GRANT BALDWIN: Building Balance in Limit-Pushing Industries

21:04And so that was a deal breaker for my wife was I explained the idea of us getting a plane. She's like, absolutely not. That's ridiculous. And I said, well, this one has a parachute. And she's like, okay, maybe. So then I was like, well, what about this one? She's like, does that have a parachute? No, but she's like, I don't want to hear about it. It's got to have a parachute or nothing. And so there's also just that from like a safety perspective, that worst case scenario, I pass out. If something happens to me, I know that my wife says, all I got to do is pull this handle and there's a good chance that we'll be okay.

21:32So that carries a lot of weight as well. I'm not quite sure what this has to do with the double win, except that I'm just absolutely fascinated by it. Here's part of it is I think it kind of speaks to, again, kind of designing the kind of life that you want to have. There's no practical reason that I need an airplane. There's no reason that I needed to get my pilot's license. On one hand, it's just kind of cool. On the other hand, it's just like, yeah, but I get to experience life in a different type of way that most people wouldn't. And so again, going back to what's the point of becoming a speaker?

22:01Because I just thought this is the kind of life that I want to have. What's the point of moving to Nashville 10 years ago when I wasn't moving for a job? We didn't have any family here. We didn't have any friends here. There's no reason on paper to move. Everybody's questioning, wait a second, why are you going there? What is this about? We just think it'd be a cool place to be, you know, and why did we homeschool our girls years ago before a pandemic, you know, forced a lot of people into it. It's like, no, this is the kind of life that we want to live. And so same thing with a plane, like, is there any practical need for it?

22:29No, like we can survive just fine without it. But from a life design standpoint, it's been a huge, huge win. Well, the other thing that I think is a huge win about it is you're essentially buying back your time. And I think for, for many people, you get to a certain level of income and more income is not going to solve any problem, but more time would solve problems. And so when you can fly somewhere faster than you could drive, and I've literally never met anybody that says, I want to spend more time actually traveling. No, you travel to get there, but it's the getting there is what's important.

23:03So the fact that you have a plane allows you to spend more time with your family. I know you take your family up quite a bit. So yeah, that's really cool.

23:17So I'm hearing this thread in your story about living in congruence with your values, about personal freedom, about life design. I mean, these are big concepts that feel like they're innate to you. But I'm imagining our listeners, and they probably don't feel innate to everybody listening today. I mean, they're probably like, wow, you know, who's this guy? So where does that come from for you? Like where you, where you thought to yourself, I can design my life in a way that works for my family, that works with the values that I had. I mean, most of us, we don't kind of come into life with a growth mindset of, you know, things are flexible.

23:57We kind of come in with like, this is how it works. Yeah. Maybe what we saw our parents do or whatever. And my childhood and teen years, my dad was an entrepreneur. And so he had, he worked from home. So we had some flexibility there. He worked from home, really? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it was. Like pre-internet. Yeah, way back when. And so I do remember seeing that and seeing like, okay, he could, you know, he could stop what he was doing and hang out with us or interact with us or whatever that may be. I don't know if there was any like one moment or instance as much as again, like, well, we all get to design this, you know, like just because I'll give you one example would be like when we started, um, my wife started homeschooling our girls.

24:30I remember one time they were real little, they came in and they said, Hey, if we do tomorrow's work today, does that mean we can play more tomorrow? I was like, yeah, because that's the way it is for all of us. Right. And it shouldn't just be that we, you know, you work eight to five or nine to five, Monday to Friday, and that's the way it is for life because that's the way it's been done for decades and generations. It's like, no, no, like you can design the things in a way that makes sense for you. And again, what may make sense for you may not make sense for someone else. So we may look at someone else's life of, Hey, here's a family who travels around the world all the time.

25:01And, you know, this is the way that they choose to live life for this family that chooses to live out of an RV or this family that chooses to live off the grid or whatever that may look like that makes sense to them. And it's also realizing like you're not making a permanent decision. So I remember, for example, whenever we moved to Nashville, we had a lot of well-meaning family and friends who are like, have you thought this through? Like what happens if, what are you, what happens if you get there and you don't like it? And I remember telling someone like, well, we'll just move back. Yeah. Like it's a ordeal.

25:35You're not like removing body parts or We're making this permanent decision, you know? And so you get a choice. Let's say we buy the plane and we have it for a little while and we don't like it. Well, then we sell it. You just move on with life. And again, there's like transactional costs associated with these things. But it's not like any of these things are permanent decisions. So one of the things I would say would be, yes, we can talk about it as if it is, you know, these are like normal common things. And part of it may just be like, we don't know any other way to live. But also some of this is, I think, is like incremental steps of bravery.

26:05where if we go back for any of our lives, years and years and years, like we have that kind of life that we have now. And so it was like making micro steps along the way of why do we live here? Or why do we choose to school kids this way? Or why do we work in this way instead of that way? And it doesn't mean, again, like you make this conscious decision on a Friday afternoon and then Monday morning, it's like, okay, it all worked out. But saying like, okay, if that's the kind of life that I want to live, and this is where I'm at today, just like on a map, what's the best possible way to get from point A to point B?

26:35and what are the steps I need to start taking in order to move toward that direction. So how do you get the courage when you're thinking about something, maybe being a pilot, for example, how do you convince yourself to do that? So I think there's a couple ways to look at it. There's, you know, one of them is going to be the regret side of things. You know, what are the things that you did that you wish you hadn't done? And what are the things you didn't do that you wish you had tried? And so I felt like through the lens of like entrepreneurship, it was one of those things of going, okay, if I start this speaking business, what if it doesn't work?

27:04You know, it's like, well, I can live with it not working, but I don't want to get to the end of life and be like, I think I could have made that work, but I'll never know because I didn't try. And the same thing was true with like being a pilot of going like, maybe I do that discovery flight. Maybe I do a couple of lessons and decide this isn't for me. And that's fine. I can live with that, but I don't want to live with it's going like, I just didn't even try, you know, because I was scared or I was worried or I was anxious or costs or whatever. And like, these are all real things. So I don't want to just like downplay them or minimize them.

27:31They're absolutely things that you got to factor in and consider. But at the end of the day, I want to look back and be like, I lived life really, really great. So let me give you a quick story. Last year, we do this houseboat trip with a couple of buddies, Brian Harris. We have heard about this houseboat trip. It's a popular houseboat trip. We've done nine years of this houseboat trip. And so we have four guys that go every year. And then we have two new guys that come every year and just get to know some other guys. And so last year, one of the guys that came, one of the new guys that came two or three days before the houseboat, his mom passed away, like just suddenly out of the blue.

28:04And so we're talking to him before the houseboat of just like, hey man, if you're not able to come, totally fine. If you've got to deal with, you know, funeral preparation, yada, yada, yada, like totally get it. You know, they're like, this is a major, major deal. And so I remember he's like, no, no, I want to be there. I've been looking forward to this. I'm coming. He comes. And we were kind of talking about it. I'm like, man, you're like, your mom literally died a couple of days ago. How are you doing? And he's like, honestly, like I'm doing really, really well. And he said, people oftentimes talk about regrets of like, oh, if I could just hug my mom one more time, you know, if I could tell her I love her one more time.

28:34He's like, I did those things. I hugged her. I loved her. I told her I love it. Like we just went on a trip with her, you know? And so I feel like that oftentimes with my own life, that if something were to happen to me, I don't want to look back and be like, man, all these things that I left undone or unsaid or unaccomplished. It's like, no, I've had a really, really great life. And I want to continue that life. But I also have been intentional to say like, no, this is a good life. I got one shot at this thing. And so I want to make sure that I lived it well and I was satisfied with what I did.

29:05What is your typical week look like now? And your typical day? Most mornings I'll start with some type of exercise. And so a lot of times I'm getting up at like 445 to go to the gym at 530, either a couple of days a week, lift with our mutual friend, Brian Harris. We lift heavy things and pretend like we're strong. A couple of days a week. Are you a CrossFitter? No, no, that's ridiculous. So, uh, I'm a pilot. And so I have to tell people I'm a pilot in the same way that a CrossFitter has to tell people that they're CrossFitter. So I'm doing something that I feel like obligated to let everyone know just to work it in the conversation.

29:36So similar, but, uh, yeah, so we'll work out a couple of days a week, play pickleball quite a bit. Uh, yeah. Have you guys gotten into that? No, but we want to, but my sisters have, I was just talking with my husband the other day we were on a walk and I was like, babe, we have got to do pickleball. It's a lot of fun. I had a friend yesterday, he was talking about pickleball and he said, you know, pickleball has made tennis more accessible to more people. You know, it's like, it's like an improvement on tennis. And he said, what we need is pickle golf because 18 holes is too long. It's a commitment.

30:12He said, we need 12 holes. And he said, we just need to take the existing golf courses and divide them into three, you know, 18. So you could play this six or this six and then you're done. I love that idea. That's intriguing. Pickleball. Yeah. So, uh, either lifting with Brian or pickleball, uh, walk the dog a couple of days a week. And so something to get the blood pumping in the morning there. A lot of times I'm at my desk by seven 38 at home and I'm ready to get going. Like I genuinely enjoy what it is that I do. So it's nothing that you're like, you know, you're dreading or like, ah, this is awful.

30:43This is miserable. Like, well, if you're living that kind of life, again, you're the one that can do something about it. So you need to change something about that setting or the environment or whatever it may be. So a lot of times I'm at my desk, 738 and getting after it. And so, like I said, because my wife homeschools the girls, like when they start to make their rounds and then I want to go out and see them, hang out with them for a few. But most days I'm working three, four, five o 'clock or so. It kind of depends. Normally like you start the beginning of the week working till four or five.

31:11And then as the week goes, it kind of trickles and maybe by Friday afternoon, it's kind of a half day of that. But I try to have some freedom flexibility there. A lot of times in the evening, hanging out with the family, doing something with them. And so I genuinely really, really enjoy my life and I enjoy the life that I get to live and that people I get to live with and get to do life with. Okay. So I feel like we have to ask you some questions about speaking because you're the guy. That's right. And we have a lot of speakers who listen to our show and a lot of aspiring speakers who listen to our show.

31:42How do people get over the anxiety of speaking. So I don't know if you know this, but I had a debilitating fear of public speaking. Not uncommon. But I basically got into a situation where I couldn't say no anymore. And so my very first speaking event was a keynote in front of 800 people. Okay. Jumping in the deep end. The deep end. And actually, it was really fun. She did great. She crushed it. It was really fun. And the six weeks leading up to it were not fun. They were the opposite of getting ready. But I I don't think that's an uncommon experience. And I had a professional reason that caused me to have to do it.

32:15Well, I'm speaking again. I've spoken since, of course, but I'm speaking again next month. And it's been a while and I'm feeling a little bit of nerves. It's not debilitating. I'll be fine. But on the spectrum of I feel anxious to I would rather die. Like, what can you tell us? So first of all, I think it's important to acknowledge that those feelings are normal, natural, and okay. If anything, I think it means that your body's telling you like, hey, this is important. This is a big deal. You should pay attention. I'd be more concerned about the people who are just like, I don't feel anything.

32:48It's like, well, does this even matter to you? Why are you doing this? And so you think about big moments in life where you've had something similar. If you had a big job interview or when you were giving birth, wedding, got engaged, any of those type of really big moments. Like, oh, I felt similar things. And it wasn't like when I was proposing to my wife that I thought she's probably going to say no, or this is going to be a disaster. It's just like, no, it's just your body's way of saying like, hey, this is a really big deal. Like you better lock in right now, right? So if anything, I would say like, well, if we know that that's an okay feeling, that's a normal, natural feeling, then what do we do to minimize that or control that so it doesn't become overwhelming or debilitating?

33:24I think one of the best things that any speaker can do is really spend significant time behind the scenes practicing and preparing. So by the time you step up there, you know, like, okay, I still feel all of that. But there's also a level of confidence and calm. So an example would be if you think back to high school or university or college and you remember taking a test or an exam. And you have a choice. Like if you knew the exam was coming up, you could, I'm just going to wing it. I'm just going to show up and like, eh, we'll just kind of see how this goes. And now I feel really nervous and uncomfortable because I don't really know what I'm getting myself into.

33:55or it's like, no, no, I'm really going to spend the time to practice, to study, to go over practice exams, to have a study group or whatever it may be to review my notes. So by the time I show up, I may still feel some of the butterflies. I know this is a big deal, but there's also a level of confidence. Like, no, I got this. Like bring it on, let's go. It's similar to like flying a plane. You don't just get up there and be like, I hope this works. Let's take the whole family up for my first flight. Every time I fly, I still feel like, okay, this is a big deal. Pay attention. But I also feel a level of like, no, no, like I've spent a lot of time and energy and effort preparing for this moment to take off, to fly somewhere, to do it safely, effectively, and confidently and land and be a good experience.

34:35And so same thing is true of going like, when you feel those things, it's okay. It's a good thing. It's a normal thing. And also know that like, I can spend some time behind the scenes practicing, preparing. So by the time I get up there, it's like, no, I got this. I'm ready. Yeah. I used to think that people who are good speakers and they seemingly weren't nervous, that they just didn't deal with that. There were like the people like me who had all those feelings and felt sick to their stomach and sweaty and whatever. And then you had to wait until that went away to sort of qualify to get on stage.

35:07And what I've realized since then is, I mean, that's just going to happen because it's a big deal. That's just part of it. Now it won't be debilitating once you know you'll be fine, but that's part of it. And you don't have to wait till those feelings go away to do it. I actually worked with a speaking anxiety coach. I mean, that's how I was like, listen, we got to bring in the professionals here. This is a 911. And he said, you know what? You can totally feel all that. And you got to go to work. And I was like, oh, in my mind, it was so black and white that it had to be either if I was that nervous, I couldn't speak.

35:40Or if I was finally not nervous, then I would, you know, whatever. and it was so freeing to realize oh i can just coexist with these feelings and of course the truth is they just blow off the back after a minute or two on stage it's so true i was gonna say you know like i'll have all those feelings too and i've spoken hundreds and hundreds of times but when i step on stage once i get past about the first 15 seconds yep then i'm totally in it but nobody tells you that i'm loving it so we're telling you right now that's right now you know you just gotta get through those first 30 seconds but you think about like other professions industry where that's the case.

36:12If you watch athletes playing in the Super Bowl and you think, well, they're professional athletes. They've played this game for their entire lives. Of course, they're not nervous. No, they're absolutely nervous, right? Because it's just that moment of they've practiced, they've prepared, they've gone through drills, they've gone through training for years, but it's still a really big moment. I'd be more concerned about the athlete who's like, I feel good. I didn't feel anything. It's like, really? Like it's the Super Bowl, Patrick Mahomes. Come on. It's kind of cliche at this point, but the whole adage of do it scared is really true, not just in speaking, but in everything.

36:44Totally. And I think that the ability to do it, even when you're afraid, is the mark of maturity. And so I think that whatever it is that life calls on us to do, I think that we've got to step into it. And when we do, those feelings disappear. Yeah. And Dan Sullivan makes this really interesting distinction between courage and confidence. And a lot of people think, well, I've got to feel confident before I can speak. He said, no, confidence comes after you've exercised courage. It's like the reward. You don't need confidence. What you need is courage, which just means the ability to do what's required, even though you have those feelings of anxiety.

37:24Well, I think there's also situations where you can borrow that courage or confidence from other people. So you were talking about with your coach, if you're feeling like, I can't do this. And your coach is like, no, no, you're good. You're not just saying that. So the same thing I think about like the first time I did a solo flight by myself, you know, you have a, I had this young instructor. He's like 20 years old. He looks like a child. And at some point after flying for a few weeks, he's like, okay, you got this. And he gets out of the plane and he says, okay, here's what you're going to do.

37:52And you're going to land and I'll see you back here. And you're going like, are you sure? Should we talk about this? Let's do one more practice, you know? But his confidence, you know, his courage is like, okay, he's not going to get out of the plane if he doesn't think I'm confident and ready for this moment. So borrowing that confidence and courage from other people. And that's why coaching, I think, is so helpful. I mean, I think we all have coaches in our lives. And the reason for that, the reason we're willing to invest in that is because the value of other people believing you can do something and helping you with the preparation for sure.

38:23But man, you will do so much more in that context than ever. If somebody's an aspiring speaker, what would be your advice to get started? And particularly, I think, people that are at mid-career or maybe late career, and they're thinking, I want to do something different, and I'd really like to be a speaker, but they don't even know where to start. Yeah. One of the things we do inside the Speaker Lab, our training company for speakers, is we teach what we call the SPEAK framework. Basically, what this is is an acronym for SPEAK, S-P-E-A-K. And so the S is selecting a problem to solve. I think this is the most difficult part of the process for people is because we just say like, I want to be a speaker.

38:58What do I speak about? I don't know. What do you want me to speak about? And who do I speak to? I don't know. I speak to humans. I speak to people. I speak to everybody, right? And so the analogy we always use is you want to be the steakhouse and not the buffet. You want to be the steakhouse and not the buffet. Meaning if we're going to grab a bite to eat and we're looking for a good steak, like we could go to Golden Corral where steak is one of a hundred things that they offer and they're all mediocre. Or we could go to a steakhouse where they do one thing and they just do that one thing really well.

39:23So they don't do tacos. They don't do sushi. They don't do spaghetti. Like we just do steak. And so if you're a vegetarian, if you're looking for something else, like that's just not us, you know. And so we get it whenever it comes to that. But for some reason, we think whenever it comes to being an expert or a speaker or whatever it may be, or starting a business, I want to solve as many problems as I can for as many people as possible. I want to spread the net as far and wide as possible. And it's counterintuitive. But the more narrow, the more focused you are, the easier it is to actually build some momentum.

39:52So that's the hardest part for so many speakers is we just think through all the different passions and interests and experience and knowledge that we have. And we go, but how do we take all of that and narrow it down to like, no, no, I can best help you with this. And that, again, we're not making a permanent decision. It can iterate and pivot and change over time. But we've got to pick some starting place versus trying to be, no, no, we're golden corral. So whatever you want us to talk about and whoever you want to speak to, we can do it. Well, nobody's hiring that kind of speaker. So does your framework help people to zero in on that?

40:23Yeah, absolutely. Because it's, you know, we've heard the expression before, it's hard to read the label from inside the jar, you know. And also realizing that just because you're passionate about a topic, knowledgeable on a topic, interested in the topic, doesn't necessarily mean that organizations, groups, conferences, events are hiring speakers to talk about that. So there has to be some type of overlap here. Like a market fit. Yeah, just because I'm interested in it and this is what organizations hire speakers. Like what is that Venn diagram? Where I know like, okay, here's where I might fit into that mix.

40:50And I think this applies to kind of all of life. Like if you're starting a business, the more narrow you can be in terms of the problem you solve, the more successful you're going to be, the faster you're going to get traction. If you're starting a social media account and you're trying to get traction there, the people that are uber successful are the people that take a stand for one thing and people know them for that one thing. And the more you broaden that, the more difficult it is for people to find you. Yeah. And we can see this in other elements of life. So let's imagine that God forbid you had, And let's use an example.

41:19You've talked about this a little bit, that you had a heart issue a few years ago, right? With a heart issue, you could go to your normal family medical doctor, and they probably know something about the heart, probably more than any of us do. But they're just kind of a general family doctor, right? I can tell you something, there's only so far I can go. Or you can go to a cardiologist where it's like, you have a broken leg, I can't really help you. You got a headache, there's nothing I can do for you. You got a bad cough, I'm sorry. But you got a heart issue, I got you. This is the thing. And so you know, I'm not looking for a buffet doctor.

41:50I'm looking for the specialist who's really, really good at this one thing. And it makes it a lot easier to attract the right type of client or customer, whatever it may be, and repel the wrong ones. Because I know exactly what I'm looking for, and you're exactly the person that can solve that problem. It seems like when it comes to speaking, and this is what I think people have to consider, there's sort of the art of speaking. you know, creating the content, focusing on the delivery, all the things that make it work on stage. But then there's the business of speaking. So those are two separate things.

42:20And I think this is where, again, a lot of speakers make the mistake of, well, I'm just a good speaker. So now I just sit back and I wait for the phone to ring. It just doesn't work like that. Like your speaking is a great marketing tool, but also there's an element of, I have to like reach out. I have to follow up. I have to do the hard things that a lot of people just don't want to do. And so people kind of naively assume if I just post something on social media, if I put up my website, if I put up my demo video and I just wait for the phone to ring, like if you build it, they will not come.

42:48And so it's a speaking is very much a momentum business, like a lot of businesses. And so the more you speak, the more you speak, but you got to do the work to get that flywheel and that momentum going. So a lot of people just assume I just want to be a good speaker and I'm neglecting the business part of it. But I would argue that the business part is as if not more important than the art of speaking. And do you help with both of those at Speaker Lab? So yeah, the majority of what we do is on the business side. But how do you actually find and book a gig? And what do you speak about? How much do you charge?

43:14And who hires speakers? Yeah, that's so helpful. It's like this mysterious black box. Because for a lot of people, when you get invited to speak to 800 people, we just assume like, okay, I guess I just wait for that email to come for me. And I've done some speaking before, and I just kind of word of mouth or referral or friend of a friend type deal. And yeah, that can happen. But if you wanted to do this on a bigger level and do not a few gigs here and there, but you want to do it as a big part of your business or career, whatever it may be. You know, there are systems processes to go about that, to actually consistently be able to find and book gigs.

43:47So that's a core part of what we do. That's awesome. And, you know, we're big fans here of just as Dan Sullivan says, find the who, don't try to figure out the how on your own. And I think in this world of professional speaking, you're the who. And it's just such a shortcut and such a hack. You know, you could spend 10 years trying to figure out the business of speaking or waiting for the phone to get nowhere. Exactly. And you don't have to. So that's really cool. Yeah. I'm impatient with results and that's why I hire coaches and why I hire people like Grant to accelerate the process. And so if you're a speaker and you want to go further, faster, Grant's your guy when it comes to public speaking.

44:31We always ask our guests three questions. And so are you game for this? Fire away. Let's go. It's kind of like a lightning round, but the questions are kind of deep. So the first one is, what is your personal biggest obstacle in getting the double win, winning at work, and succeeding at life? I would say focus. Yeah. Because there's a lot of - We can help you with that. Yeah. Well, there's a lot of things. We can fully focus on this. There's a lot of things on the menu that you're just like, I want to do that, or I think I could do that. My biggest fear is, I know we're all people of faith, and so I don't want to get to the end of the game and be like, ah, you kind of phoned it in or you went through the motions and some stuff.

45:07And like, we've all been given a certain level of talents and I really want to do something well. I want to live my life really, really well. Where again, at the end, I know that I steward and manage my life really, really well. And so that means like of all the things that you could do is trying to figure out like how to get those things done and also not miss the most important things, right? I heard from the book Die With Zero, I heard about this concept. You can make a list of everything you could possibly do in life and you can do all those things, but you have to get the order right and you have to get the sequence in right, right?

45:40Meaning that like you may be interested in learning to fly a plane, but maybe now's not the time. You got to do this, this, and this first. You just had a new baby, don't sign up for this. Totally, right? And so starting a business, moving, whatever, and then also recognizing like there is never a perfect time for any of these things. But so figuring out like the priority and the focus of going like, Like, okay, I want to do all these things, but like, here's what I have to do now. How do you know when you've gotten the double win? I think it's a reflection of the quality of your relationships and the people that matter most.

46:09So one thing I talk a lot about with our team internally, I talk about with others, is that who you are is more important than what you do. Who you are is more important than what you do. Meaning if we are great entrepreneurs, if we're great speakers, if we're great authors, if we're great, fill in the blank at the thing that we do. But we drop the ball as husbands, wives, moms, dads. If we're a shell of a human being, we're doing it wrong. And so how I know that I'm winning is the quality of my marriage, the quality of my relationship with my girls, of the people that matter most to me. I can drop the ball in a lot of areas, but I know I'm doing well if the quality of the relationship with them is strong.

46:44That's really good. That's good. Okay, last question. What is one ritual or routine that you rely on to do what you do? You've told us a few, so. All right, ritual, routine. So I'm going to go back to one thing we've kind of touched on a little bit here, and that's rely really heavily on coaches. I think coaches are incredibly, incredibly helpful, incredibly, incredibly valuable. When you're able to talk with someone who is a step or two or light years ahead of you in a certain category, whatever that may be, work, personal, whatever it may be. But seeing able to kind of like see around the corner.

47:14And so, you know, in many ways, like when we went flying, we talked about work. And we also talked about like, okay, Gail still likes you most days. And so what's that like? What are you doing? And your girls still seem to get along with you and with each other. So I'm a step or two behind in terms of girls. But how do I make sure that they still like me and respect me and we have a good relationship? And so talking with those people who are a step or two ahead of you, learning from them, benefiting from their experiences, their mistakes, their failures, their shortcomings. I'm like, okay, what are the things that I need to apply in my own world?

47:45So really utilizing coaches has been a big thing that I'd highly recommend. That's fantastic. Me too. Anytime you're trying to learn something, a coach is just usually the best example to get there faster, as we said before. So good for you. Well, Grant, this has been deep and rich. Yeah. Thank you for joining us, particularly coming into the studio today. It's always much more fun in person. Way more fun. Yeah, yeah. This is awesome. Thanks for the opportunity. And I can't wait to go fly fishing here in a few weeks. That's going to be a fun experience too. That'll be great. Okay, buddy. Thanks.

48:11Thanks for being here. You bet.

48:23So Megan, that was a fun conversation. It was so fun. The time went faster than I thought it would. I looked up and we'd already been into it for almost an hour. So what were some of your key takeaways? Number one, flying in a private plane is a little more dangerous than I've been led to believe because I don't do motorcycles and I won't be doing private planes. So that's my first takeaway. No, I'm just kidding. You know, I think the thing that was amazing about that conversation was just seeing somebody who, frankly, in an industry, in a world that's not really thought to be conducive with a double win, has been very intentional about designing his life so that he can win at work and succeed at life.

49:06And I think that's hopeful for everybody because, you know, we hear a lot that I couldn't do it because I'm in some government contract field or whatever. I mean, and certainly shift work might be an area that would make it really difficult. But the truth is, there are creative ways to solve that problem, no matter what your context is. Similar to that, I think I came away with the sense that he has a deep sense of personal agency. Yeah. He doesn't have to take life as it's been prescribed, but he can rearrange things and create a life he loves. And he's certainly done that. the way that he conducts his life, the way that he's able to spend time with his wife and his daughters.

49:47I really admire all that. I do too. I think that that's a fundamental assumption that you have to have is that you have agency. Not all of us have the same level of agency, but I think it's a fundamental belief that we have to adopt that we've got the ability to design our lives. We've got the ability, if we have the courage, to make the changes. Well, part of the reason that we have shifted this podcast to this format is because we want to introduce you to people who are living the double win. Not perfectly, because that's never going to happen for any of us, but real people who are living the double win.

50:22because I think if that's not something we had modeled for us, it can seem impossible or it can seem maybe challenging to figure out how we would do it. But when you meet people in different industries or different spheres of life, then all of a sudden it's like, okay, well, if they could do it, then maybe I could do it. And I think that is powerful, even though you may not know Grant personally, you get to know him through the podcast conversation. And I think that's powerful. I was leading a conversation with my Women Business Center mastermind earlier this morning and we were talking about the value of friendship and a peer group and all that.

50:55And they were talking about how knowing each other had challenged them to grow in ways that they just wouldn't have otherwise and just how powerful that is. And I think that's one of the great things that Grant brings to people he knows in person, but also people who follow him and follow his work and obviously listening to the show is being an example that is worth following. And I just love that. We need more of that in our world. I like that you're asking the question about fear when it comes to public speaking. Yeah. Not because it's only applicable to speaking, but it's a metaphor for life.

51:29Absolutely. And I think the single biggest barrier for most of us in terms of getting what we want is fear. Yep. And if we can somehow learn how to process fear in a powerful way and get past it, then literally anything's possible. You know, so many things are possible if we would just have that conversation with the person. You know, it's kind of like the first time I asked your mom out, you know, I was scared to death. I was trembling to do that. But boy, am I glad I did it. You know, here 48 years later now, we've been married for 46, but 48 years from our first date. And that was amazing. But I had to get past the fear.

52:12Well, you know what I think it is? I don't think you have to get past the fear. I think you have to learn to live with the fear. Yeah, or get to walk through it. To experience fear. Because I think so much of what we don't do in our lives is in an effort to avoid the feeling of fear because it's not a pleasant feeling. And when you can learn to let yourself experience it and do the thing that you want to do and that it doesn't have to go away for you to do that thing, that's freedom. Well, it's kind of why I also brought up the whole flying thing. I mean, I know that private airplanes are not everybody's jam or most people's jam.

52:44I don't have a private plane. and don't intend to. But I do think his story about overcoming the fear of that, because that would be scary. It would be very scary. It was one thing for me to fly with Grant when he was right there next to me. And I knew that at any point I got in trouble, Grant was there to take over. But if Grant had landed the plane and said to me, great, now it's your turn. Take her up and bring her back. I mean, I would have just been like - Quaking in your boots. Yeah, I wouldn't have done it. I would have bailed. So interesting. Well, hopefully this was as inspiring to you guys as it was to us.

53:15And if it was, and we hope it was, we would love for you to leave us a five-star review. And the reason is not our own vanity on that that we love hearing from you guys. We want more people to experience the double win. In fact, our company's mission is to make it nearly impossible for you not to get the double win. You got to know about it first. And this is one of the best ways to do that. So leave us a review, subscribe to the podcast, and that'll help us get in front of more people that need the double win. See you guys next week. Thank you.