Harry and Meghan bombshell: Sussexes plan move back to UK

0:03The Telegraph. They're coming home. Six years after Mexit, Harry and Meghan, along with their children Archie and Lilibet, are moving back to the UK. But why now? Our Deputy Royal Editor Victoria Ward joins us with all the exclusive details. Welcome to The Daily Tea with me, Tim Stanley. And me, Camilla Tominey.

0:37Victoria Ward. What a scoop. Honestly, what on earth has happened? It's the biggest royal story for years, isn't it? Harry and Meghan are returning to the UK later this month and their children are going to be enrolling in a British school in September. I mean, my head's about to explode. If I was Oprah Winfrey right now, I'd go like this. Wow. Yeah, yeah. This is pretty nuts. It's pretty shocking. How long has this been in the offing? Well, I think it's been in the offing for a little while, actually, a few months at least, because certainly at the beginning of this year, Harry was talking about wanting to come back for months at a time.

1:18Certainly. Things have evolved to the point where they're now putting the children to school. So this is long term. Well, the long term prospect is unknown. It's in the air. They're not saying it's permanent at this stage. They're keeping their house in Montecito. Yes. They're keeping their house in Portugal. They have a house in Portugal? They've got a house in Portugal. It's on the edge of like a five-star golf resort or something, isn't it? Yes, exactly. It's where Eugenie and Jack Brooksbank live. Right. Finding Fergie alert. Luxury, yes. Luxury golf resort kind of place that Jack Brooksbank works for.

1:52So he's obviously got them in there. So they kind of neighbours, those two royal couples now. Okay, but back to Blighty. Back to Blighty. Right, sorry, just talk us through this because, forgive me, I don't know anyone else remembers that this is the couple who wanted to find their freedom in America. They were seeking at the time in 2020, I remember the words, financial independence. Yes. They wanted a half-in, half-out role. Yes. The Royal Family said no. They then gave a succession of interviews, including to Winfrey, and then they did a docu-series on Netflix. All of which felt like a burning of a bridge.

2:27It did. Because they accused members of the royal family of racism. Well, this was about the evil UK tabloid press pushing Meghan particularly to the brink of suicide. This was about this green and pleasant land being so unconsciously biased that the people here much preferred William and Kate, who, by the way, are white. This was a rejection, I thought, of everything the UK stands for. We want to go out to the land of milk and honey to America, where we will be welcomed with open arms. We will be accepted. We will not be made to feel like outsiders. All that aside, one reason why it really surprises me is because Harry's last visit to the UK was to lose a case against the British press.

3:14And there was much debate at the time about where he would stay and a somewhat acrimonious argument with Buckingham Palace about whether or not he could stay there. Meghan chose not to come. The same fundamental issue of his security seemed to come before everything else. And I didn't think we had resolved that. He has said all along, it's the threat to me and my family that prevents me from coming back to the UK. So to suddenly come back, what can we speculate has changed? Well, yeah, he said for years now that it's too dangerous to bring Meghan and the kids back to the UK, hasn't he? He said in no uncertain terms, he cannot do it.

3:52He wouldn't risk it. it's unsafe so he's come back sporadically on his own but refused to bring his wife and children for that very reason he wants this police protection taxpayer funded police protection because they're armed they're plugged into the wider intelligence networks and that's what makes him feel safe so something's changed but we don't know exactly on security what that is because they haven't they're not yet telling us i'm sure at some point it's going to become apparent but for now we don't know something must have changed because they're moved they're moving back the kids are going to school they're coming you know it's this is a long time okay so where are they moving do we know where the kids might go to school do we know what the king and queen think of this do we know what william and kate think of it we don't know what the king we know the king and queen know but we don't know what they think of it yet we may find out um the they're going to be living in a private residence not a royal residence they've made that clear uh we don't know where i think it's likely to be outside london there was some suggestion that they were They're nosing around in the Cotswolds-y kind of area when they came back in July.

4:53We know that they rented a house in the Cotswolds before they got married, which they had to abandon because paparazzi shots were being taken from above. Yes. And we know Megan loves the Soho farmhouse, and there's lots of celebrity friends around there. So that's a likely scenario, but we don't know. And kids into school. I mean, kids into school. This isn't some extended holiday. It's not some fly-by-night thing, is it? I mean, children in school. where better to educate two blood-born royals than in Britain right well where better to educate anyone anyone I mean it's better than the Californian schools which are all you're graded on how you feel about how you did well that might seem Megan but no matter um so sorry I'm still just I'm still just part of it is deeply shocking this is is this a humiliation Are they coming back with their tails between their legs?

5:46Are they coming back and are they admitting that the American dream didn't quite work out? I think they are. I mean, this is biblical. It's the return of the prodigal prince and princess, isn't it? It is, we wanted to crack America. That's not gone as well as we had hoped. Well, Harry never really enjoyed it, right? Harry wasn't really into the making entertainment programs. When Meghan made the at home with Meghan stuff, he would show up at the end, wouldn't he? He'd pop in, wouldn't he, and say hello. Yes. Yeah, the big charity have had a big falling out with their charity. Well, he's had a falling out with Centre Barley.

6:18They're still doing the as-ever endeavour, which is her making jam. And she's going to continue doing that, by the way, in the UK. They've said that will plough on, that business is thriving, and that's going to continue. But she kind of wanted to be the next Marcus Stewart. Now she more closely resembles Rod Stewart, who left LA for the UK quite recently. She's considerably younger and better looking. I know, but I'm just making a point about, in the end, they all come back to blighting. She's been sailing. I mean, it's funny, isn't it? It's like a reverse exodus. I mean, most people are leaving the country right now under Labour.

6:46I suppose it's preferable to come back under Andy Burnham than it is to stay under Donald Trump. Yes, and we know that they're no fans of Donald Trump, don't we? Both Harry and Meghan are no fans of him at all, and they've made that quite clear. But it's still, how do they think they're going to be received? I mean, to be a fly on the wall in the Wales residence night. Now, frankly, to be a fly on the wall at the Middleton residence with Carol with an E and Michael, former air hostess. like the cabin is depressurizing. The oxygen masks are coming down. Like, my God. Okay, so just put that aside.

7:20How are they going to be greeted by the British public? You look at the popularity ratings that YouGov put out every month. I mean, they're marginally more popular than the former Duke of York. I agree. And that is true. So it's going to be very interesting. But I think there's a slight juxtaposition here because when you're out on jobs with Harry, which I've done a lot in the UK and I went to Australia with them and whatnot and on the ground they're really genuinely quite well received it's all cheering crowds when Harry came back on his own last September that week was a huge success everywhere he went he was flitting about all over the place Nottingham, London it went really well he was high as a kite, everybody loved him and I think that's really key here that's what he's always wanted to do he's always wanted to do That's all he wants to do is what he was raised to do.

8:10Yes. Charity work. So does this mean that it's Megan who's taking one for the team? Well, that's what it looks like, doesn't it? She is, isn't she? Because she's the one who, she's leaving. Her mother is in California. Yeah. Her friends, her entire kind of. The Hollywood chic comfort zone. Her Montecito minimalism. All of it, she's giving it all up. I mean, this is the interesting aspect of all this. Those people that sat in Windsor that day and said, I'll give it a year. not quite I mean she is standing by her man here she's also standing by her children I re visited Oprah and the interview in preparation for speaking to you just to be reminded of what they came out with and of course she made this huge point about whether or not the as yet unborn Archie would be given a title and we know that they fought tooth and nail to get those children titles not that it was ever in doubt that they were going to get them I think there was a debate over what they would be called.

9:06They, in turn, have not lost their titles. They have been accused of cashing in on their royal status, and we all know that they need to have those titles, even though they don't have full freedom to use them. But for the children now, as any respectable, proud, sharp-elbowed parent might, they need to position these children correctly. They need to raise them and educate them correctly. But these children are significant members of the royal family and they'll have more status in the UK than they have in America. That's for sure. So you can theorize it that way, that actually she's not only being a supportive wife, but, you know, the mama instincts have come back in.

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10:30Also, from Harry's perspective, because he views her so favourably and he loves her so much and he's so devoted to her, he'll probably be imagining that she might return as some kind of homecoming queen. He does think that. He does think that. So he does genuinely think that. So all he's got to go on is his experience in recent years. And when he's come back, he's got this experience in Australia and the little tours that they've done, which always go pretty well on the ground. And then when he comes back to the UK on his own, he says, he has said to me, and he says that people are always asking him about Meghan.

11:05Where is she? You know, how's your wife? He thinks that the public actually will probably welcome her. But the people who turn up to them will welcome them because the people who turn out for them want to see them. That's true. The house in Montecito, a house in Portugal, now a house in England, and the public school fees. I presume they're not going to the local comp. I doubt it. And we have discussed... Should take them. And we have discussed on this programme with you and Hannah Furness the question of the bill for the libel trial that he lost. Are we any idea where the money is coming from for all of this?

11:41It's an interesting question, isn't it, Tim? I genuinely don't know. I think I know. Go on, you tell me. Well, call me a cynic. Now that this couple are coming back, I'm wondering whether I need to lobby the Home Office for taxpayer-funded security from Meghan. Sorry to be a little bit suspicious of this, but don't you think they might make quite a lot of money from Harry and Meghan, colon, the return? Right. Yes, of course. That is, well, who knows? But what we do know, which we haven't mentioned actually, is that he's not coming back as a working royal. So he's not going to be... No, of course he isn't.

12:20So he can't... But it's quite key because that means he's not going to get the perks that come with it. No, but he's going to have... Automatic protection, the residence, the money. He's going to have financial freedom. Right. One covers the royals for a long time and you think you can't be surprised by things. And then I'm thinking, I am surprised, but am I not surprised? Because when you actually kind of do the 3D chess and war game it, as the couple will have, ad infinitum, because everything they do is meticulously planned out, you come to the conclusion that if they keep one foot in LA and they have one foot in the Cotswolds and yeah why not some lovely private holidays in Portugal and they aren't in the royal family but they're able to make money cashing in on their royal status forgive me but haven't they got the in half in half out royal brand of monarchy that they individually sought back in 2020 and couldn't have.

13:15Yes, absolutely they have. And they know that. They've admitted that themselves. They know that they say that we've proved it. We've made it work. Do you think it's a win? Because you did say it was a humiliation. Now you're saying it's a humiliation if they come back and people are throwing eggs and things. But, you know, the British are very polite and probably won't do that. No, the point is, is that they've got what they wanted. And therefore, I'm then thinking, was this the plan all along? I know you think that they are sly people like the Ferdinand and Imelda Marcos of British royalty. But it is possible that he's worried also about his father.

13:50Yes. Because the context of this conversation is the video that's been put out by him talking about him surviving cancer. The Queen saying, I wish we could have talked about it. Harry must just be thinking, I need to be closer to my father at this moment. I totally agree. And don't forget, he has said himself in recent interviews, relatively recent, that he doesn't know how long his father has left. Time is precious. He would love to spend more time with his father. It's obviously all in his head. It must be a key part of this decision, surely. But why now, Vicky? Because of the children's age.

14:23Sorry, Vicky, sorry to interrupt. But I just think it's all because the kids are old enough they want to enter school. How old are the children? Five and seven. Yeah, so it's kind of like at the sharp end of starting proper education. Prep, they'll be into prep school just in those earliest years, yes. But don't forget when they moved away, the king's cancer was not known about. He didn't have cancer at the time. So this is a big shift. Well, the queen and Prince Philip were both alive. I mean, the monarchy looks completely different now. Yeah. Andrew wasn't disgraced. He was a bit. He was a bit.

14:54He was a little bit less disgraced. Yeah, fine. Than he is now. Isn't this what we all wanted all along? Do you mean we, the media? The nation. Were we crying out all along for the prodigal son to come back? Weren't we criticising Harry and Meghan for going away? And now they're willing to come back, and I'm sure a reconciliation might follow. Isn't that just a good thing and what we all said we all wanted from the beginning? I mean, I can only view it from a copy perspective. Right. It makes life more interesting for journalists like Vicky and I and Hannah. And again, presumably that's the point.

15:35At the end of the day, if your financial existence depends on you telling stories about your royal connections past and present, then inevitably, once you've rinsed that for all you can in America, you may need to come back to Britain to have more stories to tell. And I can't criticise people for wanting stories to tell because we're the ones who write them up. but you could say you know there is a constant need to monetize and they have to be chameleons to a certain extent because we're living in this kind of digital age of everyone being chewed up and spat out and what's next what's next what's next i mean we're all guilty of that we're reporters for heaven's sake so that it could be a reaction to that vicky i genuinely don't know i do think tim's point about um whether there'll be you know this is actually what we've wanted all along is it could have been more easily accepted if they hadn't done the oprah interviews in a book in the interim yes but that is a big problem yes and we've got to remember that the prince and princess of wales are the most popular members of the royal family everybody loves them never put a foot wrong and they are the ones that feel deeply deeply betrayed and hurt by all of these allegations that have come out so i think it depends whether the public is prepared to let that go well some Some of the public will say, God, the brass neck on these two.

16:59And others will say, well, live and let live. I mean, it was ever the case. It's not just this couple. It's the Beckhams. Some people love them. Some people loathe them. Yeah. Yeah. But it's one of those things where you think we could have saved the last six years. We probably didn't have to go through what we went through. Don't mind the column inches. No, no. From the media's point of view, it was fantastic. We enjoyed every minute of it. But this is the irony. because at the end of the day how are they going to escape the treacherous evil demented media which drove them away if they had to go in 2020 why can they come back in 26 and megan did say in an interview um a couple of years ago that she could never do the school run in the uk because it would turn into a media frenzy although william and kate approved that not to be the case that was never going to be the case of course they could always have done the school run in the uk i mean the weird thing is actually from a privacy perspective the children give them a great deal of cover because gone are the days of the 1980s and 90s where paparazzo could like appear at the school gates or appear at fort park or on their family holidays you know royal children now they're totally off limits you get a few rogue european publications and of course an internet that publishes with impunity running photographs you wouldn't get the picture desk using unsolicited images of archie and lily but any more than you would george charlotte or louis their problem of course are going to be punters as is ever the case but they've got that in america this is going to be interesting because we've never seen archie nillibet's faces have we and this is another key thing which i think they will have to address i think there's a recognition there from them that they need to that i think they'll want to control that and i think rather than a pap shot of them snatched on a british street in all over social media and it's they've lost it then haven't they so i wouldn't be surprised if they somehow try and control that unveiling because they only need to do it once and then the issue's gone in some way soon after they come back to avoid so they can do it in their own way present them however they want to present them and then it's done and that issue is gone and then and then that also takes the commercialization the monetization of those images out of it a little bit the heat out of it doesn't it yeah i mean it's a cape model just share some images from your own family album and they'll always be better than anything taken with a long lens yeah speaking of money do we have any idea what he might do in this country Well, no, but I think he'll largely, what's he been doing in America?

19:17Apart from fighting endless legal battles, he's largely still focused on his charities. So we've got the Invictus Games in Birmingham coming up next July, which is going to be a huge thing for him. And I think a lot of his time is going to be focused on that. I mean, his ideal scenario is for the king to officially open that event by his side. That's the dream moment of reconciliation, isn't it? the two of them side by side at Invictus because the royal family all supported the launch of Invictus in London in 2014. Yes. So they were all there. So I think Harry will definitely, that's going to be a big thing.

19:51He'll spend more time with all of his British charities. But beyond that, in terms of how he spends his days, I don't know, I mean... Well, he's lucky because the government is working on getting long-term unemployed people into work. That's right. We'll actually give a small grant to employers who take on people who have been out of work for a long time. I mean, he doesn't have any military experience. Here's a man who served two tours of duty in Afghanistan, knows his military onions, could go parachute him in, pardon the expression. As always, my sympathy is with Meghan Markle because she has a very difficult set of family relationships.

20:27Her father recently showed up in the Philippines very, very unwell. So our sympathy also extends to Thomas Markle. I know we always do say, what does she actually do? She just does these Netflix videos. But she is an actress. She can't just now go and do a show at the Old Vic, right? Because every individual member of the audience would have to be screened to make sure they're not going to attack her. She can make loads of money on YouTube and things. Right, but she is now relocating to the UK, a country that she felt she had to flee because of the press. She is making a significant sacrifice here.

21:01And in the same way that there are rumours that Harry felt useless and a bit lonely in America, I'm worried she might feel useless and a bit lonely here in the United Kingdom. Yes, they must have a plan, mustn't they? They must have a plan. But you hit on something there, I think, Tim, because I had been hearing since he had moved there, I mean, you said it earlier, I don't know if he was entirely happy. It's funny, isn't it? Because he had always declared that he would like to have a life just living in a remote part of Africa. Yes. And actually, despite his criticisms of the media, he's never really and apart from the britain is unconsciously biased stuff that they subsequently moved away from pretty rapidly um he's never really been down on britain he loves britain he served for his grandmother queen and country um i wonder if some of this is to do with the fact that he was very homesick and i wonder if she's made the calculation that this guy who is clearly a very devoted and loving husband and a devoted and loving father might just be happier in the UK and happy daddy makes a happy family and a happy marriage.

22:05Yeah, very possibly. And it might have taken for him to relocate thousands of miles away to actually recognise and to be able to accept in himself that actually his heart is in the UK and that's really where he wants to be. Did we ever find out what happened to the dog bowl? I mean, my point being, I can't imagine William is going to be waiting at the door of his own Windsor property, his tail wagging, saying, welcome home, brother. There are issues here to resolve, aren't there, Vicky? I mean, significant issues. And how happy would you be about this if you were the Waleses? I imagine there's a large degree of trepidation in their household, of course.

22:47But equally, is it more likely now to be resolved now they're back in the UK or resolved on a certain level, even if they're never going to be close like they were. Harry and William may never be as close as they once were, but it's more likely that they're going to resolve some issues and get to a point where they're at least on speaking terms if he's on this side of the Atlantic. I know, but there would have to be a moratorium on sharing any content from any family WhatsApp groups. Yes, absolutely. I mean, they would have to be really... Part of the Wales' issue is they're worried about the couple breaching confidences.

23:21Of course. And they would be, wouldn't they, after Spare? Absolutely. As has often been said, including recently by Paul Dacre over at the Mail, we wouldn't have found a laundry big enough to air his dirty linen than Spare provided. Maybe these conversations have already taken place. What's the timescale on this, Vicky? So they're moving back this month. So, I mean, what is it? What's the date? We've got a couple of weeks left of August. August the 90th. So in the next two weeks, they're going to land back at Heathrow. and they've got this private residence has obviously all been sorted. I don't think they've bought anything yet but they're probably renting.

23:58The children are starting school in September. That's what, the new term's three weeks down the track? Yeah, they'll have to have chosen a school, right? First of all done, yeah. They've done it all. They've wrecked due to start. They'll have got their uniforms. Well, this would give them, I mean, this is the thing, right? They've managed to wrecky schools, presumably accommodation, you've got to be moving somewhere and all this completely under the gaze of the watching media and therefore their fears about constantly being at the centre of a media frenzy may be unfounded. This is fascinating because there is a bungalow at the end of my road, which had been on the market for a very long time because it's got damp issues, but it has suddenly taken off.

24:36And actually, your area of Kent, the Garden of England, does have some really good schools. It does, and they'd be very welcome. I wouldn't chase them away. Yeah, we know what you're like. You love me. She can volunteer with the local Lambdram. She could give you some jam. He can volunteer at the local farm. You could give her a cup of tea from the teapot. Yeah. Maybe this is all part of their decision-making. Maybe this is it. They knew where you were. Vicky, is there more to come with this story? Yes, there is. There is definitely more to come. In the next week or two, we will definitely have more.

25:06Vicky Ward, honestly, you've knocked our socks off with your journalistic triumph today. Well done to you. Well done to everyone at The Telegraph who's worked on this story. Yeah. Well done us for getting this daily tea out. I'm sorry it was late, but don't you agree? Worth waiting for. Very much worth waiting for. We'll be back. In fact, you'll be back with Poppy tomorrow. I will be. Because I've got GCSE results today. Good luck. Oh, my goodness. Harry and Meghan, bring your kids to Britain. You don't know what you're in for. You'll be back tomorrow, 5pm.

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