JRE MMA Show #153 with Joe Pyfer

23:45And, you know, I lost sponsorship. So I was depressed. So I was sidel, all that shit and 20 years of my life, I think at that point. So you were really concerned that that was the end? Yeah, I mean, look, I started this at 4 1 ,5 years old. You know, I don't know how much you know. But, you know, I started this at 4 1 ,5 years old. And I haven't seen another path. And this was my A. And there was no B. So if A didn't work, that was it. So at 4 1 ,5, you knew you wanted to fight? Yeah, 8 years old, I knew I wanted to fight. 4 1 ,5 I started Jujitsu. 5 years old, I did my first competition in Naga.

24:16And, yeah, I mean, 8 years old, I started developing like a little bit of a confidence. I was so run down and abused that that was where my confidence started coming from. So I never had a dream of the belt. And I could say all these years, I've never had a dream of holding a belt. But I always had a dream of people chanting my name when I was walking out to a sold out crowd. So that was always my dream. And I always wanted that. And, yeah, I mean, I was in a kid to hang out with kids. You know, I was homeschooled. And, yeah, there's a lot of detail to uncover in there. But, yeah, I mean, I've known I wanted to do this all my life.

24:52And when I tell you there was no plan B, bro, there was no plan B. When did you have your first MMA fight? How old were you? I was, I think, 20 years old. 20 years old. Yeah, 20 years old. Actually, no, that's not true. Yeah, it is true. 20 years old. I think it was 2017. It was my first fight. Or 2016, one of those years. And amateur or amateur? So PA, I'm PA boy at the time. You have to have five amateurs before you could go pro. Oh, really? That was the rule when I was fighting. So you had to have five. Is that still the rule? I'm not sure. I think it is. You definitely have to have amateur experience to be considered to get your pro license.

25:29What if you're like an amateur wrestler? Or something like that. Does that matter? I don't think so. I think it's just the way that the PA commission was with Greg Serr back then. It's not a bad idea. So I went four and one as an amateur. And I felt so held back with the bullshit shingards, not being able to punch somebody in the face. Oh, that's how the amateur is. Can't punch the face. No, no, no. No, no. So I couldn't wait to turn pro, man. I felt so held back. And my kind of training, like I trained at fight factory, which was a gym that had Eddie Alvarez when he was 19. I met Eddie before he even had us first fight.

26:03Oh, wow. So when I say I know a lot of these guys will say, I know these people. I'm the OG in the gym as the young guy because I've been around for so long. So that's why when these fucking clickbait turds come out and they say, oh, you know, he's fighting a guy with a lot of experience. And Gerald Mearsharts got the most submission. And when you're not doing anything that I have never seen. Now, there's a difference between watching on the TV and saying, he doesn't do anything special. And then you get in there and you feel somebody's presence. You feel that energy. You feel that intention. You know, so I knew that motherfucker wasn't going to bang with me.

26:39I knew Abdul was going to bang with me. That's why as soon as I cracked him, and as soon as I let him feel me, like, yeah, motherfucker, he's like, go ahead. And, you know, he didn't get that. He didn't get to get going. You know, I checked him immediately. Like your powerhouse, you're an alpha. Well, so am I. Come take it. So I fight with a heavy heart in there. You know what I mean? You try and take my living from me. I'm still a poor kid. That's my mentality. You know what I mean? I'm nothing. And I'm trying to be something. You know what I mean? So you better be ready to kill me, motherfucker.

27:06It's like, that's how the same thing with this guy, Jack, man. Like, nice guy. You better be ready to die in there. I'm coming for you. Like, I don't want no decisions. You talk about your abuse. Like, what exactly was the abuse? I don't want to give the short version, right? You know, this is a moment right now that I get to recognize that I'm in front of somebody who has, you've heard so many stories, so many crazy things. And, you know, my story is definitely not up there with the crazy things, right? But my story, I'm unique. I'm one of one. So my story is, you know, I started out. The abuse started when I was a year old.

27:41My parents both blame each other. You know, child services in and out of our lives. I'm one of five kids. I got four sisters, two older, two younger. And, yeah, I started getting beat as a one year old from when I was told it was because I chipped myself, right? It's what kids infants do. And so that's when it started. And, you got beat for going to the bathroom? Shit, my diaper, yeah. The story is, I shit my diaper, reached in my diaper, wiped on the walls, and then I got beat for it. Neither parent owns up to it, but both parents have blamed each other. Just because of the physical abuse on my father's side, 100 % has to be him.

28:19My mom was not physically aggressive by nature. You know what I mean? She definitely what my ass, you know, a good amount, but it was never with the mean intentions, you know, comparable to my father. It was more verbal on her end. But, yeah, so it started then. And bro, since the time I've had memory, I remember getting my head stomped, getting beat, getting screamed at slap. And that humiliated, just run down, told you're never going to be anything. And, you know, my sister's received, unfortunately, received the same treatment. And, yeah, so, I mean, abuse has been something, and toxic, and I mean toxic.

28:56Like, when I'm going to say, like, breaking somebody down, I didn't have an ounce of self -esteem. I was my dad's puppy. I didn't know no life, being homeschooled. You do school, right? Is he still around? Still living, yeah, still living. I'm not sure where. I've parted ways with him, and I don't want to talk to him. Next time I see him is probably, you know, when it's done. And, I don't hate him. You know what I mean? I don't hate him. But, I despise him as a human being, as far as, you know, what he's given back to the world, and the kind of person that he's accepted to be. But, yeah, I mean, yeah, he's still around.

29:33I just don't know where, and I don't really care where. So, I know my mom still lives at the house that I grew up in, and... It's so hard to believe that some people are capable of becoming what they become, you know, and to do that to their child. You know what's fucked up about it the most is that it was almost better for me to have never known him than to know him and see how it went and lose him. You know what I mean? Because I love that man as a child. That was my idol. Nobody could beat him in the gym. Like, that was what I thought. And I never thought he was a liar, you know, and then right around 15 years old.

30:09And I definitely think I was behind, you know what I mean? Socially. Just because of being in home schools. So, my dad wanted to get in such security disability, and he was a stay -at -home dad. You know what I mean? Collecting SSD and fucking doing nothing. But, beating his kids and screaming and sitting. Basically just being, you know, a child abuser to all of us. And never once has he ever taken accountability for the wrongs that he's done. And if he's tried to finagle it, it's been to be like, hey, you were a bad kid. And it's like, yo, I want to know. I want to know how is a bad kid. I didn't steal.

30:47Sure, I lied as a kid out of fear because I was afraid to get my head stomps or get beat like a man. You know, I didn't get a traditional ass whooping job. Like neither of my sisters either. They got picked up by their necks, picked up by their hair, strangled, you know, and there's many stories, you know. And as you know, we have a documentary, right? And I refrained from putting the details of specific stories because the documentary is not about, whoa, it's me. Pour me. It's about a, I never threw all of this, gave up on the dream to get to the UFC. Even when I broke my arm and I thought I was doing, I did everything right.

31:28I didn't go out and party. I didn't go out and do drugs. I've never, I've never smoked weed. I've never done, and I'm not saying weed to drug, but I've never smoked weed. I've never smoked a cigarette. I've never taken, popped a pill. I've never done anything. I didn't go out to strip clubs. I didn't go out and bring girls home from the bars. It's never been me. So, yeah, I mean, I was obsessed with this. I was obsessed with this. And I was obsessed with this because I knew if I couldn't do this, I would have checked out. And that's what made me, you know, that's what made me, like, keep going motherfucker, keep going, keep going, keep going.

32:02And I just kept beating down the door of people, like my coach that, you know, has come with me. I've known him since I was 10 years old, you know, and he's seen me wear in the gym. And then nothing's changed. He could tell you that from, you know, the only thing that's changed is my maturity, the way I look at life, perspective. But, yeah, man, I mean, it was a rough background. It only got worse as I got older. It's a horrible thing to hear. You know, as a parent, it's terrifying to think that another parent could do that to their child. But we all know it's true. And we all know that it can do one of two things to someone.

32:36It could just ruin your life. Or it can give you this unstoppable fuel. And that's what it seems to have done with you. I would never wish that on anybody. But I often see people like you that are so fucking driven and so angry in there. And so effective because of that, like so dangerous because of that. I'm often wonder, like, is it even possible to make a guy like you without that? I don't take so. I look at like Mike Tyson, the same thing. I don't take so. But I think that's where I have my appreciation for him. You know, I'll never discredit him. I would not be in the sport if it wasn't for him.

33:13He was the one that went to the gym. He's the one to introduce me and I will give respect where it's due. Was he a fighter? So he grew up in Kensington, Philadelphia. I don't know how well you know, Philadelphia. Shit hole. Bad parents. Mom apparently was, you know, borderline. I don't know if she was a prostitute or whatever, but he was homeless from. He was passed home to home. He was always passed back and forth to his parents. So he lived a much rougher life than me. And, you know, you got jumped all the time back then. It was, you know, a very segregated type, you know, you don't come into this part of Philly.

33:46And you don't cross this part of Philly. And so he would get jumped all the time. I think he was like a timid, like skinny, nerdy male nutrition child growing up. So I know his dad, my grandpa, who I've met a handful of times, was in the Vietnam War. But then when he came back, apparently my dad's story is that he used to sell drugs all the time. And was always high. And like, that's the story he painted to us. So in my eyes, like, we never knew him really other than a handful of times we met him because they were bad people. And he despised them. And he always held like the craziest anger towards his family.

34:21Like, they all blackballed him. He was the black sheep. So yeah, I mean, he grew up rough too. But, yeah, I mean, he, um, he boxed, apparently, for a long time. You know, he used to tell everybody was 115 and four. He can't fucking find the guy's records anywhere. 100 % bullshit. Dude, it's a fucking storyteller. But he could box, you know what I mean? Even if he didn't fight, he could box. He would do well against guys that were pro boxers or guys that were in the gym. My dad was a tough dude. He was good. But, you know, definitely always lied for his convenience, for his story. And, uh, yeah, as he was learning Jiu -Jitsu, with a guy named Steve Hague, who wound up owning fight factory, who taught me Jiu -Jitsu, alongside with my dad, but that's how I got into it.

35:06So, I owe him a thanks for the tools that he gave me for the house I have gone to build. That's how I see it. You know what I mean? I don't think he ever intended to give me these tools and me going fucking build a house with it. And I think he despises me for it. I mean, he's one of the guys when I broke my arm, sends a message, face down, ask up, just how you like it. You'll never... I told you. Bro, he sent a lot of shit, man. He has sent a lot of shit. And don't get me wrong, I've sent a lot of shit back. Like, we've argued, you know what I mean? He brings that special rage where I would like lose my life for his life over it.

35:37You know what I mean? Like, I have to separate myself from him. Jesus Christ. So, yeah, I mean, but yeah, there's no whole tomorrow when it comes to that guy. The way he manipulates, the way he lies, the way he has basically hurt every single person. He has no true... He has no long lasting friendships in his life. There's a reason for that, you know? Yeah, that's horrible. Yeah, so. Not a good human being. It's not good, but again, I mean, I hate to say it, but in your line of work, it's like a superpower. It is a superpower, you know what I mean? I got that dark devil with me when I need him.

36:10And I don't mind it, you know what I mean? I can be a sweetheart. I can be a good person. I'm a giving person. I give a lot back in the dark to my teammates, you know? One of the kids is Jose Soto, who just, by the way, got surgery today. Hope you're doing well. I think he's gonna... Like, he's got one eye. Like, like, visibility. And he's one of the toughest guys I've ever sparred and he's a amateur. And... How is it... I want to ask you about this. Like, you know, a Charibullet is one of... That's why I'm saying it, because I'm telling you right now, this kid will blow up that, dude. How is Charibullet able to fight?

36:45I mean, how do you pass athletic commission standards? So, I don't know. So, I think that from what I've heard, it's... I think it depends on the commission and where you're fighting. In PA, I know he has to have, I think, and I may be wrong. So, somebody don't roast me for it, but I think you have to have... I think it's called a 22, 2200. It has to be some type of visibility. So, you have to see objects or... Yeah, objects. ...shaped something. You have to be able to at least identify something out of that eye. Right. And, yeah, I mean, I think... That is the craziest way to fight. When you already have lost one eye.

37:20Bro, he's bigger than me. The kid I'm talking about is bigger than me. He's bigger... He's like 225 right now, and he's in shape. Ab's cut. I'm telling you. I can't wait for this kid's future. But, by training what I... But, my point is, I give back to a lot of... I try to give back to a lot of my teammates. Because I didn't let the things that hardened me and made me upset become a piece of shit. I don't think I'm a piece of shit. I think I'm a good person. I don't think I'm the best person. I'm not the nicest guy by a long shot, right? But, I think this world is about what you get. You give back.

37:56And, you know, how you can. If you're not giving back in some way, what's success that you have? Then, I think you're a piece of shit. I don't care if you're a billionaire. If you're not giving back and you're not trying to help the younger generation. That's already so fucked up. Especially the people around you. Especially your tribe. Yeah, I mean... I couldn't agree more. The one eye thing, man, is it just still really freaks me out. Like, shout out to Michael Bismeng. One of the fucking toughest teams. To ever do it. Hey, you did it in the dark. He scammed systems. He scammed the athletic commissions for 10 fights.

38:28For 10 fights that do far with one eye. But then, look at the other part of it, right? Like, if he goes out there and he's getting smoked and he's not competitive, like, sure, polls card and say, hey, you can't do this. But then, you're gonna tell somebody that they can't do what they've trained the whole life for. Because of something like that. That's not fair, too. You know what I mean? Well, you look at Charibault. I mean, obviously, I mean, depth perception is the first thing that goes when you lose one eye. Yeah. It helps, but Charibault is one of the most accurate and precision strikers.

38:56I mean, he's got some flaws in his game. Let's take down defense. It's terrible. Yeah. He's got to learn how to wrestle. I mean, did not know how to get off his back. It's crazy. It's from Dagestan. From a guy that's not a wrestler. Right. Yeah, it's a problem. It's a problem. But also, him on the feet is a fucking problem. Oh, man, guy that kicks that much. I don't want to fight that guy. It's dude's annoying. It's not even, it's like, I hate that kind of style. That's shit that you're like Jack style irritates the fuck out of me. Jack Dillamondle. No, Jack, uh, her man's a hermandson. Oh, no, I hate his style.

39:28Fucking bounces around and like, he's just an awkward, weird, like weird shit. Charibault's not weird, but you know, he's so, he's so fast and kicks and, man, I want a bang, not kick. Hermandson in you is when? When is that February 10th? Nice. Yeah, so like 25 days or some shit like that, but not too far. I'm counting. That's a very good fight for you. It's a very good fight for me. I think, uh, I think a lot of people will try to pull this experience, pull shit again. And, uh, he's definitely my toughest fight on paper. And I think he will be my toughest test. But, uh, one thing's for sure, he better not let me get that one, as I got that one.

40:04So, um, he's a dog, he's tough. But I think we know what his style is. If you look at Jack, it's like, you gotta get the takedown brother. Because if you stand in bang with me, I'ma put you down. You know what I mean? I'm not playing for decisions. And, uh, you know, shit, it might come back to bite me, right? It might say it all confident. I might lose. Might happen. But I just don't think that that's, I don't think that's the next chapter for me. And, uh, yeah. There it is. So, fight night at the A -Fix. No, you look great. That's nonsense. The fucking A -Pix is the greatest place ever to see.

40:38I like it. Everybody's complaining that I keep fighting there, but I like it, man. I like hearing my shots. I like hearing them. Yeah, I wanna hear it. I wanna hear him grow up when I hit him. I wanna hear him win. It's like, I wanna see it. Like, I don't have any outside noise blocking that. You hear your coach. You hear your corner. You hear everything. It's the, to me, the, like, when we were doing the, uh, COVID fights, when we were doing a lot of the fights from the A -Pix, including, like, World Title fights, like Francis and Gano, when he beats D -Pay, there was no crowd. Yeah. Which was so crazy.

41:09But for me as a commentator and as an audience member, I was like, God, how lucky am I that I'm here for this, that this is like, you know, the whole world's fucking shut down. And I get to be cage -side for this with nobody else here. It was a fortune in time, man. It was a, it was a fortune at time, til I think, like, being in your position, like you're saying, right? You know, being able to be there. You've been around for so long, no, man. Like, you are a nut, right? I mean, and you're, you're a part of the UFC in a big, big way. And not just a commentator, you know what I mean? So you being a part of that is also historic too, you know, but being able to see it with a guy like that in person, that's why I was upset with John Jones, man.

41:47I was gonna go to that fight. Yeah. Oh, man. Because he's on his way out. I love John Jones. I love John Jones too. That dude is, I hate when everybody, everybody's so much sidestep, some... I know. When he tore that peck muscle, I was so bummed out. God damn, I wanted to see him versus D -Pay. It was still hope, maybe. Yeah, maybe. Maybe it's summer. It seems like that's what they want to do. It seems like that's the fight they want to do. He keeps vocalizing to Tom Aspenal, you know what I mean? And I feel like he already wrote, like, which we all kind of assumed, but I think he'll have that fight with Steve A.

42:21If Steve A is still hanging around. And then, you know, I'm kind of running off and to... Maybe, or maybe he'll do Aspenal, depending upon... I don't think he has any interest to be asked. You don't think so? No. Why not, man? And... What? Elbow surgery also? When did he have this? He said, while he was having peck surgery, because he had to recover for so long, he went ahead and got his elbow done too. Is this recently? Yeah, like, I thought this was the video, but this was like a little... Wasn't this the day... This was the day out right after, or a couple days out after it had happened, I think, that video.

42:53Oh, I'll find it, because it was... This is not recent though, that punching thing. Correct, yeah. This is like two weeks ago, a week ago. I thought it was on his Instagram account, but I'll look it up real quick. This episode is brought to you by Buffalo Trace Distillery. Actually, I have some Buffalo Trace cigars here they just sent me. One of the world's most award -winning distilleries that's been making whiskey the same way for more than 200 years, made as a tribute to the rugged, free -spirited pioneers who blaze their own trail to new frontiers. It embodies the perfectly untamed spirit of independence.

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44:29The thing is, John is what, 36 now? Is that how old he is? I thought he was 38. I wonder how old is John? 30s. I just had to hear it here, but here we could go. He had elbow surgery to shave off bone. 36. I thought he was a little bit older than that. When you start getting surgeries, when shit starts falling off. That's me now. I have about one injury for sure. John said he has surgery -shaved bones, and it's left elbow. Exactly that. When I just told you about my pain in my elbow, I have six or seven of those in my elbow right now. Imagine, and that's where all the nerves are. Some days I got a...

45:14I'm in pain. They can't go in there and scoop those out. Not before the fight. After the fight you think? I'm definitely going to mention it. I'm definitely going to mention it. Have you done any stem cells or anything for that? I had a torn labrum, and I got some stem cells to try and fix that. Then, honestly, it really agitated it. The fight got announced and everything. This fight is sooner than I wanted it to be in a way. But you don't say no to something like this. This is a good fight for me. When I say good fight, I think that this is a fight that I'm very capable of winning at this point in time with the trajectory I'm on with all the people call it hype, but I fucking earned it.

46:00This isn't hype. This is called I paid my dues, and I was out for a year and eight fucking months and made a comeback. Made my comeback fight with a broken left hand. Still knocked that dude out, which was Derek Brunson's wrestling coach. Came back, knocked out another guy. You know what I mean? So I broke my left hand going into that fight. I broke my left thumb in half, like right where the joint is, and I still went in there. I remember my coach was like, yo, we got to bite down. We just got to do this, man. Like, you do this. You're going back to the UFC. It was the first time I ever worked with my head coach, John Marquez.

46:34And how far out did you break your thumb from the fight? I think it was nine days. Oh, God. Yeah. So, bro, when they grabbed my hand, like the commission grabbed like the medical tent, and they grabbed my hand. I was like, oh, but I want to get in it. I took an extra glove or double exiled glove because, you know, my hands aren't that big, but I, bro, it was terrible. It was terrible. Did you find a way to tape it in some way? Yeah, I mean, we still taped it up. Like, it was a fight, right? So I still had tons of pain, but the pressure stopped me from feeling like it was like floating around. And I actually threw it, like maybe three or four times in that fight, just out of like habit.

47:14But yeah, I mean, first fight back year and eight months, break your left hand. I have the X -ray for it. And then, you know, let alone the nerves. I had to come back. I'd never thrown my right hand in a real fight. And man, it was awful. And then three weeks later, I was playing basketball, I loved playing basketball, and fuck it broke my ankle. And the UFC calls and says, hey, you want to fight on the contender series? So when I say I've had injury after injury, and it gets, it gets, keeps going. What do you think, like maybe I shouldn't play basketball? Maybe I shouldn't do so. I don't plan on.

47:47Yeah, so, but you know, so, yeah, you know, but here's the thing. I don't, my, my theory on life, it could be wrong. I don't want to, I don't want to cheat myself along the way to do the things that I still love, you know? And if I have to stop, if I have to live so fucking careful, I'm going to develop that habit to live like a fucking hermit crap. Right. And that's not me, man, I get on motorcycle. I'm going 205 fucking miles. Oh, that's true. Don't do that. But that's me, bro. That's just, that's, I'm a thrill seeker. Do you remember Diego Corralas? No, I don't, I don't know. Follow boxing.

48:22Yeah. Diego Corralas was like, he was involved. Should have got it's a paraplegic. No, he's dead now. He died in the motorcycle accident. Good job, Joe. He was a, he was a big boxer. He's famous for the one fight. Was it Jose Luis Castillo? Is that what it was? He had this fight with Jose Luis Castillo. It was like one of the greatest displays of guts. Because he was out, man. I mean, he was out, he was battered. His eyes are small. Watch this fight. So, Diego Corralas is in the white with the red stripes. Okay. And Jose Luis Castillo, who's also a very tough guy, is the guy in the red. And he rocks him and he hurts him.

49:01I mean, Corralas looks like he's done. I mean, he looks like he's done. He gets hit with a perfect left hook. He gets dropped. And he gets up. I mean, this is like a tutorial, a tutorial, a tutorial, a tutorial, a tutorial. He's got a few extra seconds. I mean, it was one of those fights where you just like, my god, he gets up. I mean, he is fucked. He's fucked. And Castillo catches him again. I mean, it looks like the fights over. Some, some referees maybe even would stop it right there. You know, I mean, some referees, you see, go down again like that. They're waving that off, right? A lot of referees.

49:38And then I would say, good call. Good stoppage. The guy's done, right? Watch this. I mean, Corralas is left eyes completely swollen shut. Can't see shit. Get dropped twice. It looks like he can barely stand. He's talking to the referee. He's like, don't stop this. Don't stop this. I'm good.

50:00He puts his mouthpiece back in. They give him some time here, which is nice. Get's back out in there. I mean, he's still fucked, right? Yeah. Yeah, you're not recovered. He looks bad. His legs, his legs don't look. And Castillo's a very big puncher.

50:21That, he looks like he's with it. And he gets clipped again. I mean, this is like an all -time classic performance. Oh, he's got him. I mean, this is really like Mickey Ward in a Turo Gotti. Castillo, punch himself. And then all of a sudden, all of a sudden, he comes back. Hmm. I mean, this is like from the verge of defeat. And he catches him with the left foot. Yeah, I mean, Castillo is done. You see, don't look at his face. But it's crazy if you think about how done Corralas was. That's another reference. It stops it right there. It stops. I mean, crazy, crazy, crazy comeback. Well, Diego was a wild fella.

51:11And he died on a motorcycle. Yeah, so I've heard some so many, so many bad stories. But like, you won't, you don't get into a car. I'm going to give you my, like, my, my thought, right? You won't get into your car. You know, the car we talked about, the cabarral. You won't get in that and be like, man, I could die driving this. Now, you know the dangers of it. Yeah. You know, I'll fast it is and whatnot. But you'll never, you'll never, like, I won't, I could die going in this cage. Right. I could get kicked. I could have one eye. I could be paraplegic. I could have my face broken, you know, and I get it.

51:47You know what I mean? So I just, I don't do things thinking that I'm going to fail. It's just, it's not in my brain. Like, I won't, I don't know. I just won't do that because I'm not worried about you. I'll get scared of the varied abilities of the other people on the road. I can't control the driving, the drunk and all that nonsense. Well, it makes you feel better. I don't have one right now. Good. And I got rid of it. So I live in a condo. So I got rid of it because I was going to put it in the house and I was like, oh, I'm landlord. Wouldn't like that. So I was like, you're going to ride the bike right in the house.

52:16I was going to sit in the living room. But I didn't do it. So I got rid of it. Yeah. But, uh, yeah, I'm a thrill seeker, man. I love cars. Will you tell me about your EVO? Yeah, I got that EVO 8 baby. Y body. Yeah. Yeah, big turbo. You got a picture of it? Yeah, I do. Dude, it's nice. Send it to Jamie. It's, uh, you get an air drop of two. That's a great car. Yeah, cool. Because I got my tires on that. Those are great cars. So you built that, right? Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So we have, uh, it had a 4G64 and now it's, I'm going, uh, 4G63. So, um, I'll send you two pictures so that we can see the front and the back.

52:52For people who don't know, explain what that car is. So that car is an all wheel drive 2006 Mitsubishi EVO. Um, it's a wild little car, man. Super light, crazy handling. Did I not save your number, Jamie? I'm going to send this to you, Joe. Okay, so it's me. It's a drop. Does the air drop work? Can you see Jamie on the air drop? Let me see. Yeah, one second. I'm looking through your Instagram too. You had other awesome cars on there, but not the EVO. Jamie, serious. Mac Pro Pro? Yep. Cool.

53:26Got it. Yeah, so that's been my therapy, right? So I've always wanted to be in the car as my neighbor when I was young. Um, you know, uh, his name is Henry Papiano. Good dude. Like, honestly, he, I love him because we don't talk all the time and I haven't talked to him in years. But, yeah, that's my baby. That's a wild little car, dude. So it was built the body and the paint. That's an actual P1 MacLearn paint job. It's a real actual paint of it. Um, and obviously he's got the Vultex on there, the wheels. So I bought the car built as is with a 4G64 in it, but now it has a 4G63. How many of those?

54:03That was a thing, huh? That set up was the 4G64 block. So that made a estimated from what I was told from who I bought it from that it made 808. Yeah. It's got a full roll cage. It's so crazy. Yeah. That car's got to weigh 2000 pounds. Now, man, let me tell you. What is it? It's like 4, it's like almost 4 ,000 pounds. Really? Is that heavy? Yeah, I think it's 38 to 41, 100 pounds, something like that. Dude, that is, yeah, you like my tag? For body bags, we got JP bag, baby. So cars, man, I smile all day. I could be around cars all day. It's definitely something that's like a therapy for me. It's how I found like, I don't know, man, I love it.

54:43I love it. 808 horsepower. It's the most agile car. So I've driven the Lamborghini Aventador, which was the dream car mine. Thanks to Royalty Exotics of Vegas, they always hooked me up every fight. Yeah. Man, there's going down memory lane. Yeah, I was trying to find your car. That's a wild car, man. Yeah, that was the first Corvette ever bought. It was a C5 -Z06. Stock is hell. Oh, those are fun cars though. It was a turd. They're fun though. They're kind of plasticky. Yeah, yeah. But you know what I have to say. My dream car was a C6 -Z06. I want to get one. And then I didn't like the interior compared to that one.

55:21Right. Because I like the leather. I like the old one. I don't like the plastic look of a lot of modern cars. Well, Corvette nailed it with the new interior. The new interior is perfect. Yeah. So the new interior is cool, but I hate the C8 look. Because they took away from the traditional long -snout, you know, real -world drive. Like now it's a mid -engine, short -snout. Like, I'm not a fan of it. And I can't fit in it very well. Right. So I don't like it. That's why I will never buy a Lamborghini. I'll never buy Ferrari. I won't buy Porsche. I don't fit in it. And I don't, I think Porsche is ugly.

55:51But that's just really good. Yeah, I'm not. I know. Yo, I will say driving a GT3 is amazing though. But the EVO, man, I've never driven a car that fun in my life. It's why you can do it some of those Japanese cars. Like with some of the things that people do to GTRs. Yeah. They have GTRs that are like 2000 horsepower. Yeah, it's just fun. I don't got Zillis. Fucking insane. Have you ever been to a drag strip? Yes. Yeah. You've raised? No, I've never driven a car on a drag strip. Now would you? No. I'm not interested in doing that. I've seen too many of them go like this. We banged up in the area.

56:24Yeah, man. Yeah, that's a skiiiick. I think you're making a little bit more than 1000 horsepower though. Don't that. Oh, to go up in the air like that. They probably got no weight in that thing. Like, you know what I mean? I'm not gutting a car. I don't want to. I saw a 67 Corvette recently do that on YouTube or Instagram or something like that. I just took to the air. Just the guy was just... And then up in the air. So you all get out of that. I'm not that policy. Like if I start feeling like I'm lifting over that. We saw it. It's crazy. Lucy. Yeah, that's a scary proposition when you go in that fast and straight line, your car just catches it.

57:03What's the fastest you've been in a car? On a racetrack? Yeah, I think I was 178, 179. What's the Camaro on that? Up to this number. Up, baby. Yeah. No, I'm good. Look at that thing catching air. Yeah, that's a good thing. Look at that guy. Yeah, he's launching through the fucking air. That guy said, fuck it full send. Hey, what a great re... Wow, look at that. He retur... That's crazy. But yeah, he was fully in there. That dude did some good shit in his life to not die there. Yeah, right. He was fully in there. Bro, I'd be so mad. I'd be so upset. I'd like my car's messed up now. Such a beautiful car.

57:37I've been watching car masters on Netflix. Oh, okay. Yeah, I don't know if you've ever watched it. No, I've watched it. Bro, it's like they take like rust buckets, pieces of shit. Like everybody would write off. You know, they do shit like zephyrs. They put a 3D, 3 -stroke or motor in a Tesla. Oh, wow. So it's pretty cool. Yeah, I love watching that stuff. That's like when I watched it before I got a bed. Yeah, I love cars. Yeah. I mean, it's gonna be a sad day when there's no cars. Cause I feel like that's coming. I feel like they're trying the world economic forum and all these fucking psychos.

58:07I try not to mention that I hate Tesla. Tesla's a great man. No, I hate them as far... Yeah, like I've driven them. Don't like it. I don't like the automatic braking. I don't like all the gadgets. Like the... It's like a big ass iPad. That's the best. I want like a knob to turn. Yeah. But I'm also American muscle like old school. I'm also important too. No, obviously with the EVO. But I do love muscle. If I had to choose like one car that gives me the most joy, it's old muscle cars. Do you have a particular car? Not really. I like a ball. You don't have a favorite and everything you've got. You don't have a specific.

58:38No, I have a 70 chavelle and I fucking love. Yeah. It's so raw. It's a 454 and it's pumped up. It's got like 650 horsepower. It's just... It's a perfect balance. Big ass fat tires. It's a roaster shop car too. So handles and breaks real well. But it's just... So that's exactly... So that's exactly what my neighbor had. He had a chavelle. And that's what started it for me. I remember being maybe six, seven years old. And we were poor man. My parents combined ever made more than 30 ,000 in a household of seven. Combined. But, uh... Yeah, I mean, I remember him ripping down. He had an orange one.

59:14He did the motor himself and he would rip down. As soon as he put me, you know what? I think that's what got me hooked on this adrenaline shit. He took me for a ride one time. Like, my dad's a deadbeat bro. I'll never get to do this. So I was like, all of the neighbors are dead. But he took me for a ride first time. I went over 100. And I was like, I was just remembering being like, oh my god, dude, so cool. And it's the sound, the feel of those things too. When I was, I think I was like 16, a buddy of mine picked me up in his friend's car. And his friend, they were, you know, just picked me up.

59:47We're gonna go somewhere. And his friend had a 70 chavelle. And it was perfect. It was just cherry. It was a black with white stripes that tuxedo won't just what I have. And I remember thinking as 16, I was like, how can this guy own this? How is it possible that a person could own this perfect car? I couldn't imagine it. I couldn't imagine it. Remember how old you were? I think I was 16. That was in high school for sure. And I remember, he ran out of gas and coasted. He ran out of gas at the perfect time and coasted right into the gas station. I was like, this guy's the coolest guy that's ever lived.

1:00:24He ran out of gas. He's got the perfect car. He coasted into this gas station. And I just remember, here's what I looked at the car. The car people, the car world. Because if you're a car guy, somewhere along the line, I mean, especially if you're building your own cars, your blue collar, right? Like, they could teach you shit. You know, I have these nerds today. They're calling triple A or, I don't know, a fucking double A. I don't know what it is. But they can't even change a tire. They don't know where's the oil go. They'd say, bro, you call yourself a man, but you can't change tire. You can't change oil.

1:00:56Like, you don't know what to do if the car starts, you don't know anything. You're useless. Well, that is the thing with modern cars. You open them up and it's a computer. There's just so much going on in there. And, you know, there's an ECU that's powering everything that has to be... Not unless you got a standalone. That's true. Yeah. No, but that's actually the issue. I think I'm going to run into what this new build on the EVA. I think I might have to get like a standalone and get it to in there. You know, get like a motor attack or something like that. Because there's always so much you could do with a stock ECU, you know, and even like safety fails and shit.

1:01:27I'm sure they probably haven't on some of your cars, but you've got to have your safety fails so you don't blow it up again. You know Gordon Ryan? Yes. Gordon Ryan is now obsessed with Vipers. He's trying to get me to buy one of these cool Volvo Vipers. That's my dream car. 2017 Dodge Viper ACR. You seeing the Flocka Penzole commercial? Yes. Bro, I like this. I'm on Crywatch and I'm like, find that commercial. Man. That car is a monster, but there's a company. It's calvo, right? It's the best. It's got to be. Yeah. There's one of the, you're around the country. Well, there's one company that's in town that jacks them up to like 2000 horsepower.

1:02:07Man, this shit makes my car crimes. I can't wait one day. The last Viper.

1:02:15It's an absolutely an amazing car. It's just the sound that is. Yeah. Look at the way that thing looks. God, in that hood, the hood with the vents in it. It's that wing too, the everything. Everything. That's what the TV show where the Viper changed. No. There's like 1995. I thought it was real. It changed from the red convertible to the yellow hardtop. No. You thought it was real? How old were you? Damn, I don't want to. Look at that, Flocka Penzole. That's hot. That's how I drive. I bet. Look at that, fucka Penzole. I'm just not as good as that guy. And you can't get that bitch in an automatic.

1:02:53It doesn't exist. You don't, that fucking automatic. You don't get a fast car in automatic. Not that one. Not that one. Look at that motherfucker. That is goddamn monster. That is a American monster right there. Woo! It's got that supercar sound. That V12. Good Lord. Is it V10? I think it's a V10. Yeah. Look at that, fucka. Look at the fire coming out of the sides. Remember the hard bit of sound. Woo! That's beautiful man. Whoever drove that knows how to fucking drive. What a car. If you don't get excited by this move somewhere else. From a hard start race to watch it. Yeah, you need to go to another country.

1:03:38I get more trying to run away from driving like that than fighting. Look at that fucking thing. Good Lord. Hmm. Good Lord. God, that thing is amazing. Dodge, let's hook it up dude. You need to have me on your team. I love Dodge. I have a ram. I have a TRX that I got from John Hennessy. Do you like that? It's like thousand horsepower. Do you like a truck that fast? Fuck yeah. I love that one. Yeah. I love that one. I'll lay down on that. Sean Brady would be upset with this. Wow. I asked Ford Raptor. Those are great too. No, they're good. He's got an RAPter R. The V8 one is insane. Hennessy's doing that too.

1:04:20He's taking that up to a thousand horsepower. So Raptor R, twin turbo? No, it must be. It's either supercharged or twin turbo. I don't know. Well, I mean, regular Raptors are usually turboed. So I can imagine that turbo. The regular Raptor is a turbo. And this is, I think it has the same engine as the GT500. I think that's the idea behind it. Because it's 700 stock from the factory. And then Hennessy takes it and he jacks it up. So I'm 99 % sure it's supercharged. You don't remember this TV show? No. No, I never saw this. You thought this was real, Jamie? I was 10. I never heard of a Viper in my life.

1:04:55It just changes the color. Did you believe in Santa as a kid? He did till he was 12. Damn. It viper. Yeah, it was a TV show. Yeah, I'm not like, be sure you're something. Growing up. We didn't get the joy. There was no fucking Santa. There was no like, hey motherfucker, we ain't got money. You're not getting no gifts. Like we used to have the church like donated us like gifts and whatnot. Because I grew up Christian and whatnot. Well, there was no Santa. It's horrible for you as a child. But I firmly believe that being poor as a kid is also a supercharger. It's like a superpower. There's something about it.

1:05:28You're grateful. You're grateful and you can't replace that. You can't, if you have someone that grows up wealthy and then they just, they become successful in life, they're never going to have that same gear as a person who grows up poor. There's something about growing up poor. It sucks. It gives you a burning desire for the things that you want. Yeah. And you want to figure it out. I mean, these kids that are born into money, it's actually someone we both know where it's like sometime and even people like back home, it's like I know people that have kids where it's like they don't know how to like fit in.

1:06:04Because status and money and shit like that. So that could be damaging for a kid, you know. Yeah. It's good to have them in sports. It's good to have them in school curriculums like after school activities and I always tell everybody that's like, got a boy, if he's got a attitude problem, like put that motherfucker in wrestling. 100%. Wrestling is the best thing for a child. 100%. 100%. 100%. Because there's no easy wrestling. No, man. But you have to show respect to your coaches. You have to show up on time. You have to, you pay if you're late. You get broken down. You get broken down. It's good.

1:06:37That's the thing. They're getting the broken down. And then the kind of status you get from that, you really feel that. That's earned status. It's a different status. It's a team score, individual grating. You know what I mean? It's cool, man. Wrestling, like my life got real tough once I got to like once I left home. So my parents divorced at 15. Like I testified I never wanted to see my mom again. And then I left with my dad. So, you know, the other branch of that story is you got the abuse from at least my earliest memory of like four and a half, five years old. And then until 15 years old, then we leave.

1:07:13I go to PA with my dad because my mom basically hated my gut. It was like, it was such a defied family. It was the girls and my mom that we lived like the farm life. Like I grew up a farm boy. And against like my dad and the fighter, right? Like I was a puppet. And you know, I just mimicked everything that he said. But you know, I chose my dad because I didn't want to lose wrestling or or Jiu Jitsu or boxing and everything. But that when I got up to PA, he had already had a girl he was laid up in that it was like, that's all that mattered to him. And then she worked. He doesn't work. You know what I mean?

1:07:49So he found somebody to pray on to manipulate, to do his thing. And then it was like, I don't need my kid no more after I went to court. And like, you know, I didn't understand the consequences of testifying, testifying a court against your mom and being dragged to court out of school and that humiliation. And you know, I didn't talk to my mom and my sister for years. And we don't talk currently. We haven't talked since before I got into UFC. We haven't talked since before I broke my arm. Wow. Because I knocked my sister's boyfriend out for being a method. Oh Jesus. Yeah. Yeah. So. Yeah, that is what it is.

1:08:24But, uh, but yeah, man, I mean, once I moved up to PA, that was the worst. Like that short span from 15 to like 18 was like, man, like I was ready. I was out. So where were you staying during that time? So I stayed in media PA. I lived in, uh, I lived in, it's, it's Pennsylvania, but it's like 25 minutes outside of Philadelphia. So it's like the suburb city. Um, honestly, it's like a bougie. It's not bougie, but it's like a towny, nice town. And, uh, you know, everything was new to me. I came from a school of 330 kids. I got into high school. I was in a school of like 1600 kids. It cost four grades.

1:09:04But they were all like preppy fuckers. Like kids down in South Jersey where I grew up, they were, they were all fighting each other, like beating each other up, jumping each other after school. Up here, everybody would talk shit and nobody would fight. So it was like a weird, it was a weird thing for me to adjust. I didn't have friends. I didn't have a phone like until I started getting a job and yeah, man, it was weird. It was really weird. I, uh, I lived in a two bedroom apartment. Um, and my dad, his girl at the time, like, she's married to now, um, and her two daughters, we all lived in a two bedroom apartment.

1:09:39You know what I mean? So it was like, it was just like a pun, it was, it was a terrible living situation. And then the beatings, man, I swear to God, he used to beat me up just to prove that he could beat me, you know, and show his girl that he was tough. And he, you know, like nobody could fuck with him, type of deal. And it was just like, man, so it got real dark, man, and start and like, stop at me, breaking my, like, broke my teeth. Um, I had two, two crowns, you know, because of him, because he'd break my teeth. And I would, I would curl up. Like, he would punch me like a grown man, but I would curl up.

1:10:09He would throw uppercuts. Like, that's how intent this guy was on getting me. And, um, the last fight we had, it was over a fucking game called Uncharted 3. And it was, we were playing call up, but because I would get more kills in him, this is the kind of shit he would rage at. He, so, and mind you, throughout all these years, right, he's on SSD. The reason being he had a car accident, he was an oil truck driver. Uh, I forget the story of who blew the light, but when he was going through the light, he got T -bone, or he T -bone somebody blew out his back, had to get surgery. Apparently it failed.

1:10:42Whenever he wanted to jump up and what your ass though, dude, it wasn't crippled no more. So it's crazy, you know, and he would go box 15 rounds, but throughout 2004, all the way until I was 15 years old, and then some, this man was on narcotics all the time. He was on Viking and Perkis said, oxy, and he definitely was addicted. There was never a time that I didn't see it. The dude used to have like 60 fucking bottles of it. And he would take medicine and then he would drink two yin -links. And I think when I look back, I'm like, man, like that shit'll make him other fucker angry. And, uh, yeah, I mean, it just got worse as I got older, but I remember the last fight that we had.

1:11:23It was, you know, I used to, I remember I used to look at him and be crying and say, you know, like, how come you don't love me? Like, I got this empty hole in my chest, because I didn't understand emotion. So I, like, trying to plead with him, like, yo, like something's wrong with me. I got something. I got a hole, I got a hole in my heart, like, or my chest. I don't know what this, I don't even know how to explain it. And, uh, you know, the things he would say in rebuttal would be like, keep fucking kill yourself. Your feelings don't matter. Shut the fuck up. And when I say jump, you say how high?

1:11:50Like, it was, there was no remorse for anything he did. And I think that's why I despise him. Um, you know, the dude hurt me. Uh, he hurt me for a lot of years that I had to repair. Um, and even then I still carry over some bed. Bed attitude problems. And, uh, you know, the dude fucking, it got to the point where it was like, either I'm gonna kill myself or I'm gonna kill him. And finally, he beat me after death the one day. I mean, beat me after death. And I packed a bag of clothes and he came out. He pulled a fucking knife on me, said he was gonna kill me with it. I shoved them right out the fucking door and never went back.

1:12:27She never went back. But how old were you then? 16. I was just turning. I was, I was, I was either 16 and the week after 17. I don't remember. Um, but I was, it was within two weeks of turning 17 when I left, um, or I just turned 17 and then left. So, uh, it was in the month of September. And yeah, so I left slapped in the park for a couple nights and, uh, then I went up standing up for a kid, uh, a black kid that was getting called Rachel Slurs and that was my first friend I had made and, uh, yeah, I mean, he wind up having, uh, he definitely was on the spectrum. Like he, he wasn't the smartest kid.

1:13:07Um, unfortunately, like he, he had some things that, uh, people would pick on him for, um, like being overweight and, and say he would say some weird stuff and whatnot. But, uh, yeah, he was the first friend that I developed and, um, his brother was in Juvie for arson trying to light somebody's house on fire. And he was adopted by a white man. So, but the house that they lived in, bro, it was like, the most disgusting living environment you could fucking think of cat piss infested hoarder of comics that were all destroyed from cat piss. Um, like every part of the house would have been sticky. Like your shoes would stick to the fucking floor.

1:13:47Um, and there were shit everywhere. The smell was like a pneumonia. Um, maggots in the sink because he refused for about four years to fix a garbage disposal. That's how long it sat there broken live wire on the overhead of the oven. So I lived in there, um, and I wind up with, I used to run papers to the courthouse and make like 75 bucks a week. So every time I would make a little bit of money and his dad would give me some money sometimes to like try and help, uh, like straighten up the house. And I would buy bleach and fucking bleach it and try to clean and, bro, it was disgusting. Like you could wash your clothes six fucking times and it would still smell like cat piss.

1:14:22No, yeah. And it was a very embarrassing, very humbling way to live. And I lived off instant food like microwave food for the next two years. All my wrestling high school years and the next two years that I was there, everything was either donated food for my wrestling coach. Um, well, Harmon who fucking man, that, that was my saving grace when I went to that school, you know, I don't want to miss that part. Like that's important to me. That man is the whole reason I'm in the UFC now. Wow. So, um, God damn dude, those were the living conditions, man. Like I mean, I mean fucking and he and my wrestling coach would come to the house and then I had truancy officers coming after me because I missed so much school.

1:15:07Um, it was either Diffus or some child services at a certain point that was like, who's taking care of you? Who's your caregiver? And, you know, I had a nasty response for him and nothing kind of came of it. But it was like, do I look like I'm fucking unhealthy? I remember slamming the door and the kind of the woman's face because I thought that we're going to try and take me from the house. But, uh, yeah, man, it was shitty times and, uh, you know, life beat you up in ways that you're not prepared for and doesn't change. No matter how much money you make, no matter your here, your here, there's always going to be a problem.

1:15:41It's just how you roll it. So well, for sure, but having been through the problems that you've been through, I guarantee you, you know how to navigate problems better than most people. I voice it a lot, you know, people always say I'm bitching. But I just, I'm a bro and I am sometimes I bitch, you know, because that's my way of coping. I'll put it out there. So it's stuck inside and that's something that's worked for me. You know, I say a lot of things that I feel and as long as I get it out, I'm happy. You know what I mean? Or at least I'm settled. I don't have that like anger, like waiting to explode, you know, that's the worst.

1:16:13You never think of where you would be if it wasn't for martial arts. In that sense. Kill myself. I would kill myself. 100%. I struggled even when I had it, you know, and that's the. That's one of the only things that gets people out. Yeah, I just didn't see a life for me, man. I was so stupid. And when I say stupid, like the whole time that my dad to stay at home, dad, and I want to give credit to my mother too, you know, my mother, I never really felt like loved me that much. And, you know, is what it is, but my mom worked her ass off. And that's why I get my work ethic. That woman held two jobs.

1:16:52She did what she could to provide. She wasn't, you know, she wasn't a bum. She was, she tried. And she did the best she could, what a dude like that. You know what I mean? She was, she never had another man. Still hasn't had another man to this day. She was married to him for 20 years. They had five blood kids. And, yeah, I mean, my mom respect for that because she's a hard work in woman. And then matter of she, she used to work at shop right home depoters, where she jobs and then CNA and, you know, she, she did what she could, you know, so I respected for that. And, yeah, I mean, fuck man, that dude was not teaching us homeschools my point for years.

1:17:35You were afraid to ask him to fucking give you a spelling bee. Because he was sitting at the fucking computer playing games. So if you did it, what the fuck do you want? What the fuck are you talking about? I'm like, it was always a huge like explosion. So you're a kid and you know, from getting beat by this person, it's like, I don't want to make a man. He might fucking slap me. He might hit me. He might do something. So all of us were scared. We didn't fucking learn anything. I tested to get in public school. Well, if I could help me back, I was dumb and shit. Like it is what it is. So, yeah, I mean, so my point is making light of something, you know, dark, you know, but then coming back to the dark side, man, if I didn't have MMA, I don't, I don't think I would be successful.

1:18:18I don't think I would have been strong enough. I don't think I would have had confidence. And I think life would have broke me, man. I think I would have taken, I would have taken, you know, the easy way out. You're in a great position now, though, man. You know, I know you've gone through hell, but it's, uh, I really do think that it's prepared you in a way that nothing else does, you know, just for the ability to overcome adversity, ability to deal with things. And again, that, the superpower of that horrible childhood, it sounds like a terrible thing. I would never wish it on anyone, but when I know that someone has been through that, and then you see them succeeding, like that's a special kind of person.

1:18:56That's a person that's got some extra gears. Yeah, yeah, right. Like, but you know what taught me that? The people I reached out to, I was, I was so broken, but I never stopped asking questions. Same your piece of, no, he was someone I always looked up to. He was 13, three, he fought in Bellator, like, you know, he wound up retiring because he had kids and he was working two jobs and it just didn't, like, it wasn't something he wanted anymore, you know, right? But he was someone I always idolized Eddie Alvarez was someone I always idolized. I still talked to him today, you know, like, I think he's awesome.

1:19:28But he would, I would always see him go to the gym, go home, he didn't bullshit, he didn't go out clubbing, he didn't do all the party shit. I'm sure he did at a time, right? But, you know, when he was with Jamie, he started having kids. I didn't see him, you know, and I didn't know him terribly well. I knew him in the gym really well. I didn't know him personally outside of the gym, you know, that's where I always saw him. But, um, yeah, I had a lot of good examples, right? And then man, as soon as I went to high school, I met Wilhelm who that guy housed me for four years because after I left that place, I had, bro, this is the, I'm going to, I don't care if this is ratchet, right?

1:20:04You want to talk about trash. I had a friend and I had a girlfriend, right? The worst girl I ever met in my life, um, leave it at that. Okay. I never known somebody. So I moved out of this place that was basically a shit hole. I started working in Verizon. It was my first job and I said, Hey, either I'm going into military because I don't know what the fuck I'm going to be with my life or I'm going to fight. If I get this job, I'm going to fight. I interviewed somehow. I must have been a good talker. Fucking got it in every job. No job experience. Fucking idiot. Somehow I landed it. Got a job, started work and why not moving out, moved into a condo across the street from my high school wrestling coach who, if you've seen the documentary is super impactful on my life.

1:20:47So I move across, then I moved from there after a year. I moved to another place. Was only there for a short period of time. The whole relationships wind up falling apart. I was trying to fight while knowing some of the day that I thought was a best friend had fucked around with my girl while he was engaged to his girl. And that was my fucking living situation. And I was so eager to have a best friend that the motherfucker was never a best friend. And it was like, man, you out. I got the heartbreak that I got every fucking turn. And this was two weeks before I had one of the biggest fights that really put me on a trajectory.

1:21:25Like, man, I'm going to, I'm going to kill everybody on fighting. And so that happened two weeks before then that was when I broke it off with my dad. He came over and he got my face one time. And then there's the only time I ever, I never put my hands on him. I never fought back and I even put my hands on him to this day. And but it was one of those times where you know how when I don't know if you've ever had this moment where somebody gets in your facing or a kid and you have the chain quivering or like fucking nervous and it's like, it's almost like you're trapped in fear. Man, he said some shit about putting a bullet in my head.

1:21:58He said he was going to come back and put a bullet in my head. I was like, I don't want the fucker before you get to that car. I was like, I'm going to bury you. Like, that's it. Like, I'll take out every fucking part of my angry being to destroy you. You will not make it to your car. Like, that's it. You're done. Like you die. And I think it was the first time like that motherfucker knew like, he always knew I was better. Like 16 years old, I could submit him. He was a brown belt and jujus, but I could beat him. And I think that started to intimidate him. And I think that's why the beatings got worse and worse and worse.

1:22:29Yeah, I think he was scared that I was going to come like rise up against him. But yeah, I mean, that was the last time and yeah, I mean, shit, man. So I've just had like betrayal, betrayal, betrayal, betrayal, but I haven't lost faith in people. You know, I met a couple of really good ones that changed my life and you never let them go. The horrible thing about having horrible people in your life is it can ruin your faith in people. But the one thing that it does do, it makes you really appreciate good people. Yeah. If you can, if you can get past it, you could read it like, you don't appreciate sunshine unless you experience a lot of rain.

1:23:07You have to, you have to feel cold to appreciate the warmth. You get spoiled. So that's exactly what I had to explain to somebody the other day. They're like, why do you live where you live? Why do you train where you train? I'm like, man, you know, it's like to go to the hood where our gym is. Our gym is in the hood. It's on a fourth floor building. It's like a, like a warehouse type shit. It's actually pretty cool. Bill, Sean was explained to me. Yeah. And like we're nothing fancy, man. Like John, John, John doesn't like John Marquez is my head boxing coach. And then John of a web is by a jiu jitsu coach.

1:23:41And John of a web is in Jersey and John Marquez and Philadelphia in hood. Like, man, we, we, it's, we're not a fancy facility. We have a fucking square cage like, you know what I mean? Like we don't have tons of money and we're in a shitty area. But John does it to, to help. He does it to promote like all these other gyms, all these other puppy mill fucking gyms that want to brag about this and that. They got nice state of the art shit. We only got no state. We got some hand me down fucking weights and we're, we're a grind, man. But we work fucking hard. And I like that. I like being in the trenches.

1:24:16So that when I come out, I appreciate it. When I go home, I appreciate where I live. And I don't live in the best place, but it's like, I live in a place that I feel safe in. And for many a years until my restaurant coach took me in for four years, I was not safe. I wasn't, I brought, I hadn't like fucking pissed myself till I was like 12 fucking years old. Like, thinking there was something wrong with me. I grew up thinking that I had a mental health issue like, like, something like I thought I was stooped. Like, I don't know. I don't want to say that. Well, you're tired of mental health issue with me.

1:24:45You, you were tortured mentally. My dad convinced me that they were something mentally wrong with me. Well, it was him. It was your environment. But how do you know any better, you know, imagine thinking that for so many years. And then when you're homeschooled, there's, bro, I didn't have fucking friends. I didn't know. So we were all the weird kids. And then when you're a response when you try to express emotion, one, one of the things, because this shit haunts me to this day, because I wish, I wish I kind of heard him. My sister said she wanted to kill herself because she felt like her dad didn't love her.

1:25:17And we go and we pick her up, right? This the kind of guy is we go to pick her up. The whole family goes to pick her up. My mom, my four sisters, me, we go pick her up, pick her up from school. My dad seems really concerned. Yeah, yeah. I don't know why she would say that, you know, but you could tell it's like, you could tell he was burning inside. So we lived like 10 minutes from school. We get home. We all get out of the car and we're all like quiet. We're all quiet. We're like, man, something's about to go down. Like soon as she opens the door, like gave the key, grabs her by hair, grabs her by pants, fucking throws her, chucks her in the fucking room, starts strangle her in, like, like put, like through on the fucking couch and then starts strangle her in between the cushions.

1:25:59And then we all have to find him to get him off. That's your response to your daughter who's suicidal. You know what I mean? So like when I say, and we were all mean to each other, that made it even worse. We were all mean. We were all carrying in that moment because we knew like, this isn't right. Seeing him hit my mom, cops being in our house 12 times a year and shit like that. Like, like I grew up this functional. They shit fucked me up and it fucked me up when I was toxic. I was, you know, negative. And I'm still like toxic and negative, right? But like you learn who people are. When you see that kind of shit, I can have conversations like a conversation I want to have.

1:26:34Like you're, you can talk about anything. Your open mind is like, but you're also, you got your beliefs, right? Like you're a real real person. I don't like everybody because you know when somebody's got this fake face. And my dad was one of those people. He had them fucking fake face, man. But the second he could get you in that door to hurt you, he would take it. And it's like, when you see, when you, when you grow up with that, it just makes you angry. And then that's why it's like, you're going to take half my purse. This motherfucker's my toughest test. You want to take it from me? Come on.

1:27:05Try it. And you might, and if you beat me, you're one of the best in the world in my mind. And I've never, I can, I can honestly say this through all that shit. I have such a strong confidence in myself where it's like, man, ain't no man beat me until it's been done. It's not happening. I have a loss on my career as an amateur because I was 174 pounds fighting at one 85 training twice a week with a full time job with that girl that just fucked me up. My first pro loss, struggle and let suicide depression, things like that still hadn't settled that beef with myself. First time I ever went in a fight was absolutely dominating the fight.

1:27:42I still, there's guys names Jonathan Potty. Love the guy. Super nice guy still talked to him. We never want to fight him again. Like, but it was a good loss for me. And then you got my arm break. I got one real loss, man. And I got one, I got lost to myself. I lost to my fucking mental health. Like I lost to, I lost before I got in. Right. So it's just you're in a very good spot now, though. And I want to talk to you about like where you fit in in the UFC's middleweight division because you're like what I would call on the cusp. Like you're a guy that Jack or Manson fight is going to put you into a great place if you win that.

1:28:19But you're in that conversation when you can fight in a title. That's what I'm saying. Like within the next year or two, you could be fighting for a title. Yeah. But I'm going to be smart, man. You know, mental health is something I fight every day. And the reason I keep bringing it up is because I'm going to fight and I'm going to win. And then I'm going to take some time and I'm going to go on vacation and I'm going to settle some things I got in myself, you know, within myself. And you feel like that's something that you have to do like to something you put it off. Yeah. Yeah. Now when you say, do you work with anybody?

1:28:51Do you have a therapist or so I just have a lot of people that I talk too close. I've tried therapy like three, four times and I've never really gotten a benefit from it. I don't know if it's just because I haven't met the right one. Or they haven't been able to get through to me. Like I'm not an open person where I like I'm an open person. Like I can talk about these things, right? And I may get upset about some of them and I still evoke strong emotion from it. But just because you're listening doesn't mean that I trust you with what I'm telling you. You know what I mean for you to give feedback and to me to receive it in a way where I think, okay, let me apply this.

1:29:25So I just sometimes I feel like therapy is just another fucked up human being telling another person, hey, you shouldn't feel like this. But or you should try this and try that. But that's why I love cars so much. That's why I love cars. I love nature. And I also want to take time because I haven't taken a vacation since I've been in UFC and a couple years before that. I haven't taken a vacation since before I broke my arm. And I think part of, you know, one of my biggest things isn't holding the UFC title. But one of my biggest things is buying a beach house and that super car I've always wanted that Dodge Viper.

1:29:57And, you know, having a loved one and going and traveling the world before I'm dead. I think that's what my idea of peace and happiness is and I'm desperately searching for it. And, like I said, you get a lot of power off the horrible experiences that you childhood. But the key is to not be trapped by it forever. And that's where some people have to, you have to figure out a way to come, come to grips with your life and just accept it and to move forward in a positive way. You're obviously a very good guy. You're obviously an incredibly hard worker and you're obviously very successful and you're obviously haunted by your childhood.

1:30:38But someone could probably help you develop the tools to put that aside. You're never, it's never going to go away. It's always going to be inside of you. That monster, he's always going to be in a cage. But I'm okay with that. But it's good to be, you're not going to forget it, Joe. You're never going to forget it, Joe. You're never going to forget it. But the key is not let it consume you all the time. And that is where someone can probably help you. You're never going to forget it. There's a monster that's going to be inside of you whenever you need them. You're never, that's not going to go away.

1:31:09It's just not going to go away. But to not live with it all the time would be very, very beneficial for you. Because then you would get all of the positive attributes that come from having a horrible childhood, which is this unstoppable drive, this fury that you can unleash inside the octagon. It's very different than other peoples. But you can get to the point where it doesn't consume your everyday life. And it's not something that you have to think about all the time. And you can think about positive things. You can think about growth and expansion and progress. And I think you're very capable of doing that.

1:31:44It's just so many people, they rightly so, dwell on the horrible experiences of their childhood forever. And there comes a time where that doesn't serve you anymore. And it rots at you. Where even with success you're still angry. Even with success you're still bitter. Even with success you still want to talk about it. You want to live it again and you want to go over it in your head. And that can rot you out from the inside. Because at a certain point in time your mind can't handle it anymore. Yeah, I would say I grew emotionally thin when I lost my first profile. That's where I was. Right. I can talk about it now and I can evoke the strong emotions when I remember with it.

1:32:28But I forgive them. I view my dad now as somebody like I said, I don't respect as a man. Because I don't think he's the definition of what a man supposed to be. For someone that teaches their kids useful tools and whatnot. But I forgive him because I think it's beyond his help because he never got help. Because he never settled with his. Now that is a man that has aged terribly because of his past and his demons that he's never let go. And I don't want to be like that. Well, you're not going to be like that. Well, I'm already not like that. I'm the only I'm the Joseph Oliver Pfeiffer the fifth.

1:33:03And I'm going to be the last. Because I think I need to make a lasting impression for my name. And I'm the first person that's ever, you know, like none of them have been to college educated, including me at a certain point, you know, I've become successful enough. I want to go to college and get some type of degree. And do you read? Not a big reader, but watch documentaries. Watch podcasts. Joe Rogan podcast. Don't rely on this fridge. Yes, no, no, no, it's it's you right. But it's it brings a lot of your podcast brings a lot of diversity. A lot of like you have to be open minded to listen to every episode, right?

1:33:41You have to like there's a lot of different perspectives from a lot of different successful people, right? So, but now I'm really big on listening to people that have been through like traumatic things. I like listening to what a lot of like like army vets that have spoken like Nicholas Irving. The first black American sniper who had like 33 confirmed kills or something like that. I watched his documentary and hear the trauma that he's gone through and the things that he's done and how he is still making a good impact for other people. You know, that that was that's a powerful dude. And my life is very common across the world.

1:34:19Unfortunately, unfortunately. Yeah. It's very common. So I think I find light and you always hear me say I don't know if you recognize, but after every fight, I don't want to be a role model, but I want to be an inspiration for the kids that it's like a staying a sport, don't let that sport go. And whatever that unspoken is that stops you from quitting, follow it. And if it's in wrestling or if it's in soccer or if it's in basketball, keep doing it. I used to get laughed at my whole life. I would sit at cafeteria. I stopped sitting with kids. I would play chess every day with my wrestling coach during lunch because kids would laugh at me every time I sound like I'm gonna be in the UFC.

1:34:56Everybody would snuff, you know, like like like giggle at it. So I just removed myself, put myself in a better situation. I didn't like this friendship. I got out of it. I moved to a place where I could pursue fighting, you know. Look, I found people that were chasing things themselves, right? You know, so I think it's just about putting yourself around the right people and constantly wanting to evolve. If you stop evolving, you pass away. That's a giant part of it. Putting yourself around the right people. Either it's through watching documentaries about the right people. If you don't have access to the right people.

1:35:30Or if you're very fortunate like yourself to get to a gym with his great people. And to live like my gym is my family. Yeah, you know what I mean? My gym is my family. I know I know Sean and shit and I always talk about him. I always talk about him because when I joined that team man, I was not in UFC and I don't think a lot of people had a lot of faith in me. But coach John took me in, never charged me a penny, you know. And I couldn't afford it. I couldn't have afforded it if he did. And I made the switch before I even got the second surgery. You know, he cornered me and I feel it. Like I feel I can look at them and know that they like they get emotional too.

1:36:08Like we're fighting for something big here. Right. You know, fighting to change my life still. And so there's a big fight coming up this weekend obviously. Sean Strickland and Dr. Custuplacy. What do you think about that? That's your division. Yeah. Both very beatable. That's what I think. I like Sean Strickland. I like Sean Strickland. I like DDP too. I'm going to go the American way. I want to vote. I think the American boy keeps it here in America. But Dr. Custuplacy is a very unusual guy. He's a very unorthodox power puncher like Ford. But there's a lot of openings to clip him and he doesn't have a granite chain in my pit.

1:36:49He could take a shot. But like you like I don't think he's falling anybody that could test his chin yet. So, besides that's not true. Let me shut up before I get hated all right. Robert Whitaker was a dog. But he had Robert's number man. He had a good plan and he's deceptively technical. Yeah, he's just exactly. So he knows where I think he's a guy. Let's put it this way. I think he's a guy that knows what he's good at and knows how to get there quick. And that's why he comes out hot because he knows how he's going to wear on you. Also like yourself, he's very big for the weight class. I haven't seen him in person.

1:37:22He's a big boy. Yeah, I haven't seen him. He looks like a fucking heavyweight. But you know what? I watch this interview on the way here on the flight. And he's not stupid. He's a smart guy. And I have respect for all of you. I don't think you get that far if you're stupid. Yeah, you don't. You be surprised man. I mean, there's you know there's some dumbass people in this. Not at the top. Yeah, not at the top. Not at the cream of the crop. You don't get to that level. Yeah, you have to have some innate form of intelligence. Yeah, 100 % because you also have to be coach intelligence. Yes. I have a lot of respect for Sean because Sean, when I fought Gerald was in the back.

1:37:56And even before I was in the UFC, he said, hey, you want to come train. And I said no because I knew it was like man, like I don't like training with people down when I have to fight. Right. You know what I mean? But I got respect for him. I like his story. It's got a crazy style. I don't like listening to him talk. He sounds like a drunk person to me. So I'm not like a bit, but well, he off also like you came from a very abusive child. Yeah, no, no, no, man. Yeah, look at what he's done. Look at what he's done. And he's not, he's not a style that you're like, oh my god, but you're a style like man, this is on orthodox and it works for him.

1:38:29He knows what he's good at. He's confident in what he's good at. And he's put himself in the fire against some of the best to figure out that it works. So, yeah, I mean, I do think that DDP has the bigger advantage in this fight. In the way. In the way that Sean has been chin checked a few times. And I think, you know, competitively, I think that Sean is the easier guy to beat. If he's a hard guy to hit, he's a hard guy to hit, but when you hit him, he reacts big, I think. And I think a style like DDP is perfect for it. I think he's going to make him like, it's on orthodox like Sean. You know, he can be standing right there, but he's really good at his range.

1:39:10He knows how to, you'll just miss. You hit his hands, you hit his forearms. He lifts his leg. He teeps you like standing straight up. It's really strange. And he's actually a hard guy to keep down. I think people underestimate Sean Strickland's due to abilities, right? No, it's just his very high level. But yeah. I mean, they're both good, man. That's what I think. I think they're both good, but, uh, yeah, I mean, I hope the belt stays here in America. Will you shocked when DDP beat down Robert Whitaker like that? I was surprised that he did it the way he did it. I didn't count him out, but I didn't have him winning.

1:39:45You know what I mean? I definitely thought that it was going to be close. It was going to be tough. I really did. A lot of people counted him out. And I was like, that's crazy, bro. This guy's not, I think he was 20 and two or something like that. Yeah. Like, man, this dude can bring it. Like, he's going to make it a dogfight. And I don't care how technical you are. Well, somebody makes it ugly. Your energy level's down. And you're not that technical anymore. Yeah, I mean, I thought it was pretty impressive. I was very impressed. I was surprised that you could take him down. Yeah, he's a big guy, man.

1:40:14Yeah, okay. I got to see him, man. I keep hearing that. I was big. I mean, he, I don't know what you want. You say that when you start your cut, what do you walk around at? 218. 218. Oh wait, start my cut fight week. Yeah. I'll be like 208. Okay. But when you're in training before you start in cut, you're about 218. 218 to 20. And the heaviest you get is fat. That's it. Yeah. I, it's like my cap. I won't go any bigger. I'll have to go all the way, class. And I might in a couple of years, you know, but I think I would take, I would take the proper time to not be disrespectful and fight a fucking guy as big as Johnny Walker or somebody like that.

1:40:47Right. You know, on Calive, they're thick bone. Yeah. I think a lot of people underestimate like, there's bone density that comes with a certain size too. Yes. You know what I mean? I would have to throw myself a little more mosquers than these guys. I have to frame to do it. And take like a good six months to a year to build myself to then make that move up. Do you find it increasingly difficult to get to 185? I do. I do. Yeah. It sucks. It's his role. So you're definitely not too late. The week of the cut. 208. And then I'm already like, sure. Yeah. Like I'll show you like what I look like. And are you using, uh, who are you using to do this?

1:41:29Using nutritionists and, uh, weight cutting expert? No. I'm just not. Yeah. I, I, I used to, the guy Castro with UFC P .I. He's been great at, uh, controls a little bit. Okay. But you have CPI. Those are the experts. Yeah. But I don't like, like I, I keep them updated with my weight cut as I'm coming down. But I don't do like, I don't know how people fucking waterloo, man. I don't like it. I don't like the water loads. I do my cut. Like I know my body pretty well. And, uh, I get down, but it's just, it's just, I don't know. Is your cut primarily sauna or do you bike ride with a wet suit on? I train twice a day still.

1:42:03Yeah. Yeah. I, I, I sweet sweat, uh, do a couple rounds, pad work, get the, get the sweat flowing, do a couple ground and pound, uh, you know, wrestling drills and, and then do a couple ground and pound rounds. And then I'll just take you to a very little water, take in very little water. You know, the proper nutrition, they kill the sugar cravings and the hunger and shit like that. But yeah, I do, I've been getting better and better and better and better at it. But it's still hard, still very hard. And do you have a protocol as far as rehydration? Yeah. So I've been drinking whatever the UFC gives me, um, like their rehydration.

1:42:37And then I'm really big on like, like sodium and potassium and takes and whatnot. Obviously, but, uh, yeah, I mean, I have a couple drinks that I drink, but it's just like a VPN electrolyte, try to get that back in there, try to get as much salt as possible so I can hold what I'm putting in my body. And what do you try to weigh, Dave, the fight, whatever my bodies, whatever my body's happy. I don't want to overeat and I don't want to over drink where I feel so bloated or I feel so heavy. But I probably walk in around 210, um, 208. So I blow up. Yeah. That's like a like, so when I fought Gerald, I, um, when I fought Gerald, I was, I was, I was heavy.

1:43:16I think I was like 209 when I walked into the cage, but by the time I faced off with him by 4 p .m, I was like 203, 204. So I was like, I put it all on quick and I don't lose it. Like I'll wake up the next morning and it goes right back to where it needs to. So I have a good system. And I think it's only going to get better. But, uh, but man, you know, I'm not going to put it out there, but I have never had a smooth camp. I've never had a smooth camp and this is going to be no different, but this is where I've been built. I've been built in the fire and, you know, Jack's a good dude. It's going to be a tough fight.

1:43:50I don't know if anybody was a good camp. They say they have good camps. We talked to him. There's like a rib and a neck and a knee and a ankle. Across the states lately though, has been sick as fuck. Yeah. It's a lot of colds going on. I've been gone. I've been gone as far as to say. Somebody's fucking poisoning us because there's no way that everybody I fucking know got sick at the same time and everybody's sick for two, three weeks with it. Well, there's a COVID strain that's going around right now and then there's the flu. I mean, it's the winter and you know what a lot of that is is vitamin D deficiency, especially when you're dealing with cold climates.

1:44:25I take vitamin D and vitamin K as well. I take vitamin K vitamin D and I take it with magnesium because what I was told is you don't take magnesium. It doesn't mean shit. It doesn't mean as much. Magnesium is important. Do you take like a suite of nutrients? Do you know what to do as far as like how much to take of this and that? Yeah. So I have, so I just have like my morning routine of everything I've taken and I got it from the UFCPI and they gave me a sheet and then I've been doing it for long enough now that's like I know what I need. So I always use the PIs. Yes, that's a great resource.

1:44:59That's a great resource. It's so made when they first built it I was like what are they doing? Bro, I was fucking blown away when I was out there for a brand and now in cornering him. I didn't never been in the cafeteria. I always heard people talk about it. I'm like where the fuck is it? Like I never knew how to get to it. Oh, that's funny. Oh man, I was so upset. I was so mad at myself and I've been in this shit for a year and a half now, a year and I didn't know there was a fucking cafeteria. Everybody's going to but me. Super healthy food, amazing state of the art facility, the best stuff for recovery, the best stuff for training, amazing coaches.

1:45:27You know what I will say though? So I think it's a great place. I'm not comfortable training in a place like that. Real, you look adirty. I brought, I like a fucking rat. I'm a ratchet motherfucker like I'm wearing a fucking sweatpants under this. Like my money, my money, my drug -oat, fucking Siberia running with the log. It's not me, Jell. I don't know. I got an aura ring to track my sleep, right? And someone that made that like important to me was Sean because my fucking sleep sucked. But now I'm like so conscious about it. Sean's taught me so much, man. Sean has taught me so much. That's a guy that needs to slow down in my opinion.

1:45:58I've never seen somebody train that much. Like, I picture him as like a fucking disgruntled old meme motherfucker. Like just like, I didn't fucking have it. Like he just didn't do anything fun. Like, but uh, but that's not true. He does fun shit. But like he loves working out. Me, it's my job and I love working out. But that's not all I want to do. I want to go fuck off sometimes racing. Right. Ride bikes and you know, Sean wants a train. He wants to do just two competitions when it's all done. Yeah, man. Yeah, he needs to get on the sauce when he's done and get fucking. Go fuck people out. Well, I mean, you think about him beating Craig Jones in a grappling match.

1:46:33And again, they didn't have heel hooks, but that's just because that's the UFC won't allow that. But beating Craig Jones is a gigantic accomplishment. Yeah, I mean, yeah, that guy is elite in terms of people who just train grappling. And for him, a guy who's training MMA fighting in the top echelon of the UFC, fighting against some of the best of the best for him to go and beat Craig Jones in a straight up grappling match is that's incredible. And look, right? So this is exactly it is incredible. And that's that Phil Roe, you owe me money. He bailed out of a bet. He was supposed to, you know, and this was years, whatever.

1:47:10Before I was in the UFC, you know, I met Phil Roe playing what Randy Brown on Call of Duty. Oh, really? Yeah, playing Call of Duty. That's crazy. Randy Brown's how I met him. I'm a trainer of Randy Brown too. But yeah, no, I was so confident in Sean being in that match because, like I said, I've gone with Corey Anderson. I've gone with some heavy big dudes and I do well. I do, I hold my own and I do, I do more than that. Like, but, um, man, I've never hit, I've never, bro, I'm lucky if I take this motherfucker down, like once a month, I can't do it. You know what I mean? I'm going out. I'm a heavy dude.

1:47:43Grappler and you really saw that in the Kelvin Gaslam fight. Kelvin can wrestle, man. And he was all over Kelvin. I mean, like, Kelvin's, Kelvin's like a hitter miss, man. It's so weird. He, uh, it's unfortunate. I think Sean, it's just, Kelvin should have been a welter way from the jump. He should have been, but like, did you see the way it was falling? Yeah. Yeah. It looked like he just couldn't like, he, it looked like the second Sean, like, picked him up or like through something. He was always so off balance. Well, he might be dealing with injuries. He's also had a very long career. He's fucking crazy wars.

1:48:14He just had that war with Chris Curtis. He's had wars without a son. Good at Chris Curtis. Against Chris Curtis. He looked great. And Chris Criscree is a beast. Yeah. It was a good fight. And it's just, you know, Kelvin, I told Kelvin a long time ago, dude, I go, if you're 170, I think you, you're a potential world champion. Yeah. But at 85, the difference to you guy like you and I got like him, just a physical frame difference like, Otasagna or Baheda or any of these really big 85's. They're just so much bigger. Dreckus. Yeah. The difference, like, Kelvin's my size. You're not just fighting talent, you know, let's say the skill is matched.

1:48:51Now you're fighting size. You're fighting everything. Yeah. I mean, Kelvin is fast as fuck with his hands. He's got beautiful fluid combinations with his fists, like that one, two, the knock -biss being out with. The motherfucker is amazing. And the fight without a son, it was a war. People forget, he had Otasagna in all kinds of trouble. Kelvin, he's always striped, his bodybuilder's always been so, it's always been so weird to me. I mean, he's miss weight so many times and he's, I don't know, he just never looks like he fully committed. I don't know if that's just his genetics the way he's built, but it's like, it doesn't look like he's terribly sucked out of 70.

1:49:28No, no, no. He looks like he went through a cut, but like. It didn't look like he lost body fat, that's what you're saying. Yeah. He looked a bit different, she and him at 85 and him at 70. I feel like he was like, really fucks off, maybe in his diet, I don't know. There has to be something going on there. Yeah, I mean, I mean, I don't think he's working with a strict nutritionist, it's really got it all dialed out. Hey, listen, like, I told people to him, and my post -fight too, like, like, that was Sean's first time being overseas and whatnot, and look, he knows where he's best, right? I'm not saying he's, I don't think he can, I don't think he's like the best striker in the world by any means, but I think he's the best grappler for MMA by a long shot.

1:50:06It's not just me, bro. This motherfucker, he can play any of us on our back and you're not getting up. You could see when he's grappling, it's very high level. Very low, he knows where you're doing, he knows where he wants you to go, and you think, oh, I'm making up, and then you're stuck, and it's like, it's very frustrating, I hate going on. Well, you could see it in the fights, man. You could, you know, someone who really appreciates grappling, I really love watching that guy fight, because it's very high level, and his striking is very good too. You know, the ball -out fight sucked for him, but will ultimately be good for him in the long run, because it's just a painful, horrible lesson.

1:50:43Man, this is what I don't care if he gets mad, this is what I'll say. I think there was a certain coach that's no longer on our team, but I never fucked with it, that shouldn't have been in his corner and doesn't know how to fucking, like, bro. They didn't, the main, the head coach, the guy that was supposed, I'm not gonna say his name. He was supposed to run, like, give him a structure, tell him what to do, you know, like he just kind of like didn't train him and didn't develop a game plan with him, like, coach John did everything, and coach John's just a striking end of it, right? And obviously that's where he lost the fight, but the dude shot one time.

1:51:20Right. You shot one time, and that was it, you know? So I think Sean just, you had a mental bug, and I think Sean's more of like an introvert where he keeps things to himself, and he's very like his private life's his private life. And you know, and I can respect that versus me, I'm outspoken, and I'll say what I'm feeling, and I said it the week it brought, I was fucking sad as shit when I fought a duel. I didn't turn it on until I started walking. And actually that's not true. I didn't turn it on until I saw him fucking, like doing all this like dancing shit, like I was like, you think so, huh?

1:51:47And then that's when it turned on, right? But some people just can't turn it on, man. And I think that was one of those times where he just wasn't, like, he was doing good. Yeah, it was a back and forth in the first round, and it just got all the way. You also have credit to ball, balls, a big fucking tough dude, you know? Yeah. I'm not a ball fan. I don't ask him credit. It's tough, man. Tough guy. He beat my teammate, I don't fuck with him. Well, I get it, I understand that. But nobody is talking to each other. I hope he gets, I hope he gets the, you know, my feelings for him aside, I hope he gets, he's, you know, How could he not?

1:52:19I don't understand. How is it even a discussion that he doesn't get the Leon Edwards? I mean, listen, if I was ball, I'd be upset, right? Like, I got poked in the fucking eye, I lost my, I lost the fight. Yeah, yeah. Like, let's run it back. Yeah. I don't, I don't, I don't know. Like, Leon's like, like, saying he's not gonna get it and shit, like, that is just weird. What is Leon's in? Like, about him not getting it. He doesn't think he deserves it or some shit like that. Really? I think that was when he was about to fight Colby. Like, they were saying, oh, ball always gonna be next and he was saying like he doesn't deserve it.

1:52:47Or the only way I could see him saying that is if he thinks of paper view points and that ball is not a big sale, that he's not gonna sell a lot of tickets. But who else is next? There's no one else there. Shavkat? Well, Shavkat, but Shavkat needs surgery. He went into that fight with Wonder Boy fucked up and that's why he didn't throw any kicks. And then you have, who I think, look, everybody's anglin' to try to get Connor, right? And for a while to wait, yeah. Listen. He's small. I understand. Like, wouldn't you take it just for the money? I mean, that's what Leon would feel like he has a big advantage.

1:53:25You know, he's a legitimate Walter Waik. He's a dust Connor. And then he'd make a lot of money. He would so come. If he could talk Connor into that. But Connor and Chandler is interesting too. You know, I guess it's actually gonna happen. That's so crazy happen. You're wait. I pro. Which is bananas. Listen, that's bananas. Somebody said something to him about, hey, like, we got a no name in me. I would fight Connor. You will fight 85 shit man, change my life. I'm gonna fuck you up. I will fuck that dude up. But he's fighting Chandler, 85. You know the word, he's not an 85. You know what I'm not used to yet, Joe?

1:53:59The casuals, like, are you in Connor's week list? Oh, fucking. Like, what? You got to tune out the casuals. You have enough conflict in your past. So that's what I struggle with. I, my past, I'm cool with. When I, it's like, I don't think about it every time. Do you read comments? Sometimes. Because so I'm like, sometimes. Not until the time. Joe, bro, it motivates me sometimes. Does it really? It does. It does. You really need motivation? I always, I think, I, so yeah, I do. Because I don't always wanna fight at it. I'm not always, I'm not fighting at anger in my past. I have that anger because it's just, it bro.

1:54:35It's, I'm bred like that. You're also fighting out of ambition. I'm fighting out of ambition. I'm trying to. You know what my biggest drive is? Like I said, that dream car, that dream house, that love one, that travel life. Like, I want, bro, I wanna live life. I wanna see the world. A life that you didn't have when you're young. I'm scared, bro. I'm scared. I'm scared to grow old and never see what this world has. And I mean, like, sights wise. Like, I wanna go to Ireland. I wanna go to Switzerland. I wanna go see places. I hear you. And you'll see those things. Yeah, man. I really believe it.

1:55:05Right. Don't read the comments. I did almost fight one of the fans. I did. I tried, bro, I tried to get him to come to the gym. I was like, man, this would be great fucking content, right? But then I was like, man, that's corny. And I actually think the guy would have followed through. He was that fucking stupid. There's a lot of dummies. There's so many videos of guys showing up at gyms and online internet trolls getting head kicked. First of all, I'm not many of them. I just watched some recent one with some guy went into a Moitai gym and the dude hit him with a leg kick and then fucking shined him in the head.

1:55:38Okay, oh, yeah. Oh yeah, I mean, he brutalized him with a leg kick and then the guy didn't move right and then stepped back. Boom, my head kick and flat lined him. That's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's hard, right? Like I'll read the comments sometimes because I'm petty. Like I went back after I beat up door and I was like, yeah, talk that shit now. Like say something. Yeah, I mean, just to those few I saved three particular comments. You have saved. I did. And I went back. I went back. Joe, that's so crazy. Yeah. Well, I'm an elephant, bro, when you heard it. You don't forget.

1:56:14So, but nothing you get taught to deal with, right? Is is what to say when not to say people always give their opinion. Like even before coming on here, don't talk about a certain thing because I have my beliefs, right? So we stay in the safe space. We get to talk about, oh, there's a plenty of things. What are people telling you not to talk about? Ah, well, you don't talk about politics. You don't talk about people's parents. You don't talk about religion shit like that. You know what I mean? I would say don't talk about other people's parents. Yeah. Yeah, but politics and religion, that's just a part of life.

1:56:41Anybody says you should talk about politics. If I gave you, well, that's the thing. If I give my political view on this, it's like it opens up a door, not, you know, you'll get a lot of new like people, but it opens up the door for all these other wide. It's such a diverse, like such a controversial argument. It's like, I have this conversation when you off camera all day long. I got my beliefs. I think you know where I'm at, but it's like, yeah, I mean, it's just certain things. You don't, well, this is a very divided country, more so than I'm 56 and never in my life have I seen this country.

1:57:11That's crazy. That's crazy. Never. You look like you're fucking figured out how to reverse time man. You're talking about me being vague. You're fucking wider than me. I stay healthy. Yeah. TRT and a lot of vitamins and I'm always doing something. I'm very active in taking care of my body. You wish you fought? No. No. You wish you had a fight. I had kickbox and fireside, three kickbox and fireside and I had about a hundred taekwondo fights. And I. I've seen your fortune spending that kick. I'm afraid. I'm afraid. I must have had a range on that. Unfortunately, also came up in a gym that didn't sparse, smart.

1:57:50We spared hard. We fought. It was like a lot of knockouts. When did you start? I started martial arts when I was 15. That's when I started seriously. I took a little bit of it before. I took karate when I was 14. I fucked around a little bit before that. But when I was 15, I became obsessed. And you know, just wasn't really good at anything. Other than art, it was a good artist. But it was nothing that really made me feel like I was a special person until I started doing martial arts. Then when I started winning and I became obsessed, I was training every day and I started getting really good and winning tournaments.

1:58:24Then I realized, oh, I'm not a loser. I just never figured out what to do. And now I've found a thing to do and I know that if I just work hard, I can be exceptional and I can get better at it. But I was also, when I was making the transition into kickboxing, first of all, there was no money. We were talking 1988. There's no money in it. And there's nobody in kickboxing. I wasn't a good boxer. I didn't have a lot of boxing experience. And some of the guys that I was training with were going into boxing, particularly this one kid, Dana Rosenblad, who went on to be the New England Middaway champion.

1:58:59He beat Vinnie Pazienza. He beat Howard Davis Jr. Does he pass the ends of the fought? Roy Jones. Yes. He was the only guy. He broke a neck. Yeah, well, he did. He broke his neck in the car accident. But when I was watching those guys, one of the things that I was seeing was brain damage. And I was seeing guys where I knew him from five years ago and then I know him now. And I was noticing slurring a slowness to the way they were thinking. And I was just seeing, people didn't just spar. They fought in the gym. And there's a lot of that from the early days of MMA as well. You know, particularly shoot the box.

1:59:37Those guys just beat the fuck out of each other. Like the old militage fighters, those guys beat the fuck out of each other. There was a lot of camps where the amount of damage, like I've talked to Shob about this too, about him training with like Shane Carwin and those guys back in the day in Denver, they beat the fuck out of each other. And the damage that you take in the gym, that shit counts. It's real. Yeah. And in that way, I'm glad I didn't because I started seeing, you know, I was a lot of headaches and that kind of shit early on. And I was like, and there was no future. I didn't have a future in fighting.

2:00:15There was no, it didn't exist. So when the UFC came along, which was 1993, I'd already stopped fighting. I was already doing stand -up comedy. But I was like, oh, they figured it out. This is it. Somebody figured it out. Because back then, it was always like, how do you make a living as a martial artist if you want to compete? There's no money. You have to open up a school. The only thing you can do is teach at a school and then compete in tournaments and there's no money in the tournaments. But then when the UFC came along, also, we realized like how much of what people were doing was nonsense.

2:00:48How much of what people were doing was wasted time. Because that's how it was when Eddie was coming up. It was like, bar room, brawl type, fucking training. Yeah. That's how you grew up when I seen it. And then, yeah, my dad used to be pit me at 12 years old against 16 -year -olds. And I remember, I fucking thought my head was bleeding. I'm sure. And probably was. You know, that kind of training teaches you how to be tough and how to deal with like a real fight. And you definitely get more comfortable with really throwing. But the consequences of those shots that you receive in training are legitimate.

2:01:21You know, Jerry Quarry, you know who he is? Famous boxer fought Muhammad Ali back in the day. Just a crazy tough dude who just walked forward and just ate punches and took a beating. Just a tough, tough dude. Well he had a bunch of fights. And at the end of his life, he was a vegetable. He was just gone. Well his brother only had like one pro fight, I think. And his brother never had a pro career. His brother was just as fucked up as he was at the end of his life. And it was all from the gym, all from just gym wars. You know, I was watching this video last night on Wilfred Bernitas. And they were talking about Wilfred Bernitas during his day was just an insanely select boxer.

2:02:05You know, return pro when he was 17. Was a world champion shortly after that. It was an incredible defensive boxer out of Puerto Rico. And the end of his life man, where he is now, like he's bedridden. He's a vegetable basically. That's him now. Me. It's so hard to see him. Yeah, I have. He's fighting Wilfred Bernitas. The pride of Puerto Rico, the ailing box in Grey's now fully dependent on his sister watches over him. They're humble part apartments. So that's exactly another reason, right? Like when you want to talk about what we were talking about, me going 200 mile an hour, I could go into like that shit.

2:02:41I don't like reading that stuff because that sits in the back of my mind too. I don't want to be a fucking vegetable. Of course, right? But I'm not and I'm not knocking our pay, but we don't make with any other professional athlete makes. Well, you do at the high end, at the high end, right? Yeah. You know, I'm three fights in. I'm fortunate to be getting the main event. And I, I don't know, but I was told that there's only one other person that's done that in my division. And I don't know who it is. And I want to know who it is. I don't know, but obviously there's a shit ton of hype on you. You know, you've got a lot of great hype on you, which is, which, you know, it's crazy.

2:03:22Doesn't do anything to me. Like I don't feel like I think DC didn't believe me at first when I was, I made my debut. When I got in the UFC, the weight on my shoulders dropped. Now there's another way that comes on right that expectation and things like that that I hold myself to. But I'm like, man, like, I don't give a fuck if there's a thousand people, if there's zero people, if there's 50 ,000 people, it doesn't phase me. I don't care about that. I'm so locked in on your face. Like that's why I want. Like you, motherfucker, like you are the second half of my paycheck. I'm coming for you. Like, and I think sometimes that's where you have really talented guys that don't know how to get past the lights, the cameras, the big moment.

2:04:05You see it all the time. Yeah, the fighters and they make that UFC debut. Some guys just rise to the occasion and you see them better than they've ever been before in the UFC debut. Because they belong to their champions. They just have to. And then there's other guys that get dwarfed by the moment. The moment hits them and they just, woof. When you know it's crazy, it's like the moment hits you, like it's a weird feeling when it's so different. Even for me, sitting as a fan watching, like you don't realize what that person's going through. When you walk out and it's like a cold sweat because it's a fucking big ass building.

2:04:38Like, hey, see, it's like that cold sweat, but you're kind of hot. And then you fucking realize when you're in there, it's like everything's like so amplified. And you're like, fuck, man, I'm about to get into a fist fight. Yeah. But then that's where you make that decision. Like once that finally hits your brain, which we all have it, it's like you either can hone in on what you're about to do, or you can hone in on the fact that like you don't feel like being there. Right. One of the things that I've come to terms with is I think that changed my trajectory of my career and the way I fought because if you watch my early fights, like I would just go out there and try to like blitz and get out of there and like fuck you up and knock you out and get out.

2:05:13Like that's what I wanted to do. I don't force trying to knock people out. I don't force to finish. I don't. I'm just trying to wear and then catch you. I know I need one. Then my head, I'm convinced you could be Francis and Gano. I think I need one. That's, I pull hard to believe that. I don't, and then you got the other aspect of fighters that convinced themselves. Oh, I can knock somebody out, but it just don't truly believe it. It's different. Yeah, there's a difference between coaching yourself to believe it and actually fucking believing it. Well, you have extraordinary power, you know, and what I was saying about the Rizakalesan fight is that you showed another level of poise in that fight.

2:05:52It was another level of technique. It was another level of like, this again, it's like it's very difficult for a fighter to express themselves at, like, you know, when a guy's on in the gym and you just go, mother fuck, look at that dude. They just, sometimes guys just look like they're on fire. They're timing. They're everything. Look at a world beat. They're like, who could beat that dude? Right. Who could beat that dude? And then it's very difficult to express that inside the octagon. So when you hear a lot of great things about fighters and then you see a performance, you got to go, okay, they got to get over the anxiety.

2:06:23They got to get over the pressure. They got to get over the experience boundary. Because you do need experience in front of different styles. No matter what, no matter how well you train and how good your training partners are, you need live experience against really talented fighters to really develop to your full potential. And in the Rizak fight, I saw it with you. I was like, okay, he had another level. Yeah, I wish, I wish. I was, that was a tough fight. It was. It was, it was a scary fight to take because he was tactically behind me. And he had all knockouts. Right? You know, so that's, there's that, in the back of your head, there's that fear like, oh, shit.

2:07:02He can clip anybody. He can clip anybody, right? But, you know, I, and at the, in the same token, I just kept it very small. Like, I didn't buy into that. It was like, bro, you're, you're a middleweight short guy that is coming up to await you don't belong. That's my opinion. Do you think that he should be 170? 100%. Yeah. He does not belong on 185. And he doesn't, he's not the leanest guy. He's a thick, spark plug built -in type style. He's a fire hydrant, right? Like he, he is a big man at 170. I just think he's lazy. I think he's lazy. That's, that's my opinion because, yeah, the fact that I took you down that easy, the fact that I kept you down that easy, bro, I put that token pretty basic.

2:07:41And I felt him will. I think the slam really was like, what the fuck? And then he got slammed again, you know, I think there's such a difference in size. There's such a difference in size. And I, I've advocated many times for multiple weight classes. I think, I think the jump between 70 and 85 is too high. And I think the jump between 85 and 205 is way too high. 20 pounds is so big. It is. It is. So there's so, I mean, obviously, Peheda pulls it off, but he's 95 or three. A sweet ass class. Sweet. I think, I think you get the perfect, you get the height at, so I, it's funny. Every fighter will contest to say that their division is the best.

2:08:17But I think the, the perfect athlete is my size. The height, the power. The power. Right. The explosive and everything. If you can, I think I do. I like a Yo -L Romero. Like that, you get a taller guy. I mean, he's not the tallest, right? But you get a, or even a Paul Costa. Right. You look at their brand. Like I think that's the perfect mix between a not too tall, just the right height, big, explosive, high volume. High volume. I like heavy weights. Yeah, like still crazy knockout power. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But that's just me. No, I see that argument. 85 is obviously a very deep division too. Because there's a big size difference between 70 and 85.

2:08:56A big difference, which is the Calvin argument. Yeah. Like, you know, but then when Calvin went down to 170, but Sean's a big one, fucking 72. His back looks like it's two people's backs. Check on. No, Sean Brady. Oh, Brady. Bro, he has, bro, he's just chest, dick, and legs. It's insane. His back is like layers of blood. He's an ape. Yeah, literally his lats like sit. He's got so much what you would call like squeeze power. Yeah, you can see all that squeeze power. That's exactly it. Yeah. This fucker, when he gets you in something, you think, man, he's squeezing when everything he's got. And then it just keeps going.

2:09:32And it keeps going. It keeps going. It's like, what the fuck? His back. It's like these layers of like muscle that is. I hate him. Well, he's like, whaw fuck is ridiculous. He's got an extra back on top of his back. I don't know what the fuck. I don't know. He left some more in the main squad. That's more of a fucking, I don't like it. It's a big fucker dude. But when you look at a guy like that, like that's a legit 170. Like that guy at 170 is a fucking terrifying force. Yeah. Like a Kamara Usman at 170. That's a terrifying force. And if you're 20 pounds heavier than that, you know, it was a freak at 70, though.

2:10:04Andy, not Andy. Randy Brown. Oh, yeah. That's a tall boy. A .O. He could box, man. He could box. I was so mad at the way that we literally say, like, oh, don't exit. Don't exit. You can't exit with your hands down, bro. Like he's got a swing bombs over his hands. He's got to reach you. Mm -hmm. Fucking did it, man. Yeah. I think that it happens. Yeah, it happens. You know, Jalen Turner's another one. Like that dude at 155, that is crazy. I was so, I love Bobby Green. I'd you two that watched it for years. I was so mad at that. That was horrible. He did his job. Well, that referee is the same thing.

2:10:37That referee should have stopped that fight. 10, 15 punches earlier. Yeah, that referee's, I don't know who it was. I don't know what happened. They're good. They're good. I don't want to say his name. But ordinarily he's good. I don't know what happened. People fuck up. They make mistakes. Yeah, I have a chance. You know, you think the guys are going to survive. It's like we were watching the Jose Luis Castillo fight. It's a tough job to be in the very. Tid, no, when to call it. Because you don't want to take that opportunity from somebody. Yes. Like, what was the one fight? Yuri Pahaska announced.

2:11:06Yeah, man. I was pissed watching it. I was like, yo, let him fucking try still moving. He's still moving. And Yuri has shown the ability to recover. Like the Dominic Reyes fight. He was out on his feet. Bro, I'm not sure. Yuri's a bad man. I was about that man that real when he screaming out in the wild. Yeah. Bro, I thought that in my truck. Like how funny was Jamal Hill? Jamal Hill, like Yuri did that thing. Like, like he was out saying, I'm coming. Oh, yeah. He was like, that's what she said. I had to push. She said Jamal Hill is cool. He's hilarious. He's funny. I'm excited about his return.

2:11:42Him against Bahia. That is a very exciting fight. Yeah, he had done, I think he beat some. He might. I think he beat some. Bro, I think he's deceptive. He looks fluffy. But he's quick and he's got snap. Well, what he did to Glover to share. Glover to share is over. Not bad man. Bro. Yeah. Dude did not want to lose. No, he's not the man that wanted it. He's a bad man and Jamal put it on him. Yeah. He put it on him. Jamal is so good at finding your fucking chin. He's just, he's just got this range intelligence. It's intelligence of when to strike and when to like the, he's just, there's so many of his fights where you watch the movement.

2:12:23He's like a snake charmer. Yeah. Like he knows how to put it on you. Yeah. You know, the Johnny Walker one. Like when everybody said that Jamal doesn't hit hard, what the fuck are you talking about? What the fuck are you talking about? That is the weirdest fucking knockout I've ever seen. I thought he was fucking everybody. Yeah, he went, yeah, he like bent forward and then flew back. That was like, I've never seen some dumb shit like that ever. Johnny has been knocked out a lot and the thing is like when the guy gets knocked out a lot, it's like you got a wonder how much. He's got his nose broken.

2:12:52Yeah, how am I? Ankle I was a bad man. That's a thick dude, man. That's what I was talking about when I was saying like, yo, you got different bone deaths. He's like, that's a thick guy. Well, then you got to think of, uh, Yon Behovitch. Yon Behovitch went shinn -dishin with that dude and forked his legs up. Like, Yon Behovitch has made out of rocks. Like that fucking dude is, and that's another one like, like SpongeBob SquarePast. When out of Cran. Sonia went up to 205. Like, that guy was too big. Yeah, it's too big. It's a giant jump man. That's a giant jump. You think he comes back 2027 or sooner?

2:13:24I think sooner. I think sooner. I think, you know, you say things like that because your body's beat up. He went through so many camps in a row. He defended his title more than any other champs. So active. So active. You're gonna get, and then, I fucking think he just didn't, I think he slept on Sean a little bit. I think he burnt out. I think it was a little bit of that. But also think, I think he thought Sean wasn't on his level. I thought he, I think he's gonna say, he said him up the way he did with Paul Okosta. Yeah. That he was just gonna go piece him up. But Sean is so hard to hit. He's so, you know, they did that thing with the UFC with, I think it's a mouthpiece with it registers how many times you get hit.

2:14:04Sean spars more than anybody and he gets hit less than anybody. Which is pretty extraordinary. That style is very sneaky. Yeah. You know, and it's just a Philly shell. I don't do it the same way he does, but it's weird to see someone do it in MMA because no one else does it. Yeah. He walked, it just looks odd. But he also doesn't dip. So I think that's kind of like a part of his defense. A lot of people that do the Philly shell, like me, sometimes I'll dip into a certain side. And it's like he just kind of stands straight and leans and either puts his arms out. Yeah. The problem with dipping with kicks is like your face off.

2:14:43Yeah, you zig when you should have zagged and that shins coming at you. And this, you know, I mean, it's, there's so many fucking good fights to be had right now. There's so many good fights that are coming up. You know, one I'm really fucking excited about is Volkanovsky versus Ilya Toporia. Ilya's. I like watching Ilya box, bro. That's a bad man. He hunts the body. I love it. He's a bad man. And he's a tough guy that knows how to take it too. If you watch that gyher bird fight, where he got caught, he got kicked, bad. He still came back. Yeah. And as I 55, too, I do think Ilya way. He's a way.

2:15:15He's a way. I do think Ilya way. Really? I do. Yeah. We have like a, me and Sean do like a little, a little tiny like podcast on picking fights and just. This is a situation I wanted to talk to you about this because there's a lot of different philosophies on this. I understand why Usman took that last minute fight against Hansa. And I understand why Volkanovsky took that last minute fight against Markachev. And as a fan, when I was at home and they announced that those changes, I was like, oh shit. But the reality is you need a camp. You are not the same guy with 10 days notice as you are with 10 weeks notice.

2:15:54You are just not the same guy. And when you look at the Volkanovsky that fought Markachev the first time, that was a guy who went through a full fucking camp and was a plus, rip ready to go, full gas tank. Let's fucking go. The guy, let alone what it does for you mentally. Yes. Yes. You have to go through that suffering to know that you were built strong enough to withstand what you're about to go through. And I won't take no fucking short notice. I'll die. I don't think you should either. I really don't think anyone should. Even though I like them when they make them. I'm a hypocrite. I won't do it.

2:16:28Because as a fan, I'm like, oh, I can't wait to see this. You can be a hypocrite as long as you're a fan of fans. But if I was in Usman's corner, if Kamara was my friend and I would say don't do it, don't do it. I think you beat that guy with a camp. I mean, even at 85, I think you beat that guy. Because if you look at the third round, he was coming on strong. Yeah, it comes, that was done. And he didn't have a camp at all. I think there's a difference. A giant difference. It's not like a 5 % difference. I think it's like a 25 % difference. Probably even more than that. And when you look at Markachev, first of all, Markachev is a fucking monster.

2:17:01He's a monster. You do not want to fight that guy when he's gone through a full camp in Dagestan, rip ready to go. And he had adjusted to Volkanovsky's style. He had a completely good solution. He had a perfect solution. The kicks to the body. He was throwing those kicks to the body. He set up that head kick. He took away Volkanovsky's leg kicks from the outside. He took away all the shit that Volkanovsky was doing to him that was troubling him in the first flight. And he imposed his will on him. But that's often the problem, right? You go, you take a short notice fight. Sure. Now everybody will sit here and say, man, that guy's got balls.

2:17:33And then that rides off into the sunset. And that's all you got for. Or you get Aspenal. Tom Aspenal wins the title on short minutes fight, short notice fight, and couldn't even spar. His rib was all fucked up. He couldn't even train, couldn't wrestle. And he's fighting Sergei, who's a monster. He's a monster, but I think they blew him up. They blew Sergei up. They blew him up. Yeah, because they needed the next crazy punching power guy. Well, he does have that. He definitely does. But you also have to look at the Auster over in fight. Auster is fucking out. Yeah, I mean, honestly, Auster did and exposed his wrestling and things like that, but I mean.

2:18:09Auster's the guy. That's the steroid argument. Like that's the guy. Yeah, that's the guy for legalizing the steroids. That's the fucking. I remember I was so excited. We couldn't afford to fucking buy it, but I was like, when him and Brock Lesnar fought. And I was like, man, I just remembered the hype video. And I was like, yeah, these are two fucking giants. Like Brock was huge. And but then again, Brock probably shouldn't have taken that fight either because Brock was just a few months out of a diverticulitis surgery where he had to get a length of his colon or his intestine removed. I mean, thank God, man.

2:18:42I never had anything like that. And the body like that from Auster, who's a K1 Grand Prix champion and juice to the tits at 260. Yeah. Auster was. Yeah. Do you think that? Do you? He was fucking huge, man. Do you think that the heavyweight? Do you think the heavyweight limit should be 285? No. I don't think there should be a limit. I don't either. I don't think it makes any sense. We don't have a super heavyweight class. I say anything above 330's too much. Why? Let him fight. Because then you're going to get some fat motherfucker to eat. So let that guy get punched. Let that guy get fucked up.

2:19:19There are no frances. Fair enough. But I don't think you should cut. I think you should be like your heavyweight in boxing. Like when Andy Ruiz fought Joshua and terrible in the second fight, he was so fat. He was 280 pounds. But that's just what you are. That's it. This is heavyweight. Heavyweight is heavyweight. This idea of a super heavyweight class. We've never utilized it. There's a weight class above 265. Why do you say that? A single one -billet. There's nobody there. Who's there? No, no, no, no. Francis gave in like a 195, a 175. I don't know. They don't listen to me. Listen, clearly. If it was me, I would do two things very, very early on.

2:20:00If it was my decision and they would fucking throw everything into chaos, but ultimately be better for the sport. Number one thing I would do is more weight classes. I would say minimum every 10 pounds. I agree with that. I think the lighter weight classes, you could go five pounds. Look at what boxing does. Boxing is, you know, 126, 130, 135. They go, I think it would be the cleanest organization to have every 10 pounds. 10 pounds. But without like boxing, there's four different fucking belts at each weight class, or whatever it is. Well, there is kind of with the UFC, you know, I mean, people respect, obviously, Johnny Ebblin is like one of the best middle weights on the planet earth without a doubt.

2:20:43And unfortunately, he's fighting a bell tour and the casual has no idea who he is, where the guy's a monster. And then he just got announced to fight, um, Impa. Yes. Yes. Who made him, he would mean Impa fall in the same contender series when I broke my arm. He won. Yeah. I like Impa. Impa's a great guy. And unfortunately, he's at the wrong end of that highlight kick from Joaquin, Joaquin Buckley, hit him with the one of the craziest kicks of all time that jumped spinning back kick while he was holding his left leg. That was wild. Yeah, that was wild. And Joaquin is another one. That dude at 170 is a fucking problem.

2:21:19And he's a guy who was, it was a big muscular guy who decided to fight at 85 and was beating a lot of guys at 85 because he's so powerful. But you see him at 170. His gas tank is crazy. His skills are gruggies on another level. I know he was salty. I told him in the back before I beat up Dulles. I'm going to take that bonus from you. They were talking shit off me when I walked in the fucking PI though. Oh, yeah. So yeah. But me and Buckley are cool. But I love Buckley. Yeah, he was like, man, be Joe Piper. And I thought it was like, he fucked Joe Piper. I was like, ah, that's how you feel. All right.

2:21:54Yeah. That was funny. Well, I came to funny. Joaquin at 170 is a real force. He's a real force. Yeah. I think as he moves up in the rankings at 170, I think that's his real way class. So here's the thing though, when I look at a guy like Buckley and hopefully he watches this or he doesn't watch us and get offended. But how does he fare against somebody like, like you still got Kevin Holland who booked him. He did. He booked him in one of five. But I think the, you know, all fairness, I think, uh, watching it is a way better fight. He's a way better fighter now at 170. Yeah. Now, look, you get better.

2:22:29You keep the dude is driven as fuck. Yeah. He's constantly training. He's getting better. Everybody gets better or they don't. And when they don't, you see that too. I would like to see why he gets a guy like Jeff Neal. Oh, I think that would, I like Jeff Neal. Well, dude, Jeff Neal is another guy. I go back and watch his ball on my homie fight. He pieced up ball all back. And then day Jeff Neal was the dark horse. When he knocked out Mike Perry, when he hit him with that headkick, Jeff Neal is a motherfucker. When I think he's the one that put Mike Perry's fucking nose on the other side of the I thought it was two, but Mike corrected me online.

2:22:59It was Vicente Luke. Vicente Luke did that to his nose. Yeah. Yeah. Meanwhile, Mike Perry at Baronucle Boxing is one of the fucking dangerous human beings ever. Yeah. He's specifically designed for Baronucle fighting. I thought that guy is, you know, it's funny, uniquely qualified. The brink. Lorenzo Hunt, you know, yeah, I beat him. Did you choke them unconscious? They never made it. Third, yeah, my third or fourth pro fight. Oh, man, that's somebody's kid. That's somebody's kid. I choke them up. Yeah, yeah. I didn't throw a single fucking punch. He came out through a while right hand, took him down, choke them out.

2:23:35He's a very good Baronucle boxer. That was my first introduction because I was still kind of undersized in middleweight. He was my first introduction to like an old head that was like 33, 34 that had like fucking grown man strength. You see that motherfucker's head. His shit's like this fucking big. Yeah, he's stout. Yeah. Yeah. Baronucle fighting is not getting the respect that it deserves. You know, I think it's too brutal for the common people. Yeah. I think so. You're probably right. But I'm a big fan of the juggernaut. He's a beast. Yeah. I love watching those guys too. It's just because it's such a hard way to do it.

2:24:09It's such a hard way to do it. I mean, Baronucle boxing is fucking rock. You see when Rock Hold quit when Mike Perry blasted his teeth out. He's like that's it. Well, honestly, Rock Hold is the biggest disappointment to me. I used to be one of my favorite fighters and he's just like, I didn't realize I'll fucking socially stupid. He is. In interview, it's the worst shit I've ever listened to. Yeah, you better. I'm coming. Yeah. It's like, you don't know what to fuck to say. Well, in his prime, the man was a monster. Yeah, he was a beast, man. Monster in his prime. When he beat up Chris Wyman and won the title, that was a crazy fight.

2:24:43And then he's just kind of like fell off. That was Mike fucking checked his share. I think Mike ruined him. This being yeah, I think Mike fucking broke him, man. Well, that was a bad loss and to fight bisming on short notice and be like super cocky. There's a thing about being confident and being delusional or overconfident or not respecting your opponent. And you know, I don't deserve it. Yeah, I don't know if that's what happened without a sonyan striclin. I think striclin is just that good. I really do think I don't think I don't think is he like sidestep them as much as we think. I just think I think people don't understand when you're in there and you got a guy that never fucking takes a step backwards.

2:25:19Right. It does get off. You never can plant. Right. So you're not hitting your power shots. You're not doing the damage that you would if you were dictating. You're not going on your terms when you're going backwards the whole time. And that's that's why I think DDP has a good chance because he's going to fight for that center to walk forward. Right. He's got it walks forward. Sean walks forward. I just think because DDP kind of falls over his knee when he attacks, I think he's going to get Sean them back. But for how long? We'll see. I'm very interested to see who prevails. I think he does well early.

2:25:51I boost fight. A boost magameda fight. I think that fight was one of the most impressive fights to striclin's fight. I do too. I think it was underwhelming to people though. A boost comes out in that first round like a bat out of hell, but he just gasped out. And he would gasped out at the end of the first round. No, he was throwing bombs. He was trying to take him out. I think a boost was just so used to taking guys out that he thought he could just put it on Sean. He was hitting Sean with fucking fire. Yeah. He was hitting him. That dude's good man. He's good, but Sean just wilted him. He has wilted him.

2:26:20Yeah, man. He doesn't get tired. It's crazy when you and when you have a guy who spars as much as Sean because the bulk of Sean's training is sparring and he spars hard. He's so accustomed to that that that's really like a fight all the time. He knows himself very well. He knows what he's good at. And he knows what he likes. He knows what works for him. So why fix what's not broken? You know, so how do you think what do you think on a son? He does when he comes back like who does he fight? Like he does not going to fight Paul Coast. Well, he still ranks, right? Of course. Like, but why wouldn't you take him out of the rankings if he's saying he's not coming back for three, four years?

2:26:56Because he's not really. Right. So I mean, that's why I'm asking that is like, I don't think he's going to sit out that long either. Like three years is crazy. That would be a crazy thing to do. I mean, unless look, I haven't talked to him. He may have like real injuries that need like real like we said, he fought so much. He was active. I think I think that this fight happens this weekend. I think maybe one or two more title fights, whoever has holding it. I think if DDP wins, there's a chance he slides in to fight Dracus. Just because of all that shit on the truck, but it could be. And also, you got to wonder where a homestop fits in that.

2:27:37I mean, obviously, homestop being a good man, they might think. Well, he's got superstar power. Yeah, he's honestly like, I get like nervous watching him like it with excitement. Yeah, because I love watching him. It's his face. It's the way he looks. He's like, he's like, going this shit. Yeah, smiling at him. Yeah, he looks evil. He does. He's got the look of somebody that like, man, this motherfucker is about it. And he is. He's tough. He's a gangster man. He goes out there and he does his game and, you know, he's not a quitter. But I have a son. He injured. Chairs timeline for full time return to training camp.

2:28:11West time, I don't look returned sooner than many expected. Although his current rehab schedule doesn't make UFC 300 fight. Look very likely. Okay. So he is talking about coming back. So when it says he's injured, does it share what the injury is? It does not say specific. I was just looking to hopefully share that but it doesn't say specific. Yeah, I think there's stuff that he's been dealing with. So I got this injury and it'll take a while to recover. A long time to recover and whatnot. Like I'm like, what do you tell them? A smart coach knows the injury exists. We'll try to use it against you.

2:28:39So he's not going to tell anybody what the injury is. He's so far recovering very well and I'm on track. If he's got something that's that big, that's either like, knees or back or neck, generally, generally, or you know, it could be other joints. But generally when someone's got a significant injury like that and they need a lot of time off, it could be a back thing. It could be a knee thing. It could be a gastrointestinal thing. Yeah. You never know. I think that's like, I had a lot of struggles with stomach problems. Did you? Yeah, man. I always felt like I had like his crazy acid feeling in my stomach.

2:29:16It said he's aiming to get back in the gym training hard by the end of February. That doesn't bowed well for fans, hoping UFC 300 in April. No, I don't think he's going to be at UFC 300. But he might be in the June card when Connor returns. Yeah, they're going to need, they're going to want to stack that card up. How do you think that goes? Well, I don't like it that it's at 85. Is it actually confirmed to 85? I don't know. I know he said that. He's drinking wine and talking shit with a Rolex. I'm like, who knows? Who knows? But that man drinks. He does. That man drinks. That man does some stuff.

2:29:49But he likes to party. Yeah, I don't see that. And he's also, he's getting older as well. And he's also coming off the sauce. Right? So he gets on the sauce to rightly so to recover from that bone injury. It's a significant injury. You snap your femur and your tibial rather than your fibula. You snap those in half and your ankle's dangling. That's a long road back. And it's been two years now, plus. And if he really is going to fight in June, and he maybe just doesn't want to cut any weight, and he walks around at 85. So what I was saying earlier, there's two things I would do. One is every 10 pounds.

2:30:26Two, I would try to figure out a way to stop weight cutting. I would try to figure out a way to get fighters to fight. I think almost killing yourself 24 hours before you fight in the cage is insane. Almost killing yourself by dehydration isn't sane. I think they should figure out what guys actually weigh when they are low body fat, hydrated, and say, this is your weight class. And this happens because there's not enough weight classes. Right. And don't you think like they could, instead of having fights scheduled at 155 and 170 and 185, what about more catch weight fights? What about more guys fighting at what their natural weight is?

2:31:06I don't understand why they don't do catch weight fights because there's so many interesting matchups. One of them was always the GSP versus Silva, Anderson Silva. But Silva's losing weight to get to 185. And GSP when he went up to fight 185 when he fought bisming, he had to put a bunch of weight on. It was a struggle for him. He was eating six times a day. He got sick. He was throwing up all the time. He's trying to eat so much food just to maintain the mass. I think that those fights are exciting. Like super fights where guys go up a weight class or down a weight class. But I think the real way to do this is to reshape the sport where you cut what I call sanctioned cheating out.

2:31:51Everybody's doing it. There's nothing wrong with doing it. Don't get me wrong. But the fact that you don't really weigh 185, but you fight it at 185 pounds. Like when I interview you and you're 185, I'm like, how? Well, I ate a few drizzles. I'm like, how? How are you 185? Doesn't make any sense. You're not 185. You're fucking me. Pejada. Pejada's fucking huge. How are you 185? You're not 185. This is nonsense. You're really a 225 pound man. That's what you look like. That's what you are. And that's really what the weight you should be fighting at. And I think guys would fight better. I think they would have less deterioration of their endurance over the course of a five round fight.

2:32:29If they weren't fucking radically dehydrated, 25 hours ago. It's just, it's a four. And then the other part of it too, like people that walk around, like let's say I walked around at 85. Well, if I fight at 85, I'm undersized. I'm walking around at 85. You guys are fucking people cutting down. There's only a few guys that every day, I'm not that big. Frankie Edgar's the last guy that did that. Frankie Edgar's the last guy that was a champion that walked around at 155 and fought at 155. Always undersized. BJ Penn and Gray Maynard and beat all these guys at his natural weight. But that's really not where he should end up at the end of his career at 135, which is really probably where it should have been all along.

2:33:07But, you know, trying to convince guys to do that when there's guys like you that are cutting the weight that are massive for that weight class, it's crazy, you would never do it. You shouldn't do it. I'm fucking had the weight class. I'm tired of fucking cutting weight. I hate that. They should have the weight class. They should have 185, 195, 205, maybe 215, 215. You should have seen me earlier in my career. Like I said, I was 174 fighting in 185. I was skinny as fuck. I've always been skinny. I'm still kind of skinny. What did you do to put the weight on? Did you do this? This is where I get to plug my guy, right?

2:33:37So I never had a strength to get this shooting coach ever, ever. And when I got into, so I was sitting out of light one day coming back from Philadelphia practice at Marquez. And at the light, this guy's like, oh, he's like, you're a pipe for right? I was like, yeah, and he's like, you should come by my gym one day. And I was like, I was like, yeah, I don't even know, I probably not. Like, the fuck, I don't even know you. I winded up going, wind up hitting him up. Like, yo, do you do personal training? When he was like, yeah, of course. His name's Adam Ferris, he owns a gym called Pursuit. It's right in Washington, Towship, like right around where I live, right?

2:34:12I worked with him. We didn't do anything crazy, anything hard, or anything. I was skinny as fuck still, because I just came off of being, having two surgeries and all that stuff. I was still on the road back. And after I won my 50 grand bonus and I won my debut, I was still super skinny. I think DC interviewed me. You interviewed me once and it was Miami. So from that time when I won my debut, I was still skinny. And I didn't have a chance to ever have like a power program because I took a fight a month after I won the contract. So, and then I didn't have a chance to have a weight lifting program because I had had a comeback fight.

2:34:48And then I broke my ankle. So I never got a long enough period to build my body back. And I also didn't have a strength coach. Like I just, for some reason, I never thought I needed one. I made it to the UFC on the first before I continued. I made it to the contender series, hitting pads three days a week with the man that I brought Sam Orpiza, who had a full -time job and we would do it at 5 a .m. Three days a week. I wrestled with one of my best friends who literally was only a wrestler, had no MMA experience, and he was like 5 '7". And he was just like a sauceed fucking wrestler. And that's it.

2:35:23I literally, and I spot with Corey Anderson once a week. Wow. That's it. That's how I made it. That's how I was making all these fights and I was knocking everybody out and doing all this. So now that I have structure, now that I actually have a system with Marques, I have Jiu -Jitsu with Jonathan Webb. Like, you know, I'd be fucking Gerald Merchard, the middleweight submission, highest fucking whatever. Dude got waxed. Like, didn't even come close to beating me. You know, so my Jiu -Jitsu is underrated and my wrestling is underrated. But I think it will come to light, you know, with a guy like Jack.

2:35:55But, so you started the strength to get this to program. So I started the strength conditioning program. So what kind of stuff are you doing? So man, I was doing a power program. So I do like a six to eight week power program, a dad's, squats, and bench. But bench is kind of bullshit, because I care more about the explosive wrap, right? That's what we care about, because I'm just not putting more than 275 on a bench with my elbow. Right. I just not worth it. It's not worth the risk. It's not worth the nerve pain. It just doesn't make sense for me. So I'd be deadlift in a fucking. I was squatting a fuck ton.

2:36:30I always wanted thick legs. I never had it. And then now I started putting on size. And I wanted my back. I've always had a real big back, like strong back, like wide. And so yeah, I mean, we were doing, we were doing a power program. And then we would go right into like, explosiveness and jumps and ladder drills and just doing real simple movements, but a lot of functionality, like a lot of core twisting, a lot of med ball slams, a lot of kettlebell stuff. And yeah, that's my coach right there, Adam Ferris. Dude, a hole in the wall. Small ass jam. Like I hate those fucking things so much. And then the sling - Single leg lunges are rough.

2:37:09Yeah. And then we would just, you know, but my point is, Joe, I gave myself time after I won 50 grand because then I could afford to eat the way I needed to. That I was basically, I was gonna be evicted from where I was living if I didn't get side money from Dana who gave me a place to live after I won my contract. And then when I got to 50 grand bonus, I was like, I'm gonna fucking eat. Like I get to eat good food. I can buy, you know, food's expensive, you know? So yeah, I took like the next four, five -ish months to build myself. And then when I came in against Gerald, you height me up, you were like, it's fucking size.

2:37:45I was like, dude, my ego's like, yes, finally. Yeah, you looked awesome. We call fucking skinny my whole life. Yeah, nothing more brother. Yeah, no, not at all. And then obviously we're doing all that work with something that you've seen, the documentary through all that time. So now it's finally, you know, hopefully we get to release it soon. But, you do have the - There's official trailer. Yeah, we can, we'll play the trailer and end on this and listen Joe, I'm a big fan. I'm fucking pumped for you. Thank you. I have, you know, I'm so fortunate to be in the position that I'm in to be able to watch these fights.

2:38:23And one of my favorite things is to watch guys come up. I love it. Thank you, my man. And the Brasaka San fight was to me, it was like, that's what I like to see. A guy with potential that's just like, oh, nice. Like this guy's world championship potential. It's right there. Exactly. And that's the only thing I'll say, and I'll leave my last. If you look at Jack, and you look at me, the way my mind is, Jack's not been able to climb to the top but he's been against the best, and he's lost to the best. Me, and if you look at him where he is now, coming off an injury 35 years old, do you look at him and say, hey, this guy could hold the belt?

2:38:57No. I think the general public would say no. If you look at me, there's a lot of question marks still. I still have to prove myself against a lot of good guys. I haven't beat anybody that's that good. So I'm really honest with myself, but I'm gonna put myself on the map very soon. So I believe you. I'm excited. And thank you for having me on the green. My pleasure, bro. This has been fucking, my whole life has been crazy since I got into the UFC. It's awesome. Enjoy it, my friend. Okay, so this, when is this documentary coming out? When would people be able to see it? So our fellow friend Alex Davis, we're working on it.

2:39:29Shout out to Alex. Can't say it yet, but this was actually filmed by Chandler Henry who is actually a kid that I went to high school with. So now I got him a job and he does this for a living and beautiful. This was made by him. So hope we're helping really soon. I just can't say yet because that's Alex's job now. All right, well Alex will take care of it. I'm sure. So we'll end on this and this is available online. You can watch it. What is it called, Jamie? Official trailer journey to the UFC Joe Piper. Go find it. And February, what is the fight with Thurmanson? February 10th, maybe. February 10th, Las Vegas.

2:40:04It's an event from the apex. Let's go. All right, thanks Joe. My pleasure. God, we know. I've always believed ever since I was a kid, that fighting isn't something you do. Fighting is something that chooses you. All my life, I was a throwaway kid. I was always terrified. If I lost, I know I was getting screened down or I was going to get hit. Being slapped, punched, kicked, thrown down. Hair ripped to the point that I ran away from home, just shy of 17 years old, because I couldn't take it anymore. A lot of different people come from broken homes and they hold so much anger inside and hurt. That makes a person become kind of like an animal, you know?

2:40:59Joe is just on his tear. And then he gets a call from Dana. Dana's like, I want to put you on the contender's side. This is Joey's shot to get in there and a career ending injury just happened right in front of my face. 18 years in the game at that point. Golf.

2:41:24In Joe's case, this is the sort of injury that could absolutely end a career. This is an unforgiving sport. When you're the man, everybody loves you, but the second you lose, everybody forgets you. I wasn't ready to be forgotten. The pain that I know that kid went through and overcame in his life, if you want to beat him, you got to kill him. Joe didn't really find out that he didn't have a place to live. And he's like, what do I do? And I was like, you go to Vegas and fight. Oh, no! No! No! No! No! It's the playoffs! You got the power that all the teammates are talking about. Joe Piper makes his UFC debut after his week one performance on the contender's series.

2:42:17Eight of his nine wins are by finish and six of those are by knockout. This fight should be an absolute war. I'm scared for my life for the first time ever in any fight. I'm gonna build a jumping up pencil, and here it is! Joe Piper! Buddy, baby! Hey, baby! If you want to get into the UFC, and this is where you want to be, beat Joe Piper. Whoo!

2:43:04I'm gonna build a jumping up pencil. I'm gonna build a jumping up pencil. I'm gonna build a jumping up pencil.