Finding my Sikh faith against the odds

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0:54the reason i want to bring you over here because barnum road is a is a very multicultural place we have the somalis the indians the muslims but there's two places that i regularly visited i'm talking about the bookmakers two betting shops with literally less than 50 yards from each other so there are betting shops and some of the biggest names in in british and even international bookmaking and betting gambling everyone in there is in there to try and win money everyone would understand who you are because they've all experienced those losses actually you don't even feel judgment in there it's interesting because in Sikhism the Sangat the community is a big part of the faith and within those betting shops you almost had your own Sangat your own community just a bit like you would do with a sanghat when you're happy with certain things you're going to overly give you talk about several maybe only giving to people because it's making me feel good i've got some of your old bank statements and what i can see it's 500 500 500 a thousand i mean these are bets going out i can see the odd win there's some hefty wins as well you know you're winning five or six thousand but then straight away you know 500 500 500 you're back out minus 8 000 in a day To be honest with you, I feel disgusted even the fact that you're saying that.

2:16I thought I'd be a lawyer, a dentist, a doctor. I'm a recovering gambling addict. Five years into recovery. And that's not a title that I grew up thinking that would ever cut my mouth.

2:32I'm Rajiv Gupta and you're listening to the documentary on the BBC World Service. For this week's Heart and Soul, I've come to Slough, a small town on the outskirts of London and not far from where I grew up. I'm here to meet Haj Gale. You're about to hear his powerful and at times painful descent into a decade-long gambling addiction. It nearly cost him everything, his health, his relationships and almost his life. And when he hit rock bottom and turned to the Gurdwara, his Sikh temple for support, Hajj says he felt abandoned by his faith.

3:11Harj Gahley:I was like, hold on, I've got a problem. I've got an addiction and it's not shlab, meaning alcohol. It's not nasha, which means drugs. It's jua, which means gambling. It was more the way they responded. Well, you know that's wrong. I know it's wrong. I'm asking you to help me well read the Barney which is our good grandson which is our holy book read it and it'll tell you all you need to know but okay but surely you should be giving me some words of encouragement or some advice what do you think I don't know well you know what you're doing is wrong and it's almost like this feeling which is but it doesn't happen in our religion it doesn't happen in our faith

3:55Arch Rajeev how you doing man good to meet you how are you this is Rai Hi, Roy, how are you doing? There's GV. Nice to meet you, mate. All right. Hey. Low five and high five. Harge wears a bright saffron turban and a wide smile as he shows us through to the lounge. Yeah, come through, come through, bro. So you guys off school? Yeah, six, summer holidays. But I can't get past the feeling that maybe in a past life we've already met. You look really familiar. I don't know if you used to go to the Ramgiru or Gurdwara in Reading much. A couple of times. I've been there a couple of times, yeah, yeah.

4:28as soon as I saw you I was like I recognize him yeah but I don't know how but I do I know I was like I recognize so if you're studying business as well I had a couple of friends not only do we share the same Punjabi heritage it turns out that Hajj and I dance a night away to bangra music at the same club events as young men in our early 20s but karma meant our path would take a very different course.

4:52Harj Gahley:So back in 2009 it was shortly after I left university and I started up almost like a social networking site because I heard about Facebook coming over here and so what I did is I set this up and then what started off as a conversation with a company it ended up being them acquiring it. Now I thought being on 35, 40 ,000 a year driving an Audi or one of them sort of cars having a house getting married that was my level of success but now I've surpassed that right so what happened was on a night out we end up in the casino and i remember stepping my first time into this place there's this moment where you hand your id to the front people the front desk but you can never see beyond these double doors and these double doors always are closed but i remember as i walked through these double doors it all means this sudden rush of excitement It's this feeling that I'd never had before.

5:51Harj Gahley:I could see people laughing. I could hear people just having a great time. I could hear the roulette machine. I can also hear the slots, the lights, everything. My friends, sort of straight down to the blackjack table, they're literally putting their money out straight away, passing it over. Now I'm just watching them. What's going on? And they could see me maybe, I don't know, but they said, well, why don't you join us? I was like, I've never played before. They said, that's fine, we'll teach you. And I remember these feelings, these chips. I'm not sure if you've ever been to a casino. It's a weird, they're plastic, but they've sort of got a bit of weighty to them.

6:28Harj Gahley:I remember just putting down a couple of bets and then they were literally coaching me. Take a card here, don't do this, stick on this, that's a blackjack. Within 30, 40 minutes, I turned 20 quid into about 60 quid. Now, that's not a lot of money, granted, right but in my head remember i've got money in the bank account now yeah but i'm also going oh that was fun that was quick that was easy and i'm up yeah wow never felt that before that must have been quite intoxicating to add to that as well it's you're around friends as well so there's this excitement and this fun so it doesn't feel like you're doing something wrong as well right you don't feel bad how did you go from that 60 quid up to then this becoming a problem for you that first initial win for me it felt like it lasted not just one session or two sessions it seemed like it lasted like at least a month or two so every time i was going in there i was always coming out up that's when it flipped i've lost 100 pound now i'm taking another 100 pound then it'll be right okay now i'm gonna take 200 pound out now i'm maxing out my daily limits so then it became every day spending as much time in the casino as possible because ultimately now I'm trying to chase some of those losses back I just didn't like the feeling of losing playing on your ego a little I don't think that's how I felt at the beginning but I think it did happen when I started looking at the horses I started now treating it as a game of skill it went from table games you know the blackjack the three card poker baccarat and roulette that's when I think my ego got hit every time I would lose I should know better because you've done a lot of studying you've done a lot of training you've done you've put a lot of effort into making that bet but it hasn't come through you were thinking you're going to make money but when you're losing money and having put in all that effort but you went after it again you went more and rather than thinking right I'm getting out of this yes but through that what's happening I was placing bigger bets so it's no longer 50 pound 100 pound I'm pacing a couple hundred pounds or 500 pound bets do you remember I talked about that acquisition of that company so the money that I made within 12 months I had gambled all that money away wow I've got no money to pay electricity phone bills or even food so I had to tuck my toes between my legs and do one thing I knew which is go home I just said, listen, I've made a few bad decisions because I think Indians are quite understanding of investments, money, right?

9:09Harj Gahley:And I said, I've lost it all. And your mum said, she goes, you know what? It's OK, you'll rebuild again. And that's what I tried to do. Their understanding of it was, you know, you were trying to be entrepreneurial. You were selling it as you lost this money as a kind of business investment. But you hadn't opened up about the gambling. You didn't tell them. You always want to try and do things where your parents are proud of you. I know it's definitely more rife in the South Asian community. So for me opening up about a problem or saying to my parents, well, you guys worked in Asda's, you guys worked in the airport.

9:43Harj Gahley:And for them to hear how much money I gambled away is almost like spitting in their face. So I didn't want them to feel like that. I just turned around and said, well, what do I need to do? Get a job. And I remember telling myself, when I get it back, I'm going to pay this back, I'm going to pay this debt, I'm going to do this, this, until the cheque landed in my bank account. What switched in my head was, I've got now a monthly bankroll. Because you talk about the ego, right? I couldn't get out of the fact that I lost all that money. How much had you lost by this stage? It was touching near enough the 100 ,000.

10:21Harj Gahley:There would be times where I would wake up half full, because I knew that's when the money had claimed my account. and say a month worth of salary, I would have gambled away even before someone's working up to get ready for work. Wow. It took over your whole life. The rhythm, the routine of your life was basically centred around your gambling addiction. You live, eat, sleep, breathe gambling when you're in that hole. I would borrow money, I would beg for money, I would steal and defraud. So this was from people you know, friends, family, loved ones You almost become in this theatrical play That when I'm gambling I'm wearing this mask When I'm in front of my wife I'm wearing this mask If I'm with work colleagues I'm wearing this mask Depending on how I emotionally feel The masks just come off and on very easy

11:25As a turban Sikh man, there's a kind of responsibility that comes with the turban as well. Where was your religion at this point in your life, in your faith journey? Because you would obviously grown up with your Sikh moral compass as well.

11:40Harj Gahley:Every time a bet had gone wrong, or I'm feeling emotionally down, or I've lied and I've taken money or defrauded money, and I've asked help from God or my faith or Sikhi, every time I've tried to maybe express that through my prayers or through God saying, help me out, I felt those prayers weren't being answered. Faith has nothing to play anymore. I'm just a turban guy, yeah, but I'm hollow on the inside. So you lost your faith at this point? I lost my identity, which is worse. yeah when you got up in the morning and you you tied your turban what was that exercise like because people see that as a very spiritual thing wow it's a phenomenal question back then i would typically only wear black or dark colors yeah i felt like i had this devil on my shoulder constantly knowing what I'm doing is soulfully wrong I think I did more praying for my bets to come in please God let this be the one

12:5612 years of secrets the lies and the weight of the dizzying debt had dragged Harj from being a successful entrepreneur to the edge of a financial abyss but he was about to be unmasked

13:15Harj Gahley:16th of June 2020 was the exact date my wife found out and I remember coming out of the shower in the morning I walked into my bedroom and my wife was at the edge of the bed now she's crying crying like I've never seen her or actually felt her cry before a momentary switch happened which is when I noticed something in her hand my phone I'm no longer caring about how she feels or what she's crying about but more importantly what she found out she looked up at me and she turned the phone around and there it was in black and white transactions after transactions after transactions I'm not talking a couple hundred pounds I'm not even talking thousands I'm talking tens of thousands I remember just looking at her and just going what have I done you're an idiot you've let this happen because you didn't put safeguardings around your gambling she's found out about it so you were more sort of upset by the fact that she found out and you had left your phone rather than actually all this money I've lost and that's your family savings as well.

14:39Harj Gahley:I became even more selfish at that point because think about it, I've broken the biggest thing that every single relationship is built upon even before love. It's trust. Imagine going through your finances and you're calculating how much money you've lost and then we have now figured out that we are in£250 ,000 of debt. This isn't just money gamble. this is debt payday loans credit cards overdrafts money I owe to friends and family my wife basically at this point is like right I'm done I've been chasing the jackpot for so long not realising my jackpot was really in front of me

15:26Harj Gahley:I did need help but who do I turn to? I remember contacting my local temple but I felt more judged coming for that call really? yeah Now, growing up with my grandma, one thing she always told us was, if you ever have any problems, go to your local temple, or basically go back to your faith. So this is the place where I've gone back to, but yet have felt more abandoned. I felt really angry and disappointed. And that's the hardest part, because it got so dark that it took me to the darkest place of attempting the unthinkable. What were you running away from? I think the word here is failure. Feeling like an absolute failure.

16:18Harj Gahley:That's what I kept telling myself and feeling about myself. Seeing how I let my wife down, how I let myself down, how I let my children down, how I put in so much debt. the trust and my society and what my family think I mean everything that comes with it I wanted to turn the lights off I remember being on the M1 driving doing about 80 miles per hour on the third lane and I just had this moment to God just saying please let this pain just go now and then everything shut off everything went black everything went dark and I wasn't sure if I was still here or if I'd gone over to the other side you obviously wake up after this accident was it at that moment that your spiritual journey started panic started straight away some moments passed by the paramedic came on scene this lovely lady she looked at me looked at the car a number of times and she said to me listen sir if you don't believe in a higher power or god or wherever it is start believing because i've seen people not come out in less than that i think there's almost like this gratitude moment I'm thankful to be alive but I don't still feel my spirituality kicked in there it's hard me saying this but it's almost God saying now that I've got your attention trust in this path

18:08you're listening to the documentary on the BBC World Service

18:14what do Beatles member Sir Paul McCartney YouTube megastar Mr Beast and former Facebook executive Sheryl Sandberg all have in common. They're all being discussed in the new season of Good Bad Billionaire, the podcast which explores the lives and fortunes of the world's super rich. That's Good Bad Billionaire from the BBC World Service. Listen now and search for Good Bad Billionaire wherever you get your BBC podcasts. How did a boycott Jimmy become a billionaire from posting videos? On Good Bad Billionaire, we're going to find out how the world's most popular YouTuber, Mr Beast, made his fortune.

18:46He's buried himself in a coffin for days. Counted to 100 ,000 on camera. And even recreated Squid Games, all in an attempt to go viral on the internet. But it all started when he gave a homeless man$10 ,000. So is he a philanthropist reshaping capitalism? Or is he just the king of the attention economy? Find out on Good Bad Billionaire. Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Rajiv Gupta and for this week's Heart and Soul, I'm in Slough on the outskirts of London. I've come to hear how Haj Gale's secret addiction to gambling led him to the darkest of places before a spiritual reconnection with his Sikh faith

19:27Harj Gahley:it was two days after actually where everything God, spirituality whatever you want to call it aligned I was with Jeevan and we drove past McDonald's I went to the drive through and I remember my son Jeevan sitting in the rear passengers I handed him the fries he said Dad I'm lucky Jeevan in our language in Sikhi in Hindi means life and he actually saved my life that day that's another thing that our faith teaches you you have consequences but as long as you face those and you navigate through them no matter how hard how tiresome how troublesome they may be there's always light at the underside of the tunnel.

20:16Harj Gahley:So whilst this lady was looking at me in the drive-thru, bawling out, and my son looked at me like crying, like, what is going on here? I believe spirituality kicked in because I became in spirit with myself, but connected with my child. But I also believe that the universe had to bring me at this moment for it to teach me a valuable lesson.

20:38Jeevy, who's your favourite football player? OK, who's better, Messi or Ronaldo? That's Jeevan, his eldest boy. Five years ago, he guided his dad onto the path of a higher purpose. Today, he reminds Haj of his fatherly duty to play football in the garden sunshine. I know this area quite well, so I used to go to the Gordwara in Reading, but I've not been to Slauramgaria Gordwara. My family, my dad, my mum, we've all grown up there. I pretty much know all the elders that are there from being a young age, so why don't we go there? Yeah, yeah, of course. It's not too fast, mate. Yeah, don't be amazing.

21:14The one thing I remember about going God of the Wild, the best bit, it's not just a place you go to pray, but it was a place you go as a child and you see your mates. Yeah. Is it somewhere that you carried on going to as you got older? Me and my wife got married in that same temple. Oh, did you? Yeah, so we're at a circle. I'd love to see it. Let's go check it out. Yeah, all right. Thanks, guys. See you later, boys. Oh, it's a hard day today, honestly. Beautiful, mate. This part of London, the outskirts of London, and it is so diverse, isn't it? So massive. You've got, you know, your Punjabi community, which is Hindus, Sikhs, Muslims, but you've also then got a big influence now Eastern Europeans.

21:51People from ethnic minorities or marginalized communities, we don't gamble as much as, say, the white community, but the ones that do are up to five times more likely to suffer severe gambling harms. We're going to take it right at the end. Having that connection to the subcontinent with your family, a lot of the Ramgharia community I know as well I had links to Uganda and Kenya. My dad and my father-in-law were both born in Kenya and Nairobi. Oh, by the way, do you remember I was talking about the McDonald's? Yeah, tell me that story. This is the McDonald's here. Yeah. And that's where the catalyst changed, and I found what I need to be doing, and I found my purpose.

22:30Right, so we're here. We're at the Ram Ghariyath Sikh Gurdwara, the Sikh temple in Slav. Yeah. Let's go and have a look. This is the place where you spent a lot of your childhood. We got married.

22:45The first two signs you're met with on the entrance to the Gurdwara. One says it is strictly prohibited to enter the Gurdwara premises consuming alcohol. And the other one is a no smoking sign. But gambling addiction is not something that has been well spoken about, whereas alcohol consumption has been quite well spoken about now. You can physically see when someone's inebriated or intoxicated. You could smell when someone has been smoking, but with gambling, you can't see it. That's why it's called the hidden addiction. If they're open to having conversations, as opposed to saying we can do everything ourselves, there could be a lot more impact to be made.

23:25Two older ladies strike up a conversation in Punjabi. They aren't relatives, but Hajj calls them auntie. It's like a sign of respect in the culture. As they chat and laugh, the temple's secretary, Uncle, as he'd be known, comes out to meet us.

23:45This is Baldeep Channa. This is, I would say, a big uncle. He's like a big father figure to me as well. I've known Uncle, I've known his daughter, his son. We used to go tabla classes, wajja classes when Situ Singh Satara was here. How much of your work and your resources are going towards helping feed people that are coming through illegal immigration routes? Whoever comes here, you know, they can eat as much as they like. We've got kirkana classes, tabla classes. Over recent years, pressure has grown on temple resources and they can't help everyone, especially when it comes to things like gambling addiction.

24:21It's one of the reasons why Hajj has now set up a charity and he hopes to work with Gurdwaras like this one. We can help the Gurdare to be in collaboration and say, look, if someone comes to you and says we have a problem with drugs, alcohol, gambling, our CVM and Qasa, we can help them. I'm not saying that the Gordare need to have the services here, but could they at least work with people that can help? I will put in the committee meeting that we should organise something up there in the office, you know, to help these addicted people. Then it might give them, people, a better understanding of, like for me, finding their way back to Sikhi, back to their faith, back to their religion, understanding why these places of worship are so important.

25:00Thank you. Thank you. Okay. So we enter the Gurdwara. At every Gurdwara, you'll always get an open kitchen. This is constant service of food for anyone and everyone that comes in. There's Seva Dharis, so people doing selfless service, working in the kitchens, cooking up vegetarian meal. That's a big thing within the Sikhi faith, like you just said there. It's a place of service. what's your relationship with your faith now? I'm reading a lot of the scriptures and part of it doesn't resonate with me and some parts of it do and the one that do resonate with me I'm trying to understand why

25:42Harj Gahley:from a heart perspective why am I deeply connected but more importantly how is my turban connected to my identity and my roots and my values because if I can understand that we can be the change as Gandhi said that we want to see literally how the Gurbani starts Ek honkar. We are all one. And key to Sikhi is honkar, which is ego, which is one of the five kind of sins or five things that people should avoid within Sikhi. How are you now on your level of ego? You've had to really humble yourself. You've had to break down in front of your family. You've had to apologise to people. What do I need help with?

26:28surrendering your problems to the Almighty. That's how I see it. So humbleness comes from a place of allowing yourself to be. And whatever comes to you, learn from it. I can see how motivated you are to get this word out there, get this message out there. Would you say this is almost replacing the gambling? The habitual change, I call it. So your question here was, am I still addicted or do I still have those tendencies? Yes. I kept the habitual habits of what I was in in my addictive days but only this time helping and serving humanity and faith through the selfless service of breaking stigmas and rebuilding lives and there's a big part of Sikhi which is Siva selfless service so do you feel

27:15Harj Gahley:by doing what you're doing now it's a form of Siva oh massively huge this is why I formulate at the charity to selflessly serve without any expectations or anything in return. Every step of the way, God has been pushing me or my spirit has been pushing me and opening up the resources. Resources doesn't just mean money. Resources means time. It means faith. It means people. It means things that are going to help you deliver the most amount of impact based on your growth on this spiritual journey. Even just 2024 alone, I helped nearly 100 people, mainly from our community. I stopped 9 people from also attempting the unthinkable.

27:59Harj Gahley:How could I not believe that I'm here for a bigger purpose? I found purpose through my pain. You've been listening to the documentary on the BBC World Service. This edition of Heart and Soul was presented by me, Rajiv Gupta. The producer was Matt O'Donoghue.

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