Comic-Con 2026: The Reaction Pod (recorded in San Diego)

0:14Welcome to a very, very special edition of the Empire podcast. And this one is to mark the end for us. Anyway, there's one more day to go of Comic Con, San Diego Comic Con, Comic Con International to give it its full official title here in San Diego. the heart of the well's vagina or the uh or the vagina of the well's heart i'm not entirely sure which way it is around and uh i have just finished i've just laid down my tools for the year not counting this podcast of course which i'm recording on the roof or one of the roofs of the hilton bayfront hotel where i've just spoken to a lot of the cast and filmmakers behind avengers doomsday which was the big finale, I guess, to the Marvel Studios panel in Hall H.

1:05And that's all very, very exciting. And I'm joined on the roof. You'll be glad to know it's not just me filibustering for half an hour or so by my Empire colleague, Dan Jolin. Hello, Dan. Hey, Chris. Hey, Dan. How are you? I'm good. I'm a professional. Dan is a professional, I have to say. I'm no press. I'm a professional. I have a press pass. I'm out here in my official capacity as an Empire Twonk, doing stuff for Empire. Podcasts, social channels, Instagram, stuff for the website, stuff for the magazine, Jack of all trades, master of none. Dan, you are here, genuinely you are here as a professional.

1:43You were on a panel yesterday. Tell us about it. It was great. It was great. It was called... What was it called? Nerd Stuff and Sword Things. Nerd Stuff and Sword Things. Which you might remember is a line from the movie Masters of the Universe. It was burned into my brain. Yeah. I knew exactly what you were talking about when you saw that. Exactly. So it was basically, it was all about kind of like the fandom of Masters of the Universe. Why were you on the panel, Dan? I was on the panel because I've written the Art of Masters of the Universe book. So it's the making of book for that movie. Coming out when?

2:22coming out in September I don't have an exact date I'm sorry um so I was invited to be on it to kind of speak about kind of like my experiences of putting the book together and all the kind of behind the scenes stuff that I saw and everything um which was great but it was kind of weird because I was sat right next to Chris Butler who wrote the movie yes he wrote that line and indeed he did so it was like kind of strange getting asked questions about the making of Masters of the universe when i'm sat next to the guy who wrote yeah yeah yeah but you know it was fine that's you know it seemed to be fine you were in the audience thanks for coming i was in the audience because i'm a supportive friend yeah i'm loyal i genuinely got a buzz from it i mean i hate that i hate that you're on a panel i hate it you know because i've been trying to get on a panel in this place for i've been coming here since 2003 uh with a nine-year hiatus so this is my first time at comic-con in nine years uh but it's my first time ever my first time i'm caught i'm stopping this podcast right now i i hate you i fucking hate you uh you know and uh i hosted a virtual panel during the pandemic at sdcc there you go but it's not the same dan is it it's not the same no i want the i want the smattering of mild applause when my name is read out polite applause obligatory applause and it's mostly the other panelists it's mostly the other panelists who are very very supportive uh and one person in the audience going whoo whenever empire gets mentioned which was me yeah uh no i was genuinely thrilled for you it was uh it was a wonderful thing it was it was great seeing on on the panel it was a fun panel it was uh it was interesting the format was interesting i have to say i'm gonna i'm gonna put my objective hat on here and it's not how I would have presented a panel in which which this is to say that oh by the way if you're wondering why I'm stumbling more often than than not and not cutting it out uh I don't know if you can hear the music in the background you may not hear by the time I put all the noise gates and filters on and whatnot that I do for the podcast but we're on the the balcony here and there is music playing through speakers I think it's copyright free I hope it's copyright free it's definitely it's definitely porn movie music it's porn movie music it's like 70s porn Dan and I have plans immediately after we finish this podcast.

4:30Boom chicka wow wow. So because of the music, I'm going to not be able to cut things out. So we're going to have to go completely in the flow here, Dan. So that's what we're going to have to do. But the way that the panel was formatted was interesting because we had five speakers and the host, who was a producer on the movie. Yes. Nate. Nate. Nate. Nate. That's correct. You don't know his surname, do you? I do know his surname, but I'm very tired and my brain has turned to jelly and you put me on the spot and now this is absolutely terrible. That is amazing. Nate Atwood. Nate Atwood. Nate Atwood.

5:10Thank you, of course. So Nate Atwood introduced it in a very interesting way. So he gave each member on the panel about an eight-minute slot to speak. So there wasn't a lot of back and forth as you would normally get on a panel. I thought it was quite interesting. A little bit of interplay. We kind of butted in on each other's comments from time to time, although I tried not to do that too much. You were too polite. I am very polite. You mentioned Bexy Heath, which is where you're from. Yes. Before I play golf. Specifically, I mentioned Zodiac Toys in Bexy Heath, which is not there any longer.

5:41Is it not? No, it used to be Zodiac Toys and Nuxley Toys. Okay. Zodiac Toys was nearer to my house. That's amazing. Yeah. Good story. It's a good story, but I love that because when Dan's section was on, he was talking about his work on the Masters of Universe art. What's it called? The Art of Masters of Universe? The Art of Masters of Universe. You think I remember a title as simple as that? The Art of Masters of Universe. The Art of Masters of Universe. They flashed up a picture of Dan on set because you were on set multiple times and you were holding the sword of power and you confessed that you're so feeble and weak that you were unable to raise it above your head.

6:16It is true. It is very heavy though. in my defense is very heavy and I don't do strength training. So, you know, no film journalist. I'm going to have to start doing some strength training. Is there a film journalist, you know, a film journalist? I mean, I'm on kind of keeps. He's pretty buff. He's pretty. But I wouldn't mess with him. No, he's tall as well. Is he, you know, Robbie Collins tall, but I wouldn't say he's a unit. Although he did start working out for a long time. James gives aggressive vibes, but James could kill you in multiple ways. James could kill you with a paperclip. But I don't know that there's a buff film journalist.

6:46I don't know that there's someone who, when I'm at a film screening, someone walks into the room and I go fucking hell, you know, it's not like Kermode comes in and he's got a fucking six pack. It's not like that at all. This is what happens when I don't cut stuff out anyway. This ordinarily in a podcast that would be cut out. But now we have to roll with the punches. Anyway, Dan, I was going to say, so one of my favorite bits that happened was at the end of the the end of the panel. I love that. Yeah, it was great. So they gave us all like little swords of power. yeah we could actually lift above our head yes and i i was told i could keep it but then at the end some some some sort of like eager looking children came up to me and and um and i thought oh they want to talk to me uh okay well what do they want and they went can we have your sword i gave it to them yeah uh yeah because that is that is the true power of that is the true power yeah the true power of greyskull is to give the power away yeah so there you are whereas rage against the machine would say take the power back yeah but I would take it back and then give it away again okay yeah it's an ongoing process would you give it away and give it away and give it away now no again this would be cut out I can't stand the chili peppers you can't stand the chili peppers no I mean they've got a wide variety of songs what are you talking about just are you one of those people who's just like no I don't like that band therefore everything they do is just persona non grata to me.

8:11Well, just play me something by them and I'll tell you if I like it or not. And I probably I'd play you something like road tripping. Road tripping with my two favorite allies. Like I'm cringing. I'm not scar tissue under the bridge. Everyone loves under the bridge. No, no, no, I can't stand that. So anyway, Dan was on this panel and it was a real joy to watch Dan in action on this panel. I genuinely, I was so happy for you. It was a wonderful, wonderful thing to see. Also on that panel was Chris Butler, as Dan said, who was the writer of Masters of the Universe, and also Wildwood, which is the new, the second Travis Knight film out this year.

8:53It's going to be out later on. It's a big old stop-motion Leica extravaganza. And after that panel, Chris Butler was kind of to sit down with me in a fairly noisy room. So nothing I can do about that. Once again, these microphones are very, very good, but I don't know how much background noise they're going to be cutting out for a 15-minute chat or so. So I thought, you know what? Let's stick them in this podcast roundup. Let's do it. Here's Chris Butler. Enjoy. Chaos is what they should call Comic-Con, to be honest. Chris Butler, you are here. How are you, sir? I'm good. I'm trying to avoid most of the chaos by hiding in the green room.

9:27Yeah, how's it been? I mean, how was your panel? First of all, you're here for a Masters of the Universe panel, which was a lot of fun. It was fun, yeah. And it was an opportunity to meet a bunch of very talented, creative people. And Dan Jolin. Yeah. I can say a lot about Dan. I've known him for 20... Oh, my God. I've had an existential crisis in the middle of that sentence. I've known him too long. Let's put it that way. See, I've met him through Masters. Okay. Obviously, he was doing the R-Talb book. Yes. Apparently, we did a Zoom interview. I thought I'd met him in person, but, you know. and he said oh you're you're taller than i thought you were it's like it's a zoom interview how do what are you basing it on with someone standing behind me yeah if you have something to scale yeah you know maybe a nice handy like wall chart in your in your background that that's the thing that can help but uh but i have to say you know i i didn't have a sense of your height but i saw you with the panel and you have your guns out sir this is an audio podcast yeah but you're a writer Chris yeah writers are not meant to have their guns out well I don't know what you noticed but it is the new line it is the line yes um which is Jim bro Skeletor Jim bro Skeletor which was one of my finest points I think from from the movie um yeah was having for those um for those who've seen it they recall at one point Skeletor delves into Adam's mind he does and we see him in Adam's Earth Gym in Oklahoma City.

10:57And that was one of my high points of the whole thing. Jimbroskeletor. So I'm doing the brand proud by wearing a Skeletor muscle shirt on stage. It looks good. I could not pull that off. It looks good on you. Thank you. So Jimbroskeletor, was that something you wrote in the script? Did you write those words, Jimbroskeletor? No, I didn't. I wrote the scene. Okay. And then I remember Travis sent me some concept artwork and said what do you think like can we get away with this and it was Skeletor and his little gym hoodie and his dumbbell in hand and I was like this is amazing I don't know whether we'll get away with it but we should do it yeah absolutely no and and now I've got on the floor I don't know if you've had a chance to go on the floor but the big Mattel booth which is very masters centric this year yeah uh there are gym bro Skeletor action figures I can't get one you can't get no they sold out i was hoping you could get two and give me one but that's i've dropped a few hints so maybe maybe one will find its way to me but i even went online and they it it sold out within seconds of of going online it's it's crazy it's flying off shelves yeah it's look what you've wrought look what you have done it's great with jim bro skeletor you may not have written those words but you wrote the concept yeah and that's it so presumably some of that cash goes go to you as well you get a little bit of you get a little taste of that pie no no no don't be ridiculous i'm just happy to wear the shirt um so you're here you're here in the masters of universe panel it's a uh it's been a busy year for you it's going to be a banner year for you i think people look at the imdb um but even the wildwood's been in the works now for for some time and you've got masters of universe and wildwood both travis night joints as well of course um When did that relationship with Travis begin, first of all?

12:53When I first went to the studio in 2006, he was animating, I think, on Coraline. Yeah, of course it was Coraline. Yeah. God, it's a long time ago. Yeah, that's crazy. And I met him and thought he was a lovely fellow. And I suppose my... This all started really with Paranorman. because at the end of Coraline, we needed a next project. And I remember Henry Selick asked me if I had anything that I was working on, anything that I was writing. And I had the first act of Paranormal, which I showed to Henry. And he was like, we need to show this to Travis. Showed it to Travis, who, you know, I didn't know him very well.

13:37I was a little bit intimidated by him, but he called me into his office and said, this should be, I want this to be like his next movie and I want you to direct it. And I just, I think I sat in silence for a moment or two, but that was the start of it because I think he saw something in that script that really resonated with him. We are the same age. So we grew up watching a lot of the same movies, interested in the same stuff that was out there. both 80s kids and I think that's been a big part of it we we um he thankfully he likes what I write and I I love what he does it's been the most rewarding creative relationship I've ever had um I love him to death when did the first click so you had that you had that meeting he says like you did like you to direct this yeah uh by the way do you have a second and third act at this point yeah he did say that he said where's the rest and I said it's at home and it wasn't so i i'll just go get it yeah i'll go get it just give me six weeks yeah yeah no i i frantically fit it i mean i i had the whole thing mapped out yeah but it just wasn't written out and that was the first script i'd ever officially written so yeah it started there and of course i myself and sam fell directed that movie and travis was an animator on it he He animated some of the big sequences with the zombies first breaking out of the graves.

15:08So I was briefing and directing Travis, which was, you know, his own. This is ostensibly your boss, right? Yeah, yeah. I guess. Yeah. So, of course, everything he did was amazing. But it was. It was as well. Is he a David Brennstein boss? No. No. No. He is a true polymath. Yeah. Whatever he lends himself to, he seems to excel at it. And so, yeah, it was actually a really easy thing to direct him on stuff because he did such beautiful animation on that movie. But Travis is a polymath. He is very, very versatile. I mean, you've got a big year, obviously, with Masters and Wildwood, but then so does he as a director of both of these films.

15:52What can we expect from Wildwood, first of all? You could say at this point in time that someone whacking you. I mean, it's been a long time coming because we first started working on it in... I first started working on it in 2014, I think. Jesus. And I think we always knew it was going to be a pretty epic project. And the studio just wasn't quite ready to take it on at that point. I know Travis had talked to me about his aspirations for it and that it is a truly epic fantasy movie. and in order to be able to technically achieve it, some more developments had to be made. We've made a couple of movies since then.

16:35And you know, every time we make one of these things, we are learning and we apply what we learned on the previous movie into the next one. And honestly, because it was so long between me writing it and then it being made, I purposefully didn't look at too much stuff because I wanted to be surprised by it as well. Really? Yeah. Okay. So when I eventually did see some of the puppets and the sets, I was blown away. Particularly, there's footage out there already in some BTS stuff, but the general character, which is the giant eagle character, that puppet is insane. and I know this studio I know this industry and I was blown away by that puppet it is magical just technically I mean it's animated beautifully but just technically what they've managed to achieve in a practical puppet it makes your heart sing because it's practical effects it's real this thing is real and it's just glorious so I'm pleased that I distanced myself from it because when I did eventually see it I felt like an audience member which is great that's such a nice feeling you know it's very easy to be so involved in the process that you nothing is really surprising but I was so surprised by this so I think it's going to be a gorgeous in terms of the scope and the scale I know we say this every time we've never made a movie that's as big and majestic as this.

18:22We say it every time, and every time we go further. And it's the same thing again. It's a pretty impressive movie. I mean, I cannot wait. I cannot wait to see what you guys have done. And just the world building that lies in store, I imagine, is fast and ambitious and complex. But you also had to build... It's interesting because with Masters of the Universe, you had to build this world, but you're building it on existing foundations, of course, and you're tweaking with things that you have growing up, you and Travis have grown up loving as kids. But how much freedom then do you have within that to play around with stuff?

19:01Because one of the things I loved about the movie was the fact that it's tongue-in-cheek. Skeletor doesn't have a cheek, but he's a very tongue-in-cheek character. And it's aware of its own pumped-up, amped-up ridiculousness at times as well. Yeah, and those were conversations that we had to have because you use the word ridiculous. And it is. It's always been a ridiculous concept. And I think the key for us, I think the key for any successful story in that world is that you acknowledge that it's ridiculous, but you're not embarrassed by it. And there is also a sincerity to it. Like the human emotions at work beneath all the ridiculous um you know surface level stuff they're real human emotions yeah um he-man himself adam is a very sincere character and i think that's why it works i think nick galatine is is is so charming in that part because he's not just some big buff warrior dude he's like fallible human being literally as a human being you know you are human so I think that's that's part of it is as you say even the end I mean the Jim bro skeletor character comes from a scene that is incredibly intimate and incredibly human which is Skeletor going into Adams memory that was my favorite scene to write actually okay yeah I just love I love writing Skeletor anyway I think I am whether he's a Jim bro or not yeah I mean I just love how i think it's that delicate balance between jim bro and camp which which i seem to straddle so um i yeah it was always a treat by seeking his dialogue and you know i said on the panel like um one of the best things that i i enjoyed doing was going back through the original film nation show and pulling all these skeletal insults because he's known for his insults and I had a long list of insults.

21:06I crammed as many as I could into that script and quite a few survived. But yeah, I just loved writing that character and I loved writing that face-off between basically a narcissistic child and someone who is completely empathetic and works in HR. That was a dreamy little bit of... a dreamy little dynamic that I got to play with. I love the fact that he's in HR. Was that inspired by any HR people you've had run-ins with in the past? Not saying.

21:44Maybe. Maybe? Okay, interesting. Two very, very quick last things before I let you go. Are you heading back to LA now? Are you hanging around for a little bit longer? At three o 'clock. Three o 'clock. I'm going to let me out of here. Okay, two last things real quick. I'm fascinated by how you approached me. this is a study in contrast, right? Master of the Universe and Wildwood. Do you write the scripts differently? Do you get a different headspace? Is the way you write tailored to each screenplay? Oh, that's interesting. I do think I approach it differently, but I tend to be all in on whatever I'm working on.

22:20And both of these projects do have pre-existing IP, pre-existing versions. so I think it's imperative when you're when you're tackling a translation of something that already exists that you're trying to do right by the original otherwise why are you making it yeah yeah it's you're not trying to reinvent it and so for Wildwood it was like what is this book about like what makes it Wildwood and I try to hang on to that of course I do a few things here and there and it's got to be a movie length yeah because the books like 400 and something pages are probably more and it's the same thing with Masters of the Universe there's different aspects of the IP over the years that I want to do right by yeah so I think those guidelines are already in place when I start work okay yeah I know I can't stray too far if it's a completely original project you can go anywhere with it yeah but it's actually quite nice to work on something where you've got these goalposts.

23:22I'd love to read both screenplays, you know, kind of side by side and just compare the writing style and just compare how you approach them. Especially, as you said, you know, having written Wildwood some time ago as well. Last thing, when Travis came over for Motu, as we call it, Motu's release in the UK, did a Q &A with him, and he was talking about how he had a big Merman sequence at one point. It was a big battle on the sea between Adam and Merman. And he was like, hopefully one day we'll get that in the sequel. I mean, are you guys hoping that that might happen? I would love this to continue.

24:02Yeah. I mean, these characters, this world is very dear to me. How that looks, who knows? Yeah. But yeah, there are so many characters in this world. Thousands. And so many of them I love. It would have been a mistake to try and put them all in that one movie. Because then none of them is shining. None of them has the spotlight, really. So it was a conscious decision not to include certain characters that we really wanted to include. Mare Man is one of them. so really it was like our top choice list make sure that they're in the movie and then a few of the others fall by the wayside who knows hopefully we will get to revisit them now as on prime video people are discovered in the movie again there's that sense i think so yeah fingers crossed i hope so in the future merman versus he-man we need to see it brilliant chris i'm gonna let you and your guns get out of here well thank you it's a bit of pleasure thanks man okay that was chris butler talking about masters of the universe and wildwood and being a comic-con and being a screenwriter who is pumped he is surprisingly like i i didn't i'd met him on zoom i'd never met him in person before and he came up to me and went hi it's me chris and i i hadn't recognized he shook your hand and crushed it yeah i was just like superman he's this big guy and of course when when you talk to someone on zoom it can't it does you know it reduces them they're just a little person on your screen and i had no idea he was such a big fella in real life yeah I mean, he's not, he's not, that's not overstated.

25:36He's not gargantuan. He's not a Skeletor buff. He's not like, he's not eight feet tall. He's, he's our height, but he has guns and he had them out at the panel because he was wearing that Jim bro Skeletor t-shirt with a one with no arms. So, you know, people who have guns like to do. Yeah. So yeah, he's a, he's a bit of a unit is Chris Butler. Yeah. Very excited about Wildwood. And, you know, I'm wondering now whether the Masters of the Universe will find a new audience now that's it's on Prime Video. I think it's doing well. They apparently they were saying apparently it's like it was like number one on all streaming services the day it launched.

26:11Okay, that's good. So but I was hearing that from Mattel people. So yeah, yeah, well, this is how you like this is very true. I mean, it's one of those things, isn't it? You know, the movies that we really, really like things like Dungeons and Dragons, Honor Among Thieves just don't do that well. Well, they do they do pretty well, but not enough to get a sequel generated or to get a franchise. There should be two sequels to that movie by now. We should have been up to our balls in Dungeons and Dragons sequels by now. We should have been up to our balls in Shang-Chi and The Legends of the Ten Rings sequels by now as well, which is a lovely way of segueing into the Marvel panel.

26:43Dan, you really, because you're a professional, so you weren't able to get into Hall H or any of the other rooms to see stuff. They don't let professionals in there. They don't let professionals. Well, no, you'd have to queue with riffraff. Yes. Yes. Whereas, you know, I'm very, very lucky. I realized this and I was able to be whisked in through a special side entrance and then taken to reserve seating near the stage but not right by the stage. How was it Chris? What was the energy in the room like? I mean I always liked the Beatlemania, that energy and I'm not always in that room and certainly I haven't been in there for nine years because of pandemics and other things but on the few occasions when I have been there because most of the time I'm over here at the Hilton Bay front at the press line waiting for the press line to begin and then over the years I realized, well, the press line can't begin until the panel is over because everyone's there.

27:33I mean, how did you figure that out? I know. Honestly, sitting there sometimes waiting for like an hour, hour and a half, and you go, well, of course they can't be here because they're there. Anyway, so I have seen amazing things at Hall H. I wasn't there obviously for Downey being revealed as Dr. Doom two years ago, but I have felt sometimes just the hair standing up in the back of my neck, goosebumps breaking out my flesh whenever they've announced something incredible or they've dropped footage from something like oh i don't know um age of ultron or things like that or when tom hiddleston appeared as loki little things like that uh today i think was pretty much up there uh which is interesting because you know obviously doomsday is a bit more of an unknown quantity than i'd say infinity war or end game where uh it doesn't have the same benefit of a of a smash hit run-up you know marvel have faltered a little bit over the last few years.

28:27Not everything is an$800 million grossing behemoth anymore. Last year they released three films, one of which in particular, Thunderbolts, was excellent. Fantastic Four was solid to very good. I enjoy Brave New World. I realize now, in hindsight, I'm the only one who did, but you know, it's fine. But none of those ripped up the joint in terms of the box office. Mm hmm. And so they're not coming into this with a position of strength or a position of, you know, of infallibility that I think they maybe once had. It doesn't feel like it has the same momentum behind it that Infinity War did. Yeah. Which is, I mean, I'm still excited about it.

29:17I mean, I'm hugely excited about it. And most people who are into the MCU are also excited. It's not like we're not excited. Just in terms of that kind of that bigger, broader audience, is there the same anticipation? I don't know. Yeah, I don't think there is. Well, something like Deadpool and Wolverine, because we were saying the same things, people were beginning to sound almost a death knell that the good ship Marvel had taken on some water below the water line. It was beginning to begin to sink a little bit. It would never sink, but certainly would maybe engage a couple of the lifeboats. And I just feel like the kind of death knell we were sounding, or some people were sounding, was maybe a little bit premature.

30:06Deadpool and Wolverine made$1.4 billion, something like that, coming off a pretty bad year in 2023. Yeah. You know, with Marvel's not doing well and Quantum Mania not doing well. So, you know, I think that the appetite is still there. The excitement is still there. The trailer, from what I understand, you know, how much of this do you take with a pinch of salt? I don't know. But the trailer, from what I understand, did record-breaking numbers. That's true. So there might be still the excitement for this movie and also the fact that, you know, brand new day is dropping in a few days' time. Spider-Man brand new day is dropping in a few days time maybe once again maybe the the opposite is true of of what happened with infinity war and end game which was able to ride that wave and the the the rising tide lifted all boats so it was able to the momentum of infinity war and end game was able to get things like captain marvel to a billion was able to get things like ant-man the wasp to whatever did 600 million was able to get Thor Ragnarok to 800 million, all that sort of stuff.

31:08So people were just like, we want more of this. We're excited. We're on a we're rolling on a wave here. This is the opposite tact. This is you're getting very little MCU. You're getting three films. We're introducing the Fantastic Four, but we're not we're not aligning them with Doctor Doom. The footage made clear that the Fantastic Four, Pedro Pascal, and finessa kirby's sue storm no dr doom yeah they're old friends with dr doom yeah i wouldn't have minded that being established in that movie but hey that's okay uh and now you're only getting one marvel movie before before doomsday and maybe they're creating that appetite through withholding i think that's maybe maybe something that's happening i don't know treat him mean to keep them keen you could say that you could say that i'm not sure i would i i can see that that's that's kind of the stress that's on the wall in the in the marvel marketing strategy room it might be part of dr doom's ethos uh is what i can say but i'll go i'll go talk you through it real real quick there were other panels to talk about and i was at a few other panels this year but i was very much a one-man band this year at comic-con so i was pretty much stretched from pillar to post so i wasn't able to i wasn't doing as much filming as i would like normally you know when we did the 50 bloggers with Sam toy.

32:25That's all I would be doing pretty much going from places places doing interviews Doing comedy bits. Well, so-called comedy bits and then bloggy so many bloggy so man, yeah, RIP You know the 50 bloggy so man cinematic universe has not yet been announced Yeah, and then he's a doomsday He is in doomsday. Yes, we just see him right behind the back going. Oh, excuse me. Talk to do Well, this 50 bloggers man voice was more like that. But I'm bad. Very Yeah, it was very much very much very anyway um uh alarmingly so matt berry in fact in fact at the time i was going not many people know matt berry so i can do his voice and get away with it now i'll be like why are you doing a ship matt berry anyway uh and then obviously there were other people coming out to comic con and doing other things and going to panels and doing all sorts of stuff over the years when we had a bigger presence at comic con last year we came was 2017 where we had our own studio we had our own suite and we we did photo shoots and video interviews and all sorts of stuff it was amazing uh and then pandemic happened and and some various other reasons and we didn't come back since then except for this year when it was a fairly late decision to send me out here uh which is why i was one man banding it yeah so thank you for helping me out with the the doomsday marvel press line by the way that's all right uh very very much appreciate you're a very capable one man band well thank you but um i'm do the monica and the and the ankle symbols but not at the same time that's the problem uh and i i'm really really really exhausted which is why i'm rambling and say nonsense but i went to a lot of other panels and i went to a lot of stuff and i was on the floor and i spoke to really really cool people and i had a really really great time yeah but if i'm completely honest the only reason i was here was for the marvel panel and was surprised for avengers doomsday well not just not just me being a mcu fan and not just me being you know um you know, Kevin Feige's brother from another mother or whatever it is.

34:17I was sent to do this essentially as well. And it's important to Empire as a brand that we covered this panel and we were actually there in the room and got to experience it. I think if I could have gone to one panel, that's the one I would have gone to. And most people would say that. I mean, that's tech today, for example. So I was in Hall H most of the day, and I had a decent time. I had a nice time. But nothing made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up until Marvel. So I was at a Star Trek. Okay, let me walk that back a second, because there was something really, really lovely in the Star Trek at 60 panel.

34:53So it started off with a Star Trek universe panel, which was split into two parts. One was a celebration of Star Trek X60 that had a representative from pretty much every televisual iteration of Star Trek on this panel. So George Takei was there, which was amazing. Michael Dorn was there. Robert Picardo was there. Michelle Hurd was there. Christina Chong was there. You know, pretty much Anson Mount. No, Anson Mount wasn't on that one. And then they had a Strange new world's panel as well and seeing george decay being brought out onto stage in a wheelchair because he's now you know obviously quite old but his mind is still so sharp and his voice is still so powerful genuinely i got really emotional about it uh there was a big standing innovation for him the second one i saw at this year's comic-con because rick moranis was part of the space balls panel in college on Friday.

35:48And that was wonderful as well because he hasn't done anything in years. He's been essentially retired for 30 years. He's done some voice over stuff and the odd cameo in some TV movies and a Ryan Reynolds mid-mobile I think or Ryan Reynolds advert certainly a couple of years ago. But otherwise he hadn't done anything. And then he was there for the Spaceballs, the new one panel by the way that looks really genuinely funny and quite cinematic as well so i'm i'm i'm excited and they were combing the crowd they got a big comb appeared didn't they they were doing the big comb they were looking for rick moranis because the guy was he was so recluse that they'd lost him on the way to the stage and then of course there he was sitting in the audience's dark helmet and then he comes to the stage and it's just this grand standing ovation for this comedy legend and the space boss panel was great i really enjoyed being there and it was a lovely panel as well for Pan's Labyrinth at 20 with Guillermo del Toro, Guillermo del Barro and Ivana Beccaro who is the young actress from the now, she's now 32 I think.

36:47And Doug Jones of course played the Pale Man and the Faun. Who is also now 32. He is now also 32 years old. He was on the Star Trek at 60 panel as well by the way, because he's in Star Trek Discovery. Yeah. And it was a lovely moment just when George Takei came out, it was another standing innovation and Michelle Hurd kind of became emotional as well talking about how much it meant to her, you know, watching the original series and watching the Shell Nichols as Uhura and then being sat next to Sulu. And she began to break down in, you know, a little bit, not like full blown squirting a few Miller's Crossing tears, but, you know, certainly she was emotional about it.

37:27And that made me emotional as well. So that was a lovely, lovely panel as well. then the apple tv panel was fine you know matchbox the movie which seems to have more of a reason for existing than i had assumed so so you were telling me earlier i was disappointed to hear that's that's not john cena being turned into a micro cena and and driving around in toy cars no that's not that i thought that's what it was going to be but it's not it appears to be some sort of fast and furious thing like a caper thing with these five childhood friends who grew up playing matchbox toys that's the conceit that's the way into it I otherwise I don't think that there's a really great connection between Matchbox and what happens in the movie I actually quite like that it's quite elegant as kids we love playing with Matchbox toys then we grew up a bit like it we all kind of we some of us stayed in touch but this guy John Cena went off became a spy and now he's come back into our lives and we get caught up in his spy shenanigans and there's lots of car chases and motorbike chases and vehicle chases and because we were able to play with matchbox toys as kids we're able to kind of go not like superpowers but we're going hey we're driving just you know we're just going to do a stunt with this car just like we did with matchbox toys when we were kids i mean now it's a tank it's that kind of thing so it seemed to have a nice knowing quality to it i'm you know i i'm i'm as skeptical about this movie as you are dan but the the footage was funny okay the paddle was very funny okay john cena was on good form he drank a entire bottle of water in one gulp why because he was just on it man he came in hot what can i say he came in hot but he was it was it a dare did someone say i bet you can't do that in one go no he just went he was talking because he was on very very performing he was he was he was really performing he was playing to the crowd and he went now i'm going to drink this water in one go and he just did it and everyone was like oh my god that's the greatest thing i've ever seen i mean i'm a big john cena fan yeah um but i'm not sure that would impress me yeah it didn't yeah that don't impress me much all right uh uh anyway so that looked fine uh john francis daly and jonathan goldstein came out and they brought a clip from mayday fan of those guys mayday i um my understanding is it's very good and uh i'm very much looking forward to it and And certainly the clip which had Ryan Reynolds and Kenneth Branagh trying to get out of a gnarly situation was very, very funny and inventive and cinematic.

39:57All the things you expect from these guys. More of a Game Night vibe than a Dungeons and Dragons vibe. I mean, I love Game Night. Game Night, in my opinion, the greatest comedy of the last, I'm going to backdate this so I don't include Anchorman, the last 20 years. Yeah, I don't think you're wrong. Although we had this discussion recently, unless you count Dungeons and Dragons as a comedy. like obviously it's more than it is a comedy but it's more than a comedy whereas i suppose game night is just operating almost purely within that genre no i think that i think that i i accept that dungeons and dragons is a comedy i think game night is a superior comedy oh okay okay fight you want to fight yeah no no no no i'm considering it okay i'm not i i think i think i i will accept this isn't fighting music by the way no this is loving music this this is definitely we'll get to that we'll get to that uh anyway so that panel was okay and it had like it had like there was more stuff for apple tv shows like dark matter and silo and um and and widow's bay which i thought might have been a season two kind of tease but was actually kind of a victory lap for for widow's bay yeah because so those days out there and silo's like what four episodes in now precisely so to be honest yeah i kind of had a sophie's choice today actually I'd say worse than the choice she presented with in that film yeah because I had a choice between going to the Apple TV panel or the Reacher panel and I thought that Apple TV might be more salient for our listeners and for our readers and so I went to that and I kind of it was a bit of a bit of a busted flush just from my point of view in terms of like is there much here for people to glom on to because people want to go to these things to come out with great big chunks of news and I didn't go to the Reacher panel and I had great big chunks of news so they announced that the fifth season of Reacher is going to be based on Make Me which is book 20 and is one of my favorite books they're kind of they're weirdly enough the last three seasons of Reacher have like been hitting my favorite Reacher books so Persuader and then Gone Tomorrow which is a new season that's about to start and now Make Me which is effectively I think one of the last lead child solo books and I'm very very excited about that but they also announced there's going to be a niggly book which is the you know the kind of his not sidekick but his loyal friend played by maria stenn and those in those shows alan richard of course sorry jack reacher is alan richard and uh she's now getting her own book her first book uh which will be co-written by lee child and another author as well so yeah anyway so i probably would rather go to that panel but anyway I would have made the same choice yeah that's what I tell myself that's what keeps me sleeping at night but the whole Marvel Studios panel I was never going to miss for the world and I'm so so glad I did so I'm going to run through very quickly the highlights so it started off with Kevin Feige it started off with this incredible recap reel of the MCU that was again genuinely goosebumps inducing and featuring not just the mcu characters but the x-men you know from the fox movies and whatnot which was great feige comes out on stage uh and then does a bit of business uh announcing the ghost writer movie in 2028 yeah which seemed to be willed into being over the years by ryan gosling who has been talking about this now the interesting thing so he drove it yeah do you drive a bike he wrote it he wrote it the interesting thing about this because people i know will immediately be going yeah hang on chris but didn't feige stand on that stage what eight nine years ago and announce inhumans as part of phase three or four and that never got made and didn't he stand on that stage about four years ago maybe five years ago with mahershala ali and announced blade yeah and we're still waiting for that movie to be made yes is the answer to both of those but this Ghost Rider has a release date so it's coming in 2028 and it has a director Sean Levy which is not the blade movie had directors but never really got to that point okay so that was exciting so he announced that he talked about what else did talk about at that point then it was very much I think on to doomsday pretty much I don't think they mean I don't think they talked about anything else uh yes they did what do they do what black panther that's at the end though oh okay so then they talked about doomsday and he brought on the russos joan anthony russo the directors of that movie and then they did something that i believe has never been done before uh they did a little bit of business going oh i can't see anyone at the back oh my god what's it like being in the back and you can't see us we're just ants here well what if we turn the back of the arena into the front of the arena.