#2015 - Zach Bryan

22:54That's what happened to me last year. Because I mean, I wasn't like being crazy. I wasn't like shooting up or anything. But we were just drinking so much and we weren't like working out. And like, it was just like, and I woke up one morning. I was like a New York City and I'm like, man, I feel just bad. I shouldn't feel like there's an eight in the morning. I haven't done anything. That's when I started like addressing, I call my dad. I'm like, man, I got to do something. That's the real problem with booze. That's the real problem with booze. I noticed. It is so much worse for you than weed or mushrooms or anything else.

23:25Booze is the worst. Because it removes all of your, am I being an asshole, filter? So you're like, ah, ah, ah. So people get loud and confident and un -inhibited. And then you feel terrible the next day. Exactly. It's the worst drug. But it's also really fun. It's the most fun thing you can do. It's pretty fun. People give me shit all the time. Because my sister, my sister sobered up a long, long time ago. And we always talk about it with each other in a way of like balancing our lives and things like that and drinking and all that. And every time I talk to her, she's like, why don't you just quit drinking if you feel bad all the time?

24:03And I'm like, come musician. It's a great time to be at like that night at the mothership and stuff. Like you go down and you start drinking with your friends and things. It's when it gets out of hand and it's not okay. Yeah. It's a balance of that. For sure. Did you see Hubertman's podcast on alcohol? No, I didn't. It's terrible. I watched it. Yeah, no. I watched that man. I was like, I'm never put really. Really? Yeah, it's scary. He was talking about it. And I was like, I probably was drinking a beer. It was like, A .P .M. and I'm like, oh shit. He was like, no, this is, he did not don't quote me on this.

24:34He was like, this is, it kills you. Every time you drink. Every time you drink. And I was like, man, I got poisoned. Yeah. Because I'd stop drinking. I thought, man, I thought I was being the smart. And like last year we were drinking a lot of whiskey. And I was like, I'm gonna stop drinking whiskey. I'll stick with the light beers and just the beer. I started drinking beer and I felt worse. And I was like, well, you're getting a lot of carbohydrates. Exactly. And I didn't realize that. I woke up every morning like full. And I'm like, why? I can't eat breakfast. And it was a crazy calories. Yeah.

25:01If you're drinking 12 beers, that's a shit load of calories. And I mean, our days are so long. Like, being a musician, people don't realize how much fucking time you're just waiting around. Right. Because you get to the venue early and then you wait around all day to play and then you play. And then afterwards, everyone wants to talk. So you're like, up for like 18 hours and there's beer involved in everything. And you don't even mean to do it. But you're like, man, at the end of the night, you're like, I gotta eat something, man. It's crazy. Their stages of guys drinking last one of them as they go to the tequila stage.

25:31Like tequila doesn't give you hangovers, man. Tequila's bad, right? They'll do that. That's like one of the stages. You're even saying tequila makes me want to just. Yeah, man. I can't do it. Even a smell of it freaks me out. That's probably my favorite drink. Interesting. Yeah. Wow. Now, it doesn't fuck me up as much as other ones. I like when I am purposely trying to get fucked up, it's whiskey. Of course, yeah, me too. So I gotta stop drinking it. But the other one, get them all realized like, you're not invincible. You can't do this. That's what, man, it's crazy. Your body starts declining and you're like, I gotta do you ever do IV vitamin drips after you drink?

26:04I tried them once and it made me feel worse. So now I'm like scared of them. Yeah, I did it at festival one time. Because I was just, I did ACL and I'm not ACLs amazing and everything. It's awesome, but man, I woke up the next morning and I was like, I can't. Really? It was like 530. I had like the 530 slot and we had been driving all night. I was like, man, I can't do this and Danny's like, here, do this IV, it'll make you feel better. And I did it and I went on stage. I was like, oh, this is terrible. Really? I had a great time and the show was fine, but. But you felt worse? I did feel worse.

26:35It gave me a headache for some reason. I don't know. That's interesting. What? Man. I don't want to throw any companies on to the bus, but I wonder what they put in it. Because what you want is IV companies like the first -puls and things. Which you want to get in is glutathione. That's a big one. It actually helps your liver process alcohol. A lot of people take glutathione while they drink to actually help. I was literally about to ask, can you do it simultaneously? Yeah, you can take it all up and drink at the same time. You could. I think that would be cumbersome. But a lot of people take liposomal glutathione.

27:08It's a way it gets in your bloodstream better. You're like squirted into your tongue. I've tried that before. But generally, you're rehydrating and you're getting a full panel of vitamins. You're getting zinc. You're getting vitamin D and B and a lot of high dose vitamin C. It's good for your body, for sure. Of course. And when you're recovering from a night of drinking, it's good to give your body the building blocks to try to get it. Get your shit together. Well, to speak about it technically. My body hit a wall because I was so in the Navy and it was so physical. It was so physical. You had to be in such a great physical shape.

27:47And then all of a sudden it was like, out. Right, do whatever you want. Yeah, now it's like you're free. And I was like, okay, let's go. It was crazy. It was crazy. I waited eight months to, it was just such a crazy story. And then when I finally had freedom, I kind of overdid it. Do you ever think about taking like a trainer with you on the road? I think we're doing it next year. That's a good move. But I hate, there's something in me, not my, it might be my ego or whatever, but there's something in me that's like, no, you can do it yourself. Well, you can, but will you? Exactly. That's what's all.

28:15It can't happen so far. It's so unexpected. Well, I mean, I have. But you know what you could do? You could make like an agreement with the guys that you work with. Like where everyone's gonna do a specific amount of working out every day. Like you're gonna do like X amount of days a week and you have to do it with each workout, 20 minutes of cardio, 100 pushups. That's cool too, built a camaraderie. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We've been doing better this year on the road. But if you like have something like that, where everybody can complain about it, talk shit about it and have fun with it. That's when people do their best, man.

28:46When there's a market, they gotta link to Pete with. It's cool. It's also like a bonding experience and it's also, you know, it's a shared experience. It's like you're having a fun time and you're getting stuff done and it'll force you to do it. Like you hold each other accountable and just do it for a month. Oh, the thing I'm gonna do for the next month is play pool. Yeah. Yeah. You gotta get better. Okay, let's get a pool, man. Yeah, I play a lot though. It's not fair. I thought I'm telling you when I say we did too. Yeah. A lot, like too much. People like refer to it when they're talking to me.

29:19That's how it's being out. That's crazy. Well, there's pool that you play in a bar, like on a bar table. And then there's tournament pool that you play on a tight pocketed table. When I showed up and the guy started telling me the rules, I was like, I'm sorry. What? That's for nine ball. Of course. But we play eight ball. It's the best game in the world, besides maybe like poker. I love it. I love it more than anything because you have to execute. It's one of the rare games where it's not just knowing what to do and figuring out little puzzles, but you have to execute. Like you have to control your body.

29:48You just put words to it. How I feel about it too. Yeah. I've always thought that, like how is this game so damn fun? I think that's the same thing that people get with golf. You know, because you have to execute. You have to make the shot. Golf, man. You play golf? No, I don't, but Jamie's an addict. I can't do golf. Jamie just got back from my tournament. I can't do golf. Something about it, I just can't do. You'll get that. It's got to be the shorts. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. A lot of my friends do play golf and they always try to get me to play. It's a super addictive game. That's the only reason why I've never messed with it.

30:18Really? I just, I don't want to get addicted. Like Tony Hinchcliff and him and Ron White and a lot of my good friends are just full on golf junkies. Really? They can't stop playing. I've been living in the Northeast and there's a big, it's like, there's a lot of, I feel like in golf you have to go out and like, there's a lot of work involved in getting into golf. Same with like sports like lacrosse and stuff like that. There's just like a lot of shit you gotta have to play. Oh yeah, golf. You gotta have so many fucking clubs you have. You're supposed to have 14 or so in your bag, plus your shoes.

30:48There's rules about what you gotta wear out there. Yeah. I thought it was annoying carrying a pool queue on the road. They're taking a pool queue. 60 pound bag. I feel like a dork when I do that. If you walk into, you're not a dork if you do that because some of my friends do it. But you walk into a bar with a pole stick. It's like, yeah. And also people are like, they don't want to play you at that point. I don't at least. If I'm in a bar and I get brings a pole stick in and like a glove, I'm like, okay. This episode is brought to you by Zippercruder. The hiring process is stressful. There are so many different things to consider.

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34:03Yeah, it's like pulling ball lemons. Yeah, but a lot of pool players that are really good go to bars because people do think they're good at pool. And they'll go and talk shit. Possible up, man. Someone will try to gamble. Next thing you know, they're walking out there with 10 grand. Yeah, a bunch of friends that have done that. We do the dumbest shit at bars when it comes to pool because wall like be drinking beers all night. It'll be like midnight and someone's like, I'll bet you on this one. And then like the whole bottle like get around. You know, he's a watch this play. It's crazy. Yeah, it's psychotic.

34:32Yeah, gambling. It's okay. Scary. Dude, I was in Vegas with Dana White, Taylor Lewin. Who else was gambling? Well, who else was gambling? Those well, well, well, well, well, well, well, well, yeah, and Shane Gillis was with us and, and Jamie. And Dana White was gambling and he was down $600 ,000 playing blackjack. I was like, no, don't do it. Taylor was telling us. So we're backstage with Shane. Shane Gillis is doing a show at the Marage. I came to hang out. We're all having a good time. And then he goes, hey, we're gonna go gamble with Dana. I'm like, oh my God, do you know how hard he gambles?

35:10You're gonna get, he's like, I'm up all this money. Taylor's like, I'm fired up. Dana shows me how to bet. We get there. Taylor's down $120 ,000 in the first five minutes. But can also go the other way. Yeah, that's why I'm going to do it. It did go the other way. He made his money back and he won like 65 grand, I think. And then he backed out. He's like, that's it. People would just gamble on it. It would just go up. I do this thing every year where I go to the casino and I'll put X amount of dollars on red every time, no matter what. And I've never lost, which I'll probably lose now that I jinxed it.

35:40But like every year, once a year, I'll go and put money on red just to say I can't, like whatever. That's good. I can't go to the casino man. It's scary. Man, I was, we were in, I don't know, we were like in, it's freaky, like in Arkansas and Oklahoma, Missouri, states like that. If you go to the casino, I was at the hotel, like even the hotels at Casinos are scary. You're like, I'm gonna send you something to do. What just stains on the couch is man. You're like, what's going on? You go downstairs and like your buddies are like smoking cigarettes and like, with those fucking sticks on the lottery machines or what, the slot machines and your like, it's like a dungeon and you're like, oh, no offense to anyone with gambles, but it scares the shit out of me.

36:21I'm like, bro, yeah. It triggers some things in your brain. There's certain things. This is Dana. He's on vacation in the Amalfi coast. Bro. And this fucking dude brings a casino. He had a casino come on. Bro, who's that kid next to him? It was a son. That's crazy. So he's, look, he's got stacks of cash. That's baller, man. Good for him. No, it's not. That's a sickness. Who knows? He brought a goddamn casino. My thing is, man, if you could do it, you should do it. If it makes you happy. Wow, look at you. All of them mind it. No way. I guess. I guess the last year of my life has made me like that.

36:58Well, that's a good way to be. No one lets you do it. You want to do or me do it. What I want to do. Like when it comes to like socially, like on the... What do you want to do? I just think everything is so micro -analyzed. Yes. You know what I'm saying? Like everything. It's just so many voices. That's what it is. Like we were talking about earlier. Like if you go on social media and you read comments about you, you're reading the opinions of literally millions of people. There is no way they're all going to be positive. It's like gambling, man. It's either one way or the other. It's crazy. The problem with social media, though, is the negatives far outweigh the positives in terms of the way it makes you feel.

37:34Like when you see someone get ganged up on in the social media, I've seen it happen to people where they're like, they say something on a podcast that people disagree with. That's some culture issue or medical issue and people get really mad at them. And then you go to their timeline. You see all these people hating on them. I just imagine like what that does to your psychology, to your mind when you're reading all... Like if you read 100 things that like, it's that, you're a great guy. And then one guy, you fucking fraud, you piece of shit, I know who you're really... Oh, yeah. Well, being from like, individually, it freaks me out individually, like from the inside out.

38:10And also if you see someone get... Ganged up on it. Fucking socially ruined. What freaks me out is like, what would have that person done artistically if that wouldn't have happened? What would have that person done for the great, for the good of people? Sometimes. You know what I mean? Yeah, like if they would have been either way... Meaning on what it was. I mean, either way, it's like fucking scary. There's a thing that people do, what it is is they're terrified of it happening to them. So people know it's a thing that people can gang up on people. And it's the same reason why people jump people while like 10 guys will beat up one dude.

38:42Like you're terrified of that ever happening to you. And when it's happening to someone else, you just jump in and gang up on people. So it doesn't happen to you. It's like a thing that people are doing. Or they're so afraid of being ganged up on social media that they just gang up. The most neurotic people are also like, they're oddly the most aggressive about attacking people. It's weird. I saw in here like two years ago, Sapiens that book. Yes. I read it because of this podcast. And in that book somewhere it says that like people are only supposed to be in groups of 150 people. Like villages, yeah.

39:15And I had this rant and Denver call route it like two weeks ago. We played Red Rocks. And everyone afterwards went out to the pool, like pool bar when we were all just hanging out. We were walking home. And I grabbed my phone. X, I was fucking, I mean, we drank too much. Obviously, because we had played Forrest Hills in New York and then we went to Red Rocks. And we just were celebrating. Cause it was a big deal to us at least. And I was walking home with like eight other guys and I had my phone and I was like, man, screw this. And I just threw it behind me. Cause it's scary, man. There's so many fucking people.

39:48Right in the palm of your hands. Well, you know what that's from? That's from how we evolved. Yeah, that's what they think at least. It's some people think it's done bar's number, done bars number. And it's more complicated than like 150 people. It's like there's tears of people. There's people like family and very close friends. And then there's like a tear above that. Like people, that's the tears. So like there's five people that you're like super close with. And then there's 15 people that you're slightly less close to. And then it goes all the way out to 1500 people. And imagine the vulnerability it takes to be you or me.

40:20And like in your life, a lot of people think they, they know you at the 150 level, but you know, you don't know any. I mean, personally, I don't know 150 people. Yeah, I talk about my head. What is this one, Jamie? This is how to find one that has the explanations of it on the screen. Yeah. How many friends can a person have? I think about this more often than I should when it comes like looking at my phone and like seeing how many followers I have or the bullshit that comes with being socially active. You know, it's crazy. Well, it's something to think about because what I think is happening is human beings evolved in these tribal groups.

40:53And now we're evolving a new consciousness that is actually global. Because it went from being in small tribes to larger communities, agricultural communities, cities, millions of people, countries, and now the whole world. And that's a completely new way of interacting with people that has never existed in the... It's so much heavier than people make it out to be. I feel like I feel like people are like taking it lightly. Which obviously a lot of people aren't. But I don't think they're aware of it. I think it's just something that you're kind of dealing with because it's just there. You know, you're tweeting and you're looking at the news and the news cycles.

41:32Now the news cycle of literally 8 billion people. I haven't talked to anyone like this in like four years. Because I'm so fucking scared, man. Not scared of anything in particular. I'm just not scared of the world either. But you know what I mean? I just like, it wasn't worth it to me. Right. Not in an arrogant way. Just in a way where it was like, man, why? Right. I'm making up... I write enough music. Like you know me from that. Right. I just didn't feel the need. I was just getting pissed off at you. Yeah, about something silly. Yeah. And I went back to Oklahoma recently. I've been in the Northeast for like two years, three years.

42:04And I went back to Oklahoma, man. And I had some time off and I just sat in the grass, sat in a field. Like I used to when I was a kid. I was like, man, oh, that Duncan Trustle episode with you. When Duncan Trustle was like, man, there's probably some sad sex sitting by a waterfall with... Yeah. He didn't know who's mad at him or who should be scared at you. Remember that? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Crazy. He said that I'm like, he's right, man. Duncan's a genius. He is a genius. And I watch his episodes religiously on here. Because he's just so beautifully articulated. That's how he is all the time, too.

42:34It's so funny because like we did two episodes kind of back to back. We did one where we dressed as doctors. And what was the other one? I remember, man, the fucking... You guys had the butt... I saw like a fucking fanboy. But we did a lot of fanfares. Oh, we got way too hot. We got way too hot. Yeah, we could... We respect the furries. Because like... Almost a war. They put in work, those furries. I don't know. He hasn't talked about it. I was like, oh shit. I can't believe this realm of people exist. How crazy. So many had a good idea the other night. They're like, you should make every gas dress up.

43:01No matter how important they think they are, world leaders, make them put on clown costumes. I don't know. You can get a shot, but you have to put on a clown costume. I barely had it. I could barely put on a shirt this morning. I was like, what are you wearing? What do you do here, man? I never done this. Why saw this Johnny Cash shirt sitting in my closet? I was like, this is perfect. It was a perfect shirt for the show. I thought you were working out there. And I was like, okay, shit. No, shit, I did it. No, I shot bows this morning. Got a little workout in. Kim's straight here. Where do you shoot bows around here at your place?

43:29Yeah, I have a range. No, shit. Yeah, I have a range in here. I can't imagine just waking up. I mean, like you know what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna head over and shoot some bows, man. Let's go for your mind, man. Oh, it's such a... Anything you focus on. Yeah, I mean, forget about bow hunting. But just archery. Just archery. Shooting out of target is so good for your mind. Well, that's why doing anything, writing for comedy probably, writing music. Yeah. Dude, you're just focused. Right, you're in it. You're locked in. And I wish I could just be in that state forever. All the time. But you don't, man.

44:00You gotta love it, like you love sex. You don't wanna fuck all day, every day. You'd get bored. I'm there. I mean, I'm not there now. Love making music and stuff. But like even touring, like playing the same songs. Right. I love doing it because the people are so beautiful and the people who come to the shows are so moved by it. And I'm... But like, people look at me and they don't realize that I played the same show X amount of times. And I'm so blessed, so lucky. But sometimes, man, I'm halfway through my set and I'm like, give it all you got, man. Give it all you got. No matter how many times you sang it, you know?

44:31Yeah, you just gotta reset. Like those people are seeing you in many... You know, what I call the Joe Demagio principle, is that Joe Demagio was playing once. And I think he was like 40 years old and he's slid in the third base. And the third basement said, why do you play so hard? You're already Joe Demagio. And he goes because someone around there in the audience is someone who hasn't seen Joe Demagio play. And I don't want to let him down. My dad says that to me every time I go on stage. And I think about it too. I think what I do when I go on stage, I look out at the audience and I pick out one like kid, whether whoever it is, I pick out one kid who's like, in it, and I'm like, man, this one's for you.

45:09That's how I do it. So religiously, because it's kind of a paradox, man, because you write the music or you write a skit and you care about it so much. And then every time you play it, it feels like you're almost giving a little bit of it to other people. Yeah. And at one point, you're singing the song and you forget. It's so sad, because you love the song so much, but you've sang it so many times. So when I look at the kid, whoever's out there, I'm like, that's it. That's what I'm doing this month ago. Let's go. Because it means so much. What does it feel like when they sing along? Is that wild?

45:37When they know lyrics? This year has been weird, because last year was such a crazy year for us, growth wise. People used to love it. Now, now I'm like, I'm getting no arrogance attached. I'm just getting big enough to where people are like, man, I go to a show, I was getting even fucking here, I'm saying. Because everyone's singing along. Yeah. And it scares me a little bit, because I fear that like, what if there's like some like 50 -year -old woman or a 50 -year -old man who's like sitting in this house, and he's like, I'd really like to go to a Zach Bryan show to hear him sing these songs?

46:07Then you go to one of the shows, and it's all these fucking reckless kids just doing it, man, shirtless. And the 50 -year -old sitting back there like, damn it. I just want to hear him sing it, you know. But they should be just taking in that experience. That's what it is. You're not going to change it. No way. How do you do it? Stop singing. Hug, try to listen to Zach. That guy sucks, man. Whoever that guy is, sucks, ask, man, I hate that guy. That guy stormed the Capitol. Yeah, of course, man. Of course. Of course. And it's so sick, man, because we had Charles Wesley Godwin on the road with us, like the first year and the second year, and it's like such a...

46:43It felt like when I was watching him open for us or whatever, I'm not even trying to plug him, but when he would be singing and you'd be like these weird fucking 2000 cap, 3000 cap, like roller rinks. And all these American venues, like you ever been to the majestic, you know, in Detroit. Yeah, I'm a majestic, yeah. And the venues like in San Francisco, the Warfield, you look around and all this architecture so beautiful and like you're here and, like you're open or saying, you know, this is a chapter in something. This has got to be something. This is beautiful. There's all these like 18 to 25 year old kids, just like giving their everything to like be there for you.

47:19Yeah. And you're like, man, this got it. This is crazy. This is what you see like on whatever, like you read this shit in books or whatever. When I was in Greece last week, I got to see guns and roses in Athens. They're always playing not in America. But my dad always is like, I saw them in Japan. I'm like, why? I think they played everywhere. I think they played a lot of America too, but of course, dumb luck that we happen to be there. And I ran in the Axel Rosa restaurant and Axel invited me to the show. My co -shit, like this is wild. And we went and watched guns and roses. These two are 60 years old and just killing it murdering it for three hours.

47:58I don't get it for three hours. I love that, man, do go off. I mean, do your thing. It was intense. And it was like 95 degrees out. We were talking about earlier how hard the road is and stuff and I see these older guys doing them. Like, man, what's going on? Well, Mick Jagger, when the Rolling Stones were here, they played Coda, the Circuits of the Americas. Oh, yeah. My friend owns it and he was explaining to me how they brought two trailers, two trailers that had just Mick Jagger's workout equipment. He'll, yeah. Two trailers full of shit. Still moving, man. I mean, every day, that guy works out.

48:30Every day. He has to. Like we were saying, it'll kill you if you don't. He's Biden's age. That's crazy. Bro, that's insane. He's Biden's age. I want to talk. Look at him out there. And doing what I do at 27, I look at this and I'm like.

48:49He looks great. Yeah. And dude, he's moving around. You know, like he's not stationary. He's not like, just standing in the songs. He's dancing. As a young person, man. Look at him go. As a young person, that's not easy. No, man. Because they're devoted, man. And then so into there. And the show was epic, right? So it's at this outdoor racetrack and they have these giant fucking screens. This huge stage and you're seeing Keith Richards and Mick Jagger right there. Come on, man. Right there. Dude, I'm telling you, it was like being on drugs. Dude, it was like a psychedelic experience. I couldn't believe they were really there.

49:27Those guys are so iconic. Sometimes I wonder if they ever think about it. Like, do they ask themselves the same questions that I ask myself or not that sounded shitty. But like, since I'm small or obviously, like watching those guys, I wonder if they came up and accidentally became legends or like. They were so young when they hit the scene. You have to stop and think about the 1960s. Was there a dream to become massive musicians? No, I don't think anybody could have imagined. It could have been the Rolling Stones. There's no way anyone could imagine being the Rolling Stones. Exactly. Like, do you think Taylor Swift imagined she'd be Taylor Swift?

50:00No, what? Nobody could be. Maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe her. Yeah. But for most bands, the idea is just to try to be successful. There's so many talented people too. Yeah. That's a freaks me out being me. I know like three chords on a guitar and I'm like, what's up? And there's so many people that like, I get in these circles of these astounding musicians who aren't nearly as big and I almost have like that. I have a real guilt. Okay. You know, I'm like, what the fuck am I doing? Right, right. Why the fuck am I on stage, man? You're incredible. I'm on stage for your songwriting and your voice.

50:33I get. And your songs, man. And your music too, but it's like the combination of the things. And it's, you know, to tut your horn, Matt, it's uniquely authentic. It's just very, you have very authentic music. There's, you can kind of tell when someone's bullshitting. For whatever reason, it feels like you could take like a certain amount of it. Like there's a certain amount of sugar that you can take in food before it starts getting gross. You know, you're like, oh, this is so sweet. That's why the writing's so important. I'm like, it's man, I can't do it. I can't listen. The writing is excellent.

51:04I can't listen to, um, corny writing. Personally, I can't. Well, it's like there's no corny comedy. And you got to like love it to love it. But like people in the car with me like, what the fuck are we listening to? And I'm like, oh, it's an indie song I found. And I'm like, the pretentious asshole, you know? Oh, you're that guy? No, I'm not. No way. Like I usually put on like the fucking bar near our shuffle 50 of the top hits when people are with me. But when I'm alone, you know what I found, man? I don't know if you've ever heard this song. But my friend Brian Simpson turned me on to this song.

51:35And this song should have been a fucking gigantic hit. I hear this all the time. Should have been a, I mean, I hear this song. I'm going to sing it to you. I'm going to send it to you, Jamie. What's it called? Um, it's called, I'm alive. Hold on a second. Let me find it for you. By Johnny Thunder. I'm alive by Johnny Thunder. Here I'll share it with you, Jamie. Man, I always want to be the guy that you heard it. You got it, Jamie? Listen to this, man. So this is a song from 1969, I believe. And it was re -released sometimes in the 2000s. They probably thought the same thing as you. But this is, listen to this.

52:20Oh, man.

52:28Come on. How the fuck did this guy make it? Would you hear this? My friend Brian just sent it to me. He's like, you got to listen to this. Dude, you want to be on the highway right now? Fuck you. I want to be dancing right now. 1969 Camaro. Let's go. Oh, shit. How good is this? That's crazy. You hear shit like this all the time. That's why I feel so bad on stage, man. Yeah, this is a guy from 1969. Sick cover, too, man. They had it right. They had all the art right. Yeah, I mean, that too. Good. They give them the 60s and 70s. Everything you see is just right. This one is like a big, it's bigger.

53:08It's bigger. It's so good. And I'm like, a guy that can do this. This is like, this is like a world famous, gigantic music forever. Someone who can do this, this guy's a star. Well, it only takes once, too. If you put this on like whatever people are using now. Baby. Baby. Baby. Baby. I'm a man. Yo. Who wears my leather jacket? I'm a man. Oh.

53:37Dude, we got to go run around, man. This is on our pre -show playlist at the mothership. I'm going to start walking out to that. We're hanging out in the green room. We listen to that. Well, that's what there's a huge resurgence in music right now because of a TikTok and shit like that. Yeah. Because people are like finding old stuff, which is a beautiful thing, also a scary thing, but I don't even know. I don't know, I don't know anything. But it's cool because of one person that was big or whatever used that. It might be, might have a brand new life, which kind of stinks for the Johnny Thunder, wasn't it?

54:09I think Johnny's dead. Which is, isn't that crazy? Do you see the Van Gogh thing? He knew he was going to be a famous artist. And he, I don't know if this is Van Gogh or I don't know if it's another one, but there was an artist back in that era of people who, my producer Eddie, he used to tell me this. He said that one of those guys painted his entire life. He would paint in coffee shops and stuff and he would tell his buddies or whoever he would say, I know one day these are going to be worth something. And then he like lived his life, died. And then 200, 300 years later, or 100 years later, whatever, he got famous for it.

54:48And so that's like the whole planetary and watch it. Like if you plan a tree, you'll never see grow. Yeah. Plan a tree and never see it big. Whatever that shit is. I know what you're saying. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Yeah. And this Johnny Thunder, somehow or another, it slipped by. How old was he? When he died. I'm trying to look stuff up about him right now. His real name was Gill Hamilton. Tom Jones covered it. Wow. I found that Ghostface Killis song that sampled it. Oh nice. But yeah, I was trying to, I'm trying to look up. What year did this guy? I think it said, well the cover was 69.

55:20His version, not my life, 68. So Johnny Thunder's version was first, right? And then the 69 version, I've also heard. Tommy James and Sean Delaney. Yes, it's not as good. He had to have wrote it, right? Obviously. I don't think so. I think Tommy James and the Sean Delaney wrote it. There's a Don Fardone, Fardin. But if he wouldn't have sang it like that, man. Oh, he sang it. Yeah, exactly. That's a weird conflict in my head too. Right, that's a thing, right? The covering thing is where I don't cover on stage because I'm young. I don't know. Right. I don't act like I'm better than a cover. I just, I don't know.

55:54Like it gets, what I stand by. Well, it's like, do whatever you want to do, man. Whatever resonates with you. But sometimes people just have a feel for a song and then want to redo it. When I knew everything, when I knew everything, like 20 or whatever, I used to hear covers and be like, wait, man, you're ruining the feeling of a song. And then right or road it, and it means the world, don't mess it up. Some covers are fucking amazing. I agree. It gets Steve here. You want to cover a voodoo child? Yeah. Come on. Some of the best songs of like ever were covers. Yeah, there's some amazing. Oh, my goodness.

56:28Oh, right. There's a different one. Of course. That's right. He covered Dylan. And then, yeah. Yeah, Matthew's. Matthew's, yeah, we're in the live one. We're all on stage and just, it's not. And so recently in my life, I've like started delving into, this is crazy to me that people don't even, and this isn't an issue. I have no problem with this, but people don't even give a shit about who wrote whatever. If it sounds great, which is cool in a sense. But in my life, even as like a writer or whatever, I just now started going to the song credits, like looking. And it surprises me every single time, because there's people who you don't think would write something that did write it or someone who sounded so great covering a song that you think they wrote it.

57:07And then you go to it and there's like eight people writing it. And you're like, what? This is crazy, you know. I just found out that May West was a writer and May West got arrested for writing. I think it was a play. It is jail. May West. Yeah. It was about sex. There was something about sex that she got arrested for. Yeah. May West spent eight days in jail. She looks like a badass. Oh, she was a badass. What did she do? We actually have her couch. Yeah. So the, yeah, Mitzi owned her couch and Mitzi's son gave it to me. And so that's in our green room at the mother ship. We have May West couch.

57:49I was trying to get a re -oppulsed to it. That's crazy. Where was it at? It was in New York. It was at Mitzi's place. Where is Mitzi? Oh, I'm sorry. Mitzi sure was the, that's that lady. She was the owner of the comedy store. Oh, wow. Okay. Members of the cast of sex were hauled. So the show was called sex. Who is that? She was such a ho. Who did that, man? What a powerful lady. February 9, 1927, May West, the original Cardi B, went backstage of a performance of her play Sex and found herself surrounded by officers from the New York City Police Department's initial vice squad, municipal vice squad, which rounded up the cast and put them into black police vans.

58:29Whoa. West was a smart talking, wise cracking, blonde, bombshell of the 1930s. Cinema famous for some of the sharpest and most suggestive one -liners in the history of the movies. As both a playwright and a screenwriter, she wrote many of those lines herself. She was like one of them original boss pitches. That's insane. It's like all these like boss ladies now, like Cardi B's a big one. Like who else? I guess you could say Lizzo's like a boss lady. Who's a boss lady? Beyonce. Beyonce's a boss lady. The Queen of the boss lady. The Queen of the boss lady. There's a lot of boss ladies now. It's crazy to think about it.

59:03I could say whatever the fuck they want. They're amazing too. But back then, like when in May West time, like someone who was like that. No, it was a neat, it was a neat and they didn't care. Who wrote a play called Sex? Yeah. Like in the 20s. That's not surprising. That's not surprising. Yeah. That's surprising for that. I think she did. I think that's why she spent eight days in jail. Oh my goodness. That was the arrest it or for her. Yeah. What was the official charge? So much time. The charge was kind of interesting. So much time hasn't passed since this shit's happened. Like my grandpa was born.

59:33And like the 20s. Listen to what the charge was. Giving a performance, not tending to advance the morals of the spectators. Whoa, man. That's why. Wow. That's wild. Oh no. She got arrested for giving a performance, not tending to advance the morals of the spectators. That's amazing. Because it was all backed by like back in the day. It was all everyone just was so. Everyone was really religious, man. Morally. It was also you could starve to death super easy back then. Wait, why do you say that? Obviously, yeah. Obviously, yeah. Wait in the 20s? Yeah. Dude, that was the great depression. Like a little dumbass.

1:00:11To come out of the depression. 1927 was a great depression. Wait, year was the great depression. I thought that was the 1919 or something. Around the at -stock depends on the FBI right around there. So people are still recovering from the depression. My grandmother kind of never recovered from it. My grandmother these did when she died. When they were cleaning out her house, they found coffee cans filled with money that was stuffed away in the walls. That's what they were always worried about. Yeah, because the roaring was exactly. The roaring 20s and stuff. Right. Which is, so this was exactly that time period that she made that play.

1:00:46Which is wild, right? Yeah, she would think people would want to go watch it. I think they're mind off being so depressed, man. I don't think they had any money. It also I think like it was like a hopeless, helpless kind of depression where everything crashed all at once. Like the banks collapsed. Well, everyone was like, you know, what caused the great depression? It was a stock market crash, right? These motherfuckers been monkey and around with numbers. That's for a hundred years. I know right. They've been fucking everything up for that long. Making insane amounts of money. For that long, man.

1:01:16Insane amounts of money. Like that game, that financial banker game like, whoo. Being from Oklahoma, you hear a lot about like the dust ball and shit too when the great depression came by and I'm like, how much shit did people have to go through, man? Right. Because it was like, I don't know, like I'm not a historian, I'm sorry, but not. I know. You, you hear shit about like the great depression in the dust ball hitting Oklahoma at once and I'm like, bro, imagine complaining about how your coffee tastes, you know, like in the morning for us. It's like these people would wake up and like have to fucking be, be just in the great depression and like live their plate up and yeah, it's just nuts to think about.

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1:04:04One single use $3 ticket rewarded that expires in 14 days and February 28. See terms at DraftKings .com slash promotions. Brow, I mean, there's a great book, rather, a biography of this guy. I think his name is Danny McGurdy. I think it's called McGurdy Life of a Pool Hustler. And this guy was a pool hustler during the Depression. And he talks about being so hungry, just knocking on people's doors and begging for food. Just going from town to town and being broke, trying to hustle people out of money. He wrote a book, he obviously succeeded at one point. No, they wrote a biography of him. I think a guy named Robert Byrne wrote the book.

1:04:46Can you find it? I have it at home. I was telling you, but it's like you're just you're absorbing. Like the, the, the, that, those times were so desperate. Hopeless, hopeless and desperate. Which is a scary place to be. And it's surprising the more people, this is really dark to say, but it's surprising the more people just didn't go off the deep end and like just cared, you know? That's, I have this, I think I talked to you about it last time. I'm fucking annoying, man. I tell my friends about this all the time, like on the bus. I lived in New York for a little bit and I lived like by the Empire State Building just because I wanted, I thought I was some fucking, I don't know.

1:05:22I just wanted to get out of Oklahoma for a little bit and go somewhere that I never been before. So I moved to New York City and I lived by the Empire State Building and every morning I would look up and see the Empire State Building. And once my dad came in and visited me and we went up and I was like, I'm a dork when it comes to like touristy stuff. I love it. We had our, I love New York shirts on our hats. And you're up, have you ever been in the Empire State Building? Yes. They have that simulation where it's like you go in that floor and you see all these like hardened men like building and riveting the fucking buildings.

1:05:52Oh yeah. And man, people were coming from like Iowa and California, like wherever the hell. Look at this guy adjusting that bolt. Dude, it's probably making a dollar a day. People don't have this anymore, I don't think. They don't have the thing where you're like you're like struggling away and your family is whatever kind of person that could do that. This is like an athlete that you have to be in. We talked about, there was a guy recently we talked about in the podcast that this day fixes shit like that. I don't know what country he was in. I don't know if it was America or somewhere else. But this dude was climbing these fucking beams, these metal beams like an athlete.

1:06:27I was watching him do it. I'm like, I can't do that. So not only is he skilled but he's carrying tools and he could physically do things that I can't do. I'm watching him. Watch this guy. This is a different guy buddy. Okay. Well, there's another guy that's doing the same kind of thing. Look, he's got a harness on. The other guy didn't have a harness. There's no way like regulations would let someone do that in America is probably somewhere else. That guy is fucking wild. You ever seen like lineman? Well, now he doesn't have that helmet. People who work on lines and stuff like the power lines as the mom calls did that growing up.

1:06:58And that's why we're dog Martin's because my grandfather warm and he put a spikes on and my cousins and shit just climb poles like in 20 seconds. They go up there and they're just like touching shit that can kill him all day and you're like, oh my god. It's crazy. And they do that man. It's nuts. You ever I was watching this. I don't know. It was a balloon or something that flew into these power lines and holy shit. What a exploded. Dicks bloated just as I think it was my lar balloons or something like that. They flew into these power lines. Is that what it is? Oh. These are other balloons that are cups.

1:07:37So this guy has to imagine just thinking you have to touch that thing, even knowing that it's not going to get you understanding how electricity works. Just imagine wanting to be in contact with that amount of. Dude, you ever seen that guy who does it like in Montana? I don't know where it was, but he flies around on a helicopter and he gets on a basket and has his stick and he puts it out there for lightning. Yeah. Oh no, not for lightning, but he's like fixing the people. People don't think about where the power come like all the power and these do just not have a helicopter. Yeah. He's like hanging off a helicopter just messing with wires.

1:08:07Oh my God. This is the exact thing, man. No. I look this shit up because my uncles do it. Oh my God. And I'm like, no, fucking way, man. So what is he doing? Well, someone's got to fix him when they go down and stuff like that. This is so wild, dude. It's crazy. So this guy has to climb on these things. And it's a big economic thing in Oklahoma. What is he doing? He's got to climb in that? Yeah. What the fuck, bro? And that thing will just kill you, man. Dude, this is freaking out. Well, you know those Kevlar, I don't know if this is right, man. I'm not a lineman, but look at that guy's going the other day.

1:08:39You know those Kevlar suits that like shark people wear? They wear the same thing, the metal thing. I think. I don't know if it's the same shit, but how do you get shot? I'm really going to stop you from getting shot. Well, it just prevents, it's conducts a lot. So it goes around your body opposed to in it. That's what that thing's doing. I think thin little cloth that you have. Yeah. Crazy, man. People do shit like that. That's why those empire state building guys are so. So crazy. One of those guys just died. Some guy who is one of those climbing skyscraper daredevil. In that photo without eating lunch?

1:09:09No. I don't know. Kelly Slater just sent it to me. Want me to send it to you? I can fly up. Yeah. That's why I don't get it. I respect it a lot. 30 years old, he fell off a building. Oh, it's so sad. He plunged 68 floors. Bro. It was last seen knocking on window outside. I wonder why he was knocking? Because he wanted to get in. I could figure out how to get in. He fucked up. He closed the window. He climbed out. Somebody closed the fucking window. Oh, man. I wouldn't be in disrespect. Bob won a white in just like, I think I'm just guessing. He even climbs up. I don't want to be. I don't know what happened.

1:09:43I don't know what happened. I don't know if you just climbed out on the left. That's how my worst fear bro. You're running a bro. You've ever been on the left? I'm so sweaty right now. Just looking at it. They go and get rid of me. Don't do this to me, Jamie. I can't do it. I'm not a hot guy either. Not now. Not after that guy just fell. Have some respect. That's him. Don't show me. That's sad. Don't show me this. Don't show me this. That's crazy. I don't get rock climbers at all. Bro, I've had Altonald in a couple of times. He's a fascinating guy. I respect that. I've watched all of his stuff and the Jimmy Chen.

1:10:13I follow him on Instagram. He's like always not to take away from Altonald. But through Jimmy Chen, I like follow him on Instagram and all I see on his Instagram pages, him just like getting an article water and fucking skiing down mountains. I'm like, bro, what is here? Like, how are you? You just do this, man. It's crazy. You just do nothing but wild shit. Nothing but wild shit. And I think that's beautiful. And he has such amazing footage. And it's so cool to me that people can just devote their lives to showing that kind of Did you ever see the alpenest? Yeah. Yeah. Sad. But also, I mean, wild.

1:10:47It's sad that his love, but, what? I blew my mind. Just the, the experience he had in the small amount of time that he was alive. We're so over the top to a normal person. How old is Alex? Alex, how old if I had a guess, what would you say, Jamie? 32. 37. And he was like the alpeness. I'm not comparing that to it all, but how old was the, what do you like? Like a kid who was pretty young. He was 18 or something crazy. Well, he was getting so bored with free solo climbing that he was ice pick climbing. Our glaciers. Yeah. So there was overhangs like these massive ice. The video you see him where he was just climbing up these fucking things.

1:11:30You're either dude. That is the craziest way to climb. That's so insane. Imagine the straight dude. Imagine the dude he was doing. He was doing this shit. Wait, is this the alpeness commercial? Yeah. This is the, I mean, he was climbing things that nobody was climbing. And what stinks the most is that, yeah, look at any head like that, the girlfriend who like loved them so much and that she was so sweet about it. She was like, it's what he's, it's what his passion is. But there's certain people that are just wired way different. He did all that crazy shit and he did such an amazing climb and things.

1:12:03And he was just with his buddy in Alaska doing a, I don't know if this is true, but like a simpler climb. And that's when he passed away. And I'm like, man, that's got to be. I don't know if it was simpler because they died in like an avalanche. That's so, that's heartbreak. I think, I think he was climbing some insane peak when he died. I want to say it was an Argentina. Where was it when he died? I felt it. Yeah, where it was, but it was crazy. Like they couldn't retrieve his body. I remember watching the alpeness and watching the whole film and like at the end it was like, it just hit you with it.

1:12:33Yeah. And at the end you're like, what the wait, what? What? Yeah. Yeah. What happened? What are you doing? It was crazy. Oh, this is sad. It was Alaska. Okay. So after summoning a new route in Alaska's mended hall towers with partner Ryan Johnson, the pair sent messages to friends and family from the summit, but disappeared while descending after being hit by a storm. Search and rescue teams discovered that roped several days later in a crevasse. How do you say that crevasse? Near the base of the route, leading to speculation that the duo was struck by a falling rock. I don't know what a cornice is or an avalanche while descending.

1:13:10What do you know? A cornice? What is that? I'm just kidding. I got no idea. Cornice? Though the bodies were never recovered. So they only found like ropes were a cornice. That is so hard breaking. That's true. And they were trying to call the family and friends. Mass of heart and snow at the edge of a mountain precipice. Oh, interesting. Imagine just saying that and casual about something every day. You know, when people expecting people to know what you mean, like how pretentious. That guy's an asshole man. That guy's an asshole. Yeah, that's hardy. That guy's talking down to you, man. Yeah, I'm sure.

1:13:40The worst kind of person. Yeah. A cornice. Oh yeah, everybody knows that, bro. Hey, man. Everybody knows what that is. This is what I know. This is what I know. Yeah. It's common snow terms for a thousand. I rock climbed like two times in my life and I was like, I can't do it. I can't. I guess it's crazy. Are you scared of heights? Yes. That's interesting. Yes. I'm fearful of dangerous things. Whoa. It's quite too dangerous. Change. That's the first phrase. That's how you had to take the picture. Oh my god, sir. But like I was saying, man, these guys, that camera, that camera's like a typewriter.

1:14:12This is how I said that goddamn thing. Bro, I fear that we'll never get that leather shoes. And lip rest, leather shoes. Who does shit like that anymore? Who's that determined? Human beings. They built the Empire State Building in two years. Sarphan erupting. Lee. Sarphan erupting. But two years, man. Yeah. Dude, that's what I'm talking about about the Empire State Building. That was such a beautiful fucking dream and ethic and people from like, I won't shit. We're like going to New York to build it because it was such a beacon of hope. Hard times. Create hard. Yes. Hard men create easy time. And it's so easy to think now being in my position or whatever, like, oh man, I wish I had an Empire State Building to build.

1:14:51But sometimes I got a song on the new album called Tradesman. Sometimes I wish, man, that I was like just doing something that gave purpose. You know, and obviously music does and it's amazing to that I get to do what I get to do. But yeah, one year and 45 days less than two years. One year and a month. When I saw that, dude. That's insane. Bro, in the 30s, man. Imagine how determined men had to be, bro, or women, like two, but fucking a. Well, it was all men doing that construct. Of course, but the people at home and things like that who were taking care of those guys. Oh, yeah. And obviously I say that with respect, but just the human beings that were involved in the actual maneuvering and construction of that thing.

1:15:32Like those are, that's extraordinary human beings. Hard, hard men, man, who like wouldn't stop for anything. And they knew what they were doing. How many died? How many people died during the construction of the Empire State Building? They knew what they were doing. How many were taking this? What do you think? How many died? There's 3 ,400 working on it. Oh, okay, fair enough. I thought you were going to give me the answer. I'll give you a something to build it off of. 3 ,400. 17 deaths. 17? Yeah, I say 17. 84? Whoa. I want to say 84. Okay. James. That's pretty high. Five. Five. See? That's even more incredible.

1:16:10In the fall or struck by accidents over the 13 months of construction. Slip and fall. In the therese, you would think they all fell off. So in one year, four dudes fell from the sky and just splattered on the concrete. Bro. And I wonder, I wonder. Everybody else has to go to work the next day. And they can't, I feel like back in the day, people were like, I shouldn't talk about it. Don't talk about it. Because if they talked about it, I bet if they talked about it, like people would be too scared to do it. I think they just accepted the inevitability. They were devoted. Because what I'm trying to, like being in the Navy and things like that, man, like when you, not to be that fucking guy, but like you see, you, you have like kids working for you 18 and 19 year old kids.

1:16:50And you see like the, just how people work nowadays is a little bit different. Same, same goes to me. I'm not any better. I'm just saying those people who are building the Empire State Building were so devoted to the one task at hand. And they fucking didn't a year and 45 days. Those are different humans. They are. Truly. One of the first incidents occurred while the building was still in the construction of worker who was fired from the job took his own life by jumping down an open elevator shaft. Oh, God. What, when was it built? Oh, my God. Same time period. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. As the, as the great deprive like 29 to open in 1931.

1:17:24So there we go. What a beacon, man, for these fucking, for America. Because that was the tallest building in New York, I think. Oh, my God. To build that and be like, oh, yeah, Americans did that. We did that, man. Holy shhh. What? Someone jumped from the 86 floor and didn't die. Oh, God. There's a strong gust of wind blower body back towards the building and she only felt like one floor. Yo. I'm good, man. I'm not going anymore. What? I'm not going anymore, man. No, that doesn't make any sense. Have you ever been just this sheer amount? I'm not the lucky one. But the gust of wind had to be coming up under her.

1:18:00What, she was a class one? I wonder what she was like after. It gets windy up high, I'll tell you. Right, right, right. But is it possible that like 100 plus pound person could be slowed down by the wind to the point where they don't die? It doesn't sound right. Maybe. It seems. Never know, man. You ever done it? I have not. I don't know. That's great. Crazy shits happen. People have fallen out of planes and survived. Like sky jumper. I mean, uh, okay, man. It just might have been a big legend. She didn't, you know, she didn't jump out far enough. You ever skydow? She landed on a three foot ledge about 20 feet below.

1:18:33Oh, okay. So she felt 20 feet. Yeah. But it says she was on the 85th floor. She jumped from 86 and landed on 85. All right. No, I'm not discrediting. That's what the lucky, I mean, that's what this says. I was trying to find the year this time. Oh, so she was found laying on the ledge. See 85th floor ledge. That is the lucky one. I bet she was fine. Good Lord. Once on my felt 35 feet, man. Oh, that's far, man. I broke both my, both my wrists, both my collar bones. It was crazy. Oh shit. And my buddy Graham, my guitarist now. I was like, I was like a 15 year to carry me up a mountain. Oh my God.

1:19:06I don't have mountain, 35 feet ledge on a river. It was nuts. Oh my God. It was crazy. It was a rope swing. Give it to a rope swing. Yeah. I can do a river. Uh -huh. A man I thought I was so tough, they were like, we are young, there was girls there. I'm like, man, I'm going to do the tallest rump. I'm going to do this. Bunch of boys being boys. And like I climbed to the very top and tied it off. And I went off. We got to untie it. Yeah, and just immediately stopped and rolled down. Like rocks and then I landed. Man, this is why this is crazy. But this is why one of the reasons why I like believe in God because I went and rolled and tumbled.

1:19:42And my head landed exactly where we'd been putting our feet all day long. So it was indented. So I booked like both my collarbones broke because I landed in that hole and hit like that. And it was crazy. And I got up and I didn't even feel it. I was in so much shock. And I went to climb up and my wrist popped out. It was great. It was nuts, man. I never forget it. But you both both are my sophomore year in high school, man. I had like two casts. I was in a wheelchair. I was crazy. How long do you have to keep them on for? One of my arms was in a cast like three months. And the other one was like, I think probably like two, two weeks, three weeks.

1:20:18Holy shit. I'll never forget it, man. Holy shit. Isn't it wild how when you get injured, you should so appreciate not being injured. You don't realize when you're running, when I'm running a lot, sometimes I get this weird fucking feeling of like, oh man, you got legs. Right. This is cool. And I'm obviously, obviously I mean that with sensitivity to anyone who can't run or anything. But sometimes I'm running and I'm like, wow, this is so beautiful. That we can like use our fucking legs and things like that to move. And yeah, if you're able body person, you're super lucky. You're solely like 0 .005 % of whatever.

1:20:55People realize it once they get injured. Once they get injured, that's when they start going, oh my god, I'm vulnerable. Like I could be in pain all the time from this thing now. That's how yeah, like any time I've ever been sick, I felt like that too. I'm like, man, I can't believe we're just in a constant state of like, I guess at a younger age being okay and what we were talking about earlier, like working out as much as you can. Because old age is scary and I'm 27. But when I think about being older and I think about like arthritis and like all the shit that happens, like your parents, like our parents, when they get sick and stuff, it's like your grandparents.

1:21:28My man, you gotta take advantage of it now. Yeah, there's no matter who you are, when you're 98, you're fucked. Yeah, isn't that scary? Like what's the most fit 98 year old person? I saw this find the most fit 98 year old person. I saw this video the other day of like 102 year old climbing your simmity. Any climb to this grand daughter and I was like, whoa, that's crazy. I just think I was gonna be gone or by like 40, not in a dark way. But maybe they just want, if they wanna die, why not die doing something they love? I agree, it's how a lot of people feel about a lot of stuff and I don't know how I, I don't know.

1:22:04Did you ever see the documentary Dirtbag? It's about this famous climber who was, just like this legendary climber, I forget his name, but he basically just like slept in sleeping bags and slept on people's couches. He just like, it's all like I'm forever. Didn't give a fuck about anything but climbing and mapping out his climbing roots. And like, like these detailed maps of the roots and it's a Fred Becky. And no one can say he was wrong, which is crazy. But play some of this, because in the beginning, it's really interesting to hear him talk. In the beginning, like hear him talk. In my head, I thought he was young.

1:22:42That's crazy. What's that Jamie? I got there was some big music and shit, so going on. Oh, okay. I can listen to that song again, man. Who's great?

1:22:55Yo. So this dude was like, old as fuck. This is another lifestyle. Created his own culture and became a culture of one. It's a great philosophy. Sick made it. Oh, wow. His name is everywhere. He was there before the rest of us were. That's sick. It's more about the mountains of North America than anyone has ever lived. One track mine most of the time. It wasn't on women. It was on climbing. Fred was lively and addictive. There's some sort of magnetism there. Right now, I don't know what I'm doing except tomorrow. I have no idea. Exactly. We were together all the time. Our relationship deteriorated, because he continued to climb.

1:23:39And I did not climb anymore. Fred was only focused on climbing. And he never felt sorry for you if you're climbing and they're up in the divorce. Whoa. Totally obsessive. That's who Fred is. Can you just sleep on the ground? Everywhere. Some people may think it's an adventure to go on a cruise ship to the Mediterranean. To me, it's no adventure at all. That's somebody bombed the ship. For some people, they founded companies. They were like movie stars for a lot. Imagine how many people are like this. Why did the best climb of all never go on to the greatness that they all did? He's a dirtbag. And because of that, I don't think he'll get their recognition that he really deserves.

1:24:26It's a really good documentary. I can't recommend it enough. It's fast. One of the two years ago, I saw it. I don't know what year it came out. It's wild. Six years ago. It's really good. It's sleep on the ground. What's weird to think about is, he just never stopped wanting to do that one thing. And for some reason, that like haunts people. Is that a bad thing or a good thing you think? What, here's what's weird. If you saw him sleeping on the ground like that and he was 20 years old, you go, oh, you know, he's a kid. Yeah. He's still living his life. Why is it when you see him when he's 70 years old?

1:24:59Like that is it so sad. Because we have a thing everyone has to abide by in our lives, you know? Right. Which I think is, I don't know, I think it's good for us. It's good to have that thing. Yeah, I think it's good to like evolve past. Not if you're that guy. I guess. That's what I was asking. Like, who knows what's right? I think we have to realize that everyone is not wired the same no matter what we think. And everyone thinks everyone should be. Yeah. Everyone thinks that everyone should be wired exactly the way they are. And then when they aren't, they're pissed. Yeah, it's just not the case.

1:25:31They want to control. Yeah, it doesn't work that way. Want to control, yeah. It's how I feel with them. Everything sometimes. That's why I get so frustrated with people. Because everything I do, someone has an opinion or whatever. And I'm like, this seems like you just want me to be who I'm not when it comes to these sorts of things. That's just, you're probably, if I had a guest, you're probably taking in too many opinions. Of course, man. You know, you should probably have his little opinions coming in as possible. I think you know what you're doing. Deal. Deal. In a crazy man's nuts. It's day away from other people's ideas.

1:26:03But also, like, I feel like people didn't grow up in this. I feel like people, this is a whole new world now. Yeah. Like, when I was talking to a, when I was talking to Travis, I respect him after talking to him, things like that. And we were talking and he was telling me about all these things. And I was like, I feel, and in differently, I was like, man, I feel like we live in two different realms of music and things like that. Because I feel like the world's so different now from when the whole national scene was back then. And it's just funny to get to talk to other people and hear about their experiences and how they, I don't know.

1:26:39What's the big difference? I feel like radio was a huge thing. It might still be, but I feel like radio was a really, really big deal back in the day. And it's still a big deal, but it's becoming smaller and smaller and smaller. Yeah, nobody really, I mean, I'm sure some people do, but the amount of people that listen to radio now has to be. I've been surprised by it lately, because I've been going to the lake and stuff. I've been going to like birthday parties and things. And I've heard a lot of radio and I'm like, oh, wait, people, I guess people still listen to the radio. Can you make radio sound good?

1:27:11Like it was always like a lower quality signal, right, Jamie? They have what they call HD radio now, but it's still using the same technology, you know, still spreading out radio waves. But as it is good sounding is like, like, streaming XM sounds better, right? Sure. Yes. And then streaming's the best sound. Yeah, it's all compression. It's going to be better. Do people really care, though? Most don't. I know a lot of people wouldn't even realize this one here. It loud, turn it up. That's crazy about like writing music and stuff like that, because the first records and stuff they were so bad, we recorded on like one at this kind of microphone.

1:27:46And we didn't know what we were doing, so everything just kind of sounded shitty. But it was like a renewed my like faith in humanity, because no one gave a shit. They were like, no, these are good songs, man. We like them. It's authentic. Yeah, it was cool. There's something to be said for things being not that professional. Mm -hmm. You know, it's like it shows you more of who the person is. I agree. Yeah, as long as it's legit, I guess the worst thing is fake authenticity. You say that. But like there's like all the rate. Oh, man, can't. Can't. Can't. Man, I don't think people give a shit, man.

1:28:22That much at least. Like the songs on the radio and things like that, they're all, well, there's two different things going on, I think. There's people that are making songs that they think are going to be hits. And then there's people that are making songs because they want to create something special. I think there's two different things that are happening. And some people are really good at that one thing where they make hits. And they make these kind of catchy songs. And maybe they don't resonate with you, but they resonate with enough people that they become real successful. But it's like, and you know, it gets to all kinds of different levels.

1:28:56Like it gets to like the millivinelly level, right? Or they created a fake band. And they have these guys go out and lip sync it. That's insane. Yeah. I've like those more acceptable back in the day. I've like people are really hitting on the whole like realness thing nowadays. When back in the day, I feel like they were just mega stars who just did whatever. Like like all the lip syncing and things like all the people still do that today. Some people do, right? I think I really know. Like I've seen, oh, didn't Cardi B throw a microphone? She got very angry. She did two microphones though. I saw.

1:29:27Was the music still playing? She was rapping if you will over her track without the vocals taken out, which they do sometimes. It's very, yeah, it's very like, it's very gray. It's like a gray area for me, but it doesn't make sense to me because when I play, it's, oh, sorry. Is that why the girl threw the drink in the... No, but they also like getting way too deep. Some contracts, they might not pay for you to do the real performance. They might just pay for that. And you have a different fee for that performance kind of thing because it's still less, less of a big thing for them. Yeah, less risky.

1:29:59They're not. It was like daytime and Vegas. Do people get mad when you do that? And Vegas and the daytime party, why would you not, you know, you're just happy that they're there. Do you remember when there was a girl who got caught doing that on Silent Live? That's what I was talking about when I brought it up. The whole like, since the conspiracy was behind lip syncing and stuff, but today production is so like fucking in everything that like, people would just say they're like, it's a back track. When in reality, it's like a lot of their performance. And there's like a word for it now, so it's okay.

1:30:29I think, man, I've never like dove into it or anything, but it's kind of sucks when I got my boys up there, like trying to bust in their ass, fucking trying to hit every single note, right? Right. Which is a lot of beautiful bands who still do that to this day, but you hear about like a lot of like, click tracks and shit and like, you're in ears. And it's like, oh man, we were a hers the lot to make this sound almost as good as that, you know? Yeah. It's a playback track or whatever. It's crazy. Yeah, that's a weird controversy, I guess, with people, right? And I forget words all the time, which is crazy.

1:31:00Like I was at a festival like two weeks ago and I was playing in front of fucking 25, 30 ,000 people when I was playing and I literally blanked on it and I had no, I had nothing. I got nothing. Oh my God. And I'm like, what'd you do? I just said, hey, I forgot the, I'm gonna restart it. I forgot the words. And the people are like, yeah, I mean, it makes sense to me, but it's such a fucking, it's like it blows people's minds. I'm like, no, I'm singing this stuff. I guess it's also cool for the people too, because they get to see something that's rare. You know, it's not just a regular performance.

1:31:26Which is silly. People are so inhuman to me when it comes like watching people perform. I'm like, how the fuck, how are they doing it, you know? Yeah. Because when I'm performing, I'm like, I'm like going crazy in my head. I'm like, don't forget it. Don't forget it, you got it. You got it. Look at the kid. Have you ever taken anything from memory, like, neutropics or anything like that? You know what those are? Budwizers every time. Budwizers will do a different thing. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know if Budwizers bad for your memory, but I don't think it's good. Can't be. The other guy said, human instead, it kills you.

1:31:56Yeah. It's a no's man, relaxing you. Yeah. It's crazy. But there's a bunch of different things that are called neutropics and their vitamins and nutrients that you could take that actually help your memory, they help brain function. My buddy Austin, he takes them all the time. He makes it a huge deal when he does too. He makes me deal with it. He jokes about it. He jokes about it. He doesn't like jokes about it, man. He'll like take one and be like, hey guys, I'm on on it right now. I can do anything you want. It's crazy, man. But I've never felt like I needed to. I feel like I've done a pretty good job of remembering every word I've ever written when it comes to being on stage.

1:32:31But you're not even just for that. It increases whatever the fuck it's going on in your head when you're conscious. Like you know how you're awake and you're alive and you know, but you vary day by day. You vary in like how well you can talk, you vary in how well you think, you vary and how much energy you have. What Neutropics do for me is they can get you to a point where like there's less of the negative and much more of the like communicating and being able to think and being able to remember things at the peak of your abilities. Wow. But you want to be closest to that. We joke about taking one before I came on here, did you?

1:33:16Yeah. Because they do. I think I think six at a time, those alpha brains. Because I mean, you like everyone likes being quick, weighted when it comes to just speaking and communicating and things like that. I just like my brain working better. I guess like sometimes you feel fucking foggy. That's what I mean when I said I forgot the fucking song that I've sang a thousand times. And you do it and you do it and you fucking idiot. I'm sure. And every time I get off stage I'm like, holy shit. But that's touring too, right? You getting worn out. Yeah, I think so too. Like how many months have you been, it was like the longest run you've done.

1:33:47At the beginning of the year, when you saw us in Austin, two step in started our like a year up run into the May run, which was like 60 days. It was, sorry. It was absolutely insane at the end of it. We ended it at Railbird and Kentucky. And I just laid in the grass and I was like, thank God. It's crazy, man. But then you see fucking Mick Jagger and stuff doing it. And you're like, man, why am I complaining? Shut up. You know, you're like, get on stage, bro. I don't think Mick drinks anymore. That checks. I've been there too. Well, it's been a weird conflict in my head because I don't like take anything.

1:34:24I don't like take pills or anything. That's good. Getting on stage is scary. I mean like normal pill like beta blockers like that. They keep you from freaking out. But dude, I have like, have you ever taken those? Oh, no. I've always wondered what I've taken. I've just lied to you. I've taken them one time and I took them and I was like, this feels weird, man. I'm not like in it because I get really bad stage fright. Like super bad stage fright. And I like, but then as soon as I'm on stage, I'm like, oh, it's a sick. I don't know where it comes from. So it's right before, every time, just before.

1:34:54And I just like, my whole body locks up and I'm like, you can't do this, you can't do this. Oh shit, we're doing it. Oh, okay, cool. And then I'm doing it. And I'm like, why are you freaking out? I think it's just because you love what you do and you want to do it great. Yeah, nervousness is a good thing. I think there's certain amount of nervousness is a good thing. And I'm grateful for it. Yeah, it puts you on edge. Truly, it's nice. Because your performance is like, when I saw you live, you're so hyped up, man. So it was really exciting. It was really fun. And if you have to be nervous before every show to accomplish that.

1:35:23Exactly. I just want to be hungry, man. You know, like I miss, I don't miss it because I still am, but I just always want to feel that. I always want to feel like I'm proven something every single time. You can keep that. I know, I know. And it's been beautiful to see that over the last three years because I thought at this point, I'd be like, oh, it's beautiful, man. It's beautiful, it's cool. I think if you love what you do, you can keep it. I think there's just, as you're going to get more and more successful, it's going to get more complicated. Your life will get more complicated. It gets more intertwined and it gets more public.

1:35:51And you're going to experience a lot of success. And when you experience a lot of success, then it becomes weird. And then you have to readjust. Constantly. I'm dealing with that. New way of life. Readjust this new amount of pressure that people have on you. To adapt. Yeah. To adapt. It's crazy to think, man. I remember when it all first started, I was like, oh, this is it. I did it. Yeah. And it was like two months in. I had no idea. I got a steak dinner bought for me by a label or something. I was like, man, if all I get from this is a steak dinner, then I did it. And it's been really beautiful to watch it unfold and see how it all worked out.

1:36:31That's awesome. It's crazy. It's absolutely crazy. Yeah, this is a crazy story, right? It is. Yeah. And being in the Navy for like nine years beforehand is even crazy. Because no one ever talks about that. I'm like, bro, I busted my ass, man. I was like in Africa and fucking Bahrain and stuff. And I was like, would you do in Africa and Bahrain? I was a, this is a crazy story in itself, but I won't tell the whole thing. Tell the whole thing. Shit. OK, so I'm hoping a second bud light. Let's go. And like I said about my dad, he was in the Navy for like 25 years. So I was, hey, man, look at you. Hey, man, I'm in the work, bro.

1:37:13I've always loved dress blues though. That is sick. You ever heard that song dress blues by Isabel? No. It's beautiful. It's beautiful. But my dad was in the Navy for like 25 years. And my mom was in the Navy. Like I said earlier, my grandpa was in the Navy. And so growing up, when I was like 14 years old, I was like, man, I'm going to be in the Navy. That's all I want to do. I want to like die for this country, man. It's best country in the world. I want to be in it. I want to experience that whole like Empire State Building thing where you're devoted to something. Yeah. And so I turned 17. And my dad was a recruiter in Oklahoma.

1:37:45And I was like, OK, cool. So he like helped me get recruited. And I was supposed to go in the Navy as a diver. But shit fell through. And my dad was like, it'll be fine. You'll get the boot camp. And they'll ask you if you want to be a diver. And then you can just say yes, and it'll be fine. So I was like, OK, sick. This is like getting on a fucking bus. And I'm like, let's do this. And I was nervous. I was scared, man. I was terrified because as like a kid, you don't really know what to expect in the military. And I like end up at boot camp, which is crazy. And I was terrified. And then I realized it was all just kind of routine and stuff like that.

1:38:20And I got out of boot camp. Actually, no, that's not the whole story. I was trying to be a diver. And one day they were like, hey, you're going to get to reclass what you're doing. And they gave me like two options. And it was like being a master at arms, which is like a cop in the military, or be a aviation ordnanceman, which is like the dudes who like load the bombs and things on planes. And I was pissed at my dad. I was like, what the hell, man? I thought you said I was going to get to be a diver. I called him. I'm like, dude, you suck, man. And so my buddies were all AOs, which in the Navy, they're all fucking made fun of because they're all like big old dumb idiots.

1:39:02And then I became an AO. And I went to A School to be an AO. And it was amazing, man. I met some of those beautiful people I've ever met. I've learned more than I've ever learned. But while I got stationed in Nebraska and I hate this, I'm not going to oversell this because I don't want to sound tough. But I trained to be a CEO for like two years with this guy named Senior Chief Lundquist at Omaha, Nebraska. And I trained really, really hard. I took a bunch of these PSTs. And I would call my mom like every day. She would ask me how far I ran, how far I swam, how much I lifted and shit. And then I don't take it lightly there.

1:39:41I'm not tough. It never happened. But I wanted to go to Buds really bad because like I said, I wanted to do something that was greater than myself. And then the day my package came back for the SEAL, the Buds thing, my mom had died. And I was like, oh fuck, man, this sucks. This is crazy. And all the while I was an AO and I hated it. I was like, oh shit. Now I got to be an Ordin'sman. And when she passed away, I was like, man, I don't want to do that. I don't really want to pursue that. So I bitched out for sure. And I wish I wouldn't have sometimes, but life is crazy. And my chief, my chief, who's like high ranking, he looked at me and was like, man, you want to go out there and die or something?

1:40:22Why do you want to do this so bad? And I was like, I guess you're right. And it's one of those stories in my life where I kind of, I look back and I'm like, man, if things would have been different, what would have happened? But she passed away and then I moved to Washington to be an Ordin'sman. Then as soon as I fucking landed in Washington, they sent me to the desert, this Barraini desert to learn how to build missiles and load missiles. It's crazy. And it was sick, man, it was beautiful. So, and I was like, you had to build missiles as in like load them or as in like disassemble and reassemble.

1:40:55Or, and this is different from EOD. There's explosive ordinance disposal and then there's AOs, which AOs are kind of just like the little tiny baby cousin of not even connected. EOD, there's some badass guys. AOs are just the dudes who build load on and beyond the bombs that are on the planes that are taken off. Just build bombs, no big deal. Yeah, it's cool, man, it's neat. And but fucking, it's crazy. So I was in the desert, man, I was fucking like 19 years old, like, oh shit, okay, I'm here. And I was a, I was a sand sailor for sure. I never, I never like was on a ship. And so that was my first deployment and I fell in love with it.

1:41:34I wanted to do it like always. I was like, this is amazing. I had this really great gunner. Gunner is like your, your officer above you. And he just inspired me so much to be the best that I could be like every day. So I go into work and be, did I was a fucking kiss ass? Like in the Navy, everyone hated me. So I was like, let's go to war, man, let's go. And we're just doing simple shit like eating dinner, you know? And but I fell in love with it and I wanted to do it forever. And so we would like launch planes out and like do the keys and shit to arm the missiles that took off and things like that.

1:42:06And I forgot what your name question was. I'm so sorry. I get the very beginning. I don't remember what the exact question was either. Oh yeah, just being in the Navy in general. And what was it? What were we talking about? We were talking about something in specific. I know. Pacific story. Exactly. And then I said I didn't want to tell the whole story. And then I thought, God damn it. Oh, I was just saying that I was in for like nine. I was in for like nine years and no one ever talks about that shit now. And I was like, but and then I went to Djibouti, Africa, which was crazy. That's right. I asked you about Africa and I went to ask you about Bahrain.

1:42:36Yeah. That's what started it. Yeah. And then I was in Africa for like, did I been in Africa for like a year in my life? I was deployed there twice. And it's like, I loved every second of it. So I'd wake up at 5 a .m. every morning and like go eat breakfast. Just go like load your plane. Go eat lunch. Like what part of Africa were you in? And Djibouti. And where's that? The horn. It's like right on the edge, either top or I'm going to say like an idiot. Was there a lot of wildlife? No, we were stuck on the base the whole time. You can't even go off the base. It's crazy. It's going. I can't bloom in here.

1:43:10Yeah. But it's cool though, because there's like eight gyms, man. And like food. That's all you do. And you're as happy as happy as fuck. Because it's so simple. That is wild. And you go to breakfast, work out. Go to your job, work out. That's what it looks like there. No way. You were probably a little shittier where we were. It was cool. And so you're just on the base and that's it. Yeah. And then every more like whether there's like cluster bombs or whatever you'd like go, you'd go assemble them or load them and shit. And it was really crazy. Wow. Yeah. And then like I said, one day I just like ended up like it was overnight.

1:43:47One day I just went to fucking Jacksonville, Florida. Was playing my guitar on Twitter and it like blew up. And then my cheap was like, hey man, this is crazy. You got a fucking. This is a this is a conflict of interest, man. You can't be famous. Yeah, I was like, I think they were scared that I would show up to work and just be like, fuck you guys, man. I don't need this, you know, never happened. I would never do that. I was so devoted to being in the Navy, but they thought they were losing all power over it. Exactly. Which is crazy to think about, man. And I had this fucking my gunner one day comes up to me and he's like, hey man, this is getting crazy.

1:44:24You've got to get out of the Navy. I'm like, okay, whatever do I have to? And he's like, yeah. And I was like, I'd rather not. And he's like, okay, too bad. And then he was like, okay, you'll be out of the Navy next week. And I'm like, that's crazy. All right, been doing this for eight years now. And then it took eight months to process me out of the Navy. And it was crazy because every day I would go into work and think like, oh, this is my last day in the Navy. Cool. For eight months. This is my last day. You gotta work as hard as you possibly can, man. Make it count, make it count, make it count.

1:44:57And every day I'd go in and just bust my ass. And then dude, like six months in, I'm like, I'm in the fucking Navy forever, man. Sounds good. She is. She's surprised. Why is that? Is that just standard for paperwork? It's never happened. It's never hell like, I think don't quote me. But like Elvis Presley was the last guy who got like, honorably discharged out to make music. And I'm not like being arrogant in that either. I think that's true. And it just never happens like that. There's been a lot of stuff with NFL players who are like at the Academy, the Naval Academy, who are like, I really get a football and get drafted to the NFL.

1:45:31They have to like, get transferred out and stuff like that. But it's never happened like some Joe shit the rag man, AO like me. And that's when I knew it. When my gunner called me that day and he's like, pack your bags. I was like, holy f. Oh, this is that serious. I called my dad. I thought he was going to be disappointed because he was a master chief and stuff. And I was supposed to be a master chief. My dad had like a bottle of whiskey when I was a kid that said master chief Brian on it for me when I made master chief. So I thought when I called my dad, he'd be disappointed. But he was like, I might come home.

1:46:01Do it. And I thought it would flop. I thought it'd be nothing in the year. You were already successful online. Yeah, exactly exactly. But I still, I still, I never like play the show or anything. And then we went like I got it. I was your first one. Oh, yeah. What was it? It was the pageant in St. Louis, Missouri. How many people? They wasn't the very first one. This is unfair to say. Like my best friends in Washington when I was in the Navy, I used to play at this place called the... I used to play like shitty acoustic sets at this place called off the hook. Where all the sailors went, like on the weekends and shit.

1:46:39They had like, and my best friends, Austin and Kramer, they used to come to the bar and watch me. These two fucking dudes looking at me play. And every time I'd finish a song, they'd clap for me, man, because they're real friends, you know. And I was like the very first show I ever played. But the pageant in St. Louis, I got out of the Navy and here's what's weird for me. Because musicians have a... I'm talking way too much. I apologize. No, you're not at all. Musicians have usually a pipeline, which drives me crazy. I don't know why, but they have a pipeline of like, oh man, I played small bars, and then I played bigger small bars, and then I played bigger, bigger small bars.

1:47:22Then I went to medium venues, and then I went to bigger medium venues, and they have this thing where they're proud of it, of course. Which I would be too, that's a journey. But when I got out of the Navy, I was already like, there. So I like hopped on a fucking tour bus, so I had to go into the pageant in St. Louis. Wow. How many people was that? I think 2 ,000, 2 ,500. Wow. Which was crazy for me, because I never played a show, and people blame me a lot for this. Like they've get mad at me. And I'm like, bro, I didn't fucking do this. I didn't mean for this to happen. Why are they mad at you?

1:47:53Exactly, I agree. And it freaks me out too. And I just like, I wish I could just, I wish I could just like talk to people and be like, hey man. This is all. There's a phrase that I've heard that I've repeated way too much, but I'm gonna say it one more time. This, I forget who said this, but we'll look it up. All criticism is the tragic result of unmet needs. So people who feel like they should be you. People who feel like, I was thinking about that before I got here. Yeah, there's something to that. There's something to like what you do with your energy. If you're a big ol' hater, Marshall Rosenberg, father of nonviolent communication, said that every criticism, judgment, diagnosis, and expression of anger is the tragic expression of an unmet need.

1:48:37Peace requires that we develop the skills to recognize the needs, feelings, and values that influence our perspective so that we can respond. Forget what it's not on. Wow. And with the rest of the article, it says, that's just the highlight. But whatever it is, oh, three respond appropriately. Often we react to situations, people that push our buttons that have recognized and that our emotions are simply a guide to uncovering the unmet needs inside. Instead of looking outwards in blame and judgment, self -awareness helps us see our role in each interaction. That's insane. From beautiful, brilliant.

1:49:10And I get that, but you're like empathetic to those people. You can't be empathetic to someone's mad at you because you're successful. I learned the hard, like last, we did a whole bunch of shit like with ticketing and stuff like that. We tried our best, actually. Like as a man, I was like, okay, I'm gonna fix this problem, man. This is happening. I remember we had a conversation on the phone about it. Yeah, exactly. I was like, man, it's me. I'll be the guy. I'm gonna do this. And then I did it. And it was just, Theo was on the video and stuff for it. I like put out the scalpers. I was like, I'm gonna make everyone register.

1:49:42We're gonna show IDs at the venue. Tickets gonna be $150, no matter what. No matter what, I don't care. And fucking backfire on me. Because people were just so angry at me about it. And I was just trying to do the right thing. And so it kind of... Where was everybody angry at you? Or some of the people happy with you. Of course. Hard to tell. Yeah, that's the problem. Exactly, it's hard to tell. That's the problem. And that's why in that Dunbar's number, those five close confidants, those are the ones you need to be able to have a conversation with about that kind of shit. And that's the thing about my life, which is, sorry.

1:50:19That's the thing about my life, which is so crazy. It's because I have so many people that are so close to me and they know why I do what I do and the feelings that I feel and why I'm, why I try so hard and why I do this, why I do that, same with everyone's life. But it's hard, I think, to be a figure or a big figure and say one thing to those people and then the public eye see something else. And it's like, damn. Try to try to be a hardest, you know? It's crazy, man. It's nuts. It was like psychotic. Like we're saying, there's always going to be someone that's upset. And if you have people upset at you, even if it's a small percentage of the people, that feeling is magnified, it feels way worse.

1:50:59But they're feelings are valid, though, too. Like those small amount of people whose feelings are like that, I have that problem. It depends on what we're talking about. Very true. Depends on what we're talking about. I mean, sometimes it's valid, but sometimes it's just a pure expression of that paragraph that guy wrote. Yeah, very, very true. It could be that, because there's a lot of people who are upset because they didn't figure it out and they didn't get the breaks they thought they deserved and they didn't get opportunities. Or they got a bad role, the dice in terms of like their life and where they grew up.

1:51:31And they get really angry when they see someone who hits the lottery. And some people hit the lottery. You know, they respect, I think most people respect a long grind to be like the Rolling Stones. Like if you're the Rolling Stones, like, how can you not respect that? The guy's 80. He's up there, still in the concerts and killing him. And probably when they were a younger band, they fucking. Yeah. Grind it and grind it and grind it. In those like I was saying really with the small venues, those medium venues and things like that. So nobody would hate on the Rolling Stones. No, but someone would hate on you because you're new.

1:52:06So it's this new thing with this guy like, he didn't even have to try that. He didn't even play the small ball. The fucker was in the name. This is bullshit. I've it on the fucking roads. I was 12. And people forget man about the fucking like four or five hours and night I spent after a shift in the Navy, like doing the shit, writing songs, getting good at writing songs. People forget that it takes a lot to be a good writer. You know, and I'm not talking on my ass. I'm saying that that's one thing in my life. This life that I know that I've earned because I've written so many things. And I've had so many shitty songs that I've like, and I'm like, come on.

1:52:44Do you write pen to paper or do you write with a laptop or a computer? I can't, I fucking 70 notebooks in my truck right now. Because I just, and they're all like, like store them, do you like store them like images of them or anything? No, no. I think it's kind of cool. That is cool. That's very cool. It's not fucking super valuable. I know, last year I had a buddy, we were at the studio in Times Square and he had this backpack on my notebook. The four of my notebooks were in it with like every, like, yeah, I don't know if I should say this, but every song I'd written in the last two years. Dude, that's scary.

1:53:20Left it. Crazy man. No. Crazy man. Oh my God, you freak. Middle New York City house, like terrified. But that's why I don't know if I should say it. Someone's gonna fucking go on a scavenger hunt and look for it. But you're fucking song. Exactly. And try to sell them back to you. You're crazy. And you can get like a reward. Maybe got a reward. Maybe some kid, how long ago was this? Uh, November, last year. Oh, homeless people wiped their ass for the last five years. Exactly. Think about that, bro. Yeah, I wonder if it was like a fucking super hit song. I think about it all the time. It's something in the orange.

1:53:55I was out there and some homeless guys wiping his ass with it right now. And he loves it. And he loves it, man. It feels great. I think about it. Every morning I wake up and like, fuck, I knew to thought. Maybe someone will find it. I think everything happens for a reason though. Yeah. So maybe I had a fucking shitty album in there. Oh, I doubt it, dude. It's crazy. But yeah, I'm pinned to paper for sure. When you write your comedy, are you? I write on the computer. I don't know. You think that hurts it? No, I can write faster. And you're coming, so later, as I'm just asking you, if you think it makes a difference in writing a pinned to paper?

1:54:26I'm a hurts it in terms of memory, yes. So I write pinned to paper when I'm writing stuff down before a show. So I'll write on index cards and I'll write on my notebook. Well, before a show. So I'll write out key bullet points, key important parts of a bit. But when I'm writing, I don't want to be hindered by time. So if I have a thought, if I'm sitting there and I'm writing, and I can type without looking, right? It's like a touch type. So as I'm sitting when I have ideas, I can get them out, like I can write appreciation like that that quick. But if I have to write a P, oh yeah. It takes too much time.

1:55:03Yeah, I can. I'm the opposite, man. I'm a fucking, I'm an ass. I'll like take as much time as I can writing the song. But that's not something wrong with that. That's, I know a lot of comedians, like my friend Mark Norman, he carries a stack of index cards in his pocket. It's like that thick. Why are you so worried about wasting time? No, it's just better for me with thoughts, with time. Like the more, like when I'm writing something out, if I have a thought, I got to capture it. If I can get the words onto the screen, quicker, then I have less of a chance of not getting in or something. Yeah, not holding on to the idea.

1:55:38Because if I have to write out a word and they're like, fuck, what was I saying? Where did I go with this? I want to be real sure that I have a flow of ideas to documenting the ideas, ideas to expanding on the ideas. And I don't want to be herky, jerky, touch typing. I've been there. And I don't want to be, I mean, poke typing. I want to be able to just write. When I can just write, it's so much, I can get so much more done. So I can write paragraphs. And the more paragraphs I write, the more there's a chance, there's something fertile in there. Something great in there. And then I take those things and I take them out.

1:56:14That's how I put them in another file. You forget some shit. Always. It's terrifying. I know. And you create ideas in the middle of the night. I'm like, I'll remember. Never remember. I'm like, this one I'll never forget. Melodies are weird. Melodies are really weird. And then they come to for the most part. I didn't have to have a guitar. I'm different in a lot of people. A lot of people are just pops in their head. I'm like, no, I got to sit with my guitar for 10 hours. Yeah. In play. It's such a different, but the same thing. I feel like writing comedy is probably similar to writing songs in a way.

1:56:46How do you get jokes in your head? You have to write. And you have to think and you have to hang out with your friends. A big one is hanging out with our friends. Like, you know, you've been to the mothership and see how we all hang out together. Of course. I've always talked shit and laugh. And we're like, just like the other night, Ron White was telling this story. And I said, did you have you told this on stage? And he goes, now I have it. I go, fucking, please do. You got it. I'm like, that is a giant chunk of material. I'm like, please write that down. That is hilarious. He's done that like three or four times.

1:57:16But funny people are just funny people. I'm like, why is so fun? I wish I could meet him so bad. I'm not even meeting him. I remember being kidd up. Like that. But you went down tonight. I'll have you meet him. I'm here on. Dude, he loved to meet you. He's the fucking man. My dad, he's forced me to watch him, man. When I did the kids and then not that he's getting older or anything, I'm just like, remember that fucking. He's definitely getting older. We all are. Do you remember that? It's awesome. The four dudes, when we were younger, you get on DVD. It was like Larry the cable guy. Yeah, Ron White, George.

1:57:43That's what made Larry the cable guy. That's what made Ron White. Jeff Fox, whether it was already really successful. It was huge. Everyone watched it. I remember like my whole family was talking about it and Oklahoma and like that. I'm like, huge. It was huge. That's crazy. But I've learned that what you were saying about, that was really beautiful. You said about you have to hang out with your friends. Because they're part of it, right? Like communication with each other. To talking about stuff. People want a lot from you as well as me, as well as whoever. And if you're touring all year and you're playing these shows and you're on a bus and you're going in and out of arena, you're not like living these things that you can write about.

1:58:21And when you're a writer, it takes, it bothers you a lot because you're like, I have an album coming out soon and I'm like, damn man, I hope it's good enough because I've been fucking touring for three years because I haven't gotten to live the things that I want to write about. It does amazing songs that people want. It takes experience in this life. It takes living, which is such a paradox because it sucks because you want to be playing the songs you've written in the past but you also want to be writing songs you have in the future. It's nuts. Well, I mean, your song is in the past or always going to have, but when there's an exciting artist like yourself and I'm a fan, I think you're awesome.

1:59:03Thank you, Joe. And when I listen to your music, I'm like, this motherfucker could write songs like this forever. There's certain people that it's like David Tal, like my friend David Tal. David Tal can write funny jokes forever, forever. When he dies, he will be funny the day he dies. But is he funny because he's relatable? He's just awesome. He's just so good. He's so polished and he's the most underappreciated standup of our generation. It's like an asshole for not knowing him. He's so fucking funny man. He's so good. He's hilarious. Is he at the mothership? Yeah, he's been. He's been. He's also, he's in New York most of the time.

1:59:41That's where he lives. But he's a legend, like a comedy legend and a legend amongst comedians, like universally loved amongst comedians. And he just fucking, I would never imagine a time where that guy is not gonna come up with something funny to say. No shit. It's not gonna exist. Just like you. I'm not gonna imagine a time when you're not, unless you fall apart on us. Yeah. Well, it's a non -existent fear. I remember when it all, when it all, I fucking hope so. I keep it together, bro. You too, I mean, you're on the other side of it. You had to have times in your life where you, like in fame, I don't know.

2:00:12Bro, every day, every day, I'm like, keep it together, bitch. You got it every day. Every day. That's why you get in that fucking, that's why you do all that torture shit I do to myself. I'm due to it because I'm smart. I know what I'm doing. Bro, you've inserted yourself into everyone's head every morning, it's infuriating, bro, every time I wake up, I'm like, fuck, dude. Gotta go. How about Joe's doing some shit right now, man? Yeah, and I think that too. I think that, I do. I do it for myself, like I do it anyway. But I do think, imagine if people were watching you and making sure you're not half -ass in this.

2:00:42That's another thing about me and you, I guess, but like you gotta keep going. Gotta keep going. You can't stop even if it sucks. That was a crazy thing to think about. Like along your journey, no matter what, if it's bad or not, if your jokes are bad, if my songs are bad, you have to write the bad jokes and you have to write the bad songs and you have to keep going. Because if you don't, you're never gonna write the good one. And sometimes I would imagine, I've had bad jokes that I was like, I can't figure out what to do with this. I have an idea, but it's just too clunky. And then like two years later, I revisit it.

2:01:17And now I have a new premise that ties in with it. I'm like, oh yeah, oh my god, it slips like a mug. It makes sense. Perfect. That's what writing songs is like too, because like fucking you write like three lines. Yeah, that's what I was gonna say. You do have times where you write a song and you don't like it, but then you come back and you have new ideas and then something from that song. So man, that's how all songs for me are written at least. Except like a few of them, like the here's what's interesting, the thing about the, I don't wanna say huge, come on and ask, but like the big ones that I've written, the ones that were like successful, they were always like two minute songs, like sat down and like just fucking jotted.

2:01:53And then wrote, like did a video and then people loved them. And I was like, shit man. But the ones I think about a lot, the ones that I write and write, right? They're always like, no one really cares about them. It's funny. I'm like, fuck man. Maybe I should just like get drunk and write really fast. I think Sturgel Simpson said that about you can have the crown. Like that one song. I fucking love that song. Sturgel's so good man. What a hero. He's the fucking best. But all those guys are. He's off the grid now, living on an island. Good for him. Yeah, look at him. That motherfucker doesn't play.

2:02:23Bro, I follow a fucking Instagram called Where is Sturgel Simpson? You follow that one too? And it's just like random shit he's doing. No, I just wait for text messages. He's one of those guys you like, you just watching me exist. I love him to death. I wish I could made him when I was a kid. Dude, I will look it up. If he's in town, if he comes visit, sometimes I feel bad because like I said, I know like three chords and shit and Sturgel's writing songs about like metaphysics. Well, you know, Sturgel was. Yeah, that one. That's the one where the fuck is Sturgel Simpson. Yeah. There's all these fucking crazy pictures of him with puppies and shit.

2:02:55He's a wild bro. He's such a man's man, bro. I love him to death. Yeah, me too. I love that dude to death. I'm so curious about him, man. When I first had him on the podcast, I had heard there's a psychedelic country guy. And I'd listened to a couple of songs and then had him on the podcast. And I was like, I wonder if these guys gonna wanna play music? I want to give him a last. I wonder if these guys got to play music. I wonder if he's gonna just wanna hang out. And we just fucking smoked weed and torch shit. It was amazing. It was amazing. I can't, I can't smoke pot, man. But you can. It's totally possible.

2:03:27I guess, yeah, I hate to sound like a bitch. Do you get better? We smoke a lot of pot. Well, I used to smoke a lot of pot. Well, after I got out of the Navy, obviously, I was like, okay, I gotta do it now. Cause I didn't smoke. I didn't do drugs for nine years. Right. Like every day in the Navy. Right. And I didn't even know it was a thing that my buddy JR, he smokes quite a bit. And there's nothing wrong with it. But man, I lived in New York for a little bit. And one night I got some gas station marijuana. Gas station marijuana. From a fucking corner stop. And I like smoked it. And I was on this like scaffolding thing in New York.

2:03:57They were looking at the stars. And I thought everything was fine. And then all of a sudden my world collapsed. Which is such a bitch. A bitch thing to say, I don't really know. I thought my fucking body was collapsing. And I thought it, you know, it's crazy. It was like a positive feedback loop in my head. And I was like, oh man, my body's collapsing. I'm fucked. And I called my sister, my dogs running around the apartment. I'm taking my shirt off, bro. My dogs running around with me. I'm like, you gotta stay on the phone with me. I can't do it. Oh my God. It was crazy. So many people have had that experience with me.

2:04:27But yeah, I know. And it's like, you just gotta do it enough to do it. But I don't really like, there's never been a part of my life where I wanted to do it enough to get to the point where I was okay with it. You definitely don't have to. And I'd think like two hits with the guys out there in shit. Like it's not a big deal, but that's all you need. But every time I think it's a different thing, I'm like, okay, this is the time I'm not fucking down. You just want way too deep. You take my, you do mushrooms? Okay, you should. Oh, been known. They do some mushrooms. I've been, I love, I love shrooms a lot.

2:04:55I think they should be not just legal, but we should have centers where people who are educated in the right dosage and the right, you know, for whatever it is for a person, if you want to achieve a certain thing, and they should have like screenings and like mental health screenings for people, and then they should have guided psychedelic experiences. And I think it would make the world a better world. Don't they do that shit with like, I don't think it's, I don't know. No, I don't think it's a ketamine. They definitely do it with ketamine. I don't think it's for everybody. It's not for everybody.

2:05:26I don't think anything's for everybody. I think there are some people that have psychological problems, and they shouldn't do anything that perturbs their normal state of consciousness. Wow. I've heard that said by experts, so I'm just repeating that, and I agree with it because it makes sense to me. But for a lot of people, having a psychedelic experience where you get to see yourself outside of yourself is very beneficial. That freaks me out when you talk about like DMT and things like that, even on the show. I like, I hear you talk about stuff like that, and I'm like, dude, how the fuck does someone just do that to themselves?

2:05:58Not in a bad way. I mean, in like a, in like a trip way. Or like, if you were to do something like that, I have that, I have that, I got a funny story to tell you. But I have that fear in me that's like, man, what if it goes wrong? Yeah, what if you never come back? Exactly. Like we've all heard about, was it Keith Moon? Who was it in, who's like the first guy that they said went kuku from acid?

2:06:23It was the dude from Pink Floyd, right? No, what's up? Ken Keezy's like the... Ken Keezy was like the fat, the father of the psychedelic movement. He was one of the fathers of the psychedelic movement. I bet back in the day it wasn't his... Like, probably wasn't as good. Right, right, Sid Barrett was the Pink Floyd guy, right? And he went crazy from LSD. But didn't someone else go crazy as well? Sid Barrett is one of the most tragic stories in rock and roll. What do you mean go crazy? Sometimes, well, you know, how would Stern talk about this once too? He said that he took a lot of ass in one time, and he was really fucked up for a long time.

2:07:01And he's really scared that he wasn't going to come back. Because there have been times where people have had, whether it's LSD or some mind altering substance, that for whatever reason that we don't totally understand, they fucked and go and never come back. That's so weird. Why would you ever do something like that? Maybe it was Brian Wilson. Did he go crazy from...? No disrespect to anyone. That sounds as interesting. Brian Wilson from The Beach Boys. Wasn't he the guy that was also tied up with Manson? He was tied up with the Manson family. Well, that's where he was going. Right. You like, Shinson wanted to make music with him, and he was trying to force him to like do it.

2:07:38Right. So that's probably why he was doing all that. And he made him do acid. Because Manson was doing acid. Which is Manson was... What's the name of that? Dude, Manson, for the millionth time, I'll talk about this. From The Beach Manson, Ruin Dennis Wilson's life. Oh, it's his brother. Brother of Brian Wilson. Never went to dare. So Dennis Wilson was like, the guy was going to manage him, right? I don't believe so. Something like that. Like that, too. He was looking for his house, I think. But those... The Manson family, most likely, was like a CIA project. Most likely, it was a project of MK Ultra.

2:08:10And it's documented by this guy, Tom O 'Neill in this book called Chaos. It's an amazing book. That talks about the CIA's LSD program. They were dosing people all over the place with LSD. They had a thing called Operation Midnight Climax, where they would go to a brothel, and they would have 3D or C -through mirrors, so they could see through and watch the Johns. And the prostitute would give the John a drink that was laced with acid. So this guy would take this drink and just fucking trip balls, and they would monitor them, and they would talk to them. And then they did a bunch of different things where they had the LSD studies that they did out of Harvard that actually created, most likely, was a factor in creating Ted Kaczynski, because the unibomber was a part of those LSD studies.

2:08:55And then... It reminds me of a pineapple express. While he was tripping balls, was thinking that technology is going to kill all the people. So he has to kill the people that are making technology. And by the way, I'm not condoning what he did. But it's logical. Yeah. It's logical. That's an episode of Black Mirror. It's logical. It seems like it would be an episode of Black Mirror where the computers become far more intelligent than human beings, and they have no use for them anymore. And they, in fact, they find human beings to be a problem. Like, that's the idea that you're going to create a new life form that's far more intelligent than you.

2:09:29I'm going to send it down. And the technology is going to take over people. You think it's... No way. I mean, Danny, talk about all the time. Well, people smarter than me don't think it's going to happen. Like, Mark Andrews. I feel that way, and I'm not smart at all. Sometimes we talk about it. And I'm like, there's no way in hell that people let things get that far to where... I don't think we have a chance. I don't think we have a chance. Because I think you're... Instead, or this is... This is the problem. And I'm not saying the capitalism is bad thing. But when corporations are primarily around to make money, and they have an obligation to their stakeholders, they're always going to make money, if this new frontier is opening up, and it's called artificial intelligence, and you're a part of that, and you start making money doing that, that fucking train is on the tracks, baby.

2:10:15And there's no breaks. Weeeeeee! You're not going to stop them from making art. They already got chat GPT. They can have fucking conversations with you. Right? They can diagnose illnesses, and tell you how to fix your car. I have this problem where I believe in humanity though. I do too. No, not that you don't. I wasn't like inducing that. I was just saying that. I'm just a realist. Yeah, but that's just a little crazy. Listen man, they're not going to stop making it. So if they're not going to stop making it, where's it going to go? It's going to go to a life form. It's just a matter of how much time does it take.

2:10:44I don't understand the technology. So I can't say that it's 50 years from now, or 100 years from now, or 5 weeks from now. I don't know. I don't know what it is, but they're going to be able to create a life form. This is going to be... This is what I don't understand. You see, Sarvan interrupting. No, please. This is what I don't understand. You see those videos you've been seeing for like five years that like those weird robotic heads talking that look like real faces and things like that. And this is really elementary. I just mean like those weird bald mannequin looking heads or can you like eye -locating?

2:11:16The AI looking things. That's what happened for five years. Oh yeah. When's the... When's like what everyone's scared of? Well, they've got some pretty sophisticated ones out of... I believe Japan now. There's Whitney in her robot. Yeah, I thought you were just pulling the pictures like girls, man. I was like, what the hell? That's my friend Whitney Cummings, and that's her robot. So Whitney Cummings' robot couldn't like talk and say things and she has it say jokes. That's a fucking nightmare. It's hilarious. Not Whitney Cummings twice, but like the fact that there's a robot. Well, she thinks it's hilarious.

2:11:47That's so scary. A ton of inappropriate jokes about that robot. They do a robot does? No, she puts them in the robot's face. But it's... She's holding its face. Yeah, she took its head off. Yeah. Well, this is like very rudimentary. Like that kind of robot. Yeah, that's what I mean by that. I feel like everything you've seen online when it comes to AI and things like that, it's all... Which is even scarier, because who do you know? Like what's going on somewhere else when it comes to AI and things like that? I think we're only... What we're learning from like chat GPT is that just from scouring the internet, you could have a program that's so powerful that it could answer any question you have in very complex ways, in paragraph after paragraph.

2:12:31This has been interesting in the music industry because people fucking every day, 20 people send me a song by an AI bot that I wrote. And it's almost insulting, because I see the songs and it's like... It's crazy to see the lyrics that these AI bots come up with. I'm like, man, I got to write fucking better songs. Can you see it? I'm like, man. I wrote that to this AI bot. And it scares the shit out of me, but I'm also like... Like when I think of my head and like think about what I can write personally from my heart, I'm like, there's no way AI has ever... It's not going to be able to replicate what your lived felt experiences can convey in a creative way.

2:13:09Which I think people are smarter than people think. And I think that'll always reign supreme. But I think it's going to make some hits. Yeah, there was like a bunch of... There was like a bunch of... Yeah, I was going to mention it, but I didn't want to. Like, it's huge. Apparently it was huge. Yeah. Look, it's going to make some hits. And that's not against Drake. That's so true. Drake can still make hits too, but AI can make Drake hits. And that's what's crazy. It's like... When you get to a certain point, like if you have a certain style of music, like a wonder if it can do jazz. I don't really have a real understanding of jazz.

2:13:45I feel like it would be easier to do jazz than... This is not an insult to jazz musicians. I respect them. I feel like it could do jazz well because it has so many notes and perfect slides and things to go off of. When it comes like songwriting, it might be a little different. A badge of it did jazz better than the jazz musicians and everybody got mad. That'd be crazy. Oh, jazz musicians would be pissed. They'd be so mad. They'd be a bunch of fucking breweries. Just up in flames. You go into some independent coffee shop. And they're just all pissed. And there's a jazz playing. And some fucking dudes.

2:14:18But it's AI jazz, but it's amazing. And you're like, oh my god. Because if AI is that smart. There's some dude with a bass, just fucking piss. Right, what do you think about what... Like they say... I don't know anything about music. Let me just say this real quick. But they say that every note is apparently been played. Like all of them, right? Yes, okay. I don't know if this is true, but Bach... I don't know anything about music either, but Bach win. Isn't this AI then? Isn't that a program? Jamie are freaking out. But no, that's the same thing. No, no, no, no, that's a program. Those pieces of paper are those holes in that paper.

2:14:53Whatever the fuck that thing is, that scroll. But what's artificial intelligence, right? That's the same thing. You're feeding it a bunch of shit to then recreate it without some uphorses. Yeah, but it's not growing. I think it's mechanical, bro. It's not growing. Like it doesn't. It doesn't grow inside itself. That's why AI is fucking scary. That's like saying an automatic watch is artificial. Or like factories are artificial intelligence. Because all the gears are spinning and ticking and keeping perfect time. No, that's mechanical. That's engineering. You know what? I have some respect for engineering.

2:15:20I'm with him, man. That's what I feel like that's what Andrews was sort of saying. Like it's just re -breeding off of the internet sort of and saying words that sort of to us makes sense. Sure. For now. But yeah, did you guys think that people have been saying forever? Right. Did you see the black mirror episode? Um, with the AI and the likeness thing. And they, they can steal your likeness and they be creaking. I saw that one. Did I say that one? Maybe I didn't. And the TikTok fucking things are... I've seen this exactly. This has just been around for 150 years. And it's very close to, this replaced a piano player, you know, from the Wild Wild West.

2:15:56But it will always play the exact same thing. Yeah, and it sounds exact same every time you play. Oh, so they have the Wild Wild West. They were told to shit. Yeah, these are really old. Wow. See, that's what I'm trying to say about people. They keep saying that. Sounds like someone's playing. That sounds like a place where someone's getting shot. Right? How do they make that in the... When did you say it, kid? These are old. I don't know when they were first invented, but these are not new and they're old. Gotta get one of them, man. A long clock. We should have one of those in the studio. Got to.

2:16:23See, that's not, you know. Bro. How much do you think one of those costs? A player piano. Right now. We should have one in the studio. What's a player piano? Is that what it's called? There's a play. Like they act. Because they... We should get one of them old ones. Supposedly a player. It would be dope just to have a round for the vibes. Just a little bit of two grand. Put it in here, man. Oh. So next time this comes up, you can just... Just play it. There's no room in here. We have the perfect amount of things that are in here. We have no room in here, but out there. It's beautiful. Thank you.

2:16:49Thank you very much. I'm scared of artificial intelligence. I'm scared of all of it because I think human beings are going to become obsolete. And I think we either are going to merge with technology, which we're kind of already doing. Elon always points out that we're already a cyborg. We just hold our phone. Yeah, that's us. It's connected with it in a very, very strange way. You can't exist without it now. It's hard to. You can, for sure. A lot of people do. Christopher Nolan apparently does. Apparently he doesn't have email, nothing. You have to talk to him. And you aspire for that sometimes.

2:17:21Like in your head, you sometimes, but I like... First of all, I like the distraction of my phone sometimes. If I'm bored, I like to sit and watch like pool matches on you. I agree. You know, I like to watch fights if I found out about fights. And like, I get to watch like results. I get to watch things that maybe I had missed. Like on other organizations outside the UFC. I can watch my phone. I wonder why you so say, yeah, I wonder why people are so... I personally like the age that I'm at. You're older than me, but like, I feel ashamed of... Your phone, you look. You look in at my phone so much.

2:17:51Yeah. And I think that might be like an immaturity thing. You know what I mean? Where? Well, I can't monitor myself. And I like this. It's a bit different. I've got to tweet some heinous shit. Do you? I tweet some crazy shit. People are always like, man, what's going on? I'm literally just like, like 3 a .m. on a Tuesday. And I'm like, I'm gonna fuck it. You know? And I just get on with people. I'll wake up the next day and people like, hey man, you good? I'm like, yeah, it's a song lyric or something. Yeah. It's crazy. I like doing it. Like I said, I haven't talked to someone like this in so, so long that like my fucking crazy tweets are the only thing that people know me by.

2:18:22And I'm like, man, I got to clear some air, bro. It's so crazy. Do you think about not tweeting sometimes? Like it's not worth it? I actually recently deleted my Twitter. I got these phases where I'm like, I do it so much that I'm like, man, get off here for a second. I don't know how the fuck Elon does it. I have that stuff. Yeah, do he change the world today? He's like, made it X, right? Yeah, it's X now officially. You tweet ever? Yeah, I like it. I read things more than I post things. Do you run your own Twitter? Yeah. But I want to engage with anybody. You know, like see back and forth that people have with people like, I am so not interested in doing that.

2:18:58There's something in me where people respond. I'm like, man. No, it's not like fans responding. Oh, I see. It's people getting a conflict on Twitter. And I think that's ridiculous. I think it's the worst way to communicate. And bothers me a lot. And I think people, I see some people, all they do is just lash out at people. And that is a hurt person. That's what that is. That's all that is. It's like, it's not a healthy way to live your life. But you have to empathize a little bit inside yourself too with those people. Sure. Sometimes people tweet at me and I'm like, hey, man. But I don't tweet back ever.

2:19:29I always control myself most of the time. I'm not friends. Yeah, I have friends that tell me about tweets that they read. Isn't that crazy? You're thinking about fucking telling that guy to fuck off and... Oh, man. Stop reading that shit. Yeah, it doesn't matter that much. I don't think at the great. But it is interesting to read all these different people's opinions and thoughts. I do love that about Twitter that you'll get like these hard, core leftist perspectives and hard, core right wing perspectives. And I think as much as it makes people uncomfortable, you have to have a place where everybody gets to talk it out.

2:20:03Everybody gets to talk. And it's beautiful. The liberty people that think that fucking nuclear bombs aren't real. Do you know that's a big one that's going around the end of your bombs? Nuclear bombs are not real. Yeah, nuclear bombs are hoaxes. It's a hoax. Okay. That's the latest. Oppenheimer was bullshit, man. It's semi -connected, I think, to Flat Earth. Let's go. I think it's semi -connected to dinosaurs aren't real. It's like a reprawn attack of idiocy. That's crazy. What's their main reasoning behind nuclear bombs? Well, I just think they're big bombs. Just big bombs. Yeah. Yeah, there was like some Twitter thread I was reading where they were talking about how nuclear bombs have to be fake.

2:20:42Because Hiroshima and Nagasaki don't have any nuclear fallout. That's fucking... I've been that, when I was a kid, I went. I saw the museum, bro. Dude, if you're a little kid and you're walking through... I wonder. I seriously wonder how many of these people that are having these conversations online are like Russian agents or their feds or they're like somebody who's just designed to make people stupider. I should worry about the same thing now. Everyone tweets to me as a Russian agent, bro. I'm saving the world, man. I thought you mean seriously wonder. Because you remember when free bleeding was a thing on 4chan and they talked some feminists into not wearing tampons and just bleeding their pants as a sign of empowerment?

2:21:23Free bleeding. I wasn't apart of this bleeding. Free bleeding. But it became... People actually did it. Some people actually did it. It was like a troll. It was a troll at first. And I think a lot of these things, whether it's flatter, or whether it's nuclear bombs aren't real, I think it's a lot of crazy people. A lot of people that watch too many YouTube videos, but I also think some of it has to be someone that's like monkeying with people's ideas, like throwing, preposterous ideas that are well articulated out there to get people to believe in nonsense. And then we argue about it. When we did the ticket master stuff and we made it a big deal, my manager said, can't even say, hey man, you gotta be ready for bots and things online.

2:22:06Oh yeah. To manipulate how you're feeling and make you respond in a way where... Well also manipulate the conversation about you. And you get upset. It's not just how you feel. It's manipulate how the people that are re... Maybe someone doesn't know how to feel about what you did. And they're like, I mean, I think he's doing it for us. And then you go and read on Twitter. That guy's a selfish piece of shit. That guy, that guy, that guy. You're reading all these horrible takes that might not even be people. Be people. They might not be people. Or they might be engineered by people through multiple fucking sock puppet accounts.

2:22:37If you go to a famous person's Twitter and things like that, you can look at who's following in them. And I feel like scrolled down. This is psychotic that I know this. I don't do this myself. I just know from talking to people and things. If you scroll down, you can see just fucking... Like a hundred than hundreds of bots and stuff like that. Oh yeah. Who are just tweeting crazy shit, but their accounts aren't really like three people follow them. And they're following like 600 people. And all the 600 like famous people. And they're either saying like nice shit or mean shit. You're like, this is weird.

2:23:08It's weird. What's going on, man? Anytime there's culture war stuff. Like anytime there's stuff about like trans rights or anytime there's stuff about Ukraine war. Like anytime there's an abortion debate, you will read these comments. I will go through the comment. That one's a big one. The Roe v Wade one's a big one. If you go through those comments and you read them, some of the people you look at their page, like I'll read like some preposterous take on things. And then I go and read their page. I'm like, oh, this isn't even a person. Yeah, and it's a lot of times it's in politics and shit like that.

2:23:43When I said that shit about like whatever, Bud Light, because my fucking sister spouse is transgender, I like hired a security guy for a second. I was like, man, this is crazy. We better. Yeah, I'm not being a bitch either. I was like, man, it's kind of scary, bro. I live in a city. I don't know if people would come for me. Because a lot of people were pissed. Is it dumb reason to get mad? I woke up on a Saturday, bro. And I had to do tell me I was like a Nazi and a mutilator on my Twitter and I was like, oh, what the fuck are you talking about? It was psychotic. It was crazy. Well, there's people that feel there are some people that feel like supporting that idea is going to make more people try it.

2:24:19And it's going to make more people regret having gone through transition. And so they really highlight detransitioner. So like people have one side or the other side. They either look at it like it's only a good thing to live your truth and to be trans. Like you should get on hormone blockers as early as you can. And that's what that person, the secretary of the story, who's that person, the secretary of health that used to be a Rachel Levine, right? That's it is. It was saying like, what if you're going through puberty, but it's the wrong puberty. Like what if you're going through puberty and it's pain for you because it's not you.

2:24:53Like, look, you're still a child. Like the idea that for ideology, we're going to abandon this thing that we have always known, which is that children are very impressionable and very malleable. And that they can be manipulated and that also they can change their minds. And there are a ton of stories about girls who were tomboy when they were younger. And that scares me too. And there's also tons of stories about guys who were feminine when they were growing up and they became gay men. And some of my gay friends feel like this idea that like those people should become trans is probably homophobic and that someone encouraging them to become trans, if that's the case, is homophobic.

2:25:33But as a human being, you only have one, sorry. What was I going to say because he was saying that and this is true, that in Iran, I believe, they have like a large amount of transgender women. And the reason being is that homosexuality is illegal, that it's strange. So because it's illegal, the way they get around that is some of these men become trans. Whoa, which is wild. I've seen it in the Middle East. There's a weird, I don't know anything like actually, but in the Middle East, there's a weird feeling around it. Like if you're walking around, because I was in Bahrain and things like that, and you'll go out in town.

2:26:05And there's like a femininity to like a lot of the guys. And you're like, oh, it's kind of, listen, there's a certain percentage of guys, Urge, in all of the world. Yeah, of course. It's just a part of being a person. And that's what, like a lot of this stuff that came out about the whole transgender thing with me, I'm not defending anything either, I don't care. My sister is gay and she married a transgender person and they're both close to my heart. And all I know as a human being and a man is to like love them because they're my family. Of course. And that's it. I have no choice. I don't care what anyone is doing.

2:26:44I don't care if you support the kid thing or not, I just love them. And that's what being a human being is is knowing your own perspective and working from there. And I didn't realize it was going to start such a battle defending someone that I love so much. You know, because they're, they're, they're such a, they're such a funny, amazing person to me that I've spent so much time with and I've utmost trust in and respect for. And that is my picture in my head of a transgender person. So I don't have the perspective. All people should be looked at as individuals and respected. And individuals are what we should concentrate on.

2:27:20Like, but the problem is everything's so tribal today. Oh yeah. That's why this Bud Light thing went so bonkers because they, the people that enjoy Bud Light are completely the opposite tribe for the most part. Well, I think a large number of them. Then the tribe that's into following Dylan Mulvaney. I'd never cared about anything that my entire life. How would you fuck people care so much about it? And I'm like, dude, you guys are, they felt like it was taken over their thing. It's like, it's like if Fox News went all gay. If Fox News just became the gay news. And they're like, no. We get it.

2:27:55And every, every anchor was gay and they talked about everything from a gay perspective. So much so much. So much hate, man. You know, like, let's look at gays in Ukraine. And you know, like no matter what it is, let's look at it from a gay. People would go crazy. Yeah, I can't imagine waking up with that much. So I think that's what people felt like was happening with the Bud Light can. And what bothered me a lot is like, I empathize. Like, I see both sides. And like people think I didn't, I was like, I'm man, I did it, man. I understand. Both of these realms of people, I'm like, the problem is people like take it serious forever.

2:28:26Like they would Bud Light drinkers for fucking 30 years. And they'll die on the hill, man. And all of a sudden, like now, fuck Bud Light forever. Yeah, I don't care, man. And you just see my Dello cans everywhere, bro. You got a show and there's fucking my Dello everywhere. And you know what makes me mad is I've drank Bud Light so long and it's such a great beer. And I can't even drink it. Like people fucking look at you weird and I'm like, bro, I don't... I'm out of all of this. I just want to drink a Budweiser, bro. I always read about this bar owner that stopped selling it because people were beating people up.

2:28:52They were buying it. That's crazy. Crazy. I can't imagine buying a Bud Light when they just get in that kind of phase. For no... It's just a beer. It's just a beer. You fucking leftist. You suck. You die. You're good at everything. It's wrong with this fucking country. I'll just pull you up with my hand. That's how this shit is gonna fucking take over. You gotta punish these people. Look at this American flag, mom. The thing that's going on though is people are getting fired. Like regular folks that work in breweries are getting fired because the demand is down. So the demand is down. The production is down.

2:29:24The production is down. Job is down. And that's an unintended consequence. You were talking about that earlier before we got on here. You were saying they were down like fucking the market cap or whatever. Let's see what the number is. I've been checking the stock every day, but I guess more than 20 billion. They've lost more than 20 billion dollars. You know smoked cigarettes in here? No, yeah, go ahead. Sure. Yeah, we got a fan. Sucks the cigarettes out. We have... We smoked cigars in here and... Don't smoke, man. Don't smoke, man. They lost a ton of money. The point is it's not good. It's real bad.

2:29:57And it's who the fuck saw that coming? Who thought the people were going to be that upset? That's what blows my mind is. What was some of the people... What was my looks? You don't hear a lot of stories where the population can actually control the companies. Right. Share price and thing and do this a part of me, like the humorist part of me? Where I'm like, holy shit. Good job, guys, man. You fucking killed it, but it's so wrong. They definitely can if they have a point. But I sales down by 27 .1%. I don't even know what started it is what's funny. Dude, I got on Twitter one day just like everyone else in out of context responded to somebody.

2:30:35And everyone hated me all of a sudden. I was like, holy shit. I think what they're saying was the mark... Just find out what the market cap loss was because that was the big... Just Google, Anheuser, Bush, market cap, loss, 21 billion. Google that. That's heinous. Yeah. That is crazy. What was I saying here? But there's no way, though. 27 billion. Bud Lightmaker and Heiser Bush in Bev has lost a whopping 27 billion in market value in the wake of his star cross partnership with Dylan Mulvaney. Most recently slammed by a 4 % stock drop this week. That's June 2nd. So that's more than a month ago.

2:31:16This is July 4th. It says it's six billion. Hmm. It's different. What is that? Is that 60 billion or six? How do you hate something that much, man? Six billion. Oh, I was looking at all the zeros with no... How do they have all those zeros with no fucking commas? That's rude. I was in like an emotional... Isn't that ridiculous? I was in a pretty weird place when all this stuff happened, too, because there was like a shooting in Colorado or something. Some dude, some guy, he ran into a transgender bar or something, a gay bar or something and just killed a few people. And it was crazy. My sister was really emotional about it because she's gay.

2:31:55And when all this... Wasn't that like a non -binary person, too? That was the... I don't know what that was. That was a crazy one, because that was the son, I think, of a guy who was a former guy. A guy who was an MMA fighter. Wait, which one was also a porn star? The bar? Yeah. Isn't that scary? Yeah. Terrifying. My sister was really, really up in arms, but she was really emotional about it. And I'm in my best friend in the world. I would do anything. Just like you would probably for... Do you have any siblings? Yeah, a sister. And she's my best friend, no matter what. That's awesome. That's thick and thin, but that's why I definitely...

2:32:32I love my sister, too, she's awesome. Exactly. And you defended to the bits that are in there. So this is like some just really ill person who went into a bar and started shooting people. But I don't know what the motivation was. I don't know either. My sister was saying that... She was under attack and things, and I'm like, I don't... I just didn't... Like as a young guy, I just... Both ends. Because she felt like it was an attack on gay people. Exactly. And I talked with her about it, like as just a normal person. I'm like, is it an attack on your people? Or is it an individualized event that's terrible and heartbreaking and things like that?

2:33:11And I think it was that. Because I think that person... Like I said, I think that person was a member of the LBGT. I'm pretty sure. People are just... It's scary, man. That's so shitty. Or something along those lines. But either way, it's a human being doing something evil to a bunch of other human beings. And it's crazy. Time's now. That's crazy, man. That's why. Do you think it was like this when you were younger, were things as polarizing? No. No. What do you think changed things? Well, for one, the communication. For one, social media is exacerbated the gap. It has made us more divided, I think than ever before.

2:33:54But people huddled up in these like echo chambers. You think it made things better at all? It made access to information better. It made people more informed. But it's difficult to navigate those waters and not everybody's going to do it. Some people are going to crash on the rocks. You know, and I think that it's a new thing that people are trying to navigate. I think there's a lot of people that are horribly addicted to it. And they're just constantly involved in these interactions with other people. And most of them are feuds and disagreements. And they're trying to one up each other and trying to like post facts and dunk on people.

2:34:30It's always question validity of like, I was question validity of artists and things now. Like, do you think people are better for it or worse for it when it comes to talent? Like, does the cream rise to the top faster now? Or does it just make everyone great? I don't know how to word this. Make everyone great, how? Myself. Like, when I started putting videos on Twitter and things like that, I wouldn't have been discovered in the 70s because I would have just been playing guitar on a fire. Do you think, and there's, I don't mean this from my own ego. I'm just saying in general, do you think people are more talented for it?

2:35:07Because they have to compete with millions and millions of people now? Or do you think people are less talented for it? Because millions and millions of people are getting famous. I think in general, the talented people of today, like every other generation with every other kind of art form and even most sports, the generations as they progress, they have the benefit of learning from the previous generation. So we all imitate each other. Whether it's like Mike Tyson imitating Jack Dempsey style or Steve Irvon imitating Jimi Hendrick style, we all learn from our predecessors. And when you have access to all of the predecessors, which is what you have today, you're going to get an insane amount of talented people.

2:35:49There's always going to be certain, like the idea that everyone's going to be soft and society soft and no one today can do that. They're going to rise. They're always going to be here. There's always going to be exceptional human beings. There's people that are driven to do things. Just like that guy was driven to climb fucking mountains. Some people are driven to make great music. They're driven to write good books or great books. They're driven to make great films. The people are always going to be driven. And they have the benefit of having seen, you know, apocalypse now and having listened to the White Album.

2:36:22And there's so much that people can absorb. So much greatness and so much. If you were an artist in the 1800s, like how much impact did you get from other artists? Because you wouldn't know that much, right? Do you ever hear Caribbean music? There was no hip hop. So you're going to be able to inspire other people. A hundred percent. And now we're all just inspired by each other. So we're making better things. If you use your brain wisely, that's the key. If you use your brain wisely, you can be constantly inspired. And enjoy all these people. Or if you use your brain like a fool, you'll be embroiled in conflict constantly all the time.

2:37:03And always fucking arguing. Yeah. It's not good. Waking up angry. And having the least charitable view of every person you talk about. It's got to be the worst life, man. It's not a good life. It's not good for you. It's just not. And people don't realize it because they, you know, they feel that they're just ignored. Or this is the way they get attention. Or whatever it is, it's just a super unhealthy way to interact. And I see people doing it on Twitter that are my friends. And I'm like, bro, you're killing yourself. Like you're giving yourself stress levels from being in these constant Twitter battles.

2:37:36You're distracting yourself too. I think vision and navy and things like that had always scared me because we used to have chiefs and things talk about like the Chinese and the Russians and like everyone going to war and things like that. And I always would look at like the younger sailors and I'm like, oh man. Sorry. Or we're going to be okay if anything terrible happens because these guys aren't pretty. Distracted. They're not, they're not like, um, yeah. And I'm not saying that I'm tougher than anyone ever. I never will. I'm just saying when I joined the navy since I had so like you were saying about artists, you're, you're inspired by the people around you.

2:38:10So my dad and my fucking mom and my grandpa, they were on the navy and I was inspired to be in the navy and like fucking fight for my country and shit like that. And I wonder now if people are like for God and country, ask like that kind of shit like what the movies are about. Like that like the wartime movies and things like that. There's no great war like fight club said, you know. Yeah. Like I fear that if things were to happen with people have that American spirit like that Empire State Building spirit that made things like so fucking legend. Legendary and like the pictures that you see of those guys climbing on the buildings.

2:38:43Well, that's what the propaganda that we always get that says this South China thinks about us and this is how Russia thinks about us. This is, you know, like you always get that from a lot of like the hardcore right wingers. That's what their perspective is. That China and Russia are making fun of us while we are arguing about gender wars and whether or not, you know, a trans woman can use the woman's bathroom and you know, and we're concentrating on these silly things about what what what is your pronoun. And meanwhile they're trying to make people as manly as possible and they're trying to figure out a way to continue to feminize America.

2:39:24That's like the grand. That's insane. Conspiracy. But you see, dude, you see it as like Chinese marching videos and things like that. And I say that with respect, but like, you see all these like, yeah, it's crazy. They're all like, like they're all in sync and things like that. With some severe discipline. And there's also like there's there's a rejection of feminization there. They did something recently where they like outlawed boy bands. What did they do? Like B .T. No, no. Yeah, that kind of stuff like K -pop bands. I was reading this. I'm such I'm the worst at this where I'll like read a headline.

2:39:57I got enough information. I know now, man. I know it all now. I read one paragraph in and then I got distracted by a phone call. But a lot of like the. A lot of them find that. They China band. I found an article. Boy bands. No, it was a real reason. I know, but this is the same thing. Okay, China to band Sissy Boy bands. I wonder who quoted that. Yeah, I already said how. Sissy band. Oh, right. Is that a Chinese interpretation of a word? There's not a guy on TV saying we got a band Sissy band. The state regulator is calling for a boycott of pop acts that don't conform to macho standards, as well as overly entertaining and vulgar internet celebrities and influencers.

2:40:38That's crazy. Get out now. But do you think that's but do you think that's a. But do you think that's propaganda? It's hard to say. I mean, we're not we don't really know. Like we're just guessing like just like they're guessing unless you can read Mandarin unless you have boots on the ground over there. So you really know what's going on unless you know like exactly what's going on in terms of like how much censorship how much censorship are they involved in really what how about the face ID system? How often are they using is that everywhere? The social credit score system is that all real like the central bank digital currency.

2:41:10Is that all real? Where it's tied to the credit? What is is this ubiquitous is through the entire country is it? You know what is this like what are we looking at and it's hard to say because I'm sure there's propaganda that comes from both sides. Sure there's propaganda from them. There's propaganda from us. It's hard to say today like what exactly is going on but it seems like they are doing things at least in some videos that I've watched where they're that that sort of technology where they were talking about with the ears in that cartoon. They're doing something similar at least a test version of with children in classes where they have this head gear on and the head gear is monitoring whether or not the kids are paying attention.

2:41:54I was thinking I'm going to college right now and I was taking a proctor exam the other day and I was talking with my buddy about it and he was saying that we might sound like idiots at this that it exists but they were saying that like in the classrooms and like China and things like that or whatever country they have like video cameras that monitor where eyes are going. That's what they were talking about in this thing. That's so that these kids had these headsets on and they were monitoring their faces to make sure that they were looking at their phones and they weren't looking somewhere else and then this head gear they had on it was indicating whether or not they're paying attention.

2:42:30That's crazy. Yeah. So I guess there's like a different frequency. But doesn't that make you a different person like when you're cheating classes like fourth grader then that make you resourceful? It does a little. That's why I believe in like the American like I'm conflicted in my own head because like all these this has nothing to do what we're talking about. But like a lot of right wingers and left wingers I feel like they have like the wrong idea of what the American spirit is but also on this hand I'm like America is the best country in the world. We got to figure it out where the we're like the American spirit is alive and well and I think we'd be fine if it come if it came down to it.

2:43:04If we fall apart to totalitarianism it's a giant blow to humanity. Because if totalitarianism reaches a place that has the most freedom and the problem with freedom is people are willing to give it up if it suits their side and you're hearing this from people all the time. You used to hear it from people on the right but now you're hearing it from people on the left where they're willing to silence people's free speech if they think to what they're saying is dangerous and you can't do that because no one gets to decide what's dangerous and what's not dangerous because if you allow people to they keep moving that fucking goal post and then they'll silence you and then if you're a liberal and you vote for this you want this to happen and then it gets in place and then a Republican wins and they use that same thing to stifle liberalism.

2:43:47It's all competition. This is the kids with the things in their head and that green light is apparently or one of the different color lights white means you're offline. It looks so happy. It's not paying attention. This is a black mirror episode. Yeah. This is wild. And so they use facial recognition to make sure the kids are paying attention. Who owns the Wall Street Journal? Look at this facial recognition. I do not know. Look at their facial recognition. How wild is that? That's what I was talking about with the proctor exam I was taken. Yeah. Imagine. But dude, there's such a fine line between like safety and cheating and like is it good or bad?

2:44:26Well it's not cheating but it definitely is enforcing concentration. So if the results are better, right? If they get better grades. Is that worth it? To like completely give up freedom like that and to have a fucking headband. And then people don't rise to the top either. If they're great. They probably still will. Because like even if you're paying attention you might be just a dumb ass. You know whereas some people are paying attention and they have brilliant ideas. Like you're always I think there's always going to be competition. Whether you're focusing or there's going to be more competition probably because more people will be forced to be disciplined.

2:45:02You know forced to be forced to do the work as opposed to like fucking off and you know procrastinating which is what people do. Yeah but those people do amazing shit too. Like the shitty guys man in class. I was shitty. Yeah. Man I never had good. I was always shitty like teachers hated me. And if you want good songs. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like what I could do it and also I don't have kids yet. But if your kid came home and was like I had this headband on today that was making try to look to the paper next to me. How would you feel about it? Not good. I would not be into that. I would not allow that.

2:45:39Exactly. I would find another school. I just think you have to have a certain amount of freedom especially coming from a person like me who's a creative person. Like I do what I do doesn't it didn't exist when I was a kid. It's a new thing like to be able to podcast or stand up always existed but that's also like it's a very creative thing. It's got to be able to free them. Podcasting is fairly new right? It's like 20 years old. But stand up is you know 100 years old or whatever it is. But like the most recent versions of it you can't have that unless you have freedom of expression. You can't have it.

2:46:16It won't exist. And you have to be able to. And you have to be able to. And you have to be able to. And you have to be able to. And you have to be able to. That's good. That's good. Well that's good. There's public outcry. It was four years ago that's horrible got posted. Interesting. That's weird that this video has been going around even recently. Yeah. Interesting. So the people reciprocating information. Yeah. Well the outcry probably just keeps continuing because people are terrified of that being the this topy in future that we're all monitored constantly by big brother. And that we give into it because we want a little bit of comfort which is what's fucking scary.

2:46:48That's what's scary. That people taking advantage of bad situations. And you know if there's something breaks out in this country some kind of a war or something really scary you have to be very careful of anybody whose solution is to take away your rights to protect you. You got to be very careful of that because that's what tyrants do and they've always done things like that. Always. And they have all the information. Yeah. Well that's the other thing that's crazy. They have all your data. They have everything. From the geo tracking location they know where you are. From the time you were a kid for me at least for me at least.

2:47:22That thing on your fucking iPhone can track you and you can decide to let your friends track you. Other people can track you too. That's scary man. That's freaky bro. That's fucking freaky. I can't do it. I can't do it. And every the internet's weird. It's all weird but so is this artificial intelligence thing that we're talking about and then this UFO thing. Why is that like in the mainstream discussion so frequently today? You think it's a distraction from someone? I don't know man. Dude aliens are real right? That was decided? I will listen. I don't know. But I think it's very unlikely that we are the only consciousness in the universe, the only intelligent conscious communicating being other than like whales and orcas.

2:48:08So if that's the case. So if there are things out there. It's very likely there's going to be many more than we can even imagine and it's very likely they're going to be older than us. So they're probably a figure things out. And if they evolved in a stable atmosphere in a place that doesn't have meteor shower slam it into every few thousand years like Earth does. Maybe they got way further ahead of us very quickly. Maybe they didn't have to go through all the brutality. Maybe they never had dinosaurs. Maybe they didn't have to have an asteroid hit them to kill off the dinosaurs. Maybe they're like small lizard intelligence that evolved in their way more advanced.

2:48:45And they're way more advanced like a million years. But did you see the court? Do you saw the court case, right? The guy being very closely watching. The guy being like, yeah man we got aliens in the back. He definitely didn't say it like that. But he said that there are reports that indicate that there are biological entities that they have stored in freezers that are of alien, some, whether it's interdimensional or from another planet, something very different. And they have crashed vehicles, not just one, but many. As many as 12 crashed vehicles. And then there is a UFO crash retrieval program.

2:49:22And they believe that this program was probably what they used when they went to Brazil. And was it 96, the Vagina case? That long ago. There's a case in 1996 that James Fox did a great movie on called The Moment of Contact. The Moment of Contact is all about this one town in Brazil where everyone was there when this UFO was over there sitting. Like everyone has a... Was there evidence with the videos and things like that? Well, there's a guy who died who carried the body to a car. He carried the body to a car and they brought it to a hospital and the hospital's like, get that fucking thing out of here and they brought it to another hospital.

2:49:57And they're like, that's fucking... This happened? Yes. So that's all documented. And then the guy who is a soldier who carried this alien being, that guy died of a horrible bacterial infection that they couldn't cure. They didn't know what the fuck it was. He died really quickly within two weeks. He was dead. No, man. And it was a young fit guy. No way. Yeah, so this... I'm scared. They have a fucking giant like UFO monument in the middle of the city. Like when you enter into the city in Vagina, there's a huge UFO there. And James Fox is like, he's filming all this and talking to these people.

2:50:29His guy who was the police... He was a police officer that investigated the crash. When they brought him to the scene, they brought him to the woods to the scene of where this thing supposedly crashed, the guy breaks down so it's crying. I mean, he's fucking weeping. Weeping. So either he's the greatest actor in the world. Well, I was he weeping because he was there. Because he remembered that thing. He remembered seeing that crashed UFO. You remember seeing this alien body? And these girls, they talked to these two girls that ran into one of the things that was still alive. And they described it.

2:51:01There's an actual statue of it that we have in the studio or in the comedy club. And that's them today. That's them when they were little girls and that's them today. The whole town saw it, man. The whole town. He kept interviewing people after people that talked about it. That were there. It's cool. What's he been saying this? Stick for one of what that's about? I think he's probably describing the impact. Other things slammed into the ground. There was a crazy lightning storm, apparently. And this thing fell in the crazy lightning storm. It got hit and disabled and crashed into the earth. And apparently, the Air Force sent something to retrieve it.

2:51:41So the Air Force flew into Virginia, Brazil. And that's all been documented by James Fox, too. They did send a plane there to go retrieve this thing. And now that this guy has come forward and then the government is allowing him to say it. I was about to ask. Yeah. So the government is allowing this guy to say they have a retrieval project. And this is all like they're allowing him to say these things. I wonder why? Well, he only has to, he only can stay within the lines. Like and you saw that during the testimony. There was multiple questions. How do you care if I was about it? There was multiple questions they had where he said I can't answer that.

2:52:12I can answer it. What is it called in a skiff? Is that how they say it? So a skiff is like the way I've been is explained to me, make sure this is right. It's like a completely soundproof room that has no electronics. Okay, here it is. A sensitive compartmentalized information facility. It's an ultra secure room where officials and government contractors take extraordinary precautions to review highly classified information. So they go into this like very, very protected room. And then they'll break out these laptops and they'll break out these these photographs and videos and they'll show them like what these things are.

2:52:48They'll show the biological entities. They'll show them the crashed UFOs. They'll show them the high resolution videos of these things hovering over military bases. They'll show them all the reports of them shutting down all the nuclear systems. It's wild shit if it's true, but it doesn't feel true. Why would it not feel true? I don't know. Because maybe if aliens are real. Maybe if this disclose you're so real, maybe it's so mind blowing that it just feels like nonsense to me. But something about it just feels a little fake. You said that you said the UFO thing happened in 96. I think the Vardinia Brazil one was 1996.

2:53:30It's been around for that long. Why is it just now? Well, there's Roswell, New Mexico was 1947. The Roswell, New Mexico crashed. It was in the front cover of the Roswell daily record. I have it framed. It's the front cover of the Roswell daily record. They talk about a flying saucer that crashed in a ranch. And so these people or these military people who were there reported initially, who is the guy? Pull up the Roswell story. This is a crazy story. So that was on the front page of the Roswell daily record. RAAF captures flying saucer on ranch in Roswell region. No details of flying disc are revealed.

2:54:14And then they talk about the people who are really difficult to read the print in this image of it. Yeah, but someone has to approve of this getting printed and things like that. So I feel like if this is for the next day, then the next day they said, oh, it was just a weather balloon. Sorry. It made a mistake. And so they had this press conference where they posed with these pieces of aluminum foil and like very clear weather balloon. The problem is all the eyewitnesses have a very different account. They talk about this kind of metal that you could crumple up in your hand. It was light as a paper.

2:54:46And then it would open it would go right back to its original form. They talk about these pieces of metal that were impossibly strong but impossibly light. And they had some kind of writing on them that looked like Egyptian hieroglyphs or some kind of ancient write, some kind of symbols on it that they didn't know what the fuck they were. They looked very alien. And they talk about biological entities that were in the crash that they transported to this funeral home. And there's this documentation of them making these small coffins. And there's a lot of weird shit where people that were there talked about seeing the bodies.

2:55:21There's multiple versions of the same story. Now it could be just nonsense. It could be like a folklore thing that people just started talking about and everybody ran with it and then it becomes like a tourist trap. People go to Roswell to fucking... That'd be crazy. They do. Economic booster. It isn't economic booster. You want a few freaks go to Roswell, New Mexico every year. Do you ever think you're going to be that old person in those old videos that you think like when you used to watch about aliens, they'd be like, man, I saw all the saucer in my backyard. You know what I mean? I hope so.

2:55:52Like in the future, you're just the guy on the video, not you either. I'm just saying... Imagine if that is you. Imagine if you're on tour and you guys are out in the middle of nowhere and you're out of fucking truck stop and pull over to take a leak and you step outside and there's a fucking UFO. I've seen it. You have? Taking shrooms, yeah. Yeah, I've walked outside. I saw you. I saw you. Probably really. You probably can't see him. Exactly. You know. The shrooms reveal them. No, it may be. Well, it might be... It's getting more and more real now. It's freaking me the first time. It might be more complicated than we're thinking.

2:56:30Interstellar stuff. Not just interstellar, but interdimensional. What does that really mean? What does that mean? And maybe there's certain times where we have access. We don't know how to do it. Like we can't just go there, but maybe there's an opening. And maybe they have access to us. Maybe they can create these openings and just appear. Maybe they're from something that is so different than what we're experiencing here on Earth that we can't even understand what the fuck they're talking. There might be a million years more advanced than us in a completely different dimension and they figure out a way to visit.

2:57:07And they can figure out a way to just show up and hover and move around things. Look, if we can send a probe to Mars in Elon can shoot a Tesla into space. Oh, yeah. Who the fuck knows what some insanely advanced civilization that has no like war, like primate behavior like we do. Like maybe they've completely evolved past that. Maybe they have no jealousy and rage and envy. No way. Maybe they've engineered negative emotions out and maybe they read minds. And maybe these things are just insanely advanced. And it's their job to help usher in other civilizations into the next stage of existence, which would be an existence without war and violence and existence where human beings sort of achieve almost a hive mind.

2:57:59That makes the whole God conversation crazy. Well, God might be the universe. Instead of thinking that the universe created God, the universe might be God. It might be conscious. The whole thing might be conscious. Why not? When I look around though, here's my thing. Sometimes when I'm like running or like hiking or I'm on the lake or I'm playing a show and everyone's seeing back to me or I feel a certain way towards someone or whatever, those moments are like two grand and like beautiful to like not believe in God for me. You know what I mean? You ever feel like that? You ever been on a mountain top and you're like, oh, man, this is crazy.

2:58:39I believe in something. I think the problem that people have is the word. And when you say God, people automatically think of this very rigid, organized religion perspective that's based on ancient scripture. Yeah, it's rooted for a lot of people. Yeah, whether it's the God of, you know, whatever religion you choose to believe in God, there's a bunch of different religions, a lot of them believe in God, right? But what if you don't want to think that there's something going on, something like insanely complex that's constantly moving, at least in our lives and our existence, constantly moving in this ever evolving direction.

2:59:26Why? Is it possible that this is how the universe creates more universes and the universe creates new things and these things become more and more advanced and everything continues to always advance? Just like we were talking about it doing with music and movies, maybe it's how it does it with planets, maybe it's how it does it with everything. Like things constantly get better and the beings get better at manipulating reality. They get better at creating black holes and being able to pass through wormholes and being able to manipulate space time. How did you get to that perspective if you're from like boss sending things like that?

3:00:09Like did you go up in the Catholic church? Oh, well, I was Catholic church when I was a kid, did Catholic school for first grade, but then, you know, we got out of it. I was a horrible experience, not good. And then I kind of fell out of religion as a young kid because my Catholic school experience was so bad. It's like a really mean none who taught first grade. But it was also a good lesson that like there's people like that in the world because I never met anybody like that before. Religiously mean like about God and things like that. I was sick. Everybody in my life was nice to me. I was a little kid.

3:00:40Yeah. So everybody's nice to me. My grandparents are nice, my uncles are nice, everyone's nice. And then all of a sudden you're in the school where this none is a cunt. And I was like, oh, shut up. And no, there's people like this out there. Like this is crazy. I didn't know there's going to be people that just mean to you for no reason. Not if not yelling if you did something wrong. I experienced that every kid does. But mean to you like like corporal punishment. Like hearing you telling you're going to oh yeah, she hit people. Rotten hell. Or they go with rulers. But Tally, you're going to make I'm going to make you sit on a nail in the closet.

3:01:10You're not going to be able to go home. You're never going to see your parents again. Like crazy. See growing up I had to like religion and things was was so nice to me because I grew up like in a Baptist church. Everyone was like loving and shit. Yeah, there's something about that Catholic guilt. You know, there's he it's you. It's weird. I've been around and I'm not saying Calcism is weird. It is a weird. There's a strictness to it that makes you feel unwalcomed. And there's a lot of these priests they like to drink. Which is insane. They like to get fucked up. This this priest gave gave my grandmother her you know her last rights.

3:01:46And I kept saying her name wrong. And we people had a correct them. Like her name was Josephine. He was saying Geraldine left behind a great family. He's like just Josephine. Her name is Josephine. He was just going through the motions. And I remember seeing him before they started the thing and looking in his face and thinking like that's guys drunk a lot. Like he had that those gin blossoms all over his nose and his face. Like both like when he was just out talking to people and everything. But he was getting ready and setting up. I was looking at his face like wow it's got like super unhealthy.

3:02:18Communion wine baby. Yeah, well not just communion wine. I'm sure they're getting drunk. That's for a man. It's not allowed right. I don't know is it allowed but imagine your occupation does not ever allow you to be in love. It makes me. Did you see that Mark Wahlberg movie? Which one? Where he like um he gets paralyzed. He gets paralyzed and he just wants to be a priest. No I didn't see that one. Oh my goodness you got to watch it. I forgot it's. Father's too. Father's too you have to watch it. It's so good. All he wants to do is be a priest and he there's like a there's a girl in it. And this is some big actress actresses and actors in it and he like falls in love with it.

3:02:55I don't even remember what happens but he gets paralyzed and thinks and I'm not going to ruin that movie either. But it's crazy. Is that a new movie? I think it's on. Give me a listen last year I think. There's so many movies out. It's impossible to keep up. I got this crazy story. I was in Chicago. It involves like the church that I grew up in and things like that. When I was a kid like 13 and 14 years old we used to go on all these mission trips like as a church. And we used to go to Chicago to this place called Maywood and we would help all these kids out and like run a VBS. There was not the pretentious or weird about it.

3:03:24We would just go and like play kickball with kids and like talk about God and Jesus and things. And it was this park in Chicago that we would always go to like Maywood Park. And it's kind of the rougher side of Chicago but like being a kid I was naive to that so I didn't know. So it's beautiful to think about that. I had no idea that it was like the rougher part of town. It was just fun for us. And we went back to Chicago two weeks ago to play the windy city smoke out and I was there and I was there for three days so I didn't really have anything to do. And one of the days I was off I wanted to go to that park that I went to when I was 13.

3:03:56So it's been like 17 years or 15 years since I'd been there. And I haven't talked to the pastors and things that I had. Like we had pastors growing up. I don't know about Catholicism but they're just called pastors like the guys who are over you. And on the way there I had no idea where I was going. I didn't even remember where this park was in Maywood Chicago. I didn't know where Maywood was. So I just typed in Maywood into the Uber app. And my it was so beautiful man like the Uber started driving me out there and I was riding out there and I was like where is this park? I have no idea. And there was this the the stories all over the place.

3:04:32Sorry but when we used to go on that mission trip Chicago had been flooded really terribly and there was this lady named Miss Barnes who I had like helped clean out her house when I did flooded really bad. And she had written me letters while I was in the Navy. Like letters throughout the years and I would write her back and things like that and I would send them back and forth. One day I sent her a letter and it was sent back to the sender because she had passed away. And I had known when I saw the the damn like back to send her a thing. So I'm on my way to this old church that we used to do these missions out of and I'm calling my old youth pastors and I'm like hey where's this where's this park at?

3:05:07Where's this church at? And finally I get in touch with this guy named John who lives in Maywood and he sent me about all the addresses to like the park and the house and everything. And I go out there and it's been 15 years and I'm sitting in this park and it's a Friday at like 6 p .m. And when we used to go out there these to be just be all these kids and things like that playing kickball and like in the basketball in the basketball courts and at the park and like there was an American flag hanging up and stuff and I went out there and there was nobody and it was completely desolate. It was 5 p .m.

3:05:37on a Friday in the summertime and I was just sitting on the I was sitting on the bleachers and I was looking around I was like man this has got to mean something. It's got to mean something terrible or crazy. Like are people just inside? No. Do people just hang out inside and then I went to the house that she had lived in Miss Barnes the one that I cleaned out from the flood and no one was there. And this John guy who I'd gotten in contact with had bought her house had purchased her house like the mission guy and that's like those are the reasons why I believe in God because that was crazy like I was driving out there and I had no idea where I was going what I was doing and it turns out the guy I talked to was the guy who had purchased Miss Barnes's house why who I'd written letters to all those years and I'd been to that park and everything meant you ever like go back to somewhere you like you spent time as a kid oh yeah weird is not freaking it freaked me out a lot I was listening to music and I was walking around and I'd remembered like stepping in the same places was weird is for me when I was so ran out and just wanted me to go to church and things like not at all when I was a kid and I went back to my town where I grew up was weird it was like I had these memories that were just basically like placeholder memories they were like like framework where I knew the specifics of stuff but I didn't really have a memory of it until I went there and then also like everything filled in like so it freaked me out I was at the house and things like that and I was walking around I was like oh my god I remember lifting this here and like kicking this ball here yeah you it fills in that's like the nostalgia of all that shit is nuts man I'm not even that I'm not even that old you know what I mean I'm not like I have things from your childhood like that's a long -ass time ago when you know you think of how much different you are from when you were a kid though that dimensionally freaks me out yeah it should I was talking about it last night man I was in this I mean I was in this fucking kitty pool in this yard and I was like talking to someone about it I was like the reality of then is the same as the reality and now but it's also different and weird that's got to be a some weird dimensional thing man where it's like that existed too like each day is the same yeah and you think about it is your nostalgia like a fucking what are your memories man like what is this like how does how does that mean less than the present well they're definitely shaky you know we all know our memories are shaky unless we're like even of things like your songs like stuff you wrote like you have to concentrate on them right you you wrote them and sometimes you can forget the words yeah of course like memories weird and memory of like specific things from the past is always slippery until you're there again you're like oh it really freaked me out it really freaked me out to be sitting there so I remember like my dad with hair and shit you know what I'm saying and it was like yeah I called my dad when I was there and I was like man this is nuts like do you remember your friends when they were in high school and I see them now and they're all grown up and you're like what the fuck and they're all like engaged and have a kids and shit you're like wait this came out of you what's going on I remember you throwing it to Keelah bottle it coach Craig so you know I'm saying like now suddenly have kids of their own you're like whoa this is wild in some of them you're like oh yeah this is wild this is wild and um damn it's fascinating it's becoming in a adult human being is fascinating and then as you're becoming an adult human being more and more other people are becoming adult human beings they have a different way of living their life than you do and that's why like every generation looks the new generation oh these fucking kids today but everyone says it and I've been feeling it so vividly what scares me the most about growing up is having songs it's got to freak you out too about having podcasts do you ever feel like you're gonna look like having all these songs from the time I was 22 to now sometimes I'm like I've made peace with it it's just what I do I have conversations to people like my kids are gonna hear one day yeah my kids listen to my podcast before specific ones but especially people that they like on it artists that they like they'll listen to this one I'm like you're your most vulnerable moments you know your kids are yeah that's that's beautiful that man's cool it's you know we're fucking talking about aliens man it's crazy well sorry your kids that's a fascinating thing to talk about yeah kids talk about it too it is everybody does it's one of those things where it's like if it's true it's real the whole map that we have of reality is very different now these things really are visiting and they really are these super sophisticated creatures that have been here from the beginning they have been around as long as the earth's been around they've been visiting and checking in on us it'll change it'll change the trajectory of the entire universe like it'll it'll like that's why I brought God up earlier and why I went in that fucking Chicago story but like it'll change how people've lived their lives for the last yeah 600 years which is scary man that's gonna do something terrible is it though is it scary or is it good ever is it just just is it just is just is life this is life this is what it is like you can just decide you wish we're living in 1967 when you had a fucking call on a phone that was never meditated sure really yeah all the time is it is it out of just like purely I do it when I want to clear my thoughts I do it in the sauna because it's a good way to concentrate why I'm cooking myself yeah I've tried to before sorry the way you said that the like everything just is yeah and that the thing isn't that what meditating is it's like everything is coming and going for some people for some people is just a chance at stillness or attempt at stillness you know but it is it is if the aliens are real we're not gonna be able to change it because we don't like it yeah true this have to deal with it like just have to deal with it let's look all the war stuff we live in fascinating times I wonder if isn't that like a curse may you live in fascinating times who said that isn't that I think that was like an ancient curse people have had to have talked about this forever though oh yeah forever you know like that's why I get freaked out by conversations like this I'm like man are we just no because this is a different time I mean this is a time we're having congressional disclosure yeah this is the time where people who are on the inside are being allowed to talk about these things may you live in interesting times the Chinese curse was say may he live in interesting times that's a Chinese curse interesting I go and we definitely live in interesting times we're just writing songs and I have aliens exist and I'm writing some and just live in life listen man I think we did like three hours and the shit yeah time flew by wow yeah kick me out my friend that's crazy it was awesome wow this is a pleasure and I really appreciate coming in it's been fun hanging out with you I love to show and I'm a fan and appreciate everything you do man thank you for your time thank you let's go all right have you have an inspiring buddy have you eaten