JRE MMA Show #173 with Benny "The Jet" Urquidez & William "Blinky" Rodriguez

30:06Well, they're so good at slicing across those elbows. And that's what really cuts you open, especially to the forehead, and the forehead bleeds like crazy. You know, the one decision to benefit Bill Superfoot Wallace probably screwed over kickboxing in America. Kind of crazy because then Bill Wallace became the first commentator on the UFC. Which is ironic. The first commentator on the UFC is Bill Superfoot Wallace. Which is crazy because this is no rules, Bill. Rules are completely out the window. That's right. It's very unfortunate because I think the development of kickboxing in this country has been stagnated.

30:54you know and it had a shot for a while with glory glory was doing really well in america they had last man standing in la remember that yeah absolutely a crazy event amazing event but for whatever reason it just didn't take hold it was so exciting but it just never they had it i believe they had it on spike tv for a while it just for whatever reason it wasn't promoted correctly or it just didn't catch with the american public and i genuinely don't understand it couldn't get the sponsorship either, John. But it's with the views come the sponsors. And it's really just about presenting a package together and making it exciting for people.

31:35The thing is with the UFC in America, the UFC is so popular that if the UFC is coming to town, everybody's going to go see the UFC. Every time the UFC's at Philly or Houston, it's like, let's go. And you get tens of thousands of people want to come out to see the UFC. But with kickboxing, you've got to sell it on these people. You've got to sell it to them, and it hasn't been sold properly yet. The thing is the product is there. There's great strikers out there. Like, Jamie, pull up a clip of Yuki Yosa. This cat freaks me out because, like, his combinations, man. He's so lethal. And you see guys who just don't know what to do with the fact that he's taking away their legs, like, right away.

32:20He does this weird thing, too, where he, like, hooks their legs, too. and throws great boxing combinations too, but it's like everything is just constantly chopping at the inside of the legs. He throws high kicks and everything. And he's just brutalizing these dudes. And it's constant. No matter what he's doing, he's chopping your legs, taking your legs away, going inside, going outside. The kid's very good. And, you know, that Kyokushin background, you know, You guys know as well as anybody it's such a brutal style and They have to learn boxing afterwards because the Kyokushin competition is all punches to the chest only But look if you can learn how to kick you can learn how to punch It's just a matter of putting the time in and this dude has put the time in He does a sneaky thing too where he he throws a low kick and then he hooks their calves and it works even on the ties I I mean, just when you see a Thai getting his legs destroyed by a Japanese, you realize, wow, this sport has really changed.

33:27That's without a doubt. That's one of the cool things about combat sports is that you see a new person rise, doing something different. And when they do, everybody else has to sort of catch up. And then the techniques evolve. And you see everybody rise to the level of whatever this person's at and recognize that there's new techniques that people are using. Because martial arts has evolved more since 1993 to 2026 than it did in the last 10 ,000 years. And it's really because of exposure and because people like you guys went out there in the early, early days and laid it all out on the line to find out.

34:04Because when I started doing martial arts was 82, 81 or 82. And back then, no matter what you – 81. No matter what you did, you thought your style was the best. And no one really knew. You know, if you did karate, you thought karate was the best. If you did taekwondo, that was the best. And there was no competition where everybody went together that we knew of, other than we heard about your fights that you guys had in Hawaii. Everybody heard about that. It was, like, legendary. Like, Penny and Blinky went on a line. They fought everybody. No rules. Like, no rules? Who won? But we figured, oh, the strikers won?

34:40Striking's the way to go. It has to be. Like, the best strikers won. But then you watch the UFC, like, oh, jeez, what are they doing? Like, what is this Brazilian cat who's strangling everybody with a gi on? This is nuts. And it changed martial arts again. But, you know, everybody's looking for the next biggest thing. And so far, you know, I mean, where do you go from there? From UFC where you can throw and you ground and pound and so forth. When you do technique, standing, everybody sees it. But when it goes to the ground, everybody's looking at the monitor because they can't see nothing. Right.

35:17And so a lot of people were thinking it's boring. But they didn't realize there was a skill on the ground. But nobody seen it and it looked boring. But when you got up, so they were paying some of the fighters to stop the opponent standing instead of going to the ground. Well, there's a lot of promoters that definitely encourage fighters to not go to the ground. Yeah. And discouraged them when they did go to the ground because they knew they could take a guy down and just hold him down and beat him up a little bit and win. And the promoters was like, we're not interested in you. Which I think is not fair because it's all about fighting.

35:52And if a guy can hold you down, you have to figure out how to get up. And if otherwise, we're pretending. We're pretending these techniques work. Because if a guy is like a world-class wrestler, some Division I All-American, he takes you down, holds you down. You got to figure out how to handle that. Otherwise, we're lying. Because the sport is about combat. It's about fighting. It's the sport of fighting. Fighting is a man that can hold you down. If he can hold you down and beat you up, why is the referee standing you up? Why is the referee giving you an opportunity to fight? You have to figure out how to get up.

36:28You have to figure out either how to submit him off your back, sweep him, or stand up. Those are the options. A referee standing you up because the crowd's booing? This episode is brought to you by SimpliSafe. If we spend an absurd amount of time on our devices, and some days there are times when I can't stand to look or even think about all the notifications that pop up on my phone. But it's not a good idea to ignore everything, like a ping from your security camera. That could be a disaster. There are times when you just can't answer your phone, though, like if you're out in the middle of nowhere, camping or hiking or fishing with little to no cell phone reception.

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38:21Theirs is liposomal, which basically means it's wrapped in a tiny protective fat bubble that helps it survive digestion and get absorbed more effectively. It's liquid, super easy to take, a teaspoon, straight or mixed into drinks, third-party tested, manufactured in the U.S. If you care about recovery and resilience at the cellular level, check out Rho's glutathione at rhonutrition.com and use the code JRE for 20 % off. That's R-H-O, nutrition.com, code J-R-E. That's crazy. you know that's really true though it's uh i think that the crowd you know they're they want to see action and they can't see it on the ground but they don't realize there's a lot of action going on the ground but they don't see that they want to see you know it's almost like everybody at a car race they want to see the racing but they want to see a car crash you know i don't understand it but they want to see the car crash they want to see something happen yeah they want to they want to get excited but that's casuals you know you the casuals are the ones that boo when the fight goes to the ground you can't change the rules for the casuals you know but there's that's the problem when business gets involved in sport yes you know you start altering the rules to make it more business friendly which i just don't i don't agree with i just don't think that's the way to do it well when you're talking about warriors right you know you're talking about training samurais yes they're trained hey to actually get in there and do their job and back away yeah but again you know right now the promoters a lot of the promoters are looking at how can i fill my seats yes you know they don't they don't care about the fighting they care about how can i bring okay he's popular he'll bring more people in the seats yes and that's all they're looking at it?

40:20Well, it was my job in the early days of the UFC, when it first got on television, to explain to people what's going on when it hits the ground. So it was my job, you know, back in, I started working for the UFC in 2001. Well, I started in 97, then I started again in 2001. And very few people other than martial artists understood jujitsu. You know, I had been training at Carlson Gracie's. And then by the time 98 came around, I was training at John Jacques Machado. So I was training every day. So I knew jujitsu. And so I had to explain it like I was sitting next to my girlfriend. Like, okay, what he's going to do now, he's going to throw his right leg over the side of his neck.

40:57And he's going to trap that arm. Okay, now he's fucked. Now he's in trouble. Now he's going to hook that leg under his ankle. He's got the triangle. He's got the triangle. And I had to get people excited about it. Like, I was excited about it. But also kind of talk them through it because they didn't know what was happening. You had to explain, like, why are his legs wrapped around that guy's neck? This looks gay. Like what the hell is going on? You know, like what is this? And you realize, no, he's cutting off the blood to his brain with his legs. And they're like, whoa, that's nuts. And you're like, right?

41:25That's what Mel Gibson did to Gary Busey in Lethal Weapon. They're like, that's crazy. It works. Like, yeah, that's a real technique. He learned from Horry and Gracie. And so the early days was a lot of it for me was about kind of explaining to me, to people that are at home, what was happening and talking them through it. Like that was the main part of my job once the fight got to the ground. Now everybody understands. Now everybody knows what a choke hold is. Everybody knows what an arm bar is. Everybody knows. So now it's just about explaining whether or not he's in danger or he's free, where the elbow is, where the knee is.

42:02And it's just kind of letting people know like whether or not he's okay or not. But they know what's going on now. Even though they know what's going on on the ground, they still want to see him get up. You hear the crowd, get up. There's nothing like a knockout. And there's nothing like a head kick knockout. Head kick knockout is the ultimate. When someone lands a head kick knockout, like Leon Edwards versus Kamaru Usman, he's losing the fight. Fifth round. Boom! Head kick. You see Kamaru go down. The crowd in Salt Lake City goes nuts. That is the ultimate expression of martial arts is the kick, right?

42:36And a head kick that scores a knockout, like that's a Bruce Lee movie, you know? Yeah, true. That's what everybody wants to see. They want to see it in real life against a trained, skilled opponent. I get that. That's the car crash. Yeah, that's the car. It's the skillful car crash. Exactly. Yeah. All of it is skillful, but the more they know about it, the more they understand the skill it takes to get there. So you shed the light on it. Yeah. Once people, like you said, understood the damage that's going on and the need to know the technique and that art form makes you the winner. At the end of the day, who's getting their hand raised?

43:18Right. You know what I'm saying? Right. And then you got those that can do both. They'll dazzle you with a spinning back kick to the chin or they'll take you and put you in a rear naked choke. You know what I mean? Those are the top guys today. So that's the other part of the game. But when you start talking about back in the era that you understand and we understand, it was the Budo heart. That was the transition, was the spirit of. It was the essence. It was that tradition that really brought more mystique to the martial arts, more tradition in a way that people honored. You know what I mean?

43:53So it was kind of like you start seeing the different transitions that came. See what I'm saying? And, you know, it's just like you hear people. It's like a guy's out. He hits the ground. Boom. The referee don't get there in time, but he takes another whack or two. You know what I mean? So then that's the part. At least I'm like, wow, man, you want to make sure that he don't get up. But at the end of the day, those couple of extra shots can create the damage. More damage. Absolutely. More damage. You see what I'm saying, Joe? Yeah. So at the end of the day, I mean, hey, it's vicious. You've got to be conditioned.

44:27I mean, you've got to put in the work without a doubt. You know what I mean? Because exhausting has made cowards of many. Yes. You know? So, yeah, I mean, so that whole Buddha heart, the tradition, that atmosphere, that spirit, little by little started dissipating. And then the new era starts coming in. I believe the injuries that in the ground and pound or whatever even standing up getting knocked out standing and hitting the mat you know a lot a lot of promoters are saying we want to see that but again the insurance I mean to get the insurance to cover a lot of these fighters is brutal Yeah, especially small shows, right?

45:19That's it. It's brutal, and you have—it's a lot of ground and power, a lot of jarring of the mind and the body. Eventually, it's going to give out, you know? And so some of them don't last two, three years. And they're great at what they do, but, you know, by the time they finish, it's hard for them to make a living. Right. Especially if they're married and so forth. I mean, you've got to continue on life. So they try to make it safe enough, but at the same time, when it comes down to the art of war, it's mental warfare, it's physical warfare, it's even spiritual warfare, the energies that are coming at you.

46:01So educating the public to what it really takes and what it is that we're doing in the ring, in the cage, what is it exactly? Okay, it's entertainment, but there's a skill. there's a skill that we're using to be able to go in there and stop an opponent without getting hit. Yeah, it really is a test of your spirit because it's a test of your spirit just to be able to discipline yourself, to get in condition and train properly. It's a test of your spirit to be able to fight at the level of your actual abilities under pressure. And when I describe martial arts competition, I say it's high-level problem-solving with dire physical consequences.

46:42Very well put. That's what it is. It's just like that's what you're going against, a skilled guy who's trying to do something to you, and he's moving, and you're trying to do something to him, and any mistake, boom! And then the referee's got a light in your face, and next thing you know, you're like, oh, my God. You don't know what happened. I mean, you have two type of fighters. You have a checker player who take two hits to give one that don't care, and then you have a chess player that don't like to take any and give the four, five, and six. Those are the smart ones. They're doing combinations, exactly.

47:12They're the ones that are doing combinations. Well, that's why it's important where you train, you know, and the gym that you guys had set up, the Jet Center, was legendary for developing champions and legendary for teaching proper technique and showing you the consequences of the moves and also teaching people that you don't have to spar to try to kill each other all the time. You know, you could spar like some of the best sparring I ever got was at the Jet Center because the place when I was after I'd been done fighting when I lived in Boston, when we trained, it was war. Every time you sparred, you were just fighting.

47:45There was no one pulled any punches. No one pulled any kicks. Everybody was blasting everybody full blast. It was terrifying. And you saw a lot of guys get knocked out in the gym, and then they'd be back a couple days later. And that's crazy. That's crazy. We know that now. Back then, we didn't even think about it. Everybody just came back. You just came back. You started training again. You had a headache. And you just dealt with it. Nobody actually understood a concussion. Right. Hey, all right, shake it off. You know, it'll be okay. You know, sit down for a while, have some water. Okay, back in.

48:16Right. And so you went back in with a concussion, not even knowing that you had a concussion. Right. Other than I had a headache or I was a little dizzy, but I'm okay again. Let me get back in. Because, hey, you didn't want to feel like, hey, I can't hang. You didn't want to feel like a bitch. That's right. I can't hang. And so you get back in there with this. And so that's what's going on with a lot of these fighters. they you know before they go i mean they're training for their fight and they get a concussion and then next week they're going into the fight with a concussion not even knowing they had a concussion happens all the time yeah i know one guy who got knocked out twice in camp and then like one of them was less than two weeks before his fight and then he got touched on the chin and his fight just went out cold because he was already fucked up that's right he came into of the fight, like severely compromised.

49:06It's like going into battle with a hole in your armor. He was already messed up. And, you know, there's like, there's a time and place for hard sparring because I think you have to have some hard sparring to understand that, hey, you can't just block something like that. You're going to get your arm fucked up. You can't just have your, you're going to have to deal with the fact that hard shots are coming your way. So sometimes you're going to have to spar hard. But technique sparring is so important too. One of the reasons why the ties are so successful is they play spar like they fight every week so there's no reason to get banged up so when you watch tie fighters when they spar over there they're like they touch each other they just touch each other they're not trying to hurt each other because like once a week they have to go fight hard so they don't fight hard when they're training it's like they're fighting is like their one hard sparring day yes because they're some of them literally You're fighting once a week.

50:01You get these guys that are 22 years old. They have 200 fights, which is crazy. Crazy. But, you know, again, if you're fighting for lifestyle as eating for your family and so forth, when you go in there, they're fighting. Right. There's no sparring session. It's a fight. And that's why they bring home food to their families. So when they go out there, I mean, they're fighting at five years old. They're already trained. Three years old, they're already training. By the time they're 10 years old, they have so much experience of the fight. And some of them are done by the time they're 22, 24. They're done.

50:51They've already had 300 fights by then, which is crazy. It is crazy. Yeah, and a lot of it over there is motivated by gambling. That's right. So when people watch Thai fights, they go, why do they take the first round so light? Well, it's because that's when everybody gambles. And they can switch rounds. Yeah. Switch opponents. Oh, do they sometimes? That's what I understood. They switch opponents in between rounds? Opponents, my God. Who they're betting on. Oh, right, right, right. Switch opponents that they're going to bet on. Yeah, they do that all the time. I mean, there's so much gambling going on.

51:23when you go to a Muay Thai fight in Thailand, in the beginning of the fight, you see everybody waving money around and pointing to people, and everybody's like setting bets. So the first round, those fighters are just kind of like setting the pace and just experiencing each other's timing. And then the second round comes in, all the bets are in, they start ramping it up, and then they start really fighting, which is alien to a lot of foreigners. They go over there, and then they try to go wild in the first round, like, you gotta let the bets get in. in and they're like what what are you talking about like no no it's an agreement a silent agreement when you go out there that for that first round for that first round you're just feeling each other out that guy's not going to try to knock you out he's just trying to feel you out he's going to try to land some shots a couple hard leg kicks maybe a teep but really he's just waiting for that second round to open up exactly and that's again it's it's a way of life to them and you know a lot of them their parents are selling their kids when they're very young because they can't afford and they're in camps and the kids take on the name of the gym and that's all, they're upstairs they walk and talk and sleep and dream in that gym, they don't go outside every day that's all they do they're trained for fighting and I mean I've been to a couple of them and that's it, they don't see nothing else they just train They go upstairs.

52:49They do it. And the next day they do the repeating and then they go to the fights. It is crazy because the money from the gambling is what led the sport to be so huge. And the sport becoming so huge over there is what led them to be so good. And that all that money and gambling led it to be one of the most fierce fighting styles on earth. Because while the rest of the world hadn't figured out the knees and the elbows and the clench and the leg kicks, the ties have been doing it forever. They had already been doing it for a long time. It took a long time for the rest of the world to catch up to what Thailand had figured out just from allowing people to fight for money.

53:28I mean, you're talking about in 75, just understanding the word Muay Thai. Right. Thinking it was a guy. So what the heck is that? That is such a crazy story. And then, of course, the leg checks, counters, and we started getting the idea, okay, this is how you fight them. And then you have other styles for American bread fighters that didn't have part of that game in their repertoire of Arsenal, you know what I'm saying? Right, right. So I think that's what the other thing that the PK did. It didn't give anybody from the PK a chance to learn, you know, internationally what was going on in the world.

54:13Not to put them down because, you know what, that was all part of us moving forward, you know, back in the day, learning. But, you know, when you come up through Shotokan, you're going to know how to sweep and you're going to know how to front kick. You know what I mean? And so that was on the traditional side. of the art but yeah it's unfortunate it's unfortunate because i you know even dana white when i talked to him about it's like oh people don't care about kickboxing i'm like it's just because it was sold badly in the 80s that's really all it is like if it was around today i genuinely believe it would like if kickboxing had gotten the same sort of promotional push the ufc got like way back in 2001 i think it would be just as big as boxing just as big as MMA.

55:00I think it would be huge right now. I'm going to agree with you because there are a lot of excellent stand-up fighters that are really colorful and use all their weapons. They can use elbows, knees, feet, jumping. I mean, things that everybody don't do that. They didn't want me to throw spinning back kicks. It doesn't work. I said, really? And I've been showing them for every time they said that. I made them eat the words because, again, the art, if you do it right, it looks fancy. It doesn't work if you're not good at it. No, of course not. Yeah, like everything doesn't work if you're not good at it.

55:44That's right. If you try to punch Floyd Mayweather, you're not going to hit him. It doesn't mean punches don't work. That's right. It just means you're not good enough at it. That's right. You know what I mean? It's interesting that people don't see that. Even coaches don't see that sometimes. You know Terrence Crawford learned how to switch hit, you know, because Terrence Crawford is one of the best switch dance fighters ever since Marvin Hagler. And one of the reasons why he did it is because his coach told him he can't do that. His coach was like, don't do that. Stay orthodox. Stop messing around.

56:15He's like, what? He's like, I can fight this way too. He's like, no, no, no, you can't. He's like, oh, okay. I'll show you. And he would call it start fight southpaw. And then like start fucking people up and switch hands on them. And they're like, oh, no. Because it's an amazing skill to have. But it's only amazing if you develop your southpaw style as good as your orthodox style. It doesn't mean that you can't do it. It means it has to be at that leg. If you want to land a spinning back kick, it doesn't mean you can't land a spinning back kick. It just means your spinning back kick is not good enough to land.

56:45But Benny Arquidez can land that spinning back kick. I mean, I'm softpaw. I'm a lefty. But I fought left forward because my brother said, don't let them know you're lefty. So he trained all of us. Even my sister was lefty. And we all trained left forward. But when we struck, you couldn't tell that we were a softball. So we started left-handed and working. But that was his logic. It was also the benefit of that is you had a lethal left-hand kick. So your left side kick that front kick the side kick from the left side and the front round kick from the left side was fast as fuck Because this episode is brought to you by lifelock It's tax season and by now I know we're all a bit tired of numbers, but here's an important one for you to hear 16 billion dollars.

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59:58Just go to thefarmersdog.com slash Rogan. This offer is for new customers only. You're a naturally left-sided fighter. That's right. Yeah. That's right. You know, I think that it's just each decade as we go, you know, as Blinky was talking about, the Brucho way, you know, there was a, you know, you had honor. There was an honor system and all that. And then in the 70s, it started to change when Full Contact Karate came in. It started to change. And then kickboxing in 75 and on. And people were, you know, we're not martial artists, we're kickboxers. Then Muay Thai came, oh, Muay Thai, we're not kickboxers.

1:00:47And then we're UCI fighters, we're not Muay Thai fighters. I said, you know, so every decade it changed. But again, you needed to learn from ground one. And the ground one was internal. The I am concept of what you tell yourself with that, you know, and there was an honor system going on, and there was a code of honor between warriors. Right. And that got lost. That's right. And there was power in that. There was power in that code of honor of strength, of knowing. And they said, well, how do you know? I said, I just know. But they said, how do you know? I said, I can't answer you that other than the fact that I just know.

1:01:25The tenets of a warrior code that you would learn in traditional martial arts were very important. Yes. That's why everybody would bow at the beginning of the class and everybody would key eye at the same time. There was a rigid structure to it. And they would not let anyone trash talk. There was no yelling and swearing. There was no none of that. You don't even wipe the sweat off your head. Right. There was bowing and, you know, it was the beginning of the fight. Everybody, like, bowed to each other, went back to the corner. There was no trash talk. There was no none of that. It was your words will be spoken with your weapons.

1:02:02That's it. I wanted to just add, you know, Benny mentioned his sister. Well, we're one cousin's. I was married to Lily. Lily was my wife. And she passed away. But she was a trailblazer for women. Absolutely. Boxing and kid boxing. Absolutely. Won titles in both. Fought Madison Square Garden in 1978, you know, also. and just paying homage, you know, because she also pioneered and was taking the forefront, you know, fighting at the Olympic, fighting at the Forum, fighting in Japan, traveled the world and fought and represented well and trained hard, you know what I'm saying? Because actually at the fights, my sister, Lily, she actually fought first.

1:02:46Blinky would fight, and then I would be the last to fight. So all three of us, when we traveled the world introducing kickboxing, my sister, Blinky, and myself, we all fought at the same card. So the night Bobby Chacon, if you remember that name at all. Bobby Chacon, sure. Okay, Bobby Chacon and Alexis Arguello, we fought on their card, both of us, first husband and wife to fight on a boxing card like that. Wow. Under that right there. Wow. Yeah. And I grew up with Bobby. We grew up with Bobby. He came out of the San Fernando Valley, a little featherweight. Yeah. His whole style. Yeah, his whole style.

1:03:26I was his sparring partner for a while. He started busting up my nose and giving me black eyes. I said, one time he hit me with such a beautiful right hand. My leg came up automatically, and he started taking his glove off. You know, I'm not sparring with you no way. I said, it was a reflex. I'm sorry. I didn't mean to bring the leg up. He said, he started taking his glove. I don't want to spar with you no more. Did you hit him with the leg or just pick it up? No, I picked it up. he hit me with a nice right and automatically my right leg came up and by then he just told Joe Ponce I'm not spying with him no more the craziest thing about all this is you guys were trailblazers there was very little money in it are you kidding me sometimes we paid for our own way just to get there to fight we paid him to fight really?

1:04:18when I say we did We paid for our own gas just to go out there and actually fight. So it was very little money. Yeah, there was no money and glory and big houses and cars and the things that fighters look for today. Just heart. Yeah. Just the love of the sport, building it. Well, I don't think you guys get enough credit, and it's one of the reasons why I really wanted to have you on to talk about it because I think the sport needs to recognize the pioneers that blazed the trail. And you two are one of the most important pioneers that blazed the trail in martial arts in this country. And you did it back when no one knew what was going on.

1:04:59People need to understand, when did you guys first start fighting? When did you have your first kickboxing competitions? Actually, it was in 73. It was called Full Contact Karate. And we already was fighting in 64 martial arts. And that was bare knuckles hitting the ground. we were already sparring and then and then no one knew about it back then no we have to realize like the Bruce Lee movies when did they start coming out into America like early 70s right so this is like almost 10 years before that yeah crazy yeah like real pioneers man no one knew about it that you had heard about judo people knew about judo maybe some people had heard about karate but it wasn't that popular in America the first thing was actually popular was of boxing.

1:05:48Right, of course. And after the boxing. Boxing has always been popular. And then, other than all the other sports, but boxing was when it came to the art of war. And then it was judo in the, I started actually judo in 60. And then 63, we started kimpo karate. Is that when you met Gene LaBelle? Yes, exactly. And I tell you what, talking about the master of disaster. Oh yeah, he was awesome. He was awesome. Ponsonagi. Here we go. I got a chance to meet him because one of the guys that I first trained jiu-jitsu under, I took private lessons from this guy, Silvio Pimento. Oh, yes. You know Silvio?

1:06:24I do. He's a great guy. Shout out to Silvio. And he was a Gene LaBelle student. So he had a bunch of nasty tricks that he had learned from Gene LaBelle along with his jiu-jitsu stuff. So he showed me a lot of, like, different chokes and different things and different variations that Gene had developed. Right. And I was like, man. And then I finally got to meet Gene. What a character that guy was. He is such a character. there. Gene was one of those type of warrior senseis that say, if you want to train with me, don't be afraid to get choked out. And before you can actually train with him, he'd choke you out.

1:07:02He'd choke you out and he would go and get lipstick and put it around your eyes. And then when he'd wake you up, you had all this. That was Sensei Gene. And I told Sensei Gene, I said, get it over with. Just choke me out. Get it over with. Because I knew that I knew automatically like he was being easy. I said just do it. Get over with. I said I'm not afraid. Just do it. And took me out. Before I was out and I was back up again. I didn't even know I was out. And he said you took it like a you know like a charm man. You know. I said you know since if I'm not afraid to die, what can you possibly do to me?

1:07:49He said, really? And I said, yeah. And then he grabbed my big toe and put me in pain all the way up to my forehead, all the way back down to the other big toe. And I said, I'll never say that one again. Your big toe. You had a big toe submission. Yeah, he grabbed my big toe right at the edge of it and he put his nail in it. And oh my God, my eyes were bulging. Gene told me a story about when he was old. I think he was in his 70s. Some kids were breaking into his car and he went outside. Did you hear this story? Yes. There's two guys that were talking. They're like, get the fuck out of here, old man.

1:08:28He's like, oh, really? He grabs this dude, fucking hip, throws him out of the concrete, boom! Grabs the other dude, chokes him unconscious. He fucked up two dudes when he was 70 years old. Yeah. In front of his house. It's like... As a matter of fact, I did a couple of movies with him. His mother was Eileen Eaton. She owned the Olympic Auditorium. Oh, wow. The Olympic Auditorium was the spot way back then. You had some big-time fights going on. Big-time fights. He was always humble. You know what I mean? Yes. And he wore his humility very well. Yeah, he was very self-deprecating and joking about himself and being silly.

1:09:09But, man, you shook that guy's hand. You're like, this is a fucking gorilla. There's Gene. There he is. Yes, yes. Such a great guy. Yes, he is, actually. And he had one of the first mixed rules fights when he fought Milo Savage. That's right. That even predated the karate fights or the mixed martial arts fights that you guys had in Hawaii. That's right. He fought Milo Savage, who was a boxer, and he wore a gi. and the gi was so smart because Milo got tangled up in the gi and Gene grabbed him and strangled him. You know matter of fact it was Muhammad Ali at the time we went to fight in Japan and he was the main event I was a semi event.

1:09:50Was that when he was fighting in Noki? Yeah. He stood on the ground. I went and I knocked out my opponent quickly because I wanted to see the fight. So I stopped my Opponent who did you fight do you remember I can't even think of his name See if you can find the the undercard Benny's fight on the undercard because that fight with Inoki was crazy I don't know how they talked Muhammad Ali into fighting him. I you know it was a five rounder And it was there was there was not supposed to be no decision It was five rounder and so forth and they both got paid great money But I was telling in in the dressing room.

1:10:28I was telling Muhammad Ali he's going to go for your legs and he starts saying I'm so fast I said I said Muhammad he's going to go for your legs and I said sure enough after I fought I didn't even want to go to the dressing room I just wanted to stay there and when they came out and sure enough the first thing Tony did jumped went to the ground and did a flying round kick to his thighs after the second round Tony Anoki went out there and started going to his ground. And Muhammad Ali jumped on the corner of the ring and was kicking him on the ground as he was holding on to the ring. At the time, it was funny to see it.

1:11:16But after the five rounds, I tell you, Muhammad couldn't. They had to carry him. Yeah, his legs were fucked up. Oh, my God. Yeah, they were really badly damaged. And for a guy who relies on his legs as much as Ali did, that's a crazy fight to take because if he got sidekicked and hyperextended his knee and it was never the same, it would compromise his movement. That would float like a butterfly. That was a big part of his style. That's true. And I just can't imagine how anybody allowed him to take that fight. Like if I was his manager, I'd be like, there's no way you're taking this fight. This guy's going to ruin your legs.

1:11:53you know first of all it was always about whether it was about the money or not but it was about you know doing something different and Tony Onoki being Muhammad Ali here in the United States Tony Onoki was the man in Japan he was the man in Japan pro wrestling and so that's why they went and it was packed the place did you find that video is it available online at all? I was looking for the I mean I can only find stuff about the event was called the War of the Worlds and they also showed it on TV on the screen. Wow. Andre the Giant fought in New York. He fought Chuck Wepner? Wow. Wow. That's crazy.

1:12:42So that was in New York? Yeah. That was a TV event. It says like 10 rounds direct from New York and this is 15 rounds direct from Tokyo. Oh. So sort of like pay-per-view or something. Oh, wow. And then even a co-feature will appear local to your area. Oh, wow. But there's no video available? I'm still looking right now. That was their fight. I was looking for his fight. That was a great fight, though. Their fight was crazy. Their fight was crazy. When you look at Inoki kicking him, you're like, this is just nuts. He jumped right to the ground. He was a big guy. Oh, yeah. Inoki was a big guy. But you know what?

1:13:23He wasn't full Japanese. He was half Japanese, half something else. But he was tall, and he had a square jaw that was... And his thighs... Yeah, he was a big dude. Oh, yeah, without a doubt. Is this the promotion for the fight, not the actual fight itself? I don't know. Oh, there it goes. Oh, it's not showing you the actual fight, but there was a lot of that. Oh, yeah. I wonder what they paid Ali to do that. Yeah. because like that seems like a crazy decision to make here it is they took him right to the hospital look at that drops down and kicks the legs this is it i'm in the corner i wonder if you can see me there but yeah but it's just getting your legs kicked like that if you don't know what the hell's going on no like that's going to destroy your legs oh yeah they i mean right after that went right to the hospital.

1:14:17They had a drain. They had a drain. I mean, his legs were full of fluid. They had to drain it out. Oh, man. Yeah, I heard he got infected, too. Didn't he get infected in the hospital and he was there for quite a while? Yeah. That's terrible, man. That is so terrible. I just don't understand why anybody... So this is 1976. Yeah, that was the undercard there. Was Ali the champ back then? I think so. I think so. Wow. Just nuts, man. Yep, he was WBC, WBA heavyweight boxing champion. Wow. I trained with Tony Onoki. Yeah? Yeah. What was that like? I'll tell you. The way they trained there, they had these, I mean, working.

1:15:03I mean, they didn't use weights, but the strength. His grip was like a vice grip. Did they use those steel clubs? Yeah, the steel clubs. But he had all that was just natural movement. So I even tried to have smaller ones for me. But I trained with him for a week. And I tell you what, it was every day I got up. We all have that dream trip we've been wishing we could go on. But too often life or usually price gets in the way. That's why Priceline is here to help you turn your dream trip into reality. With up to 60 % off hotels and up to 50 % off flights, you can book everything you need for your next adventure.

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1:16:218 % alcohol by volume. White Claw Seltzer Works. Chicago, Illinois. Man, because those muscles I've never used before. Right. Oh, my God. Well, a lot of those guys learned strength and conditioning from Carl Gotch. Yes. And Karl Gotch was a legendary catch wrestler. And Karl Gotch went over to Japan and trained a lot of those guys, like Sakuraba, a lot of those guys who eventually became big-time mixed martial arts fighters. They started with catch wrestling. And Karl Gotch was one of the beginning guys that came over to Japan and taught a lot of those Japanese pro wrestlers a lot of the different submission holds of catch wrestling.

1:17:00And his big thing was conditioning. Carl Gottsch is a legendary strength and conditioning guy. Like his routine was absolutely brutal. In order to be able to train with him, you had – before you could train with him, he had to know that you were in physical condition. So you had to go through this program to get yourself up to – I forget what the requirement was. But it was some insane requirement of physical conditioning before he would even teach you anything. Like you had to be in shape. Like you got to have a gas tank. You got to be strong. You've got to be agile, and you've got to be able to move well.

1:17:33You know, my mother wrestled at the Olympic auditorium. Really? With actually Sensei Gene on the same card. And then my—actually, I fought. I fought there at the Olympic. And so—and then my sister, Lily, she did roller derby at the Olympic. Oh, wow. And she used to do roller derby. That was a rough lady. Yeah. Man, that's crazy. She did roller derby. Roller derby's tough, man. I've watched some of that. Yeah. I went to see an event of that live. It's like, those girls get slammed. Oh, yeah. So a little quick vignette. Lily was in a fight on a Bobby Chacon card at the Olympic Auditorium. So they did an article on Bobby, and in the article they mentioned Lily, that she's had over 50 street fights.

1:18:25And when she read that, she was like, why would he say that? because he was pulling for her. You know what I'm saying? Just crazy stuff like that. But, yeah, she went in there and she was throwing him down. And then out of the ring, you'd never guess it by looking at her. Right, never guess it. Never guess it. Well, that was interesting because there was no real female boxing presence in this country back then. That's right. It really didn't exist. Like before Lily, like who? There wasn't. There was no one. Lily is the one that actually, a bunch of girls got together, and Lily is the one that actually started boxing because they were saying, women can't box.

1:19:08Boxing, boxing. Girls, women can't box. And she was knocking people out. Right. She was knocking men out at the gyms. And that's when they decided, well, let's see what's going to happen. Sure enough, she went out there, and she was the first woman to have a boxing title, a martial art title, and a kickboxing title. That's amazing. She was the first one. That's amazing. And then there was Lucia Riker. Lucia Riker? That's her in the 90s. Right behind. Fantastic. She couldn't get any fights. Women didn't want to fight her. She was knocking people out dead. And she was a kickboxing champion as well.

1:19:41Yes, that's right. Started out Dutch kickboxing champion and then went into boxing and could never get that fight with Christy Martin. Christy Martin was the big name. Yes. And she could never get a fight with her. Yeah. Yeah. It's like Christy Martin was the first one in America that really broke through and became a famous female boxer. Yeah. But before her and then there was, of course, Layla Ali. And there's been a few other ones. Claressa Shields right now, who's the greatest woman of all time. And it's like there's, you know, it's those people. They owe it to Lily in a lot of ways. And just like martial arts fighters owe it to you guys.

1:20:17If someone didn't step in in the very early days and blaze that trail, no one's going to find out what's on the other side of the woods. Hey, Joe, but after you saying that, you know, Sensei Ben's going to be inducted this coming Saturday. Really? At the Martial Arts Museum. So it's going to be inducted to the Martial Arts Museum. That's awesome. That's awesome. Actually, we have the first three-finger glove. This was in 73, the first three-finger glove of striking and grabbing. Yeah. So there's a lot of stuff that— Like in Game of Death, those Bruce Lee gloves. That's right. That needs to be redone.

1:21:00You know, one of the big problems with MMA today is eye pokes. It's a giant problem, and I think it could be at least 80 % solved by covering up the fingertips. We don't need the fingertips for grappling. You never grapple like this. You never interlace your fingers. That's right. So if you could just cover it up like an old school Everlast bag glove, just do that because you could still grapple. No problem. It's like if you've got padding over the knuckles, just extend the leather over the tips of the fingers. Make it like a mitten. Put it under the hand like this. So your hand will slide into it the same way.

1:21:31Your thumbs will still be free. So you still have unfortunately, you'll still have some pokes from the thumbs, but way less when you don't have eight other things to poke with. That's right. I think that could be done, and I don't think that takes away from the MMA sport at all. No, because, again, you know, a lot of them, some, they're striking, and they're striking with their fingers open. Yeah. And, I mean, some of them, I mean, I had this one guy that had his finger stuck so deep that they actually had him. I mean, that's how deep his finger was. He jabbed with his finger open. Well, that happened recently with Tom Aspinall.

1:22:05Yes. With his heavyweight title. He was fighting Cyril Ghosn, and Cyril Ghosn poked him in the eye a couple times. But one time with both fingers, in both eyes, he poked him. And his right eye is fucked up. He's already had one surgery. He's going to have a second surgery soon, apparently. How many detached retinas over the course of time? Oh, a countless number. I mean, you're going to have some detached retinas from fighting, period. There's no way to avoid it. You're getting punched and kicked and elbowed in the eye. It's going to happen. In the MMA. Yes, but it's going to be less of it. I mean, look, Sugar Ray Leonard had a detached retina, and that was just from boxing gloves.

1:22:43You're going to have some detached retinas, but I think you'd have a lot less eye injuries if you covered those damn fingertips. And it's just we've gotten used to these MMA gloves that they have today. It doesn't mean that that's the only way to do it. They need to figure out another way. Got to take care of the fighters. 100%. And also make the sport better because if fights don't get stopped from eye pokes, it's more exciting. It's better. You don't want a fight stop from an eye poke. So the fights will go on. There'll be better fights. It's a better product. The same thing back then. They were fighting with eight-ounce gloves, but there were horsehair in it.

1:23:18And a lot of them were putting their glove in the spit bucket so making the horsehair wet so it would get real solid and it would start to. Guys would cut a hole in it and take their squeezy bottle, their water bottle, take that little straw part and stick it in there and squirt water into the horse hair and pat it down. That's right. That's what we started to play. We remember Margarito. He got caught. Oh, yeah. Yeah, he got caught using plaster of Paris inside of his, or whatever it was, something that when it got wet would harden up like a rock inside of his hand wraps. Like hitting them with a brick.

1:23:54Yeah, yeah. That's why they would come and check your wraps. They would mark it to make sure before the glove goes on. Because they were doing a lot of crazy things. A lot of dirty shit. Oh, yeah. Well, Margarito got away with it long after people had already been checking things, too, which is really crazy. Yeah. But, you know, you're always going to have cheaters. That's just how the sport is. I mean, you know, it's, again, when you call it a sport, there's got to be the prosciutto way of honor system and respect and so forth when you're talking about a sport. Right. But when it becomes away from a sport, then it becomes a money thing.

1:24:38You get away from that prosciutto way of really a code of honor between warriors. Right. You know, back then, even the samurais, they're assigned to the dead, but there was a code of honor and they knew what they were there for. Just like, you know what you're going in there for. And but now there's rules and either you go by the rules or don't do it. Yeah. I mean, I think if people had a martial arts code of honor, it would be just as exciting and maybe more interesting. So in agreement. And you would also develop a lot better human beings. Yes. Because instead of a bunch of kids imitating people talking trash, what you would have is a bunch of kids that imitate very respectful martial arts people.

1:25:22Very respectful, true martial artists. Very well put. Yeah. Absolutely. It's there for self-defense. It's not to be aggressive. And self-improvement. Yes. That's the other thing. It's like my instructor had a saying that martial arts was a vehicle for developing your human potential. and I never forgot that. I was like, if you could get great at martial arts, you could get great at anything, at anything. It's really just a matter of taking that knowledge that you learned about yourself and going through the fire and learning how to be a great martial artist and you could apply that to anything.

1:25:59It's supposed to be a way of life. Yeah. It's supposed to teach you about honor and dignity and respect and so forth. That's basically what it was all about. Yeah, that's what it's supposed to be about. Yeah, and even though it's about defending, self-defense is defending, instead of, you know, being a striker, learning how to defend it, slipping and moving and defending. But that turned around, and it became striking, you know, instead of learning how to—because I would put my money on a good defensive fighter than a striker, Because it's easy to go out there and strike, but if you don't know how to defend, striking back at you.

1:26:43Right. Well, one of the most humiliating things for a fighter is they think they're a good striker, and then they get in there with someone who has impeccable defense, and they can't hit them at all. And then they get confused. They get countered. Yeah, they get countered, they get confused. And, you know, it's also what caliber of fighter are you training with, which is probably one of the most important things for young fighters to understand. you will imitate the atmosphere of your gym period and the level that is the top guy at your gym that is the level that everybody aspires to if you are training with a bunch of champions you're training with a bunch of high level guys you will aspire to be at that high level if you are the toughest guy in your gym if you're the best guy in your gym and you you're not a world champion you're not the best in what you're just pretty good like you're not going to grow in that gym you got to get out of that gym you got to get out of that gym you got to go find people that are They're going to test you and put you in danger and put you in a position where you're going to have to learn and grow.

1:27:39And that's the only way. And that was the advantage of training at the JET Center. We had people coming from all over the world, all over the country. You had nothing but people that you had to aspire for. You had to reach for the stars. You know what I mean? Make it happen. And with condition being the name of the game. You know what I mean? And from time to time, there was wars in the gym. You know what I mean? but there's other times where there was, you know, we're going to learn today. You're not just going to start swinging from left to right. Well, it was the mecca of kickboxing. And like I said, like when I was living in Boston and when I was kickboxing in Boston, people would talk about the Jet Center with like hushed tones.

1:28:18Like, you got to get to the Jet Center. Because I was telling people I was moving to L.A. They're like, oh, you're going to move to L.A.? You got to go to the Jet Center. And I knew about it. I was like, oh, it's one of the first things I did. Like one of the first things I did, I showed up for work. I did all the things that I had to do. I was working on this TV show. Then I went to Van Nuys. I was like, I got to go sign up. Come on. That's beautiful. Joe, so you mentioned that, you know, because you could sling them pretty good yourself. You know what I mean? Oh, yeah. You leaned over and ripped the body shot to that one guy you were sparring with.

1:28:52He went down on one knee. And if I'm not mistaken, you mentioned, man, I thought, holy crap, I'm going to get shot in the parking lot. Yeah. And then he walks up to you and he taps your glove and he says, good shot. Yeah. I remember that. I was nervous sparring those dudes. But that was part of why I had them there. Yeah. You know what I mean? Because at the end of the day, it's not about violence. And that was giving them that lesson that they needed to learn. Yes. You know what I'm saying? During that time of their life. And now we've grown it into something now where we've done over 200 sporting events with rivals.

1:29:33Yeah, that's awesome. Tackle football games, handball, softball games. People need to learn that the division that we have with each other, we look at us versus them, it's mostly bullshit. It's not real. It's like they're just human beings just like you're a human being. And it's way better for them to be your friend than for them to be your enemy. There's no need to have enemies like that for no reason whatsoever other than tribal gang bullshit. It's not real. It's like and the thing about martial arts is it teaches you the real battle is inside yourself. The real battle is learning and growing.

1:30:07And unfortunately with young men, like there's this desire to show how hard you are and that you're macho. But you don't have any skills. You don't you're not really macho. So you have to like posture and be louder than everybody else. and martial arts teaches you like man your battle is in the gym tomorrow like you get back in there tomorrow and and get better and then learn why you got hit and then get better and learn why you're throwing your left hook wrong or why you're throwing your round kick wrong and train it and work on the bag and put in your time and you're going to learn and grow and then you're going to realize like i've been fighting my own self for this whole time i've been fighting nonsense and I've been making enemies that don't exist.

1:30:50We had a guy that came into the gym, 6 '3", 230-pound Mexican-American, which was a rare commodity back in 1980. And he had just done five years on a manslaughter, and he wanted a box. So I started working with him. Not long after, I get a phone call, and it's a parole officer. And he says, hey, I hear you're dealing with Alex. And I said, yeah, I'm dealing with him. and he's doing just great. I said, you know, I'm a private entity, and I'm going to work with this guy. I don't got to chase him. He's in the gym all the time. And so I took him to the Diamond Belt. He won it. I took him to the Golden Glove.

1:31:29He won it. I took him to the state title. He won it. He earns the right to go to the Nationals in Beaumont, Texas. Is this Alex Garcia? Alex Garcia. So I was his trainer manager at that time. Oh, wow. All them years. Take him to the world. He earns the right to go to the world box-off, wins the World Box Off, goes to the World Games, fights who? Teofilo Stevenson. Oh! Six-foot-seven Cuban. There was a three-time Olympic gold medalist. Alex fights him for the gold on ABC World of Sports. Wow. And he doesn't win, but he lost to Teofilo Stevenson from Cuba, and he wins the silver medal, and he's the first in the Hispanic community, Mexican-American, gun to win a medal or to fight in even that category that's that weight division i remember i was just talking to my friend joey diaz uh who's cuban and we were talking about tfl stevenson that that was the guy that they were trying to get to fight muhammad ali when he was in his prime because they were like you know muhammad ali might be the best in the world but he might be the second best because there's this cat in cuba that is a bad man and tfl stevenson was a bad man he was so good but he was just locked into cuba and locked into that amateur program and we never got to see him fight professionally and back then they wouldn't let them fight pro nope fidel castro would not allow that nope and didn't he didn't he come on with muhammad on the cover of time magazine like they were kind of teasing people with that fight perhaps i mean there was a lot of talk about it i remember in the 70s and the 80s there was a lot of talk about that about him fighting and then him eventually defecting and coming over to America, but it never happened.

1:33:09But the thing with Alex, that showed somebody that's gone away and come back home can make it. If he could win the silver medal for the United States of America and the World Games when we had boycotted the Olympics, that was just part of the proof. And so now when you're getting guys into union jobs, You're getting guys with tattoo removal that's going on. You're doing advocacy in the courtrooms, and you're just being able to roll out. There's education going on, and there's a response to Yellow Tape, the CVI, the Community Violence Intervention Programs, that are now nationwide. They've become a movement.

1:33:53And when you say tattoo removal, you're talking about gang tattoos. Yeah, tattoos, but yeah, mostly, you know, just things of people's past that holds them back. Right, right, right. Yeah, so now, you know, there's another thing that's going on with tattoos, you know, where it's no laser removal. There's some new technology and stuff that I'm talking to people about that you don't have to go through getting laser and ow and ooh, and you can hear that laser going off. So what's it about? It's about meeting the needs of people. It's about touching lives. You know what I mean? It's about showing them another way and having the ability to open up a door that they can get through.

1:34:34A path. A path, absolutely. That's the thing about a lot of people. They don't know how to make the first step. They've made some mistakes in their life. Their life is kind of a mess. They don't know the first step. The beautiful thing about a fighting journey in a gym is it allows you, a martial arts dojo allows you a path. You go in there. You start. There's some rules. I'll see you tomorrow. Like, okay, I'll see you tomorrow. And then you're in there tomorrow. And then you start getting a little better. And then you learn growth. And you understand, like, if I work towards something, I could build towards something.

1:35:04And now I'm seeing progress, you know. And now I've got a brown belt, you know. Now I've got a black belt. Now I'm a black belt. I can tell people I'm a black belt. Like, I did something. I accomplished something. And I think that's one of the great things about belt systems in traditional martial arts is it gives you a sense that there's a rite of passage. like you've made you've gone through this thing and now you've moved to another level and now you you're supposed to behave like you are at a different level now you're a senior student now you know now you're one of the elite students in the gym you're held to a different standard it's very important for people well you know a lot of times what happens is a lot of a lot of them come in with a lot of emotions anger fear frustration and especially at the jet with the Jets Gym, we were able to tap in and put fear to them in a sparring way.

1:35:56It will bring up all that emotion up, and then we had a chance to reprogram that. That was the best part about the gym, is to bring up what everybody hides until you're threatened. Right. Hey, once you're threatened, I don't care what you hide under your bed, in your closet, we'll come up, and then you get a chance to reprogram the way you're perceiving it, the way you're looking at it, and help them to heal, not pat it or forget it or act like it doesn't, heal it so that it doesn't stop them on their journey. And that's what the JET Center was all about, is being able to bring that up, mirror their truth, help them look at what they're really all about, and continue to let them go on their journey.

1:36:48And that's why the Jet Center was so successful, because we had a chance to really mirror their truth and bring all that that they hide and bring it forward, and they felt safe enough. They felt protected to actually go there. Yeah, and you get to see them go through that and develop real confidence. Yes. Instead of this bravado, this false confidence trying to make people feel like you're confident and scare them off, you develop silent confidence where you really know how to fight. True. That's true. So that's what makes the art, you know, so unique but so needed. And in the art, it gives you a foundation to build on.

1:37:33and in your life, and no matter what. And we've had all walks of life that come through the JET Center, all walks, I mean, and the ones that, I mean, we had so many different attorneys coming in, and we used to call them the fighting attorneys. There were six, seven of them, and they were, you know, in the gym, they were so humble to each other. They love each other. They go outside, and all of a sudden they don't know each other. I said, what's wrong with you? You just finished sparring with him, working with him? And they said, he's an attorney. I said, and? But it was, it brought character out of him.

1:38:13It brought their heart. And let them mirror the really truth on their journey and where they were going. Also, for an attorney to step into that world and be around both these young gang members that are learning a new path and then professional fighters. And like, you know, you're in a different world of discipline and willpower and focus that will help you in everything you do. Will help you as an attorney. Will help you as a doctor. Will help you in anything you do. True. And certainly help you as a human. Yes. As a human, just get through life. There's nothing that's going to be harder in life than other than the loss of a loved one.

1:38:53Nothing going to be harder than your hardest training session at a real fight gym. It's just that is that makes the rest of the world easy because your hardest thing you volunteered to do and you look forward to doing it again. And you do it every day when you could do like I always tell people martial artists are some of the nicest fucking people you'll ever meet in your life. There's some of the nicest people because they don't have anything to prove. Like when I introduced my friends to like guys, I'm like, what do you like? I was talking about George St. Pierre yesterday. I was introducing someone to George St.

1:39:25Pierre. Like, what do you think he does? It's like, I don't know. Seems like a nice guy. I'm like that is one of the baddest motherfuckers that ever walked the face of the earth He's a two-division UFC world champion one of the greatest of all time. They're like no way I'm like yeah, I mean like he's like how you doing my friend like super nice super friendly like yeah He's got nothing to prove. There's nothing to prove so he can be a nice person He could be a nice person and not feel weak He can be himself. Yeah, yeah Hey, Joe, so, you know, you may mention right now one of the hardest things to do is lose someone.

1:39:58And so for me, I wanted to share a little bit that in 2023, I got a phone call that was something that I could never anticipate. It was January of 2023, and it was a call that was made. one of my sons called to tell me that he had talked to a friend of ours that does a lot of work with the prisons, has a lot of entrees on big time boards, and that he was at one of the prisons and that an inmate walked up to him and asked him if he knew me. So he said, you know, do you know Blinky? And he said, yeah. He says, why? And the guy says, because I'd like to talk to him. And he said well why he said because I'm the guy that murdered his son and and so my son's telling me that our friend wanted to know if I would consider talking to him on the phone so I had just entered into a season of fasting and praying me and my wife now we're going to celebrate 10 years Gloria you know and and uh and I said I don't know I was grappling Joe I was I I was grappling.

1:41:10I was fighting with it. And then I heard a gentle voice, and it was, say yes. Say yes. So I called my son back, and I said, tell him I said yes. But I don't want to talk to him on the phone. I want to see him in person. And so that's exactly what happened. On January the 30th, we drove up to the prison, and we get there. and first we stop and get something to eat and then we get to the prison and the CO's right there waiting. And when we get there, he says, yeah, well, come on through. And so me and this guy went through. And he says, yeah, you know, we don't normally have meetings on Monday, but everything's fine.

1:41:58We're going to be okay. So they walk us through. We walk through, get out to the back door and there's the yard. The yard, the barbed wire, everything's right there. We start walking. We go into a building to the left. Now, I thought I was going to be talking to somebody behind glass. But it turns out that they're asking me, what do I think about this room? And I'm like, in my mind, why are they asking me? What am I thinking about this room? You know what I mean? Because, you know, that's up to them. But I looked down the hallway and there's a door. I said, what's behind that door? And the CO tells me, he says, that's a chapel.

1:42:42I said, can I see it? We walked back down the hallway. He opens the door and there's a podium right there and there's about 15 chairs. So I said to him, can we use this room? And he said, yes. So at that point in time, I need to go to the restroom. So we walk out of the building. he takes me to the restroom. When we come back out, my friend, the one that was setting it all up, he's not there. But there's an inmate. I can hear him saying, hey, Blinky, thank you for the letter to the parole board. I got a date. But I'm in another dimension, Joe. I mean, I'm like somewhere else. So a couple of minutes goes by, and I hear my buddy, and he says, hey, Blinky, this is David.

1:43:29and when I pivoted out, he was right here in front of me, this guy that had killed my son. And the words that came out of his mouth, Joe, I didn't have a second to try to digest it, but he says to me, can I get a hug? And when he said, can I get a hug, I grabbed him and I embraced him and I began to weep. I began to weep. I began to travail and he began to weep. and that was a Holy Ghost moment where the Spirit of God was moving on that whole issue and we went from there into that chapel and we spent a little over two hours talking the CO that was there and my buddy they were sitting in the corner of the room and as I'm talking to him and we're going over because my wife before I left the house she says remember he was just a young guy You know what I mean?

1:44:28He was probably confused back then. So now I'm talking to him and now we're going over different things that took place. And I hear that voice, tell him, talk to him. So I said, okay. I said to him, can I have the privilege of leading you to the Lord? And he said to me, yes. He says, yes. Tears are coming out of his eyes. I stepped a few feet over, I put my hand on his right shoulder, over his heart, and I let him. And he began with a contrite heart. He began to weep and cry. And I came to realize because it took me a long time to unpack that. Once I left there and I came home into the chair where I always sit to read, and wow, it's like, what just happened?

1:45:19What did I just do? What just took place? And at the end of the day, Joe, it was, I'll leave 99 to go get one. And that's what I grasped, that one life, that one person. So that's why I've always said since then that the power of forgiveness is more powerful than my left hook. And I had a good one, Joe. That he did. I just, nice and short, man. But the power of forgiveness, Joe, reconciles. It gives you a chance, man, to rekindle the fire. It gives you the opportunity, man, to live life without carrying a heavy yoke on your neck. Right. That people carry. It's powerful. I can't articulate to you in words what forgiveness is, but forgiveness is divine.

1:46:12The love that's required, the humility that's required to forgive unconditionally. And that's why I trust in Christ. That's a beautiful story. It really is. That's a beautiful message. And it's incredibly powerful of you to forgive that man and to be able to recognize that he made a horrible, horrible decision that affected your life and everyone around you. But he's just a human being, you know, and we're all capable of doing something terrible if we're in the wrong environment with the wrong people around us, the wrong lifestyle, wrong decisions, you know, but we're all just human beings. And that's why I'm still doing what I'm doing.

1:46:53I had to say farewell to my brother Ben because we owned the Jet Center together 50-50, man. And it was just that type of calling, Joe, that said, go. And so here I am now 36 years later. It's still jumping. That's amazing. And it's still working. I went there 32 years ago. That's when I first started. That's when I made my way to L.A. That's when I first came to your gym and took your classes. Do you still have a gym? You know what? Right now, I'm just doing a lot of traveling. I'm doing my documentary right now and working on the documentary and so forth and just doing a lot of traveling. I've seen a lot of videos online of you teaching seminars and teaching people.

1:47:38You're still doing a lot of that? A lot of it. Do you enjoy that still? You know what? I've always thought I was a better teacher than a fighter. That's crazy. You're one of the greatest fighters of all time. The fighting I can do, but the teaching I love. Really? I love being able to get somebody and turn them inside out so they may look at their truth and see that we all have talent and we all have a gift. It's just giving a chance to see that. You know, I really take a lot of pride in seeing somebody that I can see that they doubt themselves, They hesitate to go out there and really look at themselves and start to love themselves.

1:48:22There's no better feeling to see somebody come up from being very meek and weak to something that's so strong and doing something great for society and for their family. That's amazing. Do you ever get any professional mixed martial arts fighters that reach out to you for training? Absolutely. Who have you trained with? Well, you know what, right now, basically what I do is I don't talk about any of them. I just work with them. And everybody asks me, but I said, you know what, I don't care who you are. I care about what you would think that how I can help you with. If it's mental, if it's physical, because when it comes down to it, 80 % of it is mental.

1:49:1420 % of it is physical but 99.9 % of that is spiritual which is internal this is what I work with him on and so some of the fighters I said I prefer not to know you know who you are just other than what you want from me and from there I can work with you on that and so a lot of people want me to go and see their fights, you know, while they're cage fighting MMA and stuff. And there was only one time I went, I believe. I went one time because in the beginning, there were great technicians in that cage, beautiful technicians, and it got lost. It got lost somewhere around, and then every once in a while you'll find somebody that stands out like a sore thumb.

1:50:09It's just beautiful technique, And you can see they really love what they're doing. Well, the young guys coming up today are some of the most technical I've ever seen. Yeah. It's an amazing time because what we're seeing now is these kids that are in their 20s that, you know, the UFC really became popular in 2005 from The Ultimate Fighter. So you're seeing kids that were really young when that was happening. And they grew up watching Anderson Silva, John Jones, Vitor Belfort. They grew up watching these elite fight Conor McGregor. And now they are the newest version of that. And the thing about martial arts is so different is we really didn't have a chance to see mixed martial arts on television at all until 1993.

1:50:58And so you're seeing this. There's no sport other than mixed martial arts where you look back at 1993 and look at it in 2026 and it's totally unrecognizable. It's so much different. But MMA it is. And these kids are so technical. It's like we were talking about today. The kids of today, they can do everything. They can submit you. They can take you down. They can kickbox with you. They can do it all. They don't have a weak spot in their game. And those are the elite young fighters of today. And we're seeing a lot of those now, a lot of them. The only thing you can't coach is heart. Right. Right.

1:51:32You can't coach heart. I mean, you can teach it in a way that can learn it from the pain of not having heart and the shame of not having heart, and you decide I'm never going to be that person again. Some people say heart is either in you, you either have it or you don't, but man, I don't believe that. I think it's something that can be grown just like everything else, just like technique, just like everything. Condition does a wonderful job, right? But that's the journey. Yes, the journey. The journey is finding that. That's the journey. The good, bad, and ugly shows up that it may teach you something about yourself.

1:52:06Yeah. And that's the mirroring of your truth. What is it like for you two men as pioneers, like real true pioneers in the earliest days of martial arts in this country to see where it is today and to know that you started those first steps? You know, it's for me to start something but in a way of the Bushudo way, of the code of honor and respect and so forth. This is what I felt that we were doing, building up a way of life where warriors will fight with dignity and honor and respect. and along the line when actually my last fight was in 95, 94 I got my last fight and then it started to change because the graces came in in 90 and 95 it started mixed martial arts all the way up to 2000 and then cage fighting was huge just everywhere but And I was following some of it, but I didn't like some of it.

1:53:26It didn't leave a good taste. And because when I saw some of these guys were on the ground just pounding this guy on the ground, I thought, wow, was that me in the street once upon a time when I was young? and I said so a lot of it that I didn't want to take their livelihood from them because I didn't want to hurt them to the point where they couldn't make a living if they were married if they were, you know so I always had that in my mind, in my heart that to me it was a sport when somebody hit the ground I said get back up I pinned a lot of people, but to hit them on the ground, I just said, get back up.

1:54:16Yeah, but it's an important part of fighting. That's right. Yeah. That's right. But again, you know, the fight game, again, there's a difference between the fight and the art of sport. Because in the art of sport, I mean, you do a lot of that on concrete and wood, a whole different ballgame on the mats. Because there's two different flavors of understanding. one protecting in the street and hitting that kind of ground and so forth. Because a lot of times at the internationals, it was concrete. That was in 64, 65, how we fought on concrete, taking down sweeps, but letting it back up. There was a code of honor.

1:54:56Even though we swept and took them to the ground, you know, and some will reverse punch to the ground and then let them back up. But again, I just think that sometimes when you're on the ground and there's somebody's livelihood, you know, you're thrashing. And the idea, okay, I understand what it takes, you know, to hold that hand up as a winner and what it takes of the rules. But I've always got turned around when I see somebody jumping at somebody. Yeah, that's understandable considering in your day that was frowned upon. But today it's one of the most important parts of the sport. Yeah. But as for me, I'll tell you, you mentioned how it felt to be a pioneer, a true pioneer on the front end.

1:55:52I feel privileged to be a part of that, to be – I mean, it was such a robust time. It was so exciting. It was rich. There was richness in the air. We were thriving. We were pushing. You know, first it was that trip to Hawaii where we end up in a semi-comedy thing where if you don't knock them out, you're not going to win. Well, by the way, when we got to the airport, Dana Goodson was caddying there. He was taking the luggage and he seen us. He said, hey, you guys double teamed me. You know what I'm saying? But it was just the atmosphere was rich. It was thriving. It was special. It was a special time.

1:56:34You know what I mean? And so I didn't want to cheat the game because I knew for a fact the condition was king, being in tip-top shape. Because it's one thing being in shape, but being in tip-top condition. Now you almost could radar what someone's going to throw. You could catch it. You could see it. You could feel it, you know. So being on the front end, even though, you know, we got limited recognition, it wasn't always about the recognition. It was about the art. It was about life. It was about how you treat people. And I'm grateful, Joe. I'm grateful because still today, it's about people.

1:57:15It's about service. It's about being able to open a door, give an opportunity, and touch a life. In the same way, you know, Benny's talking about, you know, the emotion and, you know, what that allows to happen to an individual's life. where we're approaching it in a multi-pronged approach. You see what I'm saying? The basic needs of opportunity that a lot of people don't get a second look. It's just like next, next, next. You take the time to talk to them. You know what I mean? And I want to say this. I want to say this. You wear humility so extremely well. I mean, I'm just saying, Joe. You know what I mean?

1:57:59That's what I sense. That's what I discern in my spirit. And I've been running the race a long time, Joe. I've been running the race a long time. And there's an anointing that breaks the yoke of bondage. There's an anointing. And it flows, Joe. and if I left here without saying that I would be so disappointed in myself but anyways well my humility is honest I know who I am I'm just a person like everybody else and the beautiful thing about martial arts is it teaches you that it teaches you who you really are not image and what you're portraying what is your real spirit Like what are you really capable of?

1:58:50What can you really accomplish? Who are you? And you have to learn that. And that's the beautiful thing about hard training and learning and competing. You have to learn who you are. That's the journey. It doesn't come without loss. It doesn't come without, you know, you have to go through some shit. The good, bad, ugly shows up. Yeah, all of it. It is a part of who you are. and when you guys are seeing the sport the crazy thing about your time was that there was no other motivation other than the journey because there was no money there was no fame i mean you obviously got a lot of notoriety and respect amongst martial artists and amongst people like me but the general public you know if i say you don't know who blinky rodriguez and benny the jet are they're like what who's that and martial artists know people who watch the movies know People who saw Black Belt Magazine, they know.

1:59:46But you were doing it in a pure sense. It wasn't just a vehicle to become famous. It was because you were trying to figure out who's the baddest man on earth. And there's only one way to find out. True. Yeah. Truth speaks for itself. Truth. Truth speaks for itself. So do you have a desire at all to have a gym now? Do you ever think about what it was like when you had the JET Center? You know, there's something that I've been drawing in my mind, just like when the Jet Center, I was drawing on toilet paper. In Japan. Actually, in Japan. And I had an idea, and I started drawing on toilet paper because I didn't have anything else to do.

2:00:30So I started drawing the Jet Center, and I told Blinky, I said, Blinky, this is our gym. What do you think? And he looked at me and he said, I dreamt about that. After I showed him on toilet paper, this is going to be our next gym. This is going to be the gym of what we're going to do. And he had a dream about it right before that. Really? The Keo Plaza in Chinchiku. Yeah. I came downstairs. He was already there to eat. And he says, Blink, one day we're not going to lease or rent no more. We're going to own this gym. and he pulls his paper out and says this is and he started pointing it out jacuzzi steam room sauna cold plunge and he just started going through it and i'm looking at him and i'm smiling ben says hey you think i'm crazy again i said ben i dreamt that gym last night i dream it you know wow and the proof is that that it was what we said is when we walked into that bowling alley at 14540 Friar Street.

2:01:43We closed a two and a half day escrow on that property with $4 ,000 down. Wow. We started a month later with the construction and building of it. You can feel it in the building, man. I remember very clearly the first time I walked in the room. I was like, wow. I was like, I'm really here. It was crazy. I didn't get too nervous entering the fight gyms, but that gym I got nervous because it's like the legendary history of it. You guys really did something very, very special. I was real sad when the roof got damaged and it went under. I was like, man, this is the end of an era. But to answer your question, I've been doodling again.

2:02:28Oh. But I'm talking about a gym. There will be a safe haven where people will come to learn their truth. learning defense, self-defense, but learning about themselves, mirroring their own truth, that they will be able to feel safe and to be able to release all that people or they've been taught these emotions of anger, fear, and frustration. They get a chance to release it and feel comfortable and feel safe enough to do it, that they may go on their journey. This is the next gym that I already started doodling on. I didn't do it on toilet paper. Actual paper this time. Yeah, actual paper this time.

2:03:12Where are you going to plan on doing that? Actually, that's the key. Location. That's the key. Because, again, this one will be different than anybody's ever seen. And it will be a place to come from all over the world to look to mirror the truth. So do you think you're going to do that in California? Maybe. Maybe. You know, I mean, born and raised. Yeah. You know, and you can take the kid out of the country, but you can't take the country out of the kid. So we're still, but right now I already drawing. I already finished drawing. But hey, California could use something like that. Yeah. Really could.

2:03:57Yeah. Because I've already, believe it or not, I've already done nine pieces of equipment that nobody's ever seen. five machines that nobody's ever seen. And it's all about a mentally, physically, and spiritually endurance. Mm. You know, to take you to the next level that you never thought you can get there. So if you do something, when are you planning on doing it? Well, right now, I'm just taking one day at a time because sometimes you go jump ahead of your time. A lot can happen in one day. Yeah. So I take it one day at a time, but I've already started it, and we'll see where it goes. I really can't answer you when, but it's on the making.

2:04:42That's beautiful. That makes me very happy because you've got a lot to teach people. Both of you do. And you with your outreach, you have a lot to teach people. We've actually talked at one point about us buying a huge building and having a gym there, but also servicing people there, right out of there. You know, the people that come to our office for tattoo removal or moving their lives up the road a little bit. All that comes with the programming of the different services. I'm not going to inundate this broadcast with this, Joe. but at the same time we've had that conversation you know it is about humanity you know it is about people people need a place yeah people need a place to come and they came from all over the world when they get a chance to hear something like this they will come from all over the world to mirror their truth to look at themselves the purpose and reason why they exist why they're here what are they doing this the kind of place in my mind is what I've designed that's why I design equipment and all that for this place though that makes me very happy that you're considering doing that I think that would be amazing and I think you're right I think people will come from all over the world to train there and to learn there and I really hope that happens I really do So, gentlemen, thank you very much for being here.

2:06:11It's an honor. Thank you, Joe. My pleasure. Thank you. And it's good to see you again. Good to see you, too. Good to see you, too. Thank you. Good to see you. You're still bobbing in with me. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Okay. Thank you, everybody.

2:06:27Thank you.

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