England Survives, the Jaylen Trade Fallout, and an All-NBA Mailbag With Zach Lowe

22:55Bill Simmons:And the playoffs, he was 16 a game, 49 % from three. I went back and looked at my notes from after game six and then after game seven. And I repeatedly wrote down, Paul George was the best forward in the series. and he has actually revived his trade value to the point that maybe they can get rid of him. I did not think they would get rid of him for Jalen Brown. But from where we were with him in March to now, is it possible that they really like Paul George just as a player for their team? Because I think it is. And by the way, I don't agree with this opinion. I'm not saying they're right. I was going to say, that was one of the sadder one minute segments in the history of the Bill Simmons podcast and its predecessor.

23:41That was, it made me sad. I just, I felt, I didn't know how to react to it.

23:46Bill Simmons:Well, when you're looking for answers, Zach, you look for answers. You turn over every stone. I could tell your heart wasn't in it. I mean, you were giving it an honest try. I respect it, but your heart wasn't in it. It was not. I tried. I really tried. I don't think that the Celtics believe that Paul George is wildly underrated, a diamond in the rough, ready to average 22 points a game again next season. I think they know exactly who Paul George is. They think he's going to be a nice third, fourth option, three-point shooter, good defender, all of that. They think he fits into how Missoula wants to play.

24:21They'll win a lot of regular season games. I said even in my pessimistic trade reaction, this team is a regular season wins machine. I think they're going to win 50 games and be in contention. I mean, you can't just put almost anyone other than the very, very best teams in the East, like no brainer lock top six. They're counting a lot on Mitchell Robinson to change their offensive rebounding and shot profile at the rim because they lost some rim pressure in the Jalen Brown, Paul George exchange. And rim pressure was all Brad Stevens talked about in that postmortem. And they lost some in that.

24:51Bill Simmons:And now they have a guy who doesn't shoot free throws. And Mitchell Robinson's injured all the time, too. And so I but I don't to answer your question. I don't think the Celtics are like we've been secretly coveting Paul George. They know exactly what he is. I think this is just more about the time, whether it whether it is a overreaction to the Philly series going bad, whether it's understanding that putting Jalen Brown back into a 1B role was going to cause all sorts of issues, whether it's we've always thought he was a little overrated. and compared to his salary, compared to his salary, to be clear.

25:26And this is the time to act with three years left on the deal. It might be all those, but I don't think it's like we love Paul George like we did 10 years ago when we tried to trade for him.

25:38Bill Simmons:I agree. I do wonder though, if their thinking was, you put Tatum in all the Brown minutes from last year with the same kind of offensive responsibility. And then you shift Paul George into this supplemental role that they just obviously decided Jalen Brown was never going to want to play, that they talked themselves into, will actually still be really good. Because the weirdest thing to me is this is the opposite of a new owner syndrome trade. Right? Usually the new owner is trading Paul George and five first-round picks for Jalen Brown. And instead we have the owner going the other way. Well, and not only that, the same ownership group shed all the salary with Drew Holiday and Porzingis and on and on.

26:22Bill Chisholm and his group have done nothing but willingly kind of eat a little, you know what, and big time on this trade.

26:29Bill Simmons:Well, and I saw, when I did my thing with Kirk and CR a day after the trade, and I felt, I had landed on, this is part one of a part two, and they're going to use this Paul George and the picks they got, more picks, and make a play for the Trey Murphy, Jordan Poole type contract, where they just, they get the asset and in a year from now, they'll have way more flexibility. That did not happen either. Well, not yet. Starting to come to grips with Paul George maybe being in a Celtic uniform, which is going to be weird. And I said this when I did the pod the other day that there's real anger about this trade in Boston.

27:08Bill Simmons:And it's something, this has been a feel-good, lovable Celtics run really since the year after they traded PG and KG, PP and KG to Brooklyn. It's always been an overachieving, love it. Really, the only unhappy team was that 2019 second Kyrie season team. But there hasn't been anger toward the front office or the ownership really ever. Really going back to, I think the last time was maybe when they traded Antoine Walker. i people people were mad that they traded anton walker i did have a high level front office person at another team we were just chatting today about stuff going on in the league and he said you know it speaks to how solid the celtics front office reputation is and how brad steven's reputation is that they're not getting even more shit and more anger for this trade because there's only three or four front offices who could do this trade and not get just immediate cataclysmic blowback that they have enough benefit of the doubt, even from their angry fans, that it's not like a coup.

28:13And this is one of them. But yeah, it's, it's, I think, I think the other thing about doing it this early is it's going to be a long time before the Celtics start winning basketball games again. And if this were like in September and you could just say, Hey, look, preseason's coming, training camps come and just watch. We're going to be, you know, 15 and eight right out of the gate. We'll be solid 15 and five, whatever. And now we have the absolute full offseason for people to be angry about this. Like when Minnesota traded Towns, that was really close to the start of the season.

28:43Bill Simmons:And we were just right into it with preseason games and everything else. I'll never understand it. And I know you and I both talked separately on our podcast about this whole advanced metrics argument that has now sprung. And this is now going to be the thing that we talk about all season, I guess. and people have just dug into their sides. And it honestly mirrors real life. This has become one of those things that's like politics where it's like, I stand here. This is my opinion. I'm just going to be here. And somebody else says, I'm over here. This is what I think. Well, some of the analytics stuff is, I mean, I don't want to do the whole thing on here, but some of the anonymous source who thinks with whatever team that thinks he's not one of the 50 best players in the league or the anonymous source who thinks he's not a top seven player on a whatever typical NBA team.

29:39It's just crazy. And I have always thought that he's probably a hair overrated, but it doesn't really matter. Like the most important reason this trade happened, personally, it could be the 1A, 1B thing with Tatum, But to me, it still comes down to$57 million,$62 million,$66 million. And where the analytics come in is whatever, like the on-off stuff, throw it out. Like just whatever, like all the analytics together, if he's making$66 million and he's, let's give a realistic pessimistic ranking, a realistic skeptical ranking of Jalen Brown. If he's making$66 million and he's the 18th best player in the NBA, that's a problem.

30:27That's like hard to build around when you have another guy making even more money than that. I'm just throwing that ranking out there. Like if I were an analytics guy who's done all the eye test stuff and seen all the stuff that Jalen Brown did to win finals MVP, carry the Celtics last year, all of that. So I have that infused with my analytics stuff that's a little more skeptical and it washes out to like 18th best player in the NBA at that salary. I think that's really just what it comes down to more than anything else.

30:54Bill Simmons:And I wonder if that's where we're going with the league. Like one of the things that, so obviously every single person in my life has asked me about this. One of the things that I thought was interesting that didn't get enough attention was that the salary cap kind of went backwards. Under its projection by a little tiny bit. Yeah, but there's been years where we're like, whoa, we're way over this year. And I wonder if there's a fear with the local TV revenue just in general that they were looking at two years from now like, wow, we might get really screwed with two of these guys. So basically the big picture outside of Boston I'm wondering is, are more teams going to be thinking this way?

31:34Bill Simmons:Is this driving some of the Pistons Durant stuff? Which, by the way, the Durant thing, that was another casualty of the CBA thing where they can offer him$100 million more than anybody else, but why would they? Why am I just going to give you$100 million more than your net worth if you just tested it elsewhere? So I don't – it feels like – and I have a couple of questions about this that I don't want to step on, but it feels like we're headed toward a really strange salary cap era for the league that the only time I can, in recent history, at least since I've known you, maybe we didn't even know each other then, but it was like the end of the 2000s, specifically with the Harden trade, which we've talked about over and over again, where there was a moment where teams started choosing salary decisions over basketball decisions.

32:20Bill Simmons:And I think that's the number one reason this trade happened. Number two is that All the stuff that happened from the moment the season ended all the way to last week, I think, put a bad taste in their mouth and they decided to move on. Yeah, there was a time during that era where it sounds quaint to say it now, and I'm pretty sure I'm right about this, that the cap stayed flat basically for like three or four years in a row. And it was flat at like$58 million. Like that was the salary cap. And so that is it. And I have had a couple of agents sort of just venting to me in the last week that call the second apron this is the agents speaking but call the second apron whatever it is teams are treating it like more or less a hard cap and they're going to continue to treat it even like what james dolan did and like letting mitchell robinson go and replacing him with an inferior version and andre drummond a championship team willingly doing that yeah but he should have done that though i i'm not defending dolan but we've seen teams do that we saw the celtics do that with James Posey in 2008, where if you're not one of the best five guys and you're going to bring all these penalties and all these other things with me, I don't think it's defensible.

33:28Bill Simmons:You have to figure out how to patch those stats together. I mean, the Mitchell Robinson minutes are better than the Andre Drummond minutes are going to be. And you're going to feel, Andre Drummond is almost as good as an offensive rebounder, but not quite. Defensively, it's a huge downgrade. the corner three thing is like actually kind of interesting and i'm curious to see um if mike brown leans into that like nick nurse did that's like a little interesting wrinkle but yeah i mean look i i'm just saying what i'm hearing from agents about the hard cap and the second apron and the nuggets are going to be one of the one of the test cases i do have to give you your praise because the day that jalen brown got traded um even before and after i did my podcast i had several executives around the league reach out to me is bill is bill okay like where is bill and there were a couple i trusted enough to tell them where you were but i i said i can't i can't text it it's too good you have you want to know you have to call me and their reactions were absolutely riotous like they just like i've never heard some of these men grizzled veteran men laugh with this level of glee.

34:40Bill Simmons:I'll never have another experience like that in my life. Coming out of anesthesia and having my wife break the trade to me and just not being able to process it. I would have had a hundred guesses for it. Anyway. All right. We got great mailbag questions. Let's go. And we can cover some of this Jalen stuff in there. Joe Madden says, Dear BS, after watching the Celtics cut off a limb with a pocket knife with the Jalen Brown trade, you should add 127 hours to From Hell Month on the rewatchables I mean that is probably the movie you would say for this Jaylen thing we went from we went from the guy who was is he going to be 5th or 6th in MVP to whoa it leaked out that we offered him for Giannis to fire sale in the span of two weeks Clancy from Connecticut wants to know would you rather Boston traded Jalen Brown a year ago last summer and tanked for a chance at DeBansa, Peterson, Boozer, Wilson in the draft.

35:39That's the great what if right there. One of many, but that's a great one.

35:43Bill Simmons:So I went to I saw their first win of the season I think. They were 0-3 and then they beat Washington to go 1-3 I want to say. And Washington was terrible. And Boston and I was watching that Celtic lineup and I think I did a pod the next time and I was like I think they should throw the season away. I don't see it. Like they don't have enough turned out they go on this heater they win 56 games but um when you think like round one loss versus what they get for jaylen and how the season played out i just don't know what they would have what a year ago what would we had he would have four years left on his deal heading into you know the second season i just don't know what they would have gotten for him at that point well you're not getting a desmond bain trade i don't think but i was gonna say you you also you know it's nice to say debansa for a shot at debansa you could end up with mikhail brown jr which is fine but like the chances are not are much better that you're not getting debansa now this obviously this top four is outrageous so maybe the odds would have been in your favor but yeah that's that's a good what if would you have traded for jaylen this year if you were brooklyn like last week uh i think that was kicked around for sure oh it was really kicked around i heard the Nets front office was enthused.

37:01Bill Simmons:And then once it got to the higher levels, they were not as enthused. I haven't thought that much about it. I don't think I would. I don't think I would have. But I would have thought hard about it. And I don't like the path that I'm on really right now. I'm not that excited about it. But I don't think I would have. So if the Celtics came... Now, I don't know what the equivalent cost is for Brooklyn versus like, like what is their version of this trade? Because I don't think the Celtics would view someone like, I think it would have been like, is Porter equivalent to Paul George basketball wise?

37:39He's probably better than Paul George.

37:41Bill Simmons:I would say Porter's better. He's an expiring and he's cheaper. So Porter plus, I mean, I don't like the deal with, at that point gets pretty palatable for Brooklyn, honestly. Well, that's my question. If I'm running the nets and I see this trade and then I go and talk to my basketball people and I say, you guys told me you're interested in this Jalen Brown thing. I didn't, this was the price. So it just would have cost us Porter Jr. And we could have given them, I don't know, one of the Knicks first and maybe our own 2029 first and we get Jalen Brown. We could have had him with Julius Randle.

38:16This is the exact trade I pitched two weeks ago on the Zach Lowe show. Michael Porter Jr. and a bunch of draft picks, like two picks, a swap, whatever.

38:25Bill Simmons:You probably thought more than two first rounders. You probably thought like three first swaps. Yeah. And that was one of the things that the social team clipped and put on my Instagram and Celtics fans shit all over it. And I was just saying like, look, I said over and over again, this deal is going to net you. Once the honest thing fell through, this deal is going to net you a deal that makes you a little bit worse this coming season. It is going to make the fans mad. I tried to prepare them for it. That was one of the deals I suggested. Everyone said it was a bad deal. it's not that bad of a deal I I wish they had traded him last summer now that I know how it played out and I got Paul George and two half decent picks do you think this is my mailbag question to you do you think they are overreacting to the last three games of the Philly series one of which Jason Tatum didn't play like he's too much weight being put on that versus the 56 wins that came before it i like the i kind of like the way jaylen played in the last game game seven i did like i'm sure there's some advanced metric shit that could pick it apart but remember he guarded and beat at one point like i felt like to me that's that was the good and bad of jaylen all in one game like he took a couple dumb shots had to have a couple charges whatever that guy would was willing to do anything it took to try to win the game i'm not even just talking about him i'm talking about kind of giving up on this whole model of the team being a championship contender going into next season?

39:56Bill Simmons:Well, that's another thing. Tatum, they put those minutes on Tatum and he lasted six games and then skipped the seventh one because he wasn't happy with something that was going on with his legs. And Jalen was the fall guy? I'm not saying Tatum should have been, but I thought Missoula should have taken a lot more criticism. and I was talking about my pod as it was happening. Like, why are we putting this many minutes on Tatum? Why are you trying to make him a 38-minute-a-game guy? I don't get it. Why not ease him back into it? Why not play him 28 minutes? This is from Jordan in LA. With Jalen's value extremely low, I'd love to hear your blame pie for the reasons why.

40:38Bill Simmons:Percentages of ability in the basketball court, massive contract, off-court stuff. How would you split up the blame pie? I'm a huge fan of the pod. Go seize, even though I'm depressed. I would say off-court stuff and massive contract, probably 90 % of that. What is off-court stuff with Jalen Brown? Because there's no like, people say that and it's used pretty liberally. Is it just like that he shares his opinions on Twitch? Because there's no like bad off-court, normally we say off-court stuff and it's like bad off-court stuff. There's nothing like that. Thank you for clarifying that. you're off court stuff's the wrong phrase um let's go with um self self-criticism self-awareness self-awareness um opinion of oneself what we're going to say is like that's where it becomes hard to separate that from the basketball stuff because that's going to bleed into is there going to be a tug of war for control of the team?

41:48Is that going to impact chemistry?

41:49Bill Simmons:And they obviously thought yes. I mean, I think that's fair to say. I think they felt like this situation was what it was going to be. I think the contract, I would go 45 contract, 40 % self-awareness, what's my role, all that stuff. And then ability in the basketball court, it is an advanced metrics friendly team. And I'm sure there's some things they didn't love. The on-off stuff, I'll never know what to make sense of it because you can't tell me the last year's team was better when he wasn't on the court. He had a huge, huge, huge load and showed up all the time and did so many things. You know, I remember talking about this during COVID or right after when Kyrie was only playing home games and his stats, remember his stats were really good?

42:34Bill Simmons:It's like, yeah, he's playing once a week. Like if you're going to play, if you're going to miss 10 games in a season, You're going to play 36, 37 minutes and take the pounding that Jalen did and go to the basket like he did and nine free throws a game and guard the other team's best player. You're going to have games where you're not 100 % and you play anyway. And I still feel like there's no way for advanced metrics to value that. The guys that, whatever they're dealing with, they're still playing. This is one of LeBron, this is one of the great skills that he had. The durability and the consistency no matter what his body was.

43:08I don't know.

43:08Bill Simmons:I just don't know how you put a number on that, Zach. I would give the contract even more than 45 % blame pie or 40 % or whatever you said. I would go 50 at least. And it's impossible to separate that from the analytics because the analytics don't exist in a vacuum. They exist in relation to what percentage of the cap he's taking up and is it worth it to have that specific player taking up so much of your cap. But I would put the contract as like easily half the pie. Okay, so if we're going to say that, How does Denver regard Jamal Murray right now? I mean, I think they love Jamal Murray. They love his chemistry with Nikola Jokic.

43:48I think they're probably very aware that if they were to trade him, it would not look dissimilar from the Jalen Brown trade. And it might even be a little bit worse because he's smaller and plays a position that is pretty well filled across the league. Because we have, he's over 50, right? He's 50 this year, 54, 57.

44:14Yeah.

44:16Bill Simmons:And I wonder, is there going to be more Jalen Browns? Like, is Orlando going to start looking sideways at Franz Wagner? Like, Jesus. Well, he's on the smaller one, and that's the timing, right? But in two years, won't it be like 47, 48? High 40s? He goes, yeah, 44, 45, 50, but 51 in 2030 is different than 57 now in terms of what percent of the cap it's going to be. It's the next one. It's the next one, you know. And that's the other thing that we need to talk about is, like, all these guys who are – I understand the extension rule and why it's written the way it is and why it's beneficial for both sides in a lot of ways to get security for players and teams.

44:59These players who are like – it happened with Towns. It happened with Jalen Brown. it's going to happen with a lot of other players. Like, you have three years left on your contract. Like, I don't think, if I'm a general manager, I'm like, it's cool that you're eligible for an extension by the letter of the law. Can we wait a year, man? You have three guaranteed years left on your contract. Why? But it creates issues within teams really early in the calendar of the contract.

45:21Bill Simmons:I feel like there's only four or five guys in the league that you would proactively just keep adding years to their contract, right? Like, if Wemby is like, hey, I'd love another three years. would be like, great. That sounds awesome, Victor. Here's your next three years. Right? Luka, same thing. I'm sure the moment Luka's eligible for an extension, the Lakers will be pouring years in the extension. I just don't think Jalen's at that level. This question came all the way from Lance in Australia. Okay. Do you think Jalen Brown's trade happened not because he asked to be traded, but because Tatum was jealous and said to Boston, it's him or me?

45:58I don't think it happened for either. I don't think it happened for that reason. I don't think Tatum said to trade him and I don't think Jalen Brown said trade me. I don't think either of those things happened.

46:06Bill Simmons:I agree with you. Good question. They're even in Australia. They're thinking about this. Noah is a Clipper fan. He said, I don't have a question. Welcome to the love-hate Paul George relationship. I had a few Clipper fans throw this at me. It is funny as I continue to try to talk myself into Paul George. Really good career. eight all-stars one top five all-NBA third MVP 2019 five third-team all-NBAs three conference finals 13-14-21 21 playoffs Zach 27-10-5 41 minutes a game for his career he's 21-6-4 39 % from three guys had an awesome career and yet I don't know any Paul George fans do you do anybody's like my favorite player is paul george every young player who comes into the league who's a win his favorite player is paul george um i i'm a huge i have been a huge paul george fan i think the last two years have tainted a little bit i've i've always been a fan i wrote a big piece on him i can't remember what playoff year it was i remember that i'm gonna say late 2010s maybe about up his up and down sort of playoff record and particularly the last couple in Oklahoma City were not good.

47:26And I think it was probably the year the Clippers made the conference finals, maybe, in 2021. But anyway, I've always been a pretty big fan, but the last two years, he's now 36, and the decline is happening. And the last two years have been problematic in a lot of different ways. Even, I'm looking it up now, even Podcast P has gone dormant since July 2025. I was going to say, I think a great moment to mark this monumental transaction would be if you went on Podcast P, but it appears to be dormant.

48:02Bill Simmons:Well, I think we're going to have him on the team this year, so I'd like him to feel welcomed by all the Boston fans. Look, he's a 2011 draft guy. You know who else was in the 2011 draft? Kawhi Leonard. I mean, they were teammates. Paul George is old, but so is Kawhi Leonard. They were teammates for a hot second in Indiana. Yeah. As the summer goes along and I relax, I'm going to really start thinking more and more about how good Paul George was in that Boston series. Like, maybe there's something left. We'll take one more break, and then I have more mail back. All right, it's time for a special segment on today's podcast where we discuss the superior matches, teams, and players.

48:45Bill Simmons:We're going to talk about players today for the FIFA World Cup 26, brought to you by Michelob Ultra, the official beer sponsor of the FIFA World Cup 26, a superior light beer. I'm going to dive into three players that I thought had superior impact, at least so far, in FIFA World Cup 26 as we head into yet another week. I love it. Can't wait. We're getting close to the finals. Three players that we thought would be three of the best guys in this tournament have all delivered and then some. You have Mbappe, 27 years old, prime his career. France is playing Paraguay over the weekend. they're parking the bus.

49:21Bill Simmons:They're trying to agitate him. They're trying to agitate all the French guys. And he just has this attitude. He's seen it all. I've been here before, guys. None of this stuff's going to work. France advances. Somehow he has been one of the two most memorable players in this tournament. And I'm not counting Harry Kane just because we're recording this before the England-Mexico game. But Haaland on Norway. So look, if you watch Premier League, you've watched him on Man City the last couple of years. I think they won in 2023. It's not like he's breaking news that this guy's unbelievable, but he is the first striker I've ever seen who really makes me feel like I'm watching a dominant big man in basketball.

50:01Bill Simmons:Like there's pieces of all of these big guys that I've loved from over the years, like early nineties, Sean Kemp on the headers, just anything close to the rim, Sean Kemp would get. It feels like Anything in the box where he can have time to jump and get airborne and stick his head somewhere and just get over somebody he's putting away. Young Shaq banging bodies around. There's like three, four times a game, he'll just bowl over somebody. Footwork of Hakeem. And then a little Michael Myers in there too because he has the Michael Myers reactions after the goals. Everyone else loses their mind when they score.

50:34Bill Simmons:He's like, he does the Michael Myers. I love it. To me, he looks like when you have in the Little League World Series, the one kid who's way bigger than everybody else who just throws the team on his back. That's the feeling he's giving us during this Norway run and they had a great win on Sunday. So I still can't give him MVP through this past weekend because at least through the past weekend because it's got to be messy. Carrying Argentina yet again, highest approval rating of any team sport athlete period right now. And game after game, it feels like he's doing a couple of magical things and it's so much fun to watch him and watch the delight that his teammates have just getting to play with a legend like that who's still got it.

51:16Bill Simmons:So I would have him the MVP so far as we head into yet another week of an awesome FIFA World Cup 26. If you disagree, Ultra wants to know. They want you to share your superior moments from the FIFA World Cup 26. You have the chance to vote after every FIFA World Cup 2026 match for the superior player of the match on the FIFA Plus app. That player will get it the superior player of the match trophy representing the host countries of Canada, Mexico, and of course, the U.S. So celebrate every goal, save and win with U.S. soccer. And Michelob Ultra. Somewhere out there is a Chevy truck. And the person who drives it, well, that's a Chevy person.

51:57You probably know one, your buddy, your sister, ones who always show up. They're the first to rise, the last to leave. They always have that little extra something. and maybe you've got it too. Chevrolet, together let's drive. Visit chevy.com slash trucks to explore the lineup.

52:18Bill Simmons:This episode is brought to you by Boar's Head. What if we told you the taste of deep fried turkey is now available at your local deli? Well, Boar's Head just did that. Bursting with flavor, perfectly seasoned with that indulgent taste that usually means planning your whole day around it. Presenting the Friar's Turkey Breast only from Boar's Head. A backyard tradition now available behind the counter. Visit your local deli today. Discover the craftsmanship behind every bite. Boar's Head, committed to craft since 1905. This episode is brought to you by Netflix. The T-Mobile Home Run Derby is right around the corner.

52:52Bill Simmons:Might be one of the best showcases of pure power in all sports. Baseball's biggest sluggers, along with some legendary announcers. Pujols, Rizzo, Bonds, Sabathia, Al Duncan. Yeah. Yeah, Hunter Pence, Matt Faskersian, a whole bunch of people. And it's the one night where you don't swing to make contact, you swing to make history. I'm interested to see what Bond says about this, actually. Anyway, it is all live from Citizens Bank Park in Philly. Watch the T-Mobile Home Run Derby live on Netflix Monday, July 13th at 8 p.m. Eastern, 5 p.m. Pacific. All right, a couple more quick mailbag. Emmett from Chicago.

53:31Bill Simmons:Do you think this brown trade happens if Tatum had won finals MVP in 2024?

53:40Bill Simmons:It's a pretty good one. I did talk about this with my dad who refuses to come on the podcast. He's really mad. He doesn't want to say anything he regrets. I did wonder if Jalen wins the Eastern Conference one, Jason wins the finals MVP, and we never have this Avon Stringer thing that develops right after that. I don't know if he doesn't get traded, but I do think it changes the dynamic. I do. I think the bigger what if is what if Tatum never gets hurt and they lose the Knicks series and it's totally normal because I think that's the event that catapults Jalen Brown into a different role and that changes everything.

54:17I haven't thought too much about what if they split the MVP trophies. Does that, because...

54:23Bill Simmons:Well, there's three what ifs because you have the finals MVP. What if Tatum doesn't get hurt? what if Tatum just doesn't come back last season? That's another one too. I mean, and it's just Jalen's team the whole year and we don't see Tatum until whatever. I think all three of those things, maybe no trade. I got the, I just, I'll have to, this is from cage from Kansas city, but did get a few of these. Did Brad send Jalen to the Sixers to destroy them from the inside? Because Jalen will want to be the guy on the team and there to have Maxine Embiid. I don't think that's why he did it. In fact, I don't think so either.

55:03In fact, it's it feels far away now, but man, are they going to face him a lot of times and maybe in the playoffs and it's going to just be a lot of Jalen Brown. I do think the fit is interesting. We have all summer to talk about how those three guys are going to fit together in Philly. I'm not particularly worried about it, but I don't think Brad Stevens did that.

55:25Bill Simmons:I like that Maxi, Edgecombe and Jalen Brown all play basketball. They do. They play most of the games. 71 to 75 games, 36 to 41 minutes a game. All three. And you know who doesn't? It's Joel Embiid. But those three will be in a lot of games together, and I think they're going to be better than people think. People seem pretty split on, it's just going to be a weird team, and is there enough basketballs? I think they'll be good. I think they'll be good. I will say this, though. It's Tyrese Maxey's team, and Jalen if he goes there thinking, finally, I have my own team. I don't think that's going to go well, but we'll see.

56:04Well, I mean, there's also, when he plays, it's at least half Joel Embiid's team and half Maxi's team. I mean, when he plays, Joel Embiid is still a colossal force. He's a former MVP. It's his team a lot when he plays, too.

56:18Bill Simmons:I really liked everything the Sixers did this offseason. Simons for$12 million was a steal. Simons is good. That one snuck in. Wow. I mean, they have a lot of guards, particularly after drafting Phylon, too. So, you know, that'll be interesting to see how they split that all up. The four position after Wade. I mean, we'll see where LeBron goes. Who knows? Oh, God. The whiteboard. I almost, I almost. We were watching the Mexico-England game at a friend of mine who had a whiteboard aside in the side of his kitchen because his daughter was using it for something. And I was like, should I, should I put this in the back of our car and bring it home and have it like ready?

56:57Do it just whiteboard, some locations. Ready? Because that whiteboard has really become a star in its own right.

57:03Bill Simmons:Ryan H. says, first time writing in, love the show. Here's my thought worry. Brad Stevens, Michael Corleone arc. I'm afraid we're on to the third movie. He says, part one, reluctantly joins the family, the front office, and takes to it like a fish to water. Part two, makes the tough but right calls, bringing the family to ultimate power. removing Tom Hagen and his conciliary Rob Williams trade whacking Fredo Marcus Smart trade all leading to the consolidation of the five families beta 18 Tom Hagen is Robert Robert Williams was he's called time lord because he's late all the time Tom Hagen was a precise machine Ryan's on a heater don't talk about it this part three Michael tries to change the direction of the family by making it work in the legitimate world the second apron and in the process loses a child because of all the maneuvering Jalen Brown moved prematurely because of the honest miss.

57:56Bill Simmons:And then he said, that's all I got for now. Pretty good. That's pretty good. I have to say, I have to admit, I never saw the Godfather part three because the buzz was so bad that I treated like Jordan on the Wizards. I don't want to know what happened. I'm just going to appreciate the first two. No, it's better than Jordan on the Wizards. We did a rewatch about it five years ago. It's like a guilty pleasure now. It's bad. I mean, there's really bad things about it, but it's worth saying. Oh, LeBron question. Oh, no. No, I have to go backwards. Hold on. Okay. Christmas games. I sent this to you.

58:28Yes.

58:29Bill Simmons:Jalen wanted to know what the Christmas games will be. He predicted 76ers Celtics at noon, Spurs next 230. He left 5 o 'clock blank, 730 Minnesota Thunder, and then he said 10 o 'clock Warriors Lakers. I made my predictions, but you go. Would you write down? Okay. I didn't tell you what I had. I'll be interested to see if we have the same five. So traditionally, the Knicks play first, but I'm now I'm putting them I'm giving them the championship bumper going. We're going primetime with the Knicks. Agreed. First game, Celtic Sixers. I had the same. Where'd you have the game? I don't I didn't think about that.

59:08I'll put it. I will put it in in Boston. I want it. I want it to be the return game. Yeah, I had that as well.

59:14Bill Simmons:All right. We're one for one. We're tied. 2.30 p.m. or the second game, I have Minnesota-Denver. Just like two great teams, LaMelo Ball excitement. They played each other last Christmas, good rivalry. This was the game I was less sure about, but that was the one I put in there. I had Spurs-Knicks as the second game because the East Coast. Okay. That would be 2.30 p.m. Eastern time. I don't have Spurs-Knicks as a game. Oh, okay. What do you have for the third game? I have 5 p.m. right before dinner, Thunder Spurs. Going with that rivalry again as a Christmas sequel. And it's because I'm giving it the Knicks, the primetime game.

59:57And the problem is if I don't give them the Spurs and I don't give them the Celtics and I don't give them the Sixers, I'm kind of running out of marquee, like Knicks rival teams. There's no final rematch. but 730 Knicks Heat Giannis Heat classic rivalry renewed defending champs get the dinner time prime time spot that's what I went with my fourth game

1:00:20Bill Simmons:what's your fifth I'll do mine after you do I just went Lakers Warriors fuck it like TBD on where LeBron signs and what team he's on but if he's on the Warriors and it's a revenge game against the Lakers that's going to be I don't know what team he's going to be on I've covered all the possible LeBron teams except for the Cavs who I do not have i have spurs nicks 230 warriors at lakers as the five o 'clock okc at minnesota it's a good and then dallas denver 10 o 'clock late night i thought about yokeage i thought about dallas lakers too um just all the luca games in dallas are going to be fun and uh cooper flag showcase um but we have to account for lebron like lebron is going to play on christmas and so well i have them in the five o 'clock game with the Warriors Lakers played for the Warriors.

1:01:08Bill Simmons:Okay, so that's what your association is. With Anthony Davis and Draymond Green and Yaxel and Steph Curry and everybody else. I still think he's going to the Warriors. If he goes to Cleveland, I don't know who I'm bumping out. I mean, I guess I would... No, if he goes to Cleveland, then 5 p.m. is Cleveland at the Lakers. Lakers are going to have that 5 p.m. Okay. And then maybe Curry is the 10 o 'clock. But that 5 p.m. I think will be the LeBron spot. All right, that was fun. Dave from San Antonio wants to know, Conspiracy Bill, are the Celtics clearing up money and building up assets for 2028 when Cooper Flagg tells the Mavericks he wants to go to Boston?

1:01:47Bill Simmons:That's from Dave from San Antonio. I feel like Conspiracy Bill should be the one to answer that. I always have my eye on Cooper Flagg and the Celtics. It's a big Celtic family. I always have my eye on it. Listen, I have Paul George on my team and probably 51-31 succeed and probably lose in round one for the next couple years. So I'm going to start dreaming about Cooper Flagg. We did win the title in 24, though, Zach. You did. That happened. Actually, you know, you're mentioning that. You're just throwing it out there as a little fun aside. We did. I kept saying it. Won the title. They're in the honest stuff.

1:02:26Like, as bad as this is going, like, they won a title. They got the thing done that no one can ever take away from you. and that's the whole thing.

1:02:35Bill Simmons:We won a title this decade and it wasn't in the bubble. Joseph Quinn says, hey Bill, are we in Celtics' bizarro world right now? The Knicks are a likable NBA champion. You just traded your finals MVP to your division rival and Brad Stevens is getting universally hammered. It is bizarro world time, it feels like. I guess the final piece of that would be LeBron going somewhere super weird. LeBron playing with Curry, I think would be the fourth piece of that. what's what's the weirdest lebron team like of all the ones that are on the weirdest believable of all the ones that are on the whiteboard what's the one that if it happened you'd be like wow i can't believe that corner of the whiteboard is the one that had it minnesota okay he's just like yeah i'm gonna hitch my wagon a lamella ball that's how i'm gonna end my career and a rod is and a rod and mark laurie is my owners and i'm just gonna live in minnesota That just seems insane.

1:03:30Dallas was on the whiteboard. I'm going to just shove Dallas. I'm going to erase them from the whiteboard. I'm good. I would be shocked if you went there.

1:03:37Bill Simmons:So what's your answer? I guess it has to be Minnesota. I kind of would be surprised if it were Denver. It just doesn't. I think that would be a great spot for him. It just doesn't feel like things like that happen for Denver. Can we all agree Cleveland is the worst outcome? I ranked it by basketball fits and like entertainment value fits that I had Cleveland last. It's just like, forget that. He did his business. He brought them a title. He did it already. Don't you can't go back again. And the reason is it's just the Harden piece is just like, what is he going to be doing when James Harden dribbles 30 times?

1:04:16And he still plays that way a fair amount of time.

1:04:18Bill Simmons:Nobody in the planet thinks that's a team that could win the title. I just don't see it. I don't see it. I just don't see it. I don't think LeBron and Harden as two of my five best guys are winning the title. I think it's ridiculous. I think in Golden State it would be ridiculous too. The problem for him is he was on a team that had one of the best six players in the league and one of the best 40 players in the league. Oh, yeah, for sure. And they weren't going to win the title no matter if LeBron had come back on a minimum and they had done this Kessler trade. I still don't think they would have.

1:04:53Well, now that they've traded DeAndre Ayton, it's over. I mean, you can't recover from that. I know.

1:04:59Bill Simmons:You can't recover if you're Joe House and you have to watch Trae Young, DeAndre Ayton, high ball screens. I, uh, listen, basketball fan bill, Denver. I would love to see him in Jokic. I know you've talked about in your pot a bunch. I totally agree. I think it would be really, uh, it would be like some weird movie, like two stars that you're like, I can't believe they're in the same movie. This is unbelievable. Um, I don't think it'll happen. How much, how much money do you think he's hoping for here? I mean, these teams don't have a lot to offer him. Yeah, I mean, if he can get the full mid-level, I think that's a win.

1:05:40But it doesn't seem like he's prioritizing that at this point in his career. Well, if he wasn't prioritizing that,

1:05:48Bill Simmons:why didn't he prioritize it last year instead of cashing in the$50 million? Right, why didn't he opt out? That would have really helped last year's team. Instead of releasing an aggressive, aggressive statement, I think, through Rich Paul, and then opting in, why not just opt out? And you don't have to release any aggressive, aggressive statement. You can just go wherever the hell you want. I did a thing on my pod the other day that I was really proud of and enjoyed about him doing the Roger Clemens. Roger Clemens, the last couple of years when he was playing, he would just come back into the season like in June or July on Houston and just do like a three or four month run.

1:06:27Bill Simmons:Basically, I'm going to be, I'll be in peak shape by the time the playoffs start. I'm just going to show up. I'm going to pop in. Like if they, if the ringers, Rich Paul asked me what I think LeBron should do. I would tell him I'm going to come back in January. I'm going to watch everybody. I'm going to play golf for six months. I'm going to think about everything. I want to watch all these different teams. I've never had a chance to just not play. I want to watch everybody, see where I might fit in. And then around January, maybe somebody will get hurt. Maybe I could be a replacement for somebody, but I'll just have a better sense in January where to go and do it that way.

1:07:05Bill Simmons:And guess what? Everybody will just talk about it every week. Like we're talking about it right now. It'll just be like the story that won't end. Oh, Dallas is better than we thought. Could LeBron go there? We'll just be doing that for six months. That's the, if you want the most attention, do that. Um, Miles says, uh, does this idiotic piece of malpractice being in the Jalen Brown trade, Join the Mount Rushmore of pathetic NBA trades along with Luca Russell, whoever else you have in the list. Thanks for all you do. So this did make me, I did make a little list here, Zach. Okay, let's hear. It's the, oh no, trades.

1:07:45Bill Simmons:Luca B, number one. Barkley to Phoenix for Jeff Hornacek, Andrew Lang and Tim Perry. That was a nine out of 10. Oh no. Like that was, I was immediately calling Joe House. Did you see that? Like just, oh my God. Hard in Houston. Where do you learn about the Barkley trade? As a sports radio. Yeah, that's how you learn about it. Yeah, that's like 2020 flash. This just in Charles Barkley's been traded. Hard in Houston was an oh no. Philly traded in the number one pick in 1986 for Roy Hinson and$750 ,000 in the draft of Brad Doherty and Len Bias. A classic oh no. And I was happy they did it because I was a Celtic fan.

1:08:28Bill Simmons:I wasn't old enough to really remember my feelings on this, but when Portland had Moses Malone and traded him for one Buffalo first round pick and$232 ,000,$232 ,000. That's like, does someone have a specific debt that they're trying to repay? And then Buffalo, six days later, traded him for two number one picks. J-Kid to Phoenix, when Dallas traded J-Kid, that was a, oh God, why? Why? You've JKed. Why are you trading him? Vince to New Jersey, even though we were waiting for it, just because of how bad that trade was, where it was like, you have to, you get a lawns a morning. You're gonna have to buy him out.

1:09:08Bill Simmons:You have, here's some shitty picks. Here's Aaron Williams or Eric Williams. There was a Williams in it. They just got nobody. And then my last one, Utah, Utah's number three in 1982. Well, in the draft with James Worthy, Terry Cummings and Dominique Wilkins are the top three picks. Dominic Wilkins hints that he doesn't want to play for Utah. They trade the pick for John Drew, who was in and out of drug rehab for years. Freeman Williams at$750 ,000. The moral of the story, Zach Lowe, anytime money, weird numbers of money is in a trade, just say, oh, no, it's not a good sign. But I think Luca Barkley, I don't know where Jalen's going to rank in this, but I think everybody had the same reaction, like, oh, no.

1:09:55That's a trade? I will say I've heard and listened and read a bunch of people trying to say it's the most inexplicable trade since the Luka trade or it's as bad as I don't think they're comparable. I think the Luka trade is like by orders of magnitude and for many different reasons. The return, the fact that they intentionally did not shop him the way that the Celtics canvassed the whole league. It's just a different species of horrible mistake. I wouldn't put it above Barkley or Harden either.

1:10:27Bill Simmons:The Harden trade, I think, was way worse because just pay him the extra$4 million and trade him. And you have a team that's willing to go for a fifth year with even more money on him. That tells you you at least have the asset. You can trade it. XF Vermeer is in New York, writes, we had Kenny Atkinson talking about how the numbers said Cleveland was up on the Knicks while they were actively getting eliminated. We had Bobby Marks saying an analytics guy had Jalen Brown graded seventh best on his own team. at what point did we stop calling it analytics and start calling it astrology for guys with xl we're one model away from some asshole telling us the team that lost by 30 actually won emotionally

1:11:06they feel they feel better about it uh yeah it is getting a little wacky i mean you just like you it's some of it like i don't know who said that to bobby i don't know um i i don't know who those people are. They're obviously crazy. And I just think we don't have to, as the media, take the craziest thing that we hear and amplify it. We can use a little bit of better judgment about what we choose to amplify.

1:11:35Bill Simmons:Well, in that case, he was talking about, I'm talking to this person that really value Jalen Brown. Then I talked to this person and he said this crazy thing. And then that's the part that cut out. That's what happens to all of us, unfortunately. Mike from Hartford, Wisconsin. Hartford, Wisconsin. Did you know there's a Hartford, Wisconsin? I did not. He said, hi, conspiracy bill. Immediately you had my attention. I'm moderately surprised that LeBron did announce his latest decision either on July 3rd to try to take some attention away from the Taylor Swift and Travis Kelsey wedding or on July 4th to take shine from America's 2050th birthday.

1:12:11Bill Simmons:I think Mike thinks he's slipping. What are your thoughts? Wow. I think the opposite. LeBron's going to take all of June, all of July to really, really enjoyed the dialogue about where he might go. You want him all the way to January. Yeah. I think it's great. Was he not at the Taylor Swift wedding? You know who was at Taylor Swift wedding? Me. Were you really? Yeah. No way. Flew back 24 hours. No, you did not. No, I really did. I went back. Got back in time for July 4th. Did I miss you? 1 ,500 people. Did I miss you tweeting about this? You weren't supposed to do social media about it. How did you get?

1:12:55Bill Simmons:It's a long story. It's interesting. What do you want to know about the wedding? I don't really. Any questions? Was there a reception? Did you just get to go to the wedding? Was the party also? I didn't look at any photos. I didn't look at anything. Adam Sandler, he married them and sang this song because apparently they loved one of his movies. They didn't have tables. You weren't at a wedding table. They had these food courts. And a lot of it was big pictures. By the way, I didn't go to this wedding. I just want to see if you didn't believe me.

1:13:34Bill Simmons:You did. You thought I went to the wedding. That was unbelievable. I was skeptical. No, I roped you in. You believe me. All right. Well, look, it's 1230 in the morning. It's 1230 in the morning. I knew I could get Crocky Zack to buy into that. I was going to ask who your plus one was, why I didn't get considered as the plus one, because, boy, I would like to go. You know who's there? Tommy Alter. I don't know what to believe anymore. I don't know what to believe. No, Tommy Alter was there. All right, Matt in Charlottesville wants to know, why doesn't one of the teams in the running for LeBron just go ahead and trade for Bronny right now?

1:14:13Bill Simmons:Who sent this in? Matt in Charlottesville. I mean, if it were a deal breaker that he has to play with Bronny, he wouldn't have left the Lakers. I think he's ready for Bronny to be released like the Doves and just go fly, fly, and be your own man. So if you're Cleveland, you wouldn't trade Daquan Tomlin? Naquan Tomlin? Naquan Tomlin. Naquan Tomlin. I don't know how to call him Daquan. Boy, if that happened, I mean, it would just be the all-time. There are no tea leaves. There's nothing to, there's no dots to connect. Like that's the, if a team trades for Bronny James in the next week, I think we're going to know something, something is up.

1:14:56Bill Simmons:Golden State has somebody. He makes, Bronny makes like 2.2. So I went on the trade machine. I looked at all the teams. So if Golden State really wanted him, try to get Bronny first. That's a smart move. One of my, one of my favorite subplots of the summer so far has been Pat Riley reportedly just stonewalling all the Antetokounmpo brothers. Just like the Nassus. No, it's not happening here. Alex, Kostas, don't even think about it. But the Nassus, you can buy some tickets. We'll maybe give you a seat. But you are not playing for the Miami Heat. I think all the guys in the Heat are relieved they don't have to practice against the Nassus.

1:15:34Bill Simmons:I think he was a physical practice player.

1:15:39Bill Simmons:You know, I got this question a few times. and I'll read this one from Edwin from La Mirada, California. He also asked for a conspiracy bill. This always gets my attention. Is the Kawhi trade to Toronto the modern day version of Jordan's retirement in 1993? The parallels are undeniable. The NBA has intra-convertible proof that a player is guilty of crimes that make the league look bad, but instead of airing out their dirty laundry in public, they quietly forced the player in a double secret publication. Jordan's play minor league baseball, Kawhi to exile in the NBA version of Siberia, Toronto.

1:16:20Bill Simmons:That is, that is hurtful. Who sent this? Edwin from La Mirada, California. Edwin, state your source, Edwin. Okay. Put your full name on the email. State your source. That's some BS. Toronto is an amazing city. It's not exile. It's a great city. Great people, great food, great nightlife, great everything except the weather. And by the way, Edwin points out at least Jordan got to stay in the country. He just couldn't play basketball for 18 months. He's going to be coming in and out of the country at will. OK, there's we think and they're going to be a very good basketball team. It's not like he's they traded him to, you know, the Kings or something like that.

1:17:05Bill Simmons:Conspiracy bill did take a look at this. did catch his attention. Go back to when Kawhi signed and Toronto was really mad because they felt... By the way, Toronto may or may not have been involved a little in this aspirations camp. They certainly were about talking about Uncle Dennis, right? Oh, and just... Uncle Dennis wanted this from us, they wanted that. I felt like they were one of the sources for kind of the things Uncle Dennis was asking for in the summer of 2019. That's come out in the media even before the Aspiration scandal hit, I think. Okay. So you lose Kawhi because this other team, this is all legend, by the way, just conspiracy bill considering the argument.

1:17:50Bill Simmons:You lose Kawhi because this other team goes beyond the rules to get him. And Adam says, all right, here's how I'm going to fix this. You will now return Kawhi to the Raptors. They're going to trade these picks and then my ruling will be the picks no longer matter and Toronto basically gets Kawhi for nothing. That would get conspiracy bills. The picks no longer matter. Like we're sending them back to Toronto as punishment for... Toronto gets the... You Clippers don't get to use those picks. They just go back to Toronto. Oh no, that would be something. That would be something. That would be pretty good.

1:18:27Yeah, that would be something.

1:18:29Bill Simmons:Would that make you wonder? Would that make you go, huh? the other thing would be is if if balmer buys the seattle seahawks okay and decides i've always wanted to own the nfl team in seattle i've had a great run here in the clippers i built the new stadium i am now going to sell the clippers and we'll never know why he sold would be another conspiracy bill has accepted that one on his desk he's he's looked at that one as well It's in a yellow envelope, just marked top secret conspiracy. Dirt. Sweat. Tears. Working hard can take its toll, but your relief doesn't have to. With Icy Hot original no-mess roll-on, you get maximum strength, fast-acting, mess-free pain relief.

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1:19:34Bill Simmons:Pays Checkout is offered by your banks and credit unions. So when you shop online at participating merchants, your cards appear in one place, ready to use and kept up to date. And the best part, your actual card number isn't shared when you check out. Because boundaries are healthy, like no work emails after six. One small step for boundaries, one big leap for checkout. Pays. It checks out. Activation required. See Pays.com to learn more. Terms and conditions apply. Yeah. Jack in Missouri said about my idea in the colonoscopy pod. I like that it's now the colonoscopy pod. You had to know that that's what it was going to be.

1:20:13Bill Simmons:That LeBron might wait until December, January to sign on a team. He said, what if he chose his team based on the winner of the NBA Cup and just sat courtside? Winner against LeBron. Announced it. And then the Kings begin creeping through the NBA Cup. And he's like, oh, no. I got to get out of this. They're in the quarterfinals. So they're in the semifinals. Oh, boy. He's getting nervous. So this one excited me. We talked about surprise LeBron teams. Josh Cook said LeBron in Indiana with the Pacers would be wild, right? He loves getting out and running. That's what Halliburton's teams do. Starting five with Tyrese, Nembhard, LeBron, Siakam, Zubats, McConnell, Neesmith, Oubre, Toppin, and Porter.

1:20:55Bill Simmons:They nailed both ends of the floor, shooting, rebounding, and selfless basketball. And I'm not even a LeBron fan. That is from Josh Cook. That was Mahoney's pick when he came on my show. I said, what's your just fun? Fun only. That's the only criteria. He said Indiana. And by the way, apologies to Indiana. I should have mentioned we were doing Christmas games when I was thinking who could the Knicks play. And I settled on Knicks heat. I thought about Knicks Pacers. That would be really fun. because the Pacers are the team. The Knicks didn't have to go through the Pacers. The Pacers can still sit here and say, we beat that team twice in a row in the playoffs.

1:21:29I know there's lots of injuries and all that stuff, and that's obviously a classic rivalry as well.

1:21:34Bill Simmons:So that would be the Christmas. If they just have that noon spot and that just belongs to the Knicks every year, Knicks-Pacers makes more sense, I think. Or Knicks versus whatever LeBron team. Andrew Smith wants to know, why don't the Sixers trade a bead to the bucks for Miles Turner and Kyle Kuzma right now?

1:21:56Kuzma is an expiring Turner has three years left.

1:22:05Okay. Who has a longer meeting on that? I've taken note. I've taken note. It's 1240 in the morning. I'm a little groggy, but that's, I mean, look, obviously that's not going to happen. I think, i thought it was interesting i mean so philly would be basically in a year they would just

1:22:26Bill Simmons:have the miles turner number because kuzma would expire so you would have a center for 30 million dollars less than i mean this goes back to like how many times can we say things like what but the upside of mb if he ever stays healthy for the play like is it are we is it just time to give up on that yes so i would i think oh if i'm philly i'm the opposite i'm looking at mb like i have these three durable, really good players that I can build a regular season around and I can sprinkle and beat in, keep them healthy and just try to get in the playoffs. That counter-argument would be, well, he did that last year and he got hurt anyway.

1:22:58Can he get through four playoff rounds healthy? I mean, I'm skeptical of that alone.

1:23:04Bill Simmons:What if you just played him twice a week, even during the playoffs? So he played like game two, game four, game five, and game seven. He just played four of the seven games. Poor Nick Nurse trying to manage that. I do think the idea, what I'm fixated on is this trade rattles around in my brain is like, Joel Embiid, Milwaukee Buck, just how miserable is that person going to be? Like, what is happening? What team am I on now? I gave my whole career to Philly. We're at least a good team. And now I'm on the Bucs. Although that would be a post-Yannis Bucs. A lot of fun pieces for him. Tyler Harrow.

1:23:45Bill Simmons:This is from Mel. He says podcasters have used, can't put the toothpaste back in the tube too many times. Okay. Including you, I guess. It's fine. He has some alternatives. Can't put the milk back in the cow. Can't put the shit back in the ass. And then he had a third one that I'm not going to say, but it involves sperm. I don't like any of those. Can't put the milk back in the cow. I don't think he nailed that one. The third one. the third one was just playing offensive i'm not even gonna say it i thought you're gonna say you can't put the milk back at the carton or something but we just went straight straight back to the cow um tim bowers one of many people who wrote about the nba players association mainly represented by so many um called stars screwed over its own middle class i talked about this on thursday these contracts for the middle class guys even simon's two for 12 and a half for simon simon's is good.

1:24:49The Lakers were like, hey, wait a second, middle class. You want to come to us? Quentin Grimes here's$60 million. They were the only ones who

1:24:57Bill Simmons:they were partying like it was 2016. But for the most part, the Dean Wade 4 for 39 felt a little more old school, but a couple more and then we're done. Josh and Raleigh, imagine you're dating an absolute smoke show in college. It was tons of fun, but completely insane. She's amazing embedded at parties, but she also goes to her phone when you're not looking. Also, she's a horrible driver. You know it's not going to last. And that she isn't the kind of girl to introduce to your parents so you break up. Deep down, you know she was a long-term solution, but when she's gone, you just feel alone, and that sucks.

1:25:32Bill Simmons:That's how it feels to be a Hornets fan right now. Josh really went deep. Almost tied in obsession. I was trying to figure out where that was going. And then you figured it out. It landed in a good NBA place, actually. Good email. Brandon says, cheers. The Knicks can basically live like kings in New York for the rest of their life, but as a post-career business, I think the biggest no-brainer is for Landry Schammett. Just open a chain of laundromats in the five boroughs called Landry Schammett. He'll print money. Would you go to Landry Schammett? I think that's a harder—it sounds great. It's a harder business than you think.

1:26:10You can't just call it Laundry Schammett. And it's not like he has$300 million to spend just opening up Laundry Schammett's all over the place.

1:26:19Bill Simmons:Yeah, he needed a backer. Nicholas said he couldn't believe the Cavs' 2016 championship tenure reunion, that Kyrie didn't go, that Moskov wasn't invited. Moskov was just unaware. Just unaware. Felt bad for him. But he wants to know how will the Celtics celebrate in 2034? for will everyone be invited um who will ghost it will porzingis still be injured and will pritchard get blind drunk and repeatedly yell this is what i do all right let me look at the roster um i think jalen would probably be the ifiest invite but i think he goes i think they forget about FEMA High Luke. I think he's the Mozgov of the...

1:27:06I think he checks Instagram and is like... That's a good one. That hurts. I think Jalen goes. I think by then we're in a good spot. We're in a good enough spot.

1:27:16Bill Simmons:And Al Horford won't go because it'll coincide with his 50th birthday party.

1:27:24Bill Simmons:Ben Craven in Ludlow, Shop Shrier, UK. I feel like he's written before. he wants us to set the over under for future all-star appearances of all combined players and picks received by Milwaukee in the Miami trade for Giannis. Okay. That's a good one. Um, he said 0.5. I would go 1.5. I think hero may have like 27 points a game next year. Hold on. So we, we have Burry's amen. Um, what, what else do we have coming in that, uh, Yeah. Burry Zayman, Kelly Olenek, Ware, future Miami lottery pick would probably be your best chance. I'm trying to think how many future picks. I think Burry's could make one.

1:28:06Bill Simmons:I'm going to go one and a half. I like one and a half, but 0.5 is too long. Okay. This one's too long. I really want your reaction to this. Let's do it. Go ahead. It's a July 4th email. it's from Ben in St. Louis. He said, uh, July 4th will mark our semi-quincentennial anniversary. Is that a word? Semi-quincentennial. And perhaps that's significantly the 10 year anniversary of Kelly Olenek killing Boston's chances of getting Kevin Durant. Recall Katie and Dardis choices down to OKC, Boston and Golden State. A Celtic contingent flies to the Hamptons where Katie has a house rented. The group is Tom Brady, Danny Ainge, Brad Stevens, the owners, Marcus, Smart, Isaiah Thomas, Jay Crowder, and Kelly Olenek.

1:28:59Bill Simmons:What happened was Kelly Olenek in a tie-dye shirt versus Steph Clay and Draymond's 73-win team. He's still upset about it. He still blames Kelly Olenek for the Celtics not getting Kevin Durant. I think there were other reasons. Kelly Olenek specifically and the shirt that he was wearing? Maybe he wore a tie-dye shirt. I don't remember the tie-dye shirt. Is he speculating? that i mean there's got to be google images why did tom brady go too that was another weird one i i want to look uh i want to look this up now i mean is he was he is there a picture of all them in the hamptons that's what i'm looking that's what i'm looking for i don't see any tie-dye shirts um katie should have come to boston oh he's right he is wearing a t-shirt yeah it's not quite a tie-dye shirt he's got a backwards hat and he's got a white t-shirt with some tie-dye-like image.

1:29:51It actually might be a tie-dye t-shirt.

1:29:54Bill Simmons:Interesting. I should have been more focused on it. All right, last question. It's from Sherb from San Francisco. He's on a group chat about the Kings franchise with a bunch of Kings fans that they call the Kings fan annual season timeline. And he's posted the same timeline below every year for the last five. and somehow he is it every month on the dot this past year with the A-Cups. So this is from 2022. He sent me the screenshot. There's the screenshot. Okay. October. We're going to be good this year. November. Oh no, we suck again. December. Team is actually good, but our coach sucks. January.

1:30:43Bill Simmons:New coach also sucks. so it's probably our GM that sucks February we could turn it around at the trade deadline March we definitely still suck we should tank why are we winning April we suck and our draft pick sucks May our draft pick doesn't suck hope June the guy we drafted traded for is awesome more hope July bro our summer league guys look sick August positive sack town royalty training camp news mega hope September undefeated in preseason five seed question mark. Okay. That's the 12 stages of Kings by month. And that's the same. He's done that the same. He posted five years in a row. He's posted that in his group chat and he said they've already nailed the A-cuff thing.

1:31:30Bill Simmons:Now A-cuff I guess he had 24 points on 29 shots last night summer league. So I don't know if the summer league bro or summer league guys look sick is coming out yet. The beam team it just blows that whole the thing up. The beam team didn't follow that at all. But that is an anomalous Sacramento Kings season. Maybe that's the thing. Maybe that was an anomaly. I hope Acuff works out because it's pretty bad. For league pass purposes, we need Acuff to work out or else that is the number one I don't want to watch that team team. Who do you have when you do league pass rankings? Who is the, who's the favorite to be 30th right now for you?

1:32:12Bill Simmons:I mean, is it just Brooklyn every year? You like their court. Milwaukee's got a chance to be pretty rough.

1:32:25I feel the same.

1:32:27Bill Simmons:I don't know if I'm going to be diving into a lot of Bucs games next year. Chicago's got some young guys, Sheen. Oh, I'm excited for Chicago. Caleb Wilson? Yeah, that'll be fun. I Milwaukee's Milwaukee might be Milwaukee might be my Clippers Clippers could be a little if Yannick if my guy Yannick doesn't come back I think he's all right I don't know how long you can have a Jones what did he have a Joe or yeah one of the bad yeah he'll be all right um yeah I would I think Milwaukee is the odds on paper I think you're right okay we'll wrap it up When's your next podcast? Probably going to go up Tuesday morning.

1:33:10I think we're going to record tomorrow on some Lakers stuff and Jalen Brown fallout and whatever else happens. Maybe LeBron will sign in the next 48 hours. Who knows? I don't think so. Doesn't seem like it.

1:33:21Bill Simmons:I think basically everybody's signed now. The only things we have in play left are Peyton Watson. It's a couple of restricteds, right? What happens with Duren? I haven't liked Detroit's offseason at all, just for the record. It's been a strange one. Yeah. um it's been a strange one yeah we've got some of that and then the no-brainer extensions will come you know like oh the when banyama extension and and stuff like that but yeah jalen durance that's going to be fun do you think we'll ever see a player in our lifetime not do the rookie extension early and just do the stare down uh i mean we've seen that i think what you're really asking is will anyone take the qualifying offer that's what i mean yeah yeah uh i there's been candidates, I think the money is now reaching a point where you're basically losing $35 million or something.

1:34:12It's a pretty risky decision. And I don't see anyone coming down the pike at this point.

1:34:18Bill Simmons:Groggy Zach, thanks for staying up till almost one o 'clock your time. We put the toothpaste back in the tube. We put the shit back in the cow. I don't know what that guy was saying. Ollie for the rewatchables is coming either Monday night or Tuesday night because I think we're doing a post-soccer thing tomorrow. And then hopefully the NBA will calm down. Thanks for staying up late. Thanks to Gajal and Eduardo and Jack and Chris and everybody else at Spotify too. And I'll see you tomorrow night live on Netflix right after the America game.

1:35:03on the wayside on the first side never

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