Jürgen Klopp: Would You Go Back To Manage LFC...? The Real Reason I Fell In Love With Liverpool!

30:33Yeah, from the first seven games we won six and drew one. And we stayed in the league pretty comfortably. Comfortably is incredible. We were a bunch of friends. They were all my friends and I was their boss. They had to tell me that I changed from now on in the coach's dressing room. What are you doing here? Here's the coach's dressing room. That's your office. Okay. The first night we had a twin room. Yeah. so and i got one more game to sleep there with my friend you and crumley they're in the same room and then next day they all told me yeah you have you get your own room oh okay so but all the rest we were a real bunch of of friends and they respected me from day from the first second what was your approach going into that you you go from being a player to a manager of these boys like what what what's in your mind are you thinking i'm just gonna let them do whatever they want to do, I'm going to...

31:25We had Wolfgang Franke, the best manager we all had when we were at Mainz. She was an exception. We at Mainz, we were a football team who lost all the games when the other team had better players. I think it sounds normal, but you know, in football, it's a way to win games anyway. We never had that. So then Wolfgang Franke comes in and implements, four in the back, ball-orientated defending, and we did nothing else than that. And we changed overnight. into the one opponent nobody wanted to play against. We were like machines. We were like machines. We are not great football. We were like machines.

32:01There were games our goalkeeper didn't touch the ball once. We were just defending. It was new that time. So it was really for all of them. That means we all became believers in that. Then Wolfgang left and none of the other coaches could do that. None. There was no connection to the coaches after Wolfgang. So I was one of the players. who benefited massively from Wolfgang Frank. And now I arrived and the only thing I did when I, the two sessions I had were both exactly about that. Four for two ball-orientated movements and we go for MSV Duisburg that time. They were third in the table. We go for them like nobody else.

32:42But I like these moments. I like to find a reason why it makes sense that why we give our absolute all in a moment like this. why we don't invest only the minimum, why invest the maximum, why we would regret it if we don't do it, how better life is if we do it, how much more fun it is if we do it. I love these moments and probably something like that. I told them and from that moment on, nobody wanted to play against us anymore. So we were like, wow, animals. It was great. It was a fantastic time. same team um pretty much uh changed overnight so you fixed the defensive situation the formation and you also told the players in that dressing room a story of why we had to give this give everything showed up they they wrote us off showed outside world whatever you can do most of the time it was real life but that time so in my meetings later on I never prepared in a way that I wrote something down or whatever our life was preparation what happened during the week with us in the world that was preparation for meeting I never thought long about it just remembered when I needed it we spoke I told the boys but that time they needed one person to believe in them and I did it was not that I had to convince myself I have to tell them now before that season I told in an interview this is the best squad Mainz and Fünf ever had it would be really difficult for me to play but good for us that team is so good and then we were in a hopeless situation before I took over so when I became the manager I was the one who thought this team is incredible nobody knows it yet but we will make sure in a few weeks they will have a sense at least.

34:43How important did that prove to be, this idea of making sure that the players you have throughout your career had belief in themselves? That's all. It's all about that. It's not football. It's life. You had no, when you started your podcast, people probably told you, well, that might be something for you. But you were not sure. And then with each little thing here and there, oh, how many people listened to your first podcast? Do I remember? No, no, no. I think I read it somewhere. 40? Something around that. It was under 100. So it's a start. So it's a start. And all the rest is if you want history.

35:22And that's always in life like that. That it's just give it a chance. Of course it makes sense you believe in yourself. But not everybody can do that. But then if you meet somebody who helps you with that, who has a perspective, who can see something in you, then tell. tell them why you should keep it for yourself oh my god i think he's a talent she's a talent whatever well yeah she's good at that he's good at that yeah why we don't tell each other so where's the problem did someone do that for you told you that you should believe in yourself they saw something in you once i said i never struggled with confidence but i don't know why that's the truth but it's true i never struggled with confidence.

36:05There's no reason for it. My two best friends in school were genius. And we sat together doing exactly this, reading the same books, invested the same amount of time. They had the best A-levels in school. And I was far off that. So a normal reaction would be, I'm a dump, obviously. But I never thought that. And I don't really know why that happened. So I took it how it was. I thought, oh, respect. You can remember all these things crazy. I can't. But you had lots of players that struggled with confidence. Yeah, yeah. I tried to create a situation to make sure that the player, if they are not confident yet, they are confident.

36:53But, you know, there are moments when they lose it. Confidence is like, perhaps once there's a little flower and constantly somebody steps on it. It's like that. Oh, and then it's growing again. and oh, now we are confident again, stuff like this. In football, it's really difficult because it's like you cannot play without making mistakes. So if a mistake costs you confident, that's a real challenge. But I try to. If you would believe as much in yourself as I do, that would be a start. But as long as you cannot do that, just trust me. So you are good because I don't work with, not with other players.

37:32I don't waste time. I don't. That's what, and it's true, I don't. So I really, I really see something. And if I see it, I'm patient enough to work on it. Much more patient than the public wants me to be. But of course, the idea is that one day I help you learn flying, but in the end you have to fly yourself. Obviously, I cannot, I cannot do that for you. That's what it is. Football. You have to perform alone. They cannot look at me. What should I do? And that's my job is to prepare them as good, to make it the education, the coaching as wide. Just pick for me. That's the idea. But not too much as well.

38:16It's, yeah, it's obviously was a good time in my life doing all these kind of things. I worked with some of the best footballers in the world. Really good time. Do you sometimes have to lie in public to protect a player's confidence? I wonder this because you see managers come out and say, oh, he can't play because he's injured or whatever. And they say things. But I wonder sometimes if managers are protecting players because they're struggling. Yes, we protect players. I'm not sure I ever had to lie, to be honest. I don't know, but we protect players. Super important. So for me, super important.

38:53He lacks confidence. That's in football, obvious. You see that you run one-on-one on the goalie and you don't make it. You can see it's because you don't have confidence. That's how it is. There's not a lot of other reasons. It can be wind, weather, ball, opponent. It's there, but you do it once, you do it twice, three times. Yes, that's not good for the confidence of nobody. Having that in training, the job is not to talk too much about it, to give him a chance to get confidence back with the things you do in training. That doesn't last forever. So the one thing you have to protect players from is public.

39:30Try to because they are ruthless in moments. They don't care until something happens. So there were supporters sometimes. I think we were really lucky with that. We created that bond between the supporters and the team that they were not angry, disappointed, yes, but not angry in a way that I don't want to see them anymore. So that helped. but of course you have to protect them sometimes you have to protect them sometimes from themselves as well so that's the job did you have to involve yourself much with social media usage of your team members and did you did you ever consider someone's social media usage when you were considering signing them to join the club because i think this now as a manchester united fan i think some of when some of our players are posting on social media little indirect messages and little emojis and commenting things.

40:20I just think, oh, God, troublemaker. We had situations that players texted or posted something at night and deleted it, but I still got aware of it. So not that I read it, but people tell me, oh, last night, doesn't that happen? When? Three o 'clock. Three o 'clock. Okay. What do you say? Isn't that? Oh. What I do in these situations, even delete it, I go in the dressing room and they all lie on the house. Last night, this and this happened. Got deleted. I know what's there, but maybe you want to tell everybody? You would ask them to say in front of everybody. Yeah. Not nice, eh? The thing is, I don't go for them and tell them, how can you write that or whatever.

41:08So I said, come on. Somebody told me, so I know it.

41:14Not important, really, but come on, tell the whole team what he wanted to say. And then he starts, it's not great in that situation. I don't like to bring people in there, but I think that's a deserved punishment for something like that. But actually the effect is nobody ever did it again because nobody wants to be in that situation in a dressing room, sitting there and be the one who has to explain something he did last night or whatever. I discussed individual problems, if it was okay, in front of the team. If it was important for the team. Yeah, come on, explain why you did that, why you went out that long, what happened in the last two hours.

42:02This photo here is of things going well for you. Yeah. Mines? before I had that to get here these are tears the tears the year and two years before were not for the same reason so you probably know we didn't get promoted for a point and a goal first a point then a goal and then this happened that was the first day when it really went well so this was the day that you promoted for the first time in the history to the Bundesliga Yeah. But before winning that, I learned how to lose. This is very important, I would say. I think that's, again, to learn, even though you want to be as successful as somehow possible, you have to accept that from time to time you lose.

42:55and then when you then keep going, you have a good chance if you learn from it. A defeat is a defeat if you don't learn from it. If you learn from it, it's a very, very important information. And obviously in football, we have a lot of opportunities to get beat and opportunities to learn from it. But this was the biggest relief in my life, not happiness. That's pure relief. The pressure was mounting. I was crazy not only myself nobody not from outside I don't know even over the outside world thought but to make it happen that year I was really special but it took two years of coming close yeah and dealing with the disappointment yeah true when I spoke to Jamie Carragher I asked Jamie Carragher actually this earlier this morning I said I said to him you know what was he curious about with you and this is actually what he said.

43:55He said there were so many near misses in your career, whether it was in the Champions League or I remember when you were head-to-head with Man City in that season and you were one point shy of winning the league. And his question was, he's fascinated with how you were so good at dealing with the disappointment of near misses. Because sometimes near misses can cripple people. They can turn them into a downward spiral. It can be like the plant that or stood on it can crush someone's confidence but it appears through your career that near misses ended up being positive forces for you

44:32it's not that i knew that always but what made me spoke about very early but what made me the person i am these people of course mom dad my faith as well so and i i knew always that I'm not here to get everything. I'm here to give everything. So that doesn't help in a moment when you fail for a point. But in the general understanding as a person, of course, it helps. So I'm not surprised that I fail. I don't see myself as a constant winner in my mind. I see myself as a constant trier. So I don't know constant winners, but there might be some out there. But I just can't imagine a world that would be like that.

45:28All the people running around there, all the happy people there win all the time. Nobody wins all the time. Nobody does. So it's all about dealing with the things you want and not get, and then you want it more or not anymore or whatever. So the moments were not great, but I learned it here. Doing it that day changed the destiny of the club of Mainz 05. That's how it is. My destiny, the player's destiny, changed everything. So we wanted it that hard. But we learned before we have to try harder. And that's what I always took. If you don't get the result you want, try again and try harder. It was Christian that gave you that job, wasn't it?

46:13Yeah. Mr. Heidel. Christian Heidel. I spoke to Christian Heidel. His English is very funny, isn't it? Yeah, I've had to... I'm going to translate it for the viewers, but I'm going to actually play what he said to you in German. Oh, of course. So you can hear it. Here we go. Global. Yes, dear Global, we've known each other for exactly 35 years now. First, we were both players. Then you subsequently became my esteemed coach. It all started in Mainz. You changed an entire club. You changed an entire city. Back then, we were promoted to the Bundesliga together, and today Mainz has been in the Bundesliga for over 25 years.

46:53Back then, that was actually unimaginable. You go to Dortmund, change your club, change an entire city, and win every title there is to win. You move to Liverpool, and the same thing happens for the third time. You change your club, you change your city. I don't think any coach before you has ever achieved that. and i'm always asked what makes jürgen klopp special to this day he has simply remained a genuine person always authentic which is incredibly important apart from the fact that you are of course an outstanding expert i hope we'll see each other again soon on our little shared island in majorca um and have a great day and lots of fun with your podcast wow yeah clubbo i told you you changed a club you changed the city yeah you did that over and over and over again you went on and did that again at Dortmund um winning a huge range of awards there at a time when they were weren't considered to be hopeful and then you went off to Liverpool and did the same and as you I was reading about how when you travel to Liverpool there was 30 ,000 Liverpool fans watching your plane fly across um the channel to Liverpool because they're all very excited and you arrived at a time when they were in a period of dysfunction, kind of similar to where Manchester United are now, I guess.

48:10And you managed to bring them up from being a team that were dysfunctional, hadn't won. There was a lot of pessimism around the club. I think as a Man United fan, I was hoping and wondering that if Liverpool would ever come back, I was hoping they would never come back again. But you brought them back annoyingly. When you arrived at Liverpool that day, you said in that press conference that you're the normal one. I remember that. What did you observe when you arrived? What was the culture? What was the feeling? And what was your first thought about what you had to do to bring that club back to its glory?

48:41The feeling I got, I had roughly a week to think about everything from the first call to the signature, I think. Did you have other offers from other clubs? Oh, in that moment, not. But in the summer, I had a lot of offers like before, when I finished at Dortmund. But in that moment, it was just Liverpool. but it was kind of destiny because I didn't want to it was not we were on a family holiday in Lisbon with the two boys Ula and I sitting there phone goes my agent why is he calling boys look at my face and I say Liverpool and the both yes the boys yeah and Ula looks what what is you and she didn't see my lips when I spoke what and realize oh god we start again before she knew we will go to Liverpool.

49:32Why did your boys react to that? Come on. If you're not a Man United fan, you know what Liverpool means to people. And they loved it. We fell instantly in love with that club. Did Manchester United have a call? Yeah, I spoke to them. So, in the year when Sir Alex retired, they spoke to me. Yeah, of course, they were interested at one point. So, I was, that time I would have been interested. I was a young I had a sensational team at Dortmund. My God! So somebody probably thought, what is he doing there? Later on I heard that my players, Hendo, Adam Lallana, James Mellon, that they flew to Real Madrid when we played the semi-final in the Champions League to watch us and wanted to see what is Dortmund doing?

50:23My God! What a football that is! I mean you can't get big compliments. It's really good. I want to know why Manchester United didn't... No, no, no. They tried. It was wrong time, wrong moment. For me, I had a contract at Dortmund. I wouldn't have left not really for nobody in that time. They just needed a manager but the manager they wanted in that case now was one of a few options, I think. So it was you that turned down Manchester United not Manchester United turning you down? Yeah, that way. So I, yeah. So... We need someone else on negotiations. We need... Yeah. No, no, no. he's not there anymore the guy who negotiated that so um there are no other people in charge it's long ago long ago so what why wouldn't i'm gonna like manchester united's often known as the biggest club in the world why wouldn't you take that job why didn't you take that job manchester united the great manchester it's typical we are now not in private in a private space so there are some reasons what the people in that conversation told me which i didn't like oh really So United was that big.

51:29We get all the players we want. We are like, we can this, we get him, we get him, we get him, we get him. And I was sitting there. So it was not my project. It didn't feel like my, it was the wrong time. But on top of that, it was not my project. I didn't want to bring back, I don't know, Pogba, Paul is a sensational player. My God, but these things don't work usually. But these kind of things, or Cristiano, my God, we all know that he's the best player, or together with Messi, the best player in the world. But bringing him back never helps. And that time in 2013, it was obviously not about Cristiano, maybe about Paolo.

52:10I'm not even sure when they don't get their numbers together. But it was just the idea is we bring the best players together and then let's go. It wasn't about the football. No, not at all. And I sat there and it was like, I'm not sure. That's not for me. And then the pure football project comes up with Liverpool. And the sensational talk to Mike Gordon, that's really important as well. He's the owner. I know John and Tom, of course, as well. But Mike was responsible for us. I wanted, after that talk, I want to be his friend. He's such a good guy. So that's how it started. And in the end, yeah, it was pretty special.

52:51I find this fascinating because as a Manchester United fan, I observed from the moment Sir Alex Ferguson left, we adopted a very different approach. And we brought in all these massive name players, Di Maria, Falcao, Ibrahimović, Pogba, Ronaldo. And we failed. And it taught me something as an entrepreneur about what matters more. And actually, when I read through your philosophy, it's quite clear in your philosophy that you prefer attitude and character versus how many Instagram followers you've got and what you've done in the past. Yeah, of course. And I wanted to get your take on why you think the last, this is very selfish of me, the last sort of 15 years at Manchester United haven't worked out as an objective observer.

53:37I need to know. You can't. You're a man that was able to take teams and make them successful. And we are currently underdogs in many regards because of the last 15 years. What is it that we've missed in that time? What have we overlooked in your view? I know you don't want to hear that. You have a hypothesis though. I didn't think a second since I joined Liverpool about what Man United did right or wrong. I just did. So it's like I buy into a situation. So I went to Liverpool and that moment you became our opponent, not my enemy, but a very important opponent. One who is much more fun to beat than maybe, and like others, with Everton.

54:22I know so many Everton fans in Liverpool who lived there for nine years. So I know so many people, great people. So absolutely, but then you go to the game and think, oh my God, that's something different. Not I make that up, it's like that. But I really didn't think, but always in football is like this. And again, like in life, you have a problem and you only try to find a solution for now knowing you have two days later another problem. You know it, but it starts for now. Just find a solution for that problem. There's no mid, no long term. So, okay, we have to deal with that for another day or two and then we can sort it.

54:58And that means in our sense, we have to deal with that for a year or two and deny it. And then we can make a big step. In our case, in the football case, contracts are running out. Player goes anyway, we can sell him, we can do this. But because you're in such a rush all the time, just because you want to or have to win the next game, a little bit like that being now in the situation probably United, in the years when they were not happy, they would buy the time from that time. Jose becoming second. Nobody was really happy there and you think, oh, remember that? In that time, second was not good enough.

55:35and now you are not even close to that. But that's not a Man United story for me. It's just a football story. It's always like that in the world of football. You win, you're the greatest. You lose, you know nothing about the game. You draw, you're boring. So that's not that. You're constant and it's only about your own idea what you really want to do and where you want to go. And everything in life is about development. Today, you were not the same 10 years ago. I was not the same 10 years ago. So it means the time between then and now counts. So if it counts, for me, the next 10 years do the same.

56:10So it's important what I do. It's important what I see in a year, two, three. So I have to plan my own life, mid and long term, as much as I can do that, and especially the destiny and the future of a football club. A player can score a goal, can score five goals, will never solve the problems if you have real problems. And I don't know the United problems. But Liverpool was the same. It's not about that. On the day when we lost, sold Phil Coutinho, that was not the day when I thought, oh, good that we have the money. I lost a player I wanted to work with for the next 10 years, if you want. It was not that I thought, and we can invest it.

56:53Yeah, we invested it smartly, that's true. But it's not that we found a player for the position and sorted that. that's we had to sort differently but we found two really solid solid and becoming world-class players with Allison and Pandai that was for the future to go from there and now that's the difference I think. I've had so many founders speak to me and say why didn't this particular ad that I ran on this platform work for me maybe the copy wasn't good the creative wasn't strong but usually the problem is they're not having the right conversation because that ad never reached the right person.

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59:14What I love about football is the analogies to the world I'm in, which is the world of business, where you can watch a team like we're seeing, I think, Crystal Palace at the moment, who objectively don't have maybe the best players in the world. They don't have the most money. Bournemouth as well. Bournemouth as well, yeah. But they're doing something which is creating this magic. And it's this wonderful narrative of you don't need to have the most talent or resources to have the best outcome. So what is that gap between, like, and that's... There must be something. Now, look, it's a situation, a moment and a situation where Crystal Palace and Bournemouth is massively different to the situation for United.

59:51If Bournemouth wins a game 1-0 and doesn't perform particularly well, you take it and you go on. I'm not sure you would really find an article in the newspaper about it, just win and go. But United is united. United, each step is under the focus. And they're like, what? Oh, he didn't. They won, but he didn't play great. So they win a game and then somebody doesn't perform well, so pick him out and go for him full throttle. You think, wow. So the coach has to pick him up again. No, no, no, it's all right, stuff like this, and the next one. They're different, completely different situations. The only problem you have now, in the time you try to sort your problems, all the other clubs improve their situations.

1:00:38So Liverpool has an incredible squad. Yes, are they 100 % happy right now with the three defeats? No, probably not. But incredible squad. Arsenal, incredible squad. City, city. I mean, and they want to strike back. There's already three clubs. Chelsea, in that time when everybody thought, do they have an overview about their transfer market? Do they know who they own and who they loan and stuff like this? Obviously, somehow it pays off. So they have already five clubs. They are above you. Are you happy with position six? No. So, and here's the problem. Should you be happy theoretically with position six?

1:01:16Maybe this year, and I build on that. So find a reason. Find a reason to enjoy the situation again. Find a reason to enjoy a 1-0 victory, 2-0 victory at home, whoever against whoever. Southampton, try to enjoy that. Really, be happy, go home, and not listening to others who tell you then, for Southampton. That's what we had years ago when we decided after a draw against West Brom

1:02:18to say thank you to the supporters. A lot of good football. They need to find a way to grow together again. I fully believe in Ruben Amarim. I think he's a man that's focused on culture. And I like how honest he is as well. And I think with the team that they have around them, with people like Jason Wilcox and Ineos, who I've met, and Colette and all the others that are there, I think we've never been in a better place. I personally feel like that because I just think they're aiming for more long-term things. They're aiming at more long-term solutions. The only problem is you have no clue about football, but besides that...

1:02:53That's a small problem. So, yeah, good on you. Good on you. But I have faith. That's great. I don't know if all my friends do, but I certainly do. And the only reason I have faith is because I see the club aiming at more long-term things now and not buying players because they have loads of Instagram followers. When you got that phone call from Liverpool and they asked you to come and join, You said, well, the reason you chose Liverpool is because they felt like a football project versus Manchester United, who seemed to be a bit more, less football oriented. But it's not the same year. Yeah. Two years before.

1:03:31I'm wondering, what is it about their proposal that made you think it was a football project? Oh, the situation. I knew the club. I knew the team. So if you look at, on top of that, I didn't think it that way. But when Alex left, they became champion in his last year, but it was not that the team was the one you build a future on. So that's how it is. When you come in, it's a bit built to fail if you want it. But I didn't see it that way. At that time, it had other reasons, but if I would have thought longer about it, it would have been probably, yeah. So David Moyes, a fantastic, fantastic manager, what he proves every year, couldn't do the job.

1:04:13And since then, it's a bit of a problem. so a new team needs time. He was stitched up. So, needs time. So, Liverpool, the team, as I said when I came, nobody likes the team. Not even the team likes the team. I like the team. I like the team. I knew the players. I thought when Bobby Firmino moved there, I said, oh, that's a smart, that's a smart transfer. I know Christian, I knew Christian Penteke. I love Dibok Origi. I knew John Henderson. I knew Adam Lallana. I know plenty of players. And hurt only, ah, they're not good enough. And I thought, well, Well, let's see. So I like the team. So that's a football team, proper football, super attitude.

1:04:50I mean, just on day one, I could have played Hando, Millie and Adam together in midfield. Maybe I did. I don't even know my first line-up, but it's a proper engine room. It's smart players. It's people who really want to perform, want to work hard and all these kind of things. What do you need for a start? I knew Liverpool was not the same club than they were before. It's not that I went into the shiny room. I played there a year before with Dortmund in the preseason, and I was massively disappointed about the dressing rooms. I remember you have these pictures in your mind. You think, oh, my God, it's Enfield.

1:05:31And you walk in and make two steps into the dressing room and you run against the wall, and you think, kidding? Is that all? Where's the rest? so English dressing rooms really really small in the old stadium there we think oh my god how can you bring it it was built for 11 players and now we come here with 30 so people in that room it doesn't help so I knew about the history I knew that nobody's happy I knew that I liked the team that's a good start and did they tell you that they were going to develop the ground the stadium did they make any promises to your assurances did they tell you no we didn't really speak about that in the first conversation.

1:06:10That's nothing I need to talk about in this kind of conversation. I know the job I had in that moment was just to improve the football team, not the club. That I was involved in, all the other stuff happened with time. With time. Just that I realized this is my responsibility now as well. You never know. I don't plan seven, eight, nine-year spells in a club. It just happens. It's like I don't think they could sack me, but I know it could happen. So I plan from a specific moment on when I sorted the first few things, then I plan mid and long term or always did, knowing it might not be for me. But I was never worried about that too much.

1:06:54What was the first couple of things you thought you had to change to get them winning and to get the confidence back and to ultimately bring the city behind you? Was there anything you thought, OK, the first thing I'm going to have to do is get rid of him, change this? so a year before not in that season but two years before they nearly became chairman, it was a different team and it was a very specific way of football offensively oh my god they were ridiculously good defensively yeah lucky a good goalie there stuff like this, it was not the same we didn't have the team from that time we didn't have Suarez, we didn't have Sterling we had Dennis Durich, stuff like this but it was a different team, completely different.

1:07:37I arrived there, I had five strikers. It was Christian Mantegra, Danny Ings, Divo Gorigi, Bobby Firmino, Daniel Sturridge, five strikers and I want to play one striker system. Ooh, how do we deal with that? But it was fine and there was so much quality, it just wasn't really sorted. So the first thing I had to sort is to organize them. So find a way to make sure that they understand that we have a chance to win the next football game. We have to do a couple of things for that, but Tottenham, three days' time to train. Yeah, jump in their face and let's see what we get for it. It's not organised, it's like we started with an organised chaos.

1:08:16So I gave them a few ideas about where we want to put them under pressure and in that moment, now do it. And afterwards we talked about how it worked out because there was no time to train. Anyway, we had no time. The week after we played the European League, I think, in the midweek and then we play again. and it's like you are in a rush. A coaching career with all the games you have to play, if you really want to, a top team especially, if you really want to develop a style of football, you are set up to fail. Because it's like you have no time in the preseason, there's no, the players are everywhere, playing big tournaments, blah, blah, blah, and you come two weeks before the season starts into your camp.

1:08:57Okay, so let's go from here. Then you play, top teams play every three days from a specific date on. We obviously lost a lot of finals. That means we played a lot of finals. That means we played all the games until the end of the season, which is a lot. So there's no really time to train and really develop things. You have to use each little moment to implement a specific idea we all can buy into. And that's what we did. I loved our first game against Tottenham. Simon Mignolet had to make a few really good saves, but they had to do as well. And that year Tottenham was really strong. They became second behind Leicester, I think.

1:09:39It was that season. And that's a start. What are those little ideas that you started to implement one by one? So many, if you don't have time to change football, what do you mean? We are all not geniuses. We cannot go there and show them a little bit, pass the ball here, pass the ball there. And if you pass the ball back again, you can shoot and you're alone in front of the goal. That doesn't work like that. I'm 100 % convinced that you have to make sure that you are stable. If you're stable, that means that the other team, whatever they try, it's not easy for them to get through and shoot just finish.

1:10:17I don't like that. If you can avoid that, do it. Because we are people, but we now realize a few times it's not easy. If they have five, six chances after each other, opportunities after each other, Then it's like that. You don't feel great. Nobody plays his best football if each attack of the opponent ends in the arms of your goalie. That just doesn't work. So how can we do that? And stability is to organize a team that's number one, two, and three on the to-do list of a successful manager. And that's what I did. We organized. And then we told them to run their socks off. You have to show the people that you want to change something.

1:10:54You have to show the people that you want to achieve something. I can tell them, but in the end you have to show them. So run. And they went for it. I loved it so much. They loved it so much. It's easy. They're all top fit. They want to run. So just show them which direction and it goes. And then we developed step by step our own way of football. Brought players in step by step. But we got stable pretty quickly. Not as much as we wanted. I think we became six, seven, eight. I don't even know the first season. Two finals. Great. Lost both. Not great. but then we knew each other and we loved working together with this group brought in super players really super super players super character super players and stick together and I mean what can you do we lost it we lost the European League final in Basel how it always is there's a party after the game so you cannot organize a party but you always know if you lose who wants to go to the party so So, I was a new manager, yes, not that new anymore, seven, eight months in or so.

1:12:01And I realised some players are not there, but it was in a team hotel. So, I called them, told them, all here, come on, come downstairs. Oh, really? I tell you what, this was only the start, we only are together in six, seven months. This is not the last final we're playing, this is the first final we played. Okay, we lost, the first international final we lost, no problem, we go again. and I went on the stage on the dance floor. It was a dance floor. And I said, all coming. When I was saying, we are Liverpool. I mean, I had a few parties after finals we lost and I always thought I don't waste time at all on not being happy about what we achieved over the whole year because qualifying for a final is a real achievement.

1:12:50Losing it is not great, but until then everything was fine and I never accepted that we ignored the rest. So we have a party and then we went on to achieve new things and we need a bit of time, obviously, but it was okay. And this goes back to the point earlier about controlling the mindset and the psychology after you lose to make sure that you don't get depressed. If you don't learn from a defeat, it's a real defeat. If you learn from it, it's a very, very important information. And that's how I always understood it. I had enough opportunities to learn, really. How I say, I lost more Champions League finals than most people play.

1:13:35It's not a great thing to say. It's the truth anyway. You're known for what they call heavy metal football. Yeah, but that's, yeah, I know. Do you like that phrase? I said a lot of things, but it's like I said that. it was not in my mind that I thought you want to play heavy metal football they asked me about Arsene Wenger on the comparison and they think we are similar in a way and I thought what? Arsene and I know so come on don't be disrespectful to Arsene I'm a young bababa man from somewhere but if you want to compare us then I'm not sure that's possible because Arsene's football is rather like an orchestra and my team plays a little bit more like a heavy metal band But that was the first day when I thought about my team, I got heavy metal band.

1:14:25But it's true. Yes, somehow. It is true. And I know that more than anyone is a Manchester United fan watching. I'd hate playing your football teams because they ran so much. They were so passionate. They never let up. They could always win in the last minute. And the intensity was, you were just anxious as a football fan watching the games because it was so full on. And it was overwhelming. It's almost overwhelming emotionally. And I remember through your era, sometimes you'd win games by seven. You'd score seven goals, five goals. Every week when I pull up my phone to check the scores that week, oh, Liverpool have scored five again.

1:14:59Oh, they've scored seven again. They've scored six again. Sometimes you would concede three. But it was crazy how high intensity the way you played football was. Don't waste time with holding back. I don't understand it. We have nothing to do with 90 minutes, 95 minutes, whatever. I don't. We had to learn. I had to learn to manage games inside me until the last day. It was like, come on, come on, try. But then I grew up and I got more mature and stuff like this. It was like, okay, come on, hold the ball, control the ball. All the things at one point you do, you learn at any time on your journey.

1:15:43And that's how it is. And I love the game so much and could play it not that good that I was so happy that I could work with these outstanding players. I loved it. I enjoyed it so much, seeing them doing what they're doing. I was number one supporter of my team, teams, wherever I was. I loved what they did. So that's what I carried through the week. I didn't tell them. I told them, I want to be your friend, but I cannot be your best friend, because I'm the one who tells you off very often. They'll tell you, this is not right, this is not right. But the feeling, the general feeling was I love them.

1:16:18In my mind, my ex-players, I love them all. And some of them don't love back, let me say like that, probably for some reasons or whatever. But that doesn't mean anything to me. I love my clubs. Do you think it's important how you win? Because, you know, this heavy metal, high intensity football was great for the fans. They love watching three, four, five, six, seven. They love watching that stuff. Do you think that matters or do you think it's just about getting the three points? Let's say we didn't win that often, 5-0 or 7. It felt like it. Against United, we did. You can cut it out. No, it's, yeah, of course it's important.

1:16:58So if you have your backpack going to the stadium as a player, if you have your boots and if you have a wear shirt, don't waste time with anything than giving you all. There's no guarantee to get anything, but the only chance to get something. So give you all from the first until the last minute. You have to understand this game is only that fun for us because all the people are watching it. That's why we earn the money. I mean it. I know that's what people want to hear, but we earn the money because everybody's interested in it. Everybody wants to see it, knows about it, reads everything about it, all these kind of things.

1:17:33And for that, with all the stories around, the only thing we really have to deliver is give your absolute all in a game like that. Whatever, whichever game is there. 5.30, 2.30, 3.30, whenever the game starts, give your absolute all. But why not just 1-0 and defense and boring and pass it around? That happens. That happens in games. You realize, okay, we scored a goal, but today's not our day. Come on, let's get it over the line. That happens. but it cannot be the target or the purpose for the next game again. Let's do it like that. Not for... There are clubs, if you own... The only realistic target is to stay in the league.

1:18:12It's a wonderful result. But we talk about a club like Liverpool. We are bigger than that. You have to win each football game when you are manager of Liverpool. That's what people... That's not that before the season anybody thinks, 38 games more than 100 nobody had ever so it's not like that but still each defeat and each draw is like how could it happen and that's why you have to play in a specific way not all clubs have the same things to do but the top clubs they have to win all the games and when you have the chance you win them clear, you win them with the proper results, stuff like this you have to make the people enjoy the football you play And I love to do that.

1:18:59I loved it, honestly. It's like the games we played, the results we had were just incredible. It's just amazing. Not all of them. And I love the 1-0s as much as I do all the others. The Champions League final was the worst final of all the four my teams played. But we won it. Would I take, would I change and say, okay, let's do the other three as well. The performance in other games was really good, but we lost. So here we are, it was not fantastic, but we won. So all fine. It's about the result. But if you have a result and another result, it has to lead to really good football at one point. As good as possible for your specific team.

1:19:42You want to stay in the league? Do it with good football. You want to qualify for Europe? Do it with good football because we are there for the people. We don't, it's not there that we just go home and the people think, oh, it's unwatchable. I'm not sure I come next week again. that's not that's not fair try to play the game is really is really cool game so let's make sure that everybody sees it and what is the liverpool way what is inherent in when you come to liverpool you are the manager or you are a player what is the thing that you have to do that's specific to liverpool in order to be successful you have to understand the community i mean the community just a city community and it's a bigger community around the world there are so many people and This club went through a lot, not as the only club in the world, but come on, for that moment, we just think about ourselves.

1:20:29Went through a lot. The reaction to these situations was always exceptional, to be 100 % honest. And that's what you have to understand, what you have to learn. That this club means more to the people than just football. So that was what you have to understand. And that's why what we do is more important than it maybe is somewhere else. That's the responsibility we always took and understood 100%. Our players understood to play for Liverpool is not just a club where you play during your career. It's the club and it's something you will definitely remember for life. So we try to make sure that the boys understood.

1:21:12If we give our absolute everything now, we meet in 10, 15 years, look back, and we think it was the best we could have done. The absolute best we could have done. And I think that's how my view on life is as well. All the other stuff is just sorting the problem in front of you. There's something we have to sort. But when you sort, you think about what's the effect for the rest. And that's what some people, some clubs maybe don't want to see because the pressure is too big just to make sure, okay tomorrow at least they will not write we have no clue tomorrow at least they will say they found a solution and then we can think about um the next day or whatever how does how does someone i don't know how someone succeeds succeeds you because you have such a big aura are you aware that you have a big aura don't know if anybody has the awareness of that i heard about it but i doesn't they don't know what it means 100 to be honest but i see with other people An energy when you arrive, it's the passion, it's the ability to talk, it's the ability to inspire people.

1:22:20It has an impact on the rival team you're playing because they go all clots here and big personality, big charisma. So Arnie Slott coming in after you, he doesn't appear to have the same size of an aura. And I don't know, I just think big shoes to fill in terms of your aura. I have to go to the toilet. I bet you do. No, really. Okay. Okay. That's good. Big shoes. Big shoes. I would not want to fill such shoes. A couple of things. First and foremost, I thought I have to say what I had to say when I announced my exit, if you want, my retirement, whatever you want to call it. at the time, and people judge that, wrong moment, blah, blah, blah, whatever.

1:23:18It cannot change that. The feeling was, I have to say that. Then you have to finish the season as good as somehow possible in either world. You win something, we couldn't do that for whatever reason. And then you have to make sure, because that's still something you have to do. You have to try to make it as easy as somehow possible for the guy who's coming after you. That's what I tried as well. because I wanted them all to do incredibly well. And I always thought if somebody is not doing it that way, it's the first hint you can get that maybe he wants the next guy not to do it well. Everybody's shouting, oh my God, he did that, he did that, he did that.

1:24:04And I don't need that. I want Liverpool to do well. I want Liverpool to win what they did. So what I liked a lot about Arnett, that Arnett didn't hesitate. What you said, I want to go in these shoes, Arnett didn't have that problem. He thought, okay, that's a great club, that's a great team. And he's right. It was a fantastic, it's a fantastic club and it's a fantastic team. And he stepped into that. We had a lot of contact after that. He was super, he's a super, super good guy. And I was like, my God, what a team. Wow. Thanks a lot. All these kind of things. Yeah. and he made the best he got the best out of this team and they became champion in an incredible manner to be honest so and I'm really really happy about that so that's all that's all is it it all about it shows again it's all about how you see it you can see you step into my footsteps how you called it or you take over a fantastic football team it was a brilliant I mean my my best friend's a Liverpool fan and he said before you left actually he said this is the best squad Liverpool Liverpool have ever had.

1:25:11Arnie has inherited that squad, which is considered to be the best squad by many people that Liverpool have ever had. And in that first year, it didn't really change much. There wasn't any big signings coming. I actually heard from one of the players in Liverpool that them say to a really good friend of mine that the best thing Arnie had done was actually in that first year, don't change much. Don't come in and try and radically change things. But that's what Arne Slott would say himself. Probably, I think he said it. That's super smart. So it's not about what Arne wants to show the world what he can do, it's about how to get the best out of this team.

1:25:45And that's exactly what he did. Not changing much means he changed a little bit. We became third the year before, so there's not a lot you have to change, but a few decisive things you have to change. And all of a sudden you win the league by some distance. So that's what it is. Not that he has to put his new own stamp. This team was good in a lot of ways, but we didn't win the year before. And that's what his job was. And he did that in an incredibly impressive manner. And that's all you want. And you need people who have the confidence to do these kind of things. Because it doesn't make sense if you have a manager who is not 100 % sure about the things he wants to do.

1:26:34I want us to play like this. Or if that's not possible, I want to play like this. Or I want to be maybe completely different. That doesn't work. Being a football manager is already a challenge with all the different things you have to do. Being a football manager in such a competitive league like the Premier League is a real challenge. Being a football manager in the world we are living in with media, social media and all these kinds of things, it's an incredible challenge. believe me, you have no clue what's coming up the next day. You think, oh my God, where's that coming from? Who was that?

1:27:13Oh, my player. You read a story, whatever, and all of a sudden you think, oh, from a problem, it turns into your problem and a wing. So sort that and all the rest as well. So you need this kind of problem. I love that about Arne, that he came in and took over and he knew he got a good team. Yes, it was. And he did a perfect job. I mean, in terms of making changes, this year Liverpool have spent, what, 450-odd million, which is a crazy number. I mean, I think he broke in the transfer record in various positions several times with Wurtz and with Isaac now as well. So change has arrived. These are new people.

1:27:57They're coming in with their own ideologies from their previous clubs. they've all arrived at once a lot of new faces at once is this not now where the challenge begins because this is this is going to become arnie's team now yeah but that's not a problem it's just completely normal only that doesn't mean exactly that today was a lot of change i mean no team in the by the way it's 450 or whatever i don't know the exact numbers but they earned a lot of money as well um and change always has an impact and change always needs time and don't But people talk then about, yeah, but this, if, no, let's start like that.

1:28:35He keeps the exactly same team like last year. Darwin Union is still there. Luis Diaz is still there. I as an example. So they start playing and they have problems. So, yeah, we need a change. So now they are not there anymore. The new guys are there and they are good, really, really good players. It's not working out. I mean, yeah, why? Why it's not working yet? Because development needs time. Then nobody can change that. People need to adapt to situations, adapt to things, all these kinds of things. So it's all good, it's all in place. Liverpool this year has to be in the competition in the decisive moments and then they have to be ready to go for it.

1:29:13There's no guarantee that you then will win it again. That doesn't happen just like this. You cannot spend money and be champion again. The other teams don't sleep. That's how it is. And to become champion, you need luck in moments here and there. That's how it is. Nobody wants to hear that. But crossbar, over the line, not over the line, all these kind of things. It can go in your direction or in the other direction. So it's all fine. And we discuss the situation now like it's a struggle. Surprise. We take the money and throw it against them,$450 million. But they earned$200 million as well. So it's all fine.

1:29:53if you're with Liverpool and only these people are really that's only the only people who matter if you are with Liverpool yeah you trust them and they do the right they did the right stuff they do the right things so work on it and become the best football team this team can be You never had a transfer window like that where you spent that much money No, we built three stands and a training ground Yeah, exactly and I remember the press conference I think when you were referring to City's ability to spend money I had no clue that this is possible. Nobody ever told me that it's possible, that we can spend like that.

1:30:31My last year at Liverpool, so we obviously, so the Adidas deal, the new stadium, all these kind of things, yeah, they earn more money, but it was never, never ever I could have asked for the amount of money. But that's not a problem. That time, it was not there, no problem at all, really not. And I love the fact that we were as successful as we were and built new stands and built a training ground because we talk now about a transfer window and the way you want to talk about it, spend a lot of money, but there's no discussion about the stands and no discussion about the training ground. They are second to none, the training ground, the stands are wonderful.

1:31:15At the same place where Anfield is, they could build pretty much a new stadium without leaving the old one. So that's a fantastic story and that will stay forever. Maybe at one point they decide the Kop could be even for more people or whatever, I don't know if that ever will happen. But you could do stuff there and that's what I love about this. I think I really want as much as I can. It's not my first target because I have to win football games with my team. But I want that a club benefits from the time we were together after we left. I want that. This might be quite a naive observation, but in the time when you were at Liverpool, my assessment of Liverpool was you didn't necessarily have the world's most famous starting XI team, but you could beat anybody.

1:32:04So when you brought in Milner, who was at City before, and when you brought in these other players, I'd be like, why are they signing him? But then when they'd play for Liverpool, they would be unbelievable players and you could be anybody. So there was almost this culture at Liverpool, which I observed, where you didn't necessarily go for the Galactico players. You weren't trying to get Ronaldo or Messi. You were going for sort of these players that had character and a culture fit. and ultimately that meant that you know you at times it looked like you were playing with 12 men and so this neutral this transfer window that I've just observed where you have gone for the very very best names you know some of the best players on planet earth that were number one choices for Real Madrid and the biggest clubs on earth I almost don't recognise Liverpool it moving like that in a window there's part of me that I'm like hopefully this is their Falcao Di Maria moment Ronaldo moment where they fought big players but they didn't think of culture.

1:33:00I'm praying. Yeah. You wish. Yeah, I wish. That's the difference. You wish. I guess I'm an incredible striker. Incredible striker. Flo Wirtz, you all will eat your words if you use the wrong word. He's an incredible talent. Etiquette, incredible player. Yeah, just offensive players. It's a really, really, really good. well your squat if the young center half is not getting injured it's the perfect squat now he's injured that doesn't help then you might be a majority on the center half position besides that it's a perfect squat two super left backs really super right back so it's just a really good football that's how you set a team up and now you have to deal with the situation they all think they have to start the game but that's the normal job it's not that it's difficult that's the normal job you have this discussion who will start a week or two in the third week one is injured and you are happy that the other can start so that's that's the the world a football manager is living in so we don't have to worry about what's that I'm really interested so you don't have to worry about Liverpool they will be fine this was the just the net spend graph of the different clubs

1:34:24while you were while you were there and it's quite clear that you um you weren't spending the same as your rivals during your time and a lot of the fans in the media speculated that the owners the family sports group just weren't giving you the money but you were still getting the results which is pretty no no no so yeah what's the what's the public perception that i didn't ask for the money that's probably not right i probably had these conversations but i didn't ask in a way if you don't get it, we can do it. It's not my job to think about how much we can squeeze out of whatever area. I felt massively response.

1:35:02My idea was always with the boys we have,

1:35:09become the best team you can be. And you were right when you said we were maybe not the best team. I think there was a period when we played football, you could have thought that's maybe played by the best team. I don't know exactly, between 18 and 20, it was a pretty long spell. But we always, and it was the idea, we always were able to beat the best team. And that was the idea, because that's a constant thing. The next best, the next best, we can beat you, we can beat you, be the best. you are the one everybody wants to beat. I love that. That's net spend and stuff like this I was never too worried about.

1:35:50We had all these conversations. Yeah. I was happy with how it was. I couldn't have discussions with people. I cannot decide how much money we spend. It's just not possible. Arnest Lott cannot decide how much money Liverpool spend. That's how it is. There are other people who decide that and if you have the money then you spend for really good players what Liverpool did this year. And I think it was the right thing to do. And I'm pretty sure one specific moment changed the whole transfer window. That was the saddest day of last year. And how do you replace somebody like Djokovic? It's not about the player itself, it's about the guy he was.

1:36:45he was good with absolutely everybody absolutely everybody his he arrived he had no real it was i think he was a bit surprised that we approached him that we asked for him and he came and then we he delivered from day one i remember still when i saw him the first time playing four wolves what's that when i went to the you always hear these stories when people tell me and it's it's It's true that Mo Salah had to convince me and stuff like this. Not convinced that I take him, but it was like there were other players as well. Mo was one of the others and we decided altogether for Mo, but it's fine.

1:37:21But this, nobody came to me and told me, come on, let's have a look at Joko Jota. I saw him and I said, please give me more material, I have to see him. And he excelled all the expectations as a guy, super smart, super teammate. And now he sits in a dressing room and I cannot imagine right now the dressing room without him being there. That's so hard. It's so hard. I still cannot speak properly about it. It's really like that. It was an incredible shock. And that's for the boys as well. And I don't, we could think we don't speak about it because otherwise some bad journalists make a story of it.

1:38:02What I said about him and what it means. Nobody at Liverpool will ever use it as an excuse. but it is the situation. You walk every day in this room where he was omnipresent. He was, can you imagine, to talk about him, he was so close with James Milner. They are not the same age group. They are nothing the same. It's just he was so, but on the other side, very close with Costa Simicas. That's like moon and Mars. So that was him. And dealing with that on a personal level, not easy, impossible. And now as a club, take all the emotional stuff out and think, how do we replace him? And you have to think about that.

1:38:48Wow, that's difficult. Impossible, I would say. And now we judge the transfer window where they buy the players. There was not a plan, I'm pretty sure, that he had to get replaced. Do you remember where you were when you heard the news? Yeah. I got a message in the morning. The boss said, I have bad news. And then I got a message from a friend from Liverpool. And I couldn't believe it. It was not possible. I heard it and I know what it means, but I couldn't believe it. the whole story I saw all the pictures obviously from the wedding and all the boys were there and stuff like that and it was so it was only before that and I know exactly where I was it was exactly how long I sat there without speaking a word so it is it is it is a family member it is exactly like that

1:39:59So, look, it's really like that. It's an example for the things you have to deal with without knowing at all. You cannot be prepared to deal with things like that. And today we talk about the trends of international if you want of Liverpool that would have looked completely different. So you have to sort the things you never expected that you have to think about. Everybody wanted this boy to play the next 10 years at Liverpool. All-around player, all positions, can play football smart. On July the 3rd, 2025, Diego was killed in a car crash alongside his brother in Spain. I think just before then he had got married to his partner and he had several beautiful children.

1:40:51he said of you he said the first time you and him met he just felt your presence he said i think that's one of his main characteristics the way you can you can just feel him only with his presence and diego went on to be incredibly successful under your leadership at liverpool yeah that's true yeah same i could say the same i could say the same about him i was as impressed with his presence. Very special, very special young man, I have to say. How much of a role does a manager like you play in the transfer window? This is something that's always speculated by the fans. Do you remember the first when I came and they told me about a transfer committee?

1:41:38I never had. They told me, the journalists asked me, because they implemented a transfer committee because they didn't want to have the managers that decisive in a transfer window. Obviously, before me, there were some issues. There's no problem with that. I can discuss with everyone. As long as no player signs for the club, I don't want. I'm used to not getting all the players I want. That's completely normal. It's not up to the coaches. We say, we need one that player. And I say, yeah, it's too expensive. And I can ask again, sorry, can we make it happen? and knowing they all try absolutely everything to get the right prize and get the player in, you cannot do anything with that.

1:42:17That anybody in the club would bring in a player you don't agree on, that's not possible. But it's very, very normal in a football coach manager's life that you don't get all the players you want. So no problem with that. As long as the transfer window is open, you try to create, build the best possible squad on the day after the transfer window, you have the best possible squad, whichever transfers you made. And that's the way you go into the rest of the season. Michael Edwards left during your tenure. He was sort of one of the key people that was responsible for looking for players and signing them.

1:42:59And he's back now. So first and foremost, before I don't want to say anything, because we have a really good relationship. Michael Edwards is absolutely great in what he's doing. but it was not on one day his job alone to bring in players. There were a lot of other, Julian Ward, Ian Graham, so many people, they were involved in Barry Hunter, all these kind of things were involved in these kind of things. It was a process. We were really close together. It's not one sitting there and being the genius and producing ideas and you think, oh my God, he's available. I didn't even know him. he's like we know we know football players it's like negotiating finding the right moment to sell finding the right moment to buy that's a sporting director's job but he was before and now he's I don't even know exactly the role something in the holding company yeah across the board so Richard Hughes is now there doing an incredible job so this company it's it's all in an idol world so like people from outside are idolizing sometimes people like that definitely some of them with me and they do with Michael but Michael never did a job alone I never did a job alone it was always like a really good yeah they'd work together just really well we didn't have a lot of disagreements where you think boof where is that coming from why you want him it's a process and football team is an open book everybody can read it every day so if you want to add something it should not be a surprise to everybody and think where's that idea coming from you think we need a left back why we have already four that doesn't happen you are it's a work on progress all the time during a season but the transfer windows it clashes obviously and English people in professional football enjoy D-Day a bit more than probably in other countries so that's what I didn't get that to a full extent but I learned a lot about the excitement of a good transfer window.

1:45:07Did you always get on with them? Yeah, I would say 100%. And Michael definitely and Richard, I don't know, we spoke quite a few times after I left. So I like him. And I think they did an incredible job, honestly. Because you became bigger than the coach. You became such a huge, I mean, you still are, such a huge figure in the city. I mean, my assistant who's been with me, my PA has been with me for 10 years. She's from Liverpool and she, I'm probably going to embarrass her now, but you're like the king to her. Not even in Liverpool, you're the king globally. Because of what you did that scene.

1:45:44Exactly. If I was, if I was a Michael Edwards or someone else at the club and I was trying to, that you have, you had ultimate power. Kind of like Sir Alex Ferguson. He became, you know, he was everything. He is the state, he's on the stadium. He is the club. so i i always wondered how anyone would be able to overturn your opinion or argue with you when you are the city you're like you're the great jrgen clock but that's the outside world come on i'm not i'm a idiot i don't i don't sit there and i always said i need other people to understand things it's like i my own opinion opinion i know already well the more i get up i know my opinion So come on, how can you get a better view on things?

1:46:27That's how it is. It's just by discussing with people. Yes, the final decision I have to make and I have no problem with that. But for that, I need all people being really involved. And if you want to have an argument, have an argument. In the end, I will make the decision. Absolutely no problem. Did we have an argument? Maybe, yes. I don't remember them. But it's not important because it's just, in the end, it's about the outcome. It's about what is best for the club. And I never had a problem with that. I never thought they all have to please me. So I realized how famous I am after I left Liverpool.

1:47:03I have no clue. I was never in Liverpool out there. And on the bus, it's normal that the people cheer because everybody is in their cheer for everybody. So I realized how good I was as a coach since I'm not in the job anymore. So because I thought what I can do, everybody can do. I realized maybe not. So it's 100 % the truth because in the job, you just try to sort every day the things in front of you. That's what you try. Can I ask you about Nunes? He didn't seem very happy on your last day. Darwin. Darwin. Yeah. We had an absolutely good relationship, as good as can be, with a striker who is not scoring as often as he wants, as the people want, and as I think he could have.

1:47:48and with a striker who didn't play as often as definitely he wants. So how can you have a fantastic relationship? Would it be, if he would, I didn't see that picture. I heard about it. If he would have stand there and be the number one and jumping after me, crying his eyes out and hugging me for 10 minutes, I would, okay, what's going on here? It's a completely normal situation. I cannot. My first concern cannot be to please everybody, it's just not possible. It's not possible in that job. Easy, the first problem starts with 25 players, 11 starting positions. So, more players are not happy than you make happy.

1:48:32That's already where it starts, the problem. So, you have to get through this and I'm pretty sure he had super moments at Liverpool. We had super moments together. And on my last day, if I would have been him, I would have thought as well, okay, come on, the next one is a new chance for me. Because players do that. If it goes really well for them, it's not that they think thanks to the coach. If it's not going well, they think, it's okay, it doesn't bring me off. It's not my fault. All these kinds of things. We are humans. We are all the same. So it's not that they are special in that moment and some of them think, yeah, I have to do more.

1:49:10I have to do more for week one, week two, week three, and then I think, now I did three weeks more. It's still not picking me. So it's a bit, you cannot have always harmony and flowers and all these kind of things. That's a competitive environment, and you need to perform to get what you think you deserve. When did you decide that you wanted to sign Darwin? How did that decision? We decided exactly like before. We decided it all together involved in that process. And yes, that's how it is nowadays. We would have loved to sign him for lesser money. Of course. But it wasn't at the moment not possible.

1:49:51We needed a striker. We wanted to have an extra option for a striker. Like we had Bobby always the best false nine in the world. And now we needed somebody with a bit more speed and stuff like this. the action is Mo and Sadio I'm not even sure if Sadio was still there probably not Sadio won that year yeah I think Sadio won that year so we had to change as well so Louis Diaz great, Cody Gakpo great what kind of player we don't have I thought Cody can play a little bit like Bobby good footballer on the side but feels much better on the wing all this kind of thing so yeah of course we all signed him together no problem to admit that it maybe didn't work out as good as it could, but without Darwin, so many things wouldn't have happened.

1:50:42The biggest comeback of all times at Newcastle, for example. Oh, I love that day. I love that day. We came on. Yeah. Just give me 15 seconds to explain how you can build a viable business online. The people I see winning in life don't have a perfect plan. They just take the first step and then the next and then they keep going. They stay obsessed and they stay consistent. And Stan Store, a platform I co-own and one of our sponsors, is the best first step to help turn your knowledge into income. It only takes a couple of minutes to launch your business and start selling digital products, coaching, memberships, or communities online without any tech headaches or endless setup.

1:51:22Thousands of entrepreneurs, creators, and risk takers use Stan to take control of their future because Stan is for entrepreneurs, for those willing to put in the work and bet on themselves. If you're ready to start building, Join us. Launch your business today with a free 14-day trial at stephenbartlett.stan.store. We launched these conversation cards and they sold out. And we launched them again and they sold out again. We launched them again and they sold out again. Because people love playing these with colleagues at work, with friends at home, and also with family. And we've also got a big audience that use them as journal prompts.

1:51:55Every single time a guest comes on the diary of a CEO, they leave a question for the next guest in the diary. And I've sat here with some of the most incredible people in the world. And they've left all of these questions in the diary. And I've ranked them from one to three in terms of the depth. One being a starter question. And level three, if you look on the back here, this is a level three, becomes a much deeper question that builds even more connection. If you turn the cards over and you scan that QR code, you can see who answered the card and watch the video of them answering it in real time.

1:52:28So if you would like to get your hands on some of these conversation cards, go to thediary.com or look at the link in the description below. Why did you leave Liverpool? I watched your videos announcing your departure so many times and I was almost trying to read between the lines. Oh. I was trying to read between the lines. Tell me what you read. No, I was just, you know, because you talk about just the energy, not having the energy for it. That's kind of how I was interpreting. You sat down with your board, your board talked about plans for next year and you realized in that moment that you didn't have the energy to rebuild and go again etc no no not to rebuild that we didn't have to rebuild i knew i knew i know that the team is a good team so my expectation of myself is i'm i i'm i'm the energy giver to everybody in in this environment like that's what i bought my way if somebody has struggled come on you can I have my mind, but I don't need it, let's go.

1:53:23I have to be on top of, absolute top of my game to be the guy who deserves to be the Liverpool manager. That's what I said when I said, for the day when I feel, I don't know that anymore, then I don't, it's not that I say, okay, let's wait until everybody sees it and then they can give me the sack and la-la-la, all these kind of things. I cannot do it like that, not after the time we had together. I realised I don't want to be there after all the time we had together. I don't want to be the guy. I don't want to go on tour to USA. Why? Because I loved it every day. So it's then you realize, I need a break, whatever.

1:54:02I need to have something else. And you cannot do that in that business. You cannot say, ladies and gentlemen, give me a year, see you later. And it's just not like that. And I really think we did what we had to do to say what we felt and thought in that moment. It was exactly like that. I didn't have the energy to think about what's next. I didn't want to think about what's next. I just wanted to go. I was happy with finishing the season, but then don't ask me, what can we do here? What can we do there? It was all my responsibility for all the time because, yes, I don't decide money, but all the rest, it was in my hands from a specific moment on.

1:54:47COVID kicked in, no sporting director. Michael came after I left. He was not there anymore. It was not because we had a problem or whatever, not at all. It was just they wanted to find a leader for the pack and found that with Michael and Richard and Arne, obviously now working really close together. So that was the decision. But there was a time there was no Richard, no Michael, no Julian Ward. So it was just me sitting there, like on top of all the things. And we had to win football games, but all the rest was on my plate as well. It was an intense time. There wasn't a structure around you in that regard?

1:55:32COVID changed a lot. I mean, people didn't fly as much anymore. or the owners didn't come that off and over. It was like budget calls were on the phone, more or less. We brought in Jörg Schmadtke, the Germans, because we didn't have a sporting director at the time, in fact. Julian came back, but then I don't even know exactly why he left again. So these kind of things that just happened. And the only guys who were over there were we, the coaches and the football team. So they were just the normal stuff over a day. So he was doing the sporting director stuff. us and together within that one window with I think it was with Jörg Schmatke, the general guy we brought over.

1:56:14I don't even know if Julian Ward was still there. The lawyers, the scouts. Do you think you could ever go back and manage Liverpool again? Is that within the realm of possibilities? I said I will never coach a different team in England. So that means if then it's Liverpool for yeah so yeah theoretically it's possible what would it take theoretically for you to want to do that psychologically i don't i don't even know exactly i just it must be

1:57:20I love what I do right now. I don't. So I don't miss being in the dressing room, like in a sense of that I didn't have it often. I coached 1 ,080-something games. So I was in the dressing room very, very often. And I don't want to die in the dressing room just because it's so nice. It smells. So it's these kind of things. But there might be something. I'm 58. That's from your perspective. Old. From other perspective, from the other side, It's not that old. That means I could make the decision in a few years. I don't know. Do I have to make the decision today? I will not coach again. But thank God I don't have to do that.

1:58:02I can just see what the future brings. But now I'm involved in a project I really love and I love the people I'm working together with and the clubs we are responsible for and the countries the clubs are in. So I like doing what I'm doing right now. and in my mind only if i'm focused 100 on it i can do it really good and that's what i always want to do to do those are the things you don't miss what do you miss sometimes people so yeah sometimes i miss people like i i wish i so that's i don't miss a dressing room as a dressing room But sitting there in the restaurant with the players and having a nice chat, it's nice.

1:58:48It was always nice when they were just in a good mood. We won a lot of games. So there was often a very good mood in the building. And standing there, hearing them laugh. I still have virtual laugh in my ear, for example. Yes, this part of the job is obviously... but that's for these players which I had the last time it's now do I miss it in general with football players not right now it's not like that but I there is there's really not a lot to be honest what I miss because I'm still in the business I I I know most about so the football part I don't miss because I have it and the only thing is like I don't have to be outside I'm not the guy in the chair before a game and stuff like this no i i honestly that's that's probably the best because i don't miss anything that's how it is when i look at your career mines dortmund liverpool you seem to always be successful and it's it's extremely rare it's extremely rare and you seem to always succeed with a lot of passion and all those things but my question is and i I think about the audience we have, which are often business people, leaders, CEOs.

2:00:08Is there anything else that we haven't touched upon that is central to your idea of getting the best out of a group of people? We talked about being a sort of bespoke leader, being the jigsaw piece you need to be to get the best out of a person. We talked about giving everything. Is there anything else that's really central to your philosophy of leadership and management that you think is important that we haven't touched upon yet, that young coaches might be able to do? Create the best team. possible. And I mean in understanding of the team. Like really, there must be a reason why this team wins and not the other team because there are other teams out there.

2:00:43They try absolutely everything. So don't waste time with walking next to each other, not knowing anything about each other, not being bothered about the problems of each other, not being interested about each other. No, no, no. I want to grow together and it was my job to help them to grow, to create situations where they could do that, to make sure. And if I had to be harsh to all of them, that they found a way to get together, I did that. It was not what I said. It was what they needed to understand why we are a very special team in a very hard and difficult competition. But we have to find a reason why we deserve it more than others.

2:01:20Yes, that's what I say, what you have to do. And that's what people want to convince today with knowledge. They want to say, I know everything about that. Look, I can tell you, I can explain it to you, sir. But in the end, that's one thing. and other people can know as well. It's about how close can we really grow together to go out there and smash whatever out of them. So that's the thing, what I wanted, what I always did. So it was always clear for us, we would walk, I don't know, we would go through fire. I'm not sure if you say that, but we really would do absolutely everything. And without me telling every day to find a way, to grow as much together, that was obvious.

2:02:05How do I get people to walk through fire? So you're talking about making sure the bonds amongst themselves are strong. I heard stories of you making sure everybody knew everybody's name when you first arrived and things like that. The staff names, et cetera. What were you doing to get people to walk through fire? And that's exactly, that's exactly, that's a good question. There's no answer for the question because it means, it would mean you say one thing and for everybody runs. that's not like that you have to create a culture as an environment a situation uh a vibe where everybody realized this is special the underlining message is this is special and now let's go for it this is worth it this it means really more to all of us that we really can fight more for it what is special the togetherness the way we we had we the way we and that people can say that's in our club the same, but the way we interacted in the training ground with the kitchen staff, with the respect we showed every day with the kid men, with the gardeners, with all the people there, that was, for me, most important.

2:03:14Because you just realize the respect you show is the respect you get. You get your respect, you don't deserve any. So that's how it is. And you don't have, it's not a lesson in the sense of that I tell you, sit here, you have to respect the gardener, and then the other people will respect you as well. It's that you don't do it like that. It's just you learn that. Show respect, you get respect. Don't show respect, you don't deserve it. So all these little things over there, that's not a big thing. It's not that every day I go for them and tell them, why is this different? Why is that different?

2:03:46The way you deal with situations, we found a way for us that the most important information about the game was what I said and not was in the media, not was in social media. and I said it was good it was good there was still all the things out there were written but that were not important anymore when I said it was not good then could they write yeah but you won 3-0 and then we found a way to talk about it and worked on it we created our own world in that time which was more important than the outside world how is not being respectful to the guard now going to lose you the champions league what is the the through line i believe just in if you cannot do that if you don't appreciate what think what other people do then you can't appreciate what your teammate is doing if you don't that's just a little sign it's not that of course there's not direct impact from here to there but in the end i'm pretty sure if you would really have a a brief look at it in one or two situations like wow it doesn't look like a proper fella and then you go back to the beginning would say yeah because it isn't i can tell you i'm fascinated by this point because when i was um when i was at old trafford and the ladies who served the food in the lap in the boxes and lounges when i would ask them what was different after fergie left the thing they kept saying to me was oh it's just so different around here and i'd say explain to me how they go i don't know just he started focusing just knew our names yeah that's what they would say and it's a strange thing to hear that the only symptom that some of the staff in the stadium could point at was just the new leadership don't know our names yeah but this is obviously not the answer to the men united problems that's just the situation with the ladies or whoever working in that in that area but it shows if that doesn't then you don't know theoretically the names what it shows is the togetherness is not there anymore it starts sorry with it was just different and then you yep but not on day one but after 23 years of course it was different of course he knew your name he saw you growing up so how can you compare that this was under edward wood just for the context this wasn't under any also amaranth this was before then a couple of years ago yeah and i just always found that for me that as a business leader became a really interesting reference point because it as you said it's just a downstream symptom of something where the club has gone from feeling like a family and special and you know close and tight and these values to the decay of the values and it's from all the way down to the the stream at the bottom but this is this is a generation discussion isn't it so like in the past again i'm not that old that i say in the past everything was better for sure not but we are differently raised.

2:06:36That's how it is. I came home. I walked home in a 1 ,200-people village. I had a 400-meter walk from the bus station to my home. I walked home. Obviously, a lady crossed my way. I can't remember it. I arrived at home after 200 meters, more meters, and then my mom said, why you didn't say hello to Mr. So-and-so?

2:07:00What? so does that help me in life I'm not sure it's just how you get raised so I didn't run back and say sorry hello but next time believe me so in my life a lot of people recognize me it's difficult not to say hello to people because of that but I start obviously getting attention if I can't get through something hello that doesn't work properly for me anymore but it's still in me one thing is the things we read The other thing is the things we feel. The other thing is how we get treated. We all are the result of a lot of things, what happened to us. And as long as we are together, let's make sure that we influence each other as positive as somehow possible.

2:07:46And let's see where it leads us to. That's the idea I have. A lot of managers or leaders or CEOs would focus on tactics and strategy first and foremost. And as you say, the information and all those things. but it appears that you focus somewhere else not first same time it's not first it's not same time it's it's same time i'm 24 hours a day two hours time for training there's not a lot more you can do maybe you have another in the preseason definitely more another session two hours four hours 20 hours left seven eight hours sleep 12 more hours welcome what can we do with that Let's become the best group we can be.

2:08:26So that's what I'm 100 % interested in, definitely. The best group we can be. Yeah. That's those relationships, those values. Yeah. And were there any particular changes you made to how the team interacted with each other? I know that the Ineos guys told me at Manchester United, they've changed the canteens so that people don't sit on separate tables now and the team are together when they eat. Just small things like this that some people might think are inconsequential. Are there any things that you changed? Any rules or policies? I don't like these obvious things too much. If you don't like each other, the size of the table makes no difference, to be honest.

2:09:11I don't say that's not important. I don't see the real effect. I want to reach it in a different way. I want to introduce them to each other in a specific way on the pitch by the way that's where it starts because we have a football team we are not a community and just sit there and drink tea and biscuits it's a real competitive environment and it's all to get the best out of the boys on the football pitch so rules pitch rules dressing room but then there's so many things left and right of the rules there's so many things you can do together There's so much to talk about, so much to know about.

2:09:52And that's what life is. Otherwise, we just live next to each other and we don't benefit from each other. That makes no sense. I don't want to make it bigger than it is. But my general understanding from a football team is to become the best football team you can be. This is as important as tactics, as important as tactics. The best tactics, the guys don't respect, don't like each other. Nobody will see them ever, ever. So, we have the worst tactics by the law of each other. Boy, they still can win. That's possible. Isleworld, great team, good coach. You have a good chance to be successful. I have two pictures that we haven't shown yet, but this particular picture is of Elisabeth.

2:10:42Mama. Your mama. Yeah. 2011, we became champion with Dortmund. My home club, SV Gladden, invited me to build a stage. My elder sister wrote a poem. My mom couldn't have been prouder, obviously. That day I saw my teammates from my first football team, they were all there. Nobody would have thought that somebody from there would arrive where I was there. yeah great day Elizabeth was a really really nice woman I have to say she passed away in 2021 um after falling ill because of everything that was going on at the time with the pandemic you weren't able to attend her funeral because of the travel restrictions and all those kinds of things she did get to see your your success she got to see that's a big difference so I was not in a funeral and that was the sounds crazy online funeral was one of the saddest things i i experienced in my life but i made it happen at least that was good that we could see it that we could be part of it we couldn't be there my mom had in the end had dementia so it's not that she would have known that i was not there when she was lying there she was that that's uh not a nice thing but she saw the majority of my working life if you want.

2:12:19My dad didn't see my coaching life so that's is the nothing is perfect but mom was super happy was a very happy lady until she could remember us and see us and recognize us and the time when she couldn't do that anymore it was not too long but that's a can't wait for the day when somebody finds a solution for these kind of things for these kind of diseases and because in the age obviously you don't think about it but if you come older they think who dies today just of a heart attack and not by having already dementia or stuff like this and don't recognize the kids anymore and stuff like this you don't want that you just can get through this by ignoring the fact and hoping that science will find a way until we get there.

2:13:18Yeah.

2:13:22She started to lose her memories of her family because of dementia. Yeah. So like the normal things on the phone, she didn't know, didn't recognize my voice first. This is a strange, strange disease or whatever, however you call it. It closes so many doors and opens others. It's a long time memory. Incredible. She recognized ladies in the street. They were together in primary school, stuff like this, but didn't know who we were. So just these kind of things. It's not a competition of things you forget or whatever. There are a lot of things you forget, and especially for the people. And it was my sisters who took care of her, obviously.

2:14:07That's not nice if she don't recognize you. Who are you? Go away. these things how is that to do how is that to deal with as a family member when someone you love a parent can no longer recognize who you are you it's almost like it sounds like a grief as a heartbreak yeah i think but obviously my sisters were around um so for them it's harder of course because they were around for me it's not a problem at all because i knew she loved me more than our life in a moment she can recognize me anymore that it was not a problem for me i just felt for her that is that is really that it's really so that's so hard must be so hard if you have bright moments where oh i know oh my god you are here what are you doing here and then going again it's it's really it's really not nice and i i really sincerely hope that we find medication for that.

2:15:03I think science is in a good way but still a long way to go. But thanks for this picture. I have it on my phone somewhere but I don't have it as a... Thank you very much. Faith is a big part of your life as well. Your belief in God. And from what I understood that's not always been the case. When you were a younger man you weren't religious in the same way that you are now? Is that accurate? I wouldn't even say I'm religious, I believe. But I don't know 100 % what religious means to be 100 % honest. But this lady, my mom, prayed every night before going to bed. But the problem was that the one thing we prayed, the other thing she said, because she couldn't be hard with me.

2:15:47She just had no weapons. The only thing she could say, don't forget, if you do that again, I will have to tell the dad at the weekend when he's coming back. So it was like the only threat she had, the only weapon she carried around. And I obviously was smart enough to realize that whatever I did, she never told my dad. From the time that I went to church, I had a short spell where I thought, because Sunday morning church was when I played games, I have to go to church. I cannot play football anymore, but that lasted exactly one game. So one Sunday, I thought, God cannot be that hard. He cannot think that I have to go to church when I love football so much.

2:16:31It can't be like that. And he isn't, I'm pretty sure. So I found my way. For me, it's to live together. We have to make sure that we don't think the only thing that is interesting is my own well-being. We have to make sure that we really understand being alone in a good position doesn't help. Yes, it's completely normal that we all try to get as far as we can in our career, in our life, and all these kind of things. But it's really important that we make sure that we really try to work properly together, to live properly together, and all these kind of things. For me, this is my faith.

2:17:17This understanding is based on my faith and common sense, obviously. And that's the way I believe. And I think that's the best thing you can say about religion when it's like that, that it keeps people in a good place. If religion can't do that, then that's not the right religion for me. So it's really about that. We have to be tolerant. We have to. It's no problem. It's a wonderful planet. It's a wonderful world we are living in. But it's not for one or two. It's for all of us. And we have to make sure that that works out. And I think the right faith can help you with that. But I don't know what is the right faith.

2:18:01I only know what is for me. So, yeah, for me it's the right thing to do. And I never doubted it, to be honest, with all the information you get in life, God is real for me. And Jesus, of course. Yeah. What goals have you got left to accomplish, Jürgen? What is left on your list, if anything at all? Because you've got, you're right, you're probably halfway through your life, the way things are going in terms of people, the life expectancy increasing. Halfway through 116, we have the next podcast. Yeah. I want to travel, that's what we're doing. started now i want to be together with ulla as much as i can but not not that much that she or i don't want to be around each other anymore because i really think you see people and think what is your husband doing oh is it oh oh god so no no i'm not that but i'm very busy so i'm a lot away so that's fine but i want to spend with her with the kids with the grandkids i don't have this kind of ambitions i want to do really well for red bull really well i i feel already responsible for all the people I work together with, that's a very interesting thing for me.

2:19:11I feel so quick, really responsible, but I do. So I want to do it as good as we can, have the best time possible. Let's see what happens then. But on a private basis, I can tell you with all the things happening around, stay healthy and enjoy this part of life. Because you know now most things happened and most things were really good. There was another time when you're not sure where you want to go, where I can what's possible how safe you will be and all these kind of things where will you live in the future so I know where we will live I know how things worked out that's really good I'm not that old that I cannot move so move and try and do sports and travel and all these kind of things so I I'm more than happy with the things how they how they went out how they happened I'm really really happy I'm surprised how my career was.

2:20:07I never thought that, and you cannot plan it and stuff like this. I'm super happy with my private life, how it is, super happy with the missus, super happy with the kids, super happy with the grandkids. It's all really good. So what can you want more really without sounding ridiculous that you think, oh, you always do that? And the rest is job, and the job I always wanted to do as somehow possible. and that's still the case

2:20:42is he a man united fan if you ever want a job at a football club Manchester United would after all the time we spent together you want to tell me that it's really interesting to me because I think there's always an assumption that people want to continue to I don't understand that do the same because that's what you are good at I know I'm good as a manager I know so why should I I don't have to prove that not even to me I have to prove that I can raise my hand and tomorrow I can coach club X, Y and Z clubs who are happy now with sector manager and I don't want that so but to be my best friend that might come back that I say okay I'm ready that might I don't know today but in this moment it's not that I cannot do what I do while thinking with one leg being still there.

2:21:36I was never like that. I never looked right or left when I was at Mainz. I could have changed the club every year for the first seven. It was so obvious that something is going on there, pretty special, that the clubs want, oh, we want to have him. And I never thought a second that I want to go there. I wanted to stay at Mainz to do what we do and to learn what I thought I have to learn. Same at Dortmund, same at Liverpool. until I thought, it's not right. If that comes again, let's see what we will do. That's what the decision I wanted. I didn't want to make the job until I barely can move, I barely can travel, I barely...

2:22:14Mrs., can you help me? I didn't want to do that. Here, we're sitting, and yes, I'm 25 years older than you, but we both could probably run around the corner now, and it would not be the biggest difference. You're in great shape. Yeah, that's it, because I train. That's how it is. But I never did while I was a manager. That's the next thing. I just grew more and more and more. And now we have time for that as well. So it's good how it is. Well, even as a United fan, you brought so much to the Premier League that it was weirdly sad, also very happy, when you decided that you were going to leave.

2:22:52I felt two feelings at the same time. I felt very, very happy that this Liverpool era, in my view, was over. because I thought there's no way you leaving. You're more than just a manager. You're the spirit of the city. You're the spirit of the fan base. You're actually sort of personify the Liverpool fan base, in my mind, extremely passionate, all in togetherness. And as your former, I think he was your chairman or owner of mine said, you did. You brought the team together. You then brought the city together. And that had a profound impact both on Liverpool, but also on the Premier League and on my enjoyment and my misery as a rival fan.

2:23:27And that's a really, really remarkable thing. You've also inspired me as a lot on a personal level as a leader, just about, you know, everything you said there about how important it is to focus equally on the people and the team and the togetherness and not just on the tactics and the strategy and how passion can be a wonderful accelerant for performance and for feeling like this is special. And that's something that I think you've personified as a leader. we um we have a closing tradition on this podcast where the last guest leaves a question for the next guest not knowing who they're leaving it for oh and the question is for me not a message yes question that's been left for you as you look back on your career is there a particular moment a particular conversation a particular day that if you could you would go back and change or say something you wish you had said i honestly the problem is i would probably would say no i don't i wouldn't go back and and and try to change it because it wouldn't have a big impact the situations we had the big situations i could influence with the things I said, the specific moments which were then decisive, you just stand there and watch.

2:24:54Aguero in or not in. We have the same problem with United. We have a thing that the ball goes in or the ball is over the line for 11mm or not. That has nothing to do with what I say. Would I wish if I could go there and give it a little push? Yes. would I wish James Madison would block the shot of Vincent Kompany that he cannot score the goal against Leicester? Yes, but it had nothing to do with what I said. And so the things I said, I said in the moment for the right reasons. And sometimes they had the impact I wished and wanted and sometimes not. yeah i had to accept that that was the other thing that um jamie carrigar asked he said oh when you see when you see clock ask him how he feels about his former assistant manager pep lingers going and working going and working at manchester city absolutely no problem i like it i like both peps that's how it is no problem uh with that um i worked together with pep blinders he was an inspiration for me every day when we worked together, absolutely every day I learned a lot from him and Pep Guardiola I couldn't respect the manager more and when they asked me what do you think, can we of course you can Pep Guardiola said come on, find a guy who worked together with Pep Guardiola and Jürgen Klopp I would read a book

2:26:31and yeah and Pep knew exactly Pep Gaudela knew exactly what he was looking for yeah he wanted to you know exactly this kind of spark fire from and Pep has that Pep is Pep Leinders has that he's an extreme well of of energy and so I'm happy for them both we're playing you guys this week this weekend on Sunday. What? Manchester United Liverpool this Sunday. You didn't know. It's at Anfield. It's a Premier League. Darby. That's crazy that you don't know. Yeah. But hopefully after, so this will come out just after that. So I'm hoping that's four losses. Oh, we come after that. Yeah. When do we go?

2:27:17Hopefully the day after, but we'll see. So hopefully this is your fourth, Liverpool's fourth loss in a row. And the fan base are growing increasingly impatient and they're annoyed and amram is now one another another game in a row so this is this conversation will come out straight after wow now we've played in the enfield yeah yeah good luck

2:27:44they have to strike back yeah you know that's never a good situation you know the two days ago or so i just in the morning i wake up pretty early in the morning so I throw it on YouTube and have a look, and it shows me behind-the-scenes footage from the 7-0. The 7-0, oh, gosh. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I never saw that. I never saw it. It's like the 7-0, obviously. I know the goals and stuff, but it's the camera difference in the stands. It's really good. So, okay, fine. I watched it. 19 minutes. Really good. So all the goals again, and you see players in the dressing room all the way to the dressing room.

2:28:17Really good. The next day, I open. And because you know how it is with the algorithm, Now I see the 5-0 at Manchester. So, I watched that. And today I come here and had no clue that you are Manchester United fan. So, I was really well prepared for that talk, I have to say.

2:28:39Without knowing. Damn. Thank you so much, Jürgen. Thank you for taking the time. Thank you for being an inspiration to me. But also, thank you for all that you brought to the Northwest and to Liverpool. Sure, thanks. Welcome. It was my pleasure. Honestly, thank you so much. And I've learned so much from you as a leader and also as a man. And in the lead up to this, I spoke to so many people around you that have worked with you. I contacted Jordan Henderson. I spoke to Carragher, who knows you through various people. I think he managed him for one game, he said. Yeah, yeah. In Australia. In the Australia game.

2:29:07And they all said the same thing. They all said that you're the same man on and off the camera. You're a person that brings people together. You're extremely likable, but you have high standards and are an incredibly passionate person. and the narrative was consistently he is the same man on and off camera, which is a credit to yourself and no wonder why people were willing to walk through fire with you. It's incredible what you've accomplished and I hope, selfishly as a football fan, I hope we see you back in the game at some point. Maybe Real Madrid or Manchester United, you know, whatever. You never know.

2:29:37You never know. Thank you so much.

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