Advanced Negotiation Tactics from a Hostage Negotiator | Scott Walker

33:08So those are three elements. And it's approaching the negotiation with, okay, negotiation can be divided, I guess, into two further parts there. And that is it's about gathering information so you can solve problems. And remind me, I'll come back to that in a second. And the second, and I think probably the most important aspect is developing and building relationships. Yes. and where most people go wrong is they look to emphasize the first element of trying to problem solve and too quickly before they spent the time to work on the relationships build rapport you know empathize build rapport bring about trust and that is a golden trust is the golden thread that runs through all successful negotiations.

34:02And it's the reason why there's a 93 % chance of the hostages coming back in a hostage negotiation when there's a structured negotiation in place. A 93 % success rate. They're pretty high odds when you think it's the most unregulated, ungoverned, dangerous industry in the world. And that's why, because you've spent the time. And the same in business, the same in your personal life. If you spend the time establishing rapport, building trust, you've then earned the right to start influencing and persuading people and seeking that cooperation and collaboration. But that takes time. And there's a sequence to it.

34:48There's absolutely, there's a sequence to it. And if you want to ultimately see some kind of change in behavior, in attitude, in emotions. And as I said, you want to be aiming for that cooperation and collaboration rather than coercion. Is you start off with, I always say to people, you want to eat more pies. And they look at me as if, who's this crazy Brit? We talk about eat more pies. Well, it's a mnemonic that I talk about in the book and I go through it in detail there. And essentially these are a series of techniques techniques that you can apply that enable you to truly actively listen empathize and establish rapport and i'm sure a lot of people listening to this will think yes i know active listening i can do this i've i've heard of the podcast about it or i've read about it yeah you may know it intellectually but have you really mastered it at the physical the emotional level just as you become part of your DNA that you can do it instinctively.

35:54And some of the really most powerful techniques out of the more pies that work for me. And what I'll emphasize here is, and I'll go through some of them in a second, is pick the ones that work for you. This is not a tick box exercise. It's like, right, I'm sitting down for this conversation and Right, rapport, tick. Empathy. Empathy demonstrated, tick. Trust, yet still working on that? No, no, it's a continuous revolving process. And so the ones I particularly like are labeling, the emotional labeling, which is the E in the more pies. and this is where it allows me to demonstrate my understanding of what is going on for you it looks like it sounds like it feels like it seems like and then I will fill in the blank with the emotion that you know it sounds like you're really interested in this conversation or what I'm gonna say as opposed to seem like you're really bored right now um or it could be you could apply that to behavior as well.

37:10And again, that's just a first step in you seeking to understand. And if you can build on that label by some kind of summarizing or paraphrasing your interpretation of what the person has just said. And I particularly find that really, really powerful. And I might say something like, is it okay if I just share with you where I think you're at with this deal right now and no one's going to say no no be quiet I'm talking they're going to go yeah yeah sure and I would articulate trying to use your words as well as to your viewpoint your perspective I will look to identify what the underlying emotions are by using one of the labeling phrases, for example.

38:05And by doing so, it enables you to get to a place where you feel seen, heard, and understood. And if you do, I then got an open goal. I've then earned the right to then start looking to try and persuade you and bring about that cooperation but it takes time it's having what I call a sensory acuity imagine like a radar on the top of your head you walk into a room or you're on the telephone on a zoom call having a conversation with somebody and you're constantly scanning for the mood music and particularly if you don't rely or think you don't rely on your emotions that much you know particularly if you're data driven fact-based process kind of person my invitation to you is to just take a couple of seconds every so often just to tune into what is going on right now not physically not logistically not not not uh one thing after another but emotionally what is the mood here is the congruency between what this person is saying in their body language or their tone of voice is this person being really genuine right now do i feel they've got my intentions at heart here or is it all about them are they an ego-driven kind of manipulative narcissist that you know and so even though we will pick up this subconsciously sometimes we override that or we we drown that out by our logical part of our brain.

39:50And so again, just to reiterate, the invitation is to really take the moment, take a couple of breaths, become really present in the moment and just tune into what is showing up for you, importantly, but for other people. And then as a result of that, you can then change course. You can then maybe ask a question. You could summarize going, do you know what? I don't know if it's just me or is there a bit of an awkwardness here? Or have we just gone off track a little? Can we just take two minutes to gather our thoughts? Or is it worth me? Or shall I just summarize where I think we're at? Because I think we've slightly gone off script here.

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43:41And a good example of this is, you know, when people are passive aggressive, you know, in a relationship, no, I'm fine. Well, clearly you're not fine. Right. And that's an invitation. That is a, golden goal opportunity for you to practice and demonstrate some of this because you know full well that your partner usually is not fine um but you're right you know at work a colleague could be struggling and they just they've got this heroic archetype they're going to plow on that they've almost been a victim mentality bit of a martyr of no i'm going to struggle i'm going to carry the burden it's like brother let's you know it seems like you're carrying a lot here how can i best support you with this and you know you have to meet people where they're at and you offer them the hand and if they they don't want to take it they don't take it and you go fine but you're right life presents you opportunities every single day to practice this so jumping back i think the important thread around trust, I think, for a lot of us, because we think about deals very cerebrally, or we've seen them in movies, and we think about, okay, I want to get the best deal for myself.

44:55But that's actually not the conclusion of the negotiation. You have to live with that deal. Like, you have to get your car serviced at that dealership after you got one over on that person, or, oh, great, you got one over on the house, but they can still come after you for something. So a deal doesn't end when the negotiation is over. So building trust manages the reputation thereafter the deal and might make them more likely to do another deal with you, make them more likely to promote you later. So I think it's really important to zoom out when we start to think about negotiations. It's not just like, what am I getting and how do I get the win-win-win for everybody?

45:28But what are the repercussions long-term to my reputation, the person on the other side's reputation and that's an important part of the equation that I think we often miss in movies and in pop culture yeah it's spot on and we often think when the signature is on the dotted line that's it negotiation is over but even on a more everyday um example there's a great little independent coffee shop near where I live and the first couple of times I went in there um they didn't quite get the order right and I'm at the age now where I kind of you know I like my coffee a certain way, I like my tea. But again, I applied some of these skills, because initially I'm like, how can you get this wrong?

46:12But that's the mind that kicks in. And I'm not saying that's ever going to go away, but if you can recognize it, interrupt it, and then go, hmm, okay, maybe I'm not communicating this in the right way. But long story short, because I was looking to establish that trust and that cooperation long-term, because I knew I wanted to come back to this coffee shop where I could sit in the corner, I could be one of those people who fire their laptop up. Unbothered, do your thing. Unbothered, do my thing. This could be my place to do it. And I didn't want to jeopardize that on the very first outing. But that worked off because as the weeks went by and I got to know the staff more and I built that trust, they'd bring my coffee over but at the side there'd be a piece of homemade cake or pie or there'd be these little treats or it'd be like this one's on us so you're eating more pie I'm eating more pies literally which thankfully I've got a high metabolism but the point is there had I been a jerk at the beginning you know that they could have just constantly messed up my order they could have ignored it oh sorry we've forgotten gone slower yeah put the wrong order in or whatever.

47:30So you're right, it applies to every aspect, which is why I say you want to have this long-term, lifelong relationship. Because if you're a business, the best form of business is repeat business and referrals. Saves the marketing costs, save all that hassle and sales. If these people want to come back, there's a queue outside the door. People want to invite everyone they know to come back. They want to invite everybody to come in here. And so, but because you spent the time to establish that trust, that credibility, which is underpinned by likability, never underestimate the power of likability in your conversations.

48:11Doesn't mean you've got to be false. Doesn't mean you've got to be inauthentic. It doesn't take much to not be a jerk and just be a nice person. Even when you're dealing with difficult, obnoxious people, it doesn't mean you've got to be like it. And I think there's a, I forget one of the Stoics would say, the best thing you could do when you meet people like that is not become like that. I think as Marcus Aurelius said it, you know, that's the best thing you can do is not become like them. Yeah. And in a lot of these situations, we aren't dealing with difficult people. We're just dealing with someone else who also wants to go about their day or wants to work with you or wants to sell their car.

48:50and they have other objectives and outcomes outside of the deal that we're striking. So circling back, first off, active listening, moving aside our assumptions, and if we have them, maybe bringing them into the conversation to unpack further and make sure that those assumptions are correct instead of just moving forward. Clarify and verify each step of the way because there's a danger. really, really easily and quickly assumption leaks into the proceedings. But again, if I'm spending the time to genuinely listen at a deep level, I call it level five listening. This is where you're listening to what is not being said.

49:33You're listening for... What are they holding back? What are they holding back? The tone, the nuance there. You can't do that if you're listening at level one or level two, which I talk about in the book around my Amazon delivery should be here by now or what I'm going to have for lunch or I'm looking just waiting to rebut your argument I'm waiting to speak and so but if you spend that time and the effort to listen deeply and you're summarizing and you're checking in and you're clarifying and verifying this is all really great empathy and people misunderstand what empathy is about it's not sympathy or pity and it's not quite compassion but empathy is a doing word you do empathy it's it's me physically demonstrating or attempting to demonstrate my understanding of what you're thinking feeling and doing who you are and then you feel rapport and trust as a result of me doing empathy and so i do that on that sequence and I build a rapport, I build a trust, I then earn the right, as I said, to start influencing and persuading and then looking to bring that cooperation about.

50:51I hang up that a lot of our listeners share and even our clients who work with us is, well, we don't have anything in common. And how could you have anything in common with a criminal? You're a police officer. So how are you building rapport with criminals? What's the mindset for you behind building rapport? Again, people overcomplicate it. You know what? Yeah, I'm degree educated, but I'm a simple guy, really. And I think it was Tony Robbins who says that complexity is the enemy of execution. Absolutely. And we've got to keep it simple here. And you're right. I had nothing in common with kidnappers.

51:25And people who say, oh, look for the common ground. Hey, yeah, do you know what? I supported that football team once. Oh, yeah. You're a Fulham fan? Okay, great. We're going to get along. I like cheese, too. and it's like no and you've only got to look at siblings anyone who's with kids can testify this they've got the greatest link of commonality in the world but they done our fight and moan and squabble so looking for elements of commonality it's a bit of a red herring there and so you're better off going, right, what is driving this person? If I can listen and articulate back, actually, this person's needs are, they need a safe face here.

52:11Okay, you're dealing with somebody who may be three or four levels above you in an organization. Is you know full well, particularly if they're maybe a baby boomer or even a Gen X, they're not going to take too kindly if you're a Gen Z, tell them what to do. You know that's not going to go down well. You know they want an element. Okay, I appreciate it. I'm generalizing here, but stay with me. Is you know full well they're going to feel or want to feel like they're in control. They're going to save face. They want an input in this. But you can play to that. You can use these techniques we've just gone through, clarifying and verifying with them.

52:54Okay, how would you like this done? What does success look like for you? How can I best support you with this? you know, it sounds like this is a really important project that you want oversight of every step of the way. And you want me to check in with you three times a week. Is that correct? Actually, Scott, it may be yes to start with, but over time it may be, do you know what, Scott, I trust you now because you've established your credibility and therefore rapport and carry on and speak to me once a week instead. So rapport really is just the feeling. it can be that warm fuzzy feeling I guess when you feel listened to you feel seen heard and understood you feel there's some trust there and see rapport as almost the umbrella with which all of that sits under yeah you actually care about the other person genuinely right genuinely and okay you may argue well Scott how could you care about the kidnappers well I cared about them in the sense of I needed to get the hostages back and if I if I was really judgmental or sarcastic or dismissive in our communication with them even though I might have felt that and thought that that wasn't going to go down well so I had to genuinely intention matters I had to genuinely put on that that mindset of everybody needs to walk away here and it's going to mean difficult conversations, managing expectations, high emotion, but ultimately focusing on what is the desired outcome here.

54:32And in my case, it was a safe release of the hostages. But for you, it could be, you know, getting that deal over the line, building a better relationship with your kids, whatever. Now, you mentioned this earlier around logic and emotion. And I know that there's some common parlance around right brain, left brain, but you bring up in the book, great research around the four characters of the brain, and it's not just about one side left or right ruling the other. Yeah, again, there's been lots of misconceptions in terms of my understanding, hey, I'm not a neuroscientist, I'm not scientifically qualified, but I was practicing this in the real world.

55:12I kind of learned the science afterwards, you know, after 10, 15 years of doing this, because I had a ringside seat. into the human condition. How did people think, feel and act, particularly when they faced times of stress, overwhelm, crisis, conflict, uncertainty, no matter where it was in the world, which industry or sector, which culture, which nationality was involved, there were certain themes and patterns that showed up. And I didn't know the science behind this at the time. I'm just working on what works, what doesn't, learning from more experienced colleagues. And then when I kind of stepped back from doing the active negotiations, I started looking into the neuroscience about it and the research.

56:04And this whole concept around left brain, right brain that you mentioned is actually not true at all. You know, we have two amygdala. we have both sides of the brain can have emotional and logical aspects and the reason i mentioned in the book is it's around how can you best tune into what's going on for you it's not that awareness that self-awareness part of the emotional intelligence piece of okay which element of my brain is showing up here and again yeah i i i've read about it with jill bolt taylor in her book whole brain living. And she assigns these different characters to the brain. And again, if anybody's done any kind of personality or behavioral type assessment, you know, there's different colors or different styles or archetypes even.

56:59And there's these different elements of the brain where actually, am I in the peaceful, loving, harmonious, collegiate type part of my brain? am I in the warrior type mindset of get out of my way I'm coming through I'm going to get this done for example and you can give these different elements some come up with some names for them whatever works for you and the point behind what she was making in her book and what I reference in mine is when you hit by the tsunami of overwhelm or you're facing the crisis whatever it is personally or professionally, it's taking the time to go to stop, to pause.

57:40The power of the pause is really, really unique, is that he gives you the space which to go, right, what is showing up for me here? What part of me is in control here? Is it my ego that's driving this? Is it my task-focused, hungry for recognition type thing, type approach? Or is this, do I need to be a bit more calmer? Do I need to activate a bit more of a rational part of my brain to this? Am I allowing my intuition to run away with itself here? And Daniel Cunnaman also in Thinking fast and slow who sadly passed away recently um around this is what we're not saying here is dismiss logic right and just make all your decisions emotionally we're not saying that at all what we're saying is you need to be able to identify and manage those emotions the forces at work the forces at work knowing what part of you is showing up is driving this i.e driven by your intention usually which part of you do you need to tap into which which part of your identity do you need to bring to the fore here and what's the logic what's the rationality here what's the objective viewpoint that can kind of blend and merge with this emotion that's the kind of sweet It's what you want to get at.

59:14Well, you mentioned emotional intelligence, and I think a lot of times when that gets thrown about, we look at, okay, well, how can I use that against someone else? Or how can I recognize their emotions? But a big part of it is the self-awareness piece of actually managing your own emotions, labeling them, understanding what those emotions are before trying to project onto others and read what their emotions are. so for you in these situations i mean as you said earlier you're not getting called at like wednesday afternoon after you had tea at your favorite coffee shop you're getting called two in the morning maybe you didn't sleep well and now you're sprung up and you're into action so were there any strategies that you would use in particular to raise your own self-awareness before moving into these high stakes environments yeah over the years i've developed what i call an immediate action drill, an IA drill, a three-step process.

1:00:03And you can apply this for you're about to walk on stage or give a business presentation. You're about to pick up and have that phone call. You know, the conversation we mentioned. We talked about it at the beginning. Or you can do in the middle of a scenario, a situation where you suddenly get hit by this stress ball or curve ball from the offside there. you get right I don't want to drown in this in this overwhelm here what am I going to do and there's three steps the first step is you've got to interrupt the pattern and so for example you may be on social media and a post will pop up and it will trigger the life out of you and you don't have to go very far to get that these days or is that just me I don't know and so I mean that is probably one of the most common ways that people do get triggered now.

1:00:56And so the first step is to interrupt the pattern, which would be in that case, just turn the social media off, put the phone down, take some breaths, go outside, stand up if you're sitting down, or if you're in the boardroom, you could just do some breathing, for example. And what that does is it stops you, prevents you from spiraling into that negative, downward reactive disempowering knee-jerk reaction that's not going to serve anybody least of all you so interrupt the pattern the second stage and for anyone who's surfed skied skateboarded will hopefully get this analogy of you've got to ride the wave you've got to kind of carve it out but ride the wave is the way I describe it and after you get that trigger that stimulus whatever it is you've got about 90 seconds two minutes where that fight or flight is kicked in you've got the cortisol adrenaline and other stuff just coursing through your body and they're usually the moments when we do or say something which we later regret again hopefully i'm not the only person who's ever done that and so so you're going to interrupt the pattern you've got to ride the wave you just got to feel the feeling and drop the story and so usually when you get that that trigger or those nerves are looking to get the better of you and before every call with the kidnappers i would just tune into okay what is showing up in my body right now.

1:02:40Okay, there's a swirling in my stomach or a tightness or a tension in my shoulders, or even there's like a slight headache perhaps. Okay, well, let me just spend 90 seconds, two minutes, tuning into that and not worry about the story as to why I'm feeling it. So feel the feeling, but drop the story. Because otherwise, I'll get into that spiral of naming, blaming and shaming the person or the reason why I'm now feeling like that. And that's not going to help you because the third step is you need to ask better questions. And you can't ask better questions if you're really het up, you're angry, you're tense, you're looking to just point the finger and shout at people.

1:03:33and if you ask better questions you get better answers and these would be open questions such as okay well what am I not seeing here you know I mentioned some of these earlier what's the opportunity here how else could I look at this what does this person need for me right now what do I need right now how can I best resolve this situation all these questions that you wouldn't be able to answer as well as you might do if you're stuck in that disempowering story. And so I always keep that metaphorical drill in my back pocket. So I'm interrupting the pattern, riding the wave and asking better questions for sitting down for this podcast, for going on stage giving a keynote, walking in and seeing my kids after, you know, a busy day.

1:04:26Just stop. Interrupt the pattern, park work mode, just tune in, just take a couple of deep breaths. Right. How can I show up for my kids right now? And then away you go. So for a lot of our listeners, that negotiation with your kids is happening quite frequently. And I know you break down some signals that our kids are sending in the book and what they actually mean versus what our natural reaction to them are. I'd love for you to unpack those for our parents in the audience. Yeah, and again, I learned this the hard way. I mean, my kids are older teenagers now, so they know every trick in the book, by the way.

1:05:05When they were kindergarten age, they'd be... Well, they'd be trained with a master negotiator. They thought it was cool that daddy's away hunting pirates, and now they'll just roll their eyes. They know every trick, and they still know which buttons to press. But yeah, so when a kid has been, and again, I learned this, I learned the science behind it afterwards, having done it kind of for real, experienced it for many, many years.

1:05:39Around, a lot of them, they're just looking for some control around the decision making. So when my kids were younger, it would be, you want them to wear a jumper. and they don't want to wear a jumper. So I would say literally, do you want to wear the red or the blue jumper? Knowing full well that their fight was about they wanted a sense of feeling in control, not they didn't want to wear the jumper. And so I didn't care which kind of jumper they wore. As long as it was a jumper. And I also learned this from a great book that's recently come out, Good Inside, about parenting.

1:06:18and in it that the writer the author talks about how and this applies to adults but particularly with kids is the your child as they are as as a human being you could say in your left hand you look at your left hand okay that's my child and all their magnificence the fact they even exist at all is wonderful human being and in your other hand these are all the dramas the issues the tantrums the paddies the back chat the belligerence that they file the whole gamut that comes with having kids and what we we tend to do is we merge them together just like we would do with colleagues people in public life whomever it happens to be where actually we want to be able to separate the person from their behavior and understand what is driving that so-called bad behavior it's all it is it's an unmet need it's an unmet need and if you can look to identify what those unmet needs are, then you resolve the tantrum or the problem.

1:07:37Negative behaviors. And an example would be, a classic example is, you see this in the store a lot, or maybe it was just with my kids, I don't know, is that they'll see some candy on the shelf and they'll want it there and then. And you go, no, darling, you can't because you're going to have dinner when we get home. I'm trying to be logical, rationalize, objective with them. Of course you can't have it. You're going to have your dinner in half an hour. Why on earth would you want a chocolate bar half an hour before your dinner? But then what do they do? They have a paddy, a tantrum, kicking and screaming on the store floor.

1:08:14And so again, what I learned and subsequently discovered through the science is actually until you can balance out bring down that emotive anxious stressful state through some of the tools and techniques that we've just gone through you're never going to bring about that objective rational thinking and decision making um and so that was a that was a great help and then the other technique uh i use my kids and this seems to be pretty prevalent as teenagers is for the example of you know they'll leave wet towels on the bathroom floor and there's the saying I use when you see identify the behavior when you I feel because and then what I want to see so the wet towel example it would be when you leave wet towels on the floor I feel a little frustrated because we've all got to share this bathroom and it would just be helpful if you could put the towels back on the towel rail once you've finished so we can all use the bathroom in a nicer way as opposed to how many times I have to tell you don't leave them on the floor and then it ends a bit of you never listen to me and goes down that spiral so that when you I feel because and then the behavior you want to see it can just take out the a bit of the poison or the negativity and hey I'm not saying this is easy everything we've gone through and everything in the book it's simple and highly effective and practical but it's not necessarily easy unless you practice.

1:10:06Consistency is key. This is not a one-time trick pony where you do the technique once and then you're some kind of Jedi Knight. You know, this is a consistency is key. Well, that's the piece that we're talking about is the emotion. So yeah, I'd love to control my child's emotions, but I have my own emotions here. And if I'm not practicing these and I'm not applying it as much as I can in heightened emotional states, in low emotional states, I'm not going to be able to rally the troops in the most important critical moments of that negotiation. Absolutely. And you make a really good point there around it then becomes a battle of wills.

1:10:40Going back to your kids again. I'm right. I'm the parent. And of course, you've got to have boundaries. And you've got to be able to prevent harm or damage coming to stuff. That's a given. But most of the time, we're not talking about those situations. We're talking about this battle of wills or your own emotions clouding your decision making. And if you can't develop again that emotional intelligence and that sensory acuity of how am I thinking, how am I feeling and how am I acting and doing so in the best possible way, you are metaphorically leaving money on the table from a negotiation perspective.

1:11:22perspective you are not building as much trust as you can do and ultimately you're not achieving that cooperation and collaboration which is what you want in the first place yeah a great way to end it here I'd love to know what are the main takeaways you'd love the audience to know about the book itself and and your career yeah I said the book is it's four years in the writing but 15 years in the making and I wanted to really capture I want it to be a practical tools and techniques underpinned by real life case studies where it's worked and no matter the situation no matter the circumstances that you find yourself in there's a process there's a sequence to go through from your mindset and emotions of one end to bringing about cooperation and collaboration and a client for life at the other.

1:12:15All the things that can get in the way, how you identify and overcome them. And I end the book with the, again, another invitation to people to seek out worthy opponents. And those worthy opponents could be people, situations, conversations that you avoid, you don't want to have, it's outside your comfort zone. It's maybe a conversation you're not having with yourself. And every day gives you so many opportunities to meet or seek out these worthy opportunities. The worthy opponent, sorry. Because if you do, it's like going to the gym. That's how you build muscle. It could be, okay, a worthy opponent could be you are suddenly stuck in traffic on the freeway and you're late for a meeting.

1:13:12rather than punching the dashboard and cursing. I'm okay, you can do that for 20 seconds. Okay, have 30 seconds. Or have 90 seconds. Have a 90 second, two minutes, do that. It's like, right, I'm riding the wave. I can't do anything about it. This traffic jam is a worthy opponent. I can utilize this. I can practice this. I can develop my resilience to cope with uncertainty and things outside of my control. And 99.9 % of everything that happens to us is outside of our control. And that seeking out worthy opponents, it develops that resilience, as I said. And most people think resilience is a hashtag on a mug or a t-shirt.

1:13:59But it's not. It's hard for a hard one. It's something you do and you harness and you practice, whether it's a traffic jam whether or not it's trying to deal with your disrooted kids an ego-driven boss a business deal that's fallen through and people are blaming you maybe you you've got a disempowering story about exercising or losing weight or leaving a relationship or whatever it is it's you've got to develop that muscle of being comfortable with being uncomfortable and yet seek out the worthy opponents and watch how those conversations and your communication and your negotiation saw. Well, thank you for fighting the worthy opponent of LA traffic.

1:14:47Join me today. It's a pleasure. Where can our audience find the book? Yeah, the book is available wherever books are sold. And they can also go to my website, scottwalkerbooks.co.uk and find out more information there. I'm on LinkedIn and Instagram and the usual places. Beautiful. Thank you for stopping by. You're welcome. Thanks for having me.

1:15:16Well, this week's shout out comes from Tammy and I'll let Tammy tell you herself. Hey everybody. This is Tammy. And as a retail business owner, the old saying, you know, it's lonely at the top. It's true. I joined X Factor because I wanted to be in a group of people who were kind of on the same level that I was, who were trying to live their best lives. and it has been an amazing community to be a part of. I am in X Factor with people who are really trying to create their best future and their best lives. And I highly recommend the program to anybody who's thinking about it. I don't think that you'll ever regret it.

1:15:54To invest in yourself is the best investment you can make. Tammy, it was an honor and privilege and a pleasure to have you with us in the X Factor. Thank you very much. Analytical minds are for analytical careers. Doing the same things over and over again gets you the same results. If you're listening to this show, it's obvious that improving your communication, networking, and social confidence is important to you. It's also important to us, which is why we've created the X Factor Accelerator. The ultimate solution for analytical men ready to take action. Build their wolf pack and find the one.

1:16:25Frameworks, tools, and strategies that turn analytical minds into social rock stars. Weekly coaching, implementation sessions, and a personalized curriculum designed to skyrocket your confidence, connection, and networking skills. With 17 years of experience and over 10 ,000 satisfied clients, including executives, military personnel, and men just like you, The Art of Charm has honed the art of transformation. Imagine reading any room, forging meaningful connections, and attracting the partner of your dreams. Scientifically backed lessons to unlock skills and become a super communicator. It's time to step into the spotlight and shake things up.

1:16:59Join The Art of Charm's X-Factor Accelerator today to unlock the secrets to your success. Visit unlockyourxfactor.com to learn more and take the first step towards a brighter, bolder future. The Art of Charms X-Factor Accelerator. People skills for computer people. Apply today at unlockyourxfactor.com. All right. If you got value from this podcast or any of our previous podcasts, head on over to your favorite podcast player and rate and review the show. It would mean the world to us and it helps others find the show. And before we head out, a huge thank you to our producers, Michael Harold and Eric Montgomery.

1:17:39All right, I want everyone to go out there and have an epic week.

1:18:03Cause you had your taste Of black only yesterday Yeah, but I remember you Oh yeah, I remember you It was my life But I found you all the way