space along that front line that they don't all know.
17:31We're heading over to the right-hand side because there's no threat on the left-hand side. Yarkeres is drawn to that side because that's where the action is and he needs to have touches in the box because he's seen the TV programs, the podcasts, read the newspapers. They've all told him to do everything all the time. I want us to stretch them across our attacking line and give them lots to think of from the left-hand side. So, yeah, that's what I'm hoping to see this weekend. Yeah, and look, Manchester City have an unlosable game at home to West Ham, So we will kick off second. Obviously, if we are to win, we will be back to first, where we want to be.
18:12But I think there's a psychological component to that. Just before we move on from the Everton game and this question, Phil, I feel like the original question was, what do you want to see in the run-up up to the Villa game? And so sort of broadening out a little bit, but still incorporating Everton. This is where it's tough because Mikel has a lot of options. and every time he uses options that don't work exactly right for 60 minutes those options are going to be presumed to be the wrong options and the one on the bench are going to be presumed to be the right options and i do think we can get pulled from pillar to post with that there is a simplicity in having no options and being like well we just have to play this group into form there's a simplicity in that and they either play into form or they don't what i'm talking about is like if you start with zubamendi rice odegaard yokoresh saka martinelli and it looks like shit 57 minutes into that, or even at halftime, people are going to go, well, Eze needs to get on.
19:05Why aren't we using Nani? Marino at Stryker was working. What are we doing? And I just think you wind up in that washing machine of sometimes it takes more than an hour of playing together for players to figure it out. I remember with Arsene Wenger, there are times he just wouldn't make subs, and there were times I thought that was wrong, but there were also times when he would say, look, sometimes the way you solve the problem is giving the players more time to solve it, not making more changes that disrupt the dynamic. and we are in a very disrupted period. And Arsene Wenger also famously said he didn't want to buy too many players in a summer window because he would say it's really hard to incorporate more than two or three players.
19:41And we're incorporating arguably three or four potential, quote, first 11 players along with two or three rotational players. So I do think that this Everton game is about Mikel nailing his colors to the mast with a group up front. You know, we know it's going to be Zuby and Rice, But that next group, Odegaard Arezza, I mean, and it'll be Saka, of course, but Odegaard Arezza, Marino, Jesus, Kai when he's back, Jokeres. Is it Nani? Is it Nelly? Is it Ezza off the left? Is it Leo? I think Leo has certainly earned the right to have the first shot at that. I'd like to see him pick a group at Everton.
20:16Hopefully it works. And then give that group a run. So is that sort of the mandate here, which is having the one thing a title race doesn't give you patience, to let some group grow into some kind of form together up front. Yeah, for sure. We need to figure something out, right? And I think the point of building this squad is that it could be there to support us, not to win us things. I think we had the core of the squad that we knew we could rely on, Raya, Saliba, Gabriel. We had Rice in there, obviously Saka up front. There's maybe a couple more players in there that I would call the core, the key members of the squad.
20:56And the reason to fill everything out is so that you can support yourself if they're not there, which I think so far we've done. No, we've been sort of scraping along a little bit. It hasn't been perfect, but we're still top, top of the Champions League. I would say that what we are using the squad for is working so far. And I listened to you and Clive speaking yesterday. And I did enjoy your insistence on this topic because we've spent the last three years saying that Arteta doesn't rotate people enough and that he's running people into the ground and now when he has to use other options we need to find a settled 11 again so I think realistically the truth is somewhere in the middle we have these options to be able to change games if and when we need to so I don't have an issue with with bringing people off after an hour you know this is what this is what good managers do they can sense things in a game that need to be changed we laugh at him a lot but Unai Emery is like the king of halftime changes and for Villa this year it's been working a lot I think Pep has a history of changing his wide men on a weekly basis you know some weeks it's Savino and Doku other times it's Cherky coming in then it's Foden out wide and then it's Bernardo out wide so we need to welcome that ability to to bring other people in and use different profiles as long as it doesn't come at the cost of us just throwing stuff at a wall and seeing what sticks you know there has to be intention behind which profiles we choose and when is it based on opposition is it based on who's fit so you know my my point is that I'm not maybe on your side all the way and that we need to just find a team and stick with it for a little while but I think you asked you asked Clive if Arteta knows his best 11 and you know the the proof of this season is that he doesn't but I think he does I think in his head he knows who he wants all the time playing but he can't do that obviously so look we've got that palace game jammed in the middle that's going to be full scale rotation i would imagine i would hope anyway but with michael you can never be too sure but we got questions about that for sure yeah yeah my my feeling is that we do need to start with something that looks a bit familiar but if we do need to get onto the bench and use people that's also fine with me so the whole point of having this squad is that we can do this.
23:11We can bring on pace towards the end. We can bring on a lock pick as if our runners in behind aren't working. We can swap out a midfielder for a Marino who crashes the box. I don't care about this. So I know you might think differently and I know you do think differently based on what you said, but it's not a big issue for me. Yeah. I mean, first of all, I'm opening the idea that my concerns about this are not correct. that's always a possibility just so we're clear um i think that you know something that i've said that actually got clipped up and you know is now making its way around the internet to be ridiculed is actually that i don't think we will ever be the best attacking team in this league and i think if we need to be the best attacking team in this league we will not win the title that fundamentally what i want to see against everton actually is that we're pressing effectively taking the ball up them in high positions that they're not running through our midfield that they're not getting joy against our back line.
24:05We're having to literally tackle a free runner running it on goal with nobody back from a long throw. I want to see the principles of play related to our out of possession shape return. Because I do think from an attacking standpoint, we're always going to rely a little bit on set pieces, a little bit on one nils, a little bit on winning two nil with a 1.5 XG, not three two with a 3.5 XG. And I'm fine with that. That's our identity. And I think that's what we have to get back to. So whatever group he picks in attack, I'm actually quite a bit more interested in making sure that Everton don't have a lot of joy.
24:38And let's be clear, Everton will be without a lot of important players, right? And a lot of them relate to how they attack. Like, I don't think Grealish will play, right? Would we say he's pretty unlikely to play? Yeah, and there's some AFCON players missing. So like, it is an opportunity. I think getting back to our best out of possession shape is important. But let me ask you this, Paul, because I like the way this is phrased. We're sitting here saying, what do we have to learn from this game? And it's really important that we figure this out or we figure that out. We're talking like there's a lot of instability and uncertainty around the team.
25:12And so I'll ask the question that the distinguished member of our Discord, Bus Stop Rat Bag, asked. One of the great minds. Shouldn't we all stop shitting the bed over a couple dodgy performances? We have one of the best coaches in the world, a strong squad when everyone's back, which they should be soon. And we are top of the two most important leagues in Europe. It's not so bad, is it? Do you think that our level of concern, following a win I should point out, is beyond the appropriate level of concern, given the fact that a lot of data, not to mention the tables, have us as the best team, not just in England, but also in Europe?
25:59So I think we, I don't know about, like I actually think it's a healthy process to worry about these things and get them out there. Okay, the media over exit, but what can you do about that? Should we shit the bed? No. Possibly smear the sheets a bit though. you know it you've got to get it out there these players have to be big enough to come into a club and realize the spotlight will be on them we're probably one of the most supportive clubs when you're in that Kai Havert 65 million down the drain zone where everybody's questioning you know who you were before he came what you've done here how much was spent on you in fact we can he probably needs a song we could adapt that song for victor yorkerash you know with a few tweaks to the words he'd be right in there so um i think it's healthy to have these discussions and debates to a degree um but and it is a bit of an overreaction but it's also entirely correct that we've fallen off a cliff in terms of aspects of our performance particularly defensive defensively and like the the thing that's in my head over the last couple of days is are we the most dependent on having the right players for our system to work and have we always been that it always feels without certain critical players this very structured way of playing just doesn't work the same way and when it doesn't work the same way it's not a slight degradation it kind of falls off a cliff so we went from a team you couldn't get a shot on goal against or a shot to you know they're all having a pop at us running down the pitch unmarked through our middle it's like that's not a slight tweak that's not a center back is not quite as good as the other center back and it doesn't really come down to the center backs it comes down to that thing that is structure so i don't think it's ridiculous that there's been this reaction because if not now then when right we could lose our minds when we're six points behind whoever or we could lose it now uh like there's all the talk about the dressing room kind of kerfuffle the rice and odegaard you know having an out with everybody and like that's a necessary point we've had a week to settle in we've had a few days for the team to train work on patterns remind themselves how they want to play and we're going to have hopefully a decent bench so it you know if it was if the next game came two days after the next game came two days after that where you couldn't absorb couldn't learn couldn't adjust couldn't adapt and the manager saying well that's great but like i can't change anything i don't have the players to make the changes i don't have the time to work on what we want well we've had a nice week to absorb but we've got players coming back the team's able to breathe so no i think it'll be very healthy and uh but at some stage you got to say step back the dog you know the the doctors arrive let him work on the guy who's lying on in the middle of the street so yeah step back yeah let them work yeah look um there is there is a sort of schism among fans always, right?
29:25When you're going for a title. The ones that really just want to keep the positivity high and really believe it's going to happen. And the ones who are more inclined to think the cliff where we fall away is around every corner and see the early warning signs of that. And you're going to wind up somewhere on that spectrum. I don't think it is hysteria to think that we have not looked like ourselves, though. If you look at the post-Bayern games, Chelsea, Villa, Wolves, three league games where I think our principles of play were not as clear, and all of those teams found ways, including Wolves even, to sort of run through the middle and run at our back line.
30:04So there is that. You have Declan Rice screaming at his teammates at the end of the Wolves game. And I understand why that game was sort of frustrating for everyone, players and fans included. I don't think it's so bad in quotes. I think there are signs of issues with our play that I haven't seen from us in a while, and I am totally open to the idea that it is related to the available players and the players that are missing and the just constant change. I mentioned it on multiple pods now. Phil, you mentioned on Monday, but in the last five games, five back fours, three midfield threes, five front threes.
30:41That's not a way for a team to really feel like they understand how to play together. So no, I don't think it's so bad. Yes. I think we're still the best team in the league, but look, if we're going to be fair, I was sat on this podcast. Yeah. We can't sit on a podcast. I was sat in this chair talking into this podcast. I guess like you could sit on your phone while listening to the podcast and you'd be sat on a podcast. Anyway, I was on this podcast saying when Liverpool were winning with 98th minute winners, but not playing convincingly that they would not be top come Christmas because these late wins were not the important thing.
31:13the important thing was that the performances weren't good enough. If we're going to be consistent, you can't just look at results. You have to look at performances. And I think it is fair to suggest that that needs to improve. So we'll see. Certainly Gabby and Saliba are the heart of our team. We need them back. We need them in the lineup. I do think that we want to get back to that Timber, Saliba, Gabby, Saliba, Calafiori back four. And a lot of stability flows from there, compactness. All the other things that we do higher up the pitch, benefit from what we have there. And oh, by the way, when Rice is putting balls right under the crossbar from corners and you have Gabby there and he heads one in in the 10th minute, the games get easier.
31:50They just do. Right. And so every little bit of that helps the the degree to which we're more proactive in dealing with balls in our own box easier. Now, I know the irony is last time we saw Gabby against Bill or I guess what what game was it? Well, the Sunderland game. Right. Not his best, but hey, he's entitled. Okay, I think we can move on from this topic. We'll obviously have more to cover on the Friday Night Clive tomorrow when we have the manager's thoughts. But, Phil, I do want to talk League Cup a bit as that's coming up. It is now clear that we would have two legs against Chelsea where we do advance.
32:27City have two legs against Newcastle. And so there's a lot of questions about what we should do with this. So Rocco asks, why not go for the Carabao? If Arteta and Arsenal don't win anything this season, things will be bad! Three exclamation points. I think they should go strong to win Carabao. It's closer than the others right now. And a sort of similar question from Antiali, I guess. Antlali. Can't really tell. If we were to beat Palace, would you field a full-strength team against Chelsea over two legs considering our priorities should be the league and UCL? What's your take on that, Phil? do we need the Carabao?
33:09And should we be going full strength if we are to get past Palace? I don't think we need to win the Carabao. Would I like to win it? Yes. And do I think that if we get into the semifinal, we should try to win it? Yes. But for now, where we are in terms of ourselves, in the league schedule, I think we can make eight changes in this game and it wouldn't really affect it because I think Palace are going to be in a similar position. I think it's a good opportunity to get people on the pitch that need minutes like Ethan, like Miles, like Martinelli play more regularly, for example. Marino can come in.
33:47Ezza can come in. So already that's five players who aren't guaranteed starters on Saturday who could play again in this one. You know, Madueke is there. Jokeres is there. So even if there is large scale rotation, I can still imagine us putting out a very strong team that's capable of winning a game against Crystal Palace at home, who I think have been flagging physically, to be honest, because they're one of the smallest squads in the league. They're playing in Europe. Glasner only uses 12 or 13 players. I would be surprised if they go big for this one. I'm not saying they won't, but I think they have bigger fish to fry in Europe.
34:24I think they're going well in the league. So, you know, a lot of the lower teams have been rotating. Newcastle rotated yesterday. Fulham did as well. Chelsea obviously have that ability to do it. So I think we've been scarred I think we've been scarred by last season in particular where that two-legged semi-final basically threw our season off a cliff we had no business playing that second leg at St James's Park it killed us I think we had a lot of knock-on injuries from that game we were just exhausted what did we play nine games in January last year so this just this is sticking in our minds and I think over the years we haven't really done enough in this competition there's been a lot of home defeats to you know the brightons and the west hams of this world and stuff like that so most people are happy to discard it i'm fine if we don't win it but obviously if we do get into the semi-final i would like to win it um and that's my logic i don't think this game needs to kill us or needs to kill our season i think we can rotate heavily and still put out a good team i think the players will be up for it um it gives people a chance to show the manager things that they wouldn't get in 10-15 minutes against Brentford off the bench you know so maybe we just need to reshuffle our thinking a little bit and say even though it's coming at a pretty dour time in the schedule over Christmas we have the ability and the options to be able to say look you're going to get a game and it won't it won't kill us for Brighton you know yeah I have to say as long as I've been doing this pod and as much as I've gotten negative feedback for stuff and positive by the way because everybody's lovely it's not like it's overwhelming but the thing that probably gets people the most mad at me is when I suggest that I don't care about the league cup and I'm not particularly fussed about winning it and I want to be clear and I want to say to people for people who think it's important that we win it or really care about it I absolutely understand that and you are entitled to care about that competition and want to win that competition and think we have no right to turn our nose up at any trophy.
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36:27My only truth I can give you is that while I think it would be fun to win, much as I think the Community Shield is fun to win, I like winning those. I like winning preseason games, but I don't think it is something that in any respect would make me feel different about the success of this season or this project or this group. And so if you told me we won the League Cup but did not win anything else this season. I would regard this season as failure. Okay? If we lose to Palace on Tuesday and win the league, I would similarly regard this season as success. Right? So how I evaluate the season and how I feel about where we're headed is not going to be dictated by what we do in the League Cup.
37:10That's not to say I would not enjoy winning the League Cup. So here is the thing that has to be taken into consideration. To win the League Cup, we will need to beat Palace on Tuesday, obviously. We will need to beat Chelsea over two legs in January. We will need to win a cup final in late February. Am I right in saying? Yep. Okay. Winning that cup final will also mean that we will have a rearranged league fixture in April. And if we are in the FA Cup deep, we may have two rearranged league fixtures in April, all of which will be taking place during the quarterfinals and semifinals of the Champions League.
37:41And all of which will be taking place roughly around the time we go to the Etihad, potentially with a title on the line. And so the question I have to ask you as listeners who know we already struggle with injuries and want to have a fresh squad and want to win the UCL and the Premier League is, do you believe that to win the League Cup, we will have to do things that jeopardize those other pursuits? I believe they could jeopardize those other pursuits. And as a result, for example, if I said to you, you can have one of two things and only one of two things. We win the League Cup or we win at the Etihad in the League.
38:14Which are you taking? I'm taking the win at the Etihad in the league. Now, I know that's not true. You can have it all. You can win the league and the League Cup. City have done it quite a bit. Okay? So I want to be clear. I'm not discrediting anyone who wants the League Cup. I'm not discrediting anyone who says it's important to them. They want to win it. I'm simply giving you my truth that the things you have to try to do to win the League Cup could potentially jeopardize the league and the Champions League. Now, what I would say is we have a big enough squad that maybe this is the year to go for.
38:43because maybe this is the year, assuming the injury stuff starts to resolve itself, where you say, we actually have players who need minutes. We actually need to find time to use Ethan Winery. We need to find time to use Christian Norgard. We need to get Martinelli some starts, Nani Meduake some starts. And in that case, if Mikel is willing to really lean into the squad component in the League Cup, including against Chelsea, then yeah, I think it could be our year to go for it. The final point I will make on this, and then I'll turn it over to you, Paul, I promise. And he's raised his hand in the recording studio that we use as if I don't know he wants to get in on this.
39:20I had no idea whatsoever. I've got strong feelings earlier. Well, let me finish my strong feelings. Also, the finals on the 22nd of March, not in late Feb. Oh, okay, 22nd of March. Well, to be fair, even more of a congested period coming up at that time, right? Champions League quarterfinals, semifinal. But this is my final point that I want to make because I hear a lot that winning a trophy teaches you to win trophies. I know there are people that really believe that. People I respect really believe that. And so I'm not going to sit here and say that is not true. I'm going to say I don't believe that.
39:49I watched this team win FA Cups, and it didn't help us win anything else. I've watched Manchester United win the Europa League. I've watched Tottenham Hotspur win the Europa League. I've watched Crystal Palace win an FA Cup. Did they win the FA Cup? Yeah, they won the FA Cup. I've seen teams that lost domestic trophies win bigger trophies, and I've seen teams that won small trophies have no success as a result of it. I think there's a little bit of ad hoc logic that goes into that. So I don't know the idea that like winning a trophy teaches you to win a trophy. PSG were the laughingstock of the Champions League until they weren't.
40:26So for me, I don't know that I believe you need to win a trophy to know how to win another trophy. But that's where I am on this. Could be the season to go for it because of the squad size, but would still take a win at the Etihad over winning the League Cup and am worried about, Paul, the things we'd have to risk to push the boat out for a trophy that makes April in particular very, very, very tricky. That's it. That's my soliloquy on this stuff. Yeah. Well, I agree with all of that, which is rather worrying. Now I need to rethink my view. Can we take a rewind? Obviously, Phil's right. If he has any degree of difference to us, I think everybody should be able to think and feel everything.
41:14But this is that issue where, no, I don't think you should in this sense. You should not be able to take the other side of it that, you know, I never want Arsenal to lose a game. Well, I don't either once the game's kicked off, once we picked our team. Once the game's on, I want us to win it. But I don't think you should be able to say, this is contentious, that he's he's gonna he's gonna get us in so much trouble phil just watch where this is going he's building it up he's building it up yeah you should not be able to say we've got to go for every cup we've got to prioritize every cup you've got to try and win every cup unless you can also admit and recognize that it will negatively potentially this is all probabilistic right it might not impact our our premier league we might gain from it players who haven't played might come into like if that might happen happen but that's a possibility we all know if we're going to be mature and fair and reasonable which is what we're known for around here that it will impact your premier league and your champions league because we have demonstrated season after season including this season you can say oh we we've got the big enough squad now there are no excuses there are bloody excuses just in the league itself we're running out of players who know how to play together we're running out of a back line we're running out of left-sided players so you cannot delude yourself that it's not going to impact probabilistically the premier league you might get away with it it might make us stronger it probably won't now i'm not saying that you can't say we should prioritize the carabao cup you can but only if you're going to be reasonable in the trade-offs and there's a trade-off and i don't think that's that shouldn't be contentious but you can't say that you know you can't go out there and say we should like i know certain people can't say we shouldn't try and win this cup and it might be better if we were out of it but plenty of us don't have that national profile we're not going to be i'm not going to be cut up and put on sky news for saying what i'm about to say i just think it's very very very true and if you and if you engage in the debate about how you have to do this and have to do this and have to do that and it's not going to impact your premier league well i don't think that's being realistic and i don't think it's you're engaging in the argument fairly there is a trade-off it will impact your premier league probabilistically it will impact your champions league probabilistically and no I don't think and the idea that we're closer to the Carabao Cup go look at the betting for the Carabao Cup and the Premier League yeah we are way closer to winning the Premier League than the Carabao Cup probabilistically so yeah and and you know I mean look we can all sit here on a podcast or on social media or all of us as a community and debate the importance of the League Cup the managers tell you what they think of this away at Monaco in a game city you're a huge favorite for in the Champions League.
44:22Erling Haaland, right? Up front, first 11. Divine Mikasa started up front in the quarterfinal of the League Cup for City on Tuesday. Phil actually knows who he is. Yeah, Phil, is he good? But the thing is, right, if we win against, let's say we go all the way and win this competition, there's four games left. You know, one against Palace in the two-legged semifinal and then a final. And as we've all said all three of us have said that we have the potential to rotate and give people games who haven't been playing there's there's another argument that says this keeps everybody fresh this gives us a title that that could potentially be a springboard like it has been for Liverpool and City in the past and also do you think from a City perspective or a Chelsea perspective or even a Newcastle perspective they're all sitting here talking about it as this this thing that's going to wreck their seasons well i mean first of all city i don't know the other teams have nothing on the line because they're not going to win anything this season newcastle are currently sitting in i'm not even gonna look at the table i'm gonna guess 14th place that's 12th okay i was uh you know chelsea chelsea have nothing going for them and their manager is saying i'm a celebrity get me out of here um i guess what i would say phil is like i'll put it to you this way at chelsea January Jurian Timber It right back for you But it doesn't need to be Jurian Timber Who can it be Put Marley Sam in there, I don't care So let's stop for a minute Then we are all in a I'm not saying What do people think I'm saying Forfeit I'm not saying forfeit I got this We're saying put out a terrible team And then make it slightly worse I'm not saying that We're on the same page.
46:13Phil, I'm not saying forfeit. I'm saying what you're... So we're in agreement, actually. What I'm saying is I don't want to see in the two Chelsea legs, assuming we get past Palace, who, by the way, have been served up three games in five days. So kudos, football. You're really killing it right now. I don't want to see Timber, Saliba, Gabby, Kalfiori, Rice, Zubamendi, Odegaard, Saka, Jokeres, Leo against Chelsea in the semifinal twice. And then have to hear about how we played Timber into the ground. And that's why we didn't look fresh. You know what I mean? And I get it. You need to. Yeah. Yeah, go ahead.
46:48No, no. You. No, I think you need to take players on on a case by case basis. You know, if Timber's in the red zone, obviously don't play him. But I think in a semifinal, we could play Saka. We could play Rice. We could play Jokeres. And I'm not saying our whole season should ride on winning the Carabao Cup because it shouldn't. I'm saying we should be able to manage now, you know, and full-scale rotation doesn't mean put three of the academy kids up front and just leave it there. It means potentially putting one or two in the team, but then you can play Martinelli on the left. You can play Madueke on the right.
47:24You can play Rice and Norgard in the middle. You can put in Capier at left center back. So that's what I'm saying. We have enough options for it not to be terminal like it was last season when we had about 11 and a half players you know when it just killed us completely i don't think it will do that last season and q us getting six injuries in the next two weeks you know it just um i don't know i think we we should be able to challenge on all four fronts that's that's why i think we can we should yes yeah that our arsenal is that is that who you see in front of you the last couple of games now yes yeah yeah i i mean i i want to be clear on this right like this is one of those things that just provokes a lot of emotion and there are people who think about yeah if no i mean it phil i don't know about your mentions but i see mine when i say that i'm not super fussed about just if even if i say like i'm not super fussed about it not like we should throw it we should write to the league and say we won't participate in it i'm saying like if i'm not say other clubs don't get excited about the carabao cup we get excited about not winning it it does feel a little bit that way i mean what's interesting right is if you look at like Liverpool last season obviously made it to the final and then hilariously did not win the final um but if you're if you are in the final okay and you are in the FA Cup late which they were not because they lost to Plymouth Argyle right um and and then you're still in the Champions League which they're not because they lost to PSG early but like the final by the way came four days after their second leg against PSG.
49:06If they had won that, their rearranged league fixture would have been between their quarterfinal legs of the Champions League, and they would have had another rearranged league fixture if they hadn't lost to Plymouth Argyle. So any way you look at it, I think maybe this is what's happening. we are seeing a massive expansion of the footballing calendar i mean psg played in some tournament this week did you know that they won some tournament i think it's called the yeah they beat flamingo yeah why what are we doing there was a tournament in the summer which by the way you know city and chelsea like are they going to start to pay for that as the season wears on everybody knows like what i were hearing our i was hearing arsenal fans this summer say thank god we're not in the club world cup why wouldn't that be great to win don't you want to win that no i don't win that no well right but but like but then you turn around say i want to win the league cup it's they're all the same thing they're all extra games that are compressing the calendar into an unmanageable mess as seen by what's happening to palace this week where they have to play thursday sunday tuesday palace play thursday sunday tuesday what are we doing and it leaves fans like us in the unenviable position of having to pick and choose what's important to us because there's too much football and it can't all matter the same.
50:33So I have sympathy for anybody that says, I like watching Arsenal win stuff. I would like to win stuff. Thanks very much. Shut up, you dumb, yank, C word, N word, right? All the things that will be shouted at me. And I also understand the people that say, I really want to see Arsenal win a title or a Champions League or both ideally. And I will literally sacrifice everything else in the football calendar to make that happen. This is an unresolvable debate that is only going to get worse when we do wind up in a FIFA Club World Cup. And we're going to, by the way, we're going to be having the same argument on that podcast where we go, should we be playing the start of, you know, this is when it should be a preseason.
51:09Every cup you're in, you want to win, but that's becoming increasingly impossible to do thanks to the organizing bodies in football. Can we, can we agree on that? Right. They're making it, they're, they're creating impossible scenarios for managers, for fans, for players. And yeah, woe is us, basically. Woe is us. But of course, once the ball is kicked off, the one thing we can all agree, everybody's rooting for us to win. Like when I watch Arsenal, I want us to win. All I'm asking Mikel Arteta to do is make some decisions with those lineups that reflect the importance of the competition and what it's going to do to our season.
51:44You know? Like one of my favorite ever games is the, was it Reading 7? 7-5. Yeah, 7-5 Arsenal Reading. At halftime of that game, I completely lost my mind and said some things I really regret. Really? Yeah. I was a different man. I was a different man. Genuinely, one of the treasures of my footballing existence. Once the game starts, you want to win. That's just how it is. But, well, you know my view. Yeah, okay. I mean, Phil, do you have any last points on that? I mean, we've driven this topic into the group. No, no, let's move on. People stopped listening ages ago. I do want to say, though, there is no doubt in my mind that this will provoke the strongest reaction.
52:27People feel very, very strongly about this topic. And I get it. I get it. But that's good. Yeah. I mean, if people didn't care about Arsenal, that would be worse. This is better. Just to be clear, I'm going to restate one thing. I think it's fine if you want to win the Carabao Cup. I don't think it's fine if you say, I want to win the Carabao Cup and probabilistically it will not impact on our Premier League and Champions League you could say it shouldn't but should we start over and redo it the whole thing just run it back okay okay we've got questions about Jokras we've got questions about Odegaard we've got questions about Ezzo we've got questions about the manager we've got questions about transfers we've got questions about everything and we devoted 20 minutes to bickering and arguing about whether we should try to win a trophy that we are in the quarterfinals of so kudos to the Arsenal Vision podcast Clive and Tim please please come back okay um i'm going i'm going to cleanse the palette by talking about how you can watch dodgy websites how's that sound palette cleanser nord vpn is the vpn you you put on your device look i used it this whole trip when i went to belgium and england and like it's just awesome you have an app you click on it and boom you're watching like i watched all the nfl games in my hotel room when i couldn't sleep because of the jet lag um i watched the the blacked out uh football matches.
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55:24There's so much research that shows the importance of engaging in therapy. And so while I did therapy by going into an office and sitting with a therapist face to face, there are people that either cannot find one in their area, don't have the time to drive and drive back, don't have the resources to do it, can't drive like my mom who's used therapy her whole life now no longer drives. so whatever way you need to access it you you should and better help has therapists that work according to strict code of conduct or fully qualified in the uk by the way they do the initial matching for you they have over 30 000 therapists worldwide over 5 000 local uk therapists this december start a new tradition by taking care of you our listeners get 10 off at better help.com slash vision that's better help h-e-l-p.com slash vision do now phil is that of that indeed not okay phil um the league cup is not a priority this season so would you agree no kidding everybody's like what the absolute so all right we got we got a not a question it was a comment um in our discord but i think it's an interesting one and it i think it gives us an act entry point to a question we had a million questions about yokores but deeb in the discord says, we'd love a discussion of this infographic.
56:36What do you think of the infographic that he posted? I'm kidding. Obviously, you can't see the infographic. The infographic is basically showing Jokeres at this point of last season for sporting, and Luis Suarez, his replacement at this point for sporting, and that the performance is actually relatively close. And this leads to a lot of questions about, you know, was it league strength issue that made Jokeres look good? but we also got questions to be fair with a positive perspective on Yoko Resch um we had one question and I wanted to try to find it and I'm apologizing right now because I don't think I I just changed windows and now I can't find it but it was someone in the discord who said that they see Yoko Resch as following a similar similar trajectory to Kai Havertz last season and you know essentially that there should be patience because there's a betting in period to be expected with these signings so what's your take on kind of re-evaluating joker's performance of sporting through the lens of what's happening there now but also that it takes time for signings to bet in and the guy we see now is the savior kai havertz at this point in last season really hadn't banged for us yet either well i hope it's not the kai havertz of last season because um his hamstring almost fell off his bone i guess it was the first season he arrived no i'm sorry two seasons ago.
57:56I apologize. How time flies. I don't think anyone's seriously writing Yoko Rezov. I think they've been... Can I level with you? I think you're wrong about that. I think there are people and I don't just mean internet weirdos. I'm in WhatsApp groups with people I respect who have written him off and I think that's wrong. But I do think there are people that are drawing conclusions at this point. that's also fine right everyone's got their own feelings about players but from from a lot of the discussion i've seen it's been an understanding of the mitigating factors we've all been through them he didn't arrive with a proper pre-season we've been mixing and matching the team every two weeks he's been injured he maybe needs time to get back to himself physically you know all of this stuff adapting to a new team teammates adapting to him there's a million things you can say we only had him available as the center forward for a long stretch of this season so it's been difficult right but you can also say that in those opportunities he has been given he hasn't exactly set the world alight there's been issues in his game he hasn't been involved enough his his first touch isn't good enough the ball doesn't stick he hasn't been getting shots so all of these just sort of mesh into one thing and it doesn't need to be Jocheres is terrible and we need to sell him next summer and it doesn't need to be oh well he's moving the defenders around he's actually doing a really good job for us it can always be something in the middle um and where I see Jocheres now I I we've got Jesus back we've got Marino who's there as a serviceable option we've got Kai Havertz coming back as well he is simply going to fall into one of four in the group you know I don't know there'll be different times throughout the season where he could be number one, then he'll be number four, and then he'll be number two.
59:46For me, he's just an option. He should have come in and been a better option. It hasn't really happened that way so far, but I would be lying if I said I wasn't a little bit worried because I haven't seen all of the qualities that he was supposed to bring to the team. High intensity running, all of the ability to bosh and muscle away the defenders, the shots. None of that's been happening yet this year but it would be ridiculous to say after four months that he's done because we've seen it year after year after year that players find themselves in the team they can go on a three game scoring run and all of a sudden you're there so Havertz is a number one example actually of how we feel about players under Arteta because he was done in my mind he was done at Christmas you know it wasn't working and then all of a sudden towards the end of December.
1:00:36Oh, this is nice. He can run and actually do stuff up front that we like. So, you know, it's a very difficult one because people feel like they have to be on one side or the other side, but realistically, all you need to be is somewhere in the middle. And that's where I am at the moment. I am a little bit concerned about him individually, but also how we play with him collectively. When he first signed, I remember going on a podcast with FK, our friend over at Latte Firm, and I said he would score between 10 and 12 league goals. And it was done on a live stream and the people in the little chat box were fuming, fuming with me.
1:01:16And where I'm sitting now - We've just mugged them off by calling them the people in the little chat box. Well, there was too many to call them out individually. But does that seem so ridiculous now? And maybe that's all we needed from him. Maybe we needed some goals against Leeds and Nottingham Forest and Brentford and West Ham and And Jesus and Kai and Saka and everyone else can get the goals against everybody else. You know, it's, yeah, I don't know. It's a difficult one because people feel protective. But my view is, is that if it doesn't work this year, we can be open and should be open to selling him.
1:01:54But if we see an improvement, then he's got to earn it. And look, if everyone's talking about his mentality, his ruthlessness, Arteta spoke about how he was willing to take on that burden to be the arsenal number nine if you haven't scored in six or seven games then he's got to show it he's not a kid anymore if he wants to succeed he has to play better and in the end it's going to benefit us so the stage is yours for the second half of the season victor that's where i'm looking at it pop I think the probability that he's going to be elite or top, those percentages have come down for me. But is it just me that remembers it this way?
1:02:32And I'll look to you, Phil, for a little support or indeed undermining. But is it just me who just before he got injured, we were starting to warm up to the idea that he might be reasonably handy? Now, I won't go into this game and that, but there was kind of an arc from where he started really slow, and he looked slow, and he looked heavy. And then he looked like about where he is at the moment. And then he looked to actually have a couple of good games, and people were starting to get, dare I say the word, a little bit excited about Victor Jokeres. Then he gets injured. He comes back. At least he didn't go back to the super heavy legs, drag himself around.
1:03:09He went back to the, he looks reasonably fit, but he's not doing a lot for us yet. And I'm hoping that the bit comes after that, especially with options off the bench, is the, oh, we're starting to get a bit excited about Victor Jokeres because he has a couple of good games. Is it just me that remembers almost everybody saying, oh, he's beginning to look actually half decent, reasonably useful, could get better? No, you're right, but football moves quickly. and injuries. Those Lundertics that want to win the Carabao Cup it's the same punch isn't it? Well look I think because you can have it both ways right you could say that he needs time and Kai Havertz is a great example by the way I think the Kai Havertz example is not exactly analogous because one of the issues with Kai is I think the midfield role he was being used in when he arrived you know he played the community shield at Stryker and as Clive likes to remind us that was a really good performance and then he didn't play there again for a while and we used Eddie up front for a while but like I I am torn because I do think it's just insane the speed with which we expect players to be to be able to integrate to and adapt to a different level a different team a different group a group that's constantly chopping and changing this season already and he was starting to show that integration then he's immediately out with injury you know and there are certain players that come back from injuries and come back from absences and need time to hit the ground running, literally and figuratively.
1:04:39There's a stat going around that shows that like 42 % of his touches have led to a loss of possession, which is by far the top of that stat. It's a pretty ugly stat. For me, the worrying stat is really just the shots. He's under two shots per 90, about 1.82 shots per 90, having been a four-shot-per-90 guy in Portugal. And at the end of the day, if you're a striker, and especially not a striker who's really going to play back to goal in midfield a la Kai or Jesus, but challenge defenders and run in behind, the thing you have to be able to do is get your shots off. And if you ask me to give you my biggest worry, my biggest worry is just, he doesn't look like he's creating that half yard of space you need to get your shot off.
1:05:16The separation. That's my biggest worry, the separation. But I have seen him play well. Like, this is the problem with, I think, arguments in extraction. You wind up on the polls, like, he's just terrible, he's been bad. It's simply not true. I've seen him be not just half decent, but excellent in a few games. I have seen him look very poor and below the level as well. And that's hard, right? He just, he hasn't been a 40-goal striker for us, which, of course, there's that little thought in the back of your mind, maybe he's going to be our superstar. But I think to say that he's been completely worthless is just a complete misunderstanding of what we've seen this season.
1:05:56And that's unsatisfying. What I think is fair is that Gabriel Jesus is back and is talented. Kai Havertz is soon going to be back and is talented, right? Mikel Marino has scored goals in big games. So we can't afford to just wait for him to figure it out. Unfortunately, at this level of football, he's going to have to just prove it. And we see players all the time at clubs like Manchester City, for example, that win stuff, that show up for one reason or another, the manager decides pretty quickly it's not, this isn't the guy. and they leave and they go on to be very good at other places. And like, ultimately, I think all of us would agree, our goal is not for Victor Jokeres to be good.
1:06:36Our goal is for Arsenal to be good and win things. If Jokeres is a key to that happening, great. If sitting Jokeres down and using someone else is how we get there, that's fine too. But I don't think you have to decide on the player being shit or not, but I do think the manager has to decide on what he's going to do long term with this position. And so to that point, Phil, we have an interesting question that I think gets sorted to the heart of the matter, which is from Jake. And he says, which is more likely? Kai having a huge second half, Yorchres finds his feet and becomes a major contributor or a full and consistent Gabriel Jesus for Ementada.
1:07:16If you had to put your money down on which of those things is happening, which of those things do you have as happening? rank order them yeah i like that idea are any of us arsenal fans did an arsenal fan ask this question um where have you been um yeah i i think the most likely of the three is kai coming back well yep because i think if he's fit and available we will use him and and that's where i am with it um i think jesus will be valuable on occasion do i trust his body anymore no am i seeing still images of him in training and fearing that his knee will crush under the weight of his own body weight yes um can i can i spin this question around do you think yokarez will start on saturday you see he thinks he's the host again now you see that paul uh do i think yokarez will start on Saturday.
1:08:20I do think Jokras will start on Saturday. I think Mikel Arteta has been burned too many times by having to make an injury-enforced sub in the first half of games. That totally destroys your plan. Whatever you think of Gabriel Jesus, I love him. And by the way, he put out a beautiful Players' Tribune article just earlier before we started recording that I would recommend everybody read. It's lovely. It's a love-lettered arsenal to his family and well worth a read. And he's an easy player to root for and a very talented player but sometimes you just have to be honest about what a player's body is capable of providing and I think at this point starting him invites risk that we I don't think we can invite I'm fine with him coming on at 60 minutes so I don't think it'd be him I still don't think the best construction of Arsenal even though he's been effective is a Mikel Marino up front and I know I said that if the Champions League final was tomorrow a few weeks ago I'd start Mikel Marino up front like when it's working I don't think you change it but for right now I think we have long-term reason to try to see if Victor Jokeres can play himself into being the guy in this role.
1:09:21So I think it'll be Jokeres on Saturday, and I really don't know what to expect. What about you, Paul? For Saturday, yeah. I think it's Jokeres. Look, Trossard off the left will be different. So assuming we have Trossard, assuming we have Calafiore, the left-hand side is just going to be different and yach resh likes a bit of the left hand side so if i'm the manager i don't necessarily want to fuel the headlines if i don't need to it doesn't mean you play him because you feel you have to because of the headlines but not going to help anything if you're 50 50 i think you play him um so yeah i think you start him on saturday you've got a bench with options you got gabriel jesus uh you got michael marino you can do different things so yeah i think i think you go what you have and fix your left hand side and get a a front a solid back line and see how you're playing because it's it hasn't all been victor jacoresh uh his performance no it's not that i obviously not yeah and i i'm not i'm not one of those who says he hasn't been getting service he's been getting some service and with the service he did or didn't get he could have done better he could have made more runs he could have remonstrated with his compadres to say i made that run in behind give me the bloody ball like there's more he can do and i think he will um and you you got to let it breathe a little bit you know we're all there's a doctor uh he's got his bag out there's a guy splattered across the middle of the road and we're all like no no grab his lung stuff that back in first leave his liver we're like let us let them work through it so yeah i think he starts and i think he should start and i think we should let a little paciente as they say in spain let's be completely honest right the extent to which the anxiety around yokores has amped up recently is fully connected to city getting a little closer and our form being a little patchy none of which is related to victor yokreff ironically right so it's like you know the gif what's he saying fuck me for what you know no but i like it already yeah it's it's a good one are there flames those flames and no it's just very very clean and simple and and funny uh Phil, then I guess I would ask you this from Neil MCKT, and we won't do a big section on it, but it relates.
1:11:53Game for your life, who are our best front three, if everybody's fit? Oh, this is an easy one for me. It's Trossard, Havertz, and Saka. Okay. Yeah, Trossard, Havertz, and Saka. I mean, like, okay. Yeah, I don't know. They are the ones I trust the most. they are the ones I trust the most to deliver in a high pressure moment I can't quit as a there's still a part of me that thinks like we've and this is similar to the Yolkras thing right like you have to learn to play with that kind of player like I still I watched that as a hat trick I watched as a Newcastle strike three shots that that all of them could have been goals every time he kicks the ball from around the area or in the area it looks like it could go in the net I still think in terms of a final ball he might be the best player we have and I'd really like to see Mikel invest in finding a way to use him.
1:12:46And if it is really just Odegaard or Eza, I think that will be a shame, Paul. So the Eza point, did we not hear from Palace supporters? Well, he's great and all, but you better be prepared for the fact that every second game he's super-duper quiet and you wonder what he did for you. He's on it or he's not. Yeah. And we've absolutely seen that at Arsenal. so no he can't be my start in 11 till he shows it like I think he can grow I think he can learn to have more of that presence on the pitch you know Ethan Winery as a have a couple of things in common which is when they're on the pitch you want them to make you feel something within the game not just you know that ability to transmit and they're both very ephemeral I don't know if that's the right word but it feels like the right word they'll have moments they do brilliant things obviously ethan has a whole career he's young he can grow like but they do have that in common that you expect great things from them but how often do you say hmm that that didn't really move her needle in fact i feel like the needle slid back a little bit martin odegaard uh like that's another whole topic Martin Odegaard's a brilliant player right we haven't seen him at brilliant levels recently when he's on the pitch he moves the needle once he hits form once we work out how to play he moves the needle every game Trossard has now hit a run of form and we have enough I think evidence that he's a very good player nine times out of ten so I think you know as a off the bench or in specific games sure but he's not there at the point where i would say he's in my start in 11 because i know you know we're excited because we're going to go out and bash them today well i'm going to incorporate this question and then throw this back to you phil our friend tom canton who was great to see uh in london and in brussels said what footballing opinion have you held which you were genuinely surprised got such a high level of pushback I'm never surprised when my footballing opinions get a high level of pushback because largely they are shit.
1:15:03Obviously, we covered the one that gets the biggest pushback. When I talked about how the League Cup, we literally should not show up for the Palace game. We should throw it. We should write a letter to the league and say we refuse to participate. I'm kidding. But I'm going to give you one now that will get a huge amount of pushback. Here you go, Phil. I'm going to trial this idea. Trial balloon right here, made of lead. Aberecha Eza is currently Arsenal's best striker.
1:15:30what am I supposed to do with that? Do you want to just agree and we can move on? I don't agree, no. Why? Because he's not our best striker. So here's what I would say. We don't have a great striker. Have you ever played for us? Victor Jokras is not a great striker, currently. Maybe he becomes one. Kai Havertz is not a great striker. Mikel Marino is not a great striker. Okay, Gabriel Jesus, I mean, he might be the best of the bunch. He's not really a striker, is he? But he can play there. All of them are different in some ways. And when I say Kai Havertz is not a great striker, I don't mean he's not great when we play him at striker.
1:16:01I mean, I don't think Kai Havertz is naturally, clearly a striker. I don't think Marino is. Like if Kai is, Marino is. You know what I mean? I don't think Jesus is. Leo isn't. These are all players we've used. Ebertz, in my opinion, is the best striker of the ball we have along with maybe Mikel Marino. He has the cleanest understanding in tight spaces of combination play with others. And if you just stick him up in that area and try to get the ball to his feet. So what would the lineup be? it would be well at the nine and yeah and then it gives you the ability to do something like Zubamendi Rice and Kai or if you want to play Odegaard there to have more of a ball carrier you know as opposed to a final third creator but what I think it lets you do is get guys who can crash the box and be second ball players or win headers like Kai and Rice and the eights things like that and the combination play is going to come to life but also three touches in the box he's going to turn it into three shots that all could be goals.
1:16:56I just think my biggest worry with Eza is I don't think he can play in midfield for us in the way we play him with the intensity of how we play naturally. I don't think he's getting the right touches. I don't think he looks as clean on the ball in those areas. What I do know about Eza is every time I've seen him touch the ball around the box, good things happen. And in our ideal scenario, he was playing off the left and doing that. But as we saw recently playing off the left, the way he plays off the ball maybe lacks some of the natural intensity and understanding of pressing and counter pressing not to mention we have a right side bias and if you're not going to get the ball to Ezza a lot suddenly his limitations are more visible than his strengths so maybe just play him through the middle get him near the box I mean if Ethan Winery can be a striker according to Mikel if Leo can play striker if Mikel Marino can play striker my my contention in his arsenal under Mikel Arteta have never really had a conventional nine, never used anyone effectively as a conventional nine.
1:17:55So why not use one of the most skillful small space players who can strike the ball better than anybody at nine? And now, Paul, you can tell me why you disagree. And I want to reiterate, this started as what's an opinion that's going to get a lot of pushback. I just want to be clear about that. Here's your bloody pushback. Look, he won't get any bloody touches in the box. He'll have two center backs on him. He'll be dropping off. He'll be so, they'll be so ready for him. But then how does Leo play false nine? How do we play anybody at nine? How did we play Jesus at nine? He's way more intelligent, in my opinion, to play that position.
1:18:31I think Eza can play, Eza can play next to, or close to, or alongside a striker. But wait, that's exactly what he did. That's exactly what he did against Wolves. He played next to the striker and got completely lost. Yes, he wasn't the striker. And the striker is like, what you want is Kai Havertz striker as a left eight doing the Eza-Marino thing because Kai will drift to the same spots that Marino drifted over to the right, vacating that space for Eza to arrive in the center forward spot. You don't want him playing center forward. Like, what's he going to do? getting beaten up by two centerbacks all game.
1:19:13He's going to drop in. Centerbacks are going to, then Kai will run him behind and then he'll get on the second ball that Kai wins and he'll volley it into the top corner three times a game. And all of a sudden, when he's winning the Ballon d 'Or and everyone says he's Lionel Messi, you're going to come back here and say, Elliot, how are you so prescient? How did you see this coming when everybody else thought it was insane? Trust me, if that all happens, I still won't admit you were right, Elliot. Hey, can we talk about Raya's long kicks for a second? Yeah, yeah. what you really want is as uh the left eight and kai center forward vacating that spot and as arriving in the spots you want him to arrive in that's what you really okay well so then phil this question i mean we might as well just get to it i mean like so uh conchi conchie gunner says do we sacrifice too much just to get martin odegaard in the team It feels like that's where our right side bias comes from.
1:20:08And if he is not rating 100%, the whole team has an issue as his game has dropped since he returned. I mean, it feels so harsh on a player who, similar to other players returning from injury, needs time to get fit, needs time to integrate. I mean, when Kai comes back, he's going to be given the savior moniker and the same thing's going to happen. He's going to have patchy performances because he hasn't played regularly for over one year, right? By the time he comes back or roughly a year. So it feels so harsh that Odegaard's getting this scrutiny, But to be fair, if you're one of the superstars of the team, if you wear the captain's armband, if you're in such a high visibility position and have so many touches and you're so integral and your return is influencing a very exciting new signing we made, then you're going to get some of that scrutiny.
1:20:49And so that's just how football works. But like, what do you think of the question as it's phrased? Because I do really believe that in EZA, we have a uniquely talented end product type player, which is something Arsenal needs. we need more shots, we need more chances. But clearly it has not worked out as well as we'd hoped, and I don't know how he fits in with Odegaard. Freudian slip there. A little bit. I mean, if you'd have asked me two years ago who the key staples of the team were, it would have been Saliba, Gabriel, Rice, Odegaard, Saka. I think we maybe have lost one of those names games and it's Martin Odegaard.
1:21:37And that's just not, that's not to say that he's not a good player. That's not to say that he can't be useful. That's not to say anything about his character or commitment. I just don't think we are. How many times did you call him a single point of failure? He's not anymore because we've got other people. And I think there's been an issue in his game, the disappearance of his goal threat. I think he takes too many touches in and around the area. I think he narrows the pitch when he plays on that right side. I think we have a right side bias mainly because of Bakayo Saka, but it's also in the team when Erdegaard is there because he only looks one way ever.
1:22:23And his mechanics always take him towards the right. His first touch always takes him to the right and we are just finding other ways to play I think in his absence Trossard has stepped up massively both from a output sense and a sort of leadership sense he's becoming more creative so I can understand why people have problems with him because he hasn't been at the level that he was two years ago when he scored 15 non-penalty goals and got about 12 assists and he was the heartbeat of the team. He's not the heartbeat of the team anymore. I think that's moved. I think Declan Rice is the heartbeat of the team.
1:23:01And that's just a byproduct of him being out of form and now injured. So I've got no doubt that he'll be useful for us in the second half of the season. And I've always said that he's Arteta's eyes and ears on the pitch, just like it was with Jorginho, a technical leader. But like Jochores, like what I said about him earlier, he needs to step up. and prove that he's the guy to be in that position because we've got other players who can play there just as well. And I'm not sitting here pretending that it's been perfect with Eza as well because it hasn't. Not remotely. I mean, as someone who really rates him, Phil, I think Eza has been disappointing feels too strong, but I'll say disappointing vis-a-vis my expectations.
1:23:47it's just weird because when a guy scores a hat trick in a north london derby a hat trick of that quality from that position my first thought is how do we get that player into that position more and i think the default understanding of him has been play him from the left he can do the things leo does he can influence the game from that position the way leo does but that understanding is evolving, especially as it pertains to our out of possession shape and our out of possession intensity. And I think sometimes there is this perception that anyone can be good out of possession if they just run and try.
1:24:27And I just don't think that's the case. I think there is a talent to understanding what to do out of possession that he may have. I mean, maybe, I'm not writing him off on that front, by the way. I'm just saying Leo clearly does have it. You know, there are players like Emil Smith-Rowe. Watched a bit of him the other day. What was that? Yesterday? Fulham, Newcastle. And like, Emil Smith-Rowe gets on the ball and he strikes the ball really cleanly. He has an ability on the ball that is really special and unique. Can I just tell you something quickly? A bit of news has just dropped from Issan Khan in the Daily Mail.
1:25:04Arsenal forward Kai Havertz is set to be sidelined until early to mid-January following the setback he suffered last month in his rehab. so again that could probably push it another few weeks because we expected him back at the end of december right i mean initially after the november international break was yeah and now it's mid-january so it keeps getting longer um i mean to be fair did he say early to mid-january yeah early to mid-january we're not actually that that far from early to mid-january but i mean does this phil i assume this means now you're on board with my head the word set back in it though yeah it's not great i assume though phil that this this puts you on board with my as a nine idea it does not no it does not let's say this though this news points to what i was saying about him coming back and having to be a savior like if he's let's say he's really truly back late january then like when it's all said and done it will have been nearly a year since he started a premier i think his last premier league start for us was in february of 20 of this year it was the 5-1 5-1 against city wasn't it yeah so good days by the way uh so like it's it's ridiculous knowing football the way we do it's ridiculous to think kai havertz is just going to come back and then immediately just start games and be great and it's a it's a path to green from there so things are gonna have changed paul i mean this this dynamic in terms of how like i get look just like i said with yokaris arsenal football club's goal is not to get the most out of ever as Arsenal's football goals is to win football matches and win titles and trophies and do it in whatever way is going to get us there.
1:26:40For me, though, for a team that has been chance-shy over the years and goal-shy at times, I think he has a unique elite skill in that respect. The idea that he'd just do it from the left, I made that assumption. Because of Odegaard's injury, he played 10. but during that time leo played great and suddenly his path to the left hand side position got snatched by leo being awesome and now i don't know so odegaard and eza feel like pieces of a puzzle that we may not be able to fit together i don't know so i think there's a lot of crazy talk about odegaard uh in the words of the great of Bono. There's been a lot of talk about this next song.
1:27:28Maybe too much talk. This song is not a rebel song. This song is Martin Odegaard. Martin Odegaard is a brilliant player. We will see, maybe it's not the second, maybe it's the third or fourth coming of Martin Odegaard. He's about to become a fixture again in this team. We have seen those levels from him. we will see what he contributes as long as he maintains his fitness here he's going to establish himself as again the heartbeat of the attack because he's just that good and we forget we do it all the time we know it we forget how good somebody was sometimes we forget how bad they were when they come into a team.
1:28:13He is a top-level player, and he will establish himself in the team. Eze is currently, for Arsenal, a bench or rotation option, a kind of a tactical fit for certain games. He's got a long way to go before he's in the mix for me for that. I think you can see the players who deliver game in, game out. we just don't know who that is at center forward yet that's that's our real question i think i know our starting 11 outside of who's our striker um and that's the piece that needs to be worked out but bukaya saka martin odegaard timber on the right hand side or ben white on the right hand side now for a little bit to come is a hell of a right hand side and i think i think we shoehorn odegaard into our perception of how he plays i think he plays certain ways because that worked and i think he's more adaptable than we think and i think we're going to see that and he's not a limited player in terms of his mentality his ability his range i fully agree with Phil on the end product we haven't seen for a while.
1:29:32But he also does end product, and it will come again. There's no reason why that won't happen again. He just needs that run of games. The level of consistency. When that guy was good, he was good every game. He's one of the best midfielders in world football, full stop. No question. Yeah. One of the best players in the Premier League, depending on which side of the line you're standing on. and like in tough games where we had to sit sit back he was great what he does on and off the ball but i know we're mainly focusing on the ball and i think as long as he maintains his fitness here for just another game or two on the ball he's going to start to re-establish himself in this team and find ways to make it work we just need a left-hand side that can function so But one of the problems is everybody just went and sat on Saka and Odegaard because nothing was happening down the left with, say, the Martinelli or when Trossard hadn't figured it out because we didn't have Calafiore or whatever those dynamics are.
1:30:34It's a different team at the functioning left-hand side, Odegaard, Saka, and Jurian Timber on the right. We've got to hold back our priors and let them cook for a few games and we'll find the center forward that works best with it. It is this simple. Arsenal Football Club are the best team in the world in many respects, but we are not the best attack. And so we have to make sure that the goals and assists come from somewhere. Okay? Martin Odegaard is one of the best ball-progressing midfielders in world football, one of the best out-of-possession midfielders, although I think recently that's taken a little step back because he's learning to trust his body again, but that's beside the point.
1:31:12But here's the thing about Martin Odegaard. 22 goal involvements 22 in the 22-23 season 18 goal involvements in the 23-24 season 11 goal involvements last season and in his 6 starts 10 appearances this season 1 goal involvement 1 assist okay he's gone from .52 expected assists plus expected goals per 90.52 to.50 to.40 to.29 none of this is designed to say he's not a great player is to say that we need one of the midfielders to be a final third contributor in the way he has been with 22 goals his 18 goal contributions and so we need that back we need that back and we need because if we don't have that then we know we fall a little bit short in that respect and so that is going to be an interesting thing to watch and see how it evolves And like I back Martin Odegaard's talent that he is a player that can help us win everything.
1:32:20And when he's on it, I don't know that there's another player like him. What other players are there that can be elite? And when he's on it, he stays on it. It's not like when Eze is on it because you don't know what you get in the next game. Once Odegaard gets to Odegaard levels, he's extremely consistent. Yeah, but elite at ball progression and elite in the final third. The thing that I think is fair is to just say it's now about a season and a half with a bunch of injuries, and we haven't really seen the final third stuff. So that is going to obviously be a talking point until it isn't. And by the way, he smashed one the other day that was tipped over the bar, right, against PSG.
1:32:59He nearly got us to the final with that shot from outside the box that Donnarumma somehow claws away. One of those is going to fly in, and I think it's going to change a lot, but it's got to happen soon is sort of where I come down on that. We've been going a very, very, very long time. And there are just so many more good, fun, interesting questions. I'll ask you this, Phil. The Factor 50 Football Podcast. They got a plug in there. Asked, where will Arsenal finish in the Premier League in this season, in your opinion? Oh, God. We'll win it. It's going to be terrible between now and then, but we'll get there.
1:33:36I think we'll get there this year. Paul? well i prefer if you could tell me what kind of injuries we're going to have along the way but i'm going to veer towards we'll win it but it's going to be bloody close i'm going to say this i think the injury thing is largely random more random than people want it to be people by the way a lot of questions about injuries people i just won't i won't get into a big chat on injuries on the pod because i really believe it invites speculation about stuff that we simply have zero ability to predict or understand. But over the course of this season, we've been the best team.
1:34:16Despite all of the things that we've all talked about that have us sort of concerned, confused, not understanding it. I do think that if there's a team that's going to go on a run in the second half, it is more likely to be Arsenal than anyone else. I think we'll get fit. I think Gabby and Saliba are really important players, really. The two best defenders in the world. I think we'll win it. And I think we will win it, not comfortably. I'm sorry, I can't tell you that. But I don't think this is a down to the last day situation. I think, let's put it this way. We can concentrate on the League Cup because the league is basically done.
1:34:56That's where I'm at on this. I mean, we've got this far. All right. Without a functioning attack, game in, game out, right? We've done this off our defense and off our midfield. Once that starts to bed in and we find something that works on the pitch, we got levels to go up. I know we're looking over our shoulder, but our attack can jump up. I mean, where do we rank in the world in terms of our attacking threat at the moment? Not very high up, but that can change. We have the talent. We have to work out the combination. the patterns, all it. Like the whole attacking end is yet to come. We've been the best team this season so far, despite everything we've discussed on this podcast.
1:35:38We are currently top. Now, if you ask me again, Saturday night after City have won 7-0 and we're currently in second, I might have a different answer for you. But for now, we're winning the lot. The treble. Premier League, Champions League, League Cup. We're winning the treble. All right, Phil, thank you. looking forward to the comments on this this has been a disaster let's be honest paul thank you woohoo you're welcome this this this i mean honestly if this doesn't get some of the most contentious angry comments feedback the pod's gone down i got so guys i got inundated with messages this week just saying hey just want to let you know really appreciate what you guys do largely because i've been off the pod most of the last week and like great to see you or you know the pod means a lot to me just beautiful things we have such a wonderful audience and community of people who really think deeply about football, care about one another, and treat each other with respect.
1:36:33And we blew it. And you blew it! We blew it today. And it's gone. We made the mistake of telling them what we really felt. Yeah, never do that. Never do that. Sorry for the authenticity today. We'll go back to the usual. With Friday Night Clive tomorrow, we'll cleanse the palate with that instant reaction live after the big win in Everton. And then a main pod on Monday, if I'm allowed, back on. We love you. and we will talk to you after our still 10 everything
From the publisher
On this bizarre edition of the ArsenalVision Podcast, Elliot, Phil and Paul on a wide range of topics including Pep leaving, Everton game, “first XIs,” the League Cup, Odegaard, Eze and more as listed below. Chapter timings below.
Chapters:
00:00 Intro Music
04:33 Pep Guardiola Leaving: What It Means for City This Season
08:15 Could Pep’s Exit Create Instability or a “Last Hurrah” Effect?
13:54 What to Look for at Everton Beyond the Result
27:38 Are Arsenal Fans Overreacting to Recent Performances?
34:41 League Cup Priorities vs Premier League and Champions League
58:26 Reassessing Victor Gyökeres: Patience, Fit, and Expectations
01:09:40 Which Is More Likely: Kai’s Return, Gyökeres Clicking, or Jesus Staying Fit?
01:17:23 Trial Balloon: Is Eberechi Eze Arsenal’s Best Striker?
01:23:31 Do We Sacrifice Too Much to Fit Martin Ødegaard?
01:35:46 Final Thoughts: Title Chances and Season Outlook
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