France special: Best in surf and skincare

0:11Hello and welcome to The Entrepreneurs on Monocle Radio, the show all about inspiring people, innovative companies and fresh ideas in global business. Today's program is a sunny, French-flavored affair. First, we'll hit the waves of the country's Atlantic coast. We have really good surf spots in Angliette, also really good riders around, competitors that can provide high-quality feedback on the product. Then, Fernando Augusto Pacheco will join me in the studio to tell us about his recent Parisian adventures. He's here right now. Fernando, what have you been up to? Hello, Tom. I've been up to a lot, including a wonderful meeting with Paris' top facialist, Sophie Carbonari.

0:54We'll discuss skincare and why organic growth is the best way. Sunny indeed. And it sounds like a bright idea. More from Faye later on this edition of The Entrepreneurs with me, Tom Edwards.

1:14You're listening to The Entrepreneurs. We start today's programme on the beautiful sun-kissed southwestern coast of France, where the surf is up, and so is a new wave of sustainable surfboard innovation. We sent our correspondent Ian Wiley to Anglais and Biarritz, neighbouring coastal towns in the French Basque Country, to meet two surfers-turned-entrepreneurs who were helping redefine the surfboard industry from the inside out.

1:44This stretch of Atlantic coastline, famed for its waves, has long been a hub for surfboard shapers, the craftsmen and women who shape what are known as surfboard blanks. But it's now home to pioneering start-ups, aiming to replace the toxic, petroleum-based polyurethane with which most blanks are made. I've come to Anglet to meet Sylvain Fleury, CEO and co-founder of Wive, at the small factory where he and a team of 10 people 3D print customised surfboards from sugar cane plastic. I have an engineering background, specialised at the end of my degree in sustainability, starting to work in a really corporate environment in sustainability in Paris.

2:36and yeah i was a passionate surfers and both sport passionate and was going to surf every weekend in britainy when i was in paris with my now co-founder leo with a long time friend and we used to break at least one board each weekend and spend all of our first salary on the repairs and on new boards and as we were both engineers we started to dig into surfboard manufacturing and we realized that it's been the same for 60 years mixing a polyurethane foam that we shape with a fiberglass and resin really toxic we became kind of a surfboard geek at this point and wanted to rethink servo manufacturing to implement more durability, more sustainability in terms of materials, and also higher performance with a really scientific approach.

3:44So with 3D printing, it offers a wide range of materials. So the core inside the board is 100 % bio-based, made out of PLA we use, so it's sugarcane plastic with no petrochemical inside and so it enables to cut the CO2 emission by 40 % in manufacturing and then if the ball lasts longer and then you cut even more. When you have a foam blank it's just foam, it's homogeneous and it's kind of the same properties in the nose, in the tail, in the middle. With our pattern you can really play on the pattern itself with the hexagon we have like different size of hexagon some reinforcement at some spots and really adapt the board to the surfers to the type of wave they're going right.

4:39So yeah here we are in the 3D printing room so what you see here is a 10 large-scale 3D printing machines. How long will it take to make one board? Yeah, the 3D printing takes a kind of long time, like 25 hours. So it's gonna run during the night, running all day. And then we do the glassing. So on our side we use fiberglass and bio-based epoxy resin and this takes several steps between like seven eight hours to do but you have to let it dry in between some steps so it takes a few days to do the glassing. Along the way we realized what we are really expert on is the mechanics inside the board.

5:36The outside shape of the board is really worked by a shaper and it's kind of their work and they have been like improving it for 60 years. So now we are partner with these shapers that have like a big impact in the industry and so with this kind of partnership we feel really welcomed by the community because it's part of the tradition with innovation and push the limits of the of the performance forward i can remember the first time johnny cabianca the first shaper we work with is the shaper for really good surfers for gabriel medina who is with three times world champion so like really good shapers with a lot of experience and first time he came to our workshop so what we were doing so the precision of the machine the end product which was already pretty good at this time and so the whole potential wanted to collaborate and do some prototypes together I think we really felt we we were kind of touching something in anglet around our area here for like one kilometers from here there are maybe 10 shapers some really like art artist shapers some high level shapers or longboard shapers there are also people working on new materials We have our friends from Notox working on the cork boards, other people from Canoa around with new composite material that is more bio-based as well.

7:36There is a small ecosystem, we know each other, we work together whenever we can because we all share the same vision of making high performance and sustainable products. So this part is confidential because it's part of our patent. Once we put fiberglass and epoxy resin, then there is a final step that we call the hot coat with only resin that makes the ball waterproof. I guess having all these surfing beaches nearby is pretty handy to test the boards. Yeah, for sure. We have the really good surf spots in Angliet, also really good riders around, competitors that can provide high quality feedback on the product.

8:30So yeah, that's a huge opportunity and we are happy to be here next to the beach.

8:43Just a few miles down the coast in Beiritz is Aristide Schöndienst an architect by training who co-founded Polyola to develop and supply eco-friendly polyurethane foam blanks that are made from recycled materials and are fully recyclable For the last 70 years they have been largely built from polyurethane foam polyester resin and fiberglass. Terrific materials to work with because you can really shape each board in the desired shape but very bad for the environment. So polyurethane foams and polyester resins are fossil fuel based, the extraction from the environment is very toxic and so this was one of the driving forces that we wanted to change.

9:34The surfboard always starts with a foam core, the so-called surfboard blank. And that comes in all sizes from 5, 10 to 11 foot. I think there are less than 10 foam manufacturers worldwide, but I would say there are more than 10 ,000 surfboard manufacturers probably. We were able to develop a foam that is made from two-thirds recycled material and that produces about 73 % less CO2 emissions compared to traditional PU foam and is equivalent in or if not even exceeds in certain aspects the performance of traditional PU foam. We founded the company in Biarritz, France and we started to work with two different companies in Germany on the chemistry side and with a small blank manufacturer in Spain.

10:30So it's been really like an European project, you could say. And then we finally, at the end of last year, started to work with Arctic Foam, one of the leading surfboard blank manufacturers that is based in California. And that gives us basically access to a global audience. Moving to France, to Biarritz, has been super important for us in order to set up the company, but also because it is very much the heart of the European surfboard industry. So from Biarritz to Ossigur, which is like about 30 kilometers, there's a lot of really good waves and most of the board building goes on in that area than going over into the Basque country in Spain.

11:16Our philosophy has always been to develop materials that could be used by everyone in the industry. So we never wanted to make a surfboard company, but be a supplier of materials to many, many different companies. And therefore, Biarritz and that whole area has been fantastic because the density of manufacturers is so big there. So it was really easy for us to reach out to many different companies and shapers, especially in the early stages. And also we had a lot of support from the region and from the government. So all of that has been key and really great.

11:59For Monaco, on the beaches of southwest France, I'm Ian Wiley.

12:07My thanks to Ian Wiley for that report. You're listening to The Entrepreneurs.

12:20I am delighted to say more sunshine has arrived in the studio right now. I've been joined by Monocle's very own Fernando Augusto Pacheco. What a treat. Thanks for being on The Entrepreneurs. It's a pleasure. And what an interesting story. You know, Tom, that I love surfing, the idea of surfing. I do not surf, but I think it's the most magical and beautiful sport. There's something quite special about it. I do know what you mean. Why would you not take to the waves yourself? Is it, as it is in my case, a sheer naked terror? Well, not just terror. I don't think I have the coordination for it. Okay.

12:55Also a big problem. I don't have the elegance for it. I think you surprised me. Well, unfortunately, it's a very unfortunate thing, Tom. Okay. Now, listen, surfing, sunshine, France. Monocle's beautiful, sunny Mediterranean newspaper is out. We've been, obviously, on the road in all sorts of sun-kissed climbs as well. Tell us a bit about why this is such a lovely time of year for sunshine lovers like yourself, Fernando. It is indeed. It is my favourite season. Of course, we have the Mediterranean paper out full of sunny stories, Tom. And talking about sunny as well, I think we need to take care of our skins in the summer.

13:31Even I have to admit, you know, I'll tell you a secret. 10 years ago, I did not wear that much SPF. You know, I was kind of against. I was like, I was born in the 70s in a way. I did change. I'm getting older. So, you know, things start appearing in the skin here and there. But that's why I wanted to meet Paris top facially, Sophie Carbonari. You know, when I was planning the Parisian trip, she was always the top of my list. Tom, basically, not just a celebrity. I think she's quite interesting. She has kind of innovative ways to do a facial. and she started a skincare line as well. She was such a delight to talk.

14:07She gave us some tips as well on how to protect her skin in the summer. How's your skincare regime, Tom? Paired back. Which is fine. Fair enough. Is that good? You tell me. You can see the results right here. Luckily, our listeners can't. I think excessive products on the face. I think even the top facialists and, you know, estheticians, they would agree that perhaps that's not also a good thing. The natural look. the natural look but you do need certain products maybe a good serum you know maybe you should arrange a meet of you and sophie i think i probably need does she have an emergency number okay well let's have a listen to you and sophie in conversation so it started in really early age so i have the chance to grow up in a really like house where my mom and my father was taking really care of themselves like in a really ritual way so you know take it like self-care skincare the moment then you when you go and you enter into the bathroom was really one like one ritual that I was obsessed with because I could watch my dad shaving for like minutes and I didn't like it was so hypnotic to me so I create this kind of connection into what is it really to use cosmetics and have this kind of preparation to the world and then when I was turning eight, I was a kind of hyperactive child.

15:30Yeah, so it was a hyperactive child because I'm a dyslexic person. So, you know, I was like, and my mom, she was like, okay, so I have to find something that she can be focused on. And then so she she find this like when I was like, doing fake facials to her or extraction to her or doing doing her hair in front of the TV or anything. I was really focused on and I could do that for hours. So then I loved it. And then it was my thing. And when I turned 15, it was time for me to have a choice about, like about, you know, in French it's really in early age and you have to do a choice about your career, whether you go professional, whether you continue to do study.

16:17So yeah, my mom just said like, maybe you should go and be an esthetician. And I didn't want it at the beginning because I was thinking that I was too introvert, which actually, as you can see, it wasn't true. But then, yeah. And I embraced that career since then. And it's been like 18 years that I work and 20 years that I start into this industry now. Is it true that one of your start was actually in London? Yeah. Yeah. So London is a really, really interesting city for me. First of all, I find, and I think everybody who lives there will agree with me, it's really inspirational, really energetically, you know, oriented to push people who just have like this, whether it is entrepreneur mind, but a creative mind to excel.

17:04And it's funny because the first time I've been to London was for my first three days and I have my first paycheck, which was nothing at that time. And I say, OK, let's go to have a weekend in London. I've been there a weekend and I felt I knew at that moment I was 18, 19. I say, OK, I will leave here one day. And three years later, like, yeah, three years, three years later, I moved to London because I didn't speak English at that time. And I just thinking like I have my salon in Aix-en-Provence and I closed up because I was not a good entrepreneur. I was really young, not prepared and nothing.

17:39Then I say, OK, I close and now I have to learn. So I closed and I first I knew that something would happen if I was speaking English and, you know, learn this new language and open my mind to this new perspective. So I moved to London and so I stayed for over six years. Did I hear correctly you mentioned Provence? Yes. Is that where you grew up? Yes. Not Paris? No, I'm not a Parisian person. I'm probably from south of France. So, yeah. So I was, I'm adopted. So I was, you know, like born in West Africa in Mali. And then I arrived in France when I was eight months and moved in south of France in a city close to Arles, where there is the...

18:23Beautiful, beautiful. Yes, I love it. So I was raised there, really in the middle of nowhere in the countryside. Yes, when I was 18, I moved first to Marseille after Aix-en-Provence. And then I ended up in London. well let's talk about what makes you unique as well because when people think of facials i think some people have some misconceptions just someone doing some little things in your face some toners but you go deep you have a different technique yeah no explain to us yes so what i first of all i have this as i said you know i have this connection about like not simply cosmetic way of my work.

19:03So I think what I do is really intimate. It's connected to, first of all, to the human body and to the face. It's really important. And then what I did through this almost 20 years of my career is like, you know, go deep inside and learn how I can like, you know, learn the language of the skin. That's what I did. And it took me like a lot of time before I knew that could happen. And so I did like the regular study for like purely aesthetics, but then I have always this affiliation about what is it then the narrative, then you can bring like learning Ayurvedic techniques, learning techniques from Africa, from although from South America, from China or Japan, like there is a different approach of what is it to be to touching the skin and what is it to be an aesthetician and doing beauty in each different country region of the world and i really wanted to embrace that level of taking care of the person and then i wanted to you know like go deeper and uh so i'm kind of a geek so i just like learn all of the about like skin apothecary product and everything so i start to mix and match all of the because like the ingredients that I wanted to include it in my treatment.

20:22So I do my own product. And then after that, with that, I built a certain way of touching the face and it go deeper into the facial level. And so I come and I unlock tensions who are linked into the meridian. So it's an inside out kind of process. And good enough, it works. It works well. And it lasts longer than a regular facial in terms of result. So that makes me popular. And it's funny, you're saying that you make your own product and it's true, you now have a line, you have a serene. So tell us, which makes sense because you're really, I can see that you're really interested, you're geeky as you rightly said.

21:02So it makes sense that you have the serene. So tell us a bit more about the launch of a product because that's different to just being a facialist and you're also on now. So the thing is, it's really funny because you see when And the first time I did enter into beauty school, the teacher was like asking, oh, so like introduce yourself and give us like an insight about where you like why you do this study. And me, it was, you know, it was the beginning of Google and everything. So I'm old. I love that. Beginning of Google. But I just I knew, you know, when I was like saying like, OK, esthetician and everything.

21:38So the name who came out was like Elena Rubinstein, Elizabeth Arden, all of those persons who shaped the beauty until now. And so I knew that that's what I wanted to do. And when it came to my turn, I said, OK, so I'm Sophie Carbonari. I want to be an esthetician because I want to have my brand and I want to do like Elena Rubinstein. And the professor was looking at me and she said, you will be only an esthetician. And I was like, what? sorry what does that what does that really mean i i knew what she meant in term of like oh don't have that much you know aspiration of life or anything because this is like one woman and you will not be at that level i'm not at that level yet but what i wanted to do it's like going my way creating my own philosophy and you know protocol and aspiration and being inspirational for others and that's what I created it and for me it was not making sense having this you know like intuitive approach and everything like building something without building the products behind it and not being sure about what you put on the face of the client so that's how I came into you know like create my own cosmetics and this was really something then you know it was inside me I just, I start like, you know, making my synergy of oils first.

23:04And after I say, okay, I can do a mask. And I tried and it works. And so I improve and proved. Now I'm just like, I self-invest. So I'm really on the early stage of my brand. But what I'm proud of is like, I bring something into the market, which doesn't exist. It's the serum. And I bring, although a beauty tool, it doesn't exist because I designed it because I felt like we need something that works. And it's like, you know, intuitive and playful on the skin and everything. So that's what I want. I just, I don't want to be like another brand. I want to change the full narrative. That's what I want.

23:39I was going to ask, so there are plans for expansion for more products, right? Yes, of course. Yes, yes, yes. I do. Currently in development. Right now I'm looking, I'm looking, I'm raising funds for my Savory A. So the idea is like to be more and more, much more personalized. I really love, you know, like what's this new, you know, like technology can bring into or kind of random routines. And then I see like my clients using ChatGPT to just generate their own routines and everything. So I like this perspective and I would love to dig into it and create something that it's not like generic, something for each person and related to much more lifestyle rather than their skin type, you know.

24:21Because we all know that it depends where you live. If you live in the countryside or in the city, it depends on your level of stress and cortisol into your body and everything. Everything has an impact. And this new kind of wave of longevity, who's just like bloom right now. So it's just the beginning of the blooming side. It's really something that I feel affiliated to because it kind of, when people start to talk about it, I say to myself, okay, so it's been 10 years that I say this is happening, guys. But good enough, I'm there. I know and I'm knowledgeable now. But that was my philosophy.

24:57And finally, I have to ask you, because we're in the middle of a European summer. It is very hot, especially in Paris. Do you have any tips related to skin? Or do you change what you do depending if it's winter or summer? Of course. Does it have a big change? Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, it's different. And it's Fashion Week as well. We're quite busy. Yes. So no, actually, everything changed in terms of the temperature because it does have an impact into your full system. And whether you live into a city or if you live on the countryside or by who you are by the sea, everything has to be adaptable. One key thing is you have to, it looks stupid to say it, but it's true, you have to keep your skin cool.

25:40you know like using like you know mineral water spray all those kind of things just to refresh your skin and to like you know keep the temperature of your skin under 37 because the question is like it doesn't have an impact in your of new melanin on the cells of your skin and that can create a degenerative impact such like pigmentations or like acne or those kind of things so keep your skin fresh taking care of your sleep is really important even if we sleep less because of the light, we have to take care of your sleep because of the health of home microbiome. It's really important. Wearing SPF, obviously, double cleans because more than ever with the heat and the warmness and the humidity in the air, we have the pollution who just stays stuck on the top of the skin.

26:28Seasons have an impact on skin. So we have to re-adapt and regulate everything. I struggle with SPF. I know. I know it's horrible to say this in front of you. I know, I understand. But I have oily skin, it's so difficult. I know. Can you make an SPF thing especially? I will. I wish I could launch every product that I have in mind that will arrive, obviously. So I will say, I understand when you have oily skin, SPF is difficult. So there is two brands that I love for oily skin. So one, it's a Korean brand called Bento, which is like something that you can find on Amazon. It's FPS 50+++. It does protect for blue lights too.

27:08It's really good. You have two different ones. It's the one with scintilla asiatica inside, which is anti-inflammatory and prevent for acne. It doesn't clog your pores and the texture is really thin and doesn't get this white weird spectrum on the top of your face. The second one that I'm just starting to use since two weeks, one and a half weeks, is the Ordinary one, the SPS 45. Really light, doesn't leave any white shade on the top of your face and doesn't clog your pores and really thin and doesn't give you oily type skin or anything. So those two I loved so far. There is Lancaster, but Lancaster leaves a little bit of whiteness, so I will not recommend.

27:52But those two are really good. That was Sophie Carbonari, the world-renowned founder of her eponymous skincare line. You can find out more by heading to sophiecarbonari.com.

28:13And that is all for this Sunshine edition of The Entrepreneurs. We'll be back at the same time next week. The programme's produced by Laura Kramer with audio editing by Jack Dewars. If you'd like to reach Laura and the team, drop her an email on lrk at monocle.com. I'm Tom Edwards. Goodbye, and thanks for listening to The Entrepreneurs.