The Shameless Plug #9: Stranger Things Has Happened

0:15Hello pod, I'm Chris Hewitt and welcome to what I believe is the ninth episode of the show that we've called The Shameless Plug, in which I sit down every month, every four weeks, on the dot, on a Wednesday. Here we are, 4.30pm, in the studio with the editor of Empire, Mr. Nick Disemlian, and we talk you through the stories behind the latest issue of Empire Magazine, which is on sale right now, the world's biggest movie magazine, all good, evil, and virtual news agents. Nick is here. Hello, Nick. Hello, Chris. I like to think of this as us unpacking the issue, but also unpacking our issues. Yeah.

0:50Of which I have some today, because we've unwisely we're recording this on press day which we haven't done before no we record this every single time on press day that's the way it works no it's the way it works no so we record every single time on press day oh my gosh every single time this is very press day of me to forget that but yeah it's been it's a hell of an issue that we're just finishing but it's been exhausting and draining and so my life essence I feel like a demogorgon oh that's a good segue look at that because on the cover of the December issue of Empire Magazine issue 447 we're barreling ever closer to 450 any plans?

1:26Sleep? Maybe? No? Yeah because we've we've just we're about to finish 448 we're about to start 449 No No plans for 450 I wouldn't bother We did do we did do something for 400 but I don't know if 450 requires it but let us know if you disagree Yeah and we'll start we'll pull something together very quickly And we will do the list of questions at some point Yeah I'm keen I've lost them. You've lost the question. Yeah, I've lost the question. So do send them in more listener questions. Send in your old listener questions and then send in new ones as well if you want to know anything about how this wonderful magazine, this bastion of British movie journalism is made.

2:05But on the cover, Nick, you hinted at it heavily. We're entering the upside down for on the cover of the brand new issue of Empire Magazine, world exclusive, the fifth and final season of Stranger Things. Yes. This is a big one. Oh, this is huge. I'm so excited. This is as big as TV gets. It genuinely is. This show... Clearly you haven't seen the Fallen Rise original in Perrin. Does it have a Demogorgon in it? No, but... Well, close. A word which I still cannot spell, but I'm working on it. I didn't get where I am today, but not being able to spell Demogorgon. That's a Reggie Perrin reference.

2:44Yes. So this month we are, as Chris says, turning Empire up to 11 with a Stranger Things. Oh, that's clever. Thanks, that took me hours. We've been covering this show since it started in 2016. I remember Millie Bobby Brown was tiny. She was so young back then. And we did a photo shoot with her in a hotel for our review of the year where she was in the corridor. And we did some sneaky visual effects. So it looked like it was turning into the Upside Down. What? And that was now nine years ago. So now the show is finally about to unleash its epic conclusion. Epic in every sense, because the episodes are incredibly long.

3:22They are like movie length each. And that was the case with the last season as well. I watched the last season. I remember it vividly because I had COVID. And I was quite ill. And I was in a feverish state. And this was, when was the last season? A few years back. And I was quite delirious. So I was having a lot of bad dreams about Vecna. And then waking up and then watching more. having some Lem sit max and then having another nightmare. It was quite an experience. It's got more and more epic. It's, you know, the forces of darkness have amplified with the arrival of Vecna, the big bad play, Jamie Campbell Bauer.

3:59Not Vecna. Yeah. Yes, Jamie Campbell Bauer. I remember, I met him at the Emperor Awards years ago. Lovely chap. Very un-Vecna-like. Lovely, lovely chap. And we have spoken to him, but we'll get to that. But yeah, this was a very long in the making cover. we have been talking to Netflix and the Duffer Brothers about this for the creators of Stranger Things creators of Stranger Things yep who would win in a fight between the Duffers and the Russos we'll find out I think the Duffers are younger and also the word Duff is in their name so they would Duff the Russo Brothers in the Russos know the Avengers yeah but you can't call upon your friends I mean these guys know well actually they both know Millie Bobby Brown so yeah and who would David Harbour join because he's in Marvel but then also in Stranger Things so whatever side Lily Allen isn't wrong.

4:43Yeah, probably true. So yes, anyway, we wanted to make this cover feel epic. A lot of conversations went on. We did have one harebrained idea near the beginning about doing Empire's first upside-down cover. How would that work? We never worked it out. I mean, because when you just... I mean, how would it have worked? It would just look like a printing error. No, no, we had... Would all the text have been upside-down, but the picture would have been right way up? That's a better idea than my one. We had an idea about doing a, let me get this straight, a vertical gatefold, right? So you pull the magazine cover down and it creates like a double cover and the image on the cover would be upside down at the bottom.

5:26So anyway, we didn't do it because it was rubbish. But we talked about it. That's the main thing. And it would have won awards or maybe just confused people. So anyway, we... Yeah. So instead, what you've come up with is this cover. alright I'm not even going to say full disclosure because people who listen to the Empire podcast regularly will know I have never seen a single second of Stranger Things I know nothing about Stranger Things can you name many of these characters I know that Millie Bobby Brown was 11 she's now 43 I know that Finn Wolfhard is Jack I don't know the names of any of the other actors Finn Wolfhard is Mike ok Mike I cannot emphasize that enough from left to right we have Stewie Dustin Barnaby 43 Jack Mike and Lucas and Barnaby II and the monster is called John so memorize those names no this look just because you haven't seen it yes you should watch it it's anyone who hasn't seen Strange Things genuinely some of the best it's like a proper blockbuster movie but much longer and and it's all set in Hawkins it's all set in the 80s in this small Talbot in Hawkins there's a nice synchronicity in this issue which is that we also have a giant Back to the Future exclusive where we talk to Michael J.

6:51Fox and Christopher Lloyd and in an episode of Stranger Things they go to a screening of Back to the Future when it came out so and basically it's a giant war between good and evil there is you know a rift there's a parallel dimension scientists have been doing you know sinister experiments and they've opened a portal to hell essentially and all these terrifying monsters are scuffling and slithering their way through and Vecna is genuinely who's kind of Freddy Krueger on steroids is genuinely a very scary and disturbing monster and yeah and it's genuinely got huge Winona Ryder's in it it's a lot of fun I know things about it I've just never seen it it's become huge it's Netflix's biggest thing in many many countries and it's got a lot of celebrity fans Robert Downey Jr.

7:40dressed up as a character from Strange Things in fact his whole family for Halloween dressed up as Strange Things characters wow a few years back so yeah it's a big deal that's exciting it's a big deal so it was kind of a no brainer for us to do it and yeah we were the first or are the first first magazine cover first interviews with everyone wow got lots of exclusive images from the new season the final season which is on it starts November right and Christmas it finishes in Christmas in two parts. I believe the finale is airing on New Year's Day. Wow. New Year's Eve and then New Year's Day. Wowzers.

8:15So yeah. So we have the Duffer Brothers. So we have the Duffer Brothers. That's feature one, cover story part one. Okay. So much like the final season we split it in two. Very good. And yeah, the Duffer Brothers are very kind of interesting and funny as they talk about their journey with the show and what's in store and how absolutely giant this final season is going to be and how difficult all the bits of dust are in The Upside Down. They were quite stressed about Dust. So that's in the piece. And then for the second part, we talked to... I call them the kids, but maybe they're not kids now. They're all somehow older than us, which is wild.

8:51But yeah, we talked to the gang, the core gang, and also Jamie Campbell Bauer, aka Vecna. So we talked to Millie Bobby Brown, we talked to Finn Wolfhard, we talked to Noah Schnapp, Caleb McAthlin, Gaten Matazaro, yeah, I don't think I've left anyone out. And I butchered the names, apologies there. But yeah, we did an oral history of Strange Things. So they're basically, all of them talking about how the show changed their lives, the ups, the downs, the upside downs. That's good. Thanks, man. I was going to pause until you acknowledge that. No, no, no. And then we've also done little breakouts on some of the kind of zeitgeisty moments the show has got trending so the Kate Bush moment from the last season even I know about that what do you know about that I know that they used the song Running Up That Hill right it was at the end of one of the episodes and it went absolutely nuts and kind of got people re-interested in Kate Bush again which is a big reason why she's back in the public eye after so many years away and is huge so that's good see I know some stuff and do you know who Barb is no I don't know who Barb is because this is a show because as you know I read a lot about shows sometimes as well I'll deliberately check the Wikipedia updates I haven't done Stranger Things maybe I'm saving myself for it all to finish and then I will I will watch it and on one glorious glorious epic session well spoiler alert Barb is a character who gets killed by a Demogorgon in season one and played by Shannon Pursa and people got very upset and hashtag justice for Barb was trending everywhere and people are still some people are still upset about it and there's badges and there's petitions and there's rumors that they're going to somehow bring her back in the final season and so we spoke to we spoke to Shannon about all that and yeah breaking the internet that's exciting I also know that Frank Darabont has directed a couple of episodes does that not get you excited?

10:50yeah wow yeah first time he's directed anything since The Mist yeah in 2007 so I think he's doing more than one episode yeah yeah it's amazing so that is very very exciting indeed so Stranger Things on the cover then so shall we talk cover lines real quick. Sure. And then we can dive deep into what's left in the magazine as well. So, Stranger Things, welcome to the end. Inside the apocalyptic finale of the pop culture smash, Clooney and Sandler to Icons Talk. Three Icons Talk, really, because John Nugent was there interviewing them. I see. But we couldn't fit Nugent on. That's great. Well done.

11:26Well done, John Nugent. John? John is kind of our Venice beat man, so we send him to Venice and he cruises around on a gondola. talking to A-listers. But yeah, he had a good year this year. He, among other things, sat down for a good chunk of time with George Clooney and Adam Sandler. And this is exciting, right? I'm so happy for John. Yeah, this is great. One of the many people to talk to Adam Sandler over the last few weeks who are not me. How many times have we tried to get Adam Sandler in the magazine? Many, many times. Over the years. And we have never succeeded until this issue. So this is Empire's first Prince interview.

12:03We did have him on the podcast for Spaceman. Yes. But we have never... Spachemin. Spachemin. Spachemin. We have never talked to him for the magazine until now. And we've got him and George Clooney together. So it's a bit of a coup. And it's a really fun chat. Stars Align. Let's just go straight to the feature. This is Stars Align. It's a headline. And in there is John Ugent, a man who doesn't even appreciate Hubie Halloween, talking to Adam Sadler and his hanger-on friend. George Clowney. This is for Jay Kelly, their new movie, which is very, very exciting. Obviously, I loathe and envy John and will hunt him down and make him pay for this crime.

12:50But if you've always wanted to know what Adam Sandler thinks of Batman and Robin, this feature will definitively satisfy you. He calls it solid as a rock. But yeah, they talk about the favorites that they have of each other's films. It's just really, it's a really fun back and forth. And, you know, you never would have imagined those two doing anything together. It's just a very unlikely double act, but it's very joyous. Oh, yeah. No, I'm very, very excited about this movie. I haven't seen it yet. Jay Kelly looks great. Love Clooney. Love the Sandman. Mildly tolerant of John Nugent. So that's good.

13:28That's good. I think it's good. I think it's good. Yeah, that's good. That's good. I can't do it I can't put it to the side I'm so deeply jealous Helen got to do a Q &A with the Sandman did you not talk to him for it doesn't matter it doesn't matter

13:51I want him to myself you don't want to share him I don't want to share the Sandman one of the creepiest things ever been said on the shameless plug but let's move on I don't want to share the Sandman I don't know. It's got weird. It has got heavy. It's got heavy. Let's move on. Okay. Let's move on. Yeah. So are we going back to the cover? No, that's good. That's good of features because the cover lines, they're great, but they kind of give away what's in the issue. Back to the Future at 40, Sigourney Weaver, Wake Up Dead Man, and then, of course, Robert Redford Remembered. We'll get to that in a second.

14:21There's a very special Robert Redford obituary in this issue. I don't know if you can say it as an obituary, really. It's more of a personal remembrance of Robert Redford. It's fantastic. It is. David Lowery, who directed Robert Redford in two films, The Old Man of the Gun and Pete's Dragon. Yes. And he wrote this piece and genuinely put so much effort into it, like he did different drafts. I know Beth Webb, our intrepid news editor, was talking to him directly about this, and he was making tweaks right up until we went to press. And I remember he tweaked the ending, and it was already great. but like shortly before we went to press David Lowry was like I've got a new ending and it's a really really beautiful piece I gotta say it's um can all writers do that or yeah no it's not to be encouraged only David if you haven't directed Pete's Dragon don't do that yeah specifically you have to have directed Ain't Them Body Saints that's the only criteria we will accept just a shout out to David Lowry as well for being a damn good egg and coming to our all-nighter screen at Picturehouse last summer without us knowing none of us had any awareness this was going to happen but we hosted an Empire screen at the Pitch House All Nighter and there was a guy just sitting on his own in the front row and we sort of came in to the room and waiting for everything to start and one of us was like is that David Lowry?

15:42Is David Lowry the director like sitting there? And he was and then we started chatting to him and he was great. So I got to watch The Frighteners with David Lowry in the audience and he was lovely. I think he left before The Descent. That's a scary film. it's a scary film but yeah that was very very kind of him to write a Robert Redford obituary obviously Redford passed away recently and we wanted to do something a bit more personal for that and of course he directed him in his last movie and technically in terms of release dates Avengers Endgame is Redford's last film that one scene cameo he did but the old man in the gun was almost designed as his last film it was his last lead film it was the last film he shot he shot it after Endgame and it's such a wonderfully elegaic farewell to the screen.

16:30It's a great film. If you haven't seen it, check it out, The Old Man and the Gun. It's hard when a legend passes away and you're trying to work out what are we going to do? There's always so much coverage online when somebody of that stature dies. And so we always have those conversations of wanting to do justice. And obviously, what stage you're at in the issue makes a difference as well. we don't want it to run too late and sometimes you're just going to press and there's no time to put something together but in this case I feel like something really magical happened because he was genuinely we thought of David, we reached out to him he said yes and then I think it's really a beautiful tribute so yeah hey should we stick with news?

17:14yeah let's stick with news so what would you like to point out in the first word section Nick the section that Beth edits. There's a lot of heavy hitters in this month's section. A lot of big names. Yeah, there's some really good stuff. We talked to Tessa Thompson about Hedda and get very granular into her performance. We talked to Sydney Sweeney about her new boxing biopic, Christy. We go on the set of Fallout, the new season of that, which is a very buzzy, cool sci-fi show. And Scarlett Johansson and June Squibb. So there's a lot of star power. But I've really got to say, I love it when we do stories that are a bit more offbeat and sort of reported and maybe not talking to a big star but talking to someone interesting.

18:02And there's several of those in this issue. We open with Tilly Norwood, the AI so-called actress, which was very buzzy. But what I really liked about this is Beth spoke to an acting coach and actually got them to analyze her acting, her so-called acting performance, whatever you call it, and sort of talk about that. so I thought that was really interesting way into that we talked to a guy who runs a website called Does the Dog Die which chronicles every film and whether the dog dies so if you're triggered by that you know going into the film that something bad is going to happen quirky, unusual things like that and then Tom Ellen talked to the guy whose job it was to come up with the language for Predator Badlands, the Yautja language and so we've done a deep dive into the people whose jobs it is to come up with an imaginary language for like a sci-fi film.

18:57So, you know, Na 'vi, Yautja, all this kind of stuff. So, yeah, that is really, really interesting as well. And you'll pick up a few bits of Predator vocab. The pint of milk this month is the fantastic Kristen Milioti from The Penguin. Yeah, she's fantastic. Yeah. She's asked, what is your most irrational fear? And she says, venomous spiders, which seems to me to be a very rational fear. Yeah, that's completely rational fear. Yeah. That's not irrational. Who did this interview? Ollie Richards. He should have pushed her on that. He should have gone, that's not an irrational fear. He should have gone for Paxman.

19:32I just kept asking the question. What's your most irrational fear? What's your most irrational fear? My most irrational fear is giving an answer to that question that isn't an irrational fear. Is that irrational? I don't know. But venomous spiders, they can kill you. They can fuck you up. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's not irrational. Unbelievable. Anyway, she's brilliant. Oh, hang on. I just read it properly. It does make sense. She says because she lives in New York, it's irrational because she lives in New York and there aren't any there. Oh, I see. But even so, I apologize to her. I apologize to Ollie.

20:05It's still irrational. It's still irrational fear. Yeah. I fear snakes. I don't expect the snake to come crawling through that door and bite me. I don't fear spiders because ever since I watched Arachnophobia, I carry a nail gun with me all the time. just in case a spider jumps out of a drainpipe. Anyway, should we move on? Yes, let's move on. We're going to the back of the magazine and then we'll come back to the features. All right, okay. I love it. It's wild. You've gone full Nolan. We're shaking it up. You've mementoed the shit out of it. We're going to the final cut section, which, as everyone knows, is the best section.

20:38It's my section. It's the section I edit. There's lots of great stuff here. We have Noah Hawley talking about Alien Earth. You go, but hey, Chris, we subscribed to the Sported Specials and we've already had Noah Hawley talking about Alien Earth well this is all new stuff all new stuff no it's good stuff it's good stuff the eyeball alone is maybe the thing that I'm going to take out of 2025 with me as one of the most iconic things oh it's so good one of the great great screen monsters I was going to say movie monsters but yeah absolutely terrific how do you do something new in Alien that puts the willies up people and can go toe to toe with a cinemorph and Noah Hawley managed it do you know my least favorite thing about that guy?

21:17No, Holly or the eyeball monster. Which has got a name but I always forget it. I don't know, the Octagon Keith. Mr. Stary. Mr. Stary. Barney Part 2. The most frightening thing about it is the way it uses its tentacle to like catapult itself across the room at people. Yes. Because you look at it and you're like, okay, that's horrendous but at least it's going to move slowly and it's going to scuttle around like a spider. That's real. That's going to kill me. That lives with me here on Earth. Imagine if a spider, a venomous spider could fling itself across the room at you. It's bad. It's real bad.

21:47It's real, real bad. What's the thing you like least about Noah Hawley? I don't. I like everything about him. Really? If you were pushed, if you could say one thing you didn't like about him. He won't listen to this. It's fine. I didn't love the X-Men TV show he did. Wow. I'm telling him. I am telling him. That's it. You are fucking cancelled, mate. Worse than the Apple Monster. What? Legion? You didn't like Legion? Yeah, that's it. Yeah. It was a bit... a bit much yeah I liked it it's good okay settled I was wrong then also in my section there's some great stuff obviously everything's brilliant and well written even the bits that I did because I did nothing this month I think this is I took a back seat a little bit this month I didn't write any features which is why they are better than normal I wrote a few things in my section but by and large I think was I away was this the issue I was away for a little bit let's say yes yeah let's do that anyway I did speak to Sam Neill he was great fun fact Sam Neill is the first person I ever properly interviewed for Empire magazine he was literally the first person I interviewed first day at Empire first actual day at Empire was the Empire Awards in 2001 and so I was you know stars were literally walking in front of me and I had to interview a whole bunch of people that day but the first proper sit down 45 minute chat I ever did for Empire with Sam Neill I was terrified he was absolutely wonderful he's one of the best people you could interview I think I've interviewed him four, maybe five times.

23:17He is absolutely delightful every time. I think he's amazing. He's just a good human being. He's a good cove. He is a good cove. And this was an interview about how he has been a kind of accidental scream king. So basically, this issue was coming out. Obviously, we recorded it after Halloween, but it was coming out in time for Halloween. so if you check my section it's actually kind of themed there's a lot of horror stuff in this section in the section of the issue we're about to do there's going to be a few Christmassy related things in there because that'll be out just in time for Christmas not to overwhelm the entire section but just enough to give it a kind of Halloween-y horror-y vibe without drawing attention to it a tinge of terror so we have Sam Neill on the great horror movies of his career Possession In the Mouth of Madness which is coming out soon on 4K Blu-ray, Omen 3, The Final Conflict, Jurassic Park, he doesn't consider to be a horror film, but it kind of is.

24:18And of course, the one, the only, my beloved, Event Horizon, which, much to my chagrin, perhaps less beloved by Sam Neill, but that's fine. He spent a lot of it nude and covered in Swarovski. I had a really good time last Christmas reading Sam Neill's memoir. If you haven't read Sam Neill's book, get yourself a copy. It is an absolute delight. Weirdly, the thing that stuck in my head most from it is him talking about the Wim Wenders movie he was in. It's like a four and a half hour movie called Until the End of the World. And he hasn't seen it because he was promised a DVD and they never sent it to him.

24:49And he has a moan about it in the book and he still hasn't seen it. And he saw Wim Wenders a few years back and asked him, where's my DVD? I love that kind of, I love putting that in your memoir. It's fantastic. But there you go. Sam, I love Sam. He's terrific. Orlando Bloom, also a wonderful guy. Yeah, yeah. He's in that. He's the time capsule this month where we sit down and we talk about movies from his past. And there's a lot of other great stuff inside that section. But let's get back to the feature section. Nick, let's ride pillion. Let's do it. Let's do it. Let me just put on this gear.

25:27Would you be, if we had a motorcycle-sidecar combo, I know that's not what this movie is about necessarily, but would you want to take the motorcycle or would you want the sidecar? Would you want the Wallace or the Gromit? Which of us is the Wallace and which of us is the Gromit? I think we both know that. Am I the Gromit? Both of us are Wallace, I think. We're just both Wallace. Yeah, we're both Wallace. So anyway, we'll ride Pilly and Wallace style. Yeah, this is a five-star film. This gets five stars. I think I can say that. Of course you can. You're the editor of the magazine. Why wouldn't I say it if I could?

26:07If I couldn't. But yes, we love this film. It's sort of one of those little sleeper indie movies that's come out of nowhere. It's about two men who get involved in a BDSM relationship. It's kind of a sort of... It's easy for you to say. It's a, you know, it's an unusual rom-com, let's say. A very unusual one. A rom-com?

26:31Technically. Technically. But it's got Alexander Skarsgård in as the Dom, I believe. And Harry Melling, who you may remember as Dudley Dursley in the Harry Potter films, plays Colin. Right. The sub. The more submissive one. And it's about their relationship and it's surprisingly moving and emotional and sweet. And, you know, it's got some pretty full-on stuff in it. But it's really, really an interesting film and we all kind of saw it and have been talking about it for quite a few months now. And it's a first-time director, Harry Leighton. Harry Leighton. So, yeah. So, anyway, we have talked to all of them.

27:15That's exciting. About this sort of unusual film that sort of came out of nowhere and we can't stop talking about it. So that is out at the end of the month, Pillion. And very excited about that. Oh, here's a good one. Here's a good one as well. Just turned the page. Yeah. It's Susan Weaver. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yep. Better known as... Susan Sigourney. You actually confused me there. Yeah, Sigourney Weaver. So this is, I'm going to say, the penultimate paving slab on our path to Pandora. Are we still in this fucking path? You're never getting off it. Jesus. No, no, no, no, no. We're finishing strong.

27:49Are we? Yeah. I know we are, because I know what we're finishing with. We're finishing with a good one. I mean, we've told people what it is already, so we put out an ask for questions. Oh, yeah. We can say that our final entry in the issue we're just finishing now, because I've just read it and it is absolutely brilliant. It's questions from you guys, the readers, to James Cameron, big Jim. And he took an hour out of finishing Avatar, Fire, and Ash to answer. What I've got to say are some of the most nerdy, like joyously nerdy questions. And he answers everything in full and there is some fantastic, some absolute gold in that.

28:27We'll talk about it next month, but I'm convinced James Dyer has about a thousand burner accounts and was sending in incredibly nerdy questions. There's stuff in there that I didn't know. And it's just, it's a really fun read. But anyway, that's the next issue. That's the next issue. This issue, we, you know, we swung big with this whole Path to Pandora thing and James Cameron made every single thing happen. And we asked for a photo shoot and big interview with Sigourney Weaver. We've never done that before in Empire. And why wouldn't you ask for that? She's back in Avatar Farinash as Kiri playing a sort of teenage girl, Navi girl.

29:01again, and we talked to her and my predecessor editor, Terry White, the great Terry White, did that interview and it's fantastic. The shoot is amazing. It was shot for us by Robert Ashcroft and yeah, Terry talked for like an hour with Sigourney and there's some incredible stuff in there. Amazing. Yeah, I'm reading the interview now. Just keep yourself occupied while I finish it. Can I read you one line out of context. You can read me three lines. Sigourney Weaver, I'm much better at playing a girl who keeps a hedgehog in her vagina than I am at playing someone who's going shopping with a friend.