The Rejuvenated Cowboys, Most Desperate NFL Teams, Lane Kiffin’s LSU Move, and Guess the Lines With Cousin Sal, Todd McShay, and Van Lathan

13:14Cousin Sal:yeah I guess statistically we would have wanted the Eagles to win that game it would have increased our playoff chances right the Bears just staying at eight wins but I didn't have an M.A. to root for the Eagles at all. It's funny. It's fine. It's fine. I get it.

13:31Bill Simmons:But some of these teams getting better as the year goes along because the season is 100 weeks long. Right. The Bears, who were 22nd in DVOA heading into that game and had a bunch of either-or wins and just seemed like this year's horseshoe-up-the-ass team, they killed the Eagles. They did. They absolutely bully-balled them, ran the ball down their throats. Caleb did not play well. I didn't think, but he had a couple of good scrambles and he made one big touchdown pass. Their defense was good enough, but their offensive line, their running game, like it's a team that felt very wintry. It felt like you could see them in January being kind of a problem.

14:08Bill Simmons:I thought that was an awesome win. I have a few Bears fans in my life as do you. And it was the first time that they were like, wow, that was like a real football win and capped off with our guy, Ben Johnson, just going nuts in the post game and taking his shirt off.

14:21Cousin Sal:It's tough when you take your shirt off because where do you go from there? The pants are expected next, right? Like, what's he going to do?

14:28Bill Simmons:Yeah, I personally would have saved it for wild card, but I get it. He was excited. Also, pretty jacked too, Ben Johnson.

14:35Cousin Sal:I know.

14:36Bill Simmons:That goes a little differently if it's Andy Reid, I feel like. Maybe Andy Reid's jacked.

14:42Cousin Sal:Wouldn't that be the most surprising? Add that to your surprising list of playoff tricks. Yeah, you're right. They completely bullied them at the line of scrimmage, especially in the late third early fourth quarter when you thought the Eagles might be able to get back in it and then I don't like like we said like Hertz I don't know what's this guy legacy I like what is he like he won two Super Bowls for them he wasn't a Trent Dilfer type where it was just like along for the ride but you would also you would think that'd be enough to include him in the top five quarterbacks and we never put him in there it was always been Burrow Mahomes Allen Lamar right I don't know what order but it's very strange what how he's going to be remembered there's like a

15:22Bill Simmons:it's like a lack of urgency slash personality to their offense and now that Barkley doesn't look like the Barkley from last year when you watch it everything just seems really disjointed and you almost want them to go either you know up 20 or down 20 for them to actually look like whoever they are I like when they play with pace I don't know they have all these weapons like did Goddard play on Friday? I have no idea It seemed like he might have been out there. I don't even know. That guy was a couple years ago. We were talking about him as one of the best tight ends.

15:55Cousin Sal:I think a lot of these guys were emotional over the John Madden thing, which was somehow celebrated on every single game. Everybody had their own trophy. It's good.

16:05Bill Simmons:I mean, you and I loved Madden.

16:07Cousin Sal:Loved him, yeah.

16:08Bill Simmons:I think we're all good. We're all good. How many times can we pay tribute? dude.

16:16Cousin Sal:These guys also, these guys,

16:17Bill Simmons:Barkley dies. Is this what we're gonna do with Barkley? Like, is this?

16:22Cousin Sal:Saquon, he did. I think it was like week six. He died. We haven't, no Charles, you're talking about. Yeah. No, I know. And we did love him. And I even had a better appreciation of him when I watched the Cowboys documentary, how great those calls were, but you're giving these trophies to 24 year olds, 25 year olds who didn't even know Madden and they know the game and that's it. You know?

16:45Bill Simmons:Yeah, you have to make up your Madden story. What's your favorite Madden story? I remember one time the big dog and I were in an elevator,

16:52Cousin Sal:and he told me to keep my head up. Jason Garrett pulled out a turkey leg that he claims he has kept frozen since 1993. I'm calling bullshit on that. Yeah, I don't believe that story at all. I'm sorry. I didn't believe that story at all. I need proof. Unwrap that thing.

17:06Bill Simmons:Well, so the Bears, who I think none of us believe in, they play at Green Bay next week and have a chance to put down Philly and Philly and then Green Bay and Green Bay next week. The way they run the ball, I can't really knock them out of it.

17:21Cousin Sal:You got them two out of three weeks, I think, right?

17:22Bill Simmons:It's a shame we don't have the play-in tournament. I guess it's probably not a shame because it would be terrible, but if we had the play-in tournament like in the NBA, I would really like your team. Like, oh, Dallas is a play-in team, but watch out. If they can get in there, they could beat anybody.

17:37Cousin Sal:Well, enjoy it. It starts Thursday against Detroit. That's a playing game. And then the next four are also playing games.

17:43Bill Simmons:Well, you know what's funny about your team? I was thinking about today watching Josh Allen because I didn't think he was great today and then in the second half picked up. But maybe he's just getting older. Maybe he's taking some hits. But he had that thing going for a couple years where he seemed like that kid who was too big for the ninth grade football game. Right. Just wreaking havoc. And he's just like, oh, man, this isn't fair. This guy's too big for the game. And he kind of played NFL quarterback like that. And I don't feel like he's been as physically imposed in this year. And then the second half of the game today against the Steelers, he turned it up a little bit.

18:22Bill Simmons:But this was the year I thought he was going to be the guy. Like we were going to leave this season, but that's the best quarterback in the league. I feel like it's open right now. It's a little, I'll make an analogy just for you. It's a little like the year when Hogan stepped away from WWE and they was like, ah, Lex Luger. And Lex Luger was the WWF title holder for like 10 months because they didn't really know who to put the belt on. I don't know who has the belt for QB right now. So Mahomes is 6-6.

18:51Cousin Sal:Yeah. I don't know. Who is it?

18:53Bill Simmons:I mean, your guy's playing as well as anybody.

18:55Cousin Sal:I think so. The only thing I'll caution, we talked about it last week, like the Bills went 6-0 down the stretch two years ago to make the playoffs. And that's what put Allen right back up there. Yeah, this is a game where I felt like Pittsburgh could have stayed in. there and they but they kept the bills hanging around and then like I just don't get the bills to him like you like Pittsburgh as I did because the bills had two offensive linemen out and the bills were laying eggs on the road and then they get they set a record a rushing record for opponents and Accu sure and Hines three rivers whatever 249 yards with two offensive linemen out I don't even know what I watched there I think this Pittsburgh team is done we talk about the bills, but I really think they are absolutely done.

19:37Cousin Sal:Cook was great.

19:39Bill Simmons:And Pittsburgh, this was the second time in three weeks. The other time was the Chargers game when the quarterback played, just they had no chance. And whether he should have played or not, Rodgers, I don't know. You know, he fell in that hand once and then it seemed like he was going to leave and come back, but he was a mess the whole game. Rudolph's not much better. Offensively, they're just impotent. wasn't always the case. I thought they were going to be able to run the ball on Buffalo. Right. And they just couldn't. Then after the game, Rogers was taking shots at some of the receivers, but they're six and six and they're in a death match now with Baltimore and maybe Cincy.

20:19Bill Simmons:Cincy's two back with five to go and they play. They still get to play Baltimore once. They're at Buffalo next week. They're at Buffalo.

20:28Cousin Sal:So that's it for them if they lose. right? So they have to hope Baltimore

20:32Bill Simmons:and Pittsburgh split because Baltimore and Pittsburgh play twice. So Baltimore and Pittsburgh split and then both of them go one and two in the other three games, which I think is really conceivable because Pittsburgh's other three are home Miami, at Detroit, at Cleveland. Baltimore is at Cincinnati, home New England, at Green Bay. And since he just has to run the slate and they play at Buffalo, home Baltimore, at Miami, home Arizona, home Cleveland, it's doable.

20:59Cousin Sal:Yeah. again, at Buffalo, if they don't win that. That doesn't matter if Pittsburgh Ravens split or what. But to go back to my Lex Luger thing, Burrow

21:08Bill Simmons:could be the guy that kind of grabs it down the stretch. I'm like, no, actually, I'm the best quarterback right now, but I don't know who it is.

21:14Cousin Sal:I thought he was great, Burrow. And then I looked. He was. Did he seem like he was 24 for 46? That's what he was.

21:20Bill Simmons:No, he had the swagger though, which I think when you've had Jake Browning and 45-year-old Joe Flacco for 10 weeks. And then Burrow comes in doing his Joe Burrow stuff. And they only, you know, no Higgins. It's really just Chase.

21:36Cousin Sal:Even the incompletions, I guess, were ones that they go up for and they just didn't come down with. But everything seemed to be on the money. And everything seems great when you're going against Lamar who, I think, has seven fantasy points per week over the last three weeks. People are losing their minds.

21:50Bill Simmons:Well, this goes back to the best quarterback thing. Lamar would have been in that too. And Lamar has looked like, you know, Aaron Brooks in the mid-90s in these games. You don't feel like he doesn't move the same way. He's clearly not 100%. Not on the same... Whatever that offense they run does not fit for whatever his talents are. The Henry thing is interesting. He only had 10 carries in that game. I thought they were going to just bully the Bengals with him, and they didn't. I was trying to watch to see if I thought maybe he lost a step or not. I couldn't really tell. But his stats aren't the same.

22:26Cousin Sal:He had a thing where every other game he was over 90 yards and I try to catch him on this. This was the every other. And I thought this was okay. He's going to run it through Thursday night. Beautiful. No, you're right. 10 carats. Like, I don't know what that offense. And yet like Fandle loves them. They're minus 220 to win that division because Pittsburgh is so pathetic. And since he got off to such a late start.

22:47Bill Simmons:Yeah. Pittsburgh, Pittsburgh, I think kicked this one away and maybe they weren't that good to begin with. And I was thinking last year, Pittsburgh died as we hit the last like third of the schedule. Remember?

22:57Cousin Sal:Yep.

22:57Bill Simmons:They were like 8-2 or something, and they went backwards.

23:00Cousin Sal:But this was really it, right? This is like when Tomlin, when they're yelling fire Tomlin, and he says, I sympathize with everyone's frustration. Does that mean when you sympathize, you agree with them that you should be fired? They have no identity on offense. Rodgers, God bless him. He played with broken bones in his wrist, but then he ends up looking, his face is a mess. He looks like he bet against himself on a strips and then didn't pay his Croatian bookie. Like, he just got his ass beat in. It's like James Caan and the gambler. Yeah. Just got beat up. And then you got TJ Watt. Like, it's like, I think six games or seven games with no pressure.

23:36Cousin Sal:It's like, you paid these guys a fortune on defense. They really, they just have nothing left, I don't think.

23:40Bill Simmons:They really, really, really blew it with first not taking Dart. I think if you do that over again, you take him. But then, like, I don't know if Sanders is good, not good, mediocre, or whatever, but once we get to the fourth round, that's somebody they probably should have taken. and Mason Rudolph comes out there and you just have no faith in anything with that dude. Let's take a break and then I have a depressing question for you. The Bill Simmons Podcast is brought to you by FanDuel. Hey, Missouri. The wait is finally over. FanDuel Sportsbook live in the show me state. Right now, new customers.

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24:53Bill Simmons:Refund issued as a non-contributable bonus bet that expires seven days after receipt. Max refund,$20. Restrictions upon including token expirations. See terms at sportsbook.fanduel.com. This episode is brought to you by Michelob Ultra. The NBA Cup is back. It's sure to be thrilling as always. I think the one thing I always like with the NBA Cup, what team is going to come out of nowhere and kind of plant their flag and make us believe in them going forward? Because a big spotlight, national TV, good crowds. who's going to kind of step up in the playoff atmosphere. The best moments are served cold, just like Big Globe Ultra.

25:30Bill Simmons:Or a refreshing beer with only 95 calories. Plus, Ultra is also helping you see all the excitement up close and in person with a chance to win courtside tickets. Big Globe Ultra, superior is worth playing for. Enter now at michlobaltra.com slash courtside. Big Globe Ultra courtside, 25 to 26, no purchase necessary. Open U.S. Residence 21 +, begins on October 1st, 2025, ends on June 30th, 2026. multiple entry periods. See official rules at michelobelchurch.com slash courtside for free entry, entry deadlines, prizes, and details. All right, Sal. Which fans, which fan base should be the most depressed right now?

26:07Bill Simmons:I'm going to give you Steelers fans, Ravens fans, Lions fans, or Chiefs fans. The case for the Steelers is like, this is done. There's like no light at the end of the tunnel. even if you somehow sneak out the division what's going to happen? You're going to win multiple playoff games that's not happening and then what does your long term future look like? You don't know who your coach is going to be or your QB. Ravens you had this first half of the 2020s window with Lamar that you didn't even get to a Super Bowl. I don't even know if you want to keep the coach if you're them. You went all in on this Derrick Henry move.

26:49Bill Simmons:Lamar where is that heading? and did you just miss your window? Lions fans, those last two years were your window. You had all these injuries last year. It didn't happen, and now you just moved into the back of the pack, and I don't know if you're leapfrogging. You're probably not even making the playoffs. Then the Chiefs fans, it felt like you were headed for a three-peat. Mahomes was in the GOAT conversation. You're 6-6. You're two games behind the last wildcard spot. you might miss the playoffs when your guy was healthy the whole year, which has never happened with Brady ever. Right. When at any point of when he was actually Brady.

27:27Bill Simmons:I know you like throwing that in there. Yeah. Yeah. I'm going to mention that every time. So who's the most depressed out of those four Steelers, Ravens, Lions, Chiefs.

27:34Cousin Sal:This is easy for me. I mean, unless you're like a 25 year old Steelers fan, you've had history. You've had, you know, I'm going to count that, right. I'm going to count that for the Ravens. You've seen playoff games, the Chiefs, forget it. You've won Super Bowls. If you're saying looking forward, yeah, Yeah, these teams all kind of might be done. But the Lions, the Lions, because they never got over the hump. They had the great coach that everybody wanted, Dan Campbell, who I'm not sure is the right fit now anymore. You know, you had the excuse last year where you had like 20 guys on IR, 16 of them were on defense.

28:04Cousin Sal:Oh, our defense is going to be back. They were miserable against the Packers, just miserable. And you got the two fastest guys on the planet, and you can't figure out how to score 30 points a game. You're stuck with like 17 midway through the fourth. So I think they're a head-scratcher of a team. I'm most disappointed in them because I had money on their futures. But, yeah, I think, I don't know, which one do you go with? I mean, the Packers are biting more kneecaps than the Lions. I'll tell you that.

28:30Bill Simmons:The Chiefs fans, at least they can point to the Super Bowls and you can talk yourself in 100 excuses. We had Brady seasons like that where the team didn't have it and you just kind of regroup and retool. Ravens fans is a tough one because you never really had your moment with Lamar in the playoffs. Yeah, that's true. You didn't have one postseason. You're like, well, like even Buffalo, they got close with Allen where Allen actually 13 seconds came. Allen came through with his part and then the defense blew it. They had things to point to where they're like, well, yeah, yeah, but we didn't win, but we at least had this.

29:07Bill Simmons:The Ravens is just like a kick in the nuts every year in the postseason. and now it looks like they're going to win the division by going eight and nine. I think that's pretty ignominious. But I think I agree with you on the Lions fans because it felt like a week ago they were the next hot team. And now it just feels like it's over. And then on top of it, this wunderkind offensive coordinator dude they had that sometimes those guys leave and then they suck as head coaches, but it actually seems like he's really good. And that was a big part of your success, which I don't. there's not a lot of parallels for that where you had this awesome offense and it was like, well, who gets it?

29:46Bill Simmons:But then you see him in the Bears like doing this with a quarterback that really only completes 47, 48 % of his passes, right? And he's just kind of figured out how to keep them good. I think I'd be the most bummed out if I was a Lions fan.

30:00Cousin Sal:Yeah, I think the worst move Campbell made this year is admitting that he's calling the plays. Like, all right, man, you got the best in the world. You're calling the plays. that should last for more than one week, the success rate. And then, yeah, you're right. I mean, you lose too many coordinators. That's a problem. But to me, I actually thought the offense, I didn't think golf was terrible on Thursday. I was disappointed in that defense. They just could not get to it. It was ballsy, ballsy moves by LaFleur going for it on fourth and sixth and pretending to go for it and then calling a timeout.

30:30Cousin Sal:Like, all right, they're going to kick here. I'm like, oh my God, they are going for it. And then they just put the game away. They're like, we don't care. We're better than you.

30:36Bill Simmons:Yeah, I was really worried about them without Kraft, but they were getting it done. So to make the playoffs, just to put a bow on this, Ravens are still minus 220 to make the playoffs, which you mentioned. KC was even two hours ago. Now in Fando, it's like plus 104. Detroit's plus 120. And the Steelers are now plus 250. And they were in, I mean, think of the position they were in. What were they, four and two or five and one, whatever they were, and the Ravens were one and four with limping around Lamar. They had a three-game lead over them.

31:11Cousin Sal:You and I needed therapy. They were one in five, and FanDuel had them as a slight underdog. Like, what are we missing here? What is going on?

31:18Bill Simmons:Next time we know, just bet on it. Then you have the Jags minus 450 to make the playoffs, which I think is insane. I looked at their schedule. I know they have wins, but I still don't trust them. Colts minus 300, Texans minus 140, and the Chargers are minus 162. The interesting thing about the Chiefs, I actually think their odds should be a lot worse to make the playoffs.

31:41Cousin Sal:Yeah.

31:42Bill Simmons:Because they lost to Jacksonville, the Chargers, and Buffalo, three of the teams that they would, you know, potentially be in like a two-way tie, three-way tie, four-way tie for the six seed, seven seed, whatever. I don't really see a scenario where they make it unless they run the slate. And even if they run the slate, is that even going to be enough?

32:03Cousin Sal:It really might not be. And yeah, like you said, they lose as tiebreakers. I mean, we have so many elimination games next week. We have Detroit-Dallas. We have Houston-Casey, which is a night game. Cincinnati will be eliminated if they lose to Buffalo. It's a lot of fun. Then you have all that AFC South mess ahead of you. But I think everyone's afraid to bet against the Chiefs, but they know that plus number is insane for them to make the playoffs at this point. It's the way they're playing.

32:30Bill Simmons:Advanced metrics heading into this week, they were fifth DVOA. Yeah. They're playing two of the best defenses in their last five, Houston and Denver, but both of those are home. Denver might not even care at that point. They'll have the division locked up. They'll only care about one versus two. Then they have at Tennessee, at Vegas, which is two easy wins, but you look at their losses, Sal. They've lost to the Chargers, Eagles, Jags, Bills, Broncos, and Cowboys. so six like playoff or borderline playoff teams and they've only beaten baltimore detroit in indianapolis so they're three and six against good teams which to me is a sign you're not good

33:11Cousin Sal:and the one score games to complete 180 from last year where i think they went 11-0 in one score games they they won what was oh i guess the colts was a one score game but aside from that

33:21Bill Simmons:just loss after loss after loss as opposed to houston who's seven and five who didn't have their starting quarterback for three weeks at one point. They have four losses to the Rams, Tampa, Seattle, and Denver. Not bad. I mean, those are three of the six best teams in the league and Tampa. But they have wins against now Baltimore, San Francisco, Jacksonville, Houston, Buffalo, and Indy. So they played 10 playoff teams basically. And they're six and four. And I thought they had a really good win, which I want to talk about right now with that Indianapolis game that once again, that D 'Amico Ryan's, he had another game management thing where they're up four.

34:03Bill Simmons:And I don't know, the announcers were like, oh, interesting, he's going for it here. And it's like, kick a field goal. You go up seven. You've stopped these guys all game. Daniel Jones can't move. These guys, oh, the analytics say this. It's like, read the game sometimes. You go up seven, you're probably winning the game. I don't think the Colts are going all the way down the field. All of a sudden, they're on their heels, but they ended up winning that one. But did you watch that whole game? Because I thought that was the most fascinating game.

34:29Cousin Sal:You're going to laugh at me. I know you're all over Houston, and you saw Houston's promising ending before a lot of us, but Indy was my best bet. Did you know Jones was that compromised, though? Yeah, I thought he was. And then I looked at, like, Jonathan Taylor's had amazing games against Houston. Like a 188-yard game last year against them. Was it four over one? Like, that's it. They're just going to figure out the game plan. Although I didn't think it would be that Daniel Jones couldn't take off once ever, right? I might have gone against it that way. So you had the better team. I got it wrong.

35:04Cousin Sal:Sauce being out early might have made things different. That wasn't great. And also it might have been different if the refs recognized what a missed extra point looked like. Our friend Adam Carolla is right. Just extend the post to the moon. Who cares? It's fine.

35:19Bill Simmons:It's like some laser beam or something. then there's got to be some way to improve that. So Houston had...

35:24Cousin Sal:They're definitely not the same without a running quarterback.

35:28Bill Simmons:Indy had the ball for 25 minutes. They're three for 10 on a third down.

35:36Bill Simmons:Houston, to close the game out, they have a third and one and a fourth and one. And they do the thing where they just run the ball up the middle, even though they can't really run the ball when you know they're going to actually run the ball. But then they still snuck the game out. I think Houston's good. Yeah. Like when I think about that, I'm in that mode now, thinking of the Pats, playoff opponents. Like Houston's a nightmare matchup. Their defense is, that Will Anderson is in the running for best defensive player I've watched week to week this year. Definitely. You know who's actually in there is Crosby.

36:09Bill Simmons:Crosby's unbelievable in these Raider games. He's got 10 unbelievable plays during these, and nobody else on his team is good. But I'm really afraid of that defense. And they can run the ball just enough. Collins is good. Stroud, I'm not a huge fan of, but he'll make a play every once in a while. And really their biggest thing that would worry me if I was a Texans fan is the game management stuff. But I think they're better than 7-5.

36:35Cousin Sal:I think if you're the Chiefs this week, would you rather play Houston, Jacksonville, or Indianapolis? I think for sure Jacksonville.

36:42Bill Simmons:Houston's my third choice out of that. Even though they lost to Jacksonville.

36:45Cousin Sal:Definitely Jacksonville. Definitely the Colts who they beat. Whatever. Houston, you don't want to go up and take chances against that defense right now. Well, it's funny.

36:53Bill Simmons:When we talk before the year and we're figuring out the futures, which I don't think we did that well on the 32 over-unders, but I think our locks were pretty good this year. Do you want to know what we are right now? We're probably somewhere around 500 or a little better, I would guess.

37:09Cousin Sal:Chris Haynes, a good guy, keeps track for us. And that's all he does. He has no job other than to keep track of these stats. Thanks, Chris. Yeah, we're not going to pay him or anything. But you're 6-6. I'm seven and five. We both had New England over, Seattle over, Washington under, many under. You had Cincy under and Chicago over. I had Casey and Baltimore under and Jacksonville.

37:29Bill Simmons:We hit Denver today, right? Denver was nine and a half.

37:31Cousin Sal:Oh, okay. So that just went final, right? Yeah. So that one, we both had that. Yep.

37:35Bill Simmons:But I think of the ones that we liked the most, I think we were on the right side with those. Yeah. Denver, Patriots. But the one, the division that we just - Seattle. Yep. Yeah, Seattle was another one. Washington under. I like Chicago. The division we couldn't figure out was that AFC South. Right. It was like, I don't want to take Houston. Please tell me what other team to take. We hated the other teams. You kind of like Jacksonville?

38:03Cousin Sal:Yeah, that's who I had to win it. I don't know. I want to give them more credit than we normally do, but they also have the benefit of having the worst team maybe of the decade in that division. It's just an automatic two wins against Tennessee. Right. I mean, good God. Well, 25-3, was that the final today?

38:22Bill Simmons:They took a lead early, which you have to do. And then it just unfolded like every Tennessee game this year, except Tennessee never had the two late touchdowns to make the score respectable. If I gave you Cowboy fans, Panther fans, or Bengals fans, who should be the most irrationally excited now out of those three? Cowboys, Panthers, or Bengals?

38:46Cousin Sal:irrationally excited means the door's going to get slammed on their fingers

38:49Bill Simmons:just out of your mind tomorrow morning they're at work all they're talking about is the team let it be Panthers let it be the Panthers I think it's Panthers

38:56Cousin Sal:yeah let them think they have a chance that's fine

38:59Bill Simmons:10.5 point underdogs today at home you had the Rams in a couple of parties yeah it's funny

39:04Cousin Sal:you pointed it out immediately after the first staff they fit your profile you're like oh the Rams I know I'm pretty I'm pretty readable you had college football boxing there was some NBA They just spit your profile and throw it there. You said, say goodbye to South Street Team Teasers as soon as Stafford threw that first interception. He didn't look good early, but that defense was... It had the feel immediately. That defense was soft. That was the thing. And I do... We believe in trap games. Like, it's, you know, not enough to skip a three-team teaser with them. But they went from Seattle and Tampa at home.

39:37Cousin Sal:Big wins going out east. We saw the Chargers do this in Jacksonville. They got smoked. We should look for this. West Coast teams going east. I don't think it's paying off. But Bryce with three touchdown passes and like 164 yards rushing. They out-physicaled the Rams. Reminded me of what Chicago did with Philly the other day.

39:54Bill Simmons:Bryce was legitimately solid in that game. And he's been up and down. And there's been referendums on him all year on whether they should extend him. Can he actually be the quarterback? They're just a zigzag team. They're like, we always talk about 70s heavyweights when we talk about these, how we think of these teams. They're like the Ken Norton. They might get knocked out. They might knock somebody out. You just don't know. Week to week, I have no idea what to expect with them. You catch them on the right week, they're pounding the ball with the running game. Bryce is running around. McMillan looks like that might have been a really good pick for them.

40:30Bill Simmons:I was a little nervous about it, but apparently that was the right one. But yeah, they're seven and six.

40:34Cousin Sal:Look at their last eight. It just zigzags. It makes no sense that it wins and losses. It really doesn't. But I say it rationally because they're plus 460 to win the division. I think plus 410 to make the playoffs. They're four left. They're two against Tampa at New Orleans and versus Seattle. So do you expect them to sweep Tampa? I don't think it's in the cards there. So their best wins, they beat Dallas, Green Bay, and the Rams.

41:04Bill Simmons:Oh, Jesus. They lost to New England, Buffalo, and the Niners. They were 27th at DVOA heading into today. I mean, that was the biggest upset of the season, I think. There were other bigger point spread ones. We had like a 13 and a half. What was the biggest one this year?

41:21Cousin Sal:Who was it?

41:22Bill Simmons:There was a bigger point spread upset.

41:24Cousin Sal:Buffalo lost to Miami?

41:25Bill Simmons:Buffalo-Miami, I think, might have been bigger.

41:27Cousin Sal:But I thought this was the most important upset.

41:30Bill Simmons:It changed the NFC. It knocked the Rams down. Now all these teams have a chance for the one seed. it kept the NFC South interesting because I assume Tampa's going to beat New Orleans next week. Although, Shutt looked good today.

41:46Cousin Sal:Did you see that game? He did. I really didn't see much of it. I bet him to throw an interception. He did. He's pretty good in that game. And then I just turned it aside. I know it was a bad beat. I know they had the two-point conversion run back. That was bad.

41:58Bill Simmons:Carolina just has to stay within a game of Tampa because they play in Week 16 and Week 18.

42:03Cousin Sal:Yeah.

42:04Bill Simmons:And then Tampa has Miami in week 17 at Miami, which is no longer an easy game. Nothing's easy for them. Miami's 5-7 now.

42:11Cousin Sal:They're very weird. You almost immediately knew that's how that game was going to go. They were going to let Arizona back into it. And I guess the best thing that we could say about them is like Bucky Irving's back, right? So maybe the offense picks up, but Baker does look like a little.

42:27Bill Simmons:Godwin was back too. Supposedly McMillan's coming back. Baker didn't look 100 % to me, but whatever. Stafford's MVP case got a little wobbly today. The Panthers, we were ready to cross them off. Can't cross them off. 41 runs.

42:43Cousin Sal:I think we're going to cross on five teams next week. It's going to be a cross off. Yeah, next week's a cross off.

42:47Bill Simmons:Better buy some new Bix. I wrote down in my notes for Tampa, I've never seen anyone try harder to host a Shakey's game than Tampa. Even today with Arizona, they were just testing. And they were like, we can't beat them too convincingly. We got to let them hang around. What was that, 2017 final?

43:06Cousin Sal:It's so funny. I was thinking that about Houston. I wrote the same thing down. I was like, no one's still in our Shakey's game. Not just yet, because they were usually the home team. They were the match job home team.

43:16Bill Simmons:Houston might be too entertaining for the Shakey's game.

43:18Cousin Sal:Yeah, they might be.

43:19Bill Simmons:Their defense is fun. One thing with the Jags, they got banged up today. They lost their left tackle concussed. So that means he's probably almost definitely not playing next week. Parker Washington got hurt. I think they're down like five or six starters now. Even though their odds are pretty good for the playoffs, I'm still a little dubious. They're at Indianapolis. They're playing the Jets, who've been good now for five weeks for a bad team. At Denver, at Indy, home Tennessee. If I had to pick with those odds, like a team to short, I think I would pick the Jags. And the Colts would be second.

43:53Bill Simmons:Because I thought Dimes could have moved today.

43:55Cousin Sal:Did you say 450 for the playoffs for Jacksonville?

43:57Bill Simmons:They were minus 450.

43:58Cousin Sal:480, I'm saying, wow, that's high. That's too high.

44:04Bill Simmons:Well, then the other one is the Chargers. Herbert broke his left hand today, but apparently he's going to play next week.

44:09Cousin Sal:He wants, so he gets the extra day. Yeah. Yeah. It doesn't bode well for these guys playing with busted up bones like Daniel Jones and Aaron Rodgers, but he is a gamer, Herbert.

44:21Bill Simmons:I had to watch that entire game, as did you, I'm sure, because there's only three late games. Granted, we had three Thanksgiving games and a Friday game and then a Sunday night game.

44:31Cousin Sal:Yeah.

44:32Bill Simmons:But it meant that we had to watch Chargers Raiders and they fired their offensive coordinator last week.

44:38Cousin Sal:Right.

44:39Bill Simmons:Added a new one. I didn't really notice any difference. It just seemed like when in doubt, just try to throw it to Brock Bowers and hope he catches it. The Chargers, the only interesting thing out of that game for me is just Kamani Vidal as a fantasy football playoffs wild card. Who was it last year? Was it Chuba Hubbard? Chuba Hubbard, sure. He was the wild card last year. It feels like Vidal is going to be the guy.

45:05Cousin Sal:Yeah, he's like a poor man's Jameer Gibbs, I think, at this point.

45:09Bill Simmons:Yeah, I think he's won that job. Hampton had a setback, so that could be the one. And then we didn't talk about Prosmer.

45:23Bill Simmons:Rosborough must went full below him he did four turnovers he was so close

45:29Cousin Sal:I think you know I like him and I like these guys coming on I like to research on him and his girlfriend and they met and kind of like oh this is interesting but it's like a drunk rich dude showing up at a poker game and he plays recklessly and you know him from the start you're like yeah come on just sit down come on let's take your money meet Chelsea Phillips but that here's my friend Damon Jones Can you read the back of these cards? Good. Neither can I. That pick six was magical. That was just brilliant. It was the play of the year.

45:58Bill Simmons:Was there a better play this year?

46:00Cousin Sal:I don't know. That was really great. And, you know, you talk about like, oh, they used all the good games for Thursday and Friday. That pick six made the whole Sunday worthwhile. And I think we saw like four of the best catches we'll ever see today. Just like Bowers and Traylon Burks and Nakua and even the interception that the Chargers made on Geno the first time.

46:22Bill Simmons:Well, I was in the fantasy league that I truly care about, our knockout league, which I haven't won since 2007. And the website has a list of all the champions. And 2007, there's not people who can serve in the military who were born after I last won.

46:42Cousin Sal:It's really embarrassing. You've done a lot. You've made thousands of dollars since 2007. It's a long time.

46:49Bill Simmons:And I had bad luck this year because I lost Evans and Tyreek, but I was kind of crawling my way back in for a playoff spot, and I really needed the Seahawks defense in Myers today in these late games. Oh, my God. So every time Brosmer's going back to pass, I'm like, throw us one, throw us one. And he did. I got a pick six. I got all these sacks. The Seahawks defense in our league had 29 points. We just have a normal scoring league.

47:16Cousin Sal:Myers and the Seahawks must have had 50 for you.

47:19Bill Simmons:Yeah, he had 48 points. Myers had 19 points. That's crazy. The Seahawks defense had 29. And I beat our friend, the T-man, the defending champ, who I think is now out. And he's out because the Seahawks defense and kicker had 48 points. Right. I think he has the most points. See, I'm in the mode where, like, I think a shutout should be, like, 20 points. There's, like, five shutouts a year.

47:39Cousin Sal:Yeah, I'm with you. I'm with you. There are just too many bad quarterbacks, though, to kind of reward it is the other thing. I mean, you get a Brosmer in there. It's just a gift. But they're your regular defense anyway, right? It's not like you picked them up.

47:51Bill Simmons:Right.

47:52Cousin Sal:Well, there was an exciting moment at the end.

47:54Bill Simmons:They punted the Seahawks. It's 26-0 with like a minute left. And they punted and they downed it on the two. And I said, come on. Let Brosmer.

48:05Cousin Sal:Let him cook one more time. He was really bad. They're the first team to have two quarterbacks throw a pick six in their first start in the same year. Is that true? That's very good. Yep.

48:17Bill Simmons:I was waiting for an hour for the cut of Justin Jefferson sitting sadly by himself. And they finally gave it. It was a new one. He wasn't even on a bench. He was like sitting in the Gatorade buckets with his helmet off, just trying to figure out, just trying to deconstruct what's happened to his life. I felt bad for him.

48:35Cousin Sal:I think he's got to fake a calf strain. He didn't speak for the first time since 2022 after the game, they said.

48:41Bill Simmons:Yeah. Yeah, because he could actually get really hurt with some of these passes that these guys throw because they're sailing them high right into traffic. But I think calf strain, what are they going to do? Like calf strain seems like the injury you would fake. Sure. No, not that. Because then everyone's so afraid of the Achilles tear. Okay, so we're new Guest Alliance, unless there's anything else you want to hit.

49:07Cousin Sal:I'm trying to think. Because we can hit the other stuff when we do Guest Alliance. Let me just say real quick with the Jets thing, like the Jets beating Atlanta. And, you know, I just root for your team. Just root for your team. It's good when your team wins. I mean, you could be a tank tool. I know you're a tank tool in the NBA, but just root for your team. Don't worry about these dumb draft picks. Tom Brady was a sixth round pick. The Mavs got the number one pick last year in hoops. Tanking doesn't really work. Once in a while, you'll get a Wemby. But in general, pull for your freaking team.

49:40Cousin Sal:Stop rooting for faceless draft picks, right? You got 50 ,000 fans risking pneumonia at MetLife. You root for your team to do good. Aaron Glenn gives a game ball to Nick Folk, who he was a teammate of with Dallas. Ty Taylor's going nuts. Root for your damn team. Don't worry about the draft picks. I'm sick of it, Simmons. Don't you clap. You do the same thing.

50:00Bill Simmons:You're a tank tool. I would have rooted for the Jets this year because there's no consensus number one pick. Who am I rooting for? Last year was different.

50:09Cousin Sal:Well, and I think two years ago was different too. Last year, Cooper flag was consensus, right? And same for the football. No, I get it. I'm just saying like, it doesn't always work your way anyway. Whatever. Just root for your team.

50:24Bill Simmons:Listen, we're never going to agree on this. I respect your position.

50:31Cousin Sal:This seller dweller positioning bullshit.

50:33Bill Simmons:You're a tank tool, Simmons. If you want to tank, I have a suggestion. Hire Raheem Morris. He is now 33 and 55. There's only three coaches in the history of football who've done worse with 55 losses. Romeo Cornell was 32 and 63. Walt Kiesling was 30 and 55. And Joe Bugle was 25 and 56. He is in the Mount Rushmore of terrible 55 losses and overcoaches.

51:04Cousin Sal:There's no one who's been labeled the tanker. Right? We haven't had a coach that we've laid. There should be a tank. We have a clapper. We have the DJ.

51:12Bill Simmons:Well, the sad thing is they can't tank because the Rams have their pick, which is like the stealth version of OKC having the Mavericks pick. You see what I mean?

51:21Cousin Sal:Thinking about all this stuff all the time. Just go out of the way.

51:23Bill Simmons:I'd be thinking about it if I was a Rams fan. That might be like the fifth pick. Listen, it's the same shit every week. They do dumb stuff. They have special teams fuck-ups. Today they had another one. They always shoot themselves in the foot. If it's a close game at the end, you know they're going to blow it. and you know they're all in with Penix and Cousins and they have no pick next year and they're what are they 4-8 now? 3-9? Something terrible?

51:50Cousin Sal:4? Well that's the other thing the graphics, the Fox and CBS, they have to stop with this when they do the playoff picture they'll still have in the hunt in the hunt Atlanta 4-8 San Francisco's 10-9 What do you hunt? Yeah, they're in the hunt like I'm in the hunt for Michelle Pfeiffer. They're hunting garbage cans for food. Give me a break. Yeah, they're not in the hunt. Leave the graphics guy alone.

52:21Bill Simmons:We're going to take a break and then talk about a pretty awesome week 14 that includes Bears-Packers, Steelers-Ravens, Colts-Jags, all for first place, Cowboys-Lions on Thursday Night Football, and Texans Chiefs on Sunday night. Bill's Bengals. It's all good. It's all coming next. This episode is brought to you by HubSpot. You know why elite point guards make everyone better? It isn't just the no-look times. It's because they know everything. Who's hot? Who's tired? What the defense is doing? Which teammate needs a basket? Most businesses don't have that. Sales run one play. Marketing runs another.

53:00Bill Simmons:Nobody told service. The game plan has now changed. HubSpot. gives you that point guard vision, one platform, full customer context. And that context is everything you need to win. Visit HubSpot.com to learn more.

53:35Bill Simmons:McLobe Ultra FIFA World Cup 26 Superior Access No purchase necessary Open U.S. Residence 21 Plus Begins on December 1st, 2025 Ends on July 31st, 2026 Multiple entry periods Visit www.mclobeultra.com Slash superior access Slash FIFA World Cup 26 For free entry Entry deadlines, prizes, and details Alright Sal Guess the Lions You won last week I'm still winning for the season I'm up a couple games You're like the Cowboys You have a puncher's chance Let's do it And speaking of the Cowboys Your team is playing On Thursday night Yeah Lions-Cowboys is this is probably the best Thursday night game we've had for the stakes.

54:09Bill Simmons:We've had good Thursday night matchups. This one's a great one. Detroit, rollercoaster ride with Frank Ragnall, who's going to come back to be their center. And the Lions are like, oh, Ragnall's back. And then he fell, it's physical. So now they have to look at the other center and be like, no, no, we still love you though. Right. You're going to do great.

54:28Cousin Sal:Right, exactly. Yeah, we're keeping you around. Yeah, I was thinking about that. and like how, I'm like, oh my God, that's a smart thing to do. Sit out three quarters of the year and come back for when it matters. And then he failed. I mean, I'd hate to say someone's, it's a fake diagnosis, even though we just did that about Justin Jefferson. But you think the league is just like, no, no, no, we're not doing this anymore. Come on.

54:52Bill Simmons:Well, it hurts my Aaron Donald case for Aaron Donald coming back in like week 16. Just been like, hey guys, I'm ready. The Lions are going to be favored. It's either going to be two and a half or three. And I'm going to say Lions in Detroit favored by two and a half.

55:09Cousin Sal:Okay, good. That's what I said. It is three.

55:15Cousin Sal:Either one's fair, I think.

55:18Bill Simmons:We did ringer 107 on a Tuesday, and I love the Cowboys against the Chiefs, and we ended up parlaying it with the Eagles money line. I saw that. As a pick. Instead of just taking the points, and I have a lot of regrets.

55:31Cousin Sal:Same kind of thing. Three points, although they were home. Yeah, I don't know. The one that scares me, I actually think we have the better team right now, but Dan Campbell hates us so much. He really does. Just despises the Cowboys. Maybe it doesn't matter.

55:50Bill Simmons:I think with these Thursday night games, we just have to remind ourselves over and over again that they don't make sense and they're not an accurate reflection of what would happen on a normal Sunday.

56:00Cousin Sal:Right.

56:00Bill Simmons:So you just got to think of that. There's a chance where Pickens has 230 yards receiving. There's a scenario of this game where Gibbs is 15 for 220 and then three for 90 receiving and just has like 40 fantasy points. There's a scenario where Goff just sucks and has the Goff face. I'm ready for anything. I can't wait. It's going to be a great game. So it's a loser leaves town match. For sure. No question, right? If the Lions lose, I think they're done.

56:31Cousin Sal:Well, they can't catch Green Bay. Like now they, well, I mean, it wouldn't be a tiebreaker anyway because they have a tie, an actual tie, Green Bay. But no, they can't lose for a while. They're in trouble.

56:44Bill Simmons:Well, can we safely say nine wins, nine wins, nine wins, eight wins, eight, three, and one, nine wins, NFC South. 11 wins is the entry point for a wild card spot. Oh, wow. Right?

56:59Cousin Sal:Not all three, I don't think. You think all three will have to have one?

57:03Bill Simmons:I got Chicago at 9-3. I got Seattle at 9-3. And I have Green Bay at 8-3-1. And San Francisco at 9-4. It's going to be 11 wins.

57:14Cousin Sal:I guess you're right. I've been saying it all. I just hadn't heard it like that. I wasn't sure Detroit was even going to get to 10. Cowboys at Rams. Steelers at Vikings at Bears. It's going to be tough.

57:26Bill Simmons:Maybe it's not an official Loser Leaves Town match. because six losses can still get you there. Sounds better.

57:32Cousin Sal:We'll sell more tickets that way if we call it that.

57:34Bill Simmons:Yeah, true. Maybe we'll make it a... What was the match after the first match in the trilogy? WWE in the 80s? There's Steel Cage was the third match. First match was normal. Oh, like a Texas death match? Yeah. This is like a Texas death match. Yeah.

57:50Cousin Sal:No count out. No disqualification. Anything goes.

57:56Bill Simmons:A lot of rumors that John Cena might be on the BS podcast this week.

58:00Cousin Sal:Is that right? Yeah, I've never had him.

58:02Bill Simmons:Yeah. That's a rumor.

58:04Cousin Sal:See, I don't know if you would put that out there if it wasn't going to happen. It's heavy rumors.

58:09Bill Simmons:Heavy rumors.

58:10Cousin Sal:All right. Kayfabe might be.

58:12Bill Simmons:Look at that. Sunday marquee, a lot of good choices.

58:18Todd McShay:Yeah.

58:20Bill Simmons:But I think it's Packers-Bears for the NFC North, the history of the two teams, the fact that the Bears are actually kind of beloved in Chicago after that Eagles win. This might be an NFC title game. Who the fuck knows? It's in Lambeau, and I think this is my favorite game. And I'm putting it right in the Vegas zone. and it's in Green Bay. I have Packers minus 5.5.

58:52Cousin Sal:Oh, wow. You nailed it. I said 4.5. Also Vegas zone, but it is 5.5. Good job by you. So where does that end?

59:00Bill Simmons:I think that gets to 6.

59:03Cousin Sal:What did the Eagles line do during the week? That ended at 7, right? Straight 7. Yeah, it went up for a second. Yeah, I think if anything, it goes up. I think it ends up at 6. I have a request for these two teams, and you could join me in this. Can we have a memorable game? Like this is supposed to be the greatest rivalry in sports or top four. I saw a podcast like Al Michaels and Costas were talking about the best rivalries. And, oh, yes, this has to be it. I can't remember two great games out of it. I know they played 200 times. Costas and Michaels said Packers-Bears was a great rivalry. It's a famous rivalry.

59:41Bill Simmons:They've had no games.

59:42Cousin Sal:It was the Red Sox-Yankees. I think they agreed on Red Sox-Yankees, Carolina-Duke. Packers Bears and what would the other one be? Packers Bears I'm spacing on the easy one the problem is the NFL has

59:58Bill Simmons:it's changes in like half decade cycles depending on who the quarterbacks are it's not like when we were kids but when we were kids like there were like real rivalries and they never changed it didn't really matter who the quarterbacks were now I feel like it just kind of moves around

1:00:15Cousin Sal:what's your favorite Packer Bear game? I think that was I think the Monday night game where the guy jumped out of the stands to catch an extra point was a Packers-Bear game. Otherwise, I have no, and I know they made it to the NFC Championship once. It was Cutler and he was hurt. Can't be the best rivalry.

1:00:33Bill Simmons:Rodgers shilling the crowd. I remember that. Right. There was a Brett Favre one. Was that who he played after his dad died?

1:00:41Cousin Sal:See, I don't even know. Was on the Vikings? I don't know. Yeah. I don't know if it could be best rivalry. They have to be memorable games. It can't just be Army, Navy. God bless.

1:00:51Bill Simmons:I just don't think the Bears have been good enough over the course of the last 50 years. 50 years, that's a lot. That's 100 games. When we were kids and we'd only get either two or three games, the Bears were, I never got to see Walter Payton. I'd barely even, unless it was a highlight, I'd never even knew what he did.

1:01:09Cousin Sal:That's true.

1:01:10Bill Simmons:He wasn't on TV for eight years of my life.

1:01:16Bill Simmons:Three watchables, and they're all good ones. Colts at Jacksonville. I think this is going to... I have the Colts favored. I think this ends up at three, but I went lower than that. I have Colts minus two and a half at Jacksonville. Damn.

1:01:32Cousin Sal:I went the wrong way. I had the Jags minus one. It's in the tic-tac zone. They do have the Colts favored by one and a half, so you get it.

1:01:40Bill Simmons:The Jags are banged up. This left tackle, if they're not going to be able to block, I do think the Colts could pressure him.

1:01:46Cousin Sal:I guess so. We can't bet this. right? I didn't like what I saw from dimes. Nah, nothing. Just stay away from this.

1:01:55Bill Simmons:And Lawrence, even when they're playing Tennessee and they're inside the 10, I just feel like he's going to throw a pick.

1:02:01Cousin Sal:Right.

1:02:02Bill Simmons:It's like surprising when he completes a touchdown.

1:02:05Cousin Sal:Is this two in a row for the Jags? They're not going to win. Put a hat trick together.

1:02:11Bill Simmons:This has to be one of the biggest home games I've ever had, right? Yeah. Yeah, no doubt. Ravens home for the Steelers. I put this in the Vegas zone. I have the Ravens by four and a half.

1:02:26Cousin Sal:Okay. I add that too. It is six and a half. Oh.

1:02:35Cousin Sal:And I like them. I like them on a teaser. The Ravens or the Steelers? The Ravens. I'm going to do it again. I'm going to do it again, Bill.

1:02:43Bill Simmons:Will Lamar have another 10 days since that Thursday night game?

1:02:49Cousin Sal:You might need 100, but yeah, a 10 is good enough.

1:02:55Bill Simmons:What would be the most shocking firing over the next 14 days that you would actually believe?

1:03:05Bill Simmons:Could I talk you into whoever loses this game? The coach gets dismissed after the game as a possibility?

1:03:12Cousin Sal:No, they can't do that. You sure? Well, the Steelers don't do that. They don't even fire coaches, let alone the middle of the year.

1:03:19Bill Simmons:Or it's announced he's leaving at the end of the year?

1:03:21Cousin Sal:Yeah, yeah.

1:03:21Bill Simmons:These are like two coaches that... Oh, I know. I can't say the fan bases are enthralled.

1:03:26Cousin Sal:That's rough. Maybe you firing House. Was you counting that for giving you bad 107 picks?

1:03:33Bill Simmons:House had a good one last week. He saved his job.

1:03:36Cousin Sal:He had the Packers. Packers, yeah. Pushed the Packers hard.

1:03:42Bill Simmons:Bills. By the way, I did watch the entire Sunday pregame show today. House has this new tick that I hesitate to bring up, but I really enjoy it. House, when, you know, it's in a four box. If he gets really excited about a topic somebody else is talking about, he starts like rocking. He starts like doing this in his seat. Like he can't wait to talk. He's like a little kid. I really enjoyed this. That wasn't what it did. Available on 29 FanDuel channels across America. Plus the Ringer YouTube channel. We gave out winners left and right.

1:04:18Cousin Sal:No, that wasn't, that's not a tick. We had him sit on a custom-made toilet. He's still unloading from Thanksgiving. He's going to the bathroom. I didn't realize. Yeah, it's Thanksgiving. It's rough. It's a rough weekend.

1:04:28Bill Simmons:It's great. You think, like, playing poker with House, he gets a card he likes, he just starts, like, moving around in his chair. This is a great game. I almost put this in the Sunday marquee. Bill's Bengals in Buffalo. And Joe Burrow, it's just great to have him back. We needed all the fun quarterbacks we could get. But I put this in the Vegas zone. Bills minus five and a half.

1:04:51Cousin Sal:Oh, come on. I wanted to steal this from you. I had five and a half also. That's what it is. Oh. It's exactly five and a half. So we have two Vegas zone games already. Do you think that's too high? There's no way you would take the Bills under any circumstances.

1:05:06Bill Simmons:I would probably do a version of what I did with the Texans today. The Bengals tees up over the double-digit number to 11 and a half, 10 and a half, somewhere in there. and then move the over down because I think this game won points. I don't think you can make the over high enough for this game.

1:05:23Cousin Sal:They looked so good, Cincinnati. They looked really good. They had it all together.

1:05:28Bill Simmons:Five turnovers. I thought he was moving great.

1:05:31Cousin Sal:Yeah.

1:05:33Bill Simmons:Because I thought they would be like a little, oh, he can't have it. Didn't matter. Whatever they shot him up with, kudos to the doctor. Fairly watchables. I can't believe I put this in the fairly watchables, but I'll explain after. Seahawks at Atlanta. Oh, no. I'll make the case after we do the pick. I have the Seahawks favored by four in Atlanta.

1:05:56Cousin Sal:Oh, wow. Do you really think it's that watchable? I said seven and a half. It's eight and a half. Oh, okay. Let me make sure. Yeah, eight and a half. Man.

1:06:08Bill Simmons:I was either dead on or within a half point, and then I missed that one by four and a half points. I thought it was watchable. Seahawks defense against Kirk Cousins.

1:06:18Cousin Sal:Oh, I see. Oh, yeah, yeah. You're going to win your last regular season fantasy game of the year. Walking away. I'm just excited for that matchup for a variety of reasons. I said this morning the Falcons should win a Lifetime Achievement Award for fishy lines. Just give it to them. Every single doesn't matter if it's Cousins, Penix, Desmond Ritter, who cares?

1:06:43Bill Simmons:this is this has trap game written all over it yeah next one fairly watchable is Bucks Saints the only reason I say this is because I think the Saints are like pretty watchable as a bad team they can move the ball I don't mind watching the Saints I have the I have the Bucks by 8.5 over the Saints in Tampa

1:07:05Cousin Sal:it's 7.5 fuck alright we're tied

1:07:11Bill Simmons:Seven and a half. I'm a little low. And then Rams Cardinals, fairly watchable. I don't understand the Brissette thing. He was so terrible for the Patriots last year. But he was really awful. And now you watch him and he's pretty confident. And then I remembered that our offensive line was like an F minus, minus, minus.

1:07:29Cousin Sal:Right.

1:07:30Bill Simmons:So maybe if he has like a decent offensive line, it's okay.

1:07:33Cousin Sal:He found the home. Wilson's good. McBride's great, right? Yeah. He's like a little pro. Harrison, I don't know. Not completely sold on his work ethic. I think I had another injury today, but it'll be good too.

1:07:47Bill Simmons:Rams in Arizona. I have them favored by eight and a half.

1:07:52Cousin Sal:All right. I get this. It is. Oh, no. We split it. I had eight. It's seven and a half. I get it. You get it. Yeah. Good, good, good.

1:08:03Cousin Sal:Poop fact, though. You see so many teasers going through your head that you don't want to talk about right now.

1:08:08Bill Simmons:We have a couple themes on buy, by the way, if you're wondering. Yeah. The listeners are wondering why. Including my team. Proof fact of Browns-Titans in Cleveland.

1:08:19Bill Simmons:This is awful, and I can't wait to bet on it. I have Browns in the Vegas zone, minus five and a half.

1:08:27Cousin Sal:No. I said three, and it's three and a half. Oh, that's too low.

1:08:33Bill Simmons:You think so? Yeah, I think the Browns defense is good. they just can't fall behind. Once they're behind by like 10, it's the game's over.

1:08:44Cousin Sal:You don't think there's any pride like Cam Ward? Like F all these people who are putting Shador ahead of me. You know, I was the first pick. I mean, he was the first pick. Yeah. Yeah. I'm going to show him why kind of thing. They do suck though. They are so bad.

1:09:01Bill Simmons:Vikings home for the Washington commanders. I would have said three, seven hours ago, but I'm dropping that to two and a half. Minnesota favored.

1:09:13Cousin Sal:Oh, I said Washington by one. I think it's Washington by one and a half. Let's see. Oh. Yeah. I mean, I think. Wow. I went in a tailspin. He should be back, Jaden Daniels, right? Really? Wasn't it going to be close to this week?

1:09:30Bill Simmons:Why are you bringing him back when you're three and nine? Sit his ass down.

1:09:33Cousin Sal:Listen, I like the way they played. I need them to win. It's a perfect loss today. It's the Cowboys. Like, they played gutty. They played the Eagles twice, so I need them to be tough. What I don't need is, did you hear Collinsworth and Torrico pronounce Mariota's name? Mariota? Mariota. Mariota. For three, I had to turn it off for like a half hour. I couldn't listen to the sound. I'm like, what is this? It's like they're showing off for their eighth grade Spanish teacher. He's been Mariota for 12 years in college and everything. And then sometimes they'd catch themselves and they'd go back to however everyone else says it.

1:10:09Bill Simmons:I didn't understand it at all. I was trying to ignore it, but then they kept doing it. So it's Washington favored by one and a half in Minnesota. Right. Well, it's Brosner again, right? He's going to get points, that guy? I don't think. Washington's three and nine. You're going to be favored on the road? It's ridiculous. us.

1:10:32Cousin Sal:Brosnan could play a hundred games and he won't win one. I don't know. I think that's fair.

1:10:38Bill Simmons:What did you, would you make of the inverted Bo Nix performance today where instead of being bad, instead of being the boot and rally Bo, he was, he actually sucked you into thinking he was going to be good for all three hours. And then all of a sudden was booting in the fourth quarter, but then rallied in the OT. Right.

1:10:59Cousin Sal:I didn't know what to make of it. I like it. I mean, I think I had Washington as an upset, and I took the points, so that was going to be a miserable way to lose. But he threw his interception. He got it out there, right? What was that, third quarter? Yeah.

1:11:15Bill Simmons:When he threw it right to the guy on the other team? Yeah.

1:11:19Cousin Sal:But, yeah, we needed our friend Hench to win this week to stay alive, and he had no targets with, what's his name? Can't forget. 14.

1:11:28Bill Simmons:You got knocked out of our guillotine league

1:11:31Cousin Sal:I know, I got knocked out Stinks So now there's only Four left, right?

1:11:38Bill Simmons:You made the final four Lewis has ten bucks left, I have four bucks left The other two teams have zero bucks left So Lewis can just cherry pick He can go I guess five bucks on JSN So he gets him So he'd have He could basically get the top two guys you have Just shoot his wad try to do it that way I love the guillotine

1:12:00Cousin Sal:I'm going to miss it I wonder if there's a three week guillotine 90 % of it

1:12:11Bill Simmons:Dolphins at the Jets

1:12:15I

1:12:19Bill Simmons:I went between Dolphins minus three and Dolphins minus three and a half back and forth for a solid 20 seconds and landed at Dolphins. One of those is right.

1:12:27Cousin Sal:One of those is exactly right.

1:12:28Bill Simmons:And landed at Dolphins minus three and a half.

1:12:30Cousin Sal:Oh, I said two and a half. It is three. So we tie.

1:12:38Bill Simmons:So Jets have won three of their last five and the other two, they kind of hung around for a while. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

1:12:44Cousin Sal:Ty Towers, the guy though. I feel like they have life with that guy, right? Yeah. That offense at least.

1:12:50Bill Simmons:It fools you on the small TV when you're not really concentrating. and you're like, man, Fields looks pretty good because you can't really see the numbers. That's Ty Taylor.

1:12:59Cousin Sal:Yeah, no, they're moving too fast down the field for it to be Fields.

1:13:02Bill Simmons:That pass actually went to his receiver. Broncos are at Las Vegas, a truly terrible team. And I have the Broncos favored by eight and a half.

1:13:19Cousin Sal:I said seven and it's seven and a half. So I get that one. I like this. What's the score? Are you winning? You can't win this. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6. 10 to 6. You're winning 10 to 6? Yeah. Jesus. I'm back. You're right. I'm the Cowboys. This is tough. You're the Cowboys. I wouldn't take 10. This is the 10-7 game, right? From a few Thursdays ago?

1:13:47Bill Simmons:It's going to be really hard not to throw the Broncos money line into five different bets. and they'll have fans and everything else. Yeah. Stupid. Sunday night Chiefs, home for the Texans. Dare I say, a must-win game for the Chiefs. Great game. And maybe also for the Texans. I mean, this really might be the loser Leafs town match. I don't think either team could lose this.

1:14:14Cousin Sal:I think it is.

1:14:15Bill Simmons:I think this is. That night. We're going live after this. Yeah, we're going live. Next week, we'll go live on YouTube. I have Chiefs minus three. All right.

1:14:24Cousin Sal:You're going to get it. I said four. It was four and a half. It went to three and a half. I guess we split it. We split that? We split it. It doesn't matter.

1:14:36Bill Simmons:Monday night. I think that's a really bad. Yeah. That's a bad spot for the Chiefs. I don't like that defense. They all are. That defense against the, you know, just hitting the shit out of Kelsey. Coming at my homes. I don't like... Plus, they can't really run the ball. I don't like that spot.

1:15:00Cousin Sal:I mean, I'm sure they'd probably rather play almost every other team, honestly.

1:15:06Bill Simmons:Monday night, Eagles, Chargers in Los Angeles. 60 % Philly fans there. Although, if you're a Philly fan who lives in LA, would you even want to go to that game? I guess you want to be around other unhappy people. I don't know.

1:15:20Cousin Sal:Yeah, you just want to yell. Just to yell at your own team. Yeah, you have to. Start a couple fights in the concourse after? Yeah, just for Tanner McKee and then get out of there.

1:15:30Bill Simmons:I have the Eagles favored by minus 2.5.

1:15:33Cousin Sal:Yeah, you're going to get this. I went low. I said 1.5. It is 3. All right. That's a win for the good guys. So we're 8-6 for the season? 8-6. You still have the lead. Okay. All right. I'll take that. I'll take that. I got to look at my schedule the rest of the way. But, okay. What a game. Seven great games. Seven, like, meaningful and important and playoff-worthy games out of the 14. Pretty good.

1:16:02Bill Simmons:Today's Parent Corner is presented by Uber Eats. Uber Eats that I used twice today. Let's be real. Would it be game day without a spread of your favorite foods, pizza, burgers, burritos, you name it? Uber Eats is here to deliver it to you all season long. Or in my case today, a nice salad with a bunch of vegetables in it. I got my own salad. My way, we custom made our salads. That came, that was really good. Yeah. You could eat that in the sauna? No, I didn't eat the salad in the sauna. Oh, all right. Yeah. Did wear my t-shirt in the sauna today. What do you have for paracorn?

1:16:37Cousin Sal:Someone was asking me why you wear the t-shirt. It's one thing if you want to wipe your face with the t-shirt. If it's okay, you like the way the cloth feels, but why are you wearing it in the sauna? Why don't you just bring it with you, put it on your lap?

1:16:48Bill Simmons:I just think it's like, first of all, you always have to think like, if I'm going to die, how do I want to be found? Like, someone is a place you could die. Are you masturbating in there too? I just want to have a t-shirt if I'm slumped over. I don't want to be like naked from the waist up. Oh, I see. Then if somebody comes in, they don't realize I'm there. Like, who knows?

1:17:11Cousin Sal:All right. Okay. So it kills a couple of birds there.

1:17:15Bill Simmons:Yeah. I like wiping my face with a t-shirt. I'm not defending it. I'm not fully admit it's probably pretty weird. I'm proud of you. What do you have for parent corner?

1:17:22Cousin Sal:All right. So, you know, it's my favorite weekend. It's the, I'm sure you feel the same way. Everybody's home, football, eating just, and then Friday might even be better than Thursday if you have nothing to do, just veg out, right? And you don't have people. But anyway, we're watching this Cowboys game. And I think I told you a couple of weeks ago, I found out from my barber who cuts everybody's hair in the family that, that Harrison, my youngest is becoming a Cowboys fan. And I went and told him, I was like, you can't do this. I don't want this for you. It's like he found dad's crack vial or something.

1:17:54Cousin Sal:I don't want you anywhere near this shit. Please don't do it. He's like, no, no, no. I watched the documentary with you. I think I like them. I like the history. I like this. And I'm like, don't do it. Fast forward to Thanksgiving. Chiefs Cowboys were sitting down. He's rooting for Dallas. First touchdown, Rasheed Rice. And he cheers. And I was like, what the hell is that about? And he's like, well, I have them on my fantasy team. I'm like, you're out. That's it. You can't do that. You're not doing that. He's like, what? I need this. I'm six and six or whatever. I have to, well, like, I don't care.

1:18:25Cousin Sal:You don't root. You at least don't audibly root for the other team. And Archie's yelling at him. He's like, what are you, crazy? You don't ever do that. Like, it almost spoiled like Thanksgiving. And Jack's laughing because his Steelers don't play until Sunday. And he thinks this is all ridiculous anyway. So that was the first thing.

1:18:43Bill Simmons:Kids were deliberately defying you to try to get a reaction out of you on your favorite day of the year.

1:18:49Cousin Sal:I'd finally allowed him to be a Cowboys fan against my better judgment or any judgment. And then he does this where he's rooting for Rasheed Rice. I'm like, you got to stop this. This is stuff. But this is fantasy. This is the most important thing for kids. It just is. That's where we are in life. Real quick, my fourth son, our friend Brad, stays with me Thanksgiving weekend. So we had him. I know you're laughing already. So he's a lunatic. He comes in just spinning around just like a tornado. And he's making fun of the boys any chance he gets and telling me about 14 documentaries he's watched.

1:19:22Cousin Sal:And it makes you feel stupid. Like he's a lunatic, but he's also like really smart. You know this. He's well read. You know, he's like, what about that LA Times article? You think they're going to lock up that sheriff? I'm like, uh, I don't know. And they'll tell you like 20 things about him. So anyway, he loves ribs, right? So I found this upscale barbecue restaurant in the neighborhood, but you kind of have to dress up. So I gave him clothes he could wear. And my sons, Harrison and Jack, come with us. And I go in there and I was like, hey, this is kind of a nice place. He's like, all right, all right.

1:19:58Cousin Sal:And he's giving himself a pep talk as he's entering the place. He's saying, walk like a human being, walk like a human being, walk like a human being. He's repeating it. And the matron Z's like, welcome, sir. So I was like, I just have to sit him down. I have to sit him down in a booth. And he can't be on the outside. He's got to be on the inside. I have it all planned in my head, right?

1:20:17Bill Simmons:Because you have to trap him.

1:20:19Cousin Sal:Yes, exactly. You have to kind of trap him in there. He's like a caged animal. So he's got the onion strings. He's got about 4 ,500 calories in his beard before the entrees even hit. And then come the ribs. and just a few minutes in, it looks like he was dunked headfirst into a vat of sweet baby Ray's barbecue sauce, like just like turned upside down and jumped in. So at one point he decides he has to go to the bathroom and he goes to clean up. And he goes to the, walks to the bathroom and we're watching him and the kids are shaking their heads and he slips on nothing and runs his whole barbecue hand on the wall, which now resembles a crime scene.

1:21:01Cousin Sal:It looks like there's just blood everywhere and he's embarrassed and he, I'm not making this up. And he runs into the woman's bathroom. Luckily he figured it out right away. A lot of times he doesn't. And then he came out and so that's the end of this. Like I had to weigh over tip the waitstaff and then I sent them home today on an Uber, uh, at the end of the one o 'clock games. And, uh, I guess there was an incident. I have to look into this now. There was an incident with the Uber driver when I sent them home. Yeah. The guy wouldn't go around the construction, and Brad was telling him. So I wish you could bet on Fandle how many points my Uber rating would go down when I put Brad in a sedan for an hour.

1:21:39Cousin Sal:But I'm saying at least two and a half points.

1:21:42Bill Simmons:That's your second time this year where he's hurt your Uber rating.

1:21:45Cousin Sal:Yeah, I know. I know. I'll never learn. We just never learn. Anyway, that's my fourth time.

1:21:48Bill Simmons:So it's like in the horror movie when the detective comes the next day and they're looking for blood splatter on the wall and they see a handprint. He slipped on nothing. It's going all the way down the wall. What is this? Wow. Circus clown. Honestly, that sounds like he got away pretty okay from a night out with Brad at an upscope barbecue dinner. Yeah, that's true. We had Thanksgiving. I'm going to tell a story about my son Murph, my five-year-old dog. Thanksgiving, biggest day of the year for him. My mom feeds him under the table, food drops, people forget to close the garbage. and at some point, it's unclear, but the carcass of the turkey, he might have...

1:22:36Bill Simmons:Oh, no. We're not sure what happened to it. It's just unclear. The garbage was open. It might have been thrown away. He might have gotten to it. What we did know happened for sure, because I saw it was my mom makes these, she calls them her Aunt Minnie's cookies, these Italian cookies. They're like powdered. They're, she fries them. They're super salty. She probably made like 35 of them. That sounds amazing. We had all these pies and stuff. So there was probably at least 25 left. And I went back in the kitchen to get hot water and lemon. Uh. Murph's on the counter. There's three cookies left. So now we're like, and we don't know what else he's eaten.

1:23:18Bill Simmons:And so Thursday night, we're like, this is, he's going to fucking ruin the whole week. weekend. Like this is going to be his first diarrhea fest in a while. Friday's okay. Friday, nothing really happens. Friday night, the wheels come off. We decide we don't go out. My wife does the thing where it's like, we might have to take him to the vet. He's just lying on the ground kind of looking at us. It's like really sluggish. She won't eat. And she's like, he ate a bone. He ate something. There's turkey. This is bad. This is bad. He ruins Friday night. Saturday, started to get better. By Saturday night, he's okay.

1:24:02Bill Simmons:Had you taken him in or you did take him in? Never took him in. By Sunday, he's okay. He's a little happier. We got through it. We got through it unscathed. We thought because in the upstairs in one of the rooms, just a giant, giant poop. that unclear if it had been there for 48 hours, 24 hours, but it was like, he picked a room. He's smarter. It's better and savvy. He's like, nobody goes in this room that much. Just dropped one in there, and it was in there. And yeah, so it was our first incident.

1:24:37Cousin Sal:That's bad. Are you sure? I know you want to blame Murph, but it could have been Brad who wandered into your house accidentally.

1:24:44Bill Simmons:It might have been Brad. Today's Parent Corner presented by Uber Eats. Get almost anything for game day. like your favorite game day foods, drinks, and snacks on Uber Eats, the official on-demand delivery partner of the NFL. Order now. Anything else we have to cover? Oh, you know, we're doing Rocky 2 for rewatchables. It's going up tomorrow night. I don't know how much, when was the last time you watched it?

1:25:07Cousin Sal:You know, I watched it a couple years ago. Is that the slowest of all of them? I don't want you to blow your load here. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know if the point was to put us in a coma at the same time Adrian was in it. It's a very long coma.

1:25:22Bill Simmons:Really enjoyable, though. I've watched it twice in the past five days.

1:25:26Cousin Sal:Yeah.

1:25:26Bill Simmons:Really good. And somehow the worst of the first four, but really, really good. So can't wait to take that one.

1:25:31Cousin Sal:There you go. Stallone.

1:25:33Bill Simmons:Go ahead. Multiple scenes where he's just reading a book to Adrian. Like in the Stallone voice. They're deleted scenes that weren't deleted. They're just in the actual movie. It wasn't even in the movie.

1:25:47Cousin Sal:It was like during lunch hour. And they're like, let's roll on this. Let's roll on this.

1:25:51Bill Simmons:Just pretend.

1:25:52Cousin Sal:This will be funny. Ringer gambling show. It's greatest. Check it out on YouTube and the FanDuel Sports Network. It's me and Tate and House and the Bundle and Heifetz Tuesday, Wednesday, Friday. And then the Ringer pregame show on Sunday. Lots of fun.

1:26:08Bill Simmons:All right, great. We're taking a break. We're keeping the podcast going because I got Van Lathan and Todd McShay to talk about this crazy Lane Kiffin story, which I guess was not crazy since most people thought he was going.

1:26:17Cousin Sal:I can't be, I think I'm supposed to be outraged, but I'm not. I don't know. I get my college sports these days, right? It's fine. Like Kentucky paid their coach $37 million to go away. Kentucky gives a shit. What are they doing? That's just how it is.

1:26:32Bill Simmons:All right, we'll pass that point along to the next segment. Sal, good job by you. Good job by you, buddy. Hey, it's Bill from the Bill Simmons Podcast. FIFA World Cup 26 fans. Listen up. is the official beer sponsor of the FIFA World Cup 26. Michelob Ultra is giving away$1 million worth of FIFA World Cup 26 tickets and prizes. Enter now at MichelobUltra.com slash superior access slash FIFA World Cup 26. Michelob Ultra FIFA World Cup 26, superior access, no purchase necessary. Open U.S. Residence 21 Plus begins on December 1st, 2025, ends on July 31st, 2026, multiple entry periods. Visit www.miclobaltra.com slash superior access slash FIFA World Cup 26 for free entry, entry deadlines, prizes, and details.

1:27:08Cousin Sal:If we knew more about our sleep, what would we do differently? Would we go to bed at a consistent time or take steps to reduce interruptions to our sleep? With Sleep Score, Apple Watch measures your bedtime consistency, interruptions, and sleep duration. Then, every morning it combines these factors into an easy-to-understand score from 1 to 100. So you'll know how to take the quality of your sleep from okay to very high. Know your sleep score with Apple Watch.

1:27:36Todd McShay:iPhone 11 or later required.

1:27:38Bill Simmons:All right, I can't remember many times on a Sunday night podcast with Cousin Sal that we had to veer off and cover another sport. But this college football story that happened with Ole Miss and LSU, we had to bring in Todd McShay and Van Lathan, a giant LSU fan. We'll start with Todd. You saw this coming for a while. You talked about it in your pod, but this still felt like one of the craziest weekends we've had in college football just with a coach switching teams, the whole thing. I don't remember this much of a circus. Is there another example?

1:28:09Todd McShay:I mean, I guess Brian Kelly's the closest thing, right? Back in 2021, where they were headed towards the playoff. They wound up, that was only a 14 playoff back then. They were heading towards it. I think they were like 11 and one or 10 and one at the time when Marcus Freeman stepped in as the intern and became the full-time coach. So kind of similar in a lot of ways. The defensive coach becomes the full-time coach and someone leaving in a playoff run to go to LSU. So there are definitely some similarities there, but I remember at the time it was unprecedented. I mean, you had to go to comparisons in other sports or at least maybe in the NFL to try to get something that was an apt comp, you know?

1:28:55Bill Simmons:So it's Van's team. So it's just LSU is the one that does this. Yeah, and the last time they did it,

1:29:03Todd McShay:They still have like five and a half years and$54 million to pay off. So, but this is different, man. Like from the family quote, when he walked into the, into the basketball arena, Brian Kelly to some of the recruiting early on. And then the stories that started to surface, it was just never a fit with Brian Kelly. Yeah. This feels like home. This feels like the right fit. And I don't, there's just so many layers to peel off in this, but can we just for a half a second celebrate the fact that the college football is i mean we just had the lane kiffin documentary come out and now we have part two unfolding right in front of our eyes and college football for all of its imperfections and it's it's the wild wild west right now like this is this is like what you love about this game it's insanity so what you love is abject insanity Yes.

1:30:00Bill Simmons:Okay. Van, listen, you could feel it coming for like two weeks. And yet the part where they have this giant playoff and watching a coach leave a team that he just put all this time in to try to put in a position to do well in the playoff. And then he's like, I'll see you guys later. Got a better offer. Good luck. It never sits right to me, but this is one of the reasons why college sports is so fucked up, Van. You've benefited from it twice. No, I have yet to benefit from it. Hopefully, I've benefited from it now. I mean, we got the Hodgman Trophy season with Jaden Daniels. So, you know, and Brian Kelly did some things while he was at LSU.

1:30:37You know, it's funny. You start, you get anxious about this stuff, so you reach out to people, people that are there, the people that you know, tons of LSU press people that I know down there in and around Baton Rouge that cover the sport, and you say, what's going on? And this is like a week ago, week and a half ago, and they say, it's done. I'm like what? It's done Like Lane Kiffin has agreed to come to LSU Van, Van, Van

1:31:01Todd McShay:I got a text on Friday night And apparently I gotta be careful Apparently there's a text chain going on Right? And on that text chain there's some people And someone I knew was around it And so on and so forth I was told on Friday night Like what? I don't get it What's the Marty Smith deal? Why is everyone like he's had a, he's basically closed on a house like a week ago. Yeah. It was over. It was over. Yeah. And so all of this, this past, you know, 72 hours was about him being able to coach this team, these players through the play, have your cake and eat it too. Right. He wanted to coach this team through, but still take this job.

1:31:44Todd McShay:And we could get into Kevin Carter and the AD and all that other stuff, but it's, it's shocking to me as you're alluding to that, that the people like poor Marty Smith, man, he was held hostage in the facilities there. This was his Walter Cronkite moment, though, like this was his moment to go down there with the slicker on while the hurricane's in the back and do real news coverage. The thing was, even though people were saying that it was over, it was done. They were still very hesitant to talk about it because of the nature of Lane Kiffin. They were like, we don't know whether or not he is going to hold to the fact that he has already agreed to a contract with LSU.

1:32:22They were waiting for the Egg Bowl. Can I tell you something, too, Van? They were waiting for the Iron Bowl. Like, people weren't sure if he was going to stick to his word on it.

1:32:33Todd McShay:The same people that told me Friday night that it's done, and he's got a place, basically, and everyone in his circle knows that he's going to LSU. same people were telling me you watch it will not be announced it will not be official till after that Alabama game right because of that because the job he wants more than any other job watch the hand motions and I know I've known Lane for over 20 years I'm buds with Lane we communicate but if you just watch as much as he butted heads with Nick at Alabama he and Saban have a bond and a mutual respect for one another, even though they drove each other crazy.

1:33:11Todd McShay:That was the job he wanted. And so there was still this 1 % in him and no one will ever admit it, especially him. And by the way, we have Scott Boris right now. We have, to me, like when you look at the situation with Jimmy Sexton in college football, he is the... Yeah, David Falk, Scott Boris, Jimmy Sexton's control. Even more so. He has 14 out of the 16 SEC coaches, though. He is the lord of college football. Yes, yes. And he's messing around with Penn State right now. We can get to that later or another time. But he's messing around with Penn State right now because Penn State let go one of his guys, James Franklin, in a manner that he didn't appreciate.

1:33:52Todd McShay:And so now they're kind of sitting back. And every time they go try to hire a coach or get serious with the coach, that coach, who's represented by Sexton, winds up with an extension. or winds up going to maybe UCLA. So it's fascinating to see. But I truly believe there was a small percentage of Lane that was like, yep, I'm going LSU. It's done. But what happens if Auburn beats Alabama? Because that thing could fall apart in a hurry with Kalen DeBoer.

1:34:23Bill Simmons:Yeah, see, Van, you're basically, I'm trying to think of the Hollywood relationship parallel. Oh, I got a bunch of them. Like Lori Harvey, if you know who she is. You know, if you date Lori Harvey for a little while, you fall in love, but you know that she's going to go looking for someone else, be it Warren Beatty. There are a bunch of them. There's so many. But here's the thing, though. Here's the deal. This is the deal. With any of these people, any of these relationships, the true measure of it is not the length of it. The true measure of it is what you got out of it. Like, what did you get out of it?

1:34:58When you were, the time that you were in the sun, dating Madonna, the time that you were in the sun, dating Warren Beatty, dating Rihanna, dating Lori Harvey, did your star go up? Did you win a couple of championships? Because that person is leaving. No one thinks that this is a marriage. This is a long-term courtship between us and Lane Kiffin. What will we get out of the time that we are together? That's how you have to look at that if you're an LSU fan.

1:35:23Todd McShay:And Ole Miss people don't want to hear this, okay? I love Oxford. It's one of my favorite stops on the college football tour. I think it's a beautiful, magical place. I love Archie. I'll give you a couple more before the, I love Archie. I love the people there. I love the tailgating, all of it. But Lane outgrew Oxford. His star rose and it got too big. And it got trashed from the Tennessee to the Raiders to he and Nick fighting to FAU and all of it. But he slowly built it back up. And he kind of he reinvented himself through sobriety and hot yoga and remarried to his wife and all those things.

1:36:10Todd McShay:And he now knows he's in a place personally where he can go and make a run at being one of the greats. and he took Ole Miss. You got to remember, this 11-win season during the regular season at Ole Miss is the best season in the school's history. They've ever had, yeah. That they've ever had. 11-win season at LSU is like, okay, really good, but what's the payoff now? And with that expectation comes support, comes a foundation that Ole Miss just doesn't have. And so I understand it from Lane's perspective. It's just the timing sucks. And honestly, it's college football's calendar that's created all this because you can't wait another month with recruiting, with the NIL, with transfer portal and everything going on.

1:36:56Todd McShay:The calendar is so twisted that you have to make decisions like this at the least opportunistic time to do so.

1:37:04Bill Simmons:When you say foundation, are you saying they just don't have the same NIL war chest or they don't have the prestige? What is missing with the Ole Miss foundation that LSU has?

1:37:15Todd McShay:I think part of it's prestige. I think part of it is Ole Miss has come up with a war chest that's, that's, you know, I mean, they, they've been able. Yes. Yes. And they, and they had the right people in place that were helping Lane get the players that he wanted. And it was, but it was maxed out there. So if Lane's able to go to LSU and take the money that he had and maybe a little bit more money and the aggressive people around him to help support him, he can turn, he can become at LSU. What Nick was at Alabama. I'm not saying that many championships, but that in his mind, I can go to LSU and make a serious run.

1:37:58Todd McShay:Now that I'm in a place personally where I'm seeing things clearer than I ever have before. I'm healthier. I'm like committed. Everything's in a row. I can now go there and chase what Nick, what Nick created at Alabama. And that absolutely is his mindset.

1:38:16Bill Simmons:And more talent, more talent in Louisiana, right? Yeah, I'll say this a couple of things. Number one, along with this, LSU has made a commitment to, to the, uh, the, the NIL and to have 20,$25 million a year, um, for him to go out and, and, and get the players. Right. So he's going to be competitive as far as that's competitive with most programs in the country. Secondly is this. Per capita, I think Louisiana is second or third in terms of players in the NFL right now. It's a very fertile, fertile state for that. And there's not another SEC school in the state. Now, Mississippi is third, but there's a big gap between second and third.

1:38:56Like, Louisiana and Georgia are real close, and then Mississippi is third, but there's a gap between Mississippi and Louisiana. And then you have another SEC school in Mississippi. So, Whereas at Ole Miss, Lane is going to have to dip into the transfer portal every now and again to get players and hope that those players hit. If he can successfully build a wall around Louisiana, he can go out and have the best, most talented athletic teams in the country every single year. Top five schools, top five classes every year. The first thing that he did when he got in town was he met with Lamar Brown, the number one player in the class who's already committed to LSU, who goes to U High.

1:39:38U High is on LSU's campus. It's on the campus of the school, right? And the number one player in the state, in the country, is at that school. So there are advantages that exist at LSU that he wouldn't have had at Ole Miss. I'll say this about Lane Kiffin, though. Lane Kiffin needs to prove that he's a championship coach. Everyone knows that he's a good coach. He's a talented coach. He can see ball, he can call ball. He can build programs. But the reality is, now with the resources that he has, with as many places as he's been. It's time for him to prove that he can win championships. As the head guy, yep.

1:40:12As the head guy. Not as the guy that's calling your plays. As the head guy. And that happens here. It has to happen now because LSU is all in with Lane Kiffin.

1:40:23Todd McShay:And the thing too is, Bill, just so you understand, because I know the NBA and NFL. I barely understand. Trinidad Trinidad Trinidad No I know I know but Trinidad Chambliss the quarterback that he just won 11 games with he was a transfer from a division two school all of his games in the previous couple seasons that he played wasn't didn't wasn't in front of a crowd if you combined all those crowds as big as an SEC home game and so he brought him in and he was apparently right because I don't I don't have like the transfer portal rankings for for any position let alone quarterback but apparently they have a couple you know services that do these rankings he was like the 260 something ranked quarterback and he and lane found him and brought him in and did this with him in one year so you think about what he can do at lsu with the type of talent that van's talking about and then also like he went from west coast USC, the Pete Carroll, when you think of that, like Sarkeesian and Lane and what they did with those, like the Matt Leinerts and the Sanchezes of the world to that up-tempo craze, you know, it's kind of fit his personality to mixing and blending the two with Jackson Dart.

1:41:47Todd McShay:And Jackson Dart early on was that RPO, hand the ball off and fast tempo and going. And then as Jackson Dart grew up and got smarter and could understand concepts, like morphed those things into more West Coast. And then he kind of went veered off to the side with Trinidad this year. So not only are you getting a guy who can spot talent and develop talent, you're also getting a guy schematically who actually, and there's very few of them in college football, who actually gives you a schematic upper hand over a lot of other opponents on the offensive side of the ball. And who develops talent to where you can see a huge thing that I think the transfer portal, and shout out to my man Carter, Power Hour LSU, who talked about this.

1:42:32The transfer portal to me has affected the development of a lot of the players in college football because you're bringing in guys who are established and it's taking away reps that other guys are getting that have been in your program for a long time, right? So it's shortening the window to develop these players. Lane's players get better. They develop. You see snap after snap, game after game, these people get better. These players, they develop. They are better football players. They don't regress in weird ways like some of the big players that you've seen in other places. They get it and they continue to get a hold of what it is that he's given them.

1:43:07And I just say something else. His crazy matches are crazy. We insane. We drunk on Saturday in the morning all day. we New Orleans, Baton Rouge, Opelousas, Chalmette, Destrehan, West Monroe, Lake Charles, New Iberia, crazy. And his crazy matches our crazy. It's a culture fit.

1:43:32Todd McShay:It works, man. I don't think it would fit in Alabama. I think it fits perfectly in Baton Rouge. But I'm curious, Bill, because when you called me earlier and asked me, you know, are you around tonight to come on? It seemed like you had an edge about this whole thing. Like, kind of a little bit. Were you disgusted by it? Like, what was your first reaction to all of this?

1:43:51Bill Simmons:No, because so when I was like nine years old, the Patriots were really good. The 78 Patriots. We had this coach, Chuck Fairbanks. And he took a job with Colorado. Get the last game of the season heading into the playoffs. And everybody was outraged. They suspended him for the last game. Then he came back and coached the playoff game. We got killed by the Oilers. And he just became this pariah that Patriot fans still hate. like everybody over a certain age. I hate that guy to this day. So I wonder like, A, does that happen with him in Ole Miss where he's just hated even 45 years from now? It feels like it will.

1:44:25Bill Simmons:Then the LSU piece.

1:44:26Todd McShay:Did you see the airport today?

1:44:28Bill Simmons:Yeah, yeah. It just feels like that's going to be the all-time villain status for him. And they're right down the highway. Right. Well, then he goes to LSU and it really does feel like this isn't the last stop for him. But I was thinking about it in the context of, it's weird. So LeBron won two straight MVPs. the decision happens and he just vaults to another level of fame, right? That it was such a polarizing thing. It was such a huge story. Everybody had an opinion on it. Like even like my wife knew that it happened or my mom, people that didn't even follow sports. It feels like this Lane Kiffin thing might be like that for college football, which I didn't really think would be possible for a coach, like a story that crosses over the mainstream.

1:45:09Bill Simmons:So I guess my question is, does he now vault to this different level? Like, is he the most famous football coach now because of this?

1:45:17Todd McShay:Oh, easily. Right? So then is he more famous than any basketball coach?

1:45:21Bill Simmons:Is he just the most famous college coach now? Yeah. I mean, I think so. I think he is. I think he is too. Yeah. I mean, obviously there are guys that are running it right now. And as far as college basketball, it's an interesting transitional period where a lot of the guys where these institutions are kind of gone now. But, yeah, he is. This has been a soap opera that has captivated college football fandom for the last month. And it spilled over to where I'm getting texts from all different types of people talking about it now. And yeah, to be honest with you, Nick Saban came in and transformed LSU football.

1:46:00It's a fact. It's a fact. Grew seeds that are still bearing fruit, but it's hard for me to look at them. It just is because it became a humiliation ritual. every November first weekend to go in there and get your teeth stomped in. Right? It never goes away. But you're still kind of appreciative. You're still kind of appreciative. You're still like, we had Nick Saban. Now, the difference is, like, he never delivered them a national championship. Who knows how far Ole Miss football goes. If his legacy and what he started there can continue under Pete Golden, maybe it softens the blow a little bit.

1:46:42Bill Simmons:Well, Todd, do you remember that was the past fans with Parcells, right? There was a lot of bitterness, and he went to the Jets, even when he went to the Cowboys. But at some point, it shifted, and people were like, you know what, he brought football back. He probably saved. We would have gone to St. Louis if it wasn't for him. I appreciate him. But it was really mad for a little bit. I think this Kiffin thing will probably be a little deeper because odds are Ole Miss is never going to matter like they just did the last couple of years.

1:47:09Todd McShay:Yeah, they're not like this. Not like this. And going back to your question, you've got to remember college football in just the last few years has lost Nick Saban, Urban Meyer, Jim Harbaugh. So you look around, like Marcus Freeman, people love and adore him. Lincoln Riley was a big deal, but he went out to USC, and surprisingly, it's just not gone well, and so his star has fallen. Kirby Smart, Dabo Sweeney for a while, just with all the antics and the press conferences and the interviews, you know, the postgame was a big character. But that star has fallen. And Kirby Smart's been the most successful coach.

1:47:51Todd McShay:And while you can't argue the success, and even though the foundation is that of Nick Saban, for whatever reason, he just doesn't carry that cachet, right?

1:48:05Bill Simmons:The Oregon coach seems like he has a little bit of crossover name recognition, but not like Lane Kempfin, I don't think.

1:48:12Todd McShay:Not likely. And even, you know, Chip Kelly, when they were rolling, people loved Chip or despised him. But a lot of fun. College football, if you look at it right now, it's kind of missing that, like, sex appeal for, like, the big names and rival coaches and all that.

1:48:30Bill Simmons:By the way, so is college basketball, just FYI. When you said that, it kind of did. Tito's probably the most famous college basketball coach right now. And he's a holdover from a past era. Right. And I'm not saying it won't happen again, but I'm saying right now, you know, it used to be times where you're looking at, you know, Calipari and all of these guys are on top of it. And they had their own little fiefdoms of college basketball. In college football right now, there are a lot of things that are stopping us from getting to the middle of these stories, right? Every time two teams play, it's about the playoff.

1:49:05It's about the season. The cultural clashes is what made the sport special to me. This story is about a cultural clash. And the dominoes that fell around this, how as soon as Lane made his decision, Arkansas has their guy. Florida has their guy. Auburn has their guy. All of that is about how these... I'm as interested in why John Sumrall looked at the Auburn situation and went, can't coach there. Like, can't do it. Like, these are the things that used to undergird the love for the sport. And they kind of get washed over when you're talking about the transfer portal. You're talking about NIL. You're talking about so many other things than just which culture is superior, the cultural warfare that is college football.

1:49:49Todd McShay:I mean, the current system has created a bunch of mercenaries, from players to coaches. and they really have like it's pay for play and everyone's out to kind of get theirs and quite honestly Lane was trying to use this current system to go against the establishment in Ole Miss and from what I understand there were conversations of I'm just going to take the staff and I'm going to take a bunch of these players with me and they won't play if you don't let me coach and it didn't really work out that's the other part of this Van and Bill like someone snuck a phone into that meeting today and it got it out and they taped it and they taped it.

1:50:31Todd McShay:Yeah. So everyone had to turn their phone in. Someone had a burner phone and someone had it with stuff somewhere where no one knew and, and taped it. And when they, the, the, um, the chancellor and I think the AD, you know, spoke to the team, the players and basically thank you for everything you've done. You have no idea. Like you're going to 15 years from now, we're going to have you on the field 10, 15 years from now, and we're going to be celebrating you. You have brought memories. you have brought, like you'll never understand what you have brought to this town, this city of Oxford. But also we want to let you know, you got to keep pushing because, because we can still make a run at this and your new head coach is right here.

1:51:09And I was surprised by the level of excitement by the players.

1:51:14Todd McShay:They went nuts. I think they got to a point where they were just fed up with all of it. And so while Lane thought he was going to leverage these players that love him and would would die for him, would follow him anywhere. They seemed to, and it was just one, you know, one meeting, but there were, it wasn't like, Hey, you know, it was going crazy. So that part's interesting too. Let's be honest guys.

1:51:39Bill Simmons:This, this could be a sports movie. I keep trying to get you to get into it. I told you that I was about to hit you out. We, somebody should do this, cast everyone up and someone should do this. I'll tell you this though. I'll tell you something. well, there will be some attrition. Not now. They're in the playoff and they will play. After the dust is settled. No question. There will be some attrition. The question is who? A lot of people thought Kiwon Lacy, Trinidad, Chambliss, all of these guys would end up in purple and gold. I don't know that that'll happen. But there are definitely some people.

1:52:15There have been some decommitments already. There have been some players in Louisiana now who are looking around and they might go, I might have the chance to be Neighbors or Brian Thomas Jr. or Jamar Chase again. I might get a chance to get used like that again with the type of offense that they're playing. And there are definitely going to be guys that play for Ole Miss that feel that way as well. There will be some attrition. The question is how much and when will they start to trickle out. I don't think it will be until after they're done in the playoff.

1:52:41Bill Simmons:I mean, Todd, this is your favorite sport. Is all this good? In the long run, no. What are we ultimately trying to do here as a squirrel?

1:52:52Todd McShay:Not really. But it kind of feels like we're always in this. Right. You know, like, man, things are out of control in college football, whether it's paying players that, you know, it's not legal or illegal recruiting. I grew up, my grandfather got me into the sport, gave me an obsession with it. He was a quote-unquote area recruiter for the University of Michigan for Bo Schembechler. Well, I thought that was the coolest thing in the world, but I didn't realize that like they were having these secret meetings and like Bo was coming to the house and no one was supposed to know about it because what my grandfather was doing was illegal at the time probably.

1:53:30Todd McShay:And I still don't know exactly how illegal, but this has been going on for - Your grandfather was Connor Stallions? No, but maybe before Connor Stallions, apparently. I don't like to think of him that way, but I'm just saying, I feel like college football is always kind of in this seedy area and it's kind of what makes it beautiful. Well, now the players have been able

1:53:53Bill Simmons:to at least match the seediness and be like, all right, now we're going to do it too. And there's so many negative byproducts

1:53:59Todd McShay:of all of this. There's no question. And unfortunately, following them now to the NFL draft and getting the intel from NFL teams that have private investigators and former FBI agents going and hearing the stories of like, it's hard enough. Marty Schottenheimer had a quote to me once when he was working at ESPN. He said, the hardest part of evaluating a player, it's not does he have a big arm or does he run fast? It's knowing that you're about to hand this person three things that he's never had before. More money, more fame, and more free time. And it resonated with me. And I'm still 15, 20 years later still talking about that quote.

1:54:39Todd McShay:But now you're doing it. And that was with like a 20, 21, 22 year old. Now you're doing it with like 16, 17, 18 year olds. And to hear some of the stories going on. So at some point, college football has to have a commissioner. They've got to have a governing body that actually governs over the sport. But I don't know when that's ever going to happen. It's going to, and I've talked to so many head coaches and people in power, like the highest up people in power. And they all agree on one thing. It will take the government. stepping in and forcing it on college football because there's too much money to be had right now.

1:55:17Todd McShay:Too many people that are in power are benefiting from it financially.

1:55:21Bill Simmons:Well, you talk about the 15, 16, 17-year-olds. You also have this whole class of kind of like lower-level agents slash manager, handler. Yes. Dealmaker people who have no experience whatsoever who are super sleazy. I feel like that's where it's going to go the most sideways. Do you know what it used to be? It used to be that$40 ,000 or$50 ,000 was a lot of money. That wouldn't really talk. $40 ,000,$50 ,000. You come work on a staff. Get a car. Put you on staff. Not even put you on staff at the college. Put you on staff at the local high school. Put your uncle on staff. Let him call some plays and all that stuff.

1:55:59At a dealership or something, yeah. At a dealership. Get him all of that stuff. That doesn't move the needle anymore.

1:56:04Todd McShay:No. We need$250 ,000. And I need$250 ,000. And I'm a four-star safety. That's not, if you want a quarterback, that's a mil five, baby. That's two million. It's different. Things are different. And as we adjust to it, there are some bodies that are being left behind. Like right now, I love LSU. It's in my blood. Walked around the campus when I was three years old. Like my mom went there, all of that stuff, right? But I do feel for Ole Miss fans. I feel for what it must be like to be having the greatest season in the history of your school. than lose your identity, which is what Lane Kiffin was for Ole Miss, before you go and get a chance to make a run.

1:56:45And so I do feel for that. But honestly, it's the wire, man. It's cold outside. Yeah, I was going to say, I've known you a long time.

1:56:54Bill Simmons:You don't feel bad at all. I don't know who you're kidding. Look, it's a cold game. I've been there. Like, it's a cold game, man. The thing about the old days is they the old days. That's the thing about them. We're in the new day now, and it's kind of getting where you're feeling. It's the way it goes. So, Todd, what school was the most bummed out that this happened other than Ole Miss? Alabama?

1:57:19Todd McShay:Florida. Oh, for sure. I mean, Layla, his own wife went there. His wife's father was a star quarterback at Florida and went on to play for the Buccaneers, I think it was. They thought it was. If he's leaving Ole Miss, he's going there. So why LSU and not Florida?

1:57:40Bill Simmons:Like, why would he pull the trigger on the OSU pick and not wait?

1:57:46Todd McShay:I think if you study both programs, at Florida, there's a little bit more chaos, more bureaucracy. It's been disjointed at Florida. Terrible AD, Todd. Terrible AD. I hate to say it. Terrible. Strickland is one of the worst ADs. They got a terrible AD. A terrible AD. a guy who can't seem to make the right decisions about anything. It probably spooked a lot of coaches, to be honest with you.

1:58:15Bill Simmons:Worse than the Syracuse AD who didn't hire Bob Chesney? A little stealth joke for Todd. Two years ago, Todd remembers. And there's some layers to it, too. We might have worked for him once upon a time. He couldn't do that job either. Also, Saban's influence might have pushed him to LSU just a tad bit. Maybe.

1:58:36Todd McShay:The two people that were most influential on this were Nick Saban and Pete Carroll.

1:58:45Pete's point to him was, you did what you were supposed to do at Ole Miss.

1:58:50Todd McShay:They'll wind up appreciating you. The players will wind up appreciating you. But it's time for you to go to level up. And you've earned the right to level up through all of everything you've been through. Go take it. Nick's message might have been what you're talking about, Van.

1:59:08Bill Simmons:Well, Todd, you made the key point earlier. The way the system's set up, maybe there's no way that this could be graceful. Like for going forward, there's no way this can actually happen in a good way. You'd have to be out of the playoff race.

1:59:21Todd McShay:The only people who are affected by this that I actually care about are the players. And listening to that team meeting, maybe they're not as affected as I thought.

1:59:33Bill Simmons:I'm going to be rooting for them now. Oh, me too. Let's have the sports movie actually happen, Van. Yeah. Van, you're doing an unbelievable job of pretending you're not like absolutely euphoric right now. I just want to give you a lot of credit. I haven't seen you this happy in a while. So two things. Number one, I'm glad we got our guy. I'm glad we got the coach that we wanted. Number two, if I wanted to be, I could be such a dickhead about this, but I'm choosing. If I wanted to be, because if you, some of the some of the some of the texting calls and I'm getting this I didn't know we had it like that we went right over into the next station and took your girl wow you guys was about to get married I mean you guys are literally planning a wedding and we went over there and we said we got a bigger house we got a better car we got like you come over here and get with us if I wanted to I could be a dickhead about it but I care too much about the sport I really love college football and I know the fandom that people have.

2:00:32And I've been up there to Ole Miss. They're a decent fan, history aside. And I don't have any problem with them. And I know this must hurt. I know this must hurt. Plus, the karma and the energy thing is always a big thing for me. But I'm happy.

2:00:46Bill Simmons:The karma rules. Yeah, like I'm happy that LSU got their guy. But goddamn, that got to suck, man. That has to be tough. Well, you know who the last honest, loyal man in college football was? Drake May. could have left could have left for his last year jumped to a better program done it for him you know what he did? he stayed in North Carolina with an inferior team not a great coaching situation because he's a loyal guy Todd McShay Drake May he's built different

2:01:14Todd McShay:and now he's got a playoff run with no left tackle so here we are here we are it was all will

2:01:22Bill Simmons:alright so Todd you're covering more of this on your podcast tomorrow

2:01:25Todd McShay:yes tomorrow we have tomorrow morning it'll be up Late morning, and I've got more on this. I've got a lot more on Penn State. This whole, I don't think until this, I really, I mean, I knew that Jimmy Sexton had 14 of 16 SEC coaches, and he was powerful. I think this last six, eight weeks has shown us that he literally is the most powerful man in college football. And he is pulling every string. And if you're a Penn State fan, that is a scary thing right now.

2:01:55Bill Simmons:And then, Van, you're covering more in Ringer Tailgate? that's what we're doing on Ringer Tailgate on Wednesday. We're doing a deep dive into Jimmy Sexton. Yeah, we're doing a deep dive into Jimmy Sexton on Ringer Tailgate because I don't know you guys would know better than I would if there's any singular sports figure right now. I guess Clutch has a lot of guys Clutch has the Ringer now. I guess Clutch has a lot of guys I guess Clutch has a lot of guys guys, but I don't know if there's any one specific figure in any one specific sport from the business side. Honestly, you can talk about Boris, you can talk about David Falk.

2:02:40He's on that level, but on a crazy level. Even on the broadcast, you can hear the guys on the broadcast, Jimmy Sexton clients, talking in a Jimmy Sexton language. It's interesting. I'm not accusing anyone of anything. I'm just saying to have a player like that in your sport, it just changes the dynamics completely.

2:03:02Bill Simmons:Boris felt like he had that going, not recently, but maybe like, what, 10, 12 years ago?

2:03:08Todd McShay:Yeah, it felt like.

2:03:09Bill Simmons:It felt like he just had everybody for three, four years. But yeah, I mean, this would be the right sport to do it because it's the wild, wild west. All right, Van on Ringer Tailgate Wednesday, Todd McShay tomorrow, plus Todd's newsletter, which is essential. Love it. Go Pats. Thanks for coming on, guys. Dan got me a newsletter. I've been looking at the newsletters. Shout out to Dan. I love it. Thanks, guys. No problem. See you guys. All right, that's it for the podcast. Thanks to Sal and Van and McShay and Gahal and Eduardo. Don't forget Rewatchables on Monday night, Rocky 2, and Music Box Series actually coming back on HBO and HBO Max on Thursday night with a Jeff Buckley documentary that is fantastic.

2:03:54Bill Simmons:So I'll talk more about that on Tuesday. but just want to give you a little heads up. Thursday night, we have an awesome football game and you also have a really good documentary to watch. So I will see you on this feed on Tuesday.

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