Nev: These type of matches are costing Arsenal | Are Man City's back four a weakness? | Calls for Man Utd to bring in a new goalkeeper

0:00Peter Drury:It's the Gary Neville podcast from Anfield at the end of a game between Liverpool and Arsenal, which began gently but certainly didn't end that way, Gary. It'll be remembered, of course, for one quite stupendously good free kick.

0:14Gary Neville:Yeah, there was a narrative building before this game that Arsenal would wait till the last 20 minutes and then Eze and Odegaard would come on and Arsenal's bench was stronger. But it was actually Liverpool that got stronger, apart from the last 10 minutes after Liverpool scored and Arsenal obviously reacted. I think there was a point around 65, 66 minutes where the cops started singing and the ground started to come with them and you felt, they smell this a little bit, they want this. Now, obviously, it was an absolutely spectacular strike. I mean, Raya's been the best goalkeeper in this league, along with the guy at the other end of the pitch, and not much beats him, but it was so special.

0:49Gary Neville:I mean, when he was lining up 32 yards out, I'd say it's not Salah, it may be Shobba's Lie, but never fancied him for one second to do what he did. and ordinarily 99 times out of 100 I'm blaming a goalkeeper for any strike from that distance but this was the one time where I wouldn't do because it was just absolutely it was ridiculous that swerve and the power and the dip everything was perfect and it goes in off the post it was a violent shot and Sobbersla deserved it because I thought he was outstanding from minute one right the way through I don't think he'd give Martinelli a kick I think Martinelli to be fair sort of almost refused him at points in the first half and he was so positive when he kept going inside.

1:30Gary Neville:He sometimes went inside to get on the ball off Canate, he went into midfield. I think at one point I saw him making a couple of runs into the box. So, yeah, it was a really great day for him. He's out of position, but against Newcastle, he stood up on Monday night and he stood up again today and Liverpool stood up. You know, this was the team that couldn't defend, this was the team that couldn't keep a clean sheet, this was the team that were easy to play against, but in the big game where it mattered, they found something. They went deeper and they sort of did become sort of tougher to play against.

1:59Gary Neville:And I'm not going to sit here and say that they deserved it, but I always felt that with the crowd, the positivity in the last 25 minutes, Liverpool got stronger in the game. And I feel like Arsenal missed a chance in the first half.

2:11Peter Drury:Do you feel from Liverpool's perspective that that was a deliberately different game?

2:17Gary Neville:Yeah.

2:17Peter Drury:Or did Arsenal make it a different game? Liverpool set out to have that game, did they?

2:21Gary Neville:No, I mean, I think, you know, when you play against Arsenal, I mean what we need to do today with Liverpool is give them huge credit for the way in which they defended set pieces I'm not saying that Declan Rice's delivery was always on point as it usually is but there were probably five or six of them that were whipped underneath that six yard underneath the bar and sort of into the six yard box and Canate in particular headed two or three I think Joe Gomez headed two or three out at the end and they really set up well particularly in that first half when Arsenal had about five corners the way in which they got their players in and around the penalty spot to aggressively, not foul, because I know that referees are really stamping down on it now, but to really sort of be body to body and harass and hustle.

3:04Gary Neville:And that's what sometimes you have to do. You might be smaller in stature against bigger players. Arsenal would have landed a Giants there. They had six in the box that could head it. You've got Timber Calafiore, Gabriel Saliba, but obviously Mosquera came on. Then you've got Jocarez and you've got Mourinho. You have six big players in there. Liverpool have got two or three. that's it so they were outnumbered in terms of height so what you've then got to do is ask your 5 foot 10 your 5 foot 11 players to be absolute pit bulls and I'm looking like that really seriously because I've been there against in teams playing for United at Anfield or playing away at Wimbledon or Stoke where you've got height disadvantage and it's no excuse just to walk off the pitch as Liverpool Football Club and say oh we got beat by we got beat by set pieces because the other team were a little bit taller than those diddums you can't do that at Liverpool, you can't do that at Manchester United there's no excuses and I thought Liverpool today on those corners were absolutely outstanding and they deserve great credit for that, the way in which they've worked on that this week, so they were a little bit more formidable in terms of their aggression, they were more solid and less practical and also Arsenal are an outstanding defensive team, so the likes of Eketike, Salah Verts and Gakpo, four really good attacking players, they were playing against top class defenders, I thought But Calafiore, Gabriel, Mosquero when he came on and Timber were outstanding for Arsenal.

4:25Gary Neville:I really did think one-on-one they did a great job and they nullified their opponents. And they got done by a set piece in the end from a thingy. But that's not the problem for Arsenal, the defensive side of things. They've got Zubimendi-Rice sat in front of them who do a great job as well. They've got the goalkeeper who's fantastic. It's the intent. It's the intent. I don't think Arsenal played a bad game today. I think Mikel Arteta will say after 70 minutes, right, okay, let's try and go and get that goal. But there's something missing up here in these, I'm not going to say big matches, I'm going to say these big away games at difficult grounds.

5:00Gary Neville:You know, Merseyside is bloody tough to come for Anfield to Goodison Park. Newcastle is tough to go to. It's bloody tough up there. And it's tough also to go to Etihad because they're such a brilliant team with Pep Guardiola. But they're the grounds if you're going to win the title. you're not always going to win there but you have to win sometimes you have to think you can go and win there and it says something about your intent to go and win there I've seen this narrative for three, four years now of a point away from home it's early in the season, it's good for Arsenal not always if your intent to win and go and basically win the game is there and you draw, fair enough I think there's an element of not wanting to lose take the bloody handbrake off you've got good players They've got really good players in attacking areas.

5:47Gary Neville:And I just feel like there isn't that commitment to go and disrupt and do something a bit special. And they've got to find that. They've got to find that. You've got to go and win games that you're maybe not expected to. Because it can't always be that you're just going to go and basically deliver against the lower teams. That's not going to work. I know they've got a great record against the bigger teams, Arsenal. But this type of match is costing them.

6:08Peter Drury:That's interesting, particularly in the context of the fact that I think, correct me if I'm wrong, but as we were watching the game first half, we felt that broadly speaking, or you felt, doesn't matter what I think, you felt that Arsenal, broadly speaking, had control of the game in the early stages and had a chance to make it theirs.

6:26Gary Neville:My last comments before half-time were that I feel like Arsenal, with a bit more risk, can go and win this game. Jamie Carragher, Theo Walcott and Roy Keane at half-time, if Arsenal can just be a bit more brave, the game's there for them. Arsenal, you know, Liverpool are there for the taking, I think Jamie Carragher said. I felt that, speaking to Mike Dean here, I said, look, if Arsenal want to do this, if they want to step up and win at Anfield for the first time in 14 years, or go and win at the Etihad, only with them once in, I don't know how long, this is it, it's now. And I'm sat here again at the end of a game where they've not won and they've lost.

7:06Gary Neville:And we all said it at half-time, you know, can they be a bit more expressive? in that first half where Liverpool were a bit nervous, they were a bit anxious, they weren't quite right, that's when you play through the lines. That's when you do go and get a goal. That's when you are braver, when you can smell that there's something out here that's not quite right. Because once their backs are up, by the way, and the noise is going behind that goal, you're in a bit of trouble. You're asking for trouble, should I say, as well. So when Liverpool's fans started singing, you're thinking, here we go. Now, we used to think at coming here when we played here that we could get through that first 25 minutes when it was noisy and it was frantic and then the calm started to come and you'd be in the eye of the storm for a bit and you'd say, right, now go and win the game.

7:44Gary Neville:Go and get your goal. Punish them now when they've calmed down and the noise has gone and the circus has sort of cleared for a little while. But for this game today, it was very different. I thought Arsenal had control in the first half and they didn't have the intent. And it's all about intent and risk and thinking that you're a champion team. You're a champion team. It's a mentality. it's the edge this club have had it in this last 3, 4, 5 years they've won 2 titles and they've got a mentality out there today Van Dijk and a few of the others that we're going to win this game we're going to pinch this and we're seriously going to go and win this game and we're going to end up on 9 points and that's what they've done

8:24Peter Drury:It's fascinating psychology because not many people are champions you know and understand possibly within themselves what the difference is

8:33Gary Neville:And that's why I'm annoyed Peter because I know this is the toughest ground to come to the toughest place to win and you take a draw here snap if you said a draw at Anfield every day of the week you'd snap the hand off however if you're going to go and do it and get over the line and shock people shock the world shock the country that you are going to be champions and title winners you've got to go and do something that surprises people that you've not done before and that was today again for Arsenal and we're sat here again at the end of the game look it might come you know I've tipped them for the title I'm not going to change after today you know I'm not because I think that there's an element of belief that I have that I think, go on, Declan Rice, you can go and be that person who runs through.

9:14Gary Neville:Erdegaard, you can be that player that scores in this game. You know, Madweke, I thought, had a good game today and I thought that Eze looked sharp when he came on. So there is the talent there to think they can go and do it, but they've got to go and do it. And it's thinking it, it's saying it, it's doing it.

9:30Peter Drury:Yeah. I'm just wondering what order to do things in, actually, because we've got a lot of transfer business to do. Maybe, should we do Liverpool's first and all the talk around Isak, Gehi? How are you reading that in the context of Liverpool?

9:44Gary Neville:I mean, Liverpool, nine points. And the two games they've just played, I mean, the first game against Bournemouth was tough enough. We were here. But the two games they've just played, I mean, they had a right battle up at St. James' Park on Monday night. And to come out of there with a victory was incredible. And then to do this today, that must give them massive confidence. and if they can get Gey and Isaac through the door, I mean, they're two starting players. And Isaac's one of the top centre-forwards in the world. He's a real player. He's the one player, Isaac, that I've seen give Saliba and Gabriel and Van Dijk a real hard time over this last couple of seasons.

10:24Gary Neville:I think he's really caused them problems. He's a different level player. So Ekotike's done really well. The boy Virts, we'll talk about him maybe. He looks like he's just finding his feet still and how he can do that, we'll find out. He's played in two bloody difficult games against Arsenal and Newcastle. But Izzak coming into that team there today, with Gahey coming in as well, I thought Canard had his best 78 minutes of the season as well, which was good for him because he's had a tough few weeks. I thought Kyrgyz stuck at it. It was a tough game for him, but he stuck at it. And I thought Sobosla was fantastic at right back.

10:58Gary Neville:So look, for Liverpool to be on nine points, the two games they've just had, and think that those two could be entering the building off the back end of the international break, they'll be absolutely buzzing and confident as hell.

11:09Peter Drury:Together with Witts, as you just mentioned him, so we may as well deal with him. I mean, he is very expensive and I suppose he's bought as a point of difference, isn't he? Someone who can do something special. And you're speaking about him, I think, sympathetically. Yeah, yeah, definitely. Because it's very, very difficult to come in and just have that magic moment, particularly given the fixtures, as you said, they've had.

11:30Gary Neville:Yeah, and he's had two difficult games, I think that anybody finds it difficult to find space against Arsenal. And obviously up at Newcastle on Monday night, he must have felt like a tornado had hit him. I mean, it was like a whirlwind up there, that game. It was incredible. So I can understand why that's just... What the hell was that? I can imagine however they got back from St James' Park on Monday night versus probably thinking, bloody hell, that's the Premier League. But it's interesting thinking about him, and you asked me about him in the first half, and I was watching him quite a bit in the second half because Liverpool had the ball at the back.

12:05Gary Neville:And sometimes you hear expressions, don't you, by coaches and sometimes you say, he's always on the move. And I'm watching Virts and he's always on the move. And I'm thinking, bloody stand still for a second. The opposite. I'm thinking stand still. I'm watching him there sort of like drip between the lines. I'm thinking he's probably moving a bit too quick because I always think sometimes when you're playing in the pocket and in the hole, and I used to see it from a different side. I used to see it from being a defender. and there might be a player that you can see just drifting in the pocket.

12:34Gary Neville:And I used to think that when they were moving, it caught the eye of the defenders, it caught the eye of the midfield players, and they were easier to mark. I always thought when they just walked and drifted sometimes and they looked disinterested, and then all of a sudden they made a quick movement, that was when you got done in the pocket. So there's two things. One, I think he's jogging across the line and he can't then really sort of fool or kid people when he gets on the ball. So that's just a little bit of, you know, a little bit of sort of smartness and intelligence. And then the other thing is, I think just the element of being higher up the pitch by five or six, seven yards and not going too deep, that means that the midfield players for the opposition can pick you up easily and just shield in front.

13:13Gary Neville:I almost feel like the centre-backs want to come in to get you rather than actually be the central midfield players are marking you. I think to me, they're the two things that, look, I'm not a coach, but I think I pretty much know what would cause me a problem. You know, I've played against the likes of Gianfranco Zola and Bergkamp and Del Piero for Juventus. Those types of players, Zidane, that play in those areas. And when they're walking, you're thinking, right, what's he going to do? He's trying to kid me. Is he going to make a movement left? Is he going to make a movement right? Is he going to go deeper?

13:40Gary Neville:Is he going to make a run through? You don't know what he's going to do when they're walking or when they're looking a little bit disinterested. When they're jogging, it's actually harder then to turn and change direction. You understand what I mean? So for me, I just think he maybe is a little bit predictable at this moment in time, maybe a little bit deep, but it's very early in his Liverpool career. But I think there'll be Liverpool fans, there'll be 50 ,000, 60 ,000 in here today, and there'll be Liverpool coaches thinking, OK, he needs a bit of coaching. He's not the finished article at 115 million.

14:07Gary Neville:He's a young lad, he needs work, he needs coaching, and he's got the right man there in Arna Slott because he does get the best out of players. So, yeah, I just think two very tough games to play in. He's shown glimpses, but I think there's an element of him fitting in. And if he has Izak up front in front of him, and Eke TK, obviously, in terms of either of them. But if Izak comes in, I mean, they're going to score an absolute bucket load of goals. And you've got Salah, I don't even mention Salah, who had one of his probably most difficult games I've ever seen today. I mean, that was him in the second half.

14:36Gary Neville:You're expecting him. That little touch and that little sort of, you know, push into the far corner. His touch was off today and it was surprising.

14:45Peter Drury:Yeah. Lots to get through and people are going to want to hear you talk about Manchester United this week, I know. But before then, let's finish what you might call the big three if we're allowed to say that and just in brief Manchester City have lost today there's a question I think obviously we weren't able to see much of the game but around their goalkeeping situation which has become a topic how do you read their business and their current state of affairs

15:12Gary Neville:I actually watched most of the game I came up here early today I tend to at Anfield just to get clear of everything it's got a nice position I didn't think James Shafford was the problem today. I thought that he looked a little bit in fear last week. I thought he looked a little bit startled against Tottenham. I didn't think he was the problem until he made a world-class save. But one thing before the game and I was down there and the teams came up and when I look at Matthias Nunes at right back, ain't Norwich too early to assess but he's a new left back and I look at Kusinov at centre back, I think, all right, okay, Brighton have got a chance.

15:47Gary Neville:And a few years ago, I mean, obviously on the bench was Ake, Akanji and Diaz. So if that back four, Red, Stones, Akanji, Diaz, Ake, you'd look at those four, I know they're a bit older in years now and you think, gee, there's four monsters there, four beasts, they're not going to give you much of a chance. So there's an element, obviously Kyle Walker's left, you know, long ago, but there's an element of looking at City's back four now and thinking, we've got a chance here. Now, Rodri was back in today, but I actually thought in the first half, Ireland could have had two or three, the game could have been out of sight.

16:23Gary Neville:So let's put it into context. But the fact that it's not out of sight and it's 1-0, I never felt City were going to keep a clean sheet or were comfortable looking at keeping a clean sheet. When City were 1-0 up two or three years ago, you could almost write the game off. They'd keep the ball, pop it around, suffocate teams with possession and eventually the team would have to do something and they would either see out a 1-0 win or they'd go and win two and three. That's not this Manchester City now because with Aitnori at left back, with Mateus Nunes at right back or Rico Lewis and with Kusinov in the middle, then that's not a clean sheet back four anymore.

16:55Gary Neville:And it's giving teams a chance. It's giving teams encouragement, which means it puts pressure on the midfield and the forwards to score two and three. And if you only score one, you're going to end up with a bloody nose. And that's what's happened today. And well done to Brighton. They just keep, we said on the gantry, didn't we? You know, Brighton bring these players on and you think to yourself, if you go and commentate on Brighton today, you wouldn't know half the players. They just seem to produce like a conveyor belt of players you don't know. And then you get to know them and then they leave and then you get to know them again and then they leave.

17:21Gary Neville:It's the same every single season. But Gruda the Gavoy, it was a special goal, wasn't it? I love the little Welbeck, little touch-off. Great day for James Milner to score the penalty. You think about how old he is and sort of the career he's had, obviously against his old club. But, you know, well done to Brighton because it had been a difficult start to the season for them and, you know, brilliant for them. But for City, I didn't think Trafford was the problem today. I think it may come back a little bit in moments where he's young and he's not quite mature enough to be at the level of Edison, who's been an outstanding keeper for the last five, six, seven years.

17:55Gary Neville:But that back four, it's interesting to see what Pep's doing. He's got three stalwarts on the bench today. And if he thinks they're past their best years or they're not quite fit or not quite ready, and you're seeing Kusinov and you're seeing Aitnore and you're seeing Matthias Nunes, a lot of Premier League teams will score goals against City with that back four. they will just simple as that because it's not anywhere near the level that it has been over this last five six years

18:22Peter Drury:ok Chelsea clearly had some good fortune yesterday we've all seen that but their misfortune was Liam De Lappe getting injured and Nicholas Jackson flying