Inside Jordan Matter’s Netflix Deal, and what it signals for YouTubers

0:00Over the past year, one of the biggest stories in entertainment has been the battle between Netflix and YouTube. And over the past few months, we've seen Netflix try and make up ground in that battle by signing deals with YouTube creators. These have come in a variety of different forms. We've seen original shows get booked with creators. We've seen licensing deals for podcasts and shows that they have. And now we've seen a different type of deal that was just announced this week with Jordan and Salish Matter. Jordan spent most of his career as a photographer and took to YouTube to make videos about photography and grow his photography business.

0:36It now has over 30 million subscribers. They've done 13 billion views. And it really took off when he started making videos with his daughter Salish. Over the past few years, Jordan and his daughter Salish have grown into some of the most popular creators on the platform. And Salish actually is one of the most popular people in the world. If you go to the website famousbirthdays.com, which is kind of like Wikipedia for Gen Z, Salish Matter is the number one most searched birthday on that website over Taylor Swift. And the internet really saw how popular Salish was when she launched her skincare brand at the Sephora of the American Dream Mall in New Jersey.

1:17Over 80 ,000 fans showed up and they had to shut down the mall. This version of a Netflix deal that Jordan and Salish got is really different. So I wanted to have Jordan in the chair to explain the deal and talk about this current moment that we're seeing with Netflix pulling YouTube creators onto their platform, trying to become more relevant to a younger audience, and trying to operate a bit more like YouTube. So this is my conversation with Jordan Matter about his Netflix deal.

1:51Okay, Jordan, welcome to the show. Thank you. So obviously we've talked about this off mic but i think it's a conversation we should bring to our podcast listeners you have signed a deal with netflix we've signed a big deal with netflix yeah super exciting it's super exciting first of all congrats thank you i'm fascinated by this moment it's something we've talked about quite a bit on the pod is that this convergence of uh digital and traditional it feels like now it's how much more can we talk about it as like two separate worlds it's one but tell me about this deal that you signed just explain to everyone what is this we have a very unique deal that nobody else has been given up to this point um so you're seeing some development deals come out alan chicken chow has one uh jimmy obviously the beast games beast games too uh what that is is they present a show with a budget and then the streaming service just green lights it and then they make it.

2:47We have something different, which is a talent deal. So we have agreed over the next three years to create three to four shows for Netflix. We'll do that with Netflix, but we have creative control over their shows. It's a huge leap of faith in us and a lot of trust because we did not come to them with a show at all. They came to us with interest in us as talent. And then they want to develop something with us together. So what those shows are, that's up in the air right now. Yes, yes. We're in the process of developing them now. Lots of meetings, creative. They're amazing. Their creative team is really exciting to work with.

3:24And they have their own team that's developing ideas. We are developing ideas. Then we come together and talk about them. And we will together come up with the best idea. And we both have to green light it. So they can't say to me, you have to do this. And I can't say to them, you have to do this. Once we agree on a show together, then we go into pre-production. what happens if you don't agree on a show we will we have to got it you have to understood yeah so who came to who in this scenario like for us as creators right now like i i think a lot of us have gotten calls from the streamers specifically netflix uh but they've been at least for us they've been very exploratory um who came to who in this context we spent the last year and a half developing an animated show and we took it out to the market to amazon disney and netflix among others and right when we were starting to get those meetings we launched our skincare sincerely yours at the american dream mall and 87 000 people showed up to that which is the largest creative event in history that went super viral and then all these uh companies are not like wait wait a minute, maybe there's more to this than just an animated show.

4:34And Netflix and other, I shouldn't say who, but other companies were super, super interested in developing a bigger relationship. And we basically just kind of fell in love with Netflix and they were very open to allowing us to have a lot of creative control, which we thought was super important. It does feel like this moment in time, we were talking about this on a panel earlier, I've described it as the abundance era of content because there's just so much. I told you some numbers up there, but 20 million videos uploaded to YouTube every day, 95 million photos and videos uploaded to Instagram every day, 23 million videos uploaded to TikTok.

5:13It's crazy. And a moment like that, that you guys had at the American Dream Ball launching Sincerely Yours, signifies to me and to the rest of the industry like, oh, out of the 20 million videos uploaded every day, these videos clearly matter to people. Yes. So, and actually viewership numbers don't tell me that. No. They don't tell me that at all. Not at all, actually. And as a matter of fact, we didn't even know, and we got a lot of views. We had no idea that people would show up. So we showed up at the mall with absolutely no idea, hoping 1 ,000 or 2 ,000 people would show up. So it was the first time we had ever done anything.

5:45So we were learning, just like everybody else, that actually this relationship we've been building with the audience over the last five years actually did resonate with them to the degree where they were willing to fly from all over the world to see us. and what right now if we talk about some data about the channel um what's like the average viewership of an episode in terms of what like how many people how many people watch uh i you know usually anywhere from eight to ten million in the first week and about 40 million over time per per video uh mostly u.s based not we only dub in spanish a week late so they're not dubbed views we're not on youtube kids and they're all long form about 30 minutes 30 minutes yeah and how long are people watching that we're anywhere from 48 to 52 percent that's insane yeah right it's crazy it's crazy really all of it's crazy and so that obviously has then skyrocketed salish to being the most popular people in the world within the demo that's what's interesting right like uh right now matt damon and ben affleck have a show on netflix okay and they're recognized by emmy every demo anywhere they go but will that so i think for the most part like you and i will definitely recognize you my my salish knows who they are okay right or let's use somebody like ariana grande or any of them right massive celebrities are recognized wide appeal but do they have a passionate fan base i don't know some yes some know.

7:15I don't know. Right. If Matt Damon opens a coffee shop. Exactly. Is there a line on opening day? Exactly. I don't know. Whereas David Dobrik opens a pizza shop and there's still lines. Yeah. So there is that connection between the audience and the creator because you've invited them into your home. When we launched Sincerely Yours, one story I'd like to tell is that when we had the meeting with Sephora to try and get them interested in us, then they had no idea who we were. And we came in with all this data and they're like, okay, data is whatever. Why is your product going to sell better than Ariana Grande's product.

7:46Ariana has a beauty line in Sephora that has, I guess, had underperformed. And I said, are you a fan of Ariana? And they said, yeah, I'm saying, all right, what's the color of her bedroom? What's the name of her dog? And she had no idea. I said, this is the difference, okay, because our audience will know the answers to those questions. And I believe that the relationship between creator, influencer, and audience is so much deeper than between celebrity. So there's a lot of places we can go when nobody will know who we are, but the people that do know who we are are really invested because we're invested in them and they're invested back in us.

8:19So then content wise is the deal with like, is there a cast of characters that Netflix wants in each, uh, show or is it just Salish? Is it Salish and you? Cause, cause even when you say that, like when I, you know, look at your videos, like there's a cast, right? And so my assumption would be if I'm Netflix, I'm like, bring the cast. Is that the, is that the the context or is it just bring Salish? I think it's, there's, I think if I pitched an idea that didn't have Salish, they'd be like, okay, wait a minute here. Of course. You know, I think she and I will probably be in the first, the first show because that's most consistent with our channel.

8:54We're trying to find something that makes sense from our channel that's elevated. However, we're also looking at the huge audience that has no idea who we are on Netflix that should also be interested in the show so with jimmy i think it's very obvious okay i i'm a master of ceremonies i have game shows let me just exaggerate it by 10x and that's the show and it works for us we are not massive we're not scale we are intimate we're that relationship-based channel so how do you scale that i mean the obvious there is reality show what the d 'amelios did right the kardashians have done right like if if we're actually saying like what is the next step if you know when i looked and this is weeks ago now when you uploaded salish's uh 16th birthday yeah episode yeah 28 million views like that yeah super popular episode to me that feels akin to how people watched kylie jenner grow up yeah right exactly and so i think the obvious answer is reality show except the reality shows exist in conflict and so what do you mean as in just think about an episode from d 'amelio's or from kardashians it's not like everything is chill it's like oh there has to be conflict there has to be problems i don't want to have conflict with my daughter it's not something i don't want to create a an environment in which we need conflict in order to drive views sure um the way i see the channel is i'm just building memories with my daughter at this point and i want everything to be magical and special and fun so i would say that for for this show it needs to be something that keeps the energy which is a playful banter and it's a bit performative but it's all based in real scenarios and how do we elevate that one obvious thing would be you know a game show of some sort between parents and kids but then i think that our audience actually is more interested in watching salish experience something and less interested She's watching her host something.

10:50So that's kind of where we're at right now. It's like, what is that middle ground? Sure. Yeah, it's really interesting because I think what happens on YouTube for creators when they move to streamer, it can't be a far departure. It actually has to be, you know, basically how do we do this on a bigger scale or what do we have access to now that we wouldn't otherwise? And I think the CEO of Mythical Entertainment, Brian Flanagan said to me, it has to rhyme with something meaning jimmy and beast games is kind of like survivor it kind of rhymes with it right it's not exactly the same it's not the same thing but it kind of rhymes with it i loved when he said that because i was like i think as we all move to streamers we can't just concept like a completely brand new thing especially because there's a there's a bigger audience has never heard of you so then that means it has to rhyme with something.

11:46I love the rhyme with something. And a couple of ideas that we're working on currently do rhyme with things. Cool. And so that could be a direction, but yeah, that's, that's a great idea. Yeah. So, and I imagine that part of also the X factor of Netflix, even when I think about it, cause I, I oftentimes think about why would creators do a streaming deal? Yeah. You reach 40 million people with your show. Why? One of the reasons is an irrationally good economic deal. That's one option. Right? Yes. That's one option, which is if Netflix offers me an irrationally good deal, of course it's a yes. Right.

12:23And they have that ability. Yes, they do. Which is, okay. So it sounds like you're not going to say the number, but it sounds like it's a good, it's a good. I mean, I think that that's an aspect of the decision. That's an aspect of the decision. Hypothetically, that would be an aspect of your decision. So I think that's one. The other is like access and the other is budget. To do something. And time. Time. Because we make a video every week. So our process is Tuesday through Saturday, we're in pre-production and Sunday we're filming. We only want to film one day so Salish can have a regular life the rest of the week.

12:54So we have to get our 30-minute video done in one day. Now, anybody that makes 30-minute videos that get 50 % retention understand that that's very hard to do if you have a month, much less one day. And that's what we do every week. So what I'm excited about creatively is wait, I have a production team that's helping me. I have the support of Netflix. I have their resources and their connections. And we can come up with something that we can take three weeks to film. That's so exciting. So creatively, it's the next step up. Very important to never forget that all of this happened because of YouTube and to stay consistent with our posting and to make the content just as good as it was, but then somehow find another gear to shift into for netflix what is what is success to you for the show and what success to netflix you think number one show on netflix number one show that would be success for both of us now that might not happen but that was would be what success is i don't think and again i don't want to speak for netflix but i don't think that it's about driving subscribers as much it's about relevance it's about owning the creator space you know it's like they're they're heavily invested in creators they they get it they really do they get the the passion of the audience they get the creativity we're used to a very quick turnaround and um they're very excited to work on that in a way that isn't as i don't know predictable as a lot of hollywood content is it's it's a new thing and one of the things to their credit is they've said don't try to be anything else don't don't try to do a show that isn't you you're here because of what you've done on youtube let's figure out a way to elevate that a bit, but really it's the same show.

14:41I think there's another element to why creators should take the deal. And it actually, it really, it came up when we were in Montana together at Spotter Summit and Issa Rae was speaking to us, which is marketing. And I hadn't thought of that before, but if there's one thing that Hollywood has been exceptional at, it's marketing. And you becoming the number one show on Netflix, I would assume, you know or even in the pursuit of that in being partnership with netflix there's a lot of incentive to market salish to market you to market the show yes and again in a sea of content in a sea of creators you start to stand out yeah when you have a marketing engine behind you that's true it takes you to the next level however there's some pros and cons of that too because right now i mean we're in the top two u.s views on the platform after jimmy right so that's incredible but we're very under the radar.

15:33Yeah. Very. If you go to anybody who watches YouTube and they say, who are the top two? They'd say Jimmy and I, and I don't know. And they'd say Stokes Twins. They'd say anybody. They might say Ryan Trahan. They'd say anybody but us. Yeah. Your viewers would have no idea that that's the reality, but it is. Right. So that's a good place to be, especially when you have a daughter and you care about her emotional health. She and I have talked a lot about this. Like, look, we go to Netflix. A lot of people are going to have opinions. Those opinions might not, For no reason, they might just want to come after you.

16:03Who's this 16-year-old who's suddenly on Netflix? Why do I care? Let me knock her down a few pegs. And I think you get increased exposure, but you also get increased criticism. And that's something that we're going to have to be ready for because not everyone's going to love what we do, especially because they won't know who we are. And Salish has no real interest in fame. So it's not like she's pursuing it and wants to be the most famous person on the planet. She just loves making content. She was excited about the Netflix thing. but i don't necessarily know that she wants to experience all that and so that's one of the conversations we've been having that's complex because a lot of people who who get it all kind of reflect on the um beauty of anonymity yes yeah and it it just it just dominoes yeah you know you you start by doing content with your kid and it just it's like the thing is it's fun we have so much fun she loves doing it so much and she sees the opportunities in the future potentially she could start her own business or whatever right production company she sees it but she's never into it for fame so when that when that recognition comes it's almost a byproduct of it and now she's got to adapt to that but by the time that happened you're already there right so to stop well that's stopping the fun thing for the thing that already exists so that's the that's the dance we've been doing it's like are you good it's because she's like she said if i could go to a mall nobody knows who i am like that would be a great day for me that's her perspective right it's like okay say when we do the netflix thing it's it might take you to more of the mall experience you might not be able to go to the mall yeah right and and that's a real conversation that you got to really address and think, is this what you want?

17:52It's exciting, but also that's a byproduct of it. And I think it's important for anybody who works with their kids to have very open, honest conversations about, is this what you want? And I think she's old enough now to really be able to make those decisions, but it's something that we'll see. I guess one of the benefits of failure would be anonymity. So if you want to see glasses half full either way, if we succeed, that's awesome. If we fail, then you can go to the mall. Yeah. I mean, the worst case scenario is the show failing, but - But no anonymity. No anonymity. Everyone's like, loser! Your show sucked!

18:28Yeah. But I mean, I appreciate you bringing that up because I think that's, of course, we're talking about the business of the creator economy, the fact that we have companies like Netflix coming in. And this is a really exciting moment, but when you're doing something with your kid and when you're doing something in that space as well, there's a lot of just real human life considerations to it, of course. And, you know, Netflix has been the home of some very rough documentaries about family channels. Deservedly so, those channels, I think. And I never wanted that. I never wanted a relationship with her that was built on acrimony or built on her feeling any pressure.

19:04And every week we always check in. You feel like filming this week. How do you like this idea? Listen, if you want to stop doing this, give me three months notice so we can kind of tell the audience we're winding down. the way i see this now is i'm making memories with my daughter and what i love about this deal more than anything is i just got three more years of memories we signed up for three years so now we get to create content together whether or not it's on youtube or netflix or both for another three years and for me as a dad that is all that matters i should call your contact at netflix and say listen i got a son i'd love to make some memories what kind of deals you're offering might be a little young your son but soon he's too yeah yeah uh yeah i i'm curious if you could take me into the room with netflix and expand a little bit for everyone about this moment in time because i look at this moment it's finally here you know fox just launched fox creator studios netflix is clearly interested in our world you know they're even interested in podcasts they're interested in everything.

20:08Jimmy's the number one show on prime video. Like it's here. All of our friends are now making the shows that are, you know, especially in the unscripted world. Uh, but, but we've even seen it unscripted with the rocker rocker brothers making a hit movie with a 24, like our friends, uh, the people who've made content for the internet age are now getting to make content with the establishment of Hollywood. Is this moment over in a year? Meaning like, are they not as excited in a year? Are the outcomes actually going to be there? This is why I'm so curious about what's inside that room because I'm trying to navigate what success means and how this continues.

20:50Okay. You know, are they giving irrational deals to the point where they're going to look back and go, specifically in podcasting i look at this and i go with netflix like i hope this is a sustainable strategy because this is cool but are we going to hear about netflix podcasts in 12 months i don't know right right it's a great question i think it's about the quality of the content i mean if you talked about how many videos are produced every day but think about how much content is on Netflix already. Yeah. They don't need more content. They need unique content, exciting content. And as long as the creators are able to deliver that, I think they'll be excited because you're bringing a natural audience.

21:33But there's, I think, if you think about YouTube right now, how many creators are making content worthy of a bigger platform? Maybe millions, maybe not, right? Like it's, the question is - You're saying millions of creators? No, not really. I'm just trying to be generous. Like, you know, like how many people - I actually don't think, I don't know if it's a hundred. Exactly. I think there's a very scarce group that can make stuff and that is, even has the operational know-how or the instinctual know-how to make stuff. Because YouTube inherently is not built for that kind of production. So most people are not thinking of it that way.

22:13Creativity is very simple on YouTube often. and yet it's much more complex on Netflix. I mean, the difference we're looking at is we have to make a 30 minute video a week now. We're gonna have to make 10 hours of content for one show. So the difference between asking somebody to watch 30 minutes versus 10 hours of a 10 episode show. Of one, that has one arc. One arc. Is it completely, I like, I don't, I mean, I believe I can do it, but I haven't done it yet. So I'm sitting here now, let's meet in a year and see how it goes. Because I don't know. I just believe strongly that we can find it together to create something amazing, but I don't think a lot of people will be successful at it as much as they may seem that they would be successful based on the views they're getting on YouTube.

22:55I think they're two totally different beasts. So probably there'll be, you know, a pendulum swing back where there's some successful shows, some not successful. We'll probably see some very successful shows from creators who maybe don't have 20 million view average per video, but really have a niche or have a specialty. And that excites people. and then they make a show that gets very popular. I think there may also be, you know, again, what happens here when we sat with Daniel Eck from the founder and CEO of Spotify, he had this line to us that I'll never forget about. You know, we asked him about that moment of the$250 million Joe Rogan deal and the$60 million Call Her Daddy deal when that first moment happened.

23:39We were like, how does that, what was that? and his answer was he wanted to inject energy into the space if they were going to be a podcasting company they needed podcasting to be aspirational smart very smart very smart it is the best case scenario to be on the receiving end of that yes right yes and i'm wondering if that is partially what's happening here where you get to be on the receiving end of this moment of injecting energy into the space. We're in the right moment. You're in the right moment. Because we're early. The correction that may or may not happen, I mean, one version of it may be that, yeah, you just make a hit show and you're the best at making a family-centric show for Netflix.

24:24And that has been proven. The correction that's, I think, my assumption that happens next is there is a packaging and pairing of talent where they go, Jordan knows a lot about capturing attention in this space. But there's also another great director and showrunner who's been doing this for 25 years who also knows a lot. What happens if that's a show team? Yeah. That's now a powerful show team. And I don't, you know, I saw it firsthand with my eyes with Beast Games, where I saw Jimmy's team and I saw the traditional team, people who had been making reality competition shows forever. And they were kind of butting heads in the first season.

25:02And, you know, we obviously made a behind the scenes piece where that's like the core concept of the piece is watching them butt heads. But then when we saw them come together, we were like, wait, this is a really powerful team. They're coming up with really unique ideas. And even as I'm watching season two, I think the twists at the end of every episode in season two are some of the best twists I've ever seen in reality TV. And then I look at this 10 years out and I called Jimmy and I told him, I was like, this, you know, Beast Game season one, I was like, this is cool. I think you're doing, you're doing a big thing and doing a cool thing.

25:33Season two, I'm like, oh, this could be a franchise. And so that's, that's what I'm curious about is actually looking at creators right now, the, the industry is looking at us as like full one-stop shop production houses in a way where it's like, come up with the idea. We trust you, do everything, bring us a show. Uh, and I think the, the situation that may occur is like, you guys know a lot about something, but are these like we shouldn't throw away what has happened in hollywood for the past hundred years like people know a lot about how to make good entertainment and make long-lasting franchises let's just let's just pair these people together because right now it's interesting that's what our deal is right exactly yeah so we did not bring them any of that right so you didn't bring them a show we didn't bring them a show nor do we have a production company so they're not expecting us to create it in any way we're going to come up with the show then they're going to introduce us to several different production companies and we'll decide which one will work together when i say creative control i mean they're giving me the option to be as invested as i want to be in it but most likely i'll say you guys have done this you know more than i do about it you take the lead on this and i'll tell you when it's it's verging off the path of what would make sense for our audience yeah so i so we're exactly the test case for that right that'll be really exciting to watch yeah i'm very curious about this moment yeah i i'm i'm over the moon about it because when i first started on youtube in 2011 i was like i think this is going to happen it's happening and now it's happening it's happening i mean netflix is actively interested in creators yeah um i know that you know other streaming platforms are as well and you know if you've got multiple options I say go on Netflix because I just like, they're so good to work with.

27:19They're, they're really, like, for example, they kept saying, cause I kept saying in the negotiations, Salish's time is primary to me. She has to be able to be a kid. Like we can't send her to Romania for three months. That won't work. And they're like, of course I'm a mother. And you, you, we will only commit to the show that allows her to have her ability to go to school, see her friends do her sports and then find time to film it on the side so they're they're really willing to work with it's not just that they're taking our audience and saying make something they want to i think have a long-term partnership with us they they don't want it to be three years unless all the shows bomb right but i think they're looking at long-term relationships with creators much like they looked at adam sandler long-term relationship with yeah with a talent deal he got.

28:12Essentially an overall deal of some way, shape or form. Yeah. And they're looking at it long-term and it's, it's really exciting. Okay. Can I pitch you some shows? Yeah, please. Okay. So, uh, first full disclosure, I am my, uh, investor in Sincerely Yours skincare brand. So I'm, I'm interested in gotten there without him. Yeah, that's right. Uh, um, I'm, I'm interested in how those two things tie together. I also just obsessed with the name sincerely yours i think it's fantastic thank you um okay if we think about like a show that rhymes with something that has worked really well i think one of the most if you look at netflix a lot of what works on netflix is actually like death and disaster yes it's murder mystery it's poop cruise it's like you know these things that are like death and disaster so then i look to the like wholesome direction of what works in wholesome what works in wholesome programming is transformation transformation so queer eye successful show on netflix feels good you cry you feel great i think we can come up with a show that maybe rhymes with queer eye here yes you already have okay got it it's not that i have it's that we created it together with matt and rebecca at the spotter summit got it so so one of the ideas was incubated at the spotter summit yeah and it's one of the ones this spot that netflix is considering i think that there's something like that yes yes Yes, absolutely.

29:30Where there's transformation. There's, can I make someone's dream come true? Can I take someone from, but to me, they write in a letter and sign it, Sincerely Yours. Dude, that's so good. Yes. Okay, hold on. I got to go back to Netflix and say, scrap everything, we're doing this. It's called Sincerely Yours. I want to say what the idea is, but you know, you're supposed to not say this stuff. Don't say it. Don't say it right now. We'll watch it on Netflix. I know that there was a discussion about a road trip idea. I'm not positive on that one because I don't think I've seen anything that, captures attention in that way.

30:01And we don't, that's not a thing we do. Yeah. I think, um, the other thing that I think is interesting is because of who Salish is, there's a lot of celebrity kids who are, uh, fans of hers. Correct? Yeah. So there's a talent play here where it's you and Salish versus, you know, Khloe Kardashian and her daughter and a cooking challenge, a, you know, like I, that, that's something that I see. Okay. See, that's interesting. Cause okay. Wow. If, if, if, if we hatch the show on your show, that's so cool. But so that's a very fascinating to me because what we've been thinking about is what sort of game show, because that is a format that works, right.

30:44That could we do, because I don't necessarily think that us as hosts, is that exciting for our audience? Like boys versus girls, kids versus adults. Yeah. Generically parents versus their kids. I don't know. Us versus a celebrity family. Yes. Very fun. That's fun. And I think what I could see is like, Oh, very fun. Imagine there's, you know, try guys have a show called without a recipe, which I think is a fantastic show. I think something similar with like, like something that you have to build without instructions or, or a recipe that you have to make, like what the try guys do. Um, but I imagine it being where like Salish and maybe Chloe's daughter are in the like competition room.

31:21They have to start and they get, you know, X amount of minutes. You and Chloe are in another room. You don't know how far they've made it. You guys then swap and get in and you're like, what did Salish do? Okay. That's what she's, what is she thinking here? That's super cool. And you start making based on what she was doing, but you actually have no idea where this thing is going to end up. So you just have ingredients. Again, this could either be building or cooking, but you have ingredients. You have to make something in the 30 minute allotted time. It's kids and parents on the same team, but they don't get to see what each other are doing.

31:54And you have to see how connected each other are. Okay. That's really interesting because we're at the Lighthouse right now. At the Lighthouse, somebody just came up to me right before this and said, my daughter's a fan. I want to pitch you something. Salish cooking show. Really? Yeah. I think cooking is just fun. Cooking has always worked, right? I think forever we will watch cooking uh as as humans we will always watch people cook my wife almost exclusively watches cooking on that do you think there's anything there's something interesting in the same people cooking every week though so if it would be me and salish always versus another couple another group is that okay or is it because usually it's new people that to to be tbd yeah i think the other the alternative is like the challenges are different each but i'm not sure how much that is working uh in episodic content right now where it's like start and finish an episode and you don't have to go watch the next episode.

32:44I think it has to all build to like one eventual thing. Um, generally it seems generally it seems right now. Right. It feels harder to contain it in like episode one is cooking. Episode two is building. You know, I don't, I don't know. Um, so that, that I think you guys being the through line is super important. Um, but yeah, you're right. I, I, I, I'm not sure. I either it's like a set of 10 families and it whittles down to one winner at the end or it's you guys versus every episode yeah or it could be sailors versus some netflix kid get ollen cooper in there you get sadie sink in there yeah she's always going after a different you know challenge or something yeah or rober i don't know if he's open to it but mark and his son could be interesting yeah there's a lot or and maybe at the end of the the the series if just to tie a through line to it you guys are opening a restaurant with the uh with every dish that you made along the way and inviting a bunch of people okay now you're because because every dish is big yeah because up to that point i was like well i could kind of do those shows right right right but now i can't do that yeah yeah and then people are judging the dishes i don't know you know maybe we could get there at the end but this is this is real time this is we aren't in a in a room thinking yet yeah i love it but those are those are two ideas i could see okay you want to come to all the meetings with me and netflix and then you could pitch your idea with your kid sounds like a good memory for the right price i'll make some memories with you you won't do it for free give us all your time so when can we expect to see the first show i think our goal is at the end of this year that's really that's a huge lift wow first show in 2026 that's our goal wow yeah amazing and are you talking to some of the other creators who have gotten netflix deals and does it feel like like i'm watching mark rober become a netflix guy you know he's hosting more stuff on netflix he's he he's becoming like netflix talent yes is it fair to assume that there's going to be kind of a roster of netflix talent that you will join that you'll be probably pulled into other shows as well and be a part of their ecosystem they're they're respectfully uh understanding satelist's time yeah for school but are very interested in that kind of relationship for sure yeah yes so it just depends on her level of interest how does youtube feel about it have you talked to them they've asked that the um i think that youtube is very interested in whether these creators are going to continue to make content on the platform of course um and i've assured them i think that the whole point is the foundation it's a springboard like once you take your eye off your content on youtube you lose all the advantages you have for being a creator right because you have no way to get people to see your show or to keep them interested in you so my plan is to keep making weekly uploads gonna be hard but that's my plan but i think youtube might be a little bit like uh-oh our our bigger creators are now abandoning the platform for netflix and i don't i don't think that's going to be true do you think youtube would ever bring back youtube originals to to to combat this or do you think it's just an acceptance almost i don't know where there there's a lot of pride in hey that comedian came from snl i think the fact that youtubers are making these shows reflects well on youtube and i think it's it's a good it's a good um it advocates for them well i don't think youtube originals would have the same cachet it had in comparison to netflix or disney i think it is it is always to youtube's benefit that they don't have to cut you that check that netflix just cut you yeah and you will still upload and and you know maybe a harsh reality but i think if you uploaded 50 less it would impact your fans more than it would impact youtube yeah i mean you know we're renting real estate on youtube i don't know how much it would impact youtube at all if we left altogether us our channel but but as a whole if everybody starts going and then that's a problem for them but it isn't it is actually a net benefit to the conversation around ad dollars coming to youtube if you're getting a netflix deal because it then clarifies to the advertising market that what's happening on youtube is worthy that's a good point and so very very good point i actually think it's a net benefit to the narrative you're right if everyone does it it's challenging but i think jimmy getting elevated is only positive yes he's still uploading to youtube yeah maybe he's uploading 20 less but it doesn't matter actually i don't even think he is i don't even know he's every other week consistently yeah i think actually he added gaming and reacts back so never mind yeah he's uploading more doubling down somehow i don't know he does this all but really it's it's just i don't think any creator who understands how this whole funnel works would consider stopping their posting on youtube no i agree yeah so it's all in that benefit to you yeah yeah cool well dude i can't wait to see thank you what you make let's meet together in a year and see how it goes yeah let's definitely meet together hopefully we meet together before then yeah well yeah it's just like a cool thing to say yeah yeah i'd like to see it before a year i thought we were doing an outro there i was like this is a good ending line here and then you like interrupted it okay try a Okay, I love you, man.