Eric Weinstein (Ex-Harvard Physicist): The Collapse Has Already Started! Jeffrey Epstein Was A Front!

28:01I think I first time somebody crystallized that for me with Sam Harris. It's a really important point. But you're air to an incredibly powerful and important tradition. And if we don't have a Christian substrate, we're in real trouble. Because all of our society is based on an assumption of a Christian substrate. You're advising me to be Christian in tradition, but not in necessarily in belief. Well, this is the thing. You're alienated because you think that you have to be a believer in order to go in otherwise you're faking it. Yeah. Get over yourself. That's not how it works. That's me just being honest.

28:38I do think that if I went to a church and I sang and I prayed and stuff and I didn't believe I would be like, it'd be fake. Okay. Do you imagine that all those people who go to church are just sitting there 100 % sure that there's a Jesus to pray to? Do you know any Christians? Yeah. They're not like that. They sneak off and do bad things. If they were confident that Jesus was watching everything that they were doing. And they were constantly talking about how they said, I'm a sinner. It's a very complicated, interesting piece of kit. And my claim is that, you know, I said the Lord's Prayer is part of going to high school.

29:31I sat in a church, a chapel, a high school in LA, that had a stained glass window with an American soldier trampling a Nazi flag into the stained glass window. It was amazing. How does this link to me? I was about to say, can't... I don't know, you have faith that we'll just be able to kind of keep this. It feels like a bit of a stand up. So you're the one with the faith. I'm the one who's nervous. You...look, you're the believer. I'm not going to trust that. No, no, no, I'm going to get my hands dirty and get my fingers on. Do you know what I think it imparts? You said, I've been alive for 32 years and through that time has been relative peace, especially in the Western world.

30:13It's all over the known. I'm born with this assumption that this is just kind of how it goes. There's always threat, but we figure it out. Come to the Pacific Palace, it looks like Gaza. Yeah.

30:27Yeah, I've got some friends that lost their houses there. You know, checked out LaHina in West Maui recently. No. It's an absolute disaster. Is AI a protagonist in this story is it sure? In what respect? Well, what do you think about it? We're going through a wild revolution at the moment, and I just hear people saying the dumbest things about it. What do I think about once I might say something dumb now? Well, that's right, because I'm a system and dumb. I think, well, I look at both sides of the coin and I look at the opportunity and the threat. My concern, when I hear about the CEOs of the biggest AI companies in the world talking about this fast takeoff, is that the transition will be too quick for us to adjust.

31:13And when they say fast takeoff, they mean that H .I. like arrives, and the rate of its lining accelerates so quickly that it really disrupts the need for human beings to do a lot of the sort of jobs we're doing today that are centered on intelligence. Which jobs require intelligence? Pretty much all of them these days, because we've had the Industrial Revolution where we've outsourced a lot of labor to machines. But I don't think so. Yeah, I think a large portion of our conversation was actually in LLM. We didn't actually get to the stuff outside of the LLM. You and I are two chat bots for the most part.

31:54You're a good one. I'm on a huge platform again. But my claim is that that's the really disturbing part. More or less where LLM is, more or less we don't do a single intelligent thing all day long. And the reason that they're able to mimic us is because we don't realize that intelligence is a last resort for us. We try to automate. If you think about greetings, your assistant was very kind. I got out of a black car that you guys sent around. And I was greeted with the phrase, there he is, the man, the myth. And I knew what was coming next, the legend. Because that is a sort of humorous way of giving an intimate greeting.

32:40But it's still an LLM. And I'm not saying that your assistant is an LLM. I'm saying that more or less what we do all day long is LLM interactions. Hey, buddy, how are you? Good, good. Things have been really busy. How about you? Well, I got some travel coming up kind of excited about it. But I have to get through some work first. I understand. That's an entirely scripted conversation. That's why I'm trying to say that I want to do podcasting that is outside of the LLM. I don't want to do just dangerous stupid stuff. But I want to talk about things that I've never explored. Where I don't have something, you know, ready.

33:20Do you think I will have a break out of the LLM or expand it? That's what the LLM is. I don't see. I think that waiting for AGI is the problem is a bad idea. I think the problems are going to get here far before AGI. I think even that, the AGI expectation is something we're trained to do. Do you think AGI is coming? Do you think we'll survive AGI? Will AGI be good or bad? All of that's pre -programmed. Why are you waiting for AGI? Did you not, to Alpha Fold 3, did you track that? Did you know about this? Was that the chess game? Well, it's the chess game that became the protein folding game. You want to talk about great games, protein folding.

34:04Now that's a game. I have no knowledge of this at all. Okay. What do you know about proteins? Very little. Okay, think about proteins as tiny machines. Yeah. There's copying machine, there's scissors and a shearing machine, there's a light making machine, all sorts of things. And all of those machines are weirdly coded. Imagine that you had like a children's show. And a bunch of girls, superheroes, now I had necklaces with 20 different kinds of beads around their neck. And so when they needed a machine, they'd take off the necklace and they'd throw it into a thing called a ribosome. The ribosome would take these 20 kinds of pearls and suddenly it would build you a car, more spaceship or a gun or who knows what.

34:51Well, that's the story of DNA, RNA and protein. The only thing is, isn't it weird that a linear sequence suddenly crumbles up into a three -dimensional object that does something? So for example, have you ever seen these Turkish rabbits that glow in the dark? No. Okay, so they took green fluorescent protein out of jellyfish. And they spliced them into the nucleic acids of rabbits. And the Turks bred all of these glow in the dark bunnies. And what that is is a structure, so there's something called secondary structure and protein where sometimes you get these spirals called alpha helices and then sometimes you get a two -dimensional sheet that's made from taking a switchback in strings of amino acids.

35:44And then if you wrap that around, you don't have a beta sheet, you have a beta barrel. And these beta barrels are the glow in the dark aspect of green fluorescent protein. And what we didn't know was how a series of ACTs and Gs could code for sequences of amino acids could form three -dimensional structures. So if you just read DNA, you didn't know, well, that's going to be a sports car. Alpha -fold figured it out for the most part, like to a twin enormous extent. Humans were stuck there. And what does that mean? It means that you could, I don't know, you could target your enemies that have particular regions on their cell surfaces and you could come up with proteins that only attach to them in attack.

36:29It could mean anything. It could mean nanorobots. I don't know what it means, but my point is that that's already here. And you're not focused on it. And you're thinking AGI, and the funny part is, is that's your LLM that got programmed to wait for AGI. Well, I heard, you know, people that I think are very smart, much smarter than me talk about the... Don't listen to them. Elon? Sure. I mean, he says that it's our biggest existential threat is AI.

37:02Elon has become the outsourcing for much of our intelligence. And if Elon means anything to you, he's really saying to you, don't listen to me, do something remarkable. He's saying, where is everybody? Why is there only one Elon? There used to be lots of them. Why is there only one Elon? Yeah, not the right question. Where did all the other Elon's go? Same question, isn't it? No, I think that why is there only one Elon makes Elon feel more singular? You know, if you ever get a chance to go to Capodokia or Bryce National Park in Utah, you see what happens, which is that you'll have a stone that was resting on the soil.

37:49And suddenly the wind starts to erode everything except the compactified soil right under that stone and you get what's called a fairy chimney for a hood. And so the claim is that sometimes you get these isolated structures and the key point is everything else eroded away. We're supposed to have tons of Elon.

38:12And everybody else got taken out. What all who took them out? Look at how much trouble Elon has being Elon. Look, we keep hearing about him. He's on drugs. Great. Take drugs. No, I'm not kidding. Do you know how many amazing people take drugs? If you care about jazz, jazz is a whole, you know, it's a history of drugs. Whenever I'm listening to Ray Charles, I'm hearing heroin. Okay. What are they doing at Burning Man? They're trying to live luxuriously under oppression, simultaneously luxuriously and as dirty and disgusting as you'll ever be. Hopefully they're having tons of eye -opening, mind -bending experiences chasing some way of getting out of the LLM.

39:10And, you know, my feeling about this is, it's not even honest. I believe that Elon, for example, does understand that population and growth is really important. But I also think he just enjoys making babies. And in a weird way, this idea of, I'm going to have an empire of my children is a forbidden concept. Try explaining that to HR. You know, it's like, what did you say at work? So the key point is, Elon is barely able to be Elon. Do you think we're overestimating the impact AI is going to have? Because a lot of people say, is this really fundamentally transformative? No. You don't think we're underestimating it.

39:55I think it's going to be... I think that what AI means to us is bizarre. We've come up with this whole script about AGI. And it's going to take... Everything we do that's repetitive is on the chopping block. And since almost everything we do is repetitive, we don't need to get to AGI. We just need to do things where lots of people create lots of repetitive data. And then we tokenize it. We train the AI on the tokens. And then for the most part, it says, you know, it doesn't matter. It can be a photograph, it can be music, whatever it is. I mean, no acids. Just give me a large enough data set and let me add it and take a hike for a little while.

40:42I'll train on it. And then I'll know how to do that. You know what it's bad at? Things that where there isn't much data. So I just found out about these orphan proteins where... Everybody's got a different version of hemoglobin. But the quadrinary structure of hemoglobin is these four hem groups. You know, four different proteins around a central element. What happens when you have a protein that has no analog anywhere else? The system doesn't have the ability to learn it. If I train you on the blues and you find out what a 12 -bar blues progression is, then you find out that there's a variation where the second bar goes to the fourth rather than just staying on the one for four bars.

41:27And then sometimes the fourth bar has a seven in it to create tension. Okay, so it's going to learn every single form of the blues like that. And because there's a large corpus of that stuff, it's going to get really good at blues music. You know, but if you take something that basically never happens, it's not going to have an easy ability to train and give you more. So I think that AI is almost certainly going to transform the economy because everything that we know how to do through education creates repetitive behaviors. We don't know how to educate for creativity and genius. We know how to educate for doing higher level things.

42:09So radiology is a great example. Radiologists are, you know, some of the first in the crosshairs. I'm going to stare at some imaging and I'm going to say, I think that's a tumor. I think that's benign. And that's going to say, just give me, give me, give me all of these tokens. Like, well, their x -rays, their cats, no, no, they're just tokens. So yeah, it's going to start to automate away every repetitive behavior and then what's going to be left is the tiny number of things that aren't really highly repetitive or things where we really care that a human does it. Very interesting what's happened with chess.

42:50I don't know if you've been following chess. I loosely understand it mainly because I've spoken to a lot of AI experts and they often reference chess as an example. That's one of the first things that humans did that we really cared about that fell. So they've been longer in the AI tractor beam than any of the rest of us in subsets. How did it fall through deep blue and IBM and Gary Caspera? But does that mean that people are people aren't interested in chess anymore? What are you saying? No, no, no, that's the whole point. So Magnus Carlson, the greatest chess player of our time and perhaps of all time, was on Joe Rogan and Joe asked some of the simple question, can your phone be used?

43:36Like, yeah, easily. So the point is we can't compete with, I don't know, stock fish or whatever the top chess programs are retired on, no anymore. But nobody cares about those programs except for AI experts. We care about the drama of, you know, Anon versus Carlson. Two humans. Two humans because it's about us. We're very narcissistic in this one. And so there was a period and you know, this is something that my wife, tried to popularize. So she said this thing about the golden age of AI complementarity, where the AI's aren't good enough to take over from us, but they're amazing tools. And so there's a period where we're teamed up, you know, the prompt engineering revolution.

44:30They're not good enough to come up with their own prompts. And a great example of this that she and I have been talking about is the cyborg chess era, which is a period where humans and the AI's could form teams that would do better. But at some point, the AI just looks at the human and says, you're just holding me back. You've got two children. Yeah. And when they're thinking about their career prospects, with all that you think can know and believe about the future that we're heading towards, what kind of career advice would you be giving today? Oh, I've given them terrible career advice. I gave them somewhat different career advice.

45:08So to my son, my advice was do the hardest, most technical thing you possibly can do and be prepared to use that ability, that facility in different ways than you're honing it. But train yourself. If my daughter, I think she cares deeply about people. And, you know, there's a typical male, female divide. And I'm not, by the way, I'm not going to talk overly much about them because I try to keep them out. But she is somebody who was taking the same level of analytic ability, but putting it in the service of the law and trying to help people who are, you know, really unfortunate, very idealistic.

45:53And so at some level, the law is not going to allow us to have AI lawyers for quite some time. It's not going to trust anything. We've got jury trials and judges and a legal system that's written into our founding documents. To the average person, I would take it your board in the water and prepare to paddle like all get out. The tsunami of a lifetime is coming. And nothing your elders have seen is going to prepare. That there's no good advice to give that specific. Let's put it this way. One of the things people tell me about their moving from one city to another. I have a phrase that nobody likes, which is every place is over.

46:38Oh, I'm going to Austin. Yeah, it's over. Miami, it's over. Nashville, over. You know, all these places are over. And every occupation that is named is over. I'm going to be a dentist. Radiologist, accountant, teacher. These are all over. Whatever is coming, get flexible, get good. Get good on a bunch of different stuff. Learn how to think across disciplines. I have no idea what's going to be left for us.

47:17But you know, somebody's going to come out on top.

47:22And I hate to tell people that you should try to come out on top. I don't think it's healthy to have everyone trying to be world class. I think you should be able to just have a life. And I have a golden retriever. I don't know that it's the greatest golden retriever in the world. Sometimes I think it is. There's a lot of dumb stuff. But he's my golden retriever. I just don't think that this is many for optimization. Like if you look at your own videos, you'll find some of the best performing videos. This is how to succeed. This is how to get anyone you want. This is how to get out of a bad situation.

48:02People just want capacity. But for what? You've optimized your day. You've optimized your health. Your social media is optimized. Now what? Now what? I don't know. What should be then? Is it time to just... One would say, well, now I... One would incorrectly say, well, now I can play with my golden retriever. And then one would say, well, you should have been playing with your golden retriever the whole time. But let me put it a little differently. Through some bizarre accident, I've gotten a chance to meet incredible people that I don't even talk about who I've met. You know? I've got a chance to see the world.

48:51I haven't seen South America, but I've seen most of the other continents, other than the Antarctic. I've had a really rich life. Take somebody who hasn't had those opportunities. But they got a chance to have three kids. I'm not sure I wouldn't trade places. I am so enjoyed raising my children. It's available to everyone.

49:24It's such a strange thing that we're talking about optimization on all this stuff. I get to think about the substrate of the universe. Theoretical physics, I dream about visiting the stars. I dream about multiple dimensions of time meeting aliens all sorts of things.

49:43I still think having kids with like...unbeatable. I'm so sad that it's over. I'm so sad that they moved out. I cannot believe that I was dumb enough to live in a society that doesn't believe in having your kids with you your whole life. The idea that we look at places where kids live at home as backwards is beyond me. And shout out to the entire Indian subcontinent. It's just like family is everything. They drive me crazy.

50:20But it's just...meaning is available for you. And again... Every time I get a chance to eat a rambutan. That's one of my favorite fruits. Mangoes, rambutans, jackfruit, seat the fall if you can get custard apple. The amount of pleasure I get. I've never had a good custard apple in the entire time I've lived in the US. Not one. I've had a frozen one imported from Taiwan. You get this cherimoya. Just get out of here, cherimoya. You're not good. Great custard apple. Great seat the fall around fall. What a pleasure to be on this earth. And it's available to almost anyone. I just think that you can find meaning.

51:09For God's sake, go to Spotify if you have a connection. If you can afford a connection to Spotify. And put in Pablo Casal's version of the Bach cello suites. You're as rich as you need to be. I've flown private. I'd much prefer to listen to Pablo Casal's playing the cello suites in economy. To be deprived of real luxury. I don't know. To me, meaning is everywhere. I can't swing a cow without hitting meaning. Have you always been like that? Or is that something that you've cultivated? The point about being able to swing a cat and find meaning. So many people that would be listening now could swing a hundred mile stick and wouldn't hit meaning in their lives.

51:58But you seem to be able to find it in the pure things. There's some more simple things. And I'm wondering if that's something that we can all cultivate with a change of perspective or if it's just the way that you've always been. Why is Joe Rogan such a big deal? You ever listen to Joe Rogan talk about pugilism? Two gentlemen beating the crap out of each other as poetry, as chess?

52:26I could listen to Joe talk about MMA for days. Yeah. You know, the story of Mighty Mouse. The guy trapped in some, I don't know, flyweight division with unbelievable skills who never gets to meet a formidable enemy. You know? Do you think that's a privilege? Do you think that there's a privilege in being able to craft a story? Because so much of the meaning you're describing that comes from these great stories. And not everybody is able to craft the story upon seeing something. You probably look at this item in front of me, this glass, and create a story about it that drives meaning that makes you feel something.

53:06I worry about its manufacture. How is it that we got a surface of revolution? What is the industrial process? How do I take a picture of this and get a photograph of the machine that made it? You know that fly that has been buzzing around us this entire interview? Do you remember when Obama had a fly? Yeah, and he called it and bow. The confidence of that man. See, I try that and I'd miss and I'd screw it up in front of me. It's like I took so much meaning away from that fly. Well, you trying to or is that just a sort of pretty? We all did. Not everyone. Some people would have gone, How was it that you knew exactly what I was talking about?

53:49Because he captured a moment. He was the girl in the red dress. You know, there's this thing that women say, not every woman can wear red. Well, not every man can grab a fly with confidence. I think we all see this. I think we all see beauty everywhere. Do you remember that movie, American Beauty with the plastic bag that gets in the air funnel going up? And the key point is the ability just to see beauty wherever you find it. You know, everything behind you means something to me. The letter B, strange to me that there's only one phonetic alphabet and that every phonetic alphabet is descended from it.

54:42I basically view everything as a hyperlink. I just want to click on the world and see what it goes to. Not everybody does, though. But we do. They don't make this step is what I'm saying. Because people would see the B and nothing would cross their... You know, it's a fun. There's an absolutely horrible account that has been just dogging me for years trying to make my life miserable. And... A social media account? Yeah. Doesn't matter. Yeah. And the person said, you know, one thing I just never understand is he's not... he's not hawking a book.

55:23He's just talking. Why are his numbers high? And the answer is everybody cares about this stuff. They want an invitation. One of the funniest things that gets sent about me on social media is he goes on forever and he never says anything. And then like, I look at the word clouds of things that I've talked about and people are spooling everything incessantly. You know, if you didn't know who Pablo Casalz was, now you do. Now you know what a real cellist sounds like. I don't know. I just... I can't believe that I'm so far through this life and that they're so little left.

56:05I can't believe this doesn't go on forever. Is that what you?

56:13My people just got hit.

56:19And you know, you want to talk about the river in the sea.

56:25That river is not the Jordan River and that sea is not the Mediterranean. The Arab world stretches from the Atlantic with Morocco right up to the Chalala Rabi waterway that divides Iraq from Iran. And I don't think this is stable. There is no way in which we should be fighting like this. This is ridiculous.

57:04Trump used the F word. I mean, he's taking a ton of crap. Why would you use the F word? Well, isn't it interesting that people view Trump as so tacky? You know, he's got this queen sort of bluster. He doesn't wreak of finalist clubs at Harvard or Skull and Bones or whatever.

57:30No, Trump doesn't use the F word for a reason. He needs it once in a blue moon and it better means something. And he said this to Iran and he said this to Israel. These two countries have been fighting for so long. They don't know what the fuck they're doing. He didn't make a mistake. The rest of the world has just forgotten how to calibrate. What do you see Trump in? How is he clothed? He's almost always in a suit and tie. And he almost never says the F word. And it's carefully calibrated to get everybody's attention. And we're so asleep that we don't even hear it. This is World War III and it's already started.

58:19Biden was there in the oval office.

58:26Non -compassmentists. And I was being told, don't worry, there's a committee that it's replaced him. Because I was talking about the fact that he can't be president. I just don't know what we're doing. I'm so mystified by everybody else. You know, it's like Elon makes sense to me.

58:48I'm not Elon. I'm very different person. But at least Elon makes sense to me. Not 100%, but 98 % Elon makes sense to me. It's everybody else that I'm completely confused about. What part of what Elon is saying makes some sense to you? Oh, geez, everything. One, we have to have babies. We have to keep going. Two, it can't all be about problems. You have to be excited to be alive every morning. You have to work your ass out your whole life. You don't want to know one of the most beautiful things that ever happened. Somebody telling you that he was the world's richest human being. And he said, huh, it's interesting.

59:30Okay, back to work.

59:35Amazing, right? There's no reward that he can't have more of by stopping work and enjoying his wealth. Except doing stuff. And I was born in this country. My parents were born in this country. My grandparents on one side were not. But my grandparents on the other side were. Elon is so American.

1:00:05That cowboy spirit that he does all sorts of stuff I can't stand. I don't want to see one more of those Pepe memes ever. I really don't. What the fuck is this problem? Okay, I don't know them at all. But Elon at his best is the United States. You know, anything is possible here. And we just waste our lives on interpersonal drama. He wastes his life to an enormous extent as a troll. I cannot. That's the part of him that I don't understand is one why he's not focused 100 % on physics. I think he sees it is going through Groc and AI doesn't want to trust humans. I think he sees Mars as energizing to engineers.

1:00:57And the stars are innovating to engineers because the science. There's no amount of engineer. You can't engineer your way to the stars with the science we have. But he's being a complete pussy when it comes to science and he's being a total hero when it comes to engineering.

1:01:16But he is the quintessential American. A business is only as good as the people inside it. So how do you make sure you're hiring the best? Our sponsor, LinkedIn can help you find these applicants quickly. I believe in taking time to hire slowly. But I also understand that once you've decided to hire, you want to get the ball rolling and get the best candidates in front of you to start interviewing. And that's where paying to promote your role on LinkedIn makes all the difference. Because you'll get applicants seven times faster than if you post your job for free. And even though slower, more considered hiring is important, you never want your hiring platforms to be what's holding you back.

1:01:51LinkedIn keeps pace. It takes care of the heavy lifting sending you highly skilled candidates that you wouldn't find anywhere else. So when the time comes to make your next hire, make it count and promote your job on LinkedIn. Head to LinkedIn .com slash D O A C. That's LinkedIn .com slash D O A C in terms of conditions apply. A second ago, you said you can't believe it doesn't go on forever. Yeah. You or the universe? I can't believe my story doesn't go on forever. Look, I've never died before. So I have no experience with it. So as far as I know, I've always been alive. And I'll always go on that way.

1:02:28But there's another thing that I've talked about occasionally, which is I'm not the most public -spirited human being. I am somebody who will take the last, the last rambutan. I know that you're not supposed to do that in almost any culture on earth, but sometimes it's just sitting there bothers me. So I'm not the classiest person on earth. But I'll tell you something. If you have a kid and you have a choice about eating the rambutan yourself, or giving the rambutan to your child, it's a no -brainer. You're going to enjoy the rambutan so much more if you give it to your kid. And you'll see. And that's the way that much of this goes on forever.

1:03:16That's great. I mean, just how many young people do I have to yell at? Well, I don't know if I want to have kids. I don't want to bring anyone into this horrible world. Why do you have kids? It can see it passing. It bothers you.

1:03:37Do you have any idea how much hate there is right now for Israel? Do you have any idea how destabilizing this action against Iran was? Do you have any idea how many people have suffered for how long under the mullahs?

1:03:56We are being cheated of Persia. I'm not talking about Iran for the Persians. I'm talking about we are cheated of Persia, the entire planet. One of the greatest societies on earth taken off the line.

1:04:16Look, it catches me on the wrong week.

1:04:24I don't want to dwell on it. This is just incredibly irresponsible. We're not going to survive this. Israel is certainly not going to survive this.

1:04:38If the Abrahamic world does not get its head out of its ass, if the Christian world does not start to stand up for itself without becoming this Christ's king nightmare, I was in Tel Aviv before this all happened. I just said it from the stage, make the Middle East Christian again.

1:04:59Does nobody understand their role as sort of my question? How can you have Bethlehem without a strong Christian presence?

1:05:12Have you ever been to the church of the Holy Suppler? No. Can't give you another assignment? Yeah. Get off your ass and go. You got the money. Walk the stations of the cross.

1:05:26And for God's sake, stop with the issue of Beth Belief. You can pray like the rest of us. We're not sure if we're praying. We're not sure if the thing is hooked up and anyone's listening.

1:05:41You have the right to go back even with doubt, even with knowledge. And you have the right to believe about it tomorrow, you know, where you're not going to be, but people are going to be mentioning your name. When you say that you'll people are under attack, who are you referencing as you people? I would in general, there's several groups of people that I would describe as my people. The Jews would be one. Dislexics would be another. Americans would be another. Scientists would be another. It depends on what these think. But right now I'm thinking about the Jews and I'm thinking about the fact that the social media businesses have lost complete control of the bot farms.

1:06:28And we're just seeing this unble... I feel like I'm living through the 1930s again. We've seen this movie before. It doesn't end well. You know, what happened in Gaza is an unbelievable tragedy. And that tragedy was partially architected by the United States of America, shoving a two -state solution down the throats of Palestinian Arabs who absolutely do not want a two -state solution.

1:07:03And the creation in part of the situation where Israel has a hand, the US has a hand, the Palestinian Arabs have a hand, the creation of Hamas, and the promotion of this just unbelievable genius in Sunwar, the leader of Hamas, who is continuing to best be the Netanyahu from the grave. You know, it's just an amazing feat. Nobody reads anymore, as you know. There's an old Sherlock Holmes story called the problem at Thor Bridge. Have you ever heard of it? So you're British. Sherlock Holmes gets called in on a case in which there's a murder. And the murder is traced, the murder is traced to this gentleman who still exists.

1:08:03What Sherlock Holmes figures out is that it's not a murder, it's a suicide in which the gun will fall into the river at Thor Bridge, because it's tied to a weight. And the person uses the suicide to frame someone else. And it's just one of these genius little vignettes. And that's what Sunwar was. He was a genius. He knew he was going to die. Who was Sunwas, who was the person who was committed suicide? Sunwas' suicide was an IDF -assisted suicide. I wrote about this almost instantly after the October 7th invasion. It didn't make any sense that Gaza would undertake such an act against Israel, given the asymmetry.

1:08:52But this mirrored was before the 1990s. So you think Sunwar committed suicide to then cause the people of Gaza to invade Israel? No, no, no, no, no, no. Sunwar would be happy enough for all the gossens to die. And so what he did was he architected a situation in which Israel would be compelled to respond using the wrong tools. He tricked Israel. And I'm very confident to talk about this because if you check my old tweets, I say IDF -assisted suicide and Munkhausen by proxy and Zugswang. And I said, these are the concepts familiarized with yourself because Israel is going to invade Gaza. And I knew what was going to happen because it took me like, why would you do this?

1:09:45It doesn't make sense from first -order logic, but third and fourth -order logic. You'd be like, oh, of course it makes sense. This is hybrid war. The most important thing for Sunwar is video. Why? Look at the effect of the video. The video of Gaza has turned the world to an extent against Israel that's sort of inconceivable.

1:10:16There's a doctrine called hybrid warfare. And I think it came out of the US in the early 2000s. And it says that the kinetic component of warfare, the killing, the actual shooting and the planes and the bombs and all this kind of stuff, is not the major component. The social media is really important. The video is important. The mimetic complex is important. And Israel has an advantage over the Gaza Arabs. In kinetic warfare. And Sunwar knew that. And he was like, brilliant. All we need to do is force Israel to come after us. And this is this thing I was going to say before the 1990s. We had a spate of killings, of policemen firing on people who had pulled toy guns on them.

1:11:14And we would say thing that I remember this. Like, whatever you do, don't point a toy gun at a policeman. It's, don't you realize what's going to happen? And then somebody coined the phrase, police assisted suicide. The policeman is the instrument. That's what I knew was going to happen. And for better or for worse, BB just couldn't figure out where it was. And BB was dumber and Sunwar was smarter. Is there any way back from him? Because you said this is World War III. Well, the wave, there is, but it's slim and it's evaporating. I mean, almost everything depends on Saudi Arabia and the Iranians and the Persians.

1:12:02If the Persians didn't take this opportunity to rise up against their oppressors, I don't know what they're waiting for. Yes, you're going to get killed in some numbers, but you have to figure out whether you're interested in tyranny or not. So the Persians are absolutely falling down on the ground on the job, not rising up against the Mullahs. This is a coordinated moment. Like, you know, there's a moment for a prison break. This would be it. Who the Mullahs in this? The Iatola is the... The government of Iran. Yeah, the theocratic government of Iran. So the rulers of Iran, basically, the people that don't, okay.

1:12:37So I don't know if you know a ton of Persians, they're varied in their religiosity. But there's an underground gays scene in Tehran. There's super hyper -modern people just like you and me who can't stay on these guys. And so you're saying that if they rise up... That would be one of the parts of the solution. The other thing is Saudi Arabia. And I have to be very measured and careful here. You can't fantasize about the Middle East becoming Western Europe overnight. Every time we do this, we make a terrible mistake. When you have a modernizer like MBS in Saudi Arabia. Who's the ruler of Saudi Arabia?

1:13:20De facto. He can't suddenly become a modern person. So, you know, if we end up talking about Kishoggi and murders and murder journalists and all this stuff, the whole conversational derail. But he's a modernizer. And there was a moment where he needed to not condemn Israel publicly and thank it privately. But to say, we've all been terrorized by this country and Israel did what everyone needed. We needed to rise up against the Mullahs because you can't have a nuclear theocracy. You can't have a highly developed notion of heaven where this is the anti -room where you're waiting to get into the real room.

1:14:12That issue of needing to be rid of an aspiring nuclear theocracy. It's something that Israel undertook. Now, something that I'm going to say, there are three words in Yiddish which you may have heard. Who may not? Shlamil, Shlamazil, and Nebuchh. So, there are three unfortunate people. You don't want to be any one of those three. But the subtlety is that the Shlamil is a clutz. And the Shlamil spills hot soup on the Shlamazil. So, the Shlamazil is the unfortunate person to whom bad things happen. And the Nebuchh is the weak ineffectual person who decides that it's his job to clean up the mess.

1:15:00So, the Shlamil spills the scalding hot soup on the Shlamazil and the Nebuchh cleans it up. Now, in the U .S., we've got this terrible sort of Christian nationalist problem that we've developed, which is what sometimes people call the woke right. Where we have a bunch of people who have been badly treated. White Christian Americans have been badly treated in the woke era. They've been forced to salute everybody else's, you know, yay for, you know, I don't know, Honduran, Lesbians Day. And it's like, okay enough, we don't want to do that anymore. We've also done great things. And I absolutely think that they've been mistreated.

1:15:40And they've gone sort of metastatic. And their attitude is no more wars for Israel. America first, what I was getting to with the Shlamazil in the Nebuchh is that most Americans don't have any idea who Kermit Roosevelt was. Do you have any idea of who Kermit was? So, the U .S. and the U .K. jointly overthrew a democratically elected in Iran through something called Operation Ajax. We installed the Shah. And then there's this period where everybody stupidly celebrates the mini skirts and the jazz that was going through Tehran, which was a bridge too far. In other words, the mini skirts were a really bad idea.

1:16:24Because they weren't ready for some amount of modernization and they weren't ready for that. And so we pushed it too far. And so we got the mullis for 40 years. And now we chop off people's fingers and we pluck out people's eyes and we put homosexuals on ropes and dangle them from Kran. They're barbaric, they're horrible human beings. Okay, these are really bad men, the mullis. And we did that. So the Skolving Hot Soup is revolutionary, theocratic Iran. And we spilled it all over the Middle East, which is the Shlamazel. We spilled it on Saudi Arabia, we spilled it on Iraq, we spilled it on Israel.

1:17:10Everybody suffers from having these people installed because of the U .S. and the U .K. instituting a problem back in the 50s. And who's the Nevah? Who cleans this up? Israel volunteers for this job. And then Saudi Arabia pretends, oh my God, this is terrible. Our Muslim brother is being attacked by our Jewish... I just can't believe anybody's dumb enough to fall for all of this. Like, we're involved in a story where nobody can sort things out, there's no talking heads anyone believes in. And if I didn't understand this, then how is it that I have a tweet from, you know, 10 days after October 7th, or I appeared on Trigger Namazir, I'm telling you, Israel hasn't even walked into Gaza yet.

1:18:01And I know what the strategy is. Iran sent hypersonic missiles into the ground in Israel as a message, violence is a language, and they spoke it well. The Mullahs may be crazy, but they're still Persians. They're extraordinarily skilled. And so what they did is they wasted some of their arsenal saying, you have no iron dome. And we're not going to kill you. We're going to put our missiles, we're going to waste our missiles by sending them into your earth and try to kill no one. And these railings, these brilliant genius Israelis who pull off all sorts of things that the world can't believe, are dumb enough some of them to say, they send all these missiles and they couldn't even hit anyone.

1:18:50And I'm just thinking, do none of you understand anything? I just don't even know where I am.

1:19:01And I'm looking at, you know, I know Tulsi. Tulsi got it. Yeah. Tulsi is amazing. She's the head of the intelligence program for the United States. Director of National Intelligence, right? Tulsi has seen the devastation, not of war, but of US action abroad. Like we haven't really had full wars, but we get involved in Afghanistan or Iraq or wherever. People die and they're a firefight. It's not like it has nothing to do with war, but full on war is a very different thing. We say the Iraq war, but I want to be very careful about the language. War usually involves you getting rocked at home, not just your troops abroad.

1:19:49I don't think she appreciates the gravity of the situation. That somehow what we need to do is we need to stabilize this thing for 50 to 100 years. Well, we desperately try to figure out a long -term solution. And this idea of like just...

1:20:12We're not taking responsibility for the world we already screwed up. I don't want to send Americans. You know, I'm not in Israeli, I'm an American. I don't want to send my fellow Americans to die in foreign battles that we have no business being in. But we have to take ownership of our history with oil and energy in the Middle East. What does that look like taking ownership? Recognizing that we created the Mullahs. And doing what about it? At way, way, a second, not just that. And that we also created a lot of the heartache along with Sinwar. And to a much lesser extent, Israel by foisting this two -state solution on people who would never put up with it.

1:20:56Like I lived in Israel for two years. You would have conversations with Arabs, some of whom are Israelis. And they would say, look, you just don't understand the West Bank and you don't understand the difference between the West Bank and Gaza. And they would tell me straight up, you're going to get us all killed with this two -state solution. Stop it. And it was very hard for me to hear. But we're just having a child's conversation about the Middle East. And I will say this about the UK. The British Foreign Service had a different failure mode than the US. They really learned the regions. They learned the dialects of the languages, the countries that they were involved in.

1:21:47The British Empire took many places that they were involved in seriously. They have a very complicated legacy. I spend a lot of time in Bombay and there's a lot of debate among very educated Indians. About figuring out how to think about the British legacy, all of the great institutional structures that were built, all of the prejudice and bigotry, why was such a small country able to colonize such a large land basically working with the locals? It's a rich conversation. We're having childlike conversations about all of this. I'm sorry if I'm going on about this. But it's just a very weird thing that we can't get anybody's attention.

1:22:34You can't even get my attention. I'm watching hypersonic missiles slam into the places I just was. And then I'm watching a cat video.

1:22:50And then I'm trying to figure out what to order through Uber Eats. It's just like I can't stay focused. It's really important to put this right. And the US screwed up the Middle East along with the UK. Really good. And we have a lot of responsibility. And if we want to go isolationist, I understand that. But you first have to put back the chicken soup that you spilled. And how do you do that? I'm not sure. I'm not the director of national intelligence. I'm not the secretary of defense. I'm not in the Oval Office. I mean, you know, it's very weird. I was workmates with JD Vance. You know, these are people who are, you know, Bobby Kennedy lives one canyon over for me in Los Angeles.

1:23:38The people around power in the US.

1:23:48Godspeed, you know, just wish them well. I don't care what party you're in, but to try to sabotage Trump or sabotage Tulsi or sabotage. These guys need to figure this out. And they need to be at a totally different level. And he's figuring it out piece in the region. You know, the piece with between Egypt and Israel is a shitty, crappy, horrible piece. But it's peace. It's not a loving relationship. It's not a question of everybody going back and forth between the two countries, saying, you know, we used to be enemies, now we're friends. It's a lousy, cold piece. I'll take it. We need to have peace between Israel and the Palestinian Arabs who can live in peace.

1:24:37And we need the people who cannot live in peace. We need to find someplace else for them to be. It is absolutely imperative. And by the way, this goes for the Israelis. There are a small number of hardcore Israeli cell orders who cannot live, you know, in peace with their neighbors. And it's very important that the people who cannot live in peace not be there. Do we need to go to a you suggesting that we focus on regime change in Iran? That is really the responsibility of the Persians. So I want to get clear on what you see as a solution, because you're saying the Persian people have to rise up.

1:25:18The US need to care but not get involved in that regime change. I'm saying that a bunch of things need to happen if we're to have a long term solution. I make you president tomorrow. I hate when people do this. But it's the clearest way of understanding the actions you would think of. First of all, if I was president tomorrow, I'm sure it's how it wouldn't be on a podcast discussing strategy with you. Trump does it. Yeah, I declined to answer all sorts of questions on camera. So my feeling is that you do a lot more behind closed doors. And this idea of just handing people, you're the king of the world.

1:25:53What do you do tomorrow to stop? It's like, don't do that to me. Because it's just it's a no -win question. If I was going to, I do a lot of stress in communication. I'd meet with people in private. I'd use lots of carrots and sticks. I try to use long range thinking. And I wouldn't tell you what my plan is. And by the way, I very much respect Donald Trump in certain ways. One of which is that this confuses our friend Sam Harris, no end. Sam is always like, well, he's not being truthful. He's not making sense. He's a negotiator. You don't sit down to a negotiation with an open book saying, let me make sense to you.

1:26:30You sit there saying, you don't know what I'm going to do next. You don't know how big the stick is. You don't know how much carrot there is. Maybe I'm prepared to give you more. Maybe my stick isn't as big as you think. Or maybe it's twice as big. Do you think anyone has a good answers? I'll be honest. I think that Trump is in part respected because he has some intuitions about this stuff. His intuition is not to say everything. His intuition is that negotiation is more important than transparency. And at a time when everybody's craving transparency, tell me everything. No, I'm not going to tell you everything.

1:27:11I'm going to try to save some children today. I'm going to threaten. I'm going to cajole. I'm going to do all sorts of things. And that's what I do. I would assemble the best people around me. I would stop giving so many press conferences. I wouldn't tweet every four seconds. I'd be extremely strategic about it.

1:27:36But the situation in Tel Aviv and in Gaza makes me sick to my stomach. And in Ukraine, almost all of my DNA comes from Ukraine. At least pass through it. I've been there. And you know, Russians in Ukraine, Ukraine used to be known as little Russia. But how are we sitting here watching this? What moron decided in 2004 that we were just going to hand full Article V status to former Soviet republics with our consequence?

1:28:29It is not the case that I don't, I would love to have Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania in NATO. Not at this cost.

1:28:45Look, the world is a brutal, brutal place.

1:28:54We've gotten really bad at international understandings. I can't stand what's happened to Europe. Europe has been completely denatured.

1:29:10We're playing with fire everywhere. And I don't know how to talk about it because every time I talk about things where I'm the only person who sounds like this. It's bad for my life. Look, if you're in general a Ukraine hawk and you say, you know, we need to make sure that Ukraine is completely supported so that they don't give an inch of territory. Yeah, you'll take a lot of crap, but you'll be in a large group. And if you basically have the idea that Russia, you know, was mining its own business in the US, was encircling it and good Russia, bad US, you'll have a lot of company for that perspective.

1:29:52I don't sound like any of that. The most important thing is to stabilize the world again. And we're not going to get another chance like World War II if we're not smart. We're crazy to give up this order that we have. And again, you know, one more time I'm talking about this stuff and I don't want to be talking about this stuff. Elon is 100 % right. We can't talk about problems all the time. It's cheap meaning. There's an entire universe to explore. And we're sitting here focused on our own drama always. And I'm getting sucked into it and I don't want it. I want to be talking about traveling through time and space using Easter eggs and hidden features of what we thought was the space time continuum.

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1:32:20Stand is incredibly simple and incredibly easy, and you can link it with a Shopify store that you're already using if you want to. I'm on it, and so is my girlfriend, and many of my team. So if you want to join, start by launching your own business with a free 30 -day trial. Visit stevenbartlet .stand .store and get your setup within minutes. I've got this picture that I came across. Tell me. Well, I'd love you to tell me this is the flower of life geometric model. And I was reading through some of your work, and I came across this sentence that said, you'd kept a secret for 30 years in terms of your belief about the nature of the reality that we live in, and that you thought maybe it was more than just the dimensions we experienced.

1:33:04Maybe there was 14 dimensions. I've always, well, I wonder this a lot, you know, because we're fixated on problems. We're fixated on what we see and what we hear and what we feel. But I wonder sometimes if even that is an illusion. I've spent a lot of time actually thinking recently about the simulation theory, and is this whole reality just some simulation on some kids' video game and never dimension? So I thought you know, you're a physicist. Give me a favor. Put that in a triangle pattern here. Okay. So we have three mugs. Think of those as vertices of a tetrahedron, and think of this coaster floating here as the fourth vertex.

1:33:41For every two vertices, so the number of vertices we would agree is four. Yeah. What's his vertices mean? Points. Yeah. One, two, three, four. Idealize these three things, and this is points. Draw a line segment between all of these four vertices. How many line segments are there? One, two, three, four, five, six. Six? Yep. So there's six edges, four vertices. How many triangular faces that have three vertices on them? Oh, fool. Yeah. This is how to think about the actual dimensions that we have open to us. The four faces we know about. The key point that I was trying to get at is, I don't believe that you just have the four dimensions.

1:34:32I believe that you have all six edges are dimensions, and all four vertices are also dimensions. I'm talking about a hidden world. It's very interesting. Physics has gone stagnant in terms of how we usually measure progress. The way we measure progress is the change in something called the action or the Lagrangian, the specialized device, and that used to change a lot, and then in 1973 it stopped changing. The major thing that we have is we have no new ideas about how to change the Lagrangian that anybody finds that exciting or interesting. So there's been no progress. Nobody goes to Stockholm to get a Nobel Prize because they changed the Lagrangian in the world.

1:35:22Just the Lagrangian. The Lagrangian. So you probably think about physics in terms of equations, like Maxwell's equations or the Einstein equations or whatever. Think about an equation as being not the primary thing that physicists think about. So I give this example. The Beatles had four basically different configurations. When Ringo was the frontman, he was singing Octopus's Garden. George Harrison is singing while my guitar gently weeps. You know, Paul is singing about Penny Lane and John is singing about Strawberry Fields forever. Those four equations, those would be different configurations of the Beatles with one of them front and everybody else backing the frontman, would be the equations, but the Beatles would be the Lagrangian.

1:36:16It's the thing that generates the four different configurations. And there's this bizarre force field that anybody who wants to talk about physics and doing something new, in particular, leaving or traversing time or multiple dimensions of time, anything that's really close to what might be possible gets slammed. We don't know why, because it's very cheap to explore ideas and we have no new ideas. But the only thing about a new idea in physics is that a new idea changes the balance of power in the world. Do you remember the thing I was saying about Alpha Fold 3? Alpha Fold 3 changed the balance of power in the world, Bitcoin changed the balance of power in the world.

1:37:07The diffuse proposal from the eco -health alliance changed the balance of power in the world if that was the source of the COVID virus. Anytime somebody has a really big idea, and the biggest idea, and I talk about this, people don't grasp it, probably the most dangerous thought anyone has ever had, was Rutherford in 1911 saying, I wonder whether there's a neutral version of the proton. It doesn't sound dangerous. But it's hard to send a proton into a bunch of protons because it's positively charged and a massive nucleus is really positively charged. And so there's a repulsion. If there's a neutral version of the proton, and these things are barely stuck together with the strong force, even though they're trying to scream away from each other, because they're all positively charged, you can send a neutral version of the proton right into the center.

1:38:10Tap, I'm just imagining you have a bunch of magnets that are trying to flee from each other, and the Velcro around them is barely holding it together. So now you have a bullet in the form of a neutral proton, a neutron, and it hits this thing where the magnets want to come apart, and the Velcro is barely holding it together. Well, that idea led to the chain reaction. And the nucleobomb? Well, that was the fission ball. And then a geometry, so I'm a geometry, and not a physicist. And a physicist, named Edward Teller, and the geometry was named Stanislas Ulong, said, I wonder if there's a way to take the chemical bomb that creates the fission bomb, and use the fission bomb as the detonator for a fusion bomb.

1:39:00So bomb number one, bomb number two, bomb number three. And what they figured out was that the only way to create that is to reflect light in a particular way to compress hydrogen into helium and release energy, because anything other than light wouldn't get to this tertiary stage fast enough before the atomic bomb, like you're using a Hiroshima Nagasaki as a detonator. That's how crazy it is. So that chain of ideas, which is maybe there's a neutral version of the proton, maybe I can send that into the middle of an atom that's very heavy that was built in a stellar collision. Maybe if I have a bunch of those uranium or plutonium type things, each one, when they break apart, will have more neutrons inside that is more neutral protons, that will hit more nuclei, that will release more energy, and maybe that can then focus the light, the gamma radiation, that comes off of this thing, or who knows what, to compress a narrow rod to create fusion, which only occurs on the Sun, in the Sun, but do it on Earth.

1:40:13So we're going to take a little bit of the Sun on Earth. That chain of ideas was the most dangerous thing anybody's ever think. And that's why when you try to do physics, you don't know why are people making fun of me? Why are they being mean? Why are they dissuading me from talking? I don't know. You have a suspicion. Well, there was a guy named Jack Raper, the unfortunately named Mr. Jack Raper, who was a reporter in Cleveland, who for some reason during the war in 1944 decided to vacation in New Mexico. So he goes to New Mexico, and he comes back and he says, I've got a crazy story. There's a city that nobody knows about, with a mayor who's supposed to be the second Einstein, and it's the most secretive city in the world, and the mayor is working on a Doomsday weapon and even the people who live in the city don't know what it is.

1:41:12And he writes the story of Los Alamos and publishes it in 1944. The scoop of the millennium to say nothing of the century. Nobody knows about this article, and it's called Forbidden City.

1:41:26We pretended that it never happened. For those that don't know Los Alamos is where the atomic, the nuclear bomb was, I guess, conceived and brought to life and tested. Well, it was really designed there, and most of the nuclear processing took place at other sites, whether Hanford or Oak Ridge, I'm not sure. And it was tested a short distance away at the Trinity site. So go watch the movie Oppenheimer, if you will. But this is why physicists are the only occupation in the country that doesn't have full free speech. So are you suggesting that there's dangers in believing in more dimensions that maybe some people might not want to be known in the same way that we didn't want that?

1:42:17My point is, I don't think our government knows the real secrets of physics. If I had to make a bet tomorrow, I don't think there's a secret government office that knows physics. Okay? I think that there were a bunch of very smart people who knew how dangerous physics was and that the idea that we would continue to do it in public struck them as insane. Because it could lead to destruction. When I tell you that the most dangerous idea in human history is maybe there's a neutral version of the proton. That's supposed to sound insane. But the entire chain of ideas results in nuclear fusion happening on Earth at the direction of the President of the United States.

1:43:07And that's what I'm trying to get at, which people don't understand, which is you probably don't even realize that the Department of Energy is really the Department of Physics because we pretend that it's the Department of Energy. Like we had a war department that became the Department of Defense. We're scared of the possibility of physics. We don't even want to talk about it. Literally no other occupation has lost free speech like physics. There is a special doctrine called restricted data that says you cannot write physics on a napkin. Even if you have nothing to do with the government, I think even if you're not an American.

1:43:57If it has anything that could possibly have to do with nuclear weapons. In other words, any advance that might have to do with nuclear weapons, you have to recognize that the instant you put pen to paper or you start talking to somebody, you're committing a violation of the 1917 Espionage Act. And if you think that's crazy, start exploring the words restricted data, the 1917 Espionage Act, 1946 and 1954 Atomic Energy Act, the doctrine of born secret. It is illegal to pursue Q -clearance data if you don't have a Q -clearance, but if you're creating Q -clearance data out of your own head as a byproduct of trying to do physics, you are actually potentially committing a capital offense.

1:44:50And your theory of everything. The theory you just talked to me about there. What does that mean for the average person that's listening to this in terms of... We don't know. ...that they should... Well, this is my point. Did Rutherford know what he was doing? No. So, I talk about this a lot, but I do think it's probably one of the greatest lyrics ever in any song. And unfortunately, it occurs in a song that got way too popular. The Baffled King composing Hallelujah, that line, a Baffled King does not realize what he is doing when he composes. Rutherford was a Baffled King. Maybe there is a neutral version of the proton.

1:45:35He was composing the end of the human race. And your ideas about the nature of reality. I'm a Baffled person. And your proposal is... I am Baffled. I don't know what it leads to. It's what I'm trying to tell you. But your assertion is that there's more than this dimension that we understand and move than I'm telling you. I'm telling you that I can name for you what particles there are left to be found. And what comes back to me is you don't have any predictions. And I'm thinking... This doesn't even make sense. Literally, I'm telling you, there are... Maybe there's a neutral version of the proton doesn't begin to talk about all the things that I'm talking about.

1:46:17So many new forces, so many new particles, ways to go in... There's no longer an arrow of time in my theory. So you could live forever theoretically? What does it mean?

1:46:33If you think about a final theory... And again, by the way, I just want to say something. I say my theory sometimes when I'm having to defend it, but it isn't mine. It just is. You know, Everest didn't belong to Sir Edmund Hillary or to Mallory or even to the surveyer for whom the mountain is named. When you chose to make the first descent on Everest, you just chose a route. And then you either did or did not traverse the route. We don't know whether Mallory may have succeeded. But my point is that this isn't my theory. There is a theory that's there. It might be wrong. It's possible. I may have screwed it up.

1:47:28But it's got so much in it that I have no idea what it means. And the simple way to understand this theory is that there's dimensions that exist beyond the ones that we know. We already know from Einstein that these dimensions are implicitly in Einstein's theory. Every single dimension that I'm talking about is being constructed out of the four that we began with. When I put the cups here and the coaster, the edges were calculated from the vertices and the faces were calculated from the edges. My point being these dimensions are already here. And because the dimensions are already here, they were already present in Einstein's theory all along.

1:48:13When you ask for what Einstein's real equation is, we actually don't think about it that way. We call it the Einstein field equations plural. How many of them are there? Ten. Why are there ten? Because there are six edges and four vertices that weren't accounted for. They're already in Einstein's theory.

1:48:42We just didn't take them seriously as directions you could go in. You've had about the simulation theory, haven't you? What, I don't want to talk about. Really? Well, again, it's the LLM problem. The really interesting thing comes from, I don't know, and maybe the cosmos is traversable. Maybe time's travel replaces time travel.

1:49:10You see, if I flip all of the dimensions of time and space, so I have one of time three of space in Einstein's theory. The time dimension gets a minus sign. The three spatial dimensions get a plus sign. And the three spatial dimensions are? X, Y, and Z. Z. Which is first -simple person depth with and height. Yeah, you can go forward, backwards, up, down. Okay, so we have three dimensions there. And then we have one of time because the conversation takes place over time. You're moving around. Now, flip the time dimension to being plus when it was minus before and all the plus dimensions to being minus.

1:49:50So now I have three time dimensions in one space dimension. It would look exactly the same.

1:49:58The one space dimension would take the function of time and the three time dimensions would have the function of space. We don't even teach people the idea that there is not necessarily an arrow of time if time is not one dimensional. The only dimension that has an arrow is one. If something has one dimension, you can say, and I tried to do this on Rogan. I said, if you have a cassette tape and you want to go back to an earlier song, again, your younger listeners will have no idea we're talking about. You have to go back through all of the songs before. But if you have a stylus on a turntable, some of them will be hipsters with vinyl in their own homes.

1:50:46You can lift the stylus up and it doesn't need to go back and unplay each song and reverse. Okay. You may be able to go back in time without going back through time.

1:51:02I don't know what this means, but it's a lot like saying maybe there's a neutral version of the proton. Now, what I'm concerned about is that essentially none of my physics friends know that there is a doctrine of restricted data. They've never heard of the 1946 and 54 -automic energy acts. They don't know that the Department of Energy that funds them is really the Department of Physics. They don't know the extent to which we went to hide all of this stuff. They don't know that they're not allowed to talk to foreign nationals from hostile nations on our own soil because of a doctrine called deemed exports.

1:51:37There's an entire hidden world of national security and the penalty for talking about national security with people who don't live that is that you're a conspiracy theorist. It's like, do you have any of this terminology? Do you know the acts? Do you want to Google it? Well, this is also just something that's really interesting about the UFO -UAP world. We had this admission recently that the government knew that at a minimum, and again, I don't think this is by anywhere close to the full story. At a minimum, there were secret fake special access programs. Do you know about special access programs?

1:52:15Super secret programs are called special access programs. Then there's a further category called Unacknowledged Special Access Programs, or USAPs, which is you can know that a special access program exists like, you know, maybe Warhead Recovery is a, might be a known one. But then, like, there might be an unacknowledged special access program which is like theft of foreign nuclear warheads, which, it's not even on the books, only the super secret lawmakers, you know, the gang of eight or whatever it is, can know that that exists. And then there are further designations of secretness. There's waived and bigoted, so you can have like a waived, bigoted, unacknowledged special access program.

1:53:02And you don't know any of this language. And then there's this chorus of morons who the instant you start to educate people about the existence of the super secret squirrel club, rise up and say, this is all conspiracy theory. And you're saying, wait a second, we just admitted in UFO UAP land that we have a fake special access program, which I predicted on Joe Rogan. I said, we may be faking a UFO situation. The cost and the penalty at a personal level for letting people know how the government keeps secrets is personal destruction. The US fake to UFO programs. Yes, correct. You don't know about this.

1:53:52I think the Wall Street Journal had an article about it. So these guys knew when they filed their reports on the UFO UAP that there actually is, at a minimum, a fake UFO UAP program. Why would they want to fake UFOs? This is so weird. Did you happen to watch Joe Rogan episode 1945 where I talked about the whole history of the Golden Age of General Relativity and its relationship to UFO UAP anti -gravity research in the atomic bomb? I didn't. Okay. When we invaded the beaches of Normandy on D -Day, that was called Operation Overlord. We had an entirely fake invasion planned of Norway called Operation Fortitude that was part of Operation Bodyguard, which is part of just total deception.

1:54:47And why? Because we were building up troops to do something huge. So we tried to convince, we like planted plans for the invasion of Norway on dead bodies to wash up on beaches so Germans would find them. We fake stuff all the time. That's what we do. And you can't talk about what we do that is deceptive without being ruined by what are called covert influence operations. Like if you'll watch my Twitter account, you'll see all sorts of accounts descend on it, fraud, charlatan, grifter, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Some of that is just people being mean. But you'll notice that, like, if I really start talking about physics and I start talking about security and I start talking about things that anyone can Google and most of us don't think to do it, suddenly it gets really, really intense.

1:55:44And the whole point is it's supposed to be untraceable. It's supposed to be a way in which, like almost certainly, we know a ton about what happened in the Wuhan Institute of Virology because of two bio -weapons conventions that we were signatories to, in which we ratified the Geneva Convention and a bio -weapons convention in the 1970s. But that's not top of mind for ordinary people. They just watched, you know, their great grandma die and they watch their children get sick and they watch their own brain fog. They can't know whether that was a bio weapon that we were working on coming out of the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill with Ralph Barrick's lab.

1:56:34You know, we're up to constant secret stuff. Why would they fake the UFOs, though? What was that distraction? You ever seen the B2 bar? Yeah. What if you saw that before we were ready to say it existed? Yeah, you'd think it was a UFO, wasn't it? So wouldn't it be better if we had a UFO story ready to go when we had cool aerospace? Oh, okay. So you're saying they're working on something which they didn't want you to know? What's more, what if we convinced China or Russia or Iran that we had incredible powers that they don't have? Then they might be very reluctant to strike us. Or they might waste a tremendous amount of money developing anti -gravity technology when there's no such thing.

1:57:21There are plenty of good reasons to fake such things. Why would we plan an invasion of Norway if we weren't going to invade? But if that's a distraction technique, do you have any hypothesis as to what was going on there? But that's not my job. Okay. Because as soon as you do that, I know that the quality of my guessing is not going to be at the quality of my detecting when we're up to bullshit. Okay. So in other words, if you ask me, why is physics stagnant? I can say, I don't know, but there's a decent chance that we know how dangerous physics is and that it's crazy to do it in an open university environment.

1:58:02We've taken precautions. We have a system of national laboratories, which are effectively our secret university system, where you have to be an American. So we're using our regular universities and the whole world comes through it. You know, we have Chinese people learning physics side by side our own people. And I guess you're saying that. You don't know if UFOs exist, but you're sure now that they were faking this? I am absolutely positive that we have unacknowledged programs that have UFO written on the side of them. Okay. In other words, the number of people who repeat, who repeat strikingly similar things, who appear to be completely sober in every other respect with no known acting ability, there is no way in the world that these people just spontaneously have decided to destroy their sanity, their career, and their reputation.

1:58:53I've got you. And a minimum we're faking. I think we are doing a lot more than faking a UFO program. I don't know what it is. And I also would not be talking about this on a large podcast, but for one thing. I have a particular hatred for one aspect of our intelligence community. And I don't mean that I disagree or don't like or I'm not uncomfortable. When our secret squirrel club inside the intelligence world, and inside in particular covert operations, targets are own people who are not read into these programs for personal destruction, reputational destruction, mental destruction, economic destruction.

1:59:42We take our best people and we make fun of them. And we belittle them. And we destroy their families, their lives, their ability to earn. I have a very strong sense that you never destroy your best people. Do you think you're under attack? Let me talk about Leo Zillard instead. Leo Zillard is the father of the Manhattan Project. Which was the way the nuclear bomb was created? That's right. He was not allowed to go inside the Manhattan Project because they didn't trust him. He was a genius. He was the idea for the Manhattan Project. He and Einstein made sure that it happened. The government barely trusted Oppenheimer if you saw the film.

2:00:27What they did with Leo Zillard was they minded him. They knew how good he was. They knew how important he was. They listened to him and they didn't destroy him. He undoubtedly knew that the program was going on. But he wasn't allowed inside the program. I think that's okay. I think it's okay that our security state recognizes that some people are not cut out to keep secrets. Some people are not cut out to die with certain facts that have to be kept hidden. That's fine. The desire of our government to destroy people who have no idea what they've tripped over because our government isn't good enough to keep its own secrets.

2:01:15This is an abomination. You cannot destroy your AT. Who are you referring to when you say people are being destroyed and you're referring to people like yourself? You know, if you look at, for example, Jeffrey Epstein. Jeffrey Epstein conducted a conference called Confronting Gravity. I don't know who Jeffrey Epstein was, but I would certainly bet money that he was a product of at least one or more elements of the intelligence community. The CIA, the FBI. Those are ours. Department of Homeland Security has some of the stuff geospatial intelligence has some of this. It's a large network. I'm talking about people like David Grush.

2:02:07I'm talking about people potentially like David Fraver. I'm talking about people like Jake Barber. I'm talking about scientists like Leo Zillard. Imagine if Leo Zillard didn't know that the Manhattan Project was going on. Or Jack Raper, a journalist who broke a story. These people all think that they're doing their jobs.

2:02:33I desperately want to know why Jeffrey Epstein knew so much about my work. And I want to know why he was connected to my graduate program. I was in the Harvard Mathematics Department. Jeffrey Epstein was absolutely connected to the Harvard Math Department. I want to know why. How was he connected to that department? You're pushing me to say things I'm not going to say. I'm not trying to push you. I understand. But I'm just not going to do it. I'm saying that anybody who wants to. You say he was connected to the math department? He was a Harvard Mathematics Department. How did you know he was connected?

2:03:11You can Google it. You can Google it right now. This is not... I can point at all sorts of stuff that's hidden in plain sight. So I'll take your word for it. And the assertion that I'm picking up on is that Jeffrey Epstein was planted in your world to keep... I'm not saying he's planted. I don't know who he was. I don't know who ran him. He certainly was not a financier in any standard sense. Really? That was a cover story, yes. The way that we know Jeffrey Epstein in the UK especially is just this guy who was this rich guy who had this island who brought people there and then did these despicable things.

2:03:47Disgraced financier Jeffrey Epstein. Yeah, that's what we... Disgraced financier Jeffrey Epstein. It's called Perseveration. He was a disgraced financier. What kind of a financier disgraced one? What was his name? Oh, it was disgraced financier Jeffrey Epstein. They perseverate that into your mind so that you auto -complete that in your LLM life. Do you believe that that's what Jeffrey Epstein was? You met him. Yeah. I can tell that like... I can tell that like... He was a financier. He wasn't a financier the day I met him. What was he? He was a weird guy who didn't seem to know a lot about currency trading.

2:04:26Claiming to run a multi -billion dollar FX hedge fund. When you say a weird guy, what made him weird? Same stuff I've said on Chris Williams. I'm not going to go back through that. My point is you're getting a different interview, right? So what I'm trying to get at is... Jeffrey Epstein knew a tremendous amount about my work when nobody knew anything about my work. And he had a pipeline into me that I didn't understand, which is that he was connected to my graduate program. And you can check out the conference called Exploring Gravity. Fundhouse and Physical Workshop called Confronting Gravity.

2:05:02Confronting Gravity, that's right. In March 2006. Yeah, what is Jeffrey Epstein's very focused on gravity? Was it a gravity conference? Yeah. It was about gravity. What the fuck was he doing talking about bloody gravity? Who's a finance, yeah? It was very important to get Nobel laureates and some of the smartest people on earth to come to the Virgin Islands and talk about gravity. Stephen Hawking was there, David Gross was there, Lawrence Kraus was there, Lisa Randall was there, right before his conviction. And I'm telling you, he was very focused on the Harvard Math Department. And he knew all about me in ways that he wasn't supposed to.

2:05:41I have to be clear, I have to be clear on my understanding of what you're saying. From what I understood, and you can say, Stephen, what's going on, whatever, but I just have to, because you've opened up a curiosity hole in my mind. So let me try and fill it. Even if it's the conversation I will criticize. I'll just devade you. Fine. Yeah, yeah. My friend, you're within the right to invade me. And I hold the right to ask, which is, so is what I'm hearing is you believe, and I'm just going to say how I think it is what I'm hearing is you believe that Jeffrey, Jeffrey Epstein was not a financier.

2:06:11He was planted in some way to, it was a construct, he was what I said, he was a construct. In some way to mess with the progression of physics. Jeffrey Epstein, apparently, I think some, I'll tell you what I said, when I met him, when the meeting was over, I immediately called my wife. And I said, I have just met a construct. She said, what do you mean? I said, this person is not who they claim to be. Somebody has constructed this human being to be something that they are not, which is a hedge fund genius. Somebody who could understand the euro in the end like nobody else, bullshit. Not true.

2:06:56I believe that whoever constructed Jeffrey Epstein was running multiple different programs through the same thing, having put in a large initial investment. It wasn't about one thing. If you build a mall, you don't just have clothing stores in the mall, you have a food court in the mall. Right? You have jewelry in the mall. You have all sorts of different things in the mall. Jeffrey Epstein was a construct of something that was running multiple things. One of those things was science. And I don't think the science and the pedophilia were in necessarily in the same bucket. He was funding all sorts of people.

2:07:35I don't think everybody at that, you know, part of the problem with calling his plane the Lolita Express and calling his island pedophile island is that you just can't see all the different things that were going through this guy. I don't think almost any of the scientists are exposed, you know, maybe a few of them, but very few of them, to anything really horrible. I think he was trying to keep a periscope on everything that was interesting. And I think that his girlfriend's father, Robert Maxwell, was all through scientific publishing. And I think Pergamon Press was in part a control mechanism for making sure that revolutionary discoveries were taking place within a framework.

2:08:26Anybody can look, you can write a sub -stack article and you can hit post. And suddenly the world has access to your sub -stack article. That is a nightmare. What if somebody posts, you know, weaponized anthrax? What if they do the equivalent of saying what if there's a neutral pro -ta? So you think he was controlling science? I think that Robert Maxwell was in part trying to control science. I think Jeffrey Epstein was in part trying to fund science, trying to control it. I don't really know. Again, you know, part of the problem with Wythand Spiracy theorist have a bad name. Is that they're not content to live in ignorance.

2:09:09And I am. I know something is really off with this story. If you look at me saying things like you don't know whether Biden is going to make it to November, Ha, ha, ha, Eric, you know, wouldn't it, you plop, plop, plop, plop, okay? Then he has a debate. He doesn't make it to November. You know, I'm not no Stradamus. I'm just dumb enough to say something in public that makes sense. Let me say something in public that makes sense. Our national security people suck at their jobs. The people who are in charge of the Department of Energy, which is masking the Department of Physics, which is masking the Department of Nuclear Weapons.

2:09:53Right? The atomic energy acts, which are really about atomic weaponry. Recast as Adams for Peace or who knows what? Jeffrey Epstein, who is not a disgraced financeeer. The newspapers that have always had a national interest component and heavily A's on so that they can work with the CIA and the State Department and they do each other's bidding and scratch each other. This whole network is what I've called managed reality. We live in managed reality. We are all in some version of the Truman Show. And you can look at it. You can Google it. I can give you a million search terms. And every time I give a million search terms, you'll watch my reputation.

2:10:33Get torn apart. Are you going to blame me that you didn't know what the whole of society approach is? Because you didn't know the Daniel Inaway Center for Security and the Pacific came up with an idea for soft fascism to fight hybrid wars. You didn't know what hybrid warfare. Look at my talk at Ark, Jordan Peterson's group. He is Alliance for Responsible Citizenship. It's at almost two million views. And why is it? Because people are saying, I didn't know these terms. Did you know what the Human Terrain project is? You know about human terrain. You're a mountain. I'm a valley. And instead of war planners figuring out how do we use that valley to capture that mountain top because it gives us an eagle's nest to snipe from or whatever.

2:11:16They say, okay, this is the second most powerful podcast in the world. Seconded Joe Rogan, how do we capture him? Fuck. Leave me alone. No, but it's one for him to say you're human terrain. Yeah. When the human terrain wakes up and says, wait a minute, I'm human terrain. What my feeling is, if you don't want me to talk about this on a podcast, then keep your term separate. Nobody knew the term pre -bunked malin information. Do you know what pre -bunked malin information? Malin information is information we don't want to get out. Technically, people try to pretend that it's information that will be misinterpreted.

2:11:57But really, it's real stuff that is deleterious to the narratives that we're trying to push forward and what we're trying to do. And pre -bunked means discredited. So we know it debunked. We have to debunk this information. We get that. But you didn't know that we had to pre -bunk malin information, which is we have to destroy truth tellers. What do you think that means for people like me as podcasts is? You know, because we're doing these long -form conversations, I... You'll snap back. You'll say that was a really interesting talk. And then you'll have somebody else on. We'll be talking about the importance of melatonin and how we don't understand the role of sleep.

2:12:40And then you'll have somebody else, you know, on who will be talking about how do you do a clothing brand from scratch and turn it into a billion dollar unicorn? You're not going to stay here on this topic. This is your time with me. And it'll have some effect and it'll start to fade. And that's what this is. I'd love to be doing my podcast. I just don't know how to do it safely. I want to talk about taking our lives back from the intelligence community. I want to talk about taking our lives back from Silicon Valley, even though those people are my friends. I want to talk about taking my life back from the phone, from despair, from not having a future.

2:13:30I want to talk about having a glorious existence that is not mediated by morons who sit inside the beltway and play with large budgets and heart people, particularly really good people who are good at their job, who are trying to figure out how to advance humankind, their family, the national interest, and get fouled. I did not ask for Jeffrey Epstein to fall into my life. I met him once. But it was enough to know Holy Cow, the Harvard math department can't be what I think it is. Why was he there? I didn't even, I never heard his name when I was there. Is that what you met him in, in, in, no, of it?

2:14:12No, no, no. I think what a very powerful people at JP Morgan told me I needed to meet him. You didn't want to talk about finance. You wanted to talk about science. You can't do your part cause safely. My employer was a special informant to the FBI. He's like one of my closest friends. I'm not going to say who it is. You're employee, yeah. Yeah, and one of my closest friends.

2:14:46I live under a periscope. Practice scope is really what I meant. But yeah, I don't, I want to do physics, man. I'm really, really good at it. You know? And if we have an idea that we shouldn't do physics in public, I would like to have a call from somebody inside. Hey Eric, we need you to come in. Okay, great. What's up? But I didn't use your resources. I didn't use your grants. Nobody ever informed me. My God, nobody ever informed me about restricted data. How many people on earth know that there's a doctrine that says physicists don't have free speech? We can execute you for doing your job. It's never been tested in the courts, and I hope that the Supreme Court will not allow that.

2:15:43But you know, if we have a problem that is so serious in theoretical physics, that it needs the world's largest exemption from free speech. We need to amend the Constitution. You can't just do this as a sneak attack, where you reserve the right casually to hook the 1917 Espionage Act up against the 1946 and 54 -tomac Energy Act. I've canvassed my physics colleagues. You know, one of the memes against me, which is very funny, is that no physicists take me seriously when I'm in their offices all the time.

2:16:23I just don't know what my life is. And with this latest advent of war in the Middle East, are you really going to pretend that if you can Google all of these things that I have no idea what I'm talking about?

2:16:39I'm looking to have a conversation with my own government. I'm looking to have a conversation about theoretical physics. And I can do it quietly, but I have rights, and I do not believe that the 1946 and 1954 atomic energy acts are constitutional. Try me. There is no restricted data. You can't do that to an American. And you can't just keep mounting covert influence campaigns, you know.

2:17:13I just spent five days in the physics department. I'm not allowed to say that it was five days in the physics department as a visitor. I give a talk. I'm not allowed to say that I give a talk.

2:17:25I don't know what this is.

2:17:30And I've tired of it, you know, it's just like...

2:17:39If you're managing the Middle East this badly, if you're managing physics this badly, if you're managing the national economy this badly, if you screwed up COVID this badly by getting inside of the Lancet and nature, you know, peer review is this fake thing that supposedly stretches back to the founding of the Royal Society. And it's very clear from the scholarship around it that it comes out of the period between 1965 and 1975 initiated by the Medicare Act, predicated on the need for editors for the journal expansion founded by Pergamon Press and Robert Maxwell. By 1975, there's a giant battle between the NSF and both fiscal and cultural conservatives against something called man, a course of study or mecos where peer review was born in a Utah clinic, came out of the medical literature because the federal government in 1965 with the Medicare Act picked up the need to pay for so many medical procedures.

2:18:46They wanted to say why are we assigning this many medical procedures. The doctors circled the wagons and said we will peer review each other. Then in 1975, the NSF was under the microscope and they used peer review as a self -defense of last resort to say we will be reviewing each other. Right? Peer review is a myth.

2:19:10The scholarship is clear as day. I can't keep going on the world's largest podcast saying everything that can be Googled and figured out and just constantly have as my reward that the government refuses to have a conversation with me and sends its gaggle of idiots to harass me. You think it's doing that? It's sending a gaggle? Yes, I do. I do think that some of them are actual idiots who just enjoy having causing problems but I think more than anything, we have a real problem. Science is too powerful. If you wanted to just cut to the ultimate core of this. If for amino acids can shut down planet Earth, if what is it a nine -page paper solving the double -spend problem can create a new currency not backed by violence but backed by mathematics.

2:20:13If the concept of an inner product in a large vector space generates something you can't tell isn't a human being. In 2017, do you have any idea what the power of the human mind is at this point? Linear algebra can create something that you would fall in love with. It can create the most beautiful music you can imagine or can animate a photo of a dead relative so that you can actually have the experience of having some video of you with a great -grandparent you can't even remember. Science is the most amazing, powerful, crazy stuff possible and we spend a fortune trying to convince people that scientists are worthless, that scientists are incapable.

2:21:05And in large measure they've convinced the scientists themselves. My colleagues, the supposed physicists, will spend their entire lives pretending to do physics and retire without having actually done any. I was in this physics department, I was just in, it's been a long time since I've spent that long as a visitor. The top people in this physics department, professed that they had no interest in the physical world, that they only cared about the mathematics that they were doing. I just thought you're in a theoretical physics group and you profess openly that you have no interest whatsoever in the physical world.

2:21:50Well done. I don't know who you were, I don't know how you did it, but it took you four decades to get the physicists to stop caring about the physical world. Somehow what we did is we stopped the world's most powerful and the world's most important group for making progress. And why Elon Musk is not out here saving this by just throwing a few billion at it, you know, Elon if you're out there, it's at Astrea, yes or no, Mars is a stopgap message. Do you want to go to the stars? Is there something we don't know to the Department of Energy? Do you want to have conversations? Is there anyone at all out here?

2:22:34That's my question. That's why I do the podcasts. And it's, by the way, I'm repeating myself, I've said this before, send lawyers, guns, and money, there's no one out here.

2:22:45But I will say this, if we could get out of here, you know, in terms of transcendence, in terms of things that are really exciting, there's nothing that I had greater pleasure at as a father than taking my children from me to your showers. We take the dog, go to a secret location outside of Los Angeles, that's quite dark. We just lie under the sky and watch for hours, you know, and look up at the heavens and think, my God, that's a destination, that someplace I could go. I don't think that there's a more inspiring thing than to figure out the infinity of space, all of these galaxies and the deep field photographs of these space telescopes, filled with worlds, more stuck here.

2:23:33It's like, it's enough already, time to go, let's have some fun. That's really what I'm excited about. It's been great to be here. Thank you for being here. Super fascinating, and it's spent my brain in several different directions at the same time.

2:23:55I want to bring it back to the person who's got to the end of this conversation and mess out at home in their box of shorts, maybe listening on their iPhone as they fall asleep, wherever they are in the world or on a train or plan or whatever, and allow you to offer them some kind of closing message that might make their life better in some way. It's a broad brief, but I think it's the most important brief, which is, you know, having heard everything we've talked about today. What advice would you give the listener an actionable piece of advice so that they could live a subjectively better life?

2:24:35The songs of Tom Lehrer are pretty terrific, as are the operettas of Gilbert and Sullivan. You might want to explore the Azores as well as the Indonesian archipelago. Indonesian is one of the easiest languages to learn because it's been denuded of most of the complexity that screw up people have hard time learning other languages. By a poster of Tropical Fruit, and make sure that you visit every single one on that poster before it's time for lights out, consider box B minor Mass and the cello suites particularly by Pablo Cassal's and take a serious listen to Evacacity singing Stormy Mundo in an album called Live from Blues Alley to see if you really know how to feel things.

2:25:18I think Professor Longhair's big chief is one of the most brilliant pieces of piano music. It's absolutely inspiring. If you really like that, James Carroll Booker III has an album called The Resurrection of the Bayou Maharaja. Seriously think about visiting the island of St. Helena in the South Atlantic. Take a look at Kurt Gimengl's channel. He's doing amazing stuff being done by no one else on Earth. I think that Chris Buck is really amazing and if you think that Crossroads is good, have a listen to his version of Miss You by the Rolling Stones. An incredible groove and I didn't really appreciate it the first time I heard it.

2:25:58I think that the people making spark amps at positive grid and my friends at NURL DSP with the Quad Cortex will blow your mind with how much great audio equipment you can make. You can get a good electric guitar for a few hundred bucks thanks to advances in China. Put it into an open tuning and by yourself a slide or just slide a glass along it and you'll be able to play most songs that you care about within a minute or two. Maybe three because you only need three chords. Get married. It may not work out. It may be miserable. Have some kids. There's nothing else great to do on this planet at least give it a try.

2:26:40And if your parents won't pressure you to do it, I'm happy to do it. Try to keep this thing going. Try to keep this thing going. Try to dream big about legacy. Don't feel embarrassed about wanting to conquer the world or leave a permanent stain. Get out of this moment where everybody's worried about narcissism and drama. Listen for media showers. They're announced regularly. Nobody actually does anything about them. And it's worth inconveniencing yourself with people you love and take the dog. Really seriously think about you, whether you want to pile on when you see what is almost certainly a federal or other campaign targeting people who are standing up for you, whether they're trying to figure out where COVID came from trying to figure out who was behind Jeffrey Epstein.

2:27:30Recognize it almost everything you've been taught to do in terms of hating Israel as part of somebody's campaign out of cutter. The situation in Gaza is incredibly dire. Don't stop caring about the people who are living under that. Recognize that the Persians are not the Mollis get involved. Wish your wish your country's leadership well, even if you didn't vote for them and you think that they're horrible people. They've got very hard work to do. Be good to each other. Try. It's a grand adventure. And make sure you have some fun before it slides out.

2:28:10We have a closing tradition where the last guest leaves a question for the next guest not knowing who they're leaving it for. And the question that was left for you. I love this question. What is the problem that you are doing the most mental gymnastics to avoid?

2:28:32Pass.

2:28:38No, I know the answer. It's not appropriate for your audience.

2:28:46One of the things about being in the hot seat on podcasts is that it is not right to force anyone to respond to a question. I know how to falsify an answer to that and I'm not going to do that and I'm not going to share the answer to that question because it's not appropriate. But it's a great question. Feel free to leave it for someone else. This doesn't seem fair. Whoever you were, thank you for the question. Obviously, my reaction was just tremendous curiosity, which would be a natural reaction to what you just said. Thank you for a great interview. Thank you so much for being here. I really appreciate you.

2:29:19It's so unbelievably fascinating. And you've given me so much. Unfortunately, you've given me a lot of answers, but you've given me even more questions. And maybe that's the product of a good. You live in LA. Yeah. We'll do it again. Thank you so much for your time. I appreciate you. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks. We launched these conversation cards and they sold out and we launched them again and they sold out again. We launched them again and they sold out again because people love playing these with colleagues at work, with friends at home, and also with family. And we've also got a big audience that used them as journal prompts.

2:29:49Every single time a guest comes on the diar of a CEO, they leave a question for the next guest in the diary. And I've sat here with some of the most incredible people in the world and they've left all of these questions in the diary. And I've ranked them from one to three in terms of the depth. One being a starter question and level three, if you look on the back here, this is a level three, becomes a much deeper question that builds even more connection. If you turn the cards over and you scan that QR code, you can see who answered the card and watch the video of them answering it in real time.

2:30:22So if you would like to get your hands on some of these conversation cards, go to the diary .com or look at the link in the description below.

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