In short
Podcast Notes: The Diary Of A CEO with Steven Bartlett
Episode Title
Highlight: How To Actually Become Disciplined WITHOUT Willpower… The Leading Behaviour Expert
Episode Summary In this episode, Steven Bartlett interviews Chase Hughes, a respected expert in human behavior, who discusses the concept of discipline as a skill that can be cultivated rather than an inherent trait. Hughes provides actionable strategies on how individuals can enhance their discipline through small changes in habits and mindset.
Key Concepts Discussed
- Definition of Discipline:
- Discipline is defined as the ability to prioritize the needs of your future self over your present self.
- The Importance of Small Changes:
- Starting small is crucial for building discipline.
- Making small adjustments in daily routines can lead to significant changes over time.
- Dopamine and Gratitude:
- The concept of looking back with gratitude can generate 'discipline dopamine'.
- Using past experiences positively can motivate present actions.
- Habit Formation vs. Goal Setting:
- Focus on building habits rather than solely setting goals.
- Habits should be seen as byproducts of a desired outcome, making the outcome feel less daunting.
- The Discipline Equation:
- Hughes introduces an equation to understand discipline:
``` (Why + Psychological Reinforcement) - (Perceived Cost) = Discipline ```
Key Takeaways
- Future Self Perspective:
- By prioritizing the future self, individuals can make decisions that enhance their discipline.
- Creating a Supportive Environment:
- Setting up one’s environment to make positive choices easier is essential (e.g., prepping coffee at night for morning ease).
- Reinforcement and Emotion:
- Emotional reasons for pursuing a goal (the 'why') can drive discipline.
- Positive reinforcement can help solidify habits.
- Agitation and Disruption:
- Disrupting routine can help eliminate old patterns and encourage new behavior.
- Visualization:
- Utilizing vision boards to repeatedly expose oneself to desired outcomes can create emotional connections to goals.
Practical Strategies
- Prepare for your day the night before to reduce morning friction.
- Small rewards for past actions can create a feedback loop of gratitude.
- Write notes to your future self as reminders of your goals and motivations.
- Use visual reminders, such as vision boards or daily affirmations, to stay focused on goals.
Conclusion Chase Hughes emphasizes that discipline is not an innate quality but rather a skill that can be developed through intentionality and practice. By understanding one’s motivations and making conscious adjustments to habits and environments, individuals can enhance their ability to stay disciplined and work toward their goals effectively.
Additional Resources
- Listen to Full Episode:
- [Spotify](https://g2ul0.app.link//qeaGbuGkwRb)
- [Apple](https://g2ul0.app.link//cFLUNTJkwRb)
- Watch Episodes on YouTube:
- [YouTube Channel](https://www.youtube.com/c/%20TheDiaryOfACEO/videos)
- Chase Hughes' Website:
- [Chase Hughes](https://chasehughes.com/)
- Steven Bartlett's Links:
- [Instagram](https://www.instagram.com/steven)
- [LinkedIn](https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevenbartlett-123)
This episode serves as a valuable resource for anyone looking to deepen their understanding of discipline and behavior modification.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:01The Direvcio's brought you by Progressive Insurance. Do you ever think about switching insurance companies to see if you could save some cash? Progressive makes it easy. Just drop in some details about yourself and see if you're eligible to save money when you bundle your home and auto policies. The process only takes minutes and it could mean hundreds more in your pocket. Visit progressive .com after this episode to see if you could save. Progressive casualty insurance company and affiliates. Potential savings were very not available in all states. How do I fix my discipline if I'm an ill -disciplined person?
0:34Understanding what discipline is is the most critical element and I define this differently the most people. So I define discipline as your ability to prioritize the needs of your future self ahead of your own, present self. That's it. That's all it discipline is. I'm prioritizing the needs of future me. You're trying to think of a... No, I was thinking of two scenarios. The scenario one is I go home tonight, right? Because I go to sleep, I get to bed early and there's this other thing I'm thinking about doing after this which is going to the gym. And I'm like, as you're saying, I was thinking both help future me.
1:16So I was like, which one is disciplined? I think they both be disciplined. Okay. So the moment that we start understanding that, if I could just make decisions that are prioritizing future me, then we go back to where am I getting my dopamine from? And I want past tense me to be a source of dopamine for present tense me. Because most of us look back with regret. I shouldn't have drank that much. I shouldn't have mouthed off at the family reunion. Whatever it is, I shouldn't have overslept. If I can start looking backwards with gratitude, that's the fastest way to make discipline dopamine generating.
1:59So the tricks are to start small. So like when I go to bed at night, I will pop open the little curig coffee thing and stick the thing in there, put a cup under there, everything's like ready to go. So when I wake up in the morning, I just go bam, and everything's ready. I'll get my clothes out, everything kind of lined up ready to put on for the next day. So I'm lowering the threshold of how much attention I'm spending. So I'm going to set my life up in every single way that I possibly can as if I were a butler for future me. So when I wake up in the morning, all this stuff set out, my laundry's laid out, my checklist for what I need to do for the day, all the stuff I'm got to get on a plane is all laid out by the back door.
2:43I can grab it and jump in the car. Everything that I could possibly do to make my future self go, oh man, that's awesome. And look backwards with gratitude, I'm going to do it. I'll take a hundred dollar bill or maybe a few hundred dollar bills every spring or summer and I'll stick them in a jacket pocket that I'm not going to use until the winter. And I'll forget about it. And in the winter, I'm looking and now I become a source of dopamine. Past tense me is becoming a source of dopamine for present tense me. That forces me to look in the future along with like printing that old me photo and putting it all over the house.
3:21But everything that I can possibly do to make myself look backwards with gratitude is what I'm going to start doing. But you have to start small. It's like just going overboard is going to be crazy. And even writing a little post at note to yourself and sticking it in a jacket or maybe a dress shoe that you're not going to wear for a few months, it means so much to find that and it's from you. It's not from a loved one. You did it. So you're looking backwards with like, wow, that's amazing. So you're now getting in love and sending gratitude backwards, which automatically means that what's going forwards is concern and care.
4:04The moment I'm always looking back with gratitude, the concern is always going forward in the future. And the concern for present goes away. And I'm going to push that concern to the right out in the future. People struggle even with the small things, right? Like getting, because it's funny because I watched a video last night about a lady that went to YouTube and started her journey of weight loss and whatever. And she was very, I think she was 400 pounds or something. And she was trying to get down. And in the video, you watched some people all know him referring to over this base of a year or two years, she actually just gains weight.
4:41She gets to I think five, five hundred pounds or something. And as I was watching it, you're watching someone who's saying, I want to change my life. But then it's coming on every day and say, I've just gained three pounds, I've just gained another three pounds. And there's almost this, this like visible dissonance that you're observing between this person saying they want to change their life. But clearly the actions that they're then taking are like different to that. And many people can relate to that feeling of, I want to be this person. I mean, we're coming up to like, we're at, for anyone that doesn't know, we're recording this in December.
5:14So news resolutions around the corner. Everyone's going to say to themselves who they want to become. But it's easier said than done. I think one, seven, eight, eight percent, nine percent of me as resolutions will stick. Yeah. So is it just a case of starting small or is there any other tricks to discipline that you can offer? It's starting small and realizing that all of our lives are about habits, not goals, but what are the habits that make my goal a byproduct? Everything is about byproducts in your whole life, whether you know it or not. So instead of setting goals set like the byproduct, what are the byproducts I want to have for this year?
5:48And then what are the habits that make that up? So what the big mistake most people make is they see somebody like you, you go to the gym very often, you probably eat really clean. I know you don't drink alcohol because I brought you a flask and gave it to your team. But they took it. They did. So somebody who doesn't live a very disciplined life would look at you and say, God, I want to be like Steven. He's got all this discipline going to the gym. But they don't understand that you go into the gym isn't discipline. It's a habit. So you're not like forcing yourself to go do something. You're doing something that's a habit for you.
6:30The discipline only is necessary. You only need like a teaspoon of it at the very beginning to get this habit started. So start micro habits first and then bigger habits. So the discipline is not something that you should be seeing. If you're seeing someone eat healthy and go to the gym, do all the stuff you want to do. Those are habits. And that person, you're not seeing a discipline at work right there. You're seeing a habit. The discipline was just at the beginning. And I think if more people knew that, that you're just exercising a little discipline at the very beginning and then it's just, that's just what you do.
7:06It's like somebody who sees someone brushing their teeth every day. Like, wow, that's so much discipline. It's just what we do. It's a habit. There's an interesting part of this, like, habit equation you could say or like discipline equation, which is the why part, which is like, why does this matter to you? And is it important to get really clear on why this thing matters to you, whether it's the gym or because I was playing around with this discipline equation, I did for my last book. And the kind of conclusion I landed at was that to be disciplined, you have to understand the reason why something matters to you.
7:45You can say that in other words. Yeah. Plus the psychological reinforcement you get from the pursuit of the thing, minus the, you could say the psychological or perceived cost of the pursuit of the thing. So in the context of brushing your teeth, I think I know where it matters, right? Because if I don't then I have to get to the dentist my teeth fall out. I look, I believe, whatever it might be. Yeah. The, is it rewarding and fun to do now, not really? And minus the cost of the pursuit, it takes two minutes. It's not that bad. But when that nets out, the why is stronger, thankfully, on net than the cost.
8:23So the behavior happens. Yeah. But the key part of this equation here is the why part. Like it's not the key part, but it's a central part is the why part. Why does the thing matter to you? Yeah. And, and how much why? Like how big is the why? Yeah. Because if, if the why is I need enjoyment in the present moment, then no other why will be bigger. No discipline, why will ever be larger? The only why will be why am I eating these Cheetos right now or why am I drinking 20 beers every night? Because that's the only why. So I think once the why starts edging its way into the future, that's, that's the moment where you break the discipline spiral and you get out of that because your wives are extending into time that hasn't happened yet.
9:17Does that equation stack up for you? I'm saying this, I like it a lot because I've been trying, I've been saying it. I wrote about this in my book. The whole idea is why plus like we can say reinforcement, a minus, you can say cost, just to simplify it. Yeah. But is there anything missing from this equation? Do you think is there anything? I said it to Simon Sinek and he went, let's try it out and he talked to me about taking his bin out in the morning, like taking the bin out for like the bin man. And it kind of holds up because he's, say, the why is if I don't take the bin out, then I'm going to get fined and my bin is going to overflow.
9:50Pretty strong motivator. The reinforcement, there's no reinforcement getting out of bed at 7 AM, take your bin out. It's not nice. The cost is also significant getting out of bed. But the why is still so is why plus you can say like why plus the cycle of core reinforcement from the pursuit of doing it. So DJing, really fun for me. I would say there's, it would be divided by the cost of inaction. The cost of inaction would, would either add to it, but it's always going to be your perception of the why, your perception of the cost and your perception of the cost of an action. And all of that is going to be about, can I use, can I leverage my focus, the mammalian authority over myself in some way, over that mammalian part of my brain, force myself out of bed, force these habits to start developing.
10:43And then tribe are my friends involved. Have I made a public agreement about something? And then the emotion, which I think would be the why. And like that's the emotional driver that animal can understand. You visualizing yourself better, like looking with a six pack or whatever it is, but printing it on a vision board. This is why I think vision boards are so important, not because we're manifesting something out of the universe. Maybe it is, but we're definitely showing something that a dog can understand. It's imagery and dog, dog can understand images. So we're routinely exposing ourselves to these vision boards on a very regular basis.
11:27And if you follow the brainwashing formula, which is focus, emotion, agitation, and repetition, it spells fear. And that is the best way to brainwash yourself to form these new habits and goals. So how can I get myself to focus? How can I build the emotion, which is the why? Recurring emotion, not just one at the very beginning. How can I continue to make it emotional? Or maybe I can make the cost of an action emotional. They're making by the app that makes me look fat or one of those things. And then agitation is if I'm waking up habituation, which you just talked about, if I'm waking up at the same house every day that I've been fat in, let's say I wanted to lose weight or whatever, the same house every day that I've lived X way in.
12:14I'm seeing the same hallway, same rug, same couch, everything looks the same. My brain says, Oh, I'm here. I'm going to follow that script because our brain writes scripts for us to save us time. So agitation means I'm going to disrupt my environment so much. And so often that my brain has no chance to default to an older script. South clients that repaint their house, they rearrange their furniture, they change up their wardrobe a whole lot, they get a completely new haircut. So they're not even looking at the same person in the mirror anymore. They do everything you can to disrupt that rhythm.
12:48It's exactly what we would do with a detainee. If we were trying to brainwash someone who is in an intelligence interrogation. So I'm disrupting environment like crazy. And what will we do with the dog? Are we going to let it do everything it's always done? Are we going to change that environment? We're going to change the behavior, change the lease, change the collar. So it's not everything exactly the same. And then repetition, repetition, which is just repeating the same thing over and over. So like if even just coming to the vision board, a last client I had, I had him go to Best Buy and get a 70 inch TV and then get one of those cheap tablets, those $300, $200 tablets.
13:31And just duct tape it to the back of the TV and put his vision point vision board on that thing. It's like 900 slides of just nonstop photos, but it runs 24 hours a day in his office. Even if he's not there, he walks in the morning, it's on nonstop repetition. Because him having to turn it off at night means he's got another point of discipline. I've got to turn that TV on, start that little PowerPoint thing. But that's nonstop and it's just nonstop exposure. So can I generate focus? That's a lot of focus on the goals. Then there's emotion. You're seeing all of that agitation, which is disrupting my life patterns and repetition, which is just over and over and over.
14:14How can I re expose you to the same stimuli? I re expose myself to the same stimuli.
14:23If you're someone running a business today, that means you're probably operating in a world that doesn't sit still. Tariffs and trade policies are dynamic customer expectations shift constantly. And the pace of innovation is relentless. So your margin of error is becoming increasingly smaller, making decisions without full visibility across your business is not only risky, but it inevitably slows down everything. And I see it all the time, businesses with the right ideas, but they're stuck because they're spread across five systems that don't talk to each other. Many of my companies now use our sponsor NetSuite by Oracle, which has an AI powered business management suite that allows you to see your business more clearly.
15:00Everything from financials to HR to operations lives in one place. So instead of chasing information, you've got it all in front of you. It operates in real time so you can forecast with assurance, spot problems before they even become problems and generally move you faster without blind spots. If your business is generating seven figures or more, there's a free ebook that's worth your time reading. It's called Navigating Global Trade three insights for leaders. And you can download it now from net suite dot com slash Bartlett. That's net suite dot com slash Bartlett. I'll link it below.
From the publisher
Discipline isn’t something you either have or don’t—it’s something you build. Chase Hughes, a leading expert in human behaviour breaks down how small changes in your habits and mindset can transform your ability to stay disciplined. Learn how to leverage focus, emotion, and repetition to create powerful, lasting habits.
Listen to the full episode here -
Spotify- https://g2ul0.app.link//qeaGbuGkwRb
Apple - https://g2ul0.app.link//cFLUNTJkwRb
Watch the Episodes On Youtube - https://www.youtube.com/c/%20TheDiaryOfACEO/videos
Chase: https://chasehughes.com/
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