#2199 - Chris Harris

28:00So Tuttle did the GT what that he's just launched that at Pebble Beach Look at that that looks I hate the wheels But again, I've got to get more I work for singer. I love singer. I love singing amazing But that's my friend Richards just done that can you get me a picture of a singer? Why are they also gross? Um, because they're supposed to look like 80s wheels from Le Mans. Yeah, let that go. Yeah, I think you might be right But 100 % right The 911k is it is an amazing thing and maybe If I was Porsche or another carmaker, I'd be starting to cry foul Because what's happened is the resto more thing Is actually a movement that reminds car makers that they're not being given or being offered A fair crack at the whip now because they because uh you can come along you and I could establish The monkey and Joe car company tomorrow, right?

28:53We could find a car. We could say right. We're gonna make An e46m3 we're gonna get we're gonna buy a hundred good e46m3s and we're gonna turn them into The Joe and monkey m3 and we're gonna sell them for 300 ,000 dollars They're gonna have a nice new interior. They're not gonna stray too far from the original philosophy of the car Everyone's gonna love them and we wouldn't have to meet any kind of crash legislation Small could be according to the vehicle age in the in Europe is even less to do is comes under very low volume approval You don't have to do anything. We don't have to meet any emissions regs really in Europe You can do what you want But if you're a car if you're called if you're called BMW you cannot make that car right and I'm not sure that's fair Right like what rough does yeah, so they don't even that's not even really a Porsche Well, it has its own chassis plate.

29:40It's it's a really gray area But I think it's unfair on the car companies in many ways because they can't go out and do that right They can't make a resto mod they can't could Porsche could not make a singer what They could But they could sell it they'd have to establish a new code or They'd have to buy a company, but could Porsche make resto mods of their vehicles? I think they potentially could But they'd be terrified I suspect of the potential litigation right, you know, because if one of them went into a wall, right You know, you're suddenly you get to sue Porsche right also Especially if you're selling something like one of those old widow makers where and people don't understand that if I mean I have a 2007 GT3 RS and It's still like around corners you let off off the gas it'll whip around on you yeah, the new ones don't really do that that much The new ones are much better.

30:39They've got well, they've got this rear steer on them which definitely helps But they'll still rotate yeah, just the engine out the back I've had that to an old like design. It's it's it's less prominent now because tire technology has moved on so much right for the first time I got to drive a lot of these things I didn't quite understand the widow maker Uh, who's scoring big in the NBA this season you are playing daily fantasy at draft kings an official partner of the NBA Playing daily fantasy is easy draft a lineup Stay under the salary cap and watch your team rack up the points for baskets rebounds assists and more Take it to the rack with draft king sportsbook new customers Download the draft king's app and use code rogan for a free shot at a share of millions and prizes with your first $5 deposit that's code rogan only undraft kings the crown is yours Gambling problem called 1 800 gambler in New York called 877 8 hope in y or text hope in y at 467 369 In Connecticut help is available for problem gambling called 888 888 777 777 or visit ccpg .org 18 and over in most eligible states but age varies by jurisdiction eligibility restrictions apply new customers only minimum $5 deposit required One single use $3 ticket rewarded that expires in 14 days and February 28 see terms at draft kings dot com slash promotions This episode is brought to you by robin hood gold with robin hood gold You can now enjoy the VIP treatment receiving 3 % IRA match on retirement contributions The privileges of the very privilege are no longer exclusive with robin hood gold your annual IRA contributions are boosted by 3 % plus you also get 4 % APY on your cash in non -retirement accounts That's over 8x the national savings average the perks of the high net worth are now available for any net worth The new gold standard is here with robin hood gold to receive your 3 % boost on annual IRA contributions Sign up at robin hood dot com slash gold Investing involves risk rate subject to change 3 % match requires robin hood gold at $5 a month for one year from first match Must keep funds in IRA for five years go to robin hood dot com slash boost over 8x the national average saving account interest rate claim is based on data from the FDIC As of November 18th 2024 robin hood financial LLC member sIPC gold membership is offered by robin hood gold LLC Heck Because they had new tires they had these new tires are everything.

33:27Yeah, I'll tell you what a top gear story is fairly interesting My colleague who called party McGinnis who's one of the co -host Who's who's claimed to fame for me in America is he had to be subtitled in America for top gear because his accident is so brought from the North We didn't he had subtitles It's like watching peaky blinders. Yeah, no, it's worse than that anyhow Yeah, he crashed a Lamborghini when we were filming and it went it was all over the press in the UK It helped it was read like proper dog knob red Lamborghini goes off the road Anyhow at the end of it all Um The cars on a low loader and I look at the tires The 20 years old.

34:06Oh god. Yeah, well, it's it had been borrowed for the job You know you say old tire technology matched with age as well. It's terrible That's the story with the guy from fast and furious. What's his name? Paul Walker Paul Walker That's the story with him they had old tires on that car. Well, patty gets so patty gets Eviscerated in the press because you can't drive anything else. I could have been in that car. I'd have crashed it I can drive a bit anyone you you cannot and that's that if you get in these old cars with old tires on them They have nothing. Yeah, absolutely nothing. It's incredible how much the technology has come along in that regard I'd say Michelin at its best is you know, it's some of it's like witchcraft If you go if you get in a new Porsche GT3 RS now The tire they've developed for that probably has four compounds across it You know, so the the high -wire stuff where it needs the grip.

35:02They're so clever They really are the performance they add to the vehicle no one knows how come no one can figure out how to make a tire without air So It's a really really interesting point. They must have done it must for me It comes under the same heading as some of most have made a light bulb that you never need to replace But why would they make it? Well, the tire without air thing for safety purposes There's a lot of reasons why you would want a tire that I mean, I know they did bake them They do have this tire that looks like a looks like a sort of spring You know that adding a shoe that has the sort of lapses.

35:37Yeah, it looks a bit like that. Yeah, I have seen those But I suppose you're still dealing with a at that point it's a sprung mass which would interfere with suspension I don't have an answer. I think that's what it is. It's like it's heavier. I don't know I work because there's no air in it That makes sense because you'd have so much more rubber But I think they tried to mitigate that by having it clear So you see through it. There was some shots of one recently I have to assume the end of your reason you would there's only two reasons you wouldn't make it one It doesn't work too It gets in the way of your ability to make money right normally the latter Yeah, I don't know.

36:15It's probably a performance issue too because by manipulating the tire pressure You can get it just right Whereas you're not going to be able to manipulate anything once the compound is exactly. Yeah. Yeah tires are the more you get into cars tires are a fascinating subject That's that's a good opener when you meet some of the opposite sex But I as never worked for me But but actually they are because they're the only contact you have with with with the ground So it's the answer is no the most important part the performance package F1 commentators and I'm actually probably slightly less so in the US But in Formula One the commentator spent most of the time talking about tires Because it's what it's the main factor But they're not sexy tires are not sexy by definition.

36:59So you know car makers will tell you I've got we've got a new damper system that's got eight settings and we've got this and this and this They can't tell you that they've spent five years developing a tire right that's revolutionary nobody cares No, it looks like a tire. Yeah, it just looks terrible What are you showing me and when they come to replace that tire? They'll just just give me the cheaper I don't I don't want to spend that money on that one right right right So um You're experiencing top gear Yeah, that's interesting. So I've I've never really spoken about it because I'm I keep my mouth shut.

37:33I like to Remain dignified. It's been It's quite a journey. It's come to an end now. I really feel it's a full stop the show has been Put on hold in the UK and definitely is the terminology from the BBC that means it's an end But strangely it exists in other formats around the world so there's there's been an American one There's one in Finland. There's one in Australia. There's one in France So the the the license and the brand exists elsewhere, but not at its home in the UK And it came to an end for me one day in December 2022 In a way that I'd like to say I hadn't expected but but I had and I think that's the bit that I found very difficult to deal with over the last Couple of years fundamentally.

38:21I'm quite happy go lucky person. I'm very privileged with the life I've had And I love the fact that I earn a living doing what I love you must have the same thing to wake up What a joy. I don't push a desk. I get to I get to wreck other people's tires And and also my subject is one that is surrounded by joy no one wants to hear The last person you want to hear from is the miserable car road tester right he can fuck off Yeah, he's you know He can't and I don't want to be that guy. I hate those guys. Yeah, but actually I That is I'll be lying about said. I've you know, I'm feel good today I've had a good few months, but the last 80 months I've been Bad because I just didn't I didn't know what to do Because because I'd like to sit here and say I never saw it coming, but I did so what happened um The the accident that that my friend Andrew had known as Fred I won't go into too much because it's it's sort of out there what happened he rolled a Morgan three wheeler um He wasn't wearing a crush on it and if you do that at even at 25 30 miles an hour the injuries that you should stay in that profound uh I was there on the day.

39:29I was the only presenter with Fred that day. I wasn't actually right by him Um, but I was close by I remember the Radio message that I heard I was just to have a radio in my little room at the test track where I was sitting inside So I could hear what was going on And I heard Someone say this has been a real accident here. It's the cars upside down Um, so I ran to the window looked out. He wasn't moving. So I thought he was I thought he was dead I assumed he was then he moved um I can tell you now that he If it Unless he's a physical specimen Fred. He's a big guy six foot five six foot six strong and any if he wasn't so strong he wouldn't have survived He's a he's a great advert for um Physical strength and conditioning because if you hadn't been that strong you'd have just snucked in that keep you dead So I can't believe he's I couldn't believe he survived and that sort of that um that Moment of realization that he'd survives has Kind of defined my thoughts on the subject since because I believe that anything after that is a bit of a bonus You know he should be dead really Um, and the fact that he survived it is remarkable and it's given him and his family a chance to move on under very difficult circumstances.

40:44So that day Was very difficult um made even more difficult by the fact that the build up to that particular shoot I knew that we were at the last minute. I knew we were using a morgan 3 wheeler. It's a very It's a difficult car. You know, it's by it just the name tells you its physics is complicated It doesn't mean it's inherently dangerous. You just drive it according to what it is have to be aware of its limitations and I think That That really was difficult. There were and you need experience There were two people that had driven a morgan 3 wheeler before present that day me and someone else a pro driver And we were sitting inside at that time knowing it asked us anything about the car.

41:24They just gone on and shot it without us And I think um if I'm looking in the mirror, I find it very difficult Even now that Andrew who I love to be a lovely man He um he was a pro cricket player. He wasn't a automotive guy And he but he was a real enthusiast. He was great much like you. He'd love cars And he he would always come up to me Before a shoot and say Tell me how it is. You know, I've got all the advice give me the last bit of advice and what I should do what I should expect And that was the first because of the cool times that day That was the first time we'd never had the chance to talk about How he might approach a difficult vehicle and that was the one day that it went wrong I find that very difficult to live with and I feel partly responsible because I didn't get the chance to talk to him Um, but but my situation nothing compared to his Anyhow um The bit that I find really difficult is that In the aftermath of that accident the show was put on hold Andrew had to recover from frankly awful injuries And has done so um but uh profound injuries We all kept quiet.

42:36We said nothing and I I said nothing because I wanted to look after him It wasn't my story. Was it? I was I was caught up in the collateral damage I lost my job immediately because um they cancelled the show when my contract was up So suddenly I haven't got a job But again you look in the mirror and I think I'm alive. I've got three beautiful children. I'm not in Fred's position Andrew and Fred are the same person. Sorry, that's his nickname um and I just sort of Got my head down But I had seen this coming there was a big There was a big inquiry a lot of soul searching the BBC's good at that But what was never spoken about was that three months before the accident I'd gone to the BBC and said um Unless you change something someone's gonna die on this show So I went to them.

43:28I went to the BBC and I told them of my concerns from what I'd seen as somewhat as the most experienced driver on the show by a mile I said if we carry on At the very least we're gonna have a serious injury at the very worst we're gonna have fatality Let's explain to people that aren't aware of what top gear is and how top gear works because I know there's a lot of Americans It never watch the show you guys do a lot of really crazy stunts with automobiles not necessarily just cars But big trucks and all kinds of crazy things and some of them are quite ridiculous Yeah, there was a bit of a arms race But between us and maybe the other big car show the grand tour at the time to go have a more stupid And we did some we did do some big stunts and a lot of the time in the grand tour as the original cast top gear Jeremy Coughs and Richard May in their Amazon show.

44:18Yeah, it's had if they just ended his great show um So and also I'm James mayor. Yeah, yeah, I'm I'm not of the health and safety um I'm not risk averse. I love a bit of risk and I also absolutely believe That if you enter into a show like top gear you know what you're taking on you know I believe that you that there is no such thing as great risk -free Television like that. It's good. You just got to you know I just turn up and I assess what I see and I do what I'm comfortable with And and I want to make great television. That's it And if I if sometimes you got a bit sketchy So be it we've all done that, you know, that's that's the way the world lives and I think um What happened with top gear was I saw repeatedly Too many times my two co -hosts who didn't have the experience I had in cars This is the critical thing I'm qualified to make those decisions because I've done it a long time They weren't they're one of them is an actor comedian the other guys of pro cricket player Brilliant entertainers they were great hosts But their roles were to make people laugh and my role was to tell people what cars were like And all too often Towards towards the lot in the last year.

45:26I saw situations where It got too dangerous and it culminated actually enough being in Thailand Myself and Paddy are in Thailand and we went we did a go -cart race down a hill in just compacted mud on wooden go -carts But no engines and I just looked at them and I said this is just this So it's not a question of whether we injured it's how injured we get so just have an ambulance at the bottom Because something's gonna go wrong sure enough I broke something in my hand broke a finger or what have you and I just thought Which sounds ridiculous from your background because you you know you're super tough guys But yeah, I don't want to break my fingers I didn't I also he was a shit piece of television So I always said I don't mind breaking my hand if we get a bath before it But or an award, but this was just the shit skit and I ended up damaged And it went on too much so anyhow I went to the BBC and I said I want to have a meeting with the head of health and safety because this is not good And what what's what's really killed me is that no one's ever really acknowledged the fact that I called it beforehand And I it's very difficult to live with that For initially for me when I knew I thought I'd done the right thing I'm not very good at that.

46:33I normally just go with the flow But I saw this coming I thought I did the right thing. I went to the BBC And I found out really that no one had taken me very seriously Yeah, I did a bit of digging afterwards The conversation I had with those people was sort of at knowledge Then they tried to sort of shut me down a bit And then they didn't look after me at all. They just sort of left me to rot And I Even now I'm totally perplexed by the whole thing It's I to actually say to an organisation This is going to go wrong And then be there the day that it goes wrong Is a position I never expected to be and I never want to be in again It's it's strange and and pretty heartbreaking in many ways I love that show So did the conversation between you and the network completely stop after the accident They just sort of left me to to sweat really I just didn't really I just sat in my by 11 drunk whiskey I didn't have much contact with them at all.

47:32Everything went quiet They had two inquiries Into the accident commissioned Neither of which I had access to I pushed very hard to access to the second one and saw some of it And I had this And this is one of the most bizarre interactions I've had I sat down with Simon from the BBC Who who was going to talk me through bits of the second inquiry into the accident And I'd already been told that I no longer had a job So I'd been told that Top Gear was done And at the beginning of it he said to me I won't name him he said Well, thank you so much for taking part in this Because it's really going to help us as an organisation going forwards So it's really helped me out of lost my job And I'm always reminded of that old adage from a very brilliant BBC comedy show Which was never commissioned inquiry that you don't know the outcome of in the first place So I don't know the whole thing The whole situation was ridiculous And I've never told anyone that You know I think and I want to tell people that I did Because I a bit of me thought as the experienced driver The members of the public think that I didn't do enough to protect Andrew But I and and Paddy as well they both they both experienced other incidents on that show that I think run acceptable And that's coming as somebody loves a bit of risk You know if you and I went outside now and there were two quad bikes I'd happily roll it for a laugh with you on that guy And even me as that guy thought it had gone too far Which I think is important to say Um Well there's the problem with those shows as they always want to keep pushing the limit And it's generally the producers who don't quite understand the limitations of the vehicles And not yes they don't have the experience of Of what it's like to actually be in control of that vehicle or what is possible Right right So also often it's can you just do that Right And then you want to be a crowd pleaser you know you you want to be the guy that can do it We had that on Fear Factor Yeah When I was hosting Fear Factor there was a couple of times Where I was like what the fuck are we doing Especially the second seat like Fear Factor started in 2001 and went to 2007 and then we came back again in 2011 And we only did six episodes and they tried to make it which is really ramped up And when it was cancelled it was actually cancelled because people had a drink donkey sperm Yeah Which was pretty minor And consider me it's disgusting But uh it wasn't anything that was going to risk anyone's lives But I was really feeling like if this keeps going the stunts are so spectacular and so big We're launching cars through moving trains There was a moving train And then the train had all these like cardboard boxes in it We launch a car off a ramp like sideways and it goes through the train You have to time it just right so you don't hit the car Into one of the big metal someone in the car Yeah driving it yeah Oh yeah My experience of that now is that If you establish really big stunts that have big vision and are ambitious They tend to come with them a level of rigor that means they are executed well The difficult area is the kind of just being at a test track with a smaller crew And someone says give that a go that's when it goes wrong Because no one's really thought about it They're saying wow we've done that we've done the risk assessment But just give that a go while you're here I think that goes wrong and also my my experience And this is why I'm like everyone that's shot with me will be Or have been reminded of this now and again Close a play end of the day That's when it goes wrong If you're a test track it's just you know the lights coming down There's 10 minutes to go and the director says just do that I go no Because everyone's tired Someone's going to Ignore the lock down on the circuit There'll be someone coming driving the other way with the coffee cups over Or is the end of the day If it's six o 'clock five thirty I'm gone I'm not because I'm workshop I'll stay around and pick stuff up But don't the end of the day when you start rushing And I think there was an element of That day at Dunn's Fold That was a shoot that was rushed For me that was you know I know That that was a we need to use this day shoot That's another one that's another red flag for me We've got a day at a track we need to fill it Well that's you reverse the engineer that you know Your priorities are already to fill something up And I look back some of the stuff that we did on top of your look back that was dangerous visually dangerous and Definitely was in in practical terms and very proud of because we executed it well Like Andrew Fred Vintoff went off a dam in a in a metro into the car bungee Which is extraordinary Extraordinary piece of footage you can see it's just amazing film But it was rigorous it was done properly there has amazing stunt crew that did it I mean I couldn't have done it it was it was brave and it was a really memorable piece of television that This is it what a legend And he's got me in his ear He sat like that for 45 minutes look how far down that And um I think I'm very proud of what the team did there and Andrew was magnificent To fuck that can you imagine For Because if it goes wrong you're dead yeah, and he's got that chirpy little shit in his ear as well I think and there is there's other stuff that we did that I can't understand what we were doing So we also did and you won't find this I think they've removed it from you shit for this thing Oh my god, how about that That's so insane How about that look at when he goes over itself like that oh my god That is so ridiculous ah And then the yank Oh But that do you know I when I said to you early I I've bit of me regrets doing it I look at that and I think What I what I think to have been part of well it's it's ridiculous Yeah And I'm proud of that stuff one thing we did do Which again on reflection was just madness We There's this there are these guys that go to motorcycle Meets and shows in the UK that have these titanium Skid plates on their boots and they hold onto the back of the bike you might have seen them and they go really fast on the Sparks go out of the back And There would be we decided we'd be going to the if we did this so each of us had a vehicle we were using or you know You were the person that was pushing that vehicle you're an advocate for that car in the film And I think I had the new Land Rover defender you've seen those you had a short -willed most defender And I had to hang off the back of it wearing these we had to wear these shoes The big problem with some of these ones is that Andrew Was so brave he would go first and set such a high benchmark you'd have to go shit I need to really go here So he went out and did like I thought he'd do 40 miles.

54:31No, I think he did 75 miles No hang on the back wearing these titanium shoes Anyhow Paddy gets in and tries to go really fast any falls off And he's okay, but he's you could someone goes paddies over I look left the ambulance driver was having a cigarette Our end of the runway and he was two miles down there and I that was the one of those moments where I thought This has got a bit loose, you know if you're gonna do these things that guy should have been running parallel Because those and I didn't like that Although my minutes of two miles. It's a long time. I know although the end of that was quite I can give you some levity there I did my run.

55:08I got I didn't get quite as close as I think I did nearly 80 miles now or something Well, I and I fell off at the end then it hurt a bit And I got in the back of the crew car, which I think was another land Rover And I was sitting there thinking this smells terrible. Have I done something wrong here? That I really acrid smell Not from the colon, but definitely I thought this is not a good smell Like a chemical smell. Yeah, and I and then I was told to get out what happened was the shoes were red hot And I'd got in the car and they just melted the straight for the man straight through the carpet And it was just smoldering on fire.

55:38I look like a shit marvel superhero Yeah, I think I'm I'm very Happy and proud to have done top gear But I I'm so sad at the way I ended yeah, no one that's the ultimate No one had control of that that day. That's what the insurance industry calls an act of God whether you believe in him or not um But what happened afterwards was really sad because I've arrived here you've got your crew. You know, you got your people They were my people and from that day, I've never respoke into them The producers everyone else no one really it just it just went like that bang done And that was that was very hard because I just couldn't believe it had happened so I was they they just gone and you spend five six years of your life more In daily contact with people and they just stops I was always torn on those type of moments on top gear because I just wanted to watch car reviews I wanted to watch people have fun with cars But then for the casual people you have to do something stupid like bungee jump off with a car off the side of a damn and it's like I don't I'm not interested.

56:52Maybe it's because I hosted fear factor for so long I've seen so many things like that. They're not interesting to me. I want I want to hear Car enthusiast rave about the fun they're having while they're driving an automobile maybe you should Produce a car show. I've got an idea. I'll pitch it to afterwards, but but you're quite right There's plenty of market for that there is and actually this is the country for it Yeah, maybe in Europe it's less But I know that when we did geeky car stuff that was very you know for you and I the numbers did that And the moment you did something hyperbolic and ridiculous the numbers did that But what about online on line?

57:30Totally different. Yes, right? So that's where it belongs Like what where I found about you was online. Yeah, you know And I don't remember what was the first video that I watched of you, but I do remember that green Porsche Yeah, I remember that's a long time. Oh my god Mate and that's where I started out and I suspect I'll return there You know, I've got plans to To relaunch the youtube channel in the next month or two in this and this content coming and I'm YouTube's a very different place to when I left it. Yeah, it's pretty surprising There's so much motoring content out there. It's almost saturated It's very very saturated and there's so many different types of markets now too.

58:04Yeah, I mean algorithm I the idea of being at the behest of an algorithm is terrifying if you if you've just received You know check from a network for six years of your life suddenly going oh, I'll I'll go in with the algorithm That's quite scary It is but all you need is one thing to take off and then all of a sudden you're being Suggested to millions and millions of people which is interesting about the algorithm and if you just look at one type of vehicle Then you're like I really just got interested really recently in the inios grandadier. Yeah, I was like what a fascinating idea Take the I mean what a limited market by the way to actually is a is the only example of a brand new Resto mod, isn't it?

58:46Yes. Yes similar. I mean, it's essentially a new vehicle But if you for the casual it looks like a defender. Yeah, it really does But it kind of better kind of quite a bit better. Yeah, and you know really interesting BMW six -cylinder supercharged engine And so now when I open up YouTube it's like all the grandadiers. It's all inios Constantly all these off -roading Australia dudes and all these different people like sending me these things I I think you're right. It does belong on YouTube. I mean linear tell it. I joined a TV show when Linear television still survived or you know, you know understand destination television sure.

59:25It's gone now It's it's the world's changed completely top gear still has a place in it You know many of my previous colleagues make a lot of online content for top gear. They do a great job There's some really good films But there was a there's something quite romantic for me about the sit down squid onto the sofa with you With your with as a family and watch eight o 'clock Sunday night. It was it was a Quasar religious experience really but it was in a time where people didn't have smartphones You're quite right that that's gone That's that waiting for a very specific time to watch a program.

59:57No one is interested in that anymore. I know It's it's strange isn't it because it's logical that they wouldn't because no one has any patience because of the immediacy of these things Yes, but there's equally something quite lovely about what we used to do right? I can't really reconcile it I I totally acknowledge the excitement of the new But I'm slightly wistful for the past is that I know what you're saying the only thing that still exists that you have to wait for is live sports Yeah, so live sports when you're watching a game the game starts at 8 p .m. You have to be there at 8 p .m It's not gonna wait for you there it is and the podcast is a as a concept is amazing as well I've got a bit cheesy.

1:00:36I have got a podcast which which I didn't when's this gonna go out? It's just going out a day after we record this yeah pretty soon Well the day after that my new podcast launches I didn't realize that so it's a really really interesting name Chris Harris on cars Chris Harrison friends car podcast is what it's called Because I just thought well he's perfect. He's to my to catch up. Yeah, so that and that really is a nerd product So one of the things I did as by way of therapy was I did a car podcast in the immediate aftermath of this accident Because I realized I wanted to have contact with this world I think that the moment your life gets difficult You regress to what is your comfort food?

1:01:11Mm -hmm my comfort food is cars Right and I and I love cars they make me happy well I would much prefer you without producers and network executives and all these different people telling you what to do I like I like What I like about podcasts when I like about YouTube content from people like matt Farah is I know it's one human being This is their perspective. This is what they enjoy they really do love these vehicles And they talk about it without any influence of other human beings. So you're getting this Singular viewpoint which I think is the most attractive thing about it and and the thing you pointed out there this idea of of having to alter things or add sort of Ancillary comedy to them to them make them appeal to the masses.

1:01:56Yeah Is is what I found very difficult on top gear because I came there as the I arrived as the rigorous Car tester you put me with some comedians put me with whoever I don't need to do that They they'll do the heavy lifting they'll make people laugh But if you want to know whether the new m2 is any good or not, please give it to me and I'll tell you right And the m2 is a good example when the first m2 came out I was given it to review for top gear and I just said well I like just a review of the car. I've got a test track I'll slide it around and tell you what it's like Then move on someone else can make them laugh But that wasn't enough and they had they had a section of this where I had to I was given this sort of piece of testing equipment called the pantometer 3000 or something just made up.

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1:03:47So visible well now you know Switch today at visible .com slash rogan terms apply see visible .com for network management details This episode is brought to you by zippercruder the hiring process is stressful There are so many different things to consider and on top of it all you need to get it done quickly It's like when you're trying to find a decent contractor for home renovation project or even a new primary care doctor You don't want just anyone you probably want a person who knows their shit and will take your concerns seriously But also Need to find them like yesterday if you're an employer struggling to find that perfect fit I've got one word for you zippercruder They work fast to find you great talent try it for free at zippercruder .com slash rogan They're so fast four out of five employers who post on zippercruder find a quality candidate within the first day That might be why hiring site employers prefer zippercruder the most based on g2 ratings They get the work done without wasting your time or money So relax and let zippercruder speed up your hiring see for yourself Just go to zippercruder .com slash rogan to try it right now for free That's the same price as a genuine smile from a stranger a picture perfect sunset or a cute dog running up to you and looking your hand Again, that's zippercruder .com slash rogan zippercruder the smartest way to hire For you know whether my Fincter was moving faster in this vehicle.

1:05:23I don't know what it was but I look back And I should have just said fuck off I don't do that. Yeah, it's just an embarrassing moment in my life But that was exactly it was they had to aug they felt the need to augment the test With something stupid to draw in the casual viewer and that's where youtube is brilliant Because youtube doesn't feel the need to that it can just to do that it can just cater for us nerds Yeah, whatever you're into YouTube can can deliver it without Someone from a network messing with it. What's really spectacular about youtube is there's only one youtube You know about how big the internet is there is in china though.

1:06:00Well, that's different I'll tell you one good story about that about I know eight years ago or so. I was at the Geneva Motor Show the biggest car event in in my world And this chinese guy comes up to me and he's like really really grateful So glad to meet you want to say thank you. I went Why don't say thank you? He said because you made such a difference to my life I'm not the second coming. I don't know what I've done to you goes because you know I host all of your videos on a channel in china and it made me like load of money Iceman Sorry, yeah, so I did a bit of research he has he's made lots of you just he just took you just ripped them all off youtube and host them Wow, but there's no regulation wow So he's just telling you he ripped you off but but he had but he thought he had no it wasn't like you had no shame He couldn't even see what he'd done wrong right right thanks well china has apple stores that aren't even apple does it yes China has full apple stores where they're selling counterfeit laptops phones everything none of it is really out Though they do phones anymore, but it was all they had apple stores that apple found out about that weren't even nothing was apple It's it's creating content in the last 10 years has become a really Fascinating situation because I'm sure you felt the same when you started out What if you produce something you own it by definition?

1:07:29Doesn't matter whether you're within a network or have you the international property in your head is that's mine right And content producers over the last five years have had to accept the fact that that is no longer the proposition People can do what they want you cannot you can't hunt them down right and it's shameless And I still get occasionally get engaged I don't look at the Instagram message thing very often, but sometimes I'll just see someone saying I'm just gonna post this do you mind and sometimes I'll go well, yes, I do I I went out there at three in the morning, right? I nearly crashed that car I paid for those rare tires right why should you get the chance to monetize that for your channel exactly what are you offering me right nothing I just find it really odd it's very odd Yeah, and it's also they feel like they can just say a few things You know like hey look at Chris Harris doing this and that's enough I'm also That's enough of an alteration in their professional world Could you imagine if one of them was an accountant and I walked in and said right?

1:08:24I've got my books I'm I can't add up. I'm really disnumerant and I'm an idiot Just do those for free with you because just do them. Yeah, well, no, he'll say I want some money for that No, no, I just just do them just and also shut the fuck up and do them So what that is that no other world works like that No, the the content world is very strange. It's very strange where people can use your stuff and it'll and do entire shows based entirely on your stuff Oh, it's just extraordinary, but the Chinese example was the best for me though. I love that Well, they didn't he had no shame about it, but he but actually he was doing nothing wrong culturally They don't think there's anything wrong with that at all.

1:09:03I mean do you remember I mean you have to take the Chinese car industry seriously now But 15 years ago They used to be a sort of underground recess of the Detroit Motor Show where the Chinese car companies would be And it was a it was a sort of It was a grim catacombe of Of imitation to go underneath and they'd be like their version of a BMW X5 which was literally like someone had gone With the BMW X5 to draw one and done their own version of it They would just shamelessly copy stuff because there was no there were no IP laws over there culturally didn't acknowledge imitation You just do what you want I've I've reacted terribly at the time.

1:09:38I sort of understand now that if you don't get that from the from the age of one You can't learn it afterwards, right, but they were shameless and I can remember being again at the Geneva Motor Show You'd go to the particularly the Japanese cars And he want to sit in the back of a new one you couldn't because they'd be Chinese engineers from car companies measuring them there He'd be like 20 minutes they'd have these laser rules out going just getting all the measurements of the Terriers and of the engines and stuff you can kind of look at that. No, they'd be there for 20 minutes shamelessly Just copying scanning the car wow in broad daylight It's amazing They make incredible electric cars now though.

1:10:19Oh that they've they've stolen a march on everyone China has made they they make some unbelievable cars. I've watched someone reviewed online You can't even get them in America, but I watched someone reviewed online and they're just fucking fantastic That they are they've definitely had an advantage over Europe I can't say for America because you have Tesla, which is you know the only other Global leader in that area, but the European car industry has been caught napping And it's a bit of a worry for someone like me that you know Very fond of a lot of the European brands, but they're struggling they're struggling to respond to this There are boats full of very impressive very good value electric cars that have landed in Europe in the last six months There's also a problem with European cars in that European cars are always known for having a great reseal value like particularly like Lamborghini and Porsche and like Ferrari you can actually make more money off of them in a few years than But not electric ones.

1:11:19No That's the problem like electric tie cans, you know those things are gorgeous That's an incredible vehicle good luck trying to sell that thing No, I saw lucid heirs, which is a fantastic. Have you been in one of those? No, I haven't wow I've heard the hard the sapphire is magnificent. It's extraordinary You can't you you you're gonna get like half the price of that thing. Yeah, in a year. Yeah Fucking nuts. I know the tie can in a mirror an industry in the UK early one 30 ,000 pounds unbelievable someone paid 120 for that three years ago crazy and still really good it is it's a very again For particular people maybe the thing I the point I didn't make earlier I have to excuse myself a bit jet lag for my confused thoughts sometimes is that the electric car has one unspoken fact about it It's for rich people That's what I find quite difficult.

1:12:17There's a meritocracy about the motor car That I find appealing is that you you can have a Bugatti Veyron or Shiran or you could be some guy that lives in India that's got a little thing that costs 100 quid or $100 You're ultimately getting the same thing you have the you have the freedom to travel to choose where you're going and I think In a in a I like you I like to I don't want to be told what to do And I think it's really important that that vehicle can take you where you want to go But the electric vehicle is for rich people. Isn't it you think about it You you show me the the electric vehicle for for normal people What's terrible for people who live in apartment complexes?

1:12:55It doesn't exist unless you have some sort of a charging station Where you park your car and everybody has one so you can leave it charged overnight It's rough but look at the cost of them. Yeah, you know your expensive Terrible resale value. Yeah, I it's it's a very flawed concept at the moment But as you say the performance of them can be your your flat is a great example It's a time machine. Yeah, it's a time machine. It really is it merges in traffic silently like It goes faster than anything. It doesn't seem real It's incredible, but I'm sent the new one that I'm getting. I'm sending to what it's already sent to unplug performance Are you aware of those guys?

1:13:35So they tune them do they yes Because it needs to be faster doesn't it? No, well they they change the suspension It does not any faster. Okay, they use the same powertrain But they change the suspension they widen the front and rear and they just they upgrade the brakes they make it much more Just agile. I think the main thing it needs is some sort of jet washable pressure washable floor because I think passengers will eventually shit kidneys out They're so fast Yeah, well they're they're shocking roadster which is gonna be insane Which is basically vaporware now. Didn't people like pay full price for those things like five years ago He's fascinating.

1:14:15I know he's been on your show. I don't know what to make of him I just love the fact that he's he is the ultimate disruptor. Yes, he's come along. Yeah, he's just he's seen in industry He's gone That's ready for a shake up and he's had a go and I With multiple industries. Yeah, but that's what's crazy, but the one that's pertinent to me I'm the two question marks most are you know, what do you think of the electric car revolution And it's effect on you know the environment, but also what do you think about mr. Musk? I almost don't really have an opinion on him. I just let him do what he does What I do know is I'm always fascinated what he's gonna do next And that's that's all you need to know and the the stuff that he's produced 10 years ago there were not many tezas on the road in the UK now they're everywhere.

1:15:04I don't know any other Vertical that's that's witnessed penetration like that, you know if I walk into a white good store Not seeing fridges made by companies. I didn't even heard of 10 years ago But there's the second most expensive thing you'll ever buy is a civilian and he's managed to have that level of penetration That that will go down in the history books. Yeah, it's undeniable Yeah, it's undeniable and it's also he's doing that with rockets and he's also doing that with the internet So I bought X or Twitter and turned it into X and that's a massive disruptor you do Twitter Do you whatever it's for now?

1:15:36Yeah, yeah, I left it because I got so much abuse Initially when I did top gear. That's when I got you know you can't read comments No, you can't but then you then you'd get drawn into conversations. Oh shit I and I actually leaving it was the best thing I ever did at that time and I haven't gone back Because I didn't really need it to promote anything and it was the toxicity was long before he bought it for me The toxicity is just an inherent quality of people being able to post anonymously You're never going to get away from that. Yeah, but you just don't read it That's the most supportive thing like people are always gonna if you're a public figure People are always gonna have opinions of you and there's a lot of shady people out there and they're the most vocal and the most persistent Let them talk do you think you'd 50 years time?

1:16:19You won't be able to Post or comment without your identity being revealed. I hope that's not the case, but probably yeah I think they would like to do that in America. Yeah, you know But I think it's important for whistleblowers. It's important for you know people that work in an organization They want to expose corruption. They want to expose something. They want to expose Some illegal thing they're doing in regards to the environment. It's very important Yeah, you have to have people they want to expose the government It's very important to allow people to be anonymous when you're when you're in a dark place as I was 18 months ago You can feel that very pertinently.

1:16:57There was a lot of very unkind things said about Andrew's accident And top gear afterwards and I did want I thought to myself all those anonymous keyboard worries fuck you I was and you know this I was almost at that state which is the ultimate low the Kelvin of Of human behavior, which is I'll meet you in that car park so we can have a fight You know, you know how bad that is yeah, yeah, I can do it as well as you but when you step back from it Yeah, but I'm I'm don't engage in it. No, you can't ever I don't read negative things and I don't engage in it It's just I I'm not afraid of it. I just I know what it is and I don't like it I don't think it's necessary.

1:17:34I don't think it's good for you I don't think anybody gets any benefit out of it I don't think the person gets benefit out of you calling them a coxucker And I don't think you get any benefit out of calling them a coxucker I don't think it helps and I just look at it. I do what I call post and ghost. Yeah, I post things and I go away And I don't care what happens in the comments and and also I'm very aware of bots I'm very aware because we've done a lot of research and research We've done a lot of con we'd have a lot of conversations and done a lot of reading about the amount of content That's on especially Twitter.

1:18:07That's not organic and it's an extraordinary amount It's there's an FBI analyst that estimated it to be in the range of 80 % yeah 80 % of all the accounts you think so bullshit And they're used to promote specific narratives They use to argue and shame people they're used to attack certain political figures and public figures and And then that conversation Becomes completely changed because there's a swarm of people that have a very specific narrative and then the casual person read Well, maybe they're right. Okay, this guy is a basic shit I always thought I was a nice guy and then it everything changes and Just don't engage don't it's I'm interested in reading people in their toxic opinions sometimes But oftentimes I'll I'll go that doesn't seem real and then I'll go to their account and sure enough They have 39 followers and it looks like they're probably and you know Fucking Russia somewhere and in a troll farm and it's not a real the panicious side to it is like all the aspects of life that we know are bad and we shouldn't go there me they Alcohol or you know relationships whatever it is if you're if you're in a bad place you're susceptible And that's what that's what I find very difficult about That side of the internet sure if you're in a bad place, especially you after that accident It's a magnet it's like it's just there.

1:19:29It's the crab with its claw open. You're like I'm everything saying don't put your finger there But you do I don't I and I did very briefly and I'm very glad actually I don't actually left Twitter before then But I was very I couldn't believe some of the heartless comments that were made afterwards. It's because they're not there It's like it's a very Inhuman way to communicate we're communicating in text to a person that you're not you don't see their face You don't look in their eyes. You don't feel the pain of what you're saying to them It's not the way human beings are meant to communicate with each other We were meant to communicate with each other like this.

1:20:03Oh, no This is that's one of the reasons why podcasts are so successful And one of the reasons why I only do them with people in the room also it's because the only person I've done without that Recent in recent times Edward Snowden for obvious reasons But you don't want to that's that's not a good way to communicate It's not even a good way to communicate with your friends through text message. No They want to be there talking so the person says something go oh Okay, I get it. I get it. So you so how did you think that and it's the cadence of conversation and also the The quality of silence and the way that you respond.

1:20:36Yeah, actually I'm now going to say something terrible my podcast is done over zoom But it's the same voices every week so people become used to the cadence of conversation And they can actually they can I do believe relate to it for the comments confirm that well There's nothing wrong with doing podcasts or resume the problem is with guests exactly doesn't work with guests Yeah, it doesn't work with you can do it But I know people to do it with guests and they're fine They just they adjust and they're very good podcasts I listen my friend Duncan does a lot of people through zoom and they're great.

1:21:06They're great conversations But if you had if you had to sit down and speak to a room for young people About how to manage Third -party opinions of you on the internet. What would you would you say to them just ignore? Yes Yeah, well You have to be self -assessing though you can't be a person that is Clueless about how other people see you yes, because that's not good either So you have to be a person who's objective and introspective and you have you have to be able to honestly assess Whether or not what you've done is good or bad and we've all done good things and we've all had bad work And when you put out bad work and you know it's bad Oh just just accept the fact it's bad feel that pain grow because of it Use it as fuel to be better in the next thing that you do and that's it But don't wallow in other people telling you you suck or other people attacking you.

1:22:01There's no benefit There's another side to that that I've I had to teach my other co -host on this podcast you weren't from a media background at all I personally believe that to ignore the negativity you can't wallow in the positivity either I just think you don't have the right to just pick and choose what people say about you Yes, it's all the nice stuff and all the bad stuff That's just as bad for you yeah because then you're like I'm pretty fucking amazing like you know That's bad for everybody too. That's not good. Nobody benefits from being told they're amazing You know if you did something that's good so Congratulations you worked hard you put out something that's good leave it alone keep moving keep moving Yeah, don't don't read all that positive shit and blow your head up and that happens to a lot of people They get like enamored It's called audience capture and you see it one of the things that happens Particularly with comedians you see especially if they start getting involved in political commentate commentary They they start getting audience capture like you see it a lot with People who lean right because there's not as many right -wing voices on the internet you get a tremendous amount of support All these people say you're you're the only one out there speaking the truth and like and they you're Oh, they're speaking the truth and you start believing that bullshit and then you change your perspective yes audience capture Yes, yeah, that's dangerous too.

1:23:23Yeah, when you when you you're becoming conditioned by the environment you're in without realizing it Actually with an app with on with on just segue back to the BBC I've seen that with with that network. I work with I think there's a lot of high quality people that work at the BBC And I and at the moment they're under a lot of pressure and everyone's took everyone's judging them as individuals within the organization I think the organization is that environment is is is almost impossible to work in now And it's changing them they almost have nowhere to go well There are also that it's like it's an unhealthy relationship in the first place because you have executives and producers who want to make a thing But they're not the talent and so they're also not the experts So they have their own ideas and they have to have some sort of an impact on it to justify their position So see people having ridiculous Suggestions that everybody has to entertain because Bob is an executive.

1:24:15Okay, Bob is the fucking co -producer We got to listen to Bob and Bob's got some stupid fucking idea that you have to hear out And if you say Bob it's not gonna work because of this now you're in an argument with Bob and Bob's mad at you and would you have a mate television again? No, no done. I've just finished for the BBC which and this podcast is gonna be he's gonna put the cat in the vision So I've got one thing I've just done with the BBC which is not correlated Which will be my last and I've done for the BBC probably I did it with Paddy. I loved it. It was actually about wellness and and trying to be you know, which is a word I fucking hate It's captured word.

1:24:46I'm not even a word. It's like mindfulness. I can't if I just said it so I apologize to you Wellness and mindfulness have been captured spirituality as well It's about me being having let myself go. I'm a shit. I let myself go a bit better now But you should have seen me a year ago. Oh and I and we've gone off and done three one -hour shows about you Was that in as a response to yeah? Yeah, yeah, I just I sat I sat and I drank World -class quantities of single malt I had made I had met I like I like a single malt and I had built up a nice little collection You know, I really nice little collection.

1:25:21I was quite I was quite disciplined I'd pull myself, you know a beautiful glamfarls 25 and I'd I'd enjoy it and I put it away I did that collection in the first month after the top gear incident the whole lot gone Oh, wow, and then I then I slipped into the fold, you know, it was terrible and I yeah, and I and I I don't look back on it as being I now realize how bad it was but I'm a bit of a box ticker Like you have to you can't talk about it unless you've done it I'm done it. So that was the box you wanted to I didn't want to but now I've done it. I get it. Yeah, and I you know and also I was doing a weekly podcast my My sort of decline was quite publicly documented some people saw it some people didn't but that I sometimes someone would I'd see someone say You're right.

1:26:09I'm not me really fucking isn't Um, uh, where was I with that but but but I do think that the um yeah that the the If you start going down that route, it's a problem. Yeah, it's a problem. Yeah, it's a real problem Um, I should say mindfulness wellness what other words that wellness is worse than mindfulness They're both the same to me. We went to so this show we did All right, and this is I'm not promoting it. It's just it was interesting because I I like cars And the BBC had me all I wanted to do was present stuff about cars And this organization decided to send me off to go to Sweden to to see what it's like Why they have a good quality of life.

1:26:48I know they do. I've got a lot of Swedish friends. I've been to Sweden It's fucking great place. It was it was an amazing experience. I loved it But didn't involve cars right? I want to be making shows about cars. All right. This is what I love doing I'm getting it being hired and doing your own thing. There you go I'm grateful for it and I think there's some really entertaining television although we missed out one bit you talk about Uh having to drink donkey semen. Yeah, there's a there's a clip from this show that's I don't that doesn't make it but I'm given this substance to drink by this guy who's got an infish grin I'm like and I'll do I'm that guy that'll eat most things You know if you film top gear you've been around the world you've eaten Stuff you shouldn't have eaten and he's long as you survived.

1:27:27He's another box ticked You know, I never thought I'd eat a sheep's rectum. I'd be fine. But chewy Um, but I was given this this is the vial of liquid and I drank it and it tasted a bit like a really Petey single mole. Imagine an arbeque this like really Petey I was like Quaw And on the label it said beaver. I was like Okay, what's that and I just Swedish guy said it's uh, yeah Essence of a beaver that we make liquid alcohol with what he flavor Like a shine with beaver because it was strong and he went he sort of fudged it and moved on I was like what it was dry and it was the flavor was in my mouth.

1:28:09I couldn't get rid of it Transpires. This is a secretion from the anal gland of the beaver So I ate beaver asked I drank it I was like a Of a so someone milked a beaver. Oh boy. I drank it wasn't that bad. What's the benefit of this supposedly? Has some quality it does and you know if you see the average Swedish guy walking around you I'll have someone that be a juicer by looking at they all do drinking it I don't think they're all drinking it But I think some of them drinking it. I think so really it's popular over there It was it's for sale And I'd be fresh But when happens if you get a tainted one here it is tails from the fringe beaver gland vodka Wow So that's the beaver's butt right there and it's a gland in the vodka 10 days later.

1:28:58I was in Japan doing some other work and I I remember that my host saying what you think to that food and all what I wanted to say to them was I can just taste beaver 10 days later Wow my old factory System such as it is was only registering beaver 10 days every food I ate tasted of beaver Did you try to like wash it out without going on everything wow is an incredibly fire spinning Didn't do that But thinking how did you burn it off I don't know you'd have to just get a new head Wow, so it eventually just dissipated in time and after 10 days you still had it it was still there You know when it's just there as a sort of residual taste how have been so upset yeah You mother fucker you ruined 10 days worth of meals, but also when I found it hadn't made the cut I was like Come on That's not made that's not I went through the voice paper for the and it's not in that's so crazy But I Wellness as a concept is is something that I as a word I hate and I'm I'm proud of the show that will come out at some point but I but I'm I like cars I want to make shows about cars and I will go of course I will go back to the internet And I will you belong you you belong doing your own thing Chris Harrison cars was awesome.

1:30:24We might bring it back Yeah, yeah, it's it'll I've got some we've made some films and I'm gonna give it another month and then we'll give it another go Well a bunch of people were trying all these different things like they were trying to monetize it So you had to subscribe online or to access the content. Yeah, it doesn't work. You lose 99 .9 % of people There's too much good stuff for free. Yeah, people have that's another thing we come back to that idea of this Chinese guy going Thanks for educating my children or whatever I've done There is no monetary value placed on content now. There's a few firewall systems that work I think New York Times and the Times in the London Times works.

1:31:02I pay for that And I think they make it works barely, but it's they've had to work so hard as they have been diminished greatly by the the lack of people wanting to buy Paper newspaper. Yeah, it's been a big impact on them It also changes the way they do journalism because now everything's very click baiting You know, which is a real problem as well, but the expectation is that content is now free. Right. Yeah You know, how many how many listeners would you lose do you think if you put a paywall up for this? Well, I lost 50 % when I went over to Spotify did you Yeah, initially. Yeah, we lost like half, but we got it back pretty quickly.

1:31:37Yeah. Yeah I I think The way that we relate and interact with content is fascinating. It is there's a ever bigger appetite These devices mean that the immediacy means that this there can never be too much content I was pointing that out when I first saw here that you have the tiniest little iPhone the little baby mini That they know my friend Yoni has one of those two I admire it. I admire that you don't even have a case on yours, which is even crazy Well, I the iPhones are funny thing because it's it's a bit like a steering wheel in a car That's your contact point right? It was designed to to feel brilliant and the iPhone with that metal ridge Is one of the most pleasing objects you'll ever pick up.

1:32:15So why put a condom on it? I don't I want you don't want it to break I want it. It's been a glass still working and I want an unsheathed Also mine has a nice little kickstand look at this Oh, what's that? Yeah, oh see you could yeah, okay I'm sitting in the kitchen table but but when I sit down when I get in a car I don't want something and those are disgusting. I judge people so harshly when I get in their car And they have some stupid fucking thing on their steering wheel. I'm like what is wrong with you? Who are you? Would you wear mittens on top of that you fucking idiot? What are you doing?

1:32:47I've come here Briefly for two reasons one because I want to be on this podcast see you the other thing I've come to do in this state I'm gonna need some help with this. I'm not here for much longer is I saw a bumper sticker advertised That I think is the greatest bumper sticker ever created and it simply says Texas is bigger than France That's it the statements And I it's for sale online and I've got I've got I've got eight hours now to go and find it before I fly back But I have to get this bumper sticker. Oh, we'll get you one. It says it did she just says it's a statement It is the greatest statement made by any Stato cap.

1:33:25That's quite a bit bigger than France. Isn't it? Where is it? Yeah I okay. I just love it look at that there. Yeah, it's kind of funny. It's brilliant And I want that I happen to I have a really We were talking about this at the beginning before we got rolling But it really is its own country. Yeah, it's very different than the rest of the country Yeah, it's very independent and one of the reasons is the history of this place like for the longest time the Dominated this territory and you couldn't get across the land And so the people that Eventually figured out how to fight off the command she and settle down.

1:34:04They're the craziest most rugged individuals ever The Texas Rangers they figured out how to cold camp and there's a photograph of Jack Hayes Who's the original Texas Ranger out in the lobby and that's why he's there like without those psychopaths that figured out a way to fight off the most Forrosh's band of Indians that ever existed in this episode is brought to you by me undies when date night comes around You want to look good for your partner. That's normal So here's some advice guys if you want to impress your date It starts with some nice fitting clothes that complement your body And I'm not just talking about a suit or slacks or a blazer wearing a nice pair of underwear Can go a long way too me undies knows how to make an amazing pair of fucking underwear like their contoured pouch and ball caddy It helps you look and feel amazing and like all of their other clothing It's made with their signature fabric that's breathable, stretchy and comfortable If that's not your thing me undies also has plenty of other options for you to choose from including Loungewear and everything else comes in a range of sizes colors and prints There's even some fun valentines day prints and styles like electric hearts or lovebirds You and your partner can get a matching set to make the night extra special Try them for yourself if your first pair of underwear isn't a match made in heaven It's on me undies this valentines day good things come in big packages at me undies Score huge sight wide savings at me undies .com slash rogan and enter the code rogan That's me undies .com slash rogan enter promo code rogan for huge sight wide savings me undies comfort from the outside in This episode is brought to you by blinds .com Do you know the right window treatments aren't just about privacy?

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1:37:30They don't stop being fighters Well, just flavors the independence of the entire state and the pride of the state It's very different because I think it's viewed as this Center of cosmopolitan life and within a state that's known to be a bit different. So how does that work? It's good. It's a balance. So Austin is this preposterous progressive blue city that's surrounded by ranchers with guns So this is saying keep Austin weird and surrounded and I think that's accurate Because you've got a lot of you know, if you have the universities here You have some really intelligent interesting people here great restaurants great nightlife But also you're surrounded by Texas Texas the real Texas The majority of Texas is like ranchers and small town people and they're heavily armed That's the thing about for being an English person.

1:38:27Sorry, a British person This the gun thing is totally foreign to us. I'm not gonna I'm not gonna offer any opinion at all other than say that it's just foreign It really is yeah, and at times. I'm sure people in the UK would quite like to fill the security of having that about them But it is it's amazing driving around here as a British person thinking That person that car is almost certain to go a gun. Yeah, that we don't certainly we don't have that Well, we also have the first amendment and you see the consequences of not having the second amendment In the UK because they can tell you we're gonna lock you and jail for a Facebook post Yeah, and you know, you can't really do that here You can't just force people to go to jail You can't like that was the issue also in Australia Australia they took everyone's guns away after one mass shooting I think in the 1990s and They were able to round people up and put them in camps when they found out they had a cold It was crazy.

1:39:23You can't do that in America The second amendment protects the first amendment It's it's maybe the the What's transpired for me having traveled here so many times have worked here so often in the last 25 Is that because we speak the same language and we all look quite similar We assume our countries are really really similar, but they're not they're really quite different We have a real caste system over there. You have a class and actually they're both wonderful places I love coming here. There's there's a there's something about All of the states I visited that I love And I have no strong opinions maybe this is the older you get I no longer have strong opinions really about the way other people live their lives So that's yours.

1:40:06It's what you do. I don't I don't have any opinion about that at all really. It's what you do It works for you and in the UK we're different as well and I I The older I get the more a million so I become I think about that when I was younger would have had stronger opinions about that But you know the way that Texas operates is it's Texas is stuff is it's it's the way you do things And I don't I don't I have to be here a long time to fully understand the layers of it the nuances of it And I and if you came to North Somerset where I live there's but there's aspects of it that look because we speak the same language That look like they're straightforward, but they're not they everything has subtleties, doesn't it?

1:40:43Yeah That's that's why I see it. I don't I think maybe to come back some of the comments It's when people become part of sand Without any real information that we get that we have problems Yeah, people always giving me their fucking opinion When they haven't stopped to consider it right, you know, and that's not me I'm not trying to dodge issues here. You can probably tell I'm not completely apolitical. I I am I just don't like politicians. I don't I don't care what side of the fence they sit on I'm deeply suspicious of people that go into a career of politics You should be I should be so I'm not I'm not I don't profess to be on one side of the other.

1:41:18I just all of them tend to be in expert I think the idea that we've created a system where you get promoted Because you're in experts is ridiculous and in my world that manifests itself in transport. I've never come across a transport Minister in the UK that really has any idea what's going on or any interest or even uses fucking transport other than being driven around They just bureaucrat. It's ridiculous So that's my position on it Is I just sit there be welded by what's going on And maybe maybe where I am a total soft cock is I don't I don't have the spine to stand up and shout about it But I just it's bizarre for me and that we that that we have in expert people making decisions for us Hence our discussion of our electric cars Yeah But also we have people that have the right to say whatever they want online without having stopped to think of anything That they were talking about or to or to research what they're saying is remarkable But there's also this because of that because of there's this shitty opinions and nasty people and all this information Floen or Indian bots and all this other stuff It makes you consider the nature of speech and it makes you consider like what it what it gives you a choice Do I choose to engage in this kind of stuff do I choose to read this kind of stuff?

1:42:33Or do I just recognize it for what it is like I don't drink moonshine if I don't go to the if I go to the supermarket And there's a jug of moonshine I'll go well I need to buy that and start drinking it. No, I don't drink I don't want it. I know it's there. I don't drink it right So you can choose to avoid the things that suck in life you can but through the prism of parenthood I've got three kids I do as well. Yeah, I that's where it gets tricky. Yes And I don't know whether you've you've probably experienced this as well, but when I was first on top gear There was a lot of hate flying around And you know, I was just hated because I wasn't Jeremy which is odd because Jeremy's One of my heroes.

1:43:12I think he's one of the greatest broadcasters out there I love top gear and to suddenly be the enemy was really weird I love what he did. I loved his top gear. I was just trying to do my own top gear And I just got shot on for it But when my children started taking heat For what I was doing for a living. Mm -hmm. It was very difficult. Yes. I found that very difficult And I was crazy that people go after someone's kids for a television show about cars Like what kind of a piece of shit? If I was a political broadcaster or someone that was talking about the NRA I can understand it. I'm talking about the motor car.

1:43:44Yeah, exactly. Not the third world debt. It's a to it's ridiculous But it doesn't matter. It's just shitty human beings with bad lives They're when they go over your kids. Yeah, I tell you something about this Never said this publicly I had a phone call one day From the from family home Saying that my youngest child had been out skateboarding. It's a five -masmer. No, he's me skateboarding on some little lane I said when I heard that I thought why would you skate? Well there's really rough. We just fall over But two people in a car had approached him and said and and tried to coax him into the car I turned that it was too tabloid journalist that we're trying to get some dirt on me, but they tried to coax my child Into the back of the car.

1:44:31Oh my god, and I know I I agree with you that I want to be Have a sensible view of this world we live in but when you but when you've experienced those things Or when you've had to sit down as speech your kids teachers about the awful things that are being said to them Just because their dad happens to present a TV show you it does change you a bit You know come back from it completely. Well, you recognize the real shit nature of some human beings Yeah, and when you're confronted with it We're kind of always aware there's bad people in the world But when you're confronted with it over such a superficial thing You're so right so refreshing to hear you say that.

1:45:06It's just a car Yeah, I deal in the least Serious subject on the planet. Yeah, it's a motor car It's just being attached to that iconic name. It's all it is And then also the way that show was cancelled because Jeremy punched a producer Did you have to work with the same producer Jeremy punched? No, he he that guy had left I can't I met him once shook his hand. I never didn't know he was come on team Jeremy. Yeah, he's he's He's brilliant to what he does if he punched the guy the guy probably sucks Jesus, I'm not coming to you on that I'm gonna get in trouble but I but I do I Well, if no one's ever really asked me what I think of him is just the best He's quite a fucking character and I shouldn't I shouldn't have Maybe I shouldn't have tried to follow him, but I wasn't trying to follow him I think what I what I now realize I was trying to do is I was trying to be part of the solution I knew I could do the driving bit, but I thought the other people could carry off the Jeremy bit Right and I now realize that's very difficult.

1:46:04Yeah, it's difficult to follow Yeah, you're not gonna follow that you're just gonna be different. He's a completely unique person I think they did Elon dirtier than anybody ever did. Oh, they would naughty with that They did a terrible thing They did a terrible thing and I talked to him about it and he was Julius they pretended that his car died and they did it for a sketch And this is the early days of Tesla when Tesla had just that little tiny car There was basically a lotus with an electric engine. Yeah, right so it's called the road so that was the original roadster Yeah, they're original one which the cool -looking little car and They pretended that it died on them and they did it for a sketch and they got away with it because it's entertainment And they were allowed to create a script and apparently someone had got a hold of the script and read in the script before they even filmed it Then the car dies and then we have to figure out why the car dies so What kind of an impact do you think that had on the sales of his car?

1:47:01I mean how to be extraordinary You're watching the most popular automobile show in the world and they say your car sucks so bad that it died when they were testing it when it didn't die I can't be careful. I say here, but without wanting to shout to anyone's illusions That's the way those car shows are made That's where a lot of reality shows are made up for sure Ultimately you reverse engineer an outcome So you're being told this is what you're going to find right this is what's going to happen All we need to do is you've got to help us get there now In reality TV I can understand it, but if you're reviewing a product as you say that tens of thousands of people make and and they rely on That thing selling for their livelihood.

1:47:42It's not and you're just lying You're lying you're lying about this car breaking. It did not break one of the biggest problems on top gear for me was when things didn't break So the you know often the producers and I understand why they want stuff to break that was the joy But they normally with the older cars we'd buy and mess around with But actually older cars are quite reliable now you buy something and expect it the engine to blow up it won't Well, how many of those 1988 Toyota Land Cruisers are still on the road with hundreds of thousands of miles? Well, they did a brilliant Film about that and they trying to kill a land cruiser and they just couldn't Ended up dropping up and building you and it drove away They it's the cockroach of the car world.

1:48:25I'm very incredible I have a I have a 200 series Land Cruiser V8 diesel 157 ,000 miles on it. I have an 80 series. It's just they are They're brilliant vehicles and actually I lobbed the bottle and see on the other day by saying I drive around in my Land Cruiser feeling sorry for rain driver drivers And I just got a hold of it Yeah, but I do think that I have some sympathy for people that make television because You know if you work they say don't work with children animals, but working with cars can be difficult and I One aside of top gear that I found unpalatable not just the sort of the silly comedy bit Which I didn't like was quite often you'd be given a script I'd be given a script and my review was in it and I'd be like well I haven't driven it yet So this is the part where you say it's great, but what do I think it's shit right?

1:49:14But but they they they I can understand why the producer directors thinking we've got to get all this package together That's our hour there. That's our hour there But we haven't stopped to actually evaluate this thing was supposed to be evaluating and I have some sympathy With people that make television because actually that bit's just that they don't care about that Yeah, but for me that's all that matters I want to I want to give an honest opinion of the car Well, that's where you shine and that's why you should only be doing things on your own I think I will after this. Yeah, you know fuck fuck that wellness show too I have to take a leak.

1:49:48Let's come back. Yeah, I'll take a little quick break Dogs in cars is a good subject. Yeah, I love having my dog in the car My dog loves going in the car. He knows we're gonna go do something fun. Hey the dog. So is it sensible to suggest the dog is the ultimate car companion sure because they never upset. Yeah, yeah They're like yay, we're in the car. Must be and we're going somewhere. I love so my I've got a GT3 Touring 991 you bring the dog in that. What kind of dog he's an English Bolteria. How big is he? Quite a size, but you know, he's one with the shark face He just looks like he's gonna kill you, but all he'd do is lick you to death.

1:50:23He's a gorgeous animal And from the very from as a puppet I he all all dogs how access to all cars It's really important for me if you've got a really if you have a car that's a million dollars Dogs going in there. I really if for me it's a it's a sucker That's the it's closer to gets to religion for me. I love it because I it's a for me It's a demonstration of who I am. I want my things. I love the most to share the things. I love the most right So the dog goes in it and the dog and I love patty nation on cars. So my cars are known for being Not that cleanless. They just love living them And you know the handle on a GT3 under the bucket seat where you that lovely handle that you move the falls of backwards Online they're all chewed where he chewed them as a puppy And I leave them like that so when people get in they go Fuck what was that and I'll go either talk to you that But the only time I've come to grief Is that I now I'm very I'm very suspicious of switch gear that's laid on the horizontal Because I was on a slip road in an in an m3 of mine Last year No, sorry no it'd be the GT3 and I came off his slip road and I accelerated it was wet And I thought I'd lean on the systems, you know when you just get that E lean on the traction or the ABS and the cars went fully sideways On a slip road in the middle of the day and it looked outrageous I mean that's what I'm quite good at so I went well there you go that sideways Why I'd off again the dog had put his paw on the ESP but oh no he had turned all the systems Without me knowing oh no so now I'm aware of that he's not allowed to do that yeah They shouldn't be right there, but I suddenly thought that's there is oh what a cutie That's in the back of the m5 the V10 and five that's pit dog.

1:52:03Oh, that's nice He's an absolute legend. He is I um but he's a great dog companion no dog sickness You just I just love dog these ways as long as they're accustomed to it That's the thing yeah when when I have had dogs in the past that I didn't take in cars often Then you take them in a car they're kind of freaking out. Why are we moving they start throwing up Yeah, but it's awful. I don't want to see a dog like that no one's in animal stress right And I have rejected cars because my dogs didn't like them. I had a thing I had a thing called a got I had a thing I bought I borrowed one and I bought a golf r estate It was a I'm not sure you got them over here, but they did a combo sort of station wagon You've got there's a theme.

1:52:43I love station wagons. Why do you like station wagon? I I think long roofs and curtailed arseys look better really yeah the three box thing doesn't do it as much for me I like long down. I think they look gross. Yeah, I love them. I see them. I'm like what is what you do to that fucking thing? I bought I so this is the new I actually good look I bought I bought the old one so you type in the click in 2015 golf r estate there and I Anyone of those yeah that was so I went and bought one of these that'll be good and that's not it's not too showy and it'll do job And at that point I had my old dog boss Vimerana and And I put him in the back And he just got out again I thought he hadn't done that before put him in the back again And he was quite evident he did not like the car.

1:53:32I don't know why So you didn't like the car because he didn't like that so I so I took the car back and the guy he saw it said What's the problem I said dog doesn't like it and he went What dog do you mean I said what the dog doesn't like it I can't live with it because the dog lives with me So he goes Absolutely yeah, no the dogs are what could it possibly have been Who knows dogs Dogs are as we know the most incredible things we don't deserve them They are wonderful, but they see and they perceive things differently to us. Yeah, he knew it could be that he didn't like the cologne That the German guy that assembled the boot Interior with you know dogs dogs offer opera and level of perception.

1:54:15We can't even understand right so I Yeah, your fascination with bears, you know could a man Be it be beating up bio could a man defeat a bear. I always love that. It's like well. What you thinking of I love I often like walking around trying to think what my dog seeing of a situation Smelling oh, there must be smelling just so many different things. I know they apparently can if you have a hamburger that has like cheese pickles onions ketchup They can smell all the individual items in the hamburger. They smell everything They have like a reference of discernibility. Yeah, it's just very different than ours So do they have like terminate to vision is that red code going across and I like Because I have no language too, right?

1:55:00So it's all on instincts Which is fascinating because you know nobody taught my dog to pee on things He just knows that you step. What's this? He's on it, you know when I like take him on trails and he finds out all where all the other dogs have pee like oh You know true, but my There's an emotional sensitivity to these animals. Well that thing they just in a picture of I mean. You have this bread to fight Bulls and bears that was what was bred to do But if um, let's just say that certain times in the month if my girlfriend is feeling down My dog will go and cuddle her and sit with her all night and provide heat to the part of her body that's in pain He will do that consistently Every single time he knows He just knows he knows she's uncomfortable.

1:55:46Yeah, they're empaths Especially when they really love you. There's something about them like My dog understands language like he and he doesn't know just like sit give me your paw lie down But he knows toe. Yeah, he knows things like like we can be going towards the house I go now it's going around the back and he's okay going around the back like he knows what I'm saying He's it's like real subtle I wonder what I wonder we over project on them because when we were discussing earlier about some of the This sense of being just so disappointed about our fellow homo sapiens I overproject on to my dog the more I get this one to my human beings the more I revel in dogs Well, they're like human beings though in that it depends on the life of the dog like people get killed by wild dogs Yeah, like in Georgia some couple recently was attacked and someone who was killed by Wild dogs because the dogs are fending for themselves.

1:56:41They live horrible lives now people that live horrible lives are shit people Right, they're dangerous shit people. Yeah, whereas a dog like Marshall that said nothing but love and he's a golden retriever He's bred that way. He's just a genuine joy. Yeah, everyone everyone he meets like you're my new friend Everybody he just assumes, you know, but you've met dogs are like they see people are the sketchy They're scared of men. They know those maybe they were beaten that were a factor of the involvement Exactly exactly which dogs are just like us. They're just like us. You get a dog like Carl Carl thinks everybody loves them and he just want everybody wants to play and that's what he does He just runs up to you and tries to play because that's his whole life.

1:57:21That's all he's ever experienced. It's being taken care of I want some bear chat so I have I'm slightly fascinated by These really large bears a big reason And I do find myself sometimes before the money when I can't sleep googling just the size of them Their potential power the potential statistics of what they can and can't do Are they as always spot on as I should think they are. Oh, yeah, and beyond. Yeah There's a great story that you can find that's on YouTube. There's a clip of my friend Steve Rinella And he was on a fog -knack island and they were elk hunting and they had shot an elk and A fog -knack island is an incredibly difficult place to traverse The the bush is dense and thick and the bears are enormous a fog -knack is connected to Kodiak By a small land strip, I believe It's certainly like right next to Kodiak.

1:58:20I might be wrong about them I think it may be used to be I'm not sure but the point is They are coastal brown bears and coastal brown bears are the same thing as a grizzly bear But their diet is very different. So their diet is so rich and protein from salmon. They have so they're enormous They could be 1800 pounds They could be 11 feet tall They're fucking huge They're preposterously big and you can't imagine how big they are unless you you really encounter them So my friend Steve He was the group of friends they had shot this elk and he was filming it for a television show called meat eater They shot this elk and they put most of it up in the tree and they carry some of it back to camp and camp is six hours of Trekking through the train So then they come back the next day they trek six hours they find the spot They sit down and they start eating lunch They don't realize that a bear has claimed that meat and so the bear Charge through the camp and one of the guys Wines up on top of the bear the bear barrels through the people and this guy is literally riding the back of the bear for about 30 yards before he falls off of it One of my friends my friend Yannis it is gnashing its teeth about 18 inches from his face as it runs right now Imagine ahead this big I mean the head is like this isn't it like this in norm?

1:59:54I mean so big just impossibly big and it's gnashing its teeth 18 inches away from his head as it runs by he hits it with a trekking pole Like wax it with a trekking pole there are he said Steve the way Steve described that he said the most reptilian part of your brain is Ignited where you no longer have like what should I do? There's no there's no thinking in terms it. There's no language with the slight Fry us full chaos Full chaos terrifying chaos no one had their gun in front of them no one no one knew it to do They were all the gun like pistols were in the packs rifles were sitting down over there No one was prepared no one thought the bear was there they didn't understand that it was there Yeah, I think I think As As ignored in European We're always fascinated by this shit we haven't got right and grizzly bears are the up there with Chevy suburban Most muscle cars honestly the idea of the other the foreign is really fascinating for any person doesn't have that sure And I it's same with Australia, you know, you know, you go to Australia.

2:01:07It's a very different thing They have little shit or kill you right spiders you go there and they'll do someone will casually go Yeah, mate that'll that budget you're fucked You're like what do you mean? It's a spider. No, mate Jesus it's not like a big furry thing right but in South America. It's big and furry. It's but it's it's it's whole Presentation is I'll kill you right these ones are not quite like that right So I do have this fascination with this stuff and again, that's why YouTube's great Because as the kid growing up if you wanted to find out about this stuff You couldn't really have to go get a book or mm -hmm There's no VHS you'll be able to blockbuster you couldn't buy Documentual grizzly bears could you right you didn't get it right now?

2:01:48It's all over there But even a documentary's not gonna do it you have to experience them Yeah, you have to actually be a round one and see it have you be so you have been up close with these things I've only seen one grizzly bear in the wild and it wasn't big it was about six feet But it looked at me so much different than any other animal that I've ever seen it looks right through you like Am I gonna eat you? Yeah, so you were a food source. Yeah, are you a food source? Am I gonna eat you? What are you? one of the best things I've done With top gear was with MATLAB Long who um as you can tell I'm very fond of um, he's just a nice great fun.

2:02:26We had this idea Uh around Bigfoot He's a believer he's a believer in his own way He's not he's not a believer But he presents a really strong argument. I like people that as you can tell I shoot that argument for the halls But I like to apply tests to things he's not a believer, but he likes to apply tests He said stand in the Washington state forest And tell me that we know everything is in there And I if you come from a little island off Europe The size of your forests are awe inspiring. Yeah, I mean, I did there's so much stuff that we might not know about Does interest me? Yeah, probably at one point time was something.

2:03:02Yeah, that's what it really is And there's an actual animal Called gigantic apithecus that existed alongside human beings that was an eight to ten -foot tall bipedal ape that lived in Asia And could have come across across the bearing land bridge. Yeah, it is possible So and there's also Native Americans have some Enormous number of names for these creatures different tribes have enormous so they don't have fake animals They don't have a bunch of like dragons and stuff that doesn't exist. It's not a mythical creature So and I don't want to but I don't want to pitch Man into something you know, he's not he's not some crazy believer and actually the premise of the whole film was fun It was he was there going.

2:03:40There's I think there's something here. Let's go and have a look for it Um, and I was just Acutely aware as we were in we shot it in in Northern California. So north of San Francisco The forest at night There's a sketchy place, you know It it really reminds you of just how insignificant we are and how vulnerable we are without our man Objects to find ourselves sure and I and I in the context of that a bear For me was terrifying actually. I just thought they were creatures. I'd seen on nature programs The other that was something out there that viewed me as food that if you live in England We don't have that we simply don't we don't have mountain lions I'm not gonna eat by a badger.

2:04:21I think the largest carnivore in the UK is where your folks are a badger We don't have these things that you have I difficult for you understand. There's nothing that viewed me as a food source California killed all the bears all the grizzlies that used to have the well the California state flag is a grizzly bear Yeah, and their bears were similar. I believe in size to coastal brown bears Um, the the grizzlies the the brown bears that used to live there and there's a place in California called Levec Um, is a town called Levec that was named after I believe his name was Stephen Levec He was the last man to get killed by a brown bear in California before they eradicated them So this is in 1800s I guess so they just started killing them all they just killed them.

2:05:04Fuck these things They're killing everybody. Yeah, which just kill them. You can sort of see why. Oh, yeah What a polar bear is even more madness again. Oh, yeah Have you ever seen that BBC show where they put the guy in the glass cube? Oh my god I mean what was going on there That is so terrifying the thing is just smelling meat inside that cube and trying to get through it to get to him It's biting it and you see it's massive jaws and they don't need anything but meat. Yeah, so they're they're the most dangerous of all polar bears And ironically the ones that we make the seem to be the cutest this Fuck that thing.

2:05:43How do you know that's gonna work by the way? We try that out on a bear. It looks like a shit x -fingit fight, it doesn't it from the inside and this bear just gets to it It's like oh there's meat in there. How do I get to that meat? I just Got and we make those things out to be our friends, you know, that's that's the you know What would you do for a Klondike bar? You know, they sell Coca -Cola. They sell Klondike bars in this this bear is just a fucking super predator Balloon balloon was a bear What's balloon balloon jungle book oh yeah, yeah, it's amazing isn't it that we anthropomorphized bears yeah more than just about any other Grigian yogi pattington bear sure yeah, yeah friendly cuddly.

2:06:27I think I think because they they do look quite appealing And they are dog -like Oh, they they're so you dog -like snout sure shape of head. Well, we put hats on them and shit only you could for it for as far as I think what do we eat you? Yeah, they want to eat you they want to eat anything that's slow I mean, that's what they're there for their nature's cleanup crew friend of mine walked to the North Pole for some reason I don't know why and And he was only had a lot of training before and this is a long time ago But the the polar bear training was what he talked about was quite Difficult to absorb really effectively.

2:07:03It was that there was no there was no gun that you could carry on an expedition like that If you're just on your own or with three of them with sleds right nothing you carry that you could immediately produce that would stop a polar bear And I don't polar bear so the best thing they had was a is a short shotgun That had a solid bolt it just a solid bolt in it And if you could get that one thing off you could stop it But there's no gauge of shotgun that was going to stop one of these things. It was coming at you So they carried this thing They carried this thing that had a solid bolt in it. That's all you had.

2:07:34I don't know much about guns But that's what they said they were given Oh There's some pistols that you can Effectively unload into a bear and stop them for 50 calories stop it with it. Yeah, well sure Our 50 count they have a 50 cal pistol, but they have 40 you know 40 magnums 44 What that would stop a bad you have to shoot at multiple times Yeah, not one and you know and like if you have a 38 or a 9mm good luck Good luck is that just like bounce right off its head their heads are so thick You could literally shoot it in the forehead and it probably bounce off its forehead I Mean they bite each other you've seen them go to war with each other when they bite each other They have insane amounts of power and and bite force and they're just clamping down onto this face And they'll do it for half an hour walk away like it was nothing.

2:08:26Okay. That versus a big gorilla That's a good question. We've had that question many times. What is it? I think the gorilla is at a severe disadvantage because it doesn't really kill anything. Yeah So the gorilla just nashes its teeth at other gorillas and makes like he's a bad ass and they have incredible power But they don't even eat meat Whereas the bear all it does is run around killing things It's all does kills things and eats dead things and it's what it wants to do I got my money on the bear. I love it. I love it. What I know about is cause and I'm hit asking questions about bears But oh they're fascinating It's a fascinating part of our world and it's all the anthropomorphizing is a really fascinating aspect And I think in America it happened with Teddy Roosevelt with the teddy bear I think that's the beginning of the end and then Disney movies were a huge problem Disney movies are a huge problem because all the bears are your friend.

2:09:19They all talked everybody and hey And say why would you kill the bear like that is a giant forest dog That's an evil animal that it doesn't give a fuck about you or your kids. It'll pull you out of your tent It'll eat you 100 % You can and they're wonderful and they're beautiful and we should definitely keep a healthy population of them I'm not saying we should eradicate them But know what they are and don't be influenced by these goddamn cartoons cartoons and movies which have fuck people's heads up. Yeah It's as a parent you realize it as well particularly um in the UK we have you know, we don't have dangerous species of animals like that but we we do Through anthropomorphizing them in films and cartoons.

2:10:02We make We make things cute that might not be cute. Sure Yeah, you know, we have a real urban fox population in the UK And um, they actually started in my hometown of Bristol Um, the foxes of the clever creature and it worked out There was much easier to come into town and raid bins and it was set out there trying to find rabbits In the countryside and these nighttime foxes would they were very clever No one really knew where they were though. They were there The BBC made a fantastic documentary. I think I'll get in attenborough in the early 80s about urban foxes And they've spread throughout the UK and the foxes this you know in in In most cartoons.

2:10:37It's a lovely cuddly thing with the bushry tail. It's a beautiful color um But they're you know they're They're predators. They're a real problem for um for farmers and they date a lot of polter I'm not even going into fox hunting. That's not my world. But um But there's been a few stories recently foxes going into people's houses and you know attacking babies and you know stuff like that And you and then then you see on Instagram people feeding the foxes and they're about gardens and you think this That's not a domesticated animal. Yeah, you can't do that You know you got to make it you got to decide One or the other Also if you feed them then they become accustomed to getting food from that particular area And then you you kind of fuck them up because then they lose their ability to hunt Yeah, if you do it too often if you provide them with food every day You're gonna fuck them up.

2:11:25I'd be I've just had my holiday down in Newkiel and Newkiel North Castle Cornwall Which is just one of the most beautiful places on the planet and when you buy fish and chips From the fish and chips outlets. They all have a seagull warning now on the shop front saying when you buy your fish and chips Protect it because all the seagulls just dive on people wow So it's it's like that scene in the that Jurassic Park film when the tarot that tools are coming down You're seeing a seagull eat a rat. Yeah, whole whole just They throw it down They'll do the pigeons. They'll do it to everything catch. There's there's a wonderful Instagram clip I'm admitting too much when I search history.

2:12:03I think it's a cormorant Just being given like a black oily thing just being given fish and it eats like five Yeah, actually you think that the volume of fish you've eaten there is greater than the mass of your body There's no way that I didn't think you could eat that no there's so many videos of like Different birds throwing down a whole large mouth bass and it's like how is it even getting in your mouth? It doesn't they have these skinny little necks and they swell up Gah And they have the the fins pop another tails pop another mouth Yeah, they're pretty extraordinary creatures and they're essentially dinosaurs and actually to come back to the content Discussion YouTube whatever it is.

2:12:44I do love the fact it's all out there. Yeah, I love the fact it's being recorded Mm -hmm. I had never seen this stuff. I've got a particular phobia and it is a phobia. I hate crabs And I'm not talking about the STD style. I talk you about crustacean why I Think they're horrid to look at I think I don't eat I won't eat them. I'll eat all other seafood I'll eat all other seafood, but I won't eat a crab you eat lobster. Yeah, how is that? So the inside into the the adult brain. I hate the crab. I also think it's a non -totally unnecessary Um Looking creature. They're so delicious though. You love them everyone.

2:13:21I know loves them my children adore them But if there's a big brown crown on a plate. I can't even sit in a room with it Really off Just an awful thing also and this is a good example right in the pantheon in the pantheon of hateful aesthetics, right? Right You have a you have an exoskeleton. So you so you're inside out You this thing or someone or something is decided that's gonna be inside out So it has a shell to protect its soft, right? Cuddly and as you describe delicious in it's why would you make that exoskeleton hairy? That's unnecessary It's also disgusting. This thing has hairs growing out of a shell.

2:13:59What off? That's the worst aesthetic of anything We're very lucky. They're small It's also interesting that people they catch them and snap their claws off and throw them back in the water because their claws are regenerate And they'll grow another claw that's from a film. That's not real No, it's real. No, it shouldn't be allowed. In other words, it should be fixed. It should be fiction It's that's right. That's from a horror movie type type in coconut crap. Oh, yeah, those are crazy They're like you like anything that you're scared or you're fascinated by it Someone did a someone did some research into the claw Foot bite force of these things and they were absolutely shocked at the talk and power they could generate Look at that guy holding one you get a perspective.

2:14:38What is that size of that thing? What is that? Come on That's unnecessary isn't it? Well So type in type in claw strength of coconut crap and you will be absolutely Horrified at what they found wow Look at a size of that thing They are freakish. Where do they live? They live on a couple of islands 3 ,300 Newton's That's so nuts That could take your hand off. Oh, yeah Wow The bite of mo it's stronger than the bite of most land animals including lepers Bears and wild dogs and it looks like something from a horror movie Do you know there's some speculation that that's what the fate of Amelia Earhart was?

2:15:30Yes So when I read that I just Yeah, she crashed got on the silent and the coconut crabs ate her That's insane. I mean luckily. I think they clamp slowly. They don't yeah, but more than a leopard What the fuck man? So what does that thing biting through is that metal? Oh, they're just horrendous There's that lovely guy on um Instagram. He's a fisherman who does the experiments for the lobs as he gets the lobster crushing claw and he puts stuff in the claw Yeah, and works out what they can chop in half I find that thoroughly addictive, but crustacea like that That's my ultimate nightmare. It's a hard life To hard life for them, you know, yeah, like and you can't make them pets.

2:16:13No That's how they're wired did it but the stats of that so stronger than a leopard bite That's so I would have never imagined that I would have never guessed no and I and I stay up at night worrying about this sometimes There's something called the Japanese with a giant spider crab So we're used to go on holiday as a kid was this lovely old Victorian soil -hotel in Cornwall It was run a bit like 40 towers. If I had it was like 40 towers Had the guy that run it that was the curious guy that made lots of jokes to people found a bit rude But he was wonderful and they only had about three magazines in their very smelly lounge area where all the old people would sit And one of them was a national geographic magazine from about 1975 But I'd always sit and read when my parents were doing other stuff And it had an ask about Japanese giants these giant spider crabs And there was just one picture of what in a tank with with his legs like seven feet apart something Well, let me see this and it's it's stayed with me it stayed with me For years I was reading about these crabs So I can't open the crabs giant spider crab Mate Japanese spider crab just just just trying to read these are from two giant spider crab Coconut crabs are from Japan Giant spider crab can't believe I'm sharing all this I Crabbs are a huge problem for me They really are my children know look at look at this what's that wow Are those things today taste good look at that are they coconut crabs delicious?

2:17:41I don't think I've never had anyone eating a coconut crab I wonder why Jesus Christ that's it That's so big I had no idea that there was a crab that's longer than a human being Absolutely disgraceful thing Can you eat a Japanese spider crab? Oh, I think you do looks like they got my ice so it looks like they're preparing The Japanese spider crab is no easy task. You gotta you gotta find a big pot. Yeah, right? You gotta break it up I guess Wow Now I'm what about um find out about the coconut crab can you eat coconut crabs? I might want to eat one I'm gonna send you a picture if I get one. I'll I'll I'll be glad to see that it's no longer moving.

2:18:28I just I just cannot get my head. Can you eat them? I want yes, it says above that above that and that's a dizzy. Oh, but look at it says Yes, coconut crabs are eaten as a delicacy on some islands and are considered an apradizia Can other places some say they're tasty and don't need any extra seasoning or cooking and can be eaten after boiling for about 10 to 15 minutes However, the species is threatened by intensive hunting. Oh poor babies. They ate Amelia Earhart. Who's fucking side of you on? I was reading they don't have shells. That's what their their claws are like their protection Oh, and they mostly on one island only eat other crabs Oh, wow, they're cannibals.

2:19:08Yeah, oh like the red red crabs I guess. Oh lead other crab. Well, we mostly eat other animals We're animals Dear me well, I've shared too much there so that's my ultimate fear crabs. I can remember Several times we'd be asked on top gear when we were going away You know you're okay with everything and I'd be thinking I'll do anything. I'll eat my own feces But if there's crabs there, I've got problems And only once it'd be go somewhere where there was oh we had to go there. We were just in Cuba filming the opening for this film and uh we were in uh Bay of pigs So we're actually there we were right there with uh with a mazerati and an old camaro film with his intro to a film totally random like being in Cuba I'll give you that in a minute okay, um and um and I don't know well, you know It was so punch -drunk with just travel and filming that I'm working so hard I you'd almost just wake up and guys to another mad place.

2:20:03I'm wearing Kazakhstan today Okay, we'll get on with it and looking back. I think Kazakhstan for 10 days with Matt fat Matt Leblanc from friends That's a mad thing to do. That's pretty mad. You know But at the time it was just like work anyhow so a bay of pigs and I looked at my phone. I thought this is This is the bay of pigs fucking out, you know This is where you know This is where it all went a bit wrong for America. This is historically quite a significant place. It's been a real problem Yeah, um anyhow And I look I'm looking around then there's lots going on and I look left I'm filming the opening piece to camera which was typically bad from me But the reason why it was really bad, but the look left there was a crap Down there shuffling around and I'm like I need that Gone but I can't admit to people that that that big is worrying me like I'm really worrying me I'm not I'm thinking does gonna crawl up my leg or something totally irrational I think we all have a creature maybe a bogeyman or bogey woman whatever it is That maybe we fear do you have one or all?

2:20:58No, but I think where that comes from I have a feeling it's genetic memory I think that's where a videophobia comes from an arachnophobia fear of snakes and spiders I think because some people we've experienced we experienced that out of fear factors well People have a real it seems like a genetic irrational fear of certain things And I really feel like that is some memory from either an ancestor getting bit or seeing someone get bit and die I think there's something to that there's a reason why it exists in some people and not another because it can't be completely irrational Right No, I think it's I think it's completely a genetic memory That's my my number one guess Cuba was fascinating because I suppose as American citizen you can't go that kind of you Can you go there now?

2:21:47I think you used to be able to go there. I think during the Obama administration they made it so you can go there It's an amazing place because it's it's one of the few Which is kind of crazy a government can tell you can't go somewhere like far. Yes, I work some of the so close to you as well Exactly you go there on a robot. It's a it's a museum is what it is. It's a fully functioning museum For automobiles for for for life in many ways, you know, it's not it's not something that's been allowed to develop The way that a country should have developed over the last 40 -50 years right so you have Um as a society that has limited technology And as as evolves the way that it that it does and I then you see how resourceful human beings can be with with reference to the automobile Yes, it's fascinating because there's really It's a strange mashup of weird Soviet intervention and Americana from the 50s and well that up to 50s so they kept these American cars going that should have died They've also got a whole load of Soviet era larders that came in when the Russians wanted to help them out and and also that's where their power stations come from their power station They have a coal -fired power station on the north side of the island But when it's operating has a plume of smoke that goes as far as the eye can see I mean to turn on me it's an amazing thing.

2:23:08I couldn't believe it. It's sort of slightly hidden from from all the tourists um It's yes, it's a It's a country that hasn't been allowed to develop at the same speed as the rest of the world and it's What 100 miles from the coast of the US or something? I mean it's 90 is it yeah, it's amazing It's a it's a well worth visiting if you can go just to see it Just show it just shows you what happens when human beings act absurdly. Did you feel safe over there? Totally yeah, totally safe. I had I had I in many ways I loved it in many ways. I wouldn't want to go again It's one of those curious places where I thought I've seen the right side of it if I scratched too deeply am I gonna See something I don't want to see right maybe that was it.

2:23:52Well, you certainly will I mean there's a reason why people are escaping there Yeah, of course they're trapped. Yeah, they're trapped in a communist dictatorship. Yeah, it's not good Yeah, but as a tourist you obviously presented something completely contorted on you. That's what happens And when you're making a TV show it's also a communist dictatorship. That's in a very unusual predicament Because they're not allowed to trade right so China's a communist dictatorship But we buy everything from China. Yeah, they're arguably worse than Cuba But we're not allowed to trade with Cuba because some shit that happened in the 60s Cuba can sell stuff to other countries other than America Right We're gonna with full of extra guys in there ramen But not America used to I think you can get them now in limited quantities But it used to be if you got a hold of Cuban cigars you would I would got I would get them I'm gonna tell you a thing I did that was illegal.

2:24:40I used to get them from England Yeah, and I used to get Cuban cigars I had a friend who lived in England and he would send me Cuban cigars and then later he would send me the labels So he would he would send me the cigars with no labels. Yeah, like in a like a ziplock bag send me a few cigars And then he would send me the labels in an envelope a couple days later The pollution in Havana was the worst I've ever experienced of a city I think when the wind changed that power of blue blue is straight over Well, there's a place was it in Indiana? There's where there's three coal fired power plants and if you go outside You can run your finger over someone's windshield and you have black cold dust on your finger And all these people in that area have all sorts of weird fucking diseases because they're just breathing in particulates every day We went to um One of the best things I did with top gear again A repeat phrase maybe I need to reconsider my negativity Was the Kazakhstan thing with with Matt So we went there and Rory was there as well and we we we ended up at bikernaul which is the cosmic drone Where they when I wear the Russian space program is based Um, and it's an incredible area.

2:25:51I mean, it's just mind -bendingly brilliant The vastness of that part of the world the Soviet Union If we think the America the United States America's big The Soviet Union was was on a scale that you cannot comprehend Kazakhstan was just a small bolt -on to Russia But in itself has I think the fourth longest border of any any country with Russia. It's enormous And bite this area of Called bikernaul the way that the Russians worked Was once they'd used the launch site they just go somewhere else Because it was so big they just abandoned that one move on to another one It's a bit like rabbit warrants, you know, just move on and they plotted all of it in a map Anyhow we went there and we watched um When we got close you were aware of the amount of heavy industry It was just the place was the first place I've been to where I thought I'm not sure I should be breathing this It just felt like you were breathing in stuff that was hurting you.

2:26:40I never I've been to You know Indian cities where there's heavy pollution, but that's just sort of diesel and petrol fumes There's something else there. Yeah, you know, you're like going what is that Um, but they they culminated with us watching a Soyuz rocket take off And they let us get much closer To film it than you would normally I'd be allowed to be And I've never watched a rocket take off before I haven't been to Cape Canaveral or anywhere in the US It was one of the most awe inspiring things you've ever seen sounds like such a cliche But watching a vehicle that has enough power to leave our atmosphere Is something I'd advise anyone to do they have the chance it it there's a There's sort of ripping sound in the air that people will have seen it will understand it feel it does feel like Just the power of this thing is shredding the atmosphere around you And it hits you in the solar plexus you have no control over this sort of rattling You get a chest and I think we were Less than a kilometer away from where it went off It was absolutely sensational to witness wow just power raw power And the idea that mr.

2:27:48Musk has got something that says more power from the Saturn five about to take off It's that that fascinates me that all of that sort of thing is just we talk about power and engines Your actions got a bit of grunt, but these things They just rattle you but the smell after was interesting It's got to be horrible. Yes, okay every time they launch. I mean how many cars does that account for You think about like the amount of pollution that's put out amount of carbon that's put out by the burning rockets I Can't even begin to quantify it and also what? And cars what what are they burning as well Talking about ropey fuels I was talking to some Guys that used to race sports cars and Formula 1 Machiniais when they were using some very funky fuels Because they they had There was lots of technology left over the second world war that the Germans had for jet engines that they had pioneered That had weird lubricants in them that allowed them to run at you know very high temperatures or all have properties Normal fuel didn't have and they would use it for qualifying particularly a Formula 1 And the drivers after one lap were gone.

2:28:57They were just spent There was also great stories about the fact that they would they sometimes have a sort of Area outside the Formula 1 garage. It wasn't as a developer to sport them, but they still had sponsors and guests And one particular team had you know all the trees they put outside just died in an afternoon Because this fuel was so obnoxious and I actually a guy called Andy Wallace who's fantastic Race driver who who's now the chief test driver for Bugatti tells some amazing stories about literally being hauled out of groups See race cars after qualifying because the fuel was just Impossible just poisoning them wow, but it gave them an extra hundred horsepower for that lap Well, how about lead at gasoline lead at gasoline has been studies that show that in the places with higher amounts of lead at gasoline There's a you can see the lower IQ in the kids And they think that it is drop people's IQ by a measurable amount like people that grew up Around lead at gasoline, which is me yeah, like during that time have are that we are dumber Because of lead at gasoline the pipes the pipes in our homes under 50 years ago.

2:30:02What made of lead Lead pipes Well, my friend Shane Gillis is in a hilarious bit about George Washington and George Washington had lead dentures So he had this lead thing where these fake teeth were pre so he had like lead in his mouth So he's getting lead poisoning all day long. I have a I have somewhere in my house something I bought from the internet which is Boots chemist so our chemists your CVS we have boots, which is our standard chemist It's a logo of of um health care of stuff that's good for you Boots used to sell cigarettes for coughs I've got some I've got a tin somewhere it's brilliant So it shows you how you should smoke them to get rid of your cough.

2:30:50Oh boy So I think that wasn't that longer no that's probably After the second world no before the second world war crazy. I would have 100 years ago They thought cigarettes are good for coughs. Of course they did But then someone Something like it is if I'd find the art the the bad and it AI says that mental cigarettes are flavored which to help with coughs Oh come on The menthol can decrease the cough reflex. I have which can help with coughs heard of that by reducing airway pain and irritation menthol can reduce the pain and irritation caused by cigarettes Decreasing the cough reflex menthol triggers cold sensitive nerves in the skin Which can decrease the cold with the cough reflex soothing a dry throat menthol can sue the dry throat feeling That's funny that AI is willing to say something that's very un -PC I fucked up here because I've never heard that well, it's probably true.

2:31:44It's terrible for you Yes, I hope our smoking can make you cough more interesting Yeah, can't you say menthol without it being in the form out of a cigarette? I'm sure Yeah, it's a cough drop I think yeah, but what we what we've learned about metallurgy Is is fascinating and it does it does mean that that's why We have to apply that to what we currently witness In the motor car in the old -world industry there is there's technology out there that will change something at some point We just don't know what it is yet. We're just going to happen Because we're having to relearn so much of what we thought was facts in other areas of our lives And I think maybe that's what I get frustrated by is that you can't wait for that unprecedented change to come Necessarily, but you have to assume at some point someone's going to make a battery that runs on waspiss or I can water or something It's gonna happen scientists to clever they have big four heads for a reason at the moment the argument is where there's not enough cobalt or making it the lithium from The it's a slightly speechist argument because I think it won't always be like that someone will some of all Invent something that means that we won't need the cobalt on the lithium well some guy invented a water -powered car a long time ago and he was murdered Do you know that story?

2:32:57It's one of the great conspiracy theories that he he yelled at he met with some people You know, they wanted to talk to him about this design and then he yelled they poisoned me and he ran outside and died Yeah, and then nobody ever heard about the water -powered car ever again after that. So what is all that? Fuck is on that shit So the mysterious death of standing myer and his water -powered car it's a wonderful conspiracy theory I haven't looked into it enough to know how much of it is true looks like a tamiya mugla underneath look at it Looks like it looks like the the wild one mm -hmm. So this guy developed this water -powered car that you know had incredible mileage Interesting messaging on the start of the vehicle.

2:33:41Yeah Jesus Christ a lady oh Is oh Jesus Christ is Lord. Oh, okay. It's cursive Stanley did Stanley Meyer die because he knew how to turn water into fuel This is a British newspaper isn't the express mm -hmm. What was this go back? I believe that's 80 I can't remember This thing is ridiculous. What kind of shit website is this it's some really bad one. I mean if there's another I'm sure there's other articles about the car that ran on wool. It's where it happened happened outside of in Columbus. Oh Okay, so So his bizarre death at age 57 ended work that if prove valid scroll up could Have ended reliance on fossil fuse people who knew him said his work through worldwide attention mysterious visitors from overseas Governments buying and lucrative buyout offers.

2:34:34I know that he was offered money to sell I think the why files did an episode on this the Myers death was laced with all sorts of story and conspiracy cloak and dagger stories Gross city police lieutenant Steve Robert Robinette lead detective on the case I told them to stand had died and they never said a word. He recalled absolutely nothing no condolences no questions Hmm, but how did it run on Walter? I don't know Um, Stephen Myers featured a numerous internet sites significant portion of the 1995 documentary It runs on water narrated by science fiction writer Arthur C Clark aired on BBC focus on his water fuel cell invention.

2:35:16It's a fuel cell. Okay. Hmm Who is ignored called a fraud and died without his hometown even remembering him was so much as a plaque Hmm But I have to believe That a piece of technology would emerge in the next 50 years That will make us all wonder why we all got so freaked out, you know Yeah, right especially over exhaust right says the basis for Myers research electrolysis is taught in middle school science labs electricity flows through water cracking the molecules and filling test tubes with oxygen and hydrogen bubbles A match is lighted the volatile gas is explode and prove that water is separated into its components Myers said his invention did so by using much less electricity than physicists say is possible Video show is contraption turning water into a frothy mix with within seconds Take so much energy to separate H2 from the O Settle high -oh -state university professor emeritus Neville rea Uh, physicists for more than 41 years that energy is pretty much not changed with time It's a fixed amount and nothing changes that Myers work defies the laws of conservation of energy Which states that energy cannot be created to destroy Basically, it says you cannot get something for nothing He may have had a nice way to store hydrogen and use it to make a very effective motor But there is no way to do something fancy and separate hydrogen with less energy Hmm So who knows it would but when he said the Lord sent me okay now it gets odd His first few words were the Lord sent me here to this home I'd like to use your home as an experiment wait.

2:37:01Okay. Hold on Myers creativity seem to peak when he met Charles and Valerie Hughes truck drivers who lived in the Jackson township Julia Hughes the youngest of the seven children was five years old when Meyer rang the doorbell of her home on Marlene drive His first few words were the Lord sent me here to this home I'd like to use your home as an experiment She said maybe it was just a two -story garage shop or the privacy of towering oak and sycamore trees Julia isn't sure what Meyer saw there, but she knew her parents didn't have room for a struggling inventor yet after visiting with the family for several hours Meyer stayed the night and then the next few years in the late 1970s and returned Meyer built the family a solar silo Designed to both heat and cool to home This structure required thousands of clear resin light guides a crude form of fiber optics Which Meyer baked and molded in the family kitchen Jesus Julia Hughes Recalled the chemical stench the system was supposed to channel the sun's rays into the tower base to heat water and generate electricity for an air conditioner Despite extensive efforts that included re plumbing the house the invention never worked.

2:38:11Oh, so you might have been a cook Hard to tell But but I tell you what you love a conspiracy theory. Oh, I love them. I know you do. I'm less I'm seduced by some yeah, but But I'd probably less into them than you are. I will say this The more you delve into The relationship between business and science and the way that our lives run It's very difficult not To assume that many ideas are crushed because they're not helpful for certain businesses And I think I think the automotive industry Is Is and has been at the forefront of that. Well the oil business Is the oil business in general Before we go too far One of the kids remembered some people showed up at the house and offered him quote $250 million to stop Yeah, the Arabs wanted to offer me $250 million to stop today you and this lovely family can live in peace and prosperity the rest of your days Meyer told them this the army officials meanwhile had questioned Meyer about what foreigners wanted Thinking that the deal might have been struck Charlie recalled Meyer telling the family Meyer discussed the offer in the Clark documentary many times over the last decade I've been offered enormous amounts of money simply to sell out or to sit on it The Arabs have offered me a total of a billion dollars total pay simply to sit on it and do nothing with it Hmm Prime me goes.

2:39:44I think I'll tell you why I said sure an event that definitely people like that event happened here that did shake my I'm less cynical probably what I'm less uh likely to to be as interested in conspiracy theories mainly because I maybe I lack your imagination I don't know what it is, but I I like I like maybe I'm terrified of the fact that I've been taken for a ride in too many areas of my life But dieselgate the Volkswagen thing that happened in this country really shook me Because I didn't think something could have happened on that scale explaining to people because it's pretty crazy Well effectively um Volkswagen were able to put software into their vehicles that allowed them to cheat in emissions tests um and a load of vehicles that were had stated emissions qualities Didn't have them when they were not on the test rig um And actually that that Process have been going on in many different ways for most motor cars forever But they're but the scale on which they offended and the fact they did it in the US meant they got absent hammered for it But you know if you have an Audi RS4 from 2007 and you start the engine up It idles in an old way the car feels very aggressive for the first 30 seconds that you start it That's because there's an air pump Inside the car that is basically forcing air through the exhaust faster than it needs to so that when you put it on a Test rig it has lower emissions than it should do this had been going on for a long time, but the scale of it Was I suppose an in sort of an industrial sub -defuge that I I didn't think was I don't think it happened right Um especially with the large corporation like Volkswagen.

2:41:27I know that did shake me because that I always I'm a flag bearer for my industry I'm proud to be part of the wider car industry And I didn't think that could happen and it and it was it wasn't just a bit of naughtiness. It was lies and how many people knew about it One has to assume quite a few yeah, you'd assume but I think I think I think they would have there was a moral complication to it because They were still making very clever Really quite clean vehicles They were you know they weren't trying to Cover up something absolutely hideous it was they were in the margins But it was still wrong.

2:42:10It was morally completely wrong And once they I once they got away with it they were stuck with it. They couldn't suddenly backtrack on it Right and there's and I think the It shook my confidence in In those large corporations I thought they were being more honest with us I probably made me more likely to believe conspiracy theories are with so I thought what if they're capable of that What else are they doing? Conspiracy theories are fascinating because some of them are bullshit and some of them are real and it's hard to figure out What's what yeah, you know, there's some crazy ones like the earth is flat and then there's some ones like this Yeah, you might have killed JFK yeah, you're like who who might have They might have it makes very good listening.

2:42:53I love listening to talk about it. Oh, they're fascinating, but I suppose I I tend to sit a bit further back and just I'd like to hear other people talk about them But when it enters your world, but when something becomes pertinent to you, right? You suddenly go hang on in it What else have they been doing here? Mm -hmm, and how bad was it? And how many of them did they get away with yeah for everyone that gets caught? It's not like they catch every conspiracy. Right. There's no way. No No, some of them sneak through and manage to be effective. Do you know the latest one about this gentleman who was a billionaire who'd apparently overvalued his company and Went to court for it and the possibility of him Winning this court battle was something like one half of 1 % this is my glitch is it yeah the guy who I just died on the boat and then right after he gets out the guy who he's with the co -defendant gets hit by a car And then he gets hit by a freak water spout and sinks his yacht I was discussing this over a few glasses of wine with some friends.

2:44:00It's a good. It's got rogan written all over This one has it's perfect for you. It's so too easy. I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna pass any comment I'm gonna be a softcock again, but I'm gonna say that I read it and my eyes Well, my eyebrows raise a thought as things like coincidence. Didn't the lawyer die as well Who else died the co -defendant was hit by a car in in Cambridge? I think in so the the the one one incident was a incident in the UK A few days ago. Was it a hit and run? No, they've got they have the person that hit the cyclist. I think they have got But they were asking for my information around it Did the person that hit the cyclist have any connection to anybody that?

2:44:42I don't know. Was it I don't know. I just read it just thought like yeah, I'm like oh my god Yeah billionaire autonomy co -founder Mike Lynch and Stephen Chamberlain's careers were intertwined for years in a fraud trial Then they died on the same day miles apart Oh I think I suppose the difficulty I have with that is that's a tragedy Fucked over some billionaires. Well, they they fucked over some very very We shoot at Pac -O. Yeah, so they sold they sold autonomy to you at Pac -O and there was a big He was extradited to the US and and I you know, I don't know. It's not my world I suppose the conspiracy theory thing is fascinating But then when it's in the context of people losing their lives like that I'm like, I want to comment because it's so awful what happens And and also going down in a boat was right up there for me of Jesus Christ also a freak waterspout if you've seen the size of this boat.

2:45:46Yeah, it's extraordinary Three to feet long. Yeah, how yeah, how did it say what happened? Oh, no, you love it You absolutely love it Because I got to think that there's people in this world That have the ability to do certain things to certain people that fucked them over I think you'll rise yeah, and that seems like That would qualify we're talking about they got ripped off by billions of dollars And then somehow know this guy gets off And then dies right away Yeah, and dies in the weirdest of ways a freak waterspout How many people die every year and freak waterspouts on 300 foot yards I'm doing my uncomfortable face.

2:46:32I just I it's so it's so out there. It's so out there. Yeah. Yeah, it really is And I I'll bring it back to something more mundane There were quite often things that happened in form in a one sport that I follow the most closely probably In the 90s and nortees that looking back You think there must have been someone had a button bigger mate things happen Because it was so beyond the coincidence and I never I never stopped to think of the implications of that thought But it's not gonna do that in a sport they can do it in the rest of your life And they always rig sports I mean people have been rigging sports since the beginning of sports betting But the sport that you're involved with he can't can you rig that oh yes people have rigged it People got in trouble for rigging it.

2:47:17Yeah, yeah certain Fighters may have an injury There's a controversy about a certain trainer that was involved in betting and then an online discord Server and they would talk about bets and they he'd make a lot of bets And he was making more money betting than other things and there was a fighter that he was Taking care of and that fighter apparently had a knee injury and went into the fight And then all this money got bet on this guy losing in the first round And so he throws a kick in the first round falls down gets beat up loses by TKO in the first round blows his knee out as needed apparently already been fucked And so this guy who is the trainer has now been he's being investigated by the feds He gets kicked out of the sport No one from his gym is allowed to compete in the UFC anymore And he's under investigation and if it turns out that they're what they're saying about him is true He's really rightly fucked.

2:48:14Yeah, I think actually there's a crossover here between conspiracy and cheating Now I think the greatest book that's not been written And never will be written is the greatest cheats in motorsport Some of the stories I've heard over the years are so good Just because what they do is they reveal The competitive nature of human beings but also ingenuity The you you will see people that most ingenious when they're cheating not when they're abiding by the rules right and formable one is about The phrase that the great mark donahue one of your great drivers mark donahue was a can -am driver He did a bit of full moments well.

2:48:52He coined the phrase the unfair advantage Which I phrase I love because it just defines so many sports Whether we like it or not we're searching for the unfair advantage only And in motorsport some of the cheats I've heard about are just just brilliant like what kind of stuff so I can remember Hearing a guy called win Percy who was a touring car driver from the UK in the sort of 60s and 70s describing how There was a famous commentator we had called Murray Walker He was the voice of our motorsport for 40 years He had a very distinctive voice he's a lovely man met him a few times And he had often described win Percy getting out of this particular car he'd been racing Covered in sweat because it was such a monster to drive But it turned out that it was a v12 and it was very very thirsty So to make sure that when they did a fuel check at the end of the race to make sure they were abiding by the rules He would be furiously pumping a hand pump underneath the seat To inflate a bladder in the fuel tank To cut off a load of the volume so that And he taught this story about I don't think I'm miss quoting is saying well that's why I was knackered It wasn't it was a v12 because on the warm down lap I knew I had to pump this thing like 40 times to fill up the bladder Wow and there's amazing stories of just just ingenious cheats I mean, there's so many of them.

2:50:10I mean former one is about Not getting caught. That's really what that's what it's about You know you it what's the line between interpreting rules and not getting caught Hmm and I love all of that And I have a few times said to people I know in this in those sports Can I write that book will you tell me they don't know I won't tell you any of the stories I'll tell them to you now as a friend but if that ever published I'm a dead man Right, but are the money involved but the ingenious cheating I mean that's in 1995 Toyota was excluded from the world running championship because it just had a brilliantly simple piece of cheating It it's there all the cars were turned the world rally cars were turbocharged And you have what's called a restrictor you know, any tape restrictor so you you actually make sure that you can't take more than a certain amount of air into the turbocharger which should limit the power and make it a level playful But they created this brilliantly simple bypass valve that meant that when the car was running the able to just go round And it wasn't the intake restrictor was completely redundant What they didn't realize was that there the world rally championship had a couple of situations where the cars run side by side it would be a drag race And so it's the Toyota just fucked up And then we went well that cheating are they And then they found it but it was this was you know perpetrated by a by Toyota by a car company And I suppose those things I find fascinating Wouldn't you tell them to don't get ahead in the straightaway?

2:51:36They didn't tell the driver's did no Oh Dirty they just knew that sometimes when they go in the car someone did that with a lever Wow, they didn't know and Formula One is not big in America Which is odd so how do you feel about it here in Austin because I saw it in Austin. It's amazing I love it. Yeah, I went to Koda that's that's we have that up there. Yeah, that's Koda Yeah, um my friend Bobby owns the place so you know He took me around and showed me and we went there for the races It's incredible. They put on one of the best races of the season here. It's awesome the tracks incredible And it's so fast.

2:52:15They're going so fast. It's so wild to watch Yeah, and I find it amazing how huge NASCAR is here where they're just going around an oval Just they do have some spring circuits don't they they do have some short arrivals But yeah Formula One is is more complex way more complex and the the vehicles themselves Are so incredible and they're so expensive It's just unbelievable how much money is involved in Formula One so it makes sense why people cheat a little bit I think It's this interpreter this this gray area of interpreting a rulebook that's complicated But also try not to get caught and some of the just the way that they've through the years And it creates subterfuge it creates games another great story We covered this on top here was one of the great interpreters of the rulebook was calling Chapman The founded Lotus and he had found a way In something called the Lotus I think 77 it was a car that andretty won the championship in They created a called ground effect So it's now a common thing but he worked out that if you sealed the sides of a car On the road you could effectively accelerate air underneath the car and create a low pressure area Which basically sucked the car to the ground So you were generating downforce not through wings but through accelerating air under the car I'm by the way any engineers this I'm not an engineer but I'm basically understanding if they're having driven these things But if I'm if my terminology is wrong I apologize but effectively You're generating downforce in a way that you can't see it on the vehicle.

2:53:47It's not got wings And what they would do is they'd lower these there was a sort of a handle They'd lower these skirts when they went out onto the tracks when the car went out on track in the in the in the palette It looked like a normal car But he he they were going so much faster than everyone else he needed to find a way of Diverting the attention to the other teams. So what he would do was at the end of a test session quite often He'd have a guy scuttled from the back of the garage With something underneath a piece of like cotton or something or a blanket and run over towards a service truck Never would see him do it.

2:54:22So all the teams were like they've got a trick differential They've got something special but it wasn't it was a kettle It was a kettle this guy was running around with underneath the towel Just said everyone thought it was a component. It was a total diversion And I met the guy that used to just run around with this He had a it was like a like a tea potty kettle thing He was just told at the end of the session put that under there and run away with it So everyone thinks it's like a different you know something And I think that's where I love motorsport Because it brings out these bizarre human competitive human behaviors What's also the margins of victor are so slim if you have The same horsepower same compound tires just different engineers putting it all together Yes, they may have the same tires, but this is you know These are bunch of people 400 people in different parts of the world are told this quite you know This is the rule book or where you go and the margin of and now within a tenth of each other on a track Yeah, it's amazing amazing.

2:55:24It is amazing. Yeah, but they're but they're all at it and they're all like There's always some conspiracy at the moment Red Bull apparently they thought they ever thought they had some special brakes system That they've now had to get rid of because the FAA was aware of it now Red Bull's complaining that McLaren and Mercedes have got flexible front wings It is it is it is the politics of the playground Being played out with billions of dollars on a racetrack and I and that's why I'm totally addicted to it the moment And how much of that engineering and technology gets to consumer cars? Good question I think direct crossover there's some But not as much as you'd hope, but it's undeniable that the brains That I involved in that sport when they go over to the road car side Carry with them a curiosity and a skill set that's been so enhanced by what they learned on the racetrack that we all benefit I believe that I think if you look for direct crossovers in all of these places it you come away disappointed But if you tell me that the person that has run Max Verstappen's car for the last three years If he went to be involved in the next Tesla model 3 He's gonna have a profound effect on it.

2:56:38He's gonna know shit He's gonna have a way of looking at that project that's gonna make it profoundly better. I believe that I once wrote a story for some in -house magazine I think for BAR racing when they had a race team about the crossover between Error nautical engineering and Formula One that's profound That really is. I mean the way a Formula One car sucks itself to the track is an upside down plane But there were further things as well the carbon ceramic brake disc was developed for what? Concorde Really? They had they couldn't stop Concorde it was just it was going through brakes obviously And someone went well, why don't we use different material for the rotor and that's where the carbon ceramic The brake came from So there is there's huge crossover in metallurgy and actually you know to broaden that What's the greatest legacy of your frankly amazing mind -boggling National space program, you know, it's it's what we learned about materials, isn't it?

2:57:33It nasa served To teach us all about materials this we we are benefiting now the car you there's something about the Raptor you'll go home in That wouldn't be there of nasa hadn't needed to have some weird material with a property that hadn't been required before I really believe that that's that's the incredible corollary of Of projects that are ambitious projects on that scale It has to be with like the defense department and the construction of fighter jets Oh aren't they up? I'm just Fascinated by them we did a film with the f 35 I raced an f 35 in a McLaren Speedtail And the level of classification around the vehicle was so difficult because I didn't realize that we don't there's a British government We don't own those planes we lead them from you.

2:58:22We're not allowed to own them really yeah So the IP stays with you guys and what we do with them is kind of up to you um, but we weren't allowed any cockpit shots at all Be what I've seen cider I just got a description from the from the pilot of what the aircraft could do Well, you know, they're doing those fighter jets now with AI running them And they beat human pilots 100 % of the time in dog fights do they yeah That the f 35 was one of the coolest man -made objects have ever seen they're incredible We had to go up there to So actually it was a bit like that bungee jump thing this was so serious that we had to be rigorous For example with the uh in the theater of war I'm not sure you can decide whether the ground is full of chips of stones or not But this they have a decontaminated area the runway has to you're not allowed to go in there and drop litter because it can get sucked up when it's doing that hovering thing So you go in there you're decontaminated and we spent several days working out how to run this drag race It started out with a genuine drag race between me in a McLaren and this f 35 And they had their data on how it accelerated and we had McLaren there with their data And we worked they worked out that the car would get off the line much quicker than the plane But overtake at a certain point But I was told very clearly But I couldn't get in the wash of the aircraft as it took off because it would just flip the car backwards And we had to sort of choreograph that bit not fake it but choreograph it So anyhow first run we did I was told that I'd be absolutely safe I'd be so far ahead of the plane That the plane would then be in the air by the time it went over me and we'd be away Anyhow first run we do I'm like this in this McLaren it's Hucking fast and it accelerates and I look left and I hear a noise and there's a plane coming past me on the ground And I thought I'm in trouble here and the front wheels of the car came off the ground About 130 something miles an hour He didn't do that All right, I was fully at guard Is any racing driver would tell you and I'm a pretty poor racing driver You know when the front wheels aren't on the ground.

3:00:23What do you do? Well, you just shit yourself and hope and you're so invested in it. You're like, well, it's going over It is going over. This is the greatest piece of television ever And I hope it doesn't and the thing just and the thing went it just went next to me and again I This is why I you know want to be someone that Express his joy while things have done And when an f -35 comes past you and it's just got off the ground Yeah, you were when this thing comes past you It just started screaming Fuck Does it show you look at that? Look at that thing there. That's incredible It's so nuts that they put you next to that thing that when it got when it was right by me It fucking and we never showed You're going 218 miles.

3:01:12No, that's the kilometer. It comes past me like that bang And I just thought and the as it did it the front wheels just went Wow, I'm in trouble here Wow But the power and the sound you know you talk about the internal combustion engine while they these electric things make no sound We are amateurs compared to what they get to play with yeah, and they have like look what 30 minutes of flight time before they run out I guess yeah, I don't think that thing can go very far, but you know all this factoring Dway it can just it can just decide to be hanging like a helicopter. Yeah, incredible It's remarkable But they don't share the IP at all.

3:01:52You're not allowed to we were not allowed to see inside it That is so wild that it can do that just hover in the air like that and shoot its Draft down Fucking crazy. Maybe that's the maybe that's the TV show. I just think there's a whole There's a is it boys toys. There's a lot of more sophisticated thing. There's a whole load of stuff that's got moving past I think you're overthinking it. I just like you and your passion for automobiles is all you need do it on the internet It'll be huge. I hope so. I think so. I don't think you need anything else. I quite like those things Well, they're pretty badass if you can get a hold of one of those.

3:02:26That's great too, but f22 if you beat to a show and see one of those I flew in an f18 Did it yeah with the blue angels wow was insane Insane yeah insane just the G for the physical effect on your body so extraordinary No, they don't use g suits either. They don't use gravity suits. So you have to hook It's close so you hold on to the You're forcing blood and you feel your consciousness closing like an elevator door You see it you see the darkness coming from the left and the right you're fighting it off I wasn't very good at it. I thought I'd be I was thought to be quite good because the people of our height Yeah, should be quite good at it, but I felt it I got put up on one of those extra 300s the cart the stun planes It's a prop thing, but you know, they're the ones that these and the redball air races And I once he got to sort of six seven g's yeah, I started to see Yeah, you have to fight it off.

3:03:18I think I got to seven and a half g's But those guys can go to like nine 10 g's like that. It's fucking insane the the pressure and the the maneuver ability These things the the pilot took me through like this canyon and you're you know hundred two hundred feet off the ground Just Just can't sideways. It's fucking insane. It's seen. I did a ridiculous film looking back with a guy called Andy Green Do you know Andy Green? No fastest man on earth He's the one still holds the world's land speed record. So he drove thrust SSC He was the first man to go supersonic in a car Um, and they had this thing called bloodhound And this is the last thing I'll boy with on this podcast So they had this thing called bloodhound which was to go a thousand miles an hour And they were going to drive it in on a some salt flats or some Some something to dry that inside Africa I think Anyhow it was it was supposed to be thunder by industry.

3:04:16They lost all his sponsors And they decided to try and publicly fund it and they couldn't And Andy during that phase said I've got an extra 300. He's an ex pilot fighter pilot because I think people that can drive these things Racing drivers are useless because the decision making so quick and profound they identified early on they need pilots Not racing drivers He said I've got an extra 300 and it's got this car has got various stages of propulsion you start off With a jet then it goes to a rocket and it and he goes So his madness he goes I've got an extra 300 and I've developed a way of doing error or erratic moves That will demonstrate the change in GeForce during the run So he's put there's a boy yourself with it.

3:04:57He's put he's put and there's a film if you type in my name That fucking thing type in my name and his name and you'll he'll There's a film on YouTube him taking me up in this stunt plane to put me through the G's That you'll have in the part and I honestly by the end of it How fast did he go in this thing? Oh my god look at that. He had oversteer over 600 miles an hour Look at it That was in the US Wow So he and he um But the way he put me through the GeForce is I'd have been a terrible fighter pilot I couldn't I kept getting gray. Get graying out pumping and everything. Yeah. Well those guys are all jacked That's one thing I found out about the blue angels They had like when you go to their training facility There's weightlifting equipment everywhere.

3:05:45You have to have muscles because you have to you're literally It's like brute force but you should have been brilliant at it then. Yeah It's not fun It's a lot of work So when I when I do some YouTube videos because can I come and drag you into a car? Yes, let's do it. I'm in Okay, let's go. I love talking to you. Thank you for all I'm talking to you too. Thanks for being here man It's great to see you again after all these years. Oh, I'll be back in 10 years No, let's have a quicker and let's definitely get you on YouTube on the internet do your own day It'll happen soon. You don't need other people.

3:06:18Thank you. Fuck those people Bye everybody You