PrestonGoes: The Rise of the Next Big YouTuber

27:53At the time, I was a freelance video guy. So I was making all types of videos. But at that season when we moved, I was doing like the corporate video. So like sit down interview, two cameras, key light. They're sharing about this business that's like, okay, whatever. Drone flies away, logo, like that video. I made the video many times. And when I was living in Atlanta, I was roommates with Eric Decker, also known as Iraq. um at rack yeah like that um and uh we were roommates in like 2018 and I remember him coming in to so we had like this big house it's almost like a frat house for guys in their mid-20s living in Atlanta comes into my room and he's like dude I think I want to do YouTube I'm like what does that mean like what do you mean and over the next few years i watch my super close friend and roommate just like skyrocket yeah and the whole time he's in my ear like dude this is possible you should try like you've got the chops you should try and if i'm being real i think there's a part of me that was like it was challenging watching such a close friend succeed so well and like and me knowing secretly like i also want to be a youtuber and like i i was kind of embarrassed i'm like i'm like oh my gosh that would be crazy for all my friends to see once eric has started for like me to say i want to do that too and then what if i failed and like all of those thoughts that come and and actually stop a dream from you know going to the next level so the move from atlanta to la there's just something about getting to a new place um the the hope was we get here and my wife is a super talented painter like abstract paintings just beautiful stuff and i was doing freelance video and the idea was get to la creative ceiling for our creative careers is just higher here so that was exciting and yeah getting to a place you don't know anyone um eric was here we had some other friends here but there's something about all our friends and family being back home and getting to a new place and about to turn 30 and all of the things led to me being like, man, if there's ever a time, it's probably now.

30:40I think I'm going to start. So that first video was May of 2022. Here is the plan. 30 videos before my 30th birthday with a subscriber goal of 100 ,000. And then I began. And it's just been such an emotional roller coaster, dude. It's like, yeah, gosh, like so painful. So painful. Just painful, dude. Like wanting something and like putting effort and creative effort into something that like isn't giving you the return that you're trying to get. and that you can see in the future coming from it. So for all of this to be happening now, it's just like, oh, I'm just so grateful, dude. Like, I'm so grateful.

31:37And to be here with you guys like right now, like this is so crazy. Let's go back though to starting to upload. Okay. Like did some of that emotion come up of like what you were scared of, like the embarrassment from your friends of like you're starting out and Eric's like, you know, already exploding. Like, did any of that come up or was it helpful that you were gone from Atlanta? So you actually got to be on your own little Island. I think there was something helpful in that. There was something helpful in, I almost felt like I left my like tribe and went to the jungle. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly.

32:19And like, I'll come back once I've got food for dinner. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I actually think you have to as a creative, get into a very safe space where you aren't going to be judged, where you don't feel judged. Even if you aren't being judged, you have to get away from the feeling of I'm being judged. Big time. Because you have to create very freely where you just like don't care. Yeah. Like it's okay. Totally. This video didn't do well, but I liked it and I'm learning because like all this stuff, I had a friend recently call me and wanting to start a podcast. And I was like, do you have five to 10 years?

32:50Do you love it enough to give it five to 10 years? That's it. Because I like, and we say this quite a bit, but like there was years and years and years of our creative journey where we loved YouTube and it didn't love us back. And it's possible it'll never love you back. But if you keep loving it, if you keep loving the process, you have a shot. Yeah. Right? And so you have to look at, you know, a creator or a creative and go, do you actually, do you honestly like this? Because the validation might never come. Yeah. It might never come. you know i feel like i've had to learn so much about my relationship with failure yeah uh colin actually wrote something that has impacted me very very deeply around this uh from and you wrote a song about it it just starts again i'll be playing the role of colin also known as tony hawk yeah no it was dude it was uh an episode you episode episode you guys did i think like a year or two ago and you defined what you called the creator mindset and i printed this out and put it on my cork board and it has been up there ever since and honestly has been a north star for me uh if i remember correctly the creator mindset is um evolving through output and humility failure is not embarrassing it is not a roadblock it is the road yeah it is the road dude I mean wow just give it up for Colin the right guys yeah dude and honestly that's so cool man dude it has been on my wall ever since that episode aired I think it was like the KSI episode yeah you're right and dude that I think I'm imagining like a motivational poster I'm sorry to cut you off right there but with like like a cat jumping for something that it really wants with that underneath that go up yeah maybe we can put that together let's put it together yeah for you to say though like it is the road is so dramatic and awesome yeah it is it's not a roadblock it is the road so good so good and in the episode i re-watched it before coming on here because i was like oh i'd love to like share how much that's impacted me that's awesome and you were like you're like I actually wrote this and then you were like you wrote that yeah yeah dude like oh my god um but yeah I think anyone doing anything creative can be so impacted by that because you have to form a relationship with failure and to know that like no yeah it's not embarrassing it's not a roadblock it is the road that you have to walk so when you make another video that bombs, like with that mindset, you can be like, oh, well, I guess this is what is required for me to get to the next thing.

35:49Yes. But there's nothing natural about the creator mindset. Nothing. Yeah, and it's not, it's difficult to understand that before you found a little bit of footing in success, right? Like it's very hard to come up with that. I'm not writing that four years ago, right? You only write that from experience. Because for me, four years ago, the roadblock is the time to turn around. Like that's just what it is. 100%. Yeah. I will say though, we just spent some time with one of our good friends, Paul Rabel, who just wrote a book called The Way of the Champion. And he was sharing with us, Bill Belichick wrote the foreword of that book.

36:24Wow. And he was sharing with us that Bill Belichick will soon be the losingest coach in the NFL. And he was making a point around the greats, the greatest athletes of all time have all lost more than they've won. Wow. Like in their careers, right? But we don't remember. But we don't think about what it takes to actually win, right? Like you even think about like the NBA championship or the Super Bowl. There's only one team that wins. That means every other team lost. That means all those guys on all those teams lost. If you're going to win more than anyone, you probably also have to lose more than anyone.

37:01Yes. So good. And it's a very powerful concept that I think in order to operate as a creator, I actually think you should study athletes because they deal with failure all the time and they deal with reps, right? Just like doing, doing it over and over and over again and failing regularly, but that being a part of the game. Yes. Right. Like if you're, if you're playing football, the other team's going to score. Yeah. That's going to happen. And you might lose a game, but it's like a long season and then it's a long career. And it's like, You just have to zoom out and go, I'm in it. That means I'm going to lose.

37:37Yes. Right? That's part of the push-pull of this thing. So yeah, that's a realization that takes time because the 10 out of 10s early on feel like I don't even know how to communicate how they feel. They feel like someone is calling you, laughing at you and being like, you thought you could do this? Good try. Pack your bags and just leave the country, man. is that is that what it felt like for you not me dude oh my gosh it's like leave the writing to colin man no i totally felt like that i think especially thinking like oh no the answer is just spend more time editing like spend more money in the attempt or the creation of the thing and like oh that will do it i remember the first few times i spent money on like a youtube video i was like this is this is it i just spent a hundred dollars on a prop like the thought of that before just felt so mind-blowing uh that the thought of spending any money was like that'll do it and then it doesn't and then the failure stings more and it's like wait i'm like trying harder than i've ever tried anything like yeah it's gonna sting yeah oh so the second you feel any return from youtube saying like hey i think i kind of love you yeah it's like me really you know what i mean it's a crazy feeling what was what was that like for you guys like when was the first feeling of like youtube is starting to love us back i think it was very slow yeah it was very slow i don't know if it was like an immediate feeling.

39:22But I will say that like once prominent creators started reaching out to us, like I would say 2021, right? When we started doing the podcast on the main channel and MKBHD said he would come on the show, Mr. Beast. I mean, earlier than that, yeah, I think getting a Twitter DM from Mr. Beast being like, hey, you guys are making cool videos. It was like, that was validating. Whoa. But that wasn't, I don't think that was even YouTube loving us back. That was like, okay, cool. It's people are watching that we're talking about who are involved in this industry. they like what we're doing yes but but youtube's not loving us back to a place where this is a career yeah but it's nice that people some people are watching yes yeah i remember i was trying to think back when i first subscribed to you guys and i like mapped out the whole thing i was like wait when was this casey neistat was uploading daily yeah jack coin quits yeah gets fired from beam yeah yeah he makes a video his next video was with you guys that's right we went on a road trip and you guys went on a road trip i watched that video back yesterday and it was six years ago i've subscribed in that moment and it's been so cool for me just like flying the wall watching your journey from then till now and man it's like it's crazy dude like for me trying to become a YouTuber, your channel has served as YouTube university in a way.

40:46Like I've learned so much from you guys that has got me to where I am to some degree. And I just want to say thanks because I think I speak for a lot of people that look at your channel as a place of like, oh, like these guys get it and they're rooting for me and like, like giving me free education on their understanding of YouTube and like how I could do what they're doing. And yeah, it's just, you guys have done a lot for me and just so many other YouTubers. I just wanted to say that. Appreciate that. Yeah, I appreciate it. Thank you. We always say we're making the resource that we wish we had 10 years ago.

41:27The resources between our newsletter, our channel, now our education, like these are the resources I wish I had. um but i also think that too many resources at times maybe can be um not allow you to develop your own voice yes right like you might follow too much of yes what is going on so like your advice to other creators in this moment where they they have access at their fingertips to all the information on how to build a youtube channel how what what how to make a great thumbnail how to um craft a great intro um how to build the business like all the above like How have you navigated your relationship with the amount of information that's there versus finding your own way?

42:08That's really good. I think the education, the information is so important for you to understand the video game that you are playing. Because if you don't know the rules, you can't play the game. It's so important. And I think in the beginning, I didn't believe that it was a game. I remember someone came on here and said that YouTube is a video game. Who said that? Who was that? Was that Ryan? No, it was Tommy Innit. Oh, Tommy Innit. Yes, yes. Tommy Innit, yes. And I remember him saying that and just like opened my mind. Yeah. And so I think the information and the education helps you understand the constraints that you do need to operate within to some degree.

42:54It's kind of how I've looked at it. but I think if you do want your channel to spark, to stand out amongst the rest, it is a challenging thing watching too much of the big ones, the big guys that are doing, or girls, doing like huge things on YouTube because it's supernatural to be like influenced by them and then making a copy of those videos to some degree. So yeah, I think it's so important. to if anything, just like look at your video once it's edited and think, does this feel different? Like, is there something that feels different here compared to people I'm influenced by?

43:43All right, so earlier this month, we hosted our first ever Press Publish NYC, a gathering of 400 plus creators in New York City, and it was powered by Microsoft Copilot. So we were joined by a ton of creators on stage, including Ashley Alexander, my fam, Max Joseph, Cleo Abram. And we surprised everyone twice during the day, which was really fun, with Casey Neistat and Stephen Bartlett. Now, we also had a conversation with Microsoft AI CEO Mustafa Sullivan. And one thing that he said is that there's going to be a rise of interactive podcasts. He said, voice is the next frontier. You'll interrupt mid-podcast, ask a question, and get a personalized response.

44:21That is a wild vision for the future. that's not so far away. Imagine right now if you could interrupt Samir and I and get involved in the conversation. That's what he's saying. But right now you can't. So you have to just listen to what we have to say. But I would say voice is the most natural way for me to engage with Copilot. Copilot had a booth at Press Publish NYC where you could sit inside and have a conversation with Copilot. You could get feedback on your ideas. You could research new topics. And the problem we were having there was that creators were sitting in there for like 25 minutes at a time having a conversation with Copilot.

44:52Thanks again to Microsoft Copilot for powering Press Publish NYC. Yeah. What's your perception of the rules of the video game? Like what do you think the rules are of the video game? Right now, and I'm new to the video game, so I probably don't have like the best understanding, but when I think about the rules, the big rules for me are title, thumbnail, first 30 seconds, open loop concept.

45:29That, that is the video game for me. And then setting up a story where you want to watch till the end. And, and it's interesting enough that it's like, wait, I have to click. That's, I have to close that loop by clicking the video. I watched the first 30 seconds. I have to close that loop by getting to the end of the video. For me, I think those are my most important rules that I look at on YouTube that I don't know if I knew as well in the beginning. And the more I've leaned into them, the more success I have seen on the channel. Does that answer the question? Is there a rule that you think it's okay to break?

46:15A rule that people talk about that you from experience go, I think I broke that rule and it's okay. Yeah, yeah. I feel like some of the stuff we're talking about of like ending with failure that in the beginning, I would not have had the confidence to attempt that. But I think from beginning till now, you take risks along the way. And and then you're taking notes as OK, that was like a risk taking collecting data. Oh, never take that risk again. Got it. OK, took another risk. Oh, that one. There was more of a response there. I remember the first song I ever did was for the jet pack video. Huge risk in my head.

46:55I'm like, I can't make music for a YouTube video that breaks the rules. It completely broke the rules in my head. Send it to my, my friend, Daniel. And I didn't give him any context. I just sent him the whole edit. And he was like, this is the first thing he said, dude, that song in the middle. Where did that come from? I love that. And then the comments were very affirming of like, that was weird and fun. and we like the song so collecting data okay that i will try that again and yeah yeah other rules those are just yeah those are a few i think of like off the rip the song thing if you would have told me when i started that i would be singing into my usb microphone in my office like making music and i would have laughed in your face i wouldn't believe that yeah but i think it's only come from like slowly building the confidence to take more risks and yeah feel like i'm comfortable looking dumb if you're not comfortable failing publicly yeah it is it is so important in this weird job we have yeah yeah can you explain further like um how you open loops.

48:15And I heard a really good, like we use that term unclosed loop a lot. And I think I heard Jay Alto describe this on his channel, but he said like, described it as an information gap. The gap between what you presently know and what you want to know is the information gap. And I was like, okay, that's a good explanation of what an unclosed loop is. It's like, you know something and you want to know something and that is the gap between uh the circle of the loop right you want to close it right you want to you want to make sure that that closes because now you want to know something it's a really simple way of describing it but i think it's actually it is one of the rules of the game that you have to abide by and that's also just a rule of the storytelling game, right?

49:03Like that is just, you always need to be, otherwise there's like there, if there's no gap between what I presently know and what I want to know, then the story is over because I've gotten everything I want to know. Yes. So that basically the simplest form of it, in my opinion, is like right now in the story, is there something that I am waiting to know? Right. That's it. It's just like, but you have to actually do that prior to the story starting on YouTube with your thumbnail, right? Yes. So is that how, like, how do you describe or how do you think about creating unclosed loops? And then specifically, like, for me, if I'm talking to someone who's brand new to YouTube and I'm trying to explain the rules of the game, the first thing I'm saying is like the whole thing is title thumbnail first.

49:47Yes. Idea, title thumbnail. Yes. Then we can talk about the rest. But like the whole thing, if we're not thinking about that, then you're actually not even playing the game 100 right yeah title thumbnail fitting in an open loop structure is a very interesting thing yeah i it took me a second to realize like title thumbnail needs to be easily understood i think the beginning i would have these like just really complex fun video ideas but they didn't fit within a visual image or title that could be communicated in so many characters and i would get so frustrated i'm like but the video is gonna be great like that's that would be so fun if i did x y or z and yeah i think i think realizing that the open loop concept plays to that but it also the thumbnail has to be it needs to be an open loop but it also needs to be easily understood was like a big thing i had to learn in the beginning um but then making an open loop that someone cares about i feel like i'm still figuring that out you know i think it's still i'm still learning and experimenting and trying different things so i feel like the only way to really understand if, if it's an intriguing one is either by looking on the platform, seeing how other people are doing it.

51:20Um, there's a bunch of railroad go-kart YouTube content. Right. So when I saw that, I was like, I've always wanted to do that. It's, it performs on YouTube, huge check for me. And, uh, so, so that, that confirms, oh, there is an open loop here i can confirm it with how youtube has served this before okay um so then if i do it my way now that we're in the video uh that that has been the whole experimentation of me saying i love bridges and and hoping that you also want to see this old bridge and and there's so much experimentation that comes yeah i was gonna say that's like there's the there's the affirmation across YouTube that, you know, railroad go-karts work.

52:08That's the first unclosed loop that you know, okay, this is worth maybe committing my time to. Then when you get in the video, seeing the bridge is another one. Okay. I want to see him see the bridge. But then there's the next layer of conical wheels in the first one, right? Which is like something I didn't even really understand what it was at the start, but you learned it from the comments from people saying, it looks like you bought the wrong wheel. Right, right, right. And then we learned that you're about to go on this journey with what may be the wrong wheel. And that's the next unclosed loop that gets us like another minute or two into the video.

52:39Yes, that's a good point. And there's a lot of examples like that, where it's like these mini unclosed loops that bring us throughout the entire 12 minutes. I think that's what's important for creators is like, you got to have the unclosed loop in the title thumbnail, but then within, you need to be introducing new ones. It's like conflict points. Yeah, conflict points. So like when I'm shooting a video, I'm like, I am taking mental notes of like, oh, that's a conflict point. like when i did the the mini houseboat build yeah when we got into the water and to start taking on water yeah i'm like huge conflict point huge conflict point but you're living in danger then yes yes don't ever do this yeah so don't hold on you're living in danger in that moment and but you're like this is a good conflict point it's crazy i was definitely thinking about it and And it was like, we're making YouTube videos.

53:29Yeah. So it's just like in the back of my head, like, okay, that's, that's good. And so in the edit, I'm like, oh, I remember I lived this. That was a big conflict point. So like, how do I sprinkle that into the story to lead up to the moment of us taking on water and make you care? so in my edit i basically ask through song um will the boat float

54:03that was great yeah yeah uh i make a song and and we hear that song like four times question that keeps coming up is it's kind of annoying but you're you're you the whole time you're like is this boat gonna float and that was also honestly something i thought about right when i picked it up i was like i really hope it does and i did and i actually didn't even want to test to see if the boat floated just to have that for the moment and for that to be real you know yeah so a lot of commitment a lot of commitment to honesty like you know a lot of commitment to honesty uh which is great um but yeah i i love that what you just said is like okay you you you go through an experience and you have a conflict point.

54:49Then as you're editing, you're constantly building up to that conflict point so that the audience is prepped for the conflict point. And how you did that is through a song, a comical song that is a jingle that sticks in people's mind. It's like, oh yeah, will this boat float? Oh, it won't. Right? Like that is a really great misdirection again of like, yeah, that's really good just like any story like the big conflict point you care about that mission because of so many touch points throughout the plot yeah yeah and and that uh house you did that with the jet pack of if it will get through tsa oh was that right yes yes yes i was so unsure but it did get through tsa it was great yeah but that was another funny thing to like just introduce a new loop for us of like, okay, I already know you built it, but now what I don't know is if it'll get through TSA and you're introducing that through song.

55:47Right. That's your most watched video. The first jetpack video. Um, when you look at that title thumbnail and we can pull it up if you want to look at it, but what is the, what is the unclosed loop that earns the click at 4 million people there? I think there's something satisfying about seeing the image and realizing like, wait, this isn't like some Photoshop thing. This is actually on his back. Then you click it and you're seeing immediately seeing me going through the ocean. Yeah. And then you see a shark and it's like, now that intro also kind of breaks YouTube rules for me. I don't say anything for the first nine seconds.

56:32It's just montage with like dramatic star Wars type of music. Bum, bum, bum, bum. and it's like oh drama where am i going sharks and then it starts it's like i'm gonna build a jetpack thing and whatever and there is something satisfying about like oh there's visual confirmation that he's gonna build it it's going to take him through the water very fast there's gonna be sharks and now we're at the beginning of him saying that he doesn't know how to do it doesn't feel like he's the guy to build it but maybe he can but you just saw that it worked and there's something if i'm watching i'm like oh my gosh i can't wait like how do you get there how do you finish you make the gap seem even wider with those first lines of vl yeah i don't think i'm the guy to do this it sounds really hard all of a sudden the the unclosed loop gets bigger and bigger yes which is the truth i don't it it's like so real when i'm yeah but now you can weld so you can't say that's true that's true i can weld things yeah i will say though what you just said is really important you said that like because it's not a photoshopped image, it's more interesting to click on.

57:38Right. So again, like we're, we continuously come back to this world of honesty where it's like, if that's the honest image and it's you with a jet pack on, it's inherently interesting. You don't have to go any further. Here's a guy with a jet pack on his back. I'm in. Yeah. But that simplicity of like, if the thing you did is honestly interesting, then you can earn a click. Hard to do, but I would definitely recommend trying to keep that authenticity in the photo. Like even your Tesla Cybertruck review video, it looks like that would be a Photoshopped image. And then it opens with that. But it's actually a real image.

58:14And you drove through water with that Cybertruck. Yeah. I think that's key. If your audience begins to understand that culture of this, for the most part, is the real image. That's great. Yeah, I love that. Outside of Eric, because obviously, you know, experiencing that with Eric of him, like, you know, going through that rise. But like what, what gave you, was that what gave you the impetus for YouTube or were you a YouTube viewer prior to that? And if so, what were you watching and what do you feel like your channel is an amalgamation of? Okay. I was watching, I was watching a lot for a long time.

58:52Casey Neistat. Yeah. Like everyone was, I actually think that's, when Colin said, Ryan Tran, Bo Burnham, I think your building series has a lot of Casey in it. Oh, cool. Right? Like, do you remember when he made the penny board suitcase? Yes. There was, like, I could watch that video over and over and over again. 100%. Like, it was just, watching him build is one of the most, it's so fun. So anyway, I just want to add that to the, yeah. Watching Casey Neistat when he was uploading daily. I was unemployed at the time, so I really enjoyed. Sure. Like, a lot of time for those daily vlogs. A lot of time.

59:28And I would look forward to them. And I, yeah, I ended up starting my YouTube channel right after, right after I graduated from college. I bought the camera that Casey told me to buy and I started a YouTube channel. Which was? Which was? The Canon ADD. I didn't get the ADD. I think I ended up getting like a cheaper version of it. Maybe it was like the T7i or one of those. and like the super wide lens and like all of that was so exciting. I have family that lives in Sydney and they were about to have a, their second child and asked me as like a graduation gift from college. They said they would pay for my flight, like one way ticket to Sydney.

1:00:16And if I would watch their oldest boy for like a few days while they were in labor in the hospital. And I was like, I guess that means I'm starting a YouTube channel because I'm going to go around australia and because your boy's a travel yeah and i could never use my last name in my handle on a youtube channel which is where preston goes came from i'm like if i'm a travel creator i need to like have a travel name yeah yeah yeah of course i was like oh it's so good it's gonna be great and then very quickly realized that like making travel videos while you're traveling is the most that's the hardest thing in the world also that have like no concept if you don't like concept them out like we tried vlogging it's miserable if you don't concept them out it's just like i'm like like living and trying to find a story at the same time and like is any of this interesting and it's not most of it is right right and i ended up backpacking through southeast asia in that trip and made like probably made three videos in like a six month period sure which was dramatically lower than i would have assumed i thought i'd upload like a hundred videos yeah So in that time, I'm watching a lot of Casey Neistat.

1:01:24I'm watching a lot of Rory Kramer. He's a video guy toured with Chainsmokers, Justin Bieber. Justin Bieber has their own MTV show. Yeah. Uh-huh. Yeah. It wasn't until Eric made it his full-time thing where I realized, oh, this could be a job. Yeah. And it's so funny now looking back. Like I literally wanted to make those videos traveling because I just thought how cool would it be for me to have a video where I was like in Vietnam. That sounded awesome. Like I want that video. There was never like dollars connected to it. Sure. So it is interesting seeing how YouTube's evolved now and it's so much more like business.

1:02:09Yeah. Now that it is a job, what does the job look like for you? Who do you work with? What do you do? like what does the job of being Preston Goes look like? Especially if you're not going to Australia and Southeast Asia anymore. It's more Preston Stays. Yeah, Preston Stays. Preston Ponders. I started to have a second channel handle just in case. It's called Preston Went. That's hilarious. Preston Stays is probably better. Don't do the second channel yet. Oh, no, no, no. I just wanted to have it. You need it. Yeah, yeah. You need it. You'll get there. One year. Yeah, yeah. One year. Yeah. Preston stays.

1:02:46The business, was that the question? What does the job look like for you? Do you have people that work with you? What do you do? Right now, I am just starting to figure out how to work with more people. So I have been contracting editors to basically get a really solid rough cut for me. And that's been the only thing I've really hired so far. So I'll send them all the footage, get in a call, walk through the story. So I'll, they'll like take out notes and I will tell them the entire story of me taking a train from Vancouver to, um, or Toronto to Vancouver. And then they'll send me back a cut and then I will jump in.

1:03:35I personally, I love editing. It is my favorite part. I think I like editing more than I like actually shooting the videos because that's when it comes to life and something so simple can all of a sudden turn into a huge laugh or an emotional moment. But I also realized in order to make more videos, I just need help editing. So I'm looking, I'm in the process of finding a full-time editor and I guess a full-time producer. Like the whole Ryan Trahan model, Max Fosch model of like shooter, editor, producer, lean team, I think is like the vision for me. Right now it's just me and like some contracted editors, but I think that's kind of the vision that I have.

1:04:27What do you hope that brings you? like bringing on a full-time editor and a full-time producer having some more time to like hang out with my wife. yeah you know uh these past few years have been a grind grind just saying no to so much dude like so much meaning like socially yeah yeah yeah and that married guy youtube totally different than single guy youtube yeah it feels extra irrational yeah yeah i would love to talk about that please i need to keep working on my failing thing i'm sorry i'm sorry i can't go to becky's baby shower I need to edit this video. I'm on the hunt for 10 ,000 views.

1:05:12Do you guys have any advice for me as a married YouTuber? Like I'm figuring out as I go, but like, do you have any words around that? Oh man, I just got married. So yeah, I think you should go first. Married guy YouTube is married for 72 hours. No, actually I don't. It's so hard because it's like completely irrational. All of it is rational, you know? And like, I think all it is, is like sitting down with your partner and explaining like what it is about you that like this thing fills up, that you need it. Why do you need it? Because explaining it as a job then doesn't make sense. I remember like in my late twenties, someone was asking me what I was doing over the weekend.

1:06:00I was like, oh, I got to edit a video. And they're like, dude, I'm so sorry. You have to work over the weekend. And I was like, wait, no, I like this. This is the fun, like what I do is fun. Right. I enjoy it. And I run into that quite a bit. I think that was early on in my relationship was like, she'd be like, God, it's such a bummer. You have to work so much. And I was like, oh, I need to explain this to you in a way that's like totally reframes your understanding of someone's relationship to work. Because my relationship to work is like, it's almost like, I've had to work on this for a long time, but it's like one with my own identity, right?

1:06:36Like the thing I am crafting on a daily basis, this company, this brand, this channel, like it is a part of me. And so it's a thing that I, on a daily basis, it's more natural for me to work on it than it is for me to not work on it. And so when I am not working on it, that's work for me. The work is for me to go, I'm gonna put this down. I'm going to go to Becky's baby shower. I'm going to be present there. I'm going to have a conversation with someone. And I'm sure to some people listening or watching this, they're like, that guy sounds like a crazy person. But I think a lot of creatives understand this, where it's like your mind is incredibly stimulated by bringing an idea to life.

1:07:20It's the best. And then everything else feels not as stimulating. And YouTube's a bit self-indulgent, especially if it's your name and you're in the video. So yeah, it feels good. When you're making a video about yourself, it does well. yeah like you're building something it's exciting totally but it does take you far from feeling normal at a baby shower 100 totally yeah yeah and you're always kind of plugged in there's always a part of your brain that's like on youtube yes right and so you have to like accept that part of you that's like okay 10 of me 24 hours a day is in the algorithm you know it's like firing through ideas firing through like oh i could have changed that in that video what if i made a video about that or you know oh that's a good thumbnail idea i gotta write that down like there's like a part of you that's always there uh-huh so when we got coffee a few weeks ago yeah yeah yeah you mentioned how april was going to be a big month for you and your family because your brother was getting married yeah and how that was going to be like a slow time for the channel yeah and i got home and i'm talking to katie and i was like explaining how inspired i was of like wow they they are like trying their best to like like acclimate into the world and do things that are important and like go to your brother's way that's like an important thing that we need to do but youtube rewards the workaholic yeah youtube celebrates the addicted person who's like constantly giving but if we want to be athletes that play for a long time i think you guys it was just it was inspiring for me to see that uh it sounds like maybe there's there's another thing because i'm wondering laughing because we found a way to how many videos did we put out in april yeah we found a way to what i was gonna ask you how to happen you know i don't know we just found a way i think we also have like i also think that candidly we're moving more in the direction of Like, like, I think when you're riddled with fear, what I mean by that, when I said that earlier in the conversation, when like our videos reeked of fear, it's like they are covered in strategy.

1:09:28It's like a, it's like a chocolate covered almond, right? Where it's like. Keep going. Right. Yeah. The chocolate is the strategy, right? And so you're like. To get you to eat the almond? You're like, I know this is an almond, but it's covered in chocolate, right? I don't know. Yeah. I'll leave that. Again, I'll leave the writing. Let me get this. that i'll leave the writing to colin yeah but i'll build that one out for you but but over time it's like there's like a level of honesty that just starts to come where you're like oh wait hold on yeah we got something to say let's turn on the camera and say it and then upload that you know and like yeah we'll add some punchy editing here and there but like we're just we're the thing we do is we're here to say some things you know like that's not that complicated right it's not as complicated as your videos you know so yeah and i think that's uh over time you know what used to stresses out of like, how are we going to get videos out when we're traveling?

1:10:20It's like, even we were just at breakfast this morning and Colin's gone for the month of June. And it's like, oh, well like bring a camera and a mic with you. If we, if we have a good idea, we'll, we'll figure it out, make a video, you know? And I think that again, it's coming back to the world of like less fear, more honesty in your creative of like, it's okay. And it's interesting how those new creative constraints can output new creative videos that your channel hasn't seen as a viewer the videos you guys have posted these past few weeks have felt so new and fresh and different and to know that they are the result of like you guys having to think creatively of like okay how are we going to put out videos is encouraging i think for anyone listening just because like it's affirming knowing that like new constraints can actually benefit us versus hold us back and like stifle you know i'm curious with you being like relatively new to this being your job like what do you think the job is like what's the job of being a youtuber yes yes what is the job like like to make it work financially what is the job yeah i think for me the biggest thing comes down to upload uploading relatively consistently and whatever that means i think that's that's probably my biggest north star of right now because that's challenging when it's essentially like a one-man show with with help here and there and but i guess the job i define i define the job as like me doing fun things that I want to, I've always wanted to do.

1:12:09Right now in the beginning, I would get so stressed, like crazy stressed, thinking so much about the chocolate on the outside of the almond. Right. If you will. And, and the strategy of it all, just like, like paralyzing me. And I remember in the beginning, sending videos to my friends that watch YouTube videos. And they're like, I just don't know if I understand like seven minutes of this. And I'm like, what? Those, I followed all the rules, you know? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then being like so upset. I'm like, I thought I was following the rules. And now realizing, basically I wrote out, I have like a few little motivational things around my office, specifically from that beginning stage.

1:12:54You're writing being one of them. And now be the almond. Be the almond. Just the almond. Just the almond. Just the almond. Just the almond. No choc. Hold the chocolate. Hold the chocolate. Okay, I'll put that up today. The almond is good enough. Yes. Okay. Yeah. Be the almond. Be the almond. Carry on. In that time, I wrote down really big, this is fun. And that has been such a funny, ironic motivator for me because this job, it's very easy to forget it. and I think my favorite videos to watch are the ones where you can tell, like, wow, these guys, who's ever a part of this video, they're enjoying what's happening.

1:13:42Totally, and the audience can tell. Yes, I think they can. And the fact that I have to remind myself, hey, buddy, this is fun. I just want - But that's because it also is a job. Yes. It's also, as a married guy living in Los Angeles, it's also a source of financial stability or you're hoping for it to become a source of financial stability. Big time. So in that respect, like what have you learned about how the financial side of YouTube works? And is it different from what you thought? And are you the business-minded one? Is there someone else? I'm not the business-minded one. So a lot of it is me figuring it out as I go.

1:14:26I, yeah, I, yeah. I'm not as comfortable in the business side of things, but I think I'm getting more comfortable. But right now, I feel like I'm just really starting to make real money out of all of it. And it has just been the craziest, the craziest feeling. And where's that coming from? Brand deals or from AdSense? It's coming. Yeah, those are the only two. And I've been able to do a handful of brand deals, which is a pretty crazy feeling after watching videos for a long time. And I always look forward to the day where I could say that this, like - This video is sponsored by it. Yeah. Yeah.

1:15:07Oh my gosh. Yeah. So I was able to say that this, like this past year. And then I've been able to say it multiple times, which is a crazy feeling. And so that has been a chunk of the money. And then ad revenue as well. And - What percentage would you say each of them make up? if those are the two sources of income. All of a sudden, ad revenue took way more. Like AdSense. AdSense. Oh, cool. Interesting. Great. YouTube's loving you back. Yeah. It's crazy. It's a very crazy thing. That is, for a non-business minded creator, that is the best case scenario. You don't talk to anybody. It just is a magical check that shows up once a month.

1:15:46And to see the catalog slowly start to, like older videos making money every month, It's like, it's crazy. It's crazy. Cause you're like, I invested so much time in that video and now it's paying me back. Dude. What is going on? It's an insane feeling, especially as someone who like video has been my job. Sure. Forever as an adult. Right. I was in an agency doing, making videos for brands in Atlanta with some great people. And then I toured with a musician for like two years doing all of her social media stuff. So like Instagram, YouTube, et cetera. And all of those videos would basically, I would, we'd post them.

1:16:33They'd get a few thousand views and then it's done. I get my paycheck and it's over. So for me to all of a sudden, like have passive income coming from creative things that I made, dude. Yeah, wild feeling. Oh, it is the craziest. It's the craziest feeling. Do you remember your first AdSense check where you looked at it and you were like, oh my God, this is real? The first one, I guess, came from YouTube Shorts. Oh, really? Interesting. Was it from YouTube Shorts? I don't remember. I don't know. Do you remember the amount of this check means now that this actually is becoming my career? um there's one there's one check that came in from the railroad go-kart round two video that that i think that was probably the first time where i'm like oh this is a different like that's the first one where i was like this i'm playing a different game here and yeah my i was like i looked at katie i was like we're going on vacation so we went to mexico city it's like the first time we've been on vacation after so many like like i was saying just saying no to so many yeah things and like moving to a new city she's making all these friends i'm not making friends i'm having a fun time making a video and then sitting right right night after night uh so to be like hey i think we can like go on a vacation and like we need that like like for our marriage I want to be able to take her on things.

1:18:11And to not be able to do that for a long time, it's just hard, dude. Yeah. With this dream and... There's nothing worse than being together but not present. And that can happen a lot when you're working on a YouTube channel out of your house, right? Is you're like, you're there, but you're not the same partner as if you were working a job that ended at 5 p.m. and just were free. I think that's the hard part, is the frustration, I think, with that, of like, I wish you could just come home. When your partner, you can feel it on your partner or they say it. Like, I wish you could just come home and be here.

1:18:44Yeah. But like the post 5 p.m. is also like, that's prime edit time. Yeah, yeah, 100%. That's edit time. You know, like you're five to 2 a.m. is like, you're locked in. You're locked in, yeah. And then you're like, you come down, you eat dinner, but you're like not there. You're kind of, you're still in a timeline. You're like, you know, it's Queens gambiting the timeline around, you know, while you're eating. you're like uh-huh they're smiling you're somewhere else the older you get you realize that's like that's no place to be yeah yeah especially long term yeah yeah gosh so yeah vacation and how did vacation's good man i like vacation how did brand deals come to be and how do they happen now like especially with you not being necessarily business-minded yes what was the first brand deal and how did it yes come around uh so my channel got its pop this past summer I made a song for Ryan Trahan's Penny Series, which he ended up using throughout the Penny Series.

1:19:42It was a version of the outro song that he would use every time. I love the outro song. And I thought, oh, that would be kind of funny if it had like dumb auto-tune lyrics to the song. I sent it to him again, just like just throwing spaghetti at the wall. I'd never done anything like that. And he thought it was so funny. and he was like i'm gonna use this and and then he used it and i posted a video at the same time as his finale his finale video so this was the second time he'd done the series recently seven days abroad yep and stayed up all night so stressed zombie mode yeah katie's coming in and out and and again just so unsure i was like i don't know like my luck it's it's gonna sit right there at 3 000 views and i'll learn something from it i guess and then move on to the next thing and within like the first hour it had like a hundred thousand views wow and i'm i hadn't slept and i'm you're just refreshing just give it to me we're screaming katie everything we've been working for it's happening katie's on zillow like here we go and we had friends over that just happened to be over that morning and we're all screaming and that was like the first time anything had ever like really gone specifically in long form videos and man uh so to come back to your question it was after that uh a buddy of mine And Jake Harlini connected me with his agency management company that sells brand deals.

1:21:35And Jake was very sweet and vouched for me. And he's like, I think this guy is going to make great YouTube videos on the channel. And I got on the phone with them and they connected me with Shopify. And that was my first one. and for me as like a consumer of youtube that felt insane because shopify was the is the like brand that like mr beast works with yeah and ryan trahan you don't need to explain what they do yeah yeah exactly and yet they're a sponsor of your videos and that's really cool and that felt so crazy dude what was the cop brand deal that first was that your first no that wasn't okay that wasn't the first one okay so that one is absolutely hilarious that one's insane thank you like that was crazy was that who was that guy it was he an actor context uh for people that haven't watched this so uh this was the first railroad go-kart video i love like i'm so thankful that i get to do brand deals i want the brand deals to be as good as possible yes so i want them to be this funny like like moment in the video that you don't want to skip through like you actually want to watch and i thought it would be funny as we're driving into the desert to shoot the railroad go-kart video to uh get pulled over by the police so we shoot this this scene uh i i buy a cop outfit for my buddy vick he he looks like an italian cop with glasses like he looks like the police and basically from there i was like what if basically it feels like oh my gosh from the viewer's perspective, he's being pulled over.

1:23:16This is getting serious. And then in unison, we both turn and look at the camera. Shopify's an easy use all-in-one commerce platform. And we did it. And then we did this whole song and dance. The brand deal progresses over the time that he's getting arrested and there's a song and it is just like, and it fits perfectly into the story because you're driving and you really do believe he's getting pulled over. I mean, in Go-Kart, video number two, there's also an unbelievable moment when you're trying to go through a tunnel and there's a sign that says, warning, don't trespass. Scan this QR code to watch a video before you go any further.

1:23:56And then it's like this old school PSA style video. It's like beeping and you're like, oh wow, you can't go through. You get arrested. You're only allowed to be San Diego cops or wildlife preservation. And then it says, or if you're a Shopify owner, you can go through this tunnel. And it breaks in the song and it's so funny.

1:24:18There's just something about the misdirection of those things. Your misdirection is really so good. Well, I think it's just so fun. I think it takes what could be like this boring ad read and makes it feel like oh, we're all in on this like little treat of and now the brand deal is something that we're like enjoying. We want to comment about it and talk about it. Dude, the comments around those brand deals specifically have been so positive. Totally. And people are saying like, I like, people will say stuff like, I never watch brand deals all the way through. And I couldn't look away. It's like, so like that type of thing.

1:24:53So like such a compliment. That's the thing is like, if, if I'm to split up and describe the job of being a creator, there's, there's two sides of it. There's the creative side, which in my opinion, your job is to find content market fit, which is like what you want to make, what an audience wants to watch and what the platform wants. As long as that stuff's checked, that's your job on the creative side. On the business side, your job is to be really clear about the audience you're building and then find brands who want access to that audience and you sell access to your audience, right? And you do that through brand integrations.

1:25:27So anyone who treats their brand integration as a like, okay, I just got to do this thing real quick and then back to my story. It's like, that is your product. On the business side, that is the whole thing. Yes. You are, you are selling access to your audience. And actually in like the, the, the broad scope of being a creator, your primary customer is your audience and you're introducing a product to your audience. Right. If you don't do it in a way that they agree with or approve of, you might lose their trust across the board. And that's the, that's like the whole product you sell on the business side is your relationship with your audience, the trust they have in you and your ability to sell access to them.

1:26:11Right. And there's a lot of permission there that's being granted from the audience. So they're like, yeah, Preston, you have permission to tell us about brands because you do it in a fun way and we enjoy it. And you do it in a way that's relevant to us. And you do it in a way that we are entertained by and that we enjoy. That permission then grows over time. And now you, more brands want to work with you because the experience of accessing the customer access in the audience is good. And I think sometimes creators forget that that's the job. It's two sides. Like, yes, you need to upload as consistently as possible and you need to make great videos.

1:26:43But like the other side of the job is like, you are part of, you are a marketer, you know? Right. If you're doing branding. Right, right. So there's a way to do them that's like a premium product and a way to do them that's not. Yeah. And so I think taking it really seriously is very important. Yes. How is this like a great part of the video? Yeah. How does the audience develop a relationship with this brand? Yes. I think it's come more natural to me that I think I would have thought. And I think it connects to my time working at an agency, making videos, like these types of videos for all types of companies in Atlanta.

1:27:22And that was my job for a long time. So now to get to do that type of thing for me, where I'm like singing songs and stuff, it feels like that it's so easy and so fun because of like how i'm getting to like distribute it and i really look at it like it's an honor that i get to make youtube videos that brands are paying me to like be featured in the videos so like i want to take it really seriously because this was not the case like very recently right you know so like i want to hold it all very like appreciative like because i am you know and and i agree with you it's like people that have a lot of options on youtube so if you're like choosing to spend 10 20 minutes with me that's a lot of time i want you to leave feeling like oh man like like i can tell he enjoyed himself and like and valued my time and uh yeah like maybe you think or feel better or like laugh a few times that's what I want I think that's what I want people to feel when they're watching the videos I remember because you were part of our first cohort of creator startup and I remember uh when we had coffee you'd talk to me about the exercise that we do that's this goal setting exercise where you it's it's it almost feels comically elementary but it's something that no creative does and I find it to be so important where you like how much does it cost to live where I want to live how much does it cost?

1:28:52I remember doing it and thinking like, why do I have to do this? I almost didn't buy it at first. And then I finished the worksheet. I'm like, again, call Katie. I'm like, hey, this is like revolutionary stuff. The revolutionary stuff is just, it's a math equation to add up. How much does it cost to live your dream life? Yes. Yes. And thinking forward. That's all it is. It's like dreaming forward and then working backward adding adding it up and yeah i think part of my answer was like being able to afford to live in la yeah like it's an expensive place coming from atlanta sure so to like i don't know where i thought i was i think it was by the beach like venice somewhere yeah uh some expensive house by the beach i was like that would be yeah awesome and like backtracking and adding up the number and and realizing oh maybe that's not as as unattainable as it would have felt yeah a long time ago and yeah yeah so love the exercise love that exercise by the way that coffee we had there's nothing funnier to me than that whole situation of what happened so there i was between Colin's wife.

1:30:10Okay. Yeah. You tell the story. I would love to tell it. I'm Samir hits me up. I'm like, Oh cool. I'm going to grab coffee with Samir. That's so fun. I'm going to go to a coffee shop. I've never been to before. So I get there first and I'm looking at the menu and I look at the barista and I'm like, I'm hungry and I want to like get something that I'm not going to like embarrass myself and like put stuff all, you know, I spill often. and so i introduced myself to this very nice barista i'm like hey if you were to like order something here that like if you're like a messy eater like what like myself what would you pick uh because i'm doing like a business meeting and i don't i've never said business meeting in my life but that felt like the easiest context for someone i don't know to like understand sure she gave me a great recommendation of the frittata.

1:31:04I've never had frittata. I think it was a frittata. It was your first frittata. It was my first frittata. Love a good frittata. Big fan. We have a funny moment. She's like, yeah, frittata. Ha, ha, ha. Samir walks up. And then Samir and the barista like really look at each other. And then they're like kind of smirking at each other. I'm like, what's going on? I have no idea what's going on. And then I quickly find out that that was your wife. That's my wife. And I had zero clue. And then it made me feel even more silly because she's like, so this is the business meeting? This was the business meeting?

1:31:38This is your big – yeah, it was pitched to me as you came up and you were like, what does a big boy like me order for a big business meeting? I wasn't going to say that part. That's the funny part, Preston. That's the whole thing. You said, what's a big boy like me order for a big business meeting? You came up and you were like, what's a big boy like me order for a big business meeting? And she started laughing and was like, well, I guess if I were a big boy with a big business meeting, I would get the frittata. I don't recall saying big boy, but it does sound like something I would say to a stranger.

1:32:14She said it to me and I said, that kind of sounds like Preston. That's so funny. Great coffee, great frittata. Great barista. Great barista. Greatest. The best. What is like tactically or functionally like a week in the life of pressing ghosts look like? Like what, what is the majority of your time spent on? Like, what is, what does this week look like for you? It's flying to someplace, having some weird, unnecessary adventure, if you will. Coming back, getting into the edit, either sending that footage out to an editor that's been helping me or just diving right in myself. and um and then writing songs as i'm editing i think a lot of my creative process happens in adobe premiere yeah like i'm there and that's when yep the story starts actually happening i just it's crazy how much writing i've done since starting youtube thought so much about writing and reading all these books on screenwriting because that's what we're doing like we're writing for screens and it's funny screenwriting for ever has been like movies and tv shows but to think like no like i think we're screenwriters too like we're writing stories that are consumed in screens we are writers yeah yes yeah we are and i don't think i knew that we were writers when i started that was like i i just hadn't computed in my brain yet it's not a road block it's the road it is the road gosh it's so good you gotta write more do you do any other writing i wrote my vows you should have heard his vows man they were wild yeah they were good any oh i don't know i'll share it with you okay off camera not for you guys okay yeah but i agree with you it is it is writing it's all right we talk about it even as we're writing shorts and tiktoks and things that's all made easier if we just take the time and write yes Well, it's not even just made easier.

1:34:15It's like if you don't do it, you're not doing the thing. Yeah. If you don't sit down and write it out, you're not doing the thing. Our hardest videos have been the ones that we don't write. You don't write. Yes. I think that's also why like vlogging was hard for us because it wasn't – it was like what Casey did so well is he was writing in real time. Yes. He could write and live at the same time, which was like, I don't know. I don't know how he did that. That's a great point. That's exactly what he was doing. Yeah. And I feel like so much of my writing happens once I sit down to edit that if there is not a clear structure or storyline, that edit can take so long.

1:34:46Yes. Because it's like, oh, wait, I'm writing something kind of like that happened, but like didn't. But like that whole process can be an exhausting thing in the edit, I feel like. What about shorts? How are you treating shorts right now? Because you have multiple shorts with over like 40 million views. One with like 77 million views. and that short with 77 million views is like a perfect short oh wow thank you we were watching it and we were like huh that's the perfect this is a perfect short it's like uh you basically establish you ask the question like how do you sink in the dead sea right and it it begins with that question and then very quickly we're seeing the first attempt which is you putting on a bunch of t-shirts and you don't sink.

1:35:32Then you try another thing, I think with a rock, and then you get some dead seawater in your eye, which is funny. And now I'm like, I'm in because I like - It hurts so bad. Because I think it's really funny. And then like, you make this joke about how Mr. Beast cured your vision. And it's like, lady is like wiping a towel on your eye. And then you're like, well, maybe this amount of rocks, maybe this amount of rocks, maybe this amount of rocks, which is like the ladder system. The ladder system in a short is fantastic, right? Which another version of that would be like, here's one rubber band on a watermelon.

1:36:00Here's 10 rubber bands on a watermelon. You have to see how many does it take until it bursts. Yes. So like the ladder system is fantastic. How many of these does it take for this cool thing to happen? And you did that with the, how do I sink in the Dead Sea? How do you think about shorts in comparison to long form? How are you prioritizing them and how have they played into the growth of your channel so the first ever big views and subscribers all came from youtube shorts for me so it was it was october of 2022 i was at vid summit in the crowd when you guys hit a million you were there what a moment

1:36:53what a that like yeah just as a quick aside on that moment that moment for me is like if this all ended i would just look back and be like but that moment was what a gift yeah that was a real gift man that was unexpected and like just one of the greatest moments it was so cool yeah so i'm in the crowd yeah crying and uh at that time i was having like my first ever short start to get views and it was i i bought a cyber truck uh remote control car and framed it in a way where it looked full size using forced perspective because i'd seen it in so many movies i wanted to try it myself. And over those few days, that video went from like 200 views when I posted it to like 20 million views in a week or two.

1:37:52And my channel had never seen anything of like, like that of viewership wise. And my, I think my channel went from like 5 ,000 subscribers to a hundred thousand subscribers in two weeks just because of that short and it was so exciting i'm like this is insane i'm a youtuber now they sent me the plaque i'm like here we go i upload a long form video the next week and it gets like 400 views and i was like i don't like that feeling at all what's happening i have over 100 000 i'm a youtuber now and slowly but surely realizing that shorts viewership and long form viewership especially at the time before you could link stuff didn't necessarily correlate and if i'm being real i think it it was kind of hard for me because like long form youtube videos that's always been the dream so to like there was a version of it that almost felt like counterfeit views or something which i don't know if that's fair to say because because i think there's a lot of great creators that make shorts tiktoks all all of that but that was not my goal so i thought that that was going to help assist me to get to the goal of long form viewership and it didn't and then over time i started like like being like upset at shorts of like you're you you wronged me or something yeah yeah yeah not fair to innocent youtube shorts but over time i felt myself like like man i am i am a emotional person and maybe i shouldn't spend my time there because views and subscribers in general is an exciting hit and when you get that for the first time you're naturally going to be like oh i should do that again and again so the fear was like getting too locked in to the shorts okay and focusing more on the long form videos because that was my goal from the beginning but now i think i'm getting to a point where me and shorts we can hang again uh and i i need to get back into it i just i went through a little like weird season with them i feel like i told you this i feel like your songs would make great shorts like original songs yeah those are great shorts And just a little bit of context.

1:40:21And then, you know. Yes. You know who I think has really mastered the short-form version of long-form videos is Max Fosch. Bro. He has mastered that in a way that's like, those are standalone pieces that also make you want to watch the full piece. I don't know. He's just nailing those. Can we just talk about how great Max Fosch is? He's amazing. He's amazing. He just flew me to London to be in one of his videos. No way. Wow. So by the time this video is out, Oh, great. it'll probably be out. Oh, that's cool. The coolest, the coolest thing. Have you, have you been to London before? I've been to London.

1:40:55Okay. What a cool thing. Yeah, that's awesome. So cool. So cool. So someone you admire from afar. Yeah. Seeing your work, respecting you, and then you get to fly out and hang out with them and collaborate. And he flew me premium economy. Yes. I'm like, get out. Honestly. On Delta? Yeah. Yeah. Premium economy, Max. That's a good seat. Max is a good guy. Sounds like Max Fosh business is going well. Yeah. Premium economy. There are so many other people who've collaborated with Max that are like, he got me? like, he got me. I was in a middle C. I was in comfort plus. What's your next video? Because I imagine it'll be out.

1:41:30Yeah. Oh, nice. Yeah, by the time this comes out. Are you familiar with recumbent bicycles? No. Of course. I'm not. Yeah, lean back. That's the Delta one of bikes. Recumbent? Yeah, recumbent. Lying back. Oh, lean back like this. Yeah, okay, understood. You're biking. Understood. I've seen it. I've seen it. Old people usually are riding these on the side of the road. I thought how great would it be if you put a 420cc engine on the back of one of those. And it's by definition, a motorcycle by definition is a vehicle with two wheels powered by an engine with no pedals. So I make a by definition motorcycle.

1:42:11And I want to basically drive it over Mahalan Drive because it's like an iconic. Oh, yeah, yeah. motorcycle route unnecessary invention with an unnecessary adventure yeah that's the combo yes yes so i just finished shooting that and uh tomorrow basically tomorrow and all next week i'll be editing i think is the thumbnail done and will you be the one to design it i have been doing my thumbnails recently and it's almost done um i really after spending some time with ryan tran in uh texas the guy loves designing thumbnails oh yeah and as i'm like hearing him talk about it i was like you know what if this is the most important like we all believe it's the most important part of making youtube videos yes i should probably love it and get really good at it so sure i i could totally hire people to do that and i think i will probably continue to here and there um but if it's the most it's the most important part i should probably get really good at it and it's been like a thing recently i think i heard jimmy talk about this on the the last time you guys interviewed him of like that reminder of saying i love title thumbnails i love title thumbnails and believe it because it's so important and that has not been a natural thing for me as like a video maker yeah that it's it's been like my the hardest transition of like getting good at it and even enjoying it yeah um yeah i i i mean like colin's the one who does it on our side oh cool and like i think we always we explored a few times like can we hire out and and have some people and like tkg has helped us make a couple thumbnails uh he's awesome he's great designer.

1:44:04But I think, um, like I would encourage every creator to make their own thumbnails or if you're in a duo, one of you needs to make the thumbnails because it is the whole thing. Or at least know how to do it. Or at least know how, but I do think like hands-on keys making it is kind of like, then you can have real conversations about videos, you know? And like, I was thinking about this cause we got a question, um, from, uh, someone in our audience around like as a one-man creator, what are the things you need to focus on? Because there's a lot of things to do as a creator between like negotiating brand deals, setting up the business, making the videos.

1:44:42And I was thinking about it. I was like, I think the thing you should never, you should not let go of the ideas and the packaging. That's like, that's the main thing. And I thought about it as a car. Oh, wow. This is the first time. So - He's like, he had a stand-up who's been going around, you know, and he's been testing it. I can't wait. Yeah, I said this to a few people in our studio, but I was like, okay, if your YouTube channel is a car, the ideas and the packaging of those ideas is the engine. That's the engine of the car. Got it. The revenue is the gas. Okay. And the post-production is the wheels.

1:45:27Now let's take it a step further. Yeah. Yeah. Covered in chocolate. The more covered in chocolate. The more videos you make that start to do well, the more your library starts to take off. Yeah. The more mileage you get out of the gas you put in. That's right. Oh, good. I like that. This is good. This is good. I like this a lot. I'm workshopping this right now. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Be the omen. Yeah. Be the omen. I'm in. It is the road. Drive on the road. It is the road. But I really think like your job is to support the engine. Like you're working on the engine all day. Yes. Like you can get someone to adjust the tires and support the tires.

1:46:04You can get someone to fill it up with gas. You're the one tweaking the engine. You're the one ideas and packaging. Like I think that is the thing you can never let go of. So good. And I think that is actually the honest like future of the creator space. And of course production is something I didn't mention there, but like production is, to me that's like obvious. it's like if you can make videos you gotta film them yeah um but chassis yeah what what the chassis the main come on the chassis you put like the main thing there's no wheels on it it's just the shape of the car like the is that right the chassis can we confirm that's right right we're gonna see is crazy yeah yeah chassis is crazy yeah what did he say before the oh before we started recording i said like is vocal you don't want to sully your brand both of you You were like, what?

1:46:56Big words guy. Oh, God. I have a big words guy. Chassis. It's spelled C-H-A-S-S-I-S. The base frame of a motor vehicle or other wheeled conveyance. A noun. Chassis. Whoa. That is crazy. Yeah. That was wild. Okay. Well, anyway, what I was saying is the - That's a good word. Good job. I think my - You should know that word. I should. my caution to you would be to overcomplicate that process. Like I would not overcomplicate your process. And I'm curious if you feel in this version of the creator economy, any pressure to like build other businesses or like diversify your revenue or like make more of it.

1:47:37Like what's the pressure you're feeling right now or the problems you're trying to solve as a creator? I think the pressure I'm feeling is just trying to probably the hiring, process it's like okay there's money coming in now i need help making videos that just is just feels so outside of my comfort level but i also understand that if i can figure it out it will help the car go and so i definitely feel internal pressure there of just like wanting to figure it out, wanting to hire and not knowing how and knowing it's going to be a process and it's hard. And so I have felt myself kind of like tiptoeing in.

1:48:28I think hiring is the first part of that. The second part of that, if we go back to the car, you're in the driver's seat. All of a sudden now the car's full and other people are also making suggestions on which way you should turn and where you should go. Yeah. And I think that is also a big piece for a creative that a lot of creatives are, they work a lot better if they're the only ones in the car. Yeah. Right. And, and I think that's a, that's a caution of like, are you, yes, the hiring part is hard, but the harder part is management. Yeah. When you're building a company. Yeah. Right. Especially like full-time employees.

1:49:08Now, now you're talking about like careers now you're talking about like growth now you're talking about their lives and what's happening in their worlds right connected to your youtube channel right it's like a whole other element of mental space right that uh i do think that we're starting to see some of these these creator companies go through really hard times uh and i think part of it is because we were really building these like media companies and then recognizing like wait, actually YouTube, YouTube was built for the creator, like the single creator. Yes. Media companies can exist on here, but only if you're that type of person.

1:49:47It's great advice. If a manager is going to help you hire, get a manager, even if it's more commission. Yeah. That's great. Rather than an agent. Cause an agent's there to help you sell, but they're not necessarily going to help you hire. Right. But a manager might take care of more stuff for you. Yeah. you're giving away more. But actually, I think we maybe undervalue our personal time, mental space, and all of that in exchange for revenue, growth, and some of the other levers. When actually, again, coming back to that exercise we do in creator startup of goal setting, where you're like, wait, hold on.

1:50:23I'm actually making the kind of money I want to make. Growth would be awesome because that's the game we're playing, right? That's awesome. Of course, we always want to grow. But at the expense of my own mental well-being or sanity, it's like, that's not a trade I'm willing to make. And I actually think it's always, in entrepreneurship, it's positioned as a really noble trade. Like, stay up all night, sleep in your office. Don't spend time with friends. It is the celebrated YouTuber. Yeah, it's the celebrated YouTubers. Put everything back in. You know, push, push, push. Growth at all costs. But I actually think you have to evaluate your own version of that and being like, you know what?

1:51:02Actually, yeah, I'll pay a little bit more so that I have more time with Katie. Totally. Right? Like that's - 100%. Sure. I'll give 5 % more or 10 % more. Yeah. It's okay. My advice to you is to not get too stiff and to realize that videos serve different purposes, which is something that Ryan Trahan told us as well. But I, as a fan of yours, I want to see you make a 45-minute adventure movie like the go-kart video times two, as much as I want to see you make the video you made a year ago where it's one take and it's just you sitting at your desk talking for 12 minutes about what it was like on YouTube.

1:51:39I value those videos very differently, but they both can exist on the same channel. So I think don't get too stiff just because you are starting to find success. I would love to ask you about that video in particular. So I want to make basically the year two update of my time on YouTube video. Being new to the algorithm and brand deals and all of that, I feel like I've heard outside sources telling me like, hey, you've got to be like very protective of views and make sure you ride like a consistent thing. But like in my head, I want to post that video. But then sometimes I wonder like, wait, am I allowed to?

1:52:23Like, would that hurt me? I think you're allowed to. You definitely are allowed to. and I would also urge you to think really seriously about the packaging. No different than if you were going on an adventure. You don't have the same leverage and the same tools because you're not going, you're going to be probably just sitting in your room. You don't have a realistic image that is hyperbolic or crazy. Yes, yes. But you have the title. Yeah. And you have potentially, like you could hold a sign that says one word. Like there are still unclosed loops you can make. And we found success like that too with like sometimes we'll shoot videos in our car and they're five minutes long and we'll upload them to the main channel.

1:53:00Very different than a three-hour podcast. And the thumbnails are drastically different, but we still find a pretty good amount of viewership. Where do you want to be in one year from now? Like where do you want this all to be?

1:53:15In one year from now, I want to be, I think I want to be a little more comfortable like emotionally I think me talking about all the stuff of like shifting from it's not working to it's working to look out in a year of just feeling like more comfortable of just like what it feels like to post a 1 out of 10 and a 10 out of 10 and hiring and just like getting more like comfortable in that title of of youtuber i would love that because i i i still feel kind of imposter syndrome and trying to break it but what else a year from now yeah i just want to make really fun videos man like videos that the platform's not used to seeing that i'm really proud of i i'm so proud of the stuff that has been posted on my channel recently and not saying from like oh i'm awesome but i i put so much time and energy into them and it feels good to just try hard and and and feel like yeah i i've tried hard at these and i feel they're on the wall now my catalogs here in a year from now continuing to make stuff that i think is dumb and fun and hopefully not too dumb.

1:54:49I think that kind of answers the question. Maybe. Does it? No. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. I mean, that's awesome, man. I really do believe that you're at a position where everything you're doing, if you just keep doing it, you have the potential to 10x all of it, which is really cool. It's very cool to sit with someone and recognize like, damn, you stay on this track. Like you're on your path right now. Like it's really cool. And it's been fun to watch you find it. Yeah. You know, that's been really fun. And it's going to be a year of like, still this year it's going to go up and down. You know, like I think that's the caution is also like, don't believe that right now it's just everything's guaranteed.

1:55:34Every time you come up with a new idea, you have to do the fundamentals of like, is the packaging good? Is the title good? Is the intro good? Are there unclosed loops? Was I being honest? Is this on brand for me? Like you have to go through those exact same checkpoints every time you upload until you decide to stop YouTube. Like there's no time where it just, the platform forgives you for missing the fundamentals. And again, to make the comparison to an athlete, it's the same thing. It's like, yeah, if you just abandon the fundamentals, you're not going to play well. It's great. And I'll say, just know, no matter how hard it gets, you ever need a hammer you got one it's right here right there and it'll be right up there on that wall that means a ton just waiting for you seven ounces perfect tiny hammer here at the common center set up on right there I hope you never take it down I hope it always stays everyone this is a really important piece by the way that's a real hammer it will hammer it now good idea for a plaque of like hey you're working hard you're hammering away every day

1:56:40who decided to put the hammer up that's probably me yeah yeah but I like it I like the vibe of it I feel like after all this it has to stay yeah of course this is like guys who like watch Casey Neistat and are like damn that guy's got a cool studio look at all those tools hammer maybe in the comments let us know if you've also noticed this tiny hammer because I feel like I've looked at it every time and you're like what but that's so great how great yeah yeah but we could start a building channel who knows okay anything could happen yeah you guys want to come on a building adventure? Actually, yes.

1:57:13I would love that. Yes. Could you handle it? Yes. Really? Please include us in one of your adventures. Okay. That would be awesome. That would be awesome. They get a little squirrely sometimes. I know, but I'm looking for a little, you know. Squirrel. A little squirrel. I've never said squirrely before. All right. Thanks, Preston. Thanks for coming on. Wait. And please, what? Maybe to end. Yeah, yeah, okay. We play this song one more time. Yeah, play it one more time. Yeah, play it one more time. Yeah. So you can really appreciate how weird the song is. I just can't believe the speaker was in here.

1:58:10I'm like practicing walking over my office and they'll do this

1:58:17Did I get the words right

1:58:52Bye. See ya. Thanks Preston.