Life after Nelk (ft. Jesse Sebastiani)

0:00The Colin and Samir Show is supported by Microsoft Copilot. This is something I thought I would never say, but can I share with you my favorite prompt? I mean, like when you say something like that, I have to say yes. Were you going to say no? No, but okay. Just let me hear it. So when I'm researching for a guest or I need to know a lot about a subject matter, I say, make me a podcast about. And when you do that, you're going to get a short blurb about that subject. And then in like two minutes, you're going to get a podcast. So check this out. Welcome to Co-Pilot Podcasts. Picture this, a guy working the front desk at a hotel, making lacrosse videos in his spare time, completely unaware that he's about to become one of the most influential voices in the creator economy.

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1:10Try it for your research. Try it for getting variations of your titles, your ideas. It's one of my favorite tools on the internet right now for our creativity. And now back to the show. What's up, everyone? Welcome to the Colin and Samir show. On this episode, we're joined by Jesse Sebastiani. Now, Jesse was a part of one of the most controversial, but also one of the most popular groups on YouTube, Nelk. While they are very controversial, they also are one of the most innovative groups on YouTube. When their content got demonetized and they weren't able to make money from the platform, they turned to their loyal fan base and came up with brands and products to sell them that funded their content.

1:51They launched an apparel brand called Fold Send, and they also launched a hard seltzer called Happy Dad. And Colin and I actually went out to try and go buy Happy Dad, and it was completely sold out. Could not find it anywhere. The woman at BevMo laughed at us when we asked. They used their millions of fans to build incredible businesses, and Jesse was one of the faces of the brand. But at the height of their success, Jesse decided to do something very unique. He left the group and in the process sold his shares of the companies that he owned, walking away with millions, something that's extremely rare on YouTube.

2:25Six months later, we went to go visit him at his brand new creative agency called Sunday. We wanted to catch up with him and understand what his time was like at Nelk, what it was like to actually exit a YouTube company, and what it feels like to reinvent yourself on the platform. The videos that Jesse's making today on his Sunday YouTube channel are drastically different from what he was making at Nelk. It's the content that we love to watch. He's bringing people behind the scenes in real time with the growth of his creative agency. All right. This episode is also out on YouTube and it does have some visuals to go along with it.

2:58So if you want to go check that out over there, if you want to listen to it here and then maybe you want to go drop a comment, who knows? You can do that. It's on our YouTube channel. All right. Without further ado, let's get into it. This is our conversation with Jesse Sebastiani.

3:13Before we go anywhere else, we should address your black eye. yeah because you have a black eye right now yeah just timing also i apologize yeah right i didn't mean yeah things got i didn't mean to catch you like that i made fun of his sweater and it got really heated and i do uh sparring on fridays um i train mma during the week and it's just a hobby of mine and uh yeah i guess i got caught with a hook and i was like i honestly didn't even know like i told you guys i was in the shower and i was just like oh wait what's going on there. And then it just slowly, every 10 minutes got darker and darker.

3:47Like, so I want to go back in time and talk about your name, MTV Jesse. Yeah. Where does that come from? I had an MTV show when I was younger. Um, it was kind of like a low budget jackass type, like a stunt show in Canada. And, um, I think we filmed it when I was like in, when I was like 16 and it aired when I was like just getting out of high school. So I was just like, probably just like, Oh yeah, MTV Jesse, more people will find it or something. Like, I don't know. You know what I mean? And then it just stuck and I never changed it. How did that show come together? Like, how did you get an MTV show at that age?

4:23We, uh, we waited outside of the Masonic temple in Toronto, um, until we saw a producer and we showed him a VHS tape of our, uh, some stuff we were filming. And then we got a meeting like the next day and like took the train back down to Toronto and sold, sold the show like within a week. That's crazy. Is that where your journey with picking up a camera starts with that project? Or is that even earlier than that? No, a lot earlier it, uh, it started with skateboarding. That's where it all kind of, I mean, I've been skateboarding my whole life and, uh, that classic dream, everyone's making a, you know, a video part and they're trying to get sponsored and they're trying to show their local skate shop.

5:02Um, yeah, that was my whole childhood we would just film every summer and uh that's what made me want to get my first little sony camera and uh and we didn't have any skate spots i grew up in the country so it was like grinding a tractor and like it's like yeah it was very hard to make a video part like i had to like build like a staircase and then try to kickflip down it yeah but uh yeah that's where i kind of stemmed was it the culture of skate videos that the fact that skate videos were starting to have skits and like jackass style moments in it that you sort of you were like oh maybe that's part of my culture of what i want to film i think i was just a huge fan of jackass like i was like a mass and cky and all that like when i was a kid that was like me my friends all loved it and i think yeah i think you're right it was just so connected to skateboarding that's probably why we liked it yeah and um yeah we just everyone wanted to be johnny knoxville or steve-o and you know, so it was crazy that we relate like early nineties and early 2000s skate culture so much to like the rise of YouTube, because that was, in my opinion, YouTube before YouTube, like it was groups of people who no one was going to tell their story.

6:13Like no sports network was going to be like covering skateboarders really beyond like the, you know, X games when that came around and Tony Hawk and whatnot. But that's like, you even go back to like Bones Brigade and the era of like just telling stories about people who are really into something. Yeah. You know, and like lived and breathed this niche culture. Oh, yeah. And that created like incredible community and fandom. I mean, we were talking about this before. Like I used to go to our local skate shop to watch the latest VHS, right? Whether it was shorties or like, you know, girl. Yeah, right.

6:48Which you had playing downstairs. And I like, those were some of the first videos that I saw. where I was like, wait, so you can make a movie with just like your camera that you have at home and your friends? Yeah. Yeah. That was the difference. Like it wasn't just that it was a movie. It was a movie. It was the fact that the person behind the camera also sometimes was in front of the camera. Right. And like you were totally aware of the fact that you could cross that threshold of like in front of the lens, behind the lens, the first like really accessible media where it's like, I could do that.

7:18That's possible. What was the experience like of having an mtv show like was that a moment when you when when they picked up that show did it feel like a life-changing moment yeah it i was young so it just felt cool it was like oh like mtv was cool back then so it was like it felt just like whoa this is crazy like i don't know if i necessarily felt like canada is so different than america like it's such a smaller amount of fame you know what I mean? But I think it also set me up for like my whole life's been this like slow climb. So like it kept me very like level headed. And I think it was the perfect amount of just like people knowing who I am, but like in a very small way.

8:02Um, but, uh, yeah, it was pretty wild. And like, I remember we like got flown down to New York and went on Anderson Cooper to get like interviewed. And then like, he kicked us off the show. And like, it was like, like, it was like that feeling of like we're young and we're in like uh we're in a limo and like we're in new york and we're heading to like you know where they do like i don't know if it is like the ellen show or something but i remember seeing like other shows being like i was like on the lot and like remember that feeling of like whoa is this like happening and uh and then the show got canceled but um we started doing a second season and it got canceled i do think it's interesting how much early mtv i think has influenced what's happening on youtube today um i don't know if you watch the buried life oh yeah i love the buried life the buried life influenced yes theory right like they cite the buried life as as the influence you look at what eric's doing right now it's mtv right yeah it's like there's an element of like next with the dating shows an element of silent library would try not to laugh yeah like these are all you know like it's just for cycling yeah it's origins are in that era of nineties MTV.

9:11And I feel like what you're doing with Sunday also reminds me a lot of it has like a Deirdre field to it, right. Of like fantasy factory of like, bring me into a world of entrepreneurship, but make it interesting and cool. Yeah. You know, like I feel like Deirdre did that really well. Yeah. Um, so yeah, I think it's, it's cool to see like the early origins of what we're watching right now from that MTV era. Yeah. They're all, everything we create is like a piece of something we were like influenced. Yeah. You know what I mean? It's all building on top of each other. Yeah. Well, especially with YouTube just becoming, I mean, it already is, is like our current television.

9:46Like I think it's just, it was a no brainer that all this stuff was going to just recycle its way into. For sure. For sure. What was your relationship with like fame at that time? Like you were saying it's like, it was a comfortable amount of fame, but like even your first taste of getting in a limo, people knowing who you are, like, did you enjoy that? Was that something that like felt really good it probably was like the only time i experienced it and like i liked it because it was like everyone's first year is like it's like oh it's cool or like this is like yeah like it's like new yeah so it's exciting but uh but i i've never enjoyed it ever since i don't think like that's why i've just i don't know i don't really i'm sure one day i don't want to be on camera at all if I don't have to be.

10:36I don't know. I just, it's a very weird thing that like a lot of people know who you are and about your life and you know nothing about them. And it just makes all these very, uh, weird interactions when you want to have a normal life. You don't have a normal life. You don't. Yeah. And, uh, and I do feel like I'm pretty out of the limelight now. Um, especially not being in NELC and stuff anymore, but, um, yeah, still there. I think you just learn how to deal with it but at what point did it get to an uncomfortable level if you look at mtv show gets canceled yeah i know you started uploading to youtube after that yeah so at what point do you reach uncomfortable fame the second year of nelk i'd say i don't know exactly on a year but there was definitely a point where i remember it like shifting where it was i remember we used to like come home like i'd go get groceries when i first came to la and i'd come back and it'd be like lucas and kyle and whoever at the house and i'd be like oh dude a guy know like i remember telling them like you could count on your hands how many times someone noticed you you'd be like yeah dude this guy and he's like he said he saw her like coke prank or like whatever yeah and and uh it's just funny but then you hit a certain point where uh you drive by a coffee shop and you're like oh like i could probably just make coffee at home right because i don't want to i don't want to deal with that i don't want to deal with it yeah and i and i don't like that part of it where I kind of became a hermit and I just didn't want to, yeah.

11:59You work out at home, you watch movies at home, you do everything at home and you're just like, kind of like, I've found a way to just like embrace it though and be like, like who cares? Yeah. But, uh, I actually don't know the story of how you, I like vaguely know it, but I really don't know the story of how you joined NELC. Yeah. It's pretty crazy one. Uh, um, I made a status on Facebook that was like, like if anyone's doing YouTube stuff or whatever, like I was just like constantly trying to get into something. It was very hard in Canada to like find someone doing anything. Like I would have worked for free, did anything.

12:32I just really wanted to work with people. And, uh, and then I somehow started talking to Kyle and it was right when he was like, maybe his first year of doing NELC and, uh, and, uh, it was kind of like skits and then starting to get into some pranks. And, uh, I pitched this like prank about lighting my arm on fire. I'm like, I know how to do it. Like I can like, and you can do it with your arm too. Like we can like, Maybe we'll go act like people who are smoking are lighting us on fire. And we met in Mississauga. And first time we met, we shot the video. It went really well. Dude, your arm's on fire.

13:06Oh, my God. Oh, my God, dude. Why'd you light him on fire? I didn't do that. I just saw you light him on fire. I think before I left that day, we talked about going to LA. We're like, yeah, this is a good mix. And it just kind of clicked from there. That light yourself on fire video, I watched that last night. Oh, okay. And curious for you, like if you could bring yourself back to shooting that video, is it the prank that's fun for you in the moment or is it the response to it after it's out? Because I look at that and I'm like, that would be a bad day for me. You know, like if I was in your shoes, I don't know if I could handle that.

13:40And I'm curious. I always think about people who do pranks. Like, is it the act of the prank that's enjoyable or is it the response? That was a start. And again, it's like you're just young. So I was just like, let's do anything to just like make content or to like grow or to like build something. And like, you're kind of not scared of anything. I like to see the edit the most, like to answer your question. I think I used to love like the whole story of what we're trying to do, especially when it was like a concept like that, that we were shooting. Not just like, go get a funny shot, go get a funny shot, go get a funny shot.

14:13It was like, we really put a whole video together. What was, what was Kyle's like pitch to you about Nelk at that time? Was it just like, I'm making videos? Yeah. I'm trying to think. Cause like they probably had like 20 ,000 subscribers or 30 ,000. But to me, it's like, that's huge. Yeah. I mean, I'm like, yeah, that's, that's people that want to watch content that we could make. I wonder if it wasn't as much or like, we just saw eye to eye and we just like, we both got the vision and we just started doing it. Like it was not like, there's no contracts. It's just like we just started running, you know?

14:46What was the vision? Just like... Probably to just... This episode is brought to you by LifeLock. When you visit the doctor, you probably hand over your insurance, your ID, and contact details. It's just one of the many places that has your personal info. And if any of them accidentally expose it, you could be at risk for identity theft. LifeLock monitors millions of data points a second. If you become a victim, they'll fix it. Guaranteed. Or your money back. Save up to 40 % your first year at lifelock.com slash podcast. Terms apply.

15:43like go viral and we know how to make funny content and let's just like, let's just only do this. And, uh, I think that was the vision. When you say you can make money, was it from YouTube, the platform at the time at the time, eventually that became something that Nelk like didn't have as much access to. Yeah. Yeah. A hundred percent, which, which is again, it was a kind of a blessings that made us create full sun and, uh, made us, uh, have to find other avenues. But, um, yeah, I think at the start, I mean, there was no other, I don't think we were even getting like a brand deal or something.

16:13So how did that feel for you and the guys there that like YouTube, the platform you're investing in was like, this is not, this is not what we want. It was annoying, but it was also one of those things where like, I kind of just knew it. Like, it's like, right. Makes sense. Like, but, uh, I mean, and I still even to this day, I believe it's just, it feels like there's always needed to be two YouTubes. Like, you're like, you know what I mean? Like, or YouTube needs to make like two sides to it or something. Like the fact that there is content that isn't for a 12 year old, but can still have a certain kind of ad on it.

16:47I just, I've always thought that, and that's what we used to talk about back in the day, especially when our audience started growing is like, could we like not compete with YouTube, but like, can we make another platform for like, you know, like all the Danny Duncans of the world and all the, like, just for people that make different content, um, for an older audience. Yeah. Did the fire video go immediately viral from my understanding i don't think it did like crazy no it wasn't the first like thing was when we went to la and we uh i think it was like the first three weeks there we shot still to this day the most viral video we've done which is the coke prank i can't do this i can't do this man we have a bunch of coke in the back i'm sorry dude i'm sorry and that that's when that's when it really felt like whoa like we're really doing something like we're in a random condo in LA, like ghost face killer from Wu Tang is our neighbor coming over and eating our like chicken that we can't afford to like give him any.

17:44And like, it was just like, and we were like, go to the hot tub and there's like this movie producer and like, and then we're getting like interviewed by, uh, like the LA, whatever the LA like news would be, I don't know. Times, Times, Times, like a newspaper or the KCLA? KCLA. That's what it was. KT. KT. Yeah. Or KTLA. Yeah. But you know what I mean? Yeah. It's like you come to LA and it actually just like, because there's a lot of people who come to LA and it takes like years. Oh, yeah. Like I'm Ubering and I'm doing this on the side and then sometimes it never hits. Yeah. But like, it like, we were just so hungry and it just, just worked.

18:21In a video that's now gone viral on the internet, officers pull over an SUV with a group of men. One of the officers starts to handcuff them. The other goes around to check the trunk instead of cocaine. It is just Coca-Cola. You mentioned while you were at Nelk, you were also working other jobs. Yeah. At times. What were those jobs? And at what point were you able to quit? Oh, man, I was the man of a million jobs. I had like 20 jobs. But the one when I was at Nelk was bartending. And then I also worked at a Shadow Red Rockets in Hamilton. Best chicken wing spot ever. I used to hand bread chicken wings.

18:56That was like a grind, though, I remember. That was definitely, I think I was vlogging every single day on another channel, doing NELC and working full time as a bartender. And then I would come, I would get off work at like 3 a.m., go home and edit the vlog for the next morning and then start all over again. And just doing that like cycle of like need to do this to like pay for food and then need to do this because this is the dream. And then need to do this to keep the story going. And it was like this like, and you just, that cycle. But yeah, I try to think of days like that whenever I think I'm tired or something, you know.

19:37So when did that cycle break? Like was it the merchandise that when you saw that you were like, I don't have to work other jobs? or was it, um, you guys make money on AdSense at one point and you're like, I don't have to, I don't have to do that anymore. We can pay ourselves. I remember actually going to the bar that I worked at and like, Oh, cause it was a new bar I had to go to. It was like a fancier place. And like everyone knew who I was. So the views, it was kind of like Steve-O and Jackass. I remember he talked about this where it was like, like people know who you are and they want to buy you a shot and do this whole thing.

20:10But like, you're not making any money. You can't like afford the shot so like it was like i think that was around the like when i like i remember leaving that job being like i don't think i have to do this anymore like money started coming in because like we say ad sense but that's to run a whole company like yeah like if you're even making three grand a month of ad sense you were like oh shit like yeah that's more than a paycheck yeah so how did you have the guts at that time like were you guys just so hungry for good like okay this, we know this concept will go viral. So like, cause like, it's pretty aggressive.

20:46Like the four of you in that car, when I don't remember who it is in the back, he's like, we got, we got Coke in the back, you know? And it's just like, holy shit, guys. Saying that, like I couldn't, there's no world where I'm saying that. And you look terrified. And I can't tell in that moment, is he acting or is he actually a little bit scared? I think I was scared. I mean, to look at it now, I mean, to look at a lot of the stuff we shot, I'm like, yeah, no way. I'm never doing that. But, uh, yeah, I just, like I've said, I think it was just this fire to like, like, oh, if we get arrested or we, uh, guy punches us in the face or if like whatever happens, you're just like, I'm just going to do whatever it takes to make it that kind of fire.

21:30Um, did you feel like from an identity perspective as, cause that, that video to this day has 50 million views. There's still a lot of people who probably know you from, you know, like that was their entry point to you. Like, did you feel at that time being like, I'm totally good with being the prank guy. I'm totally good with being this guy. Yeah. Yeah. A hundred percent. Yeah. Yeah. I think if anything, my love for it over the last like year or so has been the first time it's ever like died down a bit. I just like see it differently now i have to what's funny and what's like up someone's day for some reason something switched in my brain maybe it's just getting older um but like there's it's such a fine line for me and like i've i've gone and shot stuff where i'm like i just like i lose interest right at a certain point where if i'm like oh this person's like not having a good time right why am i doing this yeah like they're the butt of the joke in a in a way that's like yeah not fun for them they call it like punching down and I have tried to, even when I did shithole, I mean, it was always in the back of my head where I tried to keep the joke about me.

22:36Like I'm, I'm the idiot and like, you should be laughing and being like, what is going on right now? But not like, let's just like make fun of you or something, you know? So that feeling, that realization of maybe how you wanted to do a prank, is that the beginning of you from an identity perspective within NELC being like, I think maybe this isn't this isn't my full-time future yeah that was like and not to say that um like that's nelk's direction to like sure punch down but waking up every day and being told we're doing this thing to the and like yeah you'd get some days you're like i don't find this funny or i don't like like this idea but it's my job and i need to just go do it and then you try to make it funny you know i mean and there was just enough bad days where i was like like we're successful like we should just be we should be making exactly what we want to be making so being in the creator world for you know colin and i've been uploading to youtube for for 12 years together and like observing the space uh i would say like especially i'm on with the rise of nelk personally i had a very complex relationship with NELC.

23:46Like I look at, at NELC as like one of the models for how to build a business in this era from a YouTube and content perspective. And at the same time, oftentimes looked at it as like, that's not representative of the YouTube that the side of YouTube that I live on and that I want people to associate with what I'm doing. Yeah. Did you ever have that complex relation or were you aware of that of like there's a huge crop of people who don't like what we're doing yeah and i'm assuming that's what made the audience who loved what you were doing really strong yeah that's kind of what made them core that's what made them core is that it was like this not underground but they are just like you know more aggressive kind of like side of like if you don't like it then fuck you kind of shit right i don't think i've ever like thought of it as like, Hey, is this gonna put me in a, in a, like a pedestal of like, I'm over here.

24:42Right. Um, because like it, I mean, a lot of it was still content that I did think was funny and cool and all that. But, um, I think it was the, the biggest thing was just like me as a person changed so much. So like, if, if like I didn't enjoy, I wouldn't watch those videos, you know I mean, so it was hard to be like the person producing or creating or starring in those videos. There's a video that I watched during the pandemic. Then you guys were getting some, there was bad press about now during the pandemic with the party you guys threw and all that. And I became increasingly more curious about you guys.

25:21And I came across this video where you do a zoom yoga class and you pour yogurt on your head. And I laughed harder than I've laughed. I like that. I like that video. It made me laugh. I think I showed it to Colin and he was like deadpan. He always comes in and I'm like, I don't know what you're showing me. I was like, yeah, it's a yoga class, but he's pouring yoga. I'm like, I see that. I see that. He said he thought it was a yoga class. I was, dude, I was dying laughing at that. And then I think there was another one in that same video where Kyle's like on a zoom call in a college and like pretending to be something.

25:55I don't remember what he's doing, but he's kind of like causing a ruckus in there. And I was like, okay, I don't really like that one. like it was like this complex relationship with like there was stuff that i had was really funny and stuff where i was like see i would that's like like and i'm not trying to shit on anyone totally to just show people an example like that day i was supposed to shoot like uh like a lecture prank yeah and i did one and i had like you know an older teacher or someone and i just like someone's mom or something and like they knew i was i hate when someone someone knows i'm fucking with them right right i lose all comedy for me i'm like oh so i'm just being an idiot like right i mean right because then they're just like just end it now yeah like i see what you're doing let's just end it now yeah whatever yeah and then that so that that morning i got up and like was supposed to shoot that and it was like i quickly thought of yoga yogurt and then they're like smoking cigarettes and um what was that like a workout class like a workout class i just like was like well i think this is funny and i'm gonna go shoot this and then you know the company was big enough that we have enough production and stuff where like I could go shoot my thing and set it up.

27:02Like, so I think that's kind of the start of like how we not dividing, but started just like, like, yeah, if you think that that's really funny and that's cool, like you do this. And if I think this is funny and cool, like I'm going to do this. What was your relationship to the NELC audience? Like you guys had meetups, you guys had like opportunities to be in front of your audience a lot. Yeah. Did you feel like as you started to meet those people, you were like, this is the type of, this is the community I want to build. Like these are, these are like-minded people like me. It's hard to answer because honestly, I think 100%, especially on the way up, that was like, I was that culture.

27:42So I was, it was, and it was like, and also it was like family, like every, like seeing all that love everywhere we went. And it's also the reason like taking care of like myself and take care of my family. Like if it wasn't for them, like I wouldn't have been able to do that. So, I mean, it's the love that we got for being the underdogs that made no money on YouTube and people supported our company from the start, like that forever. Like, that's like, that's everything. That's why I'm here. For sure. When I got sober, it did get to a point where a certain genre of fans that I would meet and be like, yo, let's go like slam a tall boy in the parking lot.