The 2025 Made-Up NBA Awards, Plus Duke’s Collapse With Ryen Russillo

25:28This was like old school. Is this the Memphis, Kansas one when they don't make their free throws? Yeah, that's a good one. That was 2008, right? That was like 17 years ago. It just doesn't happen the same way. Wait, one more thing on the NCAA. You talked about the Florida guy last week and how much you liked him. Yeah. And then you watched him last night and he just looks like he's doing a Jamal Murray impersonation. And I guess now he's crept into the first round. And I don't really know the knocks. He's not as tall as Murray is. And he's older. He's 22, which they always seem to penalize guys with.

26:08But he's been impressive enough that I'm now rooting to see him go to a decent team in the draft. Maybe a team where he could play. I'm talking about Clayton. But I've just been really, really, really blown away by his shot making and how he seems to have a sense for when his team needs him to do something. If he's on Duke last night, Duke doesn't lose the game. So where do you see him? I know you only started doing the draft stuff, but just where do you see him in that whole context? Does this even matter when these teams are looking at this in June? Older, not jump off the screen, batch of athleticism.

26:54So I think that's where I look back at some of the mocks and there was one in the beginning of this month where he wasn't even a second round pick. And that's where, again, late to this, but the Tennessee SEC tournament game, I was like, holy shit, you know, and then he's basically been that the entire time we talked about the Texas Tech shot. But what he can do, I'm not comparing to Steph. OK, but what makes Steph a great shooter is that Steph can have a bad foundation, that Steph can change the release of it, even though it all kind of comes back. You know, it's almost like a Dirk thing. If you looked at Dirk's foundation, you would never say, hey, do what that guy's doing.

27:28But everything was always adjusted for whatever the release was going to be. So there's some guys that are just catch and shoot. They can never move. they develop the muscle memory enough that if they catch and shoot in a certain spot they put up like a really good number but i don't know that it makes you a well-rounded shooter and what we see with clayton is that he can be that that corner three that he hit from the left side or excuse me it was the right side so right corner he's adjusting all of his like arm and release point to get away from the contest and then it's natural he also had a drive on the left side where he had read it and he knew what was going to happen and he knew he was going to get fouled so he's preparing himself to even throw the ball up at the rim and it wasn't even an and one but there's just stuff with him that even if he's not off the page you know or i should say off the charts athletically compared to some of the other guys he seems to keep getting past everybody the entire time and there's some players when you're doing the draft you're like i don't know if he's like the most dynamic or the most quick and it's like okay but he just keeps he just keeps getting past everybody every single time and his pace and his his comfort in the biggest moments i haven't done it but i I guess I'd have a hard time believing that there's 30 guys that go ahead of him, even at the age.

28:40I would add the way he finishes after he bounces into somebody in a drive and still finishes with touch. That's the thing that reminds me of Murray the most. When Murray's really going, he has this ability to kind of bounce off dudes and finish anyway. I think he's really impressive. And I was mad. I had the Auburn-Duke parlay last night, which then I had to chase with Duke Clippers. So it was a double loss for me last night. But I just thought Auburn was better. And then as you're watching him take over the second half, you're like, why the fuck did I bet against this guy? This guy thinks he's the best guy in this tournament.

29:18I'm not doing that again. All right, we got to get made up. Just to add to it, though, because I've been doing it now, where on FanDuel, I hedged it with a Florida-Houston-Florida over Houston plus 750 title. So I was like, I love Duke. I love them in this game. And then you're sitting there going, I still don't feel like I was wrong. There's plenty of games where you're like, I'm just wrong on this one. So yeah, I got a little title game insurance, so we'll see how it goes. But doubting Houston is a dangerous sport right now. The most important question I'm going to ask you before we go to the break.

29:54Do you think stripping the inbounds passer should be worth more than one technical? No, I'm fine with it. You think it should be? I think it should be a two tech. It's just such a crazy thing to do. I just think it should be an extra, add an extra tech to it for how stupid it is. And then that guy came back and made some big plays. He wasn't phased at all. All right, we got to get to the made up NBA awards. We're going to take a break. All right, welcome to a special part of the show, which is brought to you today by Audi with their all new fully electric Audi Q6 e-tron. So we're going to do made up NBA awards in a second, But just quick check-in because we got four games left.

30:33The biggest thing that's at stake right now is this Defensive Player of the Year award, which Draymond has. There's like a good media campaign for him right now. Rob Mahoney and I talked about it a little bit on Thursday, and both of us thought, didn't really see it. But Draymond's the favorite, basically based off this last 25-game stretch. A large favorite too, right? Yeah. Basically based off this post-Jimmy Butler trade stretch that seems to ignore the rest of the season. I'm not voting for him. I'm either voting for Moby or Dort because I just thought those guys were better. And I want to look at it.

31:07I'm not going to decide today. But did you have Draymond all of a sudden as the defensive player of the year or are you leaning somewhere else? I'm not. I think it's the hardest award to vote on, to be honest with you. With no Wendy? Well, yeah. I mean, he was just going to win it. But there's like a lot of stuff that Draymond does do that is really important that may not show up. His switchability, that stuff's crazy. There's some clutch defense with him too. He'll make the single biggest play in the fourth quarter defensively, a little stuff like that. Defensive player of the year, clearly watching all year, I have thoughts, but I definitely make the rounds with coaches, assistant coaches.

31:50and they the love for Dort and who he is and what he's tasked with and then the numbers when you start looking at some of the matchup stuff which at times I think can be packaged to be a little misleading but it's a Dort Mobley thing for me right now but I'm going to make the calls and figure it out but I just think it's such a hard thing to vote for Well, the all new fully electric Audi Q6 e-tron, a huge leap forward featuring effortless power, serious acceleration, the most advanced tech of any Audi ever. Experience technology that puts you center stage of the panoramic digital stage plus an optional screen for front seat passengers.

32:34Perfect for watching the latest sports documentary. The Q6 e-tron, not just the new EV, it's a new way to experience driving. Learn more at AudiUSA.com. Always pay careful attention to the road. Do not drive while distracted. All right, made up awards time. So we did this last year. I had a fantastic time. We're doing it again. Have a bunch of awards. I couldn't remember last year if I sent you all the nominees. I don't think I did. I think I just sent you the awards and left you on your own to come up with like a winner. But I have nominees for each category. So we're going to rip through them.

33:04And the first one is Unicorn of the Year, which Wembenyama won last year. We created it for him. He got hurt. I don't think, would you say he's eligible? I mean, he could basically win every year. I'd like to come up with a new name for this, right? can't we can we can we zag a little yeah i mean unicorn is like who was the og unicorn will chamberlain yeah hey i saw something the other day they're trying to say you could bench 500 pounds did you find that in any of your research that would be really impressive 500 pounds is a lot a lot especially with long arms really strong guy nominees i have wimby again Ahmed Thompson, LeBron at age 40, Dyson Daniels, or Zach Eady for Unicorn of the Year.

33:51We could just vote for Wemby again. No Chet? Didn't play enough? Not eligible? What do you need, 35 games? You can put Chet in there. Make the case. If they have a playoff run and he plays as well as I think he's going to play, there's going to be some real Chet conversations. I don't know if they get as absurd as DeAndre Ayton potentially being a top 15 player in the Suns finals run of a few years ago. That seems inaccurate with further information. But the rim protection numbers, the fact that he can play five out, the fact that he goes coast to coast the other night against Detroit and then finishes.

34:29Three-point shooting. Yeah. So I just, hey, just tell them the world, prepare yourself for some big-time Chet projections if OKC pulls this off. I like the Chet one. If we can't give it to Wemby, I think Chad is a good backup choice because I've never really seen another player like him. So I think you're right. I wanted to give this to Ahmed Thompson, but I feel like he's been in the vicinity of other guys we watch. But I still feel like to have enough athletic ability that people go to see you play basketball and you seem like a better athlete than anyone at a basketball game with all the best athletes feels unicorn-y.

35:07So at least he's a medalist. So we'll give it to him. Okay. okay but just just an aside a man's like four of these for me and then i had to figure out how to whittle it down so i don't think a man's a bad choice i would say michael phelps in the summer olympics one year just grabbing medals yeah yeah although i do think if you had basketball where it was like hey we'll play one-on-one two-on-two three-on-three five-on-five and then we'll play horse and then it's like jordan had seven golds so some of the swimming and gymnastics gold medal count I think is unfair to the team guys, but we can get into that later.

35:43Although this curling thing with China is nuts. Um, I have, if you had an award for most rewinds on the season, it's, um, yeah, that'd be a good category for next year. I always thought the team, like the basketball, basketball team metal just should have been bigger. I think when you're just talking about some of those individual swimming race ones, maybe a smaller one. And then the basketball, I always thought should look like a flavor flame type of medal. Next category, the 2011 Blake Griffin Award for most unexpected delight. Once again, a Matt Thompson. Here he is, along with Kate Cunningham, rejuvenated Jimmy Butler on Golden State, Austin Reeves, or anyone else you want to mention?

36:30Any other nominees? is uh nope because you already said the guy that i was gonna see using this one so who is it who's your winner i'm in all right this is gonna be like a meryl streep situation here no because i'm giving mine to uh austin reeves that's a good one i uh i can't believe how good he is offensively to the point where he's on a team with LeBron and Luka. And not only does his coach think it's a good idea to run stuff through Austin Reeves, but LeBron and Luka are like, we should run stuff through Austin Reeves. Like that's the level he's at. I think he's a potential 25 point a game scorer at some point in his career.

37:18There's pieces of different guys from over the years. And I'm going to do the comparing a white guy to a white guy thing, but there's a lot of Jeff Hornacek. There's some Paul Westphal. but his ability to get to the basket, create shots for other guys, take huge threes in big moments. I think other teams are really afraid of him offensively. I've been really impressed. Was not expecting it. And so it's either him or Thompson to me. Do we save Amen for some of the other ones? Because I think the Reeves part of it is you're not saying it's unexpected because we already knew he was pretty good. But now this is like the Jalen Brown arc where you have to keep adjusting the ceiling every time.

38:04Yeah. I just didn't, I never thought like, I always liked him. I never thought like this guy might be a four-time all-star. Like I was never in my head. It was always like, oh, this guy's a really nice piece for LeBron. Like he really turned out to be a good player. Somebody should pay him. Now it's like, Jesus Christ, this guy, this is like a real, real offensive star. You know what's crazy? Do you remember the Spurs thing, not offering him a contract? Oh, shut up. I didn't tell you this category because we already have the winner but it's a new category for next year the Luka Doncic trade award for most cataclysmic NBA moment of the season goes to Luka trade so we just have to write that one down for next year there's no way there's no way you can sit there and say plenty of unexpected things happen how about Cuban now doing the tour oh he's coming up later oh alright I didn't even realize that was a category The 1986 Bill Walton Award for biggest impact under 20 minutes a game guy.

39:06Nominees. Ty Jerome over solo podcast guest. 19.7 minutes a game this year. 12.2 points a game. Luke Cornett on the Celtics. Putting up basically like a 6-6 in 15 minutes. Obi Toppin. 10-4. 37 % from three. leads the league in field goal percentage around the rim. And then just for fuck's sake, Ben Simmons on the Clippers. I'm going to throw him in too for when he comes in and does whatever Ben Simmons does for 15 minutes. Who do you have for the Bill Walton Award? Ty Jerome. The metrics for a player like him are incredible. It's also real when you watch it. So, I mean, his win shares per 48 is over .2.

39:50So it's a really good number which sometimes that number doesn't even show up to reflect how well you know but when you start kind of getting into that area for a player especially what he's asked to do uh i i think it's jerome and i think he's had some really big moments for them i just really felt like there was a few weeks there which is like so this guy's just never gonna miss any shots and do everything right it's one of the best under 20 minute seasons in a while you know he's basically coming in for two nine minute stretches each half and that's it you don't see him again and he comes in and he's impactful the whole time um i'm with you what does he make this summer you think see a 15 to 16 million dollar guy god not a shitload of calf space floating around no but not a great free agent field either yeah veteran guy he's going to be in some big games in the playoffs i think you could see like a 50 for three one of those type of deals from somebody yeah because you're still asking like you're going is he going to be our starting point guard like is he playing 36 minutes a night out there well could he get like one of those strews contracts like when strews went to cleveland what was it 464 and they were like we just need an awesome role player who can make some shots and play swing and maybe he starts, maybe he comes off the bench, but we need him.

41:15Very excited for the next category. The Monty Williams Award for worst coach of the year. This used to be named the Vinny Del Nego Award until whatever Monty did last year, which was the most egregious bad coaching I think we've ever had this century, at least. Nominees, Coach Bud on the Phoenix Suns, Nick Nurse on the Sixers. I'm throwing Doug Christie in here as a nominee based on the last 15 Kings games and just whatever the hell is going on with that team. They're 4-11 in their last 15, not trying to tank. Anybody else you would put in as a nominee here? How is Nurse on here? I just put him on from the first two months of the season.

41:58I needed nominees. I'm going to zag on you. Okay. Toronto. Ryukovic. Okay. Now, not because he did a bad job, but because he did an amazing job. This is the worst tanking in a bad way. Like if the goal were to tank, they were eight and 31. They were unbelievably defensively there for like two plus months. They won too many games. So he was, I'm not saying he's a bad coach, but he did the worst job of executing because the team played so hard. And I think the Raptors were number two against the spread. and depending on what number you got this summer, they're going to end up being an over team.

42:39Unless they throw away the last four games, I think is our only chance. They play too hard. So I'm not even comparing them to Monte Williams, but I'm zagging a bit on the nomination of like, hey, why are you getting these? There are certain nights with their lineups where I'd go, what the hell is, and then they'd win again. I'm going to pick Coach Bud because Phoenix seems the most uninspired night to night with the most guys that really don't seem like they gave a shit about what happens in the game. I thought Bradley Beal's performance in the Celtics game the other night was one of the most reprehensible things I've seen in a while.

43:16And I really hope, if anyone missed it, go watch some of his minutes in that game. And if you want to see somebody, just completely mail it in. It was awful. Did you see it? It was awful. Yeah. I mean, there shouldn't even be any other nominees for another award a little bit later. I imagine we're aligned on that. Well, I had the 2015 Brad Stevens Award for most untankable coach. And I had your Toronto guy, Jordy Fernandez, Will Hardy, and Chauncey Billups. Action-packed category. So you'd go the Toronto guy for that one too? Yeah. Yeah. I didn't know that was a category, so I wouldn't have done that to you.

43:51No, no. I think he can win both. Has anyone ever done that before? A double, a double. I have Jordy. They're just like trying to trade dudes, get guys off the team to make them worse. And that team over and over again, it's the same thing as Toronto. Everyone plays hard. He's a really good in-game coach and he's just stolen games left and right. So kudos to him. Speaking of Chauncey Billups, the late 1990s Chauncey Billups Award for best reason never to sell your stock. Our guy, Scoot Henderson.

44:26that's it. There's no other nominees. Scoot Henderson. I was talking to a team this morning about this and their quote, so it's not coming from me, but was that this, we need to have more patience with guards. The way you have to think the game now with the number of defenses that you're seeing, it's almost like quarterbacking now. Like, hey, are they in zone? Is the safety coming down? Is all this different stuff? Like there's just so much variation for what you're having to face. And I think Kate Cunningham is a great example of this. Like you saw the physical talent. You imagine he was going to be able to shoot it well.

45:00And then at that size of the passing that we saw from Oklahoma State, it's like how this just isn't going to work out. Now, granted, he had some really alarming numbers finishing at the rim or his inability to finish at the rim. But you saw clearly, and it helped them having spacing too. But once he started kind of figuring things out a little bit, there might be a lesson in there for some of these lottery pick guards that look lost early on. so maybe there's a scoot lesson in there as well I'm going to go backwards to two guys I specifically mentioned remember for this because this might have always been a lesson and we just forgot Kevin Johnson on Cleveland I remember going to a Cav Celtics game and watching him just look like a deer in the headlights I went with my dad and we were like wow that guy seemed like a bust and then they traded him for Larry Nansen who was awesome.

45:52And then Billups on Boston. I was going to those games. Now, Patino was yelling at everybody. He lost his confidence. They traded him after 50 games. And then he bounced around. He went to Denver. He went to Toronto. He bounced around before he finally landed on Minnesota when he rejuvenated his career. But I would just never give up on a high pick after a year or two if I was a team that drafted them. Quarterback's a little different. We've had some quarterbacks where it's like, I mean, when do we know Josh Rosen? Like the second play of his career where he's just like, ah, that guy's, it's a route.

46:28I was not, I wasn't that quick on Josh Rosen. You weren't, you stayed in? How long did you stay? Longer, because I think it was a game against, I forget if it was SC or maybe it was Arizona where I thought he was reading the blitz perfectly and hitting the tight end. So yeah, I fell for it. Terrell Brandon, maybe part of this group. That's a good one. Yeah. Even somebody like Brian Shaw, who was really up and down and then turned into an awesome role player for a couple different playoff teams. Yeah, I like your quarterback point guard thing. The Freeman Williams Award for biggest black hole. This isn't as fun as last year when Cam Thomas was just the obvious winner.

47:11I went with LaMelo, which you made the case for on your pod a couple months ago. But even though he's 21.3 field goal attempts a game, in 32 minutes. So he's basically taking two shots every three minutes. He's got a 36 usage rate and the team doesn't win. So I don't feel great about it, but I thought he was the best option. Who'd you have? Yeah, because there's some alarming shot numbers that we've gone over where it was the most shots, I think per 100 possessions since Kobe in 2006. And it's like, okay, but I mean, there was even discussions then of like, okay, Kobe's amazing, but is this awesome?

47:50You know, and again, like, how dare you even bring it up? And then you mentioned the team around him and all that kind of stuff. Even if I feel like everybody would be guessed, be like, hey, Rosillo is just going to jump on this Lomelo thing because of that stuff that you're already talking about. He's such a good passer that I don't think the black hole thing applies to him. Like I have to, I have to watch you and think you never want to pass. You just don't want to. And I think Lomelo actually wants to pass a ton. I mean, there's a sneaky part of this circling back to the start of the pod where we're talking about Cooper and where he could go.

48:20Can you imagine him on lobs from Lomelo? Like, what is, you know, is there a version of this Lomelo thing where it works, where he scales down the shot attempts a little, he has some better players. Like, you know, again, I'm, I'm probably, I sound like I'm in the marketing room with the front office of the Hornets going, hey, they try to shop them. Right. Right. Yeah. We have, we have, we're selling a lot of jerseys. We didn't want to give them up. Right. Right. A couple, a couple options for you here. Yeah. Yeah. Delano Banton from Portland, I was like, that guy doesn't like passing. That's a really good one.

48:57He really doesn't. But then his assist percentage number on the advanced stuff was so much higher than I thought it would be. I was like, that's not. The numbers don't back up the eyes on that. But I'm just telling you, that guy's not. He's thinking shoot first. Yeah. If you've watched enough Portland, which some of us like watching Portland play. so then I looked at top 15 in field goal attempts not per game just raw field goal attempt total I did the same Jalen Green's fourth he's taking the fourth most shots this season in the league is that true? yeah Jalen was awesome the other night against OKC yeah he's been good last month I've been impressed they need him but if you go by the 1 ,394 shots that's again 1 ,394 shots this year so I looked at it I was like alright who let's say top 15 shot attempt guys total on the season.

49:49Yeah. He's the only one under 300 assists. DeRozan is the only one close to him at 316, and Jalen's at like 260-something. Now, you could also say, hey, scale it out to 16 field goal attempts, and then Jaron Jackson Jr., who I love. But then I go, okay, but nobody's giving it to Jaron Jackson Jr. saying, all right, now set up the offense. Maybe we don't have a black hole. maybe maybe the words defunct research i looked at the research numbers there was high volume i was surprised but what are you asked to do but when you start getting into like seven percent assist ratio like jordan clarkson had some years you're like man not a lot of playmaking there so some of it feels a little bit like okay but once the ball is passed to me what are you more meaning you and i like what do you morons expect me to do like you realize how I fit into our offense.

50:44Like I'm not, not getting the ball to set it back up. So I think it has to be on somebody who's, you're still expecting to maybe make a few plays here and there. Cam Thomas's stats are basically almost exactly the same as last year. So he's probably the winner, even though I feel I felt way better watching him this year than it did last year. Yeah. We don't really have the, that's why even like Lamella, I was like, I don't know. Maybe we leave this to funk this year. What's a, we got some media awards coming up. So let's take a break before we get to this.

51:41All right, this is one of the big categories. This is like in the Oscars when all of a sudden they're doing like, you know, best supporting actor. Like, whoa, we're doing this now. It's the Perk Thinks Jokic Pads His Stats Award for worst sports media take of the year about basketball. I'm sure you have a couple of nominees written down, too. I wrote down four. Perk saying Steph shouldn't be an all-star. all of Colin Coward's Tatum takes like all of them for five straight months which I went on his show two weeks ago and made fun of him for Marcus Morris has been debuting some Jokic stuff lately that I really want to talk about and then Gilbert Arena saying Bronny would be top five for rookie of the year if he played 36 minutes a game was an actual Gilbert Arena's take is that If you were playing 36 minutes a game, some way of bad.

52:36I feel like any rookie playing 36 minutes a game is probably in the running for rookie of the year. Any other ones that jumped out for you? I think about the Perk Jokic-Westbrook video once a week. The stat pad? Yeah, it's been years. It's been years, and I can't stop thinking about it. Every time he talks about Jokic, I can't unwind it.

53:05because I know what he was doing. And there was, there was a video of like, it was kind of like the thinking emoji face. And I kept thinking like of all the times that I'll, I'll admit the disconnect of me never playing in any game that ever mattered in this sport that I'm in love with. And it's basically my career. and then somebody who did play is capable of suggesting that because one guy gets triple doubles it's the same as the other guy getting triple doubles i just it makes my head explode okay i can't i still don't have an answer as to how it even happened so perk's been on a bit of a heater he had sga in the defensive player of the year conversation the other night when they were talking MVP.

53:55Oh, no. Yeah, it was like, why is SGA not being mentioned for defensive player of the year? And I thought like, well, because it's March and we know that he isn't. And he's actually, if Wallace isn't on the floor, like the one guy, not to say that he's a bad defensive player, but he's not even like one of the three or four best defensive players on his own team. Although he's gotten defensive, all defensive team votes. I think it was a couple of years ago. He's a good defensive player, but yeah, he's on the same team with Dorton, Caruso, and Wallace. right so that made me like i had a relapse on the yokich westbrook thing when i was watching that and so then i saw the mark marcus morris stuff with yokich and i was like you know first takes probably sitting there going this is there anybody that we can find that's kind of in the mix played not playing maybe we can figure out if he fits in to what we're doing but like back different background than yokich like is there anybody available who could come on and just shit on Jokic a little bit was there anybody that Jokic shoved from behind really hard and knocked him out for 20 games right it's his brother but is there anybody is there anybody that would like fit into what we're doing here and it's like I've got the guy I've got the guy and then he went they must have been high-fiving him being like you fit in perfectly to so you think that was in the meeting he he test drove it and they're like that's great you should say that could you say not top 50

55:24that was really good because when I saw the clip it was like no way Marcus Morris kind of shit on Jokic a little all right next category is the most shameless LeBron related media moment of the year and unfortunately there were too many this year with with people in the media and we're just going to skip this award including a couple last week that I was just stupefied by let's move on the Virginia Beach Kings Award for most contrived story on a slow news day I'll give you the nominees this is I think another action packed great category Stephen A versus LeBron for 10 days the story that Minnesota at the deadline came really close to getting Kevin Durant even though they're on the 13th apron and it's like physically impossible for them to make any sort of trade that would have allowed it.

56:20I enjoyed that. Anything, any story that involves an ex-player in a podcast taking a shot at a current player, throwing that in there. Any story that made it seem like Joel Embiid was now ramping up to play, throw in there. And then my favorite, Paul George has paused his podcast to concentrate on the 76ers season. I thought I had no notes. I thought that That was a tour de force. It's the podcast. Oh, some blame you for that. What else do you have for most contrived story on a slow news day? I'm going to blame myself for this one, but I wrote out a Tumani Kamara open that I didn't do on my pod.

57:04That you didn't do. You were going to do a Tumani Kamara open? Yeah. Wow, that was a tough headline. Yeah. Yeah, I probably would have led with the guest on the tweet of that episode. Kamara, underrated. I think you need help spiritually. My favorite contrived story is the Durant trade, though. That was my favorite. I can't believe Minnesota was floating that out like there was ever a chance in a million years. They had a chance to get Kevin Durant when all the rules make it literally impossible. You know what? Off of that, though, I think we could bring it back to the Luka thing that we haven't even brought up yet, is that when it happened, all we were doing with whatever contacts you had was like, did you know he was available?

57:49And it was like, no, no. Did you hear this? No, no, he wasn't. He wasn't or whatever. And then it like took a couple of weeks. No calls. It took a couple of weeks for us to be fed the idea that he was offered for Ant and that he was offered for Giannis. And then it became, again, it depends on who you believe, because I don't know that any of this stuff was officially reported, but the sense you got from it. I think you and I would agree. So I'm assuming a bit here where it was like, yeah, a team called us about a trade, but they didn't say, they didn't say he was available. They said, what would it take to get Giannis?

58:24And we were like, what are you talking about? Yeah. Oh, another big award. The McKeskey Award for best American white guy. Previous winners included Chet Holmgren, Tyler Hero, Kevin Love and Mike Miller. so it's a prestigious one Mike Miller actually was close to having the white belt here he had it he won it somewhere in the mid 2000s I'm not saying it's wrong sometimes it's a weak field this year it's a strong field Chet Holmgren Tyler Hero Austin Reeves we'll throw Pritchard in there just to have four candidates but this is probably the best category we've had Now Holmgren's missed a punch of time.

59:10So I'm going to penalize him and make it between Hero and Reeves. And I got to say, I think it's Reeves. It's Holmgren if we don't care that he missed the games because he's the best out of those guys. But I think if you're going by this season, it's Reeves. Right. But just to review, Jokic, Caitlin Clark, American White Guys, Trump, Cooper Flag, White Lotus. Been a big year. flag was a hit last night.

59:44So you agree that it's, it's reefs or would you go home grid on 30 games?

59:53god this was a really tough cat i think there was a time where we were wondering if mcdermott was the answer We had bad years for this. Yeah. That's why I just gave you that timeline. What's been going on? Let's see. I'll go Chet Sealing. But if you want to ding him for not playing, what, he's at 29 games. And Reeves has had to really carry the team. You're right. Chet's the best out of those guys. We don't have the all-NBA rules where it's 55 games or more. We're just going best white guy. He's the best white guy. Dennis Rodman Award for best ongoing distraction. nominees. Embiid. He's going out with his knee.

1:00:32Is he going to play today? Uh-oh, setback. Oh, he's ramping up. Ah, setback. Oh, he's ramping up. Zion. Is he playing? Oh, he's hurt. Whoa, he had 38 points and 17 rebounds last night. Oh, where is he? He's not there anymore. John Morant. Jimmy Butler in Miami. Not the Jimmy Butler and Golden State. Jimmy Butler in Miami. And then last one, here's where I'm going to put our guy Mark Cuban for his It's Not My Fault media tour. After probably two weeks of getting hammered by everyone in Dallas, why did you trade Luka Doncic and some of them explaining that they didn't. He finally felt the need to give multiple interviews rubbing salt into the open wound of the Luka trade.

1:01:15So who do you have for this? Best ongoing distraction. Biggest. There's such a recency bias with awards. I think Jimmy Butler needs to be recognized here. I think you're right It started in the playoffs last year Yep I think you're right Plus watching how great of a teammate And contributor And the way the Golden State guys are talking about him How amazing he is He can score 9 points and have 5 rebounds And still impact a game in these 19 ways Steph loves him Draymond loves him I think it's the right answer He was slow though in that Lakers game And it was something that maybe I wouldn't notice as much if I wasn't there.

1:01:57But he basically took off, like, I think the first 14 minutes. It was strange. I think he's played a lot of minutes the last 25 games in a way that hasn't really happened in a while. And I've noticed a little bit of the same thing, that it seems like he's a little bit dead-legsy. But, you know, they're in the grind now. They're trying to get a top three, top four seed. I don't think they have any choice. I was surprised he played on Friday night, but I think these guys, at this point, it's such a dramatic difference to be three or four versus falling down that. Eight is the scary one. Nobody wants to be eight.

1:02:38People will play these guys and back-to-backs, whatever. Nobody wants to be eight. So that's it. Oh, the Jim Coughlin Award. For you think you're better than me. last year this was won by the LeBron JJ pod I guess we could give it to the Nash LeBron pod this year to mind the game I don't know if you had any other candidates I've learned to love Shaq I didn't really appreciate him when I was younger I guess I did from a basketball sense but I was never necessarily rooting for him and I think at that point once he was at the Lakers I was certainly more into my commonwealth phase so it wasn't likely that I was going to root for him.

1:03:21So I've learned to love him. He feels incredibly sincere. You know, somebody that's a public figure. His honesty, the way he's talked about stuff. But I mean, just, I'd say you think you're better than me would be Shaq against anyone that's currently playing. Like he just can't help himself. And we'll have these games that are just incredible performances and then somehow the conversation just pivots back to that they couldn't guard him. And if I were a producer, I'd go, dude you have figured it out you're great on this show it was a really tough show to come into you know in the beginning i thought with shack that first year is bad yeah is this going to work is he looking at those other two guys being like i was a better player than you so i should be a bigger star than you but it's like hey charles is just the star of the show and then everybody kind of plays off of that and for whatever reason like it almost feels so important that they developed him like they've he's done a great job developing himself on television developing himself on television everybody behind the scenes like it's it's really important that he's there and I would say to him if I were on the show I'd be like just be a like be cautious of playing the same note over and over again especially when you have a night in the NBA that's like should be celebrated it's a good note oh this is a great one the Andre Blatch Award for most immediately regrettable extension and somehow we had six nominees including Joel Embiid I'm throwing Laurie Markin in Jamal Murray throwing him in Brandon Ingram happened during the season.

1:04:47Patrick Williams and Scotty Barnes. The answer is obviously Joel Embiid, but it's just fun that we had six nominees. And Markkinen, I shoehorned a couple in there that probably weren't that regrettable, but it is Joel Embiid is our answer. I'm saving Ingram for something else. That's totally fine. Markkinen, surprised you would nominate, although it's a bit alarming, but I think that team had just so many on-ball guys that were young and they were like, we want to lose anyway. so we're not going to worry about it. The Patrick Williams one, Sneaky deserves like a lot of credit here. Five for 90.

1:05:24Yeah, and he's just, he had a dunk that the other night and I was like, this is awesome. They're also down 30, I think, to Oklahoma City within minutes of the game. But the Embiid and the Embiid timeline of it is really why there shouldn't be anybody else receiving votes for this one. Would you consider changing the name next year from Andre Blatch to Joel Embiid award if Embiid doesn't come back next year? Or did Andre, having an extension that got in the steed and making NBA history that way, should that just cement the award for him forever? I have a really soft spot for Andre Blatch. Okay.

1:06:06Like we used to talk about him all the time with Van Pelt and I did Wizards Daily because if you go back to those Blatch years, that group, and then I followed Blatch. That was your first book. Yeah, I didn't get, I mean, I still have to pay the advance back, but they had a thing where they would be on the road. And like, I think one guy on the team complained about having to pay a cover charge, going to a club. Like they were just constantly sharing with you everything you could assume about like where their heads were at that season. Early internet too. And the early social media internet, which made it more fun.

1:06:39Blatch's profile pic was incredible. So I followed him immediately. And then every now and then he would just drop these gems and then like they'd had a bad losing streak again. And I felt bad for him because he was like just walking around trying to figure it out. It was like late at night. The other thing, I don't know if this could ever be a category. I don't know if it's a segment, but it could be horniest guy on Twitter because I'll tell you with the for you feed, you know, look, if you see somebody cute, you might look on a profile picture. Right. And then next thing you know, you're like, hey, this guy likes cute girls, which I think makes, you know, checks a lot of boxes for a lot of American males out there.

1:07:13So then you'll see like a picture and you'll go, oh, this guy follows her. And then if I'm being honest, I've kept track of it a little bit. Oh, I'll go. There's a few dudes that are not afraid to hit that follow button. And it just does circle back to the wizard. So I would like to have you keep it Andre Blatch forever just because I like talking about him. I miss him. He made a great case. Great passer for his size. Ball handling.

1:07:46The 2025 Ewing Theory Award. For star most likely to be Ewing Theory next season. I have John Morant, Zion, and Booker as my three candidates. Booker eligible, never won a title.

1:08:04it's got to be jaw i agree although jaw had the uh the game winner the other night and uh had some memphis fans puffing their chest out a little bit about it and yeah i don't i don't they beat me right there we'll say he's he's your guy i understand we've been through this before Okay? We know how it works. He's your guy. He's given you a lot of special moments. So you're going to defend his guy. But I would say to the Memphis fans that are confused on why Jot would be fined versus other players doing the same salute. Like, all you have to do is go through the timeline and all the stuff and the Jalen Rose interview and all the things that he had to go through, which again, he brought on himself.

1:08:48And it's fine. Like, I'm not watching him going, oh, I don't like this guy because all this shit in the past. But it's fairly common sense that you end up being punished based on. how often you kind of fall into this category. It's like the Draymond, some of the Draymond stuff. He gets punished for a different level of scrutiny because of the past behavior. Welcome to life. The Lou Brown Award out of nowhere team that surprised us the most. Detroit, Portland, and Houston, I think are the three. And I would have to say, as great as the Portland, Houston, out of nowhere seasons were, it has to be Detroit.

1:09:25That team was all-time rock bottom last year and turned into a really fun league pass team. They're going to be a six seed, probably playing the Knicks in round one. There's going to be at least one awesome near fight in that thing. Cade turned into a real guy. And for me, it's Detroit. Who is it for you? So Detroit's the only team in a full season to triple their win total. So 14 and 68 last year. And I probably said too many times last season going as bad as they are, how are they worse than Washington? Roster-wise, this team has so many other things that I like about it versus what the Wizards had.

1:09:57and they still ended up finishing behind them, which speaks to the Monty thing, which you may never get a chance to change that award because it's not just going to be on record. It is about a dude who took a job who apparently had no interest in learning about his own players. It's a comical season. And they're still taking shots at him a year later. Anyone associated with that team is still pretty bummed out about how he approached the job last season for a variety of ways. there's a technical thing historically on tripling your win total because the bobcats in 2012 finished at seven and 59 and then went 21 and 61 the next year but remember that was a shorter season yeah so they had less games to play less chances there's not a bob are you going to do a bobcats documentary or would that be straight to is anybody going to do that have you been probably Probably a one-parter.

1:10:50Seems right. We'll take one more break, and then we have some good awards left. All right. One of our big categories. The ML car trying to trade for a retired Michael Jordan award for goofiest but possibly real off-season subplot. I have five what-ifs for you. This is for the summer. What if the Lakers shopped Luka? What if KD opted out and signed for a vet minimum to chase a title? what if Lamello, Zion, and Jow were in the same three-team trade? What if Paul George demanded a trade? And what if Phoenix said, fuck this and just stretch Bradley Beal? Those are my five nominees for goofiest but possibly real offseason subplot.

1:11:40Without knowing the nominees, I had Beal in that you're dealing with somebody who seems totally happy just going, I don't care. Yeah. And that's dangerous. Send the checks every two weeks. But what is it? Do you think there's any scenario where he goes, all right, like, I know you don't want me to be here and you guys brought me off the bench for this stretch and this hasn't been a good season. I mean, I don't know. I mean, what's the market for him on top of everything else? Does that fix their problems? Probably not because he's at this point. There's only one way to do it at this point. and it's happened a couple times in the history of the NBA.

1:12:19I remember Reggie Theus was a good one. I can't remember if he was on the Bulls or the Kings, but he just got benched and they just didn't play him and they basically tried to break him. The cap situation was way different back then than it is now, but that's Phoenix's last resort is to just not play him anymore and be like, all right, we'll keep paying you, but you're just not going to play basketball. So I think it will get to Game of Chicken. He might be okay with it though. That's the problem. Yeah. Whatever I watched in that Boston game, I was really startled by it. I hadn't seen anything remotely approached that in a while.

1:12:53It doesn't, in the social media era, it doesn't really happen. By the way, when he also was out for that stretch, there was this kind of tease Phoenix moment where they were, I liked the way they were playing again for like 10 days or something like that. Yeah, and then they got killed and Durant got hurt and the moment was over.

1:13:16so Phoenix stretching Bradley Beal which nobody's been stretched with two years and 100 million left on their deal but as a way to get under the second apron and just basically take the hit for the next five years it's not inconceivable the Zaza Pekuli award for the one rule that absolutely needs to be changed what did you have for this off arm drives from the offensive player it's you know this isn't my big rant like last year uh where i just kind of lost my mind on that podcast but i think we're all better for it but this is just there's certain players kind of the pj washington where you guys are hitting the hole like a running back and they have that forearm locked out davion davion mitchell had one the other night where he drove and hit a defender so hard and then got the shot up and there was like a little bit of contact coming back towards him and Davion looked at the refs like, are you guys kidding me?

1:14:11He touched me. And you're like, dude, you're mad? You off-armed this guy. So I think there's a little cleaning up that has to be done on how aggressive the off-arm is of the ball handler on drives. I like it. I have two runner-up and then my number one. I'll make the annual plea. Please don't let coaches challenge block charges anymore. Let's just say the call is the call and we just move on. I never want to watch another replay of a review of a block charge. I don't think I should be able to have to eat the field goal attempt on a half court shot. I just get rid of that. Make it a team shot the same way they have like team rebounds.

1:14:51Because then I think it would inspire more people to try to take half quarter, three court shots. And we might have a couple. If you care about your field goal percentage that much that you end up seven to 15 instead of seven to 16, don't ask for the fucking ball on the inbounds. Yeah. How about one of the guys who doesn't care? That's what drives me crazy. He's like, so now you're going to pretend that you didn't get the shot off in time because you didn't want to hurt your field goal percentage. Stop getting the ball in the inbounds. Let the other guys that don't care and understand like as absurd as the shot is, that they're not more worried about a couple percentage points.

1:15:24I also think we should have 20 second instant replay challenges where within 20 seconds, it's like you think no, and we just flip it and keep the game going versus like the five minutes. But here's my big one. And you know what? I almost had this last year and I think it's gotten worse this year and I really hate it and I don't know where the end game is. But the rolling the ball and the inbounds pass, so the clock starts but the shot clock doesn't start and this whole game of like the ball's just going to roll and we're going to kill time and then somebody's like, all right, fine, I'm going to run.

1:15:57First of all, somebody's going to get injured on this at some point. Somebody's going to dive into somebody else's legs and somebody's going to lose their knee. I just think it's so fucking stupid. you roll the ball and the shot clock should start and the game clock should start. I don't know why they do it this way. And I would change this. So that's my passion for this year. So. Yeah, I'm cool with that. I don't know that we're ever going to get shorter reviews. We might pretend we are, but 22nd quickie reviews. I left this award open for you. The Ben Simmons award for best Ben Simmons moment.

1:16:26Figured you'd have something and you could just go. Yeah. He had a push shot the other night. It was a couple of weeks ago where it was pretty ugly coming out, but then it went in and then based on the confidence from that first one going in he had hit back-to-back shots within a few minutes of each other which I think has to be one of the highest output moments we've had in a rotation I thought it was that until last night playing Dallas to uh Anthony Davis is on the left side he has a primary defender on him Simmons is the low man and Simmons rotated a double Anthony Davis and then communicated in a way that you don't see where it was almost like, hey, you see Davis over there?

1:17:04This is like while the clock is going. I'm going to now go over here and double team him. So you've got to slide over if somebody cuts behind me. And everybody's like, great, that's awesome. And then Davis ran. So I thought it was great communication, even if it felt a little slower than what I'm used to. Well, so you went positive Ben Simmons moments. Yeah. I was going to go for the preseason media day for the Nets when he said how he's going to be a leader this year for the team. I had that. Buyout watch was fun. Then they bought him out. The 2010 Baron Davis Award for single best mail-in. This is, I think, the toughest category we've had so far because you could make a small case for Paul George on the Sixers most years, but not this year.

1:17:55Jimmy Butler on Miami and Bradley Beal just the whole season. and it is like bird magic in the mid 80s we could argue about this for days i personally think it's butler on miami because he was willfully trying to force their hand to get traded and doing all kinds of things but i i also can't shake beal and i don't want to have co-winners so i'm gonna i'm gonna let you pick

1:18:21yeah i mean if you're just going jimmy but you know like any great drama he's got that kind of redemptive arc right now, as annoying as that may be. And I would expect Miami fans should be annoying. I guess, you know, it's hard to pretend that you're in, but I'll never understand lacing them up, going to play basketball and then going, I don't care if I look bad. I can't imagine having that inside of you where you would go, well, that guy scored on me because I don't care. or I didn't try to help us win because I don't care. And I'm just not really going to play that hard. I've already made my money or whatever.

1:18:59You'd think some of that stuff, at least with all the bullshit that Durant has gone through, where some of it I think is unfair, some of it is certainly fair, and he's brought it on himself, so I'm not absolving of blame here. But it's been a pretty soap opera-ish second half of Durant's career. But there's never been a moment where I've seen him going through all of his stuff where I haven't, like, I've never questioned how much he wanted to play basketball. I think once he finally gets out there, like, he wants to beat you the entire time. And look, there's 450, 500-plus players over the course of the season.

1:19:32There's going to be a couple guys that actually don't really love basketball and don't really care. But I can't imagine actually being really good. Like, Beal's an incredibly talented player. We all know how good Jimmy can be. It'll forever blow my mind that somebody has that ability and maybe that's just a disconnect of them looking at it as a job and I'm still just in love with the game going like, I don't care if I look bad in front of all these people that came to see me tonight because I'm getting paid and I don't care. So my tiebreaker would be Beal because... Yeah, I think that's the right answer.

1:20:02Because at least Butler, something really seemingly catastrophic happened with him and Pat Riley and there was some sort of breach, whoever was right, whoever was wrong, that made it impossible for Butler to play even at a decent level for them anymore. He was just broken in Miami. I don't know what Beal's excuse is. And look, the metrics are the worst he's been at since his third year in the league. The last time he's played, I think, more than 60 games is 2018-19. So even when the trade was made and we understand how talented he is, because I remember I had said, like, if you go through this, this guy's missing like 20, 25 % of the season.

1:20:42and there was some pushback because I was using total games on the shortened seasons. It's like, okay, but you're still, you're making an excuse for a guy that doesn't seem like he's available enough. He just doesn't, on top of everything else, which again, you know, if you're Phoenix, with the effort that you get from him on certain nights, you'd almost rather him not be available. We got to rip through a couple of awards here. The Shane Battier Award for Sloan Conference, Statener, Darling DuJour. this just happened, that big article on Jokic's defense and him kicking passes and how he's had the most kick passes in this decade and more kick passes.

1:21:22This whole thing about Jokic, like the, actually his defense, by the way, I've always felt this way. I think when you take like the best players, I still feel like, I felt this way about Steph. I felt this way about Bird and Magic once upon a time. Even though Magic would get torched by small guards, but those guys were always, they're always in steals. They were always like could read what the other team was doing. They're always good coming out of timeouts on defense. But I like this whole Jokic thing. And then the other candidate for this is Jokic's on-off stuff is just the most incredible it's ever been.

1:21:56I mean, when he plays, they have like a 125.4 rating or something like that, which would be the best ever. And when he doesn't play, they're 30th in the league on offense. So they're either best all time or worst in the league, depending on whether he plays or not. There's so many good advanced stats that I swear, I think there's going to be some late Jokic momentum for MVP next week, even though it seems like Shea has it locked up. I think the stats are so crazy, and I don't want to spoil next week's pod. The stats are so crazy, and the season has been so unbelievable. Fandle has Shea at like minus 1 ,000 or something like that.

1:22:31I don't know if it's over yet. That's all I'm going to say. Sounds like somebody's leaning Jokic. which nobody's leaning anywhere. The David Kahn Award for Worst GM Performance. So my big question is, does this now become the Nico Harrison Award? Did he do enough to supplant David Kahn? Who took Johnny Flynn and Ricky Rubio over Steph Curry, among 17 other terrible things he did. Okay. Nico was good last year. Okay. So just one bad night? pretty bad one this isn't I can't believe I called her it's like I can't believe I married a cocktail waitress in Thailand yeah well nominees Nico Harrison Sacramento firing Mike Brown and then panic trading De 'Aaron Fox New Orleans throwing Dyson Daniels into the Murray trade Miami's entire handling of the Jimmy Butler deal or Denver being$5 million under the second apron and not having a bench.

1:23:39Those would be my David Conner Award worst front office nominees, but the answer is Nico Harrison. But I at least think you should bring up Masai because Masai is now... Oh, with all the extensions. Great. Let's add him. Right. So Masai's side-end scene with Ingram gave him three years,$120 million guaranteed. And you could say he hasn't played a game for him yet in side-end scene. Obviously, he knows what he's doing. look at the free agent thing that we teased earlier like maybe there's a number out there for ingram that's higher than we could imagine which is usually the lesson that we hear or uh i should say experience every time we start going like oh why is that guy gonna make that much money and then he gets signed to it but it's scotty barnes ingram quickly rj barrett and purdle next year for a combined 156.4 million dollars seven seed at best I don't know I mean look what if they get their players back and play them maybe with dark who knows I mean they've they've outperformed everything you could possibly imagine the second half of the year so maybe they're just developing all the guy maybe there'll be the deepest team in the league next year it's just an expensive five I'd love to know for that five I'd love to know why Denver didn't do a little bit more this year.

1:24:54I don't understand how their bench is this bad when you are being blessed with the best offensive player since God knows when. No, not top 20, but pretty good, yeah. Not top 20, but close. Yeah. I just want to shout them out. You have this amazing asset you have to spend when you have an asset like that, and they're not doing it and they own other teams that's not getting the money it's very strange to me you know what though is this might be the i drafted these guys i brought in pickett i brought in watson you know i brought in swather you know just trust me i know what i'm doing well i don't think you do um because i think a lot of people would want to play denver in the playoffs the way this is shaken out denver and memphis are the two teams i think people are fine playing as great as Jokic is.

1:25:46It'll be funny if they get bounced out. I'm just advanced scouting Jokic. There was a fly in front of me for those watching on the clip. I'm advanced scouting it because if he loses in the first round, then it's going to be like, can we get Marcus Morris back in here? Let's see. Can we have him? He's outside the building. I would say them and Memphis are the two best candidates for the 4-0 sweep. in round one, if we were going to have a shocking, I can't believe that team got swept, I would have Denver and Memphis. The Vitaly Potapico award for worst deadline trade, named after the time Rick Pitino during a strike season, gave up an unprotected first-round pick for Vitaly Potapico that turned out they could have either taken Sean Marion or Andre Miller, and they didn't get either because they got a backup center.

1:26:34So I don't love Miami dumping Dennis Schroeder for no reason when they got him in that deal, when they clearly kind of want to be a playoff team, I guess. But at the Mark Williams trade, when you have Luka and you have this chance in the West for the Lakers to do that trade and then to back out of it and then just kind of get nothing. And now it's unquestioningly going to haunt them in the playoffs that they don't have a center. I have to nominate that. Deadline is the trade is the Mark Williams cancellation trade. That's what I have.

1:27:09I don't know what's going to happen with LA here. I don't know what's going to happen in the West. Okay. Other than I think OKC is going to beat all of these teams and I'd be really, really surprised if they're not representing the West. I think they're that good. Me as well. And they have all of these options and it's hard to find like a flaw with them. I mean, I guess we saw one Friday night. What would you say that is? The double big lineup. They had some issues. They kind of got pounded on the boards in a way that I was like, oh, okay. We'll fly in the oinkment. All right. Credit to EME too for the the double big patience because early on with that game you watch that game adams was like they were like impactful in that game yeah yeah i don't know that wasn't nothing but no i came back in after a tough day on the seas and then watched it late and it's sometimes you're better watching it when you know what happened yeah because now you're not watching it with anticipation you're just watching trying to figure out what was going on and you know i think there'll be sometimes like this is being really really critical of an awesome team historically here yeah but there'll be some like case and wallace minutes where you go well is that and then i'm like what are you what are you mad about all eight guys not being off the charts impossible to deal with on both ends of the floor because i think last year as we were ramping up for the playoffs like right around this time last year we were talking celtics and you just laid it all out like whatever your issues are and i think we both had them with some of the late offensive stuff There's still games with the Celtics offense.

1:28:37I'm like, is this still really good? And then it's like last 15, second in offense. It's like, yeah, it is. It is that good. At some point, math becomes math. Right. OKC's math is outrageous. I'd like Drew Holiday to have the ball in his hands more often on some of these threes. But that's just what they're going to do. And so even if there's a night where I don't really love it, and then you go check the numbers again and be like, hey, you just have to love it. Move on. Accept it. you laid out the stat profile historically point differential all this stuff what okc is doing right now puts them at least on a regular season list of one of the all-time special teams are you the same place with them now that you were with boston last year where it was a bit of a wake up of like hey whatever you think of this team they're awesome and headed to the playoffs and should be the clear favorite and we should stop questioning it just because it feels new with them I think they're the clear favorite in the West.

1:29:29The only difference with them in Boston is Boston at least had had a bunch of guys who had been in a bunch of big games and big situations. I shouldn't even say it's new. You're right. No, but that's the only thing you're going to nitpick on if you're going to nitpick OKC is like, well, we just have to kind of see it. They got to win four straight rounds. They're going to be playing some of the best players in the league and some of the best players of all time. And let's see. But the math is saying it would be a complete aberration if they didn't make the finals. Like something really, really, truly fluky would have happened.

1:30:01And then when they play Boston, we've seen those games and they had really two fourth quarters where they really stuck it to Boston. So yeah, if you're betting your life, OKC's the pick. I don't think there's any question. But who knows? I did that Houston game gave me a little hope. We were like, oh, I wonder if we'll see this in the playoffs. I wonder if teams are going to try to bang them around.

1:30:27let's do the team or an award for best most polarizing NBA family member which I think was obviously brawny this year just because of all the content he generated we don't need to cover all the other family members this one I'm really excited about because this is really where you shine and I'll be interested to see how many guys we have in the same list the Reggie Lewis I don't know I just like this guy award for young guy who doesn't play much but you just kind of like last year, Kamara was on our list for this. I have the following nominees and feel free to throw in anybody else. The two Nets guys, Keon Johnson, Jalen Wilson.

1:31:06Those guys just fucking play hard every game. Every time I watched the Nets, I'm like, Jesus Christ, this guy's really give a shit. Bryce Sensabaugh on Utah. I don't know how much Utah you've watched, but the catch and shoot numbers are, are, are crazy. Like he's clearly going to be a nine man rotation guy for a good team at some point in his career. We've talked about Ron Holland before. I still like Walker on the Pacers. I don't know why, and I can't explain it. Guy Santos on the Warriors. The plus minus is crazy for him, and he also seems very comfortable playing with Hall of Fame players. And then I'll throw in A.J.

1:31:44Johnson just because Zach mentioned him on the pod last week about how he's looked a little frisky on the Wizards. Who do you have? Anybody else I didn't mention there's a few frisky wizards uh oh yeah including bub carrington who was my first choice for this at 32 the other night he is 20 in july and he's getting shots up now man he's getting those shots up he's 20 in july yeah oh my lord he's 6 '4 yeah i sent a text to somebody with the Wizards. Remember when they had that like fun Knicks game months ago? Yeah. I sent a text and said, Hey, you know, I know like you're not on everybody's radar, but I happened to catch like three games in a, in a 10 day span or whatever.

1:32:31I was like, you guys are playing really hard. And it was just a, thanks for watching. Hmm. I don't know if I shared that with you. Sometimes I'm repeating myself here a bit. I mean, I don't think you shared that one. Maybe I shared it off the air but I got Bub's your number one yeah and I'm gonna give a little love like his rotational stuff could be out of the mix here now as Minnesota probably feels better about what they're doing but Jalen Clark having a moment with this team where it's like hey Dillingham's gonna get the first minutes and I think it's a little too chaotic for him that they're not gonna trust him in some tight spots here Terrence Shannon not getting minutes when it felt like he was probably one of the more plug-and-play rotational guys that could come in and get you some buckets because of what he had done in college and he's older and all that kind of stuff.

1:33:12But there have been some defensive things with, with Jalen Clark with Minnesota where I'm like, all right, like this dude, this dude is, is ready. Like he's not remotely intimidated by any of this stuff. So I don't know what he projects to be the three point shooting numbers. You know, it's not like it's a high volume, but they're, they're pretty good and he just competes like crazy. And he, he kind of almost jumped the other guys that you would have more expectations for at certain times this season. I almost threw Shireman on this. Not enough of the sample size, but there's been a couple moments where you're like, oh, it's not nothing here.

1:33:54Carol Dawson, word for most unabashed tank job. Philly's 3-22 in their last 25 and actively trying not to win games. So I think they're the winner. Shout out to Utah. But they did it. You know, look, we can't even make fun of Philly because you're sitting there and you're looking at the OKC pick and when this conversation started ramping up, it's like they have the seventh or eighth worst record in the NBA. And this is the part where I, again, there's certain things with Daryl that I totally respect. It's like, well, if we're doing it, we're doing it. We're not screwing around. We're shutting down.

1:34:22Nobody's here. And they were 19 and 27 at that point. And if now on this four and 28 stretch, I mean, Quinton Grimes cost them a couple of games in there. This could have been, this could have been like a two and 30. This could have been a layup. Yeah. Dwight Howard. Sorry, dude. I can't help it. I just don't like watching you play basketball award. Julius Randall seems like a nice guy I just don't really enjoy watching him play basketball and he's my pick and he's been playing better lately than he's played on Minnesota all year but I just don't really enjoy it and I'll be honest 15, 16, 17 years at DeMar DeRozan at this point I think I'm good see I actually find myself coming back I just feel like I'm okay with it I'm okay with the experience and Kyle Kuzma is another one that I think I'm good.

1:35:16I just think I'm fine. I'm fine there. Who do you have for this award? I just wonder what it was like when Sacramento was like, hey, DeRozan, I can't believe you even offered up DeRozan because I think his closing fourth quarter, like getting to his stuff when he got Mobley twice in that game when they beat him, when the Cavs had that weird road trip stretch. just great he's the team's gonna go 40 and 42 again yeah but there was like the dwight howard stuff is so funny because dwight howard is really good yeah he was really good but then it was like hey i need to be taking all the shots at the end of the games it's like what did you work on this summer yeah like if i get fouled i'm gonna make one of two uh yeah zach levine i just want to know what it was like for derosen when they were like hey guess what we we got zach levine again You played with them, right?

1:36:03Yeah, you guys have good chemistry. I played with them. Thanks for the 30 points, dude. It's tough. Levine had the rollercoaster ride. It was like a stock this year. Because I thought he was good on the Bulls. And then he left and the Bulls were way more fun to watch right away, which probably wasn't good for him either. Look, I'm telling you, I could do 30 minutes on this. But there are guys that aren't my favorite. it and I come to that conclusion after a lot of watching and noticing things and I don't think that it's a coincidence to some of the dudes that I haven't been a huge fan of and guys that I'm talking about that are talented that usually can score and put up some big big numbers but you know you look at all the Lakers stuff this year and you go what's different like hey D 'Azur Russell isn't out there for 30 plus minutes a night you know and the second Levine's out of there even with his ability and the scoring numbers and all this stuff you know like what's different about Chicago like well you know even with his numbers like you're removing all the other little things that are just he never seemed to click for him and so those are the players that I I just won't argue about sometimes you're one trade away sometimes you're one injury away Ray Allen 2010 playoffs trick-or-treat award goes to a team or a player.

1:37:30I'm going Houston Rockets for this because I've changed my mind on them 17 times during the season. And I'll probably change it a couple more times as we go. But I went from thinking, this is the team you want to play in the playoffs to, I don't know, they kind of freaked me out in that OKC game. And in general, they've held this two spot and I kept waiting for them to fall to pack and they had that little losing streak. It's never perfect. I don't love their offense in the last six, seven, eight minutes, but they play hard and they're really tough. And, uh, and there's certain matchups where they just overpack.

1:38:03I mean, they got rebounded OKC by 15 rebounds the other night. Granted the game meant nothing to OKC, but, um, I don't know what to make of them in the playoffs. This might be it. There might be no gear at all. It might just be bad shots down the stretch and they lose the series 4-1 where they led into all five? Or maybe there's something more there. I don't know. I don't know what to make of them. Clippers for me because Kawhi looked great again last night. Getting his stuff. Going left. Pull up. Can't do anything with it. You know, an off the break kind of transition three where you just can see that he's totally locked in to what he wants to be.

1:38:43Zoo has been a beast. If you get Zoo against the wrong team, meaning the wrong team for the other side because there's just a few teams here that want to play small like i don't know if i don't think the lakers want to play jackson hayes a ton of minutes i don't think that's breaking news okay so they'd rather go small but when they're playing against golden state and i don't know that i'm right about this but you're like are you playing into their hands a little bit by playing small and then them being like the answer is yes they're like we're please we can play draymond at the five thank you yeah so this is wonderful so then when i think about like houston having the double big thing which changes a lot of like how you think about their closing group depending on the big guys they're going up against like the clippers with the way zoo is playing yeah and i know that it's it's a coin toss for harden and all the playoff stuff although i think i kind of joked with you like you think he'd be due just to kind of have like a nice little like run but i feel like his pace does not adjust to the pace that you need it to and that's why he has the problems that he's had.

1:39:44But there's a scenario where there's a first-round matchup for them and I'm going, oh my God, is there a path here? Is there a path to being in the West Conference Finals? What if they played OKC in round one? Imagine. I've seen them play twice in person and I was like, shit, this would be an awesome playoff series. And they have a couple things they bring to the table that aren't great for OKC. Now, there's some things OKC brings to the table that are horrible for the Clippers, But it's, my point is, that's not a typical 1-8 matchup. That's not the Cleveland Cavaliers playing Orlando with no Jalen Suggs in round one.

1:40:17Like, that's a hard series you're going to have to win. Do you think there was something? Like, it wouldn't be a national media thing because nobody would really care. But considering how all in they went on the Kawhi stuff and how he hasn't been healthy at the end of the playoffs or the end of the year for a bunch of seasons in a row, the Paul George part of it, and then what you've given up, and then watching SGA become, I mean, there's just a lot of shit here where you go, man. Imagine. Imagine if they had some moment of like a 2-2 series in the Western Conference Finals where you go, you know, those guys, Lawrence Frank and the crew, like the strategy was the right strategy and it couldn't have gone.

1:40:55But yet, is there this redemptive arc where they repaired it on the fly and let Paul George just walk because they knew better than anybody else, although they still did offer the three years. Is there some part of this where we're being brought into game five and somebody's written a Wright Thompson essay? Oh, on the Torture Clippers? Yeah. Well, if you go to the last 25 games, which is a huge sample size, they're fifth in net rating. And when Kawhi plays and looks like the way he's looked really for a few weeks now, I just wouldn't want to see that team. And honestly, I wouldn't want to see Minnesota either if I'm OKC.

1:41:37We both think they're going to make the finals. But it just sucks that those are two possible 1-8 matchups. Like you play, you're going to win 68, 69 games. And that's your prize. We only have a couple of words left. We can rip through this. The white chocolate was a problem award. For 2025 guy whose season was much better in 40-second Twitter highlights. I'll give you Ja, Zion, LaMelo, Jordan Poole or Russell Westbrook who do you have? The turn by Nuggets fans on Westbrook here is amazing it feel like that game I mean that's another team that might fall to 7-8 that game was a catastrophic loss like to waste that level of where Jokic got to that game and to have it 19 times and then blow it and they haven't won since look he's fine as your ninth guy and as your guy we're resting all the starters russ can you just go out there and do everything and put up a 32 10 10 let us hang around but wait he i just don't know how you play him in crunch time in some of these games it's too it's too much of a wild card it's too risky right the risk exceeds the reward can't do it you've yokage and murray and gordon and Porter and Braun, like that's it.

1:43:01Rush should never play in crunch time for them in a playoff game. This is what I've thought the entire time because Westbrook has been more accepting of this role with them than at any other point. But there may have been, even for somebody as stubborn as he is with his approach to basketball, like maybe even he had a realization of going, I need to change this a little bit. And when you're playing in the same minutes, the same lineup as Jokic, like you can see him almost in a hurry to get him the ball back that could lead to those other problems but like on the year considering how bad they needed somebody to play these kind of minutes a guy that was never really going to like question his own value uh the ego of a player that you kind of need as a foundation to even play in this league they needed like it's been a win because of how limited their options were it's like okay well we're going to get this guy cheap because he's been on six teams here in a very short amount of time because he hasn't fit in and maybe hasn't accepted what he needed to be so I think there was an acceptance part from Westbrook here that was admirable but I think anybody that kind of knew where his limitations were you were like is he actually going to close like it's and and I'm with you and it's not just the mistakes in that Minnesota game there's just a lot of times where you're like what's the spacing going to look like?

1:44:19Is that going to screw up some of the other stuff they're going to do? I also think there's something with Westbrook too, depending on the matchup, like it's going to be if I get to play the Lakers, I'm going to prove to them that they're morons. If I get to play against the Clippers, I'm going to there's a revenge factor with like four of these teams. How many minutes do you think he's played this year?

1:44:40Are you asking me total minutes? Total minutes. How many do you think he played? I don't know off the top of my head. I mean, he's played... What would your guess be? I'll just tell you. 2 ,002 minutes heading into tonight's game. He's played 2 ,000 minutes. That's crazy. They paid nothing for him. So for that, it's a win. The loss is when he's actually involved in the plot, when they're desperately trying to not fall into that 6-7-8 range. And they had a pretty good foothold for the three spot. And now it's looking pretty grim. No, he's been really important throughout this season because of their lack of options.

1:45:20And so it has worked out. But the hesitation I always had with it was, let's see what happens here in the playoffs. Because I think this could be the kind of thing where the game log, now who knows, maybe it could be game and score and foul trouble, all that kind of stuff. But like if we're talking real close games in the first round for Denver. Yeah, he's not out there in the last eight minutes. You look at some of those game logs and it's like, okay, 19 minutes, 15 minutes, and then you're like, uh-oh. So who's your white chocolate was a problem guy? I would say if you took Isaiah Stewart clips from today and then ran them and said that this was the 90s were like, then everybody would just say, oh, Steph would have just had 12.

1:45:59Oh, he would have been killed. That's good. I like that. My least favorite con. The Stewart pulling down Giannis from behind play is indefensible. That's fucking nasty, man. Especially the top five guy in the week. All right. Three words left. The Travolta and Pulp Fiction comeback of the year. Jimmy Butler. the Lakers as a franchise or Scoot Henderson? Who do you have? Scoot. Okay, me too. Well, this is it. The second most prestigious award we have. It's the 2025 Shamit Face Award. This is your award. I know you put a lot of time and thought and effort into this. So who do you have? Concanipple.

1:46:42On Duke? Yeah. Oh, so you're going prospects. yeah i've already graded it out what do you what do you like about it i don't know what age that the red cheeks thing goes away he's awesome by the way i think i like he's even better than maybe we realize maybe get him the ball a few more times last night but you get older everybody looks younger there's a weird thing that happens i don't know what it is with the science of it but if you look at like fraternity composites yeah when you're in college all of the guys from the old pictures look like you're like how come that guy was 40 and he was in college and you're like that's just dudes looked older and then when you're older and then you're watching college hoops like every year guys just look younger and younger and younger so I don't think he's on the Mount Rushmore of Duke face I think that's early Cherokee parks maybe a little Quinn Snyder in there maybe Grayson Allen maybe Danny Ferry so I don't know if Knipple can make that, but there's just a face and, um, it's not the same thing as Shamit face, but I'm just projecting them maybe to be there one day.

1:47:47And it doesn't even mean that, you know, you're, you can be good looking and have Shamit face. You'd say no when you see it. Yeah. Last award, the 2024 league pass MVP award, most reliably entertaining guy day after day for six months. my winner is Nikoli Jokic it's really the only winner but I would offer up Ant if I had to offer up somebody else as like an alternative like independent spirit awards kind of winner if you can't have Jokic I go with Ant even the Sixers closed the other night it was awesome the shots that he was hitting in the double overtime win against Denver I don't know what it is about the threes when they matter the most it's almost like a pitcher who cranks and it's not what he's doing, but it's like the shot goes in with more velocity than it's supposed to on the ones that really matter.

1:48:44There's a, there's a crispness to his shot and his athleticism and the way that it goes in that's visually appealing. You know, it's funny you mentioned this cause it's, it's not a rational confidence cause he's rational and confident, but I do think like if it's one eight and it's okay, see Minnesota, I think out of anybody in the league, he's the one who would go into that series going, I don't care what the record is. I'm better than everybody on that team. And like really genuinely, truly believe it, which has been really fun to watch. And he's had some great last three minutes of the game, kind of turning it up a notch stuff.

1:49:24That how old is he now? 23? I don't know. I think he's 23. Yeah. It's, that's a good one. But Jokic, this Jokic season and it doesn't look like he's going to win the MVP but holy shit man there's been 10 games from him this year that you're just like I just can't believe somebody's doing this like when you go look at the Wiltshire stats on basketball reference like oh my god it wasn't just a 50 point a game there was this other season he had 44 a game like what was that like to watch that not that Jokic is putting up points like that but just the day to day It honestly feels like any box score is conceivable.

1:50:05He's had box scores where there's no way anyone in basketball could ever have this. And he's had five of those this year. But then when you watch just how he does everything for them, he's their only real rebounder. He runs the offense. He scores all their stuff in crunch time. He sets up everybody else. Everything he does, I've never seen anything like it day to day. we didn't have league pass in the 80s for you know the great players of that era and we only got to watch Jordan when he was on you know TNT we didn't get to watch this night after night this is fucking crazy I'm seeing I look sounds like somebody's leaning Jokic

1:50:47I'm not leaning anywhere yet I I'm I'm keeping an open mind to the last week of the season it's really tough for me not to vote for somebody who's going to win 68 games and have one of the great guard seasons in the history of the position offensively. Especially when I try to value the winning piece. He's going to win 20 more games than Denver. But the more I stare at this, that 60-10 game broke my brain. That was unbelievable. Have you ever seen somebody just get the ball 25 feet from the basket and the other team knew what he was going to do and he would still back around and just get like a three-foot skyhook?

1:51:24Like what the fuck? I know there are missing some guys in Minnesota, but I just thought that game was just nuts. It wasn't just the points. It was how he was getting the points and how easily he was doing everything. It was nuts to watch. That's where whenever I hear anybody just knocking him, I lose my mind because you go, he's in control of everything that's happening. Like everything that's happening. And then the understanding, I forget what the number was. I don't know if it was Harden to Zubat for number one, but it was like who has the most field goals that are assisted or something. Like Christian Brown is number two in the NBA.

1:52:00Christian Brown, clearly because Denver hasn't done a good job with his roster maximizing it maybe the way others should. I also wonder like if Jokic were different, would there have already been some other star player that went through AAU with Jokic and goes, hey, I'm going to come up there and play with Denver. because this is it's getting alarming because the rings rule for Jokic where it's like are we going to be allowed to appreciate him I know we've already touched on some of this other stuff but he's he's just orchestrating all of it that's happening and he doesn't want to shoot 30 times he doesn't want to pull up from three as much as he does it almost feels like Nash where Nash would have these games you're like how are you not shooting more like what's going on and it's just the way he's wired to play basketball is still somebody that wants all of it to kind of connect and work together and that's why i can't fathom why guys who played can watch these games and then find a way to shit on it but you know whatever i mean this kind of normal now with the former player stuff but yeah look really good not top 20 22 to 20 yeah i mean that bob pettit range yeah probably you know to busher

1:53:14all right those are our made up nba awards for 2025 congrats to all the winners and the nominees yeah next time i see you will be sunday night we will know the playoff matchups we will do some all nba stuff we might have to go uh might even have to go two parts but i can't remember that like looking at the West innings and some games are happening right now as we talk, but this West innings, the volatility of these last seven days is going to be bonkers to watch. Anyway, good to see you, Rosillo. Yeah, we got Lakers Thunder here. Are you watching the studio yet on Apple? I'm three in. It's great.

1:53:51You love it. Okay. How many of you watch? All three. You should get Rogan on. Seth or Joe? Is Joe watching it? I don't know if Joe's watching it. You got Lotus predictions for tonight before we go? Duke dad? Boy, did that meme play out pretty well. It's pretty predictable.

1:54:18I don't know. Somebody's going to jerk off somebody? That'd be amazing if they went back to the well. A double jerk. All right, I'll see you in a week. see you then alright that's it for the podcast thanks to Rosillo thanks to Kyle Gahau as well thanks to Saruti and don't forget White Lotus tonight on the Prestige TV podcast and you can watch it live on the Ringer Dash TV right after that show ends and don't forget we put up a rewatchable it's the same it's up we put it up three days early so that's what we got going I'm gonna be back on this podcast on Tuesday and I'll see you then

1:55:00When we saw our little ones say I don't have a few years with them On the wayside Must be 21 plus in president select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 plus in president DC. Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com Call 1-887-897777 or visit ccpg.org slash chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelpline ma.org or call 800-327-5050 for 24-7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8-HOPE-NY or text HOPE-NY in New York.