The Shameless Plug #8: Wicked Panna Cottas

0:15Hello Pod, I'm Chris Hewitt and welcome to the latest episode of the Shameless Plug, the magazine, podcast, crossover, type thing, where I sit down every single month with Empire editor Nick Disemleon, and we go through the latest issue of the world's biggest movie magazine which is, checks notes, Empire, our very own magazine. Here it is. I'm holding up to the camera right now. That is last month's issue. It is. Yeah, the one job. I chased myself around London and I found myself and I shouted the running mag at myself and for my efforts I was rewarded with a copy of the running mag. This is meant to be the shameless plug, not the shameful plug.

0:57what you just did. It was shameful. Anyway, the reason I have last month's issue and not this month's issue is because I had the cove and I wasn't able to get into the office to pick up a copy of the issue and I should have just gone to a good or evil newsagent and bought one with my own money and then claimed it back. But anyway, that's not my... A good or wicked newsagent. I should have gone to a wicked newsagent. Nick DeSemlian is here. Hello, Nick. Hello, Chris. I am defying gravity to join you. I don't know what that means. Have you written down a whole bunch of wicked puns and you're just going to deploy them mercilessly throughout this podcast?

1:33I thought we could do this episode entirely in song as a duet, but then I came to myself, I soaped up and I realised that was a terrible idea. But yes, which of us is Glinda and which of us is Elphaba? I think we all know the answer to that one. Yes, I'm the talking goat. But yes, I'm very happy to be here talking to you again about a wicked for good issue. Yes, it's very, very exciting. But before we get into it, Nick. Should we say where here is? Because here is usually the studios at Empire Towers. But today we are doing this for the first time, maybe last time, in shameless plug history. And we're doing this from our respective homes.

2:10I'm doing this from your home. You're doing this from mine. Strange, but there you go. Where are you exactly? I'm not going to give you my exact location because that would be to announce where I live in full on a podcast. But I won't do that. But I've got a nice view. I can actually kind of see a cow out of the window. Okay A bit of a cow It's not a talking cow You're out in the sticks And the reason that We are doing this early And we're doing this remotely I'm not going to say Exactly why either Because that might Compromise you again But you're going away I am I'm going on a trek And I'm not even going to hint Where I'm going Because it's that secret It's not that secret You can say You can say roughly Where you're going You can say I'm going to America You're going to America I don't want to You're going to be You're going to be Where you're going to be And you're going to be like on the gram taking pictures from coffee shops and stuff like that aren't you so you might as well just say it now uh yeah all right I'm gonna be in Los Angeles it's hardly a shock that the editor of the world's biggest movie magazine is going to Los Angeles that's fine but that's it we're saying nothing else nothing else and I'll tell oh no I almost no one is gonna say anything especially that guy but you will in a couple months time Yeah, pretty soon, I would say in about six weeks, you will find out.

3:29And it is an exciting one, I must say. Even by standards of general excitement around these parts, this is a big one, so cannot wait. Even by Nick's standards of bagging the best gigs for himself, this is a good one. If you thought that going for two days and you're seeing it with James Cameron was impressive, an impressive flex, this is an equally impressive flex, I would say. When you put it like that, I sound like a monster. But there are rational, logical reasons for all of it. And I'm not a monster, I promise. But yeah, I should probably just stay here for a year or two. Nah, you're fine.

4:07Not all the good stuff. But yeah, no, it's an exciting one. It's a nerve-wracking one, but it's exciting. We'll be shamelessly plugging it in two months' time. Oh my God, I look forward to shamelessly plugging that one. And I look forward to shamelessly plugging this one because you're absolutely right. This is issue. Let me just double check. I'm going to look at my Running Man issue and then extrapolate from there. Issue 446 of Empire Magazine, November 2025 issue. It is on the cover. Nick, we've already given it away. What is it? I fly my pretties it is was that good no okay this is our wicked for good issue we're not in Kansas anymore to quote the great Miles Quaritch from Avatar we are in Oz for this issue and we are yeah we have a big old Oz Stravaganza where we have talked to everybody for for wicked for good wicked for good so this is the sequel to Wicked.

5:06Wicked, of course, is the stage show in the Broadway hit musical phenomenon that you can see on the London stage right now. If you go to London West End, I think it's near Victoria is where it's on. I might be wrong about that. I mean, that's where Hamilton is. Wicked was there, then Hamilton moved there and Wicked moved somewhere else. I don't know where Wicked's playing at the moment in London. Wasn't the Wicked Witch played by Margaret Hamilton? She was. It's all coming together. Oh my God, she was not throwing away her shot. Yeah. But yeah, no, we did not do a Wicked part one cover although we did an amazing photoshoot with Cynthia Erivo in which she was literally defying gravity because we kind of had her doing an incredible pose off the ground.

5:44Go online and have a look at that. But yeah it was such a phenomenon last year it exploded. I mean you live in Greenwich right? I do. I live in Greenwich. Greenwich. Greenwich. Did that impact your life in any way? Not in any meaningful way no but it was lovely. I mean they had a big old ceremony up at the I think it was the observatory I'm not entirely sure what they did or maybe the old Royal College and they had Jonathan Bailey and Cynthia Erivo and Jeff Goldblum who were actually here in Greenwich and for two weeks or so pretty much all the official signage around the town that could be changed was changed to reflect the wicked fonts and everything was called Greenwich instead of Greenwich which makes sense and I absolutely loved it and I have to say as well I really really liked the film.

6:33The first one, the first Ricket, when it came out last year, I hadn't seen the stage show. My wife had, but I hadn't seen it. I had heard it, you know, she plays it around the house sometimes, so I'd heard Defying Gravity a whole bunch. But I was a little bit skeptical about the first one, I'll be honest with you. And then when I went to see it, I was absolutely blown away by it. The songs were terrific. The performances were great. It looked fantastic as well. I was like, yes, please. Because I was thinking, like most people, Nick, why have they split this into two parts? Why have they done that?

7:03but the first one is so much fun that I was quite glad that there was a second part coming around. I did not, Lowe, expect it to wind up on the cover of Empire. Now, this is perhaps one in the eye for all of Lowe's. You say we only put a Star War, a Marvel, or a Marvel Star War on the cover. Can you tell the good folks at home your thinking behind putting Wicked for Good on the cover? How did this happen? Well, a lot of thinking went into it. It is what you could call a swing because it's not a sure thing. I mean, it is actually, FactFans, the first time in Empire's 36-year history that we put a musical on the cover.

7:40What? Never before have we. I went through and I checked every issue because I was like, I was almost certain. But then I went through and checked and we have never put a musical on the cover. Moulin Rouge was not on the cover because it was one of the first issues that I was there for. No Moulin Rouge. No West Side Story. Yeah. No. We have never done it before. So who knows? Please buy it so we can do more of this kind of stuff. But it's one of those that, yeah, like you said, we don't want to just keep doing superhero films. We don't want to just keep doing, you know, the stuff people necessarily expect.

8:13The film was a massive pop culture phenomenon. And yeah, we thought it worth a go. And we have the world's first interviews with the actors. We have a lot of new imagery that no one's seen before. Yeah. And it's exciting. I'm excited. Very exciting. And so this is another one of Nick's plum gigs that you bagged for yourself, right? And you flew to Oz and you spent four days living inside the head of John M. Chu. And then, no, is this not what happened? Who did this in the end? Who actually went on? I was waiting for my business class travel to be booked. And then I was informed I would have to travel via Tornado, which frankly is a deal breaker.

8:52You want the first class bubble to take you around. You got to step outside your bubble, Nick. There wasn't enough legroom in the bubble. So instead, we have dispatched the ace, Helena Horror, who reviewed the first one for us and loved it. And yeah, she has done an amazing job talking to everyone. And so everyone from Ariana Grande, Cynthia Erivo, Jeff Goldblum, Michelle Yeoh, Jonathan Bailey. So it is a proper extravaganza. And yeah, we've got new information on the songs from this new one. Because this is not a harder sell, but it's an interesting one because the second half of a lot of Broadway musicals is sometimes not as good as the first half in terms of the songs.

9:39The songs are usually bangers in the first half, and then the second half, you've got the story. They just don't know what they're singing by the second half. And there's a lot of pressure in this one to deliver because people loved the first one. It was Oscar nominated and Cynthia Erivo and Ariana Grande were both nominated for Oscars for that. You could argue all day long until you were green in the face that Cynthia Erivo actually should have won for that, but didn't. And there's a challenge on John M. Chu's books here, isn't there? He has to deliver great tunes in this one. I believe there are a couple of new songs in this one, which is exciting for the Grande heads and the Erivo maniacs.

10:19And also tie it up with a certain film I like to call The Wizard of Ozzy. Is that maybe pronounced correctly? Wizard of Oz. Wizard of Oz, I believe, is the common pronunciation. Sorry. Yeah, no, this one you're going to see Dorothy, feel though um john m2 confirms in our article that uh you're only going to see her from behind you're not going to get a like a full look at her but yeah you're going to get the tin man the cowardly lion all of that stuff is part of this yellow brick road which is on our subs cover so we are going to oz in a big way hopefully david zaslav's face will not be on any of the munchkins unlike the uh the sphere experience in vegas um but who knows maybe maybe that would be a good thing if it was.

11:04Imagine if our subs cover was David Saslav. That would be incredible. It's a munchkin. It was in contention. But yeah, the first one grossed, I think, just over 750 million. It was one of the biggest films of last year. This has got a high benchmark to clear, but they talk a good game. And Ariana Grande provides my new favourite phrase, which I'm going to start using a lot in conversation. She describes the press tour for the first film as a carbonating experience. And I love that. Oh. This is a carbonating experience right now. This is a carbonating experience. Quite fizzy. Quite fizzy. All right.

11:39We're slightly stymied a little bit in that I don't have the issue to hand. So my usual thing of reading out the first line of every feature in my voice, you know, the voice. Nick, I can't do it. What a tragedy. What a tragedy for everyone. You can't do that. No, no, no. I'm shutting it down. What's the first line of Helen's feature? Oh my god, Wicked Director John M. Chu shakes his head. Oh my god, Wicked Director John M. Chu shakes his head. That's a pretty standard response when I interview someone, but no, it is setting up, basically Helen starts her piece with Talk of the Yellow Brick Road, and he's describing how he was trying to figure out exactly what colour the yellow bricks should be, how they should be lined up, how big are they.

12:28He gets into grouting. it's a whole great paragraph where he goes into all of the many many many like micro questions when you're a director you have to make so many decisions every day and we're often about the tiniest thing but they all build a mass to the final film and so you get a sense of the weight of responsibility on someone trying to do something in the world of Oz and grouting is apparently a serious concern amazing love it Nick there's one last thing I want to say before we move on, I'm very excited about this movie. Not least because John M. Chu is, I think, Hollywood's king of sequels.

13:08He is the director of Step Up 2, The Streets. I don't know whether the road was yellow brick in that one or not, or whether the streets were yellow brick, but... Yeah, what was the grouting situation? What was the grouting? What was the grouting like in his second sequel? G.I. Joe, Retaliation. Mm-hmm. And what was the brickwork like in Now You See Me 2, which he also directed in 2016? This is his fourth second film in a franchise. He should have made it wicked. Number four. That would have been confusing. It should have been wicked too good. Yes. Too good, too wicked. I don't know. Anyway. I do think movie titles should reflect how many second sequels the filmmaker has made.

13:52That should be claimed and labeled in the title. But that's four. That's unusual. That's four second sequels Or four second movies in a franchise Is that a record? Write in If you're listening to this and you think Oh that's an interesting question you posed there Chris Do write in and let me know the answer Has John M. Chu Inadvertently and almost certainly Accidentally broken a record by directing Four second movies In a franchise Write in, let us know It's getting more interesting every time you repeat it but if you could please if you're sending in an answer please send it to chris do not send it to please leave me out of it uh right should we move on yeah let's move on okay right so we're moving on to ballad of a small player um now this is one trip i did turn down uh this was to macau um wasn't enough legroom again but um we sent tom ellen that's a joke that's a joke by the way in case people are gonna get mad about stuff again i'm joking i'm joking about all of this i do sound like a monster i promise i promise i promise this is all jokes i didn't get over this what the hell what the hell yeah i would have gone to macau this is uh the next film from edward burger who did conclave um a film i really really really liked i kind of went into that one not expecting too much um i thought it would be a bit stuffy and it wasn't it was really exciting yeah it was really dynamic really sleek and this is uh a very exciting one for me because i've read the book that it's based on.

15:23Oh, good. Well done. Points for you. And I loved it. And I can totally imagine him injecting it with that energy, which the book has as well. It's about a guy called Lord Doyle, played by Colin Farrell, who is in Macau. He's on the run. He's done some light embezzling in the UK. And he's been hunted. And he is basically a compulsive gambler. And he can't stop. And he is basically, with his embezzling proceeds, basically gambling his life away and trying to make the big win. Colin Farrell starts the feature, the first line is, gambling is the one addiction that never really got me. Gambling is the one addiction that never really got me, says Colin Farrell in his best Colin Farrell voice.

16:08Yeah, yeah. So, yeah, we talked to Colin Farrell, Tilda Swinton, who is in it. She is a character that is not in the book, who's been added. Lady Doyle. Fun fact there, not Lady Doyle, but she is kind of hunting him she's the lead sort of detective investigator on his trail if you've seen the trailer you'll see it has a ton of energy it looks really really um it looks like a really fun thriller so yeah it's a good read um tom went all the way there he was on set he watched some gambling unfolding and then colin farrell had to eat an entire hotel buffet for one scene that made him really i could do that you should hire me instead of colin farrell i'm much cheaper although crucially much shitter as well uh that's exciting i'm very excited about that trip that i wasn't offered thanks a bunch uh just saying for the record if a trip comes up to macau i am i am there i don't care what it's for problem child six yes please thank you very much indeed uh so that's ballad of a small player uh what's next in the features realm nicholas uh it's a film the name of which i've only just mastered anemone frankenstein anemone i haven't got that one yet But Anemone, I have got, this is very exciting.

17:20Alex Godfrey, our esteemed features editor, on a plane. Yes. He went to New York. Did he? Talked to Flippin' Daniel Flippin' Day-Lewis and his son, Ronan Day-Lewis, who directs Anemone, and talked to them together. And it is a cracking read, I've got to say. It's eight pages. We upped it just because it's such a good interview. And it's Daniel Day-Lewis, both of them talking about this new film. but he also talks about his experience as a kind of method actor man. And he reveals, I think this is an exclusive to us, what he was up to while he was off. Because he was retired, essentially, wasn't he?

17:58He bristles a little bit at that description, doesn't he? Well, he kind of said he retired, but then he's now walked that back and said that he didn't retire. He's unretired, yeah. So he told Alex that he spent some of that time studying violin making at a school in Boston. so he can now make shoes right because he learned how to make shoes and he can now build a violin two things that i cannot do but yeah it's it's uh it's a really really really good read and um it's our film at the lff uh we're doing uh an empire sponsored screening of anemone that's right on the 14th that's right we are and And we'll also be doing a podcast special with many members of the Day-Lewis family and Sean Bean, who's also in the film.

18:49And that'll be out next week as well. So keep you peeled. You should build your own violin, take him along and see what he thinks of it. I should. Or maybe I could knock off some clogs while he's talking away and impress him and become his best friend, which is always my goal. when I'm doing interviews. I do want to become people's best friends. But this is exciting. The return of Daniel Day-Lewis. Yeah. Arguably the world's greatest actor when Jarrah Butler's not on form. And yeah, I'm excited about this. And I'm excited about hearing Nick pronounce an enemy, quite frankly. Do it again. Anemone.

19:24That's right. I love. It's absolutely... Just the fact that I'm shouting it. Anemone. Anemone. Remember. Anemone. The anemone of my friend is my anemone Keep your friends close and your anemones close Your anemones close but your anemones Close there Keep them as far away as you possibly can First line of Alex's feature Daniel Day-Lewis has been away Daniel Day-Lewis has been away Boom From Punchy to Florid With the first line of the next feature Can you guess what film it is from this first line Beneath a sky Dotted with bruised purple clouds rushing water free falls down 100 feet of volcanic rock what film do you think that is is it Predator Badlands it's Predator Badlands there we go hang on yeah this is Tom Ellen again good month for Tom Ellen he went to New Zealand he went outside Auckland yeah and he will in fact in a manner of speaking he went to Gena the death planet which is where which is Predator Badlands is set I am very excited for this film It's a Predator film unlike any we've seen before because the Predator is the good guy and he is on an alien planet, as described, and he is up against a whole menagerie of murderous deaf aliens who want to murder him.

20:44And so we're going to be rooting for the predator, which is unusual. And also rooting for an android played by Elle Fanning or rather half an android because she has been torn rent into and used as a human backpack, which has inspired maybe my favorite sidebar of recent months. Backpack buddies, which we we pay homage to characters who are worn as backpacks by other characters. This is an actual thing that someone got paid to write, and I'm very happy about that. Who wrote that? Who had to do the research? The great Jordan King, our sidebar mastermind. That is a hell of a thing, and no human centipede allowed, right?

21:30Ideally not. Ideally not. That's a whole different sidebar. What's next? I don't have the issue to hand. Tell me. No, I have the power. The headline is Reborn in the USA. The film is Springsteen, Deliver Me From Nowhere. Yes. This is Scott Cooper's movie starring Jeremy Allen White as Bruce Springsteen. Now, you know, Dick, I and many other people have said that, you know, Jeremy Allen White doesn't look like Bruce Springsteen. But does that matter? Is that something that's addressed in this feature, which is written by Hayley Campbell, who has written a fantastic piece. and to the critics, including you, Chris, I would say that he has paid the cost to be the boss and that's the end of the story there.

22:13Has he? I don't think he paid to be in the film. I'm not implying that. He certainly did. But, you know, this is a really good read. You get deep into the background of how this film came about, Springsteen's role in it, the stuff you learn from the film that isn't out there because obviously Springsteen has been written about a whole lot, but because he was so involved, there was stuff that came straight from him that has never previously been shared. And yeah, it's really interesting. I mean, the film has a lot of references to other films in it, The Night of the Hunter and Badlands. They're all kind of part of this story.

22:49And this is, I would say, it's a pleasingly granular story about Springsteen recording one of his albums. So instead of being a whole walk-hard style biopic of his whole life, it gets deep into the making of one of his albums. Nebraska. Nebraska, yeah. And you get really into how he recorded it, the exact process of what happened in the studio. And I found all that interesting. And it's all kind of got into in this piece. It's exciting. We got a one-two punch of me and then you, because I interviewed Josh Brolin, and then you wrote about Frankenstein. Yes, so this is Josh Brolin, who is having, I mean, he's had many moments throughout his career, which he has chronicled in eye-watering detail in his own memoirs.

23:38But Nick, you spoke to him for what, an hour? Yeah, we had an hour on Zoom. I read and reviewed his memoir from Under the Truck, which came out last year, and I thought it was absolutely tremendous. I gave it five stars. And I just wanted to talk to him. I think he's a fascinating guy. And like you say, he's on a streak at the moment. he um he had weapons earlier this summer which one of my favorite films of the year um he was quite a late addition to that right pedro pascal dropped out or wasn't able to do it and he came in and he wasn't as he tells me he wasn't entirely sure he wanted to do it he didn't really understand it he didn't really understand zach regger's previous film barbarian but he he kind of as is his nature which we talked about quite a lot is just he threw himself into it and it took the risk and it worked out and he also is in the running man he's the bad guy in edgar wright's running man and he's also in ryan johnson's wake up dead man yes he plays a beardy priest yeah so we talked about all of that we talked about the fact he played a priest in his first state on stage role in a play years and years ago when he was very young uh we talked about how he birthed baby lion cubs wow did you know that i did not know that yeah yeah he grew up around a lot of wild animals and wolves and lions and whatnot.

24:53He's a fascinating guy. Yeah. Josh Brolin. I've interviewed him a few times myself. And yeah, he's very, very smart. He's very, very funny. He's completely not the deadpan. I did a pint of milk with him. I asked him how hairy his ass was years ago. Yeah. Yeah. Well, he will answer anything in my experience. And he'll give you a really thoughtful, very candid answer. This is a Q &A, right? Yes, a Q &A. So we did, yeah, we also did an amazing photo shoot with him. And I know I say that every month, but this photo shoot is absolutely amazing. It's by Arsene Vasylenko. And this, actually, my interview with Josh Brolin started out with Josh Brolin talking about the shoot and how much he loved it and how special it was.

25:35And how, again, he was a little bit reluctant because it's a, if you see the photo shoot, it's a production. And it's epic and it's very cinematic. And he wasn't sure that he wanted to commit to something that kind of big and out there. but he did it and it's really cool. Amazing. Amazing. Yeah. What's your favorite question that you asked him? I'm happy I asked him about the lion cubs and which, which part of that process he was involved in. And he also revealed that he used to watch Schwarzenegger movies with a chimpanzee called Reg. I genuinely think you can ask Josh Brolin anything and you would just get gold.

26:12He's just one of those people. You put 50 PPs in him and a great answer comes out, which is also the case with Guillermo del Toro, who is the director of Frankenstein, obviously, and which is coming out in cinemas over here in a couple weeks' time and will be on Netflix in November as well. And this is the realisation of a pretty much lifelong dream for Guillermo del Toro. he first read Frankenstein when he was about eight years old, maybe seven, maybe nine. I can't quite remember myself now. Just after seeing the Boris Karloff, James Whale movie, and it lit a fire in him, which led him to become one of the world's greatest directors.

27:00And he's been trying to make Frankenstein. He's basically incorporated elements of Frankenstein, thematic elements and otherwise, into his work over the years, but never actually adapted Mary Shelley's novel until Trailer Voice now, which is very, very exciting. And I was on set of this movie. I guess I am unofficially Empire's Guillermo del Toro Whisperer. I guess I've known him now for 20 years, which makes me feel really, really terribly, terribly old. But I've been on a lot of his movies. he is one of the most fascinating and intelligent and wonderful human beings I've ever met and I'm very very happy that he's getting to make this movie at long last where did this take you because this leads to your first opening line do you remember your opening line?

27:54give me a second if it's related to is there something about, no I was toying initially with doing something about panna cottas but I don't think I did it in the end. I wrote this feature about two months ago now I should say so I don't really remember what I did. What did they do Nick? What was my opening line? Peterborough is a nice enough city. Yeah. There we go. Nothing about panna cotta but you nobody saw that one coming. Nobody saw that one coming. That is a feature opener in the Grand Empire tradition. One of my favourite Empire features from years and years and years and years and years ago.

28:33is Ian Freer's Die Another Day piece, which began with a salvo pointed roughly in the direction of Aldershot. And I've always remembered that. And so this is kind of my riff on that. It's lovely you should tell Ian, because he calls that his worst feature that he's ever written. And I disagree, because it's extremely memorable. I don't think Ian Freer is capable of writing a bad feature, first of all. Second of all, that's one of the great, for me, Empire feature openers. there's another Ian Frears he's got so many but there's another one I don't think this line made it into a feature but he went there was one feature that he wanted to start such and such there was someone's movies like Red Wine and Cunnilingus is an acquired taste and that didn't make it in but that stuck in my head for years that doesn't come up in Frankenstein I should say but yes I did go to Peterborough for this one so the bulk of the movie was shot in Toronto.

29:32As you can tell in this issue, people have been going everywhere. They've been going to, you know, one, someone's about to go to Los Angeles. They've been going to Macau. They've been going to New Zealand. They've been going to, where was it? New York. You know, I went to Peterborough. But, turns out, it doesn't matter. Because I went to set of Frankenstein. I hung out. I sat at Guillermo del Toro's right hand and I watched, I watched Oscar Isaac, Amir Goth, and Christoph Waltz, and Felix Kammerer. shoot a scene from Frankenstein in this beautiful, beautiful place called Burley House, which is this gorgeous, gorgeous old stately home with grounds by actual capability brown.

30:15And it was just a beautiful, beautiful day. I think it was last September. And it was just wonderful watching, you know, this guy who I've seen trying to make this movie for 20 years finally make this movie. And it was just extraordinary. And I have to ask, who was eating the panna cotta? I was eating the panna cotta. Oh, you were eating it. It wasn't being eaten on set by the actors. So the scene was... You ate their panna cotta. You ate the food that was meant to be eaten on screen. So the scene is a scene in which Victor Frankenstein meets Elizabeth, who, if anyone knows the story, becomes the only human that Victor Frankenstein, that great driven monster slash scientist.

30:58He's a real monster of this story. She's the only human that he can relate to slash love. And so he meets her for the first time and they're having dinner and they're having this, they're jousting, they're having this battle of wits across this dinner table. And Christoph Waltz is there as Harlander, who is her uncle, but also someone who may be bankrolling Victor Frankenstein's experiments in Reviving the Dead. And also there was Felix Kammerer as his younger brother. and the scene was set around a dinner table and they actually had panna cotta's that had been prepared by by the catering team and as actors are wanted to do they weren't eating the panna cotta's for continuity reasons and also who wants to eat a whole bunch of panna cotta's and so during one of the takes I said to Guillermo what are the panna cotta's like and he said he called over and he had a panna cotta brought over to me and then he insisted that he eat it in front of him