An Awesome ‘F1’ Movie and Superman Expectations With Van Lathan and Charles Holmes

24:28Bill Simmons:I don't think it was light on the plot. It was just familiar. And I don't know if that's the movie's fault because we've just had too many sports movies. I don't really know unless you're going to do like Like what Cameron Crowe was able to do with Jerry Maguire, where you're just completely reinventing a sports movie, right? Where the star athlete is not even the most important character. And it's built around an agent and this whole world around sports. Which is kind of where movies have gone from a sports standpoint the last, I would say, 15 years. And I think the flipping point was probably Moneyball Range.

25:02Bill Simmons:Oh, yeah. There was a movie called Sugar in 2009 that was great. I loved it. Sugar's I It's in the discussion I randomly saw that movie On HBO Years ago About The Dominican pitcher That comes to him It's a classic And he then He starts really pitching well And it looks like He's a phenom And then it kind of doesn't Go sideways Not a ton of dialogue No But just Fantastic movie Almost plays like a documentary Love that film Yeah So And you saw like The Way Back with Affleck Yeah like that one too Warrior We moved into a different kind of era of sports movies the last 15 years where they were more not like the ones we grew up with they're more like movies that also happen to be about sports and character studies and this is like an old school could have come out basically in any decade there would have been some version of it which I thought was cool.

25:55Bill Simmons:Racing movies

25:59Bill Simmons:I've seen three. Steve McQueen, Lamont never saw it Bobby Deerfield, Pacino no something like it. Days of Thunder. Yes. Driven with Sly Stallone and Burt Reynolds, where they both have just had, all of a sudden, they weren't cool anymore. They both had a lot of plastic surgery. I remember writing that they both looked like they were wearing Halloween masks of themselves. And then our boyfriend, Remember the Titans, what was his name? Sunshine? Kip Perdue. Yeah, Kip Perdue. What are you playing in Remember the Titans? Sunshine? Sunshine. Yeah, yeah. So that was supposed to be his star vehicle. he literally crashed.

26:39Bill Simmons:Tao Dagonites. Of course. Senna, which was a documentary. One of the best sports documentaries of all time. Rush. Oh, yeah. Rush is great. Now, Rush is... Rush is also probably a top 10 sports movie of this century. A ringer pill movie because I had never seen that movie until I got here and everybody's like, you really need to watch that. And then I checked it out. And I think Rush's aged really nicely because people just care about F1 more now. Yeah. You know? And then Ford versus Ferrari was the only other one. There's been some bad ones. Yeah, I saw one. There was one with, and I don't know if I'm making this up, but I feel like there was one with Kenny Rogers back in the day where he played a race car driver and he had to take care.

27:25Stroke or Ace? I don't think it was Stroke or Ace. He had to take care of a wayward group of kids. Was it Fat Kenny Rogers or Skinnier Kenny Rogers? I can't remember, man. I'm telling you. We go back and forth. There was a Kenny Rogers movie where he was a race car driver. I used to come on cable. Yeah. He had to take place of a group of misfit kids.

27:44Bill Simmons:I did not have that one on my list. Okay. I could be making this up, bro. It's interesting, though, because boxing movies just happen over and over again. We talk about that. It's just they never and every it seems like almost every great actor wants to say, fuck it. I got to do my boxing movie. I'm going to get in crazy shape. See, that's a part of it. And it's, and I'm just, people get to see me, you know, win the big fight in the end, I'll get the girl and nobody can resist it. And you go through every great actor or good actor who is like over five, nine has probably made one. It's over five, nine.

28:17Bill Simmons:Well, like Pacino never made a boxing. Right. I guess he could have been like a flyweight. But like Denzel, Jake Gyllenhaal. They all have to do it. I guess Leo's one of the only ones who didn't do it. It doesn't fit with him. Being a boxer in a movie. He never, he's not really physical in movies. Like it's not, I mean, he's sometimes a little bit. Tom Hardy does the MMA version of it. So, but racing, which I think can really work if you pull it off, but you need to kind of access. I mean, that was another thing. This movie, you were fully immersed because F1 let them fully immerse themselves in the movie.

28:50Bill Simmons:You saw the drivers, like they're racing, you know, people like Verstappen and Lewis Hamilton are like kind of borderline villains in the movie because they're trying to beat our guys. Yeah, Louis is a producer on it. It's also the perfect time for F1 because it's only been in the last five, six years. Obviously, pre-pandemic and then a little bit after that, I've heard people that I know say, hey, Van, you should go to the F1 race. It's really just like an awesome weekend. We know people that just have become addicted to it. I have people like friends in my life, people that work for The Ringer, people like Rosillo, people that just really got into it, that wake up in the mornings.

29:31Bill Simmons:We started a Ringer F1 show. Like, I never would have expected to have a F1 show. This movie is like, I was saying I saw Trayvon last night and he was leaving the movie for like the third time because he loves F1 that much. Wow. But also, it's a beautiful movie about beautiful, rich, expensive shit, which also speaks to the top. And great locales. And great locales. Going all over the place. Right. You even get to be in Vegas with like a nice hotel suite looking out on the strip. They're driving past the CVS on the strip and you're like, oh, I know where that is. Maybe I should go to the F1 race in Vegas.

30:04The villain, the real villain in the movie doesn't appear to like the end of the second act into the third act. Yeah, we meet him, but we don't know he's the villain yet. We meet him, but we don't know he's the villain yet. There are parts of the film that I think a different writer came in and put in the movie. Was there any part of you that could see the seams in it?

30:27Bill Simmons:Yeah, I mean, there's definitely some, there's some holes. I thought there was a couple parts you know, they definitely wanted to get the you do the dip where it's like we're riding high, montage, now we're low. Now we're riding up again. And it felt like it was they tried to do two dips with the accidents. Which by the way, one of those accidents I thought was one of the best things I've ever seen filmed in a sports movie. I was like, I don't even know how they did it. Which you're talking about the Sonny's one. Sonny's accident, yeah. that was spectacular. And Kaczynski was on Sean's pod talking about how they studied all of these different accidents that actually happened and didn't like completely recreate them because you can't complete, but like try to be in the vicinity of what the actual accident was.

31:15Bill Simmons:So it was realistic. But I thought that part was great. And then we got to talk about Brad Pitt. Yeah, I was about to say that. Yeah. Because that's another giant piece. I mean, there's some really good supporting people in this movie all over the place. I thought Carrie Conum was excellent. Not who you would take. Like, one of the ways they fuck movies up like this is it's like... They overcast it. Yeah, it's like Gail Godot. Yeah, Gail Godot is going to be the... They overcast it. It's going to be the lady who's building the cars. It's like, come on. They put somebody in there. Like, it was like...

31:50I think it was GoldenEye.

31:52Bill Simmons:It's Denise Richards. Yeah, yeah. It's like Nuclear Physicist Christmas Jones. Right. Or like Elizabeth Shue in The Saint. Right. It's like, okay. Yeah. You know what I mean? Just cast it. Properly cast. She was just cool. It's like, oh man. I like, because she was in that Colin Farrell movie. She's been in a bunch of stuff. She's a good actress. Everything that came from that character just has to be believable. It has to be believable that she would leave whatever situation she was in as a smart egghead and go run a racing team or whatever. It has to be believable that she didn't have chemistry with Brad Pitt.

32:25Bill Simmons:Axum was great. I like the way sometimes movies will have this. Like she was really convincing. Like you could tell she was, she was enchanted by Sonny. She did a good job of just kind of like, you're watching her going, is she falling for this dude? I feel like she is, but you kind of didn't know. And for a while. And then by the balcony scene, she's full on hanging on his own. Yeah. Like he's got her in the palm. She was good. I thought she was a really good character. Cause that's a character in a sports movie that could go sideways. And then our guy, our guy from no country for old men, Flip a coin Oh Javier Bardem Yeah yeah yeah Flip a coin It would get it mixed in you And it would just become a coin Which it is When they have When they have somebody like that I just think he should have the haircut From No Country Show But never explained He's just got a bowl cut He's just got the bowl cut He's just dressed like the guy Who's just carrying around One of those air vapor guns Quick aside Do you know But he I thought he was really good He was great Do you know what one of the saddest scenes Just quick aside The scene between Anton and Carson, which is Woody Harrelson.

33:32Yeah. That is a sad scene. I watched No Country for Old Men twice last week. I'm not sure why. It's the scene where he's, Woody Harrelson, with all of that charm, is sitting there.

33:43Bill Simmons:He's just not buying it. In front of the Grim Reaper. Yeah. And you know he's dead and he's trying to talk his way out of it. It's a really top five sad scenes. That's one of the two movies that has grown on me the most in the 21st century. We already did it on Rewatchables. Okay, yeah. I saw it, I was like, ah, weird ending when I saw it in the theater. And then you watch it a couple more times and you're like, that ending was amazing. And now in 2025, I'm like, that's one of the best movies the last 30 years. But when you see him in this film, number one, once again, cast it very well. He looks, first of all, like an F1 driver.

34:18That's how those guys look, right? Yeah, he looks like an ex-F1 driver.

34:22Bill Simmons:Yeah, you can see like he won like in 2000. Those guys are good looking they're European and then he also looks like somebody that because Brad Pitt is Brad Pitt when he's on screen, who is Brad Pitt gonna respect? It's kind of like the Jon Ham situation from Top Gun Maverick, you need somebody in that role that you could be like, oh okay I see why this conversation between these two people would make sense, not just in this world but like in my mind as well so he fills that spot Yeah, you have those XF1 guys they're just like keep your girl away from these guys. They have to have some sort of vibe.

35:00Bill Simmons:No, you're not driving my wife home. Everything in Europe has to do with sex. It's a horny region of the world. I'm looking at these soccer players. They're out there running around like models, bro. Dudes in the NBA don't even be getting a lineup. They're playing three games in a week. Sometimes the shit The opening date and that's it Like everything out there it's sex Sex sex with these Europeans is what I've Noticed That's a good observation Brad Pitt

35:35Bill Simmons:Four decades Of Brad Pitt As a leading man in an iconic movie And I think this movie is an iconic sports movie Already you'd say that Yeah okay Listen it's not I don't know where it's going to rank in the all time pyramid But I think for what it does with the technology we have, I think it's going to be remembered. I think it's influential. Greatest racing movie ever? Are you ready to put it up in the Pantheon for discussion? I'm looking at the list. I have to watch Rush again. I thought Rush was great. But to appeal to me and my wife and my kids and I'm sure the generations in between and I know my dad would like it.

36:20Bill Simmons:Now it's four generations of People who were like, I just know if you like sports movies, you're going to beat on this. And whether you like racing or not, you're going to like it. Brad Pitt.

36:32Bill Simmons:So, Seven, Fight Club, Ocean's Eleven, Inglourious Bastards, Moneyball, Once Upon a Time in Hollywood, and F1. Just those seven movies from a rewatchable popcorn. Culturally, they mattered when they came out for some way. And that's a span of Seven was 1995. Yeah. Mid-90s to now. Like think about who the famous athletes were in 1995. It was like Steve Young won the Super Bowl that year. Michael Jordan. Michael Jordan was coming back from retiring the first time. Like that's a long time ago. I have six stages of Brad Pitt. Okay. Stage number one, up and coming, interesting, handsome guy. 90 to 94.

37:11Bill Simmons:Thelma and Louise. River runs through a true romance, Californication interview with a vampire. It's like every girl I know loves this guy. Not sure. Is he Redford? what's the path for him? Might be Redford. Didn't know. Then it's leading man on training wheels for the next four years. Seven. Big hit for him. Twelve Monkeys. Sleepers. Seven years in Tibet. And then Meet Joe Black, they really went for it with him and the movie wasn't good. But they went, that was the movie where it's like Brad Pitt's a massive star. He's with Anthony Hopkins. We're really going for this. It didn't work. It was the movie where they were like, so it was the movie where they were like let's just put Brad Pitt in a movie with an older guy and an interesting young face and see if he can just movie star his way through it.

37:59This is a Robert Redford part yeah.

38:01Bill Simmons:Can you be Robert Redford for two hours? It's actually not what Brad Pitt does though no. Brad Pitt needs a little something. He needs to it's always been said but he's like the best looking character actor of all time right he needs a little something he doesn't just do that even in A River Runs Through It good movie well not a river runs through I didn't mean that one because you left out Legends of the Fall or was it in there did you have it in there it's later okay Legends of the Fall is a very important movie for Brad Pitt to me because Legends of the Fall was the movie where a lot of people fell in love yeah right but oh I should that was 94 that should have been in there yeah but there's something going on with that movie that movie is like a serious drama it's not a dreamy rom-com about a guy coming back and he's deaf and all of that stuff and death is about to...

38:47No, that movie is about three brothers go away to war or two brothers go away to war and come back to trying to fuck each other's girls. Yeah. All kinds of stuff. There's all kinds of mystic, beautiful, ethereal shit happening. And that is the perfect Brad Pitt role. And so he goes away from that, but he always has to have a little something in the movie that's a little grimy. There's a little more. We don't just trust Brad Pitt just to smile his way through a movie.

39:12Bill Simmons:Well, true romance is Floyd, which is one of the funniest like Tarantino characters. Californication, he's a maniac. Crazy. Like that's just a nuts movie. To be classic. He does maniac again in 12 Monkeys. Yeah. So when he's leading man in training wheels, seven, 12 monkeys, sleepers, seven years to bet, meet Joe Black. It's like, all right, this might not happen the way we thought, but there's still something really good here. And then he becomes an A-lister in the next five years. Fight Club, Snatch. The Mexican, which was a movie that didn't do that well, but it was Julia Roberts, him, Gano Finney.

39:49Bill Simmons:Ocean's Eleven, I think, is the big one. Right. Because now he's with Damon's on the rise, Clooney's a star, the three of them together. The movie becomes massive. And by the time Troy comes out in 04, it's like Brad Pitt can carry a movie like this. It wasn't a very good movie. I liked it. But I just remember Troy. I was in I was going to see a movie with Candice Stein. Shout out to Candice her whole family, my girlfriend at the time. I'm sure she's married or whatever. And the Troy trailer came on. And Brad Pitt was Achilles. Let the hair flow. And all of a sudden we're sitting there. We're in a black woman in a black movie theater in a black city in Baton Rouge, Louisiana.

40:36And Brad comes on screen and she goes ugh. And I'm sitting there at over 300 pounds. I'm like, yo man, can you not? And she goes, I'm sorry, Brad's still fine. And she was saying still, and that was 20 years ago. She was saying still, and that was 20 plus years ago.

41:01Bill Simmons:That leads us to the next stage of Brad Pitt, the Brangelina Hay Day. Oh yeah. 0-4 to 11, Mr. and Mrs. Smith, Benjamin Button, and Glorious Bastards, Moneyball were the highlight movies, but he's like an A-plus lister from the end. The Brangelina thing makes him one of the most famous people in the world. Could you make an argument that it's not actually until Mr. and Mrs. Smith that Brad Pitt is a hyper, super, megawatt A-lister? That's what I just said. I think he's an A-plus lister from Brangelina. I think he was an A-lister. I was thinking about what I was going to say rather than listening to you.

41:39Bill Simmons:No, no, he was an A-lister and then he became an A plus lister. Right. But he was like, he had the celebrity relationships. Like he dated Paltrow, he dated Julian Lewis, Jennifer Aniston. Yeah, no, he always said, but I'm just saying, the Angelina thing was like, boom. He was on the tip of everybody's tongue. Everyone was talking about what was going on and not just that, but that movie became, that movie was good. It was a good movie and an informative film. Like, they made a bunch of different Mr. and Mrs. Smith type movies after that. This episode is brought to you by chat GPT. Imagine you're running a professional sports team.

42:12Bill Simmons:Nice. Imagine the player contract report is due today. Not so nice. You've got performance notes from the coaching staff. You got a salary spreadsheet from your analyst, three rounds of back and forth emails with the agent, and all of it is scattered absolutely everywhere. Well, that's where chat GPT work comes in. It's a new way to use chat GPT for bigger multi-step projects. Give chat GPT work access to your apps and files and can create real work documents. For instance, spreadsheets, slides, structured reports. You can bring all those to your next meeting. And when you don't need answers, you need help just getting the work across the finish line.

42:50Bill Simmons:ChatGPT work can move your projects forward while you stay in control. Put ChatGPT to work on your most ambitious ideas and projects. Get started. Just go to ChatGPT.com by selecting work mode available on plus and pro plans. This episode is brought to you by 7up. Okay, this one's a case for conspiracy bill. Let's bring them in. Ever notice lemon is everywhere from lemon recipes to lemon scented cleaning supplies? And when it comes to lemon lime sodas, why is lemon always first? There's a reason. A shadowy organization called the Eliminate has been padding the stats, keeping big lemon in the lead for decades.

43:28Bill Simmons:But let me tell you something. The sip is about to be flipped. 7-Up is fighting back, swapping lemon-lime for their new lime-lemon soda. Now, lime comes first. 7-Up, flip the sip. This episode is brought to you by Core Power Protein Shakes. You know how we always talk about the little things that separate great athletes? Post-workout recovery is a big factor. Core Power Protein Shakes help you keep going after your workout with high-quality protein to build muscle and electrolytes to help hydrate. It's all you need for your recovery. One bottle available in 26 and 42 gram protein options to pick what works best for you.

44:03Bill Simmons:Visit corepower.com to learn more. So in Glorious Bastards, and by the way, so he works with Fincher and Benjamin Button. Yeah. Interesting movie. Some New Orleans in there. Yeah. In Glorious Bastards, Tarantino, and then Moneyball is probably the best he's ever been in a movie except for maybe Fight Club. Yeah, Fight Club is tough. Yeah, it's a tough performance right there. Fight Club, he's awesome. Like, you're just like, wow. This is like, Robert Redford could not have done this. You are now moving a little closer almost to De Niro. But Moneyball was like, man, I just fucking like Brad Pitt.

44:40Bill Simmons:That was one of those movies. But then we hit the next stage, The Swoon. Because the Brangelina relate, all of a sudden they have like six kids. Bad press. Some bad press floating around. There's a lot of weird stories about them. And the movies, even though he's producing, doing some good producing stuff, killing them softly, Allied, Fury. I love that Killing Them Softly movie. I just got to say it, though. Yeah. Have you seen that one? I might have saw it when it came out. Who's in it? So it's him. James Galnofini is in it. It takes place in New Orleans. New Orleans Month candidate? New Orleans Month candidate.

45:17Bill Simmons:Either it takes place in New Orleans or it's a shot in New Orleans. Well, we have to do Angel Heart last for New Orleans Month because then that's when the pod gets canceled. He canceled the pod. But there's a robbery. They bring Brad Pitt. It's a good movie. All right. I'll give it another chance. I don't think it did well. No, it didn't at all. And the most successful things he was involved with were 12 Years a Slave and The Big Short, which he wasn't leading those movies. Just in them. And then the Angelina thing went sideways, and it felt like his career might be over. There was the Tank movie that came out.

45:46Bill Simmons:The By the Sea movie was like, and then there was the Allegation she had, and the family stuff went. And then Tarantino, this is the last spot. Yeah, Parentino kind of revives him with Once Upon a Time in Hollywood. COVID happens. Everyone forgets everything with COVID. And then we get to F1. Now he's in his 60s. He's had a hit movie in his 20s, 30s, 40s, 50s, and 60s. This is a very important movie. Not nothing. This is a very important movie for him. Like a super important movie. This might be. I think for the catalog, he kind of needed it. Had to have it. Had to have it. Because Redford didn't have a movie in his 60s that was a massive movie like this.

46:27Bill Simmons:Also, there's something else that Brad needed, in my opinion. The only way to quiet any chatter online about you, and I don't like to, I'm way moved past the point where I litigate people's personal lives, unless we're talking about really shitty people. But the best way to, in this day and age, is to quiet the chatter about you. Anything that anyone might be saying is going, look, nobody cares. And that's the only way you can do it. You just be like, hey, they say this about you. maybe you weren't the greatest husband of all. I have no advice to Diddy. Okay. There's zero advice. It'll be zero conversation.

47:07There's no advice. Okay.

47:08Bill Simmons:It's like camera two, no advice, no advice. But like in that situation, look, nobody cares. Look, everything is between me and my family or whomever or whatever. I just went and did this gigantic, big, huge movie. All the sponsors, the movie got made like 40 or$50 million just in sponsorships. Right. But Apple, everybody's fucking with me everybody went to see it nobody cares next story next movie the difference so in a weird way it's kind of humiliating what happened with Cruise where Cruise when he hit a certain point in age just basically became Mission Impossible Top Gun Maverick guy yeah and those are like the two kind of directions he'd go Brad Pitt because Cliff Booth and Sonny are not that far off from each other I don't think I mean Sonny's a little more talkative but same kind of thing like worn down still super handsome can still connect with any woman in the room guys are comfortable around him like that kind of balance still can get it done yeah and you believe him in any role yeah so maybe he has a little bit more upside but the one thing with him is now he kind of talks like Buffalo Bill a little bit like he has a dip in his mouth yeah so I don't like I thought he was amazing in Moneyball I actually think he could have made a case he could have won best actor for that who won that year I think it might have been was it Day-Nate Lewis was it Lincoln Lincoln here yeah football's fantastic but now you're age 61 you got a rough life and you kind of does all his lines like this a little half smile on his face but it works yeah it does you're buying it I don't think he could be like some of the roles he played in the 90s 2000s I just don't think he could do it anymore well no I mean he's gone from being because if you look because he's 61 you look back at that at that at that decade he was in a lot of those movies young cowboy he was a young cowboy Young Cowboy in Seven.

48:55You see him, he's the young, he's even kind of, although. Well, Seven, he's just like skinny cop guy. I know, but he's the, he's being schooled by the older, more grizzled. I'm out of here that. Ocean's Eleven, him and Rusty and Danny kind of on the same level. But now he's the old cowboy in the movie. And it is it, the question is, can he still keep up? And you would thought that Brad Pitt would have never gotten to a point to where you put him in a movie and then the question would be like, he could never play the can you still do it guy. Because he's just too otherworldly handsome, otherworldly charismatic, but he was able to kind of

49:36Bill Simmons:make that case in this movie. He did a nice job, and I'm sure there's some bells and whistles with it, but he's done a really nice job of keeping his looks as like an A-plus leading man guy. Yeah. Which I think when people hit their late 50s, 60s on the big screen, you just start transitioning or you end up like Cruise where it just doesn't seem Cruise with Jennifer Connelly in the bedroom scene Top Gun Maverick one of the funniest scenes of the 2020s right you just end up veering in that road where you're like come on guys what are we doing I gotta give Tom credit for hysterically laughing nah with his no shirt on I gotta give Tom credit in that movie for I know it's the script for going with age appropriate co-star cause Tom was wildin for years right If you guys told me it would be Tom Cruise and it'd be the hottest 23-year-old, 24-year-old up-and-coming actor, we'd be like, come on, Tom, man.

50:29Bill Simmons:So him with Onoda Armis and Top Gun Maverick might not have worked. Would not have worked. Brad could pull it off, though, because Brad's one of those, we looked up after. My kids were like, how old is he? They thought he was younger than I was. Brad being 61? Well, does he look 61? fuck no no no fucking way I was like I think he's like 49 I had no idea no he doesn't in any way shape or form does he look 61 no my only nitpicks for this movie it has a poker scene and I just don't think that's where they needed my sports movie consultancy agency to come in and help them out they didn't have a feel they're playing Texas Hold 'em it's kind of a key scene in the movie and we don't really see the cards long enough in the middle.

51:19Bill Simmons:I don't know who's, there's no drama. Like it is not Casino Royale. Right. Let's put it that way. I didn't love that. I didn't, you know, Sonny, not to spoil the ending, but the big race at the end, it's a long trip for him to get there and he just kind of shows up right before and it's like, oh man. Oh, you mean the actual F1 race? Yeah. I thought you meant the Baja thing. in the Baja thing actually was not needed at all. No, I would have not had that. I would just cut that out. But him just going to Saudi Arabia or Abu Dhabi, wherever he was, on a moment's notice. Premium economy. And then he's going to be in a race.

52:01Bill Simmons:Right. Like, it doesn't take like a day and a half. Like, Martin Bacoli did that, and he got knocked down in like a round. But look, this is his thing. He travels around in a van. He lives in a van. he's rough and tumbled. He's like Ben said in the commentary of Armageddon. They don't understand his rough and tumble ways. Right. So he's the type of guy that could get off the plane, get right into the cockpit of an F1 car and go win the race, the biggest race of his life. Very important Brad Pitt catalog movie. Very important movie. Big Kaczynski now, I think, has hit that Tony Scott, like whatever his next movie is, I'm going to go.

52:41Bill Simmons:I'm watching it. Also, very important movie for Apple. Oh, yeah. It might have saved their movie business. Gigantic. I don't know. Saved. They got so much money. I know, but would they have just kept trotting out$300 million checks for movies if this didn't work? Man. And they promoted it great. They did. And I try to avoid Alva because I never like to know anything when I go to a movie. But it was hard to escape, especially even if you went to Apple TV. It was like, F1's coming. F1's coming. They're banging it in your head. F1's on there right now. You see F1, F1. And I'm, you know, I'm just going to go check it out.

53:14I think it was an important movie more so, not for Apple from a financial standpoint, because I don't think that really matters to them. But I do think from the standpoint of, hey, we can put together a film, and this is not a shot at Scorsese's movie. Yeah. Not at all. But we can put together a film that is legitimately successful. When I say legitimately successful, I mean - Worldwide successful. Worldwide successful. for our studio our talent our production we go out and we make one that just attracts more I mean not that they're gonna have any problem getting talent good well let's all get that apple money

53:51Bill Simmons:I'm with it start pitching them stuff tomorrow yeah and then we forgot to mention Brad Pitt now in two of the best sports movies of the 21st century oh money ball not ready to do I don't know if it's top five top seven I gotta probably do a ranking at some point this summer but they're both in the top 10. There's no question. Is he two for two though? Are those his only two sports movies? Is he two for two? Yeah, he doesn't have like a legend of Bagger Vance hiding his skeleton in his closet. I'm trying to think like I'm missing something. When are we doing that on the rewatchables? I'm not doing it.

54:27Bill Simmons:You're not in on that one? Y 'all could do it. Could it be for how the fuck did this movie happen? Will, what the fuck are you on right now? Everybody. Why? That team didn't know how to play golf. They had to like crash course teaching. It'd be a fun movie to make fun of. Alright, so last thing before we go. Now this is a spoiler. Okay.

54:50Bill Simmons:Did the right person... So if you haven't seen the movie yet, just fast forward to the next segment. Did the right person win the last race? It was a swerve. The way they set it up, I was actually really surprised how missionary position, old old school sports movie traditional they went. It's like, let's have the old white guy win this one. I thought for sure the new guy was, and he was going to sacrifice. So the new guy went and they both win and they really zagged. And then we were arguing about in the car after. And my kids were like, no, no, but DP one too, because, because the fireworks are behind him.

55:28Bill Simmons:He's got, he's going to win a lot of races coming. I was like, I don't know. Like Sonny's really going to win the race. I thought it was a little 1980s-ish I'm gonna try to get my Mahoney on here and be concise, but it's tough I'm glad he won Okay I'm glad he won because he had never won before To me, my thing is this was a big point of contention when we left the theater as well It's four of us, we went to see the movie Everybody had a different take But do you think it was a swerve? or did they just go Jerry Bruckheimer because he produced their old school Hollywood? No, no, Brad's got to win the race.

56:07Bill Simmons:This is how it goes. I'm looking at the movie going into that final race going, wow, who needs to win here? Who, do we need to have a story where Brad ensures that Damson's character wins? But if we do that, sure, he shepherds this young man, but then he never wins a race. this reminds me of my great disdain for a movie called Mr. 3000 I don't like that movie but here's I'm not talking about I like the movie just fine but the fact that he has 3000 hits he comes back to get the one hit and then he sacrificed bunts or whatever and sacrifices that last hit for the team stupid to me I think about 493 home runs all the time for Fred McGriff and I'm like Fred McGriff was 7 home runs away from 500, I would have played nine more years.

57:00Just be a corp. Just to get those seven home runs. So to me, when I look at guys like the Sonny character in this movie, let him win one race, man. Let him win one race.

57:14Bill Simmons:Do you think DP would have been that excited about it, though? That's his, but that's his character arc. His character arc is, he's come so far that he can be excited that Sonny won his race. Sonny's come so far that he doesn't sabotage himself. See, this was Jason Tatum and Jalen Brown when Jason didn't win the finals MVP, but he was happy for Jalen Brown because they both won. That would have been... This is what I was trying to say a year ago. That would have been if DP was driving and he just choked in the last lap. Come on. Jason Tatum's in a boot right now. What are you doing? He's doing great.

57:47Bill Simmons:I'm glad he's doing great. He's doing great. Do you see him walking? Yeah, he's swimming. He's walking around in a boot. He's going to be back. Bill. He's fine. he might be back I'm not we're not allowing ourselves to think about it we don't have a center all right um yeah that and then um flying now we can say because I turned the spoiler alert thing off um or on um flying to Abu Dhabi showing up right for the race and then winning a Formula One race. Because my son was like, should I start? Do you think I could be an F1 driver? It was like one of those conversations. I was like, we're all worried.

58:24Bill Simmons:We're like, is this going to be a new fascination for you? And we were all like, the amount of concentration and endurance you need to have to do that. It's like, you can't even, the amount of locked in you have to be to be locked in, for that long, it's like a special kind of human being. And that is not my son. It's like a... It's not anyone I know. Yeah, like, who knows? You ever see those guys, their old grainy pictures where they're like behind the wheel of a co-cart or a soapbox car when they're like seven or eight years old? Right. Like, little bit, look at me, hi! You know what I'm saying?

59:01But what I always think about is, I think about these drivers like Lewis and Michael Schumacher and all of those guys. I think about all of those guys and all of those guys. but also think about how many sunny hazes there must be out there oh yeah guys who wrecked it fucked their backs up or whatever and now they're somewhere you know popping pain pills for the rest of their life and they didn't make it that's why i was happy that he won the race yeah because

59:24Bill Simmons:one of the things i don't understand is f1 because it seemed like when he was trying to sabotage the race early on and like basically um causing little accidents safety car yeah and i was like can people do this like it feels like that would be a big thing if people did shit like this that's the part of the sport. That's where we don't know. Exactly. That's the part of it where I'm holding the movie's hand going, okay, if you guys say this can happen, then this can happen. Well, that's probably what it's like to watch a basketball movie with us. Right. I remember the first year of ER, we watched with my stepmother one of the episodes and she was like, oh, my stepmother was a doctor.

59:58Bill Simmons:And she was like, that's stupid. That would never happen. Oh my God. They would never have that. And we were just like, can you just stop? Can you just let us enjoy the sapendectomy that's being performed right now, please? Have you seen a show called The Good Doctor, by the way? Yes. So we watched Bachelor in Paradise this week. What the fuck is going on? It's always home. Oh, I see. Yeah, it was on. And it ended. And you know the streamers do this new thing where they just shove the next thing. There's no credits. It's just there's a new show started. So The Good Doctor started. Never seen it.

1:00:31Bill Simmons:Never seen one moment of it. And it was the pilot episode. And we were kind of like locked in. You're fucking with it. It's pretty good. Young kid. It was like kind of the good doctor's background. It's pretty good. Network TV. Maybe I'm aging into the demo finally. Maybe I should start watching. NCIS Simmons? Maybe this should be my new podcast where I age the over 55 shows. I just start. It's like, oh, good Matlock last night. Oh, I cannot believe it. Matlock, Kathy Bates. Yeah. Kathy Bates is Matlock now. NCIS Simmons with the lady from True Blood. She's in the show. It's called like Elizabeth or something like that I know these shows because my mom And my dad My dad was furious they canceled Blue Bloods Couldn't believe it Felt like it had five more years But then they spun off Donnie Wahlberg In the Boston Blue Which was launched in September Oh okay It's in Boston?

1:01:25Bill Simmons:We're back Go ahead make your jokes What? Make your jokes about the three episode arc He's a cop in Boston So we'll make sure that us in the community, we keep track of the police brutality events that are portrayed in the show. It's going to be a positive role model. Per show, then it's not real. Oh, wait.

1:01:51Bill Simmons:Donnie Wahlberg, very close to Jalen Brown, could see a Jalen Brown cameo in Boston Blue. Donnie Wahlberg's very tight with the Celtics. So Donnie Wahlberg, is Mark Wahlberg cool with Jalen Brown? I don't know. I can't speak for Mark Wahlberg. Yeah, Jalen. Mark Wahlberg sold his house to Paris Hilton. I want you to Google. All right, so Mark Wahlberg has done a lot. No, no, no. We're not doing this. All right. Should we bring in Charles to talk about Superman or no? We're going to Charles. All right. This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. Whether you're racing to build the biggest sandcastle, seeing who can throw the fastest pitch, or competing in a championship match, It's always better when there's a prize on the line, like a Michelob Ultra, smooth, refreshing, and so satisfying after all that hard work.

1:02:39Bill Simmons:Superior's worth playing for. Michelob Ultra, Superior Light Beer. Enter for a chance to win Superior Soccer, Basketball, and Golf Prizes at MichelobUltra.com slash Superior Access. Enjoy responsibly. Copyright 2026, Anheuser-Busch. Michelob Ultra Light Beer, St. Louis, Missouri. Somewhere out there is a Chevy truck. And the person who drives it, well, that's a Chevy person. You probably know one, your buddy, your sister, ones who always show up. They're the first to rise, the last to leave. They always have that little extra something. And maybe you've got it too. Chevrolet, together let's drive.

1:03:20Visit chevy.com slash trucks to explore the lineup.

1:03:26Bill Simmons:All right, Charles Somes is here. Yo, what up? Van's partner in the Midnight Boys. You guys are going to convince me to go see the Superman movie. I'll just make the case. This is how this started. Superman came out in 1978. It's on the theater. Okay. I really like Superman 2, a movie we'll do with the rewatchables at some point. Do you like Superman 2? I love Superman 2. Who doesn't? Superman 2 is great. There's like some real stuff in there about how far will you go to keep your powers. Oh. It's like some sports shit in there. that's in a lot of superhero movies though that you don't watch then they made Superman again then I think they made it a third time they made four original Christopher Reeve Supermans then they came back in 2006 with Bryan Singer and Superman and then there's Man of Steel Batman vs.

1:04:16Superman

1:04:16Bill Simmons:and the Cavill one people kind of liked right? not really? or they liked Cavill but they didn't like the movie? Cavill wasn't given a super awesome opportunity to play Superman the way he was supposed to be played? He never really got great scripts. No, actually, the thing is, once he got good at playing Superman, it was over. It was over. All the movies had flopped to such an extent. Then, do you remember The Rock coming in and being like, the hierarchy of the DCU was changing? So it was just like, he got caught up in the basses. Okay. Well, now we have another Superman. Yes. Hornsway. But you guys liked it.

1:04:52Yeah.

1:04:53Bill Simmons:I did. Charles like it I don't want to see it I told you I'm a hater and even I liked it alright let's put so you said something crazy over at the office where you was it crazy you said you said to me James Bond is cooler than Batman and I would say not only is that a crazy take that kind of points us towards why are you so why do you have such a ill will to superheroes not an ill will I just like I like my heroes to be at least somewhat realistic. James Bond is realistic. Okay. There you go. All right. Makes a lot of sense. Handsome English guy with some gadgets. John Wick. Realistic to you. If James Bond...

1:05:32Bill Simmons:John Wick, they killed his dog. Somebody kills your dog. They killed Batman's parents. What is more realistic than that struggle? And then Batman learned how to fly off buildings. Like, once you're flying, that's where my suspension goes sideways. But I've seen all these movies. I just, with Superman, I don't know what's left to explore. Oh, man. Because James Bond He's about to get me started. Go ahead. I want to hear it. Okay. So, you guys, this is not the Ring of Earth, so this is about to get a little bit schmaltzy and whatever. I can't wait. So, I think there's a reason why we keep coming back to the story of Superman.

1:06:06The reason why we keep coming back to the story, and we've always had stories like this, and we've talked about this on The Midnight Boys, is that the story of something that is, let's face it, Superman is a higher being than the rest of the people on Earth that surround him, right? It's a very powerful being, but chooses to do good. A being that is that powerful with godlike, almost limitless powers that chooses to do good is... Unlike our growing species. Who chose the other way, right? Because when we are human beings and we get power, a lot of power, even earthly power, we often don't choose to be good.

1:06:43So Superman, to me, is a character that reflects the durability of humanity. like oh my god he's such a big deal but he just wants to be one of us he wants to have a relationship he wants to have a job he wants to get a cat out of the tree he's saddled by his greatness saddled by his greatness which you love this is a storyline that you invest in every single sports season why is it with superheroes you can't you won't say all of this about yokich but you won't say it about kal-el from the planet krypton they got they got him a good bench this

1:07:15Bill Simmons:year. Does Superman have a bench in this movie? Yes, he does! He does! Mr. Terrific Hot Girl Metamorpho? Who's Hot Girl? There you go. Who's playing Hot Girl? Isabella Merced. You didn't watch Last of Us either? Wait, wait, wait. I got one for you, though. It's not her. Last of Us, the zombie one? Yeah. That lasted five episodes. Rachel Brosnan, though. Cat Grant. Cat Grant. That's a Bill. That's a Bill special. Bill, there's something for you in this film. I'm telling you. Okay, so in the whole Ringerverse, because it got pretty grim there for a few years with some of the movies. We talked about it.

1:07:57Our friendship. Is grim fair? I will say Van and I had a lot of like, it got so bad. I'm like, damn, our shit is like fucked up now. He's not wrong.

1:08:08Bill Simmons:Like the relationship is in trouble. The movies got so bad to where it, the stuff was so bad to where it was starting to affect our dynamic. Yes. Because he was getting really frustrated. I was trying to put on a brave face. And the whole group was like, man. I'm like, yo, y 'all, get together. I was like, war. We got to go to work. Okay? We got to watch Secret Invasion. Come on, everybody. This is what we do. And Charles was like, man, fuck these shows. I was, bro, it was rough. Rough. The stuff just got bad. And Superman. So what got bad? it was too familiar the cgi like what were the reasons it got bad they they flooded the zone i think the superhero genre was very very great when it's like oh we get two or three movies a year then when like late 2000s yeah but then when marvel is like actually you're gonna have a marvel hero in your household every single quarter every single week and it just diluted the brand to such an extent and when you see a superman movie you're like oh this is a cinematic character I don't necessarily want to see him 52 weeks of the year I want to on July on a weekend in July I want to believe a man can fly also the movie making yeah like the the filmmaking so with Marvel there was Kevin Feige and he was connecting all the dots on all of this stuff and they just overwhelmed their capability and the quality started to suck so it'd be like if a couple baseball movies worked and then they just started making five, six baseball movies a year you'd be like alright Think about this.

1:09:41They make a baseball movie, right? A Babe Ruth movie. They make a Babe Ruth movie. It's great. They make...

1:09:49Bill Simmons:So now we're getting Ty Cobb, Ted Williams, Lou Gehrig. But no, not just that. We're getting a 52-week series about Mark Lemke and Jeff Blouser. And no discipline. It's like, okay, you guys love this series we just did about Ken Griffey Jr. Tommy Glavin, 20 episodes. We were out of series about their fucking mothers in the 1950s and what the fuck they was up to and I'm like hey yo show me the fucking superheroes bro right too much so we got back to the basics back to the basics because it feels like the heyday was late 2000s when we had Dark Knight which is one of the best movies that was the heyday that's not the heyday that's the heyday of Batman I'm saying when we had Dark Knight and Iron Man right around each other oh and it felt like it reinvented the possibilities of how great these movies could be but you hopped off before we got Guardians of the Galaxy Black Panther Avengers because all of a sudden there was too many of them and like even Iron Man 2 I thought was super disappointing and that was when my guard went up.

1:10:42Bill Simmons:Not the best movie. But I would say the heyday would be 16 to 19. Yeah. Well, that's the second heyday, but I missed that one. Okay. Because I enjoyed that first heyday. And neither of your kids were into the MCU. You know, I tried to get it going with my son and it just never completely took. We started it correctly and by like the fifth one we were out. But don't you also feel like Superman is in that like is in that milieu of characters to me where it's like James Bond, Batman, Superman like you have these like characters where we're kind of like damn I kind of want to see if they can work Rocky with Creed you have those type of characters where it's like it kind of tells you where America returns after if it's the same right you liked F1 I liked F1 F1 wasn't reinventing the wheel it's just Top Gun Maverick again but there is something about like settle down Charles Jesus this is Top Gun Maverick again this is the guy this is Chuck Wagon F1 is Top Gun Maverick but it was I mean the IMAX stuff was amazing though I love this movie it's one of my favorite movies of the year but they didn't reinvent the wheel on this I know but my fear with all this stuff is we talked about this a little before just there's no way to reinvent the wheel because the wheel has already been looked at every single fucking way at this point so that's when a movie like trying to think of like a wholly original movie that like Sinners when that came out we were like, whoa, this is a movie unlike anything I've seen before.

1:12:12Bill Simmons:Even though it had some vampire roots and all the different things, it just felt like original creative IP. But how does, but how does even Ryan Coogler get to Sinners where it's like, it's like Christopher Nolan had the ability, of course he did the Batman films, but he had the ability to make a bunch of original movies and then Batman got him into the category where it's like, oh, we're going to see Inception, we're going to see this. Ryan Coogler basically had to prove to these studios, all right, I did Creed and I did Fruitvale Station, but Black Panther is showing y 'all that I can actually do a four-quadrant blockbuster movie.

1:12:48Do you ever ask yourself, you ever wonder what attracts somebody like Christopher Nolan to Batman? Or like what attracts, why do some of these guys, like when you got to Batman Begins and you look at who's in the movie, it's Liam Neeson and Morgan Freeman and all of these people. And I know everybody wants to pay for their winter homes and Aspen and all of that stuff like that. I get it. I get that you're an actor, you got to make money. I get that. But also there is something with creatives on that level that intrigues them about making movies or content with a character that is so well known and so well understood because they get to think about what can I do with this character that's actually there that hasn't been done.

1:13:36Bill Simmons:So there's four reasons. Okay. That's the one is the one you just said. Challenge. Yeah. Everybody has stared at this IP for a hundred years. It's a challenge for me. I can solve this. Two is money. Three is ring culture. Oh, you want to win? Like in sports. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This is like, if you can pull it off on this, it's like when I remember talking to Affleck about this because I wrote about this when he did, what did he do? When he did the Superman movie. Ben or Casey? Because it's two. Okay. He was Batman. In Batman vs. Superman. Justice League, all of it. But remember, he was on the heater because he had the town, Argo.

1:14:15Bill Simmons:He was the fucking man. He had won it back. And then it's like, why are you doing this? And it's the second go around because he was Daredevil. So that Daredevil movie was in. But you know why he did it? Because he was like, my kid. Fuck it. It was like Tom Brady going for the Tampa Bay Super Bowl. If I can do this, I can do anything. That's the third thing. And then the fourth thing is money. Bill, let me tell you something. There's something that people don't talk about as much, but they should. He was sensational. Really? Affleck was a great Batman. He was a great Batman. He still has a suit.

1:14:48Bill Simmons:Oh, and the fourth thing is impressing your kids. Everyone always forgets that part. Most of the people that are making movies like this at some point have kids, or at least one kid under the age of eight, who thinks like, holy shit, my dad's going to be Batman? And it's just like impressive. Look at Tom Holland. Tom Holland as Spider-Man does Tom Holland get into a Christopher Nolan movie because if we look at his track record after Spider-Man could you name me a Tom Holland movie does he need like the stamp of approval almost I think with like Corn Sweat with Holland with Pattinson Pattinson like becomes Batman he didn't need this he's killing it in terms of just like oh he is the indie darling everyone loves him but there's a different thing when Robert Pattinson gets to go to his acting buddies be like, but y 'all not Batman.

1:15:36Bill Simmons:Well, that's the Downey is the best example of that, right? Or like Keith Ledger who just broke back and he's great in that, but then Dark Knight becomes the movie that's probably going to outlive him 50 years. He had a take though. He had a take on the character. The character that we're so familiar with. He had a take and that take went on to define the character. There's one thing about being the Joker. There's another thing about redefining the Joker. He redefined that character. Even like, I'll give you an example. So Nolan, right? Yeah. The Odyssey. That story is thousands of years old, right?

1:16:11Like, well, hundreds. Hundreds? When did the Odyssey? Whatever. It's an ancient by contemporary standards story. But we're going to keep telling it because the themes in the story are as relevant today as they've been in the past. And everybody's going to want to retell. That's the story of Moses. The story. All of that stuff. It's all the same shit. The Matrix is a retelling of the Jesus story. Now, I will say this. We should talk about specifically what is awesome about this Superman movie that makes it worth the trip. Well, the villain seems good. Lex. Lex and Nicholas Hole as Lex is phenomenal.

1:16:50Also, I feel like this is a movie where it's going to be a lot for you. It's very cartoony. It's very comic book-y. But I do think that this movie does a very good job of you don't have to see anything. It has that Iron Man feel of just like, I can see. Starting from scratch, basically. And it's not starting from scratch where it's like, you already know the origin story where it's like, planet blew up. He goes to... None of that happens. They're just like, we don't need that. It starts in the middle of the action where you're like, okay, I get it. I do like that. James Gunn. He's had some success in the past.

1:17:20Yeah. Little crawl. Tell you where you're at. And it reorients the character. It's your... We said this on the podcast on the Midnight Boys. most Superman movies they're looking through his eyes and if you look through his eyes everything is weaker because he's way up here if you look through his eyes everything is weaker so you start to wonder like what the fuck is going on this is like Jokic yeah get the fuck out of here okay he is a bad motherfucker though he is you know that was one of my you know I look back at the dickhead momentum that I've had in the past I'm doing it again with Caitlin Clark to a degree but I don't care I won't stop Can you talk him off to Caitlin Clark?

1:18:00I don't want to talk him off. I like it. It's one of the best zags of the 2020s. It's great. But Yoko's is a great zag. I asked my, so just real quick, I'll come back to Superman. I meant to get you on the phone with this guy. So one of my homeboys, my best friend from Baton Rouge, Ryan Davenport. I remember me and you got into it about the Yoko's and the Shaq thing. We're going back and forth about it. So I hit Ryan up, and I know that Ryan is going to agree with me. You know, my man Ryan was in the streets for a long time. So it's very, he talks the way he talks. And I was like, bruh, let me ask you a question.

1:18:37Who do you think better, Jokic or Shaq? And he goes, man, Jokic. Like, he said he was angry. He didn't want to have to say it. He was like, man, Jokic, bruh. And I was like, what? I was like, bruh, you can't do shit with that bitch. He was like, that bitch get the ball. If you double that bitch, pass that bitch. he's like he's like if you one on one he cooking everybody he's yokeish man he made Anthony Davis look crazy he's yokeish bro I'm sorry he better and I was like after that I had to he was mad he felt the feeling it's hard to admit it I still don't agree with him but I get it well now you got Caitlin yeah I got a new foil the next one has to be black or I'm not getting an agenda I have to choose you know Lamar Jackson's sitting there one more playoff watch I can't I'm just saying I can't I still gotta get it's a good zag I gotta be able to get into the end of the race you expect me to go you want to keep people on the toes Whitlock no I can't do that bro they're not gonna let me into the Bobby Barber you're gonna get in trouble bro Superman this movie does something different it orients the story it puts Superman in the middle of the story okay and the story happens around Superman simple fix now Superman Superman is not somebody that you have to question at every single plot turn

1:19:54Bill Simmons:So you weren't just pleasantly surprised. You were deliriously surprised. I didn't. You couldn't believe it was good. I got emotional on the podcast. Wow. Yeah, there were tears. I'm tempered. I hate everything. And even I was like, I was like, I can't hate it. I was like, all right, they got it. You know what I'm saying? Like, I got to get it. He didn't think it was a perfect movie. I didn't think it was. It's an eight, like, out of 10. It's like, to me, it's like in that seven, eight range where I'm like. All right, I'm going to see. You guys won me over. Hell fucking yes. Well, so give me three movies from the last 15 years.

1:20:26Bill Simmons:Three ringer-burst movies that I have to see. I know one you're going to love straight off the bat. Guardians of the Galaxy? You might like that. I could see you liking that, but that's not the one I was talking about. Wonder Woman? Bet you would, right? Captain America Winter Soldier. Yeah. Okay. Wait, you've never seen Winter Soldier? I've never seen any of those Captain America movies. Have you seen Black Panther? Black Panther doesn't count. That movie was awesome. Wait, Black Panther definitely fucking counts. Oh, that's a Michael B. Jordan. I've season tickets for my guy He's a big Michael B.

1:20:55Bill Simmons:Jordan fan Wait, you're actually on Michael B. Jordan Island? I think I was his first podcast I Fruitvale Station, I think I was the first podcast he ever did I've had to defend him a lot People have been like, hey, before Sinners Everybody's now on his fucking dick I don't know about the twins I don't know if he can act He's a movie star There was a couple poor choices There's a couple hiccups, much like an athlete A couple bad Not on film, no Well that legal movie he did was bad Whatever the one where he was the lawyer That movie was bad The movie when he's with Zac Efron And the other guy Early on but that movie's bad He did a couple bad ones But look He's a movie star Mike movie star Sinners We were waiting for the Can you be a movie star in a movie movie That's like Brad Pitt You've seen Black Panther Michael B.

1:21:54Jordan, but you saw F1, right? How are you feeling about Damson as a movie star? Did you recast him as T 'Challa? Is that on the table? That's the rumor. So the rumor is he's Black Panther now. That's the rumor. Do you think he can kind of like take that? Did you see in F1? Because like the question is, can he go from Snowfall TV show to movie stardom in F1 to like leading an entire franchise? I'm with it. I think he could do it.

1:22:21Bill Simmons:I thought he carried himself Like a leading man in F1 Even though I didn't really have a history with him You didn't watch Snowfall? No, just like a movie like that Where he's like, I had to believe in him as my hero I wanted more, I think in the second movie I'm just like, I think Brad Pitt could take a kind of like backseat I thought he had it, I think he's a star So I would say, easy work You can't not like Avengers Infinity War Endgame might not work on you He can't watch Infinity, he's not gonna know what's going on bro it's fucking Spider-Man he knows who Spider-Man is Spider-Man, Iron Man they're none of the B-list characters in the movie I think he would know you know who Thor is right yeah I would say Winter Soldier definitely I would say Infinity War just cause I don't think he can miss and Charles was the last one honestly I think you would like Guardians you like Team Dynamics you might like that I do like Team Dynamics I mean and also the last thing about Superman you love dogs Crypto oh shit Crypto is amazing in this movie.

1:23:21This is the thing. You're going to love this movie.

1:23:23Bill Simmons:Okay. Do you have a good dog or a misbehaved dog? I've had both. You've had both? You're going to fight? Yeah. He met Murph. Right now. I fuck with Murph. Yeah. Wait, you don't fuck with Murph? Murph doesn't like everybody. Yeah. Murph is crypto. You have to come in a few times. Ooh, Murph is crypto. Hey, you're going to love this movie. Yeah. Wait, I just blanked on what I was going to... Oh, the superhero movie that... Does Charles know my superhero that didn't get a movie yet that I can't believe didn't get a movie? I don't think he's ever heard it. You might not have heard it. I think I did.

1:23:55Bill Simmons:Wait, wait. Who's this hero? Plastic Man. Oh, yeah. We did talk about it. We haven't talked about it in a pod, but we talked about it at church. So when I was a kid, and they're in Saturday morning cartoons, they had a Plastic Man cartoon. It was fucking great. And he could do all this like stretch himself out shit and had a hot girlfriend because he was Plastic Man. All right, so let's follow up. But I always thought that as the technology got better, I always thought Plastic Man would be in the universe somewhere. Stretching is very hard to do. They're trying to do it in the new Fantastic Four movie that's coming out in a couple weeks.

1:24:26He could reach up and grab airbags. You know, canonically, Superman is afraid of Plastic Man.

1:24:32Bill Simmons:Plus, like, plastics, you get, like, what's going on in the world now where we all have little pieces of plastic from drinking by water. Well, Plastic Man's not really made of plastic. Well, is Plastic Man bad for the environment? Like, there's all these ways it could go. They might do it, but, like, he's ridiculously powerful. So powerful because he used to be a criminal. so powerful that Superman's a little wary of him. Superman's like, this guy might be the most powerful guy in the Justice League. We got to watch out for Plastic Man. Who's playing Plastic Man? Dumb, powerful. I don't know. We have the technology now, though.

1:24:59No, comedically, I think you need like a comic actor. So what's the best? Bill Hader?

1:25:04Bill Simmons:Bill Hader would be fucking amazing. Best Ringerverse movie of the first 25 years of the 21st century. We should have done this. We should have done this. You can do it anyway. No, we're doing it. We got some shit. It's Dark Knight. What's number one? Dark Knight's number one. hasn't been topped. That's why I think, like, that's the movie to me everybody's like, but I know what Van's going to say. He's going to say, you're going to say Endgame. You know, it is Dark Knight, without a doubt. It's not even close, but like, it almost doesn't count. How? Because it's not really a superhero movie. It's a psychological thriller with Batman.

1:25:39It's basically the town. Yeah. Yeah, it is. No, the answer is the Dark Knight. It's closer to the heat

1:25:46Bill Simmons:in the town. Yeah. I could make a really compelling argument that the reason why the movie resonates with people like it is is because it's closer to those movies than it is to the stuff that we're talking about. But the movie has Batman and the fucking Joker in it. So if it's not the Dark Knight, what would it be? It'd be either Iron Man or Endgame. Iron Man is actually probably the... Before we go, can you make the case for me to watch season four of The Bear? Because I still haven't dove in yet. Have you watched season three of The Bear? I watched all three. I love The Bear. I didn't like season three as much.

1:26:14Bill Simmons:This was a bounce back season to me. Don't listen to Andy. Andy on the watch he's my boy you know what I'm saying but like there's a lot of hate going on I think then we ended up I would say there was probably only one episode this season that I was like and not even bad just kind of just like I haven't listened to the pod yet because I haven't watched the episodes yet and it was really fun the bear was fun again because the show got to a point to where season 3 was too grim it was too grim I think he got thrown off by that Thanksgiving episode and how intense that was. And all the cameos. Like weirdly affected season three.

1:26:52I agree. There is a episode in season four that is a spiritual successor to that Thanksgiving. Was it Thanksgiving or Christmas? Christmas, whatever. To that episode. The fishes, yeah. But it's the other way. So where that episode was super intense and almost suffocating, this episode has all of the same people the same family dynamics however it's a release and they executed it really well are you so is your like apprehension to the bear just that it got you it's not apprehension just not ready yet because it's intense this one felt less it's not it's not the same anymore they took the notes where it was just like hey bro we gotta bring some of the comedy back I actually laughed this season which like third season I was like third season was done

1:27:41Bill Simmons:before we go can I pitch you a superhero movie I'm ready late 90s baseball steroids era superhero oh yeah that's it that's all I got wait why does he do the steroids everyone's on steroids but we actually have a real superhero in baseball nobody realizes it oh that's good oh they played around with that they played around with that a little bit um but that's good like he's like finally have some cover because all these guys are these steroid monsters hitting 60 homers I can finally I thought you were saying steroids give him the powers but no right I can finally play baseball and people won't be suspicious if I'm a superhero because all these other guys are cheating.

1:28:18Bill Simmons:He's taking piss that's it. This is actually we're giving away recipes but this is a limited and you have a reporter 8 episode Apple 8 episode Apple you have a reporter and that reporter is doing some sort of profile on him she's a hot lady starts realizing there's something more going on she thinks it's a creatine thing but it's not at the same time you know what the owner of the team is actually a nefarious supervillain. This guy. Definitely bald. Bald white guy. This guy. Looks like Bezos. He's doing the whole deal, but it starts to become, are you going to continue to chase what's happening on the field, or are you going to use your superhero powers for good?

1:29:01Whole thing. But it's rated R, though. It's sex. It's baseball. It's the whole nine.

1:29:08Bill Simmons:It's a dirty baseball All superhero steroids movie. What team would you want him to play? Yankees. Thank you. Let's go. All right. Thanks, guys. Good to see you. All right. That's it for the podcast. Thanks to Van and Charles. Thanks to Gahau and Eduardo as well. I'm going to be back on Sunday, a week from now. So you'll make it. Nothing's happening. It'll be fine. This is the most boring, boring week of the year. If anything crazy major happens, I'll come back. Otherwise, I'm going to be doing football prep, getting ready. trying to top my 27 and five on the over-unders from last year, which I'll never top.

1:29:43Bill Simmons:I'm probably going to suck. But enjoy the rest of the weekend, and I'll see you in a week.

1:30:03Bill Simmons:Must be 21-plus in President Select States for Kansas, in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino, or 18-plus in President D.C. Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com. Call 1-88-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org slash chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelpline ma.org or call 800-327-5050 for 24-7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-887-8-HOPE-NY or text HOPE-NY in New York. Close your eyes, exhale, feel your body relax, and let go of whatever you're carrying today. Well, I'm letting go of the worry that I wouldn't get my new contacts in time for this class.

1:30:49I got them delivered free from 1-800-CONTACTS. Oh my gosh, they're so fast. And breathe. Oh, sorry. I almost couldn't breathe when I saw the discount they gave me on my first order. Oh, sorry. Namaste. Visit 1-800-CONTACTS.com today to save on your first order. 1-800-CONTACTS.

1:31:36business-platinum.