In short
BBC World Service documentary about Nadia Martzinko (redacted as “Nadia Martinko”), described by US prosecutors as a potential co-conspirator in Jeffrey Epstein’s sex-trafficking network, and the debate over whether she was victim, accomplice, or both.
Guest backgrounds
Tim Hewell (BBC reporter) and Jakub Pole (independent investigative journalist from Slovakia). Sources include Slovak classmates and models (e.g., “Jozef,” “Jana,” “Kristina”), aviation journalist Christine Negroni, and US survivor testimony referenced in the episode.
Key claims
Martzinko met Epstein in 2003 at a Jean-Luc Brunel modeling party (she was 18). Prosecutors say Epstein controlled her appearance and forced plastic surgeries; she later alleged abuse (choking, being thrown down stairs) and coercion via visa dependence on Brunel. Emails depict a “couple-like” relationship, while also showing her recruiting women and scouting for Epstein even after his jail time. She later cooperated with the FBI (2018) and received help to remain in the US after her visa expired (2022).
Notable examples
Epstein emails ordering Brunel to put her on payroll; Epstein paying for her flight training and her pilot career; her co-piloting “Lolita Express” flights; her 2012 email accusing Epstein of seducing/manipulating other girls and feeling guilty.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOIntroduction to Nadia Martzinko
1:11 to 2:10
Learn about Nadia Martzinko's relationship with Jeffrey Epstein.
“I participated in your life, your idea of fun.”
The Complex Role of Nadia Martzinko
2:10 to 4:51
Investigate Nadia's role as a victim and possible accomplice.
“And I am Jakub Pole, an independent investigative journalist from Slovakia.”
Nadia's Background and Early Life
4:51 to 7:40
Discover Nadia's childhood and upbringing in Slovakia.
“There has to be a serious discussion about where the status of victim ends and where the status of co-conspirator starts.”
Modeling Career and Epstein Connection
7:40 to 10:50
Explore how Nadia's modeling career led her to Jeffrey Epstein.
“Anyway, all those years ago, Josef certainly did well out of Nadia's parents.”
Investigating the Timeline of Events
10:50 to 13:19
Analyze the timeline connecting Nadia to Epstein through evidence.
“match in every detail what we know about her from other sources.”
Nadia's Invitation to Epstein's Mansion
13:19 to 14:00
Learn about the invitation Nadia received from Epstein.
“OK, so Nadia regarded September the 17th, 2003 as her and Jeffrey's anniversary.”
Identifying Redacted Individuals
14:00 to 15:00
Understanding how to identify individuals in redacted documents.
“Yes, so mostly all the time when someone is redacted, there is a way how to identify this person.”
Nadia's Early Encounters with Epstein
15:00 to 17:40
Exploring how Nadia fell into Epstein's world after their initial meeting.
“to ask how Nadia could fall into his clutches so easily, as so many of his victims and those of other sexual predators did.”
Jana's Modeling Experience and Dangers
17:40 to 21:20
Jana shares her unsettling modeling experiences and the lack of support.
“And without further ado, he just lays on the table, but like very discreetly takes off his rope.”
Nadia's Complex Relationship with Epstein
21:20 to 24:40
Examining the dynamics of Nadia's relationship with Epstein and Brunel.
“And eventually, we'll come back to this, they plan a family together.”
Show all 22 chapters
Power Imbalance and Control
24:40 to 26:40
Discussing the power dynamics and controlling behavior in Nadia's life.
“It seems from some messages that Nadia knows Geoffrey prefers his women young.”
Nadia's Role within Epstein's Network
27:30 to 28:00
Analyzing Nadia's position in Epstein's network and the aftermath.
“One survivor of abuse by Epstein said the pecking order of his sex organisation, as she observed it, was first Ghislaine Maxwell, then Brunel, the modelling agent, then Epstein's assistant Sarah Kellan, and then Nadia.”
Nadia's Background and Allegations
28:00 to 30:05
Explore Nadia's past and her connection to Epstein's criminal activities.
“Kellen, who is giving testimony to the House of Representatives oversight committee this week, has denied any wrongdoing.”
Legal Battles and Relationships
30:05 to 31:47
Examine the complexities of Nadia's relationship with Epstein and her involvement in legal proceedings.
“they described in detail how Nadia took part in the sex with them.”
Nadia's Transformation into a Pilot
31:47 to 33:59
Learn about Nadia's journey to becoming a pilot and her ambitions in aviation.
“She later told the investigators he was particularly violent with her dead year.”
Nadia's Aviation Business Ventures
33:59 to 36:17
Delve into Nadia's entrepreneurial efforts in the aviation industry.
“I didn't know she was from another country or anything like that.”
Financial Ties to Epstein
36:17 to 38:14
Investigate Nadia's ongoing financial relationship with Epstein and how it impacted her life.
“Living in an environment dictated by Jeffrey Epstein, what she probably knew about appropriate displays of sexuality was probably non-existent.”
Cooperation with Authorities
38:14 to 41:07
Discuss Nadia's cooperation with the FBI and her evolving stance on her past.
“But on this, the emails partly tell an opposite story, that he helped her find work.”
Nadia's Life After Epstein
41:07 to 42:01
Outline the changes in Nadia's life following her involvement with Epstein.
“In return, at the urging of her lawyer, the FBI supported her successful application to stay in the United States after her visa ran out in 2022.”
The Ethical Dilemma of Reporting on Nadia
42:01 to 43:58
Discussing the implications of reporting on Nadia's role in the Epstein case.
“But now Christine says she'll stop writing about her.”
Dual Roles: Victims and Perpetrators
43:58 to 45:43
Exploring the complex nature of victims and their potential complicity in Epstein's operations.
“I do believe it was a honeypot operation.”
Remembering Nadia: A Friend's Perspective
45:43 to 48:10
A friend of Nadia reflects on her character and the impact of social media on her life.
“Capitol Hill is a long way from Preshow, where Nadia grew up.”
Transcript
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1:10Nadia Marcinko:Name redacted to jeevacation at gmail.com, August 9th, 2010. I participated in your life, your idea of fun. I stood by you for years of legal battles and jail time. There was nobody you could trust more or who loved you more. I've been perfect. All I wanted was more time with you, closer relationship, and a family with you. Memorandum to Jeffrey S. Berman, U.S. Attorney, December 19, 2019. Re-investigation into potential co-conspirators of Jeffrey Epstein. Epstein controlled every aspect of Name Redacted's life, including her physical appearance, her weight, and her clothing, for years, forcing, name redacted, to have multiple plastic surgeries, referring to her as his sex slave, insulting her and physically abusing her, including by choking her and throwing her down a set of stairs.
2:10Hello, I'm Tim Hewell, BBC reporter. And I am Jakub Pole, an independent investigative journalist from Slovakia. You're listening to the documentary from the BBC World Service, And here on assignment, this is the story of a key associate of the disgraced financier and convicted sex offender, Jeffrey Epstein, Nadia Martzinko. That's the name redacted in the document extracts you've just heard. Martzinko is one of four women who've been described by US prosecutors as potential co-conspirators of Epstein. None of them has ever been accused of or charged with any crime. But now one US lawmaker has called for them all to be denied victim status.
2:53Two of the women, Sarah Kellan and Leslie Groff, are about to be questioned by a congressional committee and Martzinko may be invited to testify too. Martzinko's from my country, Slovakia. Her name was originally Martzinkova. And unlike the other women labelled as co-conspirators who were alleged to have scheduled Epstein's appointments with girls, Nadia Mardzinko wasn't primarily his assistant. She was more than that. For at least seven years, she was his main girlfriend. A deeper relationship, beginning when she was 18, that Epstein maintained longer than with any other woman except Ghislaine Maxwell.
3:33We've discovered that Nadia Mardzinko and Epstein planned to have a child together. She was, undoubtedly, one of his victims. But it would seem she also became an accomplice. willing or unwilling in his operation. We've found evidence that for many years she recruited other women to satisfy his desires even after he was jailed for sex crimes. Survivors say she was perhaps number three or four in his hierarchy. Then, with Epstein's help, she reinvented herself as an aircraft pilot. Quite an impressive one, it seems. And now she's vanished. There have been a lot of falsehoods told about her a lot of gaps in her story.
4:17But we've been digging into the millions of documents in the Epstein files released by the US government to try to find the truth about their relationship. I've tried to locate every email they send one another. We're telling this story without Nadia's participation. We've contacted her and her lawyers, but they've not replied. They've said in the past that Nadia is a victim and needs time to heal. But if we're to understand fully the scale and the nature of Epstein's operations, the role of women associates such as Nadia can't just be ignored. There has to be a serious discussion about where the status of victim ends and where the status of co-conspirator starts.
5:01Because there's no clear line.
5:07We've just arrived in the town of Presso in eastern Slovakia the hometown of Nadia Madzinko This is the main square the huge old medieval church with a soaring spire low pastel coloured houses ochre yellow and pistachio green and quite a lot of journalists have been here before but totally without success somebody even said to me like Omerta where no one wants to talk about Nadia Martinkov. It was true but we managed to find one of her classmates from primary school really good friends with Nadia. It is like the first time somebody from her past is willing to talk. He thinks speaking publicly about Nadia might be bad because her family is well respected in the town.
6:02So we'll call him Jozef, and his words, as with all the interviews we did in Slovakia, are spoken by an actor. So this is a group school photo from 1993 to 1994, it says on it. 25 children there, yes? And here they're kind of aged about eight and nine. And which one is Nadia? This one, very neatly cut blonde fringe there, and a neat little pink collar. She was really a very quiet, gentle girl. That's why I think later she became a victim. Definitely a victim, because a person can't change that radically. What she liked best was taking part in poetry recital competitions. And why did you like her?
6:45She was the most beautiful girl in the whole class. Skinny, tall, lovely eyes. But she was an introvert, what we call Sheda Miška, a little grey mouse. Once, only once, Josef kissed her on the cheek. She blushed. But he also sluiced her with cold water and hit her with birch twigs. That's permitted every Easter in Slovakia. It's a custom called obljevačka. That means literally pouring. A group of guys go house to house visiting their female friends. The idea is to hit the girls lightly. It's supposed to make them prettier and healthier and the boys get a reward, like some sweets or a bit of money.
7:35But the customs gradually dying out. I don't know whether that's good or bad. Anyway, all those years ago, Josef certainly did well out of Nadia's parents. We loved going to her place for Oblivacka. We got ten crowns each from her parents. And that was a lot. And a real kinder egg. They were really nice and hospitable, lovely people. Years later, one American victim of Epstein told police he'd boasted to her about Nadia, claiming he'd bought Nadia from her parents as a sex slave. But the timeline we've established confirms conclusively that, if Epstein said that, it was a lie. Nadia actually fell into his clutches years later.
8:20We'll get to that. Nadia's family didn't want to talk to us, but to emphasize the successful middle-class people. I don't think she was desperate to escape Slovakia. We live pretty well here. It's not like we are lying in haystacks. That's a Slovak expression. Jozef and Nadia changed schools at 15 and lost contact. But then, at secondary school in 2001, she took part in a competition called Top Model of New Millennium. It was organized by an agency in a Czech capital, Prague. The winner became a very successful model. And the runner-up was Nadia Marcinkova. I was kind of a little scared of her, to be honest.
9:04This is Jana. She was a co-contestant. She also doesn't want to give her real name. Like for breakfast, I was eating everything. And they're looking at you like, they'll measure you afterwards. I wanted to go to university, so for me it was like a second-line thing. But for many girls like Nadia, it was number one. I think she really wanted to go like higher and be famous. And her face was like, like you have special looking girls and they're maybe not like pure beautiful, but they're really like interesting. And that made her so popular in Asia. Nadia travelled on modelling assignments to Japan and Taiwan while she was still at school.
9:48But what changed her life forever was when she moved to another agency based in Paris. It was called Karins. It had a branch in New York run by a man called Jean-Luc Brunel, a very good friend of Jeffrey Epstein. These are the missing years of Nadia's life, when we've not managed to gain much independent information. But we have what we know is Nadia's own account. It's from a document that was released, heavily redacted, by the US Department of Justice in January. It's a formal memorandum written by federal prosecutors at the end of 2019, after Epstein's suicide in prison. It describes the prosecutor's investigation in what they call his potential co-conspirators, and it analyses the extent to which they may be criminally liable.
10:41though the prosecutors' conclusions on that are completely redacted. We can't see Nadia's name anywhere there, but five pages of testimony the prosecutors were given match in every detail what we know about her from other sources. She says it was Jean-Luc Brunel, her modelling agent, who got her an American visa in 2003, and it was a few weeks later at his birthday party that she first met Epstein. But Jakob, how do we know that's true? Because I worked it out independently from an email chain. And I got to the same date, September 17, 2003.
11:28OK, that's very important because it confirms that Nadia wasn't underage when she met Epstein. It's often been wrongly reported that she was. In fact, she was 18, legally an adult. Of course, it's still very young. But Jakub, tell us how you confirmed that date, because basically you were trawling through the files for something completely different. Yeah, and by the way, I spent more than 500 hours going through Epstein's emails. I think that the main thing is that I'm quite autistic and I'm no stranger to hyperfocus, so, you know, I can work, like, for hours and hours. And because you're Slovak, you started out, even before you got interested in Nadia, in Epstein's extensive interests with the former Slovak foreign minister Miroslav Lajčak?
12:17Yeah, that's been and still is a major scandal in our country. And you found the date Nadia met Epstein by working backwards from the date when the minister Lajčak met him. Exactly.
12:31So, this is complicated, but it's important because it's an example of the painstaking work that Jakub's been doing, how basically you found out who all the emails with names redacted are to and from. Yes, so I found an email. It was clearly from Epstein inviting someone else, name redacted, to a meeting with Leitchak on September the 17th, 2017. More than a decade after he met Nadia. Yes, bear with me. I didn't know who was being invited, but then after a few hours searching through keywords, I discovered another email 6pm tomorrow is perfect and it also says by the way 14 years tomorrow with a smiley face so sounds like it was an anniversary for whoever wrote that exactly so then I looked for all the emails of this exact date in every year and eventually I found another one reminding Epstein of their anniversary and in that one for some reason the sender's name wasn't redacted.
13:37And the name was Nadia. OK, so Nadia regarded September the 17th, 2003 as her and Jeffrey's anniversary. And that coincides with Nadia's own account about meeting at Jean-Luc Brunel's party because his birthday was the next day. And Jakob, you've used the same method, haven't you, of detective work for most of your discoveries? Yes, so mostly all the time when someone is redacted, there is a way how to identify this person. There may be another email from the same date or another email with the same topic from a different date. You have to use your deduction skills and search not only in the Epstein files, but in various other open sources and find something that will give you context to find this person.
14:28For example, what they were doing when they were writing the email. then you can match it up.
14:38So, back to Nadia's story. She told the federal investigators that Epstein invited her just a few days after they met at that party to his mansion in Palm Beach, Florida. And the flight logs confirm that just days after that he took her off to his private Caribbean island little St. James. I want to pause here for a moment to ask how Nadia could fall into his clutches so easily, as so many of his victims and those of other sexual predators did. Was it, is it, something about the modelling business, however legitimate the agencies themselves may be? OK, let's go back to Jana. Remember, she was Nadia's co-contestant in that breakthrough modelling competition in 2001.
15:24She was often alone on assignments in strange cities. She told us her agency wouldn't pay for family members to accompany their models, and chaperones were rarely on hand. Once, when Jana was just 15, she arrived in a big European city in the middle of the night. Her taxi driver started acting strangely. He went the wrong way. Jana jumped out of the car. She was terrified. She told her agency and... They were angry because they said this story. They were like even shouting at me that I'm a spoiled person and like not nice talking, talking to my parents like, what are you doing? We pay a lot of money, the plane ticket, hotel and everything.
16:08It's hardly likely then she thinks that the agency would have been concerned if she'd gone to parties with clients. No, because it would be always connection to someone in the company, like trusted contacts inviting you. So I don't think the company would be against it. Like, why would they? Jana soon left modelling, partly because she was disgusted by some of the things we've just heard her describing. But we've also talked to another Slovak model of that generation. Let's call her Kristina. She continued building her career into her early 20s, moving to an agency in New York. One day, she got a call from someone in that agency, a trusted friend.
16:50Nadia Marcinko:That, like, I have this guy, his name's Jeffrey, he's a really good friend. And so he's looking for someone to massage him. And she knew that I didn't massage him. So that's how I know, you know, that's how I got invited to this house on the Upper East Side. Because, like, stupid me. I said, okay, why not? It's a job, you know. So it looked like if you walked into a Dracula house, like, in Transylvania. So it was expensive, antique, like, beautiful staircase. Some housekeeper escorts me to one of the rooms. there's a massage table in the middle, no furniture, nothing. I purposely dressed very like a nun.
17:33Nadia Marcinko:I was wearing this huge, long sweater, black, zipped all the way, and he comes in, like, hi, very professional, in his white robe. Bathrobe. Yeah, like bathrobe. And without further ado, he just lays on the table, but like very discreetly takes off his rope. He was lying on his front. I was massaging his back and just talking frantically because I was nervous, you know. I was going on and on about my boyfriend and how I love him. Like really stupid, really dorky. And he said, you have a very cute body. And he asked me whether I wanted to take my sweater off. I said, no, you know, I'm sort of chilly.
18:24Nadia Marcinko:And it really didn't take long because then he was like, okay, well, thank you very much. And he gave me$500 in cash. I was there probably maybe like 10 minutes. I don't know. I'm not very proud of it. But, you know, I was 23 years old or like 22. So that's it. nothing more, nothing less. Just a massage. With Epstein, it always started with a massage.
18:59To her relief, Christina never saw him again. But what about Nadia? She later told the federal investigators that Jean-Luc Brunel, her boss, encouraged her to massage Epstein's feet when she met him. And she depended on Brunel for her rights to stay in America. So how How could she say no? She couldn't. And it would have been hard for her to say no to anything from Brunel or Epstein for years to come. Because Brunel sponsored her visa and because Epstein bankrolled Brunel's agency to the tune of a million dollars, she felt, as she later told the investigators, that Epstein could have had her deported with a single phone call to Brunel.
19:42So the relationship within her and Epstein was coercive and complicated. Remember how for years afterwards she wanted to celebrate the day she met Epstein as their anniversary? He described it like that too. And of course, that's how lots of couples describe the day they met. If you just read her emails to him, and I've read hundreds, you get the impression that this was a romance. Ghislaine Maxwell, Epstein's companion, was still his close friend. She was still finding other girls for him. But their sexual relationship was coming to an end. Nadia would be his chief girlfriend now.
20:27Nadia Marcinko:Nadia Marr, to redacted email, June 17th, 2004. Hey! I hope you've had a nice relaxing day like me. Wink! This is the first email I've found between them. I went for a walk. I read the massage book. I missed you. I played with my new phone. I played with my camera. I wanted to play with you so much. But I ate a Reese's peanut butter cup and I feel better now.
21:08And for the years to come, they talk to one another like a couple. They have rows. They make up. They fuss over their small fluffy dog. She gets jealous of other women. And eventually, we'll come back to this, they plan a family together. But Jakob, isn't he just manipulating her? There's a massive imbalance of power, of wealth and age. She's just over 18 when they meet. He's 50, 32 years her senior. Yes, of course. And to call him controlling would be putting it mildly. Here's a typical message from 2009. I want you to learn how to cook eggs, scrambled, poached, over easy. I want you to learn how to run a house.
21:56I want no arguments during the Monday to Friday week. I want you to read one of the hundred great books every month. I want beautiful things only in the house. You cannot put anything in without letting me see it first. Jay. And what would happen if she displeased him? After his death, she told the investigators the whole relationship was abusive. He choked her, threw her downstairs, forced her to have multiple plastic surgeries. For whatever reason, there's no reference to those incidents in emails I've found. Though she does reproach him over many other things, I found one message where she accuses him indirectly of abusive partner behavior.
22:42Although she finishes with the words, I love you. In any case, we know Nadia was totally dependent on him and she didn't like it.
22:50Nadia Marcinko:March 16, 2006. Since I met you, my life revolves around you. There's nothing else I have, and it makes me feel very uneasy. Her modelling career effectively ended as soon as she met him. She later told the investigators her agency wouldn't send her on more castings until she lost weight. Instead, Epstein put her in charge of designing his homes. They discussed wall colours, shower doors, kitchen counters. But that's not her only job. March 15, 2006, Nadia Martinkova wrote, I had to be there when the painter had to see the apartments, some furniture got delivered, carpets were measured, then you asked me to go to the home show.
23:35Nadia Marcinko:And it is incredibly frustrating when knowing that you gave me enough to do to keep me busy full time, you then call and nag about girls again. Again and again, it comes back to girls. Nadia had to keep the supply flowing. Nadia Martinkova to Jay Epstein, March 16, 2006 What do you imagine is a fun sex thing? I will do what I can, even though if this is simply about you having sex with someone else, I don't know how it makes our relationship better. I will try to find girls whenever we are in New York. Sometimes, though, as you can hear, she was reluctant. Jay Epstein to Nadia, June 11, 2006 As opposed to learning to have fun fishing for girls, your focus was how disgusting the bait is.
24:27He went on. If you are unhappy and unfulfilled, let's decide how to make it better. It is unfair to lay the blame at my doorstep. You returned from Europe, where you had totally free time, empty-handed. It seems from some messages that Nadia knows Geoffrey prefers his women young. But we found no evidence in the files that she ever introduced him to underage girls. But recruiting adults through deception for exploitative purposes can also be trafficking.
24:57Nadia Marcinko:March 20th, 2006. Nadia Martinkova wrote. I just had dinner with Laura and her friend. She's pretty cute, 19, French. I'm sending you a picture and also a picture of the Swedish girl I met at Natalie's dinner. She says she can do Thai massage. She is not cute enough for anything else. 19. You're listening to the documentary from the BBC World Service. So you're running out of closet space. The good news? You don't need to stop shopping. You just need to start selling with The RealReal. The RealReal is the world's largest and most trusted resource for authenticated luxury resale. Whether it's that mini bag that can't even fit your phone or those boots you never fully broke in.
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27:02This podcast is your study guide. On NerdWallet's Smart Money podcast, you'll hear from trusted journalists who explain the why behind major financial decisions. You'll get research-backed insights and clear pros and cons, whether you're planning a big purchase or just want to grow your wealth. Make your next financial move with confidence. Follow NerdWallet's Smart Money podcast on your favourite podcast app. I'm Tim Hewlett with Jakub Pole telling the story of Nadia Martinko.
27:37One survivor of abuse by Epstein said the pecking order of his sex organisation, as she observed it, was first Ghislaine Maxwell, then Brunel, the modelling agent, then Epstein's assistant Sarah Kellan, and then Nadia. Maxwell is now serving a 20-year prison sentence for child sex trafficking. Brunel later killed himself in prison while awaiting trial on rape charges. Kellen, who is giving testimony to the House of Representatives oversight committee this week, has denied any wrongdoing. She's previously said she was manipulated sexually and psychologically by Epstein. As for Nadia, she's never been accused of or charged with any offence.
28:22We can't say what role, if any, Nadia played in Epstein's network. but he wanted Brunel, who he was financing, to pay her for something. From Jay Epstein, Thursday, July 13th, 2006, to Jean-Luc at mcsquaredmm.com. Please have someone in your office call Nadia and put her on your payroll. Give her$50 ,000 per year's salary. What should I tell her? Do you want her to scout? Brunel asks. There's no answer. But what else would he employ her for? Since there's no evidence, she was still modeling at the time. Nadia also got to use Epstein's credit card, and there was a whopping present to her father in Slovakia.
29:10A$10 ,000 Harley Davidson. He sent him in 2006. He replied, Nadia told Epstein, after sitting with a dictionary. Mr. Jeffrey, thank you very, very much. It is a fantastic and beautiful present. I am very glad, deliriously happy. I wish you good luck. Her father didn't reply to our requests for an interview. To be fair, he probably knew nothing then about the true nature of his daughter's boyfriend. If you'd looked up Epstein online in those days, you'd just have read that he was a rich businessman and philanthropist. But the police were already learning a great deal more about Epstein and about Nadia.
29:58When underage girls began complaining in 2005 about how Epstein abused them in Palm Beach, they described in detail how Nadia took part in the sex with them. Years later, she told the investigators she didn't know the girls were underage or that they were paid. She said Epstein used to ask her to leave the room before the end. But the US authorities named her as one of four women potential co-conspirators. They agreed not to prosecute in 2007 as part of the deal where Epstein pleaded guilty to the lesser charge of soliciting prostitution from an underage girl instead of to sex trafficking minors.
30:41Records at the Palm Beach County Stockade show Nadia visited him 67 times during the 13 months he was in jail. and even more remarkably she went on scouting for him after he was released as his trafficking operation continued unaffected by his conviction and jail term. In one email we found she asks him what he thinks of a specific woman who she says has offered to come over from Eastern Europe and it was also after he left jail that she and Epstein made detailed plans to start a family together. Yeah it's this above all that indicates how strong their relationship still was. But later, Nadia complains he'll be away for the key weekend that they planned to be together.
31:26Nadia Marcinko:To Jeffrey Epstein, October 20th, 2009. Jeffrey, so basically you are going to break your promise. This is not just two more days. This weekend means waiting another six weeks before we can try again. Your last minute suggestion to spend this weekend with prostitutes is just too much for me to handle. She later told the investigators he was particularly violent with her dead year. And again, the next, 2010, when she said they broke up as a couple. To jeevacation at gmail.com, August 9th, 2010. I participated in your life, your idea of fun. I stood by you for years of legal battles and jail time.
32:12She went on.
32:13Nadia Marcinko:You promised me a baby, time alone, real estate broker deals, apartment in Prague, castle in Slovakia, house in Florida, cars, plane, and did nothing. You ignored my birthdays, picked on me about the pettiest of errands, and even took back a used car you gave me with a bow on it for Christmas with an excuse that you didn't really give it to me. She finished by saying she wanted to move her things out of his houses. But for the next few years, as she told the investigators, they remained friends. And I found the emails between them actually increased. Publicly, she remained loyal to Epstein. That year, 2010, one alleged victim sued.
33:04Nadia had to give evidence. She was asked about his possible associates, including former President Bill Clinton, and over and over again she pleaded the Fifth Amendment, her constitutional right to silence. But she had already been trying for several years to lessen her dependence on Epstein, to break away from him financially, though she was using his help to do that. In 2009, while he was in prison, he paid tens of thousands of dollars for her to learn to fly. And she took to the air with great enthusiasm. She told Epstein...
33:43Nadia Marcinko:I am more jealous of the pilots I see taking off at the airport than the girls I see taking off their clothes in our bed.
33:54Nadia got her pilot's licence and marketed her skills on social media, where she said that after modelling, she was ready for longer runways. I met Nadia in November of 2013. I didn't know she was from another country or anything like that. Geoffrey Epstein meant nothing to me. She was just a young woman pilot who was active on social media. Christine Negroni, aviation journalist. And Nadia was delightful. She was charming company to everyone. And I was very impressed with her. And she worked very hard attending flight schools to get her certificates. One after another, private pilot, instructor pilot, multi-engine pilot, instrument pilot.
34:44She ticked them off and she ticked them off pretty fast. These are not easy accomplishments. In 2012, Nadia starts co-piloting Epstein's private jet, the so-called Lolita Express, on flights to Little St. James Island, alongside Epstein's long-term chief pilot, Larry Vysosky. That was money-making for her because she was invited to fly a lot of airplanes and do a lot of videos. Got him! In this one from 2017, she pranks a flight instructor, pretending to be a ditzy beginner in thick glasses, clutching a pink teddy, before taking over the controls, performing breathtaking upside-down aerial stunts, and finally emerging from the cockpit in a skimpy black dress and making a charity appeal.
35:38Some of you may be wondering why we've been carrying this pink teddy bear with us on the flight.
35:43Nadia Marcinko:We've partnered with the National Breast Cancer Foundation. Nadia also had her own firm, Aviloop, offering a range of flying-related services. Welcome to Aviloop, your collective buying website for anything aviation. Wired magazine described just at the time as a supremely odd business. Christine Negroni thought so too. It was very cheesy, cute, provocative ladies in mini skirts and pilot hats offering fly me captain sort of salutations. You can even vote for your favorite deal attendant and win special prizes. So what are you waiting for, Captain? Living in an environment dictated by Jeffrey Epstein, what she probably knew about appropriate displays of sexuality was probably non-existent.
36:34She had every reason to believe that that provocative, I'm adorable, I'm sexy approach to getting business would work. How successful that was, I don't know. The Epstein files show it was clearly, at the end, a method for Epstein to provide it with money. But other emails earlier on show that she was trying to make a go of the business. I don't believe that her goal initially was to remain tied to Jeffrey Epstein. From 2011, she was much less tied to him. She told the investigators that that year, Epstein and Brunel refused to renew the modelling visa she'd had. But she managed to obtain another one based on her own work.
37:24But still, from what I found in the files, a financial relationship between her and Epstein continued. It looks as though he was actually subsidising Nadia more generously in these years, when she had her own business than he did before. In 2011 and early 2012, he gave her almost$200 ,000. That's on top of buying her a Mercedes in 2010 and continuing to foot the bill for her Manhattan apartment.
37:59And messages between them in 2015 confirm what she told investigators, that Epstein agreed to double whatever money she made from other sources. She told the investigators she hadn't been able to maintain steady employment because of her association with him. But on this, the emails partly tell an opposite story, that he helped her find work. From Jeffrey Epstein to Nadia, April 15th, 2013. In an attempt to still be helpful, I believe I have found you a really great full-time job. It would be a flight instructor working full-time for my friend Dean Kamen, Segway. He is considered the Thomas Edison of the 21st century, 61, never married, so no girlfriends to deal with.
38:46Dean Kamen, the celebrated engineer and entrepreneur, inventor of the Segway and the iBot all-terrain wheelchair. Christine Negroni had already worked out, years before the files were published, that that's who Nadia was working for. Nadia told me at the time that she was flying the Phenom. The Phenom is a twin-engine jet aircraft, a very fancy airplane, and it requires a lot of pilot skill. And when I discovered whose airplane it was, it became pretty clear pretty quick that it was Dean Kamen's aircraft that she was flying. And then it didn't take long for me to discover that her business, Avaloupe, was headquartered in Dean Kamen's corporate address in New Hampshire.
39:30At the time, it was quite curious to me, because her experience in that aircraft was not so great, then what was her value to Dean Kamen, who could probably hire any kind of professional pilot he wanted? It just seemed very weird. We asked Kamen's company, DECA, for a comment about its association with Nadia Martinko, but they didn't get back to us. A spokesman for Kamen has previously said that the inventor deeply regrets having any interactions with Epstein and had no involvement in or knowledge of his crime. As for Nadia's relationship with Epstein, emails reveal he still had his uses for her.
40:06As late as 2016, he asked her to scout for him at the party. We'll not make it. You hunt for me, please. Smarties or cuties. He now had a new girlfriend, Karina Shuljak, a Belarusian dentist. He would eventually leave her 100 million dollars in his will. But as Nadia told the investigators, she and Epstein remained good friends right up to his arrest for sex trafficking in 2019.
40:46Epstein died in prison in 2019. But though she stood by him for so many years, she had by then finally, secretly, switched sides. A document in the files describes how she cooperated with the FBI from 2018 in their investigation of Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell. In return, at the urging of her lawyer, the FBI supported her successful application to stay in the United States after her visa ran out in 2022. The FBI said she'd been recruited, harbored and obtained by Jeffrey Epstein and others for purposes of a coercive sexual relationship. Nadia's lawyer thanked them for their help and said Nadia was now working on her healing and finally trying to put all of this behind her.
41:36And indeed, that's exactly what she appears to be doing. In the last few years, she's completely disappeared from public view.
41:46But she's still living in New York and at least until last year she was an active member of a Zen Buddhist centre there Pictures on social media show her taking part in ceremonies
42:00Should journalists be respecting Nadia's privacy, giving her a chance to heal? That's what the aviation journalist Christine Negroni is beginning to think In the past, she's highlighted Nadia's role in the Epstein case, attracted to her story like many others, partly because unlike other associates of Epstein, Nadia's written about herself online and posted glamorous, self-confident portraits of herself. But now Christine says she'll stop writing about her. Nadia tried to find a way out. She tried to rise literally and figuratively above the world in which she wound up. And the opportunity for her was in social media.
42:44But it is totally biting her in the back, because she's the one everybody knows and recognizes. she clearly was a victim for many years of terrible human being and that the ire of the public falls on her because she's one of the one still standing is wrong jeffrey epstein left millions of documents with names of people who willingly participated in what he was up to And if there were one fraction of a percentage of attention paid to those people, the majority of whom are men, that to me would be where the balance of justice should go. Not to the Nadias or to any other woman who was abused by Jeffrey Epstein.
43:37Yeah, I think she should be able to go and try and live as normal life as possible. But that may not happen. With only one accomplice of Epstein's, Ghislaine Maxwell, convicted nearly seven years after his death, demand for further prosecutions is growing and some think that victims can also be perpetrators. Jeffrey Epstein was running an intelligence-gathering operation in my professional opinion. I do believe it was a honeypot operation. And I do believe that there's a list of individuals who did engage in trafficking, were given these plea deals, and I'm going to name those individuals right now.
44:12That's US Congresswoman Anna Paulina Luna, a Republican member of the House Oversight Committee. It monitors the accountability of the federal government and its agencies. Speaking apparently after seeing unredacted Epstein documents, which Congress members have the right to do, Luna went on to name the four women in the 2007 immunity deal, including Nadia Marcinko, and call for them to be investigated. All of these women engaged in the trafficking of minors as adults. They were working and complicit with Jeffrey Epstein's operation. And in my opinion, they are not to be given victim status because they did partake in harming young girls.
44:57Her statement sparked an outcry on social media. Some were outraged that the victim status of the women was being questioned. Others said each case should be examined individually and the scale of Epstein's operations could only be uncovered by recognising that some people had dual roles. And that seems to be the attitude that the Oversight Committee is taking. Though Sarah Callan and another of Epstein's personal assistants, Leslie Groff, are already giving testimony, it appears that it hasn't decided yet whether or not to call the other two named potential co-conspirators. Adriana Ross, another Epstein assistant, or Nadia Marcinko.
45:43Capitol Hill is a long way from Preshow, where Nadia grew up. I asked Josef, her friend from primary school, why he wanted to take part in this programme. Basically, you can never know what's going on in someone else's head, and I haven't been in touch with Nadia for years. but why I'm talking today is to say she really was a victim. She was very strongly manipulated by love and some of the comments about her on social media are just hateful. So I'm just doing what I can to keep alive the memory that she was a good person, just destroyed by money and power. And Jakob, what do you think? I mean, you've been wading through these emails for so long, you must feel that you at least half know Nadia Martinko.
46:37To be honest, I am still not sure what I think. Whether a victim can ever become an accomplice. But of all the messages I've read from Nadia to Epstein, I want to finish with one that says more to me than all the others. It's from 2012, almost a decade into their relationship. It's about his overwhelming power and also, perhaps, her share, however limited, of responsibility.
47:14Nadia Marcinko:On Thursday, August 9th, 2012, Nadia wrote, I do not want to be with you, but it upsets me to see you use the exact same patterns to seduce, manipulate, and ultimately control and hurt other girls. I don't even like them, and I actually feel guilty about knowing how they will end up. Meeting your latest Russian was like watching a person on death row eating their last lavish meal without knowing what's about to happen. That girl couldn't handle you if you came with instructions. I know what you're capable of and I will always be protective of you out of pure loyalty and stubbornness. But my conscience is far from clear.
48:09Thanks for listening to the documentary from the BBC World Service. It was presented and produced by me, Tim Hewell and Jakob Poehler with sound mixing by Neil Churchill. The production coordinator was Gemma Ashman and the editor, Penny Murphy.
48:48I think your kid is walking up the slide. Kyle, again? Really?
48:52Nadia Marcinko:Auto Trader. Buy your car online. Really?
From the publisher
Nadia Marcinko, originally Marcinková, was born in Slovakia and met Jeffrey Epstein as an 18-year-old model. Later, she became a successful aircraft pilot. For seven years, she was Epstein’s main girlfriend. And she’s one of four women that US prosecutors named in a 2008 plea deal as his “potential co-conspirators”. But she’s never been accused of any crime. And she’s described herself a victim who was abused physically and psychologically by Epstein. Now, a committee of the US Congress is beginning to address the sensitive question of whether it’s possible for someone to be both a victim and an accomplice, as it takes testimony from two of the “potential co-conspirators”, Epstein’s former assistants Sarah Kellen and Lesley Groff. Nadia Marcinko, who disappeared from public view several years ago, may also be called to testify.
BBC reporter Tim Whewell and independent Slovak journalist Jakub Pohle have talked to people who’ve known her, and dug deep into the Epstein files, to put together the most detailed account yet of her life.
This episode of The Documentary comes to you from Assignment, investigations and journeys into the heart of global events.




