The World Cup Story, Part 2: Too Big To Fail

0:08Ryan Knutson:In 2015, FIFA was in freefall. FIFA's longtime president, Sepp Blatter, had just stepped down in disgrace. More than a dozen officials had been indicted. Some pleaded guilty. Others were convicted at trial. A few serve prison time in the U.S. We tell that story in episode one, which came out last Sunday. So FIFA needed to move forward. And the nonprofit that oversees the world's most watched sporting event was looking for a new president.

0:45Ryan Knutson:How do you run for FIFA president? What's the process like for choosing a president of FIFA? FIFA operates like any sort of democratic institution. So it's one country, one vote, and whoever gets the most votes becomes president. and I think there were five in the running to replace Bladder. The man who ended up winning the job was Johnny Infantino. He'd been in charge of UEFA, the European soccer body, and he promised big changes at FIFA. My colleagues Jonathan Clegg and Joshua Robinson told me the story. His platform was basically... Make FIFA great again? Essentially, yes. It was like radical transparency.

1:23Change we can believe in. Exactly. And he was going to get FIFA back to its roots, loving football. This organization that has operated for too long in the shadows and has now been found to have allowed all this corruption to run rampant will be brought up to sort of modern standards. There will be a much greater focus on ethical behavior and all the bad stuff that happened in the set bladder will no longer happen.

1:47Ryan Knutson:That was back in 2016. Infantino has now been president of FIFA for a decade. And over that time, Josh and John say that Infantino's big promises to the fans haven't come through. I think the World Cup, certainly as far as FIFA and Infantino are concerned, has ceased to be a tournament about the fans. And that's, again, something that we're witnessing now in the 2026 World Cup, when the considerations of fans seem to be the last thing on FIFA's mind.

2:25Ryan Knutson:From The Journal, this is our two-part Sunday special on the World Cup. I'm Ryan Knutson. It's June 14th.

2:43Ryan Knutson:Coming up, part two. How far can Gianni Infantino take the World Cup?

3:04This episode of The Journal is brought to you by Harvey, an AI platform designed for legal and professional services. Built and tested by lawyers, Harvey is trusted by more than 60 % of the AMLA 100. The platform dramatically reduces time spent on research, drafting, and document review. without sacrificing quality, all while meeting the highest industry standards for security and compliance. Harvey, AI tailored for law. Visit harvey.ai to learn more and request a demo.

3:46Ryan Knutson:Johnny Infantino became FIFA president in 2016. He's part Swiss, Italian, and Lebanese. He's bald, has thick eyebrows, and often wears a dark suit and white sneakers. — Welcome. Bienvenidos. Bienvenue. Bienvenidos. Bienvenue. — Willkommen. Ahlan was Ahlan in all the languages of the world. — Early on, he tried to differentiate himself from the corruption scandals that happened under his predecessor, Sepp Blatter. He's pledged to organize regular matches at FIFA headquarters in which he often plays. I personally watched him take one of the worst corner kicks I've ever seen anyone who's kicked a ball take.

4:29So he plays, but not maybe super well, but... Not especially well. So he also surrounded himself with like FIFA legends. He loves a FIFA legend. Great players of days of yore. He would spend a lot of time palling around with those to sort of emphasize his relationship with the players and the fans. Because I think that one of the other things about the bladder era is that FIFA had come to feel very distant from the players who play in the World Cup and the fans who fund the whole thing. He also early on made headlines because he was going to control FIFA's costs. And so he started flying on EasyJet around Europe.

5:03Ryan Knutson:A low budget European airline. Exactly. Infantino was sort of promised to bring the game back to the fans and have them be a much more sort of powerful constituency in how the organization operated going forward. Every day should be about joy, about fun, about passion. And we have to take ourselves a little bit less serious.

5:25Ryan Knutson:Fans didn't feel taken care of. They were upset about FIFA's decision to hold the 2022 World Cup in Qatar. It wasn't just the countries bidding to host the tournament who were dismayed by the decision to award it to Qatar. It was also the fans who had to go to the middle of a desert in the height of summer, who also felt that their interests weren't being looked after by FIFA. But Infantino decided not to revisit that decision. And that becomes very clear from the moment he's elected that that decision will not be questioned. This is the lot that he's been handed, and he's going to execute these World Cups as best he can.

6:01If one thing becomes clear very early on, it's that the only thing Gianni Infantino loves as much as he loves soccer, is proximity to power.

6:09Ryan Knutson:There's one image of Infantino that Josh says was a symbol of where his presidency at FIFA was headed. It comes from the opening match at the 2018 World Cup in Russia. The opening game pitted Russia against Saudi Arabia, and there is Johnny sitting between Mohammed bin Salman, the crown prince of Saudi Arabia, and Vladimir Putin. And as Russia absolutely dismantles Saudi Arabia, Infantino's looking over to MBS and making these sheepish faces. Sorry. Awkward shrugs. The 2018 World Cup in Russia went smoothly. France won again. Josh was happy. It is France! Allé, les bleus! That was sort of this big, full-circle emotional moment for me personally, but that's very boring to talk about.

6:56Ryan Knutson:No, this is why sports are the best. After that, it was Qatar's turn to host. In the lead-up to the 2022 World Cup, There was consistent criticism over human rights issues there. Homosexuality is illegal. And media outlets were reporting on poor working conditions and deaths of migrant workers. There are just days to go before the start of the World Cup in Qatar, but the build-up to the event has been blighted by safety concerns. Now, a BBC investigation has uncovered evidence that migrants working on infrastructure projects in the final months before the tournament have died or suffered abuse.

7:32This was the main topic of the buildup. This was a topic that came up every time Infantino appeared in public. How did he answer those questions? Well, he did it very memorably. Yes, he did. First of all, his general approach was to say, we take the World Cup into these countries to shine a light in places and look at what a great job Qatar has done, actually updating its systems and changing the way it behaves and the way it handles migrant labor. But then before the kickoff of the actual tournament, sitting in the press conference room in Doha, he gave the single most memorable press conference I've ever been at.

8:13Today I feel gay. And this was Infantino addressing all of the disenfranchised constituencies. Today I feel disabled. Qatar and saying he was with them. Today I feel a migrant worker. and that Qatar had done a great job in franchising them.

8:33Ryan Knutson:What did you make of that? Like, what did that say about Infantino's leadership and what he was doing as president? I think it sort of reinforced the idea that this was a guy who was sort of a little bit out of touch with, you know, how most football fans were thinking, most soccer fans were thinking. And was there, like, evidence that Qatar had actually done better on these fronts, that it had made an effort to... I think there's absolutely no question that they... have, yeah, that the conditions for migrant workers did improve, you know, partly as a result of the kind of spotlight that was shown on Qatar after winning the World Cup.

9:11Ryan Knutson:It's not clear exactly how many migrant workers died in Qatar. Some human rights groups put the figure in the hundreds. The government of Qatar said at the time that the number is 37. In addition to speaking out publicly in support of Qatar, FIFA made some big concessions in order to make the World Cup in Qatar possible. Like, they came up with a novel solution to the problem of hosting a soccer tournament during a sweltering Qatari summer. They solved that problem too, not just by air conditioning the stadiums, but also by moving the entire tournament out of summer for the first time ever. Oh, that's right.

9:44Which was just a crazy, unprecedented thing that no one ever thought was possible because the World Cup is synonymous with summer.

9:50Ryan Knutson:The 2022 World Cup took place in November and December. It really is like a completely crazy thing that they did that. You know, it's sort of the equivalent of moving the Super Bowl to the middle of like October. Because it was like during the middle of the season. Yeah, exactly. The sort of professional soccer calendar runs from sort of September until June. And so to move the sort of most important tournament in soccer right into the middle of that, it would be like asking the NFL to shut down, you know, on Thanksgiving for a month. It's just ludicrous. To move the World Cup to the winter, FIFA had to dole out hundreds of millions of dollars to the professional sports leagues who employ those players during the season.

10:30Ryan Knutson:And the players' union was mad about how this would affect athletes' upcoming offseason. It was also a major disruption for sports broadcasters. It hugely affected the European broadcasters who were now, you know, suddenly finding that they had tournaments put on in the lead-up to Christmas. We're supposed to be airing Home Alone 2 right now. Yes, exactly. Die Hard reruns are supposed to be on right now. Greatest Christmas movie of all time. And instead we have, you know, England-Senegal. So, you know, like I say, an earth-shattering decision to move the Summer World Cup to the winter. Then, 48 hours before the tournament started, Qatar sprang a surprise on soccer fans in town for the games.

11:07Football fans will no longer be allowed to buy alcohol around World Cup stadiums. This very late decision comes ahead of the opening game in Qatar on Sunday.

11:17Ryan Knutson:That, I remember that. That was wild. Yeah, that was almost as shocking as decision to award Qatar the World Cup in the first place. I mean, a World Cup without beer is like... A World Cup without a ball. Exactly. Do you feel like this typified, in some ways, the way FIFA was changing the things that you were seeing with what happened with Qatar? I mean, I think it's certainly... So the beer thing, the decision on beer, was another example of how FIFA has sort of ceded so much power to the countries that are hosting the World Cup that they were essentially, you know, being held hostage by Qatar, who had the World Cup and were then able to sort of act as they wanted.

11:57You know, FIFA charges Budweiser, you know, millions of dollars to be its primary alcohol sponsor. And the idea that they would be prohibited from selling anything other than Bud Zero at the tournament was a huge black eye for them and a huge problem for their marketing arm going forward.

12:13Ryan Knutson:At the time, FIFA said it appreciated the support of Budweiser's parent company, AB InBev, to quote, cater to everyone at the 2022 World Cup. I think what it really shows is that at this stage, Infanzino is presiding over a FIFA that didn't so much organize the World Cup or own the World Cup, but was in the business of renting it to various countries. Why was FIFA willing to do all of this? I mean, it feels, it seems like FIFA was really bending over backwards just to make this happen in Qatar. Well, I think FIFA needs to sort of expand its horizons. And I think, you know, early on, like probably before anyone else, really, FIFA recognized that the Gulf and the Middle East was going to be this huge source of income for them.

13:00Ryan Knutson:There's all these big funds, these sovereign wealth funds. Exactly. All this money that are trying to invest in a lot of sport. Exactly. It's not a huge fan base necessarily. There's not a lot of big pop. I mean, Qatar doesn't have a huge population. Qatar, the UAE, yes, Abu Dhabi, Saudi Arabia now, you know, again, yes, not huge soccer-loving public even. But, yes, deep-pocketed sovereign wealth funds who had sort of discovered that the sport of soccer was a very effective tool with which to advertise their countries to the rest of the world. After Qatar, Infantino had another big money opportunity for FIFA on the horizon.

13:43Ryan Knutson:the 2026 World Cup in the U.S., the biggest, most lucrative sports market in the world. To capitalize on this important opportunity, Infantino developed a close relationship with President Donald Trump. He knows that he also has a job to do as FIFA president, which is he is also responsible for sort of shining the halo of the World Cup on whichever world leader happens to be hosting the next tournament. And he knows that it's the legitimacy of soccer and the World Cup that those people are looking for when they decide to host the tournament. And I think we're seeing that more clearly than ever now in his repeated visits to the host of the next World Cup, Donald Trump.

14:23Ryan Knutson:Can you introduce us to the Trump-Infantino relationship? How well do these two men know each other and what do we know about their relationship? At this point, they know each other very well, mostly because Johnny Infantino has spent most of the last 18 months following Trump around the world to all manner of media availabilities and diplomatic missions. He was standing by Trump's side at the Gaza Peace Summit. He has been a regular visitor to the Oval Office. He was at Trump's inauguration. Trump even gave him a shout out at an inauguration celebration. So, Johnny, thank you for the World Cup.

15:01And everybody, thank you for the Olympics. Infantino has traveled the globe, sometimes with very short turnarounds, to make sure that he is on hand whenever Trump might need it. Infantino loves being close to power. He loves being made to feel important. And in Trump, he kind of found a kindred spirit. It's no exaggeration to say that Infantino considers himself a global leader. You know, in the same sphere as Trump and Putin, he considers himself a sort of world-changing humanitarian.

15:29Ryan Knutson:A White House official said that President Trump and Infantino share a genuine friendship built on a common vision.

15:39Ryan Knutson:This friendship was on full display at the World Cup draw held last December. The draw is when the match schedule and the lineup for the World Cup games are set. It was a snazzy event, held at the Kennedy Center in Washington, D.C., with sports stars and soccer officials in the audience. It was snowing outside. Everyone had been made to queue for hours outside in the snow. But the draw wasn't the only highlight of the evening. Infantino was presenting a new award, the FIFA Peace Prize. We pile into the auditorium and Infantino makes a special presentation of the FIFA Peace Prize, which is a trophy and a medal.

16:17There's, you know, everything had been created specifically for this moment.

16:21Ryan Knutson:On stage, Infantino stood next to President Trump and gave him that award. Mr. President, this is your prize. This is your peace prize. Infantino showered praise on Trump. He hailed the wars that Trump had taken credit for stopping or preventing. A beautiful medal for you that you can wear everywhere you want to go. I'm going to wear it right now. Okay, let me hold. Ah, fantastic. Excellent. It's no secret that Donald Trump would love to win a Nobel Peace Prize. He's talked about this. That doesn't seem to be on the cards at the moment. But Gianni Infantino, gracious guest that he is, figured, hang on, we can do the next best thing, the FIFA Peace Prize.

17:08You know, the entire thing was actually presented to an audience of one. It was literally the whole show was made for Trump. There were, you know, USA, USA chants. There was the village people played. that was the Peace Prize. And I think you're going to have an event the likes of which maybe the world has never seen based on the enthusiasm that I've seen.

17:29Ryan Knutson:I have never seen anything like it. I still don't get it. They're like, why would Infantino do this? Why would create this award for Trump? I mean, what does he get out of it? What does it do for FIFA? I think there's an understanding at FIFA that Trump is an unpredictable character, an unpredictable host for this tournament. And FIFA hates that. FIFA wants absolute guarantees. FIFA wants a free hand, knowing that everything is going to run very smoothly. And so I think Infantino's thinking is that the more he can placate Trump, he can feel that this tournament is worth having and actually going to benefit him, then the freer hand FIFA will have.

18:05Ryan Knutson:Because Trump is somebody who might say, you've upset me. If they, you know, I'm going to make this make life difficult for you. There were legitimate fears that they would pull games from Mexico. It hasn't happened and doesn't look like it's going to happen in the time before the tournament. But there were legitimate fears that at some point, citing immigration concerns, Trump would say, actually, those three state venues in Mexico, just have them in the U.S. FIFA has said that soccer unites the world and that the Peace Prize recognizes those helping to unite people. How is it viewed in the soccer world that these fans that tuned in to see, you know, the draw are now watching Trump receive a peace prize, the first ever from a soccer organization?

18:49I mean, I think it was viewed as completely ludicrous, completely ridiculous by soccer lovers around the world who could see, you know, through what was a very transparent attempt to placate the U.S. president. What the hell did FIFA just do? President Trump just became the first ever winner of FIFA's new peace prize. Yeah, you heard that right. FIFA now gives out peace prizes.

19:10Ryan Knutson:As this year's World Cup approached, fans weren't only complaining about Infantino currying favor with Trump. There are already grumblings about how much it's going to cost people to go to these games. That's next.

19:31This episode is brought to you by Indeed. The right hire can make or break your company, especially if you're a small business. And relying on luck to find that person isn't really the best strategy. But you know what is? Using Indeed Sponsored Jobs. You can use it to boost your job post to make sure it reaches more people with the right talents, certification, location, and more. Sponsored jobs posted directly on Indeed are 95 % more likely to report a hire than non-sponsored jobs. Spend less time searching and more time actually interviewing candidates who check all your boxes. Less stress, less time, more results.

20:03When you need the right person to cut through the chaos, this is a job for Indeed Sponsored Jobs. And listeners of this show will get a$75 sponsored job credit to help get your job the premium status it deserves at Indeed.com slash podcast. Just go to Indeed.com slash podcast right now and support the show by saying you heard about Indeed here. Indeed.com slash podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Hiring now? Then this is a job for Indeed Sponsored Jobs.