The Complexity Myth: Why Investing is Simpler Than You Think

0:00If there's anything you can take away, and hopefully we touch on it every once in a while, is that just being in the game and being in the game for a long time. And to Stephen's point, being in the game, even as something that's just 20 years, there's this compounding effect where your wealth becomes like a snowball rolling down a hill. And so just by being an investor in the stock market, you can really make a massive impact to your future by getting in the game. This show is sponsored by Liquid Ivy. With the days getting longer and warmer, I'm spending way more time outside. but lately I was hitting a massive afternoon slump.

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3:32Start now. Welcome back to the Investing for Beginners podcast, everybody. My name is Stephen Morris. Across from me is Andrew Sather. And Andrew, we're going to take a little bit of a break today from like the normal, super in-depth stock market stuff. And we're going to talk about an end topic, a topic that I think is important because how you give the message to a friend, a brother, a sister, someone important to you in your life will determine whether or not they make the smart decision to invest their money. And so today we're going to talk about just how do you talk to people about the stock market, people that you love?

4:13And I've shared before the story of my dad who doesn't know anything about the stock market. So therefore, he doesn't believe in the stock market. He thinks it's just for rich people, not realizing it's a great highway to build wealth on. And so that's what we're going to dive into today, Andrew. And I'm super excited about it because I think this is a vastly, vastly important topic, especially seeing how as I have kids. Actually, would you want to start with how you tried to convince your dad about the power of the stock market? Because that is step zero. If you're not convinced on the stock market, the rest of our conversation doesn't matter.

4:53Yeah, we can definitely start there. And, you know, my dad, he's came around a long way from where he was when I was a kid. I'm definitely believing in 401ks now. Mutual funds are more of his cup of tea, I guess you could say. And a lot of that comes from he's a big Dave Ramsey fan. And so I'm pretty sure that's where it comes from. And I'm not super familiar with Dave Ramsey, but I'm pretty sure he's like big into like mutual funds and things like that. The more safe or ultra safe investment strategies. So that's where my dad is. And he's retired now fully. He works only because he's bored, but not not to live.

5:44So between retirement and Social Security, he has plumbing. but i mean it was definitely late and i think that's like one of the coolest things because i dad didn't really start investing into his retirement until like 50 55 ish and but so now he's 75 and like he's not rich don't i'm no don't get me wrong but he he definitely uh has enough to survive um and you know with a little bit extra leftover and so i mean i think that's probably the coolest story of my dad is that even though he started way way way super late um compounding did what compounding does and and still gave him enough to retire eventually I love hearing that because sometimes when we talk investing in the stock market and retirement, it always can feel like some super distant thing.

6:53But you're talking about just 20 years. That feels a lot more achievable and visible than just saying, ah, you'll get rich eventually. well that and you know one of the biggest things i hear from people that are older is well i'm too old and you know it's just like getting an education you're never too old to get an education you're never too old to start investing um you know if you're 80 years old and you start investing now does that mean you're going to see the fruits of it probably not but your your kids and grandkids will most definitely because that'll get passed down to them uh you know a great way to build an inheritance or whatever it's never too late to start investing and i think that's the coolest story is i feel like a lot of times someone 50 60 years old will be like well i missed i missed the mark i should have done it when i was 20 and yes you should have but that doesn't mean that you can't do it now and i think that's a huge well what's the word a huge stigmatism is that the right word i don't even know that's the wrong word i'll edit it out but um i feel like that's just like a huge problem with the mindset of people is that they're just too old.

8:22Yeah. That's so good to get past. If I think of other mindsets that keep people away from investing, um, would probably be this idea that everything just seems too complicated, too complex, too involved. And so why even try like, I'll just pick up a different hobby. Right. The problem with that mindset being we're all ideally investors. We all have money. And so ideally we're all building wealth and making our financial futures better. I was trying to think of different creative ways to kind of visualize it. But it'd be like if we were to break down a Subaru WRX, right? Shout out to my boy Christian back in high school.

9:16You listen to all the different podcasts, all the YouTubes, all the blog posts talking about stock market investing. It feels like opening a WRX. There's turbo and supercharger and dual exhaust and all these different terms. And some of us just want to get from point A to point B. I don't care if I'm in a Honda or Toyota. And so we go online looking for advice on how to get from point A to point B. And there's all these guys talking about their WRX and this part and that part and like you just don't want to you don't want to be involved but really with investing um if there's anything you can take away and hopefully we touch on it every once in a while is that just being in the game and being in the game for a long time and to steven's point being in the game even as something that's just 20 years there's this compounding effect where your wealth becomes like a snowball rolling down the hill and so just by being an investor in the stock market you can really make a massive impact to your future by getting in the game and doing super simple stuff diversifying so you don't just put everything into Nvidia and call it a portfolio that's not a portfolio make sure you have diversification make sure you're in it for the long term so yeah it's gonna go up and down but just stick with it for the long term and try to just relax and be patient and um and just wait that part's not fun but that part is part of the game so doing those things you could probably ignore everything else that we love to talk about we all do it we do it on the show other people do it on their youtubes um but don't let that keep you out of the game get figure out how to get from point a to point b and do the minimum steps to get there and you're already 80 percent of the way there i mean yeah that's such a good point it's literally this simple unlock your phone open the app store type in whatever brokerage account you want to use literally doesn't matter we we have articles and episodes about those so just pick one that's what i did that's literally what i did when i started i just i picked one i looked at the the ratings the one i picked at good ratings boom there we go um you it's you're it's going to walk you through some steps so you're going to have to like submit your a photo id social security number things like that just it's they're not trying to get you it's literally just for embezzlement purposes um to to stop you from stealing basically so it'll walk you through that take you like 10 minutes um i think now even because when i did it it was like a week to get approved i think now it's even same day approval yeah and so you'll do that you'll get approved once you're approved the app will walk you through how to link your bank account you put in 50 bucks and you go buy a index fund boom you're done that's that simple and i can't remember evan's favorite index fund it's uh vo that sounds right yeah yeah and so like it's vanguard so yeah um so yeah just just evan's favorites vo you type that into the search boom there it is what do you know you are now invested in the s &p 500 and the you're averaging uh what what is it 11 to 15 percent return in the s &p 500 yeah when when it's going good yeah yeah so i mean it's literally that simple it is not complicated at all right all right so let's move down the path then let's say you have a buddy or um someone in your family who wants to make the leap from just being an investor to now I want to do stock picking.

13:39Do you have any thoughts that immediately spring to mind about some of the things you would say about going down that path, especially coming from you being a former swing trader? I would say get used to enjoying reading.

14:01we were just talking uh before we started recording in my military career um there was one point in time where i wanted i decided i wanted to uh be a pilot and uh try to work towards being in SOAR and um you know flying helicopters for the army and um And part of that process is you have to get a recommendation letter for a lieutenant colonel or hire that's a pilot. And so I met someone and they're going to do it, but I had to go spend the day with them. And literally all they did is read. That's it. And they read about the aircraft. And it's like, this is the most boring. No, I'm going back to the range and shoot my gun.

14:52This sucks. And so, I mean, it's funny to say that now because I avoided a career change because I didn't want to read. But one, it's different a little bit because, I mean, military technical manuals should be a war crime in and of themselves.

15:17But it's, yeah, just get used to reading. And it's not reading to be able to take a test. It's reading so that you have a broad understanding of the business. And, I mean, Andrew can answer questions about companies he's invested in that I would have never even thought to ask. And the only reason he can answer them is because he's taken the time just to read. so i mean it's i don't know if that made sense in my head it made sense um but uh yeah i mean that's the thing is is if you want to stock pick great i highly encourage it encourage you it's a lot of fun um big big adrenaline and dopamine rush from it but if you want to do that you got to be willing to read do your research and unfortunately the worst part of it all to me is the math.

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19:36Yeah. I mean, it's I'll say it gets better. it gets easier and uh if you master the skill of reading the 10k you'll know which parts you can skim and how to skim um and that makes things i don't know like more enjoyable but less painful when when you know right i've read about how companies talk about how they try to protect company data a million times so i can just skim and just look for anything that looks out of the ordinary that definitely speeds up the process um but one one other idea i wanted to throw out there which i was gonna save for later but since we're already on the topic uh the fact of you and evan being such like coffee sickos like just being like so into the coffee made me think of this but I remember when I was trying to learn the skill of reading the 10k I would be like finding the time of the day when I'm at my peak and that was always with a coffee and so I did that every day and made it my goal to get through 10ks and so it's not like I'm reading 10ks all day long is I'm doing it when I'm most focused when I'm at my best and then you know two hours later I'm done and then you just do it again tomorrow.

21:00So if I had advice around stock picking, it would be whatever is tripping you up, try to tackle it when you're at your best, whether you're a night person or you're a day person or you have energy at this time or uninterrupted quiet time, whatever it is, try to stack it in that way because that's something I had heard from Charlie Munger. I remember very early on, he had a quote about, um, if you spend the first hour of your day working on yourself, I can't remember how the rest of the quote was, but that's, that's the idea. You just spend that first, that first hour. And then, um, pretty soon you'll, you'll find that you've invested in yourself and that's going to take you farther than if you had done something else.

21:49So whatever the struggle is, try the structure of your day to tackle those things. And then it gets easier. And now I don't have to spend the first hour of my day reading 10Ks because I would rather spend it otherwise. So yeah, it gets easier. Yeah. I mean, you know, we should do like a screen recording of you reading a 10K. That sounds like the most boring thing I've ever heard. No, it's crazy. And I'm not saying so people can watch you read the whole thing. Right? But just like watching how fast you go. Yeah, like through through it. Right. And it's like, I can't keep up. It's insane. How fast you you burn through it.

22:38And then you'll you'll scroll scroll scroll stop scroll back up. Like a half a page highlights something I guess I'm guessing you copy it and paste it someplace else i don't know what what you do when you do that but um then you scroll scroll scroll stop and then you see like you'll stop on numbers and it's like you'll sit there for a second scroll scroll scroll scroll it's just it's amazing to me how fast you go through it but i mean and that's a great point and it leads me to you know if this isn't your full-time jobs which if stock picking is not your full-time job it's okay if it takes time to read the 10k you know if you're trying to read a 10k to so you can learn about amazon um and figure out if now is a good time to invest in amazon i promise you will be there in a month more than likely i would be willing to put my money on that um amazon will still be there so it's okay if it takes you a little bit of time and i think that's a big another big myth about it that new or people that don't really know about the stock market have is if you miss the boat then then you've missed the boat and there's that's it and that is not not the case at all and maybe maybe now isn't the right time to buy into amazon but i promise you there will be a time within a year or so that will be the right time to buy into amazon when it will make sense and that's okay for you if you have to wait that that time yeah i love that um we live in a world where we want everything done now and it's like i want to check that box now but investing is different you can wait you can be patient and you'll probably do better so i like that i like the advice um all right this one's kind of related again another one of these visuals i wanted to throw out there so um If you've ever tried to learn how to play guitar, becoming a good stock picker and understanding what stock picking is all about is kind of like learning how to play a guitar.

25:07For a while, you just feel like you have these stints for fingers. The fingers aren't going where you want them to go. You're not able to strum and you're just not making any sort of progress and it's so overwhelming. And then one day, you discover power chords and all of a sudden you can play a thousand more songs than you ever thought. And I would say the hurdle for stock picking is similar. There's just so many metrics. It's like, you know, how many of these 15, 30 different metrics do I need to learn? And then with enough time, you realize, oh, okay, these are the ones I hear people say over and over and over again.

25:47So these are the ones I'm focused on, top line, bottom line, things like that. and it just opens up and you might find one day you're able to be the center of attention of the quinceanera with your guitar when just a few months before you were struggling to hit notes. So shout out Leo for that one. But it does like happen quickly, but you just have to slog through until you get there. And I find that learning about the stock market can feel like that too. Yeah. I've never tried to learn to play the guitar, but I can see what you're saying. And I think for me, one of the biggest hurdles is, yeah, for me, it was almost like deer in the headlights.

26:35So when I started learning the stock market from the swing trader side and then from the when I started working with you guys, it wasn't a slow process. Like it was like basically just straight inundation. Like, boom, here you go. Um, we threw you in the deep end. Yeah. And no floaties or anything. What are those? Uh, water wings, no water wings that, that it was literally just like getting punched in the face with my entire screen. Just because that that's how many different metrics there are. and but then as fast as that happened was as fast as i realized because of you guys that none of those metrics matter i mean they matter to somebody but they don't matter to us and once i realized that i could ignore 90 percent if not more then that suddenly became a lot less stressful and make it feel like okay now i can learn this isn't latin like this is much less complicated than i initially thought like i'll be okay um but that initial like just seeing how many it's insane how many metrics there are and like i said i'm sure they matter to somebody but good if it's it's nuts yeah that's a good way to put it you're never gonna know every metric for every company and eventually you'll get to the place where you know enough to fit the type of investor you are this one was like kind of like a football idea so okay and it's a good segue so cool all right um i always looked at investing this took me like a real like it sounds overly simplified but it took me a lot longer to realize this than i would like to admit but um you can look at the stock market and investing kind of like um solely from a value perspective solely from like uh i'm gonna try to find cheap stocks perspective it would be like um trying to pick a football team and saying i'm going to try to pick a football the football teams that have you know they're going to win one extra game compared to what everybody thinks they're going to win so it's like you find those like easier to pick like cleveland browns or um the new york jets and say okay i can i i can know enough to know when they're going to win one more game than everybody else thinks.

29:25And that's certainly one way to invest. And that's the way I've invested for a while. But then you come to the realization also that you can just, you can buy the Patriots or I guess what's today's equivalent, the Seattle Seahawks and let them be the Patriots and the Seahawks. And you don't have to always find like the outperformance. So like, like one example would be, Stephen's going to love this. I'm sure. Try not to like have a heart attack on the other side, but like when the Patriots were in their heyday and they had, he's already rolling his eyes. They had like Brady, you know, and you had Randy Moss and it's like, everybody's saying, oh, you know, Brady's too old or Randy Moss is washed up or they're not going to gel.

30:16And all you have to do is just say all these people, all these haters are wrong. I'm going to bet on the Patriots that they're going to do better than what people are saying. So you can like, that sounds really kind of maybe dumb, like not a great comparison, but you really, when I look at the stocks I buy, it's really a similar process and it's an easier game. When you look for the stocks that everybody's hating on versus trying to pick the Cleveland Browns or the New York jets and companies like that. Like a lot of times when you pick the better stocks, the better companies, because they're so much better, they are the patriots of the world.

30:54They will do very, very well, but you have to pick them when everybody else thinks that they're not going to do well. And that's because of the way the stock market works, because of the way that all stocks are priced based on what everybody thinks they're going to do. And so all you have to do is figure out which stocks are going to do better than everybody thinks. and the better stocks you have in your portfolio, the better your portfolio will do because those stocks can carry your portfolio on its own. So I don't know if any of that landed. It doesn't look like it did. But shout out Laura and our games at Madden.

31:33But that's one way you could look at investing. I mean, that's a pretty horrible analogy, but I think I can say that by saying, And it goes back to what my dad used to believe when I was a kid, and that is the stock market is just you might as well go to Vegas. Right. You're just as likely to get rich in Vegas.

31:59and and if that if you're picking the the new york jets which i hate that you brought up the new york jets just as much as the patriots because you know that for the past three years i've bought into the jets are going to actually be good this year i totally screwed myself in the fantasy football because i've believed for some freaking insane reason that the new york jets are going to be good and i don't think in our lifetime and my children's lifetime or in my grandchildren's lifetime will the new york jets ever go past 500 um a lot of hatred towards the jets and it's it's well earned anyway i digress um but yeah if that if you're picking the jets to win the super bowl that's exactly what you're doing you're betting on you're you're gambling on the long shot open to get rich.

32:51And if you're doing that in the stock market, you're doing the exact same thing. You're just gambling. And if you enjoy doing that, not saying don't do it, do it wisely. But that's not what I enjoy doing, because what we enjoy doing is doing something that nets results that can change our lives and our family's lives and our friends' lives. and we do that by buying you know the the amazons of the world which are the patriots we do that by buying the uh apples of the world which are the new york yankees the teams that just find a way to win year after year have tons of championships tons of experience under their belt you know they're not going anywhere they may have a few bad seasons maybe even a decade of bad seasons but they'll be back and you know they will and it's just a matter of time until they're there and then you can just roll your eyes and hate them even more because they're back and that's how i feel with drake may and the patriots right now like man can we get at least five more years of the patriots break um but i mean and when you when your portfolio looks like that it goes from gambling to i mean well i what's the opposite of gambling i'm i don't even know what word to use it's it's just a smart investment that you know obviously is nothing is 100 in this world nothing but it's it's dang near as close to 100 as you can get if you have a portfolio of Apple, Google meta, like Lowe's, these companies aren't going anyway, and they're going to continue to make money Coke.

34:40Like, so, I mean, that's exactly what you're saying. Andrew is bet on bet on the winners, bet on the people that keep winning because then it's not a bet. It's just an investment. We have the inside scoop on something that's absolutely taken over the internet by storm. Live shopping on Whatnot is exploding. I've seen the shows firsthand. The amount of product that sells through is just amazing to see. Really a breakneck pace. Whatnot has climbed to the top of the app store and sellers are earning. Small, medium, and multi-million dollar businesses are all growing. That's because Whatnot is not just about listing products.

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36:30Carvana! Delivery fees may apply. An investment, yeah. It's pretty risk-taking. I like the way you're describing that. So I'll have one last one here. Save my best for last. shout out uh billy super k noobulus the chalupa um sometimes it's not about the person it's sometimes it's not about the chili cheese fries it's about the journey that he took to get to the chili cheese fries uh dude we used to i'm telling you man in high school these are all my high school buddies right uh say that one more time just say that one i can't repeat that i don't even remember what i said you said it's not about it's not about the chili cheese fries it's about the journey you take to get yeah that's right we we used to um back at laguna we would explore and we'd figure out all the best chili cheese fries places and that was just our thing and uh obviously the chili cheese fries are good and that's a great part of it but also the memories are formed you know driving around in the best the the sickest ride in in the town and uh listening to bench sevenfold and and blasting with the windows down you know and um same with investing i think investing should be fun one of the mistakes i've made for a long time is getting so focused on what my returns are, what my numbers are, how much has my portfolio done over this amount of time.

38:11That's like, really, this should be fun. We should talk and joke about the different stocks that we've bought and have done well, and maybe other ones that have not done well. And it's something you can... I've increasingly been able to get my family to talk more about stocks with me and it's just it's just a lot more enjoyable when you're when you're treating it like something that can be fun versus so um like oh we all have to get this right perfectly so obviously we're all investing ultimately to make money but there can be a lot of satisfaction found along the way and you don't have to wait for this arbitrary number or pile of money period of time in your life before you can enjoy the stock market i love that that speaks so true to the way i try to live my life because i've never had a job i hated and you know in the army loved it um being an entrepreneur love it even my the the nine to five jobs i had in between the army and doing this i i love those jobs too um and to me it's if you don't love it what's the point because at least for me my my personality i guess if i if i don't enjoy something i'm not going to put 100 into it i can't force myself it's going to be half half done at some point in time and so uh it makes no sense to me to not not have a career that i love to not do hobbies that i absolutely just love that i can get lost in for hours and hours and hours and you know and if you don't if you're if you're forcing yourself then just take a break then take a step back you know and i'm sure and i mean andrew said it a million times stock picking is not for everybody but i think um a lot of it's what he just said a lot of it is we just burn ourselves out trying to get a perfect trying to learn everything right now and people that would otherwise be great stock pickers great investors end up not not getting in the game because they just burnt themselves out too early so i mean it's all and it's easy it's easy to love something whenever you see hard work pay off in the end and so my point to all that is just you know to take a chill pill relax learn you know teach yourself at a pace that you're comfortable with it's okay and if you absolutely hate it then there are professionals out there you can hire that will do it for you that's probably a better option because if you hate it if you if you have to force yourself to do this every single day or whenever you're going to make a mistake and that's going to cost you money eventually that's not what we want to see happen 100 % well said brother but I'm I don't know I'm still pretty ticked off you brought up the Jets and the Patriots