In short
The Documentary Podcast: Prayers through the Checkpoints
Summary In this episode of *The Documentary Podcast*, titled "Prayers through the Checkpoints", host Emily Wither explores the deeply affected spiritual lives of Palestinian Muslims in the occupied West Bank and East Jerusalem. The episode highlights the increasing restrictions on worship, particularly after the heightened security measures following the October 7 attacks by Hamas. Through firsthand accounts and critical context, the podcast depicts the profound challenges faced by worshippers in accessing their mosques amidst a backdrop of conflict and surveillance.
Key Themes and Concepts
- Access to Religious Sites
- Geographical Barriers: Worshippers in Hebron find it difficult to access the Ibrahim Mosque due to multiple checkpoints and security measures.
- Example: A journey of 100 meters can take up to two hours depending on military checkpoints.
- Emotional Toll: The restrictions lead to feelings of frustration and sadness, as many Muslims long for the simple ability to pray in their holy spaces.
- Impact of Israeli Security Measures
- Collective Punishment: Many Palestinians argue the security measures are punitive rather than protective.
- Surveillance and Control: The episode describes the proliferation of checkpoints and surveillance cameras as a means of control over Palestinian movement, which has increased significantly since October 7.
- Personal Accounts of Worshippers
- Stories from Hebron: Residents express their feelings of isolation and fragmentation, with one worshipper explaining that he cannot visit his brother who lives just 50 meters away due to checkpoints.
- Faith as Resilience: Despite the challenges, worshippers convey that their faith provides them with strength and a sense of purpose in their struggle for existence on their land.
- Tensions at the Ibrahimi Mosque and Al-Aqsa Compound
- Historical Significance: Both the Ibrahimi Mosque and Al-Aqsa are central to the identities of Muslims and Jews, leading to heightened emotions surrounding access and control.
- Changing Status Quo: There are fears that the increasing Israeli presence and control will further alter the ability of Muslims to worship freely at these sites.
- Palestinian Experiences in East Jerusalem
- Restricted Access: A woman supervising the women’s section at the Al-Aqsa Mosque discusses the drastic reduction in visitors and the emotional strain it has caused within her community.
- Banning Orders: The episode discusses the issuance of banning orders as a means of restricting access to holy sites, often with no clear justification.
Important Quotes
- "To actually reach [the mosque] in the present circumstances is almost impossible."
- "Praying at the mosque once a day, if we're permitted, is an endeavor I have to think twice about."
- "It breaks her heart to remember how when she was a child growing up in the old city of Jerusalem, she used to play and run around Al-Aqsa compound freely."
Conclusion The episode concludes with a somber reflection on the realities faced by Palestinians in the occupied territories. Despite the ongoing struggles, the faith and resilience of the worshippers remain at the forefront, symbolizing a deeper connection to their land and spiritual heritage amidst adversity. The narrative underscores the critical importance of understanding the human experiences behind geopolitical conflicts.
Key Takeaways
- The podcast highlights both the physical and emotional barriers faced by Palestinian worshippers.
- Personal narratives reveal the profound impact of political tensions on spiritual practices.
- The episode serves as a reminder of the complexities surrounding access to sacred sites in conflict zones.
---
This summary captures the essence of the podcast episode while presenting the key points in a structured manner for easy reference and understanding.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:00This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the UK.
0:30World Service. Listen now wherever you get your BBC podcasts.
1:00Listen on bbc.com or wherever you get your podcasts.
1:10We are going to the Abrahamic mosque to pray the Friday prayer. And we have a lot of restriction here, Israeli restriction to reach the Abrahamic mosque. And you can see the mosque from your house. How many checkpoints have you had to go through just to meet me here?
1:35How many metres do you live from the mosque? How long would it take for you to travel that 100 metres? Maybe one minute and maybe two hours. It depends on the checkpoint and the soldier and the mind of the soldier in the checkpoint. So it can take you two hours sometimes to go 100 metres. Really it takes more than if the mind of the soldier in the checkpoint is not good. Hebron's old city is now a labyrinth of Israeli checkpoints. and a complicated network of various barriers. Many Palestinians here feel surrounded by razor wire and a dense web of surveillance cameras. You can see them on many street corners.
2:30You're listening to the documentary on the BBC World Service. I'm Emily Wither, and for heart and soul, I've come to the occupied West Bank, where Palestinian worshippers say visiting their mosques has become harder since increased Israeli security following October 7, 2023. That day, 1 ,200 people were killed and 251 others were taken hostage by Hamas, which is regarded as a terrorist group by many countries. The Israeli military insists extra security is needed to keep their population safe, but many Palestinians we spoke to argue the measures amount to collective punishment. We're with a Muslim worshipper in Hebron.
3:13He's too afraid to give his name for fear of Israeli repercussions. He grew up in the old city and is used to checkpoints. Jewish settlers also live right in the heart of Hebron, the second largest Palestinian city in the West Bank. But in the last two years, Israeli forces imposed a new system, and residents say they feel more restricted than ever and that their neighborhoods are increasingly fragmented.
3:40So we're just going through a metal detector in a metal turnstile. It's one in, one out. There are surveillance cameras everywhere. And this is what you have to do before you even reach the checkpoint, where the Israeli soldiers will check exactly who is trying to come to Friday Paris. Every day they make a restriction for players to enter, and the Palestinians try to return from this restriction and they are waiting for two hours or more than two hours and they try or choose to return from here to another mosque to break outside this area. Do a lot less people now try and come to the mosque because of the extra restrictions?
4:29Me and me, yes. 100 % they are less than. And before 7th October, they have a lot of people come here to breathe. But now they cannot reach the Abraham mosque freely.
4:44It is noticeably quiet here, especially considering it's Friday when Muslim communities tend to come together in worship. Locals tell us this is the new normal, that people are afraid or simply finding it hard to physically get here. The UN's Human Rights Office, OCHA, found the Israelis have now set up over 800 barriers in the West Bank, such as roadblocks and checkpoints, which it says severely restricts Palestinian movement and is a steep increase in the last two years, and more keep appearing. In the first two weeks of September, the UN recorded Israeli forces installed five new road gates in the Hebron area.
5:27The IDF told us their goal is to provide security for all residents and in accordance with situational assessments Therefore, there are dynamic checkpoints and efforts to monitor movements in various areas We sit down with our worshipper and he switches to Arabic He wasn't sure if we'd even meet today and he says inviting us round to his house is impossible because it's now surrounded by more Israeli checkpoints Every day gets worse. When we talked a few days ago, the situation was much better. They have now installed gates in between the gates. They have installed internal gates on the street, so it is now segregated.
6:10I can't go to my brother who lives 50 meters away, nor can he come to me. In normal days, he needed a pass to come and visit me. Imagine that in the past two years, not one of my relatives could come and visit me, even with a security permit. Impossible. He lives in an area called H2, the 20 % of Hebron that's under direct Israeli military control. It's home to around 33 ,000 Palestinians and over 700 Jewish settlers. We should add here that settlements are illegal under international law. Israel disagrees. Since July, Ocha found freedom of movement in Hebron for some Palestinians has been restricted even further.
6:54They say roads and Israeli-controlled checkpoints can be closed at a moment's notice, and the closures prevent some families from reaching their home. This system has also restricted access to key sites, including the Ibrahimi Mosque.
7:11When I'm in my bedroom in particular, my window face is a mosque. However, to actually reach it in the present circumstances is almost impossible. I would not be exaggerating if I say that praying at the mosque once a day, if we're permitted, is an endeavor I have to think twice about it. I have to think how I'm going to return home after I reach the mosque, because I could reach the mosque and not be able to return home. So you can understand the difficulties. If I drew a circle and placed my house in the middle of it, there would be 17 military checkpoints around my home. I asked him if he understood why the Israelis felt they needed extra security after October 7th, and he said the strictness of the closures has no clear justification.
8:05The man we're talking to lives with his wife and children, metres away from one of the West Bank's most contested and holiest places the Tomb of the Patriarchs known to Muslims as Ibrahimi Mosque it's revered by Jews, Muslims and Christians as Abraham, Isaac and Jacob's burial place to get inside there are separate entrances to different areas for Jewish and Muslim worship and an uneasy understanding exists between the two communities that share and love this ancient shrine How important of a place is it to you and to your faith? I want to tell you something. Imagine you were born in an area where the mosque opposite you or the temple opposite you is the symbol of your life.
8:52In Hebron society, people were jealous of us living in this neighborhood because we were neighbors to a holy place. Now, a Hebron resident in another area has easier access to the mosque. The holy place for me is an essential symbol tied to my soul. Normally Muslims should pray five times a day. However, in the present situation, if I can manage to pray once a day, it's a historic achievement for me. Have you ever seen the restrictions here so tough?
9:25What changed is that the whole scene is now different. Although visiting the mosque was difficult before October 7, It is now considered a dream. Not only are we suffering from excessive security measures, but the situation has become impossible. How has your faith given you strength through all of this? My faith is the only thing that is giving me patience to face these measures. I see myself as defending my right to exist on my land, opposite a significant religious edifice. And this belief has to do with our faith as Muslims. because we know that this land is ours and that we should look after it, despite all the measures taken by the Israelis against us.
10:12But this only makes me more insistent on being here and on holding on to my faith.
10:22It's also an important religious symbol for Jews. Here, worshippers celebrate a Jewish holiday in the largest section of the Tomb of the Patriarchs. For many settlers, living in Hebron is a way of claiming a physical connection to biblical history. They see it as the cradle of Jewish presence in the land, and settlers now sit in the heart of the Israeli government. They believe the land was promised to them by God. Security Minister Itamar Ben-Gavir lives nearby in Kiryat Arba, an Israeli settlement on the outskirts of Hebron. The Cave of the Patriarchs, or Ibrahimi Mosque, has historically been managed by the Waqf, a Muslim religious trust, along with the Palestinian Authority.
11:07But this year, Israeli authorities announced they were transferring administrative control to a settler-linked religious council and Israel's civil military administration. They say it's in order to carry out renovations and building work, roofing the sites in a courtyard. Israeli human rights groups warn it's a breach of the status quo, while Waqf official and manager of the Ibrahimi Mosque, Sheikh Motaz Abu Sneina, told us the same.
11:37So he's reaffirming the right of Palestinians to preserve the Ibrahimi Mosque and saying that Israel is attacking not only the historic status quo of the Ibrahimi Mosque, but also the demographic around it, trying to change it by emptying it, and trying to change the way it looks. More and more Israeli flags are up. They put menorah on the top of the Ibrahimi mosque. They're tampering with the electricity, tampering with the water. They're trying in every way possible to change the status quo, the right of Palestinians to the place and the general atmosphere. How often are you able to talk to the Israelis about some of the issues that you're facing?
12:31Because you both want to be at the site. Are you able to meet and talk through some of the tensions? He's saying that despite attempts by the Palestinian Waqf to have minimal understanding with the occupation forces, the Israeli side, over holidays, Jewish holidays, Muslim holidays, preserving the right for worship for Palestinians, protecting the safety of Palestinian worshippers. The Israeli side is only using force. They're not listening. They're not cooperating. This is the reality. We have total control of the Ibrahimovic. I asked Yishai Fleischer, the spokesperson for the Jewish community of Hebron, if they were trying to alter the status quo.
13:25The main reason that control has been lifted from the tomb of the patriarchs and matriarchs is because the WACF slash PA just don't get the stuff done. They leave everything incredibly disheveled, dirty and bad. We also need the place covered. They slow that down. And in general, they don't take care of the tombs themselves. They keep them in despicable shape for simple reasons of maintenance and of a sense that they keep it dirty on purpose so that it could be repressive against the Jews. So that is the main reason why we're reasserting control. And this is after years of trying to work with them.
14:00And therefore, the Israeli government, Israeli military, the civil administration have all demanded that they release their grip. The vision for the complex is such that it's going to become a world heritage site. the kind that everybody around the world is going to connect with. It is the seat of the Abrahamic tradition. It is the thing that's supposed to connect people who see themselves as walking in the path of Abraham. So Christians, Muslims and Jews. The Israeli military told us the Cave of the Patriarchs is open to all residents except in specific circumstances and that the status quo is fully maintained and close coordination between the IDF and the WACF officials is ongoing at the site.
14:49The Interview. The best conversations from across the BBC. Today we are spending trivians on war and peanuts on peace. With the people shaping our world. You're making decisions that will have long-term consequences for the levels of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere. Wind power in the United States has been subsidized for 33 years. Solar for 25 years. That's enough. The interview from the BBC World Service. Listen now wherever you get your BBC podcasts. America is changing. And so is the world. But what's happening in America isn't just a cause of global upheaval. It's also a symptom of disruption that's happening everywhere.
15:31I'm Asma Khalid in Washington, D.C. I'm Tristan Redman in London, and this is The Global Story. Every weekday, we'll bring you a story from this intersection, where the world and America meet. Listen on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts. I am Nina Khrushcheva, the great-granddaughter of Nikita Khrushchev, the leader of the Soviet Union in 1962. And I'm Max Kennedy, the nephew of U.S. President John F. Kennedy. we explore what was a terrifying moment in history. The story of the Cuban Missile Crisis. How close the world came to nuclear war. And what they had to do to pull it back from the brink.
16:12The bomb, Kennedy and Khrushchev. All episodes available now, wherever you get your BBC podcasts.
16:28You're listening to Heart and Soul on the BBC World Service with me, Emily Wither. We've now travelled to occupied East Jerusalem to the Old City. For Muslims, it's home to the third most important site in Islam, the Al-Aqsa Mosque compound, or Haram al-Sharif, known to Jews as the Temple Mount. Muslims believe it was where the Prophet Muhammad ascended to heaven. While for Jews, the site is their holiest place, because it was the location of two biblical temples. Jews are allowed to visit but not pray there. As you're about to hear, Palestinians say they're finding it harder to access this site too.
17:07And in recent years, the Israeli government and police have allowed Temple Mount activists, along with their representatives in government, to pray on the compound. and some Palestinians and Israeli human rights groups look to Hebron. They say they fear Israel will one day replicate the Cave of the Patriarch's model at the Temple Mount, allowing Jewish prayer and dividing access by physical space or time.
17:37We've just come in from the bustling alleyways of the old city through an arched doorway into a very quiet courtyard. It's like we've left all of the busyness of the streets behind us. And we've come up some stairs and there is a perfect view of the Dome of the Rock, the Golden Dome glistening in the sunshine. And it's framed by air conditioning units, washing, hanging up and satellite dishes for TVs. We're here to meet a woman in her 40s. She grew up in the old city and now works as a supervisor in the women's section at the Al-Aqsa Mosque. She has a breathtaking view of the site from her home.
18:20She didn't want to give her name as she too is fearful of Israeli repercussions. Over strong coffee and homemade date cookies, she tells us how access to the site has changed.
18:34She says that she for sure notices the difference in the last couple of years since the Gaza war started. It's evident to anyone from inside the old city and outside it, from Jerusalem in general and the visitors, that the restrictions have multiplied. And not only the gates leading to Al-Aqsa compound. It's the whole old city. You have random shutdowns, you have random restrictions based on nothing other than the mood of the Israelis. She says it's evident to everyone that the numbers are much, much less in the last couple of years than before. And the whole atmosphere has changed. It's quieter and sadder.
19:24How has that made you feel?
19:30She's describing the feeling as if the Eid or Christmas arrives and your loved ones unable to visit you. It's a very hard feeling to look at Al-Aqsa and see it empty, more empty by the day. She studied special education for kids and she has a special kind of love for children. she used to have them around her, running around, singing, playing. And on Eid, she would prepare boxes of gifts, little gifts, maybe sweets, something simple to give out. Now, it's not only that there are not enough kids to give gifts to, it's also if she prepares something as simple as that, the Israelis stop her and forbid her and ask her a question about what's the goal of that?
20:28Why are you taking that? Who are you giving this to? I can see it's really, really upset you. Do we have a tissue? I do. I do. She's saying that it breaks her heart to remember how when she was a child growing up in the old city of Jerusalem, she used to play and run around Al-Aqsa compound freely. Today she can't even find children who play and come and worship with their families. She also remembers growing up with her grandparents and cousins and extended family. They used to meet and eat and hang out in the yards of Al-Aqsa Mosque. Today the yards are almost empty. What does it mean to you personally to work at this holy site?
21:29She says that it means a lot to her. It's not one thing that she can pin down. But at the end of the day, when she thinks about it, God selected her to do this work, and she sees it as a great honor. She gets to be in service of Al-Aqsa mask, while many Muslims, most Muslims from around the world cannot even visit it as a holy site. Last year she was given a restriction order banning her from the site for 15 days. Palestinian officials say Israeli police issue these routinely for the Al-Aqsa Temple Mount compound and the wider old city. According to data from the Jerusalem Palestinian Governorate, in 2023 there were 740 orders issued.
22:20They say banning orders have dropped significantly in the last two years, but that's because worshippers are being restricted in other ways. She's looking for the restriction order that the Israelis gave her.
22:35Do you know why you were given the restraining order? It's not listed in the document. it's all based on false claims and nonsense the border police man who was at the gate she was coming back after prayer with her son who was 10 years old at the time they were crossing back from al-Aqsa mosque to go to their house and he stopped her and was trying to prevent her from entering. She argued back that she's not doing anything against the law. She was just at prayer that she can see her house from where he stopped her and asked him to let her go. He refused and later argued that she wasted his time arguing back.
23:24But why were you given a restraining order for Al-Aqsa when this happened on the streets of the old city. She's saying the Israelis know that our souls are connected to Al-Aqsa Mosque. And as residents of the old city of Jerusalem, we have this in common. So if you do anything as a punishment, they know where to punish us hard. It's to forbid us from going to pray at Al-Aqsa Mosque. She says that they control everything and on a daily basis they change the rules without prior announcement, without consulting with anyone. So she might go to the gate that she entered through yesterday or earlier today and they tell her suddenly you can't enter because we limited the age group or limited for women or men only.
24:21We asked the Israeli police about these banning orders and increased restrictions. They declined to comment. The woman you've been hearing from also told us Jewish settlers praying on the compound became a normal day-to-day event. She said they can't do anything but sit and watch. Under the long-standing arrangements here, Jewish prayer on the mount was not permitted. Jordan is custodian of the site, while the Waqf, the Islamic Trust, runs it. Israel is in control of security and access. We spoke to Islamic scholar Mustafa Abishway. He's on the Islamic Waqf Council. I started by asking what he thinks has changed at the compound.
Read the full transcript
25:01At the beginning, they used to simply walk to the other side, and the Israeli police would even arrest the Jews who would attempt to pray or bring a flag. Now they allow them to pray. The historical status quo means that Al-Aqsa Mosque is for Muslims, and only Muslims could worship there. And this has changed within the last few years. The settlers are allowed to pray in the eastern part of the mosque. They prostrate themselves, raise the Israeli flag, they blow the shofar. And I think these major changes that took place, they are because of Ben Gvir becoming part of the Israeli government. He and Smotrich, they definitely blackmail the government for more right-wing, extremely right-wing policies.
25:47Dr. Shwe is referring there to the makeup of the Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's government. Netanyahu has repeatedly said there's no change to the status quo at the Al-Aqsa or Temple Mount complex. But critics point to the actions and words of the Finance Minister, Betzalel Smotrich, and the National Security Minister, Itamar Ben-Gavir, which might suggest otherwise.
26:15Gavir openly prayed there in August, alongside more than 1 ,200 Jews, less than a month after he told Parliament Jews could now pray there. Shwe says this is happening at a time when fewer Palestinians can visit the site. The Palestinians from the West Bank, the last couple of years, they could not come to Laqsa Mosque unless they have a permit that allows them to go to one of the couple of hospitals that we have in East Jerusalem and that permit does not allow them to come to the mosque so but they do but in general they have no access and lately the Israeli military in the West Bank put literally a gate a yellow gate massive iron gates at the entry of every village, every town.
27:01So any moment they can simply shut. There are Palestinians who have Israeli citizenship. Many of them are Muslim. They also don't have freedom of access. And are we seeing an increase in banning orders preventing Palestinians from accessing the site? There are Israelites who are continuously prohibited. There are strained orders. It is the israeli police it's not the court so the israeli police issues no aqsa for you so sometimes it's youngsters sometimes it's even our own imams who deliver the friday prayer during the sermon if they mention gaza even in like in a prayer form or what have you so that god would ease things for them and protect them they end up being prohibited from by the police from entering al-aksa mosque for extended periods, like up to six months.
27:51Everything you're describing, how has this changed the spiritual experience for worshippers when they visit? There were times in our life when there were no restrictions so that people would understand. There was one time when three generations of our family went together to Laqsamos, my parents, my wife and myself and our children. It was Ramadan, I think. So you just go and you just celebrate. you worship and you enjoy. And now it's very painful. The moment you approach the gates and you see the police turning away Palestinian youngsters, women, sometimes during Friday you see the Israeli, they sometimes even hit the, and not only the youngsters, I've seen them hitting even those who are elderly.
28:36All in all, it's not really a happy experience. It is painful for us to see all these changes, undermining the historical status quo. So we do worry about the interference in the affairs of the mosque and this is really opening a Pandora box that nobody knows. The ripple effect will reach everywhere in the world.
29:02This edition of Heart and Soul was presented and produced by me, Emily Wither. The executive producer was Rajiv Gupta.
29:16The Interview. The best conversations from across the BBC. Today we are spending trivians on war and peanuts on peace. With the people shaping our world. You're making decisions that will have long-term consequences for the levels of greenhouse gases in the atmosphere. Wind power in the United States has been subsidised for 33 years. Solar for 25 years. That's enough! The Interview from the BBC World Service. Listen now wherever you get your BBC podcasts. I'll see you next time.
From the publisher
Imagine being able to see your place of worship, but not be able to reach it. For many Palestinian Muslims in the occupied West Bank and East Jerusalem, stricter Israeli security measures, rising tensions with settlers, and movement restrictions introduced after the 7 October attacks, have made access to mosques increasingly challenging. Reporting from Hebron and East Jerusalem, Emily Wither explores how these pressures are reshaping the spiritual lives of worshippers living at the heart of one of the world’s most contested religious landscapes.




