UFC Legend Dustin Poirier: I Lost My Mind. I’ll Never Let It Happen Again.

28:33You know, I made that decision. I'm not going to be like my father or make another mistake like I made in the airport. It's just, it's not helping me in any way. You know, it might be a quick release and a quick hit of dopamine, but it's not benefiting me in any way. So I got to cut it out, cut it out for my life. It's not an easy thing to do. With socializing and things like that, it's tougher to be the sober one. But in everyday life, it's not hard. for me you know i've never been an alcoholic i just have a bad relationship if i do drink so cutting it out completely is you know not a big deal so so take me to that day then you wake up you go to you go to the airport you're flying to atlanta you're going you're going somewhere where are you going atlanta i'm going to uh to south florida it was actually a three-leg trip i was supposed to go to south florida for a day that afternoon fly out go to la shoot a commercial show for three days from LA, Vegas, work for CBS for the weekend and then fly home.

29:38So it was a three, it was a big trip. Yeah. Three leg trip. We didn't, we didn't even get the first leg. We didn't even get the first leg, man. There should be a button just down below here. And if it says subscribe, you're already subscribed. If it says subscriber, that means you're not yet. And if you're not subscribed, please, could you do us a favor and hit that button? It helps the show more than you know. And according to the algorithm, you're someone that watches our show, but you haven't yet hit that button. Thank you so much. What happened? What was the sequence of events? On my flight from Lafayette, Louisiana, I drank two champagnes.

30:13Nothing crazy, you know, just landed in Atlanta. Had a little bit of a layover. Went to a bar, restaurant bar. Started drinking champagne. some guys came in, took some shots. One thing led to another. Go to my gate, get into it with the desk agent. They call security, call the police. Do you remember what you said to the desk agent? No. No. The police didn't tell you after? No. So you didn't even get on the plane? No, I never got on the plane. I don't believe, I'm pretty sure. 90 % sure I never got on the plane. And it might have been that. The desk agent might have saw I was intoxicated and it's like, no, we can't get on this plane and that's might have what started it.

31:00I don't know. But I do want to apologize to those desk agents, whoever they are, and the police for having to put up with me, man. They did it. I actually asked a lawyer in Atlanta who I've been working with, if he can, please give me that officer's information, his address, if I can write him a letter, his cell phone, if I can call him, just to tell him how great of a job he did, dealing with a person in that condition and how professional he was. You know, he's incredible. It could have been so much worse. It could have been so much worse. I just want to thank him. I didn't get to do that. So there's some kind of argument with the desk agents that I'm guessing you can't recall.

31:42No. And then they say you're not getting on the flight. Yeah. And that leads to them calling the security or police in the airport. The video we see is of the security guy coming in. The police officer, yeah. You've watched the video, right? No. So my wife watched it. A buddy of mine watched. I've kind of pieced it together at this point. I don't want to see it, man. You don't want to see it? I don't want to see it. Okay. I don't want to see it. Even when my wife started playing it and I heard it, she went watching the other room. And then I have a buddy I work out with five days a week. He's kind of, between him and my wife, I've put the pieces together and pretty much know the extent of what happened.

32:19Why don't you want to watch it? I just don't want. Don't want to see it, man. Can you articulate why that is? To see myself in that condition, disrespecting police officers, disrespecting workers at the airport, disrespecting myself, disrespect my family. I just don't feel like it's going to benefit me to see that. If anything, I think it's going to bring me down. I'm going to keep thinking about it. Like I said, for the most part, understand what happened, know what happened. I don't need to see it again. you know so in that video you you seem to get aggressive quite quickly and you you offered this um gentleman a fight um he kind of backs off he knows who you are clearly straight away he backs off what i find interesting also is he pulls out his taser he's gonna he says you know might tasey but as you walk away and you're arrested you dap him up and you you congratulate him on the job he did yeah my buddy was telling me that he was telling me like his my buddy's wife thinks that's the best part of the video because it's funny because you're known yeah so i didn't watch the video at all and i every day passing i'd be able to piece a little bit more together and memories kind of you know flashes of what happened are kind of playing in my head but uh i i got home deleted all my social i posted that on instagram then i uninstalled all social media off my phone so i haven't since father's or the day after father's day i haven't been on anything i haven't seen i know they're making fun i know they're talking about me obviously i've been in the light with being a professional athlete for a long time i know how this goes um so i just uninstalled all my stuff so i haven't seen any of the clips any of the videos any of anything you know besides what my wife and my buddy are telling me your buddy that you train with yeah Yeah.

34:09Well, it was interesting because you seemed, as you walked away, you were quite polite. Yeah, that's what I told him. I was like, maybe I realized what was going on. You know, maybe I had an aha moment. Like, what the hell is, what am I doing? You know, in that drunken stupor. I don't know. You said to him that he did a good job. Right, yeah. Which was quite nice. right and i looking back at it now with what that what they're telling me and the way he handled it he did a great job you know i need to thank him because like i said it could have been so much worse what if it was a young hothead cop who wanted to be a superstar i wanted to you know it could have been horrible you know i could be sitting here facing serious charges and just to put my wife and my children through that, you know, just, yeah, it's not good.

35:02So you went to jail that day? Yeah. You got charged with being drunk and disorderly or intoxicated? No, they charged me with public intoxication. Okay. And they let you go the same day? Yeah, I spent like a night, spent the night or the afternoon in jail until I sobered up. And they released you on probation or something? I'm not on well I don't know what the laws are here I haven't been to court and all that stuff yet so they just know they on bond okay on bond okay and that's when you go in you know after then go and you do the therapy session you go and try and find your father yeah all these trips are cancelled I'm guessing at that point yeah you have to go home and speak to your wife right right can't be easy it wasn't fun for sure you know to let her down and it's just been so long since I don't even know how to address it really when I got home.

35:56I haven't been in trouble. I haven't been arrested in so long, you know, decades and decades. I don't even know when's the last time I got arrested. This is the first time in a very long time. But to go back and my partner who's been with me through everything and has grown with me through everything to go back and, like, see her face to face, yeah, I just keep apologizing. and it'll never happen again. If I'm a fly on the wall during that conversation when you get home, what do I observe? Me telling her it'll never happen again, and her telling me it can't happen again, you know.

36:47Yeah, man. I'm telling her that I'm going to focus on myself And be better from this I know it sucks right now in the moment But this decision This arrest This quit drinking For the rest of my life Is going to benefit me and my kids in the future So things happen, you learn And that's just what it is You know You met Jolie When you were 14 years old? Younger Younger really Yeah 14 is Is like a freshman In high school We were dating In middle school And in many respects She's really She sacrificed quite a lot For your A lot man Career A lot She dropped out of college And moved with me To South Florida For me to chase my dreams Because she was going To nursing school Wasn't she Yeah Yeah And I honestly Don't think I would Have made it To the point I made it to in fighting if I didn't have an anchor like that at home, you know

37:56Man, she'd been my best friend for a long time

38:08Yeah, so to go home after getting arrested and speaking to her and like not only did I let myself down, but I have a family, you know? I have kids. I let my family down, man. That's what hurts. This is another beautiful photo. Yeah. The gang. That's them.

38:31Yeah, man, I let them down, let myself down. But like I said, I'm going to learn from this and continue pushing forward, and it will never happen again. it's going to affect the trajectory of my whole life this one this one arrest you know my son and my daughter is never going to grow up and see me intoxicated they're never going to see me say things or do things I don't mean to do or mean to say you know so like I said it sucks man it's bad but it's going to benefit me and my family in the long run so it's just something that had to happen i guess so she did she know what happened before you got back from jail had she seen videos or no no no no she hadn't no the police officer called her when i was in uh in a holding cell and stuff so yeah she knew what was going on she didn't know in the moment if she probably knew a couple hours after you know once they booked me and all that i've got 60 seconds and i'm going to show you how much I can get done because of our sponsor called Whisper Flow.

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41:14So if I have any questions about my out-of-range results, I can just go in there and ask it any question I want. And these tests are backed by doctors and thousands of hours of research. It's$365 for a yearly membership. go to functionhealth.com slash DOAC and use the code DOAC25 for$25 off your membership. What's interesting is, you know, we've seen these kind of incidents happen before, but I've never seen such a large amount of people understand. You'd expect the reaction to be from the general public, from fighters, from people at large to be, oh my God, this is a bad person. but I think because you conducted yourself in a certain way throughout your career that wasn't the sentiment I'm not seeing what people it wasn't the sentiment I can tell you it was like it was crazy I was like I was saying it to my fiance I was saying like the reason why the sentiment has been he's going through some things and this is a good man is because a you've conducted yourself so well throughout your career you've had good values in victory and in and and in loss but also I think because you've actually spoken about some of these struggles publicly?

42:22I've never bit my tongue. I've always been open, you know, about what I'm going through. When I was able to pinpoint and talk about what I was going through and I didn't know, I couldn't speak on it. But as I got older and started doing therapy, I'm able to speak on it. And yeah, I am going through things at some days, you know. Well, that's what I'd say to you is, I know you've not looked at the internet, but the internet has been heavily supportive of you. And you know, I think a lot of that probably as longtime fight fans and people who've been following my career a long time. You know, I grew up in fighting.

42:55So people got to watch me from a kid, you know, grow up. So they, they know my character for the most part, it was a bad day. It wasn't, you know, it's not a bad life. I had, I messed up. I had a really bad day where I was angry at the world and obviously alcohol doesn't, doesn't help that. And, uh, I really messed up, but people have seen me year after year and I mean, well, and I really mean it. And I think they know is authentic. But I am just a human being, and I make mistakes. So I think those fans, if people are sticking up for me, it's because they know it's Dustin. He's going to shake back, or he's going to turn this into a positive somehow.

43:34And that's my goal. I don't want to let anybody else out there down. I'm trying my best. I have to take care of myself first, and I'm doing that, the right steps. And that's just it. I think the people who are standing up for me have watched me grow up, you know? Well, dare I say, I think that was the majority of the sentiment, was that this is a good man who's struggling, and it was people sending sympathy because of that, but also because there's a couple of clips that went viral online of you speaking on both Theovan's show and Joe Rogan's show. And so in the wake of, you know, this clip going viral of you in the airport, these other clips go viral with them which is you oh you haven't seen it okay i mean obviously i did the i did the interviews or whatever you're talking about so i said it so i'm sure if you showed it i would remember but i haven't seen what people are talking about well this clip went viral at the same time and this is what gave it context have to yeah you just there's no if you get complacent or if you why what i'm like it's honestly bro i'm a danger to myself when i'm have nothing no no goal circling on my calendar i'm a danger to myself man yeah yeah i beat i beat myself up mentally i'm home i drink i'm it's just not good i have to have some kind of battle yeah yeah and i've always been like that but like as i'm getting older i'm kind of recognizing oh you can see it more yeah so i kind of set set goals so i so that clip went viral and there was a clip just like it um of you on jirrogan which is you saying almost identically the same thing which also went viral with it so this gave everybody context and so you see that and you go okay we understand and i think we're now you know we're old enough mature enough to understand that once a pro athlete leaves the high octane high adrenaline sport like ufc that your brain has changed for sure and not least because of the dopamine but also you know there's other reasons why there's there's head injuries are quite prevalent in the sport so there was a huge amount of sympathy i just want you to know that because i know you've not seen it but i mean i still feel horrible but you know and not even using fighting or head trauma or my homeless father or any of that stuff as an excuse i just want to say that like i did these things i know better i know right and wrong i don't want to lean on these as a crutch of my actions you know what i mean and the other the other clip that when just so you know just because of these this is you and Joe Rogan talking about a similar thing.

46:04I was talking about it's like a gift and a curse, man. It's like you have to be all in at something. Those kind of people who are built like that, whether it's fighting or drinking or whether it's good or bad, you're going all in. It's dangerous. That's the problem, yeah. The problem is like we see with Connor. When they don't have the fighting, then they go all in with the other things. Right. Fighting was always, for me, always pulled everything together, you know. That's why, like, retiring is scary, man. Days are long. I have a lot of time. I don't have to get ready for a fight. I don't, you know.

46:35You're still a young man, too. You still have a whole lot of life ahead of you. I'm 37, man. Yeah, so it makes you think, like, what do I do now? What do I do with my future? What do I do? What do you want to do? Dude, I kind of got, like, for a week or so, I would say depressed, but I kind of got into, like, a funk. Like, what the hell am I going to do with my life? Every day I would wake up for the last 20 years. How can I be a better fighter? How can I? What's new in fitness? How can I push myself? I want to be the champion. and then boom, you lay the gloves on and you wake up and you're a fucking civilian.

47:01And that's meant that some of your fellow peers, like Jon Jones, have come out and said some really nice things and other fighters have come out and said some really nice things and sent their support and, you know, well wishes. I appreciate it. I'm working on myself. I'm trying my best. Were you aware that Jon Jones had done a post and stuff? My buddy Kyle said, the guy who I work out with every day I'm talking about, he told me that Jon Jones came out and said something and it was positive. he said uh matt brown as well a former fighter did a video he said it was really nice and stuff and i'm sure i'll see some of that stuff i don't want to like relive the moment that much i don't want to keep like diving back but when i do get back on social media or do start watching videos and stuff again i'm sure i'm going to see some of it you know and i appreciate everybody but i'm i just it feels weird to you know i'm i'm not looking for it for that for sympathy or to make this okay.

47:58It's not okay. It's not. But I think the reason I'm sort of really keen to tell you is once upon a time, we didn't really understand mental health. And so people were thought to be crazy or whatever when they acted out of character. But I think the world has gotten to such a place now where we think about context a bit more. And it was really nice to see for me, having done a little bit of background research as well to see that people's first reaction wasn't just to villainize somebody it was to understand people actually went oh no this is someone struggling with their mental health it's not a bad person it's a bad mental health situation um which i've actually not really seen before which was as i say it was really nice but i know you i know what you're saying you're saying you don't blame anything right i don't want to blame anything or have a crutch to lean on about my actions about what happened you know i did it you know i'm not blaming it on mental health or anything like that even though i'm focusing on that now you know i i did i did that i decided to drink that day when i wasn't feeling well it's it's all on me so is it kind of a bit of a roller coaster in your world post fighting in terms of your mental health is it ups and downs and ups and downs yeah big time and what is that some days i wake up and i feel like i made the right decision you know uh i need to be home i need to be doing things around the house i'm going to be here every day with my kids making them breakfast and then some days i wake up and i'm like what the fuck am i doing i can beat all these guys still you know i can still beat these guys but i don't know if that ever leaves i might be 60 year old having coffee one day saying the same thing i could beat these guys i don't know if that's just a competitive spirit i don't know if that's just fighting your whole life i don't i don't know but i these top guys that are winning now and and fighting now on these upcoming cards i can i can beat them still i know i can and then i wake up the next day and i'm like ah good thing i don't have to fight these guys anymore then the next day it's like i can i can be the world champion you know it's just up and down every day and how does your your mental health sort of correlate to those ups and those um thoughts even though i have those days where i want to fight and i think i made the right decision my mental health has been pretty even you know up until recently i haven't been worried about myself or having to go to my journal and sit in the morning and have coffee like i've been doing this last week, you know, but I, when I do start feeling a hundred percent normal, okay, again, I need to continue to do those things.

50:45You know, I can't, I can't stop because I feel good. It's, it's a constant, it, something's going on with my brain. Like I have to practice these, these things every day. And now being removed from the incident removed from my three years ago when I I felt really bad and I was in the dark place. I'm realizing that. It's not a eureka moment where you're fixed. This is everyday work for the rest of your life, most likely. I'm pretty sure. Was it just the last week? Or was it, you said, in recent times? In recent times, that was like the boiling point on Father's Day. But there's been days, yeah, there's been days where I've not expressed to my wife how I'm feeling.

51:29And I was feeling down. The last two months? A few months, yeah. There's good days, bad days, you know. Where you haven't expressed to your wife how you're feeling. Yeah, some days I will tell her, but some days I don't, you know. I just continue to go along my day, you know. So I don't want to be that guy to where I wake up and my wife's worried about how I'm feeling that day. You know, I don't want her worrying about me like that. I wonder who's waking up today. Is it depressed? Is upset Dustin waking up today? Or is this my normal husband I'm waking up to? I don't want to worry her. So some days, you know, if I'm feeling really bad, which hasn't been that often lately, I'll tell her, you know, today I'm not feeling that well.

52:12I don't want my daughter coming in the bedroom, you know, why is that staying in bed all day? You know, I don't want to tell her again that I'm not feeling good today. You know, she doesn't understand. She's about to be 10 years old. She can't comprehend what's going on. I can barely comprehend it, you know, so. So to keep them more on a steady day-to-day thing, if it's just slightly I'm kind of feeling a little bit off today, I just suck it up and go about my business. But there will be days where you stay in bed all day? There has been, yeah. And you try and sort of avoid the conversation with your daughter?

52:51Yeah. It's not often, but it happens, yeah. Do you find that if you don't talk about it, it kind of comes out in other ways. Well, you bottle it up so long until it finds a way out, you know? Yeah. Yeah. Which kind of brings us to the airport incident, I guess. Could be. To some degree. Right, but even the airport incident, those days leading up, even if I did have an off day, I didn't feel like it was that bad, that serious, that dangerous to myself or anybody else. You know, I really didn't feel like that. It's an interesting thing. I've often actually contended with when I'm having like bad moments do I tell my partner so I can really relate to the feeling because in part I think as a man sometimes you want to be you have it within you that you need to be strong and steady especially with like my fiance I'm like I have to be strong and steady so if I'm having a bad day or whatever I I feel like I have to keep it to myself but then it always finds a way out and it hurts her like it'll hurt the relationship so actually i think with with age i've gone actually to avoid all problems be honest as fast as you can right it's like yeah honesty is always the best it's always the best is that kind of how you feel as well with it or is it i mean for the most part i am really open and honest but like if i'm just kind of filling off and it's for me to i know you don't understand what that what that means or maybe you have something you can link it to when you feel kind of just like Today's not my day.

54:19If I'm feeling off, I'll let her know. I've been pretty honest. But like I said, if it's just slight, like I'm just not feeling right, I won't. If it's slight, I won't even bring it up. I got to be a dad and continue to do things every day and stuff like that. But if I'm feeling really down to where I don't even want to leave the house at all and stuff, you know, I'll let my wife know. On this point of purpose, when you were talking to Theo and Joe, you were saying that, you know, the purpose you had for 20 years has now gone. So in its place, you kind of need to find something else. You need to figure out what's in its place.

54:51How are you thinking about that today? I retired at 36 years old. That's young. Like I said, the days are long. I have all day, every day. I need to stay busy. And that's what I have been doing, working with CBS, working with the podcast we have down in South Florida every Monday. I've just been trying to say yes to as much stuff as I can so I don't have time to sit back and think. and that could have been my demise as well maybe i was being too busy maybe i wasn't focusing on my mental health and myself as much you know it's easy to get lost in these whirlwinds of busy and be here be there you know life just moves so fast sometimes if you have a plan for for for what you want to commit yourself to you're 37 now right so i mean you got another 50 50 years ahead of you to to climb other mountains right potentially right no i don't have anything locked like locked down on what I'm going to do exactly, what I'm going to focus everything on, but I need to find something, man.

55:47Has there ever been anything that compared? No, nothing ever will. Nothing. I have a void inside of me that nothing were, you know, being a father is very fulfilling and I love it and it's rewarding and I actually enjoy it. But nothing fills that void of what fighting was in my life. You know, I haven't found anything yet. I don't think there is. You don't think there is? I just don't know what's going to consume me and take all of myself the way fighting did. You know, I woke up thinking about it. I went to sleep thinking about it. It was my life, man.

56:31I cared so much about it, man. I was in love with it. You can still play a role in the industry, though, no? Yeah, and that's what I thought was a good avenue. That's what I was trying to do. That was my goal after fighting, is I want to stick around the sport, whether I'm on the desk broadcast or with the podcast, anything containing to the sport where I can talk about it. you know, be around the sport that's given me everything I have and taught me so many lessons in life. I just want to be around it, speaking about it, being on the mats, helping younger fighters, whatever, you know, and I was doing, and I was doing that when I retired, you know, I'm still doing it.

57:10But it's not the same. It's not the same. No. How does it compare as a percentage? Is it 20 % the way there, 50 % the way there? Probably closer to 20. It's not, it's not even 50. No. Have you spoken to other fighters who have expressed the exact same sentiment that like fighting was the Mount Everest for me and I don't know what to do next? Not really to that exact point, but other fighters have reached out and said, hey, you know, I'm all ears if you ever want to talk about it. I went through it as well. You know, laying the gloves down isn't as easy as you think. You know, people who I look up to have reached out to me and I never took anybody up on it.

57:49You know, I never started speaking to other fighters about what they do to get past. And I should. But, you know, it's my doing, you know. Because it's not a new problem, is it? No, this isn't. Everyone, but lots of people have expressed. Right. And it's not just a new problem with fighting. It's a new problem, I think, with a lot of athletes, you know, who've done it for a long time and reached the pinnacle. And, you know, when it's over, you know, you have a lot of life left to live. I've heard similar sentiments expressed from some of my friends that were in the military and then left the military 36, 37 years old.

58:21and it's like that was their Everest. That was also the camaraderie that they had being on base and stuff like that and going away being deployed and then they come back and they're a civilian all of a sudden. It's difficult. Yeah, man. But that's life. Life's difficult. You know, it's just you got to figure something else out. You got to solve a new puzzle. It's just life keeps going. You were going off to work when you were caught up in this airport incident. Yeah. How are you thinking about work prospects and stuff like that, considering all that swirling around at the moment? Worried about losing everything I've been working on.

58:58You know, that is a possibility as well, you know.

59:07Like post-fighting, when I retired, all the stuff that I've been doing, all the desk work, me focusing on getting better at all that stuff. I'm like, did I just ruin everything that I was working for? you know i don't know yet it's still too too early to really have those answers i think have you got like sponsors and stuff like that or is it just that your partners that where you do guest work and podcasts and stuff like no i have a bunch of sponsors yeah and they've been understanding that's kind of murky right now i think it's still too fresh i know uh one big one isn't a sponsor anymore oh you lost a sponsor oh yeah i'm sure i lost a few i'm waiting to see when the smoke clears who's still with me or not that day cost me not only embarrassment and embarrassment to my family uh it cost me a lot of money too you know i'm gonna i'm losing sponsors i'm losing gigs and losing things that i had set up you know you're losing gigs you had set up in the future as well well we'll see obviously the gigs the three things i was supposed to do that that week are gone.

1:00:13And then a big sponsor of mine is gone because of it. And of the professional commitments you have coming up, what are those kinds of things that you have? I know you said in an interview that I watched that you'd reached out to, was it Paramount? I work with Paramount, yeah. You work with them. But you'd reached out to them to say, listen, I want to sharpen my skills as a commentator. As a desk analyst. Desk analyst. And so you'd reached out to them post you know post retirement because you wanted to get more and more into that i just thought it was really cool that you proactively reached out to them and said listen i'm here yeah if you guys think that i would be a good fit anywhere on a broadcast or anything i would love to talk about fighting and talk about this sport as it continues to grow with what i've learned through the two decades of doing it you know if i can be a voice in this area please let me do it and they did, you know, and I told him like, I'm coachable.

1:01:08I don't have no hard feelings. Like if I'm doing something wrong, please let me know. I'm very, you know, cause a lot of these other people who work the desk come from a media background or things like that. Of course we have a lot of fighters, but who worked the desk, but a lot of these other people might not take criticism and coaching as well as somebody who's been coached their whole life. So I'm letting them know, like, if there's something I'm doing that is not the right etiquette is not, if I, if I can do something better please let me know coach me i'm not it's no judgment you're never gonna rub me the wrong way please let me know i want to be good at this that's what i was trying to let them know well it's cool it's cool because a lot of people they come in with a lot of ego um especially if they've been at the the peak of their powers one profession yeah they kind of don't want to humble themselves enough to be a whole new thing for me you know talking on tv and talking about fights and things like that is a whole new thing so i wanted to learn as much as i can and you have a contract with them yeah i did we'll see oh you're worried that it might not be it could be yeah i guess when something like i had a year contract with with paramount cbs to work the the desks for the fights okay well i hope they all stick with you we'll see i think on the in a few weeks i'm back on the podcast so i know they're bringing me back to the monday podcast we talk about fights every monday in two weeks i'll be back on that and so we'll see if that continues you know you know the other thing is you are you are young you're 37 i'm 33 and you're young yeah yeah that's how i can i can almost relate it would be like if my career was was wrapping up in a couple of years like my main you know but i'm in the i guess my career is business so i can kind of do that forever well for sure but if i if i had to if i'd spent the last 20 years of my life i've spent the last 15 years of my life building businesses so if i wrapped up in a couple years time and i had to change profession and I couldn't do what I've done for the last 20 years anymore.

1:03:01Gosh, that's what athletes go through. For sure. They climb the mountain and then aging happens and they get older like we all do. And then they have to say, right, brand new mountain. That doesn't happen to most people in most careers. You kind of just keep climbing up. Yeah, yeah, yeah. True. I never thought about it comparing it to other careers. Do you enjoy the desk work? I really do, man. Yeah. That's why I'm scared to lose it too, because I really enjoy being connected to the sport. You Like I said, giving me everything I have, me and my family. Everything we have is through fighting. Just like Jon Jones, where marginal improvements in your cognitive performance can have a massive impact.

1:03:37Sometimes I podcast for 10 hours a day. Over the last couple of weeks, I've been in filming for a TV show. And I have like one or two days off to get all of my work done, which means there's lots of cognitive load. And so I turn to ketones because I find myself more articulate, able to think more clearly, able to work out better when I'm fueled by ketones. And so the reason I became a co-owner of this company and the reason why they now are a sponsor of this podcast is because I remember one of my team members called Christiana. She tried it once and came up to my desk and she goes, this is the best product ever made.

1:04:06And I think in part that's because she really cares about those cognitive benefits, as I do, as John Jones does, and as I think most of my listeners probably will. So if you haven't tried these yet, all you have to do is go to ketone.com slash Stephen and you'll also get 30 % off your first subscription order. You'll get exclusive Ketone IQ merch. and of course, cognitive benefits that might just change your life. If there's anything we need, it is connection, especially in the world we're living in today. And that is exactly why we created these conversation cards. Because on this show, when I sit here with my guests and have those deep, intimate conversations, this remarkable thing happens time and time again.

1:04:44We feel deeply connected to each other. At the end of every episode, the guest I'm interviewing leaves a question for the next guest and we've turned them into these conversation cards. And we've added these twist cards to make your conversations even more interesting. And there are so many more twists along the way with the conversation cards. This is the brand new edition. And for the first time ever, I've added to the pack this gold card, which is an exclusive question from me, but I'm only putting the gold cards in the first run of conversation cards. So get yours now before the limited edition gold cards are all gone.

1:05:18Head to the link in the description below. And this is obviously a bit of a personal question, but it gives useful context, is at 37 years old, you're thinking as a man, you know, I've got to provide for my family for the next 30, 40 years potentially. Are you set up sufficiently? Because there's a lot of talk around fighters not getting paid that much in the UFC as well. No, the career I've had, I don't have to work another day of my life. Really? Oh, congratulations. Thank you. Well done. Because a lot of people also, they go out and they, you know, we hear the stories of buying a little too many watches.

1:05:48or gambling or whatever it might be. I need to stop gambling. That's what I need to do. I told my wife the other day, she was like, she's like, I just paid some bills. I saw you made another deposit to the gambling thing. I was like, I can't cold turkey everything. Give me one, let's go one thing at a time. One thing, gambling's a couple steps up on the list. I got some other things I need to stop doing first. Well, if you can take care of yourself the rest of your life, then, you know, all good, right, to have fun still. Right, right, yeah. So a lot of fighters, a lot of people generally can't say that when they leave.

1:06:21But I've always, you know, I have a few businesses in Louisiana and elsewhere. I've always planted seeds my whole life. You know, I started investing when I was 23 years old, you know, before I was even making real, real money. I was investing what little I had. I always planted these seeds because I knew I couldn't fight forever. It was going to end any, you know, I could get in a car accident and never fight again. It could end any day with fighting. I knew that. So I've always planted seeds to try to have my future taken care of, you know, always or since a young age. Smart. Actually, when I was like 18, 19, I told my wife, I'm not going to fight past 35 years old.

1:07:00And I almost hit that mark. I was too young to, at the time when I told her that, too young to see the, you know, full picture and know how my career was going to play out. But 36, I hung it up. I told her from a very young age, 35, I lived half my life. I have a whole other life to live at 35. I can go to college. I can be whatever I want to be. I have a whole other life to live. So I kind of always angled at 35 to pivot. And that was the moment. Yeah, man. That's the moment where you retired. Yeah. How does it feel looking at that photo? Man, these are my brothers in this picture, man. I can see the emotion in your faces.

1:07:40Yeah, my mother's back there, and this is my family, you know? All these guys are my family members.

1:07:52It was a special day. And I got to do it in Louisiana, you know, it meant a lot to me. It really meant a lot to me.

1:08:02Well.

1:08:07Yeah man I was just a kid chasing dreams And it just flew by so quick And I guess that's a part of me that's Scared For the future I don't know You know for 20 years I was dreaming About being the best I just want to dream again you know I don't know what that dream will be I just need that in my life Whatever that is Yeah.

1:08:37Special day, man.

1:08:44So many emotions in your face as you look at that photo. Yeah, I'm trying not to tear up, dude. How come? Because it just makes me feel that way, you know?

1:08:55Because I still love it, but I know I need to walk away from it. you know, continue walking away from it. But I still love it. And like I told you, it's like a piece of me.

1:09:08Like those gloves, me putting them on the mat is a piece of myself I left, you know? I really, truly believe that.

1:09:32You know, I was a kid when I started this, the fight life.

1:09:41You know, it taught me how to be a man. It taught me how to do business. It taught me a lot of things about myself.

1:09:50I didn't go to school. Fighting was my education, you know. Traveled the world and met people and sat at tables. I would have never dreamed of sitting at through fighting. It was just an incredible journey.

1:10:08But if I can go back in time to when I was a kid, 16, 17, if I could do it again, I would do it again, even knowing everything that what could be, what damage I could take, I would do it again. That's how fun the ride was.

1:10:29But nobody rides for free, you know? That's why I'm saying I would do it again. The damage, the ups, the downs, the unknown, nobody rides for free. Whether you're working, clocking in at a job, working in an office for your whole life, you know? Or you're fighting men all over the world. We're exchanging something, you know, for something. So I would do it again.

1:11:02just glad I got to do it here in Louisiana you know where it all started

1:11:09yeah that was special to me because UFC doesn't come here often to Louisiana the time that came before my retirement was back in 2015 and I fought on that one as well to get them to come back here just for my retirement was a big deal

1:11:30And I'm proud of that and proud of bringing it back to the city. You know? I have a game room at my house and I have this. The UFC actually sent me a retirement big picture frame with my wife, my daughter. Their name was on the canvas for this fight. And I didn't even know the UFC printed their names on the canvas of the octagon. So they cut them out of the thing and they have them framed in a nice shadow box with pictures from the fight and their names. and stuff. That was really nice, man. So I had this picture hanging on my wall in my game room in my house. Actually, I need to call Mike, this guy here, Mike Brown.

1:12:10I need to call him back. He tried to call me and he's been texting me the last few days. I need to call him back, let him know I'm good, you know?

1:12:19I've been silencing every call, you know, and I just want to talk to people since Father's Day. But I need to start, I need to reach back out. There's a lot in your head, isn't there? That photo seems to have teleported you back. I'm just thinking about that night. Thinking about the guys in the picture, seeing my mom in the background, you know. My friends. It was just an incredible night. And it hurts me a little bit, like, to be sitting here talking about getting arrested last week. Like, it feels like such a fall from grace, you know. Looking at this picture, like I was on top of the world in this moment.

1:13:01I felt like I did it all the right way, you know. Even had the UFC play Sinatra, I did it my way when I was walking out the octagon that night. And, you know, it just... It's life.

1:13:22That's life. That's life. It's life. It's part of the hero's journey is the ups, the downs, the redemptions, all of it. And everything you teach. You know, it's funny because when I think about your earliest context, it was, in my subjective view, difficult. It was a real challenge. You got a father that's an alcoholic, the violence in the home, growing up in a working class area, and you rose from there. And look what happened. Yeah, it was beautiful. And then look at, you know. I'm proud of it. And then the roller coasters go down too. And that's why they're so good when they go the opposite way and such.

1:13:57And so this is just, for me, this is maybe just the platform of your next era, you know? For sure, whatever that is, I'm here for it. But I'm just learning and living, you know, and trying my best just like everyone else. It's incredible, though, what you've proven that you can do. You know, from... I honestly, no BS look you in the eyes. Like, I feel like anything I set my mind to, I can accomplish. I can make it happen. Like, you've done that. Yeah. You don't need to look me in the eyes and no BS me. You've done something that, you know, very few men could ever, ever accomplish, especially considering where you came from.

1:14:39So I think I am quite excited to see what you set your mind to next, because if that's what you're able to accomplish by 35 years old or something, God only knows what you could do with the next two decades of your life if you aimed all that energy at an equally terrifying goal. I would love to. that's what I need something terrifying I need something like that something that that I can't stop thinking about you know and you've got the mentality that few have right like to accomplish this you've got something the core components to be wildly successful as you say with whatever you put your mind to so I'm not scared to work for it you know at this moment in this photo were your family encouraging you to hang up the gloves my wife was nobody else of my family no how come she was pregnant she was uh a couple months away from giving a few months away from giving birth to my son i had been doing it for a long time

1:15:39we just kind of both knew it was about the time you know you said you were scared because of the the void of purpose that would be in your life um thereafter but i've also heard you say you're scared of like the brain injuries that fighters often get in the wake of any sort of contact sport i had the the great privilege um of interviewing arguably the world's leader on cte and for people that don't know um cte is a progressive brain disease caused by repeated head trauma leading to abnormal protein builds up which lead to brain decline older adults with a history of traumatic brain injuries have a 230 % greater risk of developing Alzheimer's than those without.

1:16:2061 % of UFC fighters stated they worry about potential long-term brain damage, with a good percentage of about 21 % noticing differences in their brain function after their fighting career. And lastly, a 2023 study found that more than 40 % of brains from contact sport players who died before the age of 30 had CTE. I think I heard you say that you were concerned about brain damage or brain trauma from fighting. Yeah, part of me laying the gloves down, like I said, from my wife wanting me to was because she was kind of worried about my behavior a few years back. And I went to a neurologist and did a scan with contrast where they put the dye in your veins and do all that stuff.

1:17:04and I had some changes in my brain, but we don't have a passport of... A fool. Or throughout the process. We just have a snapshot of right now of my brain. But the doctor, the neurologist told me that it has to be post-humorous. You put a chemical in the brain, it releases a protein. So we won't know until I pass away and they study my brain if I have it or not. But the doctor was telling me, like, you know, looking at the things you have going on, like, I can't say you have it, but. Your wife was noticing different behavior? Yeah. Just, like, emotional and. It's not a conversation people have a lot about CTU.

1:17:51I actually only learned about it about a year ago when I interviewed this person, and I couldn't believe it. I couldn't believe that athletes that are doing contact sports, kids that are doing American football are. And not only fighting, I played football all my youth, you know, as well. So I'm sure my head's been rattled a good bit. I have a brain scan here, which is really for the listeners at home, to show them what advanced CTE looks like on the brain. But it is these kind of like plaques that kind of build up in the brain from contact head injuries. And what the symptoms of that are often mental health disorders, they are.

1:18:25And there's a spectrum of addictions also sort of associated with CTE. people sometimes see boxes, for example, slurring their words and such. That's also within the same family and category of CTE. Yeah. But as you say, it's not something you know when you're alive. And they have to post-homelessly look at your brain and check if you have it. And what did the neurologist say, that it was a little bit abnormal? I have scarring and stuff. I'd have to pull out my phone and find the exact terminology for the parts of the brain. I don't know. I have a thinning in the back of my brain at whatever part, and you have a septum in your brain, like your nose.

1:19:03And my septum is splitting, separated a good bit, and the neurologist thinks my left and right side aren't communicating as smoothly as they should because of the separation. And they suspect that that's to do with head trauma? I mean, we don't know. Do you feel different? I know it's a strange question to ask, but have you noticed any difference in in your in yourself other than you know the differences one would experience when they left a job that was that significant no uh besides like ups and downs with mood and stuff like that that's one of the the things i kind of notice uh and all being honest like spontaneous decisions i noticed like if i'm like fuck it i'll just put five thousand dollars on this bet right now like just i wouldn't normally do that i i feel like but maybe it's just who i am now i don't know or saying fuck it i'm gonna get drunk as i can right now in the airport just you know i feel like that is like spontaneous decision making that i wouldn't normally do i think but maybe i would i don't know if we're talking about brain trauma and like decisions i made or ways i feel i'm sure i can draw links to all kinds of stuff you know i don't even know if it would make sense or would be correct you know when you're scrambling for answers it's easy to like draw lines and say well this is because of that this is because of that you know i feel i feel normal besides ups and down days and stuff like that i feel i feel normal um so is there any possibility that you ever return to the ufc if you had to plot it as a percentage

1:20:49five percent and since you've retired has that percentage gone up or down do you think progressively down i think down okay i'm down i think because i would have to reinstate first of all i'd have to get my wife on board then i'm gonna do another training camp and do this again but I'd have to reinstate myself in the drug testing protocol and I think I'd have to do like six months of clean drug testing before I'm eligible to compete again. So that would be another six months. You know, it's just a lot of hoops to jump through. And your father? Difficult, difficult, extremely difficult. Lairs of emotion.

1:21:28It's funny, you know, we've all got people in our life. Well, a lot of people have people in their lives where they've watched them struggle with addiction. They've tried to help them. they can't make sense of why they won't accept the help why they won't change they know they're doing like i've had it's such a familiar story what's the latest with him he was latest with him is two days ago he was sleeping in his truck uh behind a business and how do you find this out Oh, you have a... Dude, when I got a... This is Father's Day week.

1:22:05This is a... My sister sent me this. Somebody who she knows. He was parked... My dad was parked at the park. Somebody snapped a picture of him getting out of his car.

1:22:24So he's got his top off? Oh gosh. No shoes. No shoes.

1:22:36My sister actually gave him that truck that he's living in.

1:22:42God. And we're still working. We're still working to get something, get him to do something or admit himself, just to help himself, you know.

1:22:56Sorry, I'm so sorry. I mean, that's life. But to see your father like that, you know, it's just like, damn, man. Is it alcohol? Yeah. It's alcohol. Yeah. Does he do other types of drugs? No, never smoked a cigarette in his life, never smoked marijuana. Doesn't take pills, like, just alcohol.

1:23:17We're trying, me and my sister are trying to, his other kids don't want anything to do with him, But me and my sister are trying to get him right. And my wife's super on board, like trying everything to, to, but if he doesn't want to help himself, we can only do so much, you know. But like I said at the beginning, that's not my weight to carry, you know. I'm trying my best. I'm a father now too. I got to look out for me and mine. I can't babysit my father, you know. it's um it can often drag people down themselves if they try and save someone from themselves yeah dude almost lost my mind on father's day yeah i'm the guy you're talking about yeah i know it because it's i've got a sort of passing through in this regard where i had to sit with one of my close relatives and um i could see that they were destroying themselves trying to save someone else and um they are the only person in this family that i'm talking about that have made that decision to try and save this person and they are paying the price.

1:24:20They are sick. They are upset all the time. They're like, they've got constant despair. Whereas all the other siblings in that family have thought, fuck it. And it would appear that they're living more peaceful lives because they've said fuck it. But because of this person's heart, they are unable to just cut it off and let this person go. Yeah. Is there part of you that's worried that someday you're going to get a call and it's going to say... I've been waiting for months, every day. I've been waiting. I know me and my wife talk about this all the time. Like every time I get a call about my dad from my sister or something, I'm like just waiting for the, you know, waiting for the news.

1:24:55He's not in good health and he's 74, 75 years old. Like no telling if he's eating and I don't know. You know, every call I was like, this is the one. What did your mom think about this? About your father? I mean, as of most recently, she didn't know. She didn't even know that he was homeless. I told her recently. After all this stuff happened, you know, I explained to her that he's, she's just sorry that I have to deal with this and, you know. She got remarried and then, yeah. Yeah.

1:25:38So what's next? Vacation. with my family. Where are you off to? Right here in Florida, 38. Going vacation with my family, sitting in the sun with my kids and family. Just have a good time, man. Stay off the internet. Continue to work on myself. Have good mornings. That's it. Well, you know, I know you're not looking at the internet, but I just wanted to let you know that the internet's been really kind. There's a lot of really, really kind. You don't hear that too often. You don't hear that too often. Good to hear. And that's actually why I wanted to do this interview as well, is in part, I just wanted to tell you that.

1:26:14But also, I just wanted, I hoped we could be a bit of a platform for people understanding the complicated nature of mental health and purpose and addiction and alcohol and all these things that through doing this show, I've been able to sort of piece together myself. I've probably interviewed 700 people now. You don't find many new things. One of the most crazy things I've learned from doing this show is like, oh, fuck, we're all the same. We all struggle with the same things at the most fundamental level, you know, so. For sure. You know, and we're all excited to see what it is you put your great talent and your mentality and your obsession to in the next season of your career.

1:26:52Because whatever it is, you know. Thank you, man. It's going to be incredible. Yeah, I just got to find it and continue doing it and continue working on myself. And please be patient with yourself. Yeah, man. Patience is a virtue I wasn't blessed with. But I'm working on it. I'm working on it every day. every single day, man. We have a closing tradition where the last guest leaves a question to the next, not knowing who they're leaving it for. And the question left for you is, dear next guest, what are you doing to improve the world?

1:27:30Trying to leave it better than I found it. Better leave it a better place than I came into with everything I can, you know?

1:27:42for the most part making the right decisions and showing that people do care trying to be a good you know a person who cares about people and stuff like that that's what hurts me too man is me doing that I wasn't I wasn't myself you know I know it's easy for me to say and try to hide behind like a drunkenness or mental breakdown and all i feel like all those are excuses like that's people who know me know that's that's not how i roll man i just feel bad about it because that's my my intentions are always 99.9 percent of the time good you know and to hear about the video and everything i did and you know i just hurt myself man really let myself down hard to look in the mirror at times.

1:28:36But I'm going to continue doing what I was doing before this happened, you know, leave the world a better place than I found it, man, and teach my kids to do the same. And in 2018, you did start the Good Fight Foundation. Yeah. You and your wife, after clearing out your old fight gear and auctioning it off to support Lafayette families, you started this foundation and you've actively been involved in the charity. I went on the website and saw you driving delivery trucks and packing school supplies in the kitchen. But also I saw the work that you'd done in Uganda, providing kids in Uganda with multiple new water wells as well.

1:29:18And you were, at 30 years old, awarded the first ever Forest Griffin Community Award, the award presented annually by the UFC to recognise an athlete's exceptional volunteering and charity work. And you didn't have to do that, you know. especially at such a young age, sort of 28 years old when this all began. And if people do want to go and check out the foundation, I'm going to link it below. It's called the Good Fight Foundation. And I looked at the mission statement on the website, et cetera. It's exactly what this question asks. It's how can you do good for other people in the world that need it?

1:29:49Right. And I truly, honestly, 100 % believe I'm doing it. I'm using the platform I built through hard work to benefit as many people as I can. You know, fighting was going to benefit me and my family every time I walked to the ring. So why couldn't I, my mindset was, why couldn't I stack more on my back and go in with a cause and sell everything I wore that night and benefit a family or benefit a person or another organization? I was like, let me stack up as much on my back as I can and keep this momentum going with the foundation. But when we first started it, it wasn't, I didn't auction off everything I wore to the octagon.

1:30:28We didn't link it to goals. It was just kind of random. We were packing up my house, moving from South Florida back to Louisiana. And we had all this stuff. And we just saw a news article that a police officer got killed a couple streets where me and my wife went to school, a couple streets away from where we went to school. And he left behind a wife and kids, Officer Middlebrook here in Lafayette, Louisiana. And we're like, well, we're packing up the house. What about all these gloves and fight shorts that you fought in on these big fights? Can we sell it? Maybe we can sell it and donate to his family.

1:30:57And that's what sparked the whole foundation starting. We did it for maybe a year, a year and a half, two years, just out of my name, before we made it an actual nonprofit. We were just eBaying fight-worn stuff and donating it to the food pantry, donating it to this fallen officer's family. And then it turned into, let's keep this going and see if other fighters would get behind this and give it a name. So it's not Dustin Poirier does this. It's the Good Fight Foundation, so more people maybe get behind it. And it just kind of organically happened. That's something I'm very proud of. I mean, in a couple weeks, we have the backpack back-to-school drive.

1:31:32We do probably 1 ,300 backpacks filled with every school supply on the school supply list for Louisiana. Wow. Yeah, it's incredible. It takes everybody to make these goals happen, man. Not just the monetary side, but going in this warehouse and packing every single backpack. Because we stretch the dollar with this foundation. You know, we don't have any paid. And we try to keep it as minimal as possible to keep everything affordable. So we buy bulk backpacks, break all the pallets down to backpacks, bulk flashcards, everything that goes in the backpack for the school year. We buy bulk and have to pack every backpack ourselves.

1:32:10And it's something that I really enjoy doing. And I'm happy I have a platform to do it and raise awareness. And, you know, no kid should go to school without a. that's just one of the things we we've done annually but no kids should go to the school without the proper school supplies they need you know it's crazy so just small stuff like that you know we're just trying to make a difference well if anyone wants to donate you can go to the good fight foundation um i'll link it below and uh they're doing incredible work so it's wonderful thing wonderful course and as you say you run it in a very lean way so that you can uh optimize for doing more and more good dustin thank you so much thank you man thank you so much for being such a class act and thank you for agreeing to have me interview you today it's a real honor um you're a legend in my eyes for so many reasons not just because of the man that you are but because you climbed impossible mountains and also the way that you conduct yourself after fighting which is a real it's really like inspiring to me um the values the integrity the orientation towards family towards doing good and actually to being openly human definitely definitely in that You know, it's my first time living life, man.

1:33:16The good, the bad and the human. And you're willing to be so honest and open about that. And there's lots and lots and lots. I know this sounds like a crazy thing to say, but that airport incident is going to help a lot of people in a lot of ways that I don't think you'll ever get to see indirectly because of what I think is going to come from it. Thank you, man. I hope you're right. And I'm an open book. I'll talk about it and talk about my struggles. And I hope it does help somebody. Thank you. Thank you.

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