Josh Johnson on Building a Comedy Career on YouTube vs Netflix

34:48or like as i learn more about a subject or a topic i'm like oh actually this is not the the move like the like i think the jokes are funny and everything but let me not get into this thing because like the story has evolved too much yeah yeah and and and like or even the story will evolve in a way where i'm like i know that i am not expressly a journalist or anything but i never want to be just so wrong about something that i'm misrepresenting outside of jokes like i think that when you're joking you can obviously misrepresent yourself and whatever but like if i'm talking about something in any pocket of the set seriously i don't want to not know what i'm talking about and it's probably going to happen because i'm human but i but if i learn more and then learning more changes how i feel about it i'm like let me step away from this from this thing actually and either revisit it or like cut it you know so the live premiere thing i think is fascinating that feels like an athlete watching game tape where like it kind of my assumption would be that that's a painful experience and maybe that's just because my history of like reading comments and watching game tape but maybe not maybe it's more of like no i'm a pretty sensitive person it can be okay yeah i was like no no no it's easy to get my feelings yeah i was like i don't even like like when i'm editing and someone comes over and they're like let me check out what you're working on i'm like okay yeah he's like hold on but also i think you at least when it comes to stand-up i can only speak to stand-up in my opinion for people who upload stand-up whether that is on youtube or any other platform to me you already did the hardest thing which was doing it for the people that are there and the people that are there give you the feedback that you should actually be listening to like like in a in a deep way yeah if the people there aren't laughing then you either need to rewrite the thing or the thing might not be funny yeah but if people are laughing in the video like i always go back to that where sometimes there'll be like back when news was calmer there would be new like some comedian said something and it got people in an uproar and it for some reason makes it to cnn and then they're talking about it and And then the people that they have on as a panel are talking about how that's not funny.

37:05But then when you watch the clip, the people are laughing. Right. So you may not think it's funny, but it's like and don't get me wrong. I don't I'm I'm don't try to tell people what is and isn't isn't funny. I can only tell people what is and isn't funny for me, like specifically. And there are things even as a as a joke writer and someone who really loves joke writers and loves other comics. There are times where I will like not like a joke at all. I'll actually be like in my head, I'll be like, that's messed up. Structurally incredible. Like that, like I'll be like, man, that's, that's not nice, but Ooh, did you hit the nail on the head?

37:42That's incredible. Wow. And so I think that because I am in this thing and because I love it so much, I can separate a person from the thing or the intention or whatever. I think I can look at it a different way and so watching the premiere versus doing the the set don't get wrong it still means a lot to me if people in the premiere are not enjoying it for whatever reason especially a reason that's not necessarily technical like way back in the day over a year ago we had a video that um it just it the sound was like not good and it was not good from a like like from a source from the board. So it was just like, it was like nearly unconscionable how bad this was.

38:28And then we worked with people who tried to help us fix it and got it like a little bit better. But then when that's what the comment's about, you're like, yeah, no, I take that no very seriously. But then when it's about the jokes, you're like, okay, what's their feedback? Because sometimes it is like spot on where I'm like, oh, actually, I didn't mean it that way. So if it looks that way, and I don't even mean in getting offended. I mean in not getting the joke. You know? Like if people don't get the joke, you as the comedian didn't do your job. Like walking them through the joke later still won't make it funny.

39:02No one's ever been led to the punchline and been like, oh. Like that just does not work. It can work in a movie maybe because there can be that delayed like, oh, that's funny. But if I just did the joke and now I'm walking you through it, there's no hope. We're going off a cliff together. Yeah, definitely. So maybe they're expressing something in the premiere that certain people who knows at the live show maybe were thinking but didn't have a forum to even express it. Exactly, exactly. Exactly. So then through the live show, through the premiere, through the comments and through community posts and polls, you get a sense of what everyone is thinking and feeling all the time, which can help inform your decisions.

39:46I don't think that any creator should be like completely led by them because then when you get into too much of a Build-A-Bear career, it can make you do something you don't want to do. Totally. But I think that if you are, let's say you're split between two different things and you're like, I wonder what people actually think. And then you ask them. It's like that. That's if you want to talk about like legacy media, they pay people for that. they're so scared to ask yeah yeah they're so scared to come to you and ask that they're like okay look we won't come to everybody we're gonna pay six of you to sit in a room we're gonna bring snacks and then you're gonna watch half of a trailer and before we pay for the rest of the trailer to be done we're gonna ask you what you think and it's like look that thing may have worked when tv and everything was more homogenous and a lot of attention was more centered towards it's like a few big outlets but now if the people come ask them and then and then they'll tell you they're not gonna lie to you to set you up they're not gonna they're not gonna then you're gonna collectively lie what subject interest y 'all knows right it's like do you do you want to see who knows like and let's say i have two things i'm like guys i have this set on tech but then i also have this set on like how how like all the glitter is missing most of the world's glitter like no one can find it so do you want tech or do you want the glitter set you can just ask them is the glitter set real is that a real set i can't talk about it yet but i it might be okay yeah but but i mean i vote for the glitter but hypothetically yeah hypothetically there could be a glitter set somewhere we can't find it and it's like no one's gonna say i really want to see the glitter set and then when you premiere the glitter set be like this guy did the glitter set i can't believe this guy give it a fill for it yeah yeah it's like there might be three people online like that That's not most people, you know?

41:40I actually think the premiere thing is an extension of what you said about showing up and being really present for the people who are there for you. Because if 20 ,000 people are showing up for you on a Tuesday night to watch your set, that's a big deal. And we spent some time earlier this year and did an event with Kevin Hart. And he was talking about how he still does stand-up. You know, and like Kevin Hart doesn't need to do stand-up if he doesn't want to. but he he was talking about how like he wants to for as far as he can always show up in front of his fans like physically yeah like i'll be there in front of you i will watch your face while i say something to see how you're reacting to me yeah yeah like i think as a performer like that craft is so important and also like like you said that level of feedback is completely different than any other level of feedback yeah there's nothing like standing in a room like and and delivering to people and we always we do a lot of speaking engagements and so like you can feel immediately when you stand on a stage if you have the room or if you don't have the room sure do you know what i'm saying yeah and that is a different feeling of like when you say something in the room laughs or the room claps or the room you feel them or the inverse of that is one of the worst feelings in the world where you just don't have but it's also incredibly powerful like i've found a lot of uh confidence in knowing when i don't have the room yeah and knowing it's okay being like okay sometimes this happens we don't have the room yeah yeah yeah and like when you don't have them in a way that is like spectacular when you don't have them in a way that's like fundamental oh you y 'all hate me yeah yeah wow y 'all didn't even know me a minute ago like before before i walked up nobody knew who i was and now i'm here and y 'all like oh we don't like this oh we like being able to sit in that and it's nowhere near a comedian i'm sure like No one gets more feedback more often than a stand-up comedian, but we do have a taste of that.

43:31Oh, yeah. We felt bombing in multiple different ways. And we're not trying to be funny. But we're trying to make sure you're having a good time. We're just trying to make sure at least at the bare minimum. Sure, sure. And also, you have to, whether it's online or in person, be like acutely aware of what's going on around you. I think that level of awareness will then inform how you feel about whatever is happening. because there are some scenarios that are so they're set up so poorly for you to do well that you can kind of let go and be like okay yeah i mean i'm i'm like maybe performing for you in person or you're posting something online but the queen did just die so that's gonna be people's day i don't know if you can sit here and be like oh it's a seven out of ten what happened it's like the queen died she passed yeah i mean and that and that's that's something that you no matter how good things go online or how many people show up to the shows in person you just have to have that like acute awareness of of yourself and where you land in things and then then hopefully at least at least it's my hope that like ego won't be able to wedge its way between you and your creative or you and the people who enjoy you or, or, or you and your sort of mission and goals, you know?

44:56Do you consider yourself a writer? Yeah. Yeah. So for sure. I think we can learn a lot from comedy. Like I think humor is one of the greatest ways to communicate information, right? It's why we're, we look at like standup comics and they're able to explain the world to us in ways that we aren't comfortable having conversations about, whether that's through politics or through like human interactions or race or all these like touchy subjects that are so digestible through comedy when they're wrapped into a joke or a context where we're supposed to laugh. And so I was curious because I think as storytellers, we seriously can learn so much from the anatomy or the structure of a joke.

45:34With you being a writer, like how do you view the structure of a joke or the principles of what makes something funny? Yeah, I think you laugh for a few different reasons. I think you can laugh from recognition uh oh i did that thing oh i've thought that oh i'm also you know have uh have been in that situation how would i approach a gorilla yeah how would i approach a gorilla probably not well sure yeah i mean i think about my speed in that context by the way i think i think about my foot yeah i think i could run and my deceptiveness i think i'd like go left yeah yeah man no no i'm playing dead immediately i'm gonna be like interesting dog you got me never crossed my You know, you already got me.

46:13I know all my limbs being on my body. That's like an optical illusion. You got me good. You don't remember when you killed that dude, you killed me too. I think that you can laugh from recognition. You can laugh from surprise. Like something is just so silly, so out of pocket or so like disgusting and appalling. You laugh. You can even laugh from being uncomfortable. And you can also laugh from like strong agreement, you know? And with all these things, there are dangers. So then if you lean wholly into just one specific lane of how to make people laugh, you do end up potentially down the line becoming a caricature of yourself almost.

46:57Because if the only thing you've ever practiced and enjoyed about making people laugh was the disgusting whatever, then you become like so much openly and like predictably trying to shock that you end up undercutting yourself. If you try to get people laugh too much from agreement, that's where we get the claptor stuff, which like I try to like undercut that as much as I can. Like I try if if I feel like a laugh is clapter, I will just try to keep talking over it. I've never heard that clapter. Yeah. Yeah. It's just like applause from like, oh, I agree so much. And it's like that one. I'm glad you're listening and I'm glad you're enjoying what I'm saying.

47:36But like that's if you're going to clap, I'd like for it to be because I brought something home or because the thing is so funny that you can't help yourself. You're applauding the comedy. Not. Yeah. Yeah. And so so you see it a lot in like political comedy and stuff like that. So then I'll try to like, especially if it doesn't mess up the rhythm of the set too much, like bulldoze through that because that's not what I'm going for. And then when it comes to recognition, if you are only trying to make things funny through recognition, that is also where you get into trouble of like lots of parallel thinking, lots of like other issues.

48:13So I think there's so many different ways to make someone laugh and you can incorporate them all. You get this really great quilted sort of masterwork of what a set could be. Right. And when it comes to storytelling, I think that there's all these pieces to a story that sometimes the best version of telling that story is jumbling them up. Sometimes the best version is chronological. And sometimes the best version is like from back to front. like like there's i i like telling a story where i was in danger because you i feel like you're more apt to laugh because you know i lived do you know i mean like like i'm telling you about the time i almost died i almost died so everything's fine like we're we made it just by virtue of me being here we made it through we can joke about it yeah it's like a safe container to laugh inside of yeah yeah and so so i think that through which i hope i'm answering your question but but through the different ways and if you can find other ways like there there's there's things about what make people laugh that we sort of lose as we get older and so there there are things that i try to do that are like mixed in with what made me laugh when i was little so like even in the 100 men versus gorilla set there's a whole point where i just stopped speaking because i'm like when I was little, noises made me laugh.

49:36So let me see if I can like do that. Like, let me, let me see if like we can through, through the experience of us all sitting together as an audience, let's see if we can get back to this place where like just the jingling of the keys makes you laugh. Cause as we get older, you know, not only does your taste get more sophisticated, but like you've experienced enough stuff that like, okay, that's funny, but that's the 15th time i've seen a joke like that right and so the way to get original and creative again is to like try to go back and pare things down to a place that you haven't been since you were like six years old so now i'm just like grunting seeing if these grunts like hit like if they were the words you know and did they hit i thought they hit you know but also it's not for me to say right you might watch it and be like that's not hitting at all well you've had to have experienced some time where something hasn't hit oh yeah yeah yeah no what's like uh what's something give me that story of like a experience where something really didn't hit so my favorite my favorite one is okay so there used to be this club in chicago on the south side called jokes and notes and i remember my first feature weekend there like you you you all may already know but in case people don't on a regular club weekend as a comic there's the host who does like 10 12 up top gets people warmed up and everything uh there's the feature who usually does 20 25 maybe even 30 and they're like someone who you didn't necessarily come to see but they help make sure that the audience is like even more like warmed up ready to go and then there's the headliner who like does their hour 45 minutes to an hour and a lot of people sometimes will say which this is so so interesting to me about comedy a lot of people sometimes say like why did the two other people just get get the guy that paid the ticket for and it's like one of the reasons is one you're gonna be late i promise you're gonna be late especially the bigger the person is the later you're gonna be because now you gotta park now you gotta get through ticketing you gotta take your keys out you gotta put them back in you gotta get your popcorn whatever the thing is you're gonna be late so even if you don't see these people because i was a feature for a long time and like uh you may not even see their set but they help buffer for you for sure then there's also a thing of like i don't know what it is because apparently this isn't as much of a thing in in europe sometimes and in other parts of the world but as much as you paid for that ticket and as excited as you are to see that person you're not ready for them to just come out yeah if they just come out and start doing jokes you're almost gonna not know what to do to a certain degree and it's not it's not impossible there of people who have had to do it before but having a host who's like y 'all ready yeah just that is great even if you don't have a feature right so anyway i'm featuring for this comic i'm going up this is my first feature weekend ever and so i'm doing like my i i have to do 20 minutes i think i may have 35 40 minutes right and we're talking like early in i think i was like maybe a year of some change or two years into comedy.

52:42And so I'm like, okay, okay, what do I do? All this stuff. Picking my set list and I'm going through. First half, I'm like killing. I'm like properly, I can't even believe it. I'm killing. And then like, I don't know what it is because I've had, it's taken me a long time to like build a self-awareness about myself and then translate that over to what other people might find funny about what I'm doing. And I was not there yet. So first 10 minutes were amazing. And the last 10 minutes, you can see in the faces of the people in the audience, they're like, we trusted you. We really gave you a chance.

53:20Because you got to remember, it's like I'm on the south side and everything, but I'm me. So I'm like this weird guy. And I'm like, I've got like weird energy. And my stories and my perspectives are like odd and stuff like that. So I don't have the like the swag that some of those other comics had. I'm not like a cool guy in that way. Right. And I think that for anyone who's ever worried about not being cool or been awkward or anything like that, it's not that you are not this thing. You just have to find what it is about you that brings people to you in that way. Where now I feel like I'm cool because I know I'm not cool.

53:56So I'm never trying to be anything that I'm not. And that is like a level of, oh, I'd like to get to know this person that you can't reach when you're trying to obviously be a cool guy that you're not. Do you remember the joke or jokes that lost the room? Oh, yeah. Like I started talking about toad facts. Like I was hitting them. I was hitting them with stuff where they were like, what is what's wrong with you? You just crossed over into a weirdness. They weren't interested. You got overconfident. It's like, and yeah, I was just like, y 'all heard about these sharks. And it was like, it was, you could feel it in the room.

54:34People were like, oh, not my money. Not what I paid for. Are you serious? Hey, you're going on about the shark. And I'm hitting them with the shark facts, too. I'm like, oh, yeah. And then this is what the wingspan would be if a shark was a bird. Like, I'm just. And in your head, you're like, I haven't even gotten to toad facts. Yeah. And I'm like, I'm like, start to slowly bomb. Right. And then and then I get almost wrapped up. The last joke does OK, which doesn't really save you. If you're bombing in the middle, you have to kill at the end or else people remember the bomb yeah you know i mean um and then i'll never forget this the host goes up after me and he's he literally chastises them the audience he's like he's like uh he's like look look some people have dreams i y 'all y 'all let your dreams fall by the wayside so you hate a young cat try to get up here doing his thing right and so then i'm in my head i'm like no no i deserve to like in my head i'm like no don't defend me don't help don't help right yeah but then he's like he's like look and he i'll never forget this he's like like that young man got something and you know he had you rolling for some of it and then y 'all and then y 'all turned on him right and so people want to say i knew whoever win but they don't want to say how they acted back when and it was like like was really like giving them the business over me and i was like no no no no i deserve like in in the the back i'm like waving i'm like no no no it's okay they're right they're right about me like sharks was too far so then so then he's like he's like i'm gonna bring up uh i'm gonna bring up your headliner the person that you came to see and y 'all gonna go crazy but what i don't want to see is y 'all acting the way y 'all acting like and so brings up headliner obviously kills that's who they came to see and he's like and he's not killing off of like off of that thing being weird or anything like he goes straight into his set and got it destroys right so then for me i'm i'm taking account of what happened and i'm like okay that last half was like bad like it's like it makes people laugh in like alt rooms on the west side of chicago but it's not making people laugh right now so i need to switch it up you know i mean and i don't have time to like recalibrate how i deliver it in a way that's funny and so then i next show i do the the set that ended up killing for the rest of the weekend right so i'm switched up the jokes whole whole set goes well and i'm like elated like i get off and i'm like because i really feel like i redeemed myself because it's your first weekend so the owner is also watching right and so she's like she even said that was better like you know because because she would take that uh that that weekend away if you were just bombing.

57:26She can't have people bombing all weekend. Right. And so I get done and the host comes up and he was not watching my set. So he assumes that I bombed again. So he starts it to the same speech he did before where he's like, he's like, you know, some people got dreams. All right. And just cause y 'all let y 'all dreams fall by the wayside. Y 'all want to hate on a young brother out here doing his best. And then to the back, I'm like, no, no, it went, oh no, it went better. and like that's i think about that so much i think about that that's like maybe my favorite time that i bombed just because i really redeemed myself and nobody saw it because the new audience doesn't know they don't know they weren't at the first show so they're like no we like it this guy generally bombed yeah it was just like he was so sure i had bombed and he was like everybody wants to say they knew whoever back with them wants to how they act it was the same speech identical cynical i couldn't believe it felt like a speech that he had written before he ever met me now he's so perfectly twice and i'm in the back like no no i did oh gosh oh you know that's like i do feel like um the comedians have an upper hand in the in in this modern world like i truly believe that because i think to know what it feels like to bomb on stage and to to get back up and do it again and get that many reps it's like it's not an outlier when you bomb it's actually like definitively a part of the process because you're experimenting with material and you're trying things and so then when you take that craft to youtube and you bring it to social like you're you're comfortable i would assume like when you get a 10 of 10 on youtube like the worst performing episode of the last 10 like you probably look at it in the same way it's like okay i gotta tweak some things or like people didn't like that but it's all good i got another rep like it's coming up yeah because Because I think as long as you're like, I can't stress enough how much I'm enjoying what I'm doing and like how obsessed I am with comedy in general.

59:31Like, I think I mean, I agree with you. I think that it's one of not just the most important, but one of the most impactful things that that we have as communicators. right and and there's so many people like i i genuinely want a thing that i know i probably can't have but that's what keeps me chasing it's like i want to be like the best like best writer best performer best everything and then i watch other people go up and i'm like oh i'm not the best because it's because you're watching people you really respect and that are really phenomenal what they do and even if it's not what you do like you can obviously only be the best at your thing but still because art is so subjective in that way it keeps a fun little it keeps a fun little competition in my head of like man i just want to go up and i want to rip and and everything and then you see someone else and you're like ah that it's like it's like if you went to go try out for the jets yeah i mean and you get there and you're like i can kick pretty far and then you see one of them kick and you're like oh yeah yeah and and but i think that that thing is really good so when you see a 10 out of 10 or you see uh something that maybe you thought would do really well and it and it didn't do as well as you thought it is just a piece of the of the overall thing it's not about a special it's about a catalog it's like if i can have the strongest most robust wide-ranging and and uh like eclectic catalog of jokes ever, then I'll be very happy.

1:01:10And I think that that's a thing that I feel I can work towards in a way that's really productive because once again, you hear sometimes people go after other people are like my specials better than this special or my set, why they get this thing, whatever. But the thing that I know I can do that, that I'm obsessed with doing is having like the best catalog that's ever, that's ever been done. You know, that's a pretty different model for comedy though sure sure comedy like as a business model of course it has to do with touring and i'd be curious like how much of your money is made on touring and ticket sales versus how much of the money is made on like ad sense because 100 million views plus on long form content like 30 40 minute plus content i have to imagine makes a good amount of money yeah i mean we don't really have any um um like sponsorships or anything so it's really just the ads but i think a majority of the money that i make comes from touring and i think that that's really good because it also keeps my head like even if i wanted to just be money focused right it keeps my head on the thing that's important which is the live show yes do you know i mean because because i think that if if youtube ever took over and was 90 of what i made versus the the tour how can you not start to deviate a little bit and like oh maybe i should try to cover this thing just because it's trending whatever even if i have nothing to say about it yeah then you then you get in you get yourself into trouble and so i think that economically speaking most comics are going to make their money off of touring which is good because that's when you're doing the thing you're supposed to be doing because at the end of the day when people i'm not i'm not saying it up it upsets me or bothers me that much but sometimes people will say oh you're my favorite content creator and it's like i appreciate that i appreciate you watching i'm glad you're having a good time and i hope you keep coming back but like i i'm a comic first before everything and i hope that you'll come to a show live so that we can have an experience to to together that is like exactly what i'm trying to do but i have to imagine that the the youtube videos it's a really nice symbiotic relationship right because the videos promote the live shows and the live shows create the content for the videos yeah right it's kind of like this really nice and you also have to be even more mindful and careful about what you write, create, do, because that ends up being what people expect when they come.

1:03:48And so I've been very blessed that now what people expect when they come is for me to talk about whatever I want, because I talk about whatever I want. And I think that it's possible, especially as a comic, to paint yourself into a corner where the thing that gets you popular becomes the thing that people expect. And when you only do it for a portion of the show, they're like, oh, oh, okay. you're like a regular stand-up i thought you did this thing and it's like it's you know putting out such a variety on a regular basis yes as much as i can so that way sometimes obviously when i do the meet and greets and stuff like that because i try to meet and greets with people whenever the venue allows it and whenever like like time allows it and everything and sometimes you do have that sort of thing where they're like oh i wanted you to talk about politics or i wanted you i thought you covered this thing that's happening in the news whatever but to me at the end of the day those are just guesses that's not a real disappointment and you stayed for the meet and greet to to tell me that in a positive way and take a picture so you're not upset with me you're saying i love this about you yeah whereas if i did something else and then i did a regular stand-up show you might be like oh okay i kind of got sold a odd ticket then yeah yeah you know by the way i was gonna say about the jets thing where you like go out to try out for the jets and and you you think you can kick the ball and you see someone kick the ball i do think the difference is if you're someone who's then like all right i'm gonna go home and try and kick the ball further right versus like oh i can never make the jets sure there's a big difference between those two personality types right no that that's that's very fair and that but that is how i feel is that like i don't know i i don't even know if i have favorites or like deep deep influences because I really love what people are doing.

1:05:36Like I love watching comedy. I love - Who are some of those comedians that you love right now? That you feel like are really doing it right now? Like I think Jordan Jensen, Eagle Whit. Obviously then there's people who are established like Maria Bamford, T. Murph. I used to love when I was coming up watching Danny Callis and like Jonah Jerkins and like Bald Head. And there's so many, yeah, it's hard, man. It's like there's obviously like the Rushmore that people are always going to mention like burr chapelle like everything but it's like wanda sykes is amazing like you know that it's it's almost like hard to fathom how much there is and so it's like you you especially when you get to go to a show and you and you watch everybody and you're like oh that's because it because it's all down to like your way of thinking and because ways of thinking are going to be so singular to a person if you are being yourself like i was saying before about like knowing that i'm not cool is like i don't know i think that that is unironically what is like attracting people sometimes because they i'm not like an intimidating figure at all in fact when people people are very comfortable walking up in in a there are some people who are like you look like you want to talk and it's like and i i won't even be doing anything and i think that embracing that is is what has really helped you know were you gonna keep going no i almost coughed okay that was that was that was my i was stifling the cough which seemed like it was gonna be more work like he was loading up there's a lot going on on my end right now and i hope the mic isn't picking it up i have been farting like crazy and i do it's so it's someone i haven't I heard it.

1:07:24Yeah. Is it yours? No, it's me. It's like, I am bubbling over here. And I think it's because I didn't eat. And then I had that bar on those chips. And so it's like I had something after not having anything all day. And so my stomach is like, this isn't a meal, but we'll burn it. We'll make it work. And so now what is happening is like audible violence. And I hope the mic isn't picking up, but if you heard it over there, then it's in here. this edit is gonna be who edits the the do you do you aren't hearing it it's not being picked up thank you for lying to me that's because if you if you told me you could hear it oh i don't know what i would do when i left here i'd probably sit in that loud bathroom and scream while i let the water run that's crazy it's because it's man i was thinking about you this entire time i was like these are bubble guts yeah man bubble guts the worst yeah it's one of the worst especially when you didn't earn it like i didn't do anything if i had had barbecue right before i came here and i was like hey we're gonna have like a very sleepy episode i got i'm full of uh like pulled chicken or something that'd be one thing but i legitimately have not eaten except for the two snacks that's why why that's crazy i i was i was busy before this we were doing a photo shoot for someone like the tour promo okay and i do a yearbook at the end of every year so we're taking some photos for the yearbook and stuff like that and yeah there was not time to eat just time to fart so safe space you can do it here no that's very kind that's very kind i'm glad we're social distancing as well oh man if this because this is like a first impression we never met before yeah that's true so you you you can't smell me until at least the third time that's right we chat yeah yeah well thanks for admitting it i appreciate it yeah yeah i felt like i had to say something because it's been a while.

1:09:18We've been talking for a minute. I don't know where this will land in the edit, but the first time I felt it was actually when I sat down. I was like, we're in for it. Oh, no. Oh, no. Yeah, no, this is a problem. Yeah. You'll notice I haven't moved. My man's been adjusting. You had? No, no, no. I'm adjusting. You've been pinned to this side of the chair. No, you are going to make yourself comfortable, and I appreciate that about you. I wish I could be more like that, but me being comfortable is an oxymoron. I want to ask you about something we haven't talked about is The Daily Show. That's how I first came across you.

1:09:49I was seeing you as a correspondent on The Daily Show and then I saw you come across YouTube. Where does that fit into your schedule, to your ecosystem? What role does that play? Because it sounds like between all that you're putting out on YouTube, how much you're touring, I often think, how does that even fit? Yeah. Yeah. So, basically, you know, they're super supportive and they've basically made it so that my weekends are mine and everything. So I tour on the weekends and then I get back by Monday and I'm in town Monday through Thursday to be available to be on the show and everything. And I used to be a writer there before I was a correspondent.

1:10:27And when I was a writer, it was a little bit tougher because I just had to make sure that the schedule for the weekend got me back in time. Because as a writer, I had to be in earlier than I do now as a correspondent. and so yeah it basically works by being the place that i'm going to be for the for the week and then i tour on the weekend and i come back and repeat so are you then sometimes performing things on the daily show that you did not write yeah yeah so what we'll do is if if i have an idea i can pitch it or somebody has an idea for me they can pitch it okay and then i work with whichever writers get assigned so that's like the stark difference between like being a daily show and then doing stand-up is that like in stand-up, it's just me by myself.

1:11:16And at the show, I get to collaborate with these amazing writers who I used to write with. Like I've shared an office for a long time with one of my favorite writers who's Devin Del Quante. And he's been at the show for a good while. And then I also work with like Nicole Conlon, Cat Radley, Dina Hashim, you know, Matt Koff, like some really fantastic people. Zach Delanzo is hilarious, like Scott Hercman, Scott Sherman, Like all these people are so, so funny. And so anyone can get assigned to work with you. Like I've worked with David Angelo before and everything. And it'll be usually like two people that write with you so that it's in your voice for when you perform it the night of.

1:12:00It's interesting because daily show is essentially like a YouTube show. Like I consume daily show exclusively on YouTube. I consume all most television programming, whether it's late night or SNL or the daily show on YouTube. So you're essentially, does it feel like that when you're in there? Like you guys are producing for YouTube or does it feel like something different? I feel, I think it feels like something different because we know it's for like the broadcast. We know it's for TV and it is very fortunate that it basically works as well on YouTube. You know what I mean? Like, I think that when you're making anything, knowing what you're making it for, first and foremost, is like very important.

1:12:41But then there's things that are going to translate or not translate in depending on how they're packaged for social and for YouTube. So even for me, you know, one of the things that I did that was like seemingly, I guess, unique on TikTok with working with the team and everything. My buddy Brian has like chopped up the video to make the social videos and stuff like that. And he was like, I think we should post the longest version of these things so you get the whole joke rather than doing the parts. Because, you know, obviously there's like something to be said for potential virality when you grab somebody in the first four seconds.

1:13:22Sure. And the video is only a minute. They may even watch it again, whatever. But he's like, you're telling a story that's like six minutes long, eight minutes long, nine minutes long. Let's just post the whole thing, see what happens. And then it it did do well. And so that's something where that opened me up to not be afraid to post things the way that I see them working on stage on TikTok and everything. And I think the same thing potentially goes for the show. I think the show made for broadcast in the way that it's made happens to translate perfectly to YouTube because of the things like what you're saying before, where so many people are watching YouTube on their TV.

1:14:03Yeah. What's the difference? What the source is? And so that's why I think they're like perfect one hand washing the other, you know? Yeah, for sure. yeah i'd have to imagine you're uh i was gonna ask you like do you have aspirations to do a special with like a netflix or do you feel like you're already doing it like i know you mentioned like one of your goals is to build the biggest catalog of content but i feel like you have so many different things now that i would consider making it right like getting a gig with the daily show it's like i have a lot of comedian friends that's like a massive dream of a lot of my friends right?

1:14:39Becoming correspondent. That's another like huge dream to be like on air, on camera for The Daily Show. And then you have like a thriving standup career where you're touring. That's another huge dream of a lot of my comic friends. And then you're filming it and millions of people are watching it. That's another dream, right? And so I'm curious if you feel like satiated almost in this world of like, oh man, I made it. Or if you still have the desire of like the HBO or the Netflix special, if that still holds a place in your world, or is this the modern making it for a comedian? Yeah. I think that in whatever form it takes, whether that's with, you know, a streamer or it stays on YouTube or anything like that, I think the building of the catalog is career long.

1:15:28And I think everything that helps that is going to be a blessing. And I would look forward to like engaging with it because everything has its place and and everything has its own sort of look as well yeah and so to me what i want to do now is like as best as i can and i'm not necessarily the the most equipped for it but the two things i'm looking to do now are like really express the catalog in every way and in and in basically giving back as much as i can to comedy. You can do it in a number of ways. You can do it by bringing people on the road with you. You can do it by like donating money to causes and everything.

1:16:11You can, you can do it by putting on shows. And like, I try to do all of that stuff in tandem with what I'm doing now. But I think that the real goal, the thing that I'm chasing now is to make sure that I'm like nurturing this thing that is taking care of me and my family. It allows me to take care of my mom and my aunt. And it gives me so much life. And it hopefully is like a way that I can help other people, you know, because it's like I'm not built to be a doctor. Never mind not being smart enough. I'm very squeamish. Like I'm not going to be the one to help you. Yeah, I mean, so jokes is how I do it.

1:16:48And as long as I can make sure that jokes are fulfilling that purpose, then I think that that's the thing that I'm like really chasing now. It's like, do you do you want a special with a stream or all this like that? It's like, I'm not looking to turn anything down. I want to do movies, produce movies. I want to do music, produce music, like all these things. But as far as what I look at as the next goal is, once again, a thing that I think is kind of fittingly unattainable of like being the best and giving back to comedy and having that sort of loop going on. And even if it's just going on to you, even if you're just sitting in your own like semi delusion, I think letting yourself get there is a is like a step that I don't know if I'll ever do, because I feel like as soon as you think you're the best, you start to not be.

1:17:41You know, the thing that I would love insight from y 'all on is I have all of these hours of comedy. But one thing that we haven't branched out to yet is just audio, like just just the sort of audio space. And and I'm I'm trying to figure out right now if we do just packages and packages of jokes, especially the evergreen portion. So not necessarily just the topical stuff, but like the really evergreen stuff that exists within those videos that are those jokes that I've written and how to package them for comedy albums and for like audio streaming. That's so interesting because one of the most engaging pieces of entertainment I think I ever got when I was a kid was Dane Cook's comedy CD.

1:18:30I thought it was absolutely hilarious and I would just play it in the car. yeah i'll play for friends and i would think it was so funny was it retaliation or harmful of swallow harmful of swallow yeah yeah yeah yeah and then i got retaliation because i thought it was like yeah i just thought this concept this premise of comedy albums was so funny yeah and then i used to i went to school at uc santa cruz and i drove from la to santa cruz and i found like you know the car i was driving had sirius xm there was like a comedy radio and it's like seven minute bits from comedians and i was like this is so enjoyable to listen to and i guess what i said to you i think my only challenge to you there is like i have watched your videos where i turn off the video on youtube and just listen to it so does it already exist does your audio experience already exist i think it i think it does what's the value of of making an audio experience i think the audio experience is a is a repackaging of the the things that are evergreen about these sets So that way, years from now, when people are hopefully not talking about the president or like the new developments that we're focused on right now, you'll be able to see all the things that are evergreen through a repackaging of like, here, this thing is funny.

1:19:49and this thing is funny in the way that a comedy album that's just about a bunch of topics that the comic wanted to talk about was funny because i think that underneath everything that people see as topical and current is all of that stuff couldn't you do a compilations from each year like sort of a best of and those could also be they could live in video form because they'll be evergreen on youtube as well that's true yeah yeah i feel like it's something you can do it's So you need like a wrapped, like 2024 wrap. Sure, sure. Essentially like the best of. And like the, yeah. There's also like an interesting rise in people buying cassette tapes right now and buying like Walkmans.

1:20:25Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, no, there's like, yeah. Like collectors and stuff. And I think that's, it's obviously maybe not like a massive scale play, but if you did something just for your most engaged, like the 20 to 30 ,000 that are there every Tuesday night, can you give them like a really unique experience where they can like own this audio only experience that has like cool art on it um and maybe you sell it with like a walkman or something or i don't know i just think that's like fans could be like okay not only do i watch this guy on tuesday nights but on my shelf that proves to me i'm a josh johnson fan got you got you yeah i mean i think that that could be really cool especially you can do really fun things with the art that only exist on that on that piece i think you're touching on something though right now of like the you know we are we're living in a week-to-week world like where where whenever we produce something like i think what you were talking about of like being in in a theater and thinking about the people there it's also like it is challenging to think only think about the video you're putting out next and not the next five videos when you're a creator or to even after you've put out a video continue thinking about it you're often on to the next thing yeah so i think what you're touching on there is like how do you immortalize yourself a bit as an artist and as a creative where musicians, I think, have this because of albums.

1:21:41Like, you know, I'll listen to Louis Armstrong. He's got an album, like his music is immortalized. And I think today in the world that we're moving, it's much harder to do that. It's much harder to go like, here's my work. People do it through books, right? Like, hey, I got a book. You can buy this and put it on your shelf. That is my thoughts. Like those, here's my book. But it's harder in our worlds of, I guess said happened through comedy specials right like crisp rocks comedy specials or like some of these vintage comedy specials but it is like is that what you're touching on of like how do i a little bit preserve a capsule of my work and also how do you how do you then peel back the layers because that's that's what's happening it's like the right the the current event thing is there's the shell over the evergreen thing right right right and the evergreen thing is what you yeah exactly yeah Because the evergreen thing is like, like they're, you know, in the set that I did about adolescence, I'm talking about adolescence and the whatever opening idea of it is that I'm going to be talking about this thing that's like mega viral on Netflix.

1:22:46But the thing I'm really talking about is masculinity and how to how to like navigate a new world, how to navigate a world that doesn't need you to be a caveman, you know? Right. And so it's like, that's the thing that I want to make sure doesn't get buried by people being like, adolescence, I heard that was a show. Because I think that after a while, far enough removed from topical ideas, you start to catalog it in your head as something that I don't know or care about. And I think that that repackaging isn't trying to double dip. It's literally to sort of open up the fact that this thing was always a little bit something deeper within it.

1:23:33You know, because it wouldn't be every single joke I've ever told. Like, you know, when I do things about the Barbie movie, it's like, yeah, that part is just the topical stuff. But anything I did about dating underneath that is the thing that would sort of live on. And I'm trying to figure out, like you said, the best way to deliver that to people who want it. you know yeah i think even just categorizing them maybe not i said years before but maybe it's just by these segments and subject matters where it's like figure out how many of them you have that are important to you maybe it's six or whatever and like make the compilations and then you could release them over like a scheduled period of time where it's like josh johnson on josh johnson on dating right uh comes out and then you're like next week it's adolescence and there's like a a look and a feel and a brand to like how you release them yeah yeah no that makes sense what have you learned about youtube over the past couple years that you could pass on to people listening and watching i think that the best thing and it's like it's a it's a thing that was like a hunch but it is the thing that i learned is that the thing that i'm doing now which is whatever you're making make sure you're making it for those like first hundred people forever jammy yeah i've seen some really incredible stuff that had 98 views and it's not only did i hope that this person stuck with it i hope that they always made things for the for the first like 50 98 people who maybe even saw it by accident who maybe even clicked by accident and then stayed because I think that numbers start to really distract and like numbers, they can be fun.

1:25:19They can be fun goals and stuff like that. But behind all those numbers are people. And so if you are still making things with the level of intention, attention, and sincerity that you made it for those 98 people when you thought it would be zero, I think that the product you make when it's much later down the line and maybe it is a million people, it's still gonna be like incredibly unique and good. And I think that like all of the little tricks, all the little tips that people are gonna give you to try to get to a million will maybe serve you with the algorithm in mind. It maybe will serve you as far as like, maybe your video does need to look a little bit more polished.

1:25:59Maybe the sound is a little scratchy. You know, like those things are not bad things to improve upon. But when you get obsessed with the numbers, it starts to cloud everything else that you're doing. And so making things as if you're a small creator forever will make you like a worthwhile creator forever. To me, at least. I've not seen anyone who has grown that has a video that isn't like something from when they were small that isn't still awesome. I love that. like like all of this it's crazy like i've watched other people uh who like i wish i could even name them because i'd like to give shout outs but then the sometimes it's their name sometimes it's like the idea but sometimes you watch someone get to half a million and they're still making this thing with the level of intention you can tell when like and maybe they even have a team now yeah and it's like yeah but it still feels like you're either talking to me or are you still or you're clearly taking a lot of care what you don't want to have happen is the sort of like um there's a there's a level of like uh letting the audience and the trends dictate to you what they want from you and then you doing that thing that is very dangerous and it used to only be like a shock jock thing like you used to when like when we were kids it was mostly radio like radio were the guys right if you weren't on tv radio were like the independent thinkers the saying stuff you're not supposed to say whatever even though there's an fcc but they were the ones that that um or sec uh they were the ones that were doing the ultra ultra maybe like liberal to start with then as their audience got older and their audience got a little bit more conservative because now they had kids maybe they didn't like all that cursing all that then they also and look maybe they're on their own track personally but then they started to go from like shock jock to like hardcore right-wing commentator conspiracy theorists and you see that it's like i don't even know if this is you i feel like this is you going off of whatever good feedback you get and then trying to give the people what you think they want that's also fear fear of losing the thing yeah yeah like the audience keeps me employed and that's that's i guess what i'm trying to say is that like no matter numbers wise anything none of it is like owned it's not it's not like yours like they may be your subscribers they may be your followers whatever but it's this position that you're in right now being like the shiny new thing or being like top dog or what it's not yours it's like you get to visit and then whatever happens next is is up to you and maybe your visit is a stark difference from five years from now maybe you're number one and then 10 years from now your number two, who knows, but, or maybe you're number one and then you're number 115, but like getting too addicted to the spot and not seeing it as a spot, seeing it as like a permanent state is what makes people not only lose their position, but I think like lose their minds over, over stuff.

1:29:07And so I think that if you are starting YouTube right now, it's great to have goals and it's great to have things that you want to do and everything. But even as you grow, like keeping things community will keep things will keep your your work and and like you as a person taken care of because even as the community grows it's it's still the the same small thing in a way yeah no matter how big you get on it should feel like that yeah it should feel like that because because what i love is when people do like come up to me on the street and they're like oh i just saw your video on this thing and it's like now it's almost like i'm talking to a friend from way back that i sent the video to before i uploaded it because then there'd be people like that where i was like hey i'm thinking of putting this thing out this is like back when it was just like comedy seller tapes right and i'd be like hey i'm thinking about putting this thing out what do you think of this set you know and now it's like seeing that person that i sent the thing to after i posted it being like i really liked it yeah like i didn't get to watch it all the way through but like i'm gonna finish it when i get home whatever and and those things are so so deeply important like it's a thing that i have to constantly remind myself no matter how good things are going no matter what things change from one out of ten to ten out of ten that like this is this is for like the the catalog and the community this isn't for being like number one trending on youtube today you You know what I mean?

1:30:34And, and I think that that's, that's what I, I hope more people can get, can get down with, because then I think you won't run into as many issues as a creator. So many things, once again, feel like unforced errors of like, why are you wiling out? Everybody likes you. You know, like I've watched that happen. I've watched somebody like, I've watched it happen to myself. Yeah. Yeah. It's like, it's like speaking to me. No, no. It's just like you're damn near snap. And it's like, but there's no, There's no reason. Like everything, it's all good. And once again, all of these things are like temporary.

1:31:12So being like the biggest you're ever gonna be is temporary, but the dips are also temporary, you know? Like you keep making things, you keep making them earnestly for people who enjoy them and you do it with sincerity. It's like, how can you not succeed? You may not be the richest or the most famous. And if those are your goals of like richest, most famous, what like you need a hug but that's not that yeah that's never gonna fill that thing it's like if you're chasing art then you're gonna be like you're gonna be really happy with yourself yeah years down the art lane you know yeah i love that's great yeah well dude like a lot of creators need to hear that yeah i feel like i needed to hear that right now oh well sweet yeah No, no.

1:31:55I'm glad that between the farts, we got something good. Yeah, yeah. There we go. Between the farts. Yeah. If you could do me a solid and only let a couple of those through. I think I'm going to add extra. Yeah. I mean, I'll make it. In fact, I'll do you a solid right now. There we go. Yeah. And that was a wet one. So save the best for last. Yeah. No, we have a problem now. I'm not going to get up. I'm going to need everybody to leave the room and I will stand up last. You just stay there. Let's get you into a car where you can fart in peace. That means a lot to me. All right, Josh. Thanks for coming on, man.

1:32:32I appreciate it. Thank you.