Tom Segura and Fox Creator Studios: Inside Hollywood's New Business Model

15:43Colin:Yeah. I mean, the thing that's funny about your story, it sounds very similar to your story. I think about you moving pallets, of clothes around in your father's warehouse downtown, right?

15:57Tom Segura:That was also funny. It's a great jacket, by the way. That was also funny.

16:00Colin:But I just think of these dusty, dirty places where you say, hey, I have an idea. I want to reach an audience. I'm going to build something. And so just as much as you are creators, I think we think of what Tom has been building in the same way. Although when I first think of Tom, I'm like big, torn comedian. But anybody who is building a direct-to-consumer relationship with an audience and is interested and continuing to tell stories with them is kind of where the creator studio likes to show up. Those are kind of any touch point where a creator is, whether it's podcast, TikToker, or Instagram, wherever they're living, and they're wanting to build IP with their audience and scale what they're doing, it's a good place for us to work together.

16:40Colin:And I think what we decided to do together when Ryan and Tom and I kind of started Met was they have a whiteboard full of things that they want to make that are across different, We're working together on an animated project. We're working together on a sitcom, I would call it. And we're working together on a stand-up special where Tom is hosting and bringing up emerging comedians. And those are all for direct-to-consumer platforms. And so when we look at creators, whether they are TikTok-born or YouTube-born, we say, hey, what can our ecosystem at Fox, 100 years of helping monetize IP through ad sales, through distribution, helping with production and creative.

17:23Colin:Like, how can we plug into anybody who's wanting to take formats further, build further, direct on their platforms? And that's where we want to show up, kind of in all shapes and sizes with creators.

17:35Tom Segura:Ryan, will you take me into the room of you guys talking about this and what was appealing about working with Fox Creator Studios? Because I think this moment, again, why we're even hosting this event is because it felt really different for me that over the past year, Hollywood Studios are picking up the phone and calling creators and saying, hey, let's make something together. And some of that also is like, let's make something together and distribute it on your platform. And you guys have this direct-to-consumer relationship with the audience. Just take me into the room of the conversation with Billy and why do something together?

18:12Tom Segura:Well, Billy and I met each other. I used to run a company called Rooster Teeth back in the day in Austin, Texas, where Tom and I live. And we knew each other. And when we reconnected, gosh, seven months ago, maybe longer, we were just kind of brainstorming around the idea of just like, hey, we were coming off of pitching something to a traditional streamer. Didn't get bought. We were a little frustrated because we loved the project. and I think we were at dinner not too much longer and Tom was sitting across from me and I'm like, man, why don't we just do this kind of stuff ourselves? And you can't do everything yourself, right?

18:46Tom Segura:And what I've noticed working with not only just Tom but all the comedians that are kind of in our orbit and in our network, these are folks who are self-built, right, like everything that they've done, they're the ones up on stage, they're the ones building their careers, they're the ones that's like a lot of them are just a solo business. And so the idea of kind of working in like the system or a stream or a big company is kind of, it's not something that may be inherent to what someone wants to do. But when I started talking to Billy, I'm like, wait a minute, there's a way to do this where one plus one can equal three in that we could still get the benefit of a system box that is, and this has spent a lot of time, probably took too much time away from your family.

19:28Tom Segura:I don't know.

19:29Colin:It was great, it was excellent.

19:31Tom Segura:But I just really dug in and we spent, I mean, many, many hours talking about this and just making sure, because I'm obviously protective of Tom and everything we're building, but like, is this the right partnership? And it was so obvious early on, but I just wanted to make sure that like, wait, with Fox, the support of Fox and everything that they offer, and you know, you can see the announcement today that like, there's a lot of layers to this that are really exciting, but it still gives us the freedom to be able to tell the stories that we wanted to tell. Are there some things we have big, you know, ambition to make a movie with Paramount, sure, fine.

20:06Tom Segura:But most of the stuff that he's referring to that are on our whiteboard are ideas that we just love that are pretty simple. And we like the accessible ideas and like things that kind of, we certainly have a lane of comedy, Bad Thoughts, if you're aware of that, it's a lane. It's not for everybody, but I think that's why it works, because we don't make comedy for everybody. We make comedy for, we make the stuff we want to watch. And so far, that's worked. And I think having the support of Fox and again, talking with Billy about it, it was just, you know, from day one, it was not about how do we make this work?

20:38Tom Segura:He was just saying, how do we be supportive? Because I think he knew what we were wanting to do.

20:42Colin:Yeah, I love to sit first with any creator and like try to figure out what their future plan is. Like, it's really important, like, you know, talking to Ryan and Tom, like what they're building to me is, you know, they're just creator CEOs building a scaled business that is answering like something that's like kind of broken in comedy in a way that like double down into a creative that they love and formats that can travel or can live there live on their platforms and that's how all the conversations have to start it's just like where are you trying to go with your business in this opportunity um sometimes creators think that we're kind of wanting to produce stuff and travel it onto tv or move or or that we want it on fox platforms we're hyper focused on working with IP, working with formats where we can say, here's capital, make it on your channels.

21:34Colin:You drive the creative, you produce it. We're not hiring producers and making it for you. You're not shooting on our stages. We like to work with creators who are like making already and support them as they think about how to further monetize with ads, with distribution and things like that. And these guys are a train that's really moving. And so the opportunity to kind of like stop and say, hey, here's some great formats that we can work on together, and hopefully we can rinse and repeat as long as they make something that's really good.

22:02Tom Segura:I think Billy's getting to this a little bit with the freedom of creation here, but Tom, I know on an earlier call you brought up this phrase development hell.

22:11Colin:Yeah.

22:12Tom Segura:And, you know, for a lot of us, it's just like, you know, we can explain that concept, but we don't have that. We just come up with an idea, we make it, and we live in our own hell until it's done and comes back, basically. Well, the thing...

22:22Samir:Yeah, speak to me about that. The thing I would first of all say to people as creators is like, don't lock yourself into just one way of thinking that you can get something done and produced and out there. You know what I mean? If you go, I only do it this way and no other way, I think you're really limiting yourself. You're really limiting yourself. You can go case by case, project by project, whether you think this is just for you and your channel. This is something to find a partner on. This is something to go a traditional route and have a traditional studio behind it. You don't have to just think one way.

22:59Samir:Those options are available to you. Development helm, if you're not aware, is basically when you go into a studio and you go, I have an idea. And they're like, we'd love to hear it. And then you talk to them about it and they go, we want to do it. And then you do that for two years. And then two years later, you're like, aren't we making something? And they're like, who are you? And you're like, I'm the guy. And they're like, I don't fucking remember you. That happens and has happened for many years. And it's happened to all of us. And it's a bummer when it's something you love. Obviously, there's projects you get excited about.

23:35Samir:But you always want... One of the most exciting parts for me about this partnership is it allows us to actually move at a real pace. like we actually get to to make these things like this year yeah we're we're moving on this that's

23:53Colin:this isn't like development like hey like yeah great let's make this project and we'll like wait till we have the script it'd be fun to meet a lot they're shooting all of this stuff this year

24:03Samir:yeah um yeah that that is like invaluable because everyone's been caught up in that thing where you just you literally just meet for lunch a bunch you're like yeah lunch is cool i like lunch but But it would be fun to actually make this stuff. And this opportunity is allowing us to do that. And I would say always pursue the path that you want that works best for you. But God, think about it actually being made.

24:32Tom Segura:I mentioned this to you when we were talking, but I think momentum is an undervalued piece of creativity.

24:37Samir:So much. Because when I have an idea, it's pretty fragile if I wait too long.

24:44Tom Segura:thousand percent because I'll just have a different idea it's it there's an energy to it there's an

24:49Samir:energy to ideas and momentum is is and when you find yourself in a group of people that all feel the momentum you just it's on you and and the group to keep it going you know because if you let it fade if you just let it the idea fades as well and and everybody's motivation kind of goes away so yeah you have to take the momentum and run with it can you talk to me right now about

25:15Tom Segura:how you know if something you make is going to be good? Sure. Because I feel like right now there's so much stuff, right?

25:25Samir:Like everyone's making so much stuff. There's so much, and it's hard to break through. I think that that, I think, I mean, this is, I'm sure this is not new to you, but I think that this is the truth when you create. Certainly when you come from a world of comedy, is you ultimately have to make the thing that like makes you laugh. If you're thinking about will someone laugh at this, you're already, that's a misstep. So you have to react in a way you're like, this is funny to me. You know, in stand up, we always do that thing. It's like, talk about the thing. When you have ruminating thoughts, the thought that keeps coming to you, you're like, even if you don't have it worked out, take it on stage and talk about it because something's going to come of it.

26:10Samir:And I think when you're creating, when you're writing scripts, when you're doing any type of project, you don't know. That's the truth. You don't know what the reaction will be. You never know if it's going to kill or bomb. You think you do, and you're always surprised. In stand-up, you write things that you go, man, this is so well-structured, and this is a really clever bit or whatever. You take it up there, and you get like, huh. And you're like, cool. and then you do your throwaway thing that you had doubts about saying and it brings the house down and so you just you really don't know and I think that goes for writing scripts I think it goes for stand-up live I think it's for creating a video you you don't know if it's going to get 20 million views you you hope it does but you really don't know but the only thing that you do know is that your honesty with yourself about it has to stay true because it's going to dictate whether you're actually doing the thing you want to do.

27:06Samir:If you start thinking too much about outside, I think you're lost.

27:10Tom Segura:I was going to just add real quick, so Bad Thoughts, season two streaming right now, and not to pat ourselves on the back, it is number five in the country right now, and I say that not to gloat, but... I think people will clap. I think Ryan wanted to pat on the back, right? A little bit, but I will say, the reason why I bring that up is it's number five... Because we need you to watch. We want it to be number two. Yeah, the crazy ex-boyfriend, the killer with the paint face, he's beating us. That's, you know, we got to beat him. But I bring it up because, you know, there was going to the whole, like, make us laugh, and that's what's important.

27:45Tom Segura:I think that show is working because we're not trying to make, you know, like, what is the broad comedy? What is the accessible comedy? There was a sketch. I won't say which one, but that, you know, we were on set, and I was like, I don't think we should do this. but we were just laughing our asses off and we're like yeah and then it turned out to be one of my favorite sketch

28:04Samir:yeah we have sketches in that show where we literally got phone calls from agents and they're like I cannot give this to an actor and we got a call from an actor who asked us not to make it because she said it was dangerous to put in the world and it's one of my favorites you know But I mean, it's an example of it. You listen to people. You don't work in that environment like a dictator. You listen to people, but you ultimately have to go like, I think this is the right way to go.

28:39Tom Segura:Billy, I wanted to ask you, from your perspective, what makes a good idea for you right now? Because you're in a room of creators. You are hard to miss on New York Street after this. I'd have to imagine there's some creators who want to walk up to you and pitch you an idea.

28:57Colin:I'm excited.

28:58Tom Segura:What makes a good idea right now for you?

29:00Colin:I mean, I think for us, it really has to do with something that you're excited about and have conviction on, right? So I think we want to think about formats that you think will work for your audiences and that, like, we feel like we can make a little bit of a business case for. Like, hey, this tape will sell one day. Hey, brands will want to be involved one day. Or we just think this is, like, a great idea. like let's see what happens when it's out in the world. I think the business case, we are in a hits business no matter what anybody says. And we want to find great IP that we can kind of support creators as they're making.

29:35Colin:So a lot of times creators come in and they're like, okay, here's these four videos that I did that were the most successful and I had the most fun making. And here's like a 10 episode format that I want to make that borrows from a lot of those mechanics and a lot of those. So it's like this data backed approach to like formats that they believe in. And sometimes they come in and say, I really want to do a game show version of this. And I think it would be really fun. And they're like, but I haven't quite figured out the mechanic. And I'm like, do you want to talk to like the 15 people who've made 100 years of game shows down the hall?

30:06Colin:They're like, can we? And then we just let them chat about it. And like, they don't have to do those ideas. We're not talking about development hell. I'm just talking about really smart people who know how to make stuff. And they don't have to take the ideas, but they're available. So we try to make it a place that like borrows from everything that we have done here, but also builds it in a way that is understanding of where creators come from. It's not like, come here, pitch your idea, go through two years of lunches and meetings and development, and maybe we make your thing. It's like, what do you want to make on your platform?

30:38Colin:Tell me why, and let's get into it.

30:41Tom Segura:And how do you make your money back? Well, I mean, who cares? No, I mean, I think, no, no, no.

30:50Colin:I mean, everything we do, we definitely do like a business case for, right? So it's like Fox has 100 years of making money on IP, right? So there's not a concept that gets greenlit on air or made and then sold to. At Fox, we don't just make things. Fox, large Fox doesn't just make things for Fox channels. It makes things for Netflix, for Hulu, for all kinds of distributors. So we're a studio. So everything we make has a business case. How much do we think brands are going to want to get behind this? How much audience is going to come? How is the tape going to get sold? How is the format something that could maybe happen in other countries or how can the format travel?

31:29Colin:How can we go into multiple seasons of this? So all of the pipes that exist to make money from IP, the same are true. Just the approach with creators is a little different. I think from my end, one of the things - Hold on. Is that specific enough?

31:42Tom Segura:Yeah, I think that's good. I mean, in this setting, you guys have a D2C relationship with your audience, right? Yeah. I mean, you said 45 ,000 people bought tickets back in -

31:50Samir:That was in 2020, the first one we did. That's crazy. That was an eye-opening thing because we realized like, oh. And also, you know, what happened immediately were the agents who I told about, they were like, bump up that ticket price. I was like, no. Like, we always kept it, the$10 because we were like, they came for that. We can just try to get more people, try to do volume. And that's what we did for that.

32:15Tom Segura:And also, the audience is the boss of all of this, right? So, like, their relationship to you is very important and sacred. Yeah. Yeah, I think that's really important.

32:25Samir:I think with that being said, with the audience being the boss, one of the things that scares

32:28Tom Segura:me when I say yes to a project that includes a lot of creation is do I have the capacity to keep all of these things good? Say it again? Do I have the capacity to maintain the quality, keep all of these things good when you say yes to something like this? How do you, Tom, navigate that considering you're scaling, you have a lot going on?

32:47Samir:Well, one of the things you have to do is hire really good people around you to like him. I mean, it's the truth. The more you scale in different avenues, you realize that you can only do so much and that if you try to do too much, then one or more things will suffer. So you really have to surround yourself with really quality people. you know, like on the show, like on Bad Thoughts, it's like, it's from executive producers and the writers room, like I'm not in there being like, it's only my words, you know, like it's you, you, you open up the room, you try to have the best writers, the best directors, obviously talent, and you just, you have to trust people that are talented people and trust their opinions on things, and ultimately you make executive decisions on a lot of things.

33:42Samir:But I think a lot of that is surrounding yourself with very capable people, especially if you start scaling in a bunch of different arenas.

33:51Tom Segura:Closing words for a room full of creators entering this chapter of entertainment where we're seeing Hollywood studios like Fox open up creator divisions, being more open to work together. How do these two worlds meet and what's your advice for the room?

34:09Samir:get that money yo i mean yeah i like that that's good

34:16Samir:no i think i think this is like so like you realize i hope you realize that we're literally in a golden age right now like you you this this kind of stuff the fact that you can partner up with with people like at fox creator studios and and you spread out that's that's an amazing opportunity. So I would say that like, don't shut down any avenue. Figure out your goals. That's the first thing is like, what do you want to be doing? Sometimes people listen to what someone else is doing and think that that's the goal, but that might not be what you want to do. So that's the very first thing you have to do is figure out what you want to be doing and then figure out which is the best path for it.

35:01Samir:And don't limit yourself as to where you can go. like these, if you have ambitions to be doing movies or television, you know, you know that that is, it's never been more accessible and possible than right now. This is the best time in history for somebody that doesn't have a traditional entertainment path to end up with something like that. So it's all very possible. I think you just have to be clear with your goals and clear what you want to do and realize that it is very, very possible to end up there if you are focused and you are open to different ways of doing it.

35:42Tom Segura:Amazing.

35:43Samir:Cool.

35:43Tom Segura:Guys, thank you so much. Thank you, guys. Billy Parks, Ryan Hall. Yeah. Tom Segura. Thank you guys so much. Thank you. Appreciate it. Yeah.