Trump Loses Bid to Put Troops in Chicago

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1:00Welcome to The Beat, everyone. Happy Friday. I'm Ari Melbourne. We have James Carville here to kick off our show to end this week. Lead this segment. He's going to be in our lead off segment. You can see he's in a beautiful place. So, James, we'll check in on your vibes in a couple moments. We're tracking a new court loss for President Trump. Another court now stopping his bid to try to seize powers and put troops in the streets, something that has been, of course, controversial with a lot of protest. Trump has been trying to claim the power to deploy troops, and he's done it under the authority of what he calls rebellion.

1:33That's even when governors oppose using their state's guard that way, and even when there's no apparent rebellion, not one that anyone has seen. Well, judges have rebuffed Trump, and this powerful appeals court is blocking Trump's plot to put the troops in Chicago as unlawful, the court telling Trump that he's wrong, he does not have this power, and when it comes to this factual question that I just mentioned of, well, Does the rebellion clause kick in? This appeals court ruling that democracy and political opposition are not an organized rebellion, reinforcing Trump's prior losses in the lower courts on the abuse of this same type of power.

2:11So Trump is losing on the law. This is not rebellion, the court says. Now, the language and precedent are pretty clear there. So Trump's only legal path to still trying to get his troops back into the streets here would be to get the Supreme Court to bail him out, something they have done on other issues. So he's asking the high court to overrule this loss. Justice Barrett today did not order the type of stay that Trump wants. So instead, no emergency immediate action today, which means he is still on the losing side of this. Illinois officials can respond by the end of the day, Monday, the beginning of next week.

2:47If you are keeping track, this is another loss where Donald Trump has, of course, some agents and some troops in the streets and some level of concern, fear, and even among some people, a kind of despondent feeling that, well, I guess he's getting away with it all. And on some things he is, but on this one, he's not. And so the political strategy of flooding the zone or taking the L's and hoping people just focus on other things is being tested because it turns out when people fight and the law holds, you can't just have endless troops in the streets and an endless sort of military vibe in our country.

3:25That's still not America. And then there's Trump's DOJ, which continues to grind through these indictments. They've now turned this week to a Trump official from the first term. And today, John Bolton, we saw walking in to court where he pled not guilty to these charges of mishandling classified documents stemming from the security access he had in Donald Trump's first term. The wider context is that Trump has been using the DOJ to go after individuals who all have one thing in common. I mean, here you have people from different parties, from different parts of the country, state and federal officials.

3:57What do they all have in common? They are currently on Donald Trump's enemies list. And while there are some differences in the Bolton case, and we covered that when the news broke, when you look at the focus on what are factually older incidents, you have to get your calendar out and go back years to find out what they're talking about with Comey and Bolton. Well, that adds to the skepticism, the questions raised about whether the Bolton case is also, even if the facts are stronger, part of Trump's vendetta. So here, take one outside view from Rupert Murdoch's media empire, which as you know, includes Fox News, Wall Street Journal, and they've backed many Trump policies.

4:35And yet in the journal here, they're saying if you work for the president and he sours on you and you criticize him, you're not safe. There's little doubt, Rupert Murdoch's journal notes, that the underlying motivation for the Bolton prosecution is retribution. The calls are now coming from inside this conservative alliance. Fox News, you might say, is not as strong as the Journal on that issue about what the Journal says is Donald Trump's unlawful prosecution of foes, but Fox News this week also joined all other major news outlets and resisting the Pentagon crackdown from one of their own former employees, Pete Hegseth, who had said, go with the autocratic plan.

5:22You have to submit everything for their authorization before you publish it. Fox said no. And the journal's saying no. And the judges are saying no. It's a lot of no's, even in an environment where people feel like Trump is getting away with stuff. And so we turn, as promised, immediately to James Carville, legendary Democratic strategist, Raging Cajun, guy with a pretty good view, heading into the weekend. Welcome back. Thank you. I'm delighted to be back. Always fun. Friday afternoon, my favorite time to be on the show. There we go. And I know on the East Coast, people are having their drinks, getting ready for dinner.

5:57Let's start with the losing, because you have long said, if people don't know about it, it's not going to matter that much. And you got to get the word out. What does it mean to you and to the party that I know you support in fighting Trump, that I just went through a list of losses. And do you get that out to the country? Does that calcify the backbone going into these weekend protests? Well, a couple of things that we're going to get out to the country, because we're going to be stopping getting out of the country. First of all, the Democrats are not going to cave on this budget thing. Even if they wanted to, they couldn't.

6:30There is no appetite among Democratic voters to give in. I don't think there's any appetite among Democrats on the Hill, both the House and the Senate. Secondly, we're going to win in Virginia, and we're probably in all likelihood going to win in New Jersey. So that is going to change the entire dynamic of the coverage. And I mean, I'm sorry, Senator Thune or Speaker Johnson can go out and do all the talking points they want. You better prepare your caucus for a long haul because the Democrats feel they're winning this fight. They feel like they're not going to lose it. They feel like there on the right side, and there is zero appetite to give in.

7:09If they wanted to, they couldn't because Democratic voters come out of the woodwork. You better brace yourself for what's going to happen in November, because this is the first time that voters are going to go to post, and we've had special elections, and every one, the Democrats have outperformed by over 15 points. So the moment of reckoning cometh, and it's not that far away. And now we have the AP University of Chicago poll has Trump at 37 percent. So I'm sorry, guys, you're hooked up to a loser and we just have to keep making them pay. It's that simple. It really is. I mentioned the breadth of the opposition.

7:48I want to play you Joe Rogan here, who, of course, hosted Trump on his podcast, speaks to many millions of people. Here's New Rogan. Right. But does that mean that you support everything that they're doing now? Are they kicking people out? No, no. This storming into Home Depot and arresting people. No, no, that's not cool either. The military in the street, I think, is a dangerous precedent. James? Well, look, I don't know Joe Rogan. I've read on his show. It's really not in my demographic wheelhouse, but he's obviously a very talented guy. Mr. Rogan, you didn't know this was going to happen when you endorsed him.

8:25You didn't know he was going to want a vengeance to it. You didn't know he was going to try to arrest his enemies. He told you he was going to be all about retribution. I mean, I understand where you're coming from. I'm very happy that you see the light. And all of the other people that said, well, you know, maybe he'll do something about prices. He doesn't care one whit about prices. And by the way, nothing has been done about prices. is all that he cares about is trying to get back at his enemies. And that's where he spends all of his time. And I'm sorry, a lot of people just made a bad bet in 2024.

9:00I've been on the wrong side of a trade in my life before. I know how it feels. And all of these guys made a really, really bad bet. Well, you mentioned the focus on his enemies. John Bolton's a longtime conservative. He's now in the sauce with the rest of them. And this is what he says. I become the latest target in the Trump weaponizing of the Justice Department. These charges are not just about his focus on me or his mentions his diaries, but the Trump effort to intimidate opponents, dissent and disagreement are foundational to America's constitutional system. Vitally important to our freedom.

9:34James, we're in the early days of these cases. We don't know if Trump will win any of them, although they have a huge effect on people's lives, careers, money, even if Trump loses. What do you think of Bolton there? Well, I mean, Bowdoin got caught up in it. And, you know, if you get in, you know, your parents tell you and you hear it all the time, if you lie down with a skunk, you're going to smell bad. And John Bowdoin made a decision to lie down with a skunk. OK, he understood at some point what he was doing. I suspect that he'll beat this. But all of the other people that were just doing their jobs that are being here.

10:11But to Trump, it's not about people getting ahead. It's not about people struggling and trying to pay bills. It's not about people wanting an education. It's about getting the people that he doesn't like to use the power of the government to get even with him. And this is not going to work. People want a presidency and they want a government about their lives. And they get they're not getting that at all. We get it about Trump's grievances and it's going to start paying up. They're going to start paying a price and we should be the beneficiaries of this. I want to get you on Zoran Mondami. We talked about him early on.

10:48You talked about his economic message. He squared off in this debate last night. You mentioned Virginia. The you know, the election we have is going to be Virginia. There's also New York City. and there are going to be people looking to what this says about the party. Here he was last night. Well, I'm proud to say that I, yes, will freeze the rent for more than 2 million rent-stabilized tenants. And I will also build 200 ,000 truly affordable homes across the five boroughs over the next 10 years. We will have dedicated teams of mental health outreach workers in the top 100 subway stations with the highest levels of the mental health crisis and homelessness.

11:23I'm proud to have a comprehensive plan to bring new ideas to this city. If you want more of the same, vote for Andrew Cuomo. Is he the face of the Democratic Party if he wins this race? Well, I will say this. I talk communications at the college level, four years of community college, nine years of Tulane, four at LSU. If I could have one guess to demonstrate to my students how to communicate, I think I would pick him. That guy stays on message. You cannot get him out of talking about affordability. You notice what he was talking about, rent stabilization, building more houses. He talks about transit.

12:03And it's just a real tutorial. And people keep saying, well, you said this about Palestine, and you said this about this. And he just keeps bringing it back to what is the focal point. And Mondami does something that is very important. He tells people, I see you. I see what your life is. Look, may he not be my ideological, you know, compadre or maybe some different. But I tell you what, that guy can communicate. Well, you're not known. You see somebody can do that. You're not known as a young leftist. You know, who hadn't said stupid things in their 20s? Okay. Or done stupid things in their 20s.

12:45He's actually, the more I see him, when it started out, I'll be honest with you, I wasn't for him. And a lot of my friends of my generation, of my persuasion of politics, said, James, you don't get it. This guy's got some talent. He's got some freshness about it. And he's kind of what the city needs. And, you know, my friends were more right than I was. And he's going to win, obviously. And what he's not, he's not, what he's focusing on people's lives. So he's focusing on a cost. What he's focusing on, you know, I do live in New York. I spend a lot of time there. These people that live in like Queens or Brooklyn or Bronx or something like that, man, Staten Island, they have a hard time.

13:27I mean, every price increase that they get, it's like a shock to their system. And this guy sees it. And I think he's got a lot to teach us. I really do. I think he's way more to teach us than we run by them that's really good. Right. He's speaking about a city and there are a lot of urban centers that have a different bundle of benefits and challenges to live there. And affordability is one. And James, the way you're talking about his quest, you reminded me of a lyric. It is Friday night. I don't know if you know this one, but it's a rap lyric where the artist says, you know, I told my friends, I'm going to make it in New York.

14:04And they said, you ever even go there? Don't you know you got to be rich just to be poor there? And you got that dynamic where, and it's not just New York, of course. A lot of these cities are expensive. And so you can have a decent life and a decent job and feel like those are problems, because obviously if Mondami and this is something Democrats are talking about and you can you can respond. If Mondami was only speaking to the, call it the lowest 20%, right? Then in an election, you'd only have those 20 % interested and you need to get up to 51. So there are people who aren't totally broke or looking for quote unquote government assistance, food assistance, who still also seem to find his view resonating.

14:50Well, come on, man, it's expensive. I went to New York, a rich man, I left in the middle class. I mean, I joined the great American middle class after spending four days. But it's the greatest city in the world, but it's also expensive. And most people that experience it don't have a car to pick them up at the airport. They have to take the transit. They got to come in. They have to walk the streets. They have to live the life. They have to, you know, shop for groceries. They have to live that. And they live there because there's opportunity and there's cost. And I think what he's just telling people is I see you and I see your struggles.

15:23I mean, I don't know if the city grocery stores are going to work, but he's telling people that your grocery prices are too high. I don't really know if he can build 200 ,000 housing units and alleviate housing costs. But at least he's saying, I see you. I know this is your problem. And in politics, two thirds of it is not what you do. It's what you see. And if you tell people, I see you, they're going to give you a lot of time and a lot of leeway to try to help them. They really will. And I think this guy's got some credibility now. You know, it's a tough job and there's a long way to go here.

15:58But I'm encouraged by what I'm seeing. I got to be honest with you. I want to get your view on these protests. Tonight on MSNBC, Rachel's doing a special show. She took her time to produce this new film that looks back at the MLK victories, the struggle, and Andrew Young, who, you know, any day we have Carvel's a big day, James. But with all respect to you, we are also very excited. By the end of the hour, we have the great ambassador, Andrew Young, here. And so what I want to ask you about is that middle ground between the activism and the protests, which can sound very highfalutin, and the electoral part, which you were just briefing us on in Virginia and elsewhere.

16:36So you're going to stick around, right? Correct. Okay, we got James. We're going to get into those No Kings protests and the legacy of that protest movement. We're back together in 90 seconds.

16:51We're back with James Carville. people out in the streets tomorrow. These are big no-kings protest plans. Your views on the power of this and how it may or may not affect the turnout and what the Democrats are trying to build. Well, I'm going to get up in the morning. I'm going to go to the supermarket and buy about four dozen sandwiches, and I'm going to bring them to the protesters. I think this is the most American patriotic thing that you can do. And I think this is a wonderful thing that people are sort of taking this in their own hands. I mean, will there be certain people with different ideological agendas there?

17:27Yeah, of course there will. But by and large, 90 % of this are going to be people that are scared for their country, is scared to death about the future of the country. They're watching troops on our streets. You know, this is the first time in our history where the payment on the debt is now higher than we spend on defense. and I wholeheartedly, and I promise you, all right, I'm not just going to participate in this. I'm going to bring some food. I'm going to bring some stuff. I might even bring an ice chest full of adult beverages there for the people if they want to. But I think what these people are doing is a wonderful thing, and I'm going to find the one closest to me, and I'm going to join them in any way that I can.

18:09James Carville, tailgating at a political protest. I'm not surprised. I got to hurry up and get back because we got an early kickoff against Vanderbilt. It's noon Eastern. So I can't stay out there too long, but I can show the flag. Does it impact the coming elections and midterms or too early to tell? I hope it does, but it's cathartic. At least people feel like, you know, I've just been sitting here. I've been taking it. I've been reading about this. I've been angry. There's all of this pent up demand that a lot of people feel in the country, myself included, and, you know, it's a nice time of year, generally the weather down here.

18:46It's great. I hope it's great in most places, and I hope people show up, and if it does no good, you will feel better at the end of the day. I think it will do some good. I think they're scared. They're trying to say it. I don't know that Lennon is somehow or another behind all of this, or, you know, George Soros, which is always that. But I think the way to deal with this, I'm going to go out, And I'm going to be very proud and very happy and feel very good. I'm going to bring some goodies along for the other people out there. I'll really be just a good thing. Yes, I do. Yeah. And when you look at the Supreme Court, I mean, so many of these issues land back there.

19:24And again, Trump ends the week with another setback, limiting the troops power. But then it's all headed back to this court. And I'm curious what you think about that and what the Democrats are supposed to say, because it can be enervating if they keep beating him and then the court seems to take these away as pyrrhic victories. So Louisiana is a state that's one-third black. We have six congressional districts. They seem to be about the rule that you can draw them anywhere you want to. They're talking about bringing the legislature back in special session. So we may not even have a single— blacks in Louisiana or one-third of our population may not have a single black person representing the state.

20:06in the United States House of Representatives. The Supreme Court is a Republican court. It is an adjunct of the Republican Party. You do not need to respect what they do. You don't need to like what they do. You got to follow them because they can come a rescue. But never, ever respect these people. Never, ever think that they're conscientious of the law and they try to decide something along the basis of the Constitution. They could care one whit about the Constitution, and every American needs to know that. You got to follow them, but you do not have to respect them at all. And you can feel free to tell them what you think, because I've just had the opportunity to tell them exactly what I think.

20:50Yeah. So you sound like you're concerned that the voting rights case this week, which connects with what I was mentioning. Go ahead. I'm panicked. I'm I live here. I live in Louisiana. I'm in Mississippi right now. I heard the chief justice of the Supreme Court saying racism is gone in this country. It no longer exists. What are you talking about, man? Would you like to just come walk into Walmart with me? Okay? Do you think there is a single black person within a 500-mile radius of me that thinks there's no racism in the United States? You're not kidding me. Of course there is. And, of course, people know it.

21:31And there's a lot of people that don't like it. I think I'm one of them. Yeah, that's funny because we were having that conversation coverage the day of the court hearing, and it was almost like they'd prepped these arguments in some other time. and then said, oh, well, aren't we past all of this? Which isn't something that people on the right would say. They've been saying that things are out of control, anti-woke, and we're in it. And it's not something that people on the left are saying. So it felt very much like the justices were in some kind of bubble. All right. You have J.D. Vance, the vice president of the United States, being an apologist for Nazism.

22:08You have people talking about lynching people. We have people talking about gas chambers, and you have him saying, oh, it's just Himmler and Eichmann and Gloring and all the boys cutting up and snapping towels in the locker room. That's the vice president of the United States. You have the president of the United States, Donald John Trump, in 2016, who wouldn't say anything negative about David Duke. And you and I know the reason. Every person listening to the show knows the reason. They think they need their votes. They are scared to offend them. That's why Vance was like, oh, that's no big deal.

22:46It's just some people cutting up on the Internet. And John Roberts is totally fine with that. And other people are not, but that's the country we live in. Hopefully tomorrow somebody will get a message and a lot of people will come out, show people what we think of our country, not just with John Roberts or Donald Trump with J.D. Vance, a bunch of congressional snot noses trafficking some kind of racist, anti-Semitic garbage. Clear as day where you stand. No, we appreciate you weighing in. Enjoy your tailgating tomorrow. James Carver, we appreciate it. Thank you, sir. I'll tell folks what's coming up.

23:26I mentioned this is a special night here at MSNBC. A warning about this agenda, including the anti-democracy movement from our colleague, Rachel. I think they are trying to impose one party permanent rule, getting rid of American democracy and all for all intents and purposes and having an authoritarian takeover of the country. We have more on that coming up. And Mike Johnson, why he looks scared. We have one of the leading No Kings organizers getting ready for tomorrow. Next.

24:01So just to be clear, peacefully protesting a wannabe dictator means you hate America. Attacking the Capitol to overturn an election? Patriotic walking tour. There is nothing more American than a political protest. The American Revolution was a no-king's rally. The American Revolution was a no-king's rally. That's the end of the punchlines, but of course, it's simply true. And we're ending another one of those weeks where you look around at what's happening. Very aggressive ice raids out in our country. Efforts to put troops out in the streets as we began the show with that coverage. A government shutdown that's continuing.