Badenoch scraps stamp duty with ‘best speech of her career’

0:02The Telegraph

0:10Kemi Badenoch has just delivered a barnstorming speech to the Conservative Party conference in Manchester. It certainly saved her political bacon. Can it save the Tory party? We'll be analysing what I think was not just Kemi's best speech ever, but the best speech of the conference season and talking to Tory party members to get their views on it. One of them was so pleased, he actually cried. Welcome to The Daily Tea with me, Camilla Tomini. and me, Tim Stanley.

0:46Tim, we've just left the conference hall where I think we can both agree that Kemi Badenov may have given the best speech of her career, genuinely. That was honestly the best speech of the entire conference season. And one thing we can say today for sure, I don't know what the Conservatives will be polling in a week's time but that lady is safe in her job yes she is there have been no disasters this week no she shone she had a number of things she needed to do she needed to give encouragement to a conference that has felt like the conference of the last stand the last true believers because it's smaller and quieter than before she needed to give them confidence she needed to remind us why they voted for her and she needed to say something that would break through to the wider public.

1:36Yes, policy bomb. So after giving a speech which was funny, deeply personal, we can go through all that, at the end of it, she said something which is going to stand out from the whole of the conference season. The last Conservative government cut stamp duty for thousands of home buyers. But now we must go further. We must free up our housing market because a society where no one can afford to buy or move is a society where social mobility is dead. So I have looked at the stamp duty thresholds to see where we can change them. I have looked at the rates you have to pay to see if we can lower them.

2:18I have decided that we can't. Because that simply wouldn't be enough. Conference, the next Conservative government will abolish stamp duty on your hands. I mean, I was sort of listening to it and I had people around me because we were both seated among the members. They were increasingly loving it. And what they were loving is that she is, at the end of the day, a true conservative. She absolutely sort of nailed all of the things that would be on your Tory bingo card. Yes. One by one by one. Homeownership, personal responsibility, family, borders. I mean, in fact, she had a couple of moments where she literally listed everything that she stood for.

3:03Let's listen to that. I stand for a government that takes less of your money and doesn't interfere in your life. I stand for an economy where profit is not a dirty word, where enterprise is supported, not crushed.

3:26I stand for a country where what you put in determines what you get out, where excellence is celebrated. I stand for a country where actions have consequences, where we talk about responsibilities as well as rights, where crime is punished and justice is served. I stand for a society where free speech trumps hurt feelings, where everyone knows what a woman is, where people are judged by the content of their character, not the colour of their skin, where the vulnerable are supported, but where freeloaders are told where to get off. I stand for stronger borders and a stronger economy so that the young can fulfill their potential.

4:05The old can live out their years in dignity and everyone can achieve their dreams to own a home, run a business, raise a family. This is the Britain I stand for. If it is the Britain you stand for, then stand with me and let's build it together.

4:23And delivering that list, she said Labour loses when it sticks to its principles. because they crash the economy. The Tories win when they stick with their principles. Now, there have been leaders in the past who, when trying to get ahead in the polls, have tended to ditch those principles because they thought you had to go to the centre in order to win. This is a different strategy. It comes partly from being in a weaker position. They're so low, 16 % in the polls, that they've just got to remind those who are tempted by the Conservatives why they are conservatives. But nonetheless, for this group of people who need to be given a reason after so many defeats to go and knock on doors and deliver leaflets, to hear we're going to be loyal to our principles, that was really encouraging.

5:07Also, when it comes to the kind of personability of it all, I'd written a column before saying she needs to be charmed personified. She had a reputation in the past for being quite brittle, being quite brutal, not maybe pressing the flesh enough. She strides on stage. I thought, goodness me, there's a lot riding on this. Everyone's going on about it being make or break. She looked comfortable. She looked relaxed. She's delivering her jokes. They went down well, unlike last week where the jokes all failed, apart from one told by Wes Streeting. She was genuinely quite funny. Yes. She was smiley.

5:40I thought the whole thing at the beginning where she was thanking everyone for all their efforts, she was basically saying to her... By their first name. Yes, but she was saying to her team, I know it's awful out there on the doorstep. Yes. I know we have had an absolute shocker. Last year is a year we all want to forget. But it was a careful balance of sort of mea culpa, but also, and I think it was a kind of, I'm not surrendering to this narrative that everything we did was bad. I'm not giving over to the Labour attack line that the whole of the last 14 years was an unmitigated disaster. Because it's just not true.

6:15Between 2010 and 2020, we slashed the deficit. We lifted millions of people out of tax and got millions into work. We sent English schools soaring up the international league tables. We led the coalition against Russia's invasion of Ukraine. But I also loved the clarity, the ideological clarity of just saying, no, the status quo and the continuation of sort of air to Blair Cameron and maintaining the liberal, wishy-washy, frankly, left status quo will not happen on my watch. I mean, it was quite Thatcherite, if I may say that. On your point about the personability of it, it felt like the speech someone might give at the Christmas party at the end of a year of bad sales.

7:04Yes. And so you say things like, and I want to say thank you, Deborah, for the baking. Yes. And thank you, Tom, for bringing in your homemade cider. It had that family, let's keep it together, guys, kind of feel. And she said this interesting thing about how the party was her family. And those who've worked on biographies of her have said that is true. It is true, yeah. That Kemi felt most recognized, praised, and celebrated as an individual by the Conservative Party. Yes. That she came to a country which tends sometimes to treat people of color as a person of color. And she talked about how she felt there was low expectations of her when she was younger.

7:45Whereas the Conservative Party prides itself on being colorblind. And she again nodded towards that later on in her list of conservative principles, that it's a country, a party that judges people on the basis of their character, not the colour of their skin. Yes, I felt as well there was warmth in the room towards her. Definitely. At the end, when she came up this sort of centre aisle with Hamish, her husband, who she praised, it was quite sweet, actually, because she kind of used his nickname, she called him Ham, which clearly is like a pet name. Again, it's opening a bit more of herself up to us, which we haven't seen before.

8:17Who knew Kemi Bade not had nicknames for her own husband? And you are more than just a political party to me. You have supported me, you have stood by me, you have enabled me to achieve more than I ever dreamed. You are my family, in many ways, quite literally. I married the deputy chairman of my association... LAUGHTER And I... LAUGHTER

8:45I certainly would not be standing here today without my husband Hamish. Thank you, Ham. But as she came in, I mean, people were shouting, Kemi, Kemi, Kemi, and wanting to get near her. What I thought was interesting about her speech, and let's just contrast it to our experience with Robert Jenner yesterday, there was genuine sort of... Because she started speaking, I thought, is this a bit too quiet? This is all a bit... It's quite girly, this is very womanly. It's almost slightly maternal. I thought, are you going to be able to rouse the people in here? But she did it with very sort of calm and considered rhetoric.

9:18And that's almost like what she's trying to do with the conservatives, isn't it? As she said, I'm an engineer, not an arsonist. We are people who conserve things. We don't burn them down. We're not anarchists. Yes. Which was obviously pointing at reform and saying, you're getting hysterical and making promises you can't keep. I think it was also a little bit of an attempt. I mean, she name-checked Rob a couple of times. The Shadow Justice Secretary is stopping more fare evaders than Transport for London. Thank you, Rob. I think it was also... Now, you get back in your box. You spent the whole of yesterday freelancing, including on the Daily Tee.

9:59And who the hell is he? He's only the Shadow Secretary of State for Justice. He's not even one of the big three jobs. It is a little odd that he gets a whole day to himself on the airwaves. I know we interviewed him, so he contributed to that. I know. But I think his team engine it. The jury's out on how the story of the white faces comments that were made at a Conservative Association event ended up in The Guardian. I don't think anyone at The Guardian was at the Conservative Association event. I don't want to cast aspersions, but I kind of did think yesterday, this is all very conveniently timed.

10:30He dominates the airwaves, right? He is now singling himself out as precisely the opposite of her. He isn't a team player. And she's just done a sort of half-time talk in the dressing room when the team is 5-0 down and said, come on. And I think she will ingratiate herself to Conservative members, MPs, shadow ministers by saying we're all in this together because I think they'll believe her. They wouldn't believe Generic saying that. No, definitely not, no. You mentioned reform, Camilla, and how interesting that this is the party which is most threatened by reform, as in reform could drive it extinct.

11:08And yet it's the party which has mentioned reform the least of all the conferences we've gone to. I'd also add no flags. There were four enormous flags standing behind Kemi, but there weren't a lot of flags in the audience. I mean, they were towards the end. And we did start the whole thing with singing God Save the King, which I thought was quite patriotic. Isn't that normal of a Conservative conference? Is it? I think on the last day that's pretty normal, yes. I thought you might sing it at the end, not the beginning. I thought you might sing it at the end rather than before Kemi entered. But anyway, in her speech, she touched upon reform very lightly and they were the subject of one of her best jokes.

11:42Let's look at what's on offer out there for all those disappointed by Labour. Reform promising free beer tomorrow. Jeremy Corbyn promising free jam. LibDems promising free lentils. Whoever wrote the speech, to be fair, they were good jokes. Well, and they had been through their Oxford Guide to Great Quotations. Yes. And they found the George Bernard Shaw one about never wrestle with a pig because you only get dirty and the pig enjoys it. Indeed. So I thought a clever dismissal of reform there. But when we come to the substance of what was in the speech, there was some stuff that had already been trailed this week.

12:21So ECHR, things like that, the judges and all that sort of business. Mel Stride on saying that business rates in the high street were going to be abolished for shops and pubs. She also briefly mentioned that national insurance thing of saving five grand. But actually, I mean, she saved the best till last. She did. I liked the dramatic arch of it. She did. And there was, before she came to it, we must touch upon her saying that her new golden fiscal rule is that for every pound saved, at least half of it must go into paying off the deficit. Yes. So that's the I am fiscally credible line. Some will say, and Labour will say, that was then contradicted quite heavily by I will abolish stamp duty.

13:03Yes. But if she's accounted for the other 50 % of the pound going towards bringing down taxes, then that should be what she has actually accounted for. So we had Mel Stride having accounted for£47 billion worth of savings. Yes, things like welfare. And her saying we're going to fix the roof. That was another very good line. Let's have a listen to it. And we are the only party with a plan to get our economy back on track. It starts with fiscal responsibility. We have to get the deficit down. And we must also show how every tax cut or spending increase is paid for. So today I am introducing a new golden economic rule.

13:51Every pound we save will be put to work. At least half will go towards cutting the deficit because living within our means is our first priority. And with the rest, we will get Britain growing and bring down the taxes that are stifling our economy. That's the Conservative way. Responsibility today, opportunity tomorrow. Some people will say that's quite reminiscent of George Osborne. It's also not a million miles away from Rachel Reeves. No. It is the fiscal rules. Well, she said she's fiscally responsible, but she spent another 18 billion in the last six months. But Labour will now say, OK, so we spent money on poor people.

14:32You're abolishing stamp duty for the rich when they want to move from a five-bedroom house to a six-bedroom house. Well, that's obviously nonsense. Later on in this podcast, I spoke to a young man, a very tall young man, who that was, for him, the best policy he'd ever heard in his life because he absolutely associated it with helping him to get on the housing ladder. You know, you save for a deposit and then you lose thousands of it on stamp duty before you've even got the key to the door. And it's a tax that a lot of people haven't prepared for and are taken by surprise. But also the five-bed move to a six-bed move means that the five-bed house is then freed up for a middle-class family that's planning to have a family to move into.

15:09Exactly. And the problem even in my area is no one's moving. Yeah, the whole system's gunned up. Yes, exactly. So I honestly think there's an economic case for it. I can just see the Labour attack lines now, if Labour bothers to respond to it. The interesting question is, will it break through to the public? I think it will. Well, stamp duty will. I'm convinced that tomorrow people will be talking about that. Yes. In a way that they had nothing to say after the Lib Dem conference, very little to say about Labour, except for, oh, Labour likes flags. Oh, and Labour thinks that Farage is a racist.

15:44Right. So, you know, you've cancelled out the entire content of your speech if you make statements like that. Yes, yes. And I was sitting there thinking, this is great, they love it, it's brilliant, she's being applauded, she's getting standing ovations, this is undoubtedly the best speech that she's ever delivered, you said it's the best speech that we've heard at all conferences. Definitely. And yet, still in the back of mind, I'm like, is anyone listening? Does anyone care? Like, my husband messaged me in the middle of it and I said, I'm in Kemi's speech, and I'm like, why haven't you got it on the telly at home?

16:12Yes. I contacted one MP while it was going on to say, are you here? Would you like to meet up? And they replied, I'm abroad. Well, that's annoying. So how... I won't say who. That's so frustrating for her, isn't it? That she, from the sort of depths of despair, produces something really quite great. Yeah. And not enough people hear it. But maybe, as we've already discussed, are the best outcomes for Kemi Badenot right now the following? Cut through on stamp duty. Yes. Cut through on, she actually delivered a really good speech, and cut through on, do you know what? This conference hasn't been an unmitigated disaster.

16:47People have left going, hmm, the Conservatives. Maybe they're not dead and buried after all. That's a bloody result for them. And what the membership have been saying is it wasn't as bad as it could have been. Yes. Which I know that doesn't sound super, but when you're up against reform just sucking your MPs and your councillors away when all those defections are going on, a conference that people leave thinking, you know what, I am a Conservative, and she is a Conservative, and maybe I'll stick with the Conservatives at least through to the May local elections. Yeah, and then we'll see what happens.

17:19That's a win. It's going to make it much more difficult, I think, now for Big Beast to defect. You know, she's brought everybody under the tent. She's given them a warm Conservative cuddle. In policy terms, what honestly now does reform offer that the Tories are not offering? That's right. Because they're saying, leave the ECHR. Yes. They're saying secure our borders. Yes. They're saying bring welfare down, which is something that reform can't seem to bring itself to say. Yes. She's scrapping the Climate Change Act and she's scrapping net zero. Yeah. Yeah. She's saying restore educational standards.

17:54None of this Bridget Philipson-esque sort of, you know, command and control. We can't let Catherine Belbilsing be a good headteacher because we're so threatened by her success. Like at every turn, she is ticking boxes for anybody right of centre. The only thing that stands out about reform policy now is stuff that conservatives don't like. It's the nationalisation of steel or abolishing the two-child benefit cap. So I can't see any conservatives going over about that. Which does leave you thinking, if in a few months' time the reform poll lead dips, then is it anything but a poll lead? Is the story of reform that reform is ahead?

18:29And when reform isn't ahead, does reform lose some substance as a political project? Yes. So are we saying is the story of Tory success the story of reform failure? Yes. It's the point at which a bubble bursts. It's the point at which they come down a bit to, let's say, they are neck and neck with Labour. Then why not Conservatives? Yeah. Can I also say, thank God she has remembered that she is the opposition leader and therefore her job is to oppose the government. Should we hear a little bit of her laying into Keir Starmer? I mean, just for the thrill of it. This year, the Prime Minister was asked to name his best moment in office.

19:12Do you know what he said? Walking into Downing Street. For once, I agree with him. It's been downhill all the way since. Hearing that, let's not sweep under the carpet a year of criticism of Kemi. Why has it taken so long to come up with policies that you or I a year ago could have said, you need to say this, this and this. Because she's saying thoughtfulness over sloganeering. Yeah, but she's ended up in exactly the same position on policy that she could have been a year ago when she started. And therefore some people, who knows, maybe Jake Berry wouldn't have left. Maybe Danny Kruger wouldn't have left.

19:45But then if you're trying to preach sort of considered thinking versus car crash back of fag packet stuff, which they keep on going on about, they seem to be obsessed with the idea of Nigel Farage in a pub writing things on the back of his fag packet. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know. It's just so much beer. I mean, there was enough beer at the Midland Hotel last night. I don't know why they're shunning it. Again, she told another funny joke about that. These are savings that can be passed on to consumers. So, conference, I won't promise you free beer, but I do want you all to have cheaper beer. But I do come back to why did this take a year, but also, as you know, immediately after she was elected, her team thought we can't let Kemi be Kemi because we don't think people like her.

20:27So we have to soften her and keep her quiet and all that sort of stuff. That again was a mistake. What you saw on stage was Kemi. That was the Kemi we should have had for a year. But maybe Kemi needed 12 months to be herself. Maybe, and it is... Maybe you need to bed into that. Politicians are human beings. It takes time to get into a job and to get used to it and to do it well. It could just be that she had to grow. But I do wonder if some time has been lost, I don't see why we couldn't have had some of this stuff earlier on in the season. The calculation might be reform have peaked too early.

20:57You and I keep on having these discussions. What is it that the Tory party are fighting for? Are they fighting to be the party of opposition? Are they fighting to be a coalition partner with reform? They are, yeah. It's opposition. People in there are saying, you're saying that this speech has saved her from being toppled between now and the May elections. Yes. The background noise is because conference immediately, as soon as she leaves the stage, everybody, yeah everybody just starts packing away everyone runs the train station they've also turned off the central heating yeah it's freezing in here um can i borrow your jumper if i borrowed your jumper i'd look like a little elf at christmas so i really can't that's right yes but um i'm wearing red for anyone listening to this rather than watching it on youtube i'm wearing green and you're wearing green the point is i think is that am i getting ahead of myself yeah because i did ask a few people and we're going to listen to the vox pops in just a minute has she positioned herself as a potential future Prime Minister.

21:55I think that is still too early to say that is too much. So you did a panel beforehand, which was most entertaining, where you were talking to an Englishman, a Scotsman and a Welshwoman about the future of the Union, Mims Davies. And I was listening to Mims Davies, the leader of Welsh Tories. And she was talking about, we have to be the voice for Wales. We've got to stand up for Wales because the others, oh, they're ruining it, but we alone are fighting the fight. I googled it. They're on 11 % in Wales. I know. The Welsh hate the Tories. Tragically low. I know. Tragically low. But it was fighting talk.

22:27It was fighting talk, but it was kind of sad fighting talk because you know that she's not in that game. She's not in that fight. They're not relevant in Wales. No, or in Scotland, really. And all of this, right now, it's still a conversation internal to the Tories and internal to the centre-right. It's a battle between, do you want to go with reform or do you want to stick with the Tories? it's about winning that battle it's not yet about can we beat labour okay fair enough but it's convenient to her to say the very least to perhaps put a little two-fingered salute up to anyone who has complained that she's not good enough at speeches she's not good enough at pmqs you know who is she she can't cut through where are policies she's too thoughtful she can't come up with anything concrete yes she's literally just i'm afraid dropped a massive sort of big conservative policy bomb into that rhetoric and I think fair play to her.

23:16It was bold, it was brave, it showed courage which has been a little theme of this conference actually as we've all been reminiscing about Thatcher. What does it take to be a good politician? It takes some balls and that was another joke she told actually at the very beginning when she had criticised, well we heard a video and she had criticised the Prime Minister for not having the balls which of course went down well. That was one other thing. I did like it how she referred to all the other men in the race. She doesn't do identity politics, but it was a nice little reminder that there is a bird in the frame here.

23:46There is a woman doing her own thing in her own way. And I quite like the kind of femininity of all that. Coming up next, we've spoken to some Tory members as they filed out of the hall to see if they enjoyed it as much as we did.

24:12So we hot-footed it, didn't we, Tim, from our seats to the door to find out what people filing out of the conference made of Kemi Badenock's speech. Andrew Griffith, Shadow Business, what did you make of that speech? Look, scrapping stamp duty, that's what the Conservative Party is all about. It's a real values tax. Whose side are we on? We're on the side of people who aspire, want to buy their own home, maybe downsize. We're back as the party of opportunity. And I thought it was a great speech in terms of the honesty with which it was delivered and the fact that we're building from that base of fiscal responsibility.

24:43Conservative Party is back and this was a very Conservative speech. Also, I thought it was a personal speech. I mean, she seemed very relaxed. She looked as if she was enjoying it. I think she was enjoying it. I caught her eye lots of times. I think she was enjoying it a lot. It's what she believes. It's probably what many people in the Conservative Party wanted to say for quite a few number of years. It's the Conservative Party at its best being on the side of those who seek to aspire for themselves, stick to the rules, play by the rules, work hard and are looking for opportunities. Thank you very much.

25:12Safe journey home. Pleasure. Can I ask you, sir? Hello. How are you? Andre? Andre, what did you think of that speech? Well, I was at Margaret's. That is probably the first one. Yeah. That's a game changer. Is it? Why is it a game changer? Because you can see the atmosphere in the room suddenly lifted. Yeah. She said the right things. Yes. Getting rid of the tax on housing. Yeah. What did you think of that stamp duty amount? Absolutely fantastic. she's given us a bit of hope where all the other parties are all negative putting the country down she's she's thought about it took her a year she's kept telling us we're not going to make politics we can't keep no she's a serious proper politician she's very much like margaret thatcher and i'm so happy it's happening you're a young conservative i take it yeah what did you make of kemi's speech it was very good i think that's one of the biggest things we're facing is we're all none of us think we're going to get homes.

26:06So scrapping the stamp duty is just an amazing choice to, you know, get us enthused about the economy again. Do you think that's going to win some younger people over from reform? We know Farage is popular on social media. Is that the kind of red meat she needs to throw to the youth of Britain? I think a lot of the people who are reform are disenfranchised. They don't really believe in sort of traditional politics. So I'm not sure how far it will cut in, but I think it will definitely work with the people who are more engaged and more pragmatic. All right. Thank you very much for speaking to me.

26:37Thank you. You wanted to say something, sir. Your name? My name is Naveed Alam. I'm a local councillor in Leicestershire. What do you think? I thought that was a brilliant speech. We are clearly defining ourselves as a party. We are getting rid of a lot of the dead wood. And what I also think is that people need to have a thought experiment. What they need to ask themselves is if they give the reformists their country back, what would that look like? what would it look like for all those migrants, immigrants that have come to this country and just decided you know what, we don't want to work let you guys get on with it what do you think would happen to the NHS what would happen to the police, what would happen to education what would happen if all of a sudden decided we're not going to work anymore and we give it to them has she positioned herself as a future Prime Minister there?

27:21I absolutely think she has for the future of our country because what she's done today is she's defined herself she's explained that she's got policy she's got policy on tax stamp duty is a massive thing that youngsters nowadays are grappling with and the big thing, not just youngsters at the end of the day and the big thing the big thing that I like from today and it's a different idea is that she's getting rid of the business rate tax, that's killing our high streets My name's Darren Maltby Hi, nice to meet you Darren, can you give me your reaction to that speech, if you marked it out of ten what would you give it?

27:54To me it gives me memories back of Margaret Thatcher So it was a very momentous speech. Yeah, it put ears on the back of my head. It was brilliant, absolutely. Brilliant. All right, thank you very much, Darren. You're welcome. We are scrapping the stamp duty completely. Yes. We are removing the taxes from the farmers, removing the taxes on small businesses, and removing the VAT on education. Yes. Kermit's-led party, the Conservative Party, is bringing Britain back to a stronger economy. All we've had in this Labour government is inflation up, unemployment up, and growth down. The Conservatives is reversing all that.

28:29That is the Conservative values. That is what Margaret Thatcher left us with, and we are continuing with her. Thank you. All right, so you're happy with her? We are happy with her party leader, and we are standing up with her to regain Britain back from this insensible, directionless, KST-man-led Labour government. I love how energetic you are. Thank you very much. Thank you. Excuse me, chaps. Could I just ask you what you made of the speech? What's your name, sir? Jim Holt. Jim Holt? And where are you from, Jim? Oh, very nice. What did you make of that speech, Jim?

29:03Really? Were you quite emotional in there? I mean, you look emotional, Jim. Why are you emotional? Is this what you've been wanting to hear for a long, long time? I mean, she came across there, Jim, as a true Conservative. She was quite saturated in what she was saying. Are you feeling more hopeful about your party for the future? Yeah. Good.

29:31Tim, we can go home and sleep in our own beds. Oh, thank heavens. A month of being on broken-down trains and in piping hot hotel rooms. I know. Having said that, don't forget, there is another conference. Oh, there is one more, which I'm sort of looking forward to. I know. Your party, our party, whatever the party's called. Yes, Corbyn and Sultana. You, me, Corbyn and Sultana. Yeah. What a night out that would be. That's going to be fun, yeah. And we don't really know when it is because they don't seem to know when it is, but it's sometime in November. It's in November and it's in Liverpool. Is it one day?

30:04Does it require an overnight or could we maybe get away with going in and out? I don't think you can get back and forth from Liverpool. I could drive us in my Mini Cooper. That would be fun. We could record on the road, couldn't we? We could become those people. We could get one of those hippie vans like we were going to San Francisco, but we were going to see your party. Can we get a Volkswagen van and bunk up in it? Because then it would be truly sort of... It would be in the spirit of their slight hippies. Confirm a lot of rumours around the office as well. On that bombshell. We'll be back tomorrow at 5pm.

30:49Thank you.