In short
Episode topic: Three interviews about (1) Steven Knight’s Oasis reunion documentary Oasis: Don’t Look Back in Anger, (2) Camille Cottin on Call My Agent: The Movie, and (3) Corin Hardy on his Cine Supper event screening The Shawshank Redemption.
Guest backgrounds
- Steven Knight: writer/director/producer/creator of Peaky Blinders; co-creator of Who Wants to Be a Millionaire; now credited creator/writer on the Oasis documentary.
- Camille Cottin: star of the French series Call My Agent! (as Andrea); has appeared in Hollywood films including Kenneth Branagh’s A Haunting in Venice and Ridley Scott’s House of Gucci.
- Corin Hardy: director of The Hallow, The Nun, Gangs of London, and Whistle.
Key claims
- Knight says the film avoids probing the brothers’ past and focuses on reconciliation/redemption; he used fixed rehearsal cameras to capture nonverbal healing.
- Cottin says the movie stays joyful but turns emotional, with political concerns about culture under threat.
- Hardy promotes an immersive “Cine Supper” recreating a prison environment for Shawshank.
Notable examples
Cardiff footage of a young fan overwhelmed; Liam and Noel’s first rehearsal with no handshake; Liam grabbing Noel’s hand; Andrea’s character arc from agent to creative artist; Cine Supper prison platters, wardens/guards, and period trailers.
Written by AI. May contain mistakes. Listen to the episode to check what was said.
Chapters
Tap a time to open that second in VOEmotional Impact of Oasis Documentary
2:26 to 4:00
Discussion about the emotional moments in the Oasis documentary and its impact on fans.
“Yeah, I mean I did not, I mean I'm a big Oasis fan, but I did not expect, expect as Northern Irish coming through, I did not expect to be so moved by this documentary as I was.”
Steven Knight's Journey to Directing the Film
4:00 to 6:41
Knight shares his unexpected involvement in the Oasis documentary and his background with the band.
“Because that was the first one, I think, Noel says in the film, he said, when I walked out, I thought, I could do going back to the dressing room now because I have grossly underestimated what this is all about.”
The Making of the Documentary
6:41 to 8:14
Insight into the creative process and decisions while making the documentary about Oasis.
“at all or was that a relationship you had to forge?”
Rehearsals and Tension Between the Gallagher Brothers
8:14 to 10:38
Discussion on the dynamics during rehearsals and the initial interactions between Liam and Noel.
“And that shared desire quickly turned into a realization that the hatchet must be buried.”
Documentary Approach and Philosophy
10:38 to 11:50
Knight explains the unique approach taken in the documentary to showcase the Gallagher brothers.
“And one of the great quotes, and I still don't quite know what it means, but it's beautiful, where he says, look, you have to really, really care to not give a fuck.”
Audience Connection and Global Impact
11:50 to 14:01
Exploration of how Oasis's music resonates with audiences worldwide and the documentary's focus on fan stories.
“Well, yeah, you know, I wonder when they do live...”
The Emotional Resonance of Music and Documentary
14:01 to 20:16
Discover how music influences emotions and storytelling in documentaries.
“which is why when we found out that there is a whole new generation, the question is why are they finding the music?”
Introduction to Camille Cottin and 'Call My Agent'
20:16 to 20:36
Learn about the film 'Call My Agent' and its connection to its star, Camille Cottin.
“Thanks so much for your time Okay, that was Stephen Knight and Oasis Don't Look Back in Anger is out now in cinemas and on IMAX, which are also cinemas of course, but do you know what I mean?”
Camille Cottin Discusses Her New Film Experience
20:36 to 27:20
Camille shares her emotional journey while promoting her new film.
“The long-awaited feature film continuation of the beloved French series about the trials and tribulations of a French talent agency.”
Behind the Scenes of 'Call My Agent'
27:20 to 28:00
Explore the creative process and dynamics of the show 'Call My Agent'.
Show all 16 chapters
The Unexpected Success of the Show
28:00 to 31:26
Explore the surprising rise in popularity of the show amidst industry challenges.
“I mean, I remember hearing talk years ago of there being a film and maybe another season of the show.”
Returning to the Role After Five Years
31:26 to 33:48
Discuss the emotional journey and character evolution after a long break.
“And when she said yes, then it became concrete because we have this trust in Fanny's writing.”
The Actor's Experience and Industry Reflections
33:48 to 36:34
Delve into the complexities of being an actor and the impact of the show.
“It's not just an egotistic exposure or pressure.”
Challenges of Playing a Complex Character
36:34 to 40:56
Understand the intricacies of portraying a dark character in a new adaptation.
“He's been promoting his new film, The Dog Stars, recently.”
Corin Hardy's Film Journey and Style
42:31 to 48:17
Corin Hardy shares insights on his career, fashion choices, and anecdotes related to his movies.
“Which means it is time to welcome our guest.”
Cine Supper: An Immersive Cinema Experience
48:17 to 53:35
Discussion about the Cine Supper event, its unique themes, and past experiences.
“Thank you So what are you promoting apart from the 1990 movie Air America?”
Transcript
Automatic transcript. May contain errors.0:14Chris Hewitt:Hello Paul, I'm Chris Hewitt and welcome to the latest episode of The Interviews. Three crackers for you in this episode starting with Steven Knight, the incredibly prolific and versatile writer slash director slash producer slash creator of Peaky Blinders slash co-creator of Who Wants to Be a Millionaire, who this week adds yet another string to his already crowded beau by becoming a documentarian with Oasis Don't Look Back in Anger, which chronicles the return of Liam and Noel Gallagher as Oasis reunite after over a decade away due to a disagreement, or ten. The documentary, which is out now in cinemas and will soon hit Disney +, will be of particular interest to Oasis fans, of course.
0:58Chris Hewitt:Damon Albarn needn't apply as it chronicles their world tour last year its emotional impact on fans around the globe the rebuilding of those burnt bridges between Noel and Liam and of course the music which especially if you are an Oasis fan as I am remains fantastic speaking of Damon Albarn the film is directed by Dylan Southern and Will Lovelace who also directed the excellent Blur documentary from a few years ago No Distance Left to Run so maybe they could be the conduits for mending of relations between Blur and Oasis. Listen, if Liam and Noel can bury the hatchet, there's hope for everyone.
1:38Chris Hewitt:Anyway, the film is directed by Southern and Lovelace, but Knight is credited as creator and writer, and he popped into the pod booth just the other day for a natter about the movie, working with Liam and Noel, and single-handedly improving Disney Plus's C-word quotient by a magnitude. Enjoy.
2:25people are really responding to the emotion of the thing.
2:29Chris Hewitt:Yeah, I mean I did not, I mean I'm a big Oasis fan, but I did not expect, expect as Northern Irish coming through, I did not expect to be so moved by this documentary as I was. The Cardiff scenes, not just where Liam and Noel are coming out, but there's an amazing moment where the camera lights on this kid who couldn't have been more than I don't know what maybe eight or nine whenever they split up yeah probably younger and he's just kind of there as the concert's finished and he's just taking it all in and he's in absolute bits absolutely and I was just I was gone I mean that that moment gets me every time I've seen it so many times but it's when two complete strangers two sort of blokes come up and go you alright mate yeah and he's like yeah I'm fine I don't know it's a very humbling experience if you write dialogue for film because you don't need any dialogue or anything you just point at the camera at that moment and it's so moving it's absolutely wild it made me regret or as Northern Irish people I might say regret regret not getting tickets to see because I had my Oasis live experiences I saw them in Slane in 95 supporting REM I saw them at Nebworth and I was like you know what I'm good it's fine let other people pay through the nose for these tickets but then seeing the concert but you see the card of just the euphoria.
3:54Chris Hewitt:Oh my God, I regretted this so much. I could turn back time, Stephen. It was an incredible experience. Because that was the first one, I think, Noel says in the film, he said, when I walked out, I thought, I could do going back to the dressing room now because I have grossly underestimated what this is all about. Because the wave of emotion that just happened and to see two, even three generations of people all with their own view of what the song is and what it means to them. And there's a bridge built between them and the outpouring of emotion was very unexpected. And Noel said he had to turn his back because he was getting...
4:34Chris Hewitt:Yeah, because he was seeing generations come together, fathers and sons and mothers and daughters. It's just absolutely mind-blowing. Before we get into it, because I'm fascinated by the documentary and the choices that are made, the documentary, let's talk about you as an Oasis fan is that how you got involved in this or how did that all happen? Yeah I mean it was an odd route in that a couple of years ago I did a sort of cashless deal with Liam where I directed a video of one of his singles were in solo releases and in return he appeared live at Peaky Blinders Festival and of course he was brilliant and we got on really well And then years pass, and then just before Christmas 24, I got a text.
5:21I'm sitting at the keyboard, and I get a text saying, I know you're busy, but would you be interested? And it was an invitation to make this film. And so I texted. And this is from Liam? From Liam's partner, yeah.
5:33Chris Hewitt:Okay. And I texted back saying, I am very busy, however. Of course. I mean, you are very busy, Stephen. I know. But no, I couldn't resist this. I mean, it had a plot, it had a story, and I hoped it would be the story of reconciliation and redemption, which is what it turned out to be. So you weren't necessarily an Oasis fan? No, yeah. Back in the early bloom? I loved the music, and I was there or thereabouts in the 90s, and what I always responded to was the words of those songs, because, you know, Noel will say he just sat down and wrote them. He gets a lot of shit for his lyrics, but there's some really profound stuff in there.
6:12I think they're beautiful. And it's like, you know, these are things that you can sort of tell it's not someone sitting down thinking consciously, I'm going to write a song about whatever. These are just coming to him like all good poetry does. And that's why I think it's endured. It's the way that Liam delivers it. It's the words. And it's this idea of it is bad, but you can get out. You can escape. Yeah. That's the swagger of it, which I think is so important.
6:36Chris Hewitt:So you were kind of, your way in was through Liam, the Liam side. Did you have a connection with Noel? at all or was that a relationship you had to forge? Now, you know, one of the first things I did was speak to Noel and he said they were absolutely not expecting the tidal wave of interest when they announced the reunion. They thought there would be interest. They didn't think it would be that much and that's when they realized, hang on a minute, this is not just the original fans, there's a whole new generation here. And that's when I thought, well, what this documentary should be is asking the question, why?
7:11No marketing, no advertising they hadn't performed. And yet an entire generation across the globe had found the music for themselves and developed an attachment to it. I didn't realize how strong that attachment was until Cardiff, really. So I want to dig into, first of all, your credit on this,
7:32Chris Hewitt:because it comes up at the end, as I said at the beginning, created and written by Stephen Knight. And that's an unusual credit, I would say, on a documentary. I mean, what it means is, I mean, created as in... Are you taking credit for Oasis, Steve? No, no, no, no. Except that would be lucrative. Yeah, yeah. The writing is not, there's no dialogue. There's nothing written. And I love the idea that I could actually write dialogue and Liam and Norm would say, yeah, okay, I'll say that. That just ain't going to happen. No, writing as in writing what the thing is going to be. This is what this story is going to be.
8:07Fingers crossed that it's going to be hopeful. Yeah. redemption and all of those things because we didn't know because it's real life because you're
8:14Chris Hewitt:dealing with the gallagher brothers and they are combustible or could be combustible could but i have been i mean i think um you know we all get older we have kids and stuff and there's a great expression um the older i get the more like myself i become and all of the you know a lot of the pretension goes away you're not trying to prove anything anymore and i think you know there here were two brothers who were ready and they both shared a burning ambition to make this work to make the story that the they weren't happy with how that story ended no and they wanted to to make amends if you like and because they shared that desire um i believed that they would see it through and not uh liam says in the in the in the film he says i'm not even going to look at a cigarette i'm not even going to look at a drink i'm going to do it because everybody's you know he thought everybody's expecting him to be the one that will screw it up.
9:09And that shared desire quickly turned into a realization that the hatchet must be buried.
9:19Chris Hewitt:In terms of your involvement with it, because there's some incredible kind of fly-on-the-wall footage of the rehearsal process, were you on board at that point? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Were you there for that stuff? Yeah, I mean, the idea of putting fixed cameras into the rehearsal space. No one's going to go in and change batteries. The cameras are not going to move. They're just going to record exactly what they can see and then just record everything. And then the endeavor then is to find the lines, find the moments that tell the story of what's going on. And we're there for the first moment that Liam walks through the door.
9:57and they haven't they've not really spoken to each other in 16 years they haven't hardly been in the same room Liam walks through the door and before that you feel the tension as the band had been playing for a week getting the music right before the vocalist comes in and Liam walks in and goes what's that on the drums can we get rid of that yeah okay and then he's like are we ready should we go let's just go and then one two three four bang no handshake no hugs no high fives no words even and from that moment that's when that relationship began to heal it's interesting
10:32Chris Hewitt:because he leaves without saying goodbye if I remember rightly he just walks off as well and there's a sense even after that first rehearsal that Noel's like what the fuck was that yeah yeah yeah totally and what you know in structuring the thing it's like having Noel saying he does not give a fuck and then putting that next to Liam saying, I do care. And one of the great quotes, and I still don't quite know what it means, but it's beautiful, where he says, look, you have to really, really care to not give a fuck. And it's like, virtually everything either of them says could be put on a t-shirt.
11:12That's so funny and so articulate.
11:15Chris Hewitt:Yeah, absolutely. Liam is incredible. He goes from daft to profound, back to daft again in the space of a single sentence. It's wonderful. And also, So, you know, we can say fuck on the Emperor podcast, but the C word... Is pretty popular in this thing. It's pretty popular in this thing, and this is Disney +, and it's going to be Disney +, eventually, and I can't think of anything, apart from maybe Mickey's Christmas Carol, that has that many sea bombs in it. It's quite interesting. It's like salt and pepper on the meals. You know, it's just... These words are just there. It's the Irishness coming out.
11:51Well, yeah, you know, I wonder when they do live... interviews how they cope with that but yeah it's just all part
12:00Chris Hewitt:of who they are but they're so funny and so likeable and it's wonderful as well as you know as an Oasis fan who watched him over the years and you know maybe Liam's voice didn't always stand up to the rigors that he was putting it through should we say that he sounds amazing he sounds better than ever I think the band sound better than ever he sounds better than ever I think this is the best they've ever been. So it's like a reunion unlike most because it is actually the best they've ever been. And they actually give a shit as well. You can see how much they care, which is wild. Talk me through how it worked for you in terms of making this documentary because Will and Dylan are the directors as well.
12:45Chris Hewitt:So what's that relationship like? It's been fantastic. I mean, from the first moment, because I was told that Noel and Liam had agreed they wanted me to do the documentary. And I did point out I've never made a documentary before. They wanted me to do the interviews, and I'm not a journalist, you know what I mean? But it was because of that, not in spite of that. But of course, what you need is somebody who knows what the hell they're doing. So Will and Dylan are the best around. So it was a relationship where basically, having spoken to the brothers about what this wasn't going to be and what it shouldn't be.
13:23Which is what it kind of... It's like a conventional stadium tour film with cameras sweeping down on ropes and things. Is that it's going to be... First of all, we're not going to touch what's happening. We're not going to interfere. We're not going to be visible. We're not going to be present. We're going to just record what's happening. And the spirit of the whole thing is we're not pointing the camera in the hope or expectation of trouble. We positively want this to work. And so I've laid out the way, not only the way it should be done, but also what it should be about, the parameters of it, which is bigger than just the brothers, which is why when we found out that there is a whole new generation, the question is why are they finding the music?
14:10And the way to do that is find some people around the world who have a particular relationship to particular songs. In order to do that, we took on board a load of researchers who were brilliant and found people around the world who had a connection to particular songs so that we could just show those people and have them explain what the songs mean to them. And what that means is when you then see in the audience, in the crowd of the stadium, when two people come together, you think, well, I wonder what that story is then. I wonder why they are in that position. And the eloquence of the people, the lady in Korea who says, and she's got tears, you know, she's crying as she's saying it.
14:54She says, when you fall over, there is music that will pick you up. But with Oasis, when you fall over, they fall over with you and they get up with you. And it's just like all of these incredible emotional lines that are coming from the heart of people. It's like, as someone who writes fiction and writes dialogue, it's quite astonishing that when you point a camera at real people the things they can say oh man yeah
15:21Chris Hewitt:beautiful it's really really interesting as well in terms of you were talking about what the documentary is and the choices that are made as you say it's a very emotional documentary there are also interesting choices of course made and what it isn't what it isn't is a probe into what happened between Liam and Noel I mean that's it's called Don't Look Back in Anger for that reason. In other words, we're not, we established quite early on that's what happened and it was quite vicious and they meant it. And Noel says, I cannot forgive people right near the beginning. Once that's established, this is not about that.
15:59This is about reconciliation, forgiveness, redemption. All those positive things that at the moment are not very fashionable. You know, in the age of silence, screaming on keyboards and people being horrible and politicians trying to find division wherever possible. I really wanted this to be good old-fashioned 60s, peace, love, and understanding.
16:21Chris Hewitt:And everyone was aligned in that. In terms of decisions like that, who has the kind of final say on this? Do Liam and Noel have the final say? Is it you? I mean, they were busy. They were busy doing the tour, so it was important that when I sat down with them separately, to begin with, to make the point that's what this is going to be about. We're not going to try and sensationalize. We're not going to go down that road. And there were people around the early stages who were convinced that what this was going to be was us waiting for the car crash. Yeah. And that's absolutely not the point. And it's so much more powerful and emotional because we're actually naively believing in this.
17:06We believe in this stuff about redemption. and so that the spirit of that sort of informed everything and when we're looking for the stories go there go for that emotion go for that feeling because it's not corny you know we should be bold about this and it's the same whenever I'm writing stuff sometimes make it do that obvious thing you know don't be don't always try to be impressing your cool mates you know write stuff that really does go for people's hearts. Absolutely.
17:41Chris Hewitt:The car crash didn't come. No. It hasn't come. No. They were together last night. They were in Venice. Yeah. There's talk of more dates coming up as well. But nevertheless, were you on tenterhooks throughout the process, just in case? When I'm looking back, I think I must have been foolish because I didn't think it was going to happen because they were so certain that they wanted this to work. And then bit by bit, When Liam grabs Noel's hand when they walk out onto the stage, that wasn't planned. Noel didn't know it was going to happen. And he said, what the fuck? He's holding my hand. But then, bit by bit, things happened that were very subtle, that weren't even verbal about the way they were, that made you think this is going to be okay.
18:28And then the crucial moment, in my opinion, is when they felt safe enough to introduce their kids to each other. I was just about to say that, yeah. And they'd never met. The kids had never met. And suddenly these cousins meet for the first time. And they get on and they really like each other and become this gang. They're on tour with them. And once that happens, I think then you're family again. And I then felt we're in the home stretch now. It's going to be okay.
18:57Chris Hewitt:It's like, how do you know they're cousins? It's just look at the eyebrows. It's great when you meet them. You go, hi. was there something as well for you in terms of you know with Piggy Blinders you created something that spoke to an entire entire generation mostly I would say of young men but that's maybe not entirely accurate and Oasis did that as well about 20 years before Piggy Blinders was there something for you in that in terms of seeing the impact that both of these things have had on generations everything is weird everything's you realise it after the event somehow like somebody said when I started doing the press for this somebody said yeah this is about two brothers isn't it you know like Tommy and I I thought oh actually yeah you're right I never thought of it but I think it's one of those things you're drawn to things that you're naturally part of your creative process and people do point out there's a lot of fathers and sons there's a lot of brothers a lot of families in the work that I do and this is a perfect real life example to British Irish working class blokes who ain't gonna gush not gonna show their emotion but god it's there On that note, Stephen Knight, it's been an absolute pleasure Thanks so much for your time Okay, that was Stephen Knight and Oasis Don't Look Back in Anger is out now in cinemas and on IMAX, which are also cinemas of course, but do you know what I mean?
20:32Yeah. Yeah.
20:35Chris Hewitt:Not in cinemas, but on Netflix right now, in fact, is Call My Agent, the movie. The long-awaited feature film continuation of the beloved French series about the trials and tribulations of a French talent agency. The show hit a chord with people during the pandemic and became an international success, with the star Camille Cotin, who plays Andrea, making several movies in Hollywood, including Kenneth Branagh's A Haunting in Venice and Ridley Scott's House of Gucci. She returns, of course, in the movie with Andrea now moving on to film directing. And our Alex Godfrey, a massive fan of the show, leapt onto Zoom this week and had a lovely long chat with Camille, which you are about to hear now.
21:17Chris Hewitt:Enjoy. Or as they say in France, appreciate, I think. Has it been quite a heavy promo time for this film? Yeah, it is, but it's very joyful. It's been nice because we had our first public screening in a festival, Angoulême Festival, and it was nice because it was screened in about 12 cinemas, and it was great to have the people enjoying it all together. yeah so so and and and the reactions were pretty enthusiastic so it was um it was a relief and a joy you know it's it's it always makes you happy when you feel that you know the people are happy with with the film i literally finished watching it half an hour ago oh wow so you're full of the i'm actually really emotional yeah i found it really emotional which was surprising because I watched, you know, I've done the show.
22:19I watched the show during lockdown, like most of the world did with my girlfriend. And we've watched it a couple of times, like all the series. But I haven't seen it for a while.
22:33But the show was pretty emotional quite a lot of the time. And I went on quite a journey watching this film because the first hour of it or so, is just like a fun comedy and then sort of gets you by surprise and like almost very suddenly i won't spoil it for anyone listening but almost very suddenly with like 40 minutes to go or something it suddenly just became really emotional and more so and i realized um what the experience of watching that show had been like a few years ago and what the show was um there's a lot going on in this film it's great but i think fanny has always injected uh in in her work uh some some some concerns some contemporary concerns and even though it's a comedy uh she's always wanted she she has this need of saying what matters to her.
23:40And it's true that, yeah, the show, and, you know, it might be a little bit political, but I think culture is being threatened because of extreme right, and we are very worried here in our country that they might access to power and to government and that they're very clear about what they intend to do with culture. They want to cut most of our finances. And so the film doesn't talk about this, but the film pays tribute to making a film together, the, the, the, the, how being united and being together is a way of, overcoming adversity and how difficult it is to make a film. How hard it is. It also talks about a trajectory.
Read the full transcript
24:45We don't want to reveal it. So no spoiling. But yeah, the story of the woman and then we understand at the end what the story is about. But it is also a political matter. Anyway. So yes, it's getting emotional and Andrea has a particular journey in it. She's more emotional than never. She's more vulnerable. So, yes. It started in 2015. You were already a successful, you know, actor in France. But do you remember exactly when this show came to you and what it was like reading scripts for the first time and building Andrea as a character as we would become to know her on screen? Yes, I remember.
25:33We had a big edition and they obviously, as the show was about welcoming some major stars and actors and famous actors, it was deliberate that they were casting non-identified actors. aged we were around 30 or so except for Camille and Stéphie who are except for Fanny Sidney and Stéphie Selma who were obviously younger and their parts required younger people but and at that time Netflix began it was like the early beginnings of Netflix but the show was meant to be broadcast on a national TV. So it was a time also when TV and cinema were still very different. But this show was special because Cédric Lapiche was a cinema director that our generation really liked, was directing it.
26:42And it was quite new to have a cinematographic director handling a show. And now it's become very common. And people from cinema just enjoy very much doing some shows. But at that time, it wasn't yet settled like this. And so we had this big audition that lasts for about three months. They've seen a lot of people. and I remember that I really really loved that character the flow of her speech her attitude her um her personality her the fact that her sexuality was not um a matter that she was such a free spirit that she was so good at what she does and she was inspired from an agent who really exist whose name is elizabeth thaler and um so yes that was it but i think regarding lockdown you're you're right uh probably the success of the show is obviously having the pleasure of discovering what's happening backstage and what you're not supposed to know so you really lift the curtain but i think also it's about a family working together in an office and what happens in a professional family which is sometimes you're in competition sometimes you have betrayals sometimes you have love affairs sometimes you but when when it's uh necessary then you all gather together and make a group and i think maybe during lockdown the people really missed their time in the office and being together with all the conflicts and that it may draw but uh with the yeah the so it probably also explains the success of the show at that particular moment which was completely unexpected and unexpected because we had just wrapped yeah i knew i knew the show had a certain success in in in england but i mean it was a niche success from people from the industry right and then it became wider but no none of us could expect what happened yeah i mean just you said you'd wrapped i mean you you you're saying you'd wrapped the fourth and final season yeah yeah yeah it was it was meant the show was meant to be over we never thought we would do this film yeah because i think the reason why we also did this film is that because everything that happened after and the the world why i'm putting it into brackets that people can't see because it's a podcast but it's true it's true that I've traveled in Argentina in Greece um in um in uh in Italy and and some people recognize me so I could you know and I know there's been some remake in India so I know it's true that the show has been has had an international recognition and um and I think this was also something that was enjoyable by doing this film was also because So we had our time, we were time connected to the people because the moment they discovered the show, we were already doing something else.
30:00What was it like? I mean, I remember hearing talk years ago of there being a film and maybe another season of the show. I mean, it felt like almost as soon as, 2021, maybe it was announced. what it's been four or five years though has it been easy for you to stay emotionally attached and still know that it was coming or was there a part of you that felt it been too long and wasn't sure well really even though first up producers uh did did uh did say that in the press they said oh yeah maybe we're going to do this but none of us were really you know um we just said yeah why not but but it was not something that was worked on okay you know it was not concrete so um and then they came back to fanny who was the initial showrunner and she didn't do season four so um i was sure after season four that i didn't want to continue without Fanny Herrero on the show.
31:14So personally, and I think we all agreed that we will stop there. So then when they said, oh, we might do a season five or we might do a show, we just, you know, it was something in the air, but not concrete. And then the producers went back to Fanny and invited her on board. And when she said yes, then it became concrete because we have this trust in Fanny's writing. So, yes, this is how it changed. What was it like for you then finally coming back and doing it? Because it's a really interesting story for Andrea, this film, because, you know, some film directors say that making movies is life and death.
31:54And it almost literally is for her. You know, she's got so much on the line in this film, having to make this film. This film has so many ramifications for her personally and professionally. But also you're coming back to play the character five years later. You know, you've moved on since then. You've got, you know, another half decade of life experience that you can put into the character that you didn't have before. How did that change things for you? Well, I think you're right. the thing that was interesting both complicated and also a good help I would say is that Andrea has really changed also so she quit being an agent and then she faced her own desire of becoming creative artistically creative and suddenly becoming the people she used to represent but also her daughter is now five years old, six years old.
32:58So she really had time to become a mom. And I think it's like fast-forwarding your experience and maturity to take care of somebody. So she was different. So I just accepted that she was the same, but she had changed. And it was interesting also to have her start the movie with a lot of enthusiasm, a lot of excitement, but also a kind of vulnerability and a lot of risk. Because as we understand in the movie, the problem with Colette and their separation. And she, I mean, she risks a lot with this movie. She puts everything, she's all in. She puts everything on the table. And this is, it makes it interesting.
33:52It's not just an egotistic exposure or pressure. She has lots more going on. It's a really interesting character study, and the show was as well. And I was just thinking, as I was watching the film, actually, it must be really interesting for you as an actor to play a role that so incisively interrogates so many facets of what it is to be an actor. The film and the show really sort of dissects the egos and insecurities and fragility of what it is that actors do. I remember the Monica Bellucci episode of the show was incredible in terms of you know dissecting what public perception of people and what might be going through actors heads what's it like for you off camera as an actor to be working on a show that that dissects your profession so much it's great but I think you know it's funny to be on the other side It's pretty funny to be on the agent side and on the side where you have to make over for all those crazy obsessions and doubts.
35:21So I think it brings you the distance that should be required with all this. The safety distance. Has anything that you've done on and explored in the show had any impact on on what you do outside of the show? Has it made you think about what you do or what your agent does in any way? No.
35:49No, but no, because honestly, I mean, what happened is that I experienced that, for example, I refused a part. And then I was jealous when I heard who took the part after me. I mean, not jealous, but I thought, oh, my God, I wouldn't expect such an actress to take that part that I just turned down. And so I thought, oh, maybe I made a mistake. And, you know, this kind of thing. So it reminded me, for example, La Rafa Bien. And so what I would say is that I have experienced some of the things that went in the show. Or sometimes I experienced some situations and I think that could be a great episode.
36:33yeah but don't ask me which because now i'm like oh i don't know i don't know but it happens to me to have you know well you've been doing some really amazing things and and and films outside of the show as well i mean you did house of gucci which was a crazy film yeah um you had the ridley scott experience which it could have been something from call my agent because he's such a colourful director. He's been promoting his new film, The Dog Stars, recently. I've interviewed him a few times. He's such a brilliant person. I love him. He's great. Yeah, I was going to ask, because he's so direct. I get the sense that he's direct on set.
37:13He certainly is when you talk to him in an interview. He's got no filter. There's no bullshit with him. How was that for you? I loved it. Honestly, I really love it. because he has this complete trust with actors. So at the same time, you can feel a bit, I hope what I'm doing is all right. But then he sees everything. Anything you propose, tiny detail, you take the cigarette at that time, you propose to share it with, like, for example, Adam Driver. He's like, I like the thing with the cigarette. But he's really into the images. He has, like, eight cameras. You don't see the cameras. Almost you don't see.
37:44You don't know where the cameras are. And all his crew, he's very faithful. so the team they you know like for for example the hair and makeup team they told me when they prepared me uh be prepared because he's only doing two takes and you're like two takes yeah yeah because he has 14 cameras obviously but i've i've never had this experience with anyone else and uh so you have so obviously the energy on set is not the same because you think that your first take might be the one in the film so you're like but that's great it's like theater you know so you just have one take so it's fine you just have to know well let me just finish off by asking you about the next one we've got coming out which i believe is les miserables the new adaptation of that which is coming out in france next i'm not sure about the uk but i just i saw the trailer came online a couple of days ago i watched it i've never read the book i know this the musical really well i've been to see it a few times um you play madame tenardier and in in the musical she is a very comedic character and you know there's singing and dancing of course it from what i could see in the trailer you are not this is not funny it looks like you're playing her as a genuinely horrible maybe even evil human being would i would that be about right not Not completely.
39:11She's a little bit funny. She is. No, they are because they are grotesque. Does it exist grotesque? But yes, I do feel very nasty and very, because the director, Fred Cavallier, has really reinterpreted. It's his own interpretation of the book. I mean, everything is pretty faithful. But regarding the couple, he changed because in the book, it's Mr. Thénardier who's really the brain. And she's in love with him and she's just doing everything he wants. And she's very violent with the child, physically violent. And he's the one doing all the strategies and she's just following. Whereas now, Fred Cavalier inversed it.
39:59And I'm the brain. And I'm always frustrated with my husband not being strong enough. And I always insult him as being a coward. And she's really the one with a strong instinct. And anyone who comes into her tavern, into her bar, she's always feeling people and just jumping on someone whom she can use for her own survival. But she's very nasty, too. But I think, you know, Victor Hugo describes her as a pig with eyes of a tiger in the book. And because she's supposed to be huge, very, very tall with a very low voice and a lot of physical strength. And he says that there's nothing feminine in her.
40:49And I mean, feminine attributes, let's say. and um and so as i'm pretty small and tiny i thought okay so maybe not the pig but i'll try the snake so that's it that's maybe what you've seen okay i can't wait for it all right well thank you thank you so much sorry for ending so abruptly no um thank you for having the curiosity to watch our film and to interview me thank you very much no it was great i appreciate it it was It was a very emotional experience watching the film and it was great to talk to you. So thank you. Thank you. Bye.
41:25Chris Hewitt:Okay, that was Camille Cotin talking to Alex Godfrey and Call My Agent, the movie, is out now on Netflix. Last but not least, this week you're going to get an extended excerpt from the live show we did last week at King's Place London, our spiritual home, as part of this year's London Podfest. It's always a blast doing these September shows and this was no exception. We didn't plan to release this show as a podcast, but King's Place recorded it for us, which was nice of them, and it was a ton of fun. So it is currently available for Empire Plus subscribers. But this is, of course, the interviews.
41:59Chris Hewitt:And so we're going to bring you the interview portion of the show as friend of the pod, Corin Hardy, director of this year's Whistle, rode to our rescue, as you'll hear, and was on excellent form. You won't hear here his participation in a quiz called Not Mastermind, for legal reasons, or the bit where he did a flying kick on stage. You may have seen the pics and video, though, on social media. But you are going to have a lovely time as he talks about his involvement in something called the Cine Supper. What is that? Well, listen on. Enjoy. I think that's a small talk done with, right? Thank God.
42:33Chris Hewitt:Yeah, OK. Which means it is time to welcome our guest. Now, yes, very, very exciting indeed. Now, full disclosure, this man is a hero. A hero of mine, a hero of ours. Because we didn't have a guest until about 12 o 'clock yesterday. And we had a couple of guests lined up. But for the first time doing this show, they fell through at the last minute. I was in something of a quandary, wasn't I, guys? Very much so.
43:08Corin Hardy:That panic, I would have said. Despair is how I would have maybe labelled it.
43:13Chris Hewitt:Yeah, I was pulling my hair out and I backdated it by several years. And so this person who's about to come out on stage, this hero, right, who you're all going to receive like in a rapturous reception, accidentally texted me about 12 o 'clock yesterday, to which I replied, what are you doing tomorrow night? And the answer is this. Would you please welcome the director of The Hallow, The Nun, Gangs of London and Whistle, Corin Hardy!
43:53Chris Hewitt:Rapturous reception! Rapturous!
44:07Corin Hardy:I'm pleased to be your sloppy seconds today The runner-up Lovely to be here again, thank you
44:14Chris Hewitt:You were always, always top of my list, as you know But I didn't think you had anything to promote So I didn't ask you to do this podcast You were wrong I was very wrong what a segue my god we're going to win an award for best segues one of these days what do you have to promote Korn Hardy by the way what are you dressed as
44:35Corin Hardy:it's just me it's just the way I dress
44:38Chris Hewitt:I mean I love your look I love your style I mean
44:42Corin Hardy:well maybe someone in New Orleans who's got an eagle I can see
44:46Chris Hewitt:is anyone a binoculars or a telescope a little clue Korn is wearing a t-shirt that says US Antarctica research program Outpost 31. What is that from? The Thing. He's dressed as a Thing. I wish. Here's the thing, we've all come as a Thing, right? It's Chris! Why don't we just sit here for a little while and see what happens. Corrin, you were dressed as R.J. McCready.
45:18Corin Hardy:I always like hats. This is my McCready hat. I thought I'd wear it today. And I've brought in my... Actually, this jacket... It's actually from Air America, I just realised. It's Robert Downey Jr.'s jacket from Air America.
45:29Chris Hewitt:This is Robert Downey Jr.'s jacket from Air America? What, really? It actually is, yeah.
45:36Corin Hardy:Cool. That's not some kind of weird clue either.
45:40Chris Hewitt:This just...
45:41Corin Hardy:I'm not remaking Air America or the thing, sadly. No, a friend of ours used to run the Angels and Bermans and Nathan's costume here in London. and a good family friend. And a long, long time ago, I was able to acquire some clothes from there. And this was always, it looked like an Indiana Jones jacket. And then I sort of thought it's quite a good McCready jacket.
46:06Chris Hewitt:That's amazing. So what's the name of, there's a name on there?
46:09Corin Hardy:Well, I did a video for, funnily enough, the band The Feeling. And it was a sort of Russian astronaut, cosmonaut. And I made badges for everyone in that way. and I made my own one.
46:22Chris Hewitt:And so you have defaced Robert Downey Jr.'s jacket with your own name. I might even say, yeah. That's amazing. Has anyone seen Air America in this audience? Does anyone know what we're talking about? It's a film from 1990. Roger Spottiswood, I think, directed it. Not very good. Great jacket, though. It's a good jacket. Great jacket. The jacket is the best thing to come out of that movie. Robert Downey Jr. and Mel Gibson in one movie. I'm going to say nothing more at this point. I'm going to ask. Thank you so much. Robert Downey Jr. in 1990. It's a different kettle of fish. It's a different thing.
47:03Chris Hewitt:Check those pockets, Corin. Wait a minute.
47:11Chris Hewitt:And there's enough for everybody.
47:17Crikey.
47:19Chris Hewitt:It's snowing inside King's Place It really is Christmas It's the most magical time of year This is our second crack joke of the night What's going on? Can you make crack snow? Does anyone know? I'm not very au fait with crack Despite appearances Despite the phrase I'm not very au fait Which makes it sound like you really are You go up to a dealer going I hear you're very au fait with crack Might one procure some With the crack With the crack Has anyone done crack? As your lawyer No I always thought it was like Like a kind of You've cooked it in a spoon And then We're moving on I'm just not sure That you could make crack snow Anyway Corin, thanks for joining us Thank you So what are you promoting apart from the 1990 movie Air America?
48:26Corin Hardy:Well, I mean thanks for having me on but one thing I did put a few flyers out in the bar because I have a local festival down where I live the Chidding Lai Festival which is an arts festival I've spoken about it on your podcast before and I wanted to mention it to these guys and anyone listening because each year I do an event called the Cine Supper, which is an immersive night of cinema and dining put together. And we're going to be screening the Shawshank Redemption and creating a prison environment in the village hall. When you say prison environment, how does that work? Wardens, guards, intimidation.
49:11Corin Hardy:It'll be fun. food served in prison platters, but gourmet style, and live music and period trailers from the year that the movie... We've had The Godfather, we've had Back to the Future, and we've had... I went to that one. You were there.
49:25Chris Hewitt:It was so fun.
49:27Corin Hardy:Yeah, we had The DeLorean as well. The actual one, not the actual one, but... Great Scott. Yeah. That's amazing. Did you go to the secret cinema? Do you know what? I've not, and I would love to have been at those, but I haven't, so we're making our own in this little village. It's a group of volunteers that put it on and it's a great night and actually I've just had this poster made, it's a hand drawn non AI poster
49:54Chris Hewitt:Try a different angle
49:57Corin Hardy:So this is Oh yeah
50:00Chris Hewitt:No Corrin, that's worse Oh my god
50:04Corin Hardy:This is the Simpsum for this year
50:06Chris Hewitt:Oh okay That's great That was a very good ooh, by the way. I like that. Why don't we put that poster over a big hole in the wall and nobody will know. If anyone wants to escape from this podcast, this man can get you out. Problem is it takes 30 years. But seriously, how often do you really look at a man's shoes? Yeah, not that often. Precisely, right? Although I look at a man's shoes much more often now because of the Shawshank Redemption. Yes.
50:39Corin Hardy:what other quotes from movies taught you something that you now have taken into your life
50:45Chris Hewitt:never rub another man's rhubarb before Batman I was constantly rubbing another man's rhubarb how do I get out of this chicken shit outfit is the one that springs to mind if I'm honest with you so would you just go into their gardens or what like sure Helen let's go with that shall we go for the question
51:10Corin Hardy:a real phrase though to rub rhubarb I mean where did that come from I wonder or did Jack Nicholson just make it up
51:17Chris Hewitt:it has the feel of an ad lib about it what about yourself what other movie quotes do you live and die by you get busy living groovy I get a lot of shit at Empire for my reviews writing for some reason I don't know why it made me retire from the reviews writing business but apart from the Attack of the Clones fiasco I wrote a review of Shawshank years ago in our final cut section that's what it's called now because it's good and I edited it but back when it was shit it was, I wrote something I wrote a Shawshank review What did you give it? I gave it five stars because it's one of the greatest movies ever made and it's one of my top ten films of all time and I will be at the Cine Supper and it's going to be amazing and I didn't realise that it's pronounced Chidding Lai, so that's good.
52:06Chris Hewitt:Thank you for that. And I started this review with, if you haven't seen Shawshank, chances are you're beyond redemption. And I ended it with, get busy living, get busy buying. And I was so...
52:23Chris Hewitt:I was so proud of that. Little Chris, when I had hair, and I was like, oh, and dreams and hopes. Before the crack. I was so, yeah. My pockets were filled with crack. I just rubbed another man's rhubarb, but I was so happy. And then those lines came out of me, and I thought, this is great. This is a pinnacle. This is exactly what Empire has been missing. Good writing. And then I've been, I lambasted. Yeah, it was a bit hot. Lambasted publicly for that for many, many years. But anyway, hey-ho. So, Corinne, what are you going to do with this poster? Is this...
53:00Corin Hardy:Well, I just wanted to say that the Shawshank Redemption Cine Supper, if anyone's interested in coming down, you go on to thechiddinglifefestival.co.uk or look on my Instagram and things like that. I'm posting links to it. There's also comedy and burlesque. I don't know if anyone saw the movie Lee, which I believe I talked about a couple of years ago. Tony Penrose, who's the son of Lee Miller, is presenting a making of the Lee Miller film as well as an event starts it off. So there's all sorts of jazz, there's poetry, and there's the Cine Supper. So chillinglifefestival.co.uk.
53:37Chris Hewitt:Okay, that was Caren Hardy live on stage at King's Place in London. And if you are interested in attending the Cine Supper at the Chilling Life Festival and eating along with the Shawshank Redemption, then tickets are available at chillinglifefestival.co.uk. that's C-H-I-D-D-I-N-G-L-Y festival.co.uk as a great man once said get busy living get busy buying and on that note that is it for this episode of the interviews hope you enjoyed it Diane Wiest and Stockard Channing two ruddy legends and the stars of Practical Magic 2 are the guests on this week's Mothership Empire podcast which will be available from tomorrow Friday and a Belcher it is too.
54:26Chris Hewitt:As ever, thank you so much for listening. See you next time. Bye bye.
From the publisher
It's another jam-packed edition of The Interviews this week, folks. First, Chris Hewitt sits down with Peaky Blinders creator Steven Knight as he tackles another project about complicated brothers, the documentary Oasis: Don't Look Back In Anger, which chronicles the return and reconciliation of Liam & Noel Gallagher. We hear Damon Albarn loves it. Then Alex Godfrey has a lovely chat on Zoom with Camille Cottin, the star of Call My Agent!: The Movie, the feature-length continuation of the hit French Netflix series. And finally we bring you an excerpt from our live show at Kings Place last week, as Corin Hardy drops by to shamelessly plug an intriguing Shawshank Redemption experience. Enjoy!