#2474 - Dave Smith

27:00And he was a relatively unknown at the time. But, dude, the place is going nuts. He already had made so much kind of like street cred for himself. And then the Irish thing, like the Irish were really, really into it. But from the very first fight, he would always create these moments where it's like, dude, this is going to be the biggest spectacle that you, my opponent, has ever been in in their career. Like, I'm going to get you mad with shit talking. I'm going to get the fans so excited because he's completely comfortable there. Like, I'm not sure if you're really comfortable here. And even with Aldo, who had been the entire division, literally when they started the division, they started him as champion.

27:38He didn't even win it. He came in because they absolved the WEC. So he was the entire featherweight division had just dominated everyone and he even created such a moment that like Like Aldo was like he was the boogeyman. Yeah, dude. He was incredible He's one of the greatest featherweights of all time But he got him to the point where he was like so furious He was like I'm gonna take this fucking guys head off and then Connor's just like relaxed Yeah, like like he didn't care about any of the shit talking. Yeah, we're having fun. Let's play he lost his composure Yeah, and he looked he looked very overwhelmed by the moment and oh and by the way Everyone from Ireland came to Vegas for that fight.

28:19It was the nuttiest thing I've ever seen in my fucking life The entire Mandalay Bay was overcome with Irish people. I mean Overcome like you couldn't move there was nothing but Irish people everywhere and they were singing They were all singing together in the halls of this gigantic casino Packed bump like they're waiting in line for something and they were just there partying for Connor I remember I think it was when I want to say it was when look at all these people. Yeah, it was nuts. This is nuts man They're all Irish people like you got to realize nobody had a following like him Like it this is actually Irish people for the Floyd Mayweather fight They were still ride or die with him even for that fight room.

29:05I think it was when he fought Dennis Seaver I want to say I think I was in Boston So I went to I went with a Louis J. Gomez my good friend hilarious comedian And he me and him went to some Irish bar To what like we just happen to be in midtown Manhattan and we were like all the fights are coming on So they're playing it at this bar, you know, it's just like an Irish pub and dude I mean, it wasn't even that big of a bar. They must have. I mean, it was shoulder to shoulder Irish people losing their fucking minds. Like it was the it was the most fun environment to watch a fight in because they're just I mean, they're just like.

29:39But all that singing and chanting. It seemed like everyone had an Irish flag with them. Like it was it was this in a little bar. It was this. That's nuts, man. Look at that. That's Mandalay Bay. Wow. Look at this. Oh, that's MGM. Well, they were everywhere. They were probably at every fucking casino there was. This is crazy

30:05Imagine imagine if you you're from Northern Ireland

30:12Still still remember the troubles Hotel just came to Vegas for a little gambling you don't follow MMA you have no fucking idea. What's this all about? I've picked a wrong fucking week for me vacation. By the way, I was going to say that Douglas Murray's big knock on me when he wrote his op-ed in the New York Post was he goes, you know, Dave goes on Joe Rogan and he talks about foreign policy like he's an expert, but I bet he wouldn't go in there and talk MMA with him because then Joe would recognize he's not an expert. And I was like, we do that all the time. We do that every show. We do that all the time.

30:48That's so stupid. I was like, almost every time we hang out, we end up talking MMA. And like that it probably is fair that yeah, there'll be moments where you'll correct me if I get something wrong So what but if I get it right? Yeah, you don't go that you're not an expert dumb Imagine we don't talk about MMA because you're not an expert. I don't know silly. Well, I watch a lot of it I have some thoughts. Why is he so silly? I love Douglas. I really do. I've enjoyed talking to him I think he's a brilliant man, but I was very disappointed with You've never been a very very disappointed with that that sort of strategy that you shouldn't be talking about these things that are factual.

31:22But even more disappointing with that notion, the notion that you would never talk about MMA with me. First of all, I don't think I argue about MMA with anybody. I don't think anybody. If someone has a point about MMA, I never argue. I might say I disagree. You've corrected me when I've gotten things wrong. Yeah, or I might say I disagree. Some people think that a certain thing is going to happen, and I'm like, ooh, I don't see that. I disagree. That happens. Sure. Yeah, but. Well, also, like, it's, whatever point you're making is either a good point or it's not a good point, if it's, like, an objective claim.

32:01You know what I mean? Right. So, like, if I say, like, you know, when Volkanovsky fought Lopez, his jab was crucial. Okay, that's either correct or it's incorrect. Like, whether I'm an expert or not, I'm not an expert on fighting. But, geez, you could watch the fight and that would be correct. Yes, right. You can see it. Right. I saw he hit a home run. You're right. You're not an expert. That's crazy. Well, you know, it was a weird thing during that show was because it's a weird, I don't know. There's like weird incentives built into like all of this. Incentives are the right word because there's a lot of people that are saying things and you go, why are you saying that?

32:37Yeah. Well, also from my perspective, I was a little disappointed with it because I kind of thought, I was like, oh, this could be like a really cool thing. And and it had been literally which I don't think I'm saying anything that is like betraying confidence here But the only thing that was ever said to me I remember you called me and you were like, what do you think about doing this? And I think I said yes before you could finish Absolutely, let's do that. And then you told me that he had said hey He really doesn't want this to devolve into like a food fight He wants to make this like a good faith thing and I was like, oh awesome and now I feel like he like Trump Whitcoff negotiated me like he's because then he came in and the whole thing was about me he didn't want to talk about the issues at all he just won and so in a weird way I was like well this sucks because I thought we could have had a really cool thing but then there was this other part of me that was like I mean he's really just handing this to me you know what I mean like he kind of just like gave me the win in a thing that was a big show with like a you know a lot of people I knew were gonna watch it I mean obviously every time I do your show a lot of people are gonna watch it but that was a particularly big one yeah and so I was kind of almost like for the first 45 minutes of it I was kind of sitting there like oh I can't believe he just he went this route well if you look at it objectively there weren't a lot of options right yeah it's very difficult to argue the side that what they're doing like we were talking about Gaza in particular yeah like Like the arguing that that's not horrific.

34:08And if you're a human being and you recognize that there are human beings that are subjected to that government, just like you're subjected to ICE, you're subjected to Homeland Security, you're subjected to the cops. If you're a civilian, you have to listen to these orders. So if you're living in Gaza and you're a child or you're a woman and you live, you're not Hamas. Okay. And the idea that you're responsible for October 7th, even if you're one of the people that cheered in the street, boy, don't you think you kind of have to cheer in the street if everybody else is cheering the street? If you're fucking in terror for your life and you have to like keep your safety intact Like you got to kind of go along with whatever everybody else is doing.

34:52I'm not saying it's that's good, but When you look at how that place is Leveled I mean the most recent videos that I've seen we're still like a few months old So I don't know if it stopped did they stop bombing? I don't know what's going on No, they've slowed down a bit, but they haven't stopped okay it there was nothing left man And that represents people's homes. That represents schools. That represents hospitals. There's no way you can argue that that's not horrific. During Lowe's Pro Savings Days, save more on what goes into the job. Add power to your lineup with a free DeWalt 20-volt max 5-amp hour battery when you buy a select DeWalt 20-volt max tool.

35:35Plus, get up to 35 % off select major appliances from Whirlpool, Maytag, and more. Get the job done right. Keep more in your pocket. That's Pro Savings Days. Our best lineup is here at Lowe's. Valid through 327. Selection varies by location. Raw supplies last. This episode is brought to you by Welch's Fruit Snacks. Big news for your kids' lunchbox. Welch's Fruit Snacks are now made without any artificial dyes. A snack parents can feel good about and the same delicious taste kids can't get enough of. All made with no artificial dyes. Try Welch's fruit snacks today. Well, he was stuck. That's right.

36:14That's right. It's kind of indefensible. And so instead you pivot to arguing against this guy rather than against the issue. Well, I think that, you know, it's in I can't remember if this was in the letter to America or this was in his declaration of war against America. But Osama bin Laden literally said that civilians are fair targets because you guys have elections and you vote for these politicians and they're the ones who conduct these wars that slaughter innocent Muslims. So, like, just saying it's the logic of Osama bin Laden to say that civilians are responsible for. And in Gaza, like they don't even really have a government.

36:54Hamas is not a government. They don't have regular elections. They had one election back in 05 or 06 or whatever it was, which Hamas did not even win majorities of. They won on pluralities. You know what I mean? And so the idea that you're holding these people responsible for Hamas just doesn't make any sense. And just on a very basic human level, you just kind of go – and I'm not like an egalitarian. I'm not saying all people are equal or all cultures are equal or anything like that. But on a very basic human level, those are real people too. And when a mother is like pulling her six-year-old dead body out of the rubble That's this same exact experience as if your wife was pulling your six-year-old out of there Like that same thing is happening to her and once you even just admit that It does just change the calculation it changes the calculation to be like okay Look the onus is on you to demonstrate that this is Absolutely necessary like there is no other option than to do it this way and And that makes defending most wars very difficult.

37:58Not all of them, you know, but most wars are very difficult to defend if you just run it through that filter of like, is there any other option other than this? Have you exhausted everything else? And then, of course, in the case with Israel and Palestine, you go, oh, you never even tried to just give them their independence. You've never tried to just let them out from this occupation and see if maybe that will improve things. And it is crazy that the world didn't. at one point in time stand up and say, there's a simple solution here. Like, these people should have a state. Like, why do you get to control them, but they're not as really?

38:33Like, they're kind of a country, but not really, because they're attached to you? Yeah. Why don't you guys go buy another country and give it to them and let them have a country? Or they don't like being attached on the same small patch of dirt to people that have a totally different ideology, I guess. Well, that's right and that look I mean it's just but we are yeah, we have Canadians right there Yes, but Canadians Canadians do get citizenship in their own country You know citizenship here too boy. That's the last thing ice is looking for is fucking Canadians like oh, yeah Your visa's expired and don't worry about it, buddy get on the plane They probably have a much easier time like Canadians go.

39:15All right. Guess I got a goo. Well. Yeah, also they can just Ditch the accent and pretend they're Americans and everybody will buy it. Yeah, I don't say about wrong. Yeah You know, they could just say ah, sorry. I don't have my license on me. Yeah, that's true Yeah, like okay, buddy. Where you from? I live in Iowa. Okay, sounds right. That does check out of here All right shit that those shit that's going on the airports so that are they using? They're using ice now at the airports because first of all, how many ice agents are there? Aren't they busy? How do you have time to put them in all the airports how many fucking air it's in the low tens of thousands?

39:49There's not that many of right so like how many airports are there? There's a lot of airports okay? So you're putting ice in the airports We get all these nice guys are you hiring new ice guys to take the airport jobs? Like did you just like take seven weeks to train them? So did they have like a surplus of like a ice? Factory where they're turning them out and putting them out there I heard so I didn't see any of them I flew out here the other day and I didn't see any of them. But then I did see people saying that they were at the airport I flew out from later that day. Up to 150. That's not a lot.

40:22Immigration and customs enforcement officers were deployed at airports across the United States on Monday. So, of course, you know, you get on social media. Somebody sends you something. Somebody sent me something. I'm not sure if it was true. But it was like, look at the difference between the lines at the airport before ICE was there and after ICE was there. And tell me that only 10 million illegal aliens got in

40:47They're like what is the real we were talking about this last night like what's the real number? What is the real number of illegals in the United States? We don't know you were saying something about Ann Coulter Yeah, well she had um and this was from a while ago. So this was well she had she had in her book adios america she had i believe it was from bear stearns i could be wrong double check me on that was one one of the big finance companies that they had put a thing where like they put it between like 30 and 50 million um total in the country and 50s why yeah and this is before joe biden and them now i don't know maybe maybe they got those numbers wrong before but so what year was this book uh i want to say 2014 2015 oh my god that's 10 years yeah yeah so a lot of them a lot of them have come in since then.

41:36Well, at least 10 million, they believe, came in through the Biden administration. So over four years. Well, I remember the numbers being like during the Biden administration where they'd be like, it was something like last month there were 700 ,000 border apprehensions. And you're like, well, geez, then how many were just flooding? And you'd see those big caravans coming in and stuff. I mean, look, it's a huge, that still is a huge scandal. And as much as I have really been really criticizing Trump in the Trump administration since last summer. You know, he's done a good job in securing the border.

42:12That is the one thing that, like, you kind of got to give him, and he got that secured, like, right away. Even if you think that it should be open and those people should be able to travel freely, they should. There's no one's illegal on stolen land, that kind of shit. You know how much sex trafficking happened during that time of children? You know how many children were trafficked that way? You know how many children were dragged across the border and sold to psychopaths? Oh, yeah. Oh, it's horrible. I mean, I saw... Oh, there's Ann Coulter with at least 15... At least 50 million illegals in the country today.

42:46See my book, Adios, America, for the analysis from Pulitzer Prize-winning reporters and numbers crunchers from Bear Stearns. I was right. It was Bear Stearns. This is 2022, this post. Wow. The book is even older, though. The book is from before... I want to say 2015, but it's around then. is crazy. That's crazy. Supposedly, this is the book that got Donald Trump on the immigration issue. At least I've heard Ann Coulter say that before. Maybe that's right. Maybe that's not right. But, I mean, look, it's also a particularly... It's a profound act of treachery for a government to do that to its own country.

43:33Like to allow that and really facilitate that to happen against the will of the domestic population. Like if you were to – I've tried to look this up before. I was trying to figure this out because I did a big immigration debate last year or maybe the year before. And I was trying – you can't even get numbers on what the polling on open borders is because no one even asked the question in polling. Because it's like – they asked like do you think immigration policy should be less restrictive or more restrictive? Because the number of people who support open borders, it's like maybe one percent of the country supports that.

44:03It's as unified an issue as anyone could have that. No, you can't just have the border wide open. Right. And so to do that to the American people against the way, like you you drastically change the country in a way that is not really. It's not easy to just undo. I mean, as we've seen. Right. Donald Trump backed off of mass deportations almost immediately because big business doesn't want it. And then because look like the level of violence that you'd need to just physically deport 50 million people is going to be something that the American people just aren't going to put up with. I mean, you even see in Minnesota and rightfully so.

44:40I completely understand it. But you see like, you know, I saw one thing. I saw that Trump had asked the ICE agents who were going to the airports to not wear their masks. And I was like, is that even a that's even an option? Why would they be masked in the airport? Because they're ICE agents. It's because they can get doxxed. Well, that's their concern. And look, I understand that. No, that's a real concern. I understand that concern. But at the same time, you know, there is a balancing act there. And, you know, a lot of people, like a lot of right-wingers will say, hey, look, if you're, you know, if you came here illegally, then that's a crime.

45:11You're here illegally. That's the law. And, hey, I get that argument. But also, the supreme law of the land is the Constitution of the United States of America. And I've seen a ton of videos where there were masked ICE agents not even identifying themselves going up to people telling them that you have to answer my questions. You don't have an option to walk away, which is like not true at all. That was my take on it is that you can't accept people that are masked, that don't have any paperwork, that don't have a warrant on the streets in militarized situations. because if they're using it for this, which you agree to, that opens up the door for them to use it because you won't take your vaccine or because you did this or did that or whatever the fuck it is.

45:53If a different person gets in power, maybe they're going to use it for something you don't support. It's just not something you're supposed to accept. That's right. You don't want to accept that president. Here's something that someone told me that is – this is a very credible source that I can't reveal what the source is. But they told me that there are people in this country and not just a few, but many, many that are affiliated with terrorist organizations, directly affiliated, but they've applied for asylum. And because they've applied for asylum, you can't deport them until they go through the entire process.

46:28That is wild. That is wild. So there's people that are known at least terrorist sympathizers. They're in direct communication with terrorist networks. They've done things with terrorist networks and they've applied for asylum. So you have to go through this long ass process through the legal system. And it's up to a judge whether or not this person who may or may not be a part of a fucking sleeper cell gets to stay in America. Yeah. Suicidal empathy. That's what God sad calls it. You know, I think he's right. I think he's got a fair point there with suicidal empathy in terms of the idea of like that we That we cannot say On some level that it's like no look we have a desire to preserve our society and we want to do what's bad And we don't have to out of some feeling of guilt Turn our country into something worse than what it otherwise would be so I think he's got a point there I think and look and I'm not a big fan of gad He literally just him and like Sam Harris and a few others.

47:34They literally just trash me all the time and refuse to engage on a single thing I've said. So like it'll just be he calls me Wikipedia Dave on Twitter. And it's a look. I like the guy. I have a different relationship with him than you do. Well, that's true. And I'm a big critic of Israel and he's a Mossad agent. So there is that. That is part of you. You think he is? He's admitted that he worked for Mossad in the past. Yes. Yeah. I guess he would say he's not like I used to work for Newport Creamery Represent them anymore. I think it's a little bit different with the Mossad thing but I also think that the the big component that I think all of those guys are missing is that We also create more enemies with our foreign policy and that that's not to say that like You know they always kind of caricature my position on this like I'm not saying Islam is all peaceful and there are no problems in the Islamic world or anything like that.

48:30In fact, I don't think any religion has truly always been peaceful. But, you know, for guys like, say, like Sam Harris, who these kind of like pretend intellectuals who have spent, he spent his entire career talking about how violent and irrational the Muslims are and how you can't even draw a cartoon of Muhammad or Muslims want to do violent stuff. And like, hey, fair enough. That's bullshit. And we should all say like if you want to be over here in the West our values are free speech and you cannot kill people for cartoons, but then like none of them ever also go hey You know murdering an ayatollah Might be dangerous during Ramadan.

49:15Yeah, like that is you know That is not just a political figure to Shiite Muslims that is a so at the same time It's like okay. I'm fine with saying okay. You don't want to have suicidal empathy my My buddy Keith Knight who's brilliant works over at the Libertarian Institute. He had I forget what he said But he said something like okay. I don't want to have suicidal empathy Let's also not have homicidal empathy, you know And so like maybe it also is like as we were tying into that whole conversation with now. I'm okay things With the whole thing about the the kids and women in Gaza It's like it's also the fact that if you just view Slaughtering Muslim children in the Middle East and in Northern Africa as like just an acceptable Political price, you know, that's just collateral damage and unfortunately that happens when we pursue this policy You're gonna deal with more and more of that and the combination of both Joe like the combination of having open borders having all these people get in and Continuing the war on terrorism and slaughtering people in these numbers must be the most insane combination Yeah.

50:24The idea that you'd be like, we're going to you know, we're going to just make an entire generation of of Muslims hate us because so many of them have seen what we've done to their countries. And also we'll welcome all of them in with no checks and we can't get rid of them when they come here. Yeah. That is quite a combination. Yeah. It's it's all nuts. It's the Sam Harris thing. I should clarify this because he's apparently talked about me again recently on Bill Maher. We didn't not talk because it was his idea. It was me. He wanted to do a podcast with me. He wanted to do a COVID wrap-up to go over everything that happened, all the mistakes that were made and his position, my position, because that's where we kind of separated.

51:12He was very pro-vaccine. I said, I won't do that until you talk to Brett Weinstein, that you need to talk to Brett. Like, Brett, you disparaged him publicly. I think you said things that weren't correct. You called him a conspiracy theorist. And you said you wouldn't platform him because it's dangerous. I don't believe that's true. I believe the problem is that Sam was incorrect about both the effectiveness and the safety of the COVID vaccines. Brett was correct. And Brett didn't insult Sam. Sam insulted Brett. I mean, Brett's said things about Sam since, but it was Sam. And I said, look, you got to talk to him first.

51:55You can't just talk to me, you know, especially because he's an actual evolutionary biologist. Like, he understands these things. He knows what he's talking about. He's had multiple conversations with high-level vaccinologists and all these different people that worked on the mRNA vaccines. Like, he was correct. We all know that now. We know that all the things that he was talking about whether it's masking doesn't work social distancing The lockdowns lockdowns at all all the above all the above he didn't want to talk to Brett I said that doesn't make sense to me like you talk to everybody you have debates with Muslims on stage That's right that doesn't make any sense like why wouldn't you talk to Brett?

52:38I don't think he wanted to talk to Brett Because I don't I think he didn't want to talk to Brett because Brett's right yeah, I think it's and I think it's indefensible No, I completely agree. I mean, you know, I had a by the way, I don't hate Sam. You know, he could say all the crazy shit he wants. He also said, like, I don't think you should interview Gaddafi. Guess what? I would. If Gaddafi was alive, 100 percent, I would interview Gaddafi. Gaddafi. Do you ever hear Russell Crowe talk about Gaddafi? I don't think so. He did a clip that went viral that was on this show. We talked about why they wanted to get rid of Gaddafi.

53:09Right. And like what they talked about how evil Gaddafi was and how he subjugated his people. You can see if you can find that Russell Crowe on Gaddafi He wanted to create a United States of Africa Yeah, he wanted to get him on the gold standard. He wanted to get him off the US dollar he like he had some Very dangerous ideas now. He also supported Palestinian resistance. Yeah, that was it

53:39There's no sound thing in there oh there it is Here it is. We are taught, for example, to regard Gaddafi in a certain way. But if you look into what happened in his country while he was the leader, you look into the fact that every person is given a house at a certain age. You look at the fact that everybody's education and health care is free. You look at if somebody showed a particular talent for something that required further education overseas. All of the costs of that were paid for by the government. Now, these are all things put in place by the same country's leader that we're told is evil and corrupt.

54:26Yeah. So it doesn't quite balance. Well, there's also U.S. government interference. that's a that's a that is one that we definitely monkeyed with i mean he ran afoul of the united states government we have talked for example there was the um the famous clip with hillary i showed a friend of mine the other day that he hadn't seen it and he couldn't believe it was real well she was on this show and she gets unconfirmed information first that they got qaddafi and then And she gets confirmed that he's dead. And she goes, we came, we saw, he died. She was so excited about it. But laughing. And then that led to Libya, at least for a while, becoming a failed state.

55:11Oh, it still is. It still is this whole time, man. It's been a disaster. This episode is brought to you by Visible. Folks, there's one thing nobody wants this season, and that's getting catfished. And it's not just dating profiles that are putting you at risk. It's also big wireless carriers. You know the type. Looks great at first, promises a low price. But once you're locked in, surprise fees and an expensive bill that isn't what you were expecting. Your knight in shining armor? Visible wireless. It's one-line wireless with unlimited data and hotspot for just$25 a month, taxes and fees included.

55:51Now that's a green flag. The best part, visible is all digital. So you can switch as fast as you can swipe. Don't fall for the trap of getting catfished by wireless. Visit visible.com to learn more and start loving your wireless carrier. Terms apply. See visible.com for planned features and network management details. And there's and you know, the thing is that they called that Hillary's war. She really she was the secretary of state at the time under Barack Obama. But she's really the one who championed that. And I believe Obama wrote in his book that he was 50 50 and that Hillary really pushed him to that He said his big regret was that he didn't think about what came next after Gaddafi cuz I wonder why now We haven't learned that lesson yet.

56:34Like after Iraq. You'd never thought of that Listen, but thank God Trump's figured it out. Oh, yeah, that's yeah Trump's figured it out. We'll go in this drastic new direction of getting the seventh war that they won a pussy Dave Jesus Christ did you see that one I don't know what military expert was on television You said something about we need a fan of boots on the ground like Rome Like hey fucker Rome didn't have nuclear weapons and drones Rome didn't have drones that hunt you yeah, we talking about boots on the ground should we fight with swords? We get everybody to fight with swords. Is that what you're saying?

57:09Fuck what are you saying? Well also like what? What even is the plan with boots on the ground like what are you talking about here? You're going to take an island. It goes, OK, well, then you're going to be a target. You're going to be target practice as long as the Iranian regime is still standing. And if you're talking about militarily occupying the country like we did with Iraq or Afghanistan or something like that, this is a huge country with 92 million people. How many soldiers do you think you need to occupy that country? At least half a million and probably you can't do it with that. So what are you talking about?

57:41And so you're saying, are we going to start a draft for the least popular war going in in American history? Because I don't think that's happening. This is maybe slightly more popular than Vietnam. Going in, it's less. I'm sure Vietnam by the end was very, very unpopular. Vietnam going in didn't make any sense, did it? I guess the Gulf of Tonkin incident. Most people in America were like, why are we doing this? What's going on? You're drafting people to go to Vietnam. We're fighting communism in Vietnam. Yeah. What? Well, they called it Vietnam syndrome that the American people had, which is that we didn't want to fight a war again after that.

58:24From their perspective, that's a syndrome. And it's really something. They think – by the way, Ben Shapiro used this same line called – he said Trump finally broke Iraq war syndrome. because they think, see, from Ben Shapiro's perspective, the illness is after you lie the American people into a war and slaughter a million people. The illness isn't that. You might look at that as the bad part, but the bad part is that these annoying Americans have this tendency to not want to do that again after that. But he claims Trump has broken Iraq War Syndrome. Of course, there's really no evidence with support of the American people that that has changed at all.

59:07And, you know, the George H.W. Bush was said to have defeated Vietnam War syndrome in Panama and in Iraq because they were relatively easy. Right. You know, bloodless on the American side or very, very limited, you know, injuries and deaths. and they weren't like quagmires that went on forever or whatever. But, of course, after the Persian Gulf War in 92, we went on to be bombing Iraq for ever since, essentially. I mean, for 30 straight years after that, we were still at war with that country. I think for a million people being dead. What is public support? Let's put that into our sponsor perplexity.

59:53What is current public support for the Iran war in America? And first of all, how will they know? No one's asked me. You know what I'm saying? That's a fair point. That's what I always say about polls. When was the last time you answered a poll? When was the last time anybody called you up and said, Dave, first of all, when was the last time you ever picked up the phone if you didn't know who was calling? And then when you do answer, when was the last time you said yes to a poll? I don't even remember ever getting calls. It has to be the dumbest of dumb people that answer those polls. So then you got to realize out of those stupid fucking idiots, even how many of them think the war is a good idea?

1:00:30It's even unpopular amongst them. I mean, what does it say here? Most recent national polls show Americans overall oppose the current war with Iran and think U.S. military action has gone too far. A Quinnipiac poll finds 54 percent. What is Quinnipiac? Quinnipiac poll finds 54 % of US voters oppose US military action against Iran and 39 % support it I wonder how many of those 39 % are And not too much we don't have the numbers a poll reports about six and right that what is the number of Jewish people in America? 2 % something like that Six and ten adults say US military action against Iran has gone too far only about a quarter say it's been about right 25 % PUFA.

1:01:19First of all, you know, whenever you're talking about these kind of things, it's like, who, again, who are we talking about? Who was asked? Finds Republicans largely support the military action around 86 % support. Whoa. Oh. Really? Because I talk to a lot of Republicans that think it's a terrible idea. While large majorities of Democrats, around 92%, and independents, about 64 % oppose it. 92 % of Democrats. Who are the 8 % of Democrats that are like, let's fucking go? You think maybe they're Jews? They work for CNN. You know, whatever. CNN thinks it's a good idea? No. Dude, CNN is running cover for Donald Trump during this time.

1:02:03Come on. For real? Oh, yeah. No way. Yeah, they put up a poll the other day. They had a graphic that said 100 % of MAGA supports the war in Iran. CNN said that? After all these years. He was going to say he liked it or something like that. Oh, but hold on a second. CNN likes me. Is that running cover or is that making them look bad? Because most Americans don't support the war and most Democrats, 92%, don't support the war. So if that's the case, wouldn't that just make it look like these MAGA people are a fucking problem? I guess. Oh, my God. MAGA GOP view of Trump. Can I hear how he says it?

1:02:38Or would it be a problem? I'm talking. It's someone else talking. Oh, OK. That seems bonkers. It seems bonkers. Approve 100%. How many people did you ask? Two. Two guys with MAGA hats on in the party. If you notice the way they say this, right? So they don't just say GOP voters. They say MAGA GOP voters. And so what they're doing here is that they're filtering who they consider to be MAGA and And who they consider to be MAGA are the people who still say they support Donald Trump. But 100 % of the people who don't support this war stopped supporting Donald Trump over it. Right, but look at this little thing on the bottom they don't show you.

1:03:1666%, 31 % split among non-MAGA. Right. Is that non-MAGA Republicans? Is that what you're saying? No, I think that's non-MAGA Americans, I believe. The whole MAGA thing is like, we're so fractioned as it is. Yeah. Like this whole idea of right versus left as it is, and now you've got a MAGA section of the right? It's all just ridiculous, dude. But it's a way to describe it as anything other than what it is, which is the most unpopular war in American history going into it. And for good reason. Look, dude, he didn't even bother to like sell us on a propaganda campaign about it. It was like the laziest, like just lie, just lie us into it.

1:03:54Let's put on a fucking firm tinfoil hat right now. Let's let's get a double layer Reynolds wrap fucking crease the edges fold it down Why would he want to do this? Why would he want to look? I am not denying that the regime of Iran is a giant problem I'm certainly not denying that if I was Israel, I would not want them there. They hate you They're trying to get a nuclear weapon. They're right there. You're I get the Israel position. I totally understand how they're so just vehemently in defense of their homeland. Like, they're surrounded by people that hate them. They're the one Jewish country.

1:04:36Everyone else is a Muslim. They all want a caliphate. They all want to kill them. It's been going on forever. They think it's in God's word that they have it. It's a lot of craziness. I get it.

1:04:50Why now? Like, why now? Like, what does that make any sense? Well, Trump himself has said, which literally this would be like considered an anti-Semitic conspiracy theory if anyone else had said it. But Donald Trump has openly talked about many times how the Adelson's give him all this money and they come by every day and all they have is another demand on behalf of Israel. Donald Trump also very early in his political career got in trouble with the Israel lobby and then immediately pivoted to blaming – to winning their favor back over by saying he would tear up the JCPOA, the Iran deal that Obama got us into.

1:05:32And it looks to me, you know, there's speculation aside, who knows exactly what control they have over the guy. But it looks to me that after Venezuela and when there were these big street protests and riots against the regime and around there, that they convinced Trump – and this is what Joe Kent, his director of counterterrorism, has said too – that they essentially convinced him that this would be the time. You could do it swiftly, surgically remove the regime, and the people would rise up and overthrow it. And this is what Donald Trump said when he launched this war. He said, this is a regime change and I'm calling on the great people of Iran to rise up.

1:06:14And they did. They rose up by at least the hundreds of thousands they were out in Tehran in defense of the regime chanting death to America. Because it turns out when you kill 165 little girls, that doesn't make a country go, we love you. Thank you for that. Before the bombing, there were people in the streets that were protesting. Yes. And people were killed because of that. A lot. That's the other thing is that that regime is like they they clamp down and they do it with public figures They killed a very prominent wrestler from Iran. Yeah, really two of them They killed one a few years back the UFC tried to step in and somehow other stop it But he was also one that was accused of protesting well Listen, I don't know about this most recent one.

1:07:01I'm not saying this is true at all I don't trust any governments, but he was they claimed he killed a few cops That's what the the Iranian regime said he was being hung for now. I don't know Yeah, the wrestler he was I didn't he was convicted of that whatever that means in a in a mullah run You know, so I'm not saying that's right at all, but I will say this right The Donald Trump when he when he launched this war and there's been a whole lot of just false claims that have been made But he said specifically that they killed 32 ,000 protesters there has not been a shred of evidence presented to back up this claim now I'm not saying it's not true I'm not putting it past this government that they would do that and they've acknowledged that a lot of people have died I think they I think the last I had seen was that I know they were saying the the government of Iran is before the Ayatollah was killed they were saying it was something like 3 ,000 people had died and then the CIA but when you say died doesn't mean they killed the well That's unclear.

1:08:05That's good. That's not what they are claiming But then the CIA at least there was a piece in the Washington Excuse me in the Wall Street Journal where they had said and this was like a week and a half into it that they estimated like six And a half thousand or something like that, but this is a huge question right and it's not clear at all Like were they lining people up and just executing them for the crime of protesting? They hung the wrestler But I'm saying the people who have been killed here. Iran protest death toll could top 30 ,000 according to local health officials. And this is from Time Magazine.

1:08:38As many as 30 ,000 people could have been killed in the streets of Iran on January 8th and 9th alone. Two senior officials of the country's Ministry of Health told Time, indicating a dramatic surge in the death toll. So many people were slaughtered by Iranian security services that Thursday and Friday it overwhelmed the state's capacity to dispose of the dead. Stocks of body bags were exhausted, the official said, and 18-wheel semi-trailers replaced ambulances. Now, listen, all I'm saying here, man, is that you've got to be—I've just seen this movie play out a lot of times. You've got to be really careful about these accusations that are made in the run-up to a war.

1:09:15They're basically saying we have a source who told us this. What year was this? I mean, excuse me, what date was this? January 25th. So the protest started in late December and then in January. Time was unable to independently verify these figures. That's right. Listen, the claim being made here, right, is that, look, in this point, they said in two days, in two days, 30 ,000 people were killed. If that is true, that is up there with one of the biggest massacres in human history. The biggest massacres during World War II were like around that. It says, as of Saturday, U.S.-based human rights activist news agency had confirmed 5 ,459 deaths and is investigating 17 ,000 more.

1:09:58Yes. So that's at least close. So we're in the neighborhood. We're in the 20s just if what they're investigating turns out to be accurate. If that's if that's the case. But we're talking also here, Joe, about like any defunded U.S.-based NGOs who are really around hawks, you know, point. And so and I'm just saying, like, look, the the claim the claim here is that around, you know, I saw a bunch of the Zionists online when this was first coming out back in January. They were like, oh, my God, they've already killed half as many people as died in Gaza in just a couple of days. And you're like, right, that's a pretty that's a hell of a claim.

1:10:34Right. I mean, like if you just from following wars all these years, if you started carpet bombing Tehran, Vietnam style, carpet bombing Tehran after two days, that's the type of death toll you'd be looking at. Well, the thing is, we don't they don't have Internet access. Well, they shut down the Internet during that period. But there were pictures that came out. All I'm saying is that if you had numbers like that, you would expect there to be some evidence that you could point to. And there's like one picture where they've pointed to like a couple dozen body bags and been like, see, look at this.

1:11:05But look, maybe it's true. Maybe it's not. I'm very skeptical of these claims when they're made right before we launch a war. But I think the other point is that at least according – and there has been some evidence of this, right? There were police stations that were burned. There were mosques that were attacked. These were not just peaceful protests. I'm not saying they don't have a right to violently rise up and overthrow their government, whatever. But all the hawks in the West were saying these people are trying to overthrow their government. Not only that, in the past, our agencies, our intelligence agencies have engaged in nefarious practices where we have conscripted certain people to go and light things on fire and blow things up and create these events to accelerate.

1:11:52Front page of the Jerusalem Post, they were bragging that there was Mossad within the protests. Um, so now look I don't know but also the thing is this right if you are trying to overthrow a government A government will kill you for doing that and that's true about every government including our own including our own if if armed Protesters went to try to overthrow Barack Obama's government. He would kill those people if they were actually a threat to Ashley Babbitt was murdered not January 6th and every single left-winger in the country went well, that's okay It was an insurrection. And by the way, every single right winger in this country, when this pretty guy got killed, were like, well, he was interfering.

1:12:32Oh, I saw it. But by the way, the pretty thing was the most textbook example of a bad shooting. There's just no defending it. They had disarmed the guy. He's down. There's six of them. They panic. They put six bullets in. Do you know what happened, though? Do you know the whole story of the gun? The gun being removed? Yeah. Do you know the whole story about the gun? No. Okay. The gun is a Sig P320. Right. A SIG P320 is notorious for accidental discharges. There is a video of the cop removing the gun, walking off, and the gun goes off. And is that his gun for sure? Because I thought that hadn't been determined, whether or not.

1:13:08I heard people speculating about that. I've watched the video multiple times, and I've watched other people's analysis of it. Obviously, I'm no expert, but I do know something about guns. And that gun in particular has been demonstrated online that it will go off. There's a cop inside of a precinct. He bends over not touching his gun gun in the holster and it goes off There's a guy there's a video of a guy on a range and an axe the gun just goes off and he goes Whose fucking gun was that and the range master goes is that a sig and he goes yeah He goes get that fucking gun off of my range Wow because it's a p3 So I should be real clear sig makes a bunch of guns that are awesome like the p365 is like one of the best carry guns in the world There's a lot of guns they make that don't have this issue But that particular gun that pretty had with one in the chamber is fucking knuckleheads walk No, that's one in the chamber absolutely it's and and all for I'm just saying the only point I'm making is that it's clearly it was a fuck-up I'm not saying like they wanted to execute the guy I'm just saying like they had the gun taken from them.

1:14:12They didn't communicate that to each other They freaked out. But literally all it took was seeing one video 11 days earlier where he kicked the back of a cop car. Right. And for every right winger to go. Yeah, whatever, dude. Got what you deserve. So my all my point is about this, looking at this in the Iranian regime, it's just not clear. Like, what are you actually accusing them of? Are you saying that somebody was trying to overthrow the government and the government mowed them down? Are you saying that they lined up protesters and shot them all in the back of the head simply for voicing their opinion?

1:14:43Like none of this is made clear, but when the war drums are beating, no one even cares to like ask these questions. It's just like, yeah, they killed their own people. And then if you notice with this war, much like with Venezuela and almost like with all of them, they just keep giving you like they throw like 15 justifications at it. You know, and you're like, which one is the reason we're fighting this? Because I saw that all of them like to play the humanitarian card and go, we're doing this, you know, for these oppressed people. We want them to rise up. They've been living under this brutal regime.

1:15:12And you're like, OK, two things like number one, that is simply just not how you US foreign policy works. We don't fight wars on humanitarian grounds. You know what I mean? Like we're partners with some of the most brutal authoritarians in the world. And we've and in the case of like Israel, we've been funding their destruction of Gaza for the last two and a half years. And so like that's not really what's motivating this here. And then number two, Donald Trump, even just the other day, said he'll be partners with the new Ayatollah and run the Strait of Hormuz together. He's backed off. Did he say that?

1:15:46Yeah. He's backed off of regime change. Bro, hold on. Are they even talking to him? Is someone talking to him? Like, who is he talking to? Do they know who they're talking to? Because it's not like they're meeting in person. Donald Trump said. Some guy's on the phone. I am free to negotiate. Dude, he said Donald Trump himself said the other day that um That he goes negotiate we're negotiating negotiations are going great and they go who are you negotiating with and he goes a person We believe to be in charge and Then they said so is this the new supreme leader and he said no no no one's heard from that guy We don't know where he is some hacker in his basement in Belarus It's not He's talking with an Iranian accent and he's got them convinced.

1:16:32Well, it's just - I have the authority to negotiate. Let's be partners. Let's be fair. Wire one million Bitcoin to this address. Well, everything I'm seeing publicly reported today is that Iran is like, no, we're not in these negotiations. We've made our terms clear and their terms, what they're asking for is something that Donald Trump is not going to be able to give them. What's that? Their demands were that we stop attacking immediately, like that part they might get, that we pay them restitution for all the damage so far. Boy, that's a lot of money. Essentially that we leave the region. I mean, they had a few other things there that were just like— And they want them to open up a Terry Black's in Tehran.

1:17:24And a Buc-ee's. This one was really important to us. If we could just get one— One Terry Black's barbecue. We don't have a good barbecue here. It doesn't seem like if he's not really negotiating with this guy, if that's not true, and he's just like putting this out there in the public as like a negotiation ploy, what a clusterfuck. Because you're dealing with people that don't mind dying. They believe, I mean, these are very religious people. They're fanatical. They believe they're going to go to heaven. They believe they're martyrs. And they're fighting for Allah. This is the just and holy war.

1:18:02And they've been attacked. Well, that's right. And they've been preparing for this for a long time. You know, people make a lot out of the chants that the Iranians, you know, they chant death to America. What do you got there, Jimmy? Sorry.

1:18:19And who is in control of it? Will Iran still be able to control the flow of oil? Be jointly controlled. By whom? Maybe me. Maybe me. Me and the Ayatollah, whoever the Ayatollah is, whoever the next Ayatollah. Look, and there'll also be a form of a very serious form of a regime change. Now, in all fairness, everybody's been killed from the regime. There's automatically a regime change. But we're dealing with some people that I find to be very reasonable, very solid. The people within know who they are. They're very respected. And maybe one of them will be exactly what we're looking for. Look at Venezuela, how well that's working out.

1:19:05I mean, dude, this is such a fucking mess. This is such a mess, dude. I mean, this is just too ridiculous, dude. And the, you know, the thing is that a lot of people, you know, I've spent a long time at this point being against this war. Because this war has been telegraphed since, you know, the Bush administration wanted to do this shit. And at least for like 15 years, I've been publicly opposing this war. And one of the reasons why so many of us oppose this, and it's a shitty way to be vindicated, but is that, look, Iran is just not like any of the other opponents in the global war on terrorism.

1:19:43It's a different beast entirely. And you've seen this already only three weeks in. We never dealt with any of this with any of the other countries. You know what I mean? We had what the Pentagon calls escalation dominance in all of those other wars, which is all essentially like it's just like meaning like if you do this, we do this. If you do like we're prepared for everything. It's kind of like escalation dominance is a lot like you're like in jujitsu where you see really high level guys who basically put you in a position where you can make one of two choices in either way. You know, like, OK, you can you can give me your back and I'll choke you or you can push off me and I'll arm bar you.

1:20:17And, you know, like whatever option you have, I'm going to get you. We don't have that with Iran. And Pentagon's been open about this since at least 2007. And the fact is that, as we're already seeing, they can target ships in the Strait of Hormuz. They can target our assets, our bases, our embassies in the region. They can target our allies. And this is a big problem. And so, like, it seems like Donald Trump got into this thinking it would be like Venezuela. It would be quick and bloodless and easy and he could claim victory. now that it's not gone that way it seems like he's kind of scrambling for what the what the off-ramp is here yeah now at least i give donald trump as angry as i am with him um like at least it is true that he's looking for an off-ramp it seems like and he did this with the 12-day war right like he he started the war he saw an off-ramp and he and he took off he took it the The problem here really is that this war changed the calculation from the Iranian perspective.

1:21:17And that much is clear so far. You know, the after 9-11. All the countries in the Middle East and North Africa, all the ones where essentially they all waved the white flag, all of them. Saddam Hussein welcomed U.N. inspectors in. He was trying to do anything he could to not meet the fate that he ultimately met. Gaddafi denuclearized, got rid of chemical weapons. Bashar al-Assad got rid of all his chemical weapons. Like they were all just like, we don't want it with you, you know. And Iran was very much the same way. They got into the JCPOA. They allowed an inspections regime in to come look at their nuclear facilities, all of that.

1:21:52And even up to the 12-day war, when we dropped the bunker buster, as in Israel bombed a whole bunch of regime targets, they still, in their response, called ahead, made sure there'd be no U.S. troops there. They hit the side of a little base there. And then they kind of went like they gave Trump an off ramp because they didn't want it. You know, they didn't want it. They don't want to die like Muammar Gaddafi. They don't want to, you know, have their country destroyed. So for self-preservation reasons, they showed restraint. The calculation this time, clearly already from the Iranians, was that we can't do that again.

1:22:28We have to give you a bloody nose and a black eye. We have to make this cost as much as possible for you. Otherwise, you guys will just be back here in another five months doing it again. And they're probably right about that. They're probably right. And so now we're in this situation where we're already in a quagmire. It's already like over a dozen Americans have died. I think a couple hundred wounded at this point. Israel isn't given real numbers on what's going on there. But there's some pretty substantial damage and definitely some Israelis have died. And I'm sure thousands of Iranians have died at this point.

1:23:04It's cost. I mean, Pete Heggs has just asked for 200 billion dollars. I don't know if it'll get up to cost him that much. But this thing is certainly already in the tens of billions. If you consider munition, military movements and then just the damage to embassies and bases and stuff like that. I mean this thing is already a disaster and so now it's not like Venezuela where Donald Trump could just stop and declare victory and even say like look how great it's working out. Now is Venezuela really working out that great? I don't know. That's kind of – you know we took one guy away. The regime is still in place.

1:23:36The people haven't been liberated but whatever. He can claim that. This now – the problem here is that okay number one, Donald Trump is not really in a situation where if he just quit right now, How is he really gonna say look how wonderful this is? It's like I don't know dude this cost a lot already And it doesn't seem like there's any clear like what did we get out of this? Well, the only way it would work is if there was some sort of a deal with whoever the fuck is gonna be the new guy in charge And they did come to some sort of an agreement and they did give them some compensation for all the shit We blew up.

1:24:10Yes. Well that right. So they'll just print some more money for that sure and inflation But look, here's the thing is that it's not just Donald Trump. There's two other participants in this war, two other entities in this war. There is Iran and there's Israel. OK, now is Iran going to accept that? Maybe. But look, just like the 12 day war, look at the position you're in now. We're relying on the mollus. You know what I mean? Like it's that that is not an ideal situation to be in. And then the other factor is that there's Israel who also gets a say in this for some reason because we allow them to and the Netanyahu just the other day was very clear about this This is a regime change and he even said it will require ground forces And he said he's not sure who those ground forces will be And so now this happened if you do you remember the moment during the 12-day war when it was the closest Trump ever came to like flipping out on Israel and he said they don't know what the fuck they're doing But he said Israel and Iran don't know what the fuck they're doing because Donald Trump.

1:25:13So after he drops the bunker busters, he goes, that's it. We're you know what I mean? We're taking the off ramp. And then he said, I want to work out a ceasefire now. And then after he said that, Israel just started lighting up regime targets, just bombing the crap out of them. And they weren't bombing nuclear facilities. They were just bombing like government buildings. And they've been doing a bunch of that in this war as well bombing local police departments things like that just creating chaos because what they want is What they've been getting in the rest of the war on terrorism there they they are quite happy with a Libya model or a Syria model They don't want anyone that's organized as a threat to Israel.

1:25:54They don't it's it's all about around support for Hezbollah Yeah, is that they want southern Lebanon which they just cats their defense minister just announced that they're gonna occupy Yeah, that's crazy, right? They just announced they're going to be occupying another country. That's what it's about, man. And look, I mean, it's not, again, this isn't like a conspiracy theory. The guys all tell you this in their own words. Benjamin Netanyahu was asked point blank a few months back what he thought of the greater Israel project. And he said, it's very near and dear to my heart. Like, this is the point of denying the Palestinians a state for all these years.

1:26:27You can't let the Palestinians have a state because then how are you going to take that all over someday? That's all supposed to be part of Israel. And the U.S. ambassador, the U.S. ambassador, not the Israeli ambassador, the U.S. ambassador to Israel is on record saying that God promised Iraq to Benjamin Netanyahu. That God promised Lebanon and Saudi Arabia and the West Bank and parts of Syria and all of this is greater Israel. By the way, Sam Harris, where are you out on that? Where are the new atheists when you could finally use them for something? Hey, that's pretty crazy. Is that how we do politics?

1:27:07We work on this ridiculous religious superstition that somehow when God said Israel in Genesis, he was referring to the state that was created that they named after that passage. This would literally be on the level, Joe, is if I named my son Jesus Christ and then I told you, you have to worship my son. Look, it's right there in your Bible. Exactly. No, you named it after that, dude. That doesn't count. That's crazy. And they took the spot where it was. Yeah. I mean, like. They took over and they did it in a horrific way, like the napka. Yeah. Yeah. You listen to some of those soldiers, the translation of some of those soldiers talking about what they did and even laughing about what they did.

1:27:46Some of them even smiling. In 1948. Yeah, because it's not it wasn't an 1848 right you know what I mean like these guys were alive Maybe not so many of them now, but like 20 30 years ago You could put a video camera in front of one of these guys and ask him to tell their story right and 78 years ago Wasn't that long ago? Yeah, that's right. Yeah, that's right. And so you know look I mean the idea here that America after just 25 years of catastrophic failures, launching wars of choice, wars of aggression, lying the American people into it, just slaughtering millions of people and like bankrupting this country and really severely degrading the country with these wars.

1:28:26The idea that we would jump into another war of choice for Israel is just too, like, this is too crazy, man. And especially when it's the administration that that really ran on and promised that we want to get out of this out of this game of fighting stupid wars in the Middle East that was what we were all supporting yeah that was the one thing that he was saying that was so promising to so many people that were independent that were on the fence like this guy wants no wars all right oh he wants closing the border which predator Badlands now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney Plus Here, you're not the predator You're the prey Prey, prey, prey, prey, prey, prey, prey Critics are saying it's epic Stunning And breathtaking Many have come here None have survived Predator Badlands Now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney Plus Rated PG-13 I think it's a great idea, he wants no wars That enough, let's go Well, especially considering the fact that, well, like, even if there are some things about Donald Trump that maybe you don't like, but the other guys are saying we want to keep fighting forever wars, and this guy is saying we should stop doing that, that's enough to go, well, then he's better than you on net.

1:29:53And don't get me wrong. I mean, I endorse Donald Trump in 24. You know, people give me shit for this. Some people like that. Some people give me shit for it. But I do – I kind of view it like this. And I really – I will say – maybe I'm a little biased here because I love you. But I don't think I'm being biased. I really think you played an enormous role in kind of like standing up to the progressive democratic establishment and their narrative over the last decade or so. And it's really hard to kind of overstate how crazy they were, how much of a threat to this country they were. And for anybody who wants to give shit to anyone who voted for Donald Trump, it's like, hey, man, the alternative was the party who bragged about, first off, insane woke shit, like poisoning the minds of children in a really grotesque and abusive way.

1:30:47They gave us open borders, flooding the country with people. They gave us all types of covid tyranny based on pseudoscience. They gave us the most reckless foreign policy in American history, which was this proxy war on Russia's border. And they were running. They were pretending the president wasn't senile when he clearly was. Then they in the fourth quarter threw up a cackling retard who was not democratically picked in any process. And so, sorry, like it it does make sense that a lot of people went, OK, we're going to go back with with this other guy. Yeah. Also, there was an interesting dynamic happening in 24 where, OK, this wasn't, you know, Donald Trump.

1:31:27They had actually tried to throw him in jail, maybe even tried to murder him. We never really got any answers on that one. He now had Bobby Kennedy with him. He now had Tulsi Gabbard with him. He now had, you know what I mean? even J.D. Vance, like a lot of these people who were supposedly much more non-interventionist. There was reason to hope that maybe it wouldn't end up here. But anyway, I guess my thing is that you played such a huge role in this. And I, to a lesser extent, played a role in standing up against a lot of that progressive insanity over the last 10 years. And I just feel like after 24, you know, this coalition came together where Donald Trump for the first time ever wins the popular vote wins every single swing state and really more remarkably won the youth and the culture like donald trump went from being like the cultural pariah to being the guy like john jones is doing the the dance at the front and it was just it was and that whole coalition has been destroyed over this war and now he's going to hand the country right back over to these democrats who we've been fighting so hard all for what all for a war that netanyahu wanted against a country that Dude, by the way, the justification for the 12-day war was bullshit.

1:32:35They weren't trying to make nuclear weapons. They were trying to negotiate. At least they got out of that unscathed relatively. Well, that's right. But then all the – and I want to – you know, he said some nice things about me when he was on here the other day with you. So I will say some nice things about Constantin Kassin who – despite our disagreements, I really like that guy a lot. But he is – I could be wrong. I could be missing someone. He's the only guy I've seen who supported the 12-day war but is really skeptical about this. And I've seen so many people. It's unbelievable, dude. Like they just – so like the 12-day war comes.

1:33:07For the first 48 hours of it, they're like, dude, Israel's doing this on its own. All they want is for you to stay out of it. Then like the third day, they're like, all right, they do need some help shooting down the missiles that are coming back toward them. But whatever. This is just defensive. You know what I mean? Like you don't have to get involved. Then it's like the next day like alright, we don't we don't have bunker busters So we do need you to drop the bunker busters, but then their hold Like defense of the 12-day war was like look no Americans died. It didn't cost us a lot It didn't turn into this disaster and now We're at the okay.

1:33:39Well fine all of that happened, but it's still a good thing Constantine was the one guy I saw who was like no I supported that one But I am not getting on board with this one He's and I give him a lot of credit for that. I give him a lot of credit for that. I like that guy a lot I like him a lot. I like Francis a lot too. I do do their show Trigonometry is one of the best shows agree with them or not agree with them. They're always reasonable They're never ideologically driven They have opinions that you may or may not agree with but they're real clear about their opinions and why they believe what they believe Yeah, that's right.

1:34:09And I will say they're great guys. Yeah genuinely great dudes. Great guys. I really liked You know I get in a lot of Like the shit show like arguments. I find myself in them I probably should be better than them and just not engage, but I'm not and I'm petty. What do you mean by shit show? Like where it just becomes like an insult thing or, you know, I debated Alex Barron. It's kind of embarrassing in hindsight, but like, I don't know, it gets me really angry when the guy's calling me a Holocaust denier or something like that. I think that's crazy. What he was saying was kind of silly. The way he was saying it was silly and he was just trying to play gotcha with you and then you called him a faggot.

1:34:43Yeah, that's not my finest moment. You could tell he was really shaken by that. Well, it's just. I don't think he expected that. I kind of have a thing where like look I'm really into this shit and I nerd out on it And I'm obsessed with all of this for whatever reason it's just like my calling in life But I'm also stand-up comic at heart, you know, and so like as soon as someone goes like oh I want to be vicious you're like oh you want to be vicious cuz like I'm pretty good at being vicious So like I could do that and you're probably not used to hearing this type of vicious shit that like comics say to each other But one of the things that I really appreciated about Francis and Constantine was when I went to do their show It was just like it was genuinely a good faith conversation They weren't trying they weren't trying to like win the point or get a clip that they could go We destroyed Dave and then once they do that.

1:35:30I'm like, okay Well, then I'm not trying to do that either man. Like let's talk about this shit. That's that's always what I'd rather do yeah, um but The thing that's I guess the thing that's really interesting about this moment is that because the kind of corporate media propaganda apparatus has been completely destroyed and because the internet and social media and podcasts are where people go now for for you know conversations and debates and news and all this stuff they're kind of like they're like they're running without a propaganda apparatus you know like israel just israel in the last two and a half years is down like 50 points in the polls like in terms of American approval.

1:36:12They've just been, it's a drastic change like I've never seen on any issue over the last few years. Well, it's the first time in our lifetimes where it's been an issue that we are dealing with the consequences of the relationship. That's right. There's never been a time in the past where people were completely aware of, oh, there's no other reason why we'd be going into Iran. Like most people don't think it wasn't for Israel asking us to, Netanyahu's consistent visits to the White House. Oh, you can't even pretend otherwise. I mean, people can. But people do. Yes, well, they try to. Coleman Hughes just got in a debate with Glenn Greenwald about it.

1:36:48I saw that they did it. I have not had a chance to watch it. Somebody sent it to me, and it was, you know, I'm being a good boy when it comes to social media. It's been so good for my brain. Yeah. It's kind of remarkable. Just staying off, you mean. Yeah. My new phone, I'm not going to put anything on it. I'm going to have my old phone and leave it at home. and I'm not going to be able to look at it. So when I have to post things, I've got to post it on my other phone that's not going to be with me. I'm not doing that anymore. Because I just think eventually, ultimately, it rots your brain. But you do get some cool debates and some insight into what's going on, and I don't know what Coleman's argument was, but Glenn and Coleman were arguing about Israel's influence on this.

1:37:32Well, I'll be very interested to watch that. I do respect Coleman despite disagreeing with him very adamantly very smart guy very smart guy no question a very nice guy And uh, um and and look I one of the things I really respect about him is when I did his show He literally starts it by going he goes You know almost all these debates I see you in like you're kind of debating issues and then people just debate your character and he goes I'm not doing that at all I want to talk about the issues the whole time and I just genuinely appreciate that No, agree with him or disagree with him. He's a super reasonable guy and a very nice guy.

1:38:04I like him a lot. I like him a lot. Whether I agree with him or disagree with him, he's a wonderful person. I this agreed this this is what I will say about his position on this which I think is is kind of interesting so number one when I was on Pierce Morgan with him right after Venezuela happened and he was his position I don't want to mischaracterize it but I think this is pretty accurate was he was like look a lot of people are comparing Venezuela to Iraq or Libya or Syria but like that is a different region a different culture a different religion and so really what we should be comparing this to is other interventions in in Latin America and South America and I you know I didn't completely agree with that I was like actually I think there are some lessons you could learn from other Wars that we've been in that might apply here, but I was like okay fair enough Hey, let's look at other interventions in Central and South America because we've got a long list of really disastrous ones Like if you want to look at Guatemala or Nicaragua or you know Cuba Mexico a whole bunch But then when this war in Iran starts, I don't see him going the equal opposite of that, going, hey, now that we're at war with Iran, we have to judge this by Iraq and Afghanistan and Libya and Syria.

1:39:21Because, you know what I'm saying? Like, that would be the flip side to the other position. And so I don't see that. The other thing is that when he's arguing with me about – because I was arguing that the Israel lobby and the Israeli government were a huge part of why we fought the war in Iraq. And his big point that he stuck to – a lot of the hawks stick to this – is that Ariel Sharon was actually – who was the sitting prime minister at the time. He was actually against the war in Iraq. Now, that's not exactly true. He wanted George W. Bush to invade Iran first, not Iraq. And then when he got assurances that Iran would be next, he got on board.

1:39:59You could go look at Sharon's speech. He gave a speech, I think it was in August of 2002, to the Knesset. And it's all about how Iraq is the biggest threat. They have weapons of mass destruction. The Mossad was cranking out all types of BS intelligence about the nuclear weapons that he could detonate in 15 minutes or whatever. It was all nonsense. But if you're going to say that that is evidence that Israel was not pushing us into this because the sitting prime minister at the time didn't like this war. OK, but again, then how does the current sitting prime minister of Israel feel about this war in Iran?

1:40:32Because he's fighting it with us. And he said after it started that this is the culmination of his entire life's work. He has been trying to lie our government into this war for my entire lifetime. Coming here he testified how many times do you remember the one where he testified with the cartoon of a bomb? At the UN. Yeah, yeah. A bomb cartoon with percentages of the enriched uranium. And like a Daffy Duck bomb. Not like the bomb that will blow your beak around to the other. A bowling ball with a fuse. And it was he was already up real high. He was already up real high. No, dude, he was on record saying that Iran was three to five years away from getting a nuclear weapon in the 90s.

1:41:10In the 90s, yeah. I mean, it's just he's just been lying through his teeth. And there is something look man, there's something really profoundly dishonorable About trying to lie another country into war like not even trying to sell the war to your own people and have your own Military do it but because you care it is yeah there we were up to 90 percent first stage No, it was first stage. We're at he was saying there. They've hit the first stage. Oh Excuse me. Okay. Yeah, you're right. I guess this is we can't we can't go It's just so ridiculous and he knows he knows he's lying He's like your friend that like you've been friends with since high school and every time you go out he gets you in a fight Yeah, like dude don't do this like those guys over there are fucking problem Let's go over there and fuck them up and like you know all your buddies like dude Did I use that exact analogy when I debated Josh Hammer at Princeton University?

1:42:07And or maybe it was with the Charlie Kirk. It was one of the times I debated him But I use that exact analogy. He was like, is Israel an ally? And I was like, no. It's like, they're not a good friend. If your friend's getting you in a bar fight every night, stop hanging out with that guy. Bro, Tim Dillon did an ad for NeuroGum and Neuromintz on his podcast where he's like, I have a friend. Let's just call her Erica. And he does this Erica Kirk ad. He doesn't say it's Erica Kirk for NeuroGum. Have you heard of Jamie? I think so. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. It's so funny. Oh, my God. It's so crazy. He's so out of his...

1:42:47I fucking love him so much. I'm so happy Tim Dillon's in the world. He is the... He's the best. If you're not listening to his podcast and you want a rational but hilarious take on all the fucking madness that's going on with not just this war, but the Epstein Files. His episode, The Epstein Files, I hardly ever tweet about other people's podcasts. But I hardly ever tweet. But I posted it. I'm like, this is one of the best podcasts about anything ever. His ability, Tim's ability to like rant. Unprecedented. Like a hilarious rant that is laced with excellent points, but it's just hilarious the whole time.

1:43:25And just him going off is second to none. And he's sober. He just puts on his magic glasses. It's him and Fuentes are the top two. But he buries Fuentes. Fuentes is really good. Fuentes has very, he's funny sometimes. Do something different that anybody else can do. Yeah. Well, his ability to blend sarcasm and just celebration of chaos. Yeah, it's second to none. Best ranter that's ever walked the face of the planet. I remember when I first met Tim in New York before he moved out to L.A. after that. But when I first met him in New York, and he was, I think, like he was a green stand-up. I think he hadn't been doing it for that long.

1:44:06But I remember just like being on podcasts with him and just being like yo this dude is going to be a fucking superstar Like it was just like his his ranting like a bill like he would go off on things where you just find yourself like Like you almost have a moment you forget you're on the show with him Yeah, you're like I'm just sitting here watching that and then I'm like oh shit. I'm here, too I better say something but like he's just Listen to this ad. I don't even know if I should tell this, but it does show how effective Neuromint can be. A friend of mine, let's call her Erica.

1:44:47She's had a wildlife, this woman. She was in Romania. She had an orphanage. She was on a reality show. She married this famous guy. She was an intelligence asset. And I said to her, how do you do this? And she says, Tim, it's Neuro's energy and focus mints. And I said, but how do you do it after the guy, the husband and father of the kids gets murdered and you're out there doing all kinds of stuff? You're doing fundraisers and you're dancing around with glitter pants? How does this happen? She goes, I could lie to you, but I'm telling you it's Neuro's energy and focus mints. I said, really? She goes, sure.

1:45:32I said, how are you running this organization seven hours after this guy got popped? She goes, a lot of people speculate, but it's Neuro's energy and focus mints. I go, really? She said, yeah, Neuro Energy and Focus is powered by natural green tea, caffeine, L-phenanine for calm, focus, and vitamin B12 and B6. I mean, whatever they're paying him, they should pay him more. Yeah, it's not enough. No one can pay him enough. He's the GOAT. Well, that'll also just make you remember that product forever. Yeah. No, he's the greatest of all time. I'm trying to figure out how to turn our racetrack sign on all the way.

1:46:14Is it broken? God damn, we need a new one? I'll get a hold of Bobby. He's the GOAT, dude. I had someone in the White House come up to me and go, Is Tim Dillon really gay? I go yeah, he's really gay like you think you would fake that yeah, it was how long have you known him? I go I've known forever. He's really gay Yeah, well he will he's a he's a real good undercover But every now and then you see it come out every now and then you see like a like I remember and this back when he was young and And he was broke at the time But Tim was always kind of a snob even when he was like it was always kind of and I went uh I forget what it was, but I was like I was like oh we could get food from this restaurant and he goes from there go yeah they got good food and he goes you think that's good food and like because he's like a real like foodie or whatever right and there was just like oh i saw it for a second there he used to have money because he had money when he was selling he had money in finance then he decided to be mortgages and yeah he was a part of the housing crisis that's right and he was doing cocaine back then he he did topple the u.s economy for a while he was part of it but then he got into comedy he more than made up for it he's more than made up for that this is where he belongs yeah he belongs in front of that screen with the glasses on, just going on these insane rants.

1:47:28Oh, yeah. He's so funny, man. His Epstein-Files take was fucking genius. That was great. Dude, his thing about Sam Harris having a meditation app and also supporting genocide is the most hilarious thing ever. Like, what human being does both of those? Such a great take on that. Oh, he's so funny, man. Yeah, we're lucky, dude. We're we're we're we're part of a really cool group of people right now you know, it's a very unusual time that the Mainstream has lost all of its power of influence on people. It still puts out information. It still puts out shows but They're trying to look like you but they're funked That Jake Tapper thing was so crazy.

1:48:13I was like, what are you doing? Are you doing a podcast now? Like what are you doing? It's oh, it's such a perfect like little microcosm though of like it's almost painful Like, I'm like, guys, just can you hire me? I mean, like, I would explain this to you. No, it wouldn't work either. Because they're so trained. It's like if you get a dog and that dog has been maybe a cat might be a better example. If you never had a litter box in the house and the cat's been pissing all over the carpet, you are always going to have that cat piss on the carpet. That's what that cat does. You're not going to fix him.

1:48:47If your entire life you've been spitting out nonsense from a teleprompter and now all of a sudden you have to be yourself, you've been functioning in a world of executives and producers where everybody goes over every little thing you say and do. You 100 % read things you know aren't true or at least partially aren't true. They added mics for like everything. Oh, yeah, yeah. Their whole setup is they're all trying to look like podcasters. No. Wait a minute. They put mics out like podcasters. That's crazy. Imagine if they think that's all it takes. Well, this is but but Joe talk about completely missing the point, right?

1:49:23It's just Fundamentally missing it is that they go they actually go okay So all of these people have left, you know watching cable news and in droves And now they a lot of people listen to podcasts they'll listen to you or Theo Vaughn or whoever it might be and the a huge reason right why people a huge reason why you've been number one for so long now is because however anyone feels about you you're authentic and it's very hard to deny that you know one of the biggest questions i get when people like meet me if i do like meet and greet after shows or something it's it's what's joe rogan like is a question i get all the time because we're buddies and i've been on the show a lot a lot of times and you know people are love you and they'll go what's joe rogan like i always tell the same thing.

1:50:07I go, you already know. You already know who he is. He's that guy. And then offstage, he's that guy. You know what I mean? That's who he is. And people like that. People like that. Whatever you think about Theo Vaughn, he's authentic. He's being himself. That's who he is. Well, that's how it works. And because you guys in the corporate media are all professional liars and have lied to the American people about the last 17 crises, they don't trust you anymore. And so then their reaction to that is you go, well, what if we pretended to be podcasters? You're like, no, you dummy. That's the whole thing.

1:50:42This is just proving further how inauthentic you are. Do they have fucking meetings on this? 100%. We act like podcasters? 100 % they do. Dude, they all, this was to me, despite the fact that I, you know, and people give me shit about voting for Donald Trump and they could say I should have known better and whatever. I was a huge critic of him in his first term and I'm a huge critic of him in his second term. But the best thing about Donald Trump winning in 24 and I did predict this right I'm not always the best with predictions. I'm pretty good on issues. I think but I'm not great at predictions They're tough, but the best thing about Donald Trump winning was that the corporate media finally admitted it They were they had been pretending for so long I remember we used to joke about I remember coming on like a few years ago and we would joke about how Brian Stelter Would always whenever he talked about you he would always kind of go like the fringe Joe Rogan Like as if he's the mainstream and you're the fringe.

1:51:35As if the numbers aren't readily available to all of us, that we could be like, your show has like 200 ,000 listening and his has 20 million. So how is he the fringe and you're the mainstream? I think they thought that, though. Well, maybe they believed it. But that 24, the election, that's when they all admitted it. And then the talking point moved to we need to find our own Joe Rogan. The Democrats need to find a Joe Rogan or whatever. Remember that was like this so they kind of admitted that oh the podcasts have become the new mainstream and we are the fringe Right, but the dumb part of that statement was you already had me fucking idiots just lost your mind I'm not right and I'm not left Yeah, I think both of them suck and I think the adherence to the Ideologies that the left supports or the right supports is out of their fuck you gotta be out of your fucking mind whether it's these crackpot Christian nationalists that think that this whole war is a way to get Jesus to return on a white horse?

1:52:29Do you see those guys that were talking during the readiness fucking meeting? I think that's nuts too. I think the woke shit and all the chaos of the fucking last four years of having a completely open border and the justifications of all these things, that's nuts too. I'm not on either buddy's side, anyone's side. The Democrats aren't ever going to get someone like me because I'm not with either Or I'm not with either or I'm with whoever fucking makes sense and no one makes sense and I tell AI comes along I think they're a really good job all of us president perplexity is gonna run this country fairly and balanced I'm willing to try it at this point fucking dead serious man as long as it doesn't like do something to harm people As long as like that's its goal.

1:53:13It's goal is just to manage society It's a big if that you got there, but yes if we can get that well Join the hive, Dave. But what you just said, I think, is really— Open the pot door, Hal. Well, this is something that I'm encouraged by, is that I think what you just said there, I really do believe that you speak for super majorities of the American people. And that's why, even though Donald Trump has shattered his coalition by lying us into this stupid war on behalf of a foreign country, that coalition is still ripe for someone else to pick it up and run with it. And that's kind of what I'm hoping.

1:53:43I hope Thomas Massey runs for president. I think, by the way, they're doing a big money bomb for Thomas Massey on March 30th. And I think him winning reelection in Congress is like the most important political election in the country right now because he's done nothing wrong except actually stand up for America first and for all the stuff that Donald Trump and Tulsi Gabbard and all these people ran on. and he's gotten the the israel lobby and the edelsons but i repeat myself have been pouring millions of dollars uh into his race to try to unseat him for the crime of not going along with the epstein cover-up and not going along with another stupid war and having some like fiscal sanity so i hope i hope he wins i imagine those three negatives imagine those being three negatives that people are saying he's not maga yeah well then okay what is maga then well if that's like I don't know like my position is always like if you're saying if if not supporting Covering up the Epstein files or not supporting a stupid war of choice a war of aggression on behalf of Israel means I'm not MAGA Then okay.

1:54:43I'm not MAGA. I don't I'm not attached to the the You know the phrase make America great again. I don't care then fine that phrase sucks Here's the thing like first of all America is great. Let me make America greater I'm down but make America great again and then it becomes a movement of a bunch of fucking dorks because a lot of them are dorks a lot of these really weird fucking uninteresting unintelligent people that have got something they cling to and there's a lot of people that are just real genuine patriots and they're all lumped into this one group and you got to accept the dorks to fuck that like the concept of making America great is a great idea.

1:55:23But as soon as you have a fucking team and you allow anybody to join up You've you don't even have tryouts for your team So you've got a bunch of fucking dipshits that are running around spouting out opinions and you have to go along with them Because they're MAGA and then you've got bots online that are probably from fucking Indonesia or Russia or wherever And they're pretending they're MAGA and they're saying crazy shit. So that's a part of MAGA too You've fucked up by becoming a part of a group yeah whether it's a republican group a democrat group a maga group a fucking woke group whatever it is you fucked up by being in a group yeah what is it george carlin said people are great as individuals yeah but when they get in a group man they're the worst things in the world and that's why that's why it should be about the like the issues it should be about your principles and what you believe in and that's and and you should be like look like i've said uh many nice things about Tulsi Gabbard over the years, and I was extremely critical of her over since last summer into now because I think she's lying us into a war, which is the war that she was always opposed to.

1:56:29The one. She sold no war with Iran t-shirts. How is she lying us into this war? Because that's a big statement. Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. And it's true. So last summer, so Tulsi Gabbard had given her, as the director of national intelligence does every year, They give their annual threat assessment. Then she testified before Congress about it. And she it was very clear in her annual threat assessment that Iran was not attempting to build nuclear weapons, that they had not yet made the political decision to attempt to build nuclear weapons, let alone like are actually going for it. and she testified before Congress saying the same thing.

1:57:11And then while they were negotiating, Israel sneak attacks them. Then she had some post where she goes, Iran could be weeks or months away from nuclear weapons, which was like was total bullshit. It made absolutely no sense at all. Let me see what the post says. Sure. If you could find it, this is from last, it must have been last June. Right, but is that a fact? So if they're enriching uranium up to 60 % and they just have to enrich it further for the ability to use nuclear weapons. That is a couple of weeks away. No, but not before it would be. To build a bomb and to make it deliverable, I think all the experts say at least a couple years.

1:57:47But the point aside from that is that at the time, and this is over now, but at the time, Iran was still members of the JCPOA. They were still in it. What is that? This is the Iran deal that Obama got us into. Obama is horrible on foreign policy. He was the butcherer of Libya and Syria and Yemen, and he surged in Afghanistan. But in Iran, he made a deal with them. But it wasn't just with the U.S. and Iran. It also involved Russia and France and England, and there were other countries involved in it too. And the JCPOA said that Iran couldn't enrich above, I think it was 3 % to 5 % or something like that, and they were staying in it.

1:58:28And it created a new inspections regime, so they were having full inspections. They weren't in it. But the deal also said that if America gets out of the deal, they can enrich up to higher So when America got out of the deal, they started enriching When did America get out of the deal? Donald Trump tore it up in his first term I want to say 2017 or 2018 and then they immediately started enriching No, they went up a little bit and then I think there were a couple Israeli attacks and then they went up to enriching at 60 % But so the reason we knew they were enriching up to 60 % is because they were still members of the JCP away with an inspections regime who is going in there and saying they're enriching up to 60%.

1:59:04Right. But how much do you actually know about enriching uranium and what it takes to turn into a bomb? Let's read what she says. New intelligence. Confirm what POTUS has stated numerous times. Iran's nuclear facilities have been destroyed. I think this is after. This isn't the right one. Her tweet was before. This is from June. Yeah. This would have been just shortly before this. Very recently. Her tweet was before we hit Fordow. Yeah. This is June 25th. There's a recent one, though. Oh, edited June 25th. Yeah, but it seems like it was still edited the day it was posted. Probably. Can you go to her page?

1:59:40Because she doesn't tweet a lot. She's not a psycho. She's not one of those. If she tweets, it's generally something important or someone from our team. So is this the – hold on. Above that. Overwhelmingly elected by the – click on that show more. I think that's it. Well, this is what she testified to Congress this time. I was referring to a different one from my, but I also think this is a lie. I mean, for her to say that the president determines what is an imminent threat or is not. No, either there is an imminent threat or there is not one that this is like saying the president determines the weather.

2:00:20Right. Right. But you're taking her words out of context. She's saying something that's factually correct. As our commander in chief, he is responsible for determining what is and is not an imminent threat. That is true. And whether or not to take action he deems necessary to protect the safety and security of our troops, the American people, and our country. That's just an actual fact. Okay. Yes. Fair enough. But when she testified before Congress, they asked her point blank a bunch of times about this. And then she goes, that's not my job to determine what's an imminent threat. That's the job of the president.

2:00:52And if he says it is, then it is. Okay, so look at this here. Initially, she's contradicting Trump, saying that Iran did not rebuild after the 2025 strikes. Contradicting Trump. So this is also from Time Magazine. So she's saying that. Now, what you're saying that she said earlier was a lie is not a lie, dude, because that is actually his... Well, I wasn't referring to that. I understand. But you did say that was a lie, what she said was a lie. Okay, fair enough. That was not a lie. But it is... But it's it's a voiding actually correct and if you're in a position like she's in we've got that guy breathing down your neck and you're forced to make a statement You've got a tread Very carefully on this tight what rope that you're walking fine, but let's just say Hypothetically, you know for a fact that around did not pose an imminent threat, and then that's your answer when you're asked if they did fine It's not a lie, but it is Very misleading to say the least How much Okay hold on Intel Chief Gabbard Declines to say If Iran posed An imminent threat To the US She declined to say On her own Personally But she This is the congressional Testimony Yes yes yes I think this is What I was referring to here And she does at one point Say that it's not her job To make that determination Which I do think Is her entire job It's interesting Look maybe Maybe I'm being a little harsh By saying lying In that example And fair enough To your point there Like that technically Is a true statement I do think it's very misleading and I do think that she really was the one who advocated against this specific war for the reasons that we're seeing unfold right now.

2:02:29And I do think I get your point. It's a very tough tightrope to walk. The options are essentially, I think, to do what Joe Kent did and resign or to stay on and support the thing. I mean, I think it's kind of hard to thread that needle. Right. Do you think that there is any value in being one of the few reasonable voices that has his ear? If ultimately it is his responsibility to determine what's an imminent threat and what is not, I would imagine that she gets access to most of the same classified information that he does as the director of national intelligence. I don't know, though. I don't know how it works.

2:03:06But... What can she do other than try to be a voice of reason if ultimately this guy is going to do what he wants to do, right? And he's going to do it also what Israel wants to do, clearly. And he's talked about it, you know? And also in his first term, I'll never forget this fucking conversation that he had with Steve Hilton. Because I think it was one of the first times since Eisenhower I've seen a president say, and Steve Hilton, by the way, I've been friends with him for 12 or 13 years. Met him and his family in Maui on the beach when my daughter's really young and his kids really young they've kept friends We've hung out together vacation together.

2:03:41He's a sweetheart of a guy. I love that guy and When he was interviewing Trump Trump said That there is a military industrial complex and these guys want to go to war. Yep, and we were like what? This is you're just saying that like you're just saying that it's one of the many reasons Why a lot of people liked him because he would do things like that where he would completely break protocol And just say let me know let me let me let you know rather Let me inform you there's a bunch of people that want to go to war by they're pushing me all the time to go to war That's what they want. It was so crazy dude because also even Eisenhower when he coined the term It was in his farewell address to the nation He was literally like this is my last stop And then I'm leaving Trump was just in the middle of his presidency and he goes all of them want war They all want me to be in war all the time.

2:04:31If it was up to them, we'd always be at war. And I do, you know, now, look, that was great. I thought actually the one to me that was even crazier was if you remember when Bill O 'Reilly was interviewing him and he's talking about Vladimir Putin. And he goes, he's like, oh, well, you won't, you know, at the time Donald Trump, which he had run on, he was trying, he was saying we should have detente with Russia. He goes like, why do we, you know, we have nuclear weapons. Yeah, he goes, he goes, Putin's a killer. You want to have a detente with a killer? And he goes, we got a lot of killers, too.

2:05:01And then he goes, whoa, what do you mean we got a lot of killers, too? And he goes, what was Iraq? What was that? We got a lot of killers on our side, too. And then Bill O 'Reilly said, well, I mean, Iraq was a mistake. But he goes, yeah, we got a lot of killers, too. And I love that, by the way. I mean, that was a. That's breaking protocol. Yes. Yes. Well, I think this is kind of, I think, one of the main reasons why the establishment revolted against Trump the way they did. There's something very scary to the powers that be about a guy who like by his very nature, like I don't even think he's capable of not letting things slip.

2:05:39Right. You know what I mean? Like he's just that's who he is. And that was a big thing that people really didn't like about him. Very interesting to me is that so many of the never Trumpers have come to define his presidency. Like if you if you remember back in 2016, the the the Warhawk kind of Israel first or Republican crowd, the neocons and all them, they hated Donald Trump, hated him with a passion. Ben Shapiro was a never Trumper. He said because of his deeply held principles, he could never support Donald Trump. Mark Levin was a never Trumper. All of National Review, all of them. And now they are the biggest Trump supporters ever as kind of he's blown up the coalition that got him elected.

2:06:29So it's kind of interesting that they all, you know, you know, but again, tell those guys to all stay off Twitter. There's not one thing that they ever say that makes them look better. They get in these silly fucking they just feel like they're going to make some stupid fucking statement and then refute a couple of people and don't understand the crowd reaction. When you've got thousands of people tweeting against you now. Thousands just attacking you, destroying you, posting memes, posting videos. You said this and you said that, you piece of shit. It's amazing. It's crazy. I got to say, I do love that dynamic of it.

2:07:07I love it too. There's something that's why I stay off of it. Yeah. Well, look, there's problems with it, but there is something about that dynamic now that was just never true in the past where it's like, look, I'm not saying it's perfect. And obviously there's bots and there's things like that. So it's not like a, but the people kind of get a voice in a way that they never had before. Right. And there is something kind of cool about that. A hundred percent. I love it. But it's not all the people either. It's a lot of fake people. There's a lot of like state sponsored actors. No, that's true.

2:07:37That's true. There's manipulation, but there was always manipulation in the old order also. Do you see this YouTube bot farm that they just busted? No. They busted this this fucking warehouse had cell phones all rigged up for YouTube views Where people would just they would just hire a company and say hey, you know part of the problems I get enough views. I'd really like to blow the fuck up and get to number one and you hire them and they could get views Interesting. Yeah, it's also I mean I guess it was a lot of advertisements. That's legit fraud 100 % like actual fraud. Yeah 100 % and kind of a weird loophole where I don't think it's illegal Yeah, that's gotta be so there's a lot.

2:08:20It's gotta be some type of fraud though If you're like if you're intentionally doing that like maybe if you didn't know right you could but but listen Twitter pays people X pays people to post So you pay based on engagement right that's how you get right so you farm out engagement So like what percentage of what we're interacting with is just horseshit? Well, I got so I know this story just happened. I got Guilty because he made I think I think what happens he made a fake band. Yeah Yeah, he had an AR generated song He got oh wow played billions of times in an effort to mimic the genuine streaming activity of real consumers Smith pled guilty today conspiracy to commit wire fraud Wire fraud check this out though.

2:09:06I heard a similar story in Japan where first of all, let me stop right there Michael Smith generated thousands of fake songs using artificial intelligence. Hey, hey, hey Stop talking shit about AI music because it's not fake. Those are real songs. Yeah, don't say fake songs They're real songs and some of them are fucking bangers unfortunately Some of them are really good. You're gonna like what I was gonna say then a guide was doing this in Japan and it got viral and so he hired people to be the band and now the band is a real band kind of popular so ai ai is creating jobs in this case yeah well you know so shifty brent rules though you can never create him in real life he's the guy who does the uh 50 cent ones oh yeah i've seen i've seen quite a few of those first of all that guy was really he'd have lungs like a fucking ultra marathon runner because the flow like how can you even have an ear to say what you're saying like someone was saying that to me she was like I think you couldn't do this and my argument was Eminem I was like yeah you could you just have to be wicked at it like Eminem like Eminem in his prime that motherfucker could spit in a way where you're like I can't believe he's still talking yeah it was uh I remember there were a couple of his things where I was like I don't can he actually do this and then I saw him do it live and not like I was there but saw it on YouTube like where you're like oh he can actually rap like this I saw him recently it was fucking great he's still great he's thin he looks good Yeah, he was killing it man.

2:10:34He was killing it But those the speed in which that he can rap made me go. Maybe AI is not bullshitting But you know 50 Cent himself was like much more casual in his delivery. Yes, you know, and it was Much slower this shifty Brent AI version is like damn that was a real person That'd be pretty great. He would be the greatest artist. I got there was a guy I can't remember his name, but just like the other day uh some guy he works for fox news and he came out and had a whole post about me and he goes uh um he goes dave smith's account is clearly botted by foreign like and i'm almost like when he said that i was almost kind of like there's a weird thing like i know i've never paid for anything but like i don't know you know what i mean like what someone else might have done or something like that but i asked him but i so i replied to him and i go wait what evidence do you have this.

2:11:26And then his post was that he said, because I had 900 ,000 followers on Twitter, but I'm playing Laugh Boston this weekend. And he goes, that's a 300 seat venue. I played that venue two times, too. First of all, he doesn't understand comedy clubs. You just don't get comedy clubs, dude. First of all, I'm doing five shows there. By the way, come on out this weekend. Great club. Great club. One of my favorite weekends of last year. It's a fucking great room. But I was like, look, Man, I sold out all the shows last year hoping to do the same this year But I go that is any like I just know the industry of stand-up comedy pretty well When I was like anybody who you're saying would be selling more than that So what selling out big theaters or selling at a stadium or something like that all the people who do that have more followers than me So like he's not even right about the ratio of it or whatever He doesn't understand the numbers But then I kind of like I I grilled him on it a bit more because, listen, I'm kind of like you.

2:12:23Like when you were talking about suing CNN back in the day for slandering you. Like, I'm never actually going to do it. But I don't mind saying it. You know what I mean? So I tagged Fox News and I go, hey, Fox News, shouldn't you have some evidence if you're going to make a claim like I'm clearly botted by foreign influence or whatever? Fox News actually said it? The guy works for Fox News. Was he on Fox News when he said it? No, he said it on Twitter. Twitter, but he's like a Fox News contributor or something like that. But I'm a UFC contributor it wouldn't be like the UFC yeah, I guess I'm saying I guess that's true So I don't know maybe it would just be him in either way I'm not suing anyone God, but I did want him to just I go just just admit you don't have any evidence for this like just yeah Retract well here's the thing.

2:13:01I would agree that your account is botted because you're very controversial public figure So I'm sure all right. I'm sure my account is botted too, right? I'm sure Jamie's account is botted 100 % right? I think Jamie might be a bot himself. We're all botted, man. If you look at, you know, we've brought up this up a million times, but there was an FBI, former FBI analyst who analyzed Twitter before the purchase. And it was his take that as much as 80 % might be artificial. Now, this is back then. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This is before Elon purchased it. I think they've done they've taken some steps to try to ensure one of the things is you have to you could go to the person's page You can see what country they're posting from yes.

2:13:45I like that Yeah, there's a lot of people that are like pro-america and you're like hey, man, you're in Pakistan. Yeah, what's going on here? This is kind of kooky, so there's a lot of that going on I've had I've had Before where people go like Dave you always say Israel's trying to lie us into war, but this is America We decide what war we're gonna fight and then you click it Israel It's just a dude in Israel. But at least we're getting steps to know those. Listen, if it wasn't for Elon Musk, we would be fucked. I've said this before. I'll say it again. History will go back and look at his purchasing Twitter.

2:14:18And it has changed the course of communication in this country for the better. No question. I know a lot of you thought, oh, my God, the racism is up and all this stuff is up. That's people. That's the Internet. That is an accurate representation representation of people. It's not good, but it's also accurate And the only way that's gonna change is if the other voices are more compelling and at least now they have an opportunity to do that Yeah Well and you and you have to kind of engage in this whether and I'm not saying you have to be on Twitter or something like that But I'm just saying like if you wanna You know, I would love very much to get to a place where like you'd be like hey let's all agree that we're not on board with the bigotry stuff and i mean this like whether it's against white men or whether it's against black men or whether it's against jews or whether it's against muslims or whatever and i see a whole lot of all of that and i'd love to move past that i also would um like like i i wish there was a way that like mark levin and tucker carlson could have like a cool conversation you know what I mean and not like not like be like but well look it's not Santa Claus and Jesus would come meet me for dinner Well, both would be nice The latter is more likely I think too at this point you had a weird thing.

2:15:35I don't know if you saw this but Ben Shapiro Had he made this video about like about Pierce Morgan and and like going at him over having me on The show and he went this whole thing and so he he says to me or he said you know he insults me a few times or whatever and then he goes out now i i can hear dave smith right now and his response to this is debate me bro which fair enough that kind of is always my i only have one tool in my toolkit like right come let's podcast about this i don't know like this is what i do i talk but he's not willing to do that he goes no uh because you're like so uh he said because i won't i don't debate such intellectually dishonest people or something like that, which I thought was a weird criticism of me.

2:16:21Like, you could say I'm wrong, but I do believe the shit I say. Yeah, I don't think you're in the, I don't think in any demonstration of any, I don't think there's a single moment that I could point to that I think that you've been intellectually dishonest. I think that is like factually incorrect. Well, thank you. That is gaslighting. You are very honest. You're a very honest person. Well, thank you. I try to be. No, you are. It's one of the things I love about you. You you're honest about your fuck ups you're honest about your what you're incorrect about and what bothered you Plenty about things that you've said you're very honest.

2:16:57So that's a silly thing to say that's total gaslighting Well, it's also well I look at it like this and I don't you know Honestly like obviously Ben Shapiro wanted to debate I would I would do it everybody before You go dude You can't say I'm beyond the pale when you're known for debating 19 year olds who are confused about their gender. You know what I'm saying? I'm like, no, I don't know if you remember this. And this to me, I actually think is very interesting. But I don't know if you remember this. But on this show, Ben was on years ago. And there's, you know, years before October 7th or anything like that.

2:17:27But he was saying, he was talking about Israel and his defense for Israel. And you went, you go, that's interesting. Would you ever debate someone, you know, who's a critic of Israel? And just generically, not about a specific person. And he goes, absolutely. I'd be happy to do that. And, you know, the thing about guys like that is that, particularly with Ben Shapiro, for the last two and a half years his number one issue Israel has been the number one topic of conversation and in that time Israel's support has been bleeding I mean just like to a level you couldn't have imagined you couldn't have imagined two and a half years ago to go this will be in a pro-Palestinian country that was unthinkable and it's become that and forget me there's way better people than me but Ben Shapiro debated no one he never once had a conversation with a competent critic of Israel.

2:18:17And listen, people saw that. People noticed that. And so I kind of in a weird way feel like, it's like, hey, dude, I don't care if you do the debate with me or not. I wish, I don't think we ever can. I wish there would be a world where we could have a good faith conversation, like a guy with me and Ben Shapiro. But he refused to do it with anyone. Anyway, so while you're smearing everybody who's a critic of Israel, you're not willing to like, listen, there are some people who don't debate, But he branded himself as the debate guy right if you don't like Dave sit down with Scott Horton sure absolutely Scott Horton's way Smarter than me and knows way more shit than me anyway, so talk to him about it.

2:18:52Yeah, I mean He's a better guy saying that this is the reason why you won't do it that sounds crazy because Wouldn't you want to debate someone who's intellectually dishonest because it would be so easy to refute them with facts exactly so come It would be perfect. Yeah dating. It's like sparring a guy who knows fake kung-fu You know thinks he's got a death touch and you're dustin poirier. You're like oh, yeah, bro lace the gloves up Let's go well That was kind of my thing with with the Douglas Murray thing too where it was like at a certain point You're like dude You can't just say you're an expert and I'm not an expert the demonstrate that that that if that's the case Then it should be easy for you to just shot me up in front of the world right now Some things that you had to correct him on yeah Yeah, he's got it wrong and you could see like the tremor in his eyes like oh shit Like they don't want to give up that ground because they're playing a very different game and the game is not let's be Intellectually honest about what we think is going on and what we think is good and bad about what's going on Versus I'm trying to win yeah, and one of the ways I try to win is by I can appeal to authority You're not an expert.

2:19:54You know you're not of this you're not a professor You don't you've never been there yeah that kind of shit that that that is all like hack ass fake kung fu moves. You know, you're going to try on Francis Ngannou. You know what I mean? Yeah, so good luck with that. Not that I'm comparing you to Francis Ngannou. That's very disrespectful to Francis. Certainly not when it comes to fighting. You'd much rather fight me. This Ronda Rousey card, they got Francis fighting Philip Lins. Philip Lins, who's a light heavyweight in the UFC, and the UFC cut him, and he's fighting the scariest heavyweight who's ever walked the face of the earth.

2:20:29I mean, props to him. Next to primetime Alistair over him. Primetime Alistair Overeem when he was Overeem, I think is even scarier. I think because he was way skillful. He was terrifying when he was on the sauce. Yes, but even... Francis is natural, so he's scarier. Francis almost has a thing where it just seems like you have to fight a perfect fight against him. Which Stipe Miocic did in his first fight. He took a lot of shots. That's the thing about Stipe. Stipe could take a shot. And you would see he'd like jab him and he'd be rocked but he'd still get the takedown and still he'd be He'd be with skill strategy Experience everything but in the second one DC said it best he goes a patient Francis is a fucking terrifying thing Dude my favorite uh my favorite commentary ever in a fight was a when when DC said it was just so hilarious to me It was so real like he just meant it but it was when when Francis Ngannou fought fought gone and And he grappled a little bit in that fight, which we had never seen him do before.

2:21:31But there was one point where he was on the ground and he took his back or something like that. Like he passed his guard or he took his back or something like that. And DC just goes, oh my God, he's doing jujitsu now. It was like he was speaking of a robot who just learned how to feel feelings. He goes, oh my God, it's learning. It's advancing. This is so terrifying. A guy that's that much of a destroyer that learns how to take backs and strangle people too and control you from the back And blast you unconscious like he did with that dude in the PFL in his last fight took his back and just blasted him into the netherworld Yeah, that's that's scary.

2:22:05He's the scariest guy that's ever fought in the UFC Props to that dude for taking the fight. Scariest natural clean guy. I should say that. Okay, fair enough Fair enough. Yeah, because we only got a couple Alistair Overeem fights where he was Overeem and the big one being Brock Lesnar And that was the big one and of course the other fight on that card that they added which is huge is the Nate Diaz Well, here's my point. If Nate Diaz is fighting, I'm paying whatever you're charging. I'm going to be wherever it is. And it's Mike Perry. Great fight. Bad motherfucker. That's a great fight. But my point is they also have Roe Bellis Despain, who's on the card, who's a 6 '7 Cuban taekwondo expert, who's a heavyweight, who's a knockout artist.

2:22:46Like, why didn't they have him? He's fighting Junior Dos Santos. and Junior Dos Santos is, you know, he was an all-time great, but he had a long career and he's had some bad knockouts. Some wars too, dude. Bad wars. The wars with Cain Velasquez took years off his life. The war with Stipe. It was almost criminal that they didn't stop both of those fights. Well, they were definitely horrible and terrible to watch, but the point is, Robeles is huge. He's a real heavyweight. He's a big, giant knockout artist. That would have been an interesting fight versus Francis. Big, super tall guy that's hard to hit.

2:23:20Yeah. And if it just is a striking fight, the problem with Robel is he got exposed in his last UFC fight on the ground. He got beat up on the ground. His ground game's not that good. Could have gotten better. But on the feet, that's a little bit more interesting to me than Phillip. Although Phillip's a skillful fighter. You know, he's used to fighting at light heavyweight. The UFC cuts him, and now all of a sudden he's fighting against Francis. Yeah, that's a little bit of a mismatch. But, hey, I mean, you know, we've seen crazy shit happen in MMA before. Felipe, I think it's pronounced Felipe, Felipe Lins.

2:23:54But he's a good fighter. I mean, it's not a bad fight in that sense. But it's like you're going up against a guy with a chip on his shoulder that they're paying$20 million. He's the lineal. I don't know what they're paying him. I'm just guessing. But he's the lineal heavyweight champion of the world, the real one. Like, if you really, like, plot it out, no one beat him for the title. That's a that's a crazy fight. It's like that's how shallow the heavyweight division out is outside of the UFC There's so few fights for you to get Francis for this so few fights in the UFC I mean the UFC's heavyweight division is a real mess It's very hard to find gigantic men who are excellent fighters.

2:24:34I guess a lot in Russia Okay, yeah, there's there's guys that are fighting in other countries that are really good that are coming up It's just like it's hard to get him over here. There's Josh Hokett. He's a bad motherfucker Dude who's crazy who has these crazy speeches after the fight puts on an American flag bandana And he said Brittany Griner has a dick Brittany Griner's a man I forget what he said, but he's just nuts But he's also like really smart about marketing who's the other guy you you talked about him several times was the the Olympic wrestler guy Gabe Gabe yeah, yeah, he's not in yet though I had him on the podcast.

2:25:11He's not in the UFC yet. When he's in the UFC, he's going to be a fucking problem. Olympic gold medalist, elite wrestler, moves like a cat, 250 pounds, young, super dedicated, and just recently learned striking and is fucking people up with his hands. Yeah, and is picking it up quite quickly. And is a John Jones protege. So he's been being mentored by the goat and absorbing his mindset and how that guy's helping him He's investing his time into training. But if you're a young guy, you know what a fucking boost of confidence The greatest of all time says you're gonna be the man. You're gonna be the fucking man You just stick with this plan and they're bringing him up the right way.

2:25:55He fought in dirty boxing He fought some small MMA organizations. He's just like building up experience Yeah, and there's not, there's never been a lot of, but there's not really right now in the heavyweight landscape, there isn't really like a Frank Mir or, what's his name, Minotaur. Noguera. Noguera, where there used to be these guys who were kind of known for fighting off their back. You know what I mean? Right. Most heavyweights don't really like fighting off their back. These even the guys who are really good at jujitsu. I also think just in general fighting off your back is a lot harder than it used to be Fabricio Verdum was the greatest yes.

2:26:34Yes. That's a great. He was incredible Best at it, but there aren't really that many guys like that a lot of these guys you take them down They're in trouble. Yeah, and when you got a guy like Gable guess what bitch You're gonna get taken down and there's not a fucking thing you can do about it. That is a next level I saw the wrestler. I just saw the one one of his recent fights where he he he's finishing a double leg before he realized he knocked the guy out, it seemed like. He KOs him with a left hook, and he's so fast that as the guy's collapsing on the way down, he shoots a double, connects, takes him to the ground while he's unconscious.

2:27:08So before the guy has a chance to drop, that's how fast he is. He's already on him, taking him down, and pounds him out while he's already unconscious. Yeah, that was scary. Ooh, that guy's a problem. He's a problem. And that's an American heavyweight motherfucker. We need one of those. We need some American champions. We're down. Get him in the White House. Yeah. I mean, are there any American champions right now? Who are the American champions? Mackenzie Dern is the strawweight champion, so she's technically an American, although her dad is a very famous Brazilian legend. Okay. Yeah, Megaton Diaz is her dad, and she was a Brazilian jiu-jitsu champion.

2:27:48But she is American, so she's a champion. Other than that, who? Sean Strickland's fighting for the title. Kayla Harrison, that's right. So it's only women that are the Americans. Yeah, look at that. Boy, you're going to see a lot of those dudes with those beards. That's the keep coming over here. Joshua Van is an American. That's right. Yeah, it is. You're going to see a lot of those dudes. That's a caveat, though, the Joshua Van. No disrespect for Joshua because I think he's an awesome fighter, but he won that fight on the injury. We've got to have a rematch on that one. That was a freak injury.

2:28:22I mean, he fell and dislocated his arm. It's a complete freak injury. And Pantoja still hasn't fully recovered from that. So it was pretty bad, whatever the fuck. They said his shoulder dislocated and his elbow. Yeah, I remember hearing that afterward. It looked like it was just his elbow. But they said, the doctor had said it was his shoulder. And so the thing about the elbow is, the elbow is a less complicated joint, right? And so when the elbow gets dislocated, if someone just pulls on it, it can pop back into place. So like saying that there's as long they didn't know what they're doing right because you don't want to do it like Yuri Prohaska's team didn't rip his shoulder apart and they need surgery probably need surgery anyway It was dislocating like that.

2:29:05It was probably loose But the point is that like his elbow might have popped back into place by the time they brought him backstage And that's when they realized his shoulder was fucked because his shoulder probably hurt more even right That was unfortunate because that was a real interesting Dislocate a lot, you know, and you know sometimes people dislocate their shoulders and don't even realize they do And how really and I apparently according to my the this orthopedic surgeon that I went to back in the day before I realized that stem cells could fix it This guy was convincing me that I had to have surgery and one of the things he said You know that your shoulders been dislocated and I said it has he goes you didn't know I go no It was a how long how many times you hurt your shoulder.

2:29:46I go how much time you got? I can sit down and talk about how many times I've been comorid, how many times I've been fucking arm blocked, how many times I've been caught in a triangle, how many times, you know, posting on the ground I've jostled my shoulder. The good news is there have been no fracture or ligament injury. That's great. Oh, that's Bahampa said that. So from that, we have great expectations for his return, but the exact time frame is still unknown. Still needs a lot of physiotherapy. Start moving his arm. Wow. Then he can go back to light training and then hard training. but we got to get that guy down to fucking the CPI in you know the the Cellular Performance Institute the UFC uses get that dude down to Tijuana I'm worried about I'm worried about the new model for the UFC paramount model I'm worried about the Warren around and the new UFC model this is what keeps me up at night I get it so what are you worried about well the new UFC model I I'm uh I'm I'm no genius, but it seems to me, like I'm a hardcore fan of the UFC, right?

2:30:44So I was, you know, I order every pay-per-view. Right. Everyone, you know, and so every, any Saturday, if I'm on the road in my green room, we're watching the UFC. If I'm not on the road, I'm either at home watching it or I'm trying to go to the event if it's in town. Right. So then it's like, okay, ESPN is over. We're not doing that anymore. So then they go, we're switching to Paramount. Now I already had Paramount, because my kids like some shows on Paramount. Yep. So now... Landman. Yeah. Oh, yeah. I watch Landman. Great show. So I have Paramount+. I'm like, oh, okay. Well, that's easy enough.

2:31:19And then I'm like, so wait a minute. Hold on. So you tell me I just get everyone for free now? I just don't have to order pay-per-views anymore? And there's just something about that. Now, I'm not saying whether this is Paramount's mistake or the UFC's mistake or whatever, but just like the basics of business to me go, so you just had a loyal customer who's very happy to pay for every pay-per-view. And I'm just not now. Like this just, on some level, now I understand it's because Paramount gave them a whole bunch of money, but on some level I go, number one, I go, but how is this good for business if the customer no longer has to pay for a thing that I was happily paying for?

2:31:56Okay, let me correct you. Okay, sure. First of all, Paramount, the idea of doing this and investing$7 billion into the UFC over the next few years, the positive that they're going to get from that with loyal new customers is massive. So it's introducing it to a whole new audience. If you're a loyal pay-per-view buyer, if you spend, what is it,$70 for a pay-per-view? I think something like that. So$70 for this big-time pay-per-view card. Now you get it for free. You just have to pay for Paramount Plus every month for the year. You're saving so much money. Huge amount of money, yeah. So the amount of new people that are going to go, oh, this is awesome.

2:32:37I don't have to pay for pay-per-view anymore. I pay for Paramount Plus, and I get all these awesome shows too. Because Paramount Plus has a ton of great fucking shows. Great deal for the consumer. You get roped in through that, and then you go looking around on Paramount Plus, and you stay a loyal subscriber. They have all these years with this new influx of viewers from the UFC deal to build up more of a library, more shows. It's huge for business. Okay, fair enough. They can take their app from where it is now and take their streaming model from where it is now and quadruple it over the next X amount of years.

2:33:11Okay, so for them, they're bringing in the whole UFC audience. And how many people would look at a pay-per-view card and look, I would buy every one of them. Even when I was working for the UFC, I would go on ESPN Plus and I would buy them, even though I was there. I was like, I want to be able to watch it in the gym when I get home. I'm going to buy it. And so you've got all these people that were looking at those cards that were like, this one, I don't know. I don't know if that's worth$70. If you're on a budget and you're looking at this one, you're like, who's fighting? Nah, I'm going to pass on this one.

2:33:45I'll watch it in a couple weeks on ESPN+. Because you could just wait a few weeks. I don't know how long the time frame is. But you could wait a few weeks and you could watch it. You don't have to do that anymore. It's$10 a month. What is Paramount Plus a month? How much does it cost? Maybe 12 or 13, but let's find out so we're accurate, but you're saving so much money But also on ESPN they charge just something like that too Like you had to pay an ESPN right fee and then you had to pay for each individual pay-per-view So no listen I'm saving okay, it's$13.99 a month or $139 a year for the ad-free premium plan which includes Showtime New and former subscribers can currently get any monthly plan for$2.99 a month for the first two months Not for so for a new subscriber You could try it out for two months for$2.99 a month and watch every UFC for$2.99 a month for two months It's fucking worth it.

2:34:39No, and then you're gonna get this huge influx of people that you know If you're on a budget you're not gonna subscribe to Paramount Plus you already got Netflix Netflix costs X amount of money Maybe you got HBO Max. That's X amount of money. I can't afford Paramount, too. I don't want to pay another$10 a month or$14 a month. Now, it's easy. No pay-per-views. Yeah. They made a lot of wives of hardcore fans happy. I'm sure for that. I don't have to buy these pay-per-views anymore. Paramount shows. Yeah, they get the Paramount shows and they don't have to do that. All right. Fair enough. I guess it's just in some ways, I guess, and I don't really have much of a mind for business, But in some ways there's just a thing where it's like we've always done it this way Now we're doing it a whole new way, but it's been on streaming for the last few years Yeah, that's so it's always been on an app anyway, and then Paramount you could get it on Apple TV You can get it on Android TV and get it on all these different things It's like there's no reason to not have it.

2:35:36Yeah, it's easy. It's just great for as a business move for Paramount It was a smart fucking move because you get this built-in hardcore fan base now Have some of the cards been lackluster? Yes, but guess what that has always been the case Yeah, and that's just a matter of time go back and watch Rose Nama Yunus versus Carlos Barza There's been some fights back in the day that just weren't great. Yeah, and there's been cards that Even though they look good on paper in reality. They weren't so fun. Yeah, but I also I'm with you Because I remember you used to say this back in the day all the time But I am like a purist fan in MMA in the sense that like all of that is like, I don't care.

2:36:18Like you feel like, oh, it's boring. You're like, it's the most exciting sport in the world on its worst day. Even in a fight that's a bad fight. Because if you remember the Frank Mir Cro Cop is a good example of this where it was just a boring fight the entire fight. And then there's a spectacular knockout at the end of it. And even if that doesn't end up happening, you're always watching like that could happen at any moment. It always can happen. I also am with you. I believe in like I don't believe in stand-ups. I don't think anyone should ever be stood up I don't think you should be separated for stalemate or whatever It's like if someone puts you in that position then yeah, you gotta get out of it get up if they're not doing enough on the top That's silly.

2:36:54Sean O'Malley explains why piracy led to the UFC's massive Paramount deal. Oh Interesting a lot of people that I'll pay for it every week, but there's a lot of people that won't that makes sense They're streaming it illegally that makes sense I knew there was a lot of that because there was sites that you could go to and and people would openly talk about it. You can go to it and just watch the pay-per-view. It's a good move, dude. It's a good move for the business. It's just like they just need a few banger cards to make people forget about the stale ones. But that will happen. It's inevitable.

2:37:24You're going to have stale cards. I'm concerned about the White House fight. I'm concerned about it not just from a security standpoint. I'm concerned about it because it's outside. It's June, and it's in Washington, D.C. when you if it's hot out and it could very well be like what's the average temperature i looked this up the other day uh average 67 percent humidity and last year or 2024 is 100 degrees on june 14th okay okay that's tough okay and i think it's supposed to be at noon also yeah that's that's an issue okay okay okay that's a fucking big problem dude that's a big problem you are going to radically affect their performance if you make people fight in 100 degree temperature with 67 % humidity outside.

2:38:05You're also going to radically affect my ability to do commentary. Okay? My fucking head doesn't have any hair. The top of my head is going to be beet red. I'm going to have to put some toxic sunscreen on it. You're going to see me with that white zinc powder that the surfers use on their nose. I'll make fake hair with white zinc. My head's going to get cooked. That is an issue. Last year, 80 % chance of thunderstorms with highs in the mid-80s. Are they building a tent? Is this outside outside or is it outside in a tent? Are they going to have fans blowing cold air on us? You know how much DC is going to complain?

2:38:40That fucking dude, he's going to be right next to me. His shirt's going to be soaked. Yeah, that's a bit of an issue. I'm going to be able to tell with mine because I always wear black anyway. Everybody with a white shirt or a blue shirt, if Anik has a light blue shirt on, his pits are going to be fucking filled up with sweat. It's going to be ridiculous. That also really legitimately changes the actual fight itself. Oh, 100%. 100 % Okay, so there I don't see any AC there bro. How you gonna get AC on those people? What is that gonna be like that sounds fucking insane to do that in June just cuz that's a fun time to do it I mean if I was Justin Gaethje or I was Ilya Toporia if I was Justin Gaethje I mean first of all he has to take the fight.

2:39:22It's a historic fight. It's at the White House He's like he's a true red-blooded American. He wants to win the title at the White House. Come on. You have to do it But he's 37 years old. He's had a long career, and he's fighting maybe the most lethal guy he's ever faced. The one guy out of all the guys he faced that can shut the fucking lights out with one shot every time. His last three fights is the craziest resume in the history of the sport. Knocks out Alexander Volkanovsky. Knocks out Max Holloway. Knocks out Charles Oliveira. Two at featherweight, one at lightweight. All of them leveled.

2:40:04I wouldn't even say, well, I guess it's debatable, but certainly you could make an argument the two best featherweights of all time. Yes. And one of the greatest lightweights of all time. And by the way, I know MMA math is never perfect, but you look at what Oliveira just did to Max Holloway, who I love, one of my favorite fighters of all time. Love Max. You look at what Charles Oliveira just did to Max Holloway, and then you think about the way Ilya Taporia handled him. Flatlined him in the first round. And not what was, to me, almost as impressive as the knockout was handling him on the ground.

2:40:40Yeah. Passed his guard. He tried to take him down. Think about the way he got one of those body locks and tried to take him down. Think about how helpless Max Holloway was for that. How helpless a whole bunch of guys we've seen are when he gets his hands around you. And Ilya Teporia, he tried to do that. He ends up on top and passes his guard right away. Also, he ate a really clean elbow early in that fight and just was like nothing. Shook it off like it was nothing. He's a special talent. But then again, when you are dealing with special talents and great, great fighters like Justin, who this is probably his last opportunity to fight for the title, I want that under the perfect conditions.

2:41:18I want that to be in an arena where it's 72 degrees and air-conditioned. I don't want it to be outside. I don't want there to be any additional stress or distractions because you're warming up at the White House Like what do you have tents with mats on them? And these guys are gonna be slipping around in puddles of sweat or shadow boxing in the situation room before you come out Who's gonna slip on sweat and blow their ACL out? You know, I mean if you ever done striking on mats when a bunch of dudes have been training like in a class It's so fucking slippery man. It's if it's that hot It's gonna unless they have it these mats and where they're getting set up in air-conditioned building somewhere unless they have a facility Yeah, maybe they can do that.

2:42:00I hope they think that through. I hope they think that through I hope they prepare it It's just I don't like I like the idea that it's like this big Celebration of the UFC that the president loves the UFC so much wants to do it at the White House But in practice, I don't like it at all because you've got two world titles You know, you've got the interim heavyweight world title, and then you've got this world title with Justin and Ilya at 55. I don't like it. I want those to be at the T-Mobile. I want those to be at the Madison Square Garden Arena. You know, I want those to be somewhere dope, the TD Garden in Boston.

2:42:38Put it in a fucking real arena where it's air-conditioned, damn it. Yeah, yeah. These are amazing fights. I don't want anybody fighting when it's 100 degrees outside. That's crazy. Wouldn't and correct me if I'm wrong, but also I would think it's you're gonna get sweaty so quick So in weather like that and that is a big deal for like grappling and stuff like that I mean like that's a huge advantage if you're trying to not get grappled by someone here's another factor These are people that just were radically dehydrated 24 hours ago, and then you're asking them to compete in a sauna You're basically asking them to fight in a sauna that is still so crazy to me that there's not a way that we can just get two guys who weigh 180 pounds to fight at 180 pounds.

2:43:23I've had this conversation with them. Instead, we have to have two guys who weigh 180 pounds cut down to 150 pounds and then rehydrate up to 180 pounds to fight at 180 pounds. And weaken themselves, like radically weaken themselves. I see those guys the day they weigh in. The worst ever that I ever saw was Travis Luter. So Travis Luter. Against Anderson Silva, I remember. He missed weight. But I was backstage for all of it, right? So this was back when the weigh-ins were the time of the actual weigh-ins. It wasn't the ceremonial weigh-in. Like now they give them more time. You can weigh in in the morning.

2:43:56And then by the ceremonial weigh-in, it's usually 5 p.m. Usually these guys have significantly rehydrated. They do it slowly, but they have a process to it. But Travis missed weight. And so I was backstage while they gave him X amount of time to make the weight. And, dude, he couldn't walk. He was shuffling, shuffling. Like he couldn't pick his legs up his lips were cracked. His face was drawn. He looked like he was gonna die He looked like a guy who had been shipwrecked You know and like lost at sea and just drinking his own piss for a week and they finally rescued him That's what it looked like Well, I think he was dying I guess right I mean that is what you're looking at and then 24 hours later He has to fight the greatest middleweight of all time.

2:44:37He has to fight Anderson motherfucking Silva in his prime and And did, for that being the story, did remarkably well. He got viciously elbowed in the triangle. But that would not have happened if Travis wasn't compromised. Travis was a real problem back then. Yeah. He was one of the best jiu-jitsu guys to ever compete in MMA. And he was stylistically kind of like the best shot against Anderson Silva at that time. Because Anderson Silva just looked untouchable. And he got him down and got him into good positions a few times. Even though he was fucked from the weight cut. But the thing was, he never made the weight.

2:45:13So even if he beat him, he wouldn't have got the title. The whole thing was fucked. But it's like I've advocated for there's a solution. One of them is multiple weight classes that are additional to what we have. Have one at least every 10 pounds, and it probably should be more. And a lot of people push back against that. But listen, 10 pounds for an elite athlete is a big fucking deal. 20 pounds is crazy. So when you go like 85 to 205, that's crazy. That's too much weight. It's too much of a gap. You could have multiple champions in between those weight classes, and it's just better for the sport overall.

2:45:48You've got more champions. You've got more champion versus champion matchups you can make. Well, there's – it also – first of all, it's very unhealthy and dangerous, and that's the biggest issue. But then it also makes it a thing where it's like now there's two factors. It's not just who's the best fighter. It's also who's the best at dehydrating themselves losing a ton of weight and rehydrating themselves And also I think like I've heard I've heard GSP say before that like some people are just naturally better at that Yeah, some people just fluctuate and weight more some people can lose a lot of weight and then gain it all back the other day And he used to always say I just can't do that Like I'm not a guy who can do that, but I think all of us.

2:46:26We just want to see who the best fighter is exactly We don't care about who's the best at dehydrating anything that it hampers your ability should be removed from the equation, especially if it's something like this. But there's a solution. First of all, there's a real silliness to the MMA weight classes. And when I say silliness, our names that we use have been owned by boxing for more than 100 years, and the names that we use are for different weight classes than boxing uses. That's dumb. That is dumb as shit. If you want to have a 170-pound champion, fantastic. But don't call it a welterweight, because welterweight is 147.

2:47:04It's been 147 for over 100 fucking years. The fact that you have a 147 champion or 145 champion, you call that a featherweight, featherweight is 126. That's what it's been in boxing forever. Lightweight has always been 135. That's what Julio Cesar Chavez was the champ of. 135. Lightweight is 155 in the UFC? Come up with your own names. Yeah, why do we still have these stupid thought about that? It's a good point They attach these names to it when they first started developing weight classes because it used to just be one weight class Oh another one on this why and I think you've mentioned this before why am I not getting the leg reach?

2:47:45They do that sometimes do they yeah, because I've seen like but on the regular tail of the tape It'll still just be reach. Yeah, but in this because that actually for MMA That's such a huge deal sure like it's such a huge because oh like if you're kicking Yeah, if you're in kicking range of me, you know what I mean, but you can't touch me, your jab doesn't matter as much as in boxing. Right. And some guys, they have really long legs for their torso. Right. My friend Larry, my friend Larry Jones from my Taekwondo days, he had this short torso. What is this? All those leg reaches longer than Stipe's.

2:48:20Whoa, that's crazy. Is that right? That's crazy. Stipe just has a way longer torso? That's nuts. The help stifler are the same size. Oh, wow. Yeah, that's crazy. Well Aldo was such a good kicker. It's probably part of the reason why My friend Larry had this short torso like really short, but he was like 6 '3 and he was all legs And he was this insane kicker He was like a freak like he was made in a lab and when guys would fight him like you'd see guys in tournaments fight Him they'd be like what the fuck am I gonna do with this? His reach was so nuts and he was so fast with his kicks And you couldn't get anywhere close to him if you were in his weight class and you were normally built right?

2:48:56He was built like his torso was shorter than mine But he's crazy long legs and long arms. Yeah, like some people are just built certain ways and for striking It's a giant problem. There's another thing that makes Ilya Teporia so fucking unbelievably impressive He's not tall at all. Yeah, you know, and he's just flatlining people Oh, I mean Charles Oliveira looked so much bigger than oh in that fight and so much bigger than max to Oliveira is big. It's like Look the sports fine. It's not it's not trouble sports not in trouble The heavyweight division is in trouble. The heavyweight division is kind of fucked.

2:49:32It's in a weird situation. The Alex Pereira thing is very interesting. Alex Pereira versus Cyril Ghosn is very, very, very interesting because Cyril Ghosn is a problem. That guy's a problem. He's super athletic. He's really fast. He's super skillful with striking. His Muay Thai is absolutely elite. And he does a lot of things different than what a lot of people do. And has anyone, because even Francis, like I was saying before, grappled with him a lot. In that fight, obviously John Jones took him down and choked him. But has anyone really stood toe-to-toe and beat him up? No. No, no one's beat him up toe-to-toe.

2:50:07Taito Ivasa went toe-to-toe with him and tried to, but he got lit up. Dude, Cyril Gaon is a problem. And even in the little bit with Tom Aspinall, it looked like he's tough. He's tough to fight like that, man. Not just tough. He was, like, getting off on Aspinall, and it didn't look good for Aspinall. I mean, it's very unfortunate that he got his eyes poked. I mean that we really never got to see what happens if you drag cereal deep deep water what the way Tom would adjusted for the second round or third round Which we've never really seen out of Tom either. It was very interesting. We got robbed of that You know, but we got robbed of that and poor Tom He's had two fucking eye surgeries and then he felt like the UFC disrespected him.

2:50:45The whole thing's a mess Well, I don't know that the UFC but a lot of fans did disrespect him. I saw that which is crazy Like this is really stupid. We talked about this last night It should be one point period if you poke someone in the eyes you poke something in the eyes one point Well, especially if the fingers go in the eyes if it's like a glancing thing like that maybe get a warning But in a nut shot straight nut shot one point there's a glancing thing Maybe a warning I think that could be up to the judge's discretion upon view of the replay Yeah, well I the thing is that and we were talking about this last night if you So if you land a nut shot and it's it's accidental as it almost always is you know what I mean?

2:51:25You're trying to throw an inside leg kick and it was well, okay Maybe not I said almost almost always But so I just see this all the time in MMA It's the first one. It was an accident. This guy gets kicked in the nuts. He needs a few minutes Usually they don't take the full five or whatever they're offered and then you just go back It's like look even if it was an accident that's such an advantage to the guy who who kicked him in the groin you hurt him you hurt this guy and now he's got to get back to it and there's no so like it does seem like there almost has to be some accounting for that and there's i think there's still it's still a very young sport i think there is still too much referee discretion like there's too much like there should be like an official rule for what we do in this situation especially those kind of fouls it's like doesn't exist in basketball, right?

2:52:13Yeah. If somebody fouls somebody in basketball and everybody sees it, that's a foul. Yes. Right? And the crowd will go nuts. Usually. Right? Usually. But it'd be like a real one, like throwing someone to the ground. I could show you examples. There are some fucking wild things that don't get called for whatever reason. Don't you think that's a little bit of the corrupt referees? I'm not saying all of them, but that is one thing that's been 100 % proven is that referees do get paid off in order to influence gambling lines. Yeah, there was that one referee who who confirmed that it was the Sacramento Kings versus the Lakers, which was a series that was notoriously, everyone was like, yo, it was crazy.

2:52:54They didn't call any of these fouls on the Lakers, and they called all these fouls. And then a ref came out and was like, oh, yeah, yeah, that's weird. And it does kind of make sense because it was the Shaq and Kobe Lakers. You got to get them in the finals, dude. It was big money. God, it was so gross. His defense weirdly was like, no one told us what to do, but you kind of know what they want, so you sort of do it. And then you keep putting on good games and you keep getting the good stuff. Hang them. Public hanging. Fuck you. We can deal with Congress's insider trading, but basketball must be a fair act.

2:53:27Bad judges hanging. Hang them. Hang them all in front of the kingdom. All right, dude. Anything else before we wrap this up? No, thank you for letting a non-expert talk MMA with you. I love talking to non-experts. Dude, thank you so much for everything, as always, dude. My pleasure, brother. Thank you. You're the fucking man. I love you, dude. You're the fucking man, too. I love you, too. We'll have fun tonight, right? Are you coming? Are you leaving? I gotta go right to the airport. You gotta go. Ah, damn. Last night was fun. There was a lot of fun. It was a lot of fun. Good times. All right.

2:53:55Bye, everybody.

2:54:08Thank you.