#2230 - Evan Hafer

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32:58So here's a guy that went and did it one time. He's never been an anti -depressant since. Did he have to get off him before he went there and did it? I don't know exactly what the protocol is as far as like you have to get off and then you have to get back down there. I know that most of my friend group now, they've done it. And they have an extremely high success rate. You know, Vets has done a thousand former warfighters and they have an extremely high success rate where they're eliminating pharmaceuticals. So they'll go down and they'll do it one time. Maybe they've done subsequent sessions.

33:37And they have this really high success rate. And this is part of the issue. This is part of the issue. Yeah. We're under an epidemic of veteran suicide. Like more so than we ever have. And the worst thing about this too is it's also affecting our family and our kids. Like our kids are four times higher to commit suicide than our peer set. So it's not just the GWAT veteran community. Now it's our families and our children. You have something that has such a proven track record to help heal that's. And we can't do it without breaking the law. We have to leave the country. It's insane. So you can send me to Iraq under false pretenses.

34:21And you know, you can have wolf wits and chaney and rumsfeld and all these, this like orchestra of fucking idiots can send us all to Iraq for weapons and mass destruction. We can go fight the wars, come back. And now we have to break the law to go fix what's wrong with our heads or our emotions or not only our psychology, but did we're broken. Like we've been beat up and kind of shoved in a closet. And then we're sedated and told to shut the fuck up. And meanwhile, you know, wolf wits and bremmer and all these other guys, they get to walk around and provide, you know, public speeches about how fucking great they are because they're, you know, strategically important.

35:10Whereas my peer set, we're under an epidemic of suicide or kids are committing suicide. The VA's no help to us and we have to go break the law. It's like you get to go flip fucking coin and paint some paintings and you think that everything's okay. And that one doesn't make any sense. Out of all the ones, that's one that mushrooms you can do recreationally. No one's doing recreational eye -baking. I've never done it before. Have you done it? No. I've never done it, but everybody that I've talked to that they said it is one of the most like ruthlessly introspective journeys in your life. You don't, it's not fun at all.

35:47Dakota Meyer told me he's like, I fucking hated it. I couldn't believe someone made me do it. After it was over, it's like, what the fuck am I doing? It's not a fun time. It's not a recreational drug. It's not a drug of addiction. It's not a drug of dying. It's not, what's the, let's find out what the LD50 rate is for eye -baking. It's probably bananas. It's probably just like psilocybin. Probably can't really overdose on it. No, I don't know that. I don't know. I have a game I kill you. It sounds really crazy potent. Most of my close friends of Donny, their Iowasca or Ibegane, neither of which they would say is a good time.

36:23All of which have said, all of which 100 % and they've come back and been not only fundamentally changed but better. These are my business partner, Jared Taylor, he's gone and done eye -baking.

36:41Then multiple other people that probably don't want me to talk about them on the podcast. Guys that have been on 15, 20 different pharmaceuticals can literally scrape them off their dresser into a garbage can the day they get back. The fact that we aren't trying to evolve this section of the medicine, I know that Stanford did a study. I'm not exactly familiar with all the data associated with it. But the fact that we aren't leading the charge as a country to come up with dynamic out -of -the -box solutions for the guys that have gone overseas and done the hard and courageous task with this country.

37:25Then they come back and they can't get help and we're not pushing the envelope. That's a crime. I've got lots of issues with Iraq at this point. It's fundamentally, I have told this to people, Iraq is with me every day. Afghanistan was a part of my life, but Iraq fundamentally changed me for the rest of my life. I think about it every day, it's not going away, it'll never go away. What about Iraq that was much different than Afghanistan that changed you? Well, it's the first war experience I had.

38:05For me, I was like hookline and sinker, regime change, move, we've got to find weapons, mass destruction, we've got to eliminate the threat, we've got to fight them there so we don't have to fight them here. Everybody thought it was real. Hell yeah. There was nobody more motivated to go to war than me. I'm sure there was, but you know what I'm saying? You were in that group. You were gunned. Oh, 100%. It's not only, hey, we're going to go to war, we're going to do something good for America. These guys attacked the United States. We're going to eliminate the terrorist threat. And war is such a strange and surreal circumstance because it changes you for good, it changes you for the bad, and I've looked at this a lot.

38:56And I looked at life experience like a radio wave, almost like a band where you have highs, you have lows, and most people will call it 90 % of the United States. Their frequency only gets so high and only gets so low. And it basically stays within, we'll say, a fairly small band within the center. Combat, what happens is you go really high and you go really low and it forces you outside of social norms on a second to second basis. And then you do that over and over and over again. And so one person like getting a car wreck in their life and that goes really low. So it's a really high adrenaline dump and it goes really low because they have an injury.

39:39That's like one thing. Well, going out in a combat zone multiple night, like not only multiple nights a week. Sometimes you're doing multiple targets a night. You might go, you might be getting in with the rough equivalent of adrenaline car wreck, the rough equivalent of a car wreck from an adrenaline dump and a high and a low. You might doing that three or four times a night. And then you're doing that night after night, week after week. And it fundamentally changes you because you have to chop all of this down because if you get too ramped up and too chaotic, you're going to lose control and you won't be able to complete your mission criteria.

40:22If you get too low, you also won't be able to achieve your mission criteria. Your survival instincts kick down. So it chops your ability to feel all the way down to a normal person's bandwidth because it's a survival mechanism. And this is just my own assessment. So from a combat experience perspective, the first time you feel it, and I'll tell you, I mean, the first time I was in an ambush, I was losing my shit. I mean, anybody who tells you they're not fucking scared, they're either fundamentally flawed. They're like Travis Pastroni doesn't have a fear portion of his brain or they're just lying.

41:08You're scared out of your fucking mind. Going north, driving north into Iraq, you're looking into the deep dark abyss of the unknown. What the fuck am I going to be a coward? Am I going to live? Am I going to die? I mean, our casualty, projected casualty rates was that we are going to lose most of our ODA. So you're stepping into a situation where you're going, okay, well, I know out of this six shooter that I'm going to play Russian or LATW with, there are four bullets in this. Oh my God. And you're driving north going, okay, let's fucking do it. So you've already capitulated and given yourself up to die, which is it's actually a very cathartic and I think personally an experience that you can evolve from because at that point, if you're dead, you can live uninhibited.

42:04Everything I do from this point forward was as gravy on the on the steak man, I'm already dead. I was driving north in Iraq and I like through like the desert and my best friend and I are like driving north and and you have like hours to stare off into the fucking sand. You know, you're you've got night vision goggles or whatever. I had a whole fictionalized funeral for myself. I just fucking, what else am I going to do, right? You're just like driving north, you know, and there's nothing going on. So I had a whole fictionalized funeral. I buried myself and so I was already dead or at least I felt like that.

42:49And then we get in her first engagement and the world starts cracking apart and your mind can't keep up to what what's actually happening. You'll hear the gunfire and you know, I felt the explosion. I looked in the rear of the mirror, the Humvee, which is sounds crazy. I looked in the rear of the mirror and I saw this like car -sized chunk of fire flying behind the vehicle. Like so distinctly remember this. And I'm turning my my team leader and I'm like, we gotta get the fuck out of here. You know, I'm like losing it, right? I'm so stupid. I'm so stupid. We gotta get the fuck out of here. You know, like losing it, dude.

43:32I'm just like losing it. And he's like, and he's cool, man. He's like calm, cool. He's on the radio, you know, he's like, you know, vehicle one, you know, or vehicle three, this is vehicle one, vehicle three, this is vehicle one. And we're checking to see if we have calms between us and the other vehicles. And I'm fucking losing it. Where are you fuck out of here? You know, it's like, okay, because I mean, you know, you're used to like watching movies or whatever. And it's the first time anything like this has ever happened. Right.

44:03And and at this point, you know, the full insurgency hasn't kicked off that we're hunting Fatty Ian. These guys weren't the most sophisticated cats on the planet. They weren't that good. So but we end up pushing through and then consolidating at the end of this. And fundamentally, this, this like changed my tactical experience and combat forever because my team leader who I respect in the love, he was killed two years later. He's one of my best friends. What's my best friend? Um, he turns to me and he goes, Hey man, if you don't have a solution to the problem, just shut the fuck up.

44:47That's great advice. I know. That's great advice across the board. Yeah. And I I was like, okay, Roger that. You know, I was like, okay, fucking Roger that, man. And then it became a practice discipline when shit's going super sideways and you know, bullets and it went built of line. I hate sounding like that. I don't want to say I don't want to sound like that at all. Um, but that's what it is. Dude, you keep your shit together. And then I became by the time I, my, my last ambush in Iraq, I was in was my, I saw a book in this experience with ambushes. Yeah, I was in Mozul and I was in a little BMW trying to work my way and I was, I was working I was basically low like you're trying to fly under the radar, your low viz CIA at this point.

45:45So we're trying to blend in. We got hit at a checkpoint and they light us up. And so now I'm alone in a car with another guy in the CIA chief. And the entire Iraqi army in Mozul Iraq is essentially pursuing us through the, from, I mean, Mozul is the size of Los Angeles. And I started at the north end of Los Angeles, basically, and had to work my way to the southern end of Los Angeles being shot at. And, um, and I'm trying to sort through the problem, man. Like I got a fucking map sheet and you don't know. I mean, this is, this is Mad Max and the fucking Thunder Dome. And Mozul was one of the most fucked up cities in Iraq.

46:27Like it was, it looked like going back to Stalingrad in different sections of this place. It was a complete shit show. And I'm alone with my, you know, the guys with and I'm trying to navigate through the city and help the driver. We were being pursued from, from literally north to south. Yeah, being shot at and we're going, okay, right turn, right turn, right turn. And I'm, I have the, I have like the dragons are at the bumper. They're gonna fuck it. They're gonna pull me out of this car and try my fucking head off. Like they're gonna turn my card. It's with cheese. They're gonna fucking try my head off.

47:07I'm dead. We're dead. And I have like, I brought up Kyle was, they were on station. We had a really good, really good relationship with these, with these guys. And I was like, hey, you know, you this is me. I'm in a, you know, black BMW like. And you know, I'm moving, you know, from north to south. And, and the helicopter came back. So I know who you are. I just fucking, you got the everybody following you because we, and not all the checkpoints are created equal. And for whatever reason, they decided they were gonna kill set day. And I mean, you don't have time. You're not gonna sit around and be like, why do you guys want to kill us?

47:48Well, we're just good guys, you know, you're just gonna keep moving. I had to work my way all the way south to a bridge. And I had like one last, one last fucking hillmary, man. Like we had to get across, we had to get across a bridge into a place called Diamondback. And I didn't have a QRF because they couldn't pin us down a quick reaction force. And like the Kai was like these, these saves our life because they had, they had the roads blocked off on the bridge. And I was basically smoking in it like a hundred fucking kilometers an hour. And the Kai was came down and like literally dropped their fucking skids in the front on the front of the car and panned around like we're gonna kill all you fuckers.

48:35Wow. Yeah. And I whipped over at one of the guys I looked over and like flipped them off. And I was like, you dead, you know, and then like, like parting the seas like Moses or whatever they moved the fucking cars and we we drove back in. That was it. So book ending, my point of that conversation was I was losing my shit the first one, right? And I came back and I was talking the Kai was and they're like, bro, we didn't know how bad this was because it sounded like you were ordering a pizza. But everything, everything in between was like, like rep after rep after rep after rep was like like calm down, keep your shit together.

49:25And one of my really close friends is Guy Jeff Kirkham my first team sergeant like awesome fucking guy like one of the most tactically relevant people in my life. He's like psychology is more contagious than the flu. So when you start losing your shit, oh, that's so true. It infects everybody else around you. What a great quote. Yeah, and psychology is more infectious than the flu. That is a great quote. Yeah, man. That's so real. So real. That's so real. That's so real. It was everything. Everything. Everything. It controlled every piece of what I would do from that point forward. Like lose your shit in a gun fight.

50:14And then you infect everybody else around you. Yes. Rise to the occasion. Be the calm and the chaos. Become, you know, even if you don't feel like it, even if you're you're a wigan out, man. Like, of course internally, you can't you can barely keep your shit together. But what you do is you're like, okay, but I got a, I got to project this because if I infect everybody else with my chaos, I'm injecting more chaos into the equation and we're all, we're all going to run the possibility of dying because of this because of my actions. That I think that's why people gravitate towards inspirational figures is because they're trying to get some of that psychology.

50:58They're trying to get it worn off on them. You know, great quotes and great feats and fascinating people. You want to absorb some of that psychology. That is such a great great quote though, because it's so true. If you're around someone that's freaking out, you're trying to keep your shit together. It's so hard to keep your shit together. You can't. Right. If you're around a bunch of dudes, or just stoic surgeons and stoic. Yeah. And they, there's no flexion. What I would say is like in the time and repetition in the community, I mean, there's a default emotion that is acceptable. It's, you know, anger.

51:37Right. So anger and when I say joy, it's like joy from gallows humor, typically, right? But it's like you have to, everybody becomes a stoic. Yeah. Nothing can phase you. And if you are a guy that is phased, you're a liability. You're a liability. You're going to get chopped. Yeah. You're infected. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. So I rack. So going back to what I was talking about with Iraq.

52:09I'm supercharged. And my reality started to kind of crumble is we went up. We were on the first ODAs and we did this joint op with the CIA to go meet this guy, Moktaadal, Sotter. This is early on. This is like March of the war. And Moktaadal, Sotter became a prominent figure later on in the war. He was really relatively well, like not known at all in the beginning of it. And I was working with the CIA case officer at that point, not just me. It was like my entire team. And Moktaadal's like, he's a bad guy. Like he's just a real piece of shit. And at that point, and on his off was this town. And we went out to the meeting with him.

52:58And we came back. And all of us on the military, per military side were like, this guy needs to die. Like we need to actually go and he has a smaller force. He's basically going to be the instrument of the Iranians. And we're having this big debate in the team room. And everybody that carried it gone, like we speak, we speak animal kingdom. We know when there's a threat. And then we have this case officer who's like a, you know, adjunct professor, a fucking Georgetown guy didn't know his ass from a home of the ground. And we're like, this guy needs to die. We need to go like get on him now. And case officer was like, no, he's going to work with us, you know.

53:42We're like, they wanted him to be an ass. Yeah. Like this guy is a fucking stupid. Like this guy is a, he's a shea, supposedly shea cleric. You know, if you know that Iraq, you got 60 % of the country shea. It's typically going to answer that Iran. You've got 15, 20 % is up north. It's the Kurds. And then you've got the rest is Sunni. And we're like, this guy's not going to fucking work with us. And this guy's a real piece of shit. And he's already spinning up a militia. He's going to be a problem. No, no, no. And we're like, okay, like you're the, you're the big brain on Brad, you know, you're the, you're the PhD, man, like sure.

54:23You know, so we acquiesce. And years later, I don't know how many guys died going into going back into Nijaf trying to find this fucking guy. I don't know how many. I mean, it was a whole basically surge push or probably a division to try to go find this guy. But we had the opportunity to kill him right there. Like literally we could have like he had less than 40 guys on the compound. We could have like gone out and got him right like that night. And then he became a problem and not only to become a problem, it was like the, the decision makers were so poor at that point in the early in the war, it started to really affect me in the sense of like I was still botten sold, but I started really think these guys might not know what the fuck they're doing when, it was like wolf wits and rums fell and Brennan, when they debathified Iraq so after we invaded, they did the same called debathification, which was basically they fired the military and everybody that was involved in the bath party.

55:42And we're, once again, we're in and it's rums fell talking about where we're debathifying our rap, we're firing everybody. And I'm not exaggerating everybody in the, everybody in the team and was like, what the fuck? Like you guys are, you guys are going to create the insurgency. Like it was on the ground that moment, that second, like I wanted to throw, like I wanted to throw a fucking brick through the TV. Like I, I was like these guys are paint by numbers creating an insurgency, they have no fucking clue what they're doing. And that was like that moment, which is fairly early, where I lost a lot of confidence in the decision makers, but okay, you know, the question is why you keep going back?

56:38Well, because you want to try to search for meaning and you're trying to find the actual purpose. Like what is the purpose? Like are there WMDs here? Like are there, you know, like legit, direct traces back to 9 -11? Are there things that we're doing that are going to directly affect and protect America? And you're kind of searching for it. And not kind of, you are. Like that's what you're doing, or at least that's what I was doing. And by the time, by the time I left in 2009, I just figured I was going to die. Like I was like, fuck this place, like, like, like, I lived Iraq, right? And then I was like, well, I think time and repetition and thinking that you're dead for that long and then searching for not only some, some, what I would say is good and the war itself, because there is good.

57:55You have your buddies, you have the camaraderie, you have the adrenaline, but you also think you're going to fucking die every day for years on end. And that's not fundamentally turns out it's probably not good for you, psychologically, I guess. And so I went to Afghanistan thinking, well, and I went to train Afghanis for a force up there. And when I went to train those guys, it was, hey, if I can train Afghanis to take on the war, maybe I can protect 18 -year -old kids from getting their fucking legs blown off. Maybe I can protect the 20 -year -old kid from the baraska from getting a fucking RPG stuff through their face.

58:45And I was older and I was also willing to die. So the kids, when I say the kids, you know, 18, 20 years old, like man, it's not, you know, it's not fun to watch those, when I say that that's an understatement, it's so heartbreaking to watch a kid that's never been to fucking combat, like die. It, it changes everything in your life. And so you go from, you know, Iraq to Afghanistan. And I'm watching all this stuff unfold. And I don't want to say it's all negative because there's, you know, there were things that were very positive. But I'm so cheated by the time I get there that I'm like, oh, if I can save some Americans, I'll save some Americans.

59:43And you know, if not at least this will be an interesting experience. And then, you know, there's a laundry list of other things that we can talk about. I don't want to get so fucking down, I guess. It seems like it's impossible not to once you go back on it. And there's, how could you not? And the overwhelming negative experiences, the overwhelming horrific experiences. Well, I think that's where I have this massive distrust in politicians. And I think that's part of the reason they have, they have squandered the courage of the American servicemen in these, these forever wars that we've entered in under lies.

1:00:38So like, you know, wolfowids and W and rumsfeld and, and, yeah. And sorry, man, I don't, I don't have any respect for those guys. Like, I don't not only do I not have any respect for those guys, I have a profound amount of hatred for their arrogance. Because I'm like 20s. I'm not, I'm not making excuses, but you know, there's plenty of guys like me that were not only hooklain and sinker. And I still would, I'd still sign up for this country. I think service is a remarkable courage, it's courage and service back to our community is something we have to cherish. Like, we do. But when you have an orchestra of idiots that are manipulating the courageous men and women of our country to go into these wars based on a neocon pipe dream.

1:01:32And there's no consequences. You know, you can pull out of Afghanistan, and leave billions of dollars of of equipment. Who the fuck got fired? But if I made a mistake, if me and my buddies made a mistake, we fucking, we lost our lives. We go to jail. Like, we lost our clearances. And I'm not trying to sound like a whiny bitch. I'm just saying like, no consequences for these guys. Nothing, nothing. You know, they get to go paint paintings and they think it's okay. Imagine no consequences for lying about weapons of mass destruction. And it has there ever been a large scale investigation as to what led them to either believe or to push the narrative that there was weapons of mass destruction.

1:02:15Well, I think if you read, I mean, I mean, there's a lot, I think there's a lot of like, there's a lot of books out there, obviously, and whether or not you have to kind of sort through the actual documents and figure out like where these guys were at. And I've spent a little bit of my life trying to understand from their perspective. And I honestly think big part of it is the guys who are making the decisions. They're hubris. They're utopian belief that they were going to be able to rebuild Iraq like Houston. You know, like, oh, it's an oil country, you know, and you know, they really believed that if they didn't rain in this rogue nation of Iraq, that Iraq was going to eventually contribute to terrorism.

1:03:06And you had guys that were so consumed with their intelligence when it flipped to not only hubris, but they didn't have wisdom. They had intelligence. The Wolfowitz is a smart guy. He's not an idiot. The problem is he's not wise. These guys weren't wise men. There's a difference between having an high IQ and having the experience and repetition, seeing death and destruction, seeing people's lives fucking torn apart. And then understanding something from reading a book or thinking about it from an economics perspective. And, you know, I think Wolfowitz, Rumsfeld, Cheney, they had this belief that they could do anything they wanted to validate this.

1:03:56And they did. They had to data mine information and pull and pluck from different analysts that agreed with them. But the most of the intel community didn't agree with them. They're like, we had defeated the Iraqi army to the point when I say defeated it. Like, if we go back to the 90s, we say desert storm was 91. And then from that point forward, you can basically say, you know, HW to Clinton administration, Clinton administration with the economic sanctions. And with the integrated bombing campaigns that they had led throughout the 90s, we had essentially stuff that guy back into a hole where the only thing he could do was sell oil on the black market.

1:04:39And he had a really, he had a, he had a fascist state where he, he and his family had, you know, complete control out of the country. But he wasn't going to be a threat from an international terrorism perspective. That's just false. It's not only false, but it is patently false. And they had to mine the data to validate it. They had to lie. They had to sift through and find and pick and pull the pieces of information. And they really thought this was going to be a fucking cakewalk. They did because of desert storm, you think they thought because of desert storm and what they, and they were listening to these assets like, um, uh, Chalabi and some of these Iraq, uh, former Iraqi exiles and are listening to these guys.

1:05:26We, by the way, we're also manipulated by the Iranians and paid for by Iranian intel guys, uh, they're Iranian assets. They're listening to these people and they were living their own echo chambers, validating this, this idea that it was better for regime change for the international, not only the international economy, but it was going to be a stable, uh, petroleum based country where we could integrate democracy. And none of these guys were arabes. None of these guys actually understood the Middle East, not one. They didn't have any combat experience. They didn't really have any combat experience from the long term low intensity conflict, uh, guerrilla warfare perspective.

1:06:13They were given not only the information, but they were given a, uh, most of the information they were given was, was saying this is going to be much more complex than you think it's going to be. And they denied not only the opinions, but the information and they went ahead with their fucking plans anyway. Ramsfeld chopped single handedly, dictated how many people were going to participate in the war. Like he was dictating how many divisions that was going to take. And he's like, actually, I think you could do it for half that. Like he was like trying to negotiate how many guys that Tommy Franks was going to use to invade Iraq.

1:06:53And Tommy Franks didn't have the balls to say actually, I need two more divisions. So a lot of this is just like fundamentally, these are professional politicians and bureaucrats drinking their own piss, like Osean earlier, you know, like you can drink your own piss once or twice before you can start to shut down and will fucking kill you, right? These guys are all sitting around in their echo chambers, talking to the same types of people, defining how they were going to send servicemen and women to Iraq. And they were wrong. Not only were they wrong, but they were told otherwise by lots of different people to include, I mean, Tony Blair had a lot of different issues with this.

1:07:37Colin Powell essentially sold this and got the dominoes to fall on the entire thing. Because he, they knew that Colin Powell was so respected that if he sat in front of the UN with tenant, who was the director of the CIA right behind him and held up this little thing of, of, you know, VX or whatever it was that they could push it across the line from the international community. I mean, these guys were crooked, man. And not only were they crooked, they were so fundamentally wrong. And there's no consequences. Nothing. Zero consequences. They put Martha Stewart and Jill. Yeah. Yeah, they'd go after Trump for fucking two years on, you know, Russia collusion.

1:08:19It's like, you spent $7 trillion in thousands of American lives, hundreds of thousands of lives in Afghanistan and Iraq. And you're saying, you're going to put this guy through the ringer for two years because there might be some dossier that was paid for by the Clintons. Like, who's the criminal? Like, and so for me, yeah, I'll get all wound up when it comes to this because rep after rep, you're after year, my two closest friends in the world were literally one torn in half by a EFP, which was a direct, a Iranian manufactured, shape charge. You know, my other friend was turned into fucking moon dust.

1:09:03And I mean, these are my two closest friends in the world. Like, as I grew up with in in the army, I spent every fucking day with. And since then, I've had obviously more friends, but I mean, there's the two closest friends in the earliest part of the war. So I'm so directly affected by this because it fundamentally changed what I was forever. It gave me a profound amount of mistrust in my government, you know, in the decision makers, I don't believe, I actually don't believe what they're telling me anymore. I have a lot of skepticism when it comes to the people that are pulling the the handles in government.

1:09:53And I have to go to my peer set in what I tell people is, man, my, my, my currency is courage, right? It's like, that's what I broke her in. So my friends that have gone through the GWAT, which I'm extremely happy for all these GWAT guys that are in like getting appointed to these positions, you know, you've got Pete, you've got Tulsi, Hi JD. Like, they fundamentally know that what war is, and when you have decision makers that have never been to war and their kids will never go to war, and Chinese kids never went to war, W's kids never went to war, rums, like, and none of these guys, by the way, they're all Vietnam era guys, none of them went to fucking Vietnam.

1:10:38So it's really easy. Trump didn't either, right? You got a bunch of deferments. But I think the difference is is that when somebody saying stop the endless wars, I am more than happy to go chips in on that narrative that I am to go, oh, we need to invest in and put more time, money, energy into creating more chaos and destruction in the American service members lives or the lives of other people. Did you ever see that speech with Mike Pence and Tucker Carlson? No. Tucker Carlson essentially ended Mike Pence's political career. Really? In one speech, yeah. Because this was when Pence was running for president.

1:11:22And Tucker was sitting there with him and Pence was talking about getting helicopters and tanks and weapons to Ukraine. And he was explaining how they were being incompetent because they weren't providing them with what they needed. And Tucker went on this rant. So you can find it. It's probably, I bet you could find it under that. Here it is. Listen to this. Thank you for making sure the Tucker part because it's a forward format. Let me hear what he says. Look, you just start right with your cursor. Click with your cursor.

1:12:00We'll let somebody transfer some jets. I'm sorry, Mr. Vice President. I know you're running for president. You are dressed that the Ukrainians don't have enough American tanks. Every city in the United States has become much worse over the past three years. Drive around. There's not one city that's gotten better in the United States. And it's visible. Our economy has degraded. The suicide rate has jumped. Public filth and disorder and crime have exponentially increased. And yet your concern is that the Ukrainians, a country most people can't find out a map who's received tens of billions US tax dollars don't have enough tanks.

1:12:41I think it's a fair question to ask like where's the concern for the United States in that? Well, it's not my concern. I've heard that routine from you before, but that's not my concern. I'm running for president of the United States because I think this country's in a lot of trouble. I think Joe Biden is weak and America at home and abroad. And as president of the United States, we're going to store law and order in our cities. We're going to secure our border. We're going to get this economy moving again. And we're going to make sure that we have men and women on our courts at every level that will stand for the right to life and defend all the God -given liberties enshrined in our Constitution.

1:13:19Anybody that says that we can't be the leader of the free world and solve our problems at home has a pretty small view of the greatest nation on earth. We can do both. And as president of the United States, we will secure our border. We will support our military. We will revive our economy and stand by our values. And we will also lead the world for freedom under my administration. I promise you. Amen. Vice President Mike Pence, thank you very much. Just that. That's not my concern. That's not my concern. What the fuck are you talking about? How would you ever answer anything that way? That is not my concern.

1:13:57That's not your concern. You don't think you just made a really good point that we're we're really confused. First of all, aren't we like a trillion dollars in debt? How do we have 35 and a half trillion dollars in debt? It's crazy. Crazy. How do we have the money? How do we have the money to send to Iraq and we don't have the money to fix our cities? How and how can you say that's not my concern? That is the opposite of what Trump is. That is nonsense. Not that he isn't an nonsense but that is not a person's real feelings. That is just political speech. That's just we're going to clean up our country.

1:14:37We're going to preserve the right. I'll I memorize. It's memorizing sound by exactly exactly. And that's the entire problem with Washington right there. Yeah. Exactly. They memorize sound bites. They say one thing. They do the other thing. Exactly. Exactly. Completely. They've lost the trust of their constituents. They've lost the trust of the American public. By the way, it's administration after administration. It's politician after politician. It shouldn't be a surprise if people don't like politicians. Look at that guy. He's a fucking robot. He's weird. He's a weird dude. He's weird. You know, they kept trying to say, J .D.'s weird.

1:15:14J .D.'s not weird at all. I met that guy. He's fucking cool. He's normal. Smartest shit. I could hang with that guy. He's not even a little weird. That guy's weird. I guess anybody who's that smart is weird. People go to Yale. People that he's weird in that way. That's an odd dude. You don't see a lot of those. But normal. That guy's bizarre. His face doesn't move. Did you have Botox at 80? What the fuck is going on? You're weird. I think they have low like use and they're pushing that thing to the red. That's why they're actually so afraid to do anything because they're like, I have they're like, I'm really pushing this thing.

1:15:52I've got like a hundie like a 105, but my parents were rich. I went to Yale. If I break outside of my box, actually people are going to know that I'm fucking retard. Right. Well, I still also think that if you're that ambition, you have ambition at that level and you're so driven to become the alpha that you want to be the president, the amount of work that's involved in that doesn't leave a whole lot of room for reading. Doesn't leave a whole lot of room for watching documentaries and having important in -depth conversations with people expanding your understanding of the world. It's very narrow.

1:16:29They're basically actors. A lot of most of these people exhibit a lot of the traits that I see in actors. This desired a morph oneself to please the people around you, the saying the things that you think people want to hear because you want to get ahead. It's all very similar. They're actors. The fact that these actors can rise to a position where they can actually dictate what these military veterans do and don't do when they have no knowledge or experience in this. The fact that that's a real thing is fucking crazy. It's really crazy. I think that's, by the time I left, I was so jaded and the motivating factor was, oh, sorry.

1:17:18No man will ever have control over my destiny again. I will not put a bit in my mouth for another man in the government. They will not be making decisions for me. Yeah, I don't think we can recall a time in our history. Where we did trust the government, which is such a weird thing to say. I used to think it was the Obama administration. But boy, Obama during this Kamala Harris administration, it changed my opinion to that guy. Did you have a high opinion of him before? Yeah, I did just as an intelligent person in the statesman. I felt like he's probably caught up in the system. It's very difficult to make real meaningful change.

1:18:07You think you're going to do something and then you get into office and you're like, oh, God, what a fucking quagmire this place is. But watching him just straight up lie about Trump, the thing that got me was that very fine people thing, the white supremacist thing. They just kept trying to say that he was a racist, which is this thing that I think worked in 2017. I think it worked back then. I don't think it works anymore. I don't think people believe it anymore. I think that we've gotten numbed all this stuff. It's a sky is falling thing. Yeah. I'm crying a little for whatever. It's like, you guys can only call me a fascist so many times.

1:18:44I mean, like the New York Times wrote that article a couple of years ago, right? Where I'm like, it was the front of the coffee cup, where it was like, do you want Trump 2024? Do you want low taxes? Do you want this? Yeah. I'm like, I want all that. Sounds good. And you can only call me a fascist, racist asshole. I mean, to be fair, like I can float into the asshole category relative easy. But you can only call me a fascist. Yeah. Only when prompted. Yeah. It's, you know what, my fucking favorite things of this whole election cycle has been yesterday. When Biden and Trump set down the White House, yeah, Biden voted for Trump.

1:19:24I guarantee it. I fucking guarantee it. I never saw that dude so happy in his fucking life. He lost his party lost. He was happy when Obama had a shake hands with Trump and do the whole transition thing. Obama looked like Jesus Christ. Look at look at his fucking smile, dude. Trump's like a look at his fucking smile, man. That's like when your kid gets married. That dude looks like a hairless cat. Look at him. It's great. First of all, what have they done to him? What have they done to his face? Go back to the other picture because there's more high res. Look at his mug, man. First of all, for sure, he got something going on with his forehead.

1:20:12They both talks to shit. I was for her. They gave him a facelift for sure. There's a bunch of different things they did, which very ill advised by the way, folks. Look at Trump.

1:20:25He get your face pulled back like a lizard. He just more like a lizard. Everything's your lizard already. But look at that smile. That motherfucker's never been happier in his life. In his life. He's like that bitch. She went down. You can't tell me he wasn't happy. Like when he put that mag a hat on, you ever see that? Oh, yeah, yeah. He put the mag a hat on. He took it with him on the plane. I'm guarantee you a guarantee you that motherfucker was happy. He had a giant smile on his face. He said, welcome back to him. I thought it was Hitler. I thought he was dangerous. That's what they all said, right?

1:21:02It's like, hey, this is the he's a threat to democracy. I thought he was a fascist. And then all of a sudden, it's like, oh, hey, we're going to have a smooth transition here. This was the guy that you said was sharp as a tack. He was getting up into four months ago. Four months ago, that guy was going to be running again. And now here he is smiling like a Cheshire cat. How big was his, that's a crazy smile. Man, he looks, he looks like he's wearing a mask. He might be. There was a one fake Biden. Did you ever see the fake Biden? Yeah, yeah. The tall guy. That guy was so much taller. I was like, six, four.

1:21:39He's a giant Biden. It made no sense. They're going to smoke that one by us. Like it's like, dude, this guy's like, you know, six, seven could be playing in the NBA. He was so much taller. They showed Jill and him together. Jill's like, like, what happened? That's a different human being. Totally. It's so nuts, man. It's so nuts. All the different things that happened during this election are wilder than anything you've ever seen in a fucking movie. It brought, I think it brought so many more people into politics, too. And people, the more people pay attention to what's going on with politicians, with the country, I don't think that's a bad thing because I think bureaucrats and politicians like, they directly benefit from people not paying attention.

1:22:24Yes. And so they only want you to pay attention once a year when they're going to try to get everybody galvanized around a couple little stupid things and then get them out to the voting booth. But not too many. We don't want a lot of complex thought out of the voters. We don't really want them to think about too much. Because we still got a national deficit that we got to increase. And I got to align the pockets of all my buddies. You know, Raytheon, North of Grumman and Lockheed Martin. We don't want them to get in too far. Don't start talking about the reserve or don't start talking about the other stuff.

1:22:58I think that's what it is. Well, I think that's also why politicians are some of them at least are terrified of podcasts. Yeah. Because you do have to talk about that. But that's what makes guys like JD and guys like Trump unique in that they will just sit and talk with anybody. I mean, he's had with Theo Vaughn with Theo talked to him about doing coke. That's awesome. He's so funny. He was amazing. It was amazing. Theo's an ability to be himself no matter who he's talking to. And him talking to Trump about how he used to love to do coke. It was like, and Trump's just sitting there, which was super funny, by the way.

1:23:34He's sitting like, poor guy. Like you see Theo falling apart in front of you. Like, Jesus Christ, I thought I was running for president here. I think I might have helped this young fella. Who do I need to talk to you about this? But like, you know, Kamala didn't have the ability to do that. Or if she did, nobody brought it out of her. I was hoping I could. I really was. I was hoping I could have a conversation with her. There's all this talk now that the reason why she didn't do it is because of progressive people in her party, the pushback, which might have some truth to it. But for the record, they offered me two very specific days and in different places in the country to travel and then go do it and do it for an hour.

1:24:13I said, I didn't want to do that. And especially after Trump had done it here in three hours, I'm like, this is the only way to do it. And Elon said it best. He said, he goes, you could kind of bullshit someone for an hour because hour two and hour three. Like that's that's when the real you comes out. Yeah, you're you're going to get it's the real you you're going to you're going to tear the layers off the onion, right? 100 % 100. It might make you cry. Yeah. And more you peel it and more you might be like, oh, this person's. How much are you bullshit in the world? Right. And the quote about Trump or the narrative about Trump has always been that he's bullshit.

1:24:49Everybody that he's a con man. He's definitely very persuasive. You know, Scott Adams has wrote about this pretty much in depth about how well Trump practices the art of persuasion. You know, the art of the deal. He's great at making people his friend and making relationships. And if you're his enemy, fuck you, scorched earth. You know, it's like this and there's fear of that. You don't want to get on his bad side. There's all this like there's this art of like how he negotiates and has gone through this years and years and years of business. But but that's him. That's the guys right there. You could talk to him about everything and anything.

1:25:24He's right there. He's not protecting any of his ideas. He called a girl. He's allegedly slept with horse face when he was the president on Twitter. It's so funny. It's the wildest shit. So you're getting what you get. That's who the guy is. And you love I like him. I I've gone I've grown to like him. I had a much more negative opinion of him back in the day because it was there's only so much you can pay attention to and do deep dives on before you lose your fucking mind. And with him, I was like, Oh, that guy. The grab him by the pussy guy. It's probably not good for the country. That seems crazy.

1:25:57But as time went on, I was like, Oh, you need a guy that is completely crazy to expose how corrupt the whole system is. And how they all collude together and how they all they all say this. There's all these montages of clips of news organizations saying the same narrative outright over and over verbatim word by word. They're getting fed this by someone, some entities, some they're somehow or another they're collaborating. And they're all choosing this very specific narrative and they're running with it and they're trying to destroy people with it. And I saw them do it with me. Yeah. I saw them do it with me during the COVID thing.

1:26:36And it was all motivated by the pharmaceutical drug companies and the profits. And they were terrified that someone's going to come along and somehow another a notch in this little thing that they've created, which is a devious little thing that they've done. Where they eliminated all sorts of other remedies. They cut out all these generic drugs that possibly could have been used to help people. They denied people to use the monoclonal antibodies. They pushed the fucking shit out of this one thing so they can make money off of it. And they did an collusion with the media. No one acted like a journalist.

1:27:07No one looked at the excess deaths. No one looked at the instances of myocarditis and young people. No one looked at any of that. There was no journalism. It just showed everyone that the whole system is bought and paid for. It's all corrupt. And the only way you could find out who a person really is is to listen to them talk for long periods of time. It's the only thing. It's the only truth serum we have left. And even that's not 100 % effective. But it's pretty good. It's pretty your brain knows bullshit. You know, you ever like met some guy and like he's dating this girl that you know and there's just something about this.

1:27:46It's like what he's shaking my hand. He's being nice to me. And I'm like, I don't trust this motherfucker. Like some's gross about this guy. And then you find out he's beaten shit. But it's always this thing like you feel something. If you talk to someone long enough, there's patterns in the way they talk, the way they think, the way they consider things, whether or not they can admit that they're wrong or whether or not they can tell you why they changed their mind, whether or how do they form their narratives? Like what bad paths were they on? And what personal correction did they make? And how long did it take for you got to a better place?

1:28:20You learn about people when you hear them talk for long periods of time. You can't fake personal growth. You can't fake like stuff you've learned. You can't fake flaws that you're willing to expose to people so that they can perhaps see them in themselves. You can't fake that. And all those people like my pants, he's got zero of that. You can't sit that down. That guy down and have a conversation, a real conversation with them. He's so afraid. Honestly, I don't think he even knows who he is. Like guys like that don't even know who they are. Like an actor. Yeah, yeah, they're like actors. Like my buddy Dave, we were talking yesterday.

1:28:59You met him another night. And I have known him for 20 years. Great guy. Like, who's a lot of fun? Dude, you know, we met in Kabul back in the day. Dave, Dave and I like we go way back. He's good friends of Bruce and with my friend. Yeah, yeah, crazy. Like because he's a team guy, right? So he's like former CLC eye guy. And Dave and we're talking about this. And when you when you can just be authentically engaged with people, where you can just be yourself. And that's part of the issue with I think a lot of vets is in why they like why they connect really well with vets is because you can just authentically engage with people and say, I this person knows I'm a little bit broken.

1:29:43This person knows that I've done shit that I'm not super proud of. And they know that I've got a dark sense of humor. But I can like just kind of open I can open my heart and just have a real conversation with somebody. And that's the shit you chase. Yeah, where you can just be yourself. And you can talk about stuff. And you can like try to evolve the way you're thinking and feeling. Right. And these artificial bullshit conversations that we have throughout our day with people we don't give a shit about are these like, you know, inauthentic, unreal, you know, veneer people. I have no interest in having conversation with a fake person.

1:30:20That's stupid. The best thing that I took out of moving to Texas. Yeah. For moving to LA. I have way less of those conversations. I have almost none of them here. On my conversations with here, look with normal people. Right. They're normal. So many people are infected by the rhythm of Hollywood. Which is just about people trying to become successful. And the way you become successful in Hollywood is you get chosen because you have to go on auditions. Right. That's the that's the primary. Right. The number one top of the food chain. Well, I guess rock star rock star and movie star or number one and number two maybe interchangeable.

1:30:54Maybe they're the same same if it's a 10 like biggest stars in the world. It's 10 movie stars and rock stars. And movie stars. Everything you do is about your relationships with people. And whether or not people think you align with them politically and whether or not you support the right causes. You are the bowtie, the Oscars, you act proper. You do all the things that you're supposed to do. And if you do all the things you're supposed to do, then you get into the club. And if you don't do all the things you're going to do, then they're not going to use you. They're going to use Daniel Craig.

1:31:27They're going to use this guy. They're going to use that guy. They're going to use Dave Bautista. They're going to use the rock. They're going to use. There's so many guys that want these roles and there's only so many good roles, especially if you're going to be a male movie star. So no one can color outside the lines. And Dennis Quaid is like one of the rare few male movie stars who just fucking completely gave up. He's like, I support Trump. I support I'm a Christian. I sing gospel music like fuck you. I quit. He did this Reagan movie. It was a Reagan movie. It's about a 1980s president. They wouldn't let him advertise on certain social media networks because they said it was during the time of the election and he could affect the election.

1:32:15What was it? Was it Facebook? What's it? What's it? What's it? What's it? It's a scene from was a YouTuber Facebook. Some one of the social media outlets kept him from advertising this movie, which is a great movie about Reagan where he plays Reagan. He does a fucking amazing job. There's nothing to do with today. It's about a guy who's dead. He's dead. Dad. He's been dead forever. He was dead his last year in office. He was fucking up full on all time. That's the thing with this whole social media censorship demonization, like the way that they've honestly, and how I say they, like there's a big group.

1:32:55I mean, you were talking about it the Trump show and then it's not trending. You can't even find it. The firearms community on YouTube deals with this all the time. Oh, yeah. All the time. You know, the guys that have the huge YouTube channels from the firearms perspective, sure. They they're demonetized. They have to upload multiple times or like a good friend. My good friend Collins, Kory on noir. Yeah. His fucking show. He can't get it to grow. He can't get his Instagram to grow. He's like completely stifled. And they're keeping the lid on this. Yeah. I mean, like Brandon Herrera was actually on the podcast Facebook acknowledged mistake and left to the research.

1:33:36Yeah. Yeah. You acknowledge it. Look at this. He expressed belief that Facebook labeled the content as an attempt to sway an election. Yeah. Like the the entire thank you Facebook. They said they're just friends, but that's what they said.

1:33:56It the entire firearms community and it's weird because we when I say we we talk about it all the time, like whether it's you know, the biggest YouTube channels on for the firearm space, they're constantly battling trying to keep their channels up. This is a constitutionally protected right. Right. And because there's a difference in political opinion, they can they can tip the scale, right, which is completely insane to me. Right. And there and there's a lot of traffic. I mean, you think about some of these really big channels that are out there. These guys drive millions and millions of views.

1:34:35People obviously want to watch and they can't increase their reach or they get demonetized and they're constantly screwed with over and over and over again. And that's the way that we've I think a lot of us have felt we've been living under the thumb of, you know, our social media oligarchs that are deciding whether or not our information is agreeable to their political opinion. It's to have to tell you the time that I was having a conversation with a Facebook YouTube executive and my wife had a grab my leg on the table and stop me because it's seriously in Hawaii. Okay. So I'm with a friend and if my friend was a executive at Google, a very nice person, great, no problems with them.

1:35:19We're all having a good time. We're sitting down drinking and talking and I got a couple in me and this lady who's a big wig at YouTube sits down across from me and we start talking and I said when it comes so we get into this conversation. It's very friendly conversation. Nothing problematic at all. I don't think she knows you know, even notes why I am. And this is a long time ago. So this is like 2015 -14. So my podcast is not that big. It's not that big at all. Let's finally, I can tell you exactly what it was. When did Sam Harris and Douglas Murray have a conversation? When did the strange death of Europe come out?

1:36:00Tell me about that. That's Douglas Murray's amazing book that has been proved now to be absolutely accurate and his assessment of what was going to happen to Europe with Muslim integration. Essentially, the guy nailed it and him and Sam Harris. Okay. So you have two public intellectuals who are having a conversation about cultures and about the what is different about these Islamic cultures and their desire to impose sharia law, like in least in certain areas. So they're having this conversation. And it gets labeled as it gets flagged off this guy's account. So I find out about this video because this guy has an account and he put I don't remember where he posted it maybe Twitter, but he said I got flagged on YouTube for having this in my playlist as something that I watch, like not even something he hosts on his channel.

1:36:58So I asked the lady, I said, why would someone get flagged for a conversation? She was hate speech. Just like that. Just like that. I was hate speech. I go, do you remember the conversation? Because I watched the conversation. I don't think it was hate speech at all. It was definitely hate speech. I put it between two public and then my wife just clapped on my neck because she sees a fucking thing. I'm rabid. Now it's too public intellectuals having a conversation about a real thing that's happening in the world. And there's no hate speech in that. There's no slurs. There's no degrading of people in a generalization of people.

1:37:32There's no racism. This is, they're talking about real cultural differences and how they're going to affect Europe. And this fucking lady just, it's hate speech. The arrogance, the way she said it to me, she was a big executive. And that was like, oh boy, I was just boiling. I was boiling. And thank God my wife grabbed my leg. She fuckered. She grabbed the shit out of my leg because I was ready to go because the lady was going to engage with me. And I was like, okay, this is a podcast. No, you're fucked. You're fucked. You're fucked. You're just lucky. There's no cameras here, which you're saying is absolutely crazy.

1:38:12Like, who are you to make that distinction? And do you have any idea how that affects us culturally? When a person like yourself who lives in this fucking San Francisco, this whole bizarre tech cult bubble, that's what you live in. And you want to impose this crazy left disrespective on everyone in the world to the point where you're not even allowing to world renowned public intellectuals have a public discussion about this in front of an audience. I would deal with that all the time where people, I would talk about the Middle East. I spent most of my adult life in the Middle East. I was in Iraq.

1:38:52I was in Jerusalem. I was all around the Middle East in Africa. And I would just say, I just don't agree with the way that Saudi Arabia runs. I don't agree with the monarchy. I don't agree with Islamic Sharia law. I don't agree, oh, you're a fucking racist. And you're like, what? No, man, I just don't think that it's the best way to go about it. It's a bunch of different ways people live. It's like, no, I'm not a racist. I've lived there. I've been there. I've spent a ton of time there. I think this is better and these are the reasons why. And people didn't even want to have a conversation. Oh, you're racist.

1:39:30But this is what's crazy. You have to be able to have those conversations even if that person's wrong. Like if someone wants to get on YouTube and tell the world why Sharia law is better, I think they should be able to do that. I let them do it and let someone counter it and let them have debates. And Sam Harris has had a bunch of debates like that. They're you can watch them online. They're amazing. Let people figure out who they agree with. And if you just shut down discourse and say that it's hate speech and you're defining hate speech as no slurs, there's no like we got to kill all these people.

1:40:05There's none of that. There's no hate in this conversation. You're saying hate speech is disagreeing with a narrative that all leftists must subscribe to regardless of any objective assessment of the facts. And you just sitting down and looking at and go, you know, I don't think I agree with this aspect of it. Like I think that like telling women that they have to wear a hijab or there's that that's you're not giving them the choice. You're not giving someone choices. Just fundamentally bad for the race for humans. It's suppression. Anything outside of a meritocracy in the context of being able to evolve a conversation based on the best idea wins.

1:40:41And when you're chopping out 50 % of your population and saying their base of burden and where they belong is just essentially for yes. Yeah. This is the problem that I have with this. And anytime that I've had this conversation around the Middle East where like these are the things I don't like about it. And I mean, there's lots of different things. It could be the you know that the the the Arab men will typically wear this very long open bottom guard. Right. It's typically referred to as a man dress. I'm like, God, I hate that thing. That's things stupid. Like I've had to wear it. You know, and I do wear underwear.

1:41:20Did you wear underwear? Sometimes you should. I'm going to hijab. I weird times. Yeah. I had like a tiny little like belt -fed machine gun that I'd have to wear because I'm a small guy right. I'm a hundred and fucking 60 pounds. And so I would often be the woman because I could be the fucking I got a feminine frame man. Yeah. Yeah. Got you know, birthing hips of course. But you know, I could get a little saw with which is a squat automatic weapon. A little belt -fed machine gun and a couple of frags underneath of his job. And I could sit in the back seat. Oh wow. It's like surprise. Be a child.

1:41:57I'm not a woman.

1:42:03Picture in you with a job and a belt -fed machine gun under your dress is fucking hilarious. It's so much fun man. Like, did you have like a thing where you could pop it up like a like a Loki jacket? Yeah. Yeah. So you'd Velcro. So we had we had a whole department in the agency where they they would like design costumes and ship for you. So you could I had like I had this fake mustache. I got a picture of it. I'll fucking send it to you. But I had this fake mustache and like they would put Tanner and fake mustache and like some glasses. I'd like drive around looking like Saddam have the time. Like like that fucking America world police movie.

1:42:41Oh yeah. Full on. And and it's so funny because like you'd have like a no shit of person put makeup on you before you like go out to do something. You like I have fake mustache and you know or for me I'm like just give me a job. I already know what I'm doing. So you're the fucking put me in the lady thing. I don't be the fat girl. I don't be the lady thing. Are we a lot of wear makeup at all? Or the Islamic women a lot of wear makeup under their hijab or not? Yeah. Yeah. They can't depending on the on the on where they are. Some parts they don't let them do it. Some parts yeah depending on on how extreme they are.

1:43:18But if you went to the Kuwait or something like that they would flash it. You know it's like a signify it signify that they're they're they're like crazy. You know. Let's see. Little. Little. Hussy. Oh my god. I saw our nostrils. Sorry. Aegal. Spitches. Why? Is it a while though that that religion the absolute most suppressed religion. Suppressive religion when it comes to women and gays are the ones that the progressives are so vehemently defending. Like that's the one they defend over all religions. You can be is like like a leftist will accuse you readily and quickly of being a Islamophobic.

1:44:00It's a great thing. You shut you down. You it's a great pejorative. But no one ever accuses you of being an anti -Christian. No one. It never comes up. No one no one there's not even a word right. You can have a Islamophobic. Is there a Christianophobic? I've never heard it. What is what is a word like a disparaging word for someone who is is prejudice against Christians? Does it exist? I don't know. I mean it probably doesn't even it's like honky. Yeah. Yeah. It's like racist term for white people cracker. Doesn't work. Caucasian cis male. I don't even know what that means. Christianophobia or whatever.

1:44:36Christianophobia. See that's that's never anyone out of that. That's too much garbly gook. You can't say it fast. No. No. Islamophobia is kind of fun. Yeah. Islamophobia flows. It sounds like you're intellectual. Well, this podcast is filled with Islamophobia first of all. Let's just yeah discuss this. This is really important. We need to direct them to feminism. But I think that's so funny because when I when I listen to academics, you know, I'll plop a YouTube and I'll go down a rabbit hole on a certain thing and I'll listen to an academic and then half of them, I shouldn't say half of them like a good portion of them.

1:45:12They're talking about things they've never actually experienced. So for me, I've I've lived in the Middle East. Like I've I've lived in Jerusalem. Like I've lived in interacted and been in these cultures on a and and seen them in a very vivid way. And when I say this, like tactical and combat experience specifically in these countries, it's it's it's very vivid. And part of the problem with, you know, this differentiation. Let's go back to it. But this differentiation between the decision makers and the people actually implementing the the tactical execution on the ground is that there's a huge disconnect from the reality.

1:45:59They don't have the wisdom to understand what it is. And what I used to talk people is like I was almost like a zookeeper where I would usher depending on the person. I would usher them through the fucking zoo so they could see what's going on. But they would see it from afar. And I kept the lions from eating them. Right. And there's this very clear differentiation between the people in charge. And most of them shouldn't have been in combat zone specifically in the agency. They should have not have been in the in a combat zone. And when when you unpack the agency and you look at you have paramilitary guys and they're more than more than qualified to be there.

1:46:37And then you have like the cocktail circuit guys. And they they're just trying to get their combat tour so they can get promoted to another fucking spot. But they actually have no business being there. Meaning they need guys like me to keep them alive. Like they they're just like getting in days for the ledger. There is a very famous infamous case officer from coast back in the day. And I was on the ground there. Not in coast and cobble at the time. And she was being groomed to be the assistant director. There's a great book on it called Double Agent. But I was on the ground when it happened. And she had this asset that she was trying to get in, which is an agency asset that she was trying to get into a base in coast.

1:47:29Once again, this person has no they should not be here. They should be in in Germany going to a cocktail party. Like pretending like they're really cool because they have high intellect, but they have no contacts to going down to the basis of reality. And these are like rules of the jungle. Like this power is the only language they speak. Like you can't intellect your way out of this thing. Like as a fucking bullet is a bullet. A bat is a bat. Like it will win over your articulation every time. If you want to win a debate and you just put an axe handle through somebody's fucking head, that's how you win.

1:48:10Right? It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. So they bring in this asset. And she's like, oh, you know, this asset is the guy. He's going to give us the coordinates to Ben Laden. We've been working with him for a long time. He's an amazing guy. It's his birthday. He wants us to bring him a cake. So she bypasses all the security systems bringing in a guy from Pakistan. So she gets him because he's like, I don't want to go through any security. I'm your trusted guy. I don't want to go through. First, I don't want to go through any security. So she tells security, stand down. She doesn't tell anybody about it.

1:48:50She brings this guy in through the gate. Like blows him through. Now the security guys mind you are like, what the fuck did you just do? They're running down to this situation to try to get ahead of it. He steps out and he looks like the Michelin Tiger man of fucking clocks off. Oh, God. And three of my friends were killed in that suicide bomb. She was killed, ultimately. And but that's a perfect example. And I mean, there's like multiple different examples of there's a different cadence mindset and capability associated with what I would say is the paramilitary guys versus the case officers, the spies.

1:49:34There's just totally different guys. And they tried to intermingle because of capabilities and more importantly, promotions to try to get people like promoted, which is another reason why some significant things have to change over there. And they got guys. People do you just you were supposed to protect these people? Yeah. So they could be collection officers on the ground. I mean, like time after time example, after example, I had this guy in this town called Lashka Gar on the middle of fucking nowhere. And before we go there, so let's rewind it. I rack. I had a I had a spy that we were working with.

1:50:21And they're called case officers and they didn't seem. And we go out to pick her up from the air field and we're like bringing her to where she needs to go. And we pick her up and she gets in the car behind she gets in the car behind me. And she takes out her pistol. She points it and I'm in the passenger seat. She's right behind me. She takes out her clock. She puts a magazine and it racks the slide right behind my head like directly into the back of my head. Oh my god. And I turn around and I'm like, and I'll tell you exactly what I said. I'm like, what the fuck are you doing as I turn around?

1:51:01I'm like, give me that thing. Like, and I called her, I called her some like very rude, very rude things, right? So I'm like, what the fuck are you doing? Don't take your pistol out. I go, if both of us are dead, then think about it. But I'm going to keep this you just don't have it anymore. As I gave her back, I actually gave her back the empty pistol. As I listen, if both of us are dead, feel free. Take one of our, take one of our guns, take both of our guns out of give a shit because I'm dead. But I get back in the chief of base at the time, pulls me in. It's fucking super good, dude. And he's like, calls me and he's like, hey, man, I heard you had quite an exchange with somebody and you know, we don't really appreciate this and you know, I might be, I might have to send you home.

1:51:53And I was like, did she tell you what she dead? He was like, no, I just thought she got in the car and you told her like, you know, you fucking dumb, whatever. And give me your gun. He was like, no, she racked her slide into the back of my head. And he's like, oh god, get out of here. I'll talk to her. It's like, oh god, get out of here. I'll talk to her. She's for gets. But it's like, they even have to show competency and weapons use. Yeah, but it's, it's, it's, do they go through the same sort of program? Everybody thinks there's like this Jason born type person, you know, like spies are Jason born or something like that.

1:52:32It's like, it's just not fundamentally correct. Like any soft guy, there, any soft guy is so more, much more proficient firearms. I taught a selection and vetting course for a former soft guys that wanted to come into the, the agency. And I taught it for a couple of years. And I was one of the spies. And I would shoot their qualification course with my left hand. Like on two hours of sleep, still half in the fucking back. Like it's just so like ridiculously ingrained. Yeah. And more importantly, it's, that's not their job, right? They're, they're, they're collection people. And I'm defending them to a certain degree because they're very high IQ, their selection criteria, and their courses are very difficult for that.

1:53:29No, they, they don't belong in those places. Like when you go into the, when you go into a combat zone in when it's a very complex, because there's different, different areas in combat zones and some of them are more dangerous than others. You can't have some of those people there. It's too dangerous, man. You've got to have collection people that are on the military side that can handle themselves unilaterally. And you can't have like your regular hum, hum drums by this isn't Jason Bourne. They're, they're, they're not competent. And more importantly, that's, that's not their thing. It's, it's the thing of proficient artisans in combat collection and the art of war.

1:54:15And that is a very subset niche profession of guys that are extremely competent and very dangerous. Why do we want to believe in a Jason Bourne? I think it's it. Love that. They love it. They love that narrative. Some supers by 007 dude that can fuck everybody up. It's fun. Right. Oh, we, we noticed your, your, your, your, your, your really good boxer and your local gym and you went to Yale. We're going to recruit you. Like it. Fuck out of here. Let's do stupid. He's a judo champion. Yeah. He's a judo champion. Yeah. They'd always started to see. Yeah. Oh, man. Yeah. We, we, we noticed you were hitting the bags and you, you know, you're, yeah, right.

1:54:57Politically science major in Yale. This is a guy with glasses and a hat on watch. You run around the track. I think we found our man. If they only knew the bureaucratic steps that it took to like get into it where it's just like so much paperwork and interviews and it's, and it's, and it's like, who is this guy? What is it done? Well, it's wild to me is the spies that infiltrate terrorist organizations. Like there's, there's people that are in the IDF that have infiltrated Amos. They live with them. They're in there. They're in there. Lots. Isn't that crazy? Yeah. It's so respectable. That life.

1:55:36Oh, that life is nuts, man. Worried you're going to be found out and these guys knowing, Hamas knowing that a certain percentage of these people have to be Israelis? Well, that is so crazy that they do that. When you have those guys and we need those guys, like I'm not. Oh, yeah. Like we need those guys. Must be so exciting. The non -official cover, the knocks. Yeah. Like that's that I, I mean that there's so much respect. Would you were explaining that one guy that's a professor? Yeah. Well, yeah. So, I mean out of all the guys, like I had such a unique ride in history and times, right? Where, you know, looking out the window, kind of just being a passenger and history and then being able to talk to some of these guys.

1:56:23And I would sit down and I would always find like the older guy that's in the, you know, the, we have like dining halls or agency has their own separate dining halls and bars and shit like that. And I sat down with a guy one day and this is like, hey, man, what's your story? You know, and he was telling me he was a, he was an anthropology professor, the University of Washington. And he was, he was, he was finishing his PhD and he was crossing the McKenzie traverse in Canada. And he did it in era appropriate clothing in a canoe and the whole fucking thing, right? Is it is completely insane? Oh my god.

1:57:01He's like so insane. And I was like, go out, how'd you get in? You know, and that's so he's making his way across. He gets to a cabin. He's starving. He's going to die. He's explaining this to me. He's like, I'm going to die. I break into this trapper cabin. I find a bunch of old like old canned food. I gorge, I just like, engorge myself. And now I have the screaming shits. And I'm like wiping my ass with this national geographic. And I pull out this ad and the agency used to have ads in national geographic. And he thought to himself, wow, that's, that's really interesting. I should apply. So he applied when he got back.

1:57:52Imagine this is Ariel. You're fucking starving. Then you're eating botchels of filled cans of beans with pork and shit. Wiping your ass with the national geographic. You see it that I mean, it's a fucking scene in a movie. It's insane. That's the scene in a movie. So, right. It goes back to the university, Washington becomes a professor. The agency, he goes through the entire process. The agency recruits him. He goes through training. But still he has to keep his his double life going. And so he starts a life as a double life. In fact, becomes a professor while he's in the agency. Correct. Wow.

1:58:28So from the jump, he's got a double life. It's not like he gets recruited. He's some Nobel Prize winner. And they say we need you to be for America. Yeah. Wow. In his first job, I'll never forget him describing this to me because I didn't know. I didn't know any of this. So it's part history, part, just agency history. And he goes, my first job was I flew to Angola. And I just had a suitcase full of my money. And they dropped me off in the middle of nowhere. And they're like, go kill Cubans. That was his job. Jesus Christ. Just a bag of money. That was it. One straight directive. Okay. And so in defense here, that's cool as shit.

1:59:16Like, it's a pile of trust. That's okay. Here's a bag of money. Yeah. Go kill some Cubans because you had, you know, it's a proxy war, right, between South Africa and that it was the Soviets and the Cuban by proxy. They were both supporting each other. They were both supporting the communist revolution in Angola. So we're pushing back as from the state's perspective. We're pushing back against the Soviet intervention, which was driven from the Cuban. So he had a huge, huge, huge Cuban intervention, which is something most people don't realize. And I just thought it was fascinating because it was the first time I heard about it.

2:00:01And here's this guy that his job was, here's a bag of money. Go kill Cubans. That's your job. Wow. He's a pretty cool. While he's a professor. So he'd be like, going, so he could go back to, you know, whatever university and go, okay, kids, I know I've been out on a dig, you know, in, or I've been building, you know, atlattles in Australia trying to do this, but really we use an Angola hunting Cubans. Holy shit. That's pretty badass. That's way better than Indiana Jones, as far as I'm concerned. Yeah, it's been cool. Right now, the chopboard you should think about this. Nobody, nobody, nobody can know that so he never tells anybody anybody.

2:00:55No, and he's still, I mean, so I guess with a guy like that, if you can find a guy who's willing to wear error, error equivalent clothing, we'll just say an error correct. Yeah, yeah, clover and make his way through a track that was most likely going to kill people in the 1800s. You know, who did something like that? He didn't do the whole thing, but Rinella, the way I met him, was he had a first, he had a show before a meat eater. It was called The Wild Within, and I got really addicted to it. Seriously? Yeah, yeah, I used to love, but way before everyone hunting, I still have watching hunting shows.

2:01:31Yeah. I used to watch like Ted Nuget's Spirit of the Wild. My wife was like, what the fuck are you watching? But I was always obsessed with hunting shows and wilderness shows, people in the wilderness, because every time I'm in the woods, I feel like as a vitamin. I'm like, oh, again, this way. So I was like, I wanted to like experience more of that in my life. So I was watching on TV. So there was a show called The Wild Within, and what Rinella did was he like, I think he used like, error correct weapons too. I think he used like a musket and he shot a bison and he turned the bison into like, I think it was a bison.

2:02:05Whatever the animal was, he turned it into a boat. He made a boat out of it and drifted down this river. He did like all these things that these pioneers did back in the day when they were making their way across the country. That sounds awesome. It was pretty dope. That's how I got to meet him. That's how I got him on my podcast before meat eater was ever a show. Okay. Yeah. He was super dismissive of a podcast. Now he's got one. I feel like there's a lot of - What am I doing here? I'm in this comedy club with this fucking dude who's smoking weed. Like this is ridiculous. I feel like there's a lot of people that probably dismissed it.

2:02:36They're like, oh, what the fuck is Joe doing? But now he's got a great podcast of his own. I love that kind of death. Oh, he's awesome. He's such a smart dude too. He knows so many things. He's a fascinating guy to talk to because he's super well read. And he can talk to you about all kinds of shit that you would not expect from a guy who he's a professional hunter. Now he talks like a PhD. It's very, but also like a hunter. Very unusual dude. And like one of the very best guys to explain hunting. Like I saw a debate that he had. It was like, I think it was a book that he had released. And he was doing one of those talks.

2:03:12They do it bookstores. And this guy was a vegan. And the guy on the audience was a vegan. The guy got upset with him. And the Rinella handled it so perfectly. They're just the way communicated with the guy and explaining his perspective. And you have a different perspective. And I'd love to have a conversation with you. He didn't do it. Any lab bullshit. He said, New Jits like, I get pussy. Probably going on the vagina. But but Rinella is like the perfect answer to people that objectively they look at it like a widow and I do eat meat. Like I am a hypocrite. I am hiring a supermarket hitman. Like why am I upset at this man who not only hunts his meat but cooks it and writes cook books and cooks it on television.

2:03:53And like this is the same thing. Like what are we doing here? This is so stupid. You know, and then you get the people that really believe that you shouldn't eat anything but plants. And my problem with that is I think plants are smart. I think they just move real slow. And I think they have a way of interacting that is noticeable and measurable. I think there's probably a consciousness to plants. I think life eats life. And I think that's the only way it survives. And I think that's just the way it goes. That is just the way it goes. And you can choose to just eat plants. But I don't think you're going to be as healthy.

2:04:26I just I think it's too hard. I think people can kind of survive. Unvegan diets and do well on vegan diets. There's athletes are on vegan diets. I don't think they hit peak performance and thrive. I think that's all people who are consuming nutrient dense meats. Meets and fish and eggs. Those are the people that when you look at athletes, the predominant, the best athletes in every sport are all consuming protein. They're all consuming animal protein. There's so few that are vegans that that hit elite status and maintain a lot of get injured when they switch to vegan too. There's just so much in there.

2:05:04It's collagen and B12 and fucking. There's so many different aspects of different amino acids. You could have this ethical thing in your head. And I get that ethical thing. Like I don't want to see a thing suffer. I think plant suffer. You just don't feel it. Right. I really do. I think there's a communication with them that's probably similar, but different to the way we feel about animals getting killed by other animals. I think it's just a part of this whole process. I mean, they've shown that you can take the recordings of beetles, eating leaves and play recordings of beetles eating leaves near a tree.

2:05:44And the tree will experience distress to the point where it changes the profile, the flavor profile of the leaves. It releases chemicals. These phytochemicals into the leaves that makes it disgusting for the bugs. And they do it with giraffes. Like when giraffes eat, I think it's a cashew trees. When giraffes eat a cashew trees, the trees downwind all become disgusting to the point where the drafts will starve because they won't eat it. They change their flavor profile to protect themselves. They release some sort of chemical and make them inedible. Well, I think that's so interesting. Because you can see it with who's that Paul Stammett has.

2:06:29Yeah. When the fun guy is talking and communicating and the health benefits to fun guy and different plants, I think any time you have this edict where no meat, no plants, no, I think that's just another version of religious extremism. Where if you were just to say, what makes sense? What's morally, what am I going to have to coalesce in from me? I don't want to be a hypocrite. So I hunt. That's the way it is. We eat a ton of wild meat. I'm not a hypocrite. We eat meat. I love fish. I love fruits and vegetables. But I think if you're making this determination where there's no meat, this is the only thing I'm going to eat.

2:07:21Well, one, yeah, that's a lot of time and effort and energy that you're spending specifically on your diet constraints that could be allocated to being a better dad. Or maybe they could do all those things too. Maybe. I don't know. I think their philosophical point is a good one. I think their ethics, the morals, their perspective is that I want to live a life with the least suffering possible. I think that's noble. I really do. I think the problem is life eats life. I think that's the real problem. I think the problem is if you're buying just vegetables in the store, boy, you need to take a good look at monocrop agriculture because it's fucking bananas.

2:08:08There was a tailor -shared in Yellowstone. There was a scene where Kevin Costa was talking to the he was explaining, if you're on a vegan diet, you want to kill the most things, become a vegan. Because you don't understand, like if one life is one life, okay? If the life of a gopher and the life of an elk are the same thing, and why wouldn't they be? Do you have no idea how many things have to fucking die to make monocrop agriculture? It's a blood bath. They kill everything. They kill groundhogs, ground squirrels, you fucking name it, ground nesting birds, fawns, everything gets gobbled up by combines.

2:08:53It's an enormous industrial operation. It's not natural. So now you're limited to organic plants, okay? So if you're growing all of your own food and you know, you're growing a lot of soybeans, a lot of different things, like if you go out with hemp, if you're in a place where you can grow it legally, hemp is actually a really good source of protein. It's actually got a really completed amino acid profile. You can survive. You can do it vegan pizza at the supermarket. Shut the fuck up. You're contributing to this mass slaughter of small animals. You're just not aware of it. Have you watched that Netflix docu series on, it's basically vegan propaganda.

2:09:36I forget what it's named. Is it the game changers?

2:09:46That's the thing. So I went and got some vegan cheese. Then it was like, tried it. I was like, okay, it's not bad, but I mean, dude, it's a laundry list of ingredients associated with making this, which seems pretty insane to me versus what's the ingredient on a good cheese? Bell. Right. It's like a dissertation of ingredients. And it's so processed. That is literally what it is. If you want to be, I said, the million times, you want to be a vegetarian, eat Indian food. They make delicious, delicious vegetarian food. You don't have to eat fucking vegan cheese. Stop pretending. Stop lying. Stop eating tofu to eat whatever the fuck that shit is.

2:10:36Get out of here. Get out of it. Get the fuck out of here. That's nonsense. What are you eating? And also eat mollusks. People should look into that. Those things are so primitive. They're way more primitive than plants. We just have a problem with them moving. That's all it is. If people, like, they don't even have nerves. They don't feel pain. They're the fucking the simplest of organisms. Yet their protein is like animal protein. It's really good for you. Do you eat oysters? Oh, yeah. Yeah. You can fuck out of oysters. Never down that in here. Snails. Do dying. Yeah. You just go. Yeah. But every now and then I hear about a dude dying from oyster.

2:11:09So we were in Normandy. This is super funny, funny story. So I went out to the 80th anniversary for the Normandy invasion. Took a bunch of dudes out there. And my kids and I are out on this beach. And I'm taking my pocket knife out and I'm just chopping the oysters off the rocks and eating oysters straight out of the ocean. Oh, wow. And my girls are running away from me. Like this is the grossest shit I've ever seen. And then pretty soon they got into it. So then they're trying to find me the oysters to bring them back and show me where they are. My wife was like, you're going to fucking die. Like you're going to you're going to poison yourself.

2:11:49You're eating these like right out of Normandy. Like the it's one of the beaches out there. All the munitions are in the water. Yeah, I don't give a shit. And then I had to, I'm eating them. And I quickly searched, hey, are there any toxins after I've eaten like three? Are there any toxins in the oysters in Normandy? Thank God. It was like, you know, 99 .9%. I live on the edge here. Yeah, when I lived in San Francisco, you could collect muscles. There then I think I brought them home once, but then I found out that there's like a couple months out of the year that they're poison. You get like red tide, right?

2:12:33Yeah. So I was like, like, I dodged the bullet, but I was like, what's that bullet? Because you could just go find muscles and pluck them off of things. Let me let me ask you this. So if you're to move back to California, okay? But to take Texas politics with you, that's not really possible. But if it were, I'm taking you on a imaginary journey. Yeah, yeah. No, no, I like it here. You like the weather. I like everything. I like the size of it. I like the way people behave. People are super friendly. I like the scene here. The restaurant scene's amazing. The comedy scene's amazing. Live music. A bunch of cool people now.

2:13:16So many of my friends moved here. I love it here. I just love the vibe. I love that it's, you know, it's I love that we're not connected to the Hollywood machine. There's like a pull of deals and shows and things that you get roped into doing because you think about the money they'll pay you. Right. And then you wind up like becoming one of those people. Like you have to say what they say. You have to be put if you're not politically aligned with them, you're going to lose gigs. You change your behavior. I see it with so many comics. They they're really good comics coming up. They're they're like, wow, this guy's going to be good.

2:13:57He's really good. He's getting better all the time. And then they get a fucking show. They get a show and then they tone everything down and everything gets softer and everything, you know, you start seeing some like bullshit jokes in there. Like, oh, you decided to cover this joke, cover this subject just for like, just for like street cred, progressive street cred. And like you see it happen. You're like, oh, you got called into the rocks, the sirens. They call it into the rocks. That's what it is, man. They call you into the rocks. You stop, you stop being you. You stop being you because they dangle that carrot in front of your face.

2:14:33And there's no carrot out here. The carrot is just podcasts and other comics. Right. So that's way better. There's no control. There's no manipulation. There's no someone's dangling this over you. You have to agree with what I agree with. No one cares at all about any of that stuff here. Like it's it's freedom. And like I'm going to talk about it the other. I think it was today, right? Whereas like, you know, another comic was like, oh, can you believe they're a democrat? No, it's weird. Like or whatever, right? You know, but it's it's fine. In the context of I think can being conservative because I don't necessarily say like, I'm a Republican, I'm like, I just believe in less government.

2:15:18Like I don't like bureaucrats at all have a high degree of skepticism and anything that they say. And I typically will question anything an elected elected official will say. So for me, I'm like, I don't care if the guy next to me is going to vote for, you know, whatever alternate politician. I care about like, what are their ideas? Why do they think a certain way? What are they doing? What kind of a human are they? And what is the character of the individual? Am I going to disagree with them? Yeah, but who the fuck cares? It's kind of fun. Like it's kind of fun to disagree with people and debate them and have a different opinion versus being an echo chamber where people all agree and they're all kind of like step in their belief system.

2:16:04It's kind of fun to have some wingnut talking about socialism half the time. You're like, oh, what the fuck are you talking about? You believe in that? It's just like some Orwellian nightmare, man. And if you could have a conversation with someone where you're friendly with each other and completely disagree, it's a beautiful dance. It's a fun dance to talk to people that have just completely different perspectives, but you'd not rude to them. You just ask them, well, why do you think that? Well, did you ever consider this? And you have conversations like too normal to people, just have it a conversation.

2:16:35Okay. All right. So that's what you think. Huh? What was your childhood like? Get it? What are we dealing with here? Like, why do you have this perspective? You know, and you have to be able to talk to each other. And there's a bunch of people that we hang out with that have totally different opinions on all kinds of things. Like my friend Josh, who was here the other day, loving the death. He told me voted for Jill Stein. Said he voted for Jill Stein. Just like a protest vote. Wow. I think the two party systems too. But I'm like, yeah, okay. Right. Yeah. I get it. Look, I voted for two libertarian candidates in a row.

2:17:11So I'd vote for Gary Johnson. And then I voted for Joe Jorgensen. Why? Because I was like, this is this whole thing's gross. But if that's like California, I knew it was going to be blue anyway. California's always blue. It's like a legitimate protest vote. I guess he was in Florida. So that's a legitimate protest vote. If you want to go red anyway, whether you like it or not. Gonna go red. Yeah. Florida goes red hard. When they saw Miami go red, they're like, oh boy. Yeah. Oh boy. And one of the things that they were saying is like the whole, like what goes red and what goes, like if you look at the country, like California is way more red now that it's ever been.

2:17:53Oh really? The last four years. I didn't know that. Yeah. It's a big difference. If you look at there's a map of California, how it voted from 2020 to 2024. It's a giant swing. It's like it's the reds going like this. See if you can find it, Jamie. It's very interesting. Um, and that's not because people have been radicalized. That's because the left has gone fucking cuckoo. You guys have gone crazy and you're authoritarians. You want everybody to behave and believe and think and talk the way you do or else. I always look at that. Look at the difference. Holy shit. Holy shit, dude. That is wild.

2:18:33Yeah. It's most of California by landmass. By far. Yeah. It's probably 70 % by landmass or 60%. What is that blue up there on the east side? Like what is that close to? Is that like, is that where they grow the weeds on? Oh yeah. What is that? Where are you guys? Are you guys going to be like Tahoe? What is that one? That's got to be like trucky or something. You got a show off on the blocker? These fuckers. There it goes. Oh these fuckers. Oh you have to get a sink. Yeah. Go to the other, just the image, just the image. I see I've thought about this because I always tell people California is my favorite climate in the nation.

2:19:14It's the best. Yeah, that's it. So what's the one in the upper? Well, it's not the one that's blue. Yeah. Yeah. I guarantee you that's where the grow the weed. Yeah. They want to keep everything nice and quiet up there. Shut the fuck up. Shut the fuck up. Everybody shut the fuck up. Hey man, we don't want these guys to like criminalize weed again. Where's Humble? Jamie. Where's Humble? It's up here somewhere up there. That's where they grow all the best weed. That's where they have problems with the cartel too. Cartel grows weed up there too. The cartel grows weed in California. Oh yeah. That's what I was going to, that's what I wanted to ask you was about the cartel.

2:19:52Do you think that they're really going to that one was Humble? That one was Humble? That one you guys were asked. That one was Humble. Oh shit. Okay. There we go. You're right. Yeah. They grow all the weed, son. Yeah. There you go. Yeah. There's a dude named John Norris who's been on the podcast. He wrote a book called Hidden Wars and he was a game warden. So he's just thinking he's going to go around checking fishing licenses and chill like that. And then one day they find a creek that's been diverted. So they have to follow the creek that thought maybe a farmer had like damned the creek somewhere and done something to get water illegally.

2:20:22He goes up there and he finds these PVC pipes and it reads this giant grow up and it's all cartel guys. And so this guy's job changes from being a game warden. Let me check your fish. Right. Right. To running a fucking tactical unit. They had attack dogs. They had attack dogs. They had fucking shootouts with the cartel in the woods over weed. Because here's what happened. California made weed legal in the state but made growing it a misdemeanor if you grow it illegally. Okay. Yeah. So if you are a person who's doing it legally, you can grow it and you can sell it if you have a license. You can open up a shop and you can sell it.

2:20:58They tax the shit out of it's great for everybody. But the problem is you made growing it illegally a misdemeanor. So then the cartel just starts growing it everywhere in the national forests because even if the guys get arrested, nothing happens. It's a misdemeanor. So it's so they're using these crazy toxic poison pesticides. All these shit that's totally illegal to use on regular crops in America. And 90 % of the illegal weed that's being bought around the country is coming from them. Holy shit. I didn't know that. And they're doing it all in national forests and they do a most of it in California.

2:21:36Dude, they find these grow up. My friend found one. You know him. Cody. Oh yeah. Yeah. He found a fucking grow up on tone ranch. Really? Yes. Oh my gosh. That's right. Yeah. Yes. He found a cartel grow up on tone ranch with a this guy carried in pipes on his shoulder. And divert it. It's streamed. The woods. Diverted a stream. And then there was this whole field of weed. These guys have planted out there. They were camping out there. They had little religious symbols and shit. They kept by their bed to protect them. Like the Virgin Mary and shit. What do you think? I've heard this. This is what I wanted to talk about because it pertains to the cartel.

2:22:17It's like, what do you think about releasing steel team six and delta force on the cartels? What do you think that looks like? Well, I think you've solved one problem. You have, you know, only have distribution, but you still have a demand. You still have a demand. Yeah. The real problem is there's always going to be a demand. The real problem. And I don't think there's anything wrong with that idea, by the way. Okay. I like that idea. Yeah. But the problem with that idea is you're always going to have a demand. And if you're going to have a demand, someone's going to fulfill that demand. And who the fuck is that going to be?

2:22:46How are they going to get the coke in? You're not going to just not have coke. So here's the question. By having prohibition of alcohol in the United States, it's widely widely agreed that that led to the rise of the mafia. Right. Bootleggers, the mafia, criminal organizations that were organized crime that went on to do a bunch of other horrible things inside our country. And they were built up with money because alcohol was illegal. The moment alcohol stopped being illegal, you still have these people with all this money now. You fucked up. Now they're organized gangsters. Now, you know, okay, alcohol is legal now.

2:23:20So just go sell it legally. Right. And they have millions and millions of dollars from all life of crime. You've already done that with the cartel. You got to do, just got to, you got to do something. You got to do something. And you probably all show should legalize drugs. I don't think you should take drugs. I think coke is probably terrible for almost everybody. I think math is probably terrible. People still do cocaine. Absolutely. Really? I guess really. I know people do it. They're going to Chinese investment in illegal American weed. Of course. But when they get in on it, check out this number that it says here of the 2000, sorry, of the 800 farms, the OBS and Oklahoma, the Oklahoma Bureau of Narcotics says shut down in the last two years, 75 % were linked to China.

2:24:02Oh my God. China's a growing weed here. They're growing weed here. Oh my God. I was thinking about that. I was thinking about this from the thought exercise where I'm like, because I, you know, I know these units. I'm intimately familiar with them. Uh -huh.

2:24:21If we declare war on the cartel, like these, these dudes are not going to understand what the fuck is going on. Of course, they are, they are going to be, because, God, you'll stop a distribution. That's going to be, yeah, they are in for a world of like ultraviolence. They've never actually felt before because they, you know, obviously, this is a very capable ultraviolet organization. They have fucking no clue if we organize these tier one units against them. This is going to be what I would be doing if I was down there, like, I know all those shoe boxes in my fucking, you know, my walls that I'm going to have to collect up.

2:25:02I'd be getting ready to retire right now. That's what I would be doing because if Delta Force is funding me, bro, I would be so terrified. Is that a real thing that they've proposed doing? Yes. That is a real thing. Who proposed that? I'm almost positive. Either JD or Trump had said something with the new guy from ice. Like, we're going to mobilize tier one units against the cartel. The only thing I thought was like retire. You guys got some money, man. I would like put that away, you know, like maybe move, Jamaica. I don't know. Somewhere. Yeah, buy a restaurant. Like try to go legit because dude, if those guys are hunting you, yeah, by the way, like you're done.

2:25:47You're fucking done. And it's a weird thing that that's going on right on our border. It's a weird thing because it's so close to us and it's so ultra violent and dangerous. And it's just completely shaped the way the entire economy of the country works. You know, they they have so much power and control. And it's a criminal organization that is entirely almost entirely at least funded by us by our desired Trump declares war on cartels. President Lex said notorious crimes syndicates drug king, King pins will never sleep soundly again once he launches his plants attack the issue. I thought about this for a long time where I'm like, if they if they turned loose Delta Force and seal team six on cartels and pedophiles, we could just kind of like erase the problem in about it two years.

2:26:35It's begun. He wants to send troops to Mexico. He said we'll make a propious a special forces cyber warfare another over and covert actions to inflict maximum damage on cartel leadership infrastructure and operations. Oh, Jesus. Bro, it is going to get wild. It's going to get wild. Man, it is going to get wild. Very interesting. But the thing is like people in action is action as well when it comes to this. Like you're just you're going to continue to prop them up. They're going to get more and more power and more and more money. And we got to figure out why everybody wants coke. What the fuck is it?

2:27:11You think it's coke? I think that's the big one. I'm pretty sure it's the big one. I'm sure a lot of it is pills. They have fake pills. Like they sell like street pills, street, you know, different like anti -exhiding medications, Molly. There's a lot of stuff they sell that's also laced up with fentanyl, which is responsible for, you know, who knows how many tens of thousands of thousand people was with their what they're saying. It's something. It's something. Crazy high. Crazy high. It's insane. It's a horrific thing. And it's gotten to the point where people are scared to try any kind of drugs that think in fentanyl.

2:27:44They found fentanyl and weed. You know, what? Yes. People they found fentanyl laced weed. Yeah. People are dumb as shit, man. You don't think they'll try putting fentanyl and weed. People are dumb as shit. They'll try all kinds of things. People are retarded. I know people that have mixed M .A .O. and Hiberters and mushrooms and acid all together. Like what are you doing? Are you trying to go to space? Like what are you doing, man? Jesus Christ. You just experimented in your brain. What was an M .A .O. inhibitor? What'd you say? An M .A .O. inhibitor, mono -amine oxidase inhibitor. It's the the ingredient in ayahuasca that makes DMT orally active.

2:28:23So mono -amine oxidase breaks down DMT in the gut. That's why when you eat like like if you eat a salad, that's why you don't trip balls. Got it. Okay. Because otherwise like most plant some crazy number of plants have DMT in it. So like how many plants have DMT in it? I think it's like a thousand or something. When you nutty like that. When you think about the legalization of psilocybin. Yeah. So Texas, and this is what I know about Texas because they're leading I think a lot of research specifically related to bats. Apparently the former governor Rick Scott is really into this. Rick Perry. Rick Perry.

2:28:59Rick Perry because of his relationship with Marcus, Latrell and some of the other guys in the community, he has been leading the charge on this. Do you think that from psilocybin being legal in the United States, do you think it would be an issue? Do you think it'd be an issue at all? I don't know because you're going to get people trying it that wouldn't try it before. You're going to get people that use it irresponsibly. Just cut like you get people that drink it responsibly. I think that's the situation that we find ourselves in if we're going to give people personal freedom. They're going to make bad decisions.

2:29:33You know, you can buy a Corvette. You can go to the Chevrolet dealership buy a Corvette right off the lot that goes zero to 60 in four seconds and you're flying around corners. You're you're you're you could be a fucking maniac and kill people in a Corvette or you could just enjoy it on the highway and be responsible and say, wow, what a great car. This thing's awesome. I love it. Right. And you don't cause any problems for anybody. Yeah. You both things are possible. That's what's going to happen if we make drugs legal. You're going to have people try those drugs that probably shouldn't be trying those drugs.

2:30:06You're going to have people get addicted to those drugs that maybe wouldn't have gotten addicted if those drugs weren't available to them, especially if they weren't legal. If you could just buy it somewhere. But if you don't rip the fucking bandaid off of this like infantilization of society and let people know that there are things out there that they're telling you you can't do and the people who are telling you you can't do them have an even experience them. And when it comes to things like psilocybin and psychedelics like if you haven't experienced them you really shouldn't be talking about it.

2:30:40You have no idea what you're talking about. You just you have you can't possibly know you can't know. And if you do if you have experienced them then you're probably going to agree with me. You're probably going to agree that there's some like some serious benefits to it. 50. I thought it was a lot more than that. At least 50. I had read something that was like in the hundreds. I can't find a solid number. I mean it's not a lot of stuff. So the point is like I know Philaris grass is like really rich with DMT and that's also the Akashitri. That's what one when they connected this like a university in Jerusalem that connected this idea of Moses and the burning bush to a DMT trip.

2:31:21Because the Akashitri is like rich in DMT and the idea of burning it you see God and God gives you this message and tells you what to do and what the rules of behavior. This I think anybody telling you that these things should get you locked up is clearly never experienced them. They never have. I spent all of my life with the top secret security clearance. Most of my life from my 20s to my 40s. My personal experience with them. This is before before we went public. My personal experience with them was my problems were rep after rep cycle after cycle of combat after like relatively high stress scenario after scenario after scenario.

2:32:16I was having a really really hard time trying to directly connect with love. I actually could not connect with that experience. It was really difficult. My wife and I were going we were going through this ongoing debate and dialogue with it. She's like you need to try it and we tried it. It fast forward probably 20 years of talk therapy for me personally. It gave me this direct connection with this feeling that I hadn't felt for years. This is my point with with vets and especially from the combat vets. The guys have got rep after rep after rep with over pressure and explosions and a lot of violence.

2:33:09They lose context with this really important feeling that you have to have. You have to have direct love for your family, for your spouse, for yourself. If you killed that by all of the things that you've done, you built the scaffolding, this artificial scaffolding on top of this. It creates a callus and you got to be able to break through that. From a psychological perspective, an emotional perspective, it accelerates that back and you can reset. You really can. I can't imagine. I think about this from my dad's like 80 years old.

2:33:59He's got lung cancer now. I'm like, gosh, if he could call us around killing ego and past and try to understand himself from a different, more introspective way, this would take decades maybe of talk therapy or a session where you could really accelerate your growth as an individual. I think that's for GWAT vets in general. I mean, that's what they're missing. This key component is being able to retouch with their emotional strength and be able to evolve and live your life. You've said it before. I don't know if you said it on a show, but do you think society would benefit from it? I think a lot of people would benefit from it.

2:34:57But I think a lot of people wouldn't. I don't think people with real psychological disorders should be doing it. I think people that are really fucked up and having a hard time with skits of phrenics, people, you know, I don't know. I think it's probably dangerous for you. I think it's probably a bit of a stress test for your psyche. You know, you hear about these stories, like the guy from Pink Floyd that dropped acid and freaked out and never came back. There's those stories. Like we hear those stories of guys just go out there and kind of you lose them. I've kind of seen it with some people.

2:35:30I've seen him one kid who was just like smoking a ton of weed and just lost his mind and became skits of phrenic. And you don't know, like did he have a tendency towards schizophrenia already? Did he fall prey? Was it just his unique biochemistry and how he interacted with weed? Was it just in veteran weed? I mean, he was every day. He was smoking weed constantly. What is it? Like what caused him to crack? You know, I don't know. I don't know. But I don't have that problem. And I think it's very beneficial. And I don't like when people tell me that because someone has a problem with something that I shouldn't do it.

2:36:04I don't agree with that. I think you should be allowed to take chances as a person. I think if you want to do BMX jumps and fucking do flips on your bike, you should be allowed to do it. You want to do Jiu Jitsu and have grown men try to kill you. Go ahead. Go do it. Do whatever the fuck you want to do. I don't think anybody should be able to tell you what you what you can and can't do. But why does that change when you talk about substances that someone puts in their body? Well, because those people could do those and then they could commit crimes. But those are already crimes. Like you already go to jail for those crimes.

2:36:31So if you do something violent because you're on a drug, you're going to jail because you did something violent. Like there's a crime. You committed that crime. You go to jail. So we already have laws to fix the like, to address all the problems. And you're assuming that more problems would occur. We don't know that. We don't know that we don't know that more people won't chill the fuck out and wouldn't have a dramatic decrease in violence across the country. Imagine that. Imagine you have a few people that lose their fucking mind. But you have a dramatic increase in consciousness through the entire country where people develop like a mushroom culture and people start like micro dosing all the time and people get way more comfortable with talking to each other.

2:37:10Way more creative. Way more like community oriented and love oriented. That's not a bad thing. That's a real possibility with something that exists right now. There's a happy pill. It's out there and it's illegal and it's God made it. God made it. And it's probably the source of most religious experiences. There's probably some sort of a connection to a lot of those religious experiences or experiences rather and what was probably some sort of a psychedelic adventure that they went on. And who's to say that that's not even how you talk to God in the first place? We don't know because it's been it's been held back from us.

2:37:51It's been kept from us like we're a bunch of babies. It's something that human beings have used for thousands and thousands of years. The Greeks use psychedelics to start democracy. And yet here we are in the greatest democracy the world's ever known and 2024 with full access to the internet all the data that's available all the anecdotal stories and it'll get you locked in a fucking cage. That's nuts. That's really crazy. It's completely insane. That doesn't make no sense. I've tried to look at it from all different ways. I do agree with you if and when people say if you make cocaine legal people are going to die.

2:38:27Unfortunately, I agree with you. But if you don't make cocaine legal people are also going to die. I don't know which one is more. And I don't know if it was just real cocaine versus cocaine mixed with a bunch of other horrible shit. If like the real cocaine wouldn't kill as many people. I don't know how many people are dying just of cocaine and how many people are dying of fentanyl lace cocaine. I bet it's way more fentanyl lace cocaine. So if you are just pure cocaine and the same amount of users, you're going to get way less deaths. So that's a net positive. Then you take taxes from that sale of that legal cocaine and you use it to sell read rehabilitation centers where you give them I began.

2:39:07Give people the ability to break addictions. It's possible. People do it. They go to Mexico, kick opioids. People do it all the time. My friend had clay did it. That's how he got into it. He started his own clinic because he went down there because he had a pill problem. You get an injury. You're doing jujitsu. You're always fucking hurt. These guys get a disc problem. Their arms all fucked up. They take a little pill. You feel better. But then you need three pills. Then you need four. Now you're fucked. And now there's nothing to help you other than I began and that's illegal. So you make that legal too.

2:39:40So with those two together, who knows, you might have way less deaths. And then you would have taxes that you could take from that stuff and use for all sorts of things. It would be horrible for taxes from cocaine sales to fix the schools. But what if that's what did it? What if that's what did it? And what if the exact same amount of people buying cocaine are still buying cocaine? What if that is the fix? And what if responsible use of drugs, all kinds of drugs? Sure, don't drive a car when you're coked up. Don't take heroin and fly your plane. No, in responsible use, just like responsible use of alcohol.

2:40:18Why is that so crazy for us? Why is that so alien? Because we've been turned into babies. We've been turned into babies where you're allowed to take pharmaceutical drugs that make you high as fuck, whether it's high as fuck on Adderall or high as fuck on opioid. That's fine. But you can't go out and get yourself some mushrooms. That's just crazy. And for these people that are the ones in charge that are making all the money from these decisions to keep up with this insanity in the internet in 2024 and this tide of change, I feel the same way about them as you feel about those poor cartel members.

2:40:55Like you probably should be doing something else. What is this? What we eat in fentanyl, short answer is they're false. There's no solid evidence that marijuana is being laced with fentanyl. Here's some of the reasons why his, didn't someone get caught with it though? They said this at the bottom it says that there's been a few publicly stated like media stories that have said it's that's what the case was. I think we were talking about one. Then they said there was weed that was laced with fentanyl. This one got arrested. This is lab tests claims that they were errors and then the corrections don't make the headlines.

2:41:34How do you get an error? How much fentanyl is out there? There's an error. Oh, we just contamination. I think it wasn't a weed that had fentanyl. fentanyl is all in place. It's been a field test. They could have just been like, does this have fentanyl on it? They rubbed the weed and the weed comes back like, yep, someone touched fentanyl and they touched the weed and now you've got fentanyl, they say weed. That actually does make sense, right? Because if you think it's some cracked out dude working with these fields for the cartel, he's probably going to be doing fentanyl. Yeah, he's going to be doing fentanyl.

2:42:01He's going to be on everything basically. Yeah. It's going to be positive on everything. He's on a tent in the fucking woods with a little virgin Mary statue. For real. I know. It's like a candle, bro. Haven't chewed out with the fucking cops. It's so crazy that that's going on and that there's hundreds of them and then the Chinese are running. Oh, this is the most insane part where it's like everybody knows what's going on. Oh, great. All these chemicals are coming from China. They're being offloaded in A to Mexico in South America. They're being like produced and then crossed and then they're pushed across the border.

2:42:37Everybody knows. Do you ever talk to Mike Baker about any of this stuff? No, I I've never actually talked to Mike Baker. Do you know him? Do you know him? I've never ever heard of him. Oh my god. I'm bringing I got to bring you two guys together. He's I love that dude. But what he one of the things he was telling me was about the Chinese cell cell phone towers like cheaper. Right. They're like, you just buy ours. And I can listen to you and they put them all around military bases. We promise we're not going to listen to you. Hey guys, the Chinese said they're not going to listen to it. I mean, that's good enough for me.

2:43:06They're around this nuclear weapons facility. Of course. They're all over the place and then they buy land. Like Dr. Phil was highlighting that. Are they buying land right next to military bases? Like how fucking sillier way? This is so we're so silly. Like someone's moving our chess pieces around like, oh, this isn't happening. This isn't even happening. I think like that. There's no way to be buying up all the weed. There's no way they'd be buying up all the farm land right next to the military. There's no way they would be exporting chemicals. They could manufacture fentanyl that come in and there's no way to eviscerate 200 ,000 fucking people.

2:43:40There's no way they would do that. There's no way they would do that. That's crazy to even think. Meanwhile, the only way to get those chemicals from China. Yeah, definitely get it from China. They sent it in Mexico. They cook it up. They send it our way. But no, there's no way the Chinese are thinking that maliciously. There's no way. There's no way. No. Well, are they still mad at us for like the opium moors? I think the Chinese are not necessarily mad at us. They're just thinking about themselves from a hundred year vision and they're saying, okay, where do we, where, where, and how do we ascend to being able to take place, take America's place as the international superpower?

2:44:25Right. So I don't know if they necessarily have an opinion -based act to grind. It's more about how do we put the pieces together to take the pole position away from the United States? I'm sure that's their primary goal. But I do remember reading something where they were talking about, was it British? Who? There was people that introduced opium to the Chinese. Like on purpose, it was like campaign, the first opium war, 1800s. Okay. Britain, the war was triggered by China's efforts to enforce its ban on opium. The British responded by sending a naval expedition to force China to pay reparations and allow the opium trade.

2:45:05Yeah. So the British wanted to keep that fucking dope flowing. In that wild, they went to war to keep the dope flowing. This is what people have to recognize about Afghanistan too. Yeah. This is something that it sounds so conspiracy theory that no one wants to touch it. But the troops had a guard the poppy fields. Afghanistan, heroin went way up when we went in there, went way way up. Their production went way up. They were supplying it one point in time. What was the number, Jamie? 70 % was that what it was? 70 % of the world's heroin was coming out of a place that we had occupied. Well, and the other issue is that the Taliban was using the opium and essentially to fund their growth in their militia.

2:45:59So the DEA was out there. So you had the DEA out in Afghanistan doing direct action ops. And you had soft guys that were going out walking through poppy fields and marijuana fields and all these other things that you'd pass it off the DEA. 90%. Oh, 95. Yeah. In 2021. 90 %. Holy shit. Holy shit. De -de -de -de -stabilize the entire country. You deter everyone from actually focusing on the opium. You focus on terrorism in the Taliban. And then you allow it to flourish. And the dirty secret nobody wants to talk about from that from that perspective is that we've we as a country have dealt with a lot of shady opium dealers like drug lords that were essentially exporting opium.

2:46:53And if they weren't part of the Taliban and or if they were anti -tellaban, you do business with them. It's the same story. Yeah. What's your triage of priorities? So, how, hey, we need to get, you know, we need to fund our army in South America. So, hey, how do we do that? Let's let's like let's let's import some coca. You know, let's invent a market because we got to get, you know, we got to push back against the commies in Nicaragua. It's the same story. It's a dinner. I've had freeway ricky ross on like three times. I have one recently. I had him on recently. Yeah. And he was the guy. He was the guy who's making millions, millions and millions and millions and millions dollars.

2:47:37He couldn't read. He was making millions of dollars selling coke for the government. Myanmar overtakes Afghanistan and the world's top opium producer. Violent political turmoil in Myanmar in the in the years since 2021 coup has contributed to a production increase. Wow. So they took over that quick. What's that? Check this out. Math is cheaper than beer there. Whoa. There's a lot of drugs going on there. Whoa. 25 cents each. That's all. Imagine for a quarter. You could do math. The golden, the golden triangle. Imagine doing matter. Imagine doing that quarter and quarter. What kind of judgment do you have?

2:48:16You pop that 25 cent math and fucking chug it down with a Budweiser. What are you doing, man? What kind of life are you living? This guy said it took 10 pills his first time. Oh, 10 pills. How did it work out? I took 10 pills and I was totally lost and recognized my family. Whoa. I recognized my children. Son couldn't sleep at all. I didn't drink. I didn't eat. I felt powerful.

2:48:39Last one so perfect. I felt powerful.

2:48:45Yeah, look, I don't think that should be legal. But well here, I don't think you should do it, but I think it should be legal. I think if it's not legal, the cartel sells it. You just have to figure out what to do with the money they're going to make from it because that's devil money. You're selling meth money. That's devil money. You're ruining people's lives. There's going to be a bunch of slippery people that are kind of hanging on but doing their best and you're going to meth them down the road to oblivion. That's true. That's true. That's true. But that's not going to happen to me. I'm not going to get methed out.

2:49:16I'm not going to try it. I haven't even tried Adderall. I'm scared of it. So some people are going to figure it out. Just like most things in life. Just like drinking, just like driving, just like doing jujitsu, just like riding a BMX bike. Some people are going to get hurt. So we have to decide what's more valuable to you. Nurfing the whole fucking world or people figuring out what's best for everybody. The only way to do that is to give people freedom. That's it. It's the only way that works. We figure out what works, what doesn't work by successes and failures and we all adjust along the way.

2:49:50But you got to give people freedom. Freedom and information. Those are two very important things. When you're suppressing either one of them, you can't be the good guy. No, no, no, no, you're not the good guy. Freedom has to be sacred across the board. Which freedom comes with accountability, which means responsibility. And that's the problem is that when freedom, I think when you can distill it down and you can create control, then you can create profit. So power control and profit. Those things like they directly have this confidence where people in power obviously manipulate that and they'll restrict our freedom.

2:50:29Yes, especially they can make more money. 100 % more control. Have more power. And if COVID taught us anything, it taught us that we can't forfeit freedom to low IQ power hungry bureaucrats that want to affect our life because they're stupid. So why would we ever give away our freedom to a bunch of stupid bureaucrats? Exactly. That to me is the fundamental difference between the entire election process. It's like how do I maintain or increase my individual accountability, which comes with freedom, right? And how if we want to capitulate that, that's the other side. I think that's a referendum on freedom.

2:51:13Yes. I don't want to oversimplify it, but that's kind of where I think it is. It's where it is. You're not oversimplifying it. If you don't have that, you don't have any of these things. No, you don't have any growth. You don't. You're going to have people that are in power that's stifled discourse. They're going to stifled debate. They're going to stifle it because they only want their side to be heard. Is that lady at the table telling me that Sam Harris and Douglas Murray was hate speech? It's those people. You're going to have those people dictating what you can and can't talk about based on their own morals.

2:51:41And you don't even know how they think about things. You don't even know them. They don't do podcasts. They're not hanging out with you at the bar. You're not going to dinner with them. You don't fucking know them. So you don't know if they're making good judgment calls. You don't know if their assessment of something is something you agree with or if it's even rational. You don't know. You just these weird strikes you get on your account. You get like this fear based letter that comes to you. If you do this again, you're fucked. You're like, Oh, no. Now what do I do? Why better self -sensor and go along with the machine and stop misgendering people and stop doing this and stop doing that and stop saying this and and then you're fucked and then you're fucked and then you might as well be living in any other country that's controlled by a dictator.

2:52:25It's just a dictator by a different name. Right. It's all it is. It's fascism, but it's not right wing fascism. It's left wing fascism. It's adherence to the state. They want you to go along with the mandate, the way they talk about things, the way you have to talk about things. And the thing if anything, this election was a giant fuck you to all that where everybody was like, fuck you guys are fucking crazy. We see where this is going. You go and write off a cliff and you're running. And if anything that showed you about that, the Harris budget, which is spent a billion dollars, 580 million of it or something like that was for staff.

2:53:04Yeah. 580 million. And there's all this money that went to all these outreach groups and all these different and celebrities and like what the fuck is this? And then they're 20 million dollars in debt at the end of it. And you want to manage the economy? This sounds crazy. This is a, what did you do? Like what happened here? Who went crazy with the checkbook? Yeah. Who went with this? Who went hog wild? Nobody in the administration has ever been business. Right. I mean, like nobody. Find out what the numbers were to staff because I want to be accurate about that. But I think I am. I think it was 580 million.

2:53:47And I was watching this on Fox News and they don't lie. No, they don't. They never lie. Didn't they get, they had a giant lawsuit, right? The dominion lawsuit. Yeah, that was a big one. They got hit. I had a piss. All right. Let's, let's take a little break here. Yeah. They said it on Fox News. Jamie sort of has to be true. It has to be true. Yeah. That's way back. Oh, no. Better than Fox News. Patrick Bed David. I know. I know. I tell you I see the tweets that say that. But if Fox News's website says the campaign spent $56 million on payroll and payroll tax. So what's that other money? But didn't, but wasn't there all the money that they had spent on activism?

2:54:31Didn't they count that in staff? But this, no, I don't know. This all comes from like Twitter. I don't know where it comes from. Twitter. Jamie, it's real. I'm just telling you. Stop being a fucking party pooper. If you're asking for the scroll up and let me see what this says. It's not. But no, I'm sorry. Scroll down. I just want to see what it all says. So it says Kamala raised 1 .003 billion. She spent 1 .37 billion. She spent 582 .53 million on staff. That doesn't add up because I saw she spent 680 million on ads. So those two numbers, there's no money left over for everything else. So one of the two isn't correct.

2:55:15One of them is how much is she spent on ads? 680 million. Oh my God. That's like the she had done my podcast for free. Dude, that is like the secret. It's not even a secret. When it's campaign time and you have all these ads, these ad guys that are out there, they're buying up all the ads and it's a wash and money. It's hundreds of millions of dollars. And they're just pipelining campaign donations into ads. And it's like loading up their money guns and just shooting it into space. That's what they're doing. That is what it's like, right? And they've been telling people that this is effective.

2:56:01Yeah. And so they have this business going. It's just complete absurdity. Don't get me wrong. I actually, politics is so fun for me because I think it's really interesting. And it's like, I can't get into football or anything else because I like the data associated with things. And if I got into football, I'd be like one of those fantasy football doors and I can't get into it. And so politics is one of the things where I'm like, I follow it. I love it. It's interesting. Just trying to understand the strategy behind it. I've changed my opinion of it a little bit since the election. I don't think the control, the grip of the control of the country is as strong as I thought it was.

2:56:48I thought this concept. So everyone has a concept of they. They don't want you to know things. They're controlling things. I have a feeling that in times of crisis, like what we find ourselves currently in, it's like when the lights come on and roaches scatter. That's what I have a feeling. I have a feeling there's no way that they can trust each other and that they all know that a certain percentage of people are going down for corruption. There's a certain percentage of people that did some dirty shit. There's some connections with organizations and corporations and some emails. Save your emails.

2:57:25It's one of the things that Robert said. Yeah, reserve your records and pack your bags. Dude, so epic. Yeah, that's epic. Preserve your records because we know you're all a bunch of liars. Yes. We've caught you already on emails lying about stuff. So you've all perjured yourselves. Like Fauci perjured themselves. There's no difference. There's just a definition of gain of function. Like shut the fuck up. You don't change the definition and make it ultra super nuanced so that it fits in your little excuse box of why you didn't fund gain of function research. The fuck you didn't. That's what you did.

2:57:59That's what it is. And when Rand Paul was confronting him with it, that was like one of the craziest moments you said, do not know what you are talking about. It's like an evil villain. Yeah. Yeah. Evil villain that just lied to everybody and got away with it. And no repercussions. Well, I think that's I think that's like the story over and over for these guys that are empowered. There's no repercussions. Yeah. There's no accountability. I oftentimes think of Dick Cheney as a guy sitting back in like a high back leather chair in a in a big in a big black tile office that's completely shiny with a white cat on his lap like just patting it.

2:58:40That's the way I think about the fucking guy. Like fuck that guy. Like how these guys, you know, don't keep flashing back to this, but forever fucking change me, right? Where I'm like, these guys fucked up so many people's lives. Like countless, countless lives. And the fact that they still think they have public trust with zero accountability. Yeah. Man. How wild was it when Dick Cheney was endorsing Obama or excuse me, was endorsing Kamala. Of course he was. Everybody was like, yeah, look at that right wing people. Yeah. Like you might as well have painted. If you would have been a NASCAR driver, he would have had a Lockheed Martin fucking Jersey on right then.

2:59:30At that point. Or Satan. Yeah. Yeah. Satan Lockheed Martin. Fucking work. It gets parts of my scene. It's got patches on his uniform like that. It's your pal. If you fucking your pulse get where's like politicians. Yeah. We're there NASCAR drivers. I like the best. Satan would be amazing. It's just all caps on the back. Satan. And the libels still find the way. It's not, you know, it's like it's like Satanism in the classical sense. It was just like a rejection of the norm. I mean, think about it. He's a fallen angel. You know, I mean, think about how, how bad that is. You know, we have to think about it.

3:00:10Yeah. Dick Cheney's basically a fallen angel. If you've seen those Babylon bees gets where it's like Satan talking to that. The Democrats about like, dude, you guys fuck. You guys, you guys jump the shark on this. What are you doing? It's, it's so good. Did you see the Babylon bees one recently where they're talking about criticizing Trump's new appointments in comparison to Biden's appointments? Have you seen it? No, it's just images. I can, I can see you find it. Yeah, because it's that. It's that one, dude. It's the bald dude with the dress. It's the other dude who's the first female admiral.

3:00:44It's the first female admiral. Imagine if you're a woman and you're trying to become an admiral. This motherfucker just jumps the line. It's like, okay, yeah, cool. Did you see it? You find it. That whole thing with like the, it's like the Avengers United. Here it is. Yeah. But, but my administration declared Trump cabinet picks unqualified. Oh, God. Yeah. Like, if you just look at that thing and then you look at, like, and when I say things, right, it's like, you look at this thing and then you can do it to rock comparison. Like, okay. You know who scares the fuck out of me? Who? That new borders are.

3:01:18Oh, dude, he's a bad motherfucker. He scares me. He scares me. I imagine myself with a backpack, sneak it across the Rio Grande. That fucking guy's there. No. Yeah. Like, what did he say? He was like, about families? Is there any way to not separate families? Yes. He deport them together. He's a word of law. You know what I remind me of you. Remember that? It's just like, he said I was like, whoa. What is this getting dark? Yeah. See, I'm like a bleeding heart. Like, I want people from another country that are poor to make their way here and make a better life. I want that. It's wanted to be scanned.

3:01:54I want to know the fuck is coming over. Right. I want to make sure they're not cartel members. I want to make sure they're not terrorists. But I'm all for people that want a better life because I would do it. It'd be, I'd be a complete total hypocrite. If I said I lived in Guadam, Holland, some village and there's no power. And I found out that I could walk to America. And if I did it, it'd take three days and then I can get a job in the fields. And then I make way more money. I can send money home and everybody could have clean water. I'd fucking do it. You would do it. We'd all do it. So I get we'd all do it.

3:02:20That's so part of me is like, man, I don't want to send anybody back. But the other part of me is like, what about terrorists? What about what about checking for cartel members? What about the fentanyl that's coming through? Like you can't have an open border. I believe in it. Like, I believe in a meritocracy. Right. It's like, me the best idea prevailed me the hardest workers prevail. The problem is, is when we export all of our manufacturing to China, when we have a like South American, we have a border crisis. Yeah, obviously I'm a coffee guy. So I think about coffee all the time. And I think about Nicaragua, Salvador, and like all of the South American Central American countries that grow coffee.

3:02:57And I talked to the farmers and all we have to pay them is five or ten cents more a pound, depending on the coffee. And most of the time when I'm talking about coffees, I'm like, yeah, no problem. Ten cents more. Who cares? What that allows them to do is build schools, pay a livable wage, all of the things that they need to do to be successful in Guatemala, Nicaragua, wherever they're going, wherever we're talking about. So I think about this. Okay, so we're exporting these manufacturing jobs to China. And if we're just concentrating on economic policies in this hemisphere, where from a national security perspective, if we're exporting jobs to South America, we're creating economic opportunity and mobility in South America and Central America, we're creating jobs, economic stability, generational wealth.

3:03:57And we're also solving one of the issues that we're having, which is a border crisis. A border crisis. It just doesn't seem to make a lot of sense to me to say, hey, we want to export. And I know this started with the Nixon administration. And you know, you have essentially slave labor, which I'm 110 % against, which I don't think in any way, shape or form, we should support economically. So if we're to export and look at this from a manufacturing and industry perspective from this hemisphere, how do we align ourselves around strategic stability? How do we protect against our border crisis? How do we still import?

3:04:38Because, I mean, I know Americans love their cheap goods, like they love their shit, you know what I mean? They still want to have this decreased labor cost. I think investing in South and Central America is just not a bad thing. If we're not going to invest in America because of the cost, then we have to invest in this hemisphere. Well, it makes sense that if you want to make the world a better place and you want less people trying to sneak into our country, one of the best ways to make their country better. But we got to do it ethically. The crazy thing, and this is we beaten this horse a thousand times, is that everybody has a phone and everybody's phone is made by slaves.

3:05:16Right. And if it's not made by slaves, the cobalt that's in it, there's a real high chance that it came from someone with a fucking stick poking it into the ground and digging it out for you. Right. And that's everybody. We have to take a hard look at all this stuff. We should be making our phones in America. We should be making our phones in America with American minerals. They're their source for people to get paid a fair labor wage, they get health benefits, everything's OSHA, people check on things, make sure the regulations are in place, make sure that people get like make sure that they're making enough money to make a living, to live a livable wage.

3:05:54You have to do that in America if you want to do it legally. The only reason to do it somewhere else is so that you can do something legal because it's legal there, but it's not legal where you live. It shouldn't be legal to have people working in another country for you for like 15 cents an hour. It's just it's too crazy. It's too crazy that you just you cross this dirt path and now you're allowed to be a piece of shit. It seems crazy. But if you're doing it the right way and you're paying people well and you're allowing people to like thrive in a place where there was nothing before, yeah, you can you can give people a pathway to do a lot of different things.

3:06:27Economic success opens up a lot of fucking doors, especially with education, especially with safety, with schools, with better communities, people have money. There's not so much tension. Yeah, it's good. It's good to have a thriving industry. It's good to have a thriving economy. It's good for everybody. It's just not good for everybody. There's always going to be people that suffer in every kind of economy in every every kind of situation in the world. There's going to be people that suffer. And like we were talking about it on the way here like some of it's just luck. There's a lot of luck.

3:06:59There's not a luck. Luck is luck's a real thing, you know, good and bad. And it's there's you know, that's one of the most important things about having some success in this life. You know, it's having the humility to understand that you just got lucky as fuck.

3:07:16Your life. You know how lucky I'm like 10 fold order. I got all my fingers and toes. It's it's it's so incredible. Incredible business. I think good friend of mine. God, man. Like it's so incredible when you think about like the birthplace lottery of hitting the jackpot. Like holy shit. I think in this time too. Yeah. I think we're so lucky in this time. I think I'm particularly lucky because I grew up before the internet was at all. Like how old do you? 47. So I'm 10 years older than you. So when I was like 30. No, I think I was 27 when the internet became like a normal thing to have in your house and you had a dial up.

3:08:01And you turn on America, got mail or you got mail. You've got mail on AOL. So from that point on, the fucking world changed so wildly and so quickly that we weren't even really noticing it while I was changing. And now here we are. Here we are in 2024 where it seems like the most chaotic, the most weird. Trump just won again. Somehow another I helped him. Like all this fucking crazy. Like this is the wildest timeline ever. This is the most we're talking about. This is the most optimistic. Yeah, I've been in our country. Yeah. This is the most optimistic I've been in my adult life. Yeah, the moment that he won like that in a landslide, I was like maybe they don't have such a grasp.

3:08:49And maybe this will open up the door to making things more rational and balanced. And we could stop a lot of this fucking awful corruption that's just intertwined like the mycelium that's under the soil. Yeah, the corruption just intertwined a lot of its legal corruption. It's insane. When you think about, yeah, obviously, I'm super interested in the military industrial complex. But when you think about, yeah, we had, we'll say, just 50, 60 military industrial contractors, the start of 9, 11 and then now we're down to five. And we think of 860 billion dollars of annual data associated with the defense budget, which has gone up since our height in the world on terror or the war on terror.

3:09:41And we have five guys or five big companies that are basically taking 50 % of that 860. And then 50 % of that is profit. And how is it, how is it happening? When you think of this triangular effect between the military industrial complex and, okay, you have the revolving door between the Pentagon. So every star that comes out of the Pentagon goes back in the military industrial complex with X amount of years of disassociation, blah, blah, it's okay. Then you go back in the military industrial complex. So you go into like, lackey, Raytheon, one of the top five. Then you have congressmen and senators that are making decisions specifically related to the budget and the military, the defense budget.

3:10:30They're lobbying to increase defense spending. But then they also have factories that are related to like the F -35 or some big military contractor they're making 40, 30, 40, 50 % in profit. So they're the guys that are lobbying to increase the defense budget. Their campaigns are being paid for by the military industrial complex. They're directly increasing the military budget. It's a self -licking ice cream cone. It's insane. It's completely insane. And the fact that we don't have any strict firewalls separation from ethics and I'm not against people creating jobs in their state. That's not what I'm saying.

3:11:24The fact that there are not strict firewalls between the fact that you're going to directly profit and or your campaigns are paid for by the people that you will lobby to go in and increase the taxpayers liability. I was thinking about this other day. I was like if the taxpayer had an itemized look at where their taxes go, they just came out annually or once a month or whatever it is and they looked at what they were paying for. I'm pretty sure they might have a more vested interest into how much they're paying what they're paying for and saying, you know what, maybe we shouldn't be asleep at the wheel.

3:12:06Maybe we should probably pay a little bit more attention to this. Isn't that amazing that you don't get an itemized list but you're required to give an extraordinary percentage of your money to the government? Like what is the tax bracket? Someone who makes a million dollars a year. What is that? 40 % 40 %? 43 % probably. Okay, let's imagine you're paying 40 % in income taxes. Then if you live in California, you pay another 14 .4 I think it is something like that. And then I think it's another 1 % if you live in the city of Los Angeles. So now you're down to 30, what, 34 % what do you get there?

3:12:45Somewhere in the high 30s. So then you have sales tax on everything you buy. You have property tax. You have insurance. You have whatever your house costs. You don't have a lot of money left over. And the government doesn't even have to tell you what they're spending it on. Like you probably get less than they do. If you really think about it, if they get 40 % in it, let's just say you don't have tax shelters and all that good stuff. But if you get, if you pay 40 % in income taxes and then after all the shit like after all property tax and state tax and this and sales tax, like what do you have?

3:13:24How much did you get? What did you get? How much money did you actually get? Like I bet the government got more than you got this 70 % of your time at work is working for the faith that is so bananas that you don't even get an itemized list of what they spend it on. I have to file on my audited financials, right? I think about this all the time. I have to. It's a requirement. I have to pass them. Right. The Pentagon hasn't, hasn't passed an audit. In decades, they like 60%. We'll just say 50 % of the Pentagon's expenses, they're like, I don't know. I don't know where I went. Sorry. She had a look to experts.

3:14:06So how is it, it's this rules rules for the not for me? That's the rule. Always Mr. Audits. Yes, they are. How about how many times they miss their own? The Pentagon, the Pentagon, the Pentagon. I think it's like, it's crazy numbers too. Like whoopsies. Oops. I just forgot about that $300 billion. Or like, one point twenty one says they've never passed an audit. Yeah, there we go. There we go. There we go. So it's rules, it's rules for the not for me. They've never passed an audit. It's never. Yeah. Come on. Never. Never. Never. The Pentagon's accounting records are so convoluted that billions of dollars cannot be accounted for.

3:14:53Charges a new government report. Oh my god. Oh my god. That is so crazy. Never. Yeah. And and and they're and you'll go to jail. If you don't pay these, you'll go to jail. If you're not paying your taxes, you have to provide an audit and funny. That's so funny. Despite having trillions of dollars and assets and receiving hundreds of billions of federal dollars annually, the department has never detailed its assets and liabilities in a given year. For the past three financial years, the Defense Department's audit has resulted in a disclaimer of opinion, meaning the auditor didn't get enough accounting records to form an assessment.

3:15:32Like, sorry, when have he paperwork. With the money go. I forgot. Gotta go. I'm just a I'm just a military guy. We are just trying to keep America safe. Yeah. Like, it's what it is. What if all of it's going to UFOs? What if it's all of it's going to UFOs? What if all of it's going to some propulsion research thing that they're doing to got UFOs? They just not telling us. What are they spending it on? How much of it is getting greased into the side pockets of people? But even then, from a transparency perspective, does it not shake out for us? Because if we're saying, hey, we're going to spend, I don't know, let's just call it $100 billion on like black fund experimental technology to maintain our strategic hedge money.

3:16:21Do you think that we would all be like, no, I mean, it's better than not passing a fucking audit where you're like, right? I don't know where it goes. Yeah, rather you tell me that you can't tell me than tell me you don't know. Right. Tell me you can't tell me. Tell me you can't despite costing more than 1 .7 trillion in its estimated life cycle attempts to audit the program have run into major hurdles of the F 35. So this is just the F 35 F 35. This is some propulsion money. It could. It has a trillion. They probably I'm sure. Look, if area 51 exists and now we know it does for sure, it was a real base.

3:16:59They said it wasn't a base forever and then during the Obama administration, they had to expand the boundaries because surveillance equipment and binoculars and telescopes are getting better and more sophisticated and they were filming things that were flying around. They should have been filming. So they expanded the boundaries. They had to say that area 51 existed. Right. So what was that? Where did you get the money? What'd you do? What are you doing down there? Why do people say you have UFOs? What the fuck are you doing? Why do you have a base in the middle of fucking nowhere that's built into the side of a mountain?

3:17:30Like why are you guys acting like this is an Avengers movie? What are you doing out here? Once again, it goes back to just transparency. Yeah. Or you can't tell me because you think I'm a fucking baby. Like the same reason why you can't have mushrooms. The same reason why we can't have full disclosure of the JFK assassination, right? There's 4 ,000 documents. We even have we talked about the JFK assassination on this thing? I think we have. Have we like gone down the rabbit hole? I've done a lot of multiple people including all of us don't know. Maybe not. I don't know. What's your theory? So my theory is like it all goes back to Bay of Higgs.

3:18:04It's all Bay of Higgs. It's all Cuba. It's all Bay of Higgs. And so I'm looking at it from a paramilitary CIA perspective and thinking about it from Alan Dolos, which obviously like he's in charge of the Warren commission after Kennedy fired him. So I'm giving everybody a kind of a summary explanation. Yeah, Dolos Airport, which is the Dolos Brothers is single most two powerful fucking people in Washington even during the administration. But either way. So what happened I think was so operations of Pada, which is also George H. W. Bush's first oil company that he supposedly left fucking Connecticut and went out after his Yale, you know, his Yale tenure after World War II was like, I'm going to be an oil guy and start fucking a Zapatta oil.

3:18:53Yeah, of course, right? Even though it's bad dad's best friend with Alan Dolos. Sure. Anyway, so operations of Pada, which it turns into the Bay of Higgs. And Kennedy gets read in on this. He says, yes, let's go. And then when it comes down to the day, like, I mean, you've built 1400, let's say, you know, 12, 1300 man forests. That's a CIA, former Cuban exile army. You've built it in Alan Dolos has been the main architecture. He's been the main architect behind this. You've got all these guys. So let's even go back. These are all OSS World War II World War II guys that let's create a clear delineation between what they're doing and what they what they think the president is doing.

3:19:52The president's like, yeah, yeah, he's elected. Fuck that guy. We're the agency. Like, that's the way Alan Dolos actually ran things. He wouldn't have to tell me, he wouldn't even brief the president on what he was doing. So he puts together this thing, clears it through Eisenhower. Eisenhower says, yes, let's go take those fucking, you know, Cuban commies out. They put together a 1100 man force. They've been training on this. They've got secret bases in Guatemala. They've got all these paramilitary CIA guys. They're ready to take the beach. They're expecting air support because without air support, that changes the entire tactical equation.

3:20:35Like, if you don't have air support, there's a lot of things you just don't fucking do. Period. So the morning of Kennedy denies air support for the Bay of pigs. So the morning of so these dudes are taking the beach. These are hardcore like CIA trained paramilitary guys, Cuban exiles, and World War II hard core regime change combat veteran. Like, these are the hardest motherfuckers on the planet that we have. He pulls air support. He left 1100 guys on the beach to die basically. These guys all get rolled up. So they lost about 60 guys 2406 is the name of the brigade. 60 guys died. 1000 plus got put in Cuban prisons.

3:21:33Now you got an axe grind. You just pissed off the entire CIA paramilitary organization. I don't know if I'm the president. I don't know how I don't end up with a moonroof to be honest with you. Like, I just pissed off the guys that are actually in charge of like assassination paramilitary. All of the dirty deeds around the planet. I fire Alan Dulles for this catastrophe of the Bay of Pigs. I've got 1000 plus guys that are in prison in Cuba. I've got the entire former OSS hardcore anti communist anti Castro organization of the CIA pissed off. If you don't think they're not going to tear a guy up like some pro, you know, commie Oswald guy in a, you know, in a multi -story building in Dallas.

3:22:32If you don't think you're going to end up with a hole in your head, you're crazy to be honest with you. That's the way I'm looking at this. So they end up getting these guys out. But man, he pissed off a lot of super capable guy means opportunity intent means opportunity intent, which is now you left me and my buddies on a beach in Cuba. Bro, you are not going to get out of here unscathed. I'm just, yeah. That's my theory. I think that along with all the other stuff means there was probably a bunch of people that did not want him around. Oh, yeah. He wanted to get rid of the CIA. Yeah. He had his eyes on the Federal Reserve.

3:23:16There was a lot of crazy talk about secret societies and you know, you've seen that speech about secret societies. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And there was, he's a real threat. And as soon as you can get those killers to want them out too, well, now you got a problem solved. Well, you had a bunch of guys that thought he was soft on cue. He was soft on Russia. They had a bunch of dirt on him because he was he was banging a bunch of chicks. All of which, okay, you know, maybe it's true. Maybe it's false. I don't fucking know. But I mean, I think it's fairly validated at this point. It's pretty true. And you've got to, you have a collection of people that are thinking this is a zero sum game.

3:23:59This is a cold war. If you're weak on Russia and you think that the guy is going to bend is, you know, he's going to bend a knee to the bear. We've got a lot of, you've got to, you've got this confluence of interest where it's inevitable. It's also not universally loved. We think of him as being universally loved because he's dead. Yeah. But when he was alive, like there's a lot of people that were not fans of his in the red states, probably particularly Dallas driving through Dallas. Yeah, it's just a BJ that's from, it's from, it's amazing about it really is how sloppy the whole from sloppy as shit, the whole thing from autopsy to the fucking magic bullet lane on the gurney to having to come up with the magic bullet theory because the ricochet and the underpass, like the whole thing is so clunky.

3:24:57It's like such a shitty explanation. You couldn't kill one extra guy and say there was another guy over here. We killed him too. Yeah. You guys are, this is such a shit job. You guys, you don't have one other idiot. One other idiot give a bad rifle and just fucking shoot him. But they don't have any, they don't have the context of what we have, which is social media. Right. Of course. I mean, when did the, is it prudophilms? It was like 12 years later. Yeah. And it was on the Haralda Rivera show. And it's completely, you see Dick Gregory, who is a stand up comedian, brought it on the Haralda Rivera show.

3:25:32Are you serious? I know that. Dick Gregory, who is a stand up, who's a lot more than that, too. He's an activist, but, but like a real one, you know, not a, not in any way, some sort of a social value grifter, which I think a lot of people like gravitate towards activism because it gives them a chance to be really shitty because they're right. He was a brilliant guy, but it was also a guy who like was a truth seeker back when it was really hard to get to the truth. Yeah. And this guy had to acquire a copy of the supporter film when in time life got a hold of it, apparently like right after the assassination and they just kept it.

3:26:06They just kept it. They just kept it. And when you watch it, you realize why they kept it because you see his head go back into the left. And it looks like he does get shot in the neck from the front. He holds his fucking neck like this. He doesn't hold back with it. He holds his neck like this. Like that's impact. That's where it hit him. And then his fucking head goes back into the left. And we're supposed to think that this fucking guy did all this from the school depositor. Maybe he did take a shot or two from the schoolbook depositor. I don't think he was innocent. I'm not of the camp like it's a binary thing.

3:26:37Like a zero leehawve, a leehawvey Oswald was a pat sea and the CIA killed him or leehawvey Oswald acted alone. But that's a stupid way to think. I think for sure they used him. They probably gave him a rifle. He might have been in that window. He might have just been in the building. He might have been in the area. Who knows? I think he probably didn't shoot that cop. Like when they were chasing the afternoon, it seemed like he did kill that cop. I think he wasn't asset. But I also think there was a bunch of people shooting at the president. And if you look at that air, you've been to Deely. He's been there.

3:27:03Yeah. Yeah. When it's a weird. It's weird. It's weird. It feels weird. Yeah. Oh shit. It's a lot smaller than I thought it was. It's tiny. It's really little. Yeah. Like when people say he couldn't have made those shots, like shut the fuck up. He's right there. He's right there. He's right up. Like literally, you look up in the buildings right there. And he had a scope. At least he had a scope. That's what's crazy about the kid that tried to kill the president but try to kill Trump. He didn't even he had iron sights. Which isn't safe. But it's not if you just go and center mass. But this dude's doing before a headshot, 140 yards.

3:27:33And he's probably never shot anybody before. He's a 20 year old kid that they just somehow or another operation MK Ultra, a mine fucked him into shooting out of or he's on some crazy medication or or China or who knows? Who knows? Who knows? Who knows the fuck happened? But you know, some mobster. Some like happenstance mobster is so passionate about Kennedy. He's like, I'm going to kill. I'm going to show you. And people are letting him in with the pistol bang. It's so dumb. Dude, it's it's then you know what happens to him, right? Yeah, he dies. If he answered, like hard before that before that.

3:28:11No, huh? Jolly West visits him in jail. And he goes crazy. Jolly West, who is the head of MK Ultra. Oh, yeah, Jolly West was the guy who got Charles Massey acid allegedly from the book chaos. He goes into it. Jolly West went to visit Lee Harvey Oswald and excuse me, Jack Ruby. Jack Ruby is on the ground underneath his bunk crying in the fetal position that they're they're murdering the Jews with fire and he's tripping balls. This guy does them up with acid. Blue his fucking brains out. And then they probably injected him with cancer. 100%. See you later, fuckface. I think you have this outside.

3:28:49So what if we want to go all the way back and you want to just know my like two cents on this? Yeah. Okay. So Dolas knows that eventually the president is going to like, they're going to have enough amount. They're going to fire him. Dolas decides that he's going to have this whole separate CIA that's CIA guys, but they're all really very trusted in internal external guys. And I think those guys are essentially his guys. And they get hung out to dry in the Bay of Pigs. They're not attributable to the CIA other than loose affiliated documents. I think Dolas gets fired and they're like, okay, let's go.

3:29:43Let's like Alan Dolas didn't want to be answering to the president because he didn't answer to the people. He was answering to a bigger call in his mind. He's answering to this is an eminent threat. The big Communist bear is going to come and eat our lunch. So he's answering to the greater good, which is a reason for like the back drop of the Cold War is a reason for a lot of this nefarious activity. Like Angleton, like all these directors, everybody looks at these guys is like really nefarious characters, but you have to paint everything in the backdrop of the the Cold War. Like we're doing all this stuff to save America.

3:30:24Right. And I'm not validating them. They have. We have to understand that perspective. Yes. Because that was a big thing, even when I was in high school. This is the Cold War. They're going to fucking kill us. They're going to nuke us. Yeah. So we will do. It's very Maclevellian. The means justify the ends. Right. Anything and everything to save the nation at any point in time. So you have guys that are baptized in extreme patriotism and their belief is that they are doing things for the best of the nation. And that if they have an elected official, they can't be trusted. They can't be trusted.

3:31:04And they're these are guys that are in, you know, I went out to Omaha and for the 80th. These are, it's so interesting for me to think back on this because these are guys that are World War II vets that like they saw everybody die. You know, I mean, the the Soviets lost tens of millions of guys in World War II. They were defeating fascism, which is, you know, they were defeating the Nazi party, you know, the Japanese army. And they've seen thousands of men die. And they're serious guys. They're not. They're not lighthearted. They're not full of love. Like these are guys that are baptized in ultraviolence to the point of which this is a zero sum game.

3:31:54And we have everything to lose and nothing to gain by being nice. And nobody will get in our way to being able to maintain the sovereignty of the nation. Once again, I'm not justifying it. I can just get into the mind of them because if I'm jumping into Nazi occupied France in, you know, 1940 X because a lot of the OSS teams went in there. And I'm getting watching my friends get fucking mowed down by Nazi machine guns. And I'm killing Nazis. And I'm moving my way to overthrow Hitler. And now I feel like Stalin is the next thing that I have to defeat.

3:32:42But the man I've I have been quite literally baptized in blood. And I'm not going to let it happen. Now you think about a high intellect type age -driven ultraviolent guy that maybe a semi coherent based on their their copious consumption of alcohol probably right? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well old, you know, um, a lot of these programs start to make sense because these guys are like, they're fucking serious guys. And they think that we're going to die in a nuclear hall cost. Right. And everything, the means justifies that it's a very MacLevellian. I don't necessarily once again, I'm not trying to say that like every evil deed is justified.

3:33:25I'm just saying like, I've seen the beaches in Norm and do I understand greater than a lot of a lot of people with combat will in the direct psychological and emotional effects would do to people. And I can I can kind of see myself going like, hey man, if I'm a 26 year old guy that just went and fought the Nazis and I think that the the big bad bear is coming after me. Right. Man, you're a pretty serious character. That feeling of the big bad bear coming after us got lifted with the fall of the Berlin Wall with the fall of the Soviet Union, all that stuff went away. The fear when I was a kid that fear was everywhere.

3:34:05You know, I've talked to so many people that are like my age or around my age that remember being a child and being worried about a war with nuclear bombs with Russia. It was constant. It was in the air. When cruise chef banged his shoe on the the table and said, we will bury you. I watched that video on YouTube just like a month ago and it's still scary. So fucking bad issue. And when he said, we will bury you. Was that a direct quote or was that propaganda? Let me that one feels fishy. I bet that's one where it's like a little bit. Well, I think that's slippery then we will bury you because you know what I mean?

3:34:44Like when you get any translations. That was a direct response to when we agreed we have this mutual agreement between the Soviets and cruise chef wasn't like cruise chef wasn't actually a stallionist. He was making very big reforms in the Soviet Union. And so he felt betrayed by the YouTube spy missions that were taking place when we after you know, after they shot down the YouTube spy plane in Russia. And because we lied, he was like, bang, bang, bang. And I'm fairly certain that's what that whole thing was about because I think cruise ship was a man of honor. And these fucking guys are lying to me.

3:35:29And I mean, Stalin was a ship back. Don't like I'm of course. But cruise ship was like making significant reforms within the country. He was he was he was broadly condemned by a lot of the old the the the the Stalinists as here it is. I don't I mean, I think I don't see him banging the shoe in the video. He's banging his face. Yeah, I thought he'd bang the shoe. The video says did he bang his shoe? I see him.

3:36:02I see him.

3:36:08That's a scary language when they're yelling it. I know. Put that into a couple of pipes of vodka. Someone was saying this but it's so true.

3:36:23There's fucking bad fighters. Russian Muslims are the fucking scariest fighters, dude. I think if there's like one group that I would categorize like what's the scariest, I might be Russian Muslims from the CIA's website. We will bury you threat. Wily attributed to cruise chef in Western press was reported to have been made at a send off reception to Poland's gum mucamuka in Moscow. No, November 1956, according to Time magazine, cruise chef was overheard to say at the fine final reception for the Polish leader, if you don't like us, don't accept our invitations and don't invite us to come to see you, whether you like it or not, history is on our side.

3:37:01We will bury you. So he said that's a Poland.

3:37:06But that was a it wasn't in a police song or a sting song. The Russians love their children too. Wasn't that scorpions? No, no, no, no, no, no, no. No, I think it was a sting song, really? Sting song called the Russians. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, it was saying cruise chef said he will bury you. So they probably it was probably some fake news, just like how they said about Trump saying that very fine people on both sides. It's always been it's been fascinating to me because I think about the Russians and how many tens of millions of people may lost in World War II. Yeah. And I think about very empathetically how they got fucked.

3:37:48They really did. You know, I think and I'm not saying we we did anything bad. I'm just saying like what we did was we delayed the invasion of Normandy and we felt like a lot of people think this was that we were trying to soften up the Soviet Union because we felt that they were a follow -on threat in World War II. But we delayed the invasion intentionally, essentially, to let you know, a lot of Russians, millions of Russians essentially die on the Eastern Front. And when when you really think about it, when you know from, you know, those men from my context in you know, combat from how I think about combat, how I think about death, like those guys had a significant accident because they're like we need fucking help.

3:38:44We need you to open up the Western Front. I'm not validating Stalin because once again, I think he was a complete piece of shit. I know what you're saying. But yeah, yeah, is it is a Russian population knowing that we delayed the opening up the Western Front to go and take over essentially, you know, hit where Nazi, Nazi Europe because at that point obviously it wasn't just one person. Yeah, we have a significant amount of mistrust with you guys because we lost, you know, 20 million people plus the civilian population. I mean, some estimates 30 million fucking people. And you guys opened up Normandy, came through and then you're telling everybody that you won, you're the reason you won World War II and you're not even giving us any validated credit.

3:39:38They they had invaded Japan before we we dropped the bomb. And uh, in the Japanese were just as terrified of the Russians as they were the Americans. However, I can see from the Russian perspective going, man, we sacrificed millions of people to defeat the Nazis. And you guys are basically giving us no credit. So I think back in like, man, 1945, like where are these guys? Because they're all about my same age. We went to combat roughly the same same age. And there were a lot of people that were debating all of these issues back then 1945, 1946. They were talking about, uh, you know, not only Stalin, but you know, Patton was talking about like we need to just keep going, right?

3:40:33Patton was talking about like going, we need to keep going. We need to defeat Soviet Russia. And Eisenhower was like, actually, no, you're crazy. Uh, fuck dude. I think that's what he said. You know, I think that's what he's like, hey, fuck dude, like what are you talking about? Patton, you crazy. He said when he addressed the nation. Yeah, right. Yeah. That was right after that. So I keep thinking about myself and that like those guys, I think about myself a lot of times, too, or you know, 20 plus years after the fact, like this is 1968. This is 1968, man, from our war. So from 1945 to 1968, give or take, you think about all these GWAT guys that are being pointed.

3:41:14It's kind of a cool revolution, but 68 was a very important year in American history. I think 24 was a really important year in American history. Yeah. 24 is a big one. The one we're in right now is a big one. Yeah. I think when people look back at history with these great moments of change, I mean, think about how, you know, people look back at the Reagan administration, like when Reagan kind of like, what a lens slide, like they look back at those days, like we look back at like these historical moments, but I think this one is crazy than any of them. This guy gets kicked out. They try to put him in jail multiple times to get shot at.

3:41:55He says fight, fight, fight, fight. And then he wins. He wins in a landslide when they were all saying that it was a close race. And the whole thing is just wild to watch. It's like this is nuts, like this, this shows nuts. If you're watching this show on TV, like these writers are fucking amazing. Whatever they're doing, like keep doing this. This shows crazy. This twists and turns. You got your crazy billionaire character who doesn't even seem real. Doesn't seem real. This guy's making rocks. He's fucking road cars. There's no way buys Twitter because he wants a safe free speech. What? And the people that used to love him now hate him.

3:42:33The people that are driving their Teslas around like god damn it. They're angry, but they still have a lease. You know, you still have your Tesla. You hate Elon. You hate X and Don Lemon said I'm leaving X. There's no good discussions to be had here. Yeah, I just fucking boohoo. You don't like criticism. You don't like criticism. If you want to get into this game, okay, you want to get into the online game. The online game's different and the online game. You get judged by who you fucking actually are, dude. It's not about your producers and your teleprompter and shut up. You're on your own. The people think you're stupid.

3:43:11You're going to hear it and it might be because you're stupid. It might be. Look, people say a lot of people are stupid that are not stupid. I've seen people say brilliant people. I've seen people say Elon Musk is stupid. I have seen that. I've seen that. I've seen there's you're going to get it no matter what. You're going to get it. Everyone's going to get it. But if everybody's saying you're stupid, maybe you might be stupid. You might be stupid. You might have been protected from that stupid by these network shows. If you want to exist online and you don't like criticism on Twitter or you think there's disinformation on Twitter, community notes on Twitter is the greatest fucking thing that's ever been created because people get to look through the community notes and find out, oh, that is bullshit.

3:43:50And here's why it's bullshit. Or that actually is true. Even though it sounds crazy and people are protesting, it's actually true. That's fun. That's good. We learned something. If you can't handle that, well, you can go wherever. Where do you go now? Where do you go? Where do you go? Threads? What? It's people going to thread that. But they work for a while. It's pretty crazy seriously. When they work for a while. Yeah. It's not going to work. I don't think. No. If you've ever had, I don't know. The rest of you have your burgers? Yeah. I like soccer. A lot. Yeah. I like them a lot. I think he's a weird guy that you have to be a weird guy if you're super genius.

3:44:22100 billion arrows into jujitsu. He's a weird guy. But he's cool. I like him. I've had fun with him. Yeah. We played a fencing game together with virtual goggles. What? Yeah. Yeah. We both put on. He fences. So we both put on virtual goggles. I'm not sure when he was like in Hawaii or San Francisco. No, we did in the same room. Wow. It was fun. Yeah. The new Oculus is fucking cool. And you've got to wonder where that's going to be. Because when I first tried the first very first Oculus, it was kind of cool, but kind of crude in a way. And with each new version of it, you get like, it's much smaller now.

3:44:57It used to be, we had a cable. And the cable was attached to the ceiling on a wire so that you can move back and forth through this all these wires connected to you when you have the Oculus. So you had to be plugged into the computer, actually. But now you're not. Now it's just on your head. And now it's fucking resolutions. It's pretty. Goddamn good. It's in its weird. Like you do things like you can go to a comedy club and you sit in the audience and there's all these other people in there. There's a comedian on stage. It's fucking strange. There's all these little online games you can play with other people, 3D shooters and shit.

3:45:25And you got goggles on. You feel like you're in the game. It's real weird. And most people are kind of freaked out by it. So I don't think it's like they went with that whole meta thing. They thought everybody was going to dive into the metaverse. But I think there's this uncanny valley between like you put the goggles on and you're in the world and you kind of feel it. You feel uneasy. Like this is weird. This feels weird. VR feels strange. Like a lot of people make some dizzy. They want to take it off. Yeah. My wife is like that. Yeah. Mine is too. But I think they're going to get to a point where it's not going to feel weird.

3:45:57Like there's some commercial applications. Like there's a company called Sandbox. And they have this fucking amazing game called Deadwood Mansion. And Deadwood Mansion. You go into like this warehouse space. They have one in Austin. They have one in Woodland Hills where we used to go. It was right down the street from the studio. You put the goggles on and all of a sudden you're in a mansion. You got a shotgun. And zombies are running at you from everywhere and you're blown. You're blowing their heads. Seriously? Oh yeah. Okay. It's fucking amazing. Dude, no one know my family wants to play it anymore.

3:46:27Why is it two intense? I get very intense. Oh, very intense. I'm killing zombies. They don't like it. They're these gross. It's like, I'm like, come on. Let's kill zombies. Like for Father's Day, I made them come kill zombies with me. I fucking love it. Yeah, he's your father's day present. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He's awesome. It's fun. You got a shotgun and they're running at you. You're blasting their heads off and you get attacked from behind. It's fucking awesome. You have a haptic feedback vest and you see red when they're attacking you. You see black splatters of red in front of your face and they're attacking you.

3:46:57Everybody wants to do that. Everybody wants the damn. Yeah. If we were like, oh, we're in a zombie apocalypse. How many dudes do you know? They're like, oh my god. Yeah. Awesome. This is going to be fun. Yeah. They're so slow. They're so slow. But these ones are pretty fast. The ones in this, some of them run at you. They run at you. Yeah. It's like, it makes more fun. Remember that movie 28 days later, where there were zombies were running. Yeah. That's the scariest zombie movie. Yeah. Running zombies are, that's the, that's the real zombie. The walking dead zombies, get the fuck out of here, bitch.

3:47:27You get me. So disappointing. Like the first like five seasons were great. How are they not all dead? But how are not all the zombies dead? They just keep going. They're just more and more zombies. How's that possible? I can't. It's so easy to kill them. I can't get enough zombie movies. I love them. I love the post -apocalyptic. You know, I don't like Darryl using field tips. So stupid. Why is he using field tips on his grave, boss? That drives me crazy. That drives me crazy. And he's like pulling them out, loading them back up. And you're like, dude, come on, man. Like you're maybe like a angry, you don't lose any fletchings.

3:48:05You don't get any pastures. No pastures. It's all just like sticking in their heads. What the fuck are you talking about? This is the dumbest weapon ever. Yeah, Darryl. That fucking field tips got to go, son. You don't have any bronheads? You got to put like a solid like triblaid or something on there. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like get a real good car. Yeah, that's what you want. Yeah, like a Montec, one of those Montec carbon steels. Yeah, send it. What was that one? The hide? What was that? Yeah, the hide. Yeah, man. That did a lot of damage. Yeah. I'm very impressed with that one. Because that one, I got the 125 grain one, which has the steel feral.

3:48:49And it's got a two inch cut with the mechanical blade and a three quarter inch cut with the fixed. So it doesn't make a big hole opening going into the three quarters. Talk ladies and gentlemen. Yeah, two and three quarters. It's a broad head for archery. When it goes in, that's when the blades open. So the rage, which I used to use for the T2 now, the deadly version, that opens up on the way in. So at least a big hole all the way in. This one opens up inside. So really, you're penetrating with the fixed head. And then once you're passing in, the pressure is what makes other two blades go. So they really makes a pretty small entry hole.

3:49:25But the exit holes are crime scene. The exit hole was a crime scene because you're going out with two and three quarter inches. It's just instant death for the animal. It's like super ethical. I think when it comes to like the amount of damage they can do, those mechanical, they put animals down so quick, so quick. Yeah, there's something to be said for that giant cut that they make inside. It's just so different. Like cams cams, he's using a catapult. It's basically a catapult that four blade carnivore thing. That's insane. It became cheese my life. Like he really did. He's like, create a bit really big hole.

3:50:04Yeah, because I don't care what you do. Just create a giant hole. And that's because you're going to put the arrow in the right spot. If you create a giant hole, then you're going to have a great blood trail. Yeah, you're going to find your animal. He rewrote my entire hunt sequences here. Because you were before that, you were penetration. Yeah, right. Which is another way of looking at it, right? If you're thinking about a cut, a cut that goes through the entire body is a very long cut. And it's always lethal. If you get him in the vitals, but you don't get a blood trail and they don't die as quick.

3:50:41The dying is quick thing is the one in a ta -honed last year that bull died in like less than 10 seconds. How many seconds was it seven if that maybe five ran up to the top of the hill and just fell down. I've never seen anything. I've never seen anything die that fast. And that's those big mechanicals. And I'm not saying that because you know, you're Joe, like you're just the dude on the side of the mountain that was shooting the elk that I was watching. Like it fucking died faster than anything I've seen even shot with a rifle in the chest cavity, right? Right. So clearly differentiating between like a head shot and a chest cavity.

3:51:21I've never seen anything die that fast from an animal. It was dead. I think there's something to be said for those giant holes because it's just if you, especially if you have a strong bow. So if you have a bow that is a lot of kinetic energy and a lot of speed and you're shooting a heavy arrow and it's hitting that rib cage. Like there's something for that big cut. It just stops them. Because are you at 80? 84. 84. Yeah. The new bow is 84. Oh, the new hoi is so smooth. Like that's oh, it's so smooth. I got it. So they just came out yesterday. Yeah, I gotta go. I, I, I, I find the new one. I felt so special.

3:51:56I had one for a couple months and I had to blur it out. I took pictures. No, I don't feel like such a chump. I was out there. It's like I've got the old one. It's not a big deal, man. Well, I used to think that when I saw cam shoot his, I'm like, how could it be better? These are so good. How could it be better? And then you shoot the new one. You're like, God damn it. It's better. It's super accurate. Like so dead in the hand. Like the, the way the shot breaks. It's just like they keep making it smoother, smoother draw cycle. It's faster. Which, so you're doing 84. Yeah. What are you Garmin? What's your, what's your feet per second on it?

3:52:31Oh, it's 2 .93 or 2 .94. So he should in 454. 4 .75. 4 .75. Yeah, I bumped it up because I went to those 125 green. Yes. But my bow went from 80 pounds to 84 with the new one and then it kind of made up a difference. So the 25 grains is basically the same kind of speed as with the last one, which I had a 450 grain arrow. So this like a, I think there's probably be like a number you shouldn't go below. I don't know what that number is. You know, like grains, like some people, they'll hunt elk with like a 300 grain arrow. And a lot of people don't do that. Don't do that. You can get away with it because they're like, well, my daughter shot an elk and it was a pass through and she's got a 50 pound.

3:53:11Well, okay. She got lucky. She got lucky. You need some force to get in there. Like if you're shooting 500 on a 84 on a, on a 84 pound 85 pound bow. So let's say you're doing, even if you're doing 270, right? That's still boom. Massive penetration. Massive kinetic energy, especially if you have carbon arrows. Yeah. I love those carbon arrows with the victories with the slick outside because you pull them out of target so much easier. Who's making those? The vaps. Okay. What are they called? The TKOs? Yeah. I love those. Rip TKOs. That's a rip TKS. Yeah. Is it great? They're coding that they have on it is like it's so easy to find.

3:53:51I got like a tasselon or some shit around. Yeah, but you got to think that's that aids in penetration too. It has to, right? I mean, isn't that why guys like the thin diameter like cam shoots those. I don't know if he's doing it now, but he was for a long time. He was shooting those four millimeter arrows. Those are real skinny ones, but the four millimeter, I like lighted knocks and the four millimeter with the lighted knocks make me nervous. Like they're more vulnerable because they get the little light inside of them instead of being a big solid piece of plastic. Like I always change them before hunts.

3:54:25I always put fresh ones on. I never trust ones that have been sitting around. Never trust ones that are shot already. I'll shoot them a bunch of times like for practice, but they break sometimes. And especially I'm not paying attention. So I might be accidentally touching arrows. I do the same thing like I have fresh arrows for hunting. Yeah, but they're the exact same setup for practice. So that's why I like like the sever or something like that because the severers you can pin them and then I can shoot the shit out of those and then just not use the pin. Yeah, and that's huge. That's why I like them because I can shoot the same exact weight and dimensions.

3:55:02I know the flight characteristics are going to be the exact same versus sometimes when you get those practice heads. Yeah, they're different. They actually have different flight characteristics because the way that they're put together is not exactly the same and I believe in the fact that it's like, hey man, if you got a slight fin on the front and it's a different fin on the back even though it's only an inch, you still have to be 100 % consistent to maintain the same flight characteristics. Yeah, that's why when guides get real nerdy about like what helix, like what kind of helical you have on the veins and like what kind of twist you put your veins and you have to have a single bevel blade that twists for the broad head in the exact same direction.

3:55:45Don't get a right twist with left veins, then you'll get all fucked up. But their idea is that you're trying to get the broad head to spin through the animal. That's the whole idea behind the single bevel. Is that, do you think that's true, though? There's something to do it. Yeah, there's something to single bevels because the cut, the way the edge is cut. So for people listening, single bevel means the edge angles in on one side. Double bevel means it comes together as a point, right? So think of a blade, but a blade with only one side that you can, you know, you see like where the steel is ground down to the edge.

3:56:22The other side doesn't have that. So the idea is that that creates this angle and that when you're spinning, your arrow is spinning because the helicals of your vein, it goes into the animal's body cavity and the bevel in the broad head accentuates that spin and it continues that spin through the body causing like a whirlwind of trauma inside the animal and that it, you know, it almost affects axis multiple blades because it's kind of spinning around. It's not just cutting a straight line. It's twisting, but the question is like, how much twist and is it more effective to have like a four blade thing, like a four, like a tooth of the arrow, like one that you get, you know, those are, I don't think it's true.

3:57:00You don't think it's bullshin. The the bevel spin. No, I don't think it does. I think it does a little because there's a guy named Lusk archery and he does these tests on these things and he actually shoots them into ballistic gel and you can see them spin. So some of them do spin, but I think it's too complex though. Once you, because once you have a rib cage, right. And let's just say you go through the rib and stop the rib cage. So let's say a perpendicular shop in the, in the perpendicular shop from the rib cage, right at 40 yards. So we'll just keep all the variables basically the same. Even then there's no necking of the rib.

3:57:42There's no variation of the actual animal skin. There's no slight courting waste or courting torches. There's no. So ballistic gel, I think there leaves a lot of questions for me. So even though it's twisting in the ballistic gel because it's consistent, you're shooting it directly perpendicular into a very consistent format. And you're getting a consistent result. You're not going to get a consistent result. I just don't believe you're going to get a consistent result through a rib cage. Well, that's the reason why a lot of people like mechanicals, it's one of the things that they say is that the cut is so large when you get into the body cavity that you take out all the other variables.

3:58:21Yeah. It's going to do so much more trauma than something that's just a slit blade that let's say you do hit that rib cage and it does slice and only hit one lung because it deflected off of it. And it doesn't spin at all. And now you lost the animal. Whereas you get a mechanical, it goes in there. It creates this massive fucking hole. It does all this trauma going through two and three quarter inches of trauma going to the animal. The odds of that animal surviving are gone. If you get them in the body cavity, they're gone. And I've seen people hit people with really good shots with small broadheads and not do much damage to the point where the animal runs off.

3:58:54They have a hard time blood trailing it. It's even if the animal dies 30 minutes, 60 minutes later, you might have a hard time finding it, especially if you bumped it. 100%. I've had that exact experience like multiple times with those little broadheads. Yeah, man. Yeah. Yeah. Cam, like I said, he changed the entire way he thought about it because he's like, created a big hole. Well, he changed his thought about it too. He was always a fixed blade guy. Oh, and then who told him to do that? Oh, Wayne did from the boat ride. Yeah, Wayne said, you got to try these carnivores. So just trust me. Just try them.

3:59:31So these things are crazy. Because this is a bomb. Yeah. It opens up these four blade catapult. It looks like one of those turkey broadheads. Yeah. It's crazy. And because of the design, it's just like the hides. It opens up from the front. Yeah. So once it's inside, then it's doing all its damage. So you don't have to worry about it getting destroyed going in through ribcages and stuff as much as you do with other things. Because it's really just going to get a little hole going in. And then once it's in, then it's opening. It's kind of a perfect idea. The only thing that people don't like, like, Dudley doesn't like, it doesn't leave a big hole in the outside.

4:00:06Like, I talked to Dudley about it. He's like, I want extreme trauma. I just want extreme, I want it one big giant cut with all that energy. Just going through the like, he just think of it like sticking a samurai sword like through the, the animal's body. Right. And you know, obviously he's one of the best bow hunters on earth too. So like, there's a bunch of different philosophies on it. But I think the idea of the mechanical blade is legit. And I like the hybrid idea of the best because then you always have a fixed blade no matter what. I like the, I like the hybrid. Obviously, this year was great because I like the hybrid a lot more than what going either pure mechanical or pure fixed.

4:00:45You feel a little insurance policy. Yeah. Yeah. It's like the best in both worlds. Yeah. Okay, cool. Yeah. Let's let's let's let's keep consistent with this. And everybody I talk to, you know, they have well, throughout the past year, several years, they have all different opinions, which is broad heads are like, you know, assholes. Everybody has a fucking different opinion on it. Sure. And, you know, John has his opinion, Kam has his opinion. Everybody has their opinion. Like, my buddy, Dan, Elk, shape, did you ever watch that? Sure. Yeah. Yeah. He's got his opinion. All these guys have opinions.

4:01:21So I'm just trying to like, they're all successful. That's the crazy thing. It's like you're trying to sort it out. Like, who's right? And so I'm just trying to like create the data and put it down into what works for me. And I don't have any sponsorships. So I'm just, which allows me to be fairly empirical in the way that I'm actually selecting the criteria. But I also don't have to reps these guys do either. So you have to rely on their their data and then collect all of it and then kind of put it in one one case. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, absolutely. I'm always fucking around with things.

4:01:57That's one of the cool things about archery is all that tinkering. You know, there's like so many different things you could try. Like, this year's the first time I tried a 15 inch front bar. You know, I went to a 15 inch front bar with a 12 inch back bar. Oh, I like it so much better. Really? Yeah. Because I was using that quiverizer and the problem is with wind, it's a sale. That sale just pushes your pin around too much. But I love that guy though. Oh, yeah. I love that guy. Look, the quiverizer I've used it for years. It's a great invention. But I find that with wind in particular on along the balance that I would get from that quiverizer, I can get from that.

4:02:31I'm using a cutter stabilizer with a 15 inch front bar or 12 inch back bar. And it's perfect. It's holds so good. It holds so nice. It just, it feels so dead on. And this year I went with a 10 degree downward angle of the front bar. Yeah, I was going to ask you about that. Why why did you go with it down versus what what matters whether or not it's I know it doesn't make any sense. It doesn't make any sense. But I was talking to these archers who do it and Levi Morgan does it. His that goes at a downward angle too. And I was talking this archer and he said it actually for some reason it helps you hold better.

4:03:06Like you feed it locks in better. Yeah, the slight downward thing with when you're pulling back there's something about the slight downward angle of it that it lets you hold better with the same amount of weight. Right. Because it's going in a different direction than just straight forward. It doesn't totally make sense. But I really believe in it. Like when I started doing I was like, oh, there's a little different feel to this. I love that. I love all the tinkering. No, I love the tinkering. That's so much fun. It's so much fun because it's like there's all these different ways to do it. You know, there's all these different releases.

4:03:40There's all these different styles of releases. There's so many different things you can fuck with. You could just go down a rabbit hole after a rabbit hole. That I know. That's what I did. You and I, I would say like 90 % of their texts are around releases. Yeah, like what released in my doing. And I went, I think about 20 releases this year. Like over the course of 2324 after, you know, the hunting season. And it's fun. It's just pure fun because, okay, dude, I know I got it. It's like 250 bucks. Sure, you buy a release. And I fuck with it for a couple of weeks. I get the the guy that runs my little bow shop there at Black Rive for Isaac.

4:04:32I pass it off to him like, sell it on eBay. I don't give a fuck about those things. And I got a box of them. Yeah, I got a box of different releases. I've tried everything from four finger releases to two finger releases. What I really like is that one with the clicker, that onyx with the clicker. It's got this little clicked and then the real like I get to shoot that as good as I get you to hinge. So you get the best of both worlds. You get like the ability to make it go off if you have to. You know, if there's some weird situation where, you know, there's, you have like a literalist split second to make a very close shot.

4:05:03You can get away with that. Or you could shoot at a long distance target and feel just as comfortable as you do with a hinge. You know, because you have, there's something about having that little click and that onyx clicker. Like once you feel that little click, you know, it's about to go off. He just pulled through it. It's so funny. I'm the exact opposite. I hate that fucking click. Like when I'm when I'm on the click. Like, like, it's one it's go off. I just wanted to go off. It does fuck with your head. But one thing it does is it puts all your concentration in the shot process instead of like camera and the trigger.

4:05:36Right, right. Which is all you hear that click. You know, right there. Yeah. It's pulled through it. And it's so it's such a delicate little click that once you get it in your head and you shoot with it a bunch of times, you like welcome it. Like there we are. Click. Come on. Okay. So you're you're like, come on. Looking forward to it. Yeah. I'm waiting. And then the click is like settle in. We're right there. Plop. It's like that one extra step that gives you this one extra little piece of concentration. Joel Turner talks about it in that whole shot IQ process. And he developed it. He developed it onyx clicker.

4:06:09So that one little thing that one little click is what it would separate it from a regular trigger. And then plop out. And then you get all your thought process into the shot process. I'm just making sure you do a good shot. Huh. Okay. All right. I've used it. It's a thing you gotta get used to like everything else. Like, but then you talk to camhazie. Just fucking hammers that trigger. I know. So it's like some people can't do it that way. It's weird. Everybody's got a different way they like to do it. It pisses me off. I'm not sure if I can do it. So bad because I see like some of my buddies that um, Dylan Chris Jensen is the country music singer.

4:06:48If you were like, uh, he and I've wanted to get a few times a call around. He just hammers the trigger. It's the craziest thing you've ever seen in your life. He's just like, pal, like, that's kind of how cam does it. And I look at that. Touches off. Every time like, oh my god, man, how are you like hitting the target? Just center mass just over and over again. But I think it's a mind fuck that a lot of people put their head into that you're going to get target panic and that you can't control your emotions during a shot process to the point where you could command trigger. But it doesn't make any sense to me now.

4:07:27Doesn't make any sense from like, I can understand the psychological aspect of target panic. But I have a feeling that it comes from two different things. It comes from buck fever, which is like, you're freaking out. You never shot a buck this big before. Oh my god, he's right there and you're like, ah, that's normal. But that's an experience thing. And you have to learn what that is. And if you do it a bunch of times, then you get to the point where like, oh, I know how to control myself. I know what this is. And the more often you do it, like if you can go on a couple of pig hunts and then go on an elk hunt, you're way more in the groove.

4:07:55You way, you're like right there. You know what to do. You know how to do it. And you could touch the trigger off 100%. Cam does it every goddamn time. I think it comes from the target archery community. Because I think those guys are staring at these fucking little tiny X's from 20 yards and they got to shoot 30 of them in a row. Right. And I think you're you get mine fucked. And that's why those guys have hinges and all these crazy and 40 inch fucking stabilizers and V's that come out the back. And it's all about not moving. Plop. Plop. But that's not bow hunting. And we were talking about this that I think the difference between bow hunting and target archery is like the difference between doing free throws and playing basketball.

4:08:34Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Free throws. Nobody's fucking with you. You're on the line. You can measure it. You can sit there and you can throw it. Different sports basketball. You're running around. You got to people. People are saying same. Same subschool set. Right. That's hunting. Yeah. Hunting is basketball target archery is free throws. That's what I think. Yeah. That's what I think. And I think you can't tell a guy like Cam Haynes is doing it the wrong way. That is the best guy does it that way. You have to go. Okay. Why do we think you can't do it that way? Well, it's psychological. It's all psychological.

4:09:07It's all panic. It's all not being able to control your nerves. If you can shoot perfectly that way at a target, you should be able to shoot perfectly at an animal. You should be able to the different. It's not the animal isn't like some fucking invulnerable thing that like you have to do it a certain way or the the frequency is not correct. No, it's an animal. It's like just like a target. The Army Marksmanship team is not Delta Force. Like that's right. Right. Right. Very different. Very good shooters. Army Marksmanship team probably extremely proficient shooters, maybe even better so than Delta.

4:09:43However, it's a different scenario based activity. Completely different. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Just because you accurate at a stationary target doesn't mean you understand how to the freaking out. When you have a yeah, I horse coming in with swords on a 10. The freaking out. It's a fucking different thing man. It's screaming. It's like, ah, super horny. I'm going to fuck you. I'm going to kill you. I don't know. And you're like, could you imagine if you came over from Europe and there was no elk over there and you were camping in the woods. You were one of those first guys. You're stupid fucking burlap tent.

4:10:19And you hear.

4:10:23You're like demons. This fucking, you don't know. You're like, this is thing going to right. Is it going to run me through? It's not going to die. 100 % going to kill you. I would be more scared of that than a bear. Yeah. There's giant swords on it. Well, if it runs straight at you and just pales you in these. I wouldn't come in. I'll be more scared of a bear though. I feel like I'd grab an antler. If I hadn't seen any one of these before and like something comes in and it's got giant pointy things on its head. And I'm like trying to be completely blank slate. And I've got this other fuzzy thing that I can't really see.

4:10:56It's like claws and teeth. I'm like, my god. I'm way more afraid of this thing with swords on its head. The best thing is the bear. The best thing is the bear. The depends on what kind of bear we're talking about. Yeah. Like if it's a little black bear, I don't give a shit about that. I don't care. I don't care about those things at all. Like it's, it's so they're, they're kind of obnoxious. Do you see that one that got shot in New Jersey? It's 880 pounds. Yeah. 170 pounds dressed. It's fucking crazy. It new jersey. Dude, in New Jersey. That's a box. In the East Coast. How is that possible? They have the most.

4:11:28They have the most black bears per capita in the whole country. We've played a hundred times the video of the bears wrestling in the middle of a neighborhood and far rock away. Big fucking black bears. Just going to war in the middle of the street. I had a, I grew up in this middle of the, like, log and community out in the middle of nowhere. And I was just dude, they used to keep, we, I find it, it's out in the middle of nowhere dude. It's like so hill jack. But it's awesome. And my grandfather, everybody, they're all hardcore loggers. But I'm not exaggerating. We had a guy just outside of town that a pet bear, a pet black bear.

4:12:09I mean, he's a full grown fucking black bear dude. Oh my God. And he would just, this is the sad part. Like he had like, defanged it because it was slabber on people. And, but he had a full on black bear that would suck on his arm basically. And yeah, I mean, he's fed a couple of people accidentally. He what? He fed a couple of people accidentally. Playing with that. Oh, yeah. So he made him gummy. Yeah, gummy. Yeah. What did he feed it? Who the fuck knows, man? Like, oh, nuts. Like, he's, when I see this, he's are loggers. Yeah, these are, these are how long did he have this bear? By 10 years.

4:12:54I imagine, man. Like, like, you know, I tend to like, you know, what a crazy fun. Turn down the volume on my red neck up bringing. Keep this thing as yard. Yeah, we would drive by it on our way to another town. And he had a fucking bear in his front yard in a cage. It was insane, dude. Oh, no, I thought I was just running around. No, no, I kept it in the cage. Big cage. Just imagine. He definitely let it out. No, he let it out all the time. He's like fucking walking around. Like, the guy was a complete insane person. Oh, my God. And my uncle, my great uncle, it's like eight years old, create complete crazy person too.

4:13:40Time himself had to, how to fly back in the day. He came back from World War II. He was on, um, Navy, he was an easy Navy ship, ship guy. Time himself had to fly. He would fly around this Piper Super Cub. And back in the day, you get a bounty for Cougar Tails. So we had a walker hound. And he would put him in the front seat of his Piper Super Cub and fly around looking for tracks, land his plane, the middle of fucking nowhere, kick his dog out. And so you tell me these stories. And I mean, I hunted this guy forever. And the dog would find the bear. Yeah. He punched him out on the bear or the Cougar or whatever it was.

4:14:20Tread it. Tread it. Shoot it with a 22 Hornet because his whole thing was you let him bleed out in their lungs and then they fall out of the tree. You don't want to shoot him with too big of a caliber because it knocks him out of the tree and they run around. If you shoot him with small caliber and penetrates both lungs, their lungs fill up. Oh, they drown and then they fall out. Jesus Christ. This is what like my Cecil Ball was my uncle back in the. Did he have a backup gun? Oh, yeah. This guy was completely insane. He had like, when I was going to be comfortable with a Cougar in a 22. Dude, this guy was 80 years old when I was hunting Cougars with him back in like the Panhandle Idaho.

4:15:04And he was telling, he would tell me stories and I would only go hunting with him to listen to the stories because they were the best fucking stories on the plan He crashed his plane. He got fired from the sawmill. He was buzzing the tower buzzing the tower. Crash his fucking plane into his boss's office and it's like, fuck you. I'm out of here.

4:15:26He was a complete insane person. And he was telling me this other story and these are like the summarized version that the cliff notes of it. But dude, he would bake Cougars in the middle of the mountain. Spy himself. He's flies plane landed in the middle of the snow, find a spot for him, bake Cougars and he had this Cougar up in this log jam above a creek. And he was telling me this Cougar tucked himself underneath the logs above the creek and there's snow on top of the logs or the logs and then he was like crawling in underneath in the middle of mountains with like a 357 snub nose. He climbed into the Cougar Dan.

4:16:09Because he's like, this Cougar is eating my dogs and he's like reaching around my uncle who had like three strokes by the time that I was talking to him. He's like, he needs stutter a little bit. He's driving like 80 miles an hour around like a crazy logging roads in the middle of nowhere. I'm white knuckling his Toyota's comal with Cougar hounds in the back of the Toyota going, oh my god, I'm gonna fucking die any moment. And he's like, yeah, and I got my, you know, he's like, he had a he had a slight stutter. You know, pull out his snub nose 357 like a gangster and reach underneath the logs and start pulling the trigger once he found the right fur between the Cougar and his dogs.

4:16:57Oh my god. This dude was completely insane when it came to doing things. That's my uncle. This is like the guy that I'm like hanging out with. It's fucking reaching the end of the logs and felt his way to the cat. Yes. With a snub nose, whatever, you know, 357. Oh my god. To kill the Cougar because he's pulling up his dogs and eating his dogs. Oh my god. Yeah. Holy shit. Like when you talk about where I grew up and like the guys I grew up with, because I, you know, I'm a green beret, you know, this is like, oh, you fucking busy. Oh yeah. Oh, you're not like walking around on the woods with the saw in your back, you know, and like, yeah, just jumping on planes, I guess, you know, that's hilarious.

4:17:53They look down on it. Like that's an easy job. You're not a fucking lot of jack. You're kind of a bussy. That's so crazy. I go home. My dad would make fun of me. Like, is that interesting that there's like levels of discipline and hard work in the world? Like there's like, if you want to be a logger, there's no easy logger job. They don't exist. That is a hard fucking job. Those are hard men. Yes. Yeah. You want to be a logger and you're going to do it for 30 years. You're going to chop and carry trees for 30 fucking years. You're going to be living in the woods chopping and carrying three trees for 30 fucking years.

4:18:36And like falling trees, wrapping big cables around them and they're like, oh, you carried a backpack through the woods. That's pretty cool. I mean, just think about the different like groups of people that live these extreme lives. And how many people are at the coffee shop of blue hair that are totally oblivious. And I think hard work is like, you know, I'm dealing with my trauma and I'm going to Starbucks today to protest. It is a guy with a log on his back and he's 75 years old. And he can't wait to get off work so he can kill kugers with a pistol with a fucking 357. And we all exist on the same grand landmass.

4:19:20Yeah. Like this. Some dude that looks like he's like building bikes in the 1800s with the fucking curly comb mustache. It's like waxed up and you've got another guy that's like 80 years old. It's had three strokes. It's driving around in the mountains. It's running up a mountain at a six minute mile chasing his dogs to go kill a cougar. Not the same person. Not the same order of priorities. You know what I mean? There's probably a lot of those guys back in the day. But that was a common type of human in like 1820. Yeah. But you ran it all. That was like how you had to stay alive. You know, you live to be about 40.

4:20:00Then you had a stroke. Everybody died. Nobody got any vitamins. Eating fucking cornmeal and gruel and trying to eat squirrels.

4:20:14You're barely getting by. Like you're eating. You're eating a bear. That's how fucking nasty. They preferred bears. Yeah. That's what's crazy. Apparently they they thought it tasted like beef. They cooked a lot of bears. God. That's fucking gross. Some of them were gross. The grisly is apparently super gross. I asked Cam just released a new video redemption. A grisly bear. Yeah. Yeah. I saw it. And it's good. Great video. But he ate the bear. I was like, how did it taste? Like it was okay. And then I talked to James. He's like, it was fucking horrible. It's horrible. It tastes disgusting. But black bear didn't taste that bad.

4:20:50If you get it from a good spot. Apparently like Rinales says the blueberries, bears that are eating blueberries are the best tasting meat ever. But that I think that's also relative to bear meat. So they're saying no, he says it's like a great tasting. I don't believe it. I don't believe him. You don't think it was like flavored with like all the eight was blueberries. I think the problem is they eat so much rotten shit. Yeah. And that affects the way they taste. But I think if they're eating only blueberries, like, did you ever see his video with the blueberry fat? Yeah. It's like purple fat.

4:21:20It's crazy. He said that's delicious. He said it's so delicious. I believe him. I love to eat. You think he's a fucking liar. I would love to. He's awesome. He's so much fun to hunt with. And he's so bad. I just firmly disagree with him on the storm. Mike Brown. Like, no. What is the best tasting game animal for you? Moose. Moose. Interesting. 100%. That's a good one. And for me, for my kids, moose is the only game animal. My kids are like, yeah. Really? Yeah. They are 100 % chips in. They look forward to it. Not only did they look forward to it. They requested. It's the only game meat. That's interesting.

4:22:01That's a very interesting. I can eat elk. But I'm the only one at the table eating elk. Interesting. Yeah. I only shot one moose ever. And I ate it and I remember it was good. But that was with Ben O 'Brien, like 10 years ago. But I haven't had a lot of experience with it. For me, it's Axis deer and elk are the two best ones. elk first, Axis deer second. Yeah. Do you like Axis? I love Axis. It's crazy. Would it taste like right? It doesn't taste like a deer. No, it's like this is a totally different kind of animal. It's not even beef. It's like a clean. It's almost sweet. Yeah. It's a clean beef.

4:22:37Yeah. It's an interesting flavor. And the fact that, you know, they have so many of them in Hawaii, like that Maui new event as a company. For people who want to buy wild game, you can get actual wild game from Maui new event as an they'll ship you Axis deer frozen. They have meat sticks. It's fucking great. I'm not affiliated with them. I know the owners, but I don't have anything to do with them. But it's great company. And they're doing something that you actually have to do. There's no natural predators on Maui. So they have to shoot these Axis deer. They're fucking everywhere. They're like, they're rodents basically.

4:23:08And they're delicious rodents. It's a crazy animal, huh? Too. Because they grew up with tigers. So they evolved with tigers. So they move so fucking fast. They're the fastest animal I've ever hunted. I shot a doe at 30 yards bedded and she dodged the arrow. It doesn't even make sense. They move so fast. It doesn't even make sense. I started shooting them longer distance away because the arrows quiet and they can't hear the string slap. So they can't hear the bow. So I started just shooting them a little bit further away. They still yell anyway. If you, we stopped hunting them in the day because in the morning, there's no wind.

4:23:49We started hunting them only in the afternoon because there's more wind. The wind at least covers a little bit of it. But Dudley got video of me shooting this Axis deer at 80 yards and it's a perfect shot. Perfect. It's going right to the vitals at 80 yards. Perfect break. And then 10 yards. The arrows, 10 yards from him goes, and he's gone. Within 10 yards, he was gone. He was nowhere near where the arrow hit. What? He moved out of the way. He heard the arrow coming and he moved out of the way. 10 yards from this video of a slow -mo video. Because it's a lighted knock. He's in a perfect line.

4:24:21Had it straight for his vitals and then gone. Gone. Not even close. Not even close. Not even close. Like a bullet. I missed him by like a whole quarter. He was gone. He just ran away. They hear things. They think a tiger's coming. They just go. They just go. It just makes you feel so slow. When you watch how they move, like people suck. We're so fucking clumsy and soft and we're so vulnerable. My back hurts. My arrow that's moving at 300 feet per second. It has no chance. No chance. No chance. Especially if they see the bog go off or they hear the bog go off. They're gone. And they're delicious.

4:25:06And they're everywhere in Texas too. That's the wild thing about Texas. You could just bring whatever you want in. You want zebras? You can bring zebras? You can have fucking zebras. My wife saw zebra one day which is driving the kids to school. I know. I saw zebra. I think I saw zebra. You probably did. So I'm gonna ask all probably as a zebra. The zebra got out. My kids would be like driving around and like let's go look at the zebras. Okay. Let's go look at the zebras. You can have zebras in Texas. But I love it. I love it that you can go to like when we went to that place down in South Texas that ranch that my friend owns.

4:25:42We went down there like there's African animals here. Yeah. If these crazy black bucks and all these different animals are not from anywhere near here and there's thousands of them. Like this is nuts. Like you shot that um Neil guy. Yes. Yeah. But everybody says that's like the best meat ever. So put it on the scale associated with everything else. It's really good. It's all really good. All wild game from a healthy animal is delicious. I find at least undulates. They're all delicious. I've never found one that I didn't like. But I still think Elk is the best. That's just my I like the flavor.

4:26:19Also I like Elk hunting so much. It means more to me when I'm eating a piece of Elk. I think I'm just biased. I think if there's anything it's I just like eating them. I like eating them. And I also think it's gonna sound crazy. But I think you get their spirit. I think there's something about these super potent wild animals that you kill with an arrow and then you're eating it. Like you get the the spirit of that experience, the spirit of that animal. I think it empowers you in some very strange physiological way. I really do. I think that's they're so vitamin rich. Like they're such athletes.

4:26:54The way they run up a mountain. Like you're getting these nutrients from that animal. And I don't think it's any like any other animal because there's so much stronger than all those other animals. They just run. They have 900 pounds. They run right up the top of a mountain side. Like it's nothing. Like this is crazy. You watch them when they get winded and they fucking run over the top of a hill that takes you 40 minutes to to crawl up. They just run up it. When you eat that thing, you're like, you just feel it. You know, you feel it in your your body feels it. You get it like a little boost.

4:27:27Yeah, it's it's electric. Yeah. I feel the same way. I've given it to people that don't even hunt. Yeah. And they go, dude, I feel so good after I ate this. I have, yeah, there's something to that. It's super food. It is a super food. My neighbors, when I gave them, you know, elk or whatever it is, they're like, dude, this is amazing. Yeah. Yeah. This is what it feels like to be a hunter. This is what it feels like to go out, kill something, process it, put in a package, and it's special. It's meaningful. It's it's the whole celebration. And I hate to say it like that, but it is. It's like, this is, you said it earlier.

4:28:11And actually, I wanted to, what would you call it? Like an assassin for your food or something like that? Super market assassin. Yeah. Super market assassin. Yeah. This is the difference is over here. You think this is one that tastes different to there's a definitive meaning you're associating with it. So there's no way that you can tell me that there's not a psychological and nutrient connection between those two where it makes something more meaningful and beneficial specifically for you. There's just no way you can tell me that's not better. Right. Like a good meal with people you love. I feel like it just gives you extra nutrients.

4:28:47Mm -hmm. Almost like it's an extra good feeling about it. So why people like eating together? Eating good food with people you care about, having fun. The whole experience is better for you. Or overall being. It's a difference between like jacking off an porta potty and eating a meal with your fucking family, right? It's like, there's like a huge difference. Like one is like the bruce and a little bit shameful and disgusting. And just like it. Once a jack is a box cheeseburger, does it elk that you cooked on your own grill? Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. It's a big difference, man. Yeah. It's, um, I'm glad I found it.

4:29:22I'll tell you that. It's, uh, it's also, it's so hard to do. You know, we both had our trials and tribulations, elk bow hunting. And it's just, it's so difficult to do that the people that do it well, you, you know, the people that are successful, you know, are harder to do. You're like, God, damn, you pulled it off. Like that, that's a hunting elk with a bow in the wild is a real thing. Even in the places we go are better. They have more elk and stuff. It's always hard, folks. It's hard. It's always the problem with the public land thing is the public. I have so many friends that have terrible stories about guys winding elk on purpose, blowing elk out.

4:29:58They're all competing. It's the same packs of elk or the same groups of, of, of hunters are competing against the same elk groups. It's like, it's crazy. It's like, these, these herds of animals are getting like winded on two and three sides because people like moving in trying to get them. Right. You know, it's just the, the ideal situation would be that I think the ideal situation would be like, you know, they're trying to do that, um, that American, what is it called? The American Serengeti project. They're trying to like rewild whole section of the country. They're buying up land and they want to like bring back buffalo and bring back all these animals.

4:30:46If everybody like at one time in their life could have like some sort of a hunt where they're like, someone shows them how to do it, someone takes them out, they get an animal and they cook and eat that animal. If you're a meat eater, I think at one time in your life, you should try to do that. I think that may be the solution for people to understand what it's all about. Just one time in your life or even go with someone when they're doing it. One time, just know what that's like because it's a, it ignites a little part of your DNA that you didn't even know was in there. There's like a little part of us that for tens of thousands of years, the only way we survived is hunting.

4:31:23Yeah. Thousands and thousands of thousands of years just baked into our DNA. And when you're in there and you're in those woods and you got that rangefinder and that elk is 52 yards away and you see him walking through the bushes and you know you got a window and this like a part of your DNA that just goes, yeah, this is what we're doing. This is what we're doing now. Lock in, lock in, get the animal, bring it back. There's like some crazy like ancient primal code. And I tell people the same thing when you catch a fish. When you catch a fish, it's like, oh, this excitement, do you catch a fish?

4:31:58That's built into your code because now you're going to live. You're going to live. You got food for your family. It's in there, a human reward system. And you're going to appreciate the food because it's hard to get. That's what it's supposed to be. It's not supposed to be super market. And look, there's a ground beef is five dollars a pound and fucking you never chase anything. You never go kill anything. You're just sitting there eating. You're fucking ball apostas. It's so easy. It's so easy, right? It's just it's not supposed to be that easy. It's not supposed to be easy to live. If it is, you're going to get anxiety.

4:32:38You're not designed for that. You're designed for like trauma and testing. You're designed for struggle. You're designed to overcome things. And if you're not ever overcoming anything, you're filled with anxiety. Yeah. I don't deserve this. Yeah. Well, how do I deserve this majestic fucking animal that I just consumed? I didn't earn it. No, I just paid for it, which is weird. What? Doing some weird job and then you got these hitman out there. Wacken cows. Super market hitman. That's like the best. That is one of the best quotes I've got. It is. I mean, there's anything that's there's nothing grosser in this country than factory farming.

4:33:14It's the grossest thing ever. They have laws where you're not even allowed to film it because it's so gross. No, it's disgusting. Ag laws. Well, you go to jail if you filmed horrific acts, which is completely insane when you think about it. Yeah. When you think about how easy it is to go get your food and people knew, especially meat eaters, I've never quite understood meat eaters that are anti -hunting. That makes no sense to me. By the way, like zero sense. How can you think that this is a better way where you're caging an animal, filling it up full of like hormones and supplemental nutrition and corn and all these things and then you're putting a bolt through its head.

4:33:57But I'm not there. And then I'm at Starbucks protesting. Yeah. Yeah. But you don't know how this big gritty got in my hand, but now I'm putting it in my mouth. Just because I want to actually feel the significance of this event in the context of like, I don't have any bloodlust, I just don't want to be a hypocrite. Right. It's also one of those things that like if you have an experience that you really don't understand it, and when you're trying to explain it to people, they're looking at it from like the cartoon Disney version of Hunters, movie version of Hunters where all cock suckers. Dude, we should wrap this up because we got to go back and sit.

4:34:33It's almost six o 'clock. We've done like, dude, how many hours do we do? Oh, bro. Almost five hours. People, you should. Like that. All right. Thanks man. Appreciate you brother. All right. Bye.