How to Balance Work and Mental Health in 2025 | Nick Cannon

0:00This is the Gary Vee Audio Experience. Hey everybody, actually, if you're a really hardcore listener and you know I never do this, I'm sorry to be jumping in the middle of the podcast. If this podcast has ever meant anything to you, please go to Spotify or Apple right now and leave a review. By the way, even if you give me a one-star review because you think it's shit, I respect it, but just leave a review, an actual review. Four or five stars and the actual details of why. Yeah, that would mean something for me, so thanks. Now back to the podcast. Social media is like alcohol. If you don't know how to handle alcohol, it's real bad.

0:31we banned that shit in this country that's how bad it got at one point a hundred years ago but a nice glass of fucking cat bernet with a steak is proper same with social if you're fucking using it to like the national inquirer or like the fucking neighborhood gossip you're gonna fucking not get anything good out of it but by the way there's clips from this podcast that are gonna go on social that some 17 year old guy it's gonna change the course of their life in a positive way so what about that I wanted to create a space for men to be able to be vulnerable, to be able to talk about their emotions, but also a space for healing and having some conversation a lot of times that can seem taboo because some of our views and something to combat those ideas of toxic masculinity and terms that narcissists, all these terms that are thrown at us, specifically at males.

1:27and males in a sense of like wanting to be like entrepreneurs or wanting to be leaders or alpha males can get a bad rap a lot of times when just when times are good yeah everybody alpha males get it when times are good yeah but when shit hits the fan I promise you that alpha male is gonna be put on a pedestal yeah yeah that's just the history of life right the Roman Empire Genghis Khan's people don't understand the alpha male thing all we're talking about is America has been the leading empire and has gone through so much prosperity that we've gotten around to demonizing alpha I promise you if China was rolling through the streets of America right now trying to throw down alpha males would be number one in this place and any other part of the world I love that you say that because it really is, you know, the definition of a man these days.

2:32It all depends on what the conversation is about, but as gentlemen like you and I, we love to provide, we love to protect, we love to advise in that sense. And I feel like in times like that, those things are desired. Massively. You know what I mean? If something's going wrong, even like you said, it don't matter if there's a spider in the kitchen. I believe in it, man. Most of the time, everybody in the house is turning to dad to figure out, like, hey, can we figure this out? So at the level, like you said, where if there's a coup or a takeover in a country, all the way to like, dad, keep us safe Or, because that's, thank God, less realistic.

3:24Or if like, like real shit, like, you know, somebody's tearing down your door. Like, again, I just think that people are, by the way, I get it. Like, we have a whole generation of people that are overcompensating for a generation of dads. You know, you look at fatherhood in the 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s. It was a different game. But I don't blame those men. Those fucking men were coming back from World War II. Those men were getting drafted to Vietnam. Those men were the byproducts of the Great Depression. Like, those men were the byproduct of the 60s when fucking every world leader in America was getting assassinated.

4:05It was different. So, you know, I think that balance is hard and I do think we're, to your point, in the framework of the combo, we have overcorrected too far, which is why I think everybody knows it. Even the last year, we're starting to get a little bit more balanced. Like we're not beating up dudes anymore for like, not, you know, like sometimes you gotta like do shit. Like it's okay to, here's one that I tell a lot of my guy friends, it's okay to miss a little league game. It's okay. You can miss one or two. Like, you know what I mean? Like, you know, I grew up in the 80s, like unless your dad was the coach, 99 % of the games I grew up with, there was no dads in the crowd.

4:48They're working. Like who the fuck is free at 4 p.m. on a Friday? Like, you know, like, so, you know. I'm glad you said that, man. Because we're checking the box. Yeah. Nick. I deal with that a lot because obviously I get extra pressure because I have so many kids. So people are like, they're like, yo, there's no way he can be a present dad. I'm like, and then I find myself that guilt hits when I do miss one of the best. And what is presence? Because I got all sorts of fucking father friends that I know who are like, I go to my kid's shit. I'm like, yeah, but you don't give a fuck. Yeah, you're not really about that kid.

5:23You're there because too many dads, too many men, too many women, too many people, they check the box and act as if. Right. That's just not how life works. It's true. I'll be honest with you, I don't need people being around. I need them to be around when I need them. How about that? Yeah. That's fine. That's where you're going. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, what is a father? What is a mom? By the way, I always talk about my mom. My most pinned comments, my biggest content's about my mom. My mom was there every day. I saw my mom. But I was so outside, she wasn't there there. My mom didn't go to all, like, she had other kids.

6:10I had a younger sister, younger brother. Like, we've gotten to this place where the proxy matters more than the fucking impact. Right. Yeah, I mean. And dads need to start talking too. You said something. Not that financial, and this is for moms too because now we live in a world where plenty of moms are the fucking money maker. Yeah, yeah. All of a sudden, people just decided to take the money thing for granted and move on to the next thing. Right. People need to speak up a little more, Nick. Yeah. There's moms and dads out there who are working 13 hours a day to provide for kids and then the kids are giving shine to the other parent as if that dollar figure isn't the fucking operating system of the whole system.

6:55Tell me about it. It's okay for a dad or a mom to be like, yo, just to remind your ass, I know you went and bought this shit with that parent. Who the fuck do you think paid for it? It's okay. We got to this place where everyone's like, I can't say that shit. That's stupid. Because it's real, Nick. Why would that be bad? why would it be bad if you're a parent that is financially providing obviously and listen you go watch my content for anybody who doesn't know who the fuck I am you go look at my content in two seconds you'll see I give a fuck about feelings I love empathy I love kindness I love compassion I'm just not all or nothing if mama's working two jobs and dad's sitting at home schlepping you to every practice and shopping with you and you got that relationship like we need to give mom love too

7:49feeding yeah let's unpack that I actually sit in my therapist's office about that one subject matter probably more than anything because financially the thing I hear the most it's from outside chatter but I've even heard it inside my own home is that you know So money isn't everything. It's not. But then it comes to that sense of like, you can't just throw money at it. I think that's fair. So, but in a sense of someone who is a provider and I have the issue with, you know, you know, even the idea, oh, I get to be the Disney dad or the, oh, every time you come around, it's fun and we're doing this.

8:38That's fair. But I don't necessarily, because I'm working, I don't get enough, God, I don't want to say quality time. But it's, in that sense, we'll say, I don't get enough quality time. Yet. Right. Let's talk about that. Yeah. You're talking to a man whose father, different circumstance. Yeah. We came to America. We were dead poor. My dad worked every minute. Yeah. Worked in a liquor store, both first as a stock boy, then as assistant manager, then as a manager, then he owned his own store. Listen to this, Nick. This is real talk back to vulnerability. You're talking to a man who, from the time he can remember until he was 14, slept in the same home as his father.

9:24My father and I, because we never wanted a family vacation my whole life, at that point. One, excuse me, except for four days when I was 11, when my mom took me and my sister to Disney, at the Holiday Inn, slept in the same house as my father every night of my life, and has almost no memories of him before I was 14, because he woke up and went to work before I got up, and he came home after I went to sleep. And he worked seven days a week, and the only two days the liquor store was closed was Christmas Day and New Year's, ironically a week apart and that man slept all day.

10:09We had one Father Sunday. This was this big thing. When I was 12 I went into my dad's room. It was a Sunday because he didn't work that day for I don't even know what reason. It was Father Sunday. He turned on the TV put on black and white Tarzan like you know one of those Fox 5 shows. He fell asleep about five minutes in. I snuck out of the bed said to my mom can I go outside and play? That was my father's Sunday. I stand here and sit here today, spoke to my father right before I came here, have an incredible relationship with him, have zero resentment. Zero. Many kids could have resentment. We don't get to control how these kids are gonna play out.

10:54They have their nature and their nurture. But there's many kids that have alcoholic fathers that they could forgive and many that didn't. There are many people who had narcissistic mothers they forgave them or they didn't. We can't control everything in life and that's become the great farce. Some of your kids are gonna admire you when they're in their 20s for your work ethic and thank you for the ridiculous privilege that they have had financially once they understand how the world works. Other kids, positive, you know, are gonna have a different take. Be like, dad, you chose work and fame over me.

11:31Right. you are gonna have your whole life to play on the yet. I think people don't understand the yet part. It's not over until you're dead. Like, we've gotta make choices. Plus, we're human beings. But there's gonna be no perfect. And more importantly, and you know this, outside people's opinions on your relationship with your children, that's laughable shit. And all we can do, and I think about this shit all the time because I work a ton too, is how much can we adjust every day as you see the game change? Because our kids have been flow too. They change too. So anyway, yeah, I'm sure you're going through it.

12:12You and every single mother or father that works a lot to provide for their family. You and every other one. So what would be your advice in that sense? I mean, because you're in it as well. To not beat yourself up and to try. Right. And to have the strength to adjust. I, in the last five to seven years, have chosen kid time over work time at a higher percentage than I had prior. Right, what made you make that decision? That I felt that they were getting older, that time starts to run out, that you're adjusting to them. You know, when they're two and three, they're not telling you much. When they're 70, you start to hear some shit.

12:51When they're 11, 12, 13, you're starting to get, you know? And just trying to hedge, evolve, like just trying to adjust along the way. But beating yourself up is not gonna work because me and my two siblings, all three of us, same parents, me and my sister are only three and a half years apart, we grew up very similar. My brother a little bit different, 11 years younger. We all have very different relationships with my parents. Right. What would be the definition of a successful parent? Like what, or like how do you know even as a father even in your own experience as a son, like when you say mom or dad did a good job.

13:33That's a great ass question. That's what I'm saying. Like is it the amount of games you were at? Was it the quality? Was it the corporate range? I don't think so. I have unlimited friends whose parents went to every fucking game and my friends hate their parents. Right. Because that wasn't the thing. Like you know what it is. First of all, it is the hardest game because there's not one person on earth that doesn't walk around. that doesn't judge their parents for some shit. For some shit. There's nobody in this room right now behind the cameras that when I say that can't think of some shit. I mean, I'll say it again.

14:03My mother is, I'm writing a book. I'm not done with it. It's the longest book I've been writing because I write them in my head and then sometimes jot down. It's called Perfectly Parented. Where I literally am writing a book saying my parents perfectly parented me, but the punchline of the book is because of my perspective. I'm in control of that. Right. I was gonna say that. Because I've got unlimited things that I can think of that they've done remarkable. A ton. Way more than most. I really believe that. But real talk, I can think of a lot of shit they didn't do well. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I already know a lot of shit I haven't done well as a parent.

14:38And I'm just in the beginning stages of it. So we're all going through it. My definition is your kids want to spend time with you. Yeah. The thing that I've always watched from afar, this is gonna make sense to you because we got to grow up and we watched people, right? Yeah. Do kids like, You know people who like kids want to spend time with them. I do. My parents, I'm going to London for this Jets game. My parents tried to cancel. Dustin, you were in the room, right? When this happened? When my parents tried to cancel, they didn't want to go. And I picked up the phone and forced them. I want to spend time with them.

15:09I think that's the definition of success. Do your children, after they're 22 years old, want to spend time with you or don't? That I think is the best way to look at it. I think that's merit. That's played out. That's black and white. Yeah, yeah. Nah, that's powerful. So I would love to jump into the space because I mean it's right there going back to mental health and mental wellness. specifically for men and the pressure of being successful being a good parent being a great entrepreneur or employee I feel like we especially in today's day and age because the world is so crazy right now that we we're being extremely hard on ourselves Couldn't agree more.

16:03Judgment. Yes. Judgment. And it's coming from every space, but. Starts with ourselves. Yeah. How do we remedy that? By stop judging other people. That's so easy to say. Let's break it down. I believe the number one way that everybody on earth would get much happier is if they mind their own fucking business. Let me break it down for you. You like that, big man? That's some real shit. Let me break this down. I think this is going to hit because I don't hear people talk about this. we are spending so much fucking time now, unlike other times, judging everybody. We're just spending a lot of time, we got fucking two cents on everybody's life, everyone's public now, whether they're actually famous or just some shit locally on some Instagram shit.

16:48We're spending so much time saying, she looks terrible, he fucking sucks. There's the, like they're just, we're just spending so much time on this gossip shit that it makes us susceptible to other people's judgment. I always try to break down why do I not judge. One, my mother wasn't judgy, which was unheard of back then for the ladies of the 80s. So I saw it. I saw a woman who just like didn't have judgment on others, didn't like to gossip. So I saw it. And it was also my DNA because my sister saw it too and she's got my grandma's DNA. So she's a little different. But I believe because we judge others, we then feel what that feels like.

17:32So if you aren't judging you can't feel the judgment the same way. The reason that we're all fucked up is that we're judging ourselves too much. Nick, like I said earlier if you could take the beginning of this it's like I'm aware of certain things that I'm doing that I wish I was doing better but I don't think I'm a piece of shit because of it. Right. I think I'm a fucking human being. Yeah. Trying. Why is trying not a thing anymore? We as parents, we as grownups are always trying to be like, effort fucking matters, but not on ourselves. People are trying to live out here, we're trying. We've lost grace.

18:12We don't have grace. Fucking grace on yourself, grace for other people. I'm being dead serious. If we minded our own business a little more, then our shit would be a little bit easier. We're just judging, judging, judging, judging. everyone's caught up it's like back in the day when you left high school and you got to college and then you lived real life you dropped those high school tendencies now fucking life is high school everyone's children starts with fucking politicians the way they talk to each other fucking nasty I put on C-SPAN I think I'm watching fucking Jerry Springer we just lost grace I don't know listen honestly back to me eating my own dog food, I don't give a fuck.

18:59I'm in my little cocoon. Y 'all do what the fuck you need to do. I really think the reason we're beating ourselves up is because we're judging too much. And then it bleeds onto ourselves. And then all of a sudden, I don't have as many followers as Nikita. I can't get the same girls as that person. I ain't got the fucking Lambo. I ain't got the clothes. I ain't got the clout. Everybody's fucking worried about everyone's shit. Jealousy, envy. poison no matter what religion you are I promise you if you open up your book they'll tell you straight up envy and jealousy is the great poison of life I'd say comparison is the thief of joy and to be able to always just worry about what someone else is this dude said somebody I knew lightweight acquaintance been with him four or five times in my life once on a dinner friend of a friend said something to me recently he's like you're so lucky I said to him I was like unless you lived I know I know him well enough six, seven times.

19:56I'm like, I know him. I was like, yeah, but not if you lived in my shoes because you wouldn't be able to handle that heat. I'm like, you're lucky, your life is simple. Yeah. And that's the life they chose. And that's amazing. And so I just don't, I don't, like, I could sit all day and say that I'm envious of people that live a very simple nine to five. When I look at a teacher's life, from a certain perspective I'm like man that's fucking good summer like you know like a long day in the schools to six or five not bad like weekends like you know not really your fault they just move on to the next year blame the superintendent blame the principal blame the fucking system no fucking accountability I'm like but then if you really know teachers some of them they die every day in that classroom because they got one kid that they want to help and they can't, right?

20:58Like not making the financial dollars they need to like keep up with their bills. This just goes to how we look at shit. I can easily look at a teacher right now. I just did it. I don't want to waste up too much time. It's the best or it's the worst. I think too many people are just choosing to look at negativity right now. Fatherhood and parenting and being a dude is in that shit right now. Right. Yeah, and going back to the mental health of it all, you know, they say the statistics of, you know, that we're in a higher state of depression than ever before. And like you said, a lot of that is probably just based off of the access and the judgment.

21:43And Nick, the prosperity, my man. I'm telling you. I told you this once before. history was the only class I was good at. I do not believe that people understand what the world has been going through the last 50 years. It's so much prosperity. Wow. Bro, do you, bro, do you, bro, do you, bro, do you think people are gonna fucking try to cancel people for saying a word during World War II? Right. Like dudes were fucking going to Canada trying to dodge the draft in the 60s. Right. Like you had 17 year olds scared shitless of getting killed in Vietnam so they were trying to sneak into Canada. You think they were worried about how many likes they got on a post?

22:29Not at all. Bro, I'm telling you the prosperity, Nick. I'm telling you the prosperity. So the prosperity is made us weaker? 100%. Do you think our, I don't think you and I think our rich kids are as rugged as you and I are. And then when you bring that up, going back to parenting and fatherhood, I struggle with that as well because I want to give my children everything. I want them to have the privilege and experience but I want them to still know what it's like. By the way, even if you didn't, even the parents right now who've made a lot of money who are trying to do different tactics to keep it in check, your kids are going to feel the byproduct of your life.

23:11You can't fake environment. I'm on the board of Pencils of Promise and Charity Water. These are two non-profits that do a lot of work in Africa. Building schools, building wells. So I have a lot of my bougie rich friends always hitting me up. They're like, Gary, when you go to Ghana, can you take my son to really show him? I'm like, yeah, I can. And thrilled to do it. I'm like, but friend, we're gonna go to Ghana for a week. He's gonna, or she's gonna be like, man, I got it good. They're gonna see humans that don't have access to clean water. They're gonna feel crazy for a week. but they're gonna come back and you're gonna go private to Aspen and they're gonna forget in a second.

23:46You can't fake environment. To me, my answer is, listen, I love talking about parenting overall but I never tell how, I think it's crazy to tell someone how to parent. My big thing is just raise good ass kids. Right. Whether they're privileged or not. Look, they're not gonna be hungry because they're getting fed. Yeah. But that's so unfortunate because It's not really unfortunate. By the way, you and I are both lucky enough. We both know, if you really thought right now, it's not very common, but you and I both know of rich kids or kids of famous people who actually are working hard. It's rarer.

24:27But I know if you sat for a minute right now, you're probably thinking of one or two people right now. You know they come from extreme wealth or prosperity, and they're doing their thing. It happens, so it's not like it can't happen. What I think is more important, though, is especially with people like you and I, if you're really coming from a low place financially and you get to a high place, our kids can't, you can't replicate it. It's impossible. I think for me, that's the beauty of these athletic systems. I mean, when it comes to sports, whatever the sport is, when you can teach your kids that, you know, because no matter how well off you are financially, when you're on whatever field you're on, whatever court you're on, it's all about how much work you put in.

25:15My guy, you were literally talking about my favorite subject. I believe sports is the most important. You can't manipulate it. It's why eighth place trophies fucked up everything. It was well intended. I get it. You don't want little Ricky to cry when he's six. I get it. But that's not how life works. The sooner little Ricky figures out he sucks, the better for little Ricky. and you can go find something he's good at 100 % by the way I love sports for that reason and by the way and obviously Bronny bucked the trend and obviously people got plenty of opinions about Bronny but everybody I think if you take away your emotion realize Bronny's a very good basketball player whether he's an NBA all star we'll find out whether he's an NBA player we'll find out but there's a reason Michael Jordan's kids Wayne Gretzky's kids like all the greatest players of all time's kids Mickey Mantle like it's really hard for that next gen like we don't know not the best ones of all time we got kids that are better like there's been Kobe, Kobe, Curry's the only one that kind of beast there you go, there you go and Dale was a beast and obviously you know Kobe's you know Kobe's dad was a real player, played in the league but like you know Dale Curry was a specialist he wasn't a top 10 player in the league and so it's hard yeah, no it truly is like you said, we're sitting here as fathers and we want nothing but the best for our children, but they'll never understand.

26:39But break down best. That's okay. There's shit you and I will never understand. Right? Yeah, true. By the way, I sit here and talk about grind. My parents laugh. They grew up in the Soviet Union in the 60s. My mom's like, you think you had it tough? I had to go outside in the fucking snow to take a piss. They didn't have a bathroom in their house. So like, you know, like by the way God willing maybe your fucking kids think they had it hard because they're going to go out and fucking annihilate it and make it even better for your grandkids. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's true. Again, this goes back to the whole part of mental health.

27:16Mental health is predicated on perspective. This is why I'm obsessed with the content I talk about and like what I want from others. Here's my question to all this. Who makes the rules? What is better? what is balance what is doing a good job you make the rules stop listening to other people you make the rules stop listening to other people like if you define a man like for example we talked about this another time as well I think fighting matters I respect the shit out of somebody saying to me Gary the definition of a man is not someone that can use these and I'm like respect that's how you see it But for me, it is.

28:01It's a piece. It's a piece. Like, who the fuck's gonna protect? Like, it's a piece. I don't mean you gotta be a fuckin' UFC champion, but like, I feel like it's a backbone. I feel like it's stepping up for your family. I do. Like, if your family's getting punked, that's emotional damage. And it's also the great measurement, too. It's a measurement. On the same token, I think the definition of a man is being emotionally strong. I disrespect a lot of men who get into the gutter and get into gossip and act all ridiculous. Childish. I think the biggest strength is emotional strength. Not fucking muscles.

28:42But why can't both be true? Why can't you be a father that both at an argument at a dinner table instead of getting emotional and acting a fool be fucking calm collect and fucking debate your point of view with respect and why can't you also be a father that if a bobcat goes in your fucking backyard, you're ready to fucking do something about it instead of crying? Yeah, yeah. Why can't you? You should be able to. I think so. And by the way, I don't even want to use the word should. I, Gary Vaynerchuk, am allowed to think that. Yeah. I don't even impose should. Yeah. If you don't think that's the definition, good.

29:21This goes back to the point of this whole thing. If you mind your own fucking business, I think your mental health will get better. I'm being dead fucking serious, Nick. I know it's an off-speed pitch. I know it's a different angle than the way people are talking about it. Brother, I'm fucking telling you that. Wise words. Great counsel. I just think that people don't realize we're all, basically, Instagram and social media, which I adore because I know how to handle it. It's like alcohol. People are like, social media. I'm like, social media is like alcohol. If you don't know how to handle alcohol, it's real bad.