Bolivia’s Cholitas – From Outcasts to Icons

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1:03Listen on bbc.com or wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you for downloading this podcast from the BBC. With their pleated skirts, fringe shawls, and bowler hats perched on their heads, the Chilita women are a common sight in Bolivia. But life hasn't been easy for them. For many years, these indigenous women were treated as second-class citizens. It's only in recent times that they've turned that around and gone from outcasts to icons, which for me as a visitor to their country was a real pleasure to see. I found them warm and inspiring and hope you enjoy listening to their stories as much as I did.

1:46It's Sunday afternoon and there's a crowd gathering to see the Cholita rustlers. the excitement is mounting in this huge warehouse in el alto you can probably hear the crowd we've got the tourists in the front on bright green and orange and white plastic chairs filling up the rows looking excited but they're not quite sure what's going to happen and then we've got the locals on the stalls at the back and we've got someone in the ring hyping up the audience It's going to be. Leave it. We've done it.

2:25Welcome to the documentary from the BBC World Service. I'm Jane Chambers, and in this edition of Assignment, I've come to Bolivia to find out how the Cholita women went from outcasts to icons, and what that tells us about how the country is changing. Cholitas are indigenous Amara and Quechua women who are the largest two communities from this Latin American country's indigenous peoples. Until recently, Cholita was used as a derogatory term to talk about their distinctive traditional clothing, items like layered skirts, shawls and bowler hats. They originally came from the countryside and live in communities dotted around the Andean highlands, but many of them migrated to the city for work.

3:09I'm starting in one of the places they moved to. El Alto is a sprawling city full of red-brick buildings, street vendors and narrow streets. It's just above the administrative capital, La Paz, high up in Bolivia's Altiplano highlands. It's here the famous Cholita Luchadores, which means Cholita wrestlers entertain locals and tourists from all over the world every week. We had male wrestlers for many years, and the shows were always popular. But with time, fewer people were coming, so I thought we needed to change things. That's the Cholita's manager and trainer, a retired wrestler called Benjamín Simonini.

3:49I want to know how he got started with the Cholita Luchadoras. We started having the Cholita Luchadoras. They are very different from the male wrestlers. Their skirt is wide and heavy, which makes it hard for them to fight. They don't wear wrestling boots, just shoes, and the audience loves them because they put on a good show. And when you're seeing them fighting, they have different roles, don't they? You have the good one and the bad one. Can you tell me a bit about that? You have La Ruda, who is the baddie, and La Tecnica is the good one. She shows her intelligence and her abilities. La Ruda does whatever she can to win the fight.

4:28She will cheat to get ahead. And what would you say is the most difficult move they have to do? It's all difficult. I think it's one of the most difficult sports there is. The Toledo wrestlers have to use their whole bodies and their intelligence. If they get it wrong, they can be badly injured. They need to be mentally tough. Benjamín's not wrong. While the crowd shouts, lucha, lucha, which means fight, fight. I can see him at the ringside anxiously giving instructions to his wrestlers. The show's a manic mix of acrobatics and brute force, with the luchadores throwing themselves off the rope with the wrestling ring and flying through the air.

5:06Their opponents think nothing of tossing them on the concrete floor beside the ring, where they theatrically moan and splash themselves with fake blood. And the crowd love it. There are around 500 people in the audience tonight, like Mercedes. I love coming here because it's a distraction which helps me relax. I like to come and support them. I like the good ones, not the baddies. My favorite is called Elizabeth, Stealer of Hearts. She's a goodie, but a real fighter as well. She inspires me because she's a strong woman who gives it her all. The crowd are getting very animated, especially the locals.

5:47Ow, that sounded painful. They're clearly not happy with some of the wrestlers, and they're showing their disapproval by throwing popcorn at them. They've got such great stage names. Elizabeth Roba Corazones, so Elizabeth the Rob's Heart, Sarita la Tentacion, Sarah, or Little Sarah the Temptation. Or should that be temptress? All I know is that the Cholita wrestlers put on a great show as they prance and struck to the ring in their brightly coloured turquoise, yellow and red skirts. After the show, I managed to chat with Daisy La Bellissima, Daisy the Beautiful. While we talk, a little Bolivian girl gazes at her idol adoringly and bounds up to hug her.

6:32I want to know how Daisy feels when she's up on the stage. The truth is, I feel happy because it's a sport that I like, but I'm also nervous and excited. And what was the most difficult thing for you to do this evening? The most difficult thing is when we hit each other and they fall to the ground. There is always a risk. We often get serious injuries. It's an extreme sport which isn't just about your skills. You are going to get hit with things as well, and that's what makes the show tough. And what kind of injuries have you had? I have had a fractured arm, sprains, a dislocated shoulder, a broken nose and a sprained ankle.

7:25Wow, that's quite a lot of injuries. Yes, it's true, I know. But I think with all sport there is a risk. And you need to accept it. What made you get into it? I was at a stage in my life where I was feeling depressed, and I had a friend who was a wrestler. And she said, come with me to a training session to have a look. When I got there, the other wrestler shouted at me, you need to come and train with us, don't just look. And then made me give it a go. I had never thought about doing it before, but I just gave it a go. So I started training and it helped me to feel less depressed and less stressed.

8:16And I kept coming back to the training sessions until I stayed for good. Daisy is 26 years old. She tells me she'll carry on doing this as long as she has the strength. The money's not great. The lucha daughters earn around$14 a fight. When she's not wrestling, she's a hairdresser. But for Daisy, being a Cholita luchadora isn't about the money. For her, it's the love of the sport and knowing she's part of a movement. The truth is, I want this to continue with new generations becoming luchadoras. I want to be able to teach others and make sure this traditional legacy isn't lost. We Cholitas used to be discriminated against.

9:00They said we were stupid and didn't have the skills to work in difficult careers. Bolivians who are enchilitas told us that we were only useful as domestic servants, working in their houses, cooking and cleaning and nothing more. That has been how our culture was seen for years and years. Others thought we were inferior, but now they are Cholitas who are pilots, mechanics, drivers. We're everywhere. Just because we wear our traditional skirts, we aren't worthless. We're just as capable. The only thing that makes us different is the way we dress. And I think that everyone has their own style. We're trying to move out of this oppression that we face, shouting that we're equals and there is no need for us to feel inferior.

10:03I'm curious to find out more about the beautiful clothes women like Daisy wear and the Cholita style as she calls it. So I'm off to an upmarket area of La Paz to meet fashion designer Anna Paltza. She sells traditional Cholita clothes but also a fusion of designs with a twist like painted bowler hats which were inspired by the Cholitas to other Bolivians. A spacious white painted shop is set over three floors. The first two have drawers of jewellery and shawls and skirts artistically draped over mannequins. The third floor is a riot of colour with shelves filled with beads and racks of pink, yellow, blue, green skirts and tops.

10:47Everything is made by hand by five Bolivian ladies, artisans, all of them. Two of them are indigenous, and three of us are, as we call it, dressed. We dress, de vestido, we call it in Spanish. We don't wear the pollera, the long pleated skirt, but yes, we do things for them. And the reason I do all this is because I danced in Gran Poder for the past 23 years. I'm very passionate for the dance and the folklore in Bolivia. Bolivia offers so much to see and to explore that that's why I started what I'm doing now. Tell me about this amazing festival, Gran Poder. Oh, Gran Poder, the word, it says everything.

11:31Gran Poder means that it's power, luxury. It's where people from the communities, they come and they dance. There are about 60 ,000 dancers. and everything they're wearing is the first time they wear and everything is done by hand. And I've heard that that's where Cholitas go off to show their amazing outfits and there's serious amounts of money. I mean, sometimes they even need bodyguards to protect them because of what the jewels they're wearing. Absolutely. Yes, you're right. They invest a lot of money. Each Cholita, each person invests a lot of money. They save the whole year or even they borrow from the bank to be able to dance because it's not cheap.

12:10we're talking about, I'm going to say in dollars sort of, the least you spend is$1 ,000, and you can spend$50 ,000. I mean, you can spend so much money because they use a lot of jewelry. It's made from gold, silver. Wealth, beauty. A lot of wealth, a lot of wealth. That's what it represents. There's where they show also the power, economically power they have. They even have more money than many, many Bolivians here. They are people, very hardworking people, and they like to spend their money showing it in Gran Poder. And where's the money coming from? They usually are comers, comerciantes. So like businesswomen?

12:54They're businesswomen, yeah, and especially De Cholita. She's an incredible businesswoman. And what kind of things are they trading? They bring things from China and they open a market for everything, for everything. Trucks and whatever you think they are the ones who are bringing into the country. We've got a rack of brightly coloured yellow and pink and maroon skirts in front of us, which are pleated. Just talk me through these. OK, the skirts are the principal thing that a cholita wears. It has a pleated waistband, which is handmade and it takes a while. and then it has pleats in the skirt.

13:30They use six metres of material to be able to do that skirt. Then they have the petticoats under it. It could be from five to seven petticoats. It depends on how many they want to wear. Then they have their blouse and on top of the blouse they have a shawl and the shawl has the fringes. That's very typical of a cholita and let's not forget the hat, the boulder hat. We've got some boulder hats on a shelf behind us. Tell me about these boulder hats. So there's an amazing story behind that. Where did they come from? Yes, as they say, they come from London, arrived to Bolivia by mistake. And then there was a person that decided that why not sell this since they were here already.

14:10Let's try to sell some to the ladies, making them believe that it's good luck to buy them.

14:19The Bola Hats arrived in Bolivia in the 1920s. People say they were made for British railway workers who were building a railway to La Paz. When one batch arrived that was too small, they decided to sell them to the indigenous women and they became a popular part of their dress. They're always worn precariously perched on top of their heads, attached with pins or just through good balance. This is the documentary from the BBC World Service. We focus on the part of the internet that most people don't know about. It's called the dark web. Undercover in the furthest corners of the dark web, US special agents are on a mission to locate and rescue children from abuse.

15:05Move in now. Police! From the BBC World Service, World of Secrets, the darkest web follows their shocking investigations. search for world of secrets wherever you get your bbc podcasts if there was a big red button that would just demolish the internet i would smash that button with my forehead from the bbc this is the interface the show that explores how tech is rewiring your week and your world this isn't about quarterly earnings or about tech reviews it's about what technology is actually doing to your work, your politics, your everyday life, and all the bizarre ways people are using the internet.

15:46Listen on bbc.com or wherever you get your podcasts.

16:09Law should be replaced by the law of power. The interview from the BBC World Service. Listen now wherever you get your BBC podcasts.

16:23I'm Jane Chambers on assignment in Bolivia. One of Anna's colleagues is model and designer Sandra Pazzi. She's been making the jewellery and clothes Cholita's wear since she was 10 years old. Cholitas, like Sandra, are also known as mujeres de la pollera, which means women who wear the skirt. Today, she's wearing a lilac grey bowler hat, blouse and pollera, with a grey shawl fringe with green. Sandra's the epitome of style, which is only to be expected from a former Miss La Paz. But this beauty contest is not about prancing about in swimsuits. The competition was about showcasing cholitas and our culture.

17:07Any mujer de la pollera could take part from 18 to 30 years old. We needed to talk about communities and our culture. And what kind of things were you telling them about your culture? I spoke about what crops we grow, things like potatoes, beans and onions. the vegetable gardens that we have in different communities in La Paz. I also spoke about the colours and textile that our grandmothers made, the wool that we use and the dyes we make. And as well as speaking in our national language, Spanish, I also spoke in my native language, Aymara. Women like Ana and Sandra are part of a movement to stop prejudice against Cholitas and show the beauty of what they wear.

17:56But it wasn't always like this for Sandra's family. When my granny was young, just because she was wearing a pollera, she wasn't treated well when she went to the hospital. And my mother was also discriminated against because of what she wore. In the old days, indigenous women who wore skirts like ours weren't allowed in the Plaza Murillo, which is the main square in La Paz where the Presidential Palace and National Congress of Olivia are. Discrimination was so harsh against cholitas that in the past they were denied entrance to certain public spaces, government buildings and restaurants, and they often had to use separate entrances in places like the houses they went to clean.

18:41Sometimes they decided not to wear their polleras to make life easier for them. In a swanky five-star hotel in La Paz, I meet designer and businesswoman Rosario Aguilar, who, along with people like Ana and Sandra, is putting Cholita fashion on the map. She set up her own modelling school. When I talked to her, I soon realised why she was so adamant about meeting in this hotel. My dream was for the Mujeres de la Pollera, women who wear the skirts to be allowed in five-star hotels, because we've always been rejected and looked down on. People in Bolivian society didn't see us for the hard workers we are.

19:25Despite our limitations, we have always been powerful. Many of us fight to educate our children, even putting them in private schools. I have never seen a modeling school for the Cholitas, and I wanted to start one. Rosario wasn't looking for your typical model. I wanted women who sell you things in the market or cholitas who clean houses. I wanted them all to be able to go into a five-star hotel to model, in a fashion show or just to be there. It's about breaking barriers and it doesn't matter to me what the woman looks like. If they are skinny, we can use more padding on the hips to make the skirt look better.

20:09and if they are fatter, that works well because the pollera looks better on those kinds of figures. As well as breaking barriers, Rosario has always been a mother figure to her models.

20:24I have some beautiful experiences with the models where their confidence has grown. Many of them were inspired to finish their studies, start businesses, work in the media or in public and private sectors. But they also trust me with their secrets. Some of them have suffered with domestic violence and even rape. Others are single mothers. They all tell me stories from their lives, and I try to empower them and give them confidence to get on with their lives and to be able to walk down the runway as models.

21:02When Evo Morales was elected president, he became the first indigenous leader Bolivia has ever had. even though around 60 % of Bolivia's 12 million plus population are indigenous. He was president from 2006 to 2019. Many Bolivians credit him with being the person who's done the most to promote indigenous rights and help turn Chalitos from outcasts to icons. But some think he didn't do enough for indigenous women. Alicia Canaviri is the executive director of an organization called CIDEMA that helps promote the rights of Amaran women. When I visit her busy office in El Alto, she tells me that she thinks more needs to be done.

21:47I think that spaces opened up for women during his presidency. There were ministers and vice ministers who were cholitas and we had never seen that before. So that was an important change. But I don't think those women did enough when they were in those roles. They didn't make the important changes that were needed in Bolivia. More should have been done to change the situation, where there is so much violence against women. The women thought because they were in those positions, they had power, but it wasn't enough. I think one of the problems was, despite being part of the government, The men didn't let them voice their opinions.

22:35And this is still happening today. If a woman speaks out, she's accused of being a rebel and the men frees her out. Alicia says that part of her organisation's work is to train women across the country to take on political roles so change can be made. She also goes into the countryside to tackle domestic violence. Yo soy de una de las comunidades indígenas, Aymara. I come from an indigenous Aymara community, and ever since I was little, I have seen that domestic violence in the countryside is seen as something normal. Many of the grandmothers say to me, you talk about women's rights, but there are no women's rights here.

23:20I should have been born a man, they tell me. Why? I ask them. Because women are born to suffer, they tell me. And that mentality still exists today. They think it's just part of life when a man mistreats them mentally or physically. They are used to being beaten, having their earnings taken from them, or even being raped. Alicia and her team are fighting to change that.

23:54This reality is why we go into rural communities and train women there to fight against domestic violence. We tell them that women don't need to put up with this. We need to stop femicide. This year alone, 60 women have already been killed. We teach women their rights, that there are national and international laws against violence against women that should stop this happening. Through the workshops, women learn they weren't born to suffer, but it's not always easy changing the men's attitudes. Some men say that we are teaching the women to misbehave, answer back and defend themselves. But now they are learning a new reality where the women know their rights.

24:43They say, you don't have the right to touch me. The women are stopping the violence and telling people about the laws that protect them. Some of the men tell us, now we know we shouldn't mistreat our women because we could end up in prison. So they have stopped and don't hit them anymore. Workshops for men have helped change the situation as well. We have family workshops where we all discuss different themes and the men start to understand the situation. Now they have started to support our work as well. Clearly there's a lot more work to be done in Bolivia for chilitas to be fully integrated into society and to get the support they need in the countryside as well as in the cities.

25:33But women like the one I'm about to meet are true icons for the Mujeres de la Pollera and show just how far in Bolivia they've come and what they can achieve. Today, she's wearing an orange climbing hat and a white shawl and pleated skirt with bright red polka dots.

25:54It's high. I'm being told to take deep breaths because it's high, high up here. It's about 4 ,500 metres and we can see La Paz and El Alto in the distance and behind us there's a beautiful snow-capped mountain. and I'm here with... ¿Con quién estoy? Mi nombre es Lidia Guayas. My name is Lidia Guayas and I am the Cholita Escaladora de Bolivia. So I'm here with the Cholita Escaladora which is the Cholita de Clima. Now, you're very kindly giving up your free day. You've just come back from an expedition and you're off on one tomorrow. What were you doing last week? I was out in the mountains with around 100 tourists and some scientists, and they were all very happy with what I showed them as a mountain guide.

26:49How did it start? My husband is a mountain guide, and I used to travel with him to cook at base camp. I always admired him and the tourists coming down from the mountains looking so happy. and I would ask myself, what is it like at the summit? I wanted to see for myself, but the equipment was so expensive and I had to decide between that or feeding my children. So 10, 15 years went by and I was still working as a cook, but then I decided it was time. I managed to borrow some old boots, a harness and a helmet and I persuaded some other cholitas who cooked with me to come with me and my husband up into the mountains so we could feel as happy as the other people who climbed the mountains.