#2470 - Pierre Poilievre

26:05But then people were like, it's a good idea. That's not a good idea. He's saying that I can assure him of that. But and the tariffs aren't a good idea either. We should get the tariffs out because there's so much that we could be doing together as neighbors and partners if we got rid of those tariffs. You know, I think what are the biggest problems in America today? Affordability, security. And we can help with both. We knock the tariffs down. Let's look at affordability. We have the fourth biggest supply of oil anywhere on Earth. You guys pay a huge price discount for our oil because we're effectively all our infrastructure to ship it is north-south.

26:43and it's a very unique heavy oil. So we accept, unfortunately, and for now, a price discount on the oil we send you, which can translate into more jobs and paychecks, but also lower energy prices. You've got$5 a gallon right now in lots of places in America. You're buying, I want to produce more so we can sell 2 million more barrels of Canadian oil into the U.S. market. And then there's housing. You've got huge housing pressures on young people. They can't afford a place to live. We're the biggest supplier of lumber for home building of any country that imports to the United States, exports to the United States.

27:22We've got very low cost but high quality softwood lumber we could be shipping. Or the best truck, the best selling truck in America for 45 years now is the Ford series. It's aluminum. It's a military grade aluminum body. You guys can't make enough aluminum here. You don't have enough bauxite or electricity to convert it into aluminum. You get your aluminum from us. A tariff does not bring the production to America. It raises the price of the aluminum and therefore the F-series truck. Get rid of that tariff. You lower the cost of an F-series truck for the miner in Appalachia or the electrician in Ohio.

28:02And that's just on the affordability side. There's a lot we can do with our minerals to make the continent a hell of a lot safer as well. So I think it's in America's interest to come towards a tariff-free deal and trade freely as friends. And that will be good for both of us. Have you had conversations with Trump about this? No. I believe in the rule of one prime minister at a time. So I fought like hell to win. I didn't win. We came very close. So I've said, listen, I'll leave it to the prime minister to do the negotiating. And I've said I'll support him any way I can. And even in my visit down here, I'm sending him text messages to tell him what's going on, to try and support his work.

28:42Because what we want, we both want what's best for Canada. Where are your elections now? When do you have the next elections? That's, this is a strangely hard question to answer. I know, you have a weird system. Yeah, it's. Weird in comparison to ours, rather. Yours are fixed, as you know. Ours, we have technically fixed election dates, but the government can fall at any time. It's a very simple rule. is that if the opposition parties bind up and they can vote down the government, that is to say the majority of MPs in the House say, we've lost confidence in the government, the election is now.

29:15Or if the Prime Minister decides he wants an election, he can call it and the election is now. But it has to be sometime in the next roughly three years. Oh, so you have a deadline where it has to take place? Yeah, that's right. But it could happen tomorrow. It wouldn't necessarily be tomorrow, But like, you know, in the next few weeks, if there were a non-confidence vote and the government lost it, then they go to an election. So it's kind of like the British system. Interesting. Yeah. Well, it is the British system, really. We adopted the British system almost identically. So when you're campaigning, you're essentially, this is like a long game.

29:55Yeah. You're just laying out your strategy, laying out what you would do to make Canada a better place. Yeah. Well, we have two roles. So I said I'm the leader of the opposition, but I'm also prime minister in waiting. So the notion is that the Canadian people should not only have a government, but they should have an alternative. And that alternative has two functions. Official opposition, it's actually called that. I think it's a proper noun, capital O, official capital O opposition, and also government in waiting. So you have to be prosecuting the government, but you have to present yourself to people in a way where they say, yeah, that guy or that team could actually be the government.

30:33Those are the dual roles that I have to carry out. Interesting. And how long have you been attempting to become prime minister for? How long has this been going on for? Almost exactly four years because I launched my campaign in February of 2022. Was this something that you had always had in the back of your mind? or I'd say in the back of my mind, but it wasn't something I was set on. Like I thought maybe, you know, when I'm in my fifties or sixties, I would try it. But I was in no rush to do that. How old are you now? I'm now 46. And so what motivated you to do it? Well, you know, after COVID, as COVID was unfolding, it wasn't just the COVID policies themselves, it was the economic policies.

31:23Because I've been very focused on economics in my parliamentary career. And I was seeing the size and cost of government, not just in Canada, but all around the world growing so much. And that inflation was just destroying the working class people and that it was going to get a lot worse. And so I ran on the platform of making Canada the freest country on earth. We had a tradition of freedom in Canada. uh, our, our, one of our earliest prime ministers, Wilfred Laurier, we asked what's your, what's Canada's nationality. And he couldn't actually list an ethnicity or a religion because we were already mixed up even a hundred years ago.

32:00We had Scots and Irish and first peoples. So he said, look, yeah, French, French, most of all French and English and first, first nations. So he said, um, Canada is free and freedom is its nationality. And I wanted to reinstate that idea. I wanted it to be the freest country anywhere on earth. And so I ran on that platform and won the leadership and then ran in the last election and stayed on after that election. So that's kind of the last four years of my journey. And so the way your elections work now, so you're essentially just stating your case and going around and talking about what policies you would implement and how you would do things differently and just waiting to see how it all plays out.

32:44So it's, we have, see, our prime minister is different than the president. He's actually part of the legislative branch. So he comes in to the House of Commons and we debate multiple times a week, he and I. So it's not just, you know, in your system, the Republican and Democrat hold like four debates right before the election. In our system, we're always debating. So he comes in, he's on one side, I come in, I'm on the other side. And I ask him like six consecutive questions and then he answers. And we go back and forth and that's called question period. Then we have these committees where we prosecute and propose on finance, natural resources, healthcare, you name it.

33:23So we're constantly prosecuting the government, also proposing better ideas at the same time. So like the other day I proposed to bring back the auto pack between Canada and the U S to have tariff free trade going both ways across the border. So that's an example of how I'm in a position to actually offer solutions, even though I'm not in the government. And then hopefully government actually steals my ideas. and I've been encouraging them to steal my ideas. So what... Is this coffee, by the way? Yes. I need some caffeine. Yeah, I need some caffeine there. I'm a terrible caffeine addict. Me too.

33:56Cheers. Cheers. Oh, and shout out to George St. Pierre for hooking this up. Yes, George is a good man. He's the best. Great guy. He said he's going to have me do some pad work with him at some point. Oh, really? So that's pretty dangerous. Oh, that's awesome. He's here all the time. He's a fantastic guy. He's the best. He's one of the best representatives of martial arts you could ever hope to meet. He's got humility. I remember he came to Parliament Hill years ago and I thought, geez, he's going to be because he's I thought he'd be cocky and swagger. But he was so down to earth. So much humility for what he's accomplished in MMA.

34:33I've I've introduced him to people and they have no idea who he is. And then I go, that is one of the greatest fighters that ever walked the face of the earth. absolutely no way he's so nice and that's the canadian way though like it's soft-spoken and gentle and kind but but don't don't piss us off yeah but tough yeah that's where trump fucked up i wonder what would have happened if he didn't go along with that 51st state nonsense you know i mean that that is the narrative in this country like i said that if he didn't do that that you would have won well you never know but i i try not to cry over spilled milk i focus on what I have to do and live in the present but but this new guy a lot have you followed him Mike Mallott oh sure I know yeah yeah he's gonna be fighting in Winnipeg I think he's the next GSP he's very good you like him yeah he's excellent yeah he did a great job in Montreal you saw him there but you have I've been to many of us who called a bunch of his fights is that right yeah Yeah, he's excellent.

35:35Yeah, he's a... My buddy is his trainer, Crew Allen, Amalgam, in Hamilton. He's a Hamilton steel town guy, and we're hoping that he has a big win in Winnipeg. Well, you guys have one of the best gems in the world, TriStar in Montreal. Is that right? Farras Ahabi. Okay. There's like maybe a handful of great masterminds in MMA as far as coaches, and Farras is at the top of the list. Is that right? And what's his discipline? He trained GSP. Is his discipline karate or kickboxing, Muay Thai? I mean, he's a true mixed martial artist, black belt in jiu-jitsu, kickboxing. I mean, he can do everything.

36:17And TriStar is a place where a lot of people from America go up there for their camps. Interesting. Yeah. I'll have to drop in and see those guys. Oh, it's phenomenal. I mean, like I said, GSP trained up there. A lot of fighters trained up there. And he also had a great working relationship with a lot of people in America. So he would come down and, you know, they would exchange fighters back and forth and train with each other. This episode is brought to you by Uber Eats. March is here and Uber Eats is delivering deals all month long. Each game day, score big savings on all the delicious food you need to turn your couch into center court and fuel your fandom.

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38:09And that's not the only thing that makes SimpliSafe a good choice. There's no long-term contracts and an anti-theft guarantee. So get peace of mind wherever you are. And right now, listeners of the Joe Rogan experience can get 50 % off a new system by visiting simplisafe.com slash Rogan. That's simplisafe.com slash Rogan. There's no safe like SimpliSafe. Yeah, well we have a great martial arts tradition in Canada. I don't know if you know Mike Miles. He brought Muay Thai from from Thailand to Calgary like back in seven in the 70s or 80s and he still got a great Gym there and do you know who Johnny Viterio is yes, he's a buddy of mine.

38:49Oh really from Ottawa. Yeah. Oh no kidding Yeah, he was a hero of mine when I was a kid. Yeah, he's incredible I was kickboxing. He was like my idol really yeah, does he know that? I never talked to him. Well, he's going to see this. I bought his book. Yeah? I bought his book. I started running stairs because of his book. Right. Because he was talking about how it increased his leg muscles and his kicking power. I remember that. It was in one of his documentaries or something. He said his kicks weren't strong enough, so he would do stairs. But I went and trained in his dojo a few times. It's in South Ottawa.

39:18He was incredible. Yeah. He was one of the truly elite kickboxers of his time. He was a great boxer. Like I know he never competed as a boxer, but his hands were fantastic. Well, that's really what separated him from a lot of other people. It was like his accuracy and his technique was pristine. He told me that he would spend hours studying the distances that your limbs would have to travel depending on how you moved. He was kind of like a scientist in the way he learned and studied. And he was all about simplicity and removing anything unnecessary. I think Bruce Lee said that he said simplicity hack away at the unnecessary and you know how do you what's the shortest distance to hit the strike and he's got a great he's a really good heart too you know he had he has a jujitsu club as well and when I went in there there was a blind fellow who was into jujitsu which you can do as a blind person because it's so much about feel but with COVID he couldn't do jujitsu anymore because they disallowed that kind of up close contact so he actually found a way to train this guy with focus mitts even though he was blind it was really incredible oh wow yeah it was just but it was incredible amount of patience he had invested in making sure this this young man could keep doing his physical activity throughout COVID wait a minute so they allowed pad work but they didn't allow jujitsu I don't know if it was a government policy or if it was just a it was a policy at the gym because you know you're just so wrapped up and sweating and alicia.

40:50The gyms in America, everybody just... Just kept going. Kept going. They hid. They would put foil over the windows and hide or come in through the back door. A lot of the gyms in LA, that's what they did. They just plowed ahead. They just figured out a way to not get in trouble. And some people did get caught and get in trouble and nothing ever came of it because it's pretty unconstitutional to tell people that they can't work out together. The government really didn't have the right To tell people that they couldn't do what they wanted to do that was a legal thing that you can do like all of a sudden there's this Mandate there's this law or rule being passed down or at least it's being promoted that you're not allowed To go to a gym and work out with other people like but those are the healthiest people Those are the people that are least likely to get sick like this this is crazy to say and you know if you're sick and if you just have a good gym with good people say hey don't show up if you're sick everybody should be okay these are the people you should worry about the least we need to have common sense again and uh too many governments in the western world have gotten way too bossy they're just looking for every excuse to boss people around and uh that's what we have to push back again and it's you know ev mandates or um you know excessive control of the internet or the massive increase in the cost of government, which is really like appropriating the private voluntary economy into the coercive government economy.

42:22That's what we're seeing across Europe and the UK, parts of the United States, as well as back home. So we need to reverse that trend and get people back in charge of their lives. Well, the narrative has always been that rights lost are never regained or are very, very difficult to regain them. So how could you reverse that? Well, you have to keep fighting. I mean, we did regain our rights after COVID. And, you know, the people have to look at the history of it. Which rights did you regain? Well, all the mandates are gone now. Of course. But those were ridiculous anyway. Yeah, they were ridiculous.

43:02But, uh, and they also repeated business. They, they ruined people's lives, social lives. But freedom has always had to be taken. Like you go, our tradition goes back to 1215 with the Magna Carta, the great charter. And most of the freedoms we have today were in that original document. Right to a jury trial, uh, no arrest without charge, no conf, confiscation without compensation, no taxation without representation, all comes from that one document, the Magna Carta. and it was because King John was taken aside by the barons and they said, listen, pal, this is the choice. Either you sign this and follow it or we overthrow you.

43:40And as a result, we got the Magna Carta and all of, when you guys had your Boston Tea Party and said, you can't tax our tea because we don't elect you. That was an appeal as English, you were Englishmen saying, I'm not, we're Englishmen. We have the right not to be taxed unless we vote for it and we're going to throw you out otherwise. But that came out of the fields of Runnymede in England in 1215. So it's a long march towards freedom and it's never actually done. Like there's no permanent victories or defeats. You just have to keep going forward. So if you were elected, let's say you get in right now, what's one of the first things you would do?

44:17I would unblock our resources. So we have the most resources of any country in the world per capita, bar none. We need to have, to make it happen though, we need to have the fastest permits anywhere in the world and the lowest taxes on producing those resources. We're the fourth in oil, the number one in uranium, number one in potash for fertilizer. We have the fifth oceanic coastline, like we are, we have 12 of NATO's, um, sorry, we have 10 of 12 of NATO's defined defense minerals. So, you know, you had that guy, a Palmer lucky on, I don't think he can make his stuff without Canadian minerals.

45:01Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe he'll correct me, but like night vision technology, you need to have, uh, you need to have germanium for that. You need to have gallium to make semiconductors and radar. You need to have aluminum for armored vehicles and airplanes. You need cobalt for heat resistant alloys and fighter jets. You need tungsten for body, sorry, armor piercing ammunition. We have it all. And what I want to do is unblock those resources, produce them in abundance for ourselves and our allies, make$200 ,000 paychecks for our trades workers, build up an enormous strategic stockpile of it so that we have tons of leverage in international relations.

45:44And if God forbid there is ever a global conflict, we would have all the resources necessary to win it. But we need to get rid of a lot of laws that are blocking and replace them with laws that have fast permitting so that we can produce this stuff on scale very quickly. So is the concern the environmental impact of extracting these things? Is that what's holding it up? That is the, that's the ostensible reason. But I just think across Western, the Western world, like Europe, UK, parts of the US and Canada, there's a problem with bureaucracy just growing way too damn big. Like, you know, the First Nations in our country are incredibly forward-looking.

46:32The Squamish built 6 ,000 units of housing on 10 acres of land. You can believe it. In a town, in a city of Vancouver, where it's very hard to get a permit to do anything because it was their land. So they did it. They're trying to build, they're building now an LNG liquefaction plant where they replaced an old 30 mills. They cleaned it up and put an LNG plant there, but the federal government took a lot of time, 14 years to give them a permit. So we need to think like they're thinking, which is entrepreneurial speed of business, get it done quickly. Um, that's how you develop. Like we have this community in my, my district, it's called Hardesty, 600 people.

47:11They manage a hundred billion dollars of oil in a town of 600 people. Why is it there? Because their municipality offers a permit in one week with one page. And I wanted to tell this story. So I called them and I said, can I have someone come and do a video with me? And they said, we don't have anyone here. We don't have like bureaucrats that can help you. They're all out on their farms right now. They come in, they stamp the permit and they go back to their farm. Well, that's why we have$100 billion of energy moving through the area, which is bigger than the GDP of many countries because they have fast permits.

47:41And that's what we need in Canada. We need to be the fastest place to get things done. But don't you think you need some safeguards to protect the environment? And how do you balance that out? Protect it quickly. We can figure out whether a project is damaging to the environment in weeks and months rather than decades. There's nothing you're going to learn in year 14 of the review that you couldn't have learned in month 14. So there's ways to protect the environment. So when the Germans had to break their dependence on Russia after it invaded Ukraine, they approved an LNG import terminal in 60 days.

48:17They completed the whole damn thing in less than 200 days. And guess what? No environmental problems. They got their engineers to sit down and figure out how to do it quickly. And that's the mentality that we need to get in Canada. So what would you be able to do to bypass all this bureaucracy? How could that be done legally? Well, you slim it down to one project, one environmental review instead of 20 or 30. You have a fixed timeline that the bureaucrats have to give an answer of six months rather than just as long as they want to drag it on for. And the other thing I would do is study areas where they're perfectly situated to have a project like a pipeline or a mine or an LNG export terminal or a port expansion.

49:01And I would pre-permit it. I would say to our officials, go in, study, make sure that the environmental aspects are all in good order. I will issue a pre-permit and then anybody who comes along and wants to build it as long as they follow the terms and act responsibly has a guaranteed permit before they even apply for it. And I think we would have a roaring economy if we did that. That sounds awesome. But the great fear is that if you do have an impact on the environment, that impact is often permanent and it's devastating. And I've seen some of the oil extraction that they've done up in Alberta where you look at the area.

49:36it looks like scorched earth. No, no, no, no, no. No, no, no, no. It's the most responsible oil extraction in the world. But when you see these, what is that one area that often gets criticized? Fort Mac. Is that what it is? Yeah, they're open pit mines. You open up a mine, you take out the bitumen, you separate the sand from the oil, you make it less viscous by putting diluent in it, and you ship it off. And then after the mining is done, they resurface it, and you wouldn't even know there was a mine there. And there's no impact to groundwater, no impact to the environment? I mean, there's an impact no matter what you do, but at the end of the day, the people who live there are very healthy and very happy, and they're the strongest supporters of the expansion of the oil sands.

50:24It's an incredible— Because economically, it's amazing. Oh, it's incredible. It's the best resource in the world. It's like there's no decline rate. You guys have shale here, but as the years go by, you get less and less out of a shale reservoir. We have very little decline. We can keep producing and producing. We have what's called in situ, where there's an entire oil sands operation under your feet. You could be out in a forest hunting, and you wouldn't even know that under your feet, they're extracting it through a whole system of pipes where they inject just steam, steam vapor. That loosens up the oil.

50:55It sinks down. It goes into another pipe, comes up to the top. and you can have beautiful, pristine nature, the bears, the deer, the birds. They don't even know that there's extraction happening under their feet. So we have the best industry, the most responsible industry anywhere in the world. It's been a really disgusting PR campaign by extremist environmentalists and frankly some of our competitors to try and make our industry look bad. But it's the best industry in the world. Yeah, they got me. I saw some videos on it. I was like, oh my God, what are they doing to the ground? What are they doing to the earth?

51:28It looks horrible. It's all bullshit. It looks horrible. Yeah, but I mean, that's just a superficial look at it. I'll take you for a tour in the oil sands. You'll be amazed. We have the best engineers in the world. And by the way, the First Nations people absolutely love it because it's lifting their people out of poverty. They're getting enormous job opportunities out of it. One of our MPs is a former chief where they took 18 % unemployment, brought it down to three, balanced their budget. Another one of my members of parliament in northern British Columbia negotiated a$40 billion LNG plant on the Heisla territory.

52:04It's completely eliminating poverty for the First Nations there. And by exporting clean Canadian natural gas, which we can liquefy 25 % cheaper because it's cold as hell in Canada, they actually displaced dirty coal overseas. So instead of Asia burning coal, they're burning clean Canadian gas that's delivered by First Nations partnership. So this is the best way to do it makes everybody richer and Makes our entire continent better off. What seems so simple the way you're laying it out. I don't understand why this hasn't been implemented Yeah, this is this is the story of my life. It's frustrating Is it tap but it's if it is it that simple is it really that this is what's holding everything up the bureaucracy and the the time It takes for permits and yeah, like a lot of things regulations We have the same thing in housing and so do you.

52:54If you look at - California. California is terrible. Why is there such a housing shortage in California? It's because it takes forever to get a permit and there's always bureaucracy standing in the way and it totally screws over the working class youth who can't find a place to live because they're not being built. We have that challenge in Canada as well. That's why I proposed ideas to cut the bureaucracy and the taxes so that we can build affordable homes for our youth because right now we have a whole generation that can't afford homes. And that was one of the biggest issues I ran on. Homeownership is necessary for family formation, for civil peace in society where, you know, everybody feels like they have a piece of the pie.

53:32We need to expand homeownership. But to do that, you've got to get the government gatekeepers out of the way, speed up the permits, free up the land, cut the development taxes. So let's assume that you got an office. How much time would it take to start implementing these things and how quickly would that impact be felt by the Canadian people? Look, I think a lot of them could move very quickly. There's a lot of projects that investors are sitting on, but they don't have certainty in permits. So I would unblock that. And I think in the first year, you would start to see immediate benefits for the working people who'd be getting these jobs.

54:11um some of it would take more and more like a medium term like the second thing i would go after is just the inflationary spending which is a big problem all over the western world like people just can't afford to live i don't know if you you do you encounter that around here oh yeah yeah i mean inflation is crazy and it's i mean the national debt in america just went up to 39 9 trillion. Right, which is bigger than your GDP. That's a lot of money. So explain this to me. 50 years ago, a barber and a waitress could buy a house with a big yard for a dog and raise four kids, meat and potatoes on the dinner table every night.

54:54And now an accountant and a lawyer can't do that. Why is that? Well, there's a lot of spending and a lot of making money. A lot of just turning, you know, just making dollar bills with nothing behind it, nothing to back it. This is the biggest fraud perpetrated on the working class people in the last hundred years. Printing money is just insane. The idea you just print more money. It's like, and people go, okay. Well, it looks painless at first. But if you have an economy with 10 apples and$10, it's a buck an apple. you double the number of dollars to 20 but you still only have 10 apples well all of a sudden it's two bucks an apple it's not that the cost of apples has gone up it still costs the same resources to grow the and pick the apples is that the the price has gone up because the value of the money has gone down right so in america over the last 55 years you've doubled the number of homes in america from both 70 million to 150 million you know how much the money supply has grown 30 times.

55:59So you have twice the homes, but 30 times the cash. So what's happened? Housing costs have gone up 15 fold in 55 years and now an entire generation of kids can't afford homes. We have exactly the same problem in Canada. This is the biggest wealth transfer from the working class to the elites, from I say the have-nots to the have-yachts. and Washington and Wall Street love it, by the way, because it inflates the stock market, inflates the bureaucracy, politicians get to spend, CEOs get their stocks inflated, but it destroys the working people and we need to get back to hard money. Everything should be getting cheaper, by the way.

56:41You know, it takes 60 to 80 % less resources to grow food. We grow four times the food on the same acre, get four times as much milk from the same cow. We use 80 % less water and fertilizer. So why isn't it that food is not less expensive? It's because all of those gains are being erased by monetary inflation. So it's not that food is more costly. It's that the value, the money we use to buy it has less purchasing power. And we need to do what the Swiss do, which is they don't print money. They have balanced budgets. They have almost no deficit and they have almost zero inflation in Switzerland.

57:16They have the strongest money in the world, the Swiss franc. And we would all be better if we operated like the Swiss when it comes to our money. So in a real-world scenario, it's like you take over Canada. How would you go about implementing this? You've got to cut bureaucracy, consultants, which consume, by the way,$26 billion of spending. How big is your debt in Canada? $1.3-ish trillion. Oh, that's baby debt. It's compared to you. You guys are really wild. But you've gotten away with it because the dollar, the American dollar is the reserve currency. So all of these countries prop up the value of the US dollar by keeping it on reserve.

57:57Better hope that doesn't change. Yeah, better hope. We don't have that luxury. But we do have a lot of debt and we have provinces too. They're quite indebted. But I would cut the bureaucracy. I would cut consultants, foreign aid. I'd cut way back on foreign aid. And we give a corporate welfare, these checks to corporations. I believe business should make money rather than take money. So I would get rid of that. We're giving a lot of money to fake refugees, people who come in and don't actually, they're not actually fleeing danger. Like I love real refugees. My wife was a refugee, but I have no time for people who are pretending, but they're not really.

58:40And what do you mean by pretending to be a refugee? How are they doing this? They're not actually endangered in their home country. so they've come to be declared themselves as students and then wanting to stay declaring a refugee status oh and this is common yeah it just happens it happens and I mean they just want to have a better life so I don't I don't begrudge them as people but we can't we can't spend money on social service to enhance social services advanced programs that we as Canadians don't get for people who are not paying in so you're not opposed to them being there you're opposed to them getting Canadian welfare?

59:13Well, I'm opposed to them. If they're not real refugees, they shouldn't be brought in as refugees. I think we have to distinguish between those people who are actually in danger in their home country, which is the definition of a refugee, and someone who just wants to come in excess of their proper immigration cream. Is this that common that it's actually affecting your economy? Right now, it's a challenge because we had a big number of international students and temporary foreign workers that came in in very large numbers in like two or three years. We were bringing in about a million people a year, which in America's terms would be 10 million, like just if you're doing per capita.

59:52And it really caused a housing shortage, like some places where you have 26 of these students living in one basement. So we're trying to unwind that now. And how do you do that? Well, when their work permit and their visitor visa runs out, then we have to encourage them to head back lawfully. Right. But you don't want to do it ICE style. No. No, I don't think we need to do that. I just think we have to be orderly and lawful about it. And is that supported by the Canadian people? Yes, because we're a very welcoming country. We're a nation of immigrants, but we're also a nation of laws. and there's a general consensus like across the spectrum in Canada that the population growth was too fast for like four or five years.

1:00:41And so we're trying to unwind that now. What are the other things that you would have to do to drop your debt and sort of balance your budget and begin to turn things around? Well, in addition, so I like this idea that actually, believe it or not, that Bill Clinton and the Republicans did in the 90s in the US. It was called the pay-go law. It was a very simple principle. Every time the administration wanted to bring in a new dollar of spending, they had to match it with a dollar of savings. So there was no extra net spending for like eight years. And that's when your government balanced its budget and paid off$400 billion of debt.

1:01:24That law lapsed in 2002. And immediately after that, America went back into deficits and you haven't emerged. You've been in deficit now for 25 years. This is about internalizing scarcity. Every creature in the universe, every bird in the trees, every fish in the seas has to live with scarcity, maximizing use of scarce resources. The only creature who doesn't do that is the politician because he's always using someone else's money. It's like, oh, I'll just print it or borrow it or tax it. It's not my money. And so they routinely show up to their cabinet meetings and say, well, I've got a new idea.

1:01:59It's$100 million. Where are you going to get it? I don't know. We'll print it. We'll borrow it. We'll tax it. Not my money. But if you had a law saying you can't actually bring a proposal to cabinet unless you have matching savings to pay for it, well, then you'd have these politicians walking up and down the hallways in their departments looking for waste and, like, rooting it out. So instead of making the single mom, the senior, or the small business owner live with scarcity, I want the politicians and bureaucrats to live with scarcity. And that's what I would impose by law on my government.

1:02:28Well, it's just a rational way to deal with the problem. Like, don't spend money unless you could save money. Exactly. That's how you balance things out. I mean, Clinton did balance the budget. He did. During his time, and people forget that. Because we've always assumed that there's always been this extraordinary debt, but that's not the case. through the 1990s. I mean, he did a fantastic job at that. Yeah, I mean, it was that Congress was very disciplined as well, and the American people just got fed up and said, we're not tolerating these deficits anymore. And they imposed scarcity from the center.

1:03:00And by the way, the economy boomed because the government was restrained and the free market economy could just roar. And that's another part of the equation, by the way, is unlock the power of free enterprise. Like this is the 250th anniversary, not just of the declaration of independence, but also of Adam Smith's wealth of nations where he basically for the first time in human history described the free market system. And that was starting to flourish in the States and in parts of Europe. And that system basically started to come into place after the late 1770s. The growth since the free market system has come into place in the world has been too 200 times faster than it was before because there is the most powerful system for generating material benefit for the people and that's what we need to restore in Canada I want to make it the freest economy in the world well that all sounds amazing how the hell did you lose

1:04:05how can a rational person not vote for that I mean you're not saying anything that's restrictive You're not saying anything that is in any way infringing on people's rights or liberties. It just sounds like it's just 100 % positive for Canada. That's what I think. That's my mission. And I think it will be positive. And we'll get there. You know, Canadians do things through evolution, not revolution. So I'm just going to keep pushing my ideas. And I think overwhelmingly we'll win the next election. Well, it sounds like I just can't see how someone would listen to what you're saying and say, I find fault in this.

1:04:42Other than like the potential environmental impact of extracting resources, I could see how a lot of the greenies would get like really upset and get their panties in a bunch about that and be very incredulous to the idea that you're going to protect the environment while you're extracting all these resources. But if you could lay it all out and also lay out this enormous economic impact and how it would uplift impoverished communities, how it would completely change the economic landscape of the country. It just only makes sense. That's why I'm baffled. Well, listen, the people render their judgment, but it means I have to do a better job of proselytizing.

1:05:22What were the criticisms of you? What did your opponent say that resonated with people? What were they trying to say? It was funny because they all disagreed with my ideas and they said these are all very scary ideas Scary and then they say growth first of all they said they said that I had no policies Then they said they're scary policies and then they stole my policies right before the election so But hey listen if the government that's in power now steals all my ideas And does the things I want to do then I then I've won great. That's why I came here I didn't just do it so that I could have the my name on the door So I keep saying to the prime minister, steal my ideas.

1:05:59Right. But he doesn't want to. Well, I won't criticize him on foreign soil. I understand. Good for you. Yeah. I mean, we have a mutual respect. That's such a Canadian thing to do. That is a great Canadian thing to do. So polite. That's what I'm saying about Canadians. They're so polite. It's funny. Your security guy was talking about the Canadian standoff of, you know, when you get to a door, you go first. No, you go first. No, you go first. You can stay there all day. I actually looked this up the other day. Ontario actually has an apology act. It's a law that defines the apology because we always say sorry in Canada.

1:06:34So they wanted to clarify that sorry is not a legal admission of guilt. So like if we get into a car accident, I say, oh, sorry, man, it's terrible. Your bumper doesn't mean that I'm guilty. It's actually in law. There's so many apologies. Even if somebody else screwed up, you say sorry. That's funny. That's so Canadian. But you know, the great thing about Canada is we've always sorted our shit out peacefully. Like the, the, the Protestants and Catholics tore each other's eyeballs out in Europe for like hundreds of years. And then we came to Canada and just got along. And, and that's the great thing about Canada is like you can come, you know, Muslims and Jews, Christians, uh, and, uh, sorry, um, Protestants and Catholics, uh, Hindus and Sikhs.

1:07:16They come to Canada and they just get along. They live on the same streets. Eventually, we all start intermarrying, and it's a great thing about Canada. Well, it really is a great melting pot. Yeah, and folks get to keep their cultures at the same time as blending into the Canadian identity. My wife's from Venezuela, and so oftentimes I'm in the house, and there's like 16 Latinos, and they're all speaking Spanish. I have no idea what the hell's going on. And they have this food. It's called the jackas. And I said, when they start cooking this stuff, I said to my wife, did your mom just call me a jackass?

1:07:55Because that's what it sounded like. I don't speak any Spanish. You should probably learn. I should now. They're yapping in your house. You should know what they're planning. It's a great, my kids are starting to learn Spanish, so I'm going to be outnumbered. Yeah, you better learn it. Yeah. Yeah. So what else is an issue in Canada that you would like to fix? We have to we got a allergy I'm dealing with we got to toughen up our justice system We it got way too soft and what's wrong in the justice system basically bail I mean we all believe in the basic principle that you're innocent till approved proven guilty But if someone's convicted as have like 150 prior convictions and they're newly arrested on their latest crime I don't think we should be releasing them onto the streets.

1:08:46And so we got two lacks on bail. So there's now a consensus in Canada that you should have severe restrictions on repeat offenders. Like in Vancouver, they had to arrest the same 40 guys 6 ,000 times in one year. 40 guys, 6 ,000 arrests. So they're basically being released within hours of their latest arrest. So we're we're we now brought built a bipartisan multi-partisan consensus to fix that and we're pushing to toughen the bail system and ensure that It's the repeat offenders a tiny group. We don't have a lot of criminals in Canada But they do a tremendous amount of crime. So you take them off the street you put them in prison You can basically reduce the crime rate dramatically.

1:09:30Well, we probably have more crime percentage wise in America, but it's still a small percentage of the population that commits the crime. But it's the same issue. Like in New York City, it's extraordinary. The amount of people that are repeat offenders and they just let them go. And California, no cash bail, let them go. It is bananas and it doesn't make any sense and it doesn't make anybody help. I understand you want to be empathetic and I understand these narratives that the prison system is racist and the justice system is racist and these people have never been given a great shake in life.

1:10:03Well, if you want to fix that, start in these impoverished neighborhoods, establish community centers, establish better education, fund that. But don't let hardened criminals back on the street when they're habitual. If you've been arrested 40, 50 times, it doesn't seem like you're getting any better. So whatever rehabilitation process they have going on there, that's not working. So keep doing the same thing over and over again. Unless you like crime, I don't understand why you would do that. This has been, you know, it's imposed by these so-called experts. They tell, oh, we've done all these studies that show that these often crime policies work.

1:10:42But everywhere it's been tried, it's been an absolute disaster anywhere in the Western world. We have a town called Penticton. There's one guy who the police can tell by looking at the crime rate, whether he's been in jail or not. When he comes out of jail, the crime rate for the entire town actually goes. That's so crazy. But you just keep him in prison. That seems so simple to solve. It's like there's so many of these problems with government that it's just like rational thinking. Exactly. One of the great interviews that I loved about you, you were eating an apple and you were talking to this guy who is being completely ridiculous.

1:11:18You were asking him to define the issues that he had. And it was so funny. It was like, this is what happens when a rational person meets a person with empty narratives. It was such a weird moment because. You just kept eating that apple. It was such a good apple. It was so good. That's the thing. And the thing is, I didn't even realize I was being taped. I thought it was a print interview. Oh, that's hilarious. That's why I think I was so relaxed. But so I'm in the most beautiful place in the world. If you ever, if you haven't been to the Okanagan, it's unbelievable. Like it's lakes, it's mountains, it's nice, dry weather.

1:11:53And there's orchards and vineyards there. Like you'd love it. And so I'm in an apple orchard and I'm walking around just talking with people. And my staff says, this reporter wants to do an interview and I'm enjoying the apple. He comes up, starts asking questions. Nobody who was there thought this was a moment. Like we'd thought nothing of it. We dumped the whole thing. My, my staff unbeknownst to me was recording my whole walk. We dumped this 15 minute video on the internet. and no one noticed it. And like three weeks later, my phone blows up and people say, hey, how about that apple? I'm like, what are they talking about, this apple thing?

1:12:24And then within three days, everybody's talking to me about this damn apple that I had almost forgotten about eating. So it's one of those weird things. Well, that conversation sort of, it embodied this issue. It really did. Because you have rational thinking and empty narratives colliding while you're eating an apple. like you're so casual about it you're actually eating an apple which was so perfect i mean you couldn't if if you planned on like if you had a pr team i think you should be eating an apple they'd be like oh i like it so he's casual he's eating fruit it's healthy you know it was totally coincidence like out of nowhere not planned and not even noticed like i said no one there thought this was going to be a moment we just like totally forgot about it well it made it in america it was Viral in America.

1:13:12And we were like, how come that guy's not the prime minister? What the hell's going on? Well, in the meantime, you can buy Ambrosio apples from the South Okanagan. I'm really plugging a lot of sales for the Canadian economy today. This episode is brought to you by Netflix. All right, baseball fans, this one's big. For the first time ever, baseball season kicks off with one exclusive opening night game live on Netflix. The New York Yankees, led by seven-time All-Star Aaron Judge, head to the San Francisco Bay to take on Rafael Devers and the San Francisco Giants after a long offseason. The first pitch is on Netflix.

1:13:53Watch MLB opening night, the New York Yankees versus the San Francisco Giants live on Netflix. Wednesday, March 25th at 8 p.m. Eastern Time, 5 p.m. Pacific Time. Feeding the fam isn't easy, but we got you with Denny's Slam and Meal Deals starting at$5.99. Full meals for everyone, like a Grand Slam burrito for grandpa and a Super Slam for super mom. Get to Denny's now. Ballot at participating locations for dine-in or denny's.com. Limited time offer. Additional restrictions may apply at some locations. You know what I found out about Canadian maple syrup? What's that? It is actually a superfood, and it is actually better for you than honey.

1:14:31Is that right? Yeah, it contains a bunch of polyphenols and a bunch of healthy nutrients. I always thought maple syrup was just a guilty pleasure. You pour it on pancakes. No, it's a totally Canadian thing. Apparently, it's really good for you. So you take it before your workout? No. No, I just watched an Instagram video yesterday. Somebody sent it to me, and I was like, what is this? We'll have to send you a bunch of maple syrup from Canada. Oh, I've got a bunch. I've had a bunch of Canadian friends send me some. We actually have a maple syrup reserve in Canada, like a reserve of excess stockpiles.

1:15:00Like an oil reserve? Well, we don't have an oil reserve. This is something I want to change. I want to have an oil reserve, but I also want to keep the maple syrup reserve because we're Canadians after all. There's nothing more Canadian than that. Well, it's so delicious. I can't believe it's good for you. Make sure that's true. I mean, in what way is it true? Are there nutrients? Let's put it into perplexity. Our sponsor. I compared it versus honey. I'll give you what it showed. What does it say? I'm not saying it's better. Maple syrup and honey are both sugary, but maple syrup is slightly lower in calories.

1:15:29is a glycemic index, has more minerals like manganese and calcium while honey is a bit higher in calories has a slightly stronger impact on blood sugar. Well, this guy on Instagram was very convincing. I wish I saved it. I think it's convincing. I think you should go with it. I'm in it. I'm done. Stick with it. Tastes better, too. Yeah, it's the best. It's fantastic. Put that with a little bit of Greek yogurt. Your protein. Oh, yeah. That's what I do. Greek yogurt. And maple syrup. Maybe we'll start a trend. Because everybody uses honey on their yogurt. No, maple syrup from Canada. Because if it's not from Canada, it's not the real deal.

1:16:06Well, there's a lot of fake syrup, right? There's a lot of junk out there. When you go to a pancake house and they have that stuff in the little plastic cups, that's garbage. Corn syrup crap. Yeah, you don't want to have that manufactured crap. Well, that's the case with honey as well. I had a woman in here once that was a beekeeper. And she was explaining to us that a lot of honey is not actually honey. They water it down with corn syrup. There's so much shit in our food these days. Yes. I believe in eating clean. 100%. That was one of the primary factors for me supporting this administration was RFK Jr.

1:16:41and this Make America Healthy Again initiative. I had my friend Brigham Bueller yesterday from Ways to Well on, and we hammered this many times over and over again, but people need to hear it. we spend more money on health care and we're sicker than we've ever been before. And we have more chronic illness and we have more money. None of it makes any sense. It's completely ridiculous. And it's obvious that people are eating the wrong things. And there was so much outrage of him implementing all these healthy choices and trying to get rid of dyes that are illegal in Canada. Like the same cereals that the same factory sells in Canada, they sell with natural dyes.

1:17:22and in America we demand them to be more colorful so we put poison in them. Really? Yeah. What do you think are the dietary habits that are making people in the Western world sick right now? Is it the dyes? Is it the sugars? Is it the carbs? What's getting people? There's a lot of things. First of all, it's processed foods. Processed foods is an enormous percentage of a lot of Americans' diets. things with massive amounts of preservatives in them and that that's like if you want like a general guideline eat real food eat real eggs real vegetables real meat real fish you'll be healthier yeah as soon as you start having things that can sit on a shelf forever except things like rice and you know normal beans like things that are dried that makes sense they could sit there but if something can just sit on a shelf for a long period of time and you consume it how is it just not rotting exactly i'm sure you've seen where they've taken a mcdonald's big mac and they've just let it sit taking a cheeseburger in a box and the guy pulls it out like 10 years later it looks exactly the same that's not food the bacteria didn't want to eat it they looked at it they were like i'm not eating that if bacteria doesn't need it mold doesn't need it that's crazy why are you eating it like there's something in it preventing the mold from growing what is that Well, that stuff fucks with your gut bacteria.

1:18:46It's terrible for your body. And empty calories. And we consume an enormous amount of processed food in this country. And if you want to be a healthier person, eat real fruit, eat real food, eat real vegetables, eat real meat. It's that simple. Yeah. That would fix 90 % of our problems when it comes to people's diets. And we, when my, my wife once looked at some of the baby formula we had and she said, she looked on it, she said, there's no expiry date on this. This never goes bad. That's crazy. That can't be, that can't be a good thing. Right. Meanwhile, breast milk, you have to freeze. Right.

1:19:23Exactly. Yeah. So, and then what about on the, like the fitness side, what do you think we can do? I mean, beyond you've done a lot just talking about it and with your, the size of your audience, you've probably got a lot of people off the couch. but what policies do you think we could push that would get people physically active working out moving again well the real important thing is community the the easiest way to get fit is to to get around a bunch of other people that are also involved in the same endeavor right if you have a bunch of friends that are unhappy with the way their life is like just go walk together say hey guys let's all go for a walk after dinner together right let's all decide like as a neighborhood to go walk.

1:20:04Just walk for a half an hour after your meals. It'll lower your glycemic index. It'll change your body. It'll make you healthier. You'll feel better. It just does so much for you, just movement and activity. And if you're involved with a group of people that are also inclined in the same direction, they're also trying to get better, trying to get fit, then you kind of, you're, you know, you feed off of your atmosphere. People imitate the people that are around them and you get support from the people that are around them. You know, make it a little healthy competition. You know, who can, you know, do the most exercise and who can do the most, you know, whatever it is, like whether it's a sport or whether it's a game or whether it's just something that you enjoy doing that's physically taxing slightly.

1:20:53It doesn't have to be a crazy kettlebell workout or a jujitsu class. Just take a walk. Just just if the world if the United States or Canada or anybody that's got problems with their health Just decided to start walking right every day for 20 minutes. It'll change your life And then add things to it add some body weight squats add some push-ups skip a little rope right something take a yoga class It'll change your life, right? Just absolutely you need activity the human body has needs and when it doesn't those needs are not met and you don't your Your biological requirements aren't met. You develop anxiety.

1:21:31You get overweight. Your muscles atrophy. Your bone density decreases. You can't open up a jar anymore. There's all these problems that can be solved with just simple movement and activity. You don't have to become a fitness nut. You don't have to become a gym rat. You just do something and that alone and then change what you eat. Drink more water. Stop drinking soda. Stop drinking so much alcohol. You know stop eating processed food if we just Slowly but surely get this in people's heads for the longest time people didn't think there was anything wrong with eating processed food They didn't think there was anything wrong with they thought sugar just gave you extra calories That's it.

1:22:13They didn't realize the catastrophic health consequences of consuming all this sugar the increase in type 2 diabetes All these problems that are people are having that people are having because of poor diet So what's your theory, though, on how that – why did that happen? Why did – what caused millions of people to shift their diets away from good, wholesome, real food towards the processed garbage? Well, first of all, marketing, right, and availability, right? They always say the center of the grocery store is what you should avoid because the center is all the stuff that doesn't need to be refrigerated, right?

1:22:49Everything on the outskirts, all the vegetables and the fruit and the meats and the milk, that's all the stuff that's healthy because it has to be refrigerated. Because if it's not, it goes bad. Things that can just sit on a shelf. But things that sit on a shelf forever, those are the things that are the easiest to profit from because you don't have to worry about storage. You don't have to worry about refrigeration when you're processing or when you're moving them and transporting them. You know, just education is the most important thing because there's a lot of people that don't know how much their diet impacts them.

1:23:17And then there's also the problems that happen in this country where the sugar industry literally bribed scientists to pass the blame on saturated fat and pretend that this was the cause of all these heart issues that people were having and all the obesity, that it was just fat. So then people started eating all these seed oil rich foods like mayonnaise or excuse me, like margarine and corn oil and canola oil. When it's better just to have tallow or butter. Yes. It's like natural food. Your body knows what to do with it. Beef is like a superfood. A nice fatty piece of beef, best thing you can eat.

1:23:54It's so good for you. You've got iron, you've got fat, you've got protein and creatine. It's all packed in that one superfood. It is. And there's a lot of people that live very healthily off a carnivore diet and that astounds people. They don't understand it because they've been pushed into this idea. Well, one of the things they did in America that's great is they reversed the food pyramid. our food pyramid was all grains at the bottom was all wheat and grains which is like there's nothing wrong with eating that as long as you're being smart about it you don't eat too much of it but if that's your primary diet like guess what your insulin's gonna spike you're gonna be hungry all the time you're gonna get fat this is not good it's not good to eat when i cut the carbs out and i went basically uh into ketosis um i felt great because instead of having all the ups and downs, when my blood sugar was down, when you're in ketosis, you, um, you basically live off your fat stores.

1:24:48Yes. You have like a consistent flow of energy whenever you need it. Cause I've obviously, I've got some here and, and so, uh, I, I feel lighter. I have to sleep less now. I don't have to sleep as much cause I don't, I don't eat the big heavy carbs. I cheat once in a while, but, but the big heavy carbs that your body breaks down, you gotta, you gotta sleep more to work through all those heavy carbs. Well, you feel it when you eat them. I love carbs. Don't get me wrong. I'm Italian. I love spaghetti. I love pizza. I love Italian subs. I love them, but I eat them sparingly. Absolutely. And when I eat them, I feel it.

1:25:21I feel it. It's amazing why you're eating it, and then you're like, oh. You're going to hit with a tranquilizer dart. It's just not good. It's not good for you. If I eat a steak, I feel great. If I eat a steak, I don't feel in any way tired. after I'm done. I don't feel exhausted, like completely full. Also, they have a high satiety rate. If you eat just steak, you're only going to eat what you need. Your body knows when to stop. But if there's mashed potatoes next to the steak and spaghetti next to the steak and bread and all these other things, you're just going to keep eating. Exactly. And then cake and butter and ice cream, not butter, but cake and ice cream and all this other stuff, you're going to keep eating.

1:26:02And you're going to consume excess calories. But beef is really expensive now. Like it's really hard to put a steak on your plate. These for the average guy, it's insane. It's twice as expensive as a pork in Canada right now. Well, there's also this dumb narrative that cows are responsible for climate change, which is just absolutely insane. And whoever started promoting that needs to go to jail because it's you've done a terrible disservice to people, especially regenerative farming. That's, you know, actually sequesters carbon. Absolutely. And it's healthy for you. No, the farming, the ranchers in my area are fantastic.

1:26:38They produce an incredible product. We've got this, North America has the smallest cattle herd since 1951 this year. That's nuts. Very small herd. And that's why it's so hard to get beef. Why is that? I think there's been a demand spike in the last couple of years. Beef prices were low for long. So a lot of ranchers got out of it. I just said, we can't, I can't stay in this business losing money every year. And then all of a sudden prices started to go up. and moods have changed a lot on beef even in the last three, four years. So now they're trying to keep up with the demand. But I'm happy to see the ranchers doing well, but I'd sure like to see middle-class families to be able to afford to have beef again.

1:27:22But my theory on one of the reasons why the marketing has shifted towards all this processed crap, and this goes back to my obsession, which is inflation. Because instead of just raising the prices, they downgrade the quality of the food. They strip out the nutrients and they inject garbage into our food, the companies do, that is ultimately less nutritious. But the price tag doesn't necessarily look like it's changing. So it's one of the more insidious ways that the system is able to charge you to pass inflationary costs on without you seeing it in the price tag that's underneath the product.

1:28:02They also engineer food to be compulsive. Like you're more compulsively than overeat. Yeah, sure. Especially like chips and stuff like that in America. What country do you think does nutrition the best around the world? Well, that's a good question. Well, Japan has one of the lowest obesity rates, right? And when you look at Japanese food, like what is it? It's like fish and rice and vegetables. And they don't use glyphosate, I don't think. I think the way they process their wheat is very different than ours. You know, we have higher glycea. We have higher gluten in our wheat because, like, we have more complex glutens in our wheat, so we have higher yield.

1:28:43And then on top of that, they dry all the wheat out with glyphosate at the end, which is fucking terrible for you. Interesting. And they were trying to ban that in America, but then Trump passed an executive order stopping it. So this is one of the things that Kennedy kind of ran on is that he wanted to stop the ubiquitous use of glyphosate. Okay. And especially glyphosate, you know, used with wheat to dry it out. So it's not used as an herbicide. It's used to dry out the wheat at the end so that it doesn't get moldy, which is crazy. You're spraying poison on wheat. And most Americans, if you test them, have glyphosate in their blood.

1:29:26And the apologist will say, oh, but it's at safe levels. Well, we don't even really know what that means. We're talking about decades and decades of consuming this stuff. That can't be good. I mean, it literally kills plants. It destroys gut bacteria. It can't be good. It would be better. When you eat overseas, like if I eat pasta or bread in Italy, you feel better. It doesn't kill you like it does in America. It doesn't, like, oh, you don't get that same feeling. Interesting. I don't know anything about glyphosate. But one of the things I have. Do you guys use glyphosate in Canada? I don't know anything about it.

1:30:02I feel bad saying that, but I should do my homework on that one. Well, we have corn that's engineered to survive glyphosate. We have Roundup Ready corn so that you could spray glyphosate on the corn that kills all the other things that you don't want growing. But how can that be good? Like they did a test of California wines. And what was the number? It was like some preposterous number of California wines tested positive for glyphosate. Is that right? In the high 90s, I think. Okay. Which is just nuts. Yeah, I don't know anything about glyphosate. I have to admit, although I research you've piqued my curiosity.

1:30:43The problem is in America, our food system is entirely dependent on it at this point. They want to change it, and so there's a lot of strategies. One of them is they have these machines that use lasers, and these lasers go over a field and actually target the weeds. So instead of spraying poison on them, they just zap these weeds, and they can identify the difference between the weed and the crop. Really? Yeah. That's incredible. Yeah. The wine was 10 out of 10 tested. 10 out of 10. I was looking at the Japanese obesity thing. They have an interesting law that they put in place in 2008 where I believe it says workplaces have to measure people's wastes of adults over 40 to find out if they're potentially overweight.

1:31:28Wow. Those people don't get fined. The companies get fined. So they have to then provide them counseling, diet advice, exercise guidance. Wow. And they also use a lower BMI than we do. It starts at 25. It says it's because they have a higher risk in Asian populations for obesity. Interesting. I wonder why that is. I wonder if that's because of a lot of rice consumption. Way lower, 4 to 6 % compared to 42%. Wow, that's crazy. Their obesity rates are 4 to 6 % and we're 42. 42 is nuts. 42 is so crazy. We've got to find out what the Japanese are doing. My next stop has got to be Tokyo. Yeah, well, they eat healthy food.

1:32:16But that does make sense. I mean, implementing something like that, it sounds very restrictive. I mean, I don't want to tell a guy he can't have a gut. I have a lot of friends that are fat, and I love them to death. I'd like them to be healthy, but I don't believe you should have that kind of control over people. No. I think you should encourage healthy behavior. I don't think you should mandate it. Yeah, we need carrots, not sticks. Yeah. Carrots, literally. Literally. But the system is like, I think of the opioid thing. That's an incredible story, really. That's a horrible story. That's a horrible story.

1:32:52And the fact that no one's going to jail for that is infuriating. They should. What they did and what the deception that they used to pretend that that stuff is not addictive, that it's not the same as heroin is just absolutely atrocious. And the fact that they got away with it and that the Sackler family, just that one family, I don't know if you've ever seen the Netflix docudrama series, Painkiller, or was it called Painkiller? They're the guys from Purdue, right? Purdue Pharma. Yes. I think they were Purdue Pharma, if I'm not mistaken. I mean, how many lives were destroyed by that? Well, half a million ended in the U.S.

1:33:33Yeah, at least. 50 ,000 in Canada. We lost more people in the last 10 years to opioid overdoses than we lost fighting in the Second World War. Oh my God, that's so crazy. And we, you know, these companies, I mean, it started in the States, Purdue and a number of others where they basically started lying to the system. And they actually paid bonuses to distributors for every overdose they caused. What? She tracked the overdoses and then paid bonuses to distributors because that was an indicator of how successfully they were pushing the drugs on to doctors and pharmacists and the system. No way.

1:34:14It all came out in the court because there was a huge lawsuit and the companies had to pay$50 billion because of an American government lawsuit against them. But they actually paid bonuses for overdose rates. That is insane. It's wild. And they basically, they were very, very strategic. They said, we're going to go to working class neighborhoods where there's huge unemployment. So, you know, in the Rust Belt of America, where people were out of work and they obviously had some minor industrial injuries and said, you know, this will solve every ache and pain, take OxyContin. And it felt great when they first started taking it.

1:34:52And then it spread into Canada as well. and then it mutated in from oxycontin into fentanyl, which is 100 times more powerful than heroin. It can stop your lungs in 15 seconds, just absolutely deadly. And these companies, these dirtbag companies should be paying hundreds of billions of dollars to cover the treatment and recovery of the people whose lives have been ruined by this. Well, it's just insane that they only had to pay a percentage of the amount of money that they profited. It is insane. They should have gone to jail. They should have had to pay, first of all, give all the money back.

1:35:31Yeah. I mean, what you did was unbelievably evil. Absolutely. And you were allowed to profit from it, which is crazy. For years. Even the Sackler family, the amount that they got fined was a small percentage of what they actually made. I don't know how people live with themselves when they do that. They're sociopaths. They have to be. They basically got into the entire system, the healthcare system, the medical community, and they pushed these over prescriptions. And then they got this crazy idea that they pushed in places like Portland and Seattle and San Francisco, that the government should start giving out opioids that are safer than the ones that are on the street as an alternative to keep people from having contaminated drugs, which made the problem even worse because those, the, the, the addicts would sell those to kids so that they could buy the harder stuff off the street and it expanded it even more.

1:36:23And, um, so one of the things we're focused on in my plan is, is massive treatment to recovery programs to get people off drugs. Abstinence-based treatment is incredible. Like it's very successful and, uh, we're saving lives now in Canada. You get them in, you get them counseling, group therapy treatment, sweat lodges for First Nations people's physical exercise is a big part of it. I went to one treatment center in Saskatchewan and they actually bought these rusted out weights and they had the guys like lifting weights and the bureaucrats are saying, well, why are you spending money on weights?

1:36:57What does that have to do with it? He says, well, it's been the best thing we had. These guys started to see their biceps grow and they're like, I want to look like this. And if I take drugs, I'm not going to look like this. So it was one of the best things they did. Um, then you get them into jobs and treatment. And, uh, there's one guy that, uh, I met in BC. He, he was going to kill himself. He drove his car into a brick wall because he was so ruined by his addiction, but he didn't die. He couldn't even pull it off. So he actually went into treatment, turned his life around, started a business.

1:37:26He's got six employees and now he's going out on the street and like helping, you know, pulling guys off the street and bringing them in and saving their lives. So it's actually a really hopeful ending to the story if we can get to shift all our resources over to treatment and recovery services, which is one of my big objectives. Are you aware of Ibogaine? No. So former Republican governor of Texas, Rick Perry, is involved in this Ibogaine initiative here in Texas. And one of the things that they found, you know, he works very closely with veterans. And, you know, obviously a lot of these guys, they come back from the war, they have PTSD, They have a lot of pain.

1:38:03They get addicted to pills. And then they have an incredibly difficult time getting off of it. And there's a treatment called Ibogaine. And Ibogaine comes from the aboga tree. It's like a natural psychedelic that has no recreational use whatsoever. It's not fun. And it's apparently a brutal 24-hour experience. But it rewires the brain. Really? Stops the pathways of addiction. And just one Ibogaine treatment, one session, the amount of people that never go back to using those drugs is in the 80 percent. When they do two sessions, it's in the 90s. Wow. It's incredible. So they're implementing it here.

1:38:48And Rick Perry, who was like a staunch anti-drug, hardline Republican guy, great guy. But realized from talking to these veterans, maybe you have to have an open mind and look at this. We have this blanket term that we use for drugs. And we say, oh, Ibogaine's a drug. You don't want to take drugs. But this psychedelic, this Ibogaine, apparently it's like a 24-hour review of your life that in some way, some chemical way, rewires your system and stops the pathways of addiction. It's like a factory reset. Yes. Wow. Yes. That's crazy. And so they're starting to implement it here in Texas, and they're going to use it for veterans.

1:39:33So have they studied this? Yes. And is it approved as a treatment or what? Well, it's being approved here in Texas, and they're trying to do it in other places. And I know a friend of mine, my friend Ed Clay, he started a center down in Mexico. And the reason why he did it was because he got hooked on pills. He hurt his back. He got hooked on pills. He had to figure out how to get off of it. And he did one Ibogaine session, got clean. And was like, I need to educate people and help people with this. Let me start this system. And, you know, and it's very successful. I know multiple people that have done it and especially veterans that have done it and had profound changes in their life because of this.

1:40:12That's amazing. Yeah. And again, there's no recreational use for this. There's no chance of abusing it. Okay. It's not fun. Like to get people to do it twice is very hard. Okay. But even doing it once. But if you do it, it's incredibly effective, much more effective than any other form of therapy. Really? Yes. Okay. Well, I'll have to look out for that one because we need it. We still have a challenge up in Canada. I can connect you with Rick Perry. Okay. And he's, he's, him and Brian Hubbard are incredible with their, the advocacy and the promotion of this. What they've done is really amazing.

1:40:46Yeah. We got to, we got to get, get people off these drugs. And, you know, we're doing, we're making some good progress in Canada. Our biggest challenges are just the long-term aftermath of the opioid problem, like you have had down here. But, like, I think we can overcome it. And we have to try some new things in order to get people off these things. Because when you're doing fentanyl, it's Russian roulette. It could be, you might not have more than a day to live if you're still taking that stuff. Oh, it's so dangerous. It's an emergency. And it's in everything. It's in so many different street versions of pills that people think are safe, like Xanax.

1:41:26There's illegal Xanax, like street Xanax, and there's fentanyl in them. People take it and they die. Right, absolutely. I've met so many mothers. They just come up to me at my rallies and things, and they tell me the story, and they show me a picture. And you say, man, it's a beautiful child. That child looks healthy and smart, and she went to a party, and they were handing the shit out. and it's over. There's a high school kid here in town that took a street Adderall and it had fentanyl in it and he died. Is that right? Yeah, somebody sold him what he thought was Adderall. Look, that's what killed Prince.

1:41:56That's what killed Tom Petty. Adderall? No, no, fentanyl. Fentanyl. They got street drugs from someone. Like, they're both in pain and they become addicted to the pills and then they got, like, a pill from a roadie. I didn't know that. And took it and died. I didn't know that. Petty, did he sing Last Dance with Mary Jane? Last Chance for Mary Jane. Right. That's really sad. Oh, he sung a bunch of amazing songs. American Girl. I mean, Tom Petty was a legend and died because of fentanyl. Prince is one of the great musical genius of human history. And fentanyl got him too. Died from fentanyl. Unbelievable.

1:42:30He had hip pain. He needed a hip replacement. His hip was blown out and he was in agony all the time. So he started taking pills and then next thing you know, you're hooked. And I've had family members that got hooked on it. Is that right? Yeah. Did they get through it? One of them didn't. Yeah. I mean, he hurt his back doing construction and started taking pills and now he's a waste. That's the sad thing. That's the sad thing is it's they're good people and they're not lawbreaking people. No. Often it's folks who work in physically demanding jobs. They get an injury. And it's easy to judge. But when you're in excruciating pain and you find something that makes it go away, it's understandable.

1:43:09Also, if you're not educated in these subjects and you just trust the doctor, you go to a doctor and the doctor says you need pain medication and then all of a sudden you're on it. It's easy to see how people get locked into that and then they can't break loose. Well, the pathway to physical addiction is so well known and studied. It's very, very addictive, which is why it's so horrific that they actually promoted the fact that these things are not addictive when they were promoting them. They knew exactly what they were doing. They were absolute crooks. And I'm hoping we get big settlements out of them the way you did down here.

1:43:44And I want to put all that money into treatment and recovery, get people off these drugs and rescue them. I think we can save these lives. The treatment, it works. It's tough. Like the people who go through it, they say it was the worst experience of my life to go through that withdrawal. But it can be done. And you come out stronger on the other side. It can be done. And I think the most important thing is prevention and education and letting kids know like, hey, this is not what you want to get involved with. You want to have a happy, successful life. This is going to stop that. This is going to keep you from having it.

1:44:16This might kill you and it's definitely going to ruin you. Yeah. But you're right about fitness though. Cause when I was young, I hung around with a lot of people who got into a lot of trouble and I could have ended up there. The reason I didn't frankly is sports. So I had something else to drive me. So it's one of the reasons why we need to get our young people's active in sporting activities when they're in that age group, because if you're not giving them an outlet, then they'll end up down that scary path. Oh, 100%. And also you realize that if you want to be effective in sports, like you can't party.

1:44:45Exactly. It's like, it'll rob you of your vitality. It'll rob you of your performance. No, I, when I played hockey and I, I showed up a few times hungover and I was just shit like terrible, but, uh, you learn pretty quickly that you gotta be on your game. So we've got to promote more of the fitness at the, at the, at the youth level as well. And, um, and is that happening here? It's funny. I remember when I came down here, um, as a 16 year old, I haven't been here in 30 years. um i uh we we got into town and the people who were hosting us uh were driving us to their home and we saw the stadium and there's like 20 000 people and it was in houston and i said is that the cowboys playing and they said no no that's that's a high school league it's like okay in canada we don't have high school leagues with 20 000 people coming out but um but the sports are so massive here.

1:45:36Oh, football is gigantic here. It's a religion. Yeah. It's crazy. And who do you cheer for, by the way? In, in Texas? Yeah. For you personally? Well, I've, I've got into UT football. Okay. I really love going to the UT games. It's, uh, it's so fun and it's so, they're so enthusiastic and they're, they just love it. It's like when you're a part of it, when the touchdowns get scored and everybody's cheering, it's like, it's, it's so contagious. Right. It's really amazing. And it's just like the enthusiasm they have for it. It's like, wow, this is a great, these people love this here. But I've been to high school football games, and it's the same thing.

1:46:15Like packed stadiums for high school football games. And you're like, this is nuts, man. These people love their sports. We're like that for hockey in Canada. Oh, yeah. It's serious, serious. Like parents are very fixated. And I think it's actually a good thing. Some people say, oh, it's terrible. I think it's great to have parents that are competitive because they're pushing their kids to be better and more excellent. And even if they don't end up as NHL hockey players, it gives them that competitive ed. And I want us to be a more competitive society. Well, when I was a kid, I worked at the Boston Athletic Club.

1:46:46And one of the people that I was a fitness instructor when I was 19. And one of the people that I worked with was Bobby Orr. Oh, really? Yeah, Bobby Orr used to come there and train him. We used to have to help him get on the VersaClimber machine because his body was so wrecked. Really? He had so many surgeries. His knees were so destroyed. He had scars all up and down his knee. Because he had knee surgery back when they were just experimenting. You know, they didn't really know how to fix knees. They just cut you open, screwed things back together again, and then it would blow apart again. And then you'd wind up having another surgery.

1:47:20So he had many, many knee surgeries, and he could barely walk. But he was still doing some kind of physical activity? Oh, yeah. He was playing racquetball. How old was he at the time? this was 1986 so i mean geez that's like what 40 years ago uh-huh yeah so he was you know he was probably in his 50s 40s or 50s he was but he's he could barely walk i mean he his knees didn't straighten out really they were they were always like slightly bent and they only bent that much. His range of motion was very small. So you had to help him get on machines. But the nicest guy. Right. A legend. Like you couldn't believe he was really there.

1:48:03Right. Like he would walk into the gym and you're like oh my god. As I was 19 I never met a famous person. And I was like that's Bobby Orr. Absolutely. This is nuts. But it also made me realize like boy knee surgery is no joke. Like this guy was like an incredible athlete and now he can't even straighten his leg out. Yeah, it's all temporary. You got to take care of yourself. Yes. Do you, do you have like residual injuries from fighting back in the day? Oh yeah. Yeah. I've had three knee surgeries, two reconstructions. Was that from Taekwondo? Yeah. And jujitsu. One of them, one of my ACL injuries was from a jujitsu.

1:48:39And what, uh, like what injuries are the most common in jujitsu? Knees, backs, necks, shoulders. Those are the big ones. Elbows. Is that because of the, the arm bars and all that stuff? Yeah, not tapping. That's a big one. A lot of guys get hurt just because of their ego, because they don't want to tap. And you don't strike me as the type of guy who taps very quickly. Well, when I was younger, I was really stupid, and I wasn't into tapping. Right. But as I got older, I got a lot smarter. Fortunately, I got a lot better, so I wasn't in a situation where I had to tap a lot. But if I did, I did. I just tapped.

1:49:15And that's the smart thing to do. And I would tell people, treat it like you're playing basketball. Don't treat it like it's your life or death. The game is life or death. The game is if a guy gets you in an arm bar, he's essentially breaking your arm. If he breaks your arm, he can kill you. Right. That's the game. But don't treat it like that. Treat it like you can tap and keep going. Right. Or you can not tap and your arm's going to be destroyed maybe for the rest of your life. Right. And I've seen that happen with people where their forearm snaps and they have to have plates in it. and then it's a chronic injury for the rest of their life.

1:49:47Right. Yeah, no, I can imagine that. And what about in Taekwondo? Like, you told a story once about how you really clocked a guy. I think it was a real kick or something. Yeah. And that, like, freaked you out. That changed my whole outlook on fighting because I realized that could happen to me. And I had knocked people out before, but I'd never knocked anybody out where they didn't get up. Like, usually they get up and they're wobbly, and, you know, they get sat down, and the medics take care of them, And, you know, after a while, they're walking around. And this guy never got up. And I never really got over that.

1:50:21I never had the same lust for hurting people because it was just I was young. You know, I was 19. And when you're 19, you think you're invincible or you don't you don't think about the consequence. I knew I could get hurt. I've been hurt before. I've been kicked really hard and punched really hard before. I knew I was vulnerable, but I didn't think there was going to be anything permanent. Did the guy ever get out of the hospital? I don't know. Really? I don't know what happened to him. I don't know what happened to him. Maybe he'll hear this show and give you a call and say that he's all right.

1:50:51Oh, no, no. He probably don't want to talk to me. Well, your spinning back kick is incredible. I saw you and GSP doing that video where you were showing him how to do the back kick. Yeah. Did he ever use that in a fight? Yeah, he did. Yeah, he did. He landed it? Yeah, he used it a lot. It's a thing that, like, you have to almost grow up doing it. Right. You know, unless you're dealing, like, John Jones developed it later in his career. I saw that. He's a wizard. But he kind of, like, started implementing it, like, sort of two-thirds through his career. Did you teach him how to do that? No, no, I did not.

1:51:24He worked with a Taekwondo coach in Albuquerque. Okay. And he just really worked on that one technique, specifically when he went up to heavyweight, because the guys would be, first of all, less agile and mobile, and also it was the kind of technique where you could stop a guy with one shot. Right. And when you're a guy who's smaller than most heavyweights, which John is, because he was a light heavyweight, so he was fighting at 205 most of his career, and just as a challenge decided to go up to heavyweight. But he's so intelligent, he realized, like, I need a one shot that I could put people away.

1:51:54So he spent hours and hours every week just going over the spinning back kick. Really? To the body or the head? Yeah, the body. The body. Yeah. It's like getting hit by a car. Right. So much power in that. Like a wheel kick to the head is really difficult to develop. It's like a fast twitch thing that it's almost like your body has to evolve and grow doing that to really develop the kind of speed that you could pull it off on a skilled opponent. And the accuracy. Yeah. Like to try and time that all. That must be incredible. I mean, there's freak athletes that could pick it up later in life. There's some people that are just really good at everything.

1:52:30They just have amazing dexterity and coordination. But for most people, like I learned it when I was a kid. So like my body matured doing those things. My body matured kicking. And it became a part of like just my average like normal movement of life. Right. That's amazing. And the spinning back kick though, is it typically a body kick? Yes. You throw that? Well, I've thrown it to the face too, especially a jump spinning back kick to the face. Wow. But the... Taekwondo, wasn't it really the Koreans that developed so they could actually kick a man off a horse in war? Is that why the kicks are so high?

1:53:09I don't think so. I think it was just because they're smaller in stature, and they realized that you had to have more powerful kicks. Okay. You know, because your legs are always carrying your body around. There's a lot more mass to your muscles and your legs, and there's a lot more force you can generate with your kicks. Did you ever see the fight between Rick Rufus and that Muay Thai guy? Oh, yeah. Wasn't that incredible? Yeah, that changed kickboxing. We've showed that fight a hundred times on this podcast. It's amazing because it was like Americans versus Thai. Well, we didn't really understand leg kicks.

1:53:42Right. Because PKA karate, and I found this out later because of Benny Urquides, who came in the podcast. He told me that the reason why they didn't allow leg kicks in PKA karate was because of Bill Wallace. So Bill Superfoot Wallace famously had one leg that he kicked with. It was because his other leg, he had a bad knee. Right. And he didn't want anybody kicking his legs. Interesting. So he promoted this idea that only have above the waist kicks. Right. And that's what we had in America. Like, that's what Jean-Yves Terrio fought most of his career. He did. He fought Rufus himself, actually. Yes.

1:54:15Yeah. Yeah. No, that was incredible. Because if you looked at the art form, Rufus was so much more beautiful to watch than the Thai guy. He came in. He broke the guy's jaw in the first round, I think. He knocked him down a few times. Was it once or twice? He knocked him down a couple times, I believe. But Rick was amazing. And the guy just kept chopping his leg. And then I think he went out in a stretcher because his leg was busted in like nine places. He didn't know what to do. He didn't understand it. What was really interesting is his brother, Duke, became a Muay Thai world champion after that fight.

1:54:47Was that the guy who was at the fight commenting after the fight? Yes. Yes, I remember that. Where he was saying it doesn't take any skill. There's no skill. Yes, I remember that. Well, he was embarrassed by that later in his life because he became one of the top MMA trainers. Really? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And he took on Muay Thai? Yes. Well, he became a Muay Thai world champion, and he developed Rufus Sport, which is a great gym in Milwaukee. A top gym. Developed world champions like Anthony Pettis. So he was a pioneer. He was one of the guys that had to figure it out. And he spent time in Thailand.

1:55:17They all learned it. They had to learn. Where's the best place in Thailand to go? Is it Phuket? Is it Bangkok? Where do you go? Oh, there's so many good places. Thailand's the real motherland of Muay Thai, obviously. And it's like, you know, Phuket's amazing. Bangkok's amazing. I mean, there's so many amazing gyms that are in Thailand. They're tough guys. There's whole strips in Phuket. My wife and I were there on vacation once, and we just stumbled on this whole street. And you could do, there was sort of American-style boxing. There was a CrossFit-type thing. Then there was that Tiger Muay Thai and a bunch of other Muay Thai facilities.

1:55:54And then there's like street vendors that were cooking meals specifically for people who are there training. Like you could buy beautiful hard-boiled eggs and avocado and chicken strips. And this is like high protein just catered to the people who come from around the world to train for like five, six weeks in a clinic. And there's people that do it just recreationally. My friend Mark, he's a businessman. He's in his 60s. And he did it? He went over to Thailand. Did he survive? Yeah. He trained he spars all I saw him the other day had a black eye. He's in his 60s I'm like what are you doing man?

1:56:29So if you were starting from scratch you and you wanted to be a MMA would you do like you go to Thailand and do a do like a two months there and then go to Dagestan to learn how to wrestle is that That would be the best combo if you were starting out if you're a kid I would say wrestling wrestling is number one. Yeah, that's the most important thing to learn because if a guy can take you down He could do whatever he wants to if he could write you down and hold you down and beat you up If you don't know how to wrestle you can't fight right you need it at least to learn wrestling just understand wrestling take down defense That's you did jujitsu later in life didn't you yes, right?

1:57:05I didn't start jujitsu till I was 29. I think Yeah, and who do you like right now? Who do you think is the most interesting fighter to watch these days? Oh, there's so many it's impossible to say the most interesting There's a guy from Spain, Ilya Tapuria. Yeah, I really like Tapuria. He's what David Goggins calls uncommon amongst uncommon men. Want some more coffee? No, no, thank you. I'm good. Thank you. He's a freak. I mean, he's just incredibly talented. Weirdly talented. Like his last three fights, he knocked out three all-time greats. Holloway? Yeah, Holloway, Alexander, and Charles Oliveira.

1:57:50So that's crazy. Volkanovsky, who's like one of the greatest featherweights of all time, knocked him out. Knocked out Max Holloway, another one of the greatest featherweights of all time. Right. And then Charles Oliveira, one of the greatest lightweights of all time. He knocks out three guys in three fights. There's no one has a resume like that. And he's not like, as I understand, he was a Greco-Roman guy. Right, initially. He became a boxer later on. He's just talented. How do you describe, like, so I'm not knowledgeable in this area, but the way he almost looks like he has a Philly shell. Is that a Philly shell, what he does with one arm down?

1:58:25Well, he has amazing defense. He's just amazing awareness and pattern recognition, technique. He's like, he's a combination of all things, right? Incredible confidence, incredible intelligence. Insane discipline, work ethic, but just great training methods. He does everything right. And then insane confidence. His confidence is insane. When he fought Charles Oliveira for the lightweight title, he celebrated his victory the night before. He had a party to celebrate the night before the fight and then went out and knocked Charles out in the first round. And said he was going to knock Charles out in the first round.

1:59:05That's incredible. One punch. Boom! You know what impresses me most about him is how he got up after that kick to the head he took. That was incredible. Jai Herbert, yeah. And you know who else did that was GSP. Remember when GSP took that head kick and he went down, but he recovered quickly? And he was talking to me about how, because I said to him, like in politics, you get hit, right? Not physically if you're lucky, but you have to be able to get up quickly and react to it. I asked him, how did you do it? How did you, like, how does your brain go from taking that kind of hit to getting back in the fight and turning it around?

1:59:39And he said he like gets two very deep breaths through the nose and then out through the mouth and get some oxygen back into your system and focus your mind. I thought that was an incredible lesson. Well, I mean, it's all in how you get kicked because you could just get knocked out. And then it's over. There's nothing you could do. If you get shut off, you get shut off. Right. And certain people get shut off. It just, you just get kicked. You can get kicked and it kind of glances off of you or you can get kicked and it just slams right into the side of your neck and the lights go dark. Right. But if you're still able to recover and think quickly, it's incredible to have that kind of pre-programming to ready you for a moment like that.

2:00:19Well, I mean, that's a big part of what I was talking about, the camp that he comes from. I mean, Firas Ahabi is like one of the most intelligent and one of the most brilliant trainers in the sport. Who's this? Firas Ahabi. He's the guy from Montreal. Oh, that's... TriStar. So he's the guy who trains his... Yes. Trains GSP. Oh, GSP. Okay. Yes. Okay. And I mean, I think that is, that's a big part of why GSP was able to recover. Like, they prepare for everything. Right. You know, it's like, there's nothing left to chance. Like, he hires people to try to knock George out in training. That was one of the things he did.

2:00:53He would give them more money if they could knock him out. So they would just, so he would be like fully prepared when he was fighting. Like they leave no stone uncovered. Don't you have to like budget though, the number of headshots you take? Yeah, 100%. But he was pretty confident that George, I mean, it wasn't like he was doing this with a beginner. Right. He was doing this with a world champion, one of the greatest of all time. Okay. He, you know, he wanted George to be in danger, you know, so George had to fight like he was going to fight inside the octagon. Right. In danger. because john jones said somewhere that he had like every time he gets hit hard in in camp he's he said like i just that that's part of my brain budget that's that's taken away well that's why john's so smart he recognized that there's a lot of people that don't think that way john also famously won't take a fight on short notice is that right he wants to be fully prepared for a fighter even a guy like when he fought chael sunnen um they offered him a chael sunnen fight on short notice and he said no.

2:01:51Like, there is not a time, no disrespect to Chael. He's a great fighter. There's not a time on this life, in this earth, where Chael Sonnen is going to beat Jon Jones. It's just not going to happen. He could have taken that fight on one day's notice and still beat Chael Sonnen. He's that much better than him. But he still wouldn't take it. He's like, no, I'm going to be fully 100 % prepared. That's smart, though. Yeah, also he hated Chael. And so he wanted to make sure that there was not a chance that Chael could do anything to him that he wouldn't have been able to do if he was trained do these guys hate each other sometimes is it but most of them do they respect or is it it depends on the fight it really depends like when ilia tapuria fought um charles olivera he actually apologized to him before the fight he said i'm sorry it has to be you i really like you

2:02:40kind of crazy he's got to be careful but he's hated people too he's hated people he fought too i mean there's some people that just rub you the wrong way there's some people their strategies to get inside your head and fuck with you and for you to fight with emotion. Well, Habib with, um, Conor McGregor, he really hated McGregor. He wasn't going to, almost didn't let go when the tap happened. Oh yeah. Yeah. That was, that was something else. Is Conor ever going to come back? Do you think? Only Conor knows. I mean, if he's going to, he has to do it soon. I mean, I think he's 30. How old is he now?

2:03:1137. He's jacked now, eh? Yeah, well, not anymore. He came back down? He was on the Mexican supplements for a while. Okay. Because he was trying to recover from his leg break. Right. So when he fought Dustin Poirier. I remember that. He got on some stuff to try to recover for that. I don't know what he got on, but clearly it helped. He got huge. He got super jacked. The problem with getting super jacked like that is then you get addicted to what got you super jacked. Because if you're on steroids, you feel like Superman. You know, you feel like you could just run through walls and then you get off of it.

2:03:46And now your endocrine system has to kind of catch up to the fact that you've been giving it exogenous testosterone for all these months. And so that takes a long time for you to get back to a normal, healthy level. So you feel like shit. It's hard for these guys to get off of steroids. Right. I can imagine you get addicted to being that's right. I've never done it. I don't plan on it. How old is he? 37. Almost 38. That's getting up there. Who's the oldest fighter that's ever been in the octagon? Like, who's a serious competitor? Probably Randy Couture. I think Randy won the world title, the world heavyweight title in his 40s.

2:04:22Wow. Yeah. But Randy didn't even start his mixed martial arts career. I think, I was there at his first fight in 1997, and I think he was 34 or 35 before he ever had an MMA fight. He was just an elite wrestler who made his way into MMA because there's no real professional outlet for actual amateur wrestling.

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2:05:49Did you ever interact with the Gracies? Because I remember way back in like, I remember MMA or UFC 2. It was the second one. That was when it really kicked. Because the first one was a little bit strange. It was that big fat guy whose tooth went flying out. Yeah. But number two was the one with Shamrock and Gracie and Dan Severn. Was he in number two? Dan Severn, the wrestler? I think he was later. He might have been three or four. Yeah. But that was kind of the first generation of big names. Oh, Hoist Gracie changed the world. Yeah. He was a slow style, though, man. You had to have patience to watch him because he'd just lie on his back and wait, wait, wait.

2:06:26Well, with Dan Severn he did because he had to catch him in a triangle. Right. And he eventually tapped him, and no one even understood what was going on. Like, why is he? He's got his legs wrapped around him? What the hell is going on? Exactly. And then all of a sudden, Dan Severin's tapping out. You're like, this is crazy. So a man who weighed literally 100 pounds more than him, or close to it, on top of him, and hoist beat him. Well, Dan Severin didn't appear to have any finishing moves. Like, he was thinking, I got you on your back. I've pinned you. I've won the wrestling match. He would kind of give you little noogies, knuckle sandwiches.

2:06:55But then, of course, eventually that anaconda comes in and either chokes you out or takes your arm. Well, no one understood jiu-jitsu until Hoist came around, you know, other than the Brazilians. And he was his dad, wasn't it? His dad that introduced it to the family? His dad and his uncle. So it was Carlos Gracie and Elio Gracie, who were the real founders of Brazilian jiu-jitsu, and then Carlson Gracie. Okay. And those guys were the pioneers, and they were having no-rules fights in the 1930s and 40s. Wow. Yeah. And did they bring it over from Japan? Maeda brought it over from Japan, and they taught the Gracies.

2:07:32And then, you know, Elio Gracie famously had a match with Kimura, who was a Japanese judoka who broke Elio's arm with a Kimura. And that's how that technique, that's why it's called a Kimura. Really? Yeah. In catch wrestling, they call it a double wrist lock. Okay. But we call it a Kimura because Kimura broke Elio Gracie's arm with this. Elio just refused to tap, and it's like, ah! And eventually it snapped his arm. Wow, that's incredible. They're having these long no-rules fights in Brazil long before anybody had any idea what MMA was in America. And then Hoyce's brother, Hickson, who was the best out of all of them.

2:08:15Hickson was fighting people when he was 18 in, like, these big arenas in Brazil. Yeah, unbelievable and then they then I guess Dana White brought it in with you at UFC and no it wasn't Dana It was there there was another organization before Zufa owned the UFC and this other organization. They started it with Horry and Gracie So Horry and Gracie was the guy who founded the UFC Okay, and originally they were talking about putting like a moat around the cage and having crocodiles They wanted it to be like completely insane because what it was for Horian Horian is a brilliant man and what would for him what he wanted was to promote jujitsu and he's like this is gonna be the best way to open up schools all over the country and to show This art that my father had created right so they had really taken some of the ground techniques of judo and really Refined them right to a razor-sharp edge and and also one of the things that helped a lot was that Elio was a small man.

2:09:17He was only like 145 pounds And so he had to use only technique and leverage he couldn't rely on brute strength and so it was one of the best sort of Advertisements is to have hoist who was also fairly small. He's only 175 pounds Beat all these big giant muscle-bound guys with pure technique because they didn't understand what he was doing And he was like, this is going to be brilliant. This is going to, and it worked. I mean, the name Gracie and Jiu-Jitsu are synonymous. It's everywhere now. Like we even have them in Canada where these schools will have the Gracie name. And obviously they have no attachment to Gracie's, the Brazilian Gracie's.

2:09:56But everybody wants to learn the Gracie style. Well, they probably do have a, like Gracie Baja, which is a huge affiliate of gyms. They're all over the country, the world. They're everywhere. Are they good? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, there's like, it's very difficult to have a bad jujitsu gym today. Why is that? Because they're so competitive? It's too competitive. Okay. There's too many good people. There's too many good gyms. Like in Austin alone, Austin alone has like 10 amazing jujitsu schools. Is that right? Oh, yeah. Do you go and roll quite often still? There's a place right up the street, 10th Planet Jiu-Jitsu, which is the school that I started with in California.

2:10:30Well, I started with the Machado. Well, I actually started with Hicks and Gracie. I started with Hicks and Gracie, and then I went to Carlson Gracie, and that was just because I didn't know there was any difference in the Gracies, and then Carlson Gracie was closer to my house. I was like, oh, I'll go to this Gracie place. It's closer. This was when I was a white belt. I didn't know anything. And then when they closed, when that gym closed, then I went to Jean-Jacques Machado's. And so I started training there in 1998, and that was in the Valley in California. But then one of John Jock's black belts, my best friend, Eddie Bravo, he started 10th Planet Jiu-Jitsu.

2:11:05And then I trained there as well. Okay. And in Canada, we see a lot of places where they do Muay Thai and Jiu-Jitsu. So you get your striking and your grappling all in one studio. 10th Planet here has a Muay Thai program. Oh, is that right? So that's common now. A lot of those gyms have that. And you went to your first, as a commentator, you did it like for free, didn't you? No, no. I got paid in the early days, in the 90s, in 1997, but it wasn't much. I was losing money. But when the UFC was purchased by Zufa in 2001, that was when I was on Fear Factor. and I met Dana White and I became friends with him and he asked me as a favor to do commentary on this one show that they had UFC 37 and a half it was on Fox Sports whatever it was the there was a cable channel so it was best damn sports show period had this UFC show and he said would you do me a favor and just do commentary on this one event right and I said okay I'll do it for this one and he's like I want you to do it again and then I was like okay so I was like I just wanted to do it for fun like for me it's like I like going to the fights and I like going with my friends and having a good time and I did like the first 15 of them for free I just they I knew they were hemorrhaging money and I didn't need any money but you loved it you loved being there he was like a kid in a candy store well also I was very happy to try to promote this thing because for me, it was the ultimate expression of martial arts.

2:12:32Like, we need to find out what's the best style. Right. And I had been so engrossed in that world in Japan with Pride and all these other organizations that they had over there. It's like, what happens if an alligator fights with a tiger? What happens if a lion fights with a bear? We've got to match them up and find out. Well, it's humans versus humans, so it's just style. Muay Thai versus karate. Because you didn't want to waste your time doing something that didn't work. Right. And there was a lot of people that wasted their time doing stuff that didn't work. And we didn't really know what that was until the UFC came along.

2:13:05And then we're like, oh. And now the evolution of martial arts from 1993 when the UFC started to 2026. In those years, martial arts have evolved more than they have in the last 30 ,000 years. Right. Well, it's like the gap between theory and practice. Yes. And like Bruce Lee, when he, when he started with Wing Chun, but he said that a lot of it was just ornamental and he called it dry land swimming. It's like, you know, you wouldn't actually do that in a fight. And then he got into a lot of contention with the scholars of the art form. It's a very beautiful art form, Wing Chun, but I don't know if it, I can't imagine it works that well.

2:13:48Well, it is. Wing Chun is effective. There's a lot of techniques in Wing Chun. If you got into a fist fight between like a Muay Thai guy and a Wing Chun guy, who would come out on that? The Muay Thai guy. Yeah. But it doesn't mean that Wing Chun's not effective and you could use Wing Chun in Muay Thai. Okay. Or in an MMA fight. But you have to know everything. Right. That's the reality of it. It's like Taekwondo. Right. Taekwondo is not effective by itself in an MMA fight. But if you know MMA and you know Taekwondo, then you could do like what Edson Barboza did to Terry Edom and knock him out with a wheel kick in spectacular fashion.

2:14:20Right. Like it's learning. Because Jones has like a big blend, right? Yes. Like he has some Muay Thai, some karate, some... Yes. That's what MMA is, mixed martial arts. I mean, it's like you take all... And that's Bruce Lee's philosophy, absorb what's useful. Right. I mean, he was the real first mixed martial artist. And when it was very dangerous to do that. Right. Because people hated him. I mean, they would attack him. He would have to have fights with people because they thought that he was disrespecting their art. Right. And he combined Western boxing and wrestling. He learned judo from Gene Lebel.

2:14:53He learned things from everybody. He learned karate, savate. He learned all these different martial arts and was absorbing what's useful and putting his own. So Jeet Kune Do, his style, was really the first mixed martial arts style. Is that right? Yeah. Do people use it anymore? Well, yeah, there's Jeet Kune Do schools, sure. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I mean, a lot of what Krav Maga is, the Israeli martial art, is like kind of a combination of things along the same lines of the way Bruce Lee did it. Is Krav Maga a good, effective martial art system? Every martial art system is effective if you have a great instructor.

2:15:30Okay. Right? But on their own, like, the best styles are the really strong styles, like jiu-jitsu, Muay Thai, wrestling. Those are the best styles. Western boxing. Those are the best styles on their own. But what Krav Maga is is a combination of all those styles. And so if you have a great instructor in Krav Maga, yeah, you'll learn great Muay Thai. You'll learn great Jiu-Jitsu. It's essentially mixed martial arts. But with a lot of emphasis on real-world applications, street fights, dirty stuff like eye gouging, poking people in the eye, kicking them in the nuts. Yikes. Stuff that works. But that's what you – you see it in an MMA fight all the time.

2:16:10A guy gets poked in the eyes like hang on and he has to stop Isn't that against the rules punched and it's against rules so this guy's getting punched and kicked and look Tom Aspinall He was in the heavyweight title fight and he got I poked in the first round He's had to have two surgeries since then on his eyes, and he hasn't been able to fight They had to stop the fight in the first round from an eye poke My god, it's very effective. But in Krav Maga They're like go for the eye because in a real world fight for your life scenario If you're in a war, it's for the Israeli military, I think. Exactly.

2:16:42So they have to prepare for unusual situations where you're trying to survive in a situation where your weapon has been removed and you're just trying to fight for your life. Exactly. And you're in a situation with hand-to-hand combat. You need to learn. You need to know. If a guy takes you down, you can't be lost. Oh, we have to get back up so I can fight. No, you have to be able to fight on the ground. And that's the idea of it. Like incorporate jiu-jitsu. incorporate leg kicks, Muay Thai, Western boxing, even Jeet Kune Do techniques, even Wing Chun techniques. Really? There's a lot of hand trapping and things in Wing Chun that can be very effective in a fight.

2:17:20It looks really cool what they do with that wooden dummy. Uh-huh, yeah. It looks... Exactly. I've never really got into that, but if you do get into that, you'll learn blocking techniques and you'll learn... That actually work? Yeah, sure. Okay. But they'll work if you know the other stuff. It won't work if a guy just shoots a double on you and takes you down and starts pounding and you don't know what to do when you're on the bottom. You have to know how to, and this is what really MMA has taught the world. It's like you have to be able to defend yourself everywhere. Standing up, on the ground, you have to be effective in all the realms.

2:17:56But still we have a lot of people that are pure specialists that do really well in mixed martial arts because they're so good in one area. Like Alex Pereira, who was the middleweight champion, light heavyweight champion, and now he's going up to heavyweight and he's going to be fighting at the White House card. Alex Pereira is one of the greatest kickboxers of all time. He's a two-division world champion and kickboxer. But his style is all kickboxing, but he just developed takedown defense. He can do it all. He can do it all. But he doesn't submit anybody. If you're fighting him, you're going to get...

2:18:29It's going to be a stand-up fight. Unless you could take him down, he's not going to try to take you down. He's going to try to fuck you up. He's going to try to knock you into another dimension. Thanks for the warning. I'll try to avoid the guy if I see him on the street. The funniest thing I ever saw was there's this video of John Jones on the street somewhere. And he bumped into, he was talking and he leaned on some guy's motorcycle. I think he might have been in Asia or something. The guy had no idea who he was. And he started screaming at him. Oh, no. And John said, I'm very, very sorry. and he turned around, he ran away like he was terrified.

2:19:02And it was obviously, he wasn't in any danger, but it was so hilarious that this guy had no idea who he was picking a fight with. That's hilarious. The guy has no idea. His life flashed before his eyes. But he took it well because he was like, you know, I don't have anything to prove. Yeah, John's not the type of guy that would do anything. I mean, also, what a lawsuit, you know? Oh, yeah, your hands are weapons. I mean, his whole body's a weapon. But most of those guys are really nice guys in real life. Is that right? Yeah, because they get all their aggression out. They don't have anything to prove.

2:19:32They're not the type of person. They know what they can do. They don't have to prove it to anybody. Well, you should come to Winnipeg. They have a fight coming up. I think it's in I think it's in April. It's an April. A UFC in it. Yeah, I've avoided UFC's in Canada. Well, come on up. I've avoided it just because of the government just what was going on as a protest. I was like this is so fucked. Well, we'll come back up and well if you win, I'll go up there. Well, we should get you up before you become Prime Minister. I promise I'll do all the UFC events that they have in Canada. We need you up in Canada to come do one of your comedy shows, and it would be great for Canadian tourism.

2:20:06I used to love going up there. I used to love going to Massey Hall. Yeah. I used to love - Yeah. I love performing there. I did - You used to do Montreal? Mm-hmm. And how old were you when you were in Montreal? Oh, I started - I think the first time I was up there, I was like 25. Such a beautiful city, eh? Yeah, 26. It's gorgeous there. Oh, I loved it up there. Quebec is lovely. It's amazing. Beautiful province. Amazing food. Shout out to Joe Beef, one of my favorite restaurants in the world that's in Montreal. Yeah. Montreal's a great place. And you should come out to the prairies, too. Go to the Calgary Stampede.

2:20:39I've heard that's awesome. Oh, it's amazing. I've been to Edmonton. I've been to Alberta. Yeah. That's my home promise. I've performed in Edmonton a few times. And I've hunted in Alberta. Where? Well, my friends John and Jen Rivett, they have a guide. I mean, they guide people up in northern Alberta. It's all like, you know, black bear hunting. So it's like... There's a lot of great hunting. I don't hunt myself, but there's a ton of great hunting, a lot of hunters in Alberta. Oh, yeah. Well, there's talk about Alberta separating. That won't happen. What was that about? It won't happen. Some people are frustrated, but they...

2:21:20You know, there's some legitimate frustrations. But at the end of the day, Canada's going to be united. and Albertans, I'm born and raised Alberta and Albertans are seriously patriotic. Very patriotic. Yeah, they're great people, hardworking. Some of the nicest people you ever met across. They are great people in Alberta. Hardy. They are hardy people. It's cold up there. It is cold. You know how to survive. Exactly. You got to be tough to survive the cold in Canada. Carve a country like we have out of that cold weather on that big open land. But people just keep on going and Alberta's got a real kind of rugged individualism.

2:21:56And people love their agriculture. There's great ranches in Alberta, beautiful grasslands in Saskatchewan. Doesn't Brock Lesnar have a place up there? I didn't know that. I think Brock Lesnar bought land in Alberta. Really? I think he owns a ranch up there. Actually, I had heard that from somebody. I've never seen him. He fell in love with it. Well, he's a big hunter as well. Right. I think he fell in love with it up there because it's just so magnificent. It's so gorgeous. It's a great country. It's a big country. And the woods are so dense and beautiful, and you've got wolves and bears and moose and everything up there.

2:22:28It's an amazing country. The Canadian Rockies are spectacular as well. They're a worldwide attraction. You go to Lake Louise, it looks like a tropical lake because it's all this runoff from the mountain melt, and you'd think you were in the tropics because it's this turquoise green. That's where I grew up. I love Calgary. I love southern Alberta. That's really my home. and so you got to come to the Stampede. Greatest outdoor show on earth. A lot of Texans go up for the Stampede because it's a rodeo. It's a huge rodeo. Yeah, people don't think cowboy Canada. They don't think of that, but yeah. Calgary, they've got some serious cowboys there.

2:23:04No, they really do. Yeah. Look, I love Canada. I just... If you did your comedy show in Calgary, you'd get a massive turnout. Okay. It would be great. Think it over. Well, I was supposed to be up there before COVID. I was supposed to do a show up there for 420 for April 20th. I was going to do it in Vancouver. That's another great city. Every year I would do these 420 shows, like these, you know, 420 is the marijuana number. And Canada, now you guys have legal marijuana too. I've been legal for 10 years. Which they should have in America. It's so ridiculous. They just recently decided to make it Schedule 3.

2:23:40Is it state by state? Yes. It's legal in a lot of states, but it's still not legal federally. It's goofy. If alcohol is legal, marijuana is far safer. It should be legal. It's ridiculous. It's also a personal freedom thing. Leave people alone. It's like no one's robbing banks, smoking weed, fucking killing neighbors. It's crazy. That's a personal choice thing. It's not heroin. It's not opiates. It's not like maybe you shouldn't do it if you have mental health problems, right? But there's a lot of people that just like take a pot gummy and go to bed and it makes them sleep better. Like leave them alone.

2:24:15Like leave people alone. Let people have a glass of whiskey. Let people have a glass of wine with dinner. Leave them alone. Like, stop coming up with laws where you can impose your values and your morals and your judgments on other people. Let them have, make their own personal, look, if you want to eat a fucking cheeseburger, eat a cheeseburger. You know, if you want to go and have five Big Macs, you should be able to. I don't think you should do it, but I don't think there should be a law stopping you. And I think that should apply to a lot of things in life, and we'd be a lot better off. Well, the bottom line is, if you cannot trust a man to govern himself, how can you trust him to govern for others?

2:24:52Like, if you think that human nature is so flawed that people cannot make decisions for themselves, then how could you possibly trust human nature to make decisions for other people, to impose decisions on their lives? And who watches the watchman? We're constantly told we need to be kind of guided by these people from ivory towers. But who are these angels anyway? They're just human beings like everyone else. So when you give them more power and more, you give them the power to impose their will on people, then that ultimately gets abused. Yes. So even, you're right, even when somebody is doing something that I don't agree with, and I would think it would be better for all of us if they didn't do it, the mal that is done by giving me the power to impose my decision making on them is worse than the benefit of trying to direct them towards a better decision.

2:25:40Well said. That's my philosophy. That's why I like you. Well, that's where I come from. That makes a lot of sense. It's pretty simple. I think all the best things in life are simple. We overcomplicate things. Government is way too complicated. I think we need to get back to the simplicity. The greatest speech in the English language was Abraham Lincoln's Gettysburg Address, 271 words. Einstein compressed mass and energy into a five-character equation. um the you know bruce lee was an advocate of simplicity like simplicity is is a virtue and i think we have to get back to simplicity especially in government simpler clearer easier to manage that's the pro that's the kind of the the philosophical take i i i pursue well i appreciate that and i think like that philosophy and that perspective from a leader is what we need in this world, you know?

2:26:39And, uh, well, I think leaders have to have humility because the problem is that if you are an egomaniac and you're in power anywhere in the world, then you're going to want to just continually impose new rules and laws to make yourself bigger. Whereas if you believe in freedom, then you have to take, you have to be able to say to yourself, I don't know better for this other person. He knows better what's for him. And, you know, it's, it's hard, but Politicians have to think that they have to trust the people, but you know, nobody wants to have, he left people alone on their gravestone. They want to think, oh, he built this.

2:27:12He, he imposed that. He made this grand initiative that he imposed on the people in order to have a legacy. My legacy is just to let other people build their legacies in their own lives. I think the idea of forging a legacy based on controlling people and imposing your will is ludicrous. Exactly. Yeah. And the problem is history is littered with people like that. Absolutely. Alexander the Great, Genghis Khan. There's so many people that imposed their will and left a legacy. But is that good? I don't think it is. And it's also they're dead. This is who it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. Nobody walked by one of those magnificent tombs in Petra and said, boy, I'd really like to be inside there.

2:27:54Exactly. What is happening while you're alive is what's really significant and the most impactful thing. Do well, do good for the people. And I think your message resonates with me. Thank you. And if I was a Canadian, I would vote for you 100%. Thank you. Thank you for that. Well, it's a privilege to do this work. And I consider it very humbling and I'm very proud to be Canadian and to take the message of Canada here to our American friends. Well, I'm glad you're here doing that. And I think this is going to have a big impact. I really hope it moves the needle up in Canada. Absolutely. And down here, we got to get these tariffs gone.

2:28:33Yeah. Get the tariffs gone. Well, let's work it out. Right on. Work it out. And if you win, I'm coming up there. I promise. Well, we're going to try to get you up there earlier. I'm going to keep working on you. Okay. And you look at that maple leaf on your new kettlebell every day. eventually we're going to work subliminally into your subconscious and get you up. Well, look, like I said, you don't have to sell me on Canada. I love Canada. And I love that gift. So thank you so much. Thank you very much. Thank you for being here. Thank you. It was awesome. All right. Thank you. Thank you. Bye, buddy.