Police EXPOSED | Ex-Met Officer on Two Tier Policing & Race Obsession: Paul Birch

0:00Monday on NBC. U.S. Marshall! All-new Line of Fire. The thrilling new crime drama. The world sees us as heroes, but they don't know what the job really costs. One family of federal agents. It's one thing to put yourself in danger. It's different when it's your family. Balances duty to their country. An assassin is still out there. Stop! And each other. How do you protect the world and the people you love at the same time? Every case hits home on Line of Fire. Monday on NBC. You fell in love at first crunch and now the crispy chicken crunch wrap slider is back at Taco Bell. But with a twist, it's crispy all white meat chicken nuggets inside a slider sized crunch wrap.

0:41But now you can enjoy them with the kick of Hidden Valley Diablo Ranch or try the tortilla chip coated nuggets on their own. They're waiting for you. The crispy chicken crunch wrap slider, a brand new classic, is back. Only at Taco Bell. Counterterrorism. What does that entail? The biggest issue and will be for the foreseeable future is Islamic terrorism. You're looking at people that just want to butcher as many innocents as possible in one go. Blowing up a shopping centre, trying to behead a soldier in the street, running people over in a rented van. If they'd have made the life of Brian about a Muslim, they would have been beheaded, like that poor French teacher.

1:15I'd take my hat off to firearms officers. I wouldn't do it in a million years. Chris Cabber. Justified or not? He was a scumbag. He's a known gang member carrying firearms, being violent. He was an absolute scumbag. The far right problem exists is because an Islamist problem exists. So is there a two-tier policing system within the UK? Yes, 100%. You've said the quiet bit out loud there, haven't you? You know you're treating this religion differently. Who believes here that two-tier policing is a thing? Everybody put their hands up. And this is a room full of police officers. Where's the incentive to join?

1:46Well, there isn't any. This nebulous concept of community cohesion, diversity awards and all that shit. They are actively discriminating against white people because they're obsessed. They're obsessed with race. Grow some fucking balls.

2:25Go and have a look at their website, see if there's anything in there for you. I hope you enjoy this week's episode and good health. Paul. Lovely to meet you, Liam. And you. Yeah, thanks for coming on. Very interested into picking your brain. 24 years in the police force, 23 years in the Met, specialising in counter-terrorism. All of that, yeah, certainly will appeal to my audience and strikes my interest. So the million dollar question, why did you join the police in the first place? Oh, well, I could give you some sort of idealistic answer about, you know, wanting to do the right thing and all that.

2:59That did form part of it. But I didn't join until my early 30s and I had two kids and I needed to pay the bills. I needed to put food on the table and I wasn't qualified to do anything else. I sort of went off the rails a bit at school and ended up just going from job to job for the next few years. at the time and this is where it's changed a lot with the police if they thought you had a bit of nows about you and you could obviously do all the tests and everything else if they thought you had a bit of life experience they would give you a chance and they gave me a chance and i'll forever be grateful for that chance because it enabled me to do all sorts of other things so i didn't join it wasn't an idealistic romantic thing but when i did join i obviously wanted to do it as well as possible um so once i got in um i spent um about a year 18 months in cambridgeshire police very rural police force um well you have to if you're if you get caught out or you're in a bit of a sticky situation you've got to learn to talk to people because you're about 45 minutes away from any backup and then i transferred to the met because i thought if it's going to do it you might as well do the Met because it's, you know, it's the...

4:18Go for it. Yeah, it's the all singing, all dancing one. It's the most famous one. It's the biggest one by a mile. Totally different vibe. It's like going from like heartbeat to like an army of occupation. You know, I went from a fallen tree in the road, a bolting horse to like shootouts in the street. You know, it's such a weird, such a different vibe. and they didn't talk to anyone. You don't have any talking skills because if they kick off and you hit your emergency button, you can hear the sirens start up around the corner for them to come and rescue you and help you. What did you think about the Mark Duggan situation?

4:57Because there's mixed feelings on that. People think the police were at fault. People think Mark Duggan was at fault. Obviously, riots kicked off because of the people that objected to him being shot. But to my knowledge, he was known for extreme criminality and violence. And, yeah, what was your take on that? Justified or not? Yeah, 100%. Yeah, because I had someone sat opposite me recently that didn't think it was justified, and I thought that was interesting. Whenever something like this happens, the same happened with Chris Cabber, when someone, you know, basically a gangster is shot by the police.

5:34They'll have a photo of them when they're younger. They'll have a photo of them on the media with the kids, kids they haven't seen in donkey's years. And they're painted out to be, you know, just a kid on the wrong side of the tracks, life's giving him a bum deal and all. He was a scumbag. He was an absolute scumbag. I mean, I worked in the area where that gang or that organised group used to work. And, you know, a lot of the community was in fear of these people, absolute fear of these people um and i'm absolutely no sympathy whatsoever absolutely no sympathy whatsoever and you've got to understand this bloke's known to be carrying fire well he's he's on the pnc the police national computer for carrying firearms for being violent and he's a known gang member you know of an organized crime group and if you stopped him in the street, I think it was Tottenham Lane, wasn't it?

6:34You know, and those officers are going to be, their knuckles are going to be white, the hairs on the back of their neck are going to be standing up. They know, they've read the intel, they've had the briefing, they know what this bloke's like. And if he sort of like pulls something out of the car or he gets out quickly, by the time you think, shall I shoot him or shall I not, it's too late, isn't it? He could have shot you. And so, you know, I take my hat off to firearms officers. You know, I have the utmost respect for them. I wouldn't do it in a million years because you get hung out to dry.

7:06You get totally hung out to dry. Especially now. It makes me wonder who would want to join the police now? Who would actually want to serve and protect correctly with gusto when all of a sudden you're the villain? Yeah, I hate to say it, but anyone with an ounce of intelligence, I wouldn't recommend they join the police because you can be the most decent, hardworking, thief-taking copper out there, but you put one foot wrong, maybe through an innocent mistake, maybe through pressure, you put one foot wrong and they'll hang you out to dry. The senior management and the internal processes of the police, they will hang you out to dry.

7:44Look at the police officer a few weeks ago in Dorset. PC Lawn. Lawn Castle. That's right. He got expelled from the police force for swearing at a knifeman. That's right. His previous record didn't stand him in any stead whatsoever because he'd won two awards at a national level for bravery, not at force level, but national level. So, you know, he's a brave man. This kid, it turns out he's a kid. He's about six foot tall and 15. I mean, they weren't that tall when I was a kid, but now 15 year olds are taller than me, a lot of them, and they're bigger than me. this kid or this person had been involved in violence that evening which is why he stopped him in the first place yeah I mean I think he said you bitch or something didn't he you shut up you bitch or whatever I mean who cares you could have said you're on camera now because you've all got body cams don't talk to him like that it just looks ridiculous you know you'd look a bit of a twat yeah it's not great for optics but great job because you disarmed the knife man Yeah, and he had a bloody great knife on him as well.

8:45It was double-bladed, wasn't it? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, they could have said that, I suppose, out of push. You know, you don't have to give it the big and make, you know, great job, but don't say anything like that. He has to look a bit of a pillock. But no, no, a colleague dobbed him in, a colleague who had been in the job. I think when you see the footage of him taking this person down, the camera that you see this footage through, I think, is on the Metvest. or the stab vest of the colleague. And I think it was this colleague that dubbed him in. What a poor show that is. Oh, it's disgraceful.

9:20And this officer had got a few months' service in. Classic sort of... Trying to climb the greasy pole. Yeah, sort of midwit, liberal, wet, you know, the epitome of the modern police officer. Couldn't punch you away out of a wet paper bag. No. You know, if you're going to a tear-up, a brutal big tear-up, you don't want these people with you. You want people like Lorne Castle with you because you know he's going to help you and stick up for you. If you have some person who's five foot nothing with blue air, you know, trying to shout, get back, get back, because they've done that in class, these people just walk through them.

9:53They look through them like they're not there. You know, they don't even have contempt for them because they don't even see them. Look at the respect the armed police received at Manchester Airport, just the disregard. It was like they were just attacking everyday civilians. like that was at a football match. Armed police in a British airport where everyone's pretty nervous because of previous attacks and stuff. And we're now on red alert because of Trump and Iran. So we are nervous, particularly in airports. Yeah, we are. The least we expect is when armed police turn up and tell people to do as they're told, stand still and answer a few questions.

10:33You'd like to think that they would do. But that was, it surprises me because if you see, even if a normal police officer without a firearm come to me, or let's say he had a taser, meet in the middle. They said, right, Liam, stop where you are. No problem. If I had a gun, put your hands up. It's like, I'm doing the hokey-cokey for you. I'm not going to argue. Even if you've got it wrong, I'll speak my way out of this situation. Maybe it's a misunderstanding, you know, mistaken identity. but we'll talk like normal human beings and then you'll probably put your gun down and I'll go my merry way and jobs are good.

11:11But yeah, it's shocking. What was you like as a copper? Robust? Yeah. Well, we were then because none of us had body cams. We could be more robust then and so we should be. We should be robust when we need to be but you can't now because you know full well that if you fuck up or not even if you do, they will hang you out to dry You know, for this nebulous concept of community cohesion, you've got to think about community cohesion. So they'll hang some officer out to dry. You know, they've done it before. And a couple of met cases, they've actually been told to reinstate people. Because when you look into, you get into the weeds of the individual case, there is no case to answer.

11:53Well, that's good that there's people being reinstated. but it still concerns me as a British citizen because I know what it takes to enforce law and order, which equates to safety. It keeps our women and children safe and us. And I don't think people realise that the less robust the police force can be, if we can even call them a force, if that's allowed anymore. Well, now you call them a service now, don't you? You've got to call them a service. We need a police force because if you're not robust and you're not forceful, more people are in danger. So it has to be called a police service now.

12:25Well, that's what they call themselves at a corporate level. It's the Metropolitan Police Service, Metropolitan Police Service. But everyone still calls it, you know, the force of the job. So they should. Yes. I mean, we're desperate for it to be a force. I know I am. How do we get here? But that's another question. It's a long, bumpy road that's led to this, the mess we're in now. It really is a long road. Counter-terrorism. Yeah. What does that entail? I'm so interested in what goes on behind the scenes. What's being kept from the public? What do you know that I don't know? What do we need to be weary of, mindful and alert?

13:05Well, I worked in counterterrorism in the Metroamp Police. So that's a department called SO15. Right. And because terrorism encompasses all sorts of issues, all sorts of areas, it's absolutely massive. SO15 is bigger than most county forces in terms of its manpower, because there are so many different. you've got um if you've got surveillance if you've got intelligence gathering you've got community engagement you've got the investigators you have the detectives who go you know um you have liaison with security services with the military you have people that carry out exercises with the military and with the security services there there's a whole gamut of things within ct um i mean it'll take forever to go through them individually um but what i would what i would say is um yes we need to be alert we don't need to be scared but we need to be alert and by far and away the biggest issue and will be for the foreseeable future is islamic terrorism islamism you know they'll talk about far right and they'll try certainly yvette cooper seems to be obsessed with the far right.

14:18You know, there is a far right threat. Of course there is. But this is borne out of a perceived inactivity towards Islamism. You know, it sort of led on to far right. I'm not saying that justifies it, but, you know, the far right problem exists is because an Islamist problem exists. That's why. And is that by far the biggest threat, the Islamists? Oh, yeah, 100%. Is it even close? No. So some people will try and tell you it is. Some departments within the police will try and tell you it is. And people have got promoted on the back of saying it is. I'm not saying there isn't a threat, but it's infinitesimally small compared to the Islamist threat.

15:04When you think of the Islamist threat, you're looking at people that just want to butcher as many innocents as possible in one go. You know, you're not talking about a targeted attack on an individual. You're talking about, you know, blowing up a shopping centre, you know, trying to behead a soldier in the street or running people over in a rented van and then stabbing as many people. You know, I think 95 % of the deaths in Britain at the hands of terrorists since the turn of this century have been at the hands of Islamists. Joe Cox was killed by a right-wing terrorist and you had in the wake of the London Bridge attack, you had, I think his name was Darren Osborne, who ran some Muslim worshippers over in Finsbury Park.

15:52And one of those died from a heart attack subsequently. So they're the only two that spring to mind, you know, immediately. There may be more, but the threat is – I wouldn't say it's non-existent, but compared to the Islamist threat, you know, there's no comparison, absolutely no comparison. So anyone who says there is, you know, because if you look at prevent referrals, recently the right-wing referrals outnumber or greater in number than the Islamist referrals, and that's just ridiculous. But that's because the media keep going on about it. The politicians keep going on about it. You go on about it often enough, people are going to – it's going to start to sink in.

16:31to think, oh, yeah, maybe the far right threat is as big. It isn't. It's no way as big. So with that in mind and with your years of experience and your intel, Islamophobia legislation is trying to be pushed through. Yeah. I mean, what are the ramifications of that if that does happen? If we're no longer allowed to criticise an idea, especially one that's directly linked to atrocities that potentially happen down the line because of the hatred for the West that they've got running through their veins. Even they're born and brought up in the West, yeah. Even though people have told me about the threat of homegrown terrorists, people actually hate British citizens more than some people from Arabic countries.

17:09And they were born and raised here and welcomed. Yeah. Well, we've just commemorated the 20th anniversary of the 7-7 attacks. All four of those were born and brought up in Britain. That's right. You know, the NHS brought them into the world. They were educated here. you know they went to schools colleges jobs here interacted with british people and they still hated us that much they wanted to blow us to bits on the tube you know i mean this is you know that is how poisonous this ideology is if it if it sort of gets into your soul that's how poisonous it is it's that's why it's such a serious problem and islamophobia i don't think there's such a thing if you think of islamophobia as um criticizing you shouldn't be allowed to criticize someone faith.

17:52I mean, I don't think that's a thing. I don't think that exists. It's a term now that's been sort of plucked out of the air and everyone uses it, but no one knows what it means. Yet if you abuse someone who is Muslim, like verbally abuse them, physically assault them, and their ethnic background is part of that reason you're doing it, there is existing legislation for that. Crime and Disorder Act 1998 basically puts a racially aggravated element on top of many, many public order offences. To criminalise the criticism of a faith is a very, very dangerous step. The grooming gangs issue, part of it, of their motivation, was their Islamic faith and their racial difference to the girls they were attacking, which is, you know, you've seen that in the records of the court cases.

18:48That was definitely a factor. They admitted it. So potentially then you wouldn't be able to criticise that. You wouldn't be able to go down that road if you bring Islam into it because the perpetrators were Muslim and that was a driving factor. Satire of religion. You know, we have a long tradition of satire in this country of taking the piss out of religion. I mean, you can take the piss out of Christians until the cows come home. People might have a moan. Monty Python is still alive. Yeah, yeah, exactly. If they'd have made the laugh of Brian about a Muslim, they would have been beheaded in the street like that poor French teacher.

19:23You know, I don't think you need to bring Islamophobia laws in anyway because people self-police. Anyone criticises Islam, you know that your life is in danger. Yeah, we all know that. Yeah. We all know we're taking a slight risk by even talking out about it. Samuel Paty, the teacher in France, was beheaded in the street because he, I think he showed the Charlie Hebdo cartoons to his class. The teacher in Batley, who's still in hiding, four years after he showed, I think, a picture of the Prophet Muhammad. And it was a class about sort of the limits of discussion and discourse. And he actually warned the pupils he's going to do this.

20:04And someone spoke to someone else. Someone spoke to someone. He went round online. and then he had to go into hiding. So I don't think Islam needs any protecting from a law. You know, it will stick up for itself because, you know, some people are just sort of foaming at the mouth. You know, they're like a rabid dog with this stuff. It's as if they're almost waiting for an excuse to attack. Do you see the guy that was burning the Koran outside? Yeah, yeah. Was it the Iranian embassy? Turkish. Turkish embassy. Yeah. And then the guy's run out with a knife swinging it about him. Yeah, but he's not being prosecuted.

20:35The guy who burnt the Koran got remanded. Yeah, yeah. And the guy that was swinging the knife got let out on Baal. Yeah. Make that make sense. Well, the original phraseology on the charge sheet was he criticised the religion of Islam or something, which isn't even of an offence. You know, we don't have blasphemy. Well, we have unofficial blasphemy laws because people, like I say, people self-police. They don't want to be murdered. But, yeah, that's interesting, you know. And then they say, oh, no, we made a mistake. Well, you've just sort of said the quiet bit out loud there, haven't you? You know you're treating this religion differently to any other religion because even in the terminology on the charge, you criticise the holy religion of Islam or words to that effect.

21:17You'd never do that with something else. And was this madness about, say, when you first joined the Met? And I'll tell you what, what's the cultural shift that you saw during your 23 years in the Met? I suppose within the institution as well as outside. You know, people talk about the woke police, the state of the police being woke um they've been like that for a long time i mean i joined in the early two i'll tell you i'll show you how bad it was um when i joined day one week one of the training course we sat in these desks at training school um and they thumped these massive great binders onto our desks because it was all done by binders then and you had to read stuff you know it wasn't online this was like 2001 um and the first thing you opened and the first page that greets you when you open this bloody thing is it is it is it about crime is about the historic role of the police is it is it um uh robert peel's principles of policing that they supposed to stick by today no it wasn't it was a map of fucking britain with a load of arrows all over it like dad's army like the dad's army theme or the credits to dad's army the opening titles yeah so it's a map of britain with arrows and it had like anglo-saxons vikings jutes huguenots jews celts whatever so the first thing and you read the passage underneath the first thing was a political message about how britain's always been a melting pot that's the first page week one day one nothing to do with crime nothing to do with the police it was no core values no none of that and this was 2001 you know this was like two years after the met um paul condon said yeah we're all racists he said the met is institutionally racist so it had filtered down by then to sort of the new intakes coming in the first thing that greets you is a map saying we're all a we're all a great big melting pot and isn't it lovely?

23:22You know, absolute bollocks. I mean, what's that got to do with the police? What was the recruitment process like? You had tests to do, you had written tests, you had physical tests. I mean, not hard, but by today's standards, they would be hard. So you'd like push, pull, bleep test and basic strength test, that sort of thing. And like a running, like a standing jump as well. But you don't do any of that now. you still have the bleep test, but it gets, I think it's like 5.2 you have to do, which is shit, really. You do the warm-up, it goes up to three beforehand. And when I, in my last place of work, the new recruits came in to do, or the ones who were interested in joining, came to do the bleep test in the gym that I used.

24:10And some of them failed the warm-up. And would they get dismissed? Yeah, oh yeah. Well, these were before they even joined. Right. Thankfully, but who knows, who knows. Nowadays they'll probably say, oh, go on. No, they want a police force that reflects London, that looks and feels like London, all that meaningless bollocks. I've seen them pass people who shouldn't have been passed. And you've seen recently certainly West Yorkshire, and if West Yorkshire do it, I'm sure the Met does it, sort of putting white applicants to one side for a role and bringing in applicants from different backgrounds first, which is...

24:48And certainly it's not illegal, but it's immoral. It's called positive action. Was you bobbing on the beat when you started? Yeah, yeah. Bring that back. Oh, God. Yes. How effective was that? Being a bobby on the beat, having a physical presence as a police officer, probably two at a time so you got each other's back. How effective was that back in the day? In the 60s, they decided to put people in cars and take bobbies off the beat because it was cheaper and you could cover a bigger area. And immediately there, you've got that barrier. You've got that window between you and members of the public.

25:20When I've carried out foot patrols, whether in Cambridge or London, people say they're happy to see you. They're happy to see you. It's a reassuring presence. And some of these are like the rough parts of North London where the media would have you believe that everybody hates the police. It's really hostile because of Broadwater Farm or because of Stop and Search and all that. That's cobblers. you know people ordinary people of whatever background would be happy to see the police the only people that wouldn't be happy to see the police are the people who've had something to fear from the police or up to no good so um yeah you do like two years of that or you did then I think I don't think you have to do that now and you can enter now as an inspector or a superintendent the thing about the police was and it was always the thing that was one of the things that was greatest about the police you didn't have like an officer entry scheme even if you became the commissioner you would have had to start doing your two years on the beat to start off with your two years foot patrol two years answering 999 calls you know the very very basics of the job where you learn to listen to people you learn to talk to people nowadays you don't have to do that um and I think that's the that's the you know probably the one biggest thing that I think that we've lost something because we don't do that anymore.

26:45And you can come straight in as an inspector now or even a superintendent, where a superintendent is very, very senior. So if you come straight in as a superintendent, their rationale would be, well, the job's so different now to the way it was years ago. Your managerial skills mean that you don't need to know about the basics of policing. Yes, you fucking do. You do. Because if you're a superintendent, you'll be like Silver Commander at a football match. or something. You know, if you've never policed a football match as a constable, you don't know how hairy that can be, how fucking scary it is, and how you've seen, I mean, we all know cases where the police have lost control in public order incidents and, you know, people have been killed.

27:32Monday on NBC. US Marshall! All new Line of Fire, the thrilling new crime drama. The world sees us as heroes, but they don't know what the job really costs. One family of federal agents. It's one thing to put yourself in danger. It's different when it's your family. Balances duty to their country. An assassin is still out there. Stop! And each other. How do you protect the world and the people you love at the same time? Every case hits home on Line of Fire, Monday on NBC. You fell in love at First Crunch, and now the crispy chicken crunch wrap slider is back at Taco Bell. But with a twist, it's crispy all-white meat chicken nuggets inside a slider-sized crunch wrap.

28:13But now you can enjoy them with the kick of Hidden Valley Diablo Ranch. Or try the tortilla chip-coated nuggets on their own. They're waiting for you. The crispy chicken crunch wrap slider, a brand new classic, is back. Only at Taco Bell. Was there any football matches you police that you remember that was a bit hairy? Yeah, my closest ground used to be White Art Lane. And, you know, it'd kick off reasonably. When Arsenal were there, it would always kick off. The worst one, I was on duty there when Arsenal won the league in 2004 at White Hart Lane. Arsenal went two up and then Spurs got a last-minute equaliser.

28:53They'd come from 2-0 down to draw with Arsenal, the enemy at White Hart Lane. But a draw was enough for Arsenal to win the league. And the Arsenal team celebrated on the pitch. Thierry Henry got an inflatable Premier League trophy and stuck it on the centre circle, I think. And outside it just went completely bandy, totally bandy. And there was, I was in, after the game, I was in this little side road and all of a sudden there were like hundreds of these Spurs supporters there. So the minute they walked past the end of this street and the Spurs fans saw them and the Arsenal fans saw the Spurs fans, they started running towards each other.

29:34and me and this one other chap were in the middle of this and they were both running towards each other and you had these public order batons. You didn't have the ordinary sort of baton that you have. You had this big sort of plastic, heavy plastic thing and they both started running towards us and we just started swinging. Self-preservation. Body shots, head shots. Yeah, whatever. Well, survival. I mean, they're running towards you. They weren't interested in us. They wanted to get at each other. but I, you know, at the time you think, they're coming for me. And we just started swinging and within seconds everyone had vanished because they could hear the siren because we hit the emergency buttons straight away and they, you know, they must have heard the siren start around the corner.