Atheist Host CHALLENGED On His Sins During Interview

21:52So we go and we walk to, what they do is they gather in this big park area, hundreds and hundreds of them, and then they go and riot. So we met them before the riot. So we go there, and as I'm walking down the street with my team, they're following me. The Antifa heads are following me. And as I'm walking, I can hear them saying, one says to the other one, do you know who that is? And the other guy's like, no. And they said, do you not recognize his accent? This is what the Antifa heads are saying about me. Now, we'd only been there one time to share the gospel and it had traveled through the Antifa camp so that next time they all knew about us.

22:24And obviously they weren't very favorable towards us. But here's the amazing thing. It was like a biblical Old Testament story where the law brings confusion in the camp. There were hundreds of them and they just suddenly started dispersing in different directions. They were meant to be rioting and they just started going everywhere. So we were there as a team ready to share with them and they just all dispersed. So we went up to them and said, where are you going? And one lady was like, we don't know what's going on tonight. Now let me tell you this, in the 120 whatever it was nights consecutive, that was the only night there was no riots.

22:53Only that night. I think tank guy came on the next day and he's like, we don't know what happened last night. We can't understand what happened. There was no riots at all. The Lord had shown me that if I go and pray, he'd shown me to go and pray and he would intervene. And the day after that, somebody got shot and was murdered. But in that one night, it was a chance where the Lord was able to bring some hope and we were able to share with people. But that was a very answer to your question. That was a very crazy time. And then I don't know if you heard about the CHOP zone in Seattle. Did you ever hear about this?

23:22It was like an autonomous zone that Antifa took over. where they kicked out the police from the precinct in Seattle. It was like crazy, crazy thing, right? And it was literally like people just running riots. It was like something out of a movie. So we went in there and shared there. You know, you got people just walking up, knocking people out. Do you know what I mean? Like just crazy stuff, man. So we went in there and actually baptized people, led people to the law right in the middle of Carl Anderson Park was like the HQ of it all. So that was intense. So for me, the most intense experiences have been for me in the US.

23:54Have you ever come under attack yourself? No. I mean, I've had some, you know, some kind of moments, but not quite. Not quite. No, no. And if I'm honest, I always feel like, you know, the peace of the Lord. I mean, the closest I came was when a bar owner in Northern Ireland was going to headbutt me. He got in my face, was screaming at me, threatening me and was about to headbutt me. That was my most intense moment. You know, it was in a very sketchy area in Northern Ireland where I used to live. I went into these bars that were very full of like, you know, gangsters and crazy folks. And the Lord told me to go to the bar.

24:26And when I was there, the owner come in my face and screaming at me like, I'm going to kill you. I'm going to kill you. And he said to me, why are you here? He was screaming at me, why are you here? And I said, Jesus sent me. I couldn't think of anything. I said, Jesus sent me. And as I said, Jesus, he moved his head away as if there was a force stronger than me stopping him. Long story short, me and that guy became friends. he opened up his bar the darkest bar in the whole community opened it up to me said you can bring church to my bar and I brought my church team and the worship team came in I shared the gospel in that place oh fair play that was the Lord stepping in saying hey lads that's enough easy to it's like the invisible doorman yeah invisible doorman exactly you don't want to mess with this doorman and as far as fear is concerned I mean because most people wouldn't want to go anywhere near the places you go least of all sort of being as vocal as you are.

25:18Are you fearless by default? Is it the Scouser in you? You're pretty fearless lot. Or do you feel like you're protected by Jesus? Yeah, definitely. I mean, I definitely wouldn't want to go to some of these places by myself and with my own confidence for sure. But I feel definitely emboldened by the Lord. And also I feel like what Jesus did for me when he went to the cross for me, right? I'm like, what could I do for him? There's nothing that's going to come close. This is God in skin hanging on a tree for me, right? There's nothing that whatever I do is not going to come close to that. So for me, it kind of, you know, I want to do whatever I can do to reach people.

25:52And yeah, I mean, I'll go wherever I can go to reach people really. As a great analogy, think of a scarecrow. You know, a scarecrow, right, is there to do what it says in the tin, it scares crows. But for the smart crow, it's a billboard, right? That scarecrow is advertising to the crows, come here if you want if you want the precious stuff. Because the scarecrow is trying to keep the crows away. And the devil does that. What the devil does, he goes into dark areas and he tries to steal God's treasures. And he tries to stop the Christians from coming close. And he keeps them away through fear.

26:25But really, that's the Lord's precious ones. Often, they're hidden in the darkness. And it's going to take somebody to go on and to rescue them and bring them back. I mean, it's only fair we give him the nod he deserves because he also tries to help Dorothy get to Oz. Now, you've asked me about my sins Let's talk about a few of yours How long you got? Confession time, talk to me about your sins Has there ever been drink, drugs, sex, violence, porn, exploitation Who were you before you found God? Why did you find God? But talk about your sins Yeah, I mean, I got mixed up in From a young age, I got mixed up in drugs and alcohol In a bad way I mean, I was kind of, I guess I was about 15 at the time and I started dabbling.

27:13I mean, alcohol was in my family. I've lost my cousin, age 33. I watched him die of alcoholism in the hospital. That's young. Yeah, very young. Yeah, yeah. And, you know, he's in the family, right? McNamara, my lineage is brawlers, you know, Irish. My granddad was a bare knuckle boxer. So, you know, brawlers, womanizers, alcoholics. You know, I'm the first Christian in my family. There's no Christians at all in my family. we have no lineage or heritage of Christianity. You know, my family members, some of them have been in prison. My dad was a career criminal for many years. So this is kind of the heritage that I had, you know what I mean?

27:46That's interesting, you've been a career criminal. Yeah, yeah. So this is kind of where I came from, right? Is he ashamed of you when he looks at you? No, no, he's... And he's kind of like, you know, my dad's just a bit of a geezer, right? He was just out doing what he's doing. You know, he's just trying to get by, right? But for me, it was, you know, so that was my environment. So alcohol was a big part of my life, growing up, going to mass with the family, and then everyone goes to the pub and gets drunk as a kid, right? That's what I saw. So my introduction to Christianity was hypocrisy. It looked like, let's all go to mass, look at our watch and be bored, and then go and get drunk, right?

28:17So that was my only awareness as a kid, really. So for me, alcoholism was always an issue, and then from a young age I started drinking, and that led to cocaine, and then that was a slippery slope for sure, yeah. And Charlie was your drug of choice. That was my drug of choice. I mean, obviously, ecstasy, all the stuff, right, in the party days. I was a party guy, so I loved the atmosphere of being out in the bars and the clubs and all that. But I was in a boy band, obviously. I was in the music scene, so that was interesting to marry those two. Because on one side, my friend from school was a drug dealer that began to climb the criminal ranks in the underworld in Liverpool, which put me into the rooms of the Scouse Mafia, as they call them.

28:54So I ended up being in rooms with notorious Liverpool criminals that actually became friends with some of these guys. But I wasn't like the kingpin in the room. like a lot of these guys were, I was the musician. So you'd find me in the corner with a guitar jamming out with some of these guys, right? So they always liked me, you know what I mean? But then I kind of developed a punch-on for cocaine, which was not good because I was with people that had a lot of cocaine, and that began to sort of grow. So I had the music thing going on, and then I had this other life where I was mixing with gangsters and taking a lot of drugs and, you know, living a hedonistic lifestyle.

29:24And then those two began to sort of collide. Those two worlds began to collide. Prostitutes? No, I never did that, no. No, if I'm honest, I mean, I kind of, I didn't have that much trouble getting the ladies, but back in the day I was outgoing and, you know, so I always felt comfortable with, you know, pulling the girls. So, I mean, I definitely had a desire for women and I definitely, you know, I definitely indulged in that for sure. How many women have you fucked? A lot, but I don't know. I lost count. I mean, if I'm honest, those years of my life were, it was like blackouts. Do you know what I mean?

29:55I would drink a lot. I'd take a lot of drugs. So it was just, it goes with the territory, right? when you're living that kind of lifestyle. It's just whatever goes, you know? I mean, I'd have expected you to have fucked a lot of women. You're a good-looking guy, especially if you can play the guitar and sing. I mean, that's the whole thing right there. It's the whole package. How heavy was your cocaine habit? Because I know just how easy you can go from in the kitchen, fighting for airtime, to then sitting in a dark room on your own, looking through the letterbox, jumping at every single noise that you make.

30:26It's not enjoyable. And then you do more because you think is going to make you feel better, and it has a reverse effect. So how heavy was your habit, and how quick did it spiral out of control, and how long did it go on for? Yeah, so it definitely spiraled out of control very quickly, and then, because I had a lot of access to it, right, and then, I mean, I was getting up in the morning and snorting cocaine for breakfast, you know, so it was like that. Oh, it was a proper habit. Yeah, yeah, so it was like, you know, all day. It was, you know, it got to that point where I'd get up in the morning and snort for breakfast, do you know what I mean?

30:52So it definitely got very, very heavy, yeah, and, yeah, I mean, it almost killed me on two occasions, So it was bad, you know what I mean? It was three years in its intensity. And thank the Lord he rescued me from it. But it almost took me out twice. And that addiction, when you look back, what outside problems did it cause? Who else did it affect? Who else did it hurt? What other destruction comes with a cocaine addiction? Yeah. Because it isn't just you that suffers. In fact, it's probably the user that suffers the least. Yeah, definitely. Yeah, I mean, in my world at that time, I mean, I was in a boy band, right?

31:28So obviously my friends would come in, my band members would come in. The drama was upset. They weren't happy with me. But they would come in and find my stash and they would like throw it away. You know what I mean? And they actually, my boy band members, they went to the local church, right? And they told the local church that my mum was from, sort of connected. You know, I was connected loosely. I went there as a kid and they knocked on the door and said, look, this guy's killing himself. You've got to help him. so my friends my band members who were atheists they didn't believe in God but they went to the local church to tell them look you've got to help this guy's killing himself you know so I mean it was sparring out of control that way and even the alcoholism I remember doing a gig we you know in the boy band days we did a gig it was like the old yesteryear and then the the kind of band of tomorrow it was Wayne Fontana and the Mindbenders they did a groovy kind of love they had a hit with that and a few other songs so we were in this hotel very fancy hotel and I was like in the in the fountain of like, you know, as you drive in, right, you've got this big fancy fountain.

32:26I'm peeing in the fountain of this place. I'm just out of it. And the lead singer came to my band and said, your boy's got a drink problem. Do you know what I mean? He's got an addiction problem, right? So it was beginning to spill over into my music and into kind of my lifestyle with music as well. And that's when it began to sort of affect a lot of things. Have you ever sniffed cocaine in a church? No, I haven't sniffed it in a church, no. Did you ever have a quick swig of brandy in a church? No, because I never really went to church. Oh, so when you was in the heart of your addiction, the church took a back seat.

32:58Yeah, I mean, I never really went to church. I only went to church as a kid because my mum was a believer. My mum became a believer after my mum and dad split. So she found the Lord and had a real big encounter with the Lord. So I would go with her, but as soon as I was old enough to not want to go, I didn't go. So I didn't really go to church, right? It was just kind of like after that I decided that I would start going there. after I had my encounter with the Lord. As soon as we're talking about music, you just said the word believer. The monkeys, I'm a believer. Is that related to religion at all?

33:27I mean, a lot of songs have connotation, right? I mean, you know, I think if anyone with half a brain, you know, if you think about it, how do we get here, right? Everyone's got a fingerprint that's unique. You know, no two people are the same. You know, I think if you use your mind, even a lot of atheists believe in intelligent design now, that someone's pulling their strings, right? If you look at the universe, Everything is held together in the perfect kind of dimension and balance. So I think, you know, I think even subconsciously people think about God, whether songwriters or, you know, poets or whatever, right?

33:59I mean, some of the greatest minds of all time, like Einstein, have had a faith in the Lord, you know what I mean? It's only now that we've really, really drifted off more than ever, I think, in these generations. Oh, yeah, we really have drifted off. This is why I'm pro-Christianity. I know there's, I think there's thousands of gods in there that you could choose to pray to. But Christianity is, this is our heritage, our roots, our belief system. So I'm all for it to come back and heavy because there's a lot of lost souls out there. They need direction. They need a roadmap. They need the Ten Commandments because a lot of them aren't following any.

34:34They're just sort of floating around like a leaf in a breeze. And it's sad to see a lot of men are afraid to be men now. And I think maybe if they believed in themselves, Maybe start by believing in something else to realise that, you know, you're probably better and stronger than you think you are. You're not downtrodden. But let's move on to New Year's Eve 2001. Pinnacle moment in your life? Talk me through that. Yeah, definitely. Big moment in my life. I mean, I've been struggling, obviously, with drugs, alcohol. Like you said, you know, it always goes down, right? It starts off, it's party time, it's the ladies, it's fun.

35:08and then it ends up with a guy sat in his bedroom, you know, snorting his life away, right? So I think for everybody, it ends up in that low point at some stage. And for me, it definitely came to that, you know, sitting in a garage with a friend of mine, snorting coke all night, right? Talking gibberish and trying to solve the world's problems. But I'll tell you one thing that's really interesting. You just made me jog my memory. I remember sitting with some notorious gangsters. I won't name them, but you would have heard of them. And I was sat there in Liverpool, I remember. And I remember as a kid, just like high off my face, on cocaine, talking about God.

35:40And it's interesting, right? Because the Lord marks your heart from an early age. I was, my first encounter with God, I was 15 at a youth event. My brother was in, in Borstal and he got released age 18 and I was 15. And we went to this conference with my, my mom invited us in Ireland. We sat in the back row and I'm rolling up bits of paper and throwing them at people's heads, right? We were like, me and my brother were like the naughty kids, you know? And this preacher has about a hundred kids in the room. This preacher said, God wants you. And he pointed at me and I felt something inside and I literally fell to the floor and began weeping.

36:09and he came up to me about 30 minutes later, I was just weeping on the floor, turned around, everybody's gone. He said, that's God showing himself to you. It was crazy because the night before, I said to my mom and her friend, if God's so real, why doesn't he show himself to me? 24 hours later, I'm on my knees weeping, right? Which wasn't in my how to get the girls playbook. You know, me and my brother are trying to pull the girls, right? And I'm weeping on the floor and I feel for the first time in my life, I feel real love. I feel this pure love. And that was the beginning of my journey. That was age 15.

36:37I didn't follow the Lord. because I wanted music and I wanted, you know, stardom and all that, right? So I ignored it. But I remember being, you know, being in that party and still talking about Jesus because I couldn't shake that experience. So it's just interesting how these things stay with you, you know? This episode is brought to you by Palmolive. Family time isn't just the big moments. It's weeknight dinners, sitting around the table, everyone talking all at once. So when the plates are empty and the sink is full, use Palmolive Ultra. Palmolive's most powerful formula removes up to 99.9 % of grease, leaving your dishes sparkling clean.

37:12And the new convenient pump makes cleaning even easier, so you can spend less time tackling dishes and more time together. Shop now at palmolive.com. From athletic stuff like a full-court pickup game, swish, to athletic-ish stuff like a half-mile stroll. Get those steps in. Head to Sierra or Sierra.com for the brands you want at the prices that let you do it all. From athletic to athletic, Sierra's got it. Are you sure that just weren't a decent bit of Charlie? No, it was something that was like, it was something that was coming up, you know what I mean? Something I felt like I had to talk about, you know?

37:46So all that to say, that led me to that New Year's Eve experience, which was like life changing. So I had one before that, one moment before that. I was out in a club in Liverpool and it was about four in the morning. I was always the last one out at the party. And I'm wandering the streets of Liverpool early hours in the morning, off me face. And I picked a fight with three lads. And they began like banging my head on metal bars. They were jumping up and down on my head. And I'm thinking, I'm going to die here. I couldn't get up off the ground. Whenever my friend would pull one off, the other one would come on.

38:13And they would just keep jumping up and down and killing me, right? And I literally felt like I'm going to die. And I look over and there was a car because I heard a voice. The voice said, stop, that's enough. And the guy stopped hitting me. I looked over from the floor. There was a car in the distance with two figures in the car. It was quite a ways away, you know, as Americans say, quite a ways away. and I heard, we heard this voice said, stop, that's enough. The guys left and walked away and I believe that was an angelic presence because I don't know how those voices would have been heard from such a distance, but whatever happened, they left me and I ended up in hospital with a brain scan, having a brain scan.

38:45My head was out here and they could have killed me that night, you know, that was before what happened in New Year's Eve. That was before that experience. So I had a couple of moments that led me to that moment. So 2001, that is when you completely convert and you surrender yourself to Christianity. you then went and preached on the streets in Northern Ireland for three years every day. That's some commitment. Yeah, yeah. What compelled you to do that? And how did the Irish receive that? Yeah, yeah. Can I tell you, sorry, I didn't answer your question about the New Year's Eve experience. Can I tell you that real quick?

39:19Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because that was like the pivotal moment for me, you know, because the one with the fight out before. So New Year's Eve. You went off on a tangent. Sorry, sir. I do that sometimes. You confuse me. Sorry. So what happened was a friend of mine, he gave me 500 pounds worth of pure cocaine. And he gave me this big bag of cocaine. I woke my friend up and I said, okay, I'd come back from a night out in town. My friend was sleeping. I said, right, let's go party time, right? I've got this bag of drugs. We're going to get on it. So I woke my friend up and we invited a few people around and turned into a party.

39:4820 minutes or so in, my friend ODs in front of me. The guy that I'd woke up, right? He lived with me at the time. He was like my housemate. He started foaming at the mouth, convulsing, and he basically died in my arms. I held him as his eyes rolled to the back of his head and he died in my arms. So he got taken off in an ambulance dead. And I stood in that street and I watched the ambulance drive away and I began to convulse. Same thing started happening with me. It was just too pure cocaine and my high turned upside down. And I had a high tolerance for cocaine. There was a guy, very well-known gangster in Liverpool.

40:17He said, I've never seen anyone take as much cocaine as Scott. And he was a heavy cocaine addict. So I had a very high tolerance for it. But I guess it flipped me. Watching what happened to him flipped my high, right? And I literally felt like I was going to die. I then see the gate to hell ahead in the distance. It was like this dark abyss. It was like an entry point to this darkness. And I could feel under my skin, this fear like I'd never felt before. And I'm suddenly moving towards this entry point. Like I'm on a treadmill that doesn't end. At speed, I'm thinking I've got about 60 seconds and I'm going to be in this dark abyss.

40:47And I prayed, God, keep me alive. Keep Stephen alive, my friend. And I'll turn to you. That was my prayer. Please keep us alive and I'll turn to you. I begged for my life. Stephen gets resuscitated in the ambulance and I get through it. But I literally come to the edge, the precipice of eternity. It's like I'm dangling, one foot hanging over. I came that close. And it was as if somebody was holding me and stopping me from going into that place. And it was like the worst night of my life. But you know what? That was my moment, right? And the next day, I carried on with my life. Like, forget God, right?

41:22I'm okay. I can breathe. I'm good, right? So I remember I was seeing this girl on and off at the time, this beautiful blonde girl. I was with her on and off and she came round, but I didn't want to be intimate with her because I felt unclean. As soon as I started getting with her, I felt unclean. It was weird and I couldn't do it. Why? Honestly, I believe God was keeping me to my promise. I said, if you keep us alive, I'll turn to you. So it was almost like something inside of me knew that, like I said, the gift of repentance, right? You've got to know what's wrong. But why wouldn't God want you having sex with women?

41:54Well, I mean, the Bible says no sex before marriage, right? So sex is something pure for the marriage bed. So it was something that I was doing, but, you know, first time in my life, I guess, I was having this revelation that, hey, I shouldn't be doing this, even though that was something that was part of my lifestyle. So that was the beginning of it. Within a couple of months, I ended up in a place where I gave my life to Jesus. I was invited to a New Year conference, which was a New Year's Eve thing, because it just, you know, just preceded that, right? I end up in this event. I sit outside.

42:24I didn't even go in the conference and I felt this love wash over me. It was in that moment that I surrendered everything to Jesus. I began to weep and wail. I'm not even in the conference. I'm outside. But I felt this love washing over me. And before it happened, I felt like I was in a tug of war. I was being pulled into this place of peace and happiness. And then I would go back to a place of fear and kind of death almost, right? Darkness. And I felt this revelation, you've got to choose what you want. So I said, okay, God, you know, inside he just said, God, you can have my life. I didn't even speak, right?

42:54And it was like somebody cut the rope and I was free. And I began to just cry. Three people came out of the conference to see me. And the door opened because they heard me cry. And I looked up and I could see beams of light coming out these men's eyes. As I looked at them, they were like beams of light protruding from their eyes. And it was that time I realized I was blind, but now I see what the Bible says, right? And I was different from that moment on. That's where it changed. Wow. Is God the greatest love of your life? Yes. Okay. Is there anything about God that you dislike or you would criticize?

43:28Or is he perfect in your eyes? He's perfect. He's perfect in every way. And yeah, I mean, even in my own experience, right? I mean, I can give you the biblical answer, but I can give you my own answer. My own answer, 25 years I've been following Jesus. He's never let me down. He's always been faithful. So here's the love of my life. I mean, that night for me that I just described was my epiphany. It was like falling in love in a way that I never had before, you know? And it was just pure. It was beautiful. And that love has only increased. And Jesus became more real to me than anyone has ever been.

44:01He's loved me more than anyone ever has. So I've never known a love like his love. Are you married? Yes, married with four kids. Do you love God more than you love your wife and your kids? I actually do. I do, you know, but I didn't know you were meant to, right? The Bible says that. Jesus said we're meant to love him more, but I didn't know this. I just knew that I felt it before I knew the Bible. I knew that I feel more love for him than anyone else, right, in my world. But Jesus says that, right? He says that I want to be, you know, I should be number one in your life. Because, you know, he made us.

44:31What would your wife and children think about that comment? They're okay with it. You know, they're okay with it. They know earthly, you know, people on earth, right, they're most important to me. But they know that God is number one and they're okay with that. And do they share the same affection towards God as you do? Yeah, I mean, I met my wife at London Bible College. So after all my experience in Liverpool, two years old believer, I went to London Bible College and that's where I met my wife. She was from Northern Ireland and I met her there. So does your wife love God more than she loves you?

45:03Yeah, yeah. I'm totally happy that she loves him more than me. I mean, he deserves to be loved more than me. He's better than me, right? He made her, he died for her. You know, I didn't die for her. So only Jesus died for us, right? So I think, you know, his love to us is greater than any human love. So you believe that when you die, you're going to meet God? Yeah, 100%. Yeah. What are you going to say to him when you meet him? High five, touch knuckles, cuddle him? I mean, probably fall on my feet and worship him and thank him for... Saving you. Saving me, but allowing a screw up like me to get to live this life I've got.

45:33I mean, I really kind of, in a sense, feel I'm on borrowed time because I think I should have died that night. You know, me and my friend, without the grace of God, I wouldn't be here talking to you right now. I'm 25 years over what, you know, what, in a sense, I should have had. And every day I want to give to the Lord. You know, I want to give it back to him because he's given it to me. I'm glad you didn't die. I make light about religion a lot of the time as well, especially if I'm having conversations about it, because to me it's alien. But I do believe the world needs more men like you. I think you're a very, very good man, just in case you think I'm being flippant with some of my questions.

46:07But they are questions that people are going to be thinking because a lot of people don't believe. A lot of people are on the fence. What's that, agnostic? Agnostic, yeah. Yeah, a lot of people are agnostic now, and I think Christianity, there's a bit of a resurgence there. And, I mean, I'm fascinated by the whole thing. What was your take on the life of Brian before and after your conversion? The life of Brian the movie? Yeah. Yeah, you know, it's a funny question, though. I mean, my dad used to watch it, right, because my dad, you know, obviously Irish Catholics are blaspheming, and you can go around the house, every other word's a blasphemous word, right?

46:36So I was raised in that environment. So that was always on. But as a believer, never watched it, and never something I felt was honourable towards the Lord. So that kind of stuff, yeah. I mean, I'm pretty strict on what I bring in the eyes, you know what I mean? Because, you know, I want to honour the Lord in everything I do, you know what I mean? And obviously I've got, you know, grace for people who don't know Jesus, you know what I mean? I don't mind how people talk or whatever, do you know what I mean? But it's just for me personally, you know? And Monty Python, obviously, writing, producing and acting in the life of Brian, which is a bit of a mockery of Christianity.

47:11do you think they deserve to be executed for that? No, I mean, they don't know what they're doing, right? Whether Jesus said when he died on the cross, he said, forgive them, Father, they don't know what they do. So, I mean, you know, we don't know what we're doing wrong until the Lord illuminates our conscience, right? And then we have that gift of repentance and we realise, man, I shouldn't have done that. We get to see our sins in the light of his holiness, you know, and I think that's a revelation that the Lord brings, but he brings that revelation through the message of the gospel, you know?

47:38It's a shame that those Islamists that went on that massacre spree in France at Charlie Hebdo headquarters didn't adopt your attitude. Let people have a laugh and a joke. Not everyone has to take religion so seriously. As long as it brings you spiritual comfort, fine. But I don't believe religion's above mockery. Do you? I mean, I personally wouldn't choose to mock. I mean, I don't think there's anything what Jesus has done that deserves mockery when he's laid down his life for us. But again, people don't know what they're doing, right? and the Lord is gracious, he's kind. I mean, I know the life I lived, you know, was hedonistic, debauched lifestyle, but the Lord, he was there every day with his arms open wide.

48:16So, you know, he showed me grace and he extends that grace to every human being, you know. You're a good man. So are you. I appreciate that. Northern Ireland. Sorry. You preached on the streets for three years solid. How did that go down? Did you get a warm reception? Did people get pissed off with seeing you, hearing you? Did you get asked to move on, leave, shut up? How did it go? Yeah, I mean, it changed my life. The experience of Northern Ireland changed my life. I was employed by a local church. They said, we're going to bring you in for six months. And, you know, we've got some funding for six months, right?

48:50I mean, I was getting very, very little money. I was living in my overdraft. But I left my job to take on this six-month position at a local church. They said, all we want you to do is stand on a street every day. And our desire, our dream is that you could bring one person to the Lord every day. Now, we'd never seen anything like this at the time, right? People coming to Jesus on a street in a matter of minutes. Like we just didn't know about this in our community. It didn't happen. So anyway, I went there and I shared. And within two weeks, I heard the voice of God. He said to me, think of everybody like an apple on a tree.

49:21And I was like, okay. Like I heard this revelation. When you share, I'll shake. So everyone's an apple. The Bible says that we are the apple of his eye, the most precious thing. And what he was saying to me is just share the message, right? Like I told you before, I can't save anybody. Just share and let me shake people's lives. So that's what I began to do. I began to share. And then he gave me, obviously, Jesus at the door as a way of articulating the gospel message in a quite speedy fashion. So I began to share that message. And people began, those apples proverbially began to fall. And many people came to Christ.

49:53And it was incredible. My wife and I opened our home because a lot of these guys, honestly, right, I was reaching guys that most Christians would cross the road when they see them coming. you know guys in gangs drug dealers things like that they're the guys i was going for um to share with because i don't believe that they have ever been shared with and then they became they began to come to the lord we opened up our home and brought them into our home once a week we started a new believers group and it became like a family we had like uh over 300 people come through the doors of our home our church our church grew 45 in the first two years and row after row was being filled with the craziest people from our community and they found a family with us, you know, and it got to the point where I had a chief police inspector.

50:33He stopped me in Starbucks. He said, what you guys are doing has affected the crime rates in the city. I had a psychologist come to me again in a cafe and would say, some of your guys I've had on my books for years. I couldn't help him. And I'm seeing a transformation in their life. I had a local GP. He said people came to him and he'd give them, you know, write them a script for medication and all. So they would come to me for years. I started saying to him, go and see Scott and ask him to pray for you on the street. The GP would send people to me on the street for people so I could pray for these people.

51:04So it was beautiful, yeah. Planned there was advocate. Jesus at the door. That could be considered ramming religion down people's throats. Yeah. Is that a fair comment? Could be considered that way. Yeah. And is it, I mean, you've obviously got a very good success rate and I can see why because you're a very charming man and you believe, you're convincing because there's no doubt in your mind at all. I know that. But is it not best for people to find religion by themselves? Yeah, I think it's, you know, if people don't hear, if they never hear the message, right, how can they respond? So I think Jesus said, go into all the world and make disciples of all nations, right?

51:43Go into all the world, tell them the good news. So he commanded us as believers, you know, this is the one thing I want you to do, every believer. You know, many believers don't do it, right? I was looking at the stats. I think 50 % of Christians in the UK don't believe evangelism is a good idea, right? Which is kind of crazy because Jesus commanded every believer, go and tell them. He did all the hard work. And now he's like, you know, I did the work on the cross. Now he's like, no, please go and tell them, right? I want everybody to have the opportunity to hear this message. So for me, it's a case of like, we've been told to share and we have to share.

52:17And if we believe the truth that there's a devil, right? There's a devil who doesn't like you, and he wants Liam far from the arms of Jesus. He doesn't mind you even believing, but he doesn't want you receiving. So the job of the church is to go into all the world and share this good news. So for me, I'm very passionate about doing that. I think we have to do that, yeah. And shoving it down their throats, I mean, there's different ways you can approach this thing, right? What I choose to do is partner with the Lord, and I'm like, Lord, you show me who do you want me to talk to, and I let him lead.

52:46That's kind of the way I do it. rather than like, hey, you're going to hear what I've got to say, kind of trying to force you to digest it. So we get a lot of Islamic prayer on the streets en masse at the moment. Hundreds of Muslims praying on the street in the capital of our country where they've got many, many mosques to do so, and they've got their own homes to do that. What's your view on that? I mean, my view on that is one thing I would say the church could learn a lot, right? You know, when I travel around, I travel internationally, I see Mormons, I see Jehovah's Witnesses, Muslims, whoever it may be, out in the communities showing what they believe to be a bit more, you know, they're taking it to the street, let's just put it that way, whereas a lot of the Christians are kind of in the buildings.

53:32So whether it be Muslim, Jehovah Witness, Mormon, you know, they're getting out there because I guess they're trying to proselytize, they're trying to advance their message or what they believe. But I think the church can learn from that in terms of we need to be doing the same, right? But the difference is what we have is the truth. And Jesus said the truth will set you free. So if I was going to look at Islam or Hinduism or whatever it may be, right, any of the five major faiths, the difference between any of those is that we have a God who came back to life. We have a God who beat death. And Jesus, what separates Jesus from any prophet, philosopher, teacher, is that he said, I'm God.

54:10And he proved it because no one's ever defeated death. Jesus came back and over 40 days, over 500 people witnessed his resurrection and they didn't find his body to this day, right? Because he's alive and he ascended into heaven. So for me, that's what separates a Christian. So surely we should go and share this message. We shouldn't be keeping it in a building. We should be taking it to the world, right? So why are Muslims doing what they're doing? And do I agree with it? Well, all I would say is that the church needs to step up and we need to bring the truth because I believe this. If you line a Christian up, let me tell you this story.

54:45You'll love this one. My friend was a European Thai boxing champion. And he came, I came to Jesus and our other friend became a Muslim within weeks. Now we were out like, you know, taking drugs together, partying and all stuff like this. And then within weeks, I became a Christian and our other friend became a Muslim. So my friend, Stephen, he's like, what the heck is going on here? You know, my two friends are out, we're out living the life, going crazy. Suddenly I've got a Christian and a Muslim. What's all this about? So he said this. He said, I want you two, I'm going to put you two in a room.

55:16I'm going to shut the door and we're not leaving until I find out which one is true. Okay. So I'm like, okay, let's go. Right. So I began praying. I'm like, Lord, let's go. You know, I need you to move here. I want you to show both of these guys that you're the true God and this kind of thing. Okay. So we get in the room, D-Day comes, the showdown, we get in the room and Stephen's like, okay, both of you, I want you to tell me your story. So he shares and I share. And I turned around to my friend who became Muslim. I said, do you know where you're going to go when you die? Because I know, I didn't used to know, but I have 100 % certainty that when I die, I'm going to go be with Jesus in heaven.

55:51And he started to cry. He said, no, I don't know. He said, I'm actually afraid of death. He said, and what I do is actually go to a mountain sometimes. I've started going to this mountain to get away from the world because there's so many temptations that I can't choose the right thing. I keep making mistakes and I'm scared of dying. Now, this guy was crazy. He was a gangster, this guy, who became a Muslim, right? Very, very feared, very well known from Toxteth in Liverpool. He was the kind of guy like, I've been with him, he walked to the front of a queue and said, we're getting in here. Do you know who I am kind of thing?

56:20You know, this kind of guy, right? Suddenly he's crying because he's scared of going to hell and I'm not. And my friend had a revelation. He could see what was the truth and what wasn't. You see, the difference with Christ is that he defeated death and now he gives you eternal life as a gift because he holds death in his hand. Death couldn't, even death he defeated, right? so the truth will set you free. So in answer to your question, it doesn't matter how many Muslims or Hindus or Jehovah's Witnesses are out there. The church needs to come with the truth and offer Christ. This episode is brought to you by Palmolive.

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57:30Get those steps in! And for morning hikes up the mountain trail, good pace! It's a nighttime ghost choice from the camping chair. What a twist. Whatever level of active, Sierra loves it all. Head to Sierra or Sierra.com for the brands you want at the prices that let you do it all. From athletic to athletic, Sierra's got it. How do you picture heaven? Do you picture it with duck feather duvets and foot massages and grapes? How do you vision heaven being like? Great question. You have some great questions, my friend. And then I have to tell you, I just want to commend you. You're great at what you do too.

58:09And I think, you know, you're very warm. You're genuine. You're not trying to come with an agenda. So I just want to commend you, what you do as well. Handsome. Handsome as well. Thank you. Yeah. And the hairstyles, I mean, the best. On point. Okay, on point. It's the bold anointing, right? Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. I mean, I don't know. Honestly, I don't know. It's one of those questions that I think about. Should you know? I mean, biblically, right? We only have what we know biblically, which is open to interpretation. All I can think of, I used to be a songwriter. So I wrote a song once and it says, I'd rather sleep on the streets under the hallelujah skies.

58:48You see, I was talking about, people talk about mansions and crowns and stuff like this in the church, right? I wonder if I work really hard, people that have this mindset of like, maybe I'll get a mansion because the Bible talks about mansions and crowns and stuff. But I don't want a crown and I don't want a mansion. I'd rather sleep on the streets. I just want to be with Jesus. That's it for me, right? If I can be close to him, whenever I feel his presence, I just cry like a baby because I've never felt a love like I feel when I feel the presence of God. It's so beautiful. I've seen a hit piece on you calling you a homophobic because you've marched through Soho.

59:24I think it was the Daily Express. Yeah, Daily Mail, I think. Or the Daily Mail. I knew it was the Daily... Yeah, yeah, yeah. The Daily... of some description. So I know that you've been perceived as a homophobe. And what else do you get called? Right wing, homophobe? Right wing, homophobe. I'm sure being with you here today, people have a lot to write about me. What are you trying to say, Scott? You've got a lot of haters too, right? A lot of haters too. I think anyone that seeks the truth, you are going to accumulate a few people that dislike you because a lot of people want to keep the truth suppressed because it exposes them.

59:59Yeah, and it's really sad. I mean, I reposted something about the UTK event last summer and, you know, I was due to speak at a church weeks later and they canceled my engagement because I reposted something about the UTK event from Orlando, right? And so it's really sad that people have these kind of opinions where for me, you know, I don't want to talk about this, but for me looking at Tommy or what they're doing, you know, I see a brother in Christ and that I want to love and support, you know. So, yeah, there's definitely a lot of people that don't like what we do. And honestly, I think the homophobic thing, homophobic slur has been a huge one in the UK around me, around King's Army, which is crazy, right?

1:00:38Because, you know, we went to Soho. We've been there many times. The only difference this time is that the turning point chose to repost it, getting 2.8 million views on Twitter. And then it kind of opened the floodgates. So I'm not homophobic. I mean, I have love for everybody. I don't care what they do. You know, I have a Christ-like love for them, but I do want them to hear the truth. But we weren't, you know, we don't go around targeting gay people in any way, you know? I'm surprised Turning Point endorsed that message about you. No, they didn't. Sorry, they didn't endorse it. What they did, they posted us sharing the gospel.

1:01:11Oh, I see. Yeah. And then basically it was twisted down off the back of that. That's what happened. Oh, okay. Well, that makes sense because Turning Point also have a lot of enemies. Yeah. And so just exactly who are and what is King's Army? Yeah, so King's Army is a group of evangelists. Okay, so first of all, because Turning Point, you know, they'd called us activists. So we're not activists, we're evangelists. And we're people who come together in various ways around the world to kind of take the message of Christ. And obviously, so it's an evangelistic movement of individuals who want to be better at sharing the gospel, making disciples, and the mentality of a soldier of Christ, right?

1:01:50It's kind of something we used to use in the yesteryear in church history, this idea of onward Christian soldiers, the Salvation Army. It's kind of bringing that back a little bit, right, just to kind of help the church step up a little bit and be a little bit more focused in our evangelistic endeavours, shall I say. And British Christianity, is it weak in your eyes? Yeah, I think we've got to do better, huh? I think we've got to stop hiding away in churches. I mean, obviously, there's a resurgence. So I think things are happening. I'm seeing a lot more, even over this past couple of years, the church is leaving the building for sure.

1:02:25But I think the church needs to remember who we are. You see, the Bible says that our lives are not our own. You know, like Jesus, he purchased us, right? We belong to him and we need to remember that. You know, we can't be living like we get to do what we want to do because we can't. You know, when we come to Christ, you surrender your life. And I think the church needs to remember that. Jesus didn't call us to sit in nice warm buildings and have holy huddles. You know, if we look at the lineage and the heritage of Christianity, we had, you know, people sawn in half, put in boiling oil, burnt at the stake, skinned alive, crucified upside down.

1:03:05You know, this is the heritage, right? Roman candles, Christians were burnt alive like torches, right, in these Roman days. That is what Christians went through, fed to the lions. You know, that's what we have. And I'm sure they would turn in their grave if they could look at some of the church today because we've created a holy huddle environment, this kind of middle class holy huddle where all we have to do is go to church, tick that Sunday box. And it's kind of crazy, right? When we look at, well, I mean, look at what Jesus did and look at what all the disciples gave their life for what they believed in.

1:03:38And we've resorted to this kind of like watered down, weak Christianity, which is not biblical. Do you think people are afraid to speak about Jesus out loud, certainly in public? I mean, I saw a woman online get arrested for standing somewhere. And they said, what are you doing here? And she said, I'm praying. And then she said, well, I'm just praying in my mind. So do you know the clip I mean? I saw it praying in my head. She's praying in her head. Outside the abortion clinic, right? Yeah. and she got arrested for that. Yeah, crazy. So, I mean, how does that encourage people like yourself and other believers to want to speak out loud if they fear that they could get arrested?

1:04:17I mean, we don't see the Muslims praying on mass or preaching in the streets get arrested, but you get a singular female thinking about Jesus on the streets. And, I mean, there may be some more context that we miss, but the nuts and bolts of it is she's somewhere that the police didn't want her to be. She's sitting there in her own thoughts, thinking about God, probably trying to heal some pain from some previous trauma. And she's penalized for it. Yeah, I mean, the shocking thing is, I don't think there is much more to the story. We just had one recently, right? The guy who's preaching in the streets got arrested.

1:04:51So it's in Watford, I believe. So it's crazy, right? What's going on? I mean, here's the interesting thing with the early church. Whenever the church faces persecution, historically, it grows. so the lord allows persecution to grow the church the apostle paul saint paul the most influential christian ever lived right um apart from christ look look what he was doing he was going around murdering christians and trying to persecute the church and the lord met him while he was on his mission to to persecute the church he thought he was doing the right thing he thought they were you know a bunch of crazy people right so he was a religious man trying to you know bring the the the true meaning of God.

1:05:30And on that journey, the Lord met him. Jesus met him and he became the apostle. Paul became St. Paul. But it was in the persecution that the Lord chose to grow his church. And I think we're going to see the same thing here in England, right? But we need men and women with a bit of backbone who are going to be willing to listen to the voice of God, not listen to the voice of a secular society that would try and put the church in a box. You see, what society wants to do is put the church in a box and say you can come out on Sundays, but we don't want to hear from you the rest of the week. But we don't live by the laws of man.

1:06:04We live by the laws of God, right? Do you think King Charles is defending the church to the best of his ability? No. Any personal views on him and his conduct? I would say he needs to take a leaf out of his mother's book. And I think she was a beautiful woman of God. I think she kind of really represented a Christ-like life. And I think the royal family need to get back to their heritage. They need to come back to their roots. Yeah, I can't see her rubbing off on King Charles. I think it would have been done by now. I think we need to look for the future king will probably be a king more in our favour and a better defender of the church.

1:06:44And would you say that as an evangelist yourself and the king's army on a whole, would you say you were radical? Yeah, I think, I know, come on, I know radical is an interesting word, but yeah, I mean, I don't want to be anything but radical. I mean, look, for me, my life is a breath from hell, right? And I got saved, I got redeemed, and I want to use my life for the glory of the King. So I'm going to be radical while I've got breath in my lungs. And I know my message, I know what I want to share, I know why I'm here, and I'm going to do it in love, right? You know, I love people and God is love and I'm not here to hurt anybody or people get mistaken when they think of the King's Army, this bunch of radicals who are out to hurt people.

1:07:30But we're not. We're out to love people. You know what I mean? We're evangelists, not activists. And we do it. We share our message in love. But yeah, I mean, I'm going to be radical to the day I die because this is a message that I believe in. It saved my life. I've seen it save many others. I've got countless testimonies and stories of people's lives I can show you that were completely changed because of the resurrected Christ. And I'm going to keep sharing that message till I die. Do you feel a lot of pressure being the leader of the king's army? I mean, I want to do a good job for sure. You know, I want to do a good job before the king.

1:08:02That's Jesus, by the way, not Charles. I want to do a great job before the king. But also I want to make sure that I lead the people well, right? There's people who have come to be part of this movement, and I want to make sure that I honor them and encourage them. And that's definitely a responsibility that weighs on me for sure. But, I mean, the Lord asked me to do this. It wasn't my idea. I had a great revelation from the Lord. He told me to call it the King's Army. I was praying one day, and it came through the Lord. He spoke to me, said, I want you to call it the King's Army. And I want you to – he said, I'm raising up an army for the end times to push back darkness on the earth is what the Lord told me.

1:08:36So this army of believers, you know, I want to encourage them and help them in their mission for the Great Commission. Fine. Before I ask you your final question, I'm going to ask the audience to follow Scott. I'm going to put all of his links in the description. And as always, please like and subscribe to the channel so I can bring you these conversations. And I think what we'll do is we'll let Scott end with a prayer. and there'll be a thumbnail somewhere on the screen for you to click and enjoy another episode from The Dozen. So Scott, end it with a prayer. Thank you, sir. Yeah, Lord, we just thank you for this time together.

1:09:14I pray your blessing over Liam, over every viewer. Lord, I thank you that you know everyone who's going to watch this even before they do and we pray blessing over them. I pray, Lord, we pray for UK. We pray that you would continue to advance your gospel. We pray for the church, pray for boldness. Thank you that the righteous are as bold as a lion and I pray for a lion church to wake up in these days, Lord. And we just pray that you would shift things in our culture, Lord, that you would bring Christ back into the culture. And we thank you that Christ is king. And we pray, Lord, that you would begin to bring truth to the people of this nation.

1:09:47And we bless this nation in Jesus' name. Amen. Amen. Scott, I thoroughly enjoyed that and I thoroughly enjoy you. And I wish you nothing but greatness. You too. Bless you, sir. Good health, brother. Thank you.

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