Sheila Johnson

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0:33Sheila Johnson is one of the nation's most successful black female entrepreneurs. She helped to start black entertainment television. Now she's an owner of a major hospitality company, Salamander, and is also an owner of three major league sports teams. She's also an accomplished musician. I had a chance to sit down with her recently to talk about her extraordinary career. So right now, if I understand it correctly, you have been a large developer of a company called BET, which we'll talk about shortly. And that was very successful. You now are an author with this book. It's a best-selling book.

1:09You also are a philanthropist. You've made a large gift to many places, but in Washington, D.C., in the mall. We'll talk about that in a moment. You also are an accomplished musician, a violinist. and you've started symphonies in this city and in Jordan and you now are in the hospitality business. So what do you do on the seventh day? Do you rest or...? Well, more than anything, I have to tell you, I am in the third act of my life and this has been the happiest I've ever been. Really? You know. Okay, so... And so on the seventh day, I just don't even rest. You are also an owner, I should have pointed out, of three major sports teams.

1:54That's right. Right? And you're the first woman, as I understand it, the first woman to own three major, have a stake in three major sports teams. Is that right? Yes, and we'll say African-American. You were approached by the owner then of the, I guess, the Washington Wizards and the Washington Caps about maybe buying the Washington Mystics, which the female, the women's basketball team. And what did you say? Well, first of all, it was Abe Polin. He did come to me and Susan O'Malley and they said, Abe Polin says, look, I want you to be the face of the Washington Mystics. And I said, what do you mean be the face of?

2:38He says, I want you to buy this team. His health was failing. And I have to tell you, and a lot of women can understand this. We never get these opportunities. So that was the first thing that struck me, and I was flattered. I was really flattered. I said, well, Abe, what are the financials on this? And he handed them to me. He says, well, they're not making money. But I was still intrigued about team ownership. So then I called my lawyer, Sandy Aime, and I said, Sandy I've just been offered a basketball team he goes you don't want to buy a basketball team and I said but Sandy if you were offered this team what would you do and he was quiet and I said you just answered my question and so I said I'll be at your office and I said I want you to get Ted Leosis on the phone and we talked to him and I told Ted I asked Ted I said I've just been offered the Washington Mystics and I know that you want to buy the Wizards and you already own the caps.

3:47And I said, look, I can make you an offer. I said, I would like to buy into Lincoln Holdings, which was what it was then. And I said, I'd like to be the first woman and the first African-American. I said, I do not think there's any other franchise in the country that can boast that opportunity. And he says, well, let me go to the other partners and let's see what happens. And that's what happened. And so I got it, and I bought into it. I paid the money. So what happened was you were offered a money-losing women's basketball team, and you said, I don't want to just be the face of a money-losing basketball team.

4:23I want to be in the other sports as well. Is that right? Well, yeah, you know, you've got to be smart about this. Okay. You've got to be smart. You know, there's three teams that can share losses and profits. So now you're an owner of the Washington Caps, the Washington Wizards, the Washington Mystics. Right. Any more sports teams? Well, let's see. Okay. No, I don't know. Where you are now in life is a place many people would like to be. Did you start out with a wealthy father and mother? They weren't wealthy. They were middle class. Middle class. So you might describe what happened in your family growing up.

4:59As you begin your book with a relatively sad, I would say, situation, you might describe what happened in that situation. Yeah, it's a case. And now we're going to go all the way back to the 50s, early 60s. And this is a time when women had very little leverage and control over their own lives. My father was one of eight African-American neurosurgeons in the country. And that put us in a social status up here. He then decided one night he was just leaving and he just left us cold. And so my mother suddenly went from here to here in society, in the eyes of society. Her friends left her. It was going on.

5:48She literally had a nervous breakdown. And I was coming in. I was working at JCPenney. And I came in. And we found her on the floor in the kitchen in convulsions. And that was a time at 16 years old that I suddenly had to grow up. I had to take care of that family. You were interested in music. Right. And you were an accomplished violinist. What had happened, despite all my father's issues, he was a great pianist. Okay, I don't know where it came from, but he could sit down and play anything. And there was always music in our household. My mother even played the piano. And when we moved to Maywood, Illinois, District 89 said that it was mandatory that we pick up a music instrument, and that's when I picked up the violin, and I just fell in love with this instrument.

6:41That instrument was the foundation of my life. It was my sanctuary, and I became really good at it. So you graduated from high school, and you went to college where? University of Illinois in Champaign. And were you playing music on the side? No. I was in a very middle-class community. community. I didn't know about SAT preps. I didn't know about a lot of things in preparation for colleges that the upper class white people had. So the problem was, is I went and they said, you got to go take an SAT test. And I'm like, what's an SAT test? I went one Saturday and took it. I had the lowest SAT scores you can imagine.

7:26And when I told my music teacher at high school, I said, I don't understand these scores. She says, oh, my God, these are really bad. And she said, but don't you worry. She says, I want you to go down and audition at the University of Illinois in Champaign, which I did. And I played in front of Paul Rowland, who was also instrumental in bringing Suzuki along with John Kendall into the country. And he says, I'm taking you into this university. I got full scholarship, but it was because of my musical skills that I got in there. All right. So you went there and you majored in violin, more or less?

8:05I majored in music, in performance and music education. Okay. And so you were doing well there and you expected to be a professional musician? I was, yes. And I played in the Chicago Civic Symphony and under John Martinon in the Chicago Symphony. and then from there moved to the East Coast. And that's where I settled in this area and started teaching at Sidwell Friends and put together one of the most magnificent middle school orchestras. That orchestra grew. I left Sidwell in 72, took that orchestra, and bought a house on Brandywine Street where that orchestra grew to 110 students. And that orchestra was so good, we played at the old post office pavilion, which was the Trump Hotel, now the Waldorf.

9:02And Queen Nor, that whole delegation, came in and heard that orchestra. And they went, oh my God. We were invited to Amman, Jordan to play at the largest cultural festival in the Middle East called Drash. And from that point on, We got invited back six or seven times to perform over there. And I received the highest honor and education from King Hussein. Okay. So you still play the violin? I still have my violin. I picked up the cello during COVID. Did Yo-Yo Ma give you lessons or no? I wish he would. One of the reasons that you became financially successful was a company you helped to build. Yes.

9:45Called Black Entertainment Television. That's right. When did you start that company? We started, I can tell you, we went on the air January 25th, 1979. Before that was just getting everything in place. I ended up having to sell my violin, my precious violin, that my parents mortgaged the house for to pay the rent on the offices. And it was the old American Trial Lawyers building, which is now a hotel in Georgetown. but it was just these sacrifices that you have to make in life. So you started this with somebody you met when you were in college? Yeah.

10:30So what was the concept behind black entertainment television? What were you trying to do? Why was there a need for BET? BET. What you have to understand, BET was born during the birth of all cable. You know, that was CNN, Bloomberg, you name them. Everybody started these cable networks. But what they weren't addressing was the voice of the African American community. and so when Bob was working with the National Cable Television Association he had to take a senior citizen up to the hill to try to get government approval and some money to start a senior citizen channel they turned him down he threw the proposal in the trash he pulled it Bob pulled it out we brought it home he says you need to look at this I'm crossing out senior I write in black, you know.

11:27And I said, you know, and we made some tweaks. And I said, but how are we going to get money for this? And then we realized there's John Malone in Denver, who owned all the cable stations across the country, took it to him. He says, this is the best idea since sliced bread. He immediately wrote a check for$500 ,000 to get us started. But you know, in the television business, it goes like that. It was like that in every business, but okay. I know. But anyway, he really was our guardian angel all the way up to the sale of Viacom. We had to pay him back. We paid him back every penny that he invested into BET.

12:11BET, you and your then husband ran it for roughly 20 years, was it? And then you decided to sell it to Viacom for a very nice price at the time. Well, I didn't know it was going to go for that. I just remember being in Times Square and I saw the ticker tape thing going around and said BET was sold for$3 billion. And I'm like, oh, this is perfect. Let me call my lawyer so that I can. So you sold it. You split up the proceeds. Yes. And later you decided that you would try to spend some time in a place called Middleburg where you had bought a house. Middleburg was not the most welcoming place for African Americans, was it?

12:52No, not at all. Where did the idea come from to build a resort hotel there? Well, read the book, but anyway, it was a town that I fell in love with. First of all, I had to buy a gun shop that had a Confederate flag in the window. I wanted to get rid of that, That's how I bought the building. Right, Sandy? There were some tweaks I had to make there to make it livable. And I built a performing arts center for the Hill School because there were just some things that needed, you know, you got to build a foundation there. And so then a broker came to me and said, look, Pamela Harriman has passed away, as you know, and this was the last of the estate.

13:43So there's 340 acres there, and they said, would you be interested? I knew the town was financially bankrupt. And I said, I knew if I could do something as a businesswoman, I needed to put an economic engine in that place and an anchor. So when I went up on the land, I knew immediately what I needed to do, and that was to build that. I was very naive about it. I remember having a vision of what I wanted to do, but I also had a party up there to introduce my idea and my vision. The next morning, I was on my way to Dulles Airport, and there were signs on both sides of the roads that said, Don't be E.T.

14:30Middleburg. And I called my lawyer, who's sitting here, and I said, You know what? We've got a problem. and that went on for the next 10 years. It was the fight of my life. And I will tell you, with everything that I went through, it was all in the newspapers, everything, but when the final vote went down, I won by one vote. One vote was the right to build the hotel you wanted. That's right. Okay, so you started building it, but then what happened? The recession hit. I got a call from the bank, and they said, you better mothball this for a while, and we'll give you the green light when to start it again.

15:11But the other thing I want you all to know, as a woman, even with all of my money that I had at the time, I could not get a bank loan to build it. I had to use my own money to build that resort, because I had, I don't know, I was a woman, and I just could not get the bank loan. So ultimately, though, you went ahead, the recession kind of went away, and you decided to build it with your own money. Yeah, and then the bank called and said, you can proceed now. But I still had to use all my own money to finish that off. So you built it. How many rooms was it initially? Was it up? Well, we started with 68, and then it grew, and it grew, and it grew.

15:57So now it was a 168, and that's where the town put the plug on me, that that's what I do. However, I was able to get out of that to build 49 homes, which are going up now. And I was able to also broker a deal where the town hall, I was able to lease a piece of the property to the town. They have a town hall, and I have got the police department on my property. So now, you decided to build this hotel in Middleburg, and why did you call it Salamander? Oh, this is a great story. So when I moved to that area, and I decided to buy the farm where I'm living now, there was a guy by the name of Bill Ildesacker who owned the property.

16:44I kind of knew the name because his brother was teaching at Princeton or something like that, but he had never really lived at the farm. And he had a name for the farm called Cotswold or something like that, which I did not want. And so I said, who had the farm before? And they said it was Bruce Sunland. I contacted Bruce Sunland and asked him what was the name of his farm before, and he said it was Salamander. And I said, well, where did that name come from? Bruce Sunland was a fighter pilot that was shot down over Nazi-occupied Belgium. His entire unit was captured. He was able to get out. He crossed Europe and ended up in allied territory of France.

17:34He fought briefly for the French resistance. The U.S. then came to him and said, look, we have got to go in and we have to rescue the rest of your unit out of the POW camp. This is a true story, the story of Hogan's heroes. That is Bruce Sutherland. That was where the TV show came from. And he says, well, what does salamander mean? And they said, mythically, it's the only animal that could walk through fire and still come out alive, which I loved. But, you know, realistically, if you cut off its limbs, they regenerate. And it just hit, at that time, a nerve with me. And I said, I need that brand, and I'm going to brand the salamander.

18:20So Salamander, your original idea was to build a luxury resort there. But why did you decide to build more hotels or buy other ones? Was that your original idea or just to build one or more? No, it's just that after the success of building the resort in Middleburg, and it just took off. You know, they said if you build it, they'll come. And then after I hired the most exceptional team I could have put together, and they're still with me. and we were so successful with the resort out there, we decided to expand. In business, they say you can have better, cheaper, or faster, but you only get to pick two.

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20:29And when Kwame Amawatchee lost his restaurant at the Intercontinental down at the wharf, and it was written about in the Washington Post, I called him immediately, and I said, I want you to come to Salamander. We have been together ever since, and we decided to put this family reunion together to bring chefs of color, both men and women, and sommeliers from all across the country. We have 41 chefs to come. And to really discuss the issues that are going on in this country, we've got to address these issues. And as you know, I put 50 kids through the Kennedy School at Harvard, and these are young people from underserved communities that I paid for their whole education and they are now so successful.

21:17But this is something that we have to do. Okay, let's talk about another sport that you have been involved with. Yes. Your daughter, as you mentioned, was a champion equestrian, which is a very inexpensive sport, right? If anyone wants to buy some horses, I've got a few there. One time your daughter says to you, why don't you get on a horse and ride? What happened then? Well, we were out riding one day, and then she was saying, Mom, you've got to learn to jump over the logs and everything. So we went back into the indoor arena, and she was showing me how to do it. And I don't know whether the horse got stung by a bee or what happened, but I got bucked off.

22:01And she kept yelling, let go of the reins, which I didn't do. and the horse stepped on this side of my body and I could hear crunch. All of my ribs on front and back are broken. And I was in the hospital for a couple of weeks, missed my heart by about an inch. So have you been back on a horse since then? Never. I would never do it. I just laid there on the ground and the horse kept nudging me and I just said, God, if you just let me live, I will never get back on another horse again. Well, but you have been helping horses in one sense. There's a stable on the National Mall that is the stable that the park, I guess park rangers use.

22:47The U.S. Park Police. U.S. Park Police use for the horses that they have up and down the mall. So who came to you and said, guess what, we need new stables and you should put up the money? No, as you know, I joined the board of the Trust for the National Mall, and they were giving me the lowdown on you and everything that you've put into our wonderful front yard. And all of a sudden I heard horses in the background and I said, what's over there? And they said, well, that's where the U.S. Park Police horses are. And I said, well, where are they? I'd like to take a look at it. And they said, you really don't need to look at that.

23:25And I know Catherine Townsend's here and she's going to cut my throat when I say this. But I did go over there and I said, you know, this is what I want to do. We had the park police in trailers or whatever you call them. They were just terrible. And the horses were really in unsanitary conditions as far as I was concerned, of what I'm used to. Catherine, don't get mad at me. But anyway, I just said, this is going to be my project and this is what I want to do. So now if you go onto the mall, right, I don't know how many hundreds of feet down, from the Lincoln Monument, you see the most incredible stables for these horses, and they're out there.

24:11One of my horses, Chief, is right there. So it was my job to raise the, I guess it was$30 million to get that thing up, and we did it. and it's just amazing. Let me ask you, what's next for Sheila Johnson? Are you going to run for office? Are you going to become a cabinet officer, an ambassador, anything? I don't know. I'm just going to continue to focus on my company and try to help encourage so many women, and especially young women, out there to really find themselves. I want to read something to you. Okay. To the audience. 16 and a half years ago, it's really now 17, had passed since my divorce from Bob.

25:01Exactly half the time we had been together, I was finally free. If I could go back in time and talk to my younger self, I would tell her this. Trust your instincts. Get to know who you are before you give yourself to someone else. Believe that you can find happiness and that you deserve it. You're going to be okay. Thanks for listening. To hear more of my interviews, you can subscribe and download my podcast on Spotify, Apple, or wherever you listen.